The Ben Mulroney Show - This week in politics - The Alberta school book ban

Episode Date: September 3, 2025

Sharan Kaur, Political strategist, former Deputy Chief to the Liberal Minister of Finance Regan Watts, Founder Fratton Park Inc., former Senior aide to minister of finance Jim Flaherty   If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://link.chtbl.com/bms⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Also, on youtube -- ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@BenMulroneyShow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Insta: ⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠ Twitter: ⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠ TikTok: ⁠@benmulroneyshow⁠ Enjoy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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This is the Ben Mulroney show. Thank you so much for joining us. And, of course, we'd like to supercharge the show every now and then with some all-star guests on this week in politics. Please welcome Sharon Carr, political strategist and former deputy chief to the liberal minister of finance. And Regan Watts, founder of Fratton Park, as well as former senior aide to a different minister of finance. To the both of you, I say happy hump day. Hello, my chum. Let's jump into Alberta and the quote-unquote book ban, it's not a book ban, but it is a recalibration of what I think kids in libraries at schools should have access to.

There was pushback on some of the books that were caught up in this dragnet, and now the government has put a pause on it so that they can make sure that, quote, unquote, the classics are available and, images of fallatio are not and as far as I'm concerned Sharon tell me what you think but isn't this

how the system's supposed to work call me crazy Ben but when we were in school which was not that long ago I'm pretty sure there were no books showing fallatio oh yeah no there weren't

there weren't which tells me it tells me Sharon and I'll let you jump back in that something someone grabbed the football and started running with it when they shouldn't have.

And so somebody had to come in and level set. Yeah. And like, listen, I think that, I think that there's a level of, of this that I'm kind of looking at and saying, was there actually, was this actually a thing? Was there actually like pictures? Like, we're not showing kids porn. Oh, I'm, I'm looking at it right here. I'm literally looking at it right here.

I want to see it. I think that there is, I think, I think Alberta needs to find a balance. Like, I'm talking about the old goodies. Like, there was talk about Handmaid's Tale. Like, these are books that we read growing up. We've seen the shows and I think that are reasonable. But if there's a place where there's books that actually are over sexualizing things and introducing things to kids in an age that might not be helpful, I think is a problem.

But we also have to remember that we live in a day and age of social media. So how do we balance education versus like I think people are called indoctrination? So I think there has to be a balance. But I definitely want to see what exactly they've had out there. Because I think Alberta is doing what they have to do best. Yeah, let's see. I'm trying to send it to you. I will send it to you.

Regan, what do you think? Because, you know, when in the face of new information, this government in Alberta ingested that new information, and they're going to push, put out a sort of new regulation. To me, again, this is how the system's supposed to work. I don't see a single problem with this. So, Ben, I agree that that is how the system is supposed to work. And I should also preface with, look, I'm a guy who lives in Toronto and my observations on Alberta are that of a guy who lives in Toronto. What I will say is this. In my observations of

Premier Smith and her government, it's always been contentious between her and the public sector, whether it's doctors or nurses or educators or municipal governments or whatever. So the Smith government has had a certain posture with other elements of the public sector, including education for some time now. And you will recall that the Premier did like a seven-minute video over a year ago on trans issues. And so the Premier has been very clear and remarkably consistent, in my view, on her view around these issues in particular in the education system. I'm of the view, Ben, and I agree with you that if you actually look at the content that

she is talking about banning from schools, 99.99% of parents agree. I don't think it's appropriate that my children should be reading about fallatio or other activities at home, you know, in school. I mean, I think the politics should be left to parents. I'm sorry, once said, I just, I don't want to interrupt, but I just sent the screen grab to Sharon, and that's her face. That's the face of some, that's exactly. That is from an actual book in an Alberta school.

And we should, we should leave the politics and values and ethics to parents. And schools should stick to reading, writing, arithmetic. It's pretty straightforward. All right. Well, from, so you just said you're a guy from Toronto and your opinions are a guy from Toronto about Alberta. Now I'm going to ask a guy from Toronto about his opinions on Quebec. We just saw sort of the falling apart of a massive investment by the Quebec government in, you know, what was supposed to be the future of the EV supply chain with the North Volt battery project, $250 million of taxpayer money into the ether. And it's a disaster for Quebec.

