The Ben Mulroney Show - Ben is tired of Toronto Mayor Olivia Chow blaming everyone else

Episode Date: February 26, 2025

Guests and Topics: Ben is tired of Toronto Mayor Olivia Chow blaming everyone else -Doug Ford muses about making Americans pay more for Ontario's electricity amid tariff threat with Guest: Stephen Lecce, Ontario Energy Minister If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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And if you're like me and think a TFSA stands for total fund savings adventure, maybe reach out to TD Direct Investing. Welcome to the Wednesday edition, the hump day edition of the Ben Mulroney show. Thank you for listening. I want to say hi to our listeners in London and here in Toronto as well as across the podcast universe on Amazon, on Spotify and on Apple podcast. Thank you so much. Well, Mayor Olivia Chow is mad as hell

and she ain't gonna take it anymore. She's been asking municipal officials to review the city's winter maintenance operations and find ways to immediately speed up the work. This is in response to the fact that you still can't walk in most parts of the city or many parts of the city because very little snow removal has been done, especially on sidewalks. Let's listen to her perspective on this today. This current state of removal operations, particularly in the

residential sidewalk is just totally unacceptable. Last week, I was repeatedly told that 100% of the sidewalk had been proud. I was told that this morning. I was told that last week on Friday. Well, I'm sorry. It is not true. Ah, so she's been lied to. You remember, remember a lot was it last week when she made the joke that at least I didn't call in the army. That was a that was a funny one. But making light. But like, who's in charge over there? Who's in charge? We all saw the snow. We all know how much fell. We knew how much was going to fall. We saw that quite literally saw the snow. We all know how much fell. We knew how much was going to fall. We saw that quite literally saw this coming. Ross Hall, our meteorologist, told us days in

advance. We knew it was coming. We saw it fall. The impact was felt. Days later, let's chuckle about it. We didn't call the army in people saying we can't get around the city We reported on it we told you about it in our lived experience We told you how hard it was for us to walk around the city We told you about video of guys going out there and shoveling the snow themselves But it took the mayor being told by but why didn't the mayor see it herself? She's telling us that people were telling her it was all done. So she believed it. Did she not leave her house? Did she like, did someone put a bag over her head and just transport her? You know, black site style to City Hall so she didn't see any of this and she she took

other people's opinions as fact. We all have eyes and ears, Madam Mayor. Why didn't you use yours? So she was lied to. She goes on that calling out contractors specifically. As I travel across the city, I and as I looked at all the calls that I've been my office been receiving the logs and as I've been talking to other counselors, it is obvious that the sidewalk is not 100% proud. I don't know what percentage but

claiming it is 100% is blatantly untrue. Okay, so yeah, again, mad as hell ain't gonna take it anymore. And that that that's great. But, you know, if you this is an exceptionally reactive municipal government, exceptionally reactive. We weren't ready to move the snow. We're not ready to plow the snow. We're not ready to like get rid of it. How do we improve Madam Mayor? What's the plan? get rid of it. How do we improve Madam Mayor? What's the plan? We need to do more, we need to do better. Seniors, people pushing stroller, getting grocery or just normally walking on the sidewalk. All Torontonians deserve to move around the city safely. We want to do a full review of the winter maintenance operations including how to optimize the resources and review the contracts.

Let us look at the options including renegotiating or breaking the contracts, improving the maintenance of the city's fleet, and possibly purchasing heavier winter equipment. Okay.

So we have a plan and possibly purchasing heavier winter equipment. Okay. So we, so we have a plan for a plan. I feel like I'm repeating myself so many times on this show, whether it's the liberal government gearing up for tariffs or anything that goes on here in the city. It's always a plan for a plan. Where is the vision?

