The Ben Mulroney Show - Ben breaks down the income tax promises from Mark Carney and Pierre Poilievre

Episode Date: March 25, 2025

Guests and Topics: -Ben breaks down the income tax promises from Mark Carney and Pierre Poilievre with Guest: Franco Terrazzano, Federal Director of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Happy Tuesday Canada, welcome to the Ben Mulroney Show. Thank you for listening to us on the Chorus Talk Network as well as in podcast form or on the iHeart radio streaming app. Wherever we find you, we say thank you for sharing a little bit of your day with us. You know that we appreciate it. We're into the election campaign. I think this is day three of the campaign and everything that was old is new again. I think we a lot of hay was made over former cabinet minister Anita Anand who had said she would not be running in this election when

Justin Trudeau was in charge and the liberals were sitting at 20 percent in the polls and when they got some wind in their sails because of the Mark Carney effect, all of a sudden she didn't need to spend time with her family anymore, which was the reason for the retirement. Instead, she came back. And okay, I mean, crass, opportunism, fine. We'll give them a pass on one of them. But then we find out that Sean Fraser, former housing minister, who by the way is a good guy, I've always liked him, we've always been friendly with each other, and I believe my dad's school at St. Francis Xavier University is in his riding. He said he was retiring to spend time with his family, but now he's back!

Now he's back! Here's what Mark Carney has to say about the political resurrection of Sean Fraser. Sean Fraser is an exceptional public servant. And he took a decision to, for family reasons, to withdraw from public life. And I respected that. I regretted it, but I respected it. I and my colleagues have wanted Sean Fraser to come back and serve Canada at this crucial time. Sean stepping up for our country, if that indeed is what he's going to announce later today, and I don't know. If that indeed is what he's going to announce later today, is exceptionally good news for

Canada. Well, I think one thing that bears a little scrutiny is a reminder that this is yet another one of Trudeau's foot soldiers who voted for the carbon tax, who voted on the capital gains inclusion rate, voted to stop pipelines, voted for the tanker ban off the west coast, voted on all of these things that have weakened Canada is back. So it's yet another point of data to suggest that, yes, you've removed the guy at the top, but the entire army behind him is the exact same group. Same, different Carney, same circus. Back to Mark Carney, he said something really interesting that

is not getting the pushback from the press that it should be. He said and continues to say every day that the one issue that will dominate this campaign and the next four years is the threat of Donald Trump, the unreliable partner who is Donald Trump, the threats that he's levied on us. Don't worry about the last 10 years, we're going to fix that even though we caused it. What we have to look at is Donald Trump. I came into politics because this moment is unique in Canadian history and I am here to solve it. So when he said this, I shook my head. With respect to the president, president is waiting for the outcome of the election and see who has a strong mandate from shook my head. I hope Canadians will back me and then we'll have a discussion. Thank you, Steve. Sir, did you say that President Trump is waiting to talk to the Prime Minister of whoever wins

this election? Well, that's an interpretation, but I think it's a reasonable interpretation. I'm available for a call, but we're going to talk on our terms as a sovereign country, not as what he pretends we are, and on a comprehensive deal. So I find it really rich that when Mark Carney was criticized for being, you know, hadn't been elected, the accountability wasn't there, even though the system allows for it, right? There was a lot of pushback, oh, the system, that's how the system works, Ben. That's how the system works. You don't understand the system. I absolutely

understand the system. I just noticed that it was a rather unique application of the system. So, if that's how the system works, then whoever's Prime Minister, doesn't matter how they got there, they are Prime Minister. They are our representative. And the moment he became Prime Minister, it doesn't matter how they got there, they are Prime Minister. They are our representative. And the moment he became Prime Minister, there should have been a phone call between our greatest trading partner and our Prime Minister. Are you telling me that since you became Prime Minister, you haven't had a phone call with the man?

He's apparently the greatest existential threat that we as a country have ever faced. Because he is not, because he is, listen, I'm gonna say something that some of you are gonna push back on. He is not the greatest threat. He is not the greatest threat. He is a problem to be dealt with, but Mark Carney feels that it is politically expedient

for him to deal with it after the election. Had he tried to deal with it before the election and failed, it wouldn't be a ballot issue anymore. Yes, absolutely. Let's prosecute this election on the potential that I could fix it, not on the reality that I have done nothing about it since assuming power. That needs to get through to more people because they are playing with the economy of this country.

This could have been dealt with, or at least begun to get dealt with, and they've done nothing on it because it serves their political fortunes to deal with it after the election. We are being played, and more people need to push back. Why haven't you had a phone call?

You were the prime minister. You chose to do nothing. If that doesn't get you upset, nothing will. Now, Pierre Poliev on the other side of the political equation thinks that there's a reason why Donald Trump wants the liberals in power. My agenda is to put Canada first for a change. You know, there's a reason why Donald Trump wants the weak, out of touch liberals in power. They've handed him control of our economy. You know, Trudeau and Carney raised taxes on work, investment, small business, driving a half trillion dollars out of our economy to the U.S.

