The Bechdel Cast - Waiting to Exhale with Errin Haines

Episode Date: December 27, 2018

Caitlin and Jamie have been holding their breath until the moment when they could chat with special guest Errin Haines Whack about Waiting to Exhale.(This episode contains spoilers)For Bechdel bonuses, sign up for our Patreon at patreon.com/bechdelcast.Follow @emarvelous on Twitter! While you're there, you should also follow @BechdelCast, @caitlindurante and @jamieloftusHELP Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th 2017 was assassinated. Crooks Everywhere unearthed the plot to murder a one-woman WikiLeaks. She exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. Listen to Crooks Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, you're just starting your career. That's where we come in. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in people who do, like negotiation expert Maury Tahiripour. If you start thinking about negotiations as just a conversation, then I think it sort of eases us a little bit. Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everybody. This is Matt Rogers. And Bowen Yang. We've got some exciting news for you.

You know we're always bringing you the best guests, right? Well, this week we're taking it to the next level. The one, the only, Katherine Hahn is joining us on Lost Culture East. That's right. The queen of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories,

and of course, the culture. Don't miss Katherine Hahn on Las Culturistas. Listen to Las Culturistas on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Please put your hands together for the Bechtel cast with your host, Caitlin Durante and Jamie Loftus. The Bechtel cast. Questions asked. Women's have women in them. All their discussions, just boyfriends and husbands,

do they have individualism? The patriarchy's effin' vast, start changing it with the Bechdel cast. Hi! What's up? Welcome to the show that you came to! Uh, my name's Jamie. Hello, I'm Caitlin. Thank you so much for being here.

Thanks for coming! Yeah! The show! Oh, man. This is the first night of our tour. That's right. We're so excited to be here. Where to begin?

Well, this is, we're in my home state of Pennsylvania. Philadelphia, baby. Wait, can we say that... You can do whatever you want, Jamie. Can we say that your family's here? Oh, yeah, my mom and sister are here. Yeah! A tepid response about that.

Well, I was just thinking our first live episode we ever did was in my home state of Massachusetts. Never heard of it? And my mom positively ruined the episode by getting extremely horny for our guests. That was one of my favorite episodes. I was permanently traumatized by it. Interesting. My mom absolutely.

And then I don't even know how we can get into it but like our guest for a brief time this is over a year ago was considering pursuing my mom he's like your mom's so nice she added me on facebook and she has a wild view of what should be capitalized and what shouldn't be like he dm'd me and was like hey hey, should I ask out Jamie's mom? There is. And you said, I said, your body, your choice. See, I was hoping you would say hard no, but I gave my mom the heads up, and she was like, well, let's see what he says.

Sorry, I have to notice. We've got people right in the front row drinking. The mic's hard. Hell yeah. We've got mics right in the front row drinking. The mic's hard. Hell yeah. We've got mic's hard. Oh my, wait, what flavor are you rocking? Sorry. Margarita.

Oh, wait. A margarita? There's a margarita. Mic's hard lemon. What? Are you kidding me? Oh, thank you so much. Okay.

I was waiting for you to do this. Jamie was just. Wow. Wow, for me? Unbelievable. Guys, thank you. it's been a really long year we all had to

you know the hardest part of the year for everybody of course was weathering the Mike's Hard Lemonade Deadpool 2 crossover that was just

absolutely difficult for us to get through because when you think about it it really is a perfect match really every person buying

a Mike's Hard Lemonade in earnest is seeing Deadpool 2 multiple times. Yes. Yeah. So anyway, we're here for a show. What's the podcast about? By round of applause, who has seen the movie we're covering tonight, Waiting to Exhale?

Hell yeah! Oh yeah, we love when people do homework! Out of curiosity, by round of applause, who has not seen the movie? Okay. All right. All right. All right. Does anyone here think that they were coming to see an episode about Mulholland Drive?

Any chance? They're cool, cool, cool. Well, very different episode. And we can't wait to have the discussion with you yeah, we originally had on our ticket link that we were covering Mulholland Drive and then we changed it ooh, it's salty

Mike's Heart Lemonade, I think we've said I mean, what haven't we said about it but what is our podcast? what is it? as you know, we talk about the portrayal of women in movies and how it's historically very bad yeah and we use the bechdel test as a jumping off point to initiate a larger conversation about women in film hey you guys probably know but for our listeners at home who maybe this is their first episode they're tuning into yeah well let's see

if they can say it yeah so ready are you ready caitlin our fans are stupid they're dumb i don't know what to do i thought they were smart but i was wrong i have a feeling that everyone said the exact right thing, but just at different paces. You have a higher faith. So just to recap what you all said very correctly. In unison, very clearly.

Fact test requires that a movie has two named female identifying characters who speak to each other about something other than a man. Yes. For example, really quick. Hey, Caitlin. Hey, Jamie. I'm having a little contest with myself for tour to keep myself entertained, which is what is the worst outfit I can come up with? I mean, I think I'm starting out pretty strong.

I've got period panties on, and then a sheer Coachella skirt over it. And then of course rocking the team dry scabs merch up top. Right before we bring out our guests, I just wanted to take a quick, take the temp where Philly is at on the dry scabs, wet scabs debate. Are we all familiar with what this is?

If you don't know what the debate is, if Beetlejuice, the debate is if beetlejuice the character was coming is he coming wet scabs or is he coming dry scabs now i clearly we know where i'm a dsa member i say dry scabs but just a quick uh clap it up if you're feeling if you're feeling like it's a wet scab situation. Physically painful. Okay. And dry scabs? This is going to be a great show.

Clap it up if you're as disgusted by that conversation as I am. Caitlin, you're splitting the vote. This is why this happened. You're right. This is why this happened. We're splitting a friendly vote. Jill Stein over here. God. Let's bring out our guest. Let's do it. We're so excited to have her. So excited. She is the Associated Press national writer on race and ethnicity and she's worked at the Washington Post in Los Angeles Times give it up for Erin Haynes-Wack welcome Erin oh it's a delight absolute pleasure so as we uh said the movie we're talking about today is waiting to exhale yes um some of you have seen it others of you are here so it's totally my fault Whitney Houston is not in Mulholland Drive

although would have absolutely something worth considering um what is your history with waiting to exhale aaron okay so waiting to exhale came out uh the year that i graduated from high school which i don't mind sharing with you guys because melanin um yeah and i i mean these women were like obviously like total icons of like the culture at that time. I mean, Whitney Houston, Angela Bassett, Loretta Devine, Layla Rashawn, you know, like these were women who you thought were like your cool auntie or like your cooler older cousin. So you just immediately love the movie for that because these people felt immediately familiar to you.

