The Ben Mulroney Show - Best of the Week Part 1 - Regan Watts, Sharan Kaur, Andy Gibbons

Episode Date: May 24, 2025

Best of the Week Part 1 - Regan Watts, Sharan Kaur, Andy Gibbons Guests: Regan Watts, Sharan Kaur, Andy Gibbons, Mia Hughes, Sabrina Maddeaux, Adam Zivo If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

At Starbucks, we serve cold coffee just the way you like it. That refreshing chill of ice. That rich, smooth taste you crave. That handcrafted care every time. Your summer ritual is ready at Starbucks. When does fast grocery delivery through Instacart matter most? When your famous grainy mustard potato salad isn't so famous without the grainy mustard.

When the barbecue's lit, but there's nothing to grill. When the in-laws decide that actually they will stay for dinner. Instacart has all your groceries covered this summer so download the app and get delivery in as fast as 60 minutes. Plus enjoy zero dollar delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees exclusions and terms apply. Instacart. Groceries that over deliver. Welcome to the Ben Mulroney Show Best of the Week podcast. We had so many great discussions this week, including an especially good political panel and a discussion on why Canada is the last bastion of woke ideology. Enjoy.

Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney Show. And look, full disclosure to those listening on the radio, we're developing new workflows here at the show. I can now see my guests through the magic of technology. And I can see that, well, let's, let's first, let's introduce our, our group here. Let's cause it's time for this week in politics, the midweek panel. Let's say hi to Andy Gibbons, former vice president of WestJet, as well as a consultant. We've got Sharon Carr. She's a political strategist and partner at Sovereign Advisory. And Regan Watts, founder of Fratton Park, Inc., as well as the former senior aide to the Minister of Finance, Jim Flaherty. And apparently he's also a member of the Flintstones

Water Buffalo League. What's going on there, buddy? That is the loyal order of the Water Buffalo. Ah, yes, the loyal order. My goodness. Okay, well, yeah. Yeah, Sharon, I don't even know what to do with this hat. But so I'm just gonna I'm not gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna look elsewhere. Thanks all of you for joining us today. We got to start where it feels like we're living in Groundhog Day, because for the second time, Hamas has thanked the Liberal government for its principled stance on, you know, what's going on in Gaza. And Sharon, I'm gonna start with you. If Hamas is thanking you, aren't you on the wrong side of things? Listen, this is one of the most ridiculous situations and it's so unfortunate that Hamas has come out to do that. With the statement that the

government and other governments like the UK government put out, it's so unfortunate that Hamas has come out to do that. What the statement that the government and other governments like the UK government put out is not wrong. We have an issue with aid coming into Gaza, and I think that people have lost the plot a bit in terms of having this conversation in a nuanced way. It is not ideal that they did that, and we can't help that they did that,

but it doesn't put us on the wrong side of history or facts in wanting to make sure that aid can get to people who need food, water, and other goods. That is what this is about and we should be holding our democratic allies to the same account as we would with others. Regan, counterpoint. Well, I'm not only wearing a water buffalo hat today, Ben, but I'm also wearing an Israeli Defense Forces t-shirt. So I'm being particularly provocative with my wardrobe. I think anytime Hamas issues a statement, whether you are the subject of that statement

or not, if you are on the side of the positive, and I'm trying to be very careful in my language here, and Hamas is praising you, that's generally not a good day and a good place to be. Uh, and I think that, uh, uh, Hamas is obviously, uh, using propaganda as a political tool to advance its own agenda. I think it's unfortunate that Canada is, uh, is being once again, signaled out for praise by Hamas. Um, uh, and I do think though, it's also worth underscoring that it's important that the government of Canada continue to support Israel. There have been times when

the Israeli Canadian community and the Jewish community have felt that the government of Canada has been not their strongest ally. And I think it's important for the prime minister and the foreign minister and other ministers to come out and reinforce that support, especially in light of the statement from Hamas. Yeah, and Andy Gibbons, listen, when you were at WestJet, I'm sure you were a part of writing press releases and they go back and forth, number of drafts, what are we gonna put at the top?

What's the most important thing we wanna say? There was a way for the UK, France and Canada to come out without a full-throated endorsement of the policies of how Israel's prosecuting this war. They could have written it in a way that did not elicit a thank you from Hamas. I think that's the point I'm getting at. You can be critical of Israel without writing something that Israel, Hamas turns around

says, thank you for that. Thank you for your leadership on this. I don't think any of the three of us have ever sat in a room going, Hey, how do we write this release so the terrorists don't praise it? Yeah. So it's a tough one. And Sharon makes the point, right? It is a nuanced issue in a non nuanced world. And there has to be a way for the keen government to articulate a legitimate concern they have without being terrorists sympathizers, but that doesn't exist in this environment. So yeah, to your question, is it a bad day? Yeah, it's a bad day when the terrorists

are praising your actions, but the government of Canada should be able to communicate its legitimate concern without being accused of being a terrorist sympathizer, but that's a tough balance. And I thought they got it fairly good the last little while, but between Anita and Nand and this statement, that's probably not a good two step for them.

