The Ben Mulroney Show - Ben discusses shutting down busy intersections for Prayer

Episode Date: March 20, 2025

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Bet MGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. Trees of green, red roses too. I see them bloom for me and for you. And I think to myself, what a wonderful world. Welcome to the Brian Mulrooney birthday edition of the Ben Mulrooney Show. In 1939 on this day, Martin Brian Mulroney was born in Bay Como, Quebec on the north shore of the St. Lawrence River in a pulp and paper mill town. And from there, he built an incredible life that I was so privileged to share in with him. And

look, you're going gonna be hearing that voice over the course of this show. The older he got, the more he liked to sing. And we would go to parties and people would ask him to sing and he wanted me and my brothers to act as his backup singers. And one day, I don't know what happened, I might've had one too many cocktails,

but I was singing too loud for him. He felt that it was taking away from his performance and he banned me from the band. He kicked me out of the band. He was the grand marshal once of the St. Patrick's Day parade in Montreal. My sister picked up that baton and last weekend was the grand marshal here in Toronto. And I was struck by the visual of being able to walk down Bloor and take that corner, go

south on Yonge Street. I said, this is a visual I'll never get. I'm so privileged to be here. And I'm reminded of that moment today because that very intersection was taken over for a hundreds of people to pray at a busy time of the day. And the cops did nothing to stop it. And I thought to myself, well, I mean, how was I allowed to walk in the street? Well, it was a parade. And if you start a parade in this city, if you wanted to have a parade, you need a street event permit from the city of Toronto, and you have to get a notification of a tent to hold a parade with the Toronto Police Service. Does anybody think that the spontaneous prayer that was held at that intersection got either one of those things. No. So what would have happened if the St. Patrick's Day Parade just spontaneously popped up and said, well, we're here celebrating our culture and our Catholic faith? What do you think would

have happened? Do you think they would have been allowed to stop traffic? No, I don't. So why? Why was this allowed? Why is this still allowed to happen? And I want to hear from you at 416-870-6400 or 1-888-225-TALK. I will remind you that not two full blocks north of where this manifestation happened. There is a mosque.

There is a big mosque. It used to be a shopper's drug mart. And it's two blocks north. You know what's in between that mosque and where the prayers happen on the street? The Israeli embassy. It's right there. So I'm done giving anybody the benefit of the doubt. I'm done.

I don't care what your justification is. I don't care. That was done to intimidate the Israeli consulate and the people who work there. If it wasn't, it was about prayer, you actually have a place designed for that two blocks north. And I'm done hearing either the police or saying, well, you have a charter right BS, BS. That's nonsense. Somebody needs to challenge this stuff in court, or somebody needs to open and investigate, I would love the OPP or the RCMP to start looking into the directives. Like why is the leadership of the TPS not allowing the cops to enforce the rules? This is not normal.

Nobody is gonna tell me it's normal and I won't live in a world where it is normalized. I don't see this anywhere else to the extent I see it here. So I'm done giving anybody the benefit of the doubt on this. Let's see if I'm alone. Michael, welcome to the show. Hey, Ben, I didn't care for you on television, but I absolutely love you on the radio.

So keep up your good work. I appreciate it, sir. All right, what do you think of these? Look, whether it's prayer or protest, I don't care anymore. I'm done with it. And unless people stop it, sir. What do you think of these? Look, whether it's prayer or protest, I don't care anymore. I'm done with it. And unless people stop it, I don't want to hear about it. I don't disagree with you. However, I'm going to go back to the 80s. Your dad was in charge at the time and they took the Lord's Prayer out of either Queen's Park or the House of Commons. I can't remember which one. And I was having a discussion with a Muslim friend of mine

Who was like 30 years older than I was and I was offended I was perplexed by it and he said do not look at us I'll guarantee you every Muslim in the House of Commons would have voted to keep in the Lord's Prayer Yeah, you have done this to yourselves and it's true Yeah, just keep rolling over and saying, Yes, sir, can I have another? Yeah, and it's got to stop. And it does have to stop. And look, I'll say it, but I don't think it needs to be said anymore. And I'm tired of feeling like I have to justify and protect myself by saying, recognizing that this is a small group of people that doesn't represent the larger community. Like, look, I'm a good faith actor. When I talk about the protests,

I'm talking about the protesters. When I'm talking about the people clogging up traffic when they could have been in a mosque, those are the people I'm talking about. I do not, if I'm gonna tar and feather a large group, I will tell you I'm doing it. So I'm not gonna hedge anymore, but I do appreciate your call.

