The Ben Mulroney Show - The anniversary of the most shocking unsolved murder in Toronto

Episode Date: December 16, 2025

GUEST :  Joe Warmingon / Toronto Sun Columnist GUEST:  DR. Oren Amitay / registered clinical psychologist /  New book coming out soon “I f’d up, I’m sorry”,  podcast “awake at the wheel” If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://link.chtbl.com/bms⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Also, on youtube -- ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@BenMulroneyShow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Insta: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ Twitter: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ TikTok: ⁠⁠⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠⁠⁠ Executive Producer:  Mike Drolet Reach out to Mike with story ideas or tips at [e-mail] Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Get better answers to tough questions. BlueJ. AI for tax experts. Welcome to the Ben Mulruney's show. It is Tuesday, the 16th of December 2025. Thank you so much for joining us on the second day of the week. Yesterday was a heavy one. Today is going to be a follow-up to that.

But before we do, I want to back into the day. By the way, it's very hot in this room. Turn it down the heat. It's very hot. I know I'm wearing my puffer and I could take that off, but it's very hot in here. The morning guys put the temp up way up. I don't get it. I don't get it.

They run real hot. Yeah. I've tried everything. I put duct tape on the temperature, on the thermostat. I've tried everything. Intrepid producer, Mike Jolay, how are you today? Well, I'm also very warm. Yes, yes.

But apart from that, fine. Joy, how are you today? I am good. Yeah, we got Joy on the boards today. Dave Spargal is off until the new year. And so we got Joy joining us. Joy, welcome. Thank you so much.

Last night, you know what? It was a long day. It was a really long day. It was a heavy day. Yeah. And so I ended the day doing something I've been meaning to do. It's really hard these days to find the time to sit and enjoy a movie. But I watched the new Knives Out on Netflix.

It's the third installment of this Ryan Johnson murder mystery whodunit series starring. Who's a star? Daniel Craig, right, as Benoit Blanc, this southern detective, very Sherlock Holmesie. And the first one was great. The second one was pretty. and this third one is like you don't see it coming you don't and and the structure of the film is um unpredictable as well it's yeah joy go ahead even if you see it coming i mean i was halfway through it and i understood that who might have done it yeah but i just couldn't prove it i mean there's

no way of proving the fact that the person that you're thinking has done it has done it it it was a it's a tremendous it's long it's a very long movie i mean at one point How long is it? It's at least two and a half hours, more than two and a half hours. All right. But at one point, about an hour and a half in, right? So less than an hour and a half in, Benoit Blanc essentially says something to one of the characters saying,

why'd you do it? And then that person sort of concedes that they, quote, unquote, did it. And my son and I are looking at each other like, what the hell is he going to do for the next hour and a half of the movie? The guy just admitted to the murder. Anyway, it's a little more complicated than that But it's very well done We had a great time watching it

It was a nice way to sort of slough off the day Of really, really hard stuff But here's something I want to say I cannot tell you how many times People reach out to me Either friends of mine, family of mine Or people who would just watch and listen to the show And they say, why don't you have

Members of the Carney government on your show? You should have them on to explain X, Y or Z Or to have a conversation about this program or that or this initiative or this decision to which I always say we always reach out since the beginning of this show over a year ago we have been reaching out to members of the government predating Mark Carney's time in office I have heard from staffers I've heard from organized I've heard from chiefs of staff I've heard from campaign managers no problem Ben we're going to get them on I have spoken directly to members of the government yes no problem I'm going to come on your show no problem

and then silence. Now, I'll leave it to you to decide why I have not had a single member of the liberal government on my show ever. I'll let you decide and speculate. I will not do that. However, what I promise you, every single day,

Mike Droulet is going to reach out to at least one member of the government, at least one. And we are going to give you a running count at the beginning of every show. We're going to do it at nine and either at 10 or 11, right? So maybe we'll do,

we'll tabulate who we've reached out to and how many times we've reached out to them. Yeah, but every day we're going to let you know that another day has gone by that we've reached out

to a member of the government and another day has gone by that we have not had them on this show and maybe some pressure will build and one of them will come on this show for what I want to have a respectful conversation

where we can just move the ball down the field. There are a lot of people who listen to this show who either are reticent or don't want to or don't they don't link up with the liberal frame of mind.

And so having a liberal on the show, I think it does a great thing for dialogue and communication. I think the government should want to talk to the audience of the Ben Mulroney show. And they should also be, I mean, they work in politics. They should be open to criticism. Yeah.

