The Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous Podcast - The OTHER Ben from Indiana

Episode Date: November 10, 2021

Get to know the guy that Ben and Ashley wish was The Bachelor! Ben Smith (from Tayshia’s season) is here to get real about his experience baring all on the show. He tells us the honest reason why we didn’t see him in Paradise and we get a hint that he might be returning to your TV screen sooner than you’d think! Plus, Ben reveals which members of Bachelor Nation didn’t get an invite to his wedding!  Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hi, my name is Enya Eumanzor. And I'm Drew Phillips. And we run a podcast called Emergency Intercom. If you're a crime junkie and you love crimes, we're not the podcast for you. But if you have unmedicated ADHD... Oh my God, perfect. And want to hear people with mental illness, psychobabble.

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the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What would you do if one bad decision forced you to choose between a maximum security prison or the most brutal boot camp designed to be hell on earth? Unfortunately for Mark Lombardo, this was the choice he faced. He said, you are a number, a New York State number, and we own you. Listen to shock incarceration on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I just normally do straight stand-up, but this is a bit different. What do you get when a true crime producer walks into a comedy club?

Answer, a new podcast called Wisecrack, where a comedian finds himself at the center of a chilling true crime story. Does anyone know what show they've come to see? It's a story. It's about the scariest night of my life. This is Wisecrack, available now. Listen to Wisecrack on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Don't let biased algorithms or degree screens or exclusive professional networks or stereotypes.

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I just arrived about 10 minutes ago getting ready now for my wedding this Saturday. Yes, I said last week I didn't know if I'd be here or not, but I just can't stay away for that long. I thought two weeks off was too much. And plus, Ashley, I had to hear in person about your big news. You and Jared have had huge, huge news this week that I thought that I really just wanted to hear about. Oh, it's been a big week for us. One, we have, well, there's two weddings in our lives this weekend, one being Ben's. Jared has his other best friends, the one, the girl who signed him up for The Bachelor.

That wedding is the day before in Cancun, and he's just going to be a flying crazy mess. I'm not going to Cancun because I don't know that that would be the best for me in this third trimester as I approach it this week. I'm burying the lead. Jared and I became aunt and uncle last night. E! So cute. We haven't met our niece yet, though. Yeah, the COVID restrictions are really strict.

It's all, like, kind of dependent on hospital and maybe state, I'm not sure. like the hospital I'm delivering at that's not an issue like my sister and Jared can be in the delivery room I can have like one other person like my parents can visit but like at the hospital

that she's at we can't so babies are just going to be all over the place all over the Havens yep it's so crazy we were a trimester apart which was really fun we were like exactly 13 weeks apart

which is crazy well congratulations to you guys and the Haven family that's just such a cool deal and what a thing to celebrate and then yeah I have a lot of love for Jared the fact that he's even trying and he will but he's attempting to make it to the wedding which is such a will no attempts here I know it's just cool it's a big deal that he's even doing it and oh well there's just shows me that's who Jared is right very very important weddings they are I get that but in the midst of setting up a business in the midst of setting up a business

in the midst of two weddings, he's still going to make it happen. We just need to take a second to realize that Jared's just the best. Like, he's just a good dude. He's the best, and he's been working his butt off. So it'll all pay off soon. But, yeah, tell me about the opening of the generous shop in Soho. Yeah, so there's a shop in Soho now on West Broadway. I just got back today.

It's serving generous coffee. it's called the Good Market. So the Good Market is a place where 30 different for-purpose brands are being represented underneath one roof. So you can walk in and you can buy some of the brands that you might even know, like sackcloth and ashes and able and generous mud love,

which is a really popular pottery company out of Worst, Indiana, actually, but it's everywhere now. And so you can walk in and buy them. And in the back, generous coffee is being served up at the cafe. So go in and stop if you're in New York City. in the Soho neighborhood, say hey, and then tell them, I sent you. I don't think you get a discount, but I think you just might get a high five. And that would be worth it.

As we get started today, we want to mention our batch bracket rule of the week. The batch bracket rule of the week is for week five, you get 10 plus points every time a contestant is seen holding Michelle's hand. Oh my goodness. That's going to be a lot of points spread out this week. Uh, guys, we have a very cool guest in the podcast today. His name is Ben Smith. You may not have, um, he may not have crossed your mind lately, but he was such a big figure on Tasha's season. So we're really exciting to, we're really excited to catch up with him.

And we're going to do so after this break. Imagine that you're on an airplane and all of a sudden you hear this. Attention passengers. The pilot is having an emergency, and we need someone, anyone, to land this plane. Think you could do it? It turns out that nearly 50% of men think that they could land the plane with the help of air traffic control. And they're saying like, okay, pull this, until this. Do this, pull that, turn this.

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Those who lack expertise lack the expertise they need to recognize that they lack expertise. And then, as we try the whole thing out for real. Wait, what? Oh, that's the run right. I'm looking at this thing. Listen to no such thing on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, my name is Enya Umanzor. And I'm Drew Phillips.

And we run a podcast called Emergency Intercom. If you're a crime junkie and you love crimes, we're not the podcast for you. But if you have unmedicated ADHD... Oh my God, perfect. And want to hear people with mental illness, psychobabble. Yes, yes. Then Emergency Intercom is the podcast for you. Open your free IHeartRadio app.

Search Emergency Intercom and listen now. What would you do if one bad decision forced you to choose? between a maximum security prison or the most brutal boot camp designed to be hell on earth. Unfortunately for Mark Lombardo, this was the choice he faced. He said, you are a number, a New York State number, and we own you. Shock incarceration, also known as boot camps, are short-term, highly regimented correctional programs that mimic military basic training. These programs aim to provide a shock of prison life, emphasizing strict discipline,

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Your entire identity has been fabricated. Your beloved brother goes missing without a trace. You discover the depths of your mother's illness, the way it has echoed and reverberated throughout your life, impacting your very legacy. Hi, I'm Danny Shapiro. And these are just a few of the profound and powerful stories I'll be mining on our 12th season of Family Secrets.

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The Super Secret Festi Club Podcasts, Season 4 is here. And we're locked in. That means more juicy cheesement. Terrible love advice. Evil spells to cast on your ex. No, no, no, no. We're not doing that this season.

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I'm just like text your ex. My theory is that if you need to figure out that the stove is hot, go and touch it. Go and figure it out for yourself. Okay. That's us. That's us. My name is Curley. And I'm Maya.

In each episode, we'll talk about love, friendship, heartbreak, men, and, of course, our favorite secrets. Listen to the Super Secret Bestie Club as a part of the Michael Tura podcast network available on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Okay, guys, we have Ben Smith on the podcast, and it's the first time, even though he was such a prominent contestant last year on Tasia and Claire's season. Ben, hey, where have you been? Why haven't you visited us? Well, this is the first time I've been invited. Stop that, no. They keep you guys from us. Yeah. Lock you up. I'm happy to be here. I hear. that you're pregnant. The last time I saw you, you weren't pregnant, and I hear you're pregnant now. I'm super much so. And it's... How are you? I'm Ms. I'm pretty mis. I try not to complain

because, like, you know, blessed, right? But also, just like my body doesn't like it. But thank you for asking. Yeah. Well, your spirits seem high. That's cool. Thanks. I can fake it for a while. I just want to let you know that at one point, a couple weeks ago, I told Ashley, she's like beautiful. and she's like, no, I'm not. I'm so angry. I get like, I get really triggered by like the glow thing. I think it's like really toxic for women to have to like feel like they should glow. No.

Well, you seem like you're doing all right, even though it's miserable. Thank you. And Ben, congrats on your wedding. That seems like a cool thing. Thank you. Was this a good decision to still record a podcast to one day before guests arrive and 10 minutes after entering into Nashville. But that's how important you are. I appreciate it.