And I wanna hear now from, who do we have? We've got David. David, welcome to the show. What do you think? Hi, Ben. I'm absolutely sick and tired of this. And I don't understand why the weak people of Toronto do not counter organized and counter protest these flagrant acts of their acts of aggression. They're not prayer sessions.

These are people who are a who are overtly showing displays of passive aggressiveness and they're sending a message. Well, it's an intimidation tactic. That's what this is. The burden to prove it's not is not on me. I have eyes, I have ears, I live in a world, I can make connections. You chose to do that because it's right next to the Israeli consulate. It was outdoors where people can see it as opposed to praying indoors where you have a mosque two blocks away. And when I lived in Toronto, I used to head downtown Young and Dundask

really often. I loved living in Toronto. And I would see these groups of anywhere from eight to 12, you know, 25, 30 something Muslim males, all physically quite fit. And they would amass and mob around any of these people who were distributing Christian literature. And they were surrounding them and getting right in their faces and telling them,

this is not your country anymore. This is our country. You're gonna shut the hell up and you're gonna leave this corner. And I couldn't believe it. Like I couldn't believe it. And this was going back five years ago. So-

I just don't, I don't understand how, I don't understand David, why the city will allow, but take the religion out of it, take culture out of it. This is impeding our ability to live our lives. There is video from that prayer session where an ambulance with his lights on that was trying to get downtown either to pick up somebody in distress or take them to hospital row had to be diverted. Are you kidding me? Are you kidding me? I used to talk about how bike lanes were going to get somebody killed because up Yonge Street you can't get an emergency vehicle through. We have an example on video yesterday of an ambulance not being prioritized because people

want to pray in the streets and intimidate the Jews. All right, sorry, I still want to take some more calls. So before the break, let's say hi to Daryl. Good morning, Ben. Good morning, Daryl. We haven't spoken since you've taken over permanently. Congratulations. Thank you very much. Well, I do, however, think you're being a little bit hyperbolic right now. The Charter of Rights and Freedoms is thank-or-saint. I know you're going to be angry at me and say you don't have any time for me, but it's pretty hard to be any more peaceful than evening prayers. There is a mosque two blocks away. Two blocks away.

I know, but they do have the right to be in front of the building they are in front of and say, listen, what your people back over across the planet are doing is wrong and we disagree with it. And rather than they weren't yelling and shouting and screaming and throwing things and necessarily being deliberately intimidating. Tell me why that person's right to do that. Let's assume you're right for a moment. Tell me why at the drop of a hat,

when someone so chooses, their rights trump anybody else's rights to simply live their life. Just tell me that. Why is that group, why are those people allowed to disrupt everybody else's life? Just tell me that. Well, that's part of the charter of rights and freedom. No, no, no. That's not how it works. At least last night. At least last night. Listen, if it happened once, if it happened twice, if it happened five or ten times, I think a lot of people would accept that. The city has been paralyzed for a year and a half.

And what I want to see happen is I want the hammer to drop and I want the courts to figure it out. That's what I want. For once, I want the law to apply. And what, you know what? If the courts tell me I'm wrong, great. But this needs to go to court so we can settle it once and for all. Thank you for the call. I do appreciate the debate and I hope you do call back.

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BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. At Desjardins, we speak business. We speak equipment modernization. We're fluent in data digitization and expansion into foreign markets. And we can talk all day about streamlining manufacturing processes. Because at Desjardins Business, we speak the same language you do, business. So join the more than 400,000 Canadian entrepreneurs who already count on us and contact Desjardins today. We'd love to talk business. We're talking about the prayer

slash protest that descended upon Canada's busiest intersection yesterday. And and I had a great conversation with one of our callers who who who said that this is it was peaceful and they have a charter right to do this. And I took issue with it. I do appreciate the call and I do I always invite opposing views and I will always listen. We may get into it a little bit, but I hope they understand it's respectful, maybe passionate, but respectful. Look, yes, the charter is there to protect certain behaviors, the right to free expression and to protest is fundamental to Canadian society. But these rights are not absolute. You can't do it anytime you want, wherever you want.