Where is the anticipation? Where is, what is it, leadership? What did Bill Clinton say? Leadership is the ability to look around the corner of history just a little bit. Who here is looking around the corner? Who here in this city is looking around the corner saying, this is a problem for the future,

this is my vision for the future, this is how I'm going to get you there Instead we're two weeks after a dump of snow and we still can't move around the city Does this seem like a problem that a city like Toronto that holds itself up as a great Global leader in all sorts of things is this This is beneath? This is beneath us. This is a problem that should have been solved years ago. What the hell have we been doing as a city if we have to now after this dump of snow, review all of our plans? Like,

I'm sorry, I kind of want more for my city government, I kind of expect more from my city government. I kind of expect more from my city government. This feels like a city, oh, but that's because we had COVID, right? There was no accountability because COVID, everybody was working from home. That's not acceptable. You've just raised my taxes over the past two years to the tune of 25%. I demand better. You as city municipal as taxpayers should demand better. Take names. Remember this. When there is another election,

demand better. If your city councilor comes to your door, sit them down, have them explain themselves. If the incumbent owes you that, you may accept their explanation. That's fine. But they owe it to you to look you in the eye and tell you why your city failed you. And if there is somebody coming up who's a competitor to that incumbent, demand what they are going to do differently. Ask for specifics, not a plan for a plan. Ask for their plan and how they're going to do differently. Ask for specifics, not a plan for a plan. Ask for their plan and how they're going to implement it. We as citizens need to start being more active politically. We absolutely have to do it. It is

incumbent on us. We get the government we deserve. That is just a, it's a universal truth in democracies. You get the government you deserve. That is just a it's a universal truth in democracies. You get the government you deserve. And and I believe we deserve better, which means we need to mobilize. I'm not telling anybody who to vote for. It's whoever you feel, but you have to ask the questions. You've got to go to the meetings. You've got to ask the questions and demand answers, not word salads. And in our next segment, we're going to talk about this group of Etobicoke businesses that are suing the city over the Bloor Street bike lanes. That is what we need to start doing as a city.

When the city forces down our throats a policy that chokes the life out of a community, that community needs to fight back. That community needs to fight back. That community needs needs to demand better. Because not everything can wait four years. Not everything businesses won't last after four years. I mean, I remember when when the Eglinton Crosstown was going in and the the businesses on that street weren't getting a tax rebate. No, there was no foot traffic. And they had to suffer through strangulation

by various levels of government, and nobody was coming to their aid. They should have pushed back. They should have pushed back. This is a moment where we need to remember that the government works for us, and yet it feels like they just keep coming for their pound of flesh, and they're not giving us anything in return. Like nothing! Nothing!

We demand better. The next election, we should have the highest, they should be at the highest level of scrutiny. Nothing, nothing should escape our attention and we demand better. More than 40 businesses in the Etobicoke area are suing the city, its transportation manager and their local counselor over bike lanes

that were installed in 2023, 2024. If you are in Etobicoke right now, you may be stuck in traffic due to those bike lanes right now would love to hear from you. Alright, so the group is seeking $10 million from the city for what they're calling negligence and nuisance suing Barbara Gray, General Manager, Transportation Services and morally the ward three topical Lakeshore City Council for malfeasance of public office.

The businesses say that the bike lanes have proven to be an unmitigated disaster resulting in traffic congestion, a reduction in emergency response times, and an erosion of neighborhood character, a decline in property standards and a loss of business and foot traffic without corresponding increases in business from cyclists. So I don't know the Etobicoke region, except for what I read and for the pictures

and the videos that I see. However, I believe an analog in my neighborhood would reveal the same things, and that's Young Street. And everything that I have felt about that seems to be brought to bear in this lawsuit. So everything that I've suspected in my area, these guys are claiming in their lawsuit in their area of the city.

So to me, this has a ring of truth to it. In my area on Yonge Street, I don't remember a whole lot of public consultation. I've talked to businesses. They have said that the public consultation was for a pilot project, right? It was a pilot project. I don't remember a whole lot of public consultation. I've talked to businesses. They have said that the public consultation was for a pilot project, right? It was a pilot project.

And immediately they start putting down permanent structures. Now, call me crazy, but explain to me how something that you don't know whether it's gonna work or not because you're testing it out, that is a temporary program by definition. So the fact that they start putting down permanent structures, I'm talking to elevated areas

where people with mobility issues could then access, you know, a bus or something like that, because the bike lane was gonna prevent them from accessing it from the sidewalk. So they were doing that immediately. Explain to me how that works. And there is no accountability in terms of how many bikes are actually using the lanes.

