The Ben Mulroney Show - This week in politics - Wednesday edition

Episode Date: June 18, 2025

Guests and Topics: Guest:   Julia Parsons – Hill and knowlton – Julia worked on Parliament Hill for over seven years, including serving most recently as the Director of Policy to a senior member of the Conservative Party of Canada Guest: Sharan Kaur, Political strategist, former Deputy Chief to the Minister of Finance - Guest: Regan Watts, Founder Fratton Park Inc., former Senior aide to minister of finance Jim Flaherty If you enjoyed the podcast, tell a friend! For more of the Ben Mulroney Show, subscribe to the podcast! https://globalnews.ca/national/program/the-ben-mulroney-show Follow Ben on Twitter/X at https://x.com/BenMulroney Enjoy   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is the Ben Mulroney Show. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney Show. It's time for this week in politics. I want to welcome to stalwarts back to the panel, Sharon Carr, political strategist, the former deputy chief to the minister of finance, as well as Regan Watts, founder of Fratton Park and former senior aide to Jim Flaherty. Welcome to the minister of finance, as well as Regan Watts, founder of Fratton Park and former senior aide to Jim Flaherty. Welcome to the both of you. Good morning. And I want to highlight Julia Parsons the for the first time

on our show from Hill and Nolten. Julia worked on Parliament Hill for over seven years, including serving recently as the director of policy for a senior member of the Conservative Party of Canada. Julia, welcome. Thanks for having me. All right, let's jump in to you know, we've talked a lot about Mark Carney and how he's doing, and we'll get to that later. But let's talk about so that the other side of the coin, Pierre Poliev, he will be facing a leadership review. And, you know, I don't know if he's I don't know if he's doing the work required to to to win that review. What are you guys hearing?

And we'll start with you, Regan. to win that review. What are you guys hearing? And then we'll start with you, Regan. Good morning, Ben. Great to be back with you. Look, the leadership question for Mr. Polyev is a very delicate one for a couple of reasons. One, because he just blew a 28-3

like the Atlanta Falcons did in the Super Bowl in the last federal election. And two, he doesn't have a seat. Three, he's got a caucus who now have less fidelity or loyalty to him because of the election loss. That's not to say they're going to toss them overboard by any stretch. But it's just a different period for him than it was in the lead up to the election when it looked like a

certainty for him to win. Yeah, the leadership review is required. And your listeners should know that the Conservative Party Constitution. The leadership review is required and your listeners should know that the Conservative Party Constitution requires a leadership review after every election loss. And so this is normal process and it's not something out of the ordinary. However, what is out of the ordinary is that the leader doesn't have a seat and that he's he's facing a leadership review at the same time. I think Calgary is a

strange place to hold the leadership review. And I don't mean that because of the weather in January, I love Calgary. And Calgary is a wonderful place to hold a leadership review. And I don't mean that because of the weather in January. I love Calgary. And Calgary is a wonderful place all year round. But it does present some challenges for him because not just in terms of the vote on his leadership, but that is where the roots of the Reform Party are at. And Canadians have said many times

they don't want reform policies to be implemented. They wanted conservative policies. And this is a policy convention as well. And so we're going to have some headlines coming out of this convention, which I think you're going to be problematic simply on a policy basis. So it's a very, very tricky time for him personally, and also for the party. Well, Mark Carney has myself and the rest of the country purring. You love that purring imagery. And frankly, it disturbs me just a little bit. Sharon, your camp doesn't often go through leadership reviews

because your camp doesn't often lose. But this is a party that if we're laying a bare, if we're being honest, this is a party that has had multiple kicks at the can with leaders who fit a certain mold. They look a certain way. They have a certain gender. They look a certain way, they have a certain gender, they come from certain places. And the definition of insanity is repeating the same behavior over and over,

expecting a different result. What do you, let's live in a world where Pierre either doesn't win or decides he doesn't wanna carry on because maybe the mandate that he gets from this leadership review is not enough. Let's say for a moment that his time as the leader has has come to an end. What do you think this party should do to be competitive in the next election? Well, I think that there's a number of things. Now, in all fairness to Mr. Poliev, I would say, and I hear the argument from a lot of conservatives that he got more votes this

time around. He most definitely did. So did the liberals. There is still no prize for second place. That being said, I don't think he lost because he is not necessarily a good politician. He is a very good communicator.

I just think he pivoted far towards one side of the party and really tapped into the anger that he felt people were having and was unable to pivot when it came time to dealing with Trump properly. So I don't think there's one certain thing that he could do differently but I do think that there's a lot of moderate conservatives like the ones like Reagan who purrs all the time, who probably prefer to see somebody who can not necessarily be more centrist, but be more balanced when it comes to diplomacy and kind of tone and tenor.