Well, to answer your question, Ashley, I've just been living my life. I have a business here in Los Angeles, so I've been pretty stuck working with that, not stuck, but I've been pretty focused on building that and the gym space that I own here and the community that we're slowly growing. The world's starting to open up a bit again, you know, especially here on the West Coast. And so we've got this new opportunity to like finally go full speed with everything. So I've been pretty committed and, you know, focused on that. So, like, that's, I guess that's the reason why I haven't come on the show,

but also maybe have been, like, a little bit at my A, just because I'm focused on on all the stuff that I've got going on in my life. So you, like, jumped into business, entrepreneurship after the show. Was it what you were doing, the same thing you were doing before the show? Yeah. Yeah. So I, yeah, so for the last couple years, like about two years prior to going on the show, I was working as a strength conditioning coach in L.A. They had a small personal training business and coached for a family of gyms locally.

And then after the show, we came back to like a quarantined Los Angeles still. So our gym was still closed during that process. My now business partner and I built an online platform for training. And then through that, once the world started to open back up again, we like combined what we were doing digitally with the space we have in Los Angeles. And we actually just rebranded into a fully new thing last month. So it's a new community, new name, same type of thing, strength conditioning training for anyone that's open to getting better and stronger and feeling better about themselves.

So it's been a really cool thing. But it takes all my time. I mean, my most burning question is, why didn't you go on Bachelor in Paradise? So I feel like you're that dedicated. I hear that's invite only. Stop that now. I, no, I am really just focused. on all the stuff that I've got going on here, I don't feel like it's, you know, appropriate to

my partner in the community that we've got to, like, step away for long periods of time. And, you know, Bachelor and Paradise just wasn't in the cards for me this time. But, like, who knows? But you got the invite, right? I did not. Come on now. So that's shocking. That's surprising to me.

Why do you think that is? Did you talk to, I mean, did you talk to anybody? No, I mean, I. has been limited with with uh you know the people inside the franchise uh since leaving the show but uh you know all on good terms i'm just i'm focused on my life and maybe they saw that as a as a thing like they know very well that i that i own a business here and that i'm really focused on all the things that i've got going on in l.a and you know maybe it's somebody looking out for me just knowing that maybe it's not the right step for me personally uh at this time but but i think

you know i was kind of joking but it is invite only and i just didn't receive any invitation i'm truly mind-boggled as you being the runner-up on tasea season to not be invited there's always going to be there's always going to be more right there is i guess there is but that is surprising to me because it feels like you know you weren't the only one this year that we expected to see at the beach and some people you know got entered into relationships and some people maybe decline i don't know if anybody actually declined the offer but it is like we expected you to be there like Like, if you were to say who's going to definitely be on that beach, it was you.

Yeah. And so I'm surprised that the call didn't even happen. I didn't realize that it was that exclusive. I don't really know. I've never been. I don't really know. But yeah, they did, yeah, just it wasn't for me this year. And, you know, maybe people have had enough Ben.

Who knows? No, never enough Ben's. No, you. Oh, wait. Also, I hear Ben from Indiana. Yeah, I was going to ask you about that. I'm Ben from Indiana. Yeah.

So I'll let you take that from me. We are Ben's from Indiana. Yeah, we're Ben's from Indiana. So what high school did you go to? Cathedral High School in Indianapolis. Yeah, so I'm from northern Indiana. Okay. I'm glad you represented well.

The Midwest is still strong. But yeah, I saw, I knew that. And I was reminded that in our notes leading up to the show is that we're both Hoosiers. and if somebody doesn't know what a Hoosier is, that is what you call somebody from Indiana because the story goes like this. Somebody was standing on one side of the Ohio River, some guy was standing on the other,

and they yelled, who was there? But the guy on the other side thought he was saying Hoosier. And so we call ourselves the Hoosiers. That's where this came from. Yeah, it's very disappointing, Ashley. I know, but it's who we are. Right. Oh, that's hilarious.

Okay. Well, Ben, I have to play a little. like tough question game with you for a second if you were to have been in paradise like what girls would have been on your list who would you wanted to meet who would i want to meet and this is and ben i want to tell you this is a good platform to share this because we've had people say this and then they connect afterwards and love is blossom we like to consider ourselves a love show as as much as a show about the bachelor so um throw your shot out there man holy cow well i have a secret to tell you I didn't watch a single episode of Paradise so I don't even know who was there but but who would

you wanted like who would you wanted to have an invite with you from previous seasons man that's rough I wasn't really a fan of the show before going on so like you're going to throw out names of people that I like don't really follow or don't really uh pay attention to but uh I said this before I always thought Demi was funny but I know that she was on I heard that she was on this season um I don't know I, uh, that's a really hard question. I'm like not giving you a great answer. No, it's okay. Now we'll flip it and make it easier. If there was a celebrity and we were allowed to have celebrities on the island, who would you bring? Yeah. Sydney Sweeney. Who the heck is that? From Euphoria. Oh, okay. Ben knows who that is.

No, I'm going to, I'm hoping Ashley looks up picture. I don't know Euphoria. That girl from, um, from HBO's, oh my God. I'm going to look her up. She's, she's the one from white lotus oh wow voyeurs i've never seen white lotus but yeah she's my she's my celebrity crush but i get it no i get it that that's fair to me yeah that's yeah you know ben if you would have said if if ashley and i would um because this is this is our podcast sometimes we like to overstep our bounds and if you would have said who would you have set me up with we love dimmy we like dimmy as as a human we just think she's funny um But it would not have been who first came to my mind when I thought of you.

Well, see, you're going to tell me people that I wouldn't be thinking, like, to be blatantly honest, nobody's like front of mind right now, but who would you have set me out? Who would you have put me with? I mean, I would think you'd be more of like a quiet, like, like, just kind of like, just more like low key person. So maybe like Serena, who ended up with Joe or, you know, some of these people, like, some of the people that came and went even on this show, somebody maybe

that was released a few weeks earlier due to some controversy, I think you could have seen through that and been with them. I was going to put you more with this arena this year. I thought you'd be competing for those types. Yeah, like a quieter, less outspoken, but you know, you threw out, Demi, even Amari maybe, like, Mari

had like the edge to her, but yeah, she was like, um, she wasn't like the loudest or most like known character because she was consistent. And Demi obviously steps onto the beach and makes a name for herself every time she does. I think it's funny. So this is actually going to be a funny thing.

So I didn't watch, I didn't really understand what The Bachelor, Bachelorette was before going on the show. I didn't understand the depth. Then how did you get there? I was reached out to. Randomly? They were like. Yeah, via social media.

I wish that was my story. I know, me too. I begged and pleaded, not really. I just sent in the most elaborate audition tape. Ashley, you begging and pleaded. See, that surprises me a lot, actually. Wait, for real? Are you being sarcastic?

You should see her audition video. No, so I was asked to go on the show. And I, like, didn't know, like, I didn't understand, like, the gravity of what it was or, like, how deep the fan base was. I just, like, was naive to that fact. And I, you know, I wish I would have known, like, going on now, like, what to expect coming out of it. It's been a wild, wild year, a pretty exciting year.

But I didn't really know who the characters were, who the prominent influential people inside the franchise were. I didn't really understand any of that. But I did know who Demi was because one time I randomly came across a video of her, like just saying some outlandish shit on the internet. And I thought it was hilarious. And so she was really the only person that I knew inside of the franchise before going on. But yeah, it's been a really cool experience.

Everyone's been super nice and, like, really warm and accepting inside. So it's been really great to meet, you know, people like you and everyone else that I've come across since. Ben, I've got to pause you here. Yeah. Was that a lion that just walked through your background? Because something massive that semi looked like a house cat just came across your back. It's a cat. I'm at a friend's house.

And she's got a cat and a huge dog. The dog's out for a walk. But, yeah, it's a, I think, I don't know where she went. Yeah, it's a big cat. Holy moly. Anyways. Is it a friend's house or is it a girl friend's house? These are the questions I have to ask.

It is a friend's house. So I'm right down the street. My gym's in West Hollywood, but I live in Venice. And so it's a madhouse. That's an exhausting commute. It's unreal. Yeah. And so the gym's a madhouse right now.