I'm told that there's data that says there's 400% use over when there was no bike lane before. Anecdotally, from somebody who's on that street all the time, I don't believe that for a second. That's either a complete, they're either massaging the numbers or out route lying because and the only bikes that I see even on a nice day, not only bikes, most of the bikes are electric bikes and they're usually used by delivery guys and they're not supposed to be in

that lane. So I want to hear from you at 416-870-6400 or 1-888-225. Talk, what do you feel about this lawsuit? Should it go forward? Or do you think that this is you know that? Ten million dollars seems a little greedy perhaps that you might think I'd love to hear what you have to think I think that this is exactly what businesses should be doing is exactly what what? Taxpayers writ large should be doing in this city I think far too many decisions are made at the municipal level that are ideologically driven. They're devoid of data that do not that look at the taxpayer as a roadblock

that they have to plow through to get their agenda through city council. We are a problem that needs to be dealt with, not the end user that deserves respect. And I have a real problem with that. There is a level of disrespect. We saw it from Chris Moyes. Chris Moyes, my favorite city counselor, with such disrespect and disdain called

one of his own constituents, a racist, and then doubled down on the Greg Brady show. Chris Moyes, as I understand, you report to the city councilor, not the other way around. You report to him, you work for him. And I think that that is symptomatic of a great many city councilors and a great many people who work at city hall

that we are not the people that they are serving. We are a problem that they need to get around. Let's welcome Steve to the show. Steve, what say you? Ben, how are you? Your favorite Greek plumber here. Great to talk to Steve. So they dropped the lines down like they did it on a street called Huntingwood in my area in Scarborough. They dropped the lines down. So 10 people used it last year, and then they dropped the lines down and then you know, 30 people use it, well, that's a 200% Sorry, what do you mean you dropped the lines down?

They dropped the lines to check traffic. Okay. You know, when you you know, when you're driving, because those black lines that go across the road, all right, I got you. That's monitoring traffic. Yeah. So they they're basically fudging the numbers in order to do it. If you look at a street called Huntingwood and Scarborough, they've killed it with curbs. Yeah. And now in the winter with all this snow, everybody's house got locked in and nobody I drive that road every day. Nobody rides their bikes. How much did that cost? Yeah, yeah. Well, Steve, Steve, Steve, and

fundamentally, like, I don't like being talked to like I'm a friggin idiot and So you're gonna tell me that the snow that landed which takes up real estate on the road. That's causing congestion That's make it hard harder to walk. That's making it harder for people with mobility issues, but dropping a Bike lane taking up a lane of traffic, which is a permanent snowstorm. That's what it is. It's a permanent dump of snow that you never remove. That doesn't cause congestion. No, no, no, that doesn't cause congestion.

You gotta look at road closures and you gotta look at construction. That's what, see, don't talk to me like I'm an idiot. Steve, thank you very much for the call. Let's say hi to Maya. Hi there, I live in Tobaco. Okay. I drive along Bloor Street. Once the bike lanes came in, it's so congested. It's wall to wall traffic. Yeah. And the other people I know, we've never seen a bike. So the businesses are totally correct. It has really ruined the area. People are mad all the time.

Yeah. And we and people who've called the city and complain get no response. And that counselor ignores everybody. And when they have those, you know, the zoom city meetings, they only allow people on who say positive things, but don't actually get how people feel in a topical. So I, as I said, I don't even use Bloor Street anymore because of those bike lanes. Yeah. And think about what that you you you driving down Bloor Street, you're connected to the community. It was part of you were helping with the character of the community. You have abandoned Bloor Street, which means you've abandoned the

businesses there. And that's to the detriment of the businesses. And that's why they're pushing back. Who do we have now we've got Frank, Frank, welcome to the show. Good morning, Ben. Hey, yeah, there is grounds to show it's negligent interference with business and contractual relationships in that area. But, you know, it's good that they're coming together. But I think the city's going to fight this tooth and nail cost hundreds of thousands, maybe

millions, because any precedent in this case is going to set the standard for other people to do the same thing but i agree with you they can show that that business losses as a result of this that they do have grounds to shoot well thank you very much for the call i would take an extra that mike mike welcome to the morning show morning bed morning the uh...

