The Ben Mulroney Show - Best of the Week Part 2 - Jeff McArthur, Candice Bergen, Tony Chapman

Episode Date: May 24, 2025

Best of the Week Part 2 - Jeff McArthur, Candice Bergen, Tony Chapman Guests: Jeff McArthur, Candice Bergen, Tony Chapman, Kevin Klein, Mohit Rajhans If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Get your Hot Honey McCrispy today. Available for a limited time only at McDonald's. Welcome to the Ben Mulroney Show Best of the Week podcast. We had so many great conversations this week, including an incredible dilemma panel and an insight into the biggest business stories of the week. Enjoy. Welcome to the dilemma panel. No question is too awkward. No problem too petty and no opinion goes unchallenged. Our panel of overthinkers is here to help you understand the world of business. Welcome to the Dilemma Panel. No question is too awkward, no problem too petty, and no opinion goes unchallenged.

Our panel of overthinkers is here to dissect, deliberate, and sometimes derail the conversation entirely. Grab your popcorn. This isn't just advice. It's a front row seat to life's most hilariously relatable train wrecks. Here's your host, Ben Mulrooney. Welcome to the Ben Mulrooney Show and welcome to one of my favorite segments of the week. It's the cleansing tonic. We talked about politics before, we talked about politics after, so the

dilemma is the moment where we can just level set, enjoy ourselves, and solve your problems. But we can't do it without you. You've got to email us at askben at chorusent.com. Let us know what your personal problem is and then we will endeavor to solve it. I can't promise that we will make your life better, but we will try. And this week we are joined by someone new, two people who are new to the Dilemma panel,

but not new to the show, Candice Bergen, the former leader of the Conservative Party and MP. Candice, welcome. Thank you for having me. And Jeff MacArthur, television host of The Morning Show on Global Also. I should say the number one lifestyle show in the country.

Sorry, I didn't hear that. What was that again, Ben? The number one lifestyle show in the country. Thank you, yes. And you're back here. We're bringing you back to your radio roots. Yes, thank you for the invite. And it's such a pleasure to be back here on radio

and in the studio. Candice, hello and good morning to you. And I thought we were coming, Candice, maybe a misunderstanding on my part. I don't know you. I thought we were coming with our own dilemmas. Oh, wait, wait. They inform the solutions that we bring to bear. But Candice, I want to I want to like explain to people

because I've had you on the show to talk politics before. I how did you end up on the dilemma panel? Well, I was listening to your dilemma panel and I'm like, I want to you on the show to talk politics before I had you end up on the dilemma panel. Well, I was listening to your dilemma panel. And I'm like, I want to be on that. My kids don't ask my advice anymore. So George reached out to me during the election to be on one of your political panels. And I'm like, Yeah, sure, I'll do that. But I want to do the dilemma panel. Well, he said, All right, I'll put you down on the list. I guess there's a list of

people who want to do this one. All right, we're going to jump in with both feet. Shall we? I will start reading right now. Dear Ben, I found myself in a bit of a social minefield. One of my closest friends is getting married on the same day as my cousin. I've been friends with this person for over a decade. We've lived together, traveled together and been there for each other through life's ups and downs. On the other hand, my cousin and I are friendly, but we're not especially close. When I told my family, I was skipping the family wedding to attend my friends. They were furious. The weddings are a two hour drive apart. So making both on the same night is not feasible. I'm still planning on sending a gift to my cousin,

but the family is still P owed at me signed Greg. Candice, what do you think this guy should do? Yeah, he's got to go to his friend's wedding. And you guys, sometimes you have to say, family, I love you, but sorry, I'm not asking your permission. I might call my cousin and just let the cousin know, you know, so sorry, hoping you'll have a great day. And then tell your family, hey, my cousin's all you're the cousin's okay with it. So don't worry. Mind your own business. Yeah, Jeff, I mean, if you ride or die, it's your ride or die.

Well, yeah, but what's the old saying, blood is thicker than water, right, Ben? So, I mean, this is a family wedding. We don't even know if this is the first cousin. This might be a third cousin. Still family. Sure. Still family. Yeah, but you're not betraying your family

by not going to the wedding. If you're sending a present and you're wishing them well, it's not like you're actively working on the demise of your cousin's wedding. But I think you gotta be there. And I think he can do both because did he say it's a two hour drive? Yeah.

Come on, two hours. That's not asking too much between ceremonies. He can do both. You're saying you would go to one wedding, drive two hours and go to another wedding, even though you don't want to go to the second wedding. Yeah. I might not even want to go to the first wedding, to be honest, but no. Candice, I don't know about you, but I feel-

See, this sounds like you're having a hard time making a decision. You've got to make a decision. You've got to stick with it. You've got to stand up for what your decision is. That's it. I'm being typically Canadian. I'm trying to find the middle ground, the middle road, the middle road, so to speak. You're trying to make everybody happy except for you. Yes, yes. Yeah, but see, Ben, that day is not about me.

It's about the others, right? And you've got two people. But it is about you. No, no, it's about them and celebrating them. You and your friend. Yes. Your friend, your friend matters to you. I would say, here's what you gotta do, is pick the better party to be at later.

So you look at it and you go. Oh, that's fair. This party is gonna be better. Is it gonna be the friend? Is it gonna be my cousin? And if it's your friend, you go to the cousin's wedding first. You bail out of there around like six, seven, nine, nine, 30, you're arriving at the friend's wedding

and the party is just starting and happening. And everybody's happy. Actually, no I can't, that's not a bad idea. That's not a bad idea. This is why you guys got the popular idea. That's not a bad idea. This is why you guys got the popular show. Yeah. How we did it.