So I just walk down the street to a friend's house. And I'm just taking the call from inside her house, which is like really nice. It's really nice. When she left, I said people are going to. think that this is my home and you like decorated way too nice i was going to say i was like ben i understand why you didn't go to bachelor in paradise because the business is obviously didn't quite spectacularly i mean it's we're doing all right i don't know it's been a cool it's been a cool thing um but i do appreciate you saying that like maybe someone a little bit quieter would be uh my

style i think i don't know um i don't know i've dated all types of girls before and i and i I'm generally pretty reserved. Like, I'm pretty calm. But I think, like, having a little spice is fun. So, like, yeah, I don't know. Yeah, I get it. I mean, I'm getting married on Saturday, and I'm marrying a girl who definitely is more reserved and quiet.

Yeah. But every once in a while, you get a little spice, and that spice is shockingly entertaining. Yeah, it makes his life about it. Then, you know, one of the things that wasn't mentioned enough, right or wrong on the show was your background being an Army Ranger. Yeah. Do you mind explaining that a little bit?

Yeah, so that's a typo from the, that's an insane thing that happened. So I'm Ranger qualified, so I graduated from Army Ranger School in 2014. The Army Rangers specifically is like a very elite, small unit of Army, Army Special Operations. Although I was a graduate of the school, I never served in that unit, the Ranger Regiment. So that was like a huge thing initially. You'll notice that the wording was switched on the show, like by episode two. I was like, yo, I can't say this. I graduated the course in 2014, Ranger qualified.

My job was artillery, so I shot cannons and rockets and missiles for the majority of my career. But that experience was incredibly profound for me. I ended up getting hurt about seven years in, almost seven years into my service. and decided that it was right for me to leave. And it's really, like, helped me not only in the profession that I have now being in fitness, just because fitness is such an integral part of that job and that life, but the thing that I love most,

or the thing that I loved most was soldiers, and it gave me this incredible opportunity to mold and shape young soldiers, which was, like, really cool. And now I kind of get to do that in a weird, like, adjacent way with the people that are a part of our gym. So it's been really cool for me. And that experience was the best thing I've ever done. So I really enjoyed it.

I bet your panic out when you saw on your list, Army Ranger was like, oh, crap, because you know everybody who's an 80 seal. Yeah, I know it. It was unfortunate to me because, like, knowing what that means. And then also, like, having limited control over what, like, gets shown. I mean, you both have been through the experience. Like, they're the product, like, everyone's intentions are great and good. but things can be you know like misconstrued or misunderstood and the response from that community specifically or the army community military community specifically was pretty resounding and

these are the people that I love most and care about most and don't want to offend most and so starting off on week one with that response from the community that I'm I'm in love with was like pretty rough and it kind of set the it kind of set the tone for like a other less than awesome experience during uh the airing of the show you know but uh but yeah i mean people things happen and it was easily rectified and the people that i needed to explain this too like they heard it and they and they got an explanation was all was all the issue because of the title yeah yeah it's just like it's a very specific thing that you just like shouldn't say if you're not a part of this small group and so it was fixed almost immediately i just called someone on the team and

like hey this can't be this way. I know that it's like supposed to be like it's also like add value to my character or like the person that I'm portraying but like it can't be this way. And so it was an easy fix and then, you know, it doesn't really come up because it was a massive part of my life. But like since I've left the military, it's become, you know, just a thing that I was. It's not it's not a thing that I am anymore. You know, I think some people see that differently. But like I was a soldier for a long time and I had an incredible experience and it shaped me in ways that I could like never replicate in any other way, but like now I do another thing. And I'm excited for the opportunity to step out of that life and into something new.

Well, you talk about how you used your experience there with training in, you know, with the gym. You were also super vulnerable. And it was really, I don't want to say it was cool to get a guy's perspective on an eating disorder. But it was just something that we don't ever talk about. But it affects a lot of men. So it was just, it was, it was nice to get out there. So how do you do that? Because you do work in the fitness and the wellness industry, like you're surrounded by food all the time. You probably think about nutrition all the time. Yeah. So my job before owning the gym and coaching, like fitness per se, or being a strength coach, I coach nutrition and I was working with people who were struggling with some of the things that I dealt with, sharing that

with Tasha on the show wasn't like a weird thing for me like I didn't really understand that it would have such a big impact. It's a thing that I use in my business every day. So I'm like, you know, these are my experiences and I hope that I can like, you know, share in yours. And like I work intimately with a, with a small group of clients specifically with like eating disorder type things or like building healthier relationships of food, you know, currently. But the career that I had going into the show incorporated a lot of my own experience. And so sharing that with her. was just like me just being open. Like that wasn't a scary thing for me.

There's other things I talked about on the show that like were much larger and much scarier and far more impactful or like traumatizing for me to share. But that experience with my eating disorder was just something that I openly talk about here in the community that I coach in now and before. And so I'm happy that like I started the conversation and I'm happy that since the show I've been able to talk openly about it in other venues. and on other platforms and I said this the whole time if I'm able to just like maybe bring light to a situation that makes someone else feel a little bit less unheard or unseen or

less understood than I can like feel good about everything that that's happened so far so definitely did that I know that's happened and I know and it's been really cool like a guy that looks like me or a guy that does the job that I do or you know there's all these like preconceptions about who I am and what I am and it was nice to share just a little bit of of myself on the show. I know it's like you see 1% of 1% of what I am. And then after the fact, you see what I care to show, you know, like via social media or in like an interview like this. And so people like never get the full picture. But I am really thankful that like a small part, a really valuable part was able to be, you know, shared with a lot of people. So that's been

really cool. Talk me through. It's always interesting to Ashley and I. Talk me through the moment that you decided to open up about this and walk out butt naked on national television on a date. So obviously this is a, okay, so like I'm going to set up this a little bit. So like you have this thing that you know is going to be an important conversation to be had. And you know that you are at this point ready to talk about it. Yeah. And you're getting prepped for this date.

and at some point you decided this is the way it's going to happen. And like take away everything else, which you can't really do, but take away everything else. Like the courage to just do that in general. Like nowadays we're seeing more and more people come out on this show naked. It's been a theme lately. I would have never been. I just, I don't have that confidence, I guess.

Yeah. Like walk us through that behind the scenes for everybody listening. So I can like set the scene, but the date, it's an art specific date we're expressing ourselves through like different mediums ones like clay there's a charcoal painting expression there's some other stuff that's going on and the final portion of the date is a self-portrait and I'm not good at drawing and I'm pretty okay at like expressing myself verbally but I I wanted it to be like impactful and like some grand gesture I think maybe I struggle with like I struggle with opening up

sometimes. But the eating disorder and that date were, or sharing that I had an eating disorder for a long time and that date were like mutually exclusive. The thing with getting naked was a thing that like I'm comfortable doing. If you asked mom, if you called my mom and said, you know, what is Ben's deal? He's always naked. She'd be like, yeah, he's been doing that since he was a baby. The eating disorder wasn't about me being uncomfortable in my body. It was more of a control thing. Like I, like someone who like turns to alcohol, I turned to food. It was. was a numbing agent. It kept me safe in times where I felt like I wasn't safe. And so that's what the eating disorder was for me, fueled by my childhood, fueled by my experience in the military,

fueled by a ton of things that made me feel really out of control and food was something that I could control explicitly. And so that's where the eating disorder came from. But the being naked thing was I was in a room full of guys who felt the same way about this woman that I did. And I knew that they were all going to do something artistic in the form of like a sculpture or a painting or a whatever and immediately my brain turns to oh ben just like take your clothes off and that will be the thing that like is like oh he did something big um but i was so terrified that it was going to be like everybody in the room's like oh my god there's a butt like look you see his butt over there and like unfortunately that's kind of what happened except for tasha and so in that moment i was

able to stand there like yeah being naked it like doesn't it doesn't scare me so like I'm naked there, it got everybody's attention. And then I was able to have a real conversation with her. And I said, all I said was like, look, you see a physical thing here. You see my body. You see my face. You see my hair. But there's so much underneath here.

