The Ben Mulroney Show - A visa scam unlike any other / The verdict is in on a homeless encampment solution

Episode Date: April 17, 2026

 GUEST:   Susan Stevenson / London, ON City councillor ward 4 If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://link.chtbl.com/bms⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Also, on youtube -- ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@BenMulroneyShow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Insta: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ Twitter: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ TikTok: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ Executive Producer:  Mike Drolet Reach out to Mike with story ideas or tips at [e-mail] Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This podcast is brought to you by the National Payroll Institute, the leader for the payroll profession in Canada, setting the standard of professional excellence, delivering critical expertise, and providing resources that over 45,000 payroll professionals rely on. I always love when we can dovetail off of a story for one day and talk about the continuation of it, the next. And yesterday, we told the story of a judge who brought the gavel down

on the Canadian judiciary and also took, a couple of swipes at people who are gaming the system as it relates to their immigration status or lack thereof. And for some reason, how our judges are saying, oh, my goodness, yeah, you overstayed your visa and you're a criminal. Well, we don't want to put you in jail because that could get you deported. They've done the heavy lifting for you, Judge. Send them on his way. There's the exit. No door prize on your way out. Welcome to Canada. Now what? This is a problem here, yes, but we want to start today's part of the story in the UK. UK's got its own issues with migrants and people overstaying visas.

And they sent a BBC reporter undercover to report on a visa claim, a visa scam, rather. And look, again, this is not me talking here. This is the BBC. And I don't see eye to eye with the BBC on everything. So the scam, it's brilliant in its simplicity. Just claim you're gay. The undercover reporter posed as a student who had a visa expiring, right? And that's, we've told that story a number of times.

And, but he has no, like, he's just a regular dude. He's the equivalent, I guess, of a cis white male, right? Like, there's no, he's not checking a whole bunch of boxes. but they uncovered a network of UK law firms coaching fake asylum claims. And can you believe, what do you think they're coaching them? What do you think they're saying, telling them to say, that their lives are in danger?

No, no, no. Just say you're gay, dude. Just say you're gay. That's it. Yeah. Say you're gay. And so the video is impressive, right? Like the guys wearing these secret, like hidden cameras.

And said, we will provide you with all the doctors. documentation. Photos at clubs. That's one of the things. Photos at clubs. I'm sure he's marching in a parade. Now, I would love to do a deep dive into that whole thing because like what if he'd posted on social media that he was with a girl? Well, we were just friends. But anyway, one advisor bragged about 17 years of helping fabricate cases. Another lawyer offered a full fake asylum package for 1,500 pounds, all of up to 3,000 pounds for manufactured evidence. It's a big deal. This is a big deal.

They're essentially going to fabricate a victim profile for you so that you can go in and say, well, we're going to kick you out because your visa is expiring. And then they said, but here, here's my documentation. I'm gay. Oh, well, then in that case, stick around because we don't want to send you back to a place that you could be harmed. and the reason we told you this is because it happened in Canada. And I hope you're sitting down.

I hope you're sitting down for this one. So this comes to us thanks to Jamie Sarkonic from the National Post. There was a Nigerian man who was deemed inadmissible to stay in Canada in 2023. He claimed refugee status in 2024. And he said, you can't kick me out. I'm gay. And then they said, oh, oh, well, in that case, you have every right to be here. So welcome to Canada.

The pride parade is right over there. And he promptly did none of those things. And he got married to a woman. He stayed around, right? He stayed right. He got married to a woman. And then once he's married to the woman, he submitted a spousal sponsorship. application in 2025.

This happened over a short period of time. Denied in 2023, said he was gay in 2024, he stuck around and got married to a woman in 2025. And now that he's, now that he's on that list, awaiting approval on that, he's withdrawn his refugee claim and his admit admits he's not gay. And if we were living in a rational world, if we were living in a Canada that made sense to me, He would be hauled before a committee and they'd say, so you lied about being gay and then you got married and now you are coming back and saying, hey, look, I cheated and I won. Ah! And but now that he's married, he wants to stay. In a world that makes sense to me, you haul him before a committee or whatever it is, a review board and say, you, sir, are an inveterate lie.

And Canada, at this moment in time, doesn't need any more liars. We're all full up. So you, sir, are getting on that plane. And we're charging you for the damn ticket because you took a place in this country that could have gone to somebody who was really in danger. You, sir, are a net negative on this country. And your time here is over. But do you think they're going to do that?

No, but I want them to kiss your wife. She has a choice. She can stay here and thank her lucky stars that she's away from a terrible, awful, liar of a person. Or she can join in Nigeria. But you, sir, have no place here. That's a world, that's a Canada that makes sense to me. So that's one of the scams. And I was surprised to hear that about that one.