All right, here we go with the next dilemma. This is a classic Reddit am I the a-hole for telling my coworker her kids are none of my business. School holidays are coming up and I have a coworker panicking as she left it too late to book vacation slots. My company has a rule where no more than three workers can leave at the same time for vacation. I already filled in my vacation slot months ago and I haven't taken in any in nearly a year. I'm single and unmarried and in

my thirties. The company told my coworker that her only way to get her vacation is to get one of us who already had our vacation time approved to trade with her. Of course, I'm the only single one and she came to me. She tried explaining gently at first that her kids were really looking forward to going to Disneyland and that everything is already booked. And if I can give her, if I can give up my vacation spot to her,

I told her no, as I too already had my vacation booked. She got really pushy and kept on trying to insist. I gave her my vacation spot saying, my kids would be so disappointed. I blew up with her, I blew up at her after the fourth or fifth time telling her that her kids are going to be disappointed. It's none of my business. Am I the a-hole? Candice? Well, I'd say the damage is done. If you already blew up at her, you know, you're going to have problems with your work relationship with this woman.

Seriously, if this woman. Seriously, if this woman already had her vacation booked, I wouldn't expect her to change it for really for any reason. But, you know, in the interest of getting along with somebody and being kind, if she could change

her vacation and let this woman have it so the kids could go to Disneyland, you know, it just helps all around, right? You could be right and not be right. So I would say, but I think the damage is done. If she said no, and my your kids aren't my problem. All of that. There's probably something deeper to Ben. Yeah, there's something more going on. And there's probably something deeper in this dilemma. I yeah, well, I don't know, she asked four or five times. I mean, that's pushy. If once it listening, everyone has to book

their own vacation. It seems like it's a first-come first first-come first-serve sort of situation and we've we value our time off It's that whole work-life balance and she's asking you to prioritize her needs over yours I don't know that he's the a-hole or she's the a-hole right having said that though Who is the a-hole for booking their entire vacation before they got the time off? Correct! That's exactly right! Let's start there, shall we? I mean, who goes and books airline fare, Disney passes, all of that stuff and is like, oh, did I forget something? Oh yeah, I don't have the time off yet. Yeah, as I would, I wouldn't have been this rude, but I would have said this is a you problem, not a me problem. Having said that-

Which is absolutely true. Yeah. Sorry, go ahead, Jeff. I was just gonna say, having said that, not having kids of my own, I've got like a soft spot for that and for this employee and worker. And if I could, I would take the step back and switch because I think my plans, my individual plans

are a lot easier to, you know, change up, switch up than the family plans. Love to see the kids go to Disney. I'm sure to be a highlight for them and the family. My only proviso, if you will, for this is if I got to cancel things that I've already booked and I can't get refunds, then you got to make me whole. Yeah, you got to make, yeah, somebody's got to- You owe me big time.

Somebody's going to have to pay you back. And I also think if I'm giving you five vacation days, I want seven in return. Yes. I would drive a hard bargain. But this is the point I'm coming from, not whether the person who booked the holiday, you know, for her kids, she didn't do the right thing. But I'm coming from the position of the person who

asked us for an answer, Ben. That's what I'm thinking about. Yep. I get it. Drive a hard bargain or be the nice person. Yeah, I don't think I'm with you, Candace. You're the a-hole for saying no and your kids aren't my problem, although I wouldn't phrase it that way.

Yeah, I wouldn't phrase it that way either. But I'd also want to be a good teammate because this is somebody that you spend, what, 48 weeks of the year with that maybe you need to rely on to get some jobs and tasks done and you need that good working relationship. Yeah, but you're not the one ruining it. It's the other person with the kids coming and pushing and pushing and pushing asking three, four or five times at that point, you throw up

your hands and say, you got to back off because I'm going on vacation. True. Yeah, I have something more going on here. And I think there's something more. And Candace, like, I appreciate the idea of do you want to be right or do you want to be happy? But that's, that's within the confines of one's home and with a wife and a husband and kids. That's where you can't escape at work. No, no, no. At work there are that's why you have HR departments at work. Yeah. Well, having said that though, a lot of us spend more time at work than we do at home. And with our work spouses than we do our actual spouses. That's your job, Ben.

I know my job. I used to have it because you want to get along with it. All right, guys, don't go anywhere. We got more with the Dilemma panel right after the break on the Ben Mulroney Show. Welcome back to the Dilemma panel. Welcome back to Candice Bergen and Jeff MacArthur, guys. Let's jump right into our next dilemma, shall we?

Let's do it. Dear Ben, my husband and I are in a standoff over our kids' weekly allowance. We have two boys, 10 and 7 years old. I think they should be given at least $40, no strings attached, just to help them learn money management and budgeting. He thinks they should have to earn every dollar through chores or they won't understand the value of work or responsibility. We both want to teach our kids good habits, but I think they're still at the age where

they should enjoy life and not have, quote, a job. Every discussion turns into a debate, and it's starting to cause real tension between us. Is there a right answer here, or at least a middle ground? Signed, Lana. I want to go to Candice first, because you were in politics,

you had to search for the consensus. You had to reach across the aisle and find common cause. So make this make sense. Find common cause for these two this make this make sense. Find common cause for these two parents. And look at what a wonderful job we did. Didn't we been in opposition? We are always finding consensus.