And there's so much underneath it that I haven't shared with anybody. And I'm so excited for you to be the one that, like, uncovers that. And so I can't remember exactly what I said, but it was something along the lines of like, you've got this physical being, but you've also got everything inside. And it was impactful. And I don't know that they, I can't remember exactly what they showed. but it was that conversation and like it was this meaningful moment together where we I think like the relationship took you know a different turn or a different step and getting naked

just happened to be the like the flash that like allowed the moment to have you know I just I was trying to create something show this grand gesture and then tell her something really meaningful and like it's mis that's interpreted a million different ways by a million different people like oh Ben just wants to show off his wiener in front of the room I'm like no like I don't No. No, I just wanted it to be something where people, she specifically would remember. Yeah. You mentioned a couple times, basically, that you get to see, like, such a small part of your personality, like 1%. What was looking back on your experience, like, the most frustrating part of your storyline that only got shown 1%.

Yeah. There's two parts to this. So my biggest fear going in, was that nobody would understand my humor. I have like a pretty dry sense of humor, like a bit eclectic. Like I'm just, my humor is different than most of the people I interact with. But like, I think it's funny as hell. So I was concerned that I would go on this show and I would be myself and people would misunderstand my humor.

I'd be like, oh, what's this dude's deal? It only got shown once. There was like a roast date where we got to like roast everybody. and I stood up there and just had a ton of material and little bits of it were shown. But that was the only time I ever got to be funny on the program. And so, like, I dodged a bullet there where, like, they never even showed me being funny,

so, like, it never got to be interpreted. That was ever part of your character. Yeah, but, but like, I was, you know, I'm not frustrated by any part of the experience because it's given me things that I could have never even hoped for, which is so incredible, namely this platform, to, like, talk about the stuff that's really important to me. But I was a bit frustrated by the narrative that, like, I can't express myself emotionally

or that I'm a poor communicator. And, you know, I think there's, like, a level of empathy from the viewership or from the people that are, like, interpreting this thing where you're like, this is not a real life experience. This is, like, real life intensified a million fold. And so the way that you might normally act or the way that you might normally respond in a situation might not happen on the TV screen. And so if I had any frustration, it'd feel like, you know, I think that I'm an okay

communicator. I wouldn't say I'm great, but I, not for lack of trying, you know, some things weren't said or somethings weren't shared in the moment, but like looking back, it was stressful as hell. And so, you know, people interpret everything the way that they want to interpret it. but, like, I am, I'm more than just the guy who can't share his feelings, you know. Okay. Yeah.

And that was, like, a bit frustrating. I'm trying to say that in the most, the best way. But yeah, I'm more than that guy. Yeah. So we, in the final minutes here, seconds maybe with you. And I want at the end here, Ashley and I was like it, if you kind of, publicize what you're up to you know your gym's name how people can join you all that stuff but um i do have a question kind of bouncing off of what you just said so if your storyline true not

good or bad was that you you lacked your ability to communicate um what was it about your moment with tasha where all the other guys um laughed shocked said look at his butt yeah And she said, what was it about Tasha that allowed her to see something more? She was the one person in that room that said, I understand what he's doing. Yeah. Why was that, in your opinion? Well, I think all, I think, I'll gas Tasha up here a bit. I think she's an incredible listener, at least in our experience, she was an incredible listener.

And she was able to see the intention behind what was going on. And so, you know, I'll give her all the credit in that. But like in a moment where it's chaotic, there's a bunch of people in the room. There's eight other guys or 10 other guys or however many it was. She gave me the space. She gave me the spotlight to like share a thing. And I'll say that she was never distracted. I mean, as you've been the lead before and I'm sure there's like a million things going through your head at all times.

But what allowed me to share that with her and allowed her to receive that is there was no distraction. for her. She was totally focused on me. And in that moment, I was totally focused on her. And it was, I was grateful then. I'm grateful now that, like, I had this opportunity to share all these things with her. And for, like, probably the first time in a romantic relationship in my life, I felt heard. I felt listened to.

I felt seen, which was really exceptional. And it also, like, even though things didn't pan out in that relationship, it lets me know that, like, there is an opportunity for that later in my life, which is really, really cool. I went into the experience. I'll like elaborate just a little bit more. I went into the experience with like three intentions. One was to like maybe meet a really cool girl and have a relationship with her. The second was to learn something about myself. And then the third was even if her relationship didn't materialize to like have faith in myself in a relationship in the future and also like restore my faith in women or in my partner, you know, my future partner. And I think all three of those

things happened, which is really cool. You know, it goes the way that it goes. And I'm just really grateful for her listening to me, for her creating space for me to share my story. And then for the opportunity that's come on the back end, which has been really special and incredible. Oh, well, after this half an hour conversation, now I really want to see more of you on our TV. Well, you know, maybe that happens later. I don't know. Man, also, you making me want you to be The Bachelor because this Clayton guy is so boring.

I know nothing about him, but I heard that he's really tall and has big muscles. Sure, but that doesn't cut it. Well, I had the same thing going for me. Yeah, look at Ben. You know what I mean? Really tall, huge muscles, and Benny's the Bachelor. that's just not all ben either he just has so many more things above that

yeah that's the one percent i remember ben you ben both bens from indiana ben smith uh i just want to wrap up with two like really silly questions about um some guys that made some splashy splashy headlines since your time with them on your season there's blake moines uh what do you think about everything that's gone down with him over the past nine months. Well, so I didn't even realize that he was going back on the show. Like, I didn't even, and then I see all these, like, people send me, like,

Instagram stuff all the time, but I see all these things like he's back on the show. I think the video was, like, him holding a thing, holding a boom box in the street, which is kind of funny. So you haven't kept in touch, I suppose. Not really, not really, no. You know, I think there was, like, talk of maybe doing some, like, philanthropic thing where we, like, go to Africa and do great stuff for rhinos and other wildlife. But we really haven't communicated much since then.

I heard that he just broke up with Katie. I don't know the specifics on that, but I heard that that happened. And I hope that they're both doing all right. I should probably reach out to him. And then there's Brandon, who you're Brendan, who you're with the entire time on Tasia's season. And he was a little sketchball down in Paradise. Was that at all surprising for you? I was very taken aback.

Again, I, like, didn't watch Paradise. I feel shitty saying that because, like, you guys... No, no. We are a part of... We're not offended. Right. Yes, I didn't watch anything, but, like, just the same way with Blake, I've heard tons of stuff. You know, Brennan has visited me in Los Angeles at the gym.

So I was very... You know, we were close on our season together. He's come and visit me in Los Angeles. I was incredibly surprised by what, not only what he said, but what has been said, you know, in response to all the things. And, you know, I hope for his sake that he's doing okay. And I hope that, like, everyone else affected by everything that's gone on is also doing okay. It's, it's just such a crazy deal.

Telling you what, these characters come out at some point. So here's a funny thing. I had a boss early on. And what did he say? He said, you can fool everybody for a little bit, but you can't fool anybody forever. It's good. You can pull everybody for a little bit, but you can't fool everybody forever. Especially when your life is televised.

It's kind of hard when everything's. Also, like, there's cameras and microphones all the time. Yeah. All the time. Like, not even just all of the time. Yeah. It's wild to me. So it's always been shocking is the things people decide to say.

thinking they're going to get away with it. They never do. They never do. It's always the thing that's shown. Actually, I can think of a time or two. People did get away with it, but we won't go there. Yeah. Ben, as we say goodbye to you, if you can, just give like a 20-minute plug.

20-minute. 20-second plug. Your commercial for everything you're up to, where people can find you, how they can support you. Yeah, I really appreciate it. My name's Ben Smith. I live in Venice Beach, California. I own a gym called Rodeo Athletic at Rodeo Rodeo Athletic. We are in West Hollywood, California.

My social media is at Ben V. Smith, B-N-V-E-E-S-M-I-T-H. If you're into feeling really good about yourself and about the life that you're currently living, follow along, and I'll relate to you on there. Sweet. Go check out Rodeo Athletic, Ben Smith. Thanks for coming on almost for this podcast. It's been a pleasure. And thanks for joining us for the first time ever.

