The Ben Mulroney Show - The Liberals claim victory by eliminating a Carbon Tax that they installed

Episode Date: March 17, 2025

Guests and Topics: -The Liberals claim victory by eliminating a Carbon Tax that they installed Guest: Franco Terrazzano, Federal Director of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation Guest: Kris Sims, Alberta Director Of The Canadian Taxpayers Federation If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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talk business. Welcome to the Ben Mulroney show. Thank you so much for listening. You may be listening on the Chorus Radio Network. You may be listening as a podcast. You may be listening on a streaming app like the iHeartRadio app. Wherever you find us. Thank you so much and happy St. Patrick's Day. I hope everybody is enjoying the luck of the Irish on this Monday.

Someone who enjoyed quite a bit of luck is the Liberal Party, because all of a sudden they have reinvented themselves, and there are a whole bunch of people who seem to have forgotten that they are responsible for the past 10 years. It's ironic to me that the same people who say, we don't elect a Prime minister, Ben, we elect a government is now looking at Mark Carney and the cosmetic changes that he's made as an indication that everything is different now. Well, I thought you

elect a party. The party is still the same. The ministers are still the same. The staff is still the same. And seeing as how they haven't sat in the House of Commons, it's essentially, it is the exact same thing. But the Liberal Party twisted itself into a pretzel to pat itself on the back over the weekend. Because according to their tweet, we cancel the carbon tax. While Pierre Poliev offers empty slogans,

we're taking action to fight climate change, put more money in your pocket, and build a strong economy. No. Nope. I thought the carbon tax was taking action to fight climate change. So now no carbon tax, but you're taking action? I thought the climate, the carbon tax, put money, more money into the pockets of seven out of ten Canadians.

But now you've canceled it and you're putting more money into my pocket. No, sorry. That dog don't hunt. And also, let's not forget, you didn't cancel the carbon tax. And so if you go to their, you go to their Twitter feed, it's just the hubris involved is, it's just crazy. They say, they denigrate Pierre Poliev saying he's all about empty slogans. Well, what about change, focus, action? Canada's new government is ready to get to work. Word salad, meaningless slogans. What about the next one?

We're strongest when we're united. This party has been responsible for creating more divisions within this country over the past 10 years than I've ever seen in my 49 years on this planet. Oh, but they've got the hashtag Canada Strong. Okay, well that makes it better. What's the other one? This is action for Canadians reminding us that Prime Minister Mark Carney's decision Friday to eliminate the consumer carbon price, we'll see the price of gasoline

reduced by 17.6 cents on April 1. So what you're actually saying, Liberal Party of Canada, is I and every Canadian who fills their tank up with gas has been paying an additional 17.6 cents per leader every single time that we didn't have to be paying. Because according to you, eliminating this tax is climate change work in action and putting more, well yes in this way you're putting more money back in my pocket but what you're saying

is you've been taking it for years. We canceled the carbon tax. Mark Carney got it done, canceled the carbon tax except you didn't, you didn't. And look, I know that this party is hoping that we all develop amnesia over the past 10 years. But I don't have to take you back 10 years. I can take you back 11 months. When Mark Carney sat with CTV's Vashi Kapilos, here's what he had to say about the carbon tax. You're asking me a question in terms of positioning and the actual policy.

When you get the rebate, you and I both get the rebate, everyone watching gets the rebate, 70% or so of Canadians get more in their rebate than they pay in their tax in the price on carbon. It's hard to track the second aspect and with the first aspect, when you get the rebate, even when I first got the rebate, I looked at it I wonder if that's the carbon and it turns out it was but so look it's it's partly it's partly on positioning I don't think it's been as communicable I mean here's a real insight it has not been communicated as well as it should have been and fact is, let me flip it around, if we took away the price on pollution, you know, two thirds, more than two thirds of Canadians would be worse off.

They would receive less, and you know, they get the price off on the carbon, but they would receive less in terms of the transfer. And I think very few people understand that. My issue with Mark Carney and his rise to power is not that he rose to power without being elected. That happens in our system. My problem is that he is unaccountable because he said that 11 months ago and has yet to sit for a meaningful interview where one of Canada's great journalists could hold his feet to the fire and demand answers on behalf of Canadians whom he is currently in charge of governing. That is what I have a problem with. And someone will say well

he wasn't Prime Minister then. Okay well then let's listen to the guy who was Prime Minister for whom this was the defining policy. This was the thing that was going to save the planet. Here's what Justin Trudeau said not 11 months ago but in April of last year. Here's what he said about the value of these rebate checks. Now we see the federal conservatives in particular Pierre Poliev wanting to make pollution free again and on top of, wanting to take away the Canada carbon rebate checks that are delivering this year $1,200 to a family of four in Manitoba, which is more than the

vast majority of families in Manitoba pay in the extra price on pollution. That's done to both help with affordability while we fight climate change. I said on Twitter that had the name spelled out on that bogus Trump-like pageantry, had the name spelled out Pierre Poliev instead of Mark Carney. In other words, in an alternate universe, in a world where Pierre Poliev was responsible for canceling the consumer carbon tax, he would have been destroyed by the very people who are now celebrating it. The hypocrisy is through the roof, through the roof. Every now and then, every now and then, rarely, but every now and then, I

agree with Andrew Coyne. And here's what he said on the CBC, calling out the liberals for bogus messaging on this carbon tax. Well, the sad and bizarre part is, it's not as if people are not, unless we don't have any carbon policy at all, there's gonna be a carbon policy, it will cost things and it will cost consumers.