No, I'm gonna put my mom hat on first. You know, I think you should teach your kids how to work and the value of money. So I would probably be on the side of dad. However, again, I have a feeling with this couple, it might be more than just this issue. It's probably deeper and all of that stuff. So I think there is a compromise, right?

Give the boys or the kids, you know, you automatically get 10 bucks a week or 10 bucks a month, whatever it is, just for being such a wonderful child. But the other part you have to earn. You've got to walk the dog, you know, take the garbage out, do the dishes. You've got to walk the dog, you know, take the garbage out, do the dishes. So I think there is a compromise, but I would

be more on the side of make them earn their money. Yeah. They will never regret it. You will never regret it as a parent. Jeff, I kind of like that idea. A flat fee for just being in the flat family fee of 10 bucks. And if you want more, you have to earn it.

Yeah. First of all, I'm concerned about Candace because every issue of me, there's something deeper behind it. Yeah. There always is, there always is, Joe. All right, I think, I mean, 10 and seven, right, Ben? Yeah. It's a kid's age, yeah.

I mean, how young is too young? I mean, seven years old, are you really gonna comprehend and get money management at that age? Seems a little young. No, but you could learn the idea of like, if I do a good job, I will be paid for, I will be remunerated for it. Sure.

And so you'll, appreciation of a hard earned dollar. Yep. And I'll give you that. And I think to Candace's point, I'm kind of with dad on this as well. There's something about earning that money, just not it being handed to you. And then you figure out how to manage it.

Yeah. No, earn it. And I think, you know think you will learn money management if you actually earn it, because you've had to really work with this money, and you think about it. I know the argument these days is everything's on tap, so you don't have the physical dollars,

and you don't feel that pain of spending. And it's just so easy. Right, yeah, exactly. So I think maybe, because I think back, I think I was 11 when I got a paper route, it was my first job delivering the Hamilton Spectator, and I had to go around door to door every two weeks

and collect the, I think it was like $3 for home delivery. Made to the menu art today. Yeah, absolutely. Host of the number one lifestyle show in the country. Oh, that's right, thank you, I forgot. All right, let's move on to the next dilemma. Dear Ben's panel, so this isn't even directed to me, it's directed to you. I'm a stockbroker who has done quite well for myself. I've done the job for 12 years now and no matter where I go, as soon as I tell people what I do, the first question is do I have any tips for them? That includes my family who constantly ask what should I buy right now or where do you think the markets headed? Here's the thing, I don't want to give them advice not because I don't love them but because this is my profession not a party trick. I understand the risk

when buying stocks and diversifying your portfolio but they don't. They want to load up and go all in on anything I say. If it fails I will of course hear about it forever. There's no upside for me. Tell me I'm not wrong-signed Max. Jeff? First of all I'd send the 10 and 7 year old from the last letter to the stockbroker to learn money management. They'd probably be retired by the time they're 15. But yeah, I agree with the stockbroker that this is my livelihood, this is my profession, it's something of value. Just don't come to me and ask me for a hot tip. Plus, I wouldn't want to give out a quote unquote hot tip because I'd be afraid it would backfire particularly if it's a family member and

there are maybe a significant amount of money and then that damages our relationship moving forward. Agreed. Candice what do you think? Well I was going to ask could we get a hot tip from this person before we give him an answer but I guess he probably won't want to do that. No I think you, you know, he probably should just say to his friends and family, hey, we're here to have a fun evening. I don't really want to talk about stocks. I remember having to do that often in politics because people would want to go, you know,

we'd be at a party, they want to get into a debate. And I was like, let's not do this. Cause I, like, I do it for a living. So, you know, here's my card. Why don't you make an appointment and come on in? I'd be happy to talk to you about your portfolio. But I don't know, here's my card, why don't you make an appointment and come on in, I'd be happy to talk to you about your portfolio. But I don't know when it's close family that might not cut it. Yeah, but what I just said, if

he says it once or twice, I think people will back off. Look, I don't understand why he can't say, well, here's what I'm invested in. Like, you know, if you're gonna take a risk, just follow me. I don't know why he wouldn't tell his family that here's here are the three or four stocks that I've been invested in for 10 years and they've grown X amount every year like the banks and the energy stocks and so on. And you even have to name those stocks. Couldn't you just talk in generalities and say, listen, you want to be diversified. Just make sure whatever your

portfolio is, you're diversified and you're protected. Ball bearings. That's the future. Plastic. I'm going to say this again. I think it goes deeper. I think he doesn't want to talk to her at a party. I think he's involved in a Ponzi scheme and this goes deeper. I'm going to do that also. Alright, 11 number five, another am I the a-hole for kicking a family out of our condo pool just because they don't live there. I was enjoying my coffee pool site at our condo on Sunday morning. A mother and her two kids arrived who were

clearly not residents because they drove up with all their pool stuff in their car and changed in their bathing suits in the bathroom. It's been almost a hundred degrees for a week. The kids jumped into the pool and started splashing around having a great time. Yeah they were noisy but they were just being kids. I started thinking about what if all the kids from the surrounding apartment buildings started using our pool. Was I the a-hole for pointing out to the sign that said residents only and making them leave? The kids were so disappointed that I made them leave and they started crying. The problem is us residents have to foot the bill for maintenance. Plus,

if they got injured, they would sue the condo association. If word got out that anyone can swim in our pool, anyone would. And before you go there, everyone involved in the story is the same race. Okay. All right. Well, that might change things. Candice, you go first. I would find the superintendent or the maintenance person at the condo building and get them to, to go be the mean person. I would not want to be the person making the kids cry and tell them that you have to leave. And then what if you've made a mistake and they go, well, actually our grandma lives here and we're going to come visit her. I just, I just wouldn't want to do that.