If you're not, then you're in the wrong line of work. Yeah, but I'm also, look, come on. You don't invite someone into your house for a meal and when they walk in the door, punch them in the face. Like, that's not the kind of host I am. I'm actually quite a nice host. If I invite you into my house,

I promise you, you'll be treated respectfully. And I've been, but I've... I've walked into houses like that. It's not great. It's not great when you're punched in the face as soon as you walk in someone's house. I would never do that.

I don't know anybody who would do that. But anyway, today's day one. All right? And we're going to keep this count going every single day. Also, please text us who you want to us to reach out to first. A couple of names. That's all we need.

I mean, we have names ourselves. We've reached out to them time and again. But let us know who you would like to hear from. Hey, do you remember last, like last summer when there were some children missing in Nova Scotia? And the RCMP were giving an update to the press. And with missing kids, every second counts. And the member of the RCMP got up and before giving an announcement as to what, what, new information they had that the viewers needed in order to find these kids, they did a land

acknowledgement for a couple of minutes, which defied logic. It just defied logic. Well, I think we have a new fresh take on that from Senator Chuck Schumer, who wanted to give his take on the Bondi Beach massacre. Let's listen. And of course, I'm going to say a few words about the terrible shooting in Sydney, Australia. Okay? So, and first, of course, as I always say, no matter what, go Bill's, they beat the Patriots today, it's a big deal.

You know, Bill's. Look, one can find the humor in that. I don't. I do, because I'm a Bill's fan. Yeah. Bill's Mafia, baby. That's what they call it. No, I get it. Yeah. I get it.

I'm not, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, to see I'm sorry sorry Chuck man you lost the plot there man like that's really gross but you also have to understand the bills were down 21 nothing in that game they came back to win yeah great don't care don't care I don't care in that moment I don't care I think that was gross I think it was really gross and I don't know what reaction he got from it maybe maybe nothing maybe people don't look to Chuck Schumer for that sort of thing in western New York he's probably hailed as a hero yeah and listen good good for the bills I knew I don't need Chuck Schumer

to give me that information. Chuck Schumer is a legislator who's got power to do X, Y, or Z on that fight. He's got no power on the NFL. He should leave the comedy to his niece. Yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah, it's his niece, I think. Yeah, that was his niece. That was a fumble.

That was a fumble, Chuck, to use the parlance of the bills. That was a fumble. But in Western New York, he would have recovered the ball. Yeah. Okay, still not funny. Still not fun. I know you're trying to thread the needle. it's a no bueno no buono now yesterday uh in toronto at mel lastman square was day day two of um of honica

night two of honica and uh politicians of all stripes showed up for the lighting of the of the menorah as well as a memorial for the victims of the bondi beach uh massacre and uh well there there was a there's an independent journalist uh dania boardman who was uh who was there and he gave the lay of the land as he saw it. Now, there are many people here, people of all different parties in all different forms of government, but the most impressive politician

performance site was Olivia Chow. She came up, snuck in unannounced, so no one could boo her, jumped on the stage, got her staff to take a quick selfie, and then, like, ran out before anyone can notice her. So that's high-level merit. But if you know you're a coward, at least live within

your means, and that's what the lesson is, kids. A conservative MP, a Roman Babber, I think rightly called out the mayor on stage without saying her name, saying, you know, you can come here and you can say that anti-Semitism has no place. But if you've been one of the people who's been unfairly tainting the Jewish people and Israel with the blood liable that they perpetrated a genocide, then you're helping make this place, a place where anti-Semitism festers. And I said almost as much yesterday on this very show. You don't get to say something like that and then turn around and want to hug the Jewish people. You don't get to do it. That's not how it works.

You don't throw a caracine on the fire and then get credit for calling the fire department. That's, you're the arsonist. And that's how this one person sees it. Anyway, we got lots to get to on the show today. But up next, the eighth anniversary. of the murder that continues to confound police. Don't go anywhere. The Ben Mulrudey show continues.

Welcome back to the Ben Mulrudy's show. It was on this date in 2017, December 15th, 2017, the billionaire philanthropist, Honey and Barry Shurie. German were found dead in their Toronto mansion hanging by belts near their indoor pool. It was a gruesome sight for those who uncovered these two people hanging after finding these two dead people. And the deaths were initially described by police as suspicious. There's a there's been a massive investigation. Eight years later, no suspects, no motive, $35 million reward, hundreds of interviews, ongoing public speculation, and no answers.