All right, let's move on to Canada Post. Because again, we've lived this story before. Canada Post has received a strike notice from the workers set to walk out of their from on their job again on Friday. Canada Post says they're broke. That and the and the workers are asking for more money. on their job again on Friday. Canada Post says they're broke. And the workers are asking for more money.

Is it time to dump daily delivery? Should Mark Carney bail the Crown Corporation out yet again? Sharon, what say you? Oh my goodness. Canada Post is like the gift that keeps on giving in terms of like strike notices. And this is, if everyone remembers during Christmas time and Boxing Days, we went through this. I think the Carney government and all the bureaucracy and everyone at Canada Post need to take a deep hard look at whether or not this is a system that it's going to work.

I think I saw a headline this past weekend that said they were essentially bankrupt. Yeah. Listen, I like getting my mail, but I also think there's got to be better ways of doing bankrupt. Yeah. Listen, I like getting my mail, but I also think there's got to be better ways of doing it. Yeah. And I think they're going to have to wake up Paul, because we've seen this song and dance happen in the UK and with other postal services.

And I have an issue with public sector unions who do this type of nonsense over and over and over. And I think the organization hasn't been run well. And I think maybe it's time to blow it up a little bit. Well, yeah, listen, when Amazon came and all the bookstores closed, you know, we said, well, this is just this is a changing world that we're living in. And for some reason, the the the workers at Canada Post are not willing to live in a world that's changing. You know, so, Regan, what are your thoughts? Is it is it time to take some drastic measures here?

You know, if part of it has to die, part of it has to die. Well, there's a couple things, Ben, and I think Sharon touched on it a little bit. First is the organization itself from a business standpoint is losing money. And that is not a sustainable business model, whether taxpayers continue to bail it out or not. And I would be of the view that taxpayers should, in and particularly the minister of finance should think very carefully about writing another check to bail out Canada Post because in business, it's pretty straightforward. You have revenues and you have costs. And if your costs exceed your revenues,

you're not going to be in business for very long. And that not only applies to Canada Post, but it also applies to Via Rail. That's the first thing. The second thing is I think the mail and the delivery service, a system, pardon me, is a bit dated and antiquated. Community mailboxes are a reality for millions of Canadians, particularly those who live in subdivisions. I don't know why it should be downtown elites in urban centers who get delivery to their door and not others. And so I think that the Canada Post really needs to be evaluated. This is not the first report saying something should be done about it. The other thing to keep in

mind is the only asset of value that Canada Post has is pure later. And so I think we need a real hard look at what the future of Canada Post possibly spitting off pure later. And Canadians need to accept that times are a-changing. And they voted for change in the last election. And maybe that means we change mail delivery at the same time. And you were an executive. If something's not working in your company, you look at it and you see, do we close it down?

Do we make it leaner and meaner? It's also a political litmus test for the new government. Can they do change? Do they want to do change? So if you look back to 2015 election, Trudeau campaigned on ending the conservative plan to end home delivery. And fast forward, we're in this financial mess. So does this new government and Mark Carney have the chops to make tough

decisions and implement the Kaplan report? Like that's a good one to watch. It's not the sexiest issue, but is there a willingness to continue to write a check to an organization that's out of touch? Well, meanwhile, you've got the workers who said that the Kaplan report is all BS. It's like they're denying that there's any relevancy

to it at all. Well, the facts- Well, look, Ben- The facts and time have just outlasted the unions arguments on these issues. Yeah. The math is the math. It's just, there's no, it's not a philosophical debate anymore. You can't keep the patient is bleeding in the hallway and you can't argue about what color the blinds are in the room.

Like you got to arrest the arrest of leading. Yeah. Regan, I'm going gonna give you the last 30 seconds because your head bobbing up and down like that with the hat warrants it. Well, look, I think Andy's analogy is apropos. Governments of all political stripes have been required to look at Canada Post in a hard and critical way.

It has become a political football, like other issues of national importance. But I do think that if in the heart of hearts of Prime Minister Carney and his cabinet, they will look at their whole hard reality that Canada Post is not a sustainable business. And the question is, do they have the courage, as Andy calls it, to make the decision that we all know. Those of us who've been in and around government know that needs to be made with Canada Post.

This is the Ben Mulroney show on the Chorus Radio Network, but it would be very boring if it were just me all the time. That's why I love bringing together our This Week in Politics midweek panel. So please welcome back Andy Gibbons, Regan Watts and Sharon Carr. Guys, really appreciate your time. So a lot of people, very divisive that the Prime Minister has decided that we will not be getting a full federal budget

until the fall. Here's what Mark Carney said about that very question. There'll be a budget in the fall. In the short term, it's a very short parliamentary session that is coming up. The speech from the throne is on the 27th, as people know. The House is due to rise under the House's rules by the 20th of June, so it's really three weeks. We have some very clear priorities, which, as you know from following those who followed the campaign, those who followed my remarks, those who followed my opening press conference, would include the federal government taking all the steps it can to help create one Canadian economy out of 13, in addition, initiatives such as the middle class tax cut.