They cannot come at the expense of the rights of others or of safety or of the basic function of society. If it was absolute, then there would be nothing offensive about droves of protesters going into Jewish communities where those people live and pray marching by their homes that that would be absolute they should absolutely have the right to do that right absolutely not we have a problem with that why can't we say that people who live downtown and work downtown and for the basic function of this city we are going to put limits on when you can do these sorts of things. Why is that against the grain? Why is that so wrong?

Well, let's see. Let's welcome Naeem to the show. Naeem, welcome. Thank you so much for calling in. Good morning, Ben. And before we get started, the conversation regards to your family on your dad's birthday. I wanted to say that I'm a little conflicted in this matter because maybe I feel like I have skin in the game in this particular issue as a person who is, you know, simpatico to the plight of the Gazans and somebody who is a practicing Muslim. I do have issue with, you know, inconveniencing others for perhaps what I may consider to be my cause. I guess we live in a society and maybe to the prior caller's point about our charter right and to your point is it is a charter right trumped by inconvenience. Maybe it does need to be tested in the courts.

Perhaps I agree with you on that. But I think about myself in the past when it's not an issue that I have maybe direct skin in the game, whether it was, you know, the Tamil takeover of the Gardiner or, you know, in this case, particular case, like if the UJA is holding their walk for Israel, right? Obviously something that I don't agree with, but I do feel like I do agree with their right to protest. I suspect though, and Naeem, if I can jump in, I suspect if there's something official like a walk for Israel, I'm pretty sure they got a permit to walk down the street.

I was just, yeah, so I was just gonna address that point. Is that in the case of the Tamils, right? It was obviously not official. They took over the highway. Obviously even something that was illegal. But you know what happened? At that time I was younger. It actually caused me to think about and look at the issue and entertain the discussion, which an average person may

never do. Well, and Naeem, listen, by the way, all great points and thank you for making them. But I think only somebody who is a shut in, who does not consume even one iota of news has not been affected by these and therefore has not engaged in the conversation. We're there. Can we just agree we've been having the conversation as a city for a year and a half? I think we can agree on that. We have been having the conversation, I agree. And I guess the question would be begged again by people who are out there would send is, okay, have we had enough of a conversation? And I guess that just depends on how vested are you in the cause, right?

For somebody who's superficial, they had, they've had it months ago. For somebody that's touched by it, it's probably never going to end until- But that is not on the, that is not on the regular, the regular ordinary everyday citizens of this city to own. It's not. This is a, this is a city in North America made up of, this is the most multicultural city in the world. If every community was allowed to import

the ills of their country and take over the city, anytime there was a flashpoint in their country, this city would burn to the ground. I think you are allowed to implore your government. And in the case of neighbourhoods, I also agree with you. But in this case, they were at the Israeli consulate. I think you kind of referred to it as an intimidation tactic. Well, then it becomes a no-win.

Is that, okay, you know, they're being told, don't go into neighbourhoods. Why not go to City Hall, where there's no traffic, you could have prayed. There's a Ramadan sign there every year. Why not go to City Hall where there's no traffic, you could have prayed, there's a Ramadan sign there every year. Why not there? Why not take over that spot, the seat of our city government where nobody would view it as intimidation, the message would still get out

and the people of the city, some of whom by the way, are probably inclined to support your side of the equation who have been so inconvenienced, they're done with the conversation, they just want to get back to their life. I agree with you. I like I said, at the outset, I am I am more inclined and not inconveniencing people. But I think that, you know, when you say that the regular person, you know,

they're done with it. I agree with that, too. It's the situation is we live in, we live in a society where we are allowed to protest. And at this point, we have to balance out inconvenience and your right to protest. And the protests continue, they continue. And I think we live in a society where it's fluid and things do work out in the end, they work themselves out. Well, Naeem, Naeem, listen, I want to thank you for a respectful conversation. I really did. I'm glad we were able to chat on this. And yes, we do live in a, I want to thank you for a respectful conversation. I really did. I'm glad we were able to chat on this. And yes, we do live in a society where you have the right to protest,

but not with impunity. It is not an absolute right. And at some point it's got to butt up against the reality of everybody else living in this city. Speaking of which, Michael is on the line and he lives in that, at that intersection. Michael, talk to me about what your life was like yesterday, because everybody who was praying feels that they had certain rights. Tell me about how it affected you.