But also, I mean, Terry McMillan was such a big part of black culture at that time as an author. So, you know, I think for a lot of reasons, this movie kind of immediately resonated with like black women of all ages. And it was something that rewatching it as a grown woman, I definitely have different feelings about. But like at that time, at that time, the story of our podcast. Exactly. No, this definitely fits into that genre. Kind of like WTF a generation later.

Caitlin, what's your history? I hadn't seen this movie. I was familiar with the gif moment. Does everyone know what I'm talking about? Where Angela Bassett's walking away from the burning car and she does a motion. Raise your hand if you've ever used that gif. Yeah, exactly.

Exactly. Some of y'all are lying. The context of the gif is way more satisfying. So much more satisfying. So I hadn't seen it, but I'm very excited to talk about it. Same. I, in keeping with being myself, saw it this morning.

And because I have never seen a movie, if you go to our iTunes reviews, it's a common complaint. No, I'd seen scenes from this movie before. I'd seen the GIF. Of course. I'm familiar with the GIF. Had you used the GIF? I'd used the GIF.

Right. Yes. And now I feel even stronger about the GIF than I did when I first started using it. You have a new appreciation for that GIF. I would just use search term Angela Carr. That'll get you what you need, though. And that will get you the GIF, but it will not get you the contest. But if you look up Angela Carr, the GIF generally comes up.

Yes. But yeah, I saw it today. I've seen scenes of it over the years. It's one of my aunt's favorite movies. Yes. Shout out to your auntie. Shall I do the recap of the movie? Yes.

Wow, everyone loves it. Oh my goodness. And this will especially be helpful for the people who thought that we were going to talk about waiting. Waiting for Mulholland Drive. Waiting for Mulholland Drive. Yeah. So it's New Year's Eve. Yeah.

Yeah. The end. That's actually the beginning and the end. Yeah. New Year's Eve. Full circle. Like rent. Yeah. Full circle. Like rent. Yeah.

I believe we're in Phoenix, Arizona. We are. Where apparently a lot more black people live than I thought. Right? Right? That was my first thought watching that movie. I was like, woo, there's a lot of black people living in Phoenix. I'm from Atlanta.

I did not know. Phoenix is apparently the Atlanta of the Southwest. According to this film didn't it was news to me I don't know yeah absolutely uh so we meet four friends uh Savannah Jackson that's Whitney Houston's character Bernadine Harris is Angela Bassett Robin Stokes is uh Layla how do you say Rashaun and Gloria Matthews is Loretta Devine. They are all holding their breath, or some might say, waiting to exhale. Oh god.

Lots of flourishes in the recap today. I know. I wrote one out, just you know, to be... Is that in your doc? It's in my doc. I love it. There's color coding.

There is. As always, yes. It's six pages, eight point font. Yeah. So they're basically waiting until they find the right man. And the story centers around different relationships between men that are in their lives. So Savannah, she's moving to Whitney Houston. Yes.

Yes. Yeah. I feel like we're going to be switching a lot back and forth between character names and actors in this one. Definitely. Yeah. So the first guy in her life is Lionel. She meets him at a New Year's Eve party.

One of many slow dance scenes. Yeah. him at a New Year's Eve party. One of many slow dance scenes. And she says the title to the movie, sort of, which I was very excited about. Yeah, that was kind of corny. But I mean, Whitney Houston, acting was not what she was known for. Can we say that?

She can sing. She can sing, though. Her contribution to the soundtrack, which we will get to later, was very important. Here's what I'll say about Whitney Houston as an actress. She can sing. Exactly. Exactly.

An amazing thing. I think she did a pretty good job. Yeah. Okay. Back to lionel yeah so lionel they have sex in a really funny sex scene but he turns out to be like a cheap like freeloader dude so she's like get out of here on to the next one meanwhile we've got bernadine yeah she is married to this guy named john yes yes so she's married to this guy named john and he leaves her and her two kids on new year's eve on new year's eve yeah i know gasp yes gasp it up

it was shocking he comes in the room and she's like not feeling going to the new year's eve party right and he's like hey do you want to not go to the party? And she's like, oh, thank God. He's like, because I'm going with the woman I'm leaving you for. I was like, oh my God. Happy New Year. It's like they got a sitter and everything. And then he's like, hold on. Actually, this marriage is over. Right.

Insane. So then that's followed by a sequence where she takes all of his expensive things and then burns them and his car. I mean, where is her Oscar, folks? Where is Angela Bassett's Oscar? I mean, nobody does Despair and Rage like Angela Bassett. And, you know, this needs to be. Is there like an honorary Oscar that can be given to her now?

Yeah, retroactively. We need to go back. This needs to be, is there like an honorary Oscar that can be given to her? Can we like go retroactively? We need to go back. This needs to be recognized by someone. It's crazy because a lesser actress, it would have just sounded like a spewing exposition, which is what she's doing. She's like, I went to grad school. Hey, speaking of grad school. There was, I mean, like, she delivered just, like, one of her many, like, epic lines in the movie. Like, I was your white woman for 11 years.

And I'm like, yes, burn it all. Burn it all. It was amazing. It was amazing. I think that was the first time that I really learned what satisfaction really was. What gratification could really feel like. I felt it in that moment, even at that young age, I recognized. She lights the cigarette and then lights the car on fire and then the gift.

And you're just like, yeah, this is the best thing ever. I felt what she felt in that moment. And then the fire department comes in and is like, she's like, yeah, it's trash. Yeah, it's trash. That was trash. Slams the door That was trash. I was burning trash. That fireman was so baffled, but he also looked horny.

He did? And he knew not to take it further as well. He knew. He was like, alright, ma'am. Alright, don't do that again. He was like, I'm not going to get in the line of fire of whatever's happening. He has doors already slammed in your face. It's over. You're not. He's done.

Nothing's happening. He got his SAG card. Get out of there. You're done. Oh, my God. Yes. So, yeah, she burns all his stuff. And then she's, like, trying to get money from him or something.

My font is really small, so I can't read it. Well, there's, like, a big divorce. That yard sale? The yard sale, where she sells all his stuff for a dollar. A dollar? 17-year-old me thought, I mean, I was really appreciative of the petty, of the dollar yard sale. Grown-ass me is like, this was not a wise financial choice, boo. You didn't know what you were going to get in that divorce.

Meanwhile, I mean, you may not have a pot to piss in. Like, why are you selling his stuff for a dollar? I mean, you may not have a pot to piss in. Like, why are you selling his stuff for a dollar? I mean, that car alone. She burns everything and then sells the skis for one dollar? Absolutely not. Yeah, bad choice. Poor choices. But again, this whole movie is about poor judgment.