But there will be a budget in the fall. All right. So the reaction to this has run the gamut from complete outrage to exactly what the prime minister said that this is, this is, it is what it is. And Sharon Regan, you've both worked with ministers of finance, Jim Flaherty and Bill Morneau. So Sharon, let's start with you. What do you make of, I mean, are people making a mountain out of a molehill or is this significant?

So, so listen, I went down the rabbit hole this weekend on the cesspool of the platform that is Twitter slash X because everyone was losing their mind about this and I welcome Regan's criticism if he thinks I'm wrong on this, but essentially the budget, when the budget comes through, it requires a series of things that need to happen before it gets put into place. You've got consultations, you've got mandate letters, you've got numbers and crunching and all these things that you have to do. And as much as I think it would be ideal if there was a budget coming out, say in the next couple of months, there's a lot of work that needs to happen plus new

ministers and new ministries. So a fall economic statement was going to come out in the fall, which I guess now is being turned into a budget. I don't think it's the end of the world. A fall economic statement would have given a picture. You could do spending. You can do all these things in it. Now, the prime minister has said a budget will be done. I think some of the outrage was a bit uncalled for because people were not looking at the logistics. It's just they just got sworn in and all this nonsense that we see all these chattering folks on Twitter saying is that the bureaucracy can put it up. No, the bureaucracy does the back end of the work, but the direction and the mandate and the

spending on certain programs comes from the elected officials, it's not already sitting there. And the idea where people have said it should have been done during the election period is just silly to me. Regan, what do you think? Well, I think there's a couple of pieces to this issue that are worth talking about. And I'm not gonna actually not gonna criticize Sharon's response at all. I do think that it's legitimate that yes, the government just got out of election,

they need to get up to speed, mandate letters, I think that's all fair ball. But I do think we need to think about the remember what Prime Minister Carney said during the campaign. He positioned himself as the man who can handle crisis and act swiftly. Those are his words, not mine. And, you know, when they get into office, the first sort of major decision from the Finance Department is to delay a federal budget. That's not going to change the operating of the government of Canada.

There will be various legislative measures that get bills or get money into the public service and bills paid and the system moving. So I don't think a budget is necessary. It would have been, I think, appropriate to do a fiscal update to describe the health, the fiscal health of the nation, I think, because we have not had a full budget in 14, 15 months.

I think that's a legitimate concern. But I think there are ways around it and to address it down the line in the fall. I suspect, and this is my own projection, I suspect that the fiscal numbers are not as good as Prime Minister Carney and Minister Champagne thought they might be when they took over. And I suspect they are waiting for that additional time for the economy to improve. I expect the economic conditions will improve with the middle class tax cut that the all parties have said they will support and with consumer spending going up that is bound to have

a positive impact. I suspect that's why the full budget was delayed but I don't think it's as big of an issue in real people's lives as it was on Twitter. Look, I was in the Magic Kingdom and nobody talked about the federal budget. Well, look, I was in the Magic Kingdom, and nobody talked about the federal budget. Well, look, I take both your points, and I'm not getting overly heated about it either. I'm going to come to you, Andy, in a second. My two cents is, Pierre Poliev mentioned during the campaign

that if he were to become prime minister, the House was going to sit through the summer. And I don't know why, if we're in this crisis, why Mark Carney would not have said the same, nobody gets a vacation until we solve this crisis. But that's, that's just my two cents on that. Andy, as I said, you know, explain to those listening, why having a full economic, having a full budget versus an economic update would be important to say corporate Canada or some or business people in this Canada writ large. Well, and this is the

issue Pierre has been raising, which is around investment decisions are made based on budgets and financial cycles and so on and so forth. So but I haven't heard Canadian business making that point publicly. So if I think if they feel that way, they should say that. I kind of find Mark Harney's comments here unbelievable, actually, because if you have just been hired as the best financial manager the nation could find, and your answer as to why you can't provide clarity to the nation is parliament is only sitting for three weeks and sit through the weekend, sit through nights.