But in Ontario, an even more sizable investment occurred a couple of years ago. And is this something that's going to repeat here? So, Ben, I don't know if it's going to repeat here. I have to say I am a supporter of incentives for industry from government. I think given the nature of our economy and the fact we have to compete with the Americans and the Asians and the Europeans, we have no choice but to provide these incentives. I will say from experience that many in emerging industries, you know, it is a bit of a gold rush at the beginning and Norfolk appears to be part of that trend where there's lots of Charlottans and pretenders and promoters who want government money. And the question is who is going to survive.

I think in defense of the Premier of Ontario and Minister Fidelity and the government, they've made large bets on well-established companies, Volkswagen and Honda being two of the largest. And I should be clear with your listeners that Honda is a client of mine. and I'd do some work with them. But they bet on established companies. North Volt was a startup that the province of Quebec sunk hundreds of millions of dollars into and gave grants to. That's different than what Ontario typically does. And so I don't know if you'll see the same outcomes here,

even if there are ongoing challenges with the EV sector because of the way that Ontario typically hands out taxpayer funds. But one last point, Ben, which is if we're going to transform our economy and we want governments to make the right bets, we is the public and tax people, payers need to be prepared to accept some losses. Governments don't like to lose money because the public gets outraged. And I understand why. And there's some rationale to that.

We've got to take some swings. And sometimes you'll hit and hit a home run or a grand slam. And sometimes you're going to strike out. And I think the public needs to accept that that's going to happen from time to time. Yeah, no, I think that's a very good way of putting it. Sharon, like when Trudeau and Ford got together and made those massive announcements in Ontario, look, I was, I was supportive of it. I thought it was a great idea because I didn't want.

want to look back 20 years from now and say, Jesus, if we'd only known then what we know now. And so, and I think, I think looking at it with the, through the, with the sage wisdom of Mr. Watts is, I think appropriate. Like, not every one of these is going to come out a winner, but I'd rather play some bets, some big bets that could pay out huge rather than not even get into the game. Yeah, listen, I think I'm 100% Reagan and I are on the same page with this. you're going to hear, I remember when the government put money into

Salantis, for example, there was a bunch of people out there with outrage saying, oh my God, how are we putting this much money into it? The thing that we have to remember is that government does have to play a hand in bringing investments into our country, into our provinces. Ontario specifically is a auto-heavy industry province, and the government does have to provide incentives to get companies to do stuff here, so they're not doing it overseas. Now, EVEV incentives and investments are tricky ones.

because we went through a period of time with the last government where EVs were really like hot and the thing. I love EVs. I drive an EV. I understand that it's not for everyone. And the problem is that there had, there was mandates around by 2030. All cars were going to be EV. There was an EV mandate, but we have to remember that sometimes our policies might not actually work the way we want them to to work. We're seeing China being heavily involved in EV production. And I think that Canada still has a place and we're still going to see vehicles like this and investments. like this utilize and expanding the industry, but sometimes they don't work out the way we want them to, but it's better to be ahead than behind. Exactly. And I'm glad you mentioned this. We'll only have one minute left. So I'll just, I'll end on this. You know, we just talked about in Alberta when the facts on the ground required a change to a government decision, they did so. And my hope is that this liberal government is able to sort of, you know, take a step back and realize that the EV mandate for a future that is absolutely on the horizon is just not now.

And until they realize that that EV mandate is causing great problems for the auto sector in terms of like, what are we supposed to build? People don't want them. Part of the challenge there, Ben, with EV mandates, and I totally agree with you is the government. Real quick, real quick. Give me one point. The fact is right now the EV mandates don't include traditional hybrid models and what the government

should do is include those in the calculation. Agreed. And if they do that, I'll actually get much better outcomes economically and environmental. All right. When we come back, we're going to be talking about what are the priorities of this liberal retreat? And if you're a supporter of the NDP, you better not be a cis male. That's coming up next. This show is sponsored by Better Help. Let's be honest. We've all shared our problems in some pretty funny places, the group chat, your bar, or maybe even a stranger on a plane.

And, hey, sometimes that helps. But when it comes to stuff like stress, anxiety, or relationships, it makes a big difference to talk to somebody who's actually trained to help. That's what BetterHelp is all about. They connect you with credentialed professional therapists online. And what makes them stand out is their therapist match commitment. After a quick questionnaire, BetterHelp does the hard work of finding someone who fits your needs. Most people get it right the first time.