The person's right. You know, the reasons that they're asking, think that the kids should leave are the right reasons, but I would not want to be the heavy doing that. Yeah, I agree. Jeff. I think for me, Ben, the, the big factor here is it's a hundred degrees and it's been that way for

a few days, right? So, I mean, can't Ben, the big factor here is it's 100 degrees and it's been that way for a few days, right, so, I mean, can't we just like get along here and it's one day. Well, listen, the reasons he bring up, the liability reasons are serious. Yeah, but that's on the condo, that's not on you, the residents, sounds like they're upset because they're there and they just want a peaceful time

and I get that, but having said that, I mean, this is one family and I'm hearing like what if every family came? Well not every family is coming to the pool. This is one family on one day. If it is habitually happening on and on again each and every day, then maybe I would go to the condo officials or board and say, hey this is happening and it's too much,

but one day when they're trying to cool off, doesn't bother me so much. Yeah, look, it wouldn't bother me either. But when I'm on a plane, if somebody's annoying me on a plane, I don't ever talk to the person. I get the flight attendant because that's their job. And I would do the same thing that Candice suggested. If I decided I didn't want them in the pool,

that's my right as someone who lives in the condo, but I wouldn't do it myself. I would go to somebody who represents the condo association and tell them they might say, you know what, just leave it, in which case I would defer to them. But if anyone's gonna be the heavy, I'd prefer it be somebody else and not me. For sure, and particularly because if it happened

on a plane and you did that, it'd be like, Ben Mulroney did this to me on a plane. Yeah. Be all over Instagram. Do you know who I am? Ben Mulroney would have a do you know who I am moment. Candice, do you suspect there's something deeper going on here? I think there is.

Have you guys ever owned a condo? Yes. Because there's always condo drama going on. So you bet there's something deeper. For sure. As soon as you say condo, there's something deeper going on. Definitely.

Yes. I live in a condo downtown Toronto and I can, yes, verify that fact. There's a million stories going on in just the one condo complex. Well, I live in a condo downtown Toronto and I can, yes, verify that fact. There's a million stories going on in just the one condo complex. Well, I want to thank you both for joining us. I think we did a lot of good for society, guys. I really appreciate it. I feel good. Candice, thank you so much. Jeff, thank you so much. I hope you guys come back anytime, really, because I'd love to have you back on the Dilemma panel. Yes, indeed, Candice, I know you've solved political problems in the past and now you have

solved personal problems. I appreciate you both. From commutes that become learning sessions to dishwashing filled with laughs, podcasts can help you make the most out of your everyday. And when it comes to everyday spending, you can count on the PC Insider's World Elite MasterCard to help you earn the most PC optimum points everywhere you shop. The PC Insider's World Elite Mastercard to help you earn the most PC optimum points everywhere you shop. The PC Insider's World Elite Mastercard, the card for living unlimited. Conditions apply to all benefits. Visit pcfinancial.ca for details. The White Chocolate Macadamia Cream Cold Brew from Starbucks is made just the way you like it.

Handcrafted cold foam topped with toasted cookie crumble. It's a sweet summer twist on iced coffee. Your cold brew is ready at Starbucks. Lots of great stories to break down right now, including what to do with Canada Post. A lot of us have been waiting with bated breath as to whether or not there's gonna be a strike. It looks like there'll be a strike on Friday,

and maybe it's time to reinvent this storied institution. So with this story and so much more, we're joined by Tony Chapman, the host of the award-winning podcast, Chatter That Matters, and the founder of Chatter AI. Tony, welcome back to the show. Always a pleasure to be with you. All right, so let's talk about this.

Canada Post, I mean, it's a tale as old as time. It's an institution as old as anything else in this country. So many people, so many businesses depend on it, but it's it's broken. It's it's broke. What do we do with this with this institution? You know, it's tough to tell this to people, but is it time to close this institution down? And the reason I say it is, as a country we need to prioritize where do we put our dollars? And I would argue Canada Post,

and it's not just the operating loss per year that's the issue, the issue with Canada Post is also the pension funds that taxpayers are on the hook for. So I think it's time we really look and say, you know, there's a business out of Ottawa called Traxity. It's just got, you know, delivering parcels. There's say, you know, there's a business out of Ottawa called Traxity. It's just got, you know, delivering parcels. There's, you know, there's Federal Express.

There's a whole bunch of different businesses that I think would rise to the challenge if they knew they didn't have to compete against a crown corporation that's subsidized and would say that's a market we can deliver. I mean, Uber certainly did that with delivering food to your home. So there's no reason for me to believe that entrepreneurs could fill the gap and just absolutely move on from hand-delivered mail to just delivering it electronically. Well, that and but and I think that's a laudable goal to get to a point where we don't need Canada Post anymore. But I think that's going to take years. I think there has to be a transition in place.

