The Ben Mulroney Show - Ben discusses what Justin Trudeau's legacy is after 9 years as Prime Minister

Episode Date: February 20, 2025

Guests and Topics: Guest: Warren Kinsella, Former Special Advisor to Jean Chretien and CEO of the Daisy Group If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is Carry the Fire. I'm your host, Lisa Laflamme. Carry the Fire, a podcast by the Princess Margaret Cancer Foundation featuring inspiring personal stories about what happens when world leading doctors, nurses, researchers, and their patients come together to ignite breakthroughs. Carry the Fire launches Monday, January 27th, wherever you get your podcasts. I'm joined now by Warren Kinsella, a good friend and former special advisor to Jean Creutzin, the CEO of the Daisy Group. Warren, welcome back to the Ben Mulroney Show.

Thanks, my friend. So we got a lot to talk about. And I think one of the most interesting stories of the week that I don't think anybody saw coming was Justin Trudeau's announcement of a high speed rail corridor between Quebec City and Toronto, something that people from all walks of life and all political persuasions have been hoping for. I just think it was really odd that it came from a caretaker prime minister. And like, forgive me for being cynical, but I am cynical.

Like Ben, as you and I know, this has been promised by governments in Canada, going back to the early 1960s. And we still don't have it. So like color me not impressed. Like it just, it's like, seriously, this guy's departing in just a matter of days and he makes an announcement of this magnitude.

It just didn't feel serious. No, it didn't feel serious. I'm wondering where the like we're in a parodied situation. His minister of transport was sitting next to her. She's not running again. He's out the door. I'm wondering where the money's coming from. I don't I don't know where the where the political will comes from.

So, so let's explore two cynical scenarios. One of them is that he's worried about his legacy. I mean, look, when my dad resigned, as unpopular as he was at the time, there wasn't a single candidate lining up to replace him that was suggesting jettisoning his major policy initiatives. That is not the case with this outgoing prime minister. This is a guy whose signature policy initiative

was the carbon tax and the people who supported it are willing to jettison it immediately. So besides that, what does he, he's got legalizing marijuana. I think he's got a couple of things. The political one is taking a party that was in third place in a distant corner of the House of Commons and propelling it into a majority government. That, in fairness to him, that's never happened before. Having a cutting in half child poverty in Canada

with the Canada Child Benefit, that's good. We probably did better than the other countries during COVID. So he's got some things to point to, which is the point where, you know, we probably did better than the other countries during COVID. So he's got some things to point to, which is the point where, you know, I think you and I and other people said to him, well, for the love of God, go, you don't have anything else to prove. And that's what, you know, made this high speed rail announcement yesterday. So bizarre. It's like, why are you doing this? Like you,

you literally are going to be a private citizen in just a matter of days. Like, and you've got a minister of transport who's announced she's not running again. Like it just doesn't make any sense, you know? Like have one of the liberal leadership candidates around. You know, they're gonna be there. So it just didn't feel credible. It actually felt quite cynical.

Well, okay, here's cynical scenario number two, if you look at polls across the country, the the the Tories are still in in the lead in every region, with the exception of Quebec, where it's a two horse race between the liberals and the bloc québécois. Something like this could shore up support in Quebec, where a lot of jobs would be would be created. And and and the proof to me that validates that theory is the Bloc Québécois rushed to endorse this idea as well. Yeah, and I you know, it's for sure. And it's been talked about in everywhere from Calgary to

Edmonton, Vancouver to Calgary, you know, high speed rail has been a fantasy of successive governments of all political stripes, as you pointed out. So you know, maybe it does something for you in a tight race and the tight race is now what we've got now that Polly has lost that 30 point lead he had at the start of the year. So you know, they're going to throw everything at the wall to see what sticks and the, you know, the Tories are going to do the same thing. But at the end of the day, the ballot question to me is not high-speed rail. It's Donald Trump and, you know, where people stand on Donald Trump and tariffs and what

