The Ben Mulroney Show - Kevin O'Leary lays out a compelling case on why China is the biggest problem

Episode Date: April 11, 2025

Guests and Topics: -Guest:Kevin O’Leary, Chairman of O’Leary Ventures, Shark Tank’s Mr. Wonderful If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Welcome to the Ben Mulroney show. I want to jump right in with a regular friend of the show friend of mine Mr. Wonderful himself Kevin O'Leary Kevin. Welcome back to the show. Thanks so much for joining us Great to be here. Thank you Ben. So, you know what we're used to seeing you on TV. We're used to seeing you talking about business and entrepreneurs Yesterday you actually were in in Washington talk to me about that. So Senator Rick Scott decided to hold hearings probably quite timely although these hearings are set up months ago about China and the environment obviously the tariff wars and

it was obviously because it was timely probably serendipitously so it was packed. And there were many testimonies regarding the situation. But I don't think a lot of people in the US understood how blatant the IP theft is and how it works with China. And can I just jump in for a real quick because when you read the headline, Kevin O'Leary wants 400% tariffs on China. You know, someone who doesn't dig into what you actually say is gonna say, oh that's Kevin being Kevin. That's Kevin trying to get headlines. But when you listen to what you actually said yesterday, and you're gonna share that with us, you make a really good case. Yeah, so the way it works, and I think the senator's eyes

were opened after they heard this because there's so many instances of this, when an American company, frankly Canadian for that matter, gets investors and does a startup, let's say you put up 10 million bucks or whatever, you know, and eight out of ten times it doesn't work out. But when it does, and the product is introduced into the market, goods or service or technology, it doesn't matter. As soon as it gets to a run rate of five million annually, almost 100% of the time it gets knocked off in China.

And so the company has to recoup the 10 million that it made, let's say, in R&D. The Chinese don't. So they knock it off, and they reintroduce it into the American and Canadian and Mexican market and European market too, at 30 to 40% off of the price you're selling it at, because they don't have to recoup anything. They're just making pure margin. You have no need to recover. And this happens thousands of times and there's no recourse. And there's no consequences.

And that's, and we thought 20 years ago when we we as a sort of the Western world Invited China to be part of sort of the the global trading if I we thought we thought that commerce would normalize this this This this country that was sort of working on its own on its own rules. It turns out that didn't happen That's right in the year 2000 under Bill Clinton this country that was sort of working on its own rules. It turns out that didn't happen. That's right. In the year 2000, under Bill Clinton and his administration,

they finally convinced China to join the WTO. Within the very first month, they weren't compliant. And they never have been. All the grievances brought to the WTO to be resolved through litigation, never advanced. So China has basically built their economy on the back of Western civilizations investment in IP. And at this point, as an investor, having seen it, I'm frustrated. I finally said, look, it may sound bombastic

to ask for 400 percent, but I really want to put their feet to the fire. I've had enough. Yeah. And so I speak on behalf of millions of investors. Everybody knows what I'm talking about. It's been burned by China this way. Yeah. Well, and you also highlighted a story that I've actually mentioned on the show, and I read about this about 10 years ago,

China has so many, what they call ghost factories, where an American or Western product is made in a factory in China and they work a 12-hour shift and then everybody goes home they turn off all the machines and then a whole other group of people come in and they make the exact same product they maybe change a letter in the name and that is the knockoff product it's the exact same thing they sell it at 30% less and and and that that's been the stock and trade

of a lot of a big part of the Chinese economy for years. And what's so troubling, if you talk to young Chinese people, they think that's okay. No one's ever taught them that that's wrong. And so there's an education process that has to occur here. It's as if they have the right to steal and it's embedded in them at a young age.

I mean, there's something very, very wrong here. And now that we're going into an economic war with China, it's gotta get resolved. You know, I wanna take a step back and look at sort of Donald Trump's, the chaos that was sown by all the tariffs that went on. And now it does seem like The focus is coming to where it should have been in the first place and I would argue almost exclusively

Because you've highlighted how egregious Some of the behavior is from China, but you got guys like Doug Ford who've been beating the drum saying we're not the problem We're your friend. We want to help you with this problem And yet here we find ourselves still today with automotive tariffs, aluminum and steel tariffs, and we're wondering why are we still being treated like a problem when the real problem is what you just highlighted yesterday in Washington? Well, let's talk about Canada and talking about Canada and Lutnick, Harold Lutnick, excuse me, Harold Lutnick said publicly already that he's not to deal with Canada until the elections over on the 28th and so the rhetoric that we're you know I'm getting you know I was in Geneva last week and they were covering a Canadian story same in London I mean

it's getting really really crazy and noisy because Carney's doing a masterful job of saying to everybody, look, never mind about my party's performance over the last decade. Keep your eyes on this shiny bead called Donald Trump. I'm the person that can save you. Only I can save you, even though my policies brought you to your knees financially. Don't worry about that. I've kept all the same cabinet members that took your knees and wiped out the country. But I can save you from this horrible shiny beat Trump.

Trump sees this, he's watching it, certainly Burgum and Doug Ford's been dealing with Lutnik, dealing with Burgum. And they've just said, we're going to put the whole Canadian thing on hold till all this rhetoric stops and you've chosen a leader. And then, you know, get your high knees down here to Washington, let's work this thing out. Because what they've offered Europe, Eastern Europe, the Brits and the Brits even this morning have come back and said, look, we're ready to go to zero tariffs in both directions, which is what we want in Canada as well.

But each side has to drop all of their regulations and tariffs. In the case of the British, they've got massive tariffs on agriculture, fertilizer, ag tech, grains. And so what's happening here, if you think of the two verticals, Ben, you've got this circle of friendship. I know it doesn't feel like it's family with Canada, but that's our own fault because of an election. But we're going to have a deal with Eastern Europe, Mexico, Canada, but that's our own fault because of an election But we're gonna have a deal with Eastern Europe Mexico Canada Probably all at zero and that circle of friendship is going to go against China who's trying to keep To become the world's largest superpower economically. That's what the that's what Trump's signal is I know the noise is insane and by the way, no government has ever tried to meet

60 trade agreements at once. Yeah. In the open. I mean, from that perspective, it's absolute chaos. Hey, with the one minute left that we have, I'd love to get your take. What's the state of play today on the fate of TikTok? So Senator Cotton in that same hearings that you were talking about earlier, dropped a bomb yesterday.

He basically—there was a deal on the table that included leasing the algorithm from China. So they get to safe face, keep ownership, and TikTok goes on under American ownership, and they license the algorithm. The algorithm that has, as Cotton calls it, warcraft, weapons grade spyware, which is what it is. I mean, everybody knows. Anyways, he blew that up. He basically said, because what's required for that deal, Ben, is an indemnification against the 800 billion a year fine. So all the investors in that deal wanted to get indemnified. And he said, we're not indemnifying. We're not changing the law. You cannot buy TikTok with the Chinese algorithms were to square one. Okay, all to figure out a new strategy. As of today, we've got 68

days to figure that out. Kevin O'Leary, chairman of O'Leary Ventures and Shark Tank's Mr. Wonderful. Always appreciate you having you on the show, my friend. Take care. bye bye. Want to transform your space and your Sundays? Well, Home Network is giving you the chance to love your home with $15,000. There can only be one winner.

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