the city is pretty reliable under a little which is the a met by a third american the uh... accessibility or on terry ones with disabilities act people have to be able to get around city and inconvenient for somebody like me downright impossible and insulting to someone

need a month mobility device to get around. I don't know if you've ever noticed it, but the TTC, when they're doing reporting on service in the morning, like their traffic report, they include elevators now. And the reason for that is that because the elevators are essential under the AOTA Act. And if there's an elevator down, that's the same thing for somebody with a disability, with a mobility issue, as a streetcar out, a bus out, or a subway out. I didn't know any of that. Thank you so much for highlighting. I hope you have a great day.

We've got time for one last call, So let's say hi to Fabian. Fabian, you there? Hey, how are you? I'm well, thank you. What say you? You know what? I think the residents have a say. Their businesses have been affected by the sounds of it and they have a say. But I think there's even a better lawsuit that should be put out there.

Maybe the people on Eglinton with that LRT that's taking over a decade. Yeah, I mean, that one, I guess you'd have to go, you'd have to go after multiple levels of government, including Metrolinx, which is I guess it's a convoluted system, I think a partnership, I'm not exactly sure. But but but there's a direct line between these people and City Hall and the problems in Etobicoke. So I think the accountability is easier to get to, because who exactly do you blame for the LRT?

But thank you all for your calls. We'll follow this lawsuit as it makes its way through the courts and hopefully some justice and retribution restitution for the people and businesses of Etobicoke is in the offing. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney show. Yesterday on the show, we had Ontario liberal leader Bonnie Crombie for a wide ranging conversation in anticipation of the election tomorrow. Today we are joined by Stephen Lecce, the Ontario Energy Minister in the previous government.

And welcome back to the show, Mr. Lecce. Thanks so much, Ben. Good morning. Good morning. So your boss, Doug Ford, said that depending on what Donald Trump does, he and his government, if you were lucky enough to form government again tomorrow, is willing to make Americans pay more on the electricity we sell to the United States. What would what would that do to the sector to those sectors?

Well, first off, we want to send more energy into the US. I just returned from Washington with Premier Ford, where we made this pitch to American leaders. We want to send more clean, affordable energy in the US and monetize this massive commodity for the benefit of Ontarians. But if this tariff does proceed, and I think most Canadians are expecting the shifting goalposts of Donald Trump, we don't really know where he's going to land, but we think tariffs will come, then we need to push back. And that's why the Premier said one of the steps in a when it comes to the escalating steps we can

take is to impose a surcharge on all every megawatt of power we send south to the US to contextualize this. We're sending like over a full nuclear unit, one dedicated unit of Darlington of power gets sent down there. And we're talking six, $700 million of power. So we can literally add a tariff, effectively a tax, we're going to impose on Americans for buying our power. That's the first step in sending a signal that we're not going to take this lightly. And we're going to stand up for our province

and for the taxpayers of Canada. Yesterday, as I said, I had Bonnie Cromby on the show and she was very clear against the carbon tax earlier in the campaign. But yesterday when I was interviewing her, she said that she committed to not taxing consumers or farmers, but that she would quote make big polluters pay. Now I wish I had a chance to press her on the specifics, but it sounded awfully like this federal liberal plan of keeping aspects of the carbon tax on on on large polluters, sort of like a shell

game. We can't keep keep this stuff straight. What is the PC plan as far as carbon tax goes? And would you want both aspects of the carbon tax gone? Well, look, we have brought the federal liberal government to the Supreme Court of Canada because we believe the carbon tax is a punitive tax and raises the prices of everything. It is not a luxury. It is a necessity to drive to work or kids to school and the liberal philosophy is to tax you for doing so.