People don't want an angry guy screaming at them. They kind of want level of steadiness. So I think this is going to be an interesting moment for Pierre Poliev because the conservative brand tends to live beyond its leader. Well, and, and, and Julia, you Julia, you're steeped in the conservative party. I'm of the opinion that a guy like Pierre Poliev can learn from a mistake like this. And if given the opportunity, he could show us

that he is capable of not necessarily being the snarky guy who needs to win every battle in question period. What do you think is going on right now inside that party? I definitely think you make some really good points there, Ben. You know, I will say, to build on Regan's point, he is in a new situation. That is fair and that is true.

But you know, he's also made some key games with new MPs in new areas, brought in some new demographics into the fold for the party. What I think is really going to be important here is Mr. Polio is doing his summer listening tour and taking that feedback that you said that you know we've heard on this call already and and taking that feedback seeing what worked what didn't work and what viewers will really need to watch for is how does the leader take that feedback and implement it. Particularly while Mr. Carney is seemingly consolidating a lot of support in the center lane of the

spectrum, it's really going to depend on how he implements that feedback and that's what I'll be watching. Yeah I don't think anybody, I'm not anticipating an election for the next three, three and a half years. That is a lifetime and and Mark Carney is enjoying, rightly so, a well-earned honeymoon. And a lot of people that didn't support him are, if they're not supporting him, they are giving him enough leash or enough runway to take off. And I think we're all hoping that he is successful. And so I know that they're, you know, Pierre Poliev, his support overall nationally has gone down significantly. But that, to me, is to be expected Regan.

Like that's not an indication that he's unelectable. It's a statement of where we are following an election, isn't it? So a couple of things in that then. First, I want to state for the record, for your listeners and for the country, Sharon referred to me as a moderate. I'm not sure that's the right label.

I don't like conservative labels. We're all one big tent, but I'm as a moderate. I'm not sure that's the right label. I don't like conservative labels. We're all one big tent, but I'm not a moderate. I actually believe deeply in conservative principles and I think it's okay to do so. And I think conservatives should not be ashamed of being a conservative. And I think that's okay, just the same as liberals and new Democrats.

With respect to Pierre and Mr. Polly, pardon me, and his polling, I actually think his numbers are going to get worse, not better. You know, Mr. Carney has had an exceptional start as Prime Minister. His government's taking a little bit of time to find its legs in terms of ministers and staff and all those things. That's pretty normal. But I tell you, I watched the G7 meeting this week and I can't think of one Canadian who said to themselves, gee, I wish Mr. Poliev was running the G7 and not Mark Carney. It was a professional job. There was great outcomes.

You see the reaction from President Trump, who remains a very important, if not the top issue in Canadian policy circles and political circles and certainly top of mind for Canadians. And so I think Mr. Poliev's numbers are going to dip. And the thing that I believe he needs to do, and I suspect Julia and Sharon would agree with me on this, is look, he's got to manage expectations.

He's going into a rioting and running in a by-election in Northern Alberta, where the incumbent candidate just won 80% of the vote. We have issues with respect to Alberta separatism and things like that that are going to cause that 80% to go down. Why? Because there will be a separatist candidate

on the ballot. Maxime Bernier is going to run in the by-election. And so what are we doing as a party and what is he doing as a leader to manage those expectations? I also think as a result of Mr. Carney, you know, Mr. Poliam needs to go like, I say go away, and I don't mean that as a leader, but he needs to just hunker down and sit back for a while and let the public detox a little bit from him and then come back in the fall. Sharon, I want to give you 45 seconds and I want Julie to finish up on this topic. Well, listen, I think that I personally think that no one would have wanted someone like Pierre Poliev in the situation that we've been in specifically when it comes to the US and we saw

the G7 and how Prime Minister Carney handled it. A lot is gonna happen and a lot is gonna change in the coming weeks and days. And I think that I personally think we're gonna start to see some claws coming out. We've already started to see some of that, but I'm all for hopeful discourse. We're gonna see this by-election.

Number one step is gonna be for him to get a seat in the house. I actually think it's so noble that somebody stepped down for him to run when they didn't have to him to get a seat in the house. I actually think it's so noble that somebody stepped down for him to run when they didn't have to, but I'm here for the plot. Julia, last 45 seconds to you. Yeah, absolutely. You know, to your point then at the front out there, we are probably years away from an election.