And well, one of the things I was floating, Tony, was the idea of getting rid of daily mail, except for certain businesses that require it. But for people like myself that don't need to get the mail every day, so long as there was a commensurate legislative change that allowed for an extended period of time to pay bills, for example, like credit credit card bills if they added an extra week

To how long you had to pay those credit card bills then that would satisfy The sort of the the slowdown in mail service. Don't you think? Yeah, but it's also taking a band-aid off a festering wound and what's underneath is that the what Canada Post used to deliver? And what's underneath is that the what Canada Post used to deliver was our ability to connect to the world I mean we stood I mean there's no doubt humans love to be connected We probably waited at the window to see if the postman was bringing us a letter a note or a card I would argue those days are done So you're talking about is essential services the businesses that that need that parcel to be delivered to someone else and I would argue The longer we hold off on this,

the more it's going to be sort of this broken supply chain. And I'd like to just say, why don't we reinvent a new link, take some of our government money and go, we will help to fund the small businesses that need to set up this kind of service in more remote areas where the economics might not make sense. But in the major cities, to me, having a crown corporation responsible for delivering parcels to businesses doesn't make sense when I know entrepreneurs

can do it faster, better, and more efficiently. All right, well, let's move on to Netflix. It seems almost every week they make a major announcement on another property that they've either acquired or have built from the ground up. And now they've got a new one that I really didn't see coming. Netflix is the new home to Sesame Street. Yeah, I mean, this is a brilliant move on two fronts. First of all, Netflix at first mover advantage and what they continue to do is step on the accelerator, where often

first mover advantage gives away to disruptors that come in and do it better. Netflix is saying no way we're going to continue to be in the content game. Now they're moving in, not just what I saw was a major move into sports last year, but now into children's programming. You know what it's like with young kids. They want to watch the same show over and over again. So if you have all of that access on one channel, it creates a condition at home that says, okay, we get the Netflix set up for the kids. They click on it.

We know we're safe. We know they're going to be watching the right programming. They're not going to get bombarded by a million ads. That makes sense to me. So I think it's a very strategic move. And then they also allowed PBS to continue to air it because they didn't want to be that data-driven organization that puts public broadcasting out of business. I think that's just a brilliant PR move, but the reality is, there's no doubt in my mind, parents will migrate over to

Netflix if they feel that within the Netflix family, there's enough children's programming to satisfy what they want. It's just not just entertainment, but they want these kids to be learning by watching. And I think no one does that better than Sesame Street. Look, the fact that they've gotten into live sports, they've got live shows now, the fact that, and now they're going to have Sesame Street for kids. I mean, they're, they're hitting every, every demographic at this point. And they've got data, but understand that they know how old your kids are. They know when they're growing up. They know what parents are allowing and not allowing all of this stuff is so valuable

to monetize on Netflix's point of view. And that's why in this data game, it's not about third or fourth, it's about really being a dominant player. And I would imagine we're gonna see more consolidation in the streaming business, because economically being number four or number five doesn't make sense if subscribers are saying,

no matter what, I'm gonna have Netflix and maybe one other service. Tony Chapman, we've seen hockey players at the Olympics, we've seen basketball players at the Olympics, and now we're gonna see NFL football players at the Olympics in 2028 for Olympic flag football. First of all, I didn't even know that that was a sport yet, but who's the bigger winner do you think? Is it the Olympics where they're gonna have this marquee show and game that people are gonna watch or is it the NFL which is gonna have an international global audience I think the NFL is the loser in this I think the Olympics is great because they're gonna get marquee

players NFL should be building their brand around the globe which they're doing anyways but tackle football that's their brand around the globe, which they're doing anyways, but tackle football. That's their brand. That's their positioning. But they'd be like going to NBA and say, we're going to do three-man basketball at the Olympics. It does very little for your sport. Like football and football, I couldn't think of two sports more different other than they share the name football.

And I think if anything, it's degrading the brand. And don't get me wrong, I'm sure people people love the sport and they play it and they play it with the heart. But ultimately, the NFL is the is the Mecca for football. Yeah. And therefore, if you're going to bring football to the Olympics, it should be tackle football. I don't know, Tony, I think there's going to be something really cool. First of all, like, don't forget, basketball is a global sport, right? So when they play basketball at the Olympics,

you have marquee incredible players on almost every team. Obviously the Americans are the high water mark, but there are other teams out there that are fantastic as well. I don't know that you're gonna have anything but a dominant American team and everybody else playing for second and watching the physical skill of American players versus

lesser players is I think going to showcase the excellence of these athletes. You know, it's such a, I mean, we could argue this for hours because I would say then maybe we should draft Andre Degrassi because he's the fastest 200 meters sprinter in the world. And he should be out there because flag football is just going to be about speed. printer in the world and he should be out there because flag football just going to be about speed and it's just it's a completely different game. I mean to me it's I don't even understand how that's the first of all an Olympic sport but if it's an Olympic sport and they really want to bring football in because they know the marquee value of the NFL that bring the NFL in and yeah it'll take a few years to

type something with Americans first started playing basketball the professional it was no contest but last Olympics Greece put on a hell other show. Well I'm glad you brought up Greece because Adidas has had an ad that they put a drone performance above the Acropolis and people are outraged over this. What do you make of that? People are being a little precious no? I think you're a little precious, but what I love is the bureaucracy within Greece blaming each other. And the permit for doing so, I think, was about $11. Somebody missed the file. But yeah, listen, I understand that your culture,

they'd be like putting Adidas over the Vatican. I think you've got to be very careful when you cross the line. But I happen to think of the Acropolis and the Adidas and the Sebastian for what Olympics stood for was a brilliant move from the Ditas point of view. And the fact that they're getting so much controversy over is just giving a much bigger bang for their buck because it