It's just an odd answer to say, well, the calendar only gives us this amount. That's a weird answer for someone who was just hired and given an incredible mandate. And also if the numbers suck, it actually works for him because he can differentiate himself and show everyone he's not Trudeau 2.0 and show everyone who's in charge and show everyone he's not Trudeau 2.0 and show everyone

who's in charge and show everyone the merits of his plan and get the transparency from where it was around budgets and economic statements to where he wants them to be, which is the highest degree of transparency possible for Canadians. So why he didn't choose to throw his best punch and to dance his best jig? I don't get it. Strange answer from him to say, oh, the calendar just doesn't quite work. Well, yeah. Can I just for 10 seconds? Sure. So I can appreciate that and I can appreciate where people will

say the House of Commons needs to sit to have these conversations, but the House of Commons is purely theatrics to be honest in my opinions I think that there needs to be work that needs to be done behind the scenes and that could be done through the summer months. Budgets take a lot of legwork, a lot of meetings, a lot of discussions so I don't think sitting through Parliament is what's gonna get us to the finish line I think actually doing the work is and sure having them sit through the summer could have been something that people would have liked, but I don't think that's what's going to show everyone that they're doing something.

So I just want to gently push back on that, Ben, a little bit, because Sharon knows that the Department of Finance is filled with some very capable people who will have been preparing transition memos and binders and all kinds of details for the new minister. And they would have started doing the pre-budget work last fall, because that's typically when it starts, as those of us who work at the finance department know. So I'm not sure it's fair to say that there's not enough time to do that work.

I'm actually giving the government a pass and saying, if you want to take your time, present a fiscal update. Just say, here are the numbers. And as Andy said, you can reset the frame. What I do think, though, is it's, and the consultation's already happened. We just had an election. That's the Andy said you can reset the frame. What I do think though is it's and the consultation's already happened we just had an election that's the largest consultation you can do in Canadian politics. What I do think though Ben and I will I'd like to nominate Sharon

is I do think the Carney government needs an enforcer in the PMO to run communications because these guys have been awfully sloppy and if there's one person in Canada there you go to whip this government into shape it is going to be Sharon Carr. Last week we saw with the cabinet outs, how off message they were, was disorganized and disorienting. I think Sharon is the perfect candidate to go and fill that job

and to get these guys back on track. I put my hand up as well. Sharon, what say you? Look at that, unanimous on the this week in politics midweek panel. What say you Sharon? I've said no to, I'm, I'm not going back into government and I always say never say never, but thank you Regan for that. I'm sure my buddy's gonna be like, That's not a no.

It's not a no, man, just for the record. She hasn't said no. She has not said no. Okay. I very much loved the fact I could see all three of you this time. Let's do it again as soon. Andy Gibbons, Regan Watts, Sharon Carr, to all three of you. Again, my deepest gratitude. And we'll talk to you soon. Thank you. Bye guys. Thanks Ben. Merci mucho. Thank you. And thank you again for joining us on the Ben Mulroney show.

When I found out my friend got a great deal on a designer dress from Winners, I started wondering, is every fabulous item I see from Winners, like that woman over there with the Italian leather handbag, is that from Winners? Ooh, or that beautiful silk skirt. Does she pay full price? Or those suede sneakers? Or that luggage? Or that trench?

Those jeans? That jacket? Those heels? Is anyone paying full price for anything? Stop wondering, start winning. Winners find fabulous for less. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney Show. And last week we had what I thought

was a really thoughtful conversation about pediatric gender affirming care and how a number of countries that had thrown in on this idea were reversing course in, like I said, thoughtful ways because the evidence was mounting against the efficacy of those protocols. And we asked ourselves the question,

will Canada follow suit? And now we find out that Nova Scotia, the province of Nova Scotia, is ignoring this growing evidence against youth gender affirming care. So we welcome back to the show Mia Hughes, senior fellow at the MacDonald-Laurier Institute, specializing in researching pediatric gender medicine,

psychiatric epidemics, social contagion, and the intersection of trans rights and women's rights. Mia, welcome to the show. I have to say, last week we had such a great conversation. I did not think that we would be doing it again so soon. But when I read that Nova Scotia after the conversation we had last week, I read that Nova Scotia is sort of going against the grain. Is that fair to say? I would say very much going against the grain. As I, the analogy that I drew in my National Post article is very much like the joke where a woman hears on the news

that there's a lunatic driving the wrong way down the highway and she calls her husband to say, to warn him and he says, just one, there are hundreds of them. That honestly, that's Nova Scotia right now. It's not just that they are looking the other way and continuing business as usual, which would be bad enough.

Ignoring all of the developments elsewhere. Nova Scotia is going in the wrong direction with their foot to the gas. And it's the, the analogy works perfectly because there are injuries. There are young people being harmed in this crazy, mad mission in the wrong direction. Yeah, and you're right. The evidence for the puberty suppression experiment has been shaky from the beginning

and the rationale highly questionable. Yet it went largely unchallenged until 2020 when Finland became the first country to apply the brakes. Sweden soon followed, then Norway, Denmark, England, most recently Brazil, Chile, Queensland, and Alberta have joined the retreat. The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, which is what we discussed last week, just released the most scathing review to date. So what has Nova Scotia done that sort of allowed it to ping on your radar to the point that you wrote about it? It was an article that was published in CBC and they're rather proud, I think, of the expansion of their pediatric gender services. So they opened a clinic in February 2024 in Kentville and this is serving youth age 16 and under.