So here to discuss this and sort of remind the people of Toronto about how confusing this entire situation has been. We're joined by Joe Warmington from the Toronto Sun. Joe, welcome to the show. Yeah, it's good to be with you, Ben. It's interesting how fast that eight years went by. Yeah, yeah. I remember back in the day when I was doing a morning television show,

this was all we could talk about. It was probably the most high-profile crime that we'd seen in this city and indeed probably around the country and at this point it probably ranks as one of the biggest unsolved mysteries ever in the entire country. And it's

you know interest for this case is all around the world as well. I went out there that day when I heard about it was Barry Sherman and you know there was a couple found or something but then when word got back to me by the time I got there was snowing

it was evening now maybe 5.30 was getting dark, and it was, you know, really jammed with people all around there. But the word from the Toronto police was that they're not looking for any suspects, which, you know, as you know, as a reporter, and certainly Mike Drolay knows that, you know, covering all these different things we've done over the years, that that means that this is an in-house thing, a domestic of some kind, whatever. And that was the narrative. But we have a lot of sources, as you well know, after all the years we've been doing this. And the people that were inside there were saying, no, this is a homicide.

So there's a real contrast to it. We were ready to go with that at the Toronto Sun. Front page, you know, they were executed or something along those lines. But we checked with the police and all our sources, and they came back and said, no, that this was a murder of suicide. And it stayed like that for 42 days. That first night after I wrote that column, I didn't sleep the whole night because I didn't really know. I didn't seem right to me. I don't know Barry and Honey, but I covered, because I was Night Scrawler, I was out at things that they were at and, you know, they were well known and the different things that they do in the community.

So I kind of knew who they were. Yeah. But I didn't, you know, having seen them in person, I just didn't see any of this kind of thing as possible. You know, that's what I thought. That was my gut. And then, of course, 42 days later, detect a sergeant Sue Gomes, who was the head of the, or was the running that investigation, said that they thought there was a target. and homicide. Well, that was a hell of a head start for whoever did this. That's six weeks. So that's where we're at. To what do you attribute that about face? I mean, you've got these two

exceptionally wealthy people. I mean, their wealth was estimated just under $5 billion hanging from belts in the pool area of their home. You know, they were, by all accounts, they were just you know, an elderly couple, very, very wealthy, philanthropic and well-connected around the city. To see this, and to assume murder suicide, I think is a big

assumption. And you're right to have gone down that rabbit hole for about six weeks and then to turn around and say, oh, no, we've changed our mind. Unless I'm mischaracterizing this, please tell me. But then to turn around and change our mind, you're right, It's such a head start. If anybody did, if this was foul play,

six weeks is a lot of time for any leads to run cold. The first 48 hours are very important. They certainly didn't take the approach that they were looking for anybody or anybody was in danger. But to answer your question, I think the, you know, I mean, there must have been something that they saw that indicated that. And, you know, they have never revealed what that is. And certainly my, you know, the great Kevin,

Donovan over the Toronto Star, who has done the most work on all this, written books and done documentaries and all that stuff. He, you know, he's of the view that the thing was botched. Yeah. And, you know, that's kind of what we did. I don't know if that's true or not, because, you know, things can look a particular way. And, you know, they never did it. I was reviewing my notes while I was writing these three columns that are all on Toronto Sun.com for the anniversary. And, you know, again, looking at everything that I had, my tapes, my notes, they did indicate that they were going to do all this for the police that's this. They indicated they were going to do all the forensics and do all that stuff, but it looked to them at this point

like a murder or suicide. So I don't want to kick them too much because, you know, it does look like a particular way, but they did their due diligence and then they changed their mind. But it just, that's the key to why we're talking about it now is because whoever did this. Yeah. really had a jump on on law enforcement. Now, explain to me. One thing that I have not been following is this $35 million reward. Who's responsible for that? And what does one get?