Thanks, y'all. Thanks, man. Bye. See, yeah. Imagine that you're on an airplane and all of a sudden you hear this. Attention passengers. The pilot is having an emergency and we need someone, anyone, to land this plane. Think you could do it?

It turns out that nearly 50. percent of men think that they could land the plane with the help of air traffic control. And they're saying like, okay, pull this, until this. Pull that. Turn this. It's just, I can do it my eyes close. I'm Manny. I'm Noah.

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Okay. That's us. That's us. My name is Curley. And I'm Maya. In each episode, we'll talk about love, friendship, heart breaks, men, and, of course, our favorite secrets. Listen to the Super Secret Bestie Club as a part of the My Cultura podcast network available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, I'm Janica Lopez, and in the new season of the Overcover podcast, I'm taking you on an exciting journey of self-reflection.

Am I ready to enter this new part of my life? Like, am I ready to be in a relationship? Am I ready to have kids and to really just devote myself and my time? I wanted to be successful on my own, not just because of who my mom is. Like, I felt like I needed to be better or work twice as hard as she did. Join me for conversations about healing and growth. Life is freaking hard. And growth doesn't happen in comfort.

It happens in motion, even when you're hurting. All from one of my favorite spaces, The Kitchen. Honestly, these are going to come out so. freaking amazing. Be a part of my new chapter and listen to the new season of the Overcomber podcast as part of the MyCultura podcast network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Well, it's great to have Ben Smith on the episode.

It is good to hear from him. It's been a while. I am shocked, Ashley, that he was not invited to paradise. Weird. weird you know what it reminds me of what um remember peter uh from rachel's season when he didn't get invited back to anything else well yeah but i think that that was more like peter's decision making right was it wasn't that like more like negotiations didn't exactly go the best like they wanted him but like he had you know requirements yeah well it's

It was still shocking. It was great to have been on. Hey, Ashley, before we do this week's breakdown of the episode, I want to say thank you to everybody. I'm not going to be able to respond to everybody because it's been a lot who sent advice or info on ALS. Our fan base, Ashley, like, I've never asked anything of anybody that I've gotten a bigger response to. Oh, that's so, so good to hear. And I'm reading them all, but like, it's impossible to. I know. Sometimes when you open up about something, you get the most incredible responses and you do end up reading them all. But then you have this sense of being overwhelmed that you like can't thank people enough. Yeah. So like just you guys just let, we just want to let you know that like we appreciate everything that you send us. And we really do try to read it all. We're so sorry we can't respond to it all. Definitely. And then there's side of I don't want, you know, Brandon Sam to be. be overwhelmed either. Like, you know, and so we're filtering through stuff. I have somebody always going through the emails and the DMs like, you know, gathering information, sending it off to me or them when it feels helpful. But just like people are awesome. So that's, you know, that's something that I just want to sit on. Well, hey, it is time to break down another episode of

Michelle's season. Ashley, to get us started, I think it would be helpful to share overarching thoughts so far leading up to this and then even after this episode and then we can go step by step in chronological order. Here's my thoughts. Clinton still did not shine and I'm shocked why.

It just, I'm waiting for him to explode as a main character and it just doesn't feel like it's happening to me. I don't think it's going to happen. You don't think it's going to happen? No.

I don't know what they were thinking. I don't even think that there's anything he can do to make me engross in him right now. Well, you would expect them to have a few more episodes left. And it just takes one. Like, that's what we're holding on. It just takes one episode to really, like, change the narrative.

But at this point, I am surprised because they need a good bachelor season. They need a compelling lead. They need somebody that, like, the audience rally behind it. And I actually thought, like, this is going to be that guy. They haven't had it in a while. You know, I thought, oh, this is, this is the reason they chose him so early is because they think this guy is going to steal the hearts of America. And so far, we just don't know anything about him.

Like, he's just there. But, like, there's guys on the season, like the Nates of the world and the Joes of the world and the Rodney's of the world that are like, in my opinion, people are rallied behind. Like, they're like, no, this is good. This is good stuff. Like, these guys could do it. Yeah. There's definitely better options.

But I have to say, overall, because you did want my macro opinion. I don't know that any of these guys are good enough from a show. I'm, like, obsessed with her. She's so cool and so pretty, and I just feel very underwhelmed by the group in general. That's a fair statement because I do think she is in a league of her own when it comes to life. I just think she's really incredible.

I, you know, we feel this way often, actually. So I want to remind us that we feel this way often at this point in a season where we're like, you know what, there's just nobody up to the lead, you know, standards. And then at the end of the season, you know, stuff starts to switch. I mean, think about how big of it. It's not like we are ever not a fan of Zach. But there was a moment during that season where we didn't know she'd end up with Zach. That's true.

And now we see Tasia and Zach together and we're like, oh, no, this is big. I mean, I became obsessed with Zach for Tasha as time went on. Yeah. Late in the season, though. Yeah, I know. At this point, we weren't convinced you. Yeah. Yeah.

So it can still happen. I'm with you. I think Michelle is incredible. We've talked about the upcoming lead. We've talked about the current lead. We're still waiting for both things to happen for Michelle on her season and also Clayton to shine. Again, I sit in the same place I did.

I don't dislike. the guy. I just don't know the guy. I don't have much of a feeling on the man. And so as a result, I'm just not convinced that I'm going to be like full on support running into this next bachelor season going, I cannot wait for this guy to find love because I just don't know him. So that's where he's standing. I'm hoping that changes for Michelle. Yeah. Like maybe we'll just stop talking about him for the next couple weeks. And then if if he gets eliminated and we still feel nothing, then we'll really critique the crap out of this whole situation. No, I'm going to talk about it every week because I think it's, I think it's a storyline that

everybody's wondering. Every week, you see Twitter blowing up. I mean, last week, his name was trending with people going, oh, was it? Oh, yeah, where is this guy? Oh, yeah, where is this guy? Wow. So it's a big conversation. People are waiting. People are wanting, and they need a big one. So, okay, Ashley, chronological order, this episode, let's step through it. All right, let's do it. Okay. So let's do the first one-on-one, which is with Martin. And Martin, we were saying that we like kind of liked him.

He was kind of a dark horse last week. This date actually didn't make me like him more. What about you? No. I think he was fine. I think what I would say about this date was it just like it allowed us to highlight him. and I just don't think he's like stepped up like I just don't I mean he he was obviously he tried to open up he was vulnerable he tried to communicate and that's good I mean it's good and

it's healthy in a dating relationship however nothing from this date made me go this is her husband or this is a future partner just made me go and and even the way uh it's funny got awkward with the whole jimmy situation yeah yeah they're a very awkward like tub thing um was when really saw and I was like this guy just isn't it for her in my opinion he's missing it and he doesn't necessarily know how to handle himself right now in like a natural way with an incredible person by his side so no I mean I still I'm more of a fan of him than I thought I would be and that's mostly based on my judgmental ways of seeing him in a picture and he's growing on me but I think this week he didn't grow any further than he did last week

No. I don't think that he was trying to, like, question her judgment about the Jamie situation. Maybe he didn't pick the words correctly. I can still understand why she would get, like, a little awkward about it. But I just felt like there was, yeah, there just was, like, not enough there for me, for me to, like, pull him through as a favorite in my mind. Yeah. Um, and their conversation over dinner was just kind of about like the fact that he's like blunt and like is always working on like, what, what did he say? Like get just like communicating better and allowing himself to open up. Yeah. And I mean, and I mean, I'm sure like I don't know everybody's upbringing and I'm sure people do struggle with that. You know, Michelle did empathize with him and say, hey, you know, I'm similar. He was like, I don't cry.