We oppose the carbon tax outright and I'm frankly, I don't believe Bonnie Crombie. Like with respect, if you've spent your entire critical political career bet advocating for a carbon tax, you've spent your entire time cozying up to Prime Minister Trudeau saying this is the right step forward for Canada. And then only the last few months before an election you change course. You know, yesterday on her show she said she was talking about the gas tax cut that Doug Ford cut 10 cents a litre of savings in your pocket, hundreds of dollars on average. And in her

budget that is not fully costed, it includes no provision to extend the gas tax cut, meaning the effect is everyone's gas bill's gonna go up and everyone's home heating bill's gonna go up because of this carbon tax. So there's no really credibility for the liberals. I mean, when they were in power bed and the energy system, hydro rates increased by 300%, $1,000 more of family. So we gotta look at their records

to inform where they're going as political leaders. Well, let's look at something that you guys promised a while ago, as people are excited about, and people in Etobicoke are taking issue with the bike lanes. When are, if you guys are reelected, when are those bike lanes gonna start getting ripped up in the city of Toronto?

Well, they already are. I mean, there's already been actions being taken in some of the major corridors. I mean, we have people like christine hogarth in the total call lake shore who've been leading the charge you know saying there's obviously were for transit were for some ways i'm also for highways were for all of the above when it comes to getting people moving the cost to greenlock is tens of billions of dollars in the premier saying we've got to move

with a greater sense of urgency so yes removing bike lanes or reallocating them to more suitable locations makes sense. Building the largest subway expansion on the continent. Remember, the liberals said, this is a faint hope. We're never going to build the subway. And we're building the Ontario line, the largest expansion in my lifetime and on the continent's history. I'm proud of the work that Premier's doing of getting people working and getting shovels in the ground. And that's the type of approach he's going to take that the people of Ontario give him a strong mandate. Because if you want to invest more in transit, or you want us to expand more of these services, we need an economy to pay the bills. And he's the only man with a plan to keep taxes low and grow the economy

to pay for the services we all depend on. Mr. Lecce, I went on the record saying that the provincial government had the absolute right and probably the responsibility to go into what people felt was a municipal responsibility of those bike lanes because the province depended on the tax base and we weren't doing anything to get people in and out of the city and making money and paying taxes. I also feel that the city has been derelict in its duty in terms of public safety as it relates to protesters who seem to be able to take over the city with impunity

whenever they want for the past year and a half. Would the province ever sort of look to the issue of public safety in the city of Toronto and with a heavy hand start directing the city or the police to to start cracking down on these on these protesters who seem to be able to do what they want when they want. Well, we actually are the party that support which is giving mayors across the province and councils the tools to keep

public safety safe. So we're increasing penalties on people who continually and deliberately trespass, be it private or public lands in these illegal encampments. Specifically, banning consumption of illegal drugs in public spaces when it comes to giving law enforcement the tools to enforce the rule of law for those that are either creating chaos or lawlessness on our streets.

We've got to take back control. And the Premier is saying he is for more police on the ground, more use of technology, helicopters, drones, to stop these criminals or stop what is increasingly like lawlessness happening in cities across the country, including in Toronto. So when it comes to drug injection and consumption sites, we're the only party saying to the people of Ontario,

we're gonna have limitations. They cannot be near a school. We've got to put the broader interests of our children first. So we've done that. We've obviously created new resources and enforcement tools for municipalities to crack down on drug use in parks.

All these things are related. It's about restoring common sense, sense of order and stability and frankly, safety back for our kids. And I think the one that you saw with the liberal record, they are not in favor of mandatory minimum sentences for serious criminals. They are not in favor of expanding jails

that we can put these repeat offenders, not back in our streets reoffending, but back in jail where they belong, if they pose a risk to the people of Ontario. So the Premier has been very strong, he's been endorsed by the by the police association, he's proud of the work he's doing to keep the people of Ontario safe. I've been speaking with Stephen Lecce, the Ontario Provincial Election is tomorrow so it will be a sprint. Mr Lecce, I suggest you stretch, you don't want to pull a hammy.

Thank you so much for joining us. Thanks so much. Have a good day. Okay, take care. Yeah, so listen, a lot of really interesting things in that conversation. Before we go, let's listen again to Doug Ford, the Ontario PC leader and his response, what he would do in the face of Donald Trump tariffs. And I'm encouraging every other premier in the country, all the US alcohol off your shelves. That's number one.

