The Ben Mulroney Show - Disney opening in the Middle East... so much for caring about Gay Rights

Episode Date: May 12, 2025

Guests and Topics: -Disney opening in the Middle East... so much for caring about Gay Rights with Guest: Tony Chapman, Host of the award winning podcast Chatter that Matters, Founder of Chatter AI If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Our next guest solves a lot of problems for us because he answers all the questions I have. Maybe one day we'll convince him to show up for the Dilemma panel as well. Please welcome to the show Tony Chapman. He is the host of the award-winning podcast, Chatter That Matters, as well as the founder of Chatter AI, Tony, welcome. Always a pleasure. Okay, so Weight Watchers, I remember when Weight Watchers announced that Oprah had become an investor

and also a client, and their stock shot through the roof, and then to learn that they have filed for bankruptcy makes me ask the question, what changed? Well, the world went from community, which they were really good at building, to chemistry and chemistry being I can get instant gratification by getting a pill a day keeps the pounds away. And, and they didn't really, they bought a company called sequence to start prescribing, but it was too little too late. Here's the reality.

They're trying to take one 1.4 billion a debt, take a 1.1 million off their balance sheet, which means there's a big haircut for a lot of investors, and try to revamp. And unless they change the status quo, I don't think they can. I've got some ideas for them, but I don't think as they stand now, instant gratification America versus actually doing the hard work. Well, but the studies show that Ozempic is good at taking the weight off, but for those people who don't take advantage of that weight loss

to adopt the healthy changes in their diet and lifestyle that they need, they're going to put the weight back on. So maybe there's a role for Weight Watchers in a post-Ozempic world. So for people who are all taking it, if they could become that life coach for the millions of people on Ozempic world. So for people who are all taking it, if they could become that life coach for the millions of people on Ozempic, if there could be, if an Ozempic endorsed Weight Watchers plan that they could then follow, maybe that's the path forward.

It's an interesting one. I mean, the tension point for Weight Watchers was I stepped on a scale, I gotta do something. Yeah. Right, where I would say gyms and apple carrot, a lot of people are playing at preservation of that weight. Here's what I would do. I think they should move away from weight watches to more of a longevity

play. Longevity is about chasing your fountain of youth. So why can't weight watches be much more thought leadership? Could they be brain watches, foods that I should be eating for my cognitive abilities, functional, sexual, all the functional foods that I should be consuming. So it's not just about losing weight, it's about being the best I can be. I foods that I should be consuming. So it's not just about losing weight,

it's about being the best I can be. I think that would be a play. And I would absolutely double down on the fact that the prescribing drugs is if they have that data, then your idea kicks in. If I've got a million people I'm prescribing those Zempik to, then why not those one million people be, now that you've taken off, let's keep it that way.

So it's a combination of the two that I like. Yeah. And that's what I would be doing. Brain watchers. I don't know if sex watchers would get the clients. You might not have to use sex watchers, but you could certainly just talk about your sexual health. And the reality is functional foods, we now know we can eat to prevent cancer. We can eat to chase that found youth. Weight watchers needs to own that territory. Because if it's just simply about losing weight, I think that to chase that found youth. Weight Watches needs to own that territory.

Because if it's just simply about losing weight, I think that the trains left the station. Tony, for as long as I could remember, it was Pepsi, Coke followed by Pepsi. That was the number one, number two. There was one, two punch, right? And now to find out that Pepsi has fallen out of the top three in terms of carbonated beverages in the United States.

That's the people in Pepsi are probably asking themselves, what the heck went wrong? in terms of carbonated beverages in the United States. The people at Pepsi are probably asking themselves, what the heck went wrong? I worked on Pepsi for 32 years, and when the Cola Wars were at their height, there was nothing more fun. You could have fun with each other, it was playful punches.