Like, what do you need to provide in order for to be eligible for a $35 million reward? Well, you have to have the key to a conviction of whoever did this. And it's a very big reward. It started at $10 million and the four children all put. that up. And of course, they fought back at the narrative right away. Yeah. I mean, that very first night, Paul Godfrey, my boss, he knew them, and he was having lunch with them the next week in Florida. Wow. They live in the same complex. And he told me, this is nonsense. He didn't kill anybody. They didn't, you know, like he just said, it's crazy. I mean, that was his first

reaction. And he actually was pretty angry. I mean, I hated to write it because, you know, but nonetheless, everybody else said the same thing. But the kids, you know, particularly Jonathan Sherman at the funeral, he said, look, our parents didn't, you know, they never left anybody behind, they, you know, and told the police that they were taken from us. So they put up to 10 million and then a few years later, Jonathan Sherman added the 25 million. In these stories that I wrote, you know, talked about the new arena that was built up north a bit there on the campus. Yeah. And so that's a really great arena. And, you know, the dog daughter, that's the son that did that, and Alex, one of the daughters, she's put forward

10 million towards the Humber River Hospital. The legacy of the Sherman's been is just enormous and it's still happening. Yeah. Thanks to the kids. So, you know, in, in death, they're just like they were in life. The money that they earned through Apotex is being spread in a good way across, you know, GTA. Now, is there, when the police aren't able to close a case and it becomes a cold case, are. Are there any lessons learned from a case like this and the procedures that the police used that possibly led to it not being closed? That, I mean, are there any changes to procedure because of this case? Do the police do things differently today because they weren't, they were unable to close this case?

Well, that's a really good question. I mean, that might be better for Hank, you know, anything got to talk about because I really don't know. But I can talk about the communications part of it. And I do think that it is better now. I think that you need to have one, at a big murder case or a very big case, you need a deputy chief or a superintendent at the, you know, somebody like that to address the media or a homicide detective, somebody that, not just the media, this is not to knock the media

spokespeople because they're very good and they are good. And I work with them every day, as do you. But you need to have somebody senior so that, And one person doing the talking, wherever that is, all the way through. Well, you know, obviously with rare exceptions of someone's off or whatever, but you know what I'm saying. Yeah. Have a consistency. So, and I sense that from that, then Hank would know best, but I think that they do that now.

Well, listen, Joe. You know, if I need to get a hold of the chief or the deputy chief or whatever, I can do it, where before it was a lot harder to do that. Yeah. So I think they've improved that for sure. And Joe, I just want to say, thank you for your coverage of this. but my heart still goes out to the Sherman family to not be able to know what happened to their parents who died in such a gruesome fashion.

I'm going to say something that no one's talked about, but I don't rule out anti-Semitism in this either. And, you know, in light of what happened, and, you know, many other places, obviously the Bondi is really affecting all of us and we're all devastated by that. And it's sort of the horrible approach that, you know, when people are going in and stealing the mazuzas and all the different

things we've seen. And since there's no other answer, you know, I'd like to see that pursuit a little bit as well. All right. Joey, we got to leave it there. But thank you very much for joining us. Thank you for reminding us about this gruesome crime and how it has not yet been solved. Thank you so much.

All the best. Merry Christmas. Merry Christmas. Happy Hanukkah and all that. Thank you very much. All right. Up next was the shadow of living in the shadow of a legendary Hollywood father and grandfather, too much to bear.

We're going to talk about the Rob Reiner murder next. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney show. We wanted to talk about the murder of Rob, of Rob Reiner and his wife allegedly at the hands of his son. Was it Nick? Nick. And the

possible role that the pressure of being the son of a very famous Hollywood luminary and as well, the grandson of one of the people who probably you could argue was

was one of the the forefathers of of Hollywood itself, Carl Reiner. That's a double whammy for anybody. And so we want to talk, listen, there's no other, the expression today is nepo baby. So we're going to use that.

We're not trying to use it disparagingly. It's just the word that everybody knows these days. So to discuss this, we're joined by Dr. Orne Amateh, registered clinical psychologist. He's got a new book coming out called I-Fed-Up. I'm sorry. And his podcast is Awake at the Wheel.

Doctor, welcome to the show. thank you ben yeah so this is a double whammy for anybody who wants to get into the family business isn't it you've got a father who's known for academy award winning films uh and these these cultural touchstones your grandfather arguably helped build hollywood uh and and and you've got a lot of pressure on you well you've got a lot of um assumptions about uh who you are and where you know where you got to and how you got there yep and that's the biggest problem well and that that's it listen I'm not making this about me. I am not a nepo baby.

I mean, I didn't go to politics. I'm not a nepo baby. And those who suggest I am are trying to use a shortcut to de-legitimize me, which is fine. I can take it. I did get one thing from my dad, which is a really tough outward hide and a good head of hair, apparently. But anyway, but this is somebody who was trying to swim in the same pool that his father and grandfather swam in. And that can be harder.