So right now, and to build off what Reagan was saying as well, right now is the time to reflect, take a step back, figure out what worked, figure out what didn't work is the time to reflect, take a step back, figure out what worked, figured out what didn't work, what needs to change and begin to build a new plan going forward from there. I think we're going to start to see that over the coming weeks and months, particularly

once we get up to and after the leadership review, that's when you'll be watching to see what are the plans to go forward. That's what I think is going to be really important as we think about who is leading the party into the next election. to see what are the plans to go forward. And that's what I think is going to be really important as we think about who's leading the party into the next election. All right, well thank you to all three of you.

Don't go anywhere. We've got so much more with our This Week in Politics panel coming back, including now that criminals are hitting premieres homes. Is it perhaps time we revisit how we tackle crime in this country? This is the Ben Mulroney Show. Welcome back to the Ben Mulroney Show

and welcome to part two of this week in politics. We're joined by Julia Parsons, Sharon Carr and Regan Watts. Great to have all three of you back. I think it that we all know that crime in big cities in this country is out of control on a lot of fronts, but it takes it takes it to a new level when four masked men try to steal the escalade of the premier of Ontario. And here's what Doug Ford, here's what his reaction was after crime hit home with him. These weak, need judges, the biggest bust in the Peel's history, guess where they are. They are back out on the street again. Bill. Except one person.

Do you believe that? They actually get released on the largest drug bust in Peel's history. 500 kilos of cocaine that could ultimately kill people and judges slap on the wrist. OK, little Johnny, you go out there and deal more drugs.

Why don't you and deal more drugs. Why don't you give them more drugs? It's crazy. The system is broken. I will be all over the prime minister and the federal government. Yeah, so he's angry and he's not gonna take it anymore. And his government has announced today that they are going to be building more jails.

There's more capacity as of the end of 2026. So he's doing something on his side of the fence to help with this. Julia, I wanna come to you first because look, there's a couple of ways to attack this, but in question period a couple of days ago, the conservatives were trying to hold the new justice minister's feet to the fire.

And the justice minister was holding firm that we have a robust justice system. The criminal code is strong on these fronts. It is not, in my opinion, and not for nothing. But Doug Ford, as the leader, I have a lot of time for Doug Ford. There was an alternative to this liberal government on the ballot, and it was a tough on crime conservative party. And he chose not to mobilize his conservative party to the benefit of Pierre Poliev.

And so it's sort of a, yeah, this is sort of, this is sort of what you wanted. Uh, you got, you got what you, he didn't vote for it, but he got what he got, what he helped get elected. What do you think? Well, look, I think the last election showed us particularly in key areas, like in the GTA, we've seen stories of exactly what the premier himself just experienced. The tackling crime and bail reform is a

key priority for Canadians right now. I mean, to be fair to both parties, both the liberals and the conservatives both talked about this issue in the election. You can say Pierre Poliev more extensively, particularly in the lead up to the election, the issue of crime and bail reform was a top-line message.

But I would say also, PM Carney, he had some protections that he listed and commitments he made in his platform related to tackling crime as well. We've seen, you know, even with this personal impact to the premier's house, which is absolutely egregious, I think

we have a real moment in time to see if there is political consensus that the issue needs to be addressed. So let's see where they move forward and whether the prime minister takes an action as outlined in his election platform. And Sharon, that's what was so confusing, dumbfounding, disappointing to me

when the minister stood up in the House of Commons and sort of defended more or less the status quo. This is an opportunity to show that this liberal party is not the same as the old liberal party. And if ever there was something to cast aside, it would be this permissible system where criminals get to do what criminals want, and we as a taxpayer just have to deal with it.

And so I didn't understand that knee-jerk defense of everything's okay. Yeah, and I don't think that was the messaging they were probably going for. And listen, my view on crime, and I feel for Premier Ford because he kind of says it as it is, but no one government is going to be able to solve the issue of crime alone. It is up to our cities, it's up to the municipalities, up to the police, up to the province, up to the feds. But you know, it's also up to us as people to have a better society.

And I think that is changing the government and having peer policy coming into place, going to make things different. I don't think so. I think we're going to continue to have bad players. I'm all in favor of us doing some serious reform when it comes to bail. I was on Alex's show yesterday

and there was a tweet that I saw where a judge let a man off for having modest amounts of child pornography. Oh yeah, that was a crazy one last week. But Sharon, I think you're letting people off the hook here and I'm gonna ask, I think you're letting people off the hook here. And I'm going to ask Regan to jump in. I think saying, oh, it's not up to one government. Under the watch of one government, we saw a steady descent into what a lot of people feel.