The only, there won't be a rebate anymore. So the idea that we're actually gonna be letting people out of some sort of hardship as a result of this is completely bogus. It's going to mean we're going to have a more expensive, less efficient system without rebates that ultimately will the cost will get passed on to consumers. They just won't know it. And that is basically what the compromise, the agreement that's been made amongst all the parties now is let's just keep the public in the dark. Until this about face on the carbon tax happened, the most base political move I have ever seen was when Jean Chrétien campaigned on axing the GST and then kept it.

That was to me the height of situational hypocrisy. But at the very least, that wasn't his policy that he was claiming he was gonna cancel. This is their own damn policy. And because he doesn't sit for interviews, nobody can ask or challenge him on the lack of even rudimentary logic that they're asking us to swallow as taxpayers. I'm not the only one frustrated here for a lot of reasons. People like

Bob Fife, again, one of our great journalists in this country, who would relish the opportunity of holding this country to account, here's what he had to say. Well, what he doesn't tell us is how much he's worth. I mean, that's really the question here. Are you worth 10 million, 20 million, 50 million dollars? We have no idea. Who is the person who's running the blind trust?

Is it your brother? I mean, if you're having an independent person who's supposed to take care of the blind trust, that person should be independent and far removed from Mr. Carney's assets. We don't know who that is. You know, is he requiring to sell all the stocks, which apparently you're supposed to, but has he sold all the stocks and his investments and anything that may put him in a conflict with the government?

Those are things that he needs to answer to Canadians. And, you know, he doesn't want to answer those questions and you said he was a little testy. He does not like tough questions from journalists. He's used to… That's it. Yeah. So there you go.

Look, unelected is fine temporarily. Unaccountable whilst unelected should be unacceptable to every single living, breathing Canadian. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney Show. Thank you so much for taking time out of your day to spend some time with the show and whether or not you're listening to us on radio or on a streaming app or as a podcast, we really do appreciate you joining us

and becoming part of this growing community. So I was pretty busy on Twitter this weekend taking issue with the liberal government Canceling their canceling in air quotes their own tax and taking credit for it as if as if this is something that they shouldn't be Ashamed of and I got a lot of people pushing back saying stain your lane Go ask people on a red carpet what they're wearing on and a lot of ad hominem attacks, meaning they did not actually attack my, what I was saying, but rather who I am, which means they lost the argument,

at least as far as I'm concerned. So in an effort to push back on that, let's talk to two people who actually spend their entire lives focused on issues like this. Two good friends of the Ben Mulroney Show from the Canadian Taxpayers Federation, we've got Franco Tarrazano, the Federal Director, and Chris Sims, the Alberta director.

To both of you, I say happy Monday and happy St. Patrick's Day. Thanks, Ben. Yeah, thanks for having us on the show. Chris, let's start with you. And let me just put on my devil's advocate hat and say, like, what are we complaining about? They did something that, more or less,

that a lot of us have been asking them to do for a really long time. So what's wrong with that? Well, two things here, Ben. One, it is a big win for Canadians because normal everyday working Canadians made Mark Carney, the dude who wrote a 507 page book praising carbon taxes, The former UN special envoy on this very topic, we made him tap the mat. Okay? He tapped out.

He said, I'm going to have to get rid of carbon taxes or make it look like I'm doing that in order to get some votes. So that is just a huge achievement. Okay? So that is a win for Canadians. For us to say, you know what? This carbon tax is radioactive man So you're gonna have to get rid of it

So they made him at least look like he's doing that but of course to your point all weekend I was watching what you were saying devils in the details here It's just reduced to zero and he's going to hide the cost of the carbon tax. Yeah, it's not really gone Yeah, Franco, maybe you can pick up on that. What what does that mean? I heard Pierre polio referencing that he was going to hide the price of the carbon tax. But look, we know it was visible for all of us to see that it was dropped down to zero. So how does he then move to shroud the carbon tax and its cost into secrecy? Yeah, and Ben, let me just say one thing. They deserve 0% credit for this, right? Up

until six minutes ago, they were captain carbon tax. They were telling you, if you care about the planet, then sit down, be quiet and pay your carbon tax bills. Okay? But there's two reasons why the carbon tax fight isn't over. Number one, the carbon tax rate will be reduced to zero. Okay. But guess what? The carbon tax law is still on the books. So we're all expecting an election right around the corner. And that means that when the House of Commons comes back, they can still crank up the carbon tax to their harsh desires, because the law is still on the books. But number two, and probably the most important point here, is that Mr. Carney, he's not ending

all carbon taxes. He wants to hammer Canadian businesses with huge hitting carbon taxes. And then he hopes you won't notice when those costs are passed on to you through higher prices. Yeah. Right. A carbon tax is a carbon tax is a carbon tax. Canadians don't want the carbon tax kind of gone.

