The Ben Mulroney Show - It's time for Mark Carney to put his elbows down

Episode Date: April 4, 2025

Guests and Topics: -It's time for Mark Carney to put his elbows down with Guest: Terry Newman, Senior Editor & Columnist for the National Post If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Visit your Toronto area Ford store or Ford.ca today. Great to have you here. I am Alex Pearson in for Mr. Ben Mulroney. And no, you're not confused. Mr. Ben Mulroney. And no, you're not confused. Mr. Ben Mulroney is in Washington, D.C. having conversations, meeting the movers and the shakers because, you know, we send our politicians down to Washington, they come back with their spin, and we need to cut through that. And so I think it's a great idea. Ben goes down to Washington, he's meeting with a number of people. And maybe we get a better idea as to what are the impacts, how long this whole tariff war is going to

go on, who's pushing for us on the Republican side, at the Democratic side, and what is he hearing as to, are we going to end up getting our own carve out, are we going to be pushed into negotiating our trade deals sooner than later? We need to get answers. And it's not enough for politicians to come back and say, hey, don't worry, we've got your back. We're going to get you through this crisis. We actually really need some clarity. Certainly a lot of things evolving in a roller coaster as we watch the markets today, as we watch really, really troubling job numbers coming into Canada.

So we're starting to see a lot of the volatility and it's going to carry out obviously over into the election, you know, the election trail. And I want to talk a little bit about, you know, some of the comments that we're hearing from our front players and it's really just down to Pierre Pauliev at this point and Mark Carney. They are the two that we are watching because they're the only two that we can actually look at as being the people and the players to deal with current situations. But you know, for the last couple of days, certainly, Mark Carney has been trying to make

his mark because don't forget, he is campaigning and chose to campaign off of Trump and this crisis. And that is his choice. It comes with risks. It also comes with a lot of benefits because he gets to run as a prime minister and show what he can do. But some of the things that he has said, I think, you know, should he be saying as a candidate? Because he is in caretaker mode as a prime minister.

He's not supposed to do big, big things. He needs a mandate. So when he says, you know, and he said a couple of things, of a relationship in the future of America, should he be saying this? The global economy is fundamentally different today than it was yesterday. The system of global trade anchored on the United States that Canada has relied on since the end of the Second World War, a system that, while not perfect, has helped to deliver prosperity for our country for decades, is over.

Our old relationship of steadily deepening integration with the United States is over. The 80-year period when the United States embraced the mantle of global economic leadership, when it forged alliances rooted in trust and mutual respect, and championed the free and open exchange of goods and services, is over. Well, this is a tragedy. It is also the new reality. All right. Well, I don't know what it is. I mean, yes, things have changed, but we don't actually know what we're dealing with, right? And frankly, I don't like big declarative statements like that. No question about it. We need change.

We never should have been caught in this position. I've heard Ben Mulroney talk about it. I've been saying it for a long time. We never should have been allowed to be this vulnerable, this back on our heels, and we never should have been as so exposed as we were. And so here we are, and yeah, things have changed, but what they change into will be the mandate of the next prime minister who is elected by the Canadian people in three weeks.

And so when you keep repeating this, yes, our relationship's over, and they are playing this down in the United States on their newscasts. So at what point then are we really kind of shooting ourselves in the foot? Because we are always going to have a relationship with the United States and we're always going to need them. And we're going to need them for quite some time. And Europe's got its own problems. So while Mark Carney is trying to establish that yes, we'll partner and do more with with Europe, okay, great, we got to do stuff with a lot of countries.