And it might be unfair, but it feels like lawlessness. And so I'm not going to let the other guys off the hook and say it's up to us to build a better society. Regan, what do you think? Well, it won't surprise you, Ben, that I agree with that. I think the point you make at the start of your monologue just there is the prescient one, which is the long national nightmare known as Justin Trudeau.

Thank God it's finally over. But over the 10 years of his time as prime minister, crime went up. That is a fact. And I think that Canadians have of all political stripes and across the country have decided that enough is enough. And you know, there's lots of stories that we've seen on social media and in the mainstream media around car

thefts and other violent crimes. And, and this is not the Canada this year and last year that we had 10 years 15 years ago, 15 years ago, 30 years ago. That's the first thing. And so I think it's, it's germane and relevant. And I think Premier Ford is certainly right to be outraged. And it's also true that all three governments have to work together on, on, on combating crime. That is true.

One thing though that I, I hope, and I'm going to offer this up to Sharon, cause I know she's a proud liberal is, you know, Mr. Carney has done a wonderful job of plucking all of the Conservative Party platform, all of our best policies. And I would encourage Sharon to have a word with her friends on the red team in Ottawa and have them take a look at the pages in the platform that talk about getting tough on crime, because bail reform and jail not bail is something that Canadians overwhelmingly support. And I told you earlier, Ben, I wasn't a moderate,

so this is me showing my teeth a little bit, but we need to get tough on crime. And there's no such thing as a conservative idea or a liberal idea in my view, it's what is a good idea. And I don't know if Sharon feels the same way. And I think that as unfortunate it is for the premier, it takes all three levels of government. Justin Trudeau is the one who really started this.

Olivia Chow at the City of Toronto was certainly not helping with her approach, but we need to get moving on this issue. All right, lastly, we only have a couple of minutes left. I want to sort of talk about Canada in the national spotlight, not as it relates to Mark Carney, but as it relates to Netflix. And if you live in the city,

you don't have to live in the city of Toronto to know the story of the reign of Rob Ford as our mayor, and he's now the subject of a new documentary. Now, our the premier of Ontario is as his brother thinks it's garbage and doesn't want anybody to watch it. I watched it and I thought it was a very fair representation. And I actually gained more compassion and for the humanity and the struggle of Rob Ford. My question as we wrap this up is, do you have an intention of watching this documentary?

And I will start with Sharon. Listen, I lived the days of Rob Ford. That was my first job in politics with City Hall, two doors down from him. And I got to live it. I got to experience it. And I got to say people have demons and Rob Ford had many of his. Am I going to watch it? I probably will.

It's a bit nostalgic. I can appreciate where Premier Ford came from. It's personal. When it's your family member watching someone kind of relive that in a dramatic way on television is hard, but your public figure is kind of fair game. But I got to say, people don't realize how crazy City Hall used to be back then. And Rob Ford was a different kind of politician.

For all his flaws, that man was the most accessible human being, like so accessible to everybody. And so, the Ford does that. Julia, I wanna hear from you. Yeah, absolutely. I have many things I want to watch these days, but just haven't had the time with all the political news that's keeping us busy here in Ottawa, absolutely. I have many things I want to watch these days, but just haven't had the time with all the political news that's keeping us busy here in Ottawa, Ben. So right

now, not on my list, but you know, I certainly did listen to the Premier's comments when asked by a reporter about it. And you can certainly feel the emotion there. Beyond the dark entry more broadly, I think, you know, regardless of what it is, a TikTok of a political hot take or a national media story, we all have to remember that politicians are people too. Regan, close this out for me in about 30 seconds. Well, I watched the documentary last night. I was struck by a couple of things. One, just how fast time flies, because a number of people who are in the documentary are people I know and respect and have time for and

we're all getting older. Secondly, I was struck in the documentary by some of the people who were interviewed. I mean, Toronto City Council is full of some of the most useless people in Canada, and we need to change down at City Hall. Three, I was struck by the humanity of it. And I think it was Rex Murphy, God rest his soul, who talked about Rob Ford as being a man of the people, by the people and for the people to paraphrase Abraham Lincoln. And I think Mr. Ford's demons are what they are. We have to be compassionate. However, we're out of time, my friend. We need more people like Rob Ford at Public Life. Thanks so much, guys. Hey, so what did you want to talk about?

Well, I want to tell you about Wagovi. Wagovi? Yeah, Wagovi. What about it? On second thought, I might not be the right person to tell you. Oh, you're not? No, just ask your doctor about what gov Yeah, ask for it by name. Okay. So why did you bring me to this circus?

Oh, I'm really into lion tamers, you know with the chair and everything ask your doctor for what go be by name Visit what gov.ca for savings exclusions may apply