Well, I didn't have rights. The police get very aggressive with you. You tell them I live in that tower right there and you're basically told no. And you couldn't go home well I had to walk around three blocks right and and you know the thing is that young and blue and you know this you live kind of midtown yeah if your bumper blocks the sidewalk while you're trying to get into the underground you got these these meter mates tapping on the back of your car telling you to move yeah

meanwhile all of young and blue is shut down, which is illegal. If I cross Young and Blue on a red light, I can get a ticket. Michael, I got a speed ticket for going 47 and a 40 at 6 a.m. with no cars on the road. So this whole, they have the right to protest. That's all the cops were saying, and they keep repeating that. They have the right to protest, but I don't have the right to get home. Yeah And and this is where this is what this is where we are now This has been and look I'll go back to what I said before Michael like because we're the most multicultural city in the world

There are problems all over the world all over the world and the people from one community are affected more from by it because of where they come from if community are affected more from a by it because of where they come from. If every cultural community in this city is given absolute license to take over young and Bloor every time something happens in their part of the world, that means that much to them, we will never function as a, as a city. We will fall apart. You know, we had to do this. This is the first protest down there. And it's not the first time residents

have been given the finger. It's just not residents. A lot of people weren't there. They want to get home. You talk to Josh Matlow, nothing. You get no response whatsoever. Last night was an okay night, but we've had to do this when it's a minus 30 out.

Okay, and when you live at Yonge and Bloor, you have to walk out to Bay, or you have to go over a block west and then come across Charles and down an alleyway to get home. Yeah. Something, where are my rights? Yeah, and well, exactly.

Well, they've been consumed because we're living in a world where the right to protest has now been deemed de facto absolute. Thank you to everybody who called in. I hope you know that if you disagree with me, I'm still gonna engage with you. I'm not gonna, I want this to be a forum where we can all discuss things.

Like I said, it might get heated, but it'll always be good faith and it'll always be respectful. Now streaming. What do you know about the Happy Face Killer? He's my father. It's so good to see you, Missy. Experience the thrilling new series.

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exclusively on Paramount Plus. analysis from award winning global news journalists. New episodes drop every day. So take this as your personal invitation to join us on the global national podcast. You can find it on Apple podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, and wherever you find your favorite podcasts. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney show. And there are few people in our society I admire more than the entrepreneur. Somebody who bets on themselves, has a vision for what they want to put out into the world, works their butt off with no guarantee of success, and builds something. Builds something that creates connections in a community, creates jobs.

It takes a special kind of person to have that sort of belief in themselves. And I do everything I can to champion entrepreneurs in every way I can. And of those entrepreneurs, there is a subset that is particularly brave, and it's people who go into the restaurant business. The margins are razor thin. You depend on, you know, you depend on so many factors to be successful, but you love food and you love hospitality and you want to welcome people and you want to feed people. And there's emotion that goes into it as well.

And there are, it happens sometimes, but it happens for tons of reasons, but every now and then you make a reservation at a restaurant and then for whatever reason, you can't show up. I do my best to cancel as early as I know. It doesn't happen every time and I feel awful when I don't. But now I'm learning that in Quebec, the Quebec government is now allowing restaurants to charge people who do not show up.

They're allowing them to charge $10 a person for no shows, but only if the reservation is for five people or more. However, restaurateurs will not be allowed to charge the fee if at least one member of the group shows up to eat. First of all, I didn't know that you required the government to allow you to do that. You're an entrepreneur, you should be able to set the rules of engagement.

And if people don't like it, they shouldn't show up. If there's a no show fee, you shouldn't, and you don't like it, then don't make a reservation. And I have not only have no problem with this, I very much like this. I very much think that entrepreneurs should and restaurateurs should be able to charge whatever they want. Take your credit card upon making the reservation and if you don't show up, a hundred bucks. Ding. Sorry, but we have to make our money back. And we were going to make a heck of a lot more than a hundred bucks from you because

we make our money off of selling you booze, not selling you food. And so anyway, I like it. I don't know if you like it. Let me know. Four one six eight seven zero sixty four hundred or one triple eight two two five talk. Do you love this idea? Do you hate this idea? And so anyway, I like it. I don't know if you like it. Let me know. 416-870-6400 or 1-888-225-TALK. Do you love this idea? Do you hate this idea? Should Ontario be allowed to implement it here as well?

I don't even know if we do allow it. I mean, I've been at restaurants where you have to put your credit card down when you make the reservation. And look, it would allow, it would light a little fire under somebody if they know they're not gonna show up. The onus should be on you to tell the restaurant. Restaurant's ready for you.