was just you know, and how cool are these drone shows? I know. They're amazing. I think people should just turn down the outrage and appreciate the visuals. Tony Chapman, always a pleasure having you on the Ben Mulroney Show. We'll see you soon. You bet. Bye-bye. One of the hot topics that dominated the public conversation was the idea of the brain drain of Canadians moving south of the border where the pastors were greener,

where the paychecks were bigger, and where the ability to live the most successful life you possibly could, that's where you went. And there was this real fear that there would be a lost generation in Canada where the skills that we needed to grow an economy and just as importantly, the tax base that we needed to grow the economy would disappear. And it turns out that is not just a problem

that goes north south, but the province of Manitoba is experiencing its own brain drain, a youth exodus. And it's been going on for a significant amount of time. It's really important for us to talk about this. And the person who's highlighted it for me, and I'm very thankful for it because it's been written about in the Winnipeg Sun, is Kevin Klein.

He's the president of the Winnipeg Sun, as well as a columnist and former minister of the environment for Manitoba under the conservative government. And so welcome to the show, Mr. Klein. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you very much for having me, and please call me Kevin. All right, Kevin, I will. So, Kevin, how long, how big of a problem is this, and how long has it been going on for? Well, I think we've been seeing this happening since the eighties, to be quite honest. And it's been getting worse and worse.

And in recently, 22 to 23, we lost over 10,000 people. Now that is quite significant for a province our size. And of course we're gaining some of that back with immigration, we're kind of flattening out. But our young people, the people with energy, the people with innovation, the people that are going to build the province, they're not staying. They're taking off. So if you're telling me that this has been a problem since the 80s, has there been a period in that, has there been a hiccup in there? A period sometime

between the 80s and today where people have returned to the province? Because my next question is, what can be done to reverse it? Has there been a period where something was done where young Manitobans either said, we're sticking around or people from outside the province were saying, we're going to move there? Well, we have a blended family. So we have six kids. Now four of them have moved out of the province they've gone elsewhere to what

reason now they left for opportunity now some time ago the province offered the uh... graduation tuition tax rebate right so young people they came back together twenty five thousand dollars tax relief that would be that was an opportunity for somebody to make, to come back here, even if they were schooled outside of the province, come back to the province and start working. That is gone. But other provinces are offering that. So they're finding reasons to leave. They're also finding better jobs. They're finding jobs in the newer industries. There's a lot of new,

exciting industries that we should be banging on the doors of Manitoba, the AI companies, because we have so much power, we have green energy. We should be knocking on the doors of these people. Well, that's, I mean, just a few months ago, we were talking on this show about how Kevin O'Leary had been working with the Alberta government to build a massive AI park in, I believe in northern Alberta. I don't know why there's nothing specific about Alberta that makes it that AI parks that this size, I mean we were talking tens of billions of dollars in investment, that there's nothing specific about Alberta

where why AI should should be built there, why it should be the home there. You could build a hub in Northern Manitoba just as easily and as effectively. Well, I think we could build it probably much more effectively, right? We have multiple amounts of land here. We have the energy, we have the climate for it, right? We have the right climate for this,

but we're not doing what it takes. We're not making the sales calls, we're not banging on the doors, we're not making the sales calls. We're not banging on the doors. We're not hammering on doors down south saying, look, we have what you need. We can offer you this. We can offer you that. And I think that that's what young people are seeing.

And they're saying, well, I'm going to have to go elsewhere. I'm going to have to take off somewhere. And look, I mean, if we know why, how important keeping young Manitobans is for the province and they're not doing it, does that speak to a larger structural problem in Manitoba? And look, I'll put the question out there

and it's a good faith question. Is there a modesty in Manitoba that doesn't exist elsewhere and unwillingness to pump your own tires? Is there something about the character of being a Manitoba that doesn't exist elsewhere, an unwillingness to pump your own tires. Is there something about the character of being a Manitoban that makes it harder to go sell being a business coming to Manitoba? Absolutely, biggest problem we have, we are so afraid to talk about how good it is here

and how good it can be here. I mean, the quality of life here, I'm sure you've been here, but actually, I think you were here when they were doing Canadian Idol, you were here for a little bit. I mean, the lakes we have here, the parks that we have here, we have wonderful opportunities to raise a family. Housing is affordable. Believe it or not, you can buy a house in Manitoba. So, there's lots of reasons to live in Manitoba, but we're not keeping the young people, we're losing them because we're not taking that step to say,

you know, let's give them the programs, let's give them startup and innovation grants, let's do job matching. We should be doing job guarantees for doctors and nurses going through our school system here to make them want to stay here. We had this talk on one of our podcasts where I called it the Northern Exposure Method, right? Yeah, yeah, sure. I remember that show. We'll pay for your schooling, but you're staying for 10 years. I don't see a problem with that. Then they'll put down roots. They'll love it here. The lakes, as we talked about, let's give them reasons to stay here. But we, you're absolutely right. We have to get aggressive and

we have to brag about what we've got in Manitoba. Kevin, it seems ironic or maybe he just hasn't had enough time, but you've got a young, dynamic, popular premier in Wab Kanu who just, he could be the face of that. I mean, you look at him and he's very, you look at him and you compare him to say a Doug Ford or a Legault and he seems, he could embody the idea of young people in the province of Manitoba. What does he say about this, what seems to be a provincial crisis? Well, we've heard him talk a lot about doing job creation to keep young people here.