Canadians don't want the carbon tax relabeled. We want it completely scrapped. Yeah. And Chris, you know, so so I saw the tweet that they were very proud of that the cost of a liter of gas was going to go down by 17.1 cents on April 1, which tells me I've been paying 17.1 cents per liter that I shouldn't have been paying for years. But but so that's that's on the consumer facing tax, which is now down to zero. But if they're going to increase the tax on large emitters, surely that includes the oil

and gas sector, which ultimately would then pass that on to me, the consumer. Bingo, bingo. So as he's going to put the carbon tax on to say a fuel refineryinery that of course will make things like gasoline and diesel cost more that fuel refinery is not going to eat the cost of that carbon tax so yeah we're still gonna be standing there fueling up our vehicles paying out of the pump same thing goes for utilities companies if you're paying for your natural gas for your home heating you're still going to be paying

the carbon tax the problem here for us as consumers is that it's going to be more hidden. Because keep in mind, that's what was annoying people like Mark Carney, is that we could often see the cost of the carbon tax, and that made us get upset about it. That is why people like Christopher Freeland said language like consumer-facing carbon tax. They didn't see the carbon tax as a problem. It was the fact that we could see it. Also keep in mind, like you said, he's going to crank up the industrial carbon tax, so that's the tax in all those businesses. But keep in mind that we've got

somebody called US President Donald Trump who's ringing the dinner bell for industry down in the United States. why would a steel manufacturer or a fertilizer plant in Ontario or Saskatchewan or Calgary decide to stay up here with industrial carbon taxes when they can just move stateside and pay no carbon tax? Frank

Oterozano, let's move to the second volley of gas lighting that I identified over the weekend, and that was with our new finance minister, Champagne, who was speaking with Vashi Kapilos of CTV, where he essentially said that we are now in an era of fiscal responsibility. I'm a fiscal hawk.

We are going to look at reducing the footprint of spending. We are differentiating between investments and spending. This all, honestly, as a centrist Canadian had had the liberal said this ten years ago I would have said oh, there's a palatable centrist alternative to the conservatives Unfortunately, I just don't buy it Yeah, no wonder. I mean you're you have every reason to have trust issues Okay Like they're trying like they're trying to pretend like they weren't the government

That doubled the national debt in less than a decade, right? And they also want to split the books they want to pretend like they're gonna be balanced in the budget Well, I got news for you. Okay, if debt is still going up It means interest charges are wasting too much money and you're not being fiscally responsible. Right? They haven't identified a single place to cut spending. And you know what? After a decade of this runaway crazy spending train, finding savings in every area of the budget should be like finding water in the ocean. Okay? Like, come on, you guys just added 108,000 extra bureaucrats in less than a decade. They spent 8 million bucks building a barn at Rideau hall. Not

to mention the new finance minister is the same minister who put taxpayers on the hook for tens of billions of dollars in corporate welfare to multinational corporations. So you know what I say? I'll believe it when I see it. Chris Sims, when our prime minister was in Europe today, he tweeted about his conversation with President Macron of France, and he used that expression that a lot of us hear

but don't necessarily understand, but it does get us feeling a sort of way. He renewed his commitment to net zero. Now when you hear net zero, what does that mean to you and what does that say about a future Carney government? That means a carbon tax and a production cap here, especially in the province of Alberta. And as we saw the parliamentary budget officer come out with recently, he said that that production flash emissions cap that's being imposed by ottawa is going to blow a twenty billion dollar hole in the canadian economy and it's going to cost us about forty thousand jobs

so as an elbert and had a representative of the ctf that's what that says to me frank Franco, what about you? Well, yeah, I think it means life's going to be more expensive and it's going to be harder to create investment and jobs in Canada. And let me just go back to the elephant in the room, right? This terrafore that is hanging over our heads. Like Mr. Trump wants more businesses to set up shop in the United States. And these governments, our government's energy regulations, energy taxes, carbon taxes are going to help Trump do just that. Right? Washington, like the vast majority of countries do not hammer their citizens with carbon taxes. And there is no way that Ottawa should be hammering Canadians with carbon taxes, whether it's

consumer facing or hidden carbon taxes on business. And let me just give a shout out here some kudos because earlier today, the Conservative Party leader, Pierre Poliev, he said he would end the carbon tax law and also end the industrial carbon tax. And he is the first federal party leader to commit to ending all carbon taxes. And I think that's a great commitment. Chris Sims, the Alberta Director of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation and Franco Tarrazano, her federal analog.

To both of you, I say thank you very much. Always a fun chat. Thanks, Ben. Thank you. There's no limit to how far criminals will go to cover their tracks. But investigators will go even further to uncover the truth. I'm Nancy Hicks, a senior crime reporter for Global News.

This season on Crime Beat, I'll take you from the crime scene to the courtroom and inside some of Canada's most high-profile cases and some you've likely never heard of before. Search for and listen to Crime Beat on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, and wherever you find your favorite podcasts.