They had great ad campaigns. The other guy blinked. I mean, everything was fun. And then what happened is the category expanded from a handful of drinks to thousands. I think Pepsi lost their focus on their core beverages. Coke has always stayed true to it. So Pepsi had their obviously their potato chip business and lays. They had a wide menu, big orchestra to play. Coke has always said first and foremost, we've got to fill those trucks and

sell a lot of Coca-Cola. And by sticking to their knitting, I think they did an extraordinary job. And then Dr. Pepper and Sprite, Sprite's obviously Coca-Cola, Dr. Pepper's bottled by Coca-Cola, all of those three things. If you own the shelf space in the store, if you've got the lead pony being Coca-Cola, you can command attention from the retailer. And if you command attention from the retailer,

you push Pepsi in the corner, and that's what we're seeing happening in the grocery stores, and obviously the market share. No, you know that, that's interesting that you say that because I've been thinking about the branding at Coca-Cola, even when they've added new drinks, right? When there's Coke Zero or Coke Zero Sugar now, it's still, the ethos is still the same as that classic

that, you know, like when they add a new flavor, it's a flavor but an ion maintaining, they say it still tastes like the original, right? And the polar bears at Christmas, they all to me feels so- Very iconic. Yeah, very iconic. And it's a wall in the store of Coke.

And again, you've got a second, a tenth of a second to catch the consumer's attention, the shopper's attention, especially soft drinks. Mom doesn't want you to go down that aisle anymore. You're only allowed to bring soft drinks in for a hockey game because she doesn't want that sugared soft drink. So you gotta be Coca-Cola, get the end-all displays

and build it, stack it, and they fly. So what should Pepsi do to get back to number two? I don't think one is attainable, but two is possible. I think if Pepsi wants to refocus on Pepsi or they just admit that that cola and soft drink category is gonna continue to decline, and where they gotta win is they gotta win with bubbly, they gotta win with some of their other energy drinks

like Celsius that they've just launched. Really owned- I tried Celsius. It's, I don't want to knock anybody in case we're looking for a sponsor. Way too sweet for me. Yeah, I mean, it's again, that's targeted more for the feminine palette

and they love that sweetness. I mean, this is the stuff they test. They don't want that hard, you know, that Red Bull energy. So they want something a little bit more efficacy on it. So Pepsi's got to do that. And also they own the snack category. They need to build that. So keep Coke honest.

I would be tactical with pricing. So Coke can't get too wealthy to expect. And at the other side, win with their ancillary brands. Okay. We got to talk about Disney here. Because you're never going to find a... I had kids, I joke about it. I had kids so I wouldn't be the old dude roaming the Disney parks solo.

Like they're my insurance policy, so I don't, so the creep meter doesn't go off when I go into the Disney park. That's how much I love Disney. And now I hear that they're building a new park in the Middle East, in the UAE. This, and it looks like it's gonna be fantastic and phenomenal, but context is everything.

And just a few years ago, Disney was very proud to go to war with the Republican governor of Florida over his stance on gay rights. So how does that square with opening up a park in an area of the world where it's illegal to be gay? It's amazing how money suddenly shifts, your moral compass shifts when you have money attached.

And you gotta understand, this will be Disney on steroids. There's an unlimited budget. People down there, I mean, they're gonna put more money against this than we've ever seen and experienced. They're gonna make the sphere in Las Vegas look like a snow cone bowl, right? And this is what they're gonna do. So Disney is gonna take their properties

and now have a new flagship. And that's what's interesting. The flagship for Disney will no longer be in Florida, but in the Middle East. That's the other thing that I got to come to terms with. Is the world moving to the Middle East because they've got the cash, cash is king, and I can't wait to see it. I'll tell you something, I love Disney as well. I can't wait to see what they do over there because I think every experience that you have will be on steroids. Yeah, I mean, I'm trying to reconcile it with

their ethos. They were very proud to be the tip of the sword. It was it had become in a lot of ways, their corporate identity. You know, it was a badge of honor. Is nobody noticing the situational hypocrisy here? No, they're not. And I can imagine the board meeting how they debated it. And then somebody stood up and said, hey, you want to continue to have your shareholder share prices go up? You guys around the board, you got about $100 million in options at stake here, maybe a billion dollars. I think we got to do it and not money, sadly, obviously will change your moral compass. And there's no doubt that they put billions of dollars on the table to license Disney and to take it to the next level. Well, yeah, and sports are moving there, too. You've got golf, UFC, boxing, soccer, Formula One.