I recognize that now, you guys. I recognize it now. The pettiness in this movie is very strong. But in a very satisfying way. Black girl tragic, as I like to say. So then she's dealing with the grief of this divorce for the rest of the movie.

And then, meanwhile, we've got Robin. I feel like she would have been an Instagram thought in 2018. Just based on her behavior, some of her choices, I feel like she would have been on Instagram. Who agrees with doing the most? Yeah, okay.

Okay. Going live. Just wondering. Her first guy is Michael, who she works with. And she is not attracted to him. She called him a human submarine sandwich. She fat shames him a lot. She really did.

Yeah, it's not okay she came down hard but also we know that she i mean she makes it very clear she is physically repulsed by well she did yes and then he undermines her at work so she fires him so good for her guess what if you're bad at sex you're fired right right but this time women are doing it and then we meet gloria she is a single mother of a teenage donald fazan hello shout out to you scrubs clueless anyone josie and the pussycat anyone yes pre braces too and you can hear it in the line reads true bless his heart had a bad haircut all of that all of that it's a very convincing teenager and but why his mom was aresser. Like, why did he have a bad haircut? I don't know.

I'm just, questions that I'm asking now. I did not. He's just a rebel. He's like, my hair's gonna look like shit. I guess. And then,

her whole thing is she hasn't had sex in a long time. So she's extremely horny. Yes. Then, she says, a moment of silence.

I'm loving your takeaways, your synopses of these characters, this is hilarious that was a very strange moment I think it was my fault but I don't know so then we it's time for more Savannah's men troubles

a lot of vignettes a lot of fade outs a lot of badignettes. A lot of fade-outs. A lot of bad wigs. A lot of bad wigs. Her next guy. I also noticed that in retrospect. The bad wigs. We just want to put that out there.

Whitney didn't have some good wigs. But she could sing. Never forget. She could sing. The one thing in this movie she does not do. So when Houston starts seeing Kenneth, who I call Mr. Allstate, because he's the guy from the Allstate. You cannot look at him now without thinking about that.

It's so true. She was not in good hands at all. At all. Right. Because he is married, and he has a small child and they used to date but then he got married and then...

But wasn't he married when they were dating the first time? I don't know. I thought so. Right. Yeah, that was why they couldn't work out before

because, you know, the little matter of his wife and child, you know, that was complicating things. Not that that bothered Savannah's mother in the least.

Yeah. She's like, you need Savannah's mother in the least. Yeah. She's like, you need a man. All women do. I don't want you to be alone. Because I can't take care of you. Like me. Right. Like me.

Yes, exactly. And that storyline concludes with her dumping him and being like, I'm too good for you. Bye. Forever. And then calling her mom and being like, stop telling me to get married. Click. Also stop. Yeah.

Cosigning my side chick behavior. Like I'm, I'm gonna, I'm, I'm a reformed side chick now and I'm leaving that life. It's like, okay girl. Yeah. That was supposed to be one of the many moments where you're like, yes, but I'm just really like, it's about damn time I like I was I was much more disgusted with her I was much more disgusted with this movie in general actually re-watching it um than I was before because it was like oh yeah girl yes dumb pant it's like no you you really should not even be in the picture yeah

by the way get here right get here hey Jamie what do you say we take a real quick break and then we'll come back for more. Sounds good to me. All right. All right. was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th 2017 was murdered. There are crooks everywhere you look now. The situation is desperate. My name is Manuel Delia. I am one of the hosts of Crooks Everywhere, a podcast that unhurts the plot to murder a one-woman Wikileaks. Daphne exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. And she paid the ultimate price. Listen to Crooks everywhere on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Gianna Pradente. And I'm Jemay Jackson-Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline, a new podcast from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. When you're just starting out in your career, you have a lot of questions. Like, how do I speak up when I'm feeling overwhelmed? Or, can I negotiate a higher salary if this is my first real job? Girl, yes. Each week we answer your unfiltered work questions.

Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in experts who do, like resume specialist Morgan Santer. The only difference between the person who doesn't get the job and the person who gets the job is usually who applies. Yeah, I think a lot about that quote. What is it like you miss 100% of the shots you never take? Yeah, rejection is scary, but it's better than you rejecting yourself. Together, we'll share what it really takes to thrive in the early years of your career without sacrificing your sanity or sleep.

Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everybody, this is Matt Rogers. And Bowen Yang. We've got some exciting news for you. You know we're always bringing you the best guests, right? Well, this week we're taking it to the next level. The one, the only, Katherine Hahn is joining us on Lost Culture East. That's right.

The queen of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories, and of course the culture. I feel some Sandra Bernhardt in you. Oh my god. I would love it.

I have to watch Lost. Oh, you have to. No, I know. I'm so behind. Katherine Hanken's thing. Oh, I'm really good at karaoke. What's your song? Yeah, what's your song?

Oh, I love a ballad. I felt Bjork's music. I just was like, who is this person? I got to hawk this slalom, Luge. I'm not going gotta hawk this slalom, Rudy. Not hawk the slalom. I absolutely love it. It was somehow Shakespearean when you said it. It was somehow gorgeous.

Yee, my slok, you hollum. Listen to Las Culturistas on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Something rare about this movie that we don't get with movies with women in them ever is we know what everyone's job is, which is great. However, the way they show people doing their jobs is very like,

you know, it's sort of like in a science movie where they're like, chemicals, right? We know that Whitney Houston is a TV producer because she stands in front of screens. You don't get to actually see her producing. No. It's like, oh, well, she is there. Layla Rashan is at her office looking boss-like. Insurance.

Allstate, really. It's probably Allstate. Probably. Probably. She stands in front of a chart at one point, and we're like, oh, okay, yeah. Right. She could have been doing anything.

She could have been doing anything. And then Gloria's doing hair. I mean, we see her doing her job, and we know she's good at it. Everyone else is sort of just like, yeah, she's there, so probably it's fine. But I will say, I mean, even the little bit that they did show, like to me as a young woman, like that telegraph to me,

like that these were successful professional black women, right? And so like this is kind of what I envision like women in their, black women in their 30s being like, right? Except for the like not getting married part, because like I didn't really see that for my future. But I did see, yes, these women have jobs. They have their shit together. They are independent, whatever.

And so I'm thinking, yes, this is what this is supposed to be. Absolutely. And it is so genuinely hard to find movies where you see women doing their jobs at all. Yeah. So this movie goes above and beyond in that regard sadly even even this these crumbs we've we've we've got a chart we've got a chart and that is progress yeah and then bernadine has an mba and again speaking of grad school didn't get to get

it in the first time but i do have a master's degree in screenwriting from boston university i hate to bring it up yes yes you're using that right now yeah thank you okay so bernadine's the rest i'll go through this really quickly uh her next guy is herbert who she like spends one night with he's another married guy uh she keeps sleeping infidelity is okay in this movie why Why was it so okay? And she's the one who burned all of her ex-husband stuff for cheating on her. Yes. It's a little,

it sends mixed messages, Bernadine. Sure, sure. And then her, the final guy is James, played by Wesley Snipes. Right. Yeah.