But if it's not a match, you can switch counselors anytime at no extra cost. It's flexible, totally online, and you can hit pause whenever you need to. With over 5 million people supported to date globally, BetterHelp is now available in Canada with a network of counselors who have expertise in a wide range of specialties. With a 4.9 out of 5 rating based on over 1.7 million client reviews. BetterHelp makes counseling affordable and convenient, and you can switch counselors at any time for no cost. Our listeners get 10% off their first month at BetterHelp.com slash Mulruni. That's BetterHELP.com.

slash Mulroney. This message is from Wise, the app for international money. With Wise, you can send, spend, and receive in up to 40 currencies with a fair exchange rate and no hidden fees. Download the Wise app or visit wise.com. T's and Cs apply. Welcome back to the Ben Mulrooney Show. And welcome back to Sharon Carr and Regan Watts.

Thanks so much for sticking around, guys. All right. So our prime minister and the cabinet are in the. their second retreat since the election, the first one, I mean, gearing up for this new sitting of parliament. And I'm wondering what the priorities are going to be. What's going to be discussed? Because, you know, something that was quite refreshing after the election was the mandate letters that were handed to each new minister. Simple, clear, seven priorities. But now we need details, right? Now this is where the rubber meets the road to use as many expressions as I can.

So Sharon, you're closest to the party. What are your thoughts? What are some of the priorities that are going to come out of this meeting that are going to drive the priorities and drive the government moving forward? Right. So the prime minister, as you said, gave out this standardized mandate letter to all the ministers kind of being clear and concise of what the government's priorities were going to be. And then I believe it was August 1st or around then that each ministry had to get their response to the mandate letters back to the prime minister kind of outlining what. are their priorities, but also like their cost cutting. So I think what we're going to see come from that is we have a fall budget that's coming up. And I think the focus is going to be

on streamlining a government's message around building Canadian sovereignty and also a bit of discipline in terms of what is it that Prime Minister Carney expects of everyone. A big part of this is going to be cost cutting and trying to figure out what each department can do to streamline programs, see which funds are not needed anymore. But I think like it's going to be interesting to see what comes out of today because we haven't heard very many ministers do interviews just yet, but I'm gathering that it's all very tightly controlled and the prime minister is going to lead with what his vision is going to the fall. Regan, this is a pretty pivotal time. I think a lot of us who have been approaching another liberal government with at least, I think, a healthy dose

of cynicism. But also a healthy dose of, come on, guys, you got to make this work, right? are hoping that what's going to come in the next few weeks and months are surprise announcements that all this groundwork that's being laid by Mark Carney's government is going to lead to all of a sudden an announcement after announcement after announcement of we're building this and we're announcing this contract and we're announcing this achievement and we're announcing this milestone. That's what I'm hoping to see. So I think what I don't know if there's going to be a bunch of surprise. prize announcements this fall, Ben? I think the Prime Minister is managing, as those of us who've

worked with him know how he works, which is he likes to line up the system and line things up and then execute. And you saw that as Sharon described in the way he offered his mandate letter and then asked ministers to come back with their priorities. You know, there's a number of items that are out there, whether it's Trump and trade or crime or immigration or whatever. Canadian public opinion, though, was still firmly on the side of the Prime Minister. He leads in, in, he leads in in every single public opinion poll, both as a party and as a party leader versus his main competitor.

So it'll be interesting to see, honestly, the dynamic in how issues come to the four this fall with Mr. Pauliev, the conservative leader, back in the House of Commons, who won his by election. And I think conservatives are grateful that the people of Alberta gave somebody from Ontario another job. But now with Mr. Pauliyev being back in the House,

you know, the question really will be and how this focuses the prime minister's efforts politically is, you know, is Mr. Polyev going to continue be the one-trick orang-a-tang that he's been up to now, where he walks in a room and hoots loudly and bangs his chest? Or are the Conservative Party going to play a more nuanced role as opposition? And I think you'll see the Prime Minister and the government, maybe not respond every single time to how the opposition behaves. But I think public debate and around issues will really depend on whether it's an orangutan or a politician in the House of Commons sitting in the lead

of the opposition's chair. Well, historically, the Conservative Party has depended on a healthy showing at the polls for the NDP in order to form government. And it seems like they are hell-bent on diluting whatever appeal they have. Last week, I talked on this show about the left eating itself and turning natural allies into enemies. It's just part and parcel of the, I don't know, the math that they live by. And so now as they're gearing up for a leadership race, prospective candidates need to collect at least 500 signatures from party members. members. Rules indicate that at least 50% of the total required signatures must be from NDP members who do not identify as cisgender men, meaning a male whose reported gender corresponds to

their reported sex at birth. The party also requires a minimum of 100 signatures from equity seeking groups, such as racialized members, indigenous members, members of the LGBT. Okay. I mean, and it goes on and it goes on. This is, I look at this and I chuckle and I say, You know, the NDP is going to NDP, Sharon. You know, I had a chuckle about this, not because I don't think that they have the prerogatives. They can do what you want, yeah. Do what you want.