But the, hey, I'm blunt and it can come off wrong. Like, it's kind of when somebody says, like, sorry, I just, I just speak truth. But really, they're just mean. Yeah. You know, like, it's like, oh, you know, you're just a jerk. Like, you just, you know, and somebody's like, sorry, I just say what's on my mind. And it's like, well, yeah, like, if we all did that all the time, like, we'd just all be mean to each other probably. So it doesn't, like, that didn't fly with me as much as them relating on the, hey, it's hard for me to get emotional.

I don't get I'm not allowing myself to go deep that stuff was fine I just don't that this whole date fell short for me on a romantic level for the two of them 100% and meanwhile back at the house there's a group date card that comes Nate sees that he's not the person who's going on the one-on-one and he ends up saying that he's not stressed about not getting it he said eventually it will come he feels like he's in a good but regardless, which flags Chris S to, like, think that he's coming off as cocky. I can kind of see that there's, like, a fine line between confidence and cock. No, there's a fine line between confidence and cocky. I think he just feels good about himself. I don't, I didn't find a huge problem with it. I think that absolutely Chris is ridiculous in the entire second half of the episode. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, what do you want Nate to say? Oh my gosh, I don't have the one-on-one. I think I'm going home. He knows he's not. Yeah. It's fair for him to say, I'm okay. Like, this is the journey that she wants to go on.

I don't need to go on this date. And I would like to be on this date, but I know it's going to come at some point. That's, okay, maybe it came off a little cocky. Maybe somebody there was sensitive to it. But at the same time, I personally have zero problem with that mindset of I'm good for now. Like, I'll wait until she's ready. Yeah. same same okay so the group date was like a real big bummer for michelle because it was a sleepover themed

but it seemed like the guys all went into brozone and they gave her no attention and i guys do this and girls don't this would only happen on the bachelorette where the guys get so broie and like enjoy the activity so much that they end up ignoring the girls don't this would only happen on the bachelorette where the guys get so broie and like enjoy the activity so much that they end up ignoring the girl the girls would never have that happen and have the guy be sitting in the corner not being pursued no guys love hanging out with guys sometimes well yeah I get that but it's also just weird to me that she was so alone the whole time I mean do you think that like there was something said where they were like yeah Michelle doesn't feel very good today like leave her alone

Ooh, maybe. I mean, even then though you would have had somebody there, you'd expect that would have checked on her, maybe they didn't show it. But typically, you know, what I would say is like the overall tone of the date is fairly accurately shown on television. Like, there's not a date that I ever went on that I watched it back. I was like, that's not at all what happened. Like, if the tone of the date overall was, hey, she felt like she was on the outside looking in,

then I think they accurately portrayed it and I'm imagining that is because she has personal conversations about that afterwards. So she felt pushed aside. She felt like these guys were more interested and hang out with each other, but also just a weird date. I mean, I know they're trying to get creative

and so far this season's had some incredible dates but like this is probably in the hotel conference room and they've like made it look like a living room. Like what a weird date to have in general. Yeah, I didn't like it again as far as the pillow fight and the pillow slash teddy bear fight. You guys know that I can't stand it when it's like some sort of competition, at least this time. It was a competition where nobody was going to get hurt because we always complain about that because somebody always gets hurt. But this is pretty safe, pretty PG.

But I still like kind of dazed out about it. Like I don't really care. I don't know I think it was I think it was odd how little she was pursued to the point where it's just like was there something going on

I don't know but I also don't think that that is like I'm not worried about that being the tone for the guys about Michelle like I think they're very into her and so possibly you know the date just didn't go according to plan or, you know, nobody stepped up to do it well.

But I, uh, I think these guys are super into, into Michelle. And I think they want to give her attention. Maybe they just didn't know how to in that, in that scenario. Okay, that's my one thing is sometimes I would just be so nervous on the show, the main show, that I would be just like scared to kind of like go up to Chris and start talking. because I'd be like, oh, if nobody else is doing it, then maybe I shouldn't be doing it. Is this awkward?

Like, what am I going to talk about? So you kind of like psych yourself out. And I can see that maybe like that became a train like a fact. Yeah. No, it is. But it does. And it sparks an important conversation for Michelle where we get to see more of her and understand more of her.

Because this date really led into her then opening up about, the fear of not being seen, the fear of being pushed aside, the fear of being like feeling like the outsider looking in when, you know, she's not, right? She's the lead of the show. She's the, has the attention of every man. At least we hope that is there.

But it does allow us to hear more of her, some of her insecurities and struggles and what makes her Michelle. And that was a great moment. And some guys did step up in that moment for her as she opened up about that. Like, oh, Lou. Olu? Olu being the one. I mean, he stepped up for her in that moment and was, in my opinion, if we're looking at

this thing, like, now I know, I know he's a, he's a force to be reckoned with on this show. He is now the Martin of last week where we don't know a lot about him leading up to this. And now we're like, no, this guy's got something for her. Yeah, he's a sweetness. I got good vibes from him. And it was a really good. meaningful, deep conversation that they had. I'm glad he got that rose.

I'm glad that, like, we have another solid quality man in this group. Yeah. And the other quality guy that I think kind of, like, came out of the woodwork this episode was Rick, who got the other one-on-one date. Yeah. Seems like a really sweet guy. I do not feel a ton of romance between them. But he's a nice guy, right?

before this episode and maybe still forever I'm going to think about his head on the dinner tray that's weird that it's really sticking for it with me it's hard to take him serious when that's all you can remember his head on a platter but yeah I'm with you but he did he stood out and this is I'd say the two the best episode was for Olu and then for Rick

those two had the best episode I believe they both will be around now a while because it wasn't like this this kind of like sudden spark no we both got to see a lot we got to see as viewers a lot of both of them and I think that over time it proved that this

their relationship with Michelle is something special yeah they're both going to go way farther than I think we would have initially imagined yeah with Rick he he had that story that he told about his dad was just heartbreaking. I mean, this is the second one-on-one that Michelle's had where she has somebody confide in her that a parent committed suicide.

And that is a lot to handle. I mean, and for him to have this guilt with him for the rest of his life because he was the one who caught the dad cheated. is just so heavy, so sad. Yeah. You know, Ashley, it shows us every time. And it's people that go on this show, and people in general have incredibly hard

and also incredibly beautiful stories. And we get to hear them on this show. It's one of the best parts of the show is it does allow the space for us to connect with the cast members and also have conversations that matter, which Michelle's doing this year. Shell's doing this year and then have conversations with people like Rick that matter and that get to know him better. And that's why I'm just saying like over time we either fall in love

with these people more or we push away from them more. And for us this week, especially like we understand Rick better. And we'll probably get to understand Rick a lot more as this season goes on. But that was that was a tough conversation to sit through. But one that was one that was so necessary because I'm sure Rick is not the only one out there who feels similar to how he's feeling now. Yeah. That's one of my favorite parts of the show is that people get to see, you know, viewers get to watch people have these hard conversations on TV and therefore them being at home feel

like more seen, which is like kind of ironic that like I'm talking about being seen when like the theme of the episode was Michelle feeling not seen. but I do think that Rick was a great choice following that group date because he is the kind of personality that's just going to be like obsessed with her do you know what I mean?

Like he probably feels like he's a little out of that she's a little out of his league and that's the kind of guy that's going to like give you he's going to like worship you if you're Michelle. It's interesting too because Michelle I mean

and I know this Michelle would have had no idea his story before this date. There's not like a list of this is Rick, this is his story. Do you want him to go on this wrong? She chose Rick because she was obviously interested in Rick. And he just happened to be there on a week that it was so, I would say, probably needed for her and for him. And so the timing of this is really beautiful because she wouldn't have known his story. when she asked him to go on this week's 101.