Outwardly, it presents as, oh, you're on the fast track to success. Your dad can open every door to you. And that's not necessarily how any business works. No, I mean, it does often happen. And we know that in many businesses, when the children or grandchildren take over, it only takes a couple of generations before they lose everything that their predecessors had built. I mean, that's a common trajectory. it's extremely difficult.

It's not like you're handed, you know, a golden ticket. You may have a silver spoon in your mouth, but it's not a golden ticket. And one of the really important things is whether it's said explicitly or whether the child internalizes it, but it's the sense that, you know, like it's not measuring up. It's almost like being an imposter because, again, whether it's said explicitly or you just feel this way that, you know, I'm only here because of, not because of anything I have done. And, you know, even if you've achieved something on your own, still, A lot of people feel that, you know, people are still looking at me, and they still think, yeah, but, I mean, you only got there because, you know, of who your parents or grandparents are.

Is that level of judgment? Is that, is that specific to the era that we're living in now? Because what I mean by that is Rob Reiner was technically a nepo baby. And it doesn't seem like that same pressure was brought to bear on him that his son Nick had to deal with. Well, I'm not quite sure because I don't, you know, I've followed Rob Reiner for many, many years. So, I mean, I don't know what was going on behind the scenes. I don't know if that pressure was there and he was just so resilient that he was able to say, you know what, I'm just speaking out on my own no matter what people say. I'm really not quite sure. But, I mean, it's certainly these days, it's clear that, again, I can't talk about the past as much. But these days, people do want to tear others down instead of gaining their own success.

It's like the crabs in the bucket. People are trying to climb out of the bucket, and people just want to pull them back in because it shines a light on their own insecurities and inadequacies. Dr. Why do success, fame, and private crisis so often coexist? Well, because, I mean, many people can't handle what success brings. Success brings expectations. It's always what's next, what's next. And so, you know, unless you have a really strong,

support network. And it starts with a family, unless they can ground you, unless they're telling you, look, either we achieve the success or you did, whoever's, you know, the source of the success, unless somebody really has strong people helping to, like I said, to ground them and to keep everything in perspective, it's almost impossible to lose perspective. Sorry, it's almost impossible to maintain perspective because it's, it's such an unreal world. I mean, unless you've been there, it's hard, you know, it's hard to put yourself into someone's shoes and say, well, I would do this or I wouldn't act that way. You don't know until you're there. And I have to say one thing, the biggest thing about all of this, the thing that cuts through all of this is even if you have

a thousand people around you, even if you have hundreds of sycophants, even if everyone's telling you, you're great, if you don't feel connected to something, whether it's yourself, you're a family, something greater than you. If you don't have that connection, no matter how many people around you, you still feel isolated. And that sense of isolation is what cuts through so many of these terrible stories. Yeah. And look, one of the stories about sort of a nepo baby who did have to deal with

a lot of that pressure was Charlie Sheen, and we all watched that Netflix special that was quite raw and quite honest, where you know, this was a guy who was handed so much and he did succeed quite significantly.

He were rising to the, you know, the top of his field as a television actor. He was in some of the biggest movies of the 80s and early 90s, and yet those demons, that pressure, that pressure to succeed, that pressure of expectation that was foisted on him by the she name, was significant. And we saw, we saw the repercussions of that. Well, yes. And when I talked about this, this isolation, the other thing that is associated with it, and, you know, I'm not going to read anyone's minds, but this is with all my patients, okay? Whatever they're dealing with, when you have this

internalized sense of shame, okay? That's the, you know, shame underlies so many addictions. It underlies so many people's inability to succeed in the world because no matter what you do, no matter how well you present to the outside world, if inside you feel that I'm nothing but a piece of crap, I'm a fraud, I'm empty. I just, you know, like that shame, it's so hard to overcome it. Well, and that's why I'm sort of trying to ascribe a little bit of responsibility to the era we're living in because social media allows those worst accusations to enter your

your personal space so freely back in the day that there was no there was no way for those worst that you know those those people who believe the worst about you to get into your head today all you have to do is open Twitter or open Instagram open TikTok and somebody is going to tell that to you that you are you are a fraud that you are underperforming that you are a, you know, a cheap photocopy of your dad or your grandfather. And that didn't exist 20, 30 years ago. No, it didn't. It's ubiquitous now.