So we are talking the precise cohort that the rest of the world has backtracked and switched to psychotherapy. These clinics are specifically offering affirmation, which means the young person self identifies as transgender and then these clinics will just affirm that and then offer puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones. They opened another one in March, 2025 March this year in Bridgewater and now they're looking to open another

one in Sydney and I think possibly another one in Annaginish. So they're just expanding the harm. They are completely ignoring all of the cautious, all of the cautious backtracking that other countries have done, all of the cautious, all of the cautious backtracking that other countries have done, all of the warnings, all of the red flags, they're ignoring all of it, and they're just expanding clinics

so that more young people can be sucked into this medical scandal. And the thing that would surprise a lot of people, I think, is to learn that this is happening under the leadership of a progressive conservative government. You would think, to learn that this is happening under the leadership of a progressive conservative government. You would think, you know, this is the type of thing that we saw enthusiastically adopted by sort of the center left and the left in Canada and elsewhere, but this is being adopted by a progressive conservative government.

What do you make of that? It is surprising, of course, but then I'm in Ontario, as are you, I think. And we also have had the same thing happen under a conservative government. I do think on the one hand, I'm not giving them any excuses. I'm not excusing them at all. But on the one hand, they're not medical professionals. They're government, they're politicians. And so they don't understand

this. And the trans activists and the people pushing this make a lot of noise, and they're very aggressive in their lobbying and they're very aggressive in their activism, and they push this as a human rights cause. And I think it's cowardice on the part of politicians on the left on the right wherever they are it's cowardice to just. Not look at what's really happening not look at the medical scandal but just do what the transactions tell you and particularly there's no excuse for it in twenty twenty five when we have so much evidence of harm right now there is. much evidence of harm right now. There is absolutely no excuse to continue listening to these loud activists who are on an ideological quest

and they have no respect for science and they have no respect for the Hippocratic oath. It's odd to me. I've said it before and I believe that you told my producer something very similar that this, if woke politics and I loathe to use it in this way, because like I said, I very much enjoy, I think it's important to have a very respectful conversation when we, especially as it relates to sort of the mindset

of young people who may be in crisis. And I don't wanna make them a political football, but I'm not the one making them a political football. There are people who are agenda driven, who are doing so themselves. I'm simply reacting to it. But you know, woke politics in this country, this is where, if there's going to be a last stand for a pure unadulterated woke politics, it's going to be Canada.

I didn't necessarily know that this was going to be the file on which Canada was going to be an outlier. But here we are. I do. I agree completely. And part of my fear is right now, I hate to say it, but Trump, President Trump has got this right on gender medicine. He's got this right. And I think that repels Canadians because of the, he's not very popular in Canada. And so unfortunately, because Trump is going in the right direction on gender medicine,

particularly pediatric gender medicine, I fear that's going to push Canada in the wrong direction more towards Nova Scotia and the approach they're taking. I mean, that's that's I don't know that that's the right way to ever adopt any policies, be they gender pediatrics or anything. It, just because you don't like the other guy, you're going to do the opposite of the other guy. Because, you know, you can you can dislike someone and they can be right at the same time. It's, it seems like a very unnuanced view of the world. Yes, I agree. It's definitely misguided. It is. And you and I can chuckle about it. But as you've said, this can cause very real, significant,

lasting damage to children. For those who did not hear our first conversation last week, can you give us just a little bit of a primer on what those negative outcomes can be for those who are, for young people who are experiencing gender dysmorphia and go through a protocol of gender-affirming care? young people who are experiencing gender dysmorphia and go through a protocol of gender affirming care? Certainly, so first and foremost,

you have to bear in mind that these are adolescents and we were all adolescents at one time, so we all know how your identity is not completely formed in adolescence. It's a time for experimentation, it's a time to try on different hats. And so these are adolescents who have adopted a transgender identity based on their encountering the messaging of the modern trans rights movement in our culture

today. It's so pervasive. And then they find themselves in gender clinics, in these affirming clinics that don't explore why they've come to the conclusion that they're trans they just block their puberty thinking that it's a fully reversible pause which it is not it actually Blocks the the maturing and the cognitive development that would help them get over their gender distress if we left them to develop Unimpeded from puberty puberty blockers can impair own health They can cause cognitive issues. And then 98 to 100% go on to cross sex hormones, which can cause infertility. Mia, we're going to have to leave it there. But thank you very much. And we'll talk to you again

soon. Okay, thank you. Welcome to the Ben Mulroney show. Thank you so much for joining us. In an earlier segment today, we were talking about how youth in Manitoba have been exiting the province in search of greener pastures elsewhere for a significant amount of time. But our next guest suggests that those green pastures are few and far between in this country. Just for context for you,

there is a labor force survey from StatsCan that says that the national unemployment rate for 15 to 24 year olds is 14.1%. In Ontario, 16.4%. In Alberta, it's 17.2%. So to discuss why this is, what the problem is, where it lies and how we can fix it. We're joined by the author of the article

in the Toronto Star, Sabrina Medo. She is a political commentator and a broadcaster and writer, Sabrina, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me on, Ben. So yeah, so I had a great conversation with somebody who was highlighting this very problem in the province of Manitoba, where people are leaving because they're looking for jobs.