No, don't clap for him. No. Because again, looking back, he was supposed to be like the one good guy in this movie you got well that's not true gregory hines too but like he was supposed to be the good guy in the movie after like so many of these trash men and like but he is not he's totally not right like he's hitting on you and you got a dying wife at the crib. Yeah. No. That was baffling to me.

No. And you're like, but no. No. No. No. Reject that impulse. This man is hitting on her. Feel bad for the dying spouse.

Don't feel bad for Wesley Snipes. Right. So for context for the Wesley Snipes character, he shows up out of nowhere, which is how all men in this movie show up. Sure. They're just suddenly in frame and taking control of the scene. It's very

exciting. But he shows up and he's talking to Angela Bassett and he is like, yeah, so crazy. My wife is dying. Right. And she's like, oh, so crazy. My wife is dying. And she's like, oh, do you want to have sex? And he's like, yeah. And then they go upstairs and he's like, just so you know, I love my dying wife.

P.S. she's white. Right. It's like, but she's still dying. It's like, I think the more important part here is that she's dying. She's dying right now? Possibly, I don't know, and I don't care, because I'm up in here in this hotel room with you. Let's make tonight beautiful.

And so Angela Bassett. No! And then Angela Bassett's like, okay, so she's dying. Let's split the difference and spoon while clothed no cause she was still like what do you wanna do that is true she was gonna go along

she was gonna go with go with that if he had been like alright but then yeah they end up spooning with all their like yeah

with all their clothes on and we're supposed to be like aww but again while they're spooning old girl is back home dying we've got

we've got a lady in chemo and he's spooning angela bassett everyone's worst fear romantic and then her story ends uh the divorce proceedings go through she wins a shit ton of money and and property and property yeah A lot of stuff. Yeah. Never forget. Then we've got Robin. Her. One of her guys is Michael. The submarine sandwich.

Submarine sandwich. Oh, right. And then Troy. Troy. Move on to Troy. Mikel T. Williamson. You know, he is an unsung hero.

This movie. I mean, those of you who have seen it know how hilarious he was from start to finish because I mean she was really trying to make that work because that's not anybody that you want to be your boyfriend for real like but she was at that point you know she's getting over Michael Troy comes into the picture and it's like could it get worse yes yeah I think he does crack but like let's talk about that. Because let's talk about, I mean, like she rolls up on him doing a line. And then, and then, and then Robin is on the phone with Savannah, a.k.a. Whitney Houston, having a conversation about somebody being a crackhead. Whitney Houston is trying to, girl, he's a crackhead.

It's like, well, you wouldn't know. I mean, wow, wow. Again, I totally missed that the first time around, but like. Time was not kind to that scene. Whitney Houston is like crack as whack, basically, to Robin. And I'm like, yes. It's hilarious. It is hilarious.

She knew all the crack behavior. Girl, he stole your wallet. Like, she knew! She was speaking from experience, and we... I wonder how she was really handling those scenes, like, looking back, because that was hilarious. That was hilarious. But that wasn't even the funniest part.

The funniest part was, you know, when he shows up drunk for the the barbecue and throws fruit at her throws fruit at Layla Rashan who throws it back with perfect aim by the way I wish I wish that that had not been out of frame because I would have loved to seen him get hit in the back of the head with the orange but leather wearing in the summertime I mean that was a classic scene because why did he have on that leather vest in Phoenix why did he have on that leather vest? In Phoenix. Why did he even own leather in Phoenix?

Like, I just, I don't know. And he was picking, he, in theory, was picking her up because he decided, he didn't ask her. He's like, you're going to meet my mom and my sister today. I'm showing up. I'm drunk and on crack, maybe. Possibly, probably. And I'm wearing a leather vest. Get outside. And she's like no i'm good i'm gonna

stay right here on this porch yeah thanks and that is like kind of the closest we get for that character of like standing up for herself but it's like but that sort of just seems like a given she stands up for herself later but we'll get to that yeah uh and yeah because her story ends with uh her old boyfriend rus, comes back into the picture and he's all like, I don't want to leave my wife either. They're,

all these men are married to someone else. Well, they're going to leave, but it's just not the right time. It's never the right time. My kid's birthday. A lot of those.

Totally the right time for me to come over, you know, slide through on the late night, but it's not the right time for me to leave. And then she dumps him once and for all uh but she's pregnant with his baby

and again you want to cheer this moment she's standing up for herself he's like coming over she's like no you can't come in he's like what you reading oh childhood choices what's that he's like backing out the door and she's like, yeah, it's yours and I'm keeping it. Again, we can't root for the side chick people. We cannot root for her. Good for you, you're having a baby. You're not gonna get another abortion, like whatever. But like, yeah, you were the mistress.

Yeah, this is not, I mean, mean yeah i'm not feeling it i'm not feeling the happy ending here for you there's a lot of i mean it just seems like sort of the the movie aims to do this flip of like the three women at the beginning of the movie who were like i need a man end up not with a man and then the one woman gloria who's like i'm raising my son and i'm giving to everyone ends up with a man. So they just sort of like flip the original intention. But in cases like that, it's like, oh, but they're not thinking too hard about it.

Well, Angela Bassett's going to get a man just as soon as white woman breast cancer dies. Right? Because her man is on the way. She has a really sinister, like, big sports clock in her kitchen. I don't even, I'm not going to rewind. Countdown to death. Right, because after you sent that letter, it was like, yeah, keep me posted.

Yeah. She's like, you know, I'll just, here's my email. Just invite me to the funeral. I sort of a, oh my God, a subtweet to when I can. It's brutal. It's brutal. Right. And Jamie, as you mentioned, Gloria, she's the only one who ends up with the man, her

neighbor, Marvin. Although before that, she has a brief interaction with her son's dad, David, who is like, I used to be bi, but now I'm gay, which he said he changed his mind. It's like, oh my God, 1995, get it together. But you know what, though? That part was interesting, too, because again, thinking back to that era, you had a lot of conversation in black culture about like the download phenomenon

of black men and so it was like oh this dude is supposed to like you know be not typical but like exemplary of of this phenomenon like she she didn't have any idea and then you like he ends up coming out to her you know because she's trying to keep something going and he's like oh actually I should let you know this is where I'm at now. And it's like, okay. And then, well, we haven't gotten to the birthday party yet, but they're lamenting that the good men are gay or unavailable.