But I think I saw the National Post headline last night where it says, like, it's a cisgendered. And for me, like, that is defined as identity politics. We all do it. Every party does it. And I kind of like went at my NDP friends today. And I'm like, guys, this just seems weird. And they said, you know, it's the communications that is off.

we've always done this. Is this how I would do it? No, because like it's meant to be an open process. But this is, I think this is the NDP comms, NDP, and I know they stand by it, but like, I don't think it helps them. I really don't think it helps them when they, this is the message. Yeah, listen, they need to, they're, they're a party that is, I don't know, struggling to figure out what its identity is.

That's the identity politics. They need to figure out. What does the, what's the identity of the NDP, Regan? Well, that's the $64,000 question. This is the record of Jugnit Singh, the most useless federal political party leader in the history of Canada. The NDP of today is not the party of latent normal care or broadband or of Rachel Notley or of Gary Dewar in Manitoba or even Bob Ray in Ontario. And so, you know, I think there's a real problem, though, politically for conservatives. And I'll bring that lens to this discussion because thanks to their, you know,

two-year destroy his reputation campaign of Jagmeet Singh, the NDP are unpalpable to 90% of the population. Think about that 90%. And so what you have is this leftover cornucopia, this mix of pink and purple-haired activists who care more about Gaza than they do about organized labor and issues that real Canadians care about. And I think the NDP will continue to struggle as they meander from special issue to special issue, which leaves a lane clearly for the liberal party and a problem for the conservatives who are trying to compete in what is essentially going to be a two-party state for the foreseeable future.

Yeah, they've lost the plot. And you're right, Sharon. It's interesting that you say that, that this is how they've always done it. And if this is the way they've always done it, then with that, that's in and of itself a problem. But I don't think they've always done it that way, Ben.

I think this is just a product of, again, the pink and purple-haired activists who are the leftovers of the... No, they're saying they've been doing this for, like, Decc, like, literally, this is what I sound like, you, this is something you've done forever. They're like, yeah, we've always done this. And I'm like, well. No, it really does seem like, and as, as Regan said, you know, there's 10% of the party that was always the loud, fringe, radical side.

And then you had sort of, then you had these very proud and storied members of the NDP who had been, you know, part of the solution. And they'd been standing up for labor and they'd been standing up for environmental causes in Canada. It seems like those people either don't care anymore or they've gone away. And they've left. They're voting liberal then. That's what's happened. Yeah. They've gone away and they're voting liberal because the prime minister has found a way to address

issues that they care about. One, and two, the orangutan leader of the opposition that I just mentioned has found a way to alienate soft NDP voters and stampede them back to the liberal party. And so while you have extremists running the new Democrats, what it's done is it's pushed voters into the liberal column, which is partly why they, well, big reason why they won as many seats as they did back in April. Yeah. And look, and I'm looking at who's, the names that are standing out on, on their list. And Avi Lewis, obviously, I'm surprised he waited this long to get into the race. He should have, if he should have run any time, it should have been like 15 years ago. But Eve Engler, the fact that he's probably one of the highest, most visible people on that list. And he is known as being sort of, he's borderline anarchist. And I have never heard him speak. Not once. I have never heard him speak one word. about labor issues.

Everything is about the taking down the capitalist system and Gaza, Gaza, Gaza, Gaza, Gaza, Gaza, Gaza, I hate Israel. That's it. Ben, the NDP used to be a pragmatic group of people who cared about the working class. And they've lost those roots as Sharon talked about. And this is going to be an ongoing problem for them. All right. Well, to the both of you, I say thank you very much.

I wish you the very best on this Wednesday and enjoy the rest of your week. No, see, moncha. All right. Bye, guys. The end. For four years, Noah and Sarah have been clying out from beneath the Denver airport. They have faced monsters, secret armies, and killing machines. But they're done running.

This season on escaping Denver, the truth is revealed. Captives become legends, and a war a thousand years in the making, erupts around them. Join us for the end of our story. The final season of escaping Denver drops August 11th on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, and wherever you find your favorite podcasts.