The Ben Mulroney Show - Richmond BC land owners feel betrayed and the Green Party exposed!

Episode Date: October 29, 2025

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Now streaming on Paramount Plus. It's the epic return of Mayor of Kingstown. Warden? You know who I am. Starring Academy Award nominee Jeremy Renner. I have sway in these walls. Emmy award winner Edie Falco. You're an ex-con who ran this place first.

years. And now, now you can't do that. And BAFTA award winner Lenny James. You're about to have a plague of outsiders descend on your town. Let me tell you this. It's got to be consequences. Mayor of Kingstown, new season now streaming on Paramount Plus. Welcome to the Ben Mulroney show on this Wednesday, October 29th. Love that song. Love Queen. I was first introduced to Queen in, I wish I would like to say I listened to Queen as a kid. First time I ever heard Queen was in Wayne's World. Very first time I ever heard that song. I couldn't believe it was a real song.

I couldn't get enough of it. And then the more I heard about Queen, the more I loved Queen. And now I want it all. That is the unofficial theme song, I think for Major League Baseball during these playoffs. but specifically the Js. We want it all. We want the whole thing. We're coming for it.

We're playing well with a few good bounces and a few less crappy calls by the umps. We might be at three and one right now in this series, but that is neither here nor there. The one thing that is still sticking in my craw was the Canadian National Anthem sung at the first game played at Dodgers Stadium by a singer. A lot of people don't know.

and a lot of people wish they didn't know today, J.P. Sachs, who decided to take some liberties with the lyrics of O Canada. Oh, Canada, our home on native land. That's all we need to hear. That told you everything you need to hear.

Guy needed auto tune, and he needed a spell check. But we're living in a time where it's okay to take liberties with those words because people feel emboldened. We have prepared the ground for years by telling people, by doing it ourselves, by getting up at public gatherings, telling people that this land is not ours.

And we took it and it was taken or it was seated or it's a treaty land, whatever it is. There are land acknowledgments that have created a paradigm in people's minds that people who look like me don't belong here. and so this guy in an effort to, I don't know, show people how, I don't know what the whole point is when they do this, but they do it, I don't know, to show how enlightened they are. And I'm going to do so much, I'm going to change the national anthem.

But we want to play that for you because that's where we are today. And this is in, that's the backdrop for the story of the BC Supreme Court ruling that Cowich and Tribes hold Aboriginal title to about 750 acres of land along the Fraser River in Richmond. And the Crown, the court found that the Crown and the city titles are defective and invalid. And the government's granting of private titles infringed on Cowichin rights. And of course, Richmond, British Columbia, and Canada are doing the only things that a responsible government can do. They are appealing this decision.

Now, here's where things get, that's, we all know that. Here's where things start getting interesting. There's a public meeting last night. hundreds of property owners angry that they were not informed earlier about this case or potential impacts on their land showed up demanding answers

because we found out that this court case began God, it began pre-justin Trudeau 2014. This is pre-justin Trudeau. This is when the crazy train left the station. Let's listen to the mayor, Malcolm Brody, explaining why I didn't tell everybody in 2014.

We've been working very hard on this case. We have gone through over 500 days of court hearings. We waited for the decision for two years before that. Application was made to have the plaintiffs give notice to the landowners. The court said it wasn't necessary. And so here we are. But the city of Richmond didn't feel it necessary to tell them in 2014? I think we've been through that.

We went through that in the meeting. Next question. No, we didn't really go through that. Why did you choose not to go on your own as the city of Richmond talked to the resident before the court decision? We didn't make that decision. Do you think residents have a right to be angry about that, though? Listen, they're entitled to feel the way they feel.

I'd be very angry if I was one of those landowners and found that I woke up one morning. and found that there was this Aboriginal title which affected my property, sure. I didn't really answer the question. I mean, he said, but why didn't you tell them? We made the decision not to tell them. No, we didn't do that.

We didn't do that. Okay, but the why of it all, I don't know if we'll know. Maybe there's some minutes from some meetings that may explain it at some point. But again, like the opacity of government decisions is really frustrating to a lot of people. So here's some of the questions that were asked yesterday by these property owners at the public meeting.

And I think this is a fair question. Why should they pay property tax if their ownership is uncertain? If I don't know that I own this property, why should I pay you taxes that only the owner the property should pay? Excellent question. They don't know whether they'll receive compensation or face reduced property values.

Some of them do know that they have reduced property values. We've heard from property owners themselves. And you got financing and insurance issues. as lenders are questioning the title of security. Here's one landowner specifically. He's had his property in the Richmond area since 1975. And he has, this is him trying to renegotiate his mortgage. I've owned my land more than enough years to know it's money.

I'm not giving it up without a hike. Do you have a mortgage on your property here in Richmond? I do. Have you spoken to your lender? I have. And what have they told you? They are not renewing it. Wow.