But they've got their own problems too. So I just don't want us to be declaring absolutes. And at a time when I think what people want are solutions, right? And we do need those as well. And Paul Yev's saying on Thursday, what he would would do and one of the things you know he's going to have to deal with he can't do it as easily as Mark Carney because he's not acting as the prime minister so he's in the opposition but here is his suggestion of what he feels would be the appropriate response right now in the moment. We need to protect auto workers in Oshawa, Cambridge, Brampton, Windsor, Essex, St Catharines, Oakville, Aliston, Woodstock, Ingersoll, and elsewhere. That's why I'm

announcing today that a new Conservative government will eliminate the federal sales tax on Canadian-made automobiles. Everyone who's looking to buy

Canadian, to support Canadian workers, will be able to save money as a result of this announcement. And I'm very proud of the work that made automobiles. Everyone who is looking to buy Canadian, to support Canadian workers, will be able to save money as a result of this announcement.

Axing the GST on a $50,000 Canadian made automobile will save $2,500 to the car buyer. will save $2,500 to the car buyer. All right. So there is one solution. Will it be enough?

Bottom line is we don't make Canadian cars here. Last time we made a Canadian car, it was All right, so there's one solution. Will it be enough? Bottom line is we don't make Canadian cars here. Last time we made a Canadian car, it was like, I think it was a Chevelle. I can't remember. It was so long ago. We make, we put cars together here in Canada. If you want to buy like a Toyota, Toyota RAV4, something like that.

But is this a good idea? Does it make sense? Because it actually is here. We're giving you an option and this is what we'll do. Bob Fife over at the Globe and Mail, here's how he saw that announcement. Well, look, I think this was the strongest day that I've ever seen in the election campaign for Pierre Poliev. He came out very forcefully in speaking out against the tariffs that Donald Trump has imposed on Canada, particularly the auto, and he came up with a pretty decent policy. Let's get the sales tax off of automobiles.

It'll take $2,500 off a $50,000 car, and if the provinces match it, that's $7,000 off. That's a very populist and a pretty good campaign pledge. Because it's instant, you know, you get an instant knowledge, people can relate with that, right? Like you go to the car dealership and you go, oh, well I can get this Toyota RAV4

and I get to save automatically $2,500. Again, that's an instant homie solution. So there you go. I would say that his best policy would be the cancellation of the carbon tax. You know, he didn't even have to be the prime minister to get that done, but he got that done too. The other one I thought he was interesting, didn't get a lot of attention for, but Pauli have also said that he'd be stopping the old syntaxes on booze moving forward, which again,

speaks to the populism and what people actually ask about. And it's interesting because Greg Brady on Monday night when we were out seeing one of his campaign stops you know he's in the Durham read him he's running an Ajax and he a lot of the questions from people were do you think any of the players will stop taxing alcohol and cigarettes you don't normally see them canceling the tax on cigarettes but the booze Poliev says he will he does however layout you, how he views the future relationship and how, you know, he will, I guess, move us forward in this relationship with our closest or what was our closest ally. No, I don't consider the Americans to be a reliable trade

partner right now. Their president has chosen to betray America's best friend and closest ally. I'm saddened to say that because I love the American people, but there's no denying that there is a president right now who consistently betrays the Canadian people and shows that he has been unreliable to deal with. We can't control the president. Nobody can. We're learning that today despite the very unrealistic expectations that certain people tried to make, the very unrealistic promises that people were making right up until today. What we can control is what we do at home. Precisely.

And you kind of go back to we would have, could have, should have. Wouldn't it be great now if we had the energy east? Oh boy, wouldn't it be great now if we had energy east? Oh boy, wouldn't it be great now if we could get liquefied at gas shore to shore? There are so many things we could do and we're going to have to do. My concern in this election is that we're gonna get the words and not the action.

And so where I kind of look at this, Pierre Pauli has laid out a pretty detailed plan he's been working on for quite a while. He is all about energy development with energy corridors, as well as, you know, just getting our liquefied energy to market minerals, all these things. He wants to get that expedited. And Paul, you've got Mark Harney not actually specifying what he would do, right? He'll say energy development. He does not talk about oil and gas. And if you actually read his book Volumes, he very clearly says back in 2021 that 80% of our oil sands should be landlocked.