I mean, it's only a matter of time before we can go to an NFL game there. I'd love to do a show on how they can take over sporting and gambling and experience and entertainment because ultimately, they can justify money that we could never make a case for in the United States. I need a return in 10 years. They don't care about returns. Last thing, and we only have about a minute left, but Hudson's Bay, 17 bids to find a new owner. We've already talked about these pop-ups

that you think would be a very good idea. How long until we see a new iteration of Hudson's Bay? Oh, they'll be weeks. And it'll be so quick, because again, my belief is show me your stripes. Connect Canadian culture, identity, our need for being united. Show Me Your Stripes could be the rallying cry and out of that they will populate so many different products. Oh, just so long as it supplants elbows up because I can't take

that anymore. Tony Chapman, always great to talk to you. Fabulous. Alright. This is the Ben Mulroney Show and this is your host, Ben Mulroney and very glad that you're joining us on this Monday. I hope everybody had a wonderful weekend. It was a time to celebrate. We had a great time. We had a great This is the Ben Mulroney Show and this is your host Ben Mulroney and very glad that you're joining us on this Monday. I hope everybody had a wonderful weekend. It was a time to celebrate the mothers in our lives and I hope that you did

your duty as a son, as a father, as a friend to say thank you to the woman who gave you life or gave life to somebody who matters to you. The Prime Minister of Canada, Mark Carney, has said as we await a new government to be announced tomorrow, what it's going to look like, what the cabinet is going to look like, that's happening tomorrow morning. He has announced that he's returning to Justin Trudeau's gender parity rule for his cabinet. That's just super, just super as far as I'm concerned. I don't know how you feel, but when I heard that this morning, I just sighed and said,

ah, here we go, here we go again, performance over result. And this is not a knock on, no one's coming at me and telling me that I am being somehow a regressive conservative for saying this. The facts are the numbers. And the numbers are that there were more men elected to the Liberal Party as MPs than women. And if that's the case, which it is, then the numbers dictate that there are all things being equal, And that's all we got to work with,

that there are more people that that should be reflected in the cabinet. Because if you're going for parody over anything, you're going to pick, you're probably going to pick a woman who is less well suited for the portfolio than a man. And don't forget, it's not just about gender parity. You have to have regional representation. You have to have cultural representation. You have to have linguistic representation.

When you put all of that representation into the formula, there's no way, zero way that the best people and the most well suited people are going to be in every single portfolio. There's no way it's an impossibility. Anytime you start saying, well, let's not forget, we have to have a balance. We got to have Quebec properly represented or the West properly represented. If you don't have, if you're thinking about that, then you're not thinking about who is

the best person for the job. Now, in an ideal world, you're gonna have the best people in the best jobs. But that's only if that's what you're, the only thing you're thinking of. And that's how it works. Now, we as a country have, make allowances for certain things. We make allowances for the regional representation,

for the linguistic differences, for the linguistic differences, for the age differences, for the making sure that you have people from certain cultural backgrounds to be represented. We've made those. When you throw gender into that, it's yet another dilution of quality. And I'm not living in a world where me saying that is anti-woman in any way. I'm not living in that world. So saying that is anti-woman in any way.