What the heck is this guy supposed? to do? What's he supposed to do? If he doesn't have his mortgage, you can't pay for it. And then what happens? Who takes over the, let's assume the worst case scenario happens. He defaults on his mortgage and he's kicked out. Okay, so he's kicked out. Who gets to take the place? Does the bank or does the tribe?

If they don't renew it and he can't sell it, yeah. What are you supposed to do? Does he have to now launch a lawsuit? Does he have to get a lawyer? Yeah. I mean, he probably has to get a lawyer. and hopefully the city is dealing with that. But again, this is an unbelievable mess. And we've spoken to people.

We spoke to a lawyer last week from Alberta who says, you better pay attention to this across the country, although it's not as serious in other provinces. And look, I just saw a tweet by the editor of the New Westminster Times who said, this is, we're not living in an air of reconciliation. Reconciliation is out the window, especially in British Columbia, because we're not living in an era where that is the goal. We're living in an era of decolonization. And we hear that word thrown about all the time.

We're living in a world where we're trying to peel back all the ills of decolonization. And my estimation is, in the eyes of the activists pushing this, every aspect of colonization is an ill. By its very definition, it is a cancer that is metastasized, and we need to cut it out. That is how it is being portrayed. And so, therefore, in an era of decolonization, you can't have true reconciliation. I would also humbly submit that the BC Supreme Court feels exactly that way, that it is their job to decolonize the law. And they have now put reconciliation in their crosshairs. You cannot have reconciliation when you pit First Nations against property owners and government.

Because of course, now you've got the leaders of the Cowitz and Tribe saying, listen, this is no big deal. We just want you to negotiate with us. Well, of course you'd say that with all humble respect. Of course you'd say that today because you now have all the ammo you need to get more than what you're entitled to at the negotiation title. You're not going to be negotiating with equals. The government has one arm tied behind their back because they've literally been told there's a judgment against you

you don't own that property anymore. Good luck to you. And so it's... But the Cowish Nation says, though, they are saying, no, this does not invalidate or raise private property titles. Actually, the court's saying pretty much that. And listen, I mean no disrespect.

But of course you would say that right now. Of course you try to minimize it. Because ultimately, this thing's going to be If they don't negotiate with you, which the court said, you have a year or something like that until negotiate and then if not, then we'll apply this judgment. But to me, and it's a conversation that's happening all over the country for other reasons, it's ridiculous judgments like this is why we need the notwithstanding clause in the charter. when the unelected courts overstep and don't stay in their lane, that's when the supremacy of the legislature needs to be activated by way of the notwithstanding clause. And if ever there was a reason for why, now I'm not saying it applies here,

it could be applied in any way, but that's why we have it. Because our elected officials carry more weight and should be more important than our judges all the time. Up next, the truth behind the green party. A new book is out now. You're not going to want to miss it. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney show. And I just want to thank you because I haven't done so at all today for really helping us grow our show on all the channels where we have decided to sort of stake a claim. Obviously, we're on radio.

That was where the show started. And then we built up on all the podcast platforms out there. so think Apple Music and Amazon and Spotify and then we moved on to social media and now we're on YouTube. We're also on streaming apps and you know, you find us wherever you want to find us and we're glad to be there for you

and we're glad that you show up each and every day to help grow this show and it's not lost on us. Something that is lost on me is the appeal of the green party and for years now it's almost like when Gretchen tried to make fetch a thing. Stop trying to make fetch a thing. Stop trying to make the Greens a thing. For years we were told this was

the party of a responsible environmental stewardship married with sober-minded economics. And this wave of green politics had really found purchase in Europe and it was eventually

going to stake its claim in Canada. And Elizabeth May, who I have a lot of time for on certain files, was the the face that was going to, and the voice that was going to usher in a sort of a larger cohort of green voices in the House of Commons federally. That has not materialized. And we've seen some really odd things coming out of that party for years.

I think about their leadership race a few years ago, followed by the quick beheading of that leader figuratively. And so that's what it looks like on the outside. So what's the explanation for it from inside the green tent? Well, we're joined by Mark Liren Young. He worked with the Greens for six months, quit early on. He was teed up to run as a green BC candidate. And he's written a book called Greener Than Thou,

surviving the toxic sludge of Canadian eco-politics. And he joins us now. Mark, welcome to the show. Thank you, probably. Good morning. So what drew you to the Greens in the first? place? Really, I saw a phenomenal window there for kind of everything's changing Canadian politics when Judgment Singh took over as leader of the NDP. I felt he created a vacuum and a window for the greens.

Where did he, where, where, what did he leave? What lanes did he leave empty that you felt the greens could slide into? I felt he left basically the. entire left of liberals open and empty, but also, I felt like there was a moment there where climate and eco-policy was very much top of mind for Canadian voters. Yeah. Like, it actually was a voting issue. Yeah, and you're right.