Young people have been leaving for jobs elsewhere, but you're saying there's not a lot of jobs anywhere. Yeah, the problem is really spanning the entire country. It's the worst in Ontario and Alberta right now, where you just read out those pretty disastrous stats we're seeing. You know, in Alberta, that's 17.2% unemployment rate for 15 to 24 year olds,

that's one out of every six young people. So really the numbers here are quite a blood bath and this isn't something that's just popped up in the last month or two, although it's been getting worse and worse. We've really been seeing this youth unemployment rate spiking for well over a year now and it hasn't been getting the attention it deserves. And it's not just unemployment that's a few extra weeks or even a few extra months looking for a job. We're also seeing a long-term unemployment spike in this age range, which are young people looking for jobs for six months or more and even people leaving the workforce entirely, whether that's just giving up or going back to grad school. So the numbers are really quite bad here.

Both whether it's teens looking for part-time work or students looking for work, but also new grads and young professionals who are really suffering to get that first leg into the workforce. Well, even summer jobs, even summer jobs. I mean, you write this summer jobs, um, on the search engine. Indeed. We're down 22% in early May versus the same time a year ago. So what are some of the structural problems that are leading to this job desert for the youth of Canada? The biggest one, it's the failure of immigration policy.

And we've seen how unsustainable immigration levels have impacted the housing market, especially the rental market for younger people. And now it's also come for the job market, especially the rental market for younger people, and now it's also come for the job market, especially when it came to the Liberals policies on uncapped temporary foreign worker visas, which a lot of employers just ended up using to find cheap labor that they could more easily control, and then sometimes this labor ended up in predatory situations themselves, and also uncapped student visas and allowing them to work more and more hours in a week. And also when immigration levels in general are too high, you're bringing in a lot of

young labour to compete in areas where employers have claimed there are labour shortages, but as we've seen now in hindsight, those labour shortages didn't necessarily exist. Again, they just wanted to stagnate wages, but now young people in Canada can't find jobs at all. So yes, Sabrina, I think, generally speaking, there seems to be consensus to what the problem is, right? When you just described it really, really well. But the question I have is, how do we fix it? How long does it take to fix it? Yeah, unfortunately, it probably will, like when anything reaches a crisis of this level,

a little bit time to unwind, but the sooner we address it, the better. The key is we can't let this be like the housing crisis where we saw the data, we saw the anecdotes, young people were crying out for pain and politicians just ignored it for years. The biggest thing is we still have to work on our immigration policy.

Now, Carney has taken a few steps to reign that in, but we're not there yet. That has to become much more targeted and get those numbers down. But on top of that, there are other things we can do. We have to fix competition in this country, right? Make businesses invest in innovation and competition. We can help young people by removing barriers to entrepreneurship, right? Helping the innovation sector start up so that people can invest and hire young people by removing barriers to entrepreneurship, right? Yeah. Helping the innovation sector start up so that people can invest and hire young people

again. And of course, another big thing is the economic mobility in this nation. It's very hard because of affordability issues for young people to move to where jobs are. Yeah. And some of the most unaffordable places are where jobs are. So we have to also continue to fix housing and affordability so young people can be matched with employment. Yeah, you know, you brought up something

that sort of stuck with me. If we could create a more entrepreneur friendly environment, like if the jobs don't exist, then we should let the youth create their own jobs. We should create the fundamentals so that if somebody has an idea for a business, it's a lot easier for them to start that business and then they can they can be the engine that hires other people. 100% and that's the problem. They can't find jobs elsewhere and they also can't

start their own businesses. You know, we're one of the only western countries where entrepreneurship rates never rebounded after the COVID pandemic. So why is that? It's because there's so much red tape, so much over taxation there. And these are problems that we should be able to solve. I've got to wonder Sabrina, what this does to the psyche of a young person. You know, for years, the narrative was, you know, people of a certain generation are lazy.

They don't want to work. They want that work-life balance where people of say my generation or your generation are willing to roll up our sleeves and do what we needed to do to climb the corporate ladder. And it seems based on this data and the conversation that we're having, that narrative is wrong.

Oh, it's definitely wrong. You know, it reminds me of, but just buy fewer avocados and you'll afford a house that we heard a few years back. Maybe travel to Positano one fewer times this year for your Instagram pics. Exactly, you'll be fine. You'll own a house with a little...