And even if, like, even if we talk about non-famous people, even if, you know, a child at school is being bullied, at least they had some respite. They got home and they were able to have a bit of freedom away from their tormentors. But now you turn on social media and it's 24-7. And the shame is not just people telling you you're terrible. Yeah. The shame is also self-generated, what we call the upward social comparison. Everybody's going on social media and saying supposedly that everybody else is doing so amazing.

They're going on these vacations, living on true lifestyle. And I am not as good as them. And that also generates a sense of shame. Yeah. And look, there are people are going to be listening to this and say, oh, here's Mulroney trying to get sympathy for, for NEPO babies. Oh, woe is me. I had every advantage in life and I screwed it up. and to suggest that anything is that simple

and anybody's life is that simple is I think is disrespectful and it's disingenuous but I wish we could talk more about this instead of what I'll say is I wish you the happiest of holidays doctor and I look forward to talking to you about your new book coming out I effed up I'm sorry Thanks Ben and happy happy holidays

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year Thank you so much all right we want to hear from you How difficult is it to live up to expectations Has it been hard on you? Do you worry about your Kids, let's talk about pressure next, right here on the Ben Mulroney show. We want to talk about the pressure that kids feel to live up to the expectations, fair or unfair, that are set according to the success of their parents. I'm not going to say set by their parents, set according to the success of their parents and possibly even their grandparents.

This is all in light of the murder of Rob Reiner and his wife at the hands, allegedly of their son, Nick, who a lot of people suspect was fighting against the pressure to succeed at the level of the other Reiner's. and obviously Rob Reiner being one of the most prolific and successful movie directors of all time that on the heels of being one of the biggest on one of the biggest TV shows in history, all in the family. And a few years ago, Rob Reiner and his son Nick

were actually on a podcast and they talked about the pressure of being famous. It's not hard to reveal that stuff. It's only hard to reveal that stuff to then get told, you're a spoiled, white, rich get in it. It's like, okay, maybe all these things. Well, who would say that to you, not your dad?

No, no, but the world, you know. Listen, I had to talk to him about this. Listen, I know what it's like to be the son of. Yeah. And to have people assume certain things about you, and it's very, very difficult. Well, how did you handle that? Well, I mean... I mean, obviously you didn't go to drugs, but you must have had those issues.

Your father's an icon. In the 60s, there was plenty of drugs around. Yeah. But you just have to know what you do. You have to block out all that extraneous noise. And it's hard for him because this is the first time. He's, you know, all of a sudden, there's a lot of attention. People are talking.

And, you know, he has the double whammy. He's got me and he got his grandfather, and they're going to say whatever the heck they want. But they don't know. They don't know what he's experienced. They don't know what he's gone through. They don't know why he's done what he does. And, you know, and it's pretty dumb, pretty ignorant of people to say, just because you're, you know, you're born and you have money.

That doesn't mean anything. Yeah, no, listen, we live in a world where everyone's, we're supposed to respect everyone's journey and everyone's truth. But when it comes to people of the kids of people who have been successful, those are the people that we get to paint with a very broad brush. If you were to do that with any other socioeconomic group, you would be rightly condemned for committing generalizations and being unhelpful to any sort of conversation. and what was going on in the family of the Reiner family, what was going on in the mind of Nick Reiner, it was specific to them. We learned some new information late last night

that Nick Reiner went to the Conan O'Brien Christmas party with his parents and by all accounts was acting very strange. Strangely, everybody was in suits. He was wearing a hoodie, didn't speak with anyone. Apparently that's when he and his father got into a huge fight. And the night then went as, as we heard later on. Let's start this conversation with David.

David, welcome to the Ben Mulroney show. Thanks so much for calling in. First of all, I think you're a great host, number one. Well, thank you very much. Number two, I grew up with a relatively affidavit area where a lot of the wealth of the parents, you know, whether it's second or third generation, the kids had something called a trust account.

Yeah. Where I think they were sort of blindfolded to being successful in life. They were sort of sheltered from really living a life, you know, where their parents just bowled out money, traveled the world and went abroad, you know, and left them home with the name. Then again, I've got a lot of friends who play professional sports whose kids are now playing professional sports. Yeah. And I guess the best person asked the question is what about yourself? I mean, with your father being the Prime Minister of Canada. I mean, I think it's done a marvelous job.