They've blocked pipelines, mines, LNG plants, forcing our energy companies to sell 100 percent, almost a hundred percent of their their product to the Americans at discount prices. They have buried us in bureaucracy and Donald Trump knows that a weak, out-of-touch, Liberal government, given a fourth mandate, will only make Canada a bigger target for him. Find one thing he said that isn't true.

One thing. All of that is true. Every single word that he said is factually accurate. And when you've got Mark Carney wordsmithing, trying to infer what is not there when he says that, oh, Donald Trump wants somebody who's in sync with him, there's nothing wrong with a Canadian government being in sync with our largest partner on so many different files. Being in sync doesn't mean being a lapdog. And if you don't know the

difference, actually I do believe Mark Carney knows the difference, I believe he and his team are being disingenuous. I believe they are trying to confuse the argument. I think they are trying to confuse the voter. I think they are trying to tell them something that is not true. And if you ever listen to Pierre Poliev, there is not a word that comes out of his mouth that does not come from a place of wanting to project a vision of Canada that is strong so that we can then defend our interests against somebody who will push back. Simple as that. Simple as that. But back to Mike Myers and Mark Carney. Yesterday, we cringed as a nation with the exception of perhaps people of a certain age over the video that they did together. Well, they went back to

the well. Let's listen to a little bit of Mike Myers and Mark Carney's love fest. It's bullies. This is what I can't stand in the world. And we're the country that stands up to bullies. And I hope, and I know that you will, but I hope we continue to be the good guys. What does Canada mean to you? Like, how does it? Canada means everything. I wouldn't be anything without Canada. The Canadian taxpayers subsidized our housing, gave me a fantastic high school. They had a television studio. JAY... You get that education.

You get that perspective. I mean, you're talented, but you get the opportunity to express that talent. I mean, you are talented. POLLIN Yeah. Well, thank you. That's very kind. No, I got to learn a bit. JAY...

I think you're going to do big things. POLLIN I hope so. Thank you. That's very nice. No, but got to learn a little bit. I think you're going to do big things. I hope so. Thank you. That's very nice. No, but, you know, I worked at the CBC. In fact, I didn't know that. You worked? I didn't know that. Yeah.

I didn't see. Do you think we should get rid of the CBC? No. No, you should get rid of the CBC. All right. Let's end it there. And bonus, bonus, Mark Carney got the endorsement from Mike Myers. Very early on in this election campaign, we got two major announcements almost back to back, one by the Liberal leader Mark Carney, the other by Conservative leader Pierre Poliev

on a tax cut. And to talk about that and a few other tax issues, we're joined by Franco Tarrazano, federal director of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation. Franco, welcome to the show. Hey, Ben, thanks for having me on today. Okay, so break down these two announcements by the numbers for me. On one hand, you got Pierre Poliev's pledge of a 15% income tax cut for the average worker, but it comes out to about 2, 2.5%.

And on the Carney side, it's a 1% reduction. So talk to me about what that means practically. Well, let me just say, you know, at the Canadian Canadian Taxpayers Federation I love to see this dueling tax cut election where both parties are trying to outdo themselves promising more tax cuts and on income taxes right Paulie Ev is promising twice as much relief as Mr. Carney and the Liberals so what Paulie Ev is proposing is to take the lowest income tax rate from 15% to 12.75%. So what that means is that it would save the two income working family about $1,800 a year. Like that's some big time savings.

That's keeping $14 billion in taxpayers pockets every year. Now on Carney's side and what the liberals are proposing, they're going to take that income tax rate from 15% down to 14% and that would save the two income working family up to $825. Okay. Okay. So still something. Yeah. Yeah. Still something. But, uh, you know, Paul Yev is saying we're going to save that family $1,800. Carney is saying, we're going to save that family $825. Both are talking about savings, but you've got to give the edge there to Poliev, who is cutting income taxes twice as much as Carney. Can I tell you something that I find quite spectacular is when I hear pundits and journalists

push back and say, well, now it's incumbent upon Pierre Poliev to explain how he's gonna pay for his tax cut. As if the government is entitled to a certain level of taxes as opposed to saying, we're giving people back the money that they earned. And it should be incumbent on people to say how they're gonna pay for their programs. I think it's very, very telling

when people put the onus on the tax cut as opposed to the program. Yeah, newsflash. That isn't the government's money. Yeah. That's Canadians money. Yeah. Right. We worked hard for that money. That's our money. Okay. This is that money doesn't belong to the government. Right. The government isn't giving us our money back.