Yeah. Yes, yes. So true. So the theme of being seen continues with the cocktail party slash rose ceremony when Chris is a little weird. And like there was some bleep out things that I was a little confused with their bleeping out. I guess he says that's effed up, right? He just like straight off the top says it's effed up that you guys didn't show her the effort she deserves. but I'm like Chris

you were on that date too you're clumped into that feeling she was referring to your part of the date not the nighttime portion of the date you know you just classic I mean this is classic guy not getting attention you know probably on the verge of getting eliminated

and he decides to get attention by creating some drama yeah oh yeah i mean it just happens every season we could get upset about it every season we could you know throw our fist up in the air and be like chris what are you doing this makes no sense where do you hope this goes are you trying to ruin this experience for her and for everybody else there and just like help yourself out so uh i'm you know what it does for me ash if i'm going to be like harsh yeah i just don't take him seriously anymore i mean like there's

nothing to take seriously he comes across as like a used car salesman in an 80s movie yeah sure yeah that's a great example it's like all right cool man you've you've you've said what you need to say you've had your your party here the attention's been on you you're gone you know this is just in my head this doesn't matter anymore like and I'm tired what I don't love Ashley and it's happened now through Michelle's season it's been this constant theme is every week somehow some way her week has been ruined. And I remember times when, you know, if Michelle is feeling,

if her insecurity is not being seen, I imagine she has some insecurities being the bachelor. Like she's doing an incredible job. But like at some point you're holding on for anything just to feel like you belong there as the bachelor's. So you continue to date and function in this. environment and if every week you're in your own head questioning is anybody into me um is anybody here for me like it's gonna mess with you like and people and viewers might not get that like it does

i had two weeks of this during my season where like something happened where i was like i don't think anybody actually wants to be here um and and you lay in bed at night and you're like this thing's going to come crashing down around like this thing's done well i don't belong here i'm i've proven it to myself. So I'm sick of that because I feel bad for Michelle that we have to continue to broach this subject. I feel you. How did you feel about Nate when she sat down with him? Because while I'm of course more on Nate's side here than Chris's, I don't think it was Nate's shining moment when he sat down. You could tell that he didn't like feeling, I mean, obviously nobody's going to like feeling targeted.

Yeah. But I don't know that he, like, reassured her in the best way. He kind of came across as cool guy. Yeah, that might be. I think you just explained it. You know, how do I feel about it was he was defend, you know, he felt defensive. Yeah. And instead of being in a place where you are defensive of the person probably most hurt, which is not him, it's Michelle.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He is defensive of himself. And that just doesn't come off. well. But he's also in the moment, which is why one of the issues with the show is you don't have time to like process and think and like step away and then come back and be like, you know what? After you're thinking about that, Michelle, you're probably most hurt here. Let me hear from you. You have to almost react. And that's why, you know, you've heard me say it before. And we've talked about like the best leads and the best cast members are ones that don't overreact.

They're really good at navigating the problems. Michelle's really good at navigating. getting to problems. She takes time away. She cancels cocktail parties. She says, hey, I'm not ready to speak on this stuff yet. But for Nate, it was, I felt like he just started talking too soon. And it came off, it came off fairly, uh, self-promoting and not as much focused on her. I hope he turns back to the guy that we saw previously come next week, in which they're going to Minnesota.

yeah you and I wanted them to go to Minnesota I don't know why I've been not cool with them being in Palm Springs I'm just really sad that they're hot so hot all the time and so sweaty Minnesota's going to be great it's going to be beautiful it's going to be comfortable to her and you know she's down to a smaller group of people

and hope I mean we said it last week we're hoping this group of guys are like the right ones for her Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I really hope that there's somebody that emerges that I feel like is the perfect combination of sweet, smart, romantic, because I feel like she has romance with some guys. And then she has, like, depth and, like, real quality in some guys. I don't know that I'm seeing someone who has the full-rounded picture for her. I don't know. I'm hoping. I'm hoping. Well, I mean, it's a good point, um, as we talked about earlier, uh, view. listeners out there who do you see for Michelle right now who is your top choices but Ashley so write us in Ashley as we do every week now who's your top three Joe Rodney and I mean maybe Brandon Brandon no yeah Brandon Brandon okay okay so

Brandon. Yeah, I'm going to go Joe Rodney. I'm going to still throw Nate up there. Yeah, I like Brandon a lot. I mean, he's got a lot of momentum, but I still see the Joe Rodney, Nate thing as the three, you know, biggest players. It's interesting if you look at this list of Brandon, Leroy, Joe Rodney, Clayton, Casey, Nate, Chris S. I would say that, you know, Rick, Brandon, Joe, Nate, Rodney are all above Clayton in terms of familiarity right now. And that's just odd, again, just odd to me. We keep beating that thought down. I just, I'm a little surprised by it.

Super, super weird. Thing about Joe, how interesting will it be if she ends up with a guy that she, like, previously DM'd and, like, lives in her city? I mean, it's probably happened before. Maybe not the city thing, but the previous DM thing. Well, kind of of Katie and Blake. Yeah. I would say it's not going to be the... But I think it would be cool because maybe they needed this to get together.

They needed this to push them. And I'm cool with that. Like, ultimately, we just want to see everybody's love story play out. And so if that's where love takes them, then that's where love takes them. Yep. All right. Well, after this, we're going to do Bachelor headlines. and Ben, you're part of The Bachelor Headlines,

and I can't wait to dig into it with you. Hi, my name is Enya Yumanzor. And I'm Drew Phillips. And we run a podcast called Emergency Intercom. If you're a crime junkie and you love crimes, we're not the podcast for you. But if you have unmedicated ADHD... Oh my God, perfect.

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scary, it's not going to go away just because you're avoiding it. In fact, it may get even worse. For more judgment-free money advice, listen to Brown Ambition on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Hola, it's Honey German. And my podcast, Grasias Come Again, is back. This season, we're going even deeper

into the world of music and entertainment with raw and honest conversations with some of your favorite Latin artists and celebrities. You didn't have to audition? No, I didn't audition. I haven't audition in, like, over 25 years. Oh, wow. That's a real G-talk right there.

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You feel like you get a little whitewash because you have to do the, code switching. I won't say whitewash because at the end of the day, you know, I'm me. Yeah. But the whole pretending and you know, it takes a toll on you. Listen to the new season of Grasas Come Again as part of My Cultura Podcast Network on the IHartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

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on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's time for Bachelor Headlines with our resident expert, Ashley I Kennedy, here to break down everything going on in Bachelor Headlines. I haven't seen the headlines yet, but she hinted to me that I'm in them. So, uh-oh, uh, is what I have to say.

Anyways, um, here's the first headline of this week. Katie Thurston seemingly responds to wild rumors about her friendship with John Hersey after Blake Moyne split. This is according to us weekly. So there's this guy John Hersey, which you may not even know if you don't follow Katie or him on social media. He was eliminated week two during her season. And she wrote, or said something on Instagram this week, saying,

y'all are getting wild in my DMs, said, internet rumors are leading me to become, this is weeks ago, she said this part, internet rumors lead me to this guy becoming a dear friend. And people are DMing her things like, hope you guys are more than friends now, heart emoji, or it won't be long until romance, bloom. between you guys but I think she's trying to make it very clear they are just friends apparently she posted a picture of a bouquet of flowers that she got from a friend and the note said these are not romantic flowers these are happy flowers because I want you to be happy and fans are speculating that that was from him now just based on this info do you do you

think that this guy, John, wants to be friends with Katie, or is he slowly trying to make his way out of the friend zone? Oh, I'm sure he's trying to make his way out of the friend zone. I mean, I think there's a lot of really good examples of guys and girls being friends, right? Sending flowers. Exactly. That's always the, that's like where you have to draw the line. That's where I drew a line with Jared, where I was like, nope, no matter what people tell me, he likes me this was between bachelor and paradise seasons because there were two moments one in October and one in March where he sent me flowers and the note was so personal definitely not just friends like he said in the second one on my birthday like the Corey to your Depanga and it was

just like I was like okay guys uh you can pretend like I'm crazy but I am not. He really knows the way to your heart, Ash. Wow. All right. Next headline is this. Ben Higgins. We kind of know him.

Details Jessica Clark kind of know her also. Wedding three officiants and countless bachelor and bachelorette alum. This is according to us weekly. What do you want to talk about? Ash. According to us weekly and yourself. Yeah. Three officiants.