Number two, we have 30 billion dollars of procurement. We will pull every contract off any US companies, especially we do a lot in the tech sector. They're done. They're gone. We're reviewing the cost of electricity we are sending down there. If he puts tariffs on anything in Canada or Ontario, they are getting a tariff on their electricity. Then we will go to the next stage

and we will wait to see what happens from there. Then we have a strong list. We are working collaboratively with all the premieres and the federal government to make sure we have retaliatory measures. I have always said it is a very important issue Then we have a strong list. We're working collaboratively with all the premiers and the federal government to make sure we have retaliatory measures. And I've always said it's dollar for dollar, tariff for tariff.

But we're all working well as Team Canada and we're going to continue. So that's the plan to deal with Donald Trump. But ancillary to that is how we can better make our, you know, make our internal trade optimal by breaking down internal trade barriers. And Tim Huston, the premier of Nova Scotia yesterday, tweeted, Today I introduced legislation to end trade barriers in Canada, improving the flow of goods and services between goods between our provinces. I'm calling on all premiers to joining in passing reciprocal legislation to help Canadians better sell goods to Canadians and

About 55 minutes ago Doug Ford Candidate for to be premier again said count me in now the devil is in the details obviously there are you know supply management out of the greatly benefits the dairy industry and Intensely helps the protects. I don't know if it helps it protects the dairy industry and intensely helps the protects I don't know if it helps. It protects the dairy industry in Quebec. That's going to be a tough hill to climb, especially when you've got liberal leaders, candidates for liberal leadership, saying that they will break down every trade barrier, but supply management is off the table again, because I think they are very precious about the votes that they think that they need to protect in the province of Quebec

More to come on that file Welcome back to the Ben Moorini show and let's file this next segment under Toronto's gonna Toronto This is a perfectly Toronto story that sums up how frustrating it is to be a taxpayer in this city. And that's really what it comes down to. So thanks to the Toronto Sun for learning that there's a fund, $7.5 million that was supposed to be spent as part of the FIFA World Cup budget. They decided they were going to spend it on social initiatives, right?

They were going to spend, but, but so far they've only figured out how to spend two and a half million of it, which means they got this $5 million. They created a need for $5 million for 7.5 million. They've solved for 2.5 million. They've left to this 5 million left and they still don't know how they're going to spend it. So they created a need that didn't exist. And they and they created a budget for it. And now they're sitting around trying to reverse engineer reasons to spend this money. Let's keep in mind, this is money we probably don't have, right as a city. But they're they're going to come up with a

way a reason to justify spending this money that they earmarked just because. So to to talk to us a little bit more about it is Justin Holmes, the page editor for the Toronto Sun. Justin, welcome to the Ben Mulroney Show. Hey, thanks for having me on. Okay, so do I have reason to be frustrated here? You do, I think I would just go back one second. They spent almost none of it.

I believe it's only a hundred thousand. There's 7.5 million just kind of sitting there. And they set it aside and they're going to figure out how to spend it. It was approved in the recent budget and now they figure out what to do with it. So yeah, so just to be clear, they didn't have to earmark any money. So I asked them about that. I don't think this is a fee for requirement or anything like that. If you look at the day, released their budget notes as part of the budget process and they have something like seven bullet points and the most important things to the city to city hall to do with the world cup. And one of them is about the truth and right affiliation commission, which is one of their justifications for spending this money. The

other one is to create legacy impacts. And when I, I don't know about you, when I hear about legacy in terms of something like hosting a World Cup or the Olympics, I think of like big infrastructure, but there's almost none of that in this event. So legacy for them means social initiatives, currently. Yeah, yeah.

So I'm trying to figure out what the Truth and Reconciliation Commission has to do with an international soccer game. Like honestly, for them, as my dad used to say, that dog don't hunt. Yeah, yeah. So I read their explanation and I read the call to action, which is just a sentence. It's not very long. My understanding is it would be something like, if you think about the Vancouver Olympics in 2010, uh, a, a, a big event over, uh, uh, over the

region in Vancouver and their regional, uh, first nations, and perhaps they didn't want them railroaded when someone said, Hey, let's, this is where you're, you're going to have a stadium tomorrow. Um, again, that doesn't seem to apply here so much. So it's a very different interpretation. There's no, there's no real building. There's going to be a field house that goes up at Centennial Park. But other than that, there's really not that sort of building. There's really nothing that I'm not really sure what they're, they're based in what they're engaged, but we don't know what that means.