Yeah, I kind of feel bad that that's what I thought. I didn't really think it, but it was a narrative that was easy to get behind. Yeah, a lot of people... The reason you're not working is because you don't wanna work. No, young people want to work. And if you go on social media, on Reddit boards,

if you just talk to young people, there's so much frustration because they've already been, you know, in this economic sea of despair for so long with affordability and housing. And now on top of that, they can't find a job and it feels, you know, increasingly hopeless in this country for young people. And they feel like they have nowhere to go.

And we're already seeing just such high rates of disenfranchisement and disillusionment and anger, like righteous anger from young people. And the longer this goes on, I mean when you have people who have no stake in a market and no stake in a society in their communities, that can lead to some really dangerous outcomes both individually but for broader communities and society at large. Oh yeah, no, I mean now that I'm thinking about it, I mean, there's an entire generation, they lost the last few years of their high school existence. Some of them didn't graduate because of protests on their college campuses. Now they can't get jobs and they're living in

their parents' basements. If they want to start a business, they can't because as you said, there's red tape there. This is I don't even know what this would do to your idea of self-worth if you know you've been told your whole life that you know once you once you grow up you get a job and you start providing and if you can't do any of those things and every step along the way your your experiences were diminished or watered down or turned into something else I don't know what that would do to me. I know it wouldn't be good. No, not at all. Of course,

these young people are angry and they have a right to be because really the social contract has been completely not even just broken, but torn up to shreds to a point where you're right there sitting at home. And then what takes that place? Do they end up, you know, getting involved in, there's online gambling these days. There's all these online silos filled with missing disinformation. So that can lead down some bad paths. But even if they do end up finding work after a year or two of being out of the workforce, that has, you know, lifetime consequences. That's fewer savings. You're lower on the wage ladder.

Yeah. You're further away from even buying that home or moving out of your parents' place, starting a family. We see delayed family formation. So there's all these role on consequences that have already taken a toll on society and Canada's unity and ability to get things done. And this is something we really need to pay attention to. And I do think that older generations

aren't connecting with it and seeing it in the same way. Because if you look at the stats, the older you are, the more likely you're to be insulated from this crisis. The 55 plus age group is the only one not experiencing a decades high unemployment rate. I'm not suggesting that Pierre-Paulio have had all the answers, but you definitely see that there was a difference.

There was a disconnect between how older voters viewed the issues facing Canada versus younger voters. And so if both sides aren't talking to each other, hopefully, I'm going to give this new government the benefit of doubt and say, you know, now is your chance to define yourself as being a truly national government. You got that older vote, and now do something for those who may not have voted for you. If you can do that, you know, you have the chance of being viewed positively in

history. Sabrina Mado, thank you so much for joining us. I hope you come back soon. Thanks for having me. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney Show. Thank you so much. Today is Tuesday. We weren't here yesterday, so we've got a short week, so let's make it count. And look, I think I'm glad that almost every time we call he's able to join us because the Russia Ukraine conflict is it's an ever evolving. It's an ever growing shell game, if you will look over here, then look over here. And nobody has his eye on the prize better than our next guest. So please welcome back to the show, Adam Zivow, National Post columnist,

as well as the executive director for the Center for Responsible Drug Policy. Adam, welcome back. Thanks so much for joining us. It's a pleasure to be on the show. Thanks for having me again. So where do we find ourselves today? Last time we talked,

there was hope that Donald Trump was gonna be able to get these two guys together. There was supposed to be a meeting in Turkey that did not happen. Then Donald Trump said, well, of course, Putin wasn't going to show up in Turkey to meet Zelensky because I wasn't there. So where do we find ourselves today? Well, we see ourselves in a quagmire where Russia is proposing peace negotiations that it obviously

isn't taking seriously. These are bad faith initiatives that are being launched by Russia to essentially obfuscate and delay any Western land sanctions. And there's been essentially this continuous process over the course of this entire month, where Russia has been trying to prevent the EU from having, you know, further sanctions. It all goes back to the Victory Day parade celebration back in May 9th. It's a whole thing. Yeah. Well, what what happened to that meeting that Putin never showed up for? Well, good. So here's what happened. So May 9, you know, was Victory Day. It's the annual celebration of the defeat of Nazi Germany. Putin proposed a unilateral three day ceasefire

that coincided with the parade. Ukraine obviously declined that because that only benefited one side Russia, and they counterproposed a unconditional-day ceasefire instead, which Russia then said no to. So the day after Victory Day on May 10th, the leaders of the coalition of the willing, so that's the leaders of Poland, Germany, France, and the UK, came to Ukraine, came to Kiev, and they jointly announced with Zelensky that they were going to impose a 30 day ceasefire starting from May 12th. And if Putin didn't play along with that, then they would impose serious sanctions. So Putin didn't seem really interested in doing the 30 day ceasefire because he's always maintained that peace negotiations should come first and then a ceasefire. And

essentially what that does is that allows him to push his military advantages to extract the most concessions from Kiev all possible during the peace process. Meanwhile, the West has said that we have to have a ceasefire before we have talks. So Putin ignored this 30-day ceasefire idea and counterproposed talks in Istanbul and continued to bomb Ukraine. The West didn't seem like it was going to listen. Uh, but then Trump went on truth social and said that these talks have to happen. So the, the coalition, the willing canceled its sanctions. Uh, then Zelensky changed the game. He said that, okay, I'm going to be at these talks myself.