Right. That whole scene plays very weird. What, the birthday scene? Well, the birthday scene plays very weird. The weird coming out scene. very weird where what the birthday scene the well the birthday is very weird the the weird uh coming out yeah yeah that whole scene you're just like i see what you're going for and i respect it however everything is weird they're like i don't want you they even do like he's wearing earrings like they're sub-tweeting the out of you in this scene and he also had on an auntie wig but i mean

actually that's probably like his real hair, but it was cut like an auntie wig. But it's like all this stuff. And then he comes out to her in a very 1995 white guy adaptation of a story way. And he's like, I was bi. I changed my mind. Sorry. And her original reaction to that is, oh, if you're not attracted to me like just tell

me and like she that she was taking it personally and thought that he was just trying to get out of the situation he's like no i'm gay and i'm leaving and then he leaves and that's sort of it yeah it's very and then donald fazon's reaction to that is even we can get into that in a moment but yeah it's bad to be clear we recognize that sexuality is fluid and maybe of course but yeah the way it's handled in this movie is like oh that's that's not your intention but that's like not that's not what you were trying to say. It's just a mess, the way they treat sexuality in this movie. But then she ends up with Marvin, who seems really nice. He did seem nice.

I mean, Gregory Hines, he did not seem like the type of person that should have been messing over one of these ladies. And his wife is dead. His wife is definitely dead, so he's available, right? And Gloria made sure she got the 411 on him like right away right yeah yeah yeah and then plied him with soul food and um sandwiches you know until he finally yeah exactly that shit worked because women be making food all the time women be nurturing this uh and you may have noticed that uh the way I framed all of these storylines was around the men

because the women do not end up on screen together that much. They're four best friends, but I think they're only on screen together for like 20-ish minutes total. That may be true, actually. I mean, they're at the club together and they're having the birthday party yeah there's like that one random gratuitous scene of them coming out of church together yep that's about a 10 seconds either uh two of them are at a carnival at one point you know talking about abortion yeah they were on a ferris wheel talking about oh no that was two carnival scenes i'm thinking about the other one where they're like drunk at that park or wherever they were. I don't know.

I'm like. There is a Ferris wheel scene. There is. Yeah. That's fun. Oh, the other one, they're at an ostrich race. Yes. They're.

Well, I mean, again, they're in Phoenix. Like, what are they doing? But they're at. What are they doing? They're at an ostrich race. And then Angela Bassett opens the scene by saying this is boring

and then she's like by the way I helped someone cheat on their wife last night how do you feel about it such a weird scene

the most jarring part of that scene for me is saying ostrich racing is boring cause like you've been given a gift exactly what do you so that's pretty much the story of the movie the extent of their ostrich racing is boring. I was like, you've been given a gift. What are you?

So that's pretty much the story of the movie. At the very end, it's New Year's Eve again, presumably the following year, but who knows how much time has passed. Who knows? Too much. It's six years later.

No, she's pregnant. It was like totally a year. Oh, that's true. Yeah. They're like, oh, we don't need men. We've got a car and friends. First of all, no.

Again, watching this now, my first thought in that last scene, why the fuck aren't they at Angela Bassett's house in Acapulco? Right? Okay. If I am going to be spending New Year's with you bitches, I want to be in Acapulco. Because where are they? They're in a lot. They're in a vacant lot.

They're nowhere. They're burning stuff again. They're still in Phoenix. Still in Phoenix is where they are. P.S. Gloria's got a man now. I'm shocked that she ditched Marvin to be with these chicks. Right. Invite Marvin. Donald Faison's in Spain. That's a whole thing. He's definitely

gone. Donald Faison's like, why can't I go to Spain? And I love saying like homophobic slurs. That's his whole character. Oh, and also at one point, Gloria busts in on him getting his dick sucked. Very jarring.

No one, Donald Faison pre-braces getting sucked off is not something anyone's ready for. It's just not. I wasn't. I was in no, I was like

I was as shocked as Gloria. I know. I was like, get out of her, out of his shed? Where does he live? He's living in the pool house, he's in the pool house. I guess. I was like, that's a very nice shed that he's getting sucked off in, I guess. I was like, that's a very nice shed that he's getting sucked off in, I guess.

I don't know. As one does. God. What is Phoenix like? No thanks. So, Erin, you have said that you grew up with this movie. It was an iconic movie for you, but now as an adult re-watching this in today's era,

tell us about how it's different for you or how just your thoughts on how black women are represented. I mean, I think it speaks to the fact that just the under-representation, you still don't see, you know, these kind of relationships really portrayed in this way on the big screen. I mean, like think about how excited people were

about Girls Trip, you know, I mean, and that movie, you know, is coming, you know, 30 years later. So people recognize that, you know, because we don't really get this, like any kind of representation like this, and especially because these women were the stars that they were at the time, like you really were so excited for this movie.

But like in retrospect, yeah, these are not people that I really would want to root for, I mean, except for Gloria. I did not feel myself rooting for any of them and their storylines this time around. It was just kind of like, I literally am looking at each one of them like, girl, get it together, like, wake up.

No, like, no. Yeah, I was literally just yelling at the screen at multiple points because I was just like one of them to be making better choices. And also just I was not as willing to put as much blame on some of these men as I would have been. Like when I was young thinking, oh, these are great women. Like, you know, what is you know, what is wrong with these men? It's like, no, actually, they are making poor choices. Like these are not people. Yeah, you shouldn't be with with any of these dudes but also like why do you keep picking these trash people right well the big thing for me about this movie is i was

coming and expecting it to be a movie about black female friendship and i was like i can't wait to like just like see them interact on screen and then the whole movie was is totally framed they're totally defined by like the men who they're with or who they want to be with every storyline is about the men in their lives and i was like boring right and that's like the most frustrating thing about i mean seeing like a movie that's built around female friendship being sort of thrown away and like this really lazy writing kind of way of like well they're female friends so we can use that as a conduit to talk about how they consider the men in their lives to be like what defines them absolutely like by the time you get to the birthday like the living room birthday scene like that you wish

that that could have been like most of the movie because like you have like every friend that you need is in that room right like somebody that's going to talk you down from bad choices somebody that's actually maybe if you are going to make bad choices ready to go along with that shit like let's go you know when bernadine is drunk and ready to call and cuss john out you know robin Robin is right there. Right. Dial that number, you know. And, like, you know, that one friend that's kind of, like, neutral and just kind of hanging back to kind of see what happens. Like, that is, and they go through, like, the range of emotions, like, in that one night as girls do when they get together and open them away.

Okay. I mean, they're having a good time. They're crying. You know, they're talking about men, but they're also just kind of talking about their lives and it's like yes more of this please and it's more fun to watch than the 900 scenes of one of the characters deciding to be a side check to someone else's marriage because that is what most of the movie is or having bad sex with somebody who is single but those things are really funny though those are and those Those are sad sex scenes.

And those are like female gaze scenes where there's that scene with Michael where you see the fucking flop sweat on his... He's character acting the shit out of that scene. He is. He's like, uh, ooh, ee, I love sex. And you're like, oh my God, he's so much. I wonder how things worked out for him after that for a while.

Probably a boy now. Yeah, I bet he was in like. Well, he even ends up at the club with another woman. Oh no, I mean in real life. Oh, I see. Let's look him up. Right, exactly. I feel like he has 200 movie credits.

But also Lionel. I mean, that sex scene was pretty terrible too. Right. And comical. Yeah. Whitney Houston's face in that is priceless. She's like. Because he's making like. He'sston's face and that is she's like because he's making like he's like growling yeah and she's like no thing no she's like i don't want to go to

the zoo or something she's like i'm the zoo i guess i'm the zookeeper yeah yeah i do appreciate how like sex positive this movie is though that's a line from the movie true yeah very sex positive uh because they're like at some point every character is like i'm so horny and the other women are like yeah and go get some like they are very supportive never like slut shaming anything like that yeah well with that let's take a quick break shall we let's shall and we'll be right back definitely caruana galicia was a maltese investigative journalist who on october 16th 2017 was murdered there are crooks everywhere you look now the situation is desperate my name is manuel delia i am one of the hosts of Crooks Everywhere, a podcast that unhurts the plot to murder a one-woman Wikileaks.

Daphne exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. And she paid the ultimate price. Listen to Crooks Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Gianna Pradenti. And I'm Jimei Jackson-Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline, a new podcast from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. When you're just starting out in your career, you have a lot of questions like,

how do I speak up when I'm feeling overwhelmed? Or can I negotiate a higher salary if this is my first real job? Girl, yes. Each week, we answer your unfiltered work questions. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in experts who do, like resume specialist Morgan Sanner. The only difference between the person who doesn't get the job and the person who gets the job is usually who applies. Yeah, I think a lot about that quote. What is it like you miss 100% of the shots you never take? Yeah, rejection is scary, but it's better than you rejecting yourself. Together, we'll share what it really takes

to thrive in the early years of your career without sacrificing your sanity or sleep. Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everybody, this is Matt Rogers. And Bowen Yang. We've got some exciting news for you. You know we're always bringing you the best guests, right?

Well, this week we're taking it to the next level. The one, the only, Katherine Hahn is joining us on Lost Culture East. That's right. The queen of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories, and of course, the culture. I feel some Sandra Bernhardt in you. Oh my God, I would love it. I have to watch Lost.

Oh, you have to. No, I know, I'm so behind. Katherine Hahn can sing. Oh, I'm really good at karaoke. What's your song? Yeah, what's your song? Oh, I love a ballad. I felt Bjork's music.

I just was like, who is this person? I got to hawk this slalom, Luge. Not hawk the slalom. I absolutely love it. It was somehow Shakespearean when you said it. It was somehow gorgeous. Yee, my slok, you hollum. Listen to Las Culturistas on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. There's that scene with Gloria and the neighbor. The scene where she meets the neighbor is such a horny scene. It's so crazy. She's looking at him like a sandwich. I knew this was an adapted work but there are some scenes where you can very much feel it because they're like having loud

monologues to themselves in front of the other character you're like he is right there where where she's walking away and it's like after it's there's a vibe and then she's going back home and then she's like i hope he's not watching me walk away and then turns around it's like he is i was like he's four feet away from you right right saunters off across the street speaking of monologues can we talk about bernadine's monologue as she's like throwing away and burning all of john's stuff it was epic yes uh because she's touching on stuff like the man like his expectations of me is that i was gonna like be the background to his foreground yes i mean she's talking about that she's talking about how he didn't want the kids to go to a certain school because he didn't want

the improper influence right she's talking about how she wanted to start a business but he told her no. I mean, yeah, she's just, I mean, yeah, she was airing a lot of shit on her way to that garage with those back and forth trips. It's fully earned, yeah. Where she even, like you see his organized closet, you're like, oh no.

Yes. Things are about to be mismatched. And just how quickly it happened too though i mean because like it starts off like she's in the bed right she's miserable she's crying gets up makes a pot of coffee and hits that closet and 15 it puts the kids on the bus and 15 minutes later that's it's a bonfire baby in the driveway and you're just like and then she's on the couch watching cartoons and then later on there's the scene where uh her husband has just had the kids for a weekend and he brings them back and they oh my god her facial expressions so good again nobody does rage like angela bassett like the the death stare that she is

giving this dude when he is dropping those kids off and how she just immediately just on a dime goes from that to like being loving mom to these kids as they're coming home and clearly they're like siding with her and love her so much and they're just like dad is trash. All right, then I'm back. But like, yeah, that. But also another Angela Bassett classic is when she busts up in that office when he clears out. Oh, yes. I do want to talk about that.

That is a scene. Yes. Because she comes in, she's like yelling. And then the first thing she does is slap Kathleen, his mistress across the face. Yes. I felt rewarded in that moment. It was very rewarding.

See, I kind of... Where is that gift? Like, that should be... That is underused if that is a gift that is out there. And if not, if anybody in here has those kind of skills or capabilities, please go ahead and get that going on Twitter so that I can begin to... See, I found that moment a little troubling because... Oh?

I think we talked about this on i have as a white woman or for some other reason why was it troubling yeah that's why that's why no uh race completely aside we talked about this on our cruel intentions episode uh where women who get wronged by a man by them cheating on them, there's a tendency because women are so generally pitted against each other in society for the one who was cheated on

to blame the other woman. And then a lot of the men kind of like get off scot-free or they're not held as accountable. So I mean, I understand her anger and frustration. I thought that went up in my head as well. But then it's like she's just as mad, if not angrier, at her husband. That's totally true. And also, I mean, this woman, she was in between her and the husband.