We don't know how that money will be spent to engage those communities. And you know, I've got to, I've got to assume Justin that just because this is the first time I'm hearing about this backwards situation of putting a pot of money together and then just trying to figure out reasons to fill it. I have to assume this is not the first time the city of Toronto has done this. As a matter of fact, I'm pretty sure this is this is probably pretty standard. Yeah, well, to an extent, you can't spend money you don't have. And for the World Cup,

they wanted to put money aside and figure out, well, what do you have? But I asked them, where did you come up with the number 7.5 million? And I got a very vague answer, but it's through consultation. I would say that this sort of spending in which city council comes up with a very sort of vague,

very broad mandate, be it about the climate emergency, be it about consumer conciliation or anti-racism. And they make something very broad. They come up with a very broad statement. And of course, who's going to say, who's going to argue with let's, let's be an anti-racist city. And then they turn around and say, well, we have to spend this money because we have this, this mandate. And that's what we're seeing here. And we've seen that a number of times.

I've covered a number of, uh, uh, large expenditures in city hall or even small expenditures, but not, it's not always clear what one has to do with the other. Uh, cities, the city is changing a lot of what it does in terms of, um, procurement. And that's a great example. Every element of procurement, they want to be viewed through these lenses. But will that cost the city? We don't know. Yeah, and listen, if anybody's ever wondered,

how does it happen where a city decides, okay, we're gonna invest in a particular project, and five years from now, it's gonna happen. And over the course of those five years, the budget doubles, and people wonder, how did the cost of it double to me that has something to do with decisions like this, where you're not asked to make this spend this money, but you do

anyway. That's a very good point to bring up. Because when we're talking about the World Cup, it's almost all operating costs. I think when people think about an event like this, they think about, you know, Olympic Stadium, they think about some sort of really expensive thing that you've built built and you just got to keep dumping money into it. We're not going to see that in Toronto.

If there's cost overruns, it's because these sorts of programs get more expensive. Yeah. Hey, I want to thank you, Justin Holmes from the Toronto Sun. Thank you for highlighting this. This is one of those again, Toronto's got a Toronto and this is Toronto at this peak Toronto I should say peak Toronto government, I appreciate it. Thanks for having me on, I really had a good time. Thank you so much.

All right, listen, before we end this segment, I think I've been railing a lot today, but every now and then something in the city happens that makes me smile. And so there was a potential road rage incident between two people, I guess one guy was gonna try to pull a Ui and the other guy got hit and things could have come to blows but a guy with a phone he was the man met the moment let's listen

yeah okay but guys okay here's the thing I get it but you know what you are blocking traffic so let's just get you guys kissing really quick just you kiss him kiss him just hug and kiss him. Go go go. Yeah, yeah. Good. Good. Oh, look at that. You made up you made up. You have to get that off the you have to get it off the road because you're blocking everything. Okay, pull this off the road. Pull this off the road over here. Over here. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. Thanks, guys.

Listen, that wouldn't work in every situation. But honestly, as soon as these guys like as soon as he said you guys have to kiss they both smile. got uncomfortable obviously but then then they both hugged it's really hard to punch somebody after you've hugged them now I don't say that from personal experience I have never been punched despite being told I have a very punchable face I've been told that many times but no one has ever punched my face. But I have to assume, once you hug somebody, it's really hard to then turn around and punch them.

So I commend this gentleman. I commend him. You were the hero. You were the hero we needed in that moment. At Desjardins, we speak business. We speak startup funding and comprehensive game plans. We've mastered made-to-measure growth and expansion advice, and we can talk your ear off about transferring your business when the time comes. Because at Desjardins Business, we speak the same language you do, business. So join the more than 400,000 Canadian entrepreneurs who already count on us and contact Desjardins today.

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