The Ben Mulroney Show - Hot Takes Wednesday! A gov't same as it ever was? And does FIFA want royal treatment?

Episode Date: April 29, 2026

Guest: Andy Gibbons, Principal at Walgate Advisory, former VP WestJet Guest: Regan Watts, Founder Fratton Park Inc., former senior aide to Finance Minister Jim Flaherty If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://link.chtbl.com/bms⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Also, on youtube -- ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@BenMulroneyShow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Insta: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ Twitter: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ TikTok: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ Executive Producer:  Mike Drolet Reach out to Mike with story ideas or tips at [e-mail] Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Play. Post. Taste. View and enjoy. Via Rail, love the way. It is the Ben Mulroney show But at this point on the show on Wednesdays, it really is the Ben Mulroney show featuring Andy Gibbons and Regan Watts.

I'm talking to Andy Gibbons from Wallgate and Regan Watts from Fratton Park. One gate, one park. Welcome boys, Jellum, welcome back to the show. Happy Wednesday, Ben. Thank you. So, Migwitch. We saw the, we saw Carney's economic update. And it had me think of this a song that just keeps rattling in my head.

Same as it ever was. Same as it ever was. Yeah. Well, let's start with the kitten whisperer over there. Regan. Is this plan, same as the old plan? It feels like it is. And if you listen to, if you listen to Andrew Coyne,

whom I've said earlier today, has a lot of time for this government. He is pretty blunt in his assessment that this is a lot of the same stuff that's not going to get us to where we need to be. So a couple of things, Ben. First and foremost, it's unusual for Andrew Coyne to be right about anything. So let's keep that in mind. I also want to put, you know, I know you make the reference to kittens. I didn't believe you, I didn't think you were against kittens,

but let the record show that you may have an issue with kittens. Oh, I do. No, I love the issue. And we can. Yeah. Kittens are cute. Cats in general have a problem with because they seem to have a problem with me. Okay.

Look, there may be something in that. With respect to the fiscal update from the government of Canada, I think though Coin had something reasonable to say, which is it is an orgy of spending $37 billion, and it remains to be seen how much of that is going to drive economic and productivity gains in the country, which we so badly need. I think Mr. Coyne's comments around the need to grow the economy

and us being happy with 1.6, 1.7% GDP growth, compared to, say, when your father was in office, when we had two, three, even four percent GDP growth, I think are reasonable points to be made. You know, there's a few things that were announced that I think are worth noting and worthy. One of them is the funding that was set aside for sport, something like $750 million, was set aside for national sport organizations. I think that's a worthy goal. I think we, just coming off the back of a disappointing Cortina Olympics,

money for amateur athletes so they can prepare and compete at the highest level is a good thing for the country because Canadians will feel proud. But there's billions for other things in the update that, I'm not sure we're necessary. And to Brother Coins point, I think the proof will be in the pudding, we need to measure about how the spending is going to grow the economy and grow the country. And as of right now, the verdict is out on that one. It remains to be seen.

Andy, there's another song that just keeps rattled around in my head. How does it go again? This is going to be a problem, right? I mean, we talked with an economist just a few minutes ago that the amount of money that we owe, just servicing the debt is that number is crowding out our ability to pay for the things that we must pay for. Yeah, and the opposition's calling it credit card budgeting, which I think is a pretty good and effective line. What surprises me, Ben, is, you know, this is the 11th year of liberals being in power. And every single year, they've committed to Canadians that spending is going to fuel growth.

And for 11 years, it hasn't occurred. So I think it is more of the same. The good news is they didn't hype the hell out of this economic statement, which was probably a wise choice because it was pretty flat for everyone who's watching. But, you know, this concept of spending will fuel growth. It's not something new. They can call themselves the new government, but it's not a new concept. In fact, we've heard it over and over again.

So I was a little bit surprised by this week's economic statement. And also their projections, Regan's right, they're projecting 1.7% GDP growth. That's our projection. That's not what our actual GDP growth is. It's like 1.1 to 1.5. Most of Europe is under one. The United States is over two, close to 2 and a half. So, you know, we're not doing well.

But according to those numbers, we are the second fastest growth. growing economy in the G7. But for context, the OECD average is 1.7% and the global average is 2.9%. So we are about halfway from the global average. Look, I'll say this, Regan, is a lot of people believed the absolute best about this idea of a new liberal government under a new liberal leader. But the problem is because it's the same government with the same people behind them, those people have a vested interest in perpetuating the programs that they either started or espoused or pushed forward. If this had, let's take Pierre Poliev out of it, if it had been a new government, a

truly new government, a new party, they would have come in and said, I don't know you and I don't know this thing and I don't like this. And this is gone, gone, gone, gone, gone, line item by line item. you know, so many of the projects but, you know, teaching people how to raise rice for the, you know, queer youth in Indonesia. Gone, right?

Don't care. Don't know it. Gone. And you can, but you can't do that. And I did hope that Mark Carney was going to come in and unlike his predecessor, who believed that the economy grows itself from the heart outward, this guy was going to come and say, can't afford it, can afford it, can't afford it, can't afford it. And that hasn't happened yet. Well, I think you're seeing some of that. But to your point, Ben, and I know Andy's going to weigh in here, I'll be quick. I think you're seeing some of that, but I think it's a fair

argument to say that the government of Canada and Canada's new government as they're calling themselves can probably do a lot more when it comes to spending reductions and canceling some worthy programs that are not as worthy or worthwhile or achieving their objectives. That, that I think goes without saying. And I would be, and I'm the first person to put my hand up and say, I wish they would go further when it comes to spending reduction. Yeah. Look, if we want to spend, you know, we still have to spend a billion dollars annually for health care

for asylum workers, a billion for temporary workers to get to Canada. I mean, these are things, these are costs that we have, right? So why not look at the stuff we, those are must-haves, right? So let's look at the nice-to-haves, which are no longer nice-to-haves. They are useless. They are-drain on the things we have to pay for. But listen, things could get better for this government by the time the, by the time the next budget comes out,

because when these numbers were projected, they were projected with about a $75 a barrel cost, but right now the cost is closer to $100, which means they're going to get more money in taxes from that. So we could see a better outlook come, what, November, Andy, but I don't know that that is necessarily because of proper economic stewardship. Well, I think that's the problem with Canada, right now, and I do think the prime minister is trying to solve it, which is, you know,

this half month, a half month price of this, price of that, we want the fundamentals of the economy to be strong. And to go back to the 1.7, Ben, you know, the single greatest thing Mark Carney and the government could do for economic future is to get the American relationship right. Yeah. And to get that on a solid footing. Our GDP and the fact that it is higher than the average in the G7 is because of our proximity and access to that market. That's the fact. And that has to be made right and made whole and it's not easy and it's hard. So I think it's all it's all sort of wrapped together. But yeah, will they get a sugar high from high older prices? Sure. But that's not, you know, I think Canadians are really looking for more drastic action.

I think they're looking for Paul Martin, Jean-Cretchen, austerity. I think they're looking for common sense revolution policies. The appetite is there. Is the government going to meet that appetite? So far, it's It's like a mixed bag. Yeah. So that's a good point. I mean, that's, that would be if, if this prime minister were truly a progressive conservative, as a lot of circles want us to believe, they would be more akin, he would be more akin to that, the tactics of Paul Martin and Jean-Cretzien.

And why do you think that isn't? Is it because the liberal party's buoyed by really high poll numbers? They're like, nothing to, no one seems to have a problem with it. So we're just going to continue steady as she goes. Sure, I think some of it is polling, Ben. I think some of it as well is the Prime Minister is taking baby steps in areas where I think, and I think Andy's right, the public appetite and the public mood for adjustment in government finances and how government's spending money and how government is taxing is, I think,

quite voracious when it comes to making changes. He made some changes in the update around consulting spend, for example, to try and save a billion dollars a year in external consultants for the government of Canada. I think there's an appetite to do much more of that. But the prime minister is, you know, he's been in power for a year. He's found his feet. He's got his caucus. He's now got his majority.

I think it's the next budget where we will see if he's going to swing for the fences on those items, like Andy said. I think that's when we will see it, not in the spring update of 2026, but the fall budget of 2026. All right. Well, we're going to take a quick break when we come back. We've got lots to get to, including the president of FIFA, who thinks he's an actual president. That's coming up next on the Ben Mulrney show. Some crimes are so shocking. They don't just make headlines. They forever change our society. I'm Katie Ring, host of America's Most Infamous Crimes. Each week, I take on one of the most notorious criminal cases.

Each case unfolds across multiple episodes, release every Tuesday through Thursday, from the first time that something was wrong, to the moment the truth came out or didn't. Listen to and follow America's Most Infamous Crimes on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Welcome back and welcome back to Andy and to Regan. Thank you guys so much for sticking around. Look, according to the Toronto Star, they say that a report suggests that the Canadian economy is weathering Trump's trade war. And I'm sure that there's an element of truth to that. But there's another story in the globe of yet another Quebec furniture manufacturer that has gone belly up.

Yesterday, we heard a few days ago we heard about Rogers cutting half of its staff. There are stories in the press about Cineplex voluntarily putting itself up for sale on the hopes of being subsumed by either an American or a British analog. These are not great indicators, Andy. No, they're not great indicators. And again, just back back to the USA. And that meant that furniture manufacturing facility cited that their American buyers have uncertainty and lack of clarity around Canada.

and the trade relationship with Canada. So while the government's technically correct to say there are three industries that are targeted by Trump and they need to be supported, it has a trickle-down effect that just puts a cloud over all of these, all of these businesses for which really, Ben, there's no replacing the U.S. market. No. There is no replacing it. And it's bad and it's difficult. But, you know, the furniture manufacturer in Lacme, Antique, is not selling.

his furniture in Kuala Lumpur. It's not going to happen. And Regan, there's this balance that I think all of us are trying to get in our own minds between the idea that yes, I think we all subscribe to the prime minister's idea that I'd rather have no deal than a bad deal.

But what constitutes a bad deal changes with each passing day, right? So where do we land on that? Because I heard him on a CBC interview with Adrian Arsino. And I certainly did not, there was no urgency in his tone as it related to this. He said there's lots of discussions happening.

I concede that we don't know what happens behind closed doors. But he was very, very comfortable saying, no, we're not going to have a deal until it's a good deal for us. Of course we respect that. But what does that mean practically in terms of a timeline? Well, there's a couple of comments that I want to make. first is on the on the store or the factory in Quebec that were that was went out of business there's any you know any number of reasons that happened i don't i don't know the specifics about that particular

company but obviously your your hearts go out to the workers who were affected and their families but i'm not sure you can blame that on president trump or the trade relationship with the u.s until we have more detail um with respect to the prime minister's comments on trade and in the u.s relationship you know i think there's been a bit of a miss in terms of the nuance around of this discussion. And what do I mean by that? I mean this. That the negotiation was always scheduled to take place this coming summer. While there had been pre-discussions happening with the Americans and the Mexicans and on the margins, the actual main event starts in the summer when the clock officially ticks for the renegotiation or the review of, it's a review, not a renegotiation,

but it's a review with a view of renegotiating some of the terms in USMCA or Kuzma or NAFTA, or whatever you want to call it. You know, the Prime Minister so far, I think, has played his cards pretty well. Yes, the Canadian economy is resilient. 1.7% economic growth is okay, but I think we should all be aiming for higher. But, you know, Canadians are a resilient bunch, and it's clear that they've leaned into the Buy Canada mantra, because, you know, while we have the issue of the furniture maker in Lackney Gantik, you know, the economy and businesses are still more or less making it.

We want them to thrive, and obviously the status quo is not good enough. But I do think that the prime minister is managing this issue with the U.S. in particular fairly well. I mean, I just don't believe there's anybody in the country who thinks that Mr. Polyev would do anything better than the prime minister. Though, you know, the prime minister will have to be accountable for the outcomes from the negotiation. That'll come in the fullness of time. Yeah, but I think you're letting them off the hook for the July 1st, new economic and security relationship. Look, that's fair. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, that's fair. I agree with that. Andy, what do you? You go ahead. He's missed his own markers. No pun intended, right? And now Donald Trump is a fluid situation.

No one has a perfect grasp on it. And, you know, one day changes to the next. That's all true. But I just felt that with his majority government now, he wouldn't have to play so much to the elbows up crowd, to the U.S., you know, that we can do it alone sentiment. I thought we would see a more practical tone and more discussion about the truth,

which is our economic future is tied to the United States. And that has to be put on solid footing. And that's what our workers and our businesses and our provinces need. And it's more important than Donald Trump or anyone else. And that's the number one priority for the government. I just would like to see that talk from him. Look, Ben, I think July 1st, I think July 1st is that thing the prime minister should be hammered.

on because he missed his deadline. The fact is, though, that Canadians don't seem to want to punish him if you read the public opinion polls. They're willing to give him... Regan, I get that. I 100% get that. But he said that it was important to do.

And I don't under... Governing based on public opinion is the tail wag in the dog. You've got to take the country where you say they need to go. And you said we need to go there by July first and damn, like, then do it. And if... But Ben, if there's no deal,

I mean, that's, I think, what the prime minister is saying without saying it, that if there was no deal on the table or a deal that was good for the country to be had, he was prepared to make the, and I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt, and I'm sure this is going to drive the YouTube keyboard warriors nuts. But he was prepared to take the hit for not delivering a deal by the 1st of July. He hasn't taken a hate on that. So flip the dynamic for me. He is tanking in the polls.

Tanking in the polls. Are you saying that if he was tanking in the polls, he would get us a deal? that that's that's terrible I'm saying I'm saying I'm saying Ben that I think this prime minister much like your father for example would would look at the issue as it is and try and get the best deal for Canada regardless of what the poll said that is what your father did on any number of issues and I you know again Carney for me Prime Minister Carney has earned this right until he's disproven otherwise that he's acting in the best interest of Canada unfortunately for the keyboard warriors in the YouTube comments he's not acting for Brookfield he's not

Prime Minister for Brookfield, this Prime Minister for Canada. And I think that even if his numbers were in the toilet, he would still be doing what he believes is right for the country. Well, maybe we shouldn't let Howard Lutnik and Donald Trump determine what our nation feels about America. Look at what happened in Buffalo the other night. With the anthem, right?

Like, we have to move past this at some point. Yeah. And make a decision that Howard Lutnik is not going to determine our national mood about America and Americans. Like, come on. This has to be put behind me. And Kearney has an opportunity to do that. And I don't know why he doesn't.

Well, shout out to the 716 and the people of Buffalo, Ben. I don't know if you caught that clip. Oh, I didn't know. I started my show with it. Buffalo, New York. Shout out to Thurman and Patty Thomas and my boy, J.K. Kelly, who are all from Western New York and live there. You know, the people of Buffalo are great friends of Canada.

And I think to Andy's point, as Canadians, we need to remember that the United States is more than just what Howard Lutnik, friends. friend of Jeffrey Epstein has to say that the relationship is much deeper and more meaningful than than a cabinet secretary. And I'll point this out as well. It was not for nothing. They sang the old version of the national anthem in all thy son's command. You know, it's a classic.

I go with it. And listen, we don't have a lot of time left. So I'm going to share a quick little story with you because the news that the FIFA president wanted a motorcade so he could get from location to location in Vancouver. And that was turned down. It reminded me of a story that my dad told me about 1988, Calgary Olympics. The UN Secretary General, I believe, was there.

Perez de Quayar. And my dad was like, he called him, he said, I need to talk to Paris. And the woman said, well, of course, Mr. Prime. Of course, sir, but it's, it's, just so you know, he's secretary general. I think my dad said something like, I'm Brian Mulroy. I'm the right honorable, Brian. Mulroney, the 18th Prime Minister of Canada. Get Paris on the phone.

And that was the end of that. There are some people out there who don't, I don't know, they get a title and they earn the title, but every now and then you got to take these guys down a peg. And the guy at FIFA certainly deserved to be taking down a peg. No discussion to be had here. I just want to share that story with you. Love to share in stories

about my dad. Guys, always great talking. Enjoy the rest of your week. Hey, it's Ellen Cross. And if you love true crime podcasts, you're invited to join me for a very special live recording of my award-winning podcast Uncharted Crime and Mayhem in the Music Industry. May 7th is part of the Departure Music Conference. It's going to be an evening filled with stories about mobsters and gangsters who got their hooks into the music industry. We're talking rubouts, kidnappings, beatings, and a whole lot more. Music and the mob, a special live recording

of uncharted crime and mayhem in the music industry. May 7th at the Jane Mallet Theatre at 27 Front Street. Tickets at Departartartor.com.