I'm not living in that world. So you want to come at me, you come at me. I don't care. It will bounce off of me. I don't care. But this is what I think a lot of people were hoping we were moving away from as a country. This performative pageantry to show look how progressive we are. Look how evolved we are. It's just exhausting. And the fact that we're starting with this again, I've said before that the pendulum is swinging

away from identity politics around the world. Not in Canada, or this will be this is this will be the woke ideology, Stalingrad, the last stand of woke politics will happen in Canada, or this will be the woke ideology, Stalingrad. The last stand of woke politics will happen in Canada. It just will. And that's a sad thing. The social media was a flutter, a flutter over the weekend when a video of the President of France, alongside the prime minister of England and the chancellor of Germany, they were on a train together.

And the press were invited into this boardroom, part of the train that the three men were sitting in. And there are certain people on social media convinced, convinced that it is proof positive that the president of France was hiding a bag of cocaine and I believe the chancellor of Germany was hiding a I guess like a little spoon that you use for cocaine as they were caught on camera caught red-handed apparently, caught red-handed. Now what I saw was a used up Kleenex in front of Macron that he, when he saw the press were coming, didn't want that to be in the official pictures and took it and moved it out of the way. And what they're convinced is a spoon could just as easily

be, I don't know, one of those sticks that you stir a coffee with. And even if you don't believe what I just said, what are the chances of Keir Starmer, Macron, and I wish I could remember the German chancellor's name, these three dudes who know each other professionally, who are on a train together, who just decided to start doing fat rails while riding the rails, just because with the press in the other room, with the press right next door, like there is no world where that makes sense to me, like none. But the internet is just convinced of it, just convinced of it, and it's a thing. just convinced of it and it's a thing. It's a thing. There are a lot of people on the left in the UK who are hoping that Keir Starmer was high

when he tweeted out his promises for tougher visa rules for a broken migration system. Yeah, we actually have the audio of this. Let's listen. Nations depend on rules, fair rules. Without them, we risk becoming the audio of this, let's listen. Nations depend on rules, fair rules. Without them, we risk becoming an island of strangers, not a nation that walks forward together. So when you have an immigration system

that seems almost designed to permit abuse, that encourages some businesses to bring in lower paid workers rather than invest in our young people Or simply one that is sold by politicians to the British people on an entirely false premise Then you're not championing growth You're not championing justice or however else people defend the status quo You're actually contributing to the forces that are slowly

pulling our country apart. So yes, I believe in this. I believe we need to reduce immigration significantly. Yeah, he he added the immigrants coming to the UK need to quote speak English quote, if you want to live in the UK, you should speak English, that's common sense or raising English language requirements across every major immigration route. Where's where what's what's in this to be outraged by? Why if I

want to move to Japan, I should probably learn Japanese. And I do not believe that we have a government that will say this sort of pointed direct thing about immigration in Canada, at least not federally. I mean, in Quebec, they say it, they've been living it for years. But I do hope that if they don't say it, I hope that the policies indicate that that is what we prefer. And I would take one issue with Keir Starmer. I don't think that it's slowly corroding society. I think it's quickly corroding society. And look, to be fair to Keir Starmer, he campaigned on this.

He campaigned almost to the right of the Tories on immigration. But I think he's actually taking this very activist position because he is facing pressure from other parties that are leading and owning this this position. But this is not outrageous. This is not controversial. This is, if you believe in your country, if you believe your country is not a post-national state with no core identity,

then you should believe in the things that underpin its identity. And in Canada, when our founding document says that we have to, well, we have three founding peoples, English, French, and First Nations, then coming here, a barrier to entry needs to be language. One of them. There's got to be a lot of barriers to entry here. I'm not suggesting a purity test, but I would like to know that the people who come here actually wanna be here and they like it the way it is and aren't looking to cut us off at our knees. So that to me is refreshing. And the fact that it came from a labor party

speaks to where this debate has gone and how we've gotten certain things so wrong in the West on issues like immigration that the pendulum is swinging in a way to course correct. I mean we've got a course correct which means things have got to get worse before they get better. Before we get back to that massive, incredible consensus that we used to have on immigration in Canada, we're going to have to turn off the taps almost, I wouldn't say completely, but significantly,

just to level set and get back to a place where things feel like they're under control.