I can't be surprised. But I was just remembering about one back in 2018. Oh, yeah. Canada actually tightened up the rules around Romanian travelers, so-called gypsies, because they were... The Roma, exactly, because they were coming in, and they started to notice at the border that all of their stories were the same because they were getting coached. Yeah. So it was, it was, they said all the right things. They had, they had a list of things that they were supposed to say.

That they memorized? Yeah, exactly. And it got them through the border. And then they just sort of disappeared. It was a huge issue, so they tightened it up. So now maybe, who knows? maybe they'll say, I'm here for pride. Are you really? Now, I don't want to, I don't want to get this wrong. There is a, there's a country somewhere. I'm thinking Turkey, but I don't think it's Turkey. It's somewhere where if you claim to be gay to get out of military service, you have to prove that you're gay. It is, I don't know if it's Turkey. I do know that's Spain. I think it's Spain. I think it's Spain. I think it's Spain. And I don't want to get it wrong, because I don't, I don't.

want to besmirch a country, although these days Spain deserves some besmirching. But I think you have to, you literally have to, somebody has to watch you in some sort inflagrante. Delicto. Yes, yes. Video or something. Yeah, I'm telling you. But, I mean, with all due respect, if, listen, we found this.

No, it's not Spain. We found this one guy. Do you think he's the only guy doing this? If it worked for him, he told his. WhatsApp chat group in Nigeria and said, hey guys, I found it. Show up. You're gay. They won't check. And then you can marry

somebody and you can stick around forever. I guarantee you this has happened many times before. He wasn't the guy who invented this. He's the guy who knew it worked and that's why he did it. And so how many people are out there doing that? And so when I first heard the we want to see with our eyes that you're gay,

it sounds awful until you realize that that this is happening. Turkey is one of those places actually, yeah. I guarantee you, they don't have any Nigerians come and just claiming they're gay and then marrying women in Turkey.

I know we shouldn't be taking any leads from Turkey on lots of stuff. But meanwhile, the waste continues. Don't have a lot of time for this. We don't have a lot of time. We'll hold this. This is a good story. We'll figure out a place to put this in another time.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know, man. Like, I think it's, it's sad that this guy went back and forth. And he just, he game the system until he was able to get married and say, hey, now I can be here legally because I get the sponsored because I married a Canadian. Yeah. And look, if, if marrying a Canadian was it. Like that was it once you do, like, you're safe, you know, you're, you're, you're, it's like if you make it to dry land from Cuba on the, on the beaches of Florida, you, you.

that's it. They can't kick you. They can't kick you out, right? That's not this. There is a reason that you have to petition and you have to ask for permission to stay. This man should be denied permission to stay because he's a liar. And we don't need any more liars in Canada. And on that note, we're going to take a break when we come back. We've got a big conversation. We've had lots of conversations about homeless encampments, what to do. One city in Ontario has been, has been, has been, has been, has, as a program that we can now see whether or not it's yielding the results that other, maybe other municipalities should follow or is it a cautionary tale? We'll be talking with Susan Stevenson from London, Ontario, when we come back. Oh, welcome back. Listen, I come across sometimes on this show very loud, and I say what I think, and I say what I mean, I mean what I say, and some people don't like that. And then from that, they hear what they want to hear.

But one thing that I've tried to put forth anytime we speak about homeless populations across this country is I very much want to lead with empathy. I feel that you can say you can tell a lot about a city by how they treat their most vulnerable. And once you have a homeless population, it is not about just saying go get a job. That's not, it's about helping them get back on their feet, understanding their problems. and giving them the tools to reintegrate with society. That's what I want from any city government. But part of that is making sure that in the crazy winter months in Canada, they've got a warm bed.

And in the summer months, they don't opt to create a tent city somewhere, which can be hazardous for so many reasons. The city of London, Ontario, had a project, essentially creating a homeless village, of modular homes. And these are called micromodular shelter village and it's getting some overwhelming positive feedback. But I'm not there.

And I've read a few things, but somebody who has been on the front lines of this battle is our next guest. She's the London, Ontario City Council for Ward 4. Susan Stevenson, Susan, welcome. Thanks for having me back, Ben. Yeah, thanks for coming back. Okay, so this is, look, anytime,

a city tries something novel, something that is not necessarily standard practice, I pay attention because if it is something that works, then cities like Toronto should pay attention. It's cities like Montreal and Calgary and all over the country. So talk to me about what our audience should know about the high-level bullet points of this project. Well, the celebration is that we've got 70 people who are not sleeping in the woods anymore or under a doorway. they've got their own lockable place to live. So that is a good thing that I think all Londoners get behind. I don't know how innovative it is.