they're going to do about it. Well, I want to play some audio for you of our prime minister getting quite emotional and I think sincerely emotional at one of what he's calling his last speeches. And this was to the Haida nation. I was one of my first trips as liberal leader. I can't think of any place more appropriate for what am I very last. You guys, this not just because this place is an incredibly breathtakingly beautiful place not only because of the incredible hospitality of the Haida nation, not only because of the incredible hospitality

of the Haida Nation, not even because this place is so important to me and my family. And look, I don't want to go down the path of saying I'm tired of hearing his voice and I'm tired of hearing the emotion. That's not the point of this. I think that the emotion was genuine,

and it reminded me of the last days of my dad and then the ensuing chapter out of politics where we as a family noticed that there is an identity crisis that happens in a former prime minister where you quite literally go from the nexus of everything, the center of everything, to outside of all of it overnight. The country is concerned about themselves, they're not concerned about you,

and your party has moved on to other things. And so there is a tough shift for any former leader who is so central to all of a sudden go from the middle to going to the outside. Yeah, and you know, I saw that with my guy with Christian, and you know, the interesting thing that's happened is we've got a former Prime Minister's Club a bit happening in the form of Stephen Harper and John Christian they've actually become quite close and you know

communicate quite often and your dad was part of that kind of circle too because you become a citizen unlike other citizens and people think you have a lot of power but you don't yeah you know you're just a regular citizen like everybody else and you have to be very very careful about what you say about the politics of the moment that's what has been so extraordinary about Harper and Kretzsch and Clark and Campbell all coming out and I know your dad would have too if he'd been here with us speaking out against what Trump is doing.

But that's an unprecedented event. It's a historic event. So Justin making the transition to that, it is tough. It is, and you know, so I'm not gonna make fun of him for being emotional. I know he's genuine about indigenous issues, but you know, as a dad to an indigenous girl, I share my daughter's cynicism

I don't think he's actually done much and Jody Wilson-Raybould would agree Lastly we only have a little bit of time left But I want to get your take on the state of play of the the liberal leadership campaign because we're hearing that there are questions surrounding Ruby Dalla's leadership right now and You know, we saw Chandra Arya being sent the way of the dodo bird. We are promised a national and robust campaign. It looks like it's a full-throated coronation of Mark Carney at this point. So I wondered what you made of the questions surrounding Ruby Dalla at this point. Well, it's a Bob Fife story in The Globe and Mail.

So we always, you got to take those seriously. Those are real stories. Bob Fife is, you know, when you hear he's holding and waiting to talk to you, that should make your blood run cold. So my suspicion is that the difficulties for Ms. Dollar about to just starting and, you know, the allegation here, the liberal party was warned about this. You guys need to change your membership rules to avoid foreign interference precisely

during nomination campaigns and leadership campaigns. And they didn't do it. You know, we've all heard about Yaha, Sinha signing up from India to be a participant in the leadership race. So now that now we're seeing what happens. So, you know, she's a marginal candidate. She was never going to be a serious candidate, but this is a mark on the Liberal Party's reputation, not just hers. And look, I'm not somebody who feels that we should be focused on race or ethnicity

or cultural community, but the fact is, in this race, there were two people of color, and both of them, one is out, and the other is under a cloud of suspicion, and the two front runners are people who look like you and me. And they set for a party that that that puts that in the window so often it seems I'm trying to reconcile those two those those those two things.

Well, how about this here, because you're bang on. This is the liberal party that lectures everybody about feminism all the time, particularly this prime minister. And once again, they are the only political party that's going to have a leader, because we all know it's going to be Carney, who's not a woman. Every other party has had a woman as leader. And so the Liberal Party, again, it's just they're not on the walk and the talk. And people know it. So I think it, like I say, it's going to be a very competitive race and I think it's coming

pretty soon. Warren, thank you so much. I hope you enjoy the hockey game tonight. Thanks, brother. Daniel Blanchard is no ordinary thief. His heists are ingenious. His escapes defy belief. And when he sees the dazzling diamond CC Star, he'll risk everything to steal it. His exploits set off an intercontinental manhunt,

but how long can CC Star stay lucky for Daniel? I'm Seren Jones, and this is a most audacious heist. Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts.