The Ben Mulroney Show - How Netflix is pushing TV to net zero

Episode Date: December 31, 2024

How Netflix is pushing TV to net zero Guest: Tony Chapman, Host of the award winning podcast Chatter that Matters, Founder of Chatter AI If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy

We got a glimpse of how things are going to change in terms of how we consume content, streaming content, television content. We've seen massive structural changes from over the air to cable to Netflix. And joining me to talk about the changing and evolving sort of landscape in television is Tony Chapman, the host of the award-winning podcast, Chatter That Matters, and the founder of Chatter AI. Tony, welcome to the show. Thanks so much for being here.

Always a pleasure. I'm a big fan of yours and what you're doing with your show. Thank you. Thank you. We're all big fans of Netflix, but they took a big, big step when we saw Logan Paul, quote-unquote, box with Mike Tyson,

the numbers for that 65 million viewers in the U S alone. And then the two Christmas NFL games. And this wasn't, this was, they weren't taking a Fox broadcast and streaming it on their platform. This was a Netflix production. And we always said the conventional wisdom when I was in television, Tony was the one thing that's going to keep conventional television alive. The two things are live sports and, and breaking news. And we, they've now proven that one of those two is, is moving to streaming forever. I mean, listen, anybody that focuses on where the consumer is

and what matters most wins. And let's just break that down for a minute. First of all, you've got to understand with consumers, they're no longer consumers of content. They're also creators. So they're using their own tools to put things out. So you've got to be very good at what you bring to them. Second thing that happened is conventional TV was just milking money, three stations.

You could print money. 65 million people would watch Archie Bunker. You missed it that night. You had to wait to the summer for a rerun. That's how they dictated content. Cable comes along and says, you know what? You might want a do-it-yourself thing, a home and garden, food network. So they went out. Guess what?

They did the same model. We're going to not only sell you that cable, that content, we're going to still put a bunch of advertising on it. Netflix comes in and says, we're going to put it all under one roof. You're going to choose whatever you want is within arm's reach to desire. What happens? Netflix, 280 million subscribers. Netflix in the first six months of this year, 100 billion hours of content.

And then I went, one of the tools I use at Chatter AI is Ask Polly, a brilliant Ottawa company, by the way. And you dive into it and they go, and I asked Ask Polly, who's the biggest sports broadcaster right now? And guess what? Netflix has passed ESPN. Wow. So you look at it and you say,

well, how's that possible? It's possible because Netflix gives the consumer what they want to consume. And more importantly, Ben, they've got the data. And data is the new oil. And we can talk about data for miles content, but they can actually, their algorithm can put the content that you want

and lead you to other content you haven't even thought about. And guess what? Down the road, I bet you they're going to sell you the merchandise and the sports gambling and everything else that comes around with your eyeball fixated on a Netflix show. And listen,

if they really double down on live sports, then they have a very valid argument to create a new tier of pricing, right? And like that's a, I, when I signed up, it was to get reruns of Seinfeld and their new content. With them bringing this on and they're going to have to pay a lot for it, they can say, listen, if you're a sports fan, it's going to cost you an extra whatever, six bucks a month.

Or they could go with ads. If they go with ads, Tony, I genuinely think that that is going to be the death blow for a lot of uh a lot of people in conventional television because already the the numbers are lower than they've ever been and if that money goes to netflix in the form of advertising and we're talking with that data that you're talking about they could target me specifically because they know me better than anybody and during that same game my brother who watches a completely different thing is going to get a different ad. And it's so highly effective, so highly targeted. Why would I invest my $1 in advertising on that network when it's going to yield better results on Netflix?

Can you imagine being in that boardroom and having that discussion right now? Do we advertise or not? Do we take a football game and now shorten it to two hours without advertising and charge you an extra $8? So you can watch it in a time-compressed basis. Can we use the data to start understanding what you're really focused on when you're leaving? I mean, think about Netflix. Just let's rewind the tape. Christmas broadcast had twice the viewers than the Super Bowl, and the Super Bowl had Taylor Swift and Beyonce in the halftime. And by the way, that's when the viewership peaked at the halftime. So you're looking at Netflix, they've got complete command,

but I would tell you, if I was advising Netflix, I'd say, I'd go with a much less advertising model, charge you a premium, and then monetize you another way, saying, I want to control your sports gambling and betting,

your merchandise sales, I want to give you preferred access when you want to watch the live game, I want to give you a different viewpoint, I want to take you in the locker room. You're going to pay a premium because you're a rabid sports fan. Oh, you're just a casual sports fan? I'm going to give you some advertising.

Yeah, yeah. And they can tear it that way effortlessly, and you don't even know they've done it. It's like you're walking in the front of a store, and it's completely different. And that's the power of data. And that's why what I always say to consumers, you've got to understand that how you think, how you feel, and how you act is becoming less determined by you and much more determined by the data they know about you. And just think about how frictionless a change like that would be. If all of a sudden they give us a suite of new offerings, it's as simple as clicking the button

on your phone versus when you want to change your cable package, you got to be on the phone with somebody for 20 minutes. I mean, it's night and day it's the the ease of use the joy of use of something like netflix versus the hassle of cable uh i just what do they have left they've got they've got live tv they've got live live news and live news is is already being disrupted by the fact that i have news on my phone yeah i you know and and nobody i'm not believing the news. So the only news that exists today is the sense that it's feeding my passion. It's putting me in a like-minded, with my like-minded people

in a like-minded castle and I hate the other guys and I love what you say. So no matter, confirmation bias, I can give you the most scientific evidence, but if I'm sitting in this castle and my friends are telling me

and they're wrong, I believe them. Right? And so this is, you know, like I look at someone like you, you're doing some incredible content here and I'm going, this should be traveling like liquid across every touchpoint.

I'm going, why am I having to listen to you on radio? Where's my two-minute, momentary minute in the morning? Where are my sound bites? George, get on that. But this is what we need to think about as a broadcaster. And they're still in this invisible bars of status quo. No, we're a radio station. No, you're a content creator and let people contribute to that content.

And I think that's what Netflix has done better than anybody else. And all the other streaming services, we're going to see massive consolidation. I've got to believe that we're going to see deals between Prime and Apple happen maybe even this year because what Amazon's very good at is selling you anything you want and what Apple's very good at is

content. And the combination of those two might be a Netflix threat. I've noticed, because I've got Prime at home and I've got very good at is content. And the combination of those two might be a Netflix threat. I've noticed, because I've got a Prime at home and I've got Apple TV at home and I've got the Samsung Smart TV. So I get this content through different channels. And I've noticed that you can, on my Prime app, I can now watch Apple TV Plus and vice versa.

So there is communication going on there. There's no question. And listen, they're both very smart at what they do and they're understanding that there's going to be one or two that are going to own the streaming. You have 280 million subscribers. That's a big cash flow that's coming into your thing every month. That dictates big terms.

You're going to tell me Fox or CBS is going to go up against Netflix and Netflix chooses and wants the NFL. And what are the NFL owners doing now? Bringing in private equity. Why are they bringing in private equity? Because private equity is seeing what the future is. And the future is about subscription economy, not about, will Coca-Cola please sponsor this ad on the halftime.

Tony, but you don't think that there could be a play to disrupt live news with people sort of shying away from traditional news? And you're right, going the mobile digital route. Could Netflix or Amazon or one of those not stand up and say, we are going to be – you trust us already with content. We're just going to give you a different kind of content. If I did that, I would co-brand it with york times or one of the most trustworthy news stories and say we're going to bring the content with investigative journalism unbiased unfiltered we're going to bring it we're going to we're going to go right into where the homes are

and again with data is somebody might be interested in the cat that's got caught up in the tree and someone else might be really interested in what's happening in the middle east and they'll be able to absolutely put those chips on the table where you want it. Put things within arm's reach of desire is the essence of capitalism and marketing. So there's no question they'll get in the live news if they think there's dollars and cents in it. But I'll tell you something, the low-hanging fruit to me is sports, sports gambling, sports entertainment, sports merchandising. And it's a destination for people to watch and a time to watch. And if I control you at 2 o'clock on a Sunday afternoon because of football,

I can get you at 6 o'clock to stream my content. Tony, this has been a great chat. I want you to come back. I promise I'm going to come on to your show as well. But thank you so much for helping us end the year with such a great discussion, and I hope you have a wonderful 2025. You as well, my friend.