And so the question we need him to actually answer is, okay, you have fundamentally changed in a matter of weeks on your position when it comes to oil and gas and energy,'s gonna get it built what are you gonna do to actually get it built to stop the protesters from getting in the way because if no one stops them we're in trouble that is what counts we don't need to talk we actually need the walk we will talk with Terry on the other side of this. Terry Newman is Mark Carney putting his elbows up too much. And I am Alex Pearson and I am in for Van Mourenia. It's terrific to have you on this Friday. By the way, you can always find us on any kind of day. Get us on our podcast. You can find that on Spotify, Apple Music or Amazon Music. It is all the rage, so you can find that there.

I want to talk about the campaign itself and the Trump effect, right? What happens if we campaign off of them, right? Because Mark Carney has made a, his campaign is about Trump and the crisis. They chose that as a strategy. Liberals saw how successful it was for Doug Ford, who we, of course, saw run on this a year and a half before his election date had come up. And so Carney is more than very happy

to play the part of prime minister. It gives him a huge advantage because it lets him show what he can do to the Canadian people who don't know him. And while he's supposed to be serving this country in a caretaker mode, which means you do as little as possible to make sure that things aren't falling down, the question then becomes, and certainly when he announces things like reciprocal tariffs, should he be doing this

in his role, is he poking the bear? Because on Wednesday, as my next guest points out, you have to read carefully because Trump made the suggestion that if the existing fentanyl and migration orders, which levy 25% tariffs on anything not currently compliant with our current trade deal, are terminated, well then we would be replacing it with a 12.5% tariff instead. So lower. But you saw then Carney swinging back with these countermeasures. So is he putting elbows up at the risk of our country? Let us ask the person who wrote about this. Terry Newman, Senior Editor and columnist

over at the National Post. So great to talk to you. Hi there. Hi Alex. Thanks for having me. Let's talk about your concerns when you see Mark Carney go elbows up. What is it that you heard in that speech yesterday that concerns you or we should be aware of? Yeah, well I think a few things. He's also been on the record a few times now saying that the relationship with the U.S. is over. I think that's a very premature thing to say for someone who hasn't become prime minister yet so hasn't actually been able to enter in

official negotiations. So negotiations should, you know, be the first step if we want to protect Canadians from tariffs. And as I give an example in my article, even of the Liberation Day tariffs, as bizarre as they are, the UK decided to proactively reach out to Trump and were able to negotiate a 10% rather than a 20% tariff, which was placed on the EU, showing that in fact, not talking in heated language, going in with the idea of being compromised or not talking in war language was helpful for them. Yeah, I mean look Pierre-Paul Liev made the suggestion on Thursday that he would ask for a pause, you know, in these tariffs given we're in an election and then pick up a conversation and get to renegotiating Kuzma or whatever we call it

after the election. That is one thing that could have been done and I think Carney could have done that. But instead he came out and so there is that risk. He's chosen that fight however it turns out. Yeah, yeah. I mean he seems to have chosen the fight. As we know the liberals before Justin Trudeau stepped down, they were at 16% popularity. Carney came in, a lot of the rhetoric was based on fighting Trump and tariffs. How much of that has happened since the Liberal leadership campaign and now is very unclear. And as you pointed out

before, the main, the 25% tariffs that were suggested in terms of emergency measures, that were suggested in terms of emergency measures, there is a lot of discussion about whether or not they were warranted. Even if people think they may not have been, I happen to think they are something we should engage in a thoughtful discussion about. The liberal government,

the pose on those, even the existence of those things has been very mocking. which couldn't help, right? Because President Trump watches a lot of TV. So to say, you know, the fentanyl problem is, crisis is not a problem, probably didn't put us on good terms, right? So right now we're fighting. We've had a party that has, you know, mocked the suggestion that the border was a problem. Has even Justin Trudeau in Trump's first after his first inauguration sent out that tweet, which is basically like, bring us your cold and hungry.