I mean, many cities have been doing this. I toured the Herb Street shelter site back in 2023 or 2024. So there's many cities that have done this. I'm not sure what's so unique about London. I think it's the same as what's been done elsewhere. Well, I think it's unique in that in a city like Toronto. I'm not seeing any version of this in bigger cities. and if there is a way to implement something like this as part of a larger strategy in a city like Toronto,

you know, I think we should look at it. Yeah. So now, what did it cost? How much does it cost to run? And then tell me if the cost is, is the juice worth the squeeze? Yeah, well, that's always a good question, too. I mean, we've got shelter costs now ranging $4,000 to $11,000 a month for a shelter bed in our city. when you could get an apartment for $2,500.

So a lot of people are looking at that. You know, when I hear from the public, they're saying, why does it cost this much money to put people in a temporary shelter site? It's a good question. The other thing is where the funding's coming from. I supported this venture, but I didn't support it coming from the municipal property tax base.

I think we should have used the provincial tax funds that we got, we got given by the province, $8.5 million extra a year. year back in 2023 and we chose not to open any new beds with that it all went to uh additional costs that our current shelters wanted to to uh to charge so i think it's a good thing it's not sustainable on the municipal tax base right and the province honestly is asking us to do better with the money that we're being given and i think that's reasonable well what you've what you've just highlighted uh in london is something that uh a city like toronto has certainly been dealing with

which is the taxpayers are asked every year to pay more, to pay more, to come in with massive tax increases. And there has been, not only has there been no commensurate improvement in the delivery of services, but in fact, in a lot of cases, we've seen a retrenchment of the quality of those services. And so we're wondering where our money's going and why it's not translating into a better city. And one of the reasons is because there are so many people in this city who don't all pay taxes who are reliant on increasing level of services and the city's got to find that money somewhere. So they're coming to people like me.

Yes. And CBC did an article. There was one gentleman that wanted to leave the site because he saw his monthly ODSP check go down from $1,400 down to $500 a month because the city was deducting a shelter cost of $599 from his check, which highlights the fact that we've got people out there that are getting the shelter allowance when they're not paying shelter. And it also highlights the fact that we are not, like in that guy's case, I'm sure he's got a lot to overcome. But we have a sort of a problem with a welfare state where people think, all right, this is my money that I'm entitled to. And we haven't filled out that. We haven't populated them with ideas of like there's work to be done.

This is the beginning of something. You need to get to a place where you don't. want that check anymore. You want to earn a check. And then more than that, then you want to pay back into the system that helped you get on your feet. And so, so to me, that's a snapshot of somebody probably at the beginning of his journey, but it's a highlight that we have to invest in, in the pathways to making sure that that person can become that productive member of society. Yes. And to me, it highlighted, too, some of the problems we have with, you know, Hamilton's pointing out the OW and ODSP overpayments that.

happening and how they're not being recuperated and that's draining the tax base in a way that's not getting people house. So I know when I raised the similar questions that the Hamilton Council was asked just at committee last month, the questions, many of them weren't answered and some of them were ruled out of order. There didn't seem to be a desire to talk about the fact that we do have people getting shelter payments when they're not paying shelter costs. taking money from the system. Yeah, so what do you think is going to happen?

You know, you're a veteran of these debates at city council. What do you think is going to happen with this? I mean, I've seen if city councilors and a mayor don't have the proper frame of mind, then they'll poo-poo this cost. You know, it's three-point. Just a few million dollars from the taxpayer. And it'll just get sunk into the next year's budget, next year's budget, next year's budget, next year's budget.

But if it's not yielding the benefits that we want, want it to, there should be somebody there to throw some cold water on it. What do you think is going to happen here? Yeah, well, that's the problem, right? Like, we do need to bring people inside, and so that is doing it. But the details matter. Our job as a council is to evaluate the money spent and what is it creating. When I went out and toured the Herb Street shelter in Kitchener, Waterloo,

they said that, you know, it was working in that people had a roof over their head. but people were not getting well and moving on into housing. It was basically, you know, where housing people, but there was no pathway out, no pathway to recovery from addiction and to sustainable housing. Here, we house people who are deeply, severely mentally ill and deeply addicted, and it's placing an incredible strain in our affordable housing units and putting other people at risk.

Yeah. So that's another avenue. You know, if we're flowing people through, well, to wear and what are the impacts and cost of that? Yeah, it's all well and good to, you give someone a place to hang their hat. Absolutely, they need that. But that's not all they need. But more importantly, it's not what we as a society need. There is a societal need to integrate these people back into productive lives.

So that they can help the next generation. They can help the next, God forbid, there's another generation that falls on tough times. Everybody wins that way. Everybody wins that way. Exactly. Our taxes go down. We've got more people paying taxes and and and and and. People get their life back.

Yeah, people get their life back. Susan Stevenson, London, Ontario City Council, Ward 4. Thank you very much for being here. Have a great weekend. Thanks, you too. All right, don't go anywhere because when we come back, it's hot takes. Well, we got, and we've got a new addition to the panel. So you will meet this person when we come back on the Benmolery shop.

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