If she had stepped out of the way, we may not even have been there. She should have just stepped to the right. Like, if we're being honest. Like, it not even have been there sure she should have just stepped to the right I mean like if we're being honest like if it had been if it would not have been me but had it been me I would have just slid on over because I mean you see the tornado coming yeah oh yeah and you just are sitting here you stand up and start to speak absolutely not absolutely not and then this but when she I mean god when she finally does light into him i mean she doesn't hit him but i mean her unleashing on him when he's talking oh yeah by the way i'm thinking about coming to pick up my kids and she's like oh god you guys you guys know what she says she's like

if you have them anywhere near that tramp bitch and she leans into that with everything that she has. Again, where's her Oscar? I just, it was so good. It seems like her rage is sort of distributed. Everyone who's wronging her is receiving a rat. Let me be clear. There are many white women who should be slapped by black women. Any woman who voted for Trump, basically. It's tricky. I mean, and that comes up again later in the Wesley Snipes scene

where it's like a reveal to Angela Bassett that because he says, it's just like, I don't know, I'm interested in how you, because it's all over the place. If he's like, I'm a civil rights lawyer and I'm which by the way is catnip for like a professional black woman you throw that

out there and it's like I'm sorry what I love you I'm sorry what what but then they go upstairs and he's like remember that dying wife I told you about she's white and then and then Angela Bassett's like, remember that dying wife I told you about? She's white. And then Angela Bassett's like, that hurts like hell.

Yeah, it's weird the way they, and I read that in the book, that is not how that scene goes and that's not how that story goes. In the book, the Wesley Snipes character wants to divorce his wife. Who is white in the book. His wife. Sorry.

He wants to divorce his dying white wife and it wasn't working before she got sick and then she got sick and then he's like, well I've gotta, for lack of a better phrase, ride this out. I'm so sorry. We do need a better phrase damn but and that sort of i think is a more effective story choice to be like the marriage is over and it was over but in this

version he's like i love her deeply and then angela which makes angela bassett's choice seem bizarre or like her being like let's fuck anyways yeah but i mean clearly she was already cool with uh one-offs with married dudes i mean we saw that yeah which is crazy because she's so mad at right like her husband and that white woman it is crazy like cheated on her i don't know it's confusing and a lot of this is, I mean, I would hazard to guess adaptation issues from the book to the movie. But maybe somebody, whoever, I'm forgetting who wrote this. Oh, a white guy wrote it. Maybe that makes him more endearing.

It was the author of the book, Terry. Oh, well, never mind. But also a white guy. A white guy. No, of course. Well, no, that's true. I could see what they ended up coming up with for the movie, though. Like, in some people's minds, making him more endearing.

Because at the time, like I said, I mean, I was like, oh, this is so sad. Like, you know, if only they'd met, you know, in another lifetime or whatever. It's like, no, they're meeting in this lifetime and she's dying. And so step out of the... Why are you even sitting down next to her ordering Hennessy? Why? Right?

Why are you hitting on this woman as your wife actively passes away? I don't know. But there is like a Bell Hooks piece written, just a few movies after this movie came out, and Bell Hooks does not like this movie. She knew. Very much, yeah.

She knew. but like you were saying erin before we came out like she was a full-grown right you know she was she wasn't 17 right when this and that's when like we talk about all the time like the movies you see while your brain is still squishy and you're trying to understand the world using the media around you it it shapes your view of the world uh bell hooks was formed by the time she saw this she was not having it she was not having it and she writes about in her piece that there was a white guy screenwriter actively involved in giving recommendations on how this should be adapted and so stuff like stuff that changes markedly from the book like the wesley

snipes stuff is like at the suggestion and push of some rando Hollywood white guy. Imagine. So adaptations are fucked. Show me a good adaptation. Doubt? Doubt. That's true. That's true.

Touche. But doubt was, I mean, they just let John Patrick Shanley go for it check out John Patrick Shanley's Twitter it's fucking weird he posts a selfie before he goes to bed don't ruin this for me he's like good night I don't know anyways anyways this movie was a box office success. Yes. It opened at number one. Yeah. Again, black women were, they were ready for this movie. It was a critical, like, mixed review.

Sure. Because Angela Bassett. But also Whitney Houston. She can sing. Yeah. She can definitely sing other final thoughts yeah whether it was like other stuff you wanted to i mean like i said the only thing that was better than this movie for me at that time was the soundtrack which frankly still holds up right i mean babyface you know the king of rm 90s r&b you know he it. But all of the songs were by black women. And so, I mean, I'm talking about, obviously, Whitney gets to be on the soundtrack.

But, I mean, you had Brandy. You had Aretha, Chaka Khan, TLC. I mean, like, and Mary J. Blige. Yes. I mean, it was a soundtrack for the ages. Like, for real. And I'm not going gonna start singing along here Right now we can if you want to but I mean like seriously like

I've done not gonna cry at karaoke before it's a lot It's emotional the one thing that we didn't quite hit on was donald fazan's reaction to finding out his father is gay like it it is a weird it was foul it is not good yeah basically what happens is gloria accidentally outs right david and then she realizes that she's made a mistake to be fair she's shocked because she just saw donald faz on getting sucked off in a shit pool house so you're right you're right you're right and then his reaction is extremely bizarre because he uses a series of homophobic slurs and then says it's all the same thing right right he doesn't totally minimizes it and then it's like well at least

it didn't run in the family remember when you saw me getting sucked off mom it was like why is this the way this goes yeah so yeah and then that never gets cleaned up or resolved or whatever I mean cause like that's just it never really he just gets to go to Spain right like that's how that ends

right so though I mean the way this movie deals with queerness is uh two thumbs down is not good and i would uh argue that there's a stylist character in gloria's salon who is queer coded because gay men can only be stylists as we see in every movie ever but i will say i mean like the gay black the gay black man who's doing hair is very real. And shout out to all the ones

that I've had in my life that have kept me late. I appreciate them. Now, I mean, was he over the top and dramatic? Maybe. But also,

do I know some black men doing hair who are like that? Oh, sure. Absolutely. Absolutely. And so maybe, I don't know if they appreciated doing hair who are like, absolutely, absolutely. And so maybe, I don't know if they appreciated being seen in this film or not. Obviously, he's not representative of all gay black men.

Sure, absolutely. You know what I mean? It's weird because it's like seeing queer characters in this movie, seeing queer characters in movies in 1995 in a way that isn't like they're a punchline is something, it's something in the right direction, in 1995 in a way that isn't like they're a punchline is something, it's something in the right direction but it just doesn't quite, it doesn't go there

and it doesn't fully realize those characters. Cause he is like messy and he's the one who like tells Bernadine's business to like the rest of the girls and you know it's like. It's imagine a movie in 1995 is just not perfect. Right. My last thing was I like the scene, this is just not perfect right my last thing was i like this scene this is just a straight thought i like the scene where bernadine gets mad and cuts her own hair because gloria won't do it listen oh baldest woman in charge that was yes the baldest woman in charge rule holds true yeah

yeah no when a woman chops her hair off watch watch out. Yeah. I mean, Mulan. And get out of the way. Get ready. She's going to war. Something's about to go down. Right. Yeah. No, for real.