And I challenged Putin to come one-on-one that created a dilemma for Putin because Putin is actually has said for several years that Zelensky is illegitimate. So if he came to these talks and met Zelensky one on one, that would legitimize his arch nemesis. So he just didn't show up. And the talks obviously collapsed right away because Russia proposed things that were ridiculous.

For example, they wanted Ukraine to see even more territory and fully give up for provinces that are currently only partially occupied. So I think Donald Trump was under the impression that once he became president, he was going to be able to solve this in a matter of days. And that didn't happen. And you and I've talked about that before as to why it wasn't going to happen. But it does feel to me like the fact that the Pope has indicated the new Pope has indicated that he is willing to hold mediation of this war at the Vatican. To me that that seems like a wild card that I didn't see coming. What impact could that have on this dynamic?

To be honest, I think the impact will be superficial. So obviously, Pope Leo was much more pro Ukrainian than his predecessor. He is explicitly called out Russian imperialism. He has consistently made positive references to Ukraine. His Twitter feed from before he became Pope obviously shows that he's not a huge fan of the Trump administration. So one would imagine that if there were any negotiations that were to be mediated by the Vatican, Ukraine would be on friendly territory. But at the same time, the Vatican is a spiritual force, not a military one. And so though these negotiations, you know, with the help of the Vatican could provide some symbolic victories and some nice photo ops for Kiev, that's not enough to pressure

Putin into making real concessions. And Russia continues to maintain that it can't have peace without full control of these partially occupied Ukrainian provinces and without addressing the root causes of the war, which essentially means the installation of a pro-Moscow government in Ukraine. It what were any of those things discussed on the two hour phone call between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin? I mean, we don't know. We don't know the exact content of the calls. But essentially,

it seems like Trump is Trump is he's a naive fool in this context. He just doesn't understand how this game is played. He's being constantly outplayed. And so Trump, by announcing these peace talks without mandating any ceasefire come before this, he's essentially given Putin what he wants, right? Which is another quagmire where you have these hollow peace talks preventing the implementation of sanctions while Putin makes incremental advancements on the ground without any real track. Adam, what are the intelligence experts within Donald Trump's administration telling him? Like, why isn't he getting the memo that Vladimir Putin is playing him or that Vladimir Putin, you know, is an expert at misinformation and misdirection and you're not supposed to take

him at his word? What information is he getting from the people he's supposed to be trusting with the intelligence if he keeps coming back and thinking that on the other side of that phone is a good faith operator in Vladimir Putin? Well, the problem is that the White House, the Trump administration right now is composed of sycophants who have no subject matter expertise

or people who actually know what they're talking about, but are too scared to stand up for their principles and too scared to tell Trump the truth. And you can see right now in the administration that there are two main factions when it comes to Ukraine's policy. So the first faction, which is led by Kiv Kellogg, who is the special ambassador to Ukraine,

as well as Rubio, Secretary of State, they're very pro-Ukrainian and they see the situation with clear eyes. On the other hand, you have this guy, I forget his first name, last name, Witkoff though. So you know, he's the special envoy. Steve Witkoff, there we go. Anyways, so this guy has no diplomatic background, is essentially just some real estate mogul who's been pulled in to solve the Middle East and solve the conflict with Ukraine.

And he has no, he has no understanding of this stuff, of this stuff. He, he barely seems to even know what some of these provinces where they are. And so, um, I think that when you have Trump relying on his old friend, Witkoff, who has no clue what's happening, then you have a president who is misinformed and doesn't understand the opponent that he's grappling with. Well, Adam's Evo, again, always appreciate you giving us a snapshot of where things are today. I'm sure we'll call you next week because things will change over the course of the next few days. But we appreciate you, my friend. Thank you so much for being here. Thanks for having me.

Thanks for listening to the Ben Mulrady Show podcast. We're live every day nationwide on the Chorus Radio Network. And you can listen online to the Radio Canada player and the iHeart Radio Canada apps and make sure to follow and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music or wherever you get your streaming audio. We release new podcasts every day. Thanks for listening. The best high-concept sci-fi rig of our all in the universe is back. What the hell? How long was I out? Close airlock 7! Crash! and the universe is back. Ah! What the hell? Oh, sh**.

How long was I out? Close airlock seven! Rick! Seth, please let me out! Rick put you in there for a reason, sweetie. Mom, just... Ah! Get back here!

This is for your own good! Rick and Morty. New season, Sundays on Adult Swim. Stream on StackTV. Get your mouth rounded.