Well, thank you. No, listen, my parents always told us to find something you love and do it as well as you possibly can. They did not tell us to go down one path or another. You know, and my brother, Mark, went into banking. My brother Nick is an entrepreneur. My sister, Caroline, has worn many hats. She was a stay-at-home mom. She was a lawyer.

She was an investment banker. Now she's a politician, and she was excellent at all of them. And I've had varying degrees of success in media. And in each case, I think we found something that we view as our strength, and we've tried to do them to the best of our ability. And that's it. The one thing that we all have in common, I said this in the previous segment, is I don't give two flying Fs what anybody thinks about me. I don't accept. The only people that matter to me are my friends, my family, and the people who cut my checks.

That's it. Just going back to Nick for a second. I think the bigger question to ask here is, was he sheltered? you know what he's sort of supposed to live up to his grandfather and father's expectations you know I don't think they probably ever gave much I mean the two of them did a movie together called Charlie yeah yeah and yeah and it was you know it was a it was an attempted a set it was semi autobiographical it was the you know a son who was in the throes of addiction uh in and out of rehab the father was famous and in that case he was a politician running for governor and and so it looks

I haven't seen it. The trailer looks good. I've looked online. It did not get the greatest reviews. But that's got to be difficult. You know, when you put your life out there and it is not well received. And who knows why it wasn't well received? Some people might not have received it well because it came from a famous kid. I don't know. I have no idea. But David, I want to thank you very much for your call. And look, I have friends who come from very, very, very successful stock. Their parents and grandparents are very, very successful. And they created a system where each kid had a baseline. They knew that they were going to, you know, in the future they would be well taken care of.

But if they wanted more of the family fortune, if you will, if they wanted more, if they wanted to be, if they want to participate more in growing that family fortune, then they had to, there's certain achievements they had to achieve. They had to get a master's degree and they had to play a role in the family business and so on and so on. All of them are high achievers. All of them are. All of them are exceptionally successful. And that may be a path worth pursuing

for some successful families. Felix, welcome to the show. Hey, Ben, how's it going? Pretty well, thank you. I just think that a lot of people only see what they see, but they don't know what's happening behind the scenes. I mean, having an icon as a grandfather and a father and trying to meet those expectations, those are huge shoes

to fill. Oh, yeah. You know, I think it's very easy. I think it makes people feel very good about their lives to find a way to minimize any challenges by somebody whose parents are successful. Well, it's just easier to deflect, right? Well, I mean, look at this guy. He has everything and everything is handed.

to him and blah, blah, blah, and man, if I had that, I wouldn't be complaining. Yeah, exactly. We don't know. We don't know what they go through. And that's why a lot of people go to drugs to cope and then at least to other things. Yeah. It's even sports athletes. Yeah.

They go through the same things. I mean, look at Ronaldo and then his son, is his son going to be as good as his father? We don't know. We hope so. Yeah. We'll give us the benefit of the doubt. Yeah, well, exactly. Hey, thank you so much for the call.

I really appreciate it. No, no problem. Thank you. Uh, who do we have? We got Frank. Frank. Welcome to the show. Hi, Ben.

Hi. I really think that the biggest problem or the main cause of what transpired, it focuses on, it should focus on the drug addiction issues. This time may have had a lifestyle associated with certain people. And we know that serious and severe addiction issues can change everything regarding the way you think, the way you think regarding you've been talked to, talked down to, and maybe in this case, his parents. So I really think the focus should be on the addiction issues because the addiction issues and this guy's lifestyle as it was. And maybe the criticism coming from his parents

cost this guy to pass the line and do what he did. You know, I heard, I listened to that, uh, that, that podcast with his son. And it definitely felt like his, his dad that Rob Reiner had a lot of understanding for the pressure that his son was under. And so it didn't feel like that pressure was necessary. coming from Rob Reiner. It felt like it was, to me, the pressure of today. We've got time for one more call. Thank you so much for the call. I appreciate it. Brad, if you can make your point in about 20 seconds. Okay. If money was in the bank, so you had enough, but you had to occupy yourself eight hours a day to access that money, what would you do? Whatever the answer

is, do something in that realm. Yeah. No, it could be as simple as that. It could be as simple as that. Hey, thank you so much for the call. Yeah, find something you love and do it as well as you can. That's what my dad used to say. There are streaming services, and then there's Stack TV. What you want, when you want it. Action, comedy, drama, reality, all when you want it. Dive into Rick and Morty's latest season.

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