There was a moment where, I mean, do you remember the green shift under Dion in the liberals? It showed at the time that the environment was always a nice to have, but it was never going to be a must-have. and then all of a sudden it became a must-have. Oh, man. Seriously, if all of the people who had marked, if all the people in Quebec who marched with Greta Twembourg had voted for Elizabeth May,

had voted green, you would have had a phenomenal shift. Yeah. It didn't happen. I don't even think the people who took selfies with Elizabeth voted for Elizabeth. So you come in, so you come into the tent and you're brimming with optimism, and you feel there's wind in your sales, what took you from that point

to writing a book referencing the toxic sludge of Canadian eco-politics? What happened? Oh, man. Basically, the sense that there was no there-there, there really was no plan beyond elect Elizabeth. But if you look at how most dreams get elected, it's kind of accidental, right?

Like, Genick out when getting elected out east was split. Yeah. And watching, basically watching this, what looked to me like a once-in-a-generation opportunity for a shift, just damage. Yeah. It was seriously heartbreaking. You know, and somebody actually cares about environmental issues. Sure. it was kind of a heartbraining moment to be a part of

and to witness well and a lot of us felt that Elizabeth May and her advocacy in what she stands for on environmental issues so essential for her to be part of the party in the early days but if the party couldn't grow beyond the cult of this one person and I say cult in a cavalier way but if it couldn't get beyond the growing an identity beyond its leader at the time, then it didn't really have, the hopes for its long-term viability were small. And so the party in 2019, after Elizabeth May resigned, they had a leadership

race, an enemy paw won, and she had a lot to like about her. She was first black Jewish lawyer, black Jewish woman to lead a party in Canada. She looked apart. She sounded great. I believe She was bilingual. And I don't know what happened within the party that forced this high-stakes leadership revolt in a party of like six people. I don't I don't get it. Oh, before we go there, may I just go back to something that you said right off the top of what you were saying of your question? Wow, did the word cult come up over and over and over. again when I was, you know, fact-checking this. Because after I wrote this, I thought,

wow, if I didn't chew hard on, you know, on the greens, like, am I missing something? Yeah. And when I started to dive in and interview people, the word cult came up over and over and over. And I feel like the NDP is a religion and the greens are a cult. I love that. The NDP is a religion and the greens are a cult. Wow. Okay. So it's a The NDP is the only party you can get excommunicated from for not being quite NDP. Right. Oh. Okay.

So now we're trying to, now we're trying to grow beyond the leader. We're trying to grow the party beyond Elizabeth May for whom there's a lot to be thankful for if you're a green. And it did not go according to plan. Oh, it does not go according to plan. I sort of feel like Trudeau laid the perfect trap. for Paul, which is, and for the Greens. Because they're in the middle of a leadership race. He called the by-election, you know, riding that Paul had run in before and not successfully.

So the by-election happens. Paul comes in with, you know, numbers that look vaguely respectable by green standards, but they're not inspiring. Right. Right? So if not for that by-election, he could have spent several years like, yes, I'm going to grow the party in Ontario. Yes, I'm going to be the green voice. All of those, you know, hope, optimism, all of the things you want from a green leader, from a leader of a smaller party.

And instead, she's barely, you know, she's barely found the leader's room and she's in a by-election and is wiped out by the liberals. So where's the hope then? There, where's the, I'm going to change the party, I'm going to save the party. So it was a devastating start. Yeah. And, you know, she barely won that leadership race, right? Yeah. It's like, you know, when you go to eight ballots, you're not even rated party.

Right. Yeah, and yeah, and it just went downhill from there. And ever since then, it just doesn't feel to me like when I hear the part of the, that, that the environment is front and center. I've heard a lot of talk about the Middle East. I've heard a lot of issues. And it just, like, you know, you got to know what your strengths are. You got to know how the world sees you. And so where do they go from here?

We only have about a minute left. I'd love to know where do you think they go from here? I felt like in the last election, the only green it was going to be standing was Elizabeth. I feel like just as she was the first green to get elected, she's likely to be the last green to get elected. Oh, wow. So, you know, I feel like, they go from here is Elizabeth holding on to, you know, Sandysk Gulf Islands for as long as she wants the gig. But I don't see where they're getting their second impeachment. Well, Mark

Ler & Young, the author of Greener Than Thou, surviving the toxic sludge of Canadian eco-politics. I believe that you told my producer you're torn whether it is the funniest thing you've ever written or the most depressing or both. That is a hell of a hook for a book, my friend. Hey, thank you very much for being here. This fall on Flavor Network. I'm actually on Top Chef Canada. It's super surreal being here. The search for Canada's top chef starts now.

Let's go! Ten chefs are on a culinary quest. It tastes like fear, anxiety, all at the same time, but delicious. Only one will be crowned. It's tough. One of the hardest things. I have every time. Two minutes shot!

Top Chef Canada, all new Tuesdays. On Flavor Network, stream on Stack TV.