He wants to promote our cultural activities and such, but we're seeing a lot of talk. He is great. He has a lot of charisma. He's very good on TikTok. He is great. He has a lot of charisma. He's very good on TikTok. He's very good at reaching the younger generation. I'd like to see him now go to the businesses

and start banging on the door saying, we need to keep our youth here. We need to do something with the tuition tax. Maybe he needs to bring that back. Maybe that's what he does with young people. And that's how he connects with the young people and said, here, we'll give you that graduation tuition tax back, but you stay here.

You stay with us and we will make this the place you want to be forever and ever. So you said you have a blended family and how many did you say have left the province? Four. Four. Any chance that they're going to come back? No.

No, no. You know what? Yeah, but let me, let me re- I thought you really wanted them, none. Let me reframe. What would it take to to come back? No. No, no. You know what? Yeah, but let me, let me re- I thought every one of them, none. Let me reframe. What would it take to get them back? That's a really good question. I would hope family would bring them back, but I think-

Guilt, family guilt? Family guilt. I tried it. It doesn't work. Your mother keeps asking for you. She's lonely. Yeah, if you need somebody to babysit the grandkids, you're going to have to come here. Yeah. But you know, we jump on the plane and we go out there.

They're enjoying where they are. They have a good quality of life. They have opportunity and that's really what it is. They have opportunity. They're proud to be where they are. They love Winnipeg. They love Manitoba. You nailed it. We are so afraid to talk about how good we have it. It's almost like we're afraid someone will take it away. Yeah. But we need to brag about how great Manitoba is. Geographically, we are in the perfect position. When it comes to clean energy, we are in the perfect position. When it comes to clean water and the abundance of water, we are in the perfect position. We have a coast, you know,

we have the opportunity to have a port, an ocean port where we can ship goods to Europe. We have everything that every province needs, but we're not promoting it enough to keep young people here. Well, Kevin Klein, I think one of the, that's, I think we've cracked the nut as to what the problem is. And the solution, I guess, with that ambition in mind,

could take many forms. I feel optimistic that a guy like Wab Kanu could be the embodiment of that. And hopefully, he'll hear this conversation as well as others, I'm sure, that you've been having, and come up with a plan to keep young people where they belong in the province of Manitoba. Because we need every province to be strong, especially in the world that we're living in.

I appreciate it and I hope to talk to you again soon. I appreciate the opportunity. Thank you. When does fast grocery delivery through Instacart matter most? When your famous grainy mustard potato salad isn't so famous without the grainy mustard? When the barbecue's lit, but there's nothing to grill? When the in-laws decide that, actually, they will stay for dinner. Instacart has all your groceries covered this summer. So download the app and get delivery in as fast as 60 minutes. Plus, enjoy zero dollar delivery fees on your first three orders.

Service fees exclusions and terms apply. Instacart. Groceries that over-deliver. Welcome back to the Ben Mulrooney Show and thank you very much for joining us. This is the time of the week that I love talking to our next guest. We're talking all about AI, but specifically AI as it intersects with the federal government. For the first time in our history, and I think this could be a good thing, Mark Carney's government is opening up a brand new ministry. And a lot of times they'll take an old ministry and repackage it with a new name. And like the environment of the ministry, the Ministry of the Environment became

Ministry of the Environment and Climate Change, okay? Six of one. But this is a brand new ministry of artificial intelligence and former journalist, Evan Solomon will be in charge of it. And this could be groundbreaking in a lot of ways. And so here to discuss it, we're joined by Mohit Rajan. He's a mediologist, great friend of the show. He's a consultant with thinkstart.ca.

Mohit, welcome. Ben, thanks for having me. And so I really appreciate you being here today because I was listening to some journalists sort of describing why this could be a very big, very big thing, because it's not gonna be, it's not a ministry that's intended to exist in a silo, right, it's going to, it has to work across all ministries.

It's about implementing AI in all walks of life from what I gather. What do you see? Well, specifically, it's involved with innovation is going to be the key here, is where does Canada stand when it comes down to making innovation accelerate within the country? What does it have as the capacity to facilitate some of the change that we see on the horizon? And then also, how does government stay involved without getting too involved? And I think we both know that Canada doesn't have a great history of adopting fast enough when it comes down to technology. And so what'll be interesting to see, Ben, it is, is whether we are in a situation where this actually is just a placeholder for the

bigger changes that we need to see, or if this is actually going to be leadership. Well, this is going to be a very big test for Mark Carney. He has said that he is a different kind of liberal, that this will be a different liberal government than what we're used to over the past 10 years. And I don't think it's cynical of me to say, because I've said it before, and I say it in good faith, that the previous government was addicted to bold pronouncements, big ribbon cutting ceremonies. And then they would fall short. They want to be the first to say they were gonna do something.

And then they would just slow down or crawl and wait for somebody else to lap them. And so for them to take this stance, look, we're at a crossroads. They could do something different and they could actually be bold and be leaders in terms of being a government that is trying to navigate an entire country through the landmines of AI to get us to a place where we are leaders on every file. Or they could be the ribbon-cutting kind of liberals that just build a new bureaucracy and leave it at that.