They got a table ready for you. You're the one who didn't show up. You're the one who broke the contract. It's a social contract. You called them. You said, I wanna eat at your restaurant. They said, yes, we can accommodate you. We look forward to serving you. And then you decide you don't want to go and you don't have the respect for the entrepreneur and the restaurateur

to call them and say, sorry. And what have they done? They've got an empty foretop. And I'd love to know what you have to say. I don't have an iota of a problem with this. I think it should be it should be almost automatic, frankly. But I'd love to know what you have to what you have to say. Because I know for some people, it's going to rub them the wrong way. Bill, what do you think? Ben, yes, happy Thursday. Happy Thursday. Any place offers reservations. Be entitled to a surcharge if you fail to show up for that reservation. Yeah. Your dentist does it. Yeah. Why not

a restaurant? Of course. Exactly. I don't I don't know. It shocked me that this is the Quebec government wasn't even allowing restaurants to do this. This is a net positive for these things that we depend on. We depend on restaurants for so many reasons, not just for culture and for food and for tourism, but for employment and for the taxes. Especially when we go to that restaurant and all of a sudden we had something that cracked our tooth. Now we gotta go to the dentist. Yeah. It could be a double whammy. But listen, even with dentists, it's, excuse me, you gotta call them like 24 hours before.

With restaurants, I mean, they should be able to make up the rules that they want. Say, this is the value proposition that we are offering you. We're gonna offer you food, we're gonna have a reservation for you. Great wine list, great atmosphere. But if you don't show up, we're gonna ding your credit card X.

Do you still wanna eat here? Yes or no? No? Okay, go find another restaurant. Why can't every restaurant in the country do that? Melissa, what do you think? Am I off base? No, I totally agree with you. I used to work in the service industry going through to do nursing back in the day. Most recently went to a new speakeasy restaurant in London, Ontario

called Poppy Steakhouse. It is very, very expensive for London area. And we couldn't make the reservation, wasn't feeling well and they did in fact charge us $100. But you know what I mean, like it is what it is and if you're going there, I'm not going to McDonald's, I'm not going to another place like that, I'm going to Pappy's Steakhouse, this is going to be overtly like beyond expectations.

Yeah, you're not just going for the food, you're going for the experience. And they are banking on you showing up. They've literally cordoned off a spot in the restaurant for two hours and they've said, and listen, I've watched enough of those restaurant makeover TV shows to know that you can get really granular in terms of how much are our food costs for this meal?

All right, what should we charge for it? Okay, so how much are we gonna make every time we sell it? Right? And how much wine do we sell? So they know more or less how much they are expecting to make when you call and say, I wanna be there for Friday for dinner with four people. They can get really close to the total that they can expect.

And they have to be able to make projections so that they can then invest in the next week's food. And, you know, maybe they got something that isn't selling very well. And so then they tweak the offering. Like this is, for an industry that operates on such tight margins to begin with, for them not to have the ability to recoup the loss that somebody else has inflicted on them is unfair and onerous. And if I were a restaurateur, I would be, I would be getting together with the BIA and

I'd be petitioning the city or the province to if in fact the province doesn't allow them to do that, to ensure that they have the right to do it. And again, I don't even think the government should limit how much they can charge $10 per person and only if there's five of you in a reservation, first of all, five and it's two tops and four tops, you know, every now and then you get five or six or seven or eight. But this is this is a terrible bar that they've got five or more. Why are you coming down on the side of the person who's breaking the social contract?

You should be coming down in favor of the group that is paying the taxes, paying the rent, employing the community and giving them a place to go. And if that restaurant becomes a success, people from elsewhere come to the city. This is, this to me is, this is a no brainer. This should be, restaurants should have exclusive domain to tell people what the rules of engagement are

when they call up and establish a social contract by getting a reservation. That's it, full stop. Anything else is government overreach and establish a social contract by getting a reservation. That's it, full stop. Anything else is government overreach as far as I'm concerned. So I don't know what the rules are in Ontario. I should have done my research. But if that's the case here, then Doug should show his support for restaurateurs

and give them carte blanche to do whatever they want, let the chips fall where they may. There's no limit to how far criminals will go to cover their tracks, but investigators will go even further to uncover the truth. I'm Nancy Hicks, a senior crime reporter for Global News. This season on Crime Beat, I'll take you from the crime scene to the courtroom, and inside

some of Canada's most high-profile cases, and some you've likely never heard of before. Search for and listen to Crime Beat on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, and wherever you find your favorite podcasts.