How did you not mention this last week and I was grilling you about wedding details? that's a good point i don't know why didn't um yeah we're having three efficients and it's i think it's going to be like the cool unique one of the one of the unique things that exist for us is um we want jessica and i both wanted this wedding to be a celebration um and every wedding is right but we really wanted this to highlight us coming together in the people in our lives that have played a role in us coming together if that's childhood if that's you know adulthood whatever and so um It's a big deal for us because we have my childhood pastor.

We have her childhood pastor. And then we have a pastor who had a huge role in my life specifically and hers over the last couple years in Denver. And so we wanted to incorporate all of them because it didn't make sense for us to just have one of them. And so one is going to intro, one is going to do the middle. One is going to do the closing. And that way we get married by all three of them. And we can say, like, those three people in our lives will have played a role and we'll now have always played a role in our relationship. Oh, that's really sweet.

I love that. And then, of course, everybody wants to know who's going to be there. And this guest list of Bachelor contestants and alums and friends, nobody is surprising to me, but I'm going to list them off. Okay, so it's me and Jared. It's not all of them. Okay. This is what you mentioned. So me, Jared, Becca Kufrin, who's bringing her plus one, Thomas. Then there's Dean and Kalin.

Chase McNary is bringing his new girlfriend, or I guess he's been with her for a while. Blake and Elise, Becca Tilly, Sean Booth, Caitlin and Jason were both invited, but they have a tour date in Boston, so they're not going to be there, which I'm going to miss her for sure there. and then Nick and Natalie Chris Solz And okay so who are we missing from that Yeah I'd have to look back at the list and find out who we have to cross out But that's a lot of them most of them right And I'm just super pumped to have everybody there

I'm so excited to see everyone I'm so excited to see everybody So excited to celebrate with everybody It's been a long time since we've been in together in the same spot And so, you know, it's going to be great. It's going to be like a reunion in a lot of ways. And the cool part about this is, you know, these people are friends of mine. Like, these are people I still talk to on a regular basis.

There's still people that have a huge role in my life. Wells, I don't know if Wells was on there, but Wells. I know. I think I meant to mention Wells separately. So it says he's going to be an usher. You call him an usher. Does that mean that you're not having a proper bridal party? Or is he a groomsman?

No, he's like an usher. So he helps people get seated. I don't know if that's a Midwest thing. No. When you walk in, he'll be, it's like, you know, there's four friends of mine, Avery, Wells. Aw, Avery. Yeah, they're going to be usher.

So you're going to help people get seated, sit down, kind of get people a rally together. So they're part of the wedding party. They're just ushers and not standing up with me as groomsmen. Do you have groomsmen standing up with you? I do. So, um, they're going to be, uh, standing up with, they're going to walk out with me, I believe. And then, uh, my dad is my best man, as I mentioned. Okay.

Very nice. And so they, yes, I do have grooms with me. That's very important to me. Uh, and, and Jess. I mean, she has a lot of friends that she won standing beside her. Lovely. Okay. So excited.

We will have a big report next week. We're four days away, Ash. Four days. Four days. so so crazy very exciting um yeah can't wait can't wait i would have cry my eyes out i'm sure i'm gonna be i'm gonna be a mess jess you're gonna be crying too yeah starting to to to do not she said not like out of anything more than just like we're so close and it's so exciting and we just got to nashville like literally right when i walked in the door and like i finally now feel

like it's here. So the place that it all started, I'm right back at it. Well, that's enough about me. Why Bachelor Nations Peter Weber says dating Madison Pruitt was the most difficult experience ever. This according to E. Okay. So he goes, this is literally the most trying experience he's ever endured. Most difficult experience ever been through. As much as respect as I have for her and think so highly of her, I definitely see there were differences between the two of us that probably weren't going to allow a meaningful

long-term relationship to flourish. Nothing against either one of us. It's just who we are. It is what it is. It's very interesting there. I feel like a lot of it probably has to do with the religion because she is so religious and I don't

know that that really ever came out about him. So in this article from page six that came out this week, It talks about how Maddie, who was waiting, saving herself for marriage, walked away after learning that Peter had been intimate with both Hannah Ann and Victoria and the fantasy suites. And he was asked about whether or not Maddie had had a fantasy suite date, whether that would have given them a better chance. And he said, if that would have been the case, obviously the show would have gone a little different. But I really truly mean this. I don't know that

that would have changed anything in the long run, which I'm pretty sure he's quite accurate about I mean, yeah, of course not, because they ended up having like plenty of private solo conversations. Nothing about a fantasy

sweet date would have made a difference. No. Well, final headline, other than one kind of fun one that we want to do, congratulations to Tisha Adams, her fiance, Zach, Matt James, and many more. Tyler, who else was there?

There's a lot of Bachelor Alums. Peter Weber did it. Dr. Joe did it. I mean, there's a huge list here of people who did it. But they just ran and completed all of them. The New York City Marathon, I was in New York City the day of the marathon. All I saw was a bunch of people and a lot of traffic. but it was and I also had a big piece of pizza a couple pieces at night while they were running

but it doesn't matter congratulations to them on on completing this it's a huge deal it is such a huge deal I am mind boggled that anyone can run a marathon I can't even believe I used to run three miles in high school and PE class I give myself props for being able to do that my marathons are just i know i said this before but like they fascinate me because they are just seems like the most difficult feat and for all of these bachelor alums that i've met to be able to have the strength and endurance to do it like i'm i'm in all of you guys congratulations yeah well final headline the fun one that we wanted to read uh e w uh just ranked the bachelorette seasons they ranked them in this order. Trista number one, Ashley, your thoughts.

Okay, so I didn't watch Trista season. I mean, I was like 14 when that aired, so I don't really know. Sounds like it was a great season, though. It ended in love and marriage and kids, and it was a huge season. Caitlin, number two, I would like to take credit for that since I was on that season. I think you are able to take partial credit for that. Love Caitlin's season. I agree. It was my favorite season, too. If my husband wasn't on it, still would have been my favorite Bachelorette season. Fantastic cast, fantastic lead. Heck yeah. That was a great season. Jillian was number three, which I did not see, but did you see it? I did not see it. I started watching at Allie's season. Yeah, so Jillian Harris got number three. So went Trista, Caitlin, Jillian.

Listeners, Ritison, your favorite seasons of the Bachelorette. We want to hear them. I want to hear from you. And that's always fun to do. So Ritizen, let us know, Ashley, that's all we got for everybody today. It's been a great episode of Almost Famous Podcast. I will not be here next week. I promise you that. I will not jump back on. I'm going to be gone, but you're going to hold down the fourth. You're going to be on your honeymoon.

Heck yeah. Your honeymoon. Wow. That's some stuff that we can't talk about on air. Oh, baby. We hope that you have a fantastic time. All right. Well, hey, with that, I've been Ben.

I've been Ashley. Bye, guys. Follow the Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous Podcasts on IHartRadio or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts Hi, my name is Enya Umanzor And I'm Drew Phillips And we run a podcast called Emergency Intercom

If you're a crime junkie and you love crimes We're not the podcast for you But if you have unmedicated ADHD Oh my God, perfect And want to hear people with mental illness Psychobabble Yes, yes Then Emergency Intercom is the podcast for you

Open your free IHeartRadio app Search Emergency Intercom And listen now Every case that is a cold case that has DNA Right now in a backlog We'll be identified in our lifetime On the new podcast, America's Crime Lab Every case has a story to tell

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what would you do if one bad decision forced you to choose between a maximum security prison or the most brutal boot camp designed to be hell on earth unfortunately for mark lombardo this was the choice he faced he said you are a number a new york state number and we own you listen to shock and incarceration on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. How serious is youth vaping? Irreversible lung damage serious. One in 10 kids vape serious, which warrants a serious conversation from a serious parental figure like yourself. Not the seriously know-it-all sports dad or the seriously smart podcaster. It requires a serious conversation that is best had by you. No, seriously, the best person to talk to your child about vaping is you. To start the conversation, visit talk about vaping.org, brought to you by

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