Yep. Right. So it's been antagonistic. So if the Liberals continue an antagonistic relationship with President Trump, it may not be to the benefit of Canadians. Right. And there's not a lot of transparency because, I mean, the narrative that can be and is written is well, he must have had a great conversation on that phone call. And I have no idea, you have no idea what was discussed. I mean, there are a lot of questions asked about his relationship and any kind of

conflicts of interest given Brookfield and the kind of company it is and if those kinds of things will become a conflict in dealing with Trump given that he had given a loan to Jared Kushner in some kind of real estate thing like why we don't know what's been promised what's been made but Carney has said a number of times and even you know we need a non they keep calling well when he's prime minister when he's prime minister he's not acting as he's not supposed to be acting as prime minister right now like there's a difference in caretaker mode than there is in you've got a mandate now run with it because he

whatever he does now in the campaign trail whatever damage is done Canadians are going to be paying the price. Well, yes, and like the official capacity of what he can do right now is debatable, but it would seem like an emergency, but no change in the fact that there was no change in what was announced, what was expected was still kind of in place, doesn't suggest the escalation was appropriate. It certainly it certainly doesn't look good that somebody who needs to actually win the prime ministership still has to happen making these types of decisions very quickly. Right, I mean the one piece of information you know workers are certainly the ones already being laid off and you certainly saw the job

numbers today where you know 33,000 jobs have been lost when we were expecting to put 10,000 jobs, create new jobs. Workers don't know if they're getting EI packages. They don't know when they're getting it. All they've been told are the talking points of don't worry, we've got your back. That's the kind of information,

I think if you want to campaign on this issue, get that information out. Because right now we've got workers who are laid off and have no idea are they going to get paid for the next two weeks over it's you know from Stellantis. Yeah absolutely I mean people that both parties have been talking a bit about these types of packages. The other issue with this is like are we going to need these packages if we have right transparent negotiations that we're reporting back to Canadians. Whether they're about the fentanyl and crisis and the initial tariffs that were first proposed and what the works

and the discussions were on that, or any negotiations. Instead, Justin Trudeau kind of came back and didn't really report about what the negotiations were. He just said, you know, Canadians like to stand outside in the cold. Yeah. The other thing, you know, and the reality is we can't bail out every industry, right? We can't bail out auto and lumber and, you know, oil and gas. Oh yeah, and canola, which no one talks about. I mean, Mark Carney has not said anything about our canola farmers who are being tariffed by China, and it's

like that doesn't even matter apparently and he's there's no consistency there. Yeah that's it and I mean it's a it's a Western thing right so so that's that's going to be eyed very suspiciously but also I mean pipelines right you know just say it are you going to build them? No specific I think it has to be very specific specifically how are you going to build them given all the barriers that have been put? In the way of this stuff. I want to know specifically what he's going to do with lobbyists activists How he's going to get all of that done within four years Yeah, they see the Liberal Party's have been promising green jobs since their first campaign platform

They never manifested right and Kearney's page on the Liberal platform doesn't say conventional and clean energy as he said in public, it just says clean energy. Right. So people need to be pressing him on this. Like what is your plan? Right. Or if you are elected? Yeah, you need absolute consistency on this but absolutely the fine print has to be talked about and given details otherwise it's just air it's just words and we've had too many of that obviously for the last well ten years and we can blame a lot of others but we are ultimately it's do-or-die times we either you know poop or get off the pot

I think as they say I appreciate talking to you thanks so much thanks for having me Alex that is That is Terry Newman, Senior Editor and Colonist over at The National Post. Again, Debil is going to put towards the grocery bill. Oh, I love that. Tune into Flavor Network every night at 9 Eastern or stream live on StackTV. Look for the daily code word and enter on our website for a chance to win $15,000. Oh my god, that's so good. I'm going to blow some minds. Let's do it.

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