Yeah. All right. I think that... Did we get there? Did we do it? Does this movie pass the Bechdel test? A couple of very brief two like, two-line exchanges. Yeah, a lot of two-liners in this one.

17-year-old Aaron would have said, absolutely. Yeah. Grown-ass Aaron says, I don't know. Well, let me make a case for it. Savannah at one point says, nice house, Bernadine. Bernadine says. You know what? You know what, Caitlin?

You are really reaching right now. You are really reaching. Okay. She responds, at $5, you can have it. Then they talk about John for a few minutes. Right, because this conversation is happening as her home video footage is playing in the background yes yeah so that negates that next um true robin and gloria have a brief conversation about manicures and robin's job because she

because she's like blowing off work to maybe get a manicure. To please a man, probably. And Gloria was also going to charge her by the finger for that polish. Some friend. I feel like that one passes.

I don't know. It's one of those movies, though, that however many things we break down, the subtext of the whole movie is men. So it just gets harder. The longer we do this podcast,

we're just like, the subtext of the world is men, apparently. So how the fuck are we supposed to pass this damn test? Yeah, I was even thinking about, remember when Savannah calls her mom and her mom is talking about her like financial situation yeah I'm reaching it's I mean I think

we never learned her name the mom's name first name I don't think so maybe that one I don't think I didn't care I feel like moms I think get a pass on the Bechdel test mom I don't know mama

Bernadine and her daughter who is named onika yes talk about words yes they do the word freak specifically there you go i think i mean i think this movie does pass the vectal test a couple of times but i mean it's one of those things where it's like given the fact that the marketing of this movie was like, for women, like for black women, and this is their friendship, it should pass way more than it does. Yeah. So, I mean, it passes, but not as much as it, or any movie with four female leads should.

Shall we rate on our nipple scale? Let's do it. Okay. So, in terms of like, I love that there's a movie that's representative of four strong black women who, yes, do have many lapses in judgment throughout the film.

But because the movie isn't really, the core of the movie isn't so much about their friendship. It's more about how these women are relating to men and having relationships with men. And even when the women are together they're almost exclusively talking about men so that is disappointing and there are like kind of those brief moments of feminism where you know bernadine's like i'm tired of like not being able to pursue my own thing i have an mba damn it like i want to open a catering business right but then she spends the rest of the movie trying to have sex with married men right like they could have

showed her focusing on her catering business that's where i thought the story was going with her but like that doesn't even come up again whose wife is dying like you're shaking him down for alimony when you could be making that catering business hopefully she invests that 1.5 million dollars in that business so one can hope but yeah so representation wise because there are so few movies with a an all-black cast like this the fact that it was financially successful that people got to go see it is great but the stories and while the characters are like distinguishable and you know we see representation of successful black women which is unfortunately a rare thing in mainstream movies they are entirely framed around the men in their lives and should have been more about their friendship

i think yeah that success was limited because they hadn't found love and right marriage yeah so i'm gonna give it uh i'll give it a three nips no well that's generous i know right I'm wrong, right? Two? Two and a half. You can't crowdsource your opinion. Y'all see it now. Y'all see it now. Look, I'm easily influenced. So what I meant to say, I'm going to give it two and a half nipples.

This is my own thinking. Everyone's. And I will give one to Angela Bassett, one to Whitney Houston's singing voice. The soundtrack. Yeah. And my half nipple will go to Gloria and Robin. And their friendship that we barely see.

Erin, what do you say? Yeah, I'm going to go with two nipples. One for Angela Bassett because, I mean, she was just everything in this movie. Probably the best thing to me about this movie. And then one for Gloria because, again, she's the only one that seems to have a positive outcome by the end. So, yeah, that's all the nipples I have for this movie.

I'll go two and a half, and just to tie on to what everyone is saying, movies that are supposed to be about female friendship that secretly aren't about female friendship and are about the men and how they define their lives are insidious and evil and don't do that come on uh so i'm giving one to angela one to gloria and half to that guy's dying wife like give her a fucking break uh all right aaron thank you so much for being here thanks for having me thank you guys

where can we find you online where can we find your work so I am on twitter very easy at emarvelous and I am on all my stories are on apnews.com and you can find us on Bechtelcast across all your platforms

get t-shirts blah blah blah there's a show coming in we love you so much give it up for Kate Banford and everyone at Good Good Comedy Theater and give it up for yourselves hey everyone it's Caitlin on behalf of Jamie and I we just

wanted to give another shout out to Kate Banford and everyone at the Good Good Comedy Theater. Thank you so much for having us there and for letting us do our live show. We had so much fun. And to listeners, if you're ever in Philadelphia, go and check that theater out. It's a great comedy venue with a lot of great shows. Thank you again so much to our guest, Erin Haines-Wack. She was so awesome, and we had so much fun talking to her. And then just the usual stuff,

a quick reminder about our West Coast tour. We still have tickets for our San Francisco show on January 20th. We are covering The Breakfast Club. We have tickets to our show in Portland on January 23rd. We are covering Fight Club for that show. And then on January 24th in Seattle, Jamie and I are going to be doing a stand-up show. And tickets to all of those shows are on our website. So if you go to Bechtelcast.com and click on the live appearances tab, you'll be able to find all the links to get tickets to those shows and then also on our website is the link to our merch store or you could just go to tpublic.com slash the bechtel cast and that's where you'll find all of our t-shirts our sweatshirts our stickers and phone cases mugs we've pillows even, whatever your little heart desires.

And then be on the lookout for some new designs in the new year. Wow. And then as always, you can follow us on social media at Bechtelcast. Please rate and review us on iTunes and give us a little five star or a five nipple rating because that helps us out a lot. And then we just wanted to say from both of us, thank you so much to you, our listeners, for your ongoing support. It's been a wild year, but you know, we've really enjoyed communicating with you online and hearing your suggestions for episodes and everything like that. So thanks again and a happy new year. And may all your New Year's wishes come true.

All right, bye. Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th, 2017, was assassinated. Crooks everywhere unearths the plot to murder a one-woman WikiLeaks. She exposed the culture of crime and corruption, Hey, I'm Gianna Pradenti. wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Gianna Pradenti. And I'm Jermaine Jackson-Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. There's a lot to figure out

when you're just starting your career. That's where we come in. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in people who do, like negotiation expert Mori Tahiripour. If you start thinking about negotiations as just a conversation, then I think it sort of eases us a little bit. Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio

app, Apple Podcasts, this week, we're taking it to the next level. The one, the only, Katherine Hahn is joining us on Las Culturistas. That's right, the queen of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation

that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories, and of course, the culture. Don't miss Katherine Hahn on Las Culturistas. Listen to Las Culturistas

on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Don't miss Katherine Hahn on Las Culturistas.