Ben, we're at an AI arms race right now in the rest of the world. We're standing by and watching the US and China daily come out with new products to talk to the rest of the world about why they are the center point for how AI innovation is going to be run across the world. And the truth is, other countries are not slowing down either. Canada, unfortunately, can't sit around and

wait for us to celebrate the idea that we have one person in this specific role. And instead, we need to get private industry at the table just as quickly as we have the government interested in this, because we will be left behind. And instead, we will be taken advantage interested in this because we will be left behind and instead we will be taken advantage of in this AI arms race. We're still a rich country full of amazing stuff. But if we don't get things in line quick, this isn't about pageantry. So if you had the ear of Evan Solomon, the new Minister of Artificial Intelligence and the Prime Minister, for whom AI is sort of a sort of the brass ring. What advice would you give them as they build out this ministry? And what priorities would you hope this government espouses?

Well, the biggest priority is figuring out where we sit in the global landscape. You know, I just mentioned this arms race. The truth is we've had allies when it comes down to technology and we've had some great innovation within this country. Are we fostering it or are we just receiving this tech from the rest of the world?

The second thing is we have to understand what data sovereignty means to different countries. So there are many places that we're never going to get our AI products from, or are we gonna be able to ship our AI innovation and technology to? And so there's rules that are changing on the global front about how we can engage with people from technology right down to bureaucracy. But the key here, Ben, in my opinion, is Canada can't stand by and be a consumer of all of

this innovation. And that's what I worry about. We've had these amazing feats in technology. We've had the Godfather of AI be considered to come from Canada, but we're still not the star players in this field. And so that's what I'm hoping to see in the next five years. What about the idea that there's a gas pedal

and there's a break for everything, right? Especially when it comes to government policy. And I have to assume, and you know this better than I, that there are certain policies and there's certain initiatives as they relate to AI where we should just put our foot down and drive as fast as we can. And there are other places where the role

of the government should probably be a brake pedal to slow things down. Are we too early in this arms race to distinguish between those two levers? Or do we know where we should be careful, where we should be putting guardrails and where we should just be letting private industry go run amok?

You know, you bring up a great point. The same tools that can help us will definitely hinder us in this process from education right down to innovation. But I also think the risk in that and what you're saying is that we will lose talent. Not everybody wants to make the best AI tools for the most ethically available consumer out there. Right now there is a situation where we're going to have brain drain within this country and where we should be worried about losing talent to other countries that are starting to invest a little bit more rapidly. Don't get me wrong. This isn't a situation where I'm saying

we're extremely behind. But what I do fear is that just placing somebody in this position might not be enough. And instead, this policy needs to be rolled out very quick so that we understand the different parameters that even other businesses have when they're operating in this country. But there's also immediate applications of AI tools that exist in the marketplace today that could be beneficial for military procurement, for healthcare, for bringing down inter-provincial trade barriers.

I'm assuming a lot of this, but I also, you and I have had enough conversations where I don't think it's a leap to assume that AI could be beneficial in, I don't know, environmental assessment of natural resource projects. Those are places where I think this new minister of AI could have immediate impact and say, we're going to change the workflow of a multi-billion dollar ministry that is going to improve outcomes and speed up results.

Yes, definitely so. On the other side of that, then they have to be accountable and speed up results. Yes, definitely so. But on the other side of that, then they have to be accountable to the cybersecurity side. So for example, dairy farmers love the idea of automation and how AI can help them predict what the weather patterns will be for the best output that they could have. But also their machines can be hijacked

very easily remotely, and all of a sudden it disrupts their workflow. The government will have to step in at this point and stop and say, well, we are okay with innovation happening at this level, but we also want to be the leaders when it comes to securing our citizens from nefarious attacks.

Yeah, I mean, I'm looking at, you know, some of the stuff coming out of China. I've heard some worrying things about the world economic forum. And look, if you take everything that Pierre Poliev said at his word, right? Back in the election campaign, that he did not win, to be fair,

the Canadian government, Canadian people decided they wanted a Mark Carney government. But Pierre Poliev said that this is not, the Liberal Party is not liberal because they're all about control. The fear would be that this new ministry would be about the application of AI in order to control people online and social media

and, you know, making sure that they limit people's access to information. At what point, let's assume the worst for just a moment, and not to say it's gonna happen. What should we be looking out for as your freedom loving Canadians call it, as red flags that this government might want to pursue? Well, I think that you bring up a great point in how we are already advertised to and how people can target and data target and use our data to target us.

You know, we see these, these swellings happening in these various niches and corners on the internet, where we realize misinformation is going to continue to run rampant, the quicker it is for people to create these synthetic versions of media and put it out there, there will be this natural worry that the horses have already left the barn, as they say, and how can government really pull back and you know, for example, can they find these tech companies, if they're the victims of synthetic media used for propaganda, etc, etc. But the truth is in the title alone, you don't get to cover all of that. And it's not going to be one

person that's going to solve for all of these problems bad mo hit, we're gonna leave it there. Thank you very much, my friend. My pleasure. Have a great one. Thanks for listening to the Ben Mulroney Show podcast. We're live every day nationwide on the Chorus Radio Network, and you can listen online through the Radio Canada player and the iHeart Radio Canada apps. And make sure to follow and subscribe on Apple podcasts, Spotify, Amazon

music, or wherever you get your streaming audio. We release new podcasts every day. Thanks for listening. Ooh, or that beautiful silk skirt. Did she pay full price? Or those suede sneakers? Or that luggage? Or that trench? Those jeans, that jacket, those heels. Is anyone paying full price for anything? Stop wondering.

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