The government is just not taking it in the first place. But like look, you mentioned the savings, I'll get into it. Okay, so far Carney has not given any idea how he's gonna actually reduce the debt, right? He says these slogans like spend more or spend less, invest more, whatever that means. But you know, under Carney, he hasn't given us any concrete plan how he's gonna stop the debt from climbing further and further after the federal government just Doubled the national debt in less than a decade. Yeah, you know at least to mr Poliev's credit we haven't seen the platform yet So still waiting on more details, but at least Poliev is outlining places that he's going to cut some spending right like the consultants

Yeah, where the government doubled the cost of consultants in less than a decade. Does anybody think that the size of government is appropriate? Does anybody think that the level of spending of the government is appropriate? Does anybody think that every single government program that exists today is vital to the national interest? The answer to all those if you're a level-headed good faith person is no. Yeah, if you're living outside of Ottawa, and you're not getting paid by the government, the answer is no. And, and you know, Ben, let me just throw it a stat, okay, because it ties into

what Paul EF says, and I think it paints the picture pretty well. So Paul EF says, yeah, we got to shrink the size and cost of the bureaucracy. Because since 2016, okay, the Trudeau government ballooned the cost of the bureaucracy by 73%. We're not getting anywhere close. We're not getting value for that. It's not easier today to get a passport. I can promise you that. So I think a reality check is important. I'm glad we're having this election to do just that.

But let's go back. He has promised to spell out his spending cuts in his platform. That will come. One thing he did announce was he tweaked his promise of reducing the GST on certain types of home purchases. It went from homes up to a million dollars and now up to 1.3 million. What do you make of that change?

Yeah, it's a good move. It's a good move. I mean, look, you're talking about savings when you buy a new home of up to $65,000. Yeah. Like, I don't know anyone who's going to be complaining about that. I mean, these housing prices are out of control. You know what I mean? So by Paulie of expanding that threshold to $1.3 million, you know, I really do think

it's going to help people who are looking to get into the market. And it's going to save people up to 65,000 bucks. Yeah, and it also deepens the pool of potential homes that would be subjected to this because, you know, a million is great, but there's a lot more a lot more homes that fall under the $1.3 million bracket. Oh, yeah, especially in the big cities, right? Like Toronto, Vancouver, I mean, you know, Montreal, Ottawa, to an extent as well. No, I think this is good, but hey, it's one other thing that this will do.

Like, so, okay, Polyeth announcement essentially does two things, right? Number one, it saves you money immediately if you're buying that new home up to 65,000 bucks. But number two, what it actually does, and I think the longer term effect here is that encourages more development, it encourages more supply and that's really how we're gonna have to deal with this housing affordability crisis and the

reason it does that is because you know government fees, charges, taxes you know make up to like more than 30% of construction cost. If every other level of government was able to get on board with this sort of level of cutting, all of a sudden it's not 65,000, it's over 150,000. And now you're talking real savings that can allow people who were previously prohibited from entering the housing market to jumping in with both feet. I want to move on Franco Tarrazano from the Canadian Taxpayer Federation to something I didn't even know existed. I used to talk about the dysfunctional relationship that existed in Ontario between the government and alcohol, but I didn't realize that that extended

to the federal government. I had no idea that there was this alcohol tax hike that happens every year without a vote in the House of Commons. Yeah, completely undemocratic. And it's just, this was brought in under, well, I guess previous now, Trudeau government in 2017. And what they did is they increased federal excise taxes every single year without a vote in parliament and it happens every April 1. So in exactly one week, federal excise taxes on the beer you like, the wine you like, the Canadian whiskey you like, well that's going up again. What's the justification for that? Oh, they haven't provided a justification, right? They said initially, oh, well, we got to keep increasing

taxes with inflation. Yeah, so now Canadians get soaked twice, once with the higher cost of living, and then the second with the tax increase on top of it. But you know, Ben, this year's tax hike will cost us about 40 million bucks. However, since being imposed this automatic sneaky alcohol tax hike, it is so taxpayers for more than $900 million. Okay. Now, if you're looking at all the different taxes that we play pay to both

provincial and federal governments for the beer, the wine, the whiskey. OK, beer and wine, 50 percent of the price you pay for a cold one or for a glass of Pino with your better half. That's tax. Is it really? I had no I had no idea. So so you're calling on all the leaders to oppose this. My if I had to guess, I mean, I don't know what people are going to say, but this seems more in line with the ethos of a Pierre Poliev. And given the fact that Mark Carney has decided that everything that they supported just a few weeks ago, they're going to turn their back on.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mark Carney endorsed your idea as well. When are you hoping to hear from the leaders? Well, I mean, we have a week until the tax goes up. You know what I mean? So pitter-patter. But we don't have a mechanism by which tax goes up. You know what I mean? So pitter patter. But we don't have a mechanism by which to stop it at this point, right? If it's an automatic increase, we're going to have to wait until there's a new government in place, but they could retroactively turn it off.

That's correct. But even technically, even though we have a caretaker government, even technically, just like how Carney was talking about setting the carbon tax rate to zero through a cabinet order. That same mechanism technically still applies. He could have a signing ceremony. He could have a Donald Trump signing ceremony. It'd be lovely. Get the photo op. There you go. So they have a week to stop this. And if they don't stop it, what they could do, right, is just in their platform, commit to ending this undemocratic and unapportable alcohol tax increase.

Franco, thank you so much for joining us. Hope to talk to you again soon. Hey, thanks Ben. We've mastered made-to-measure growth and expansion advice, and we can talk your ear off about transferring your business when the time comes. Because at Desjardins Business, we speak the same language you do – business. So join the more than 400,000 Canadian entrepreneurs who already count on us and contact Desjardins today. We'd love to talk business.