The Big Flop - The CEO Who Couldn't Stop Partying: Steven Galanis' Cameo Collapse | 73

Episode Date: February 3, 2025

He built an empire on Kevin from The Office that turned into the hottest tech startup in town: Cameo. But when Steve Galanis became more interested in throwing Miami mansion parties than running his company, his billion-dollar tech darling became a digital bargain bin featuring more fraudsters than A-listers.Aaron Goldenberg and Jake Jonez (The Mean Gays) join Misha to break down how Cameo went from A-listers to Z-listers.Be the first to know about Wondery’s newest podcasts, curated recommendations, and more! Sign up now at https://wondery.fm/wonderynewsletterListen to The Big Flop on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen early and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/the-big-flop/ now.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Psst. Hey, you. Yeah, you. The one who can't get enough of the Big Flop? I've got a proposition for you. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or in Apple Podcasts, and you'll unlock a treasure trove of ad-free episodes and early access to the Big Flop. It's like having a secret map to the most notorious corporate catastrophes. Trust me, it's an offer you can't refuse. Talk about a problematic fave. You all know I love Cameo, and I use it to do a lot of fundraising. But I didn't know until today just how much of a party animal Cameo's CEO is. That's right. Today on the Big Flop, we're fulfilling all requests, especially if they involve fancy cars, lavish parties, and so, so, so, so much money being flushed down the drain.

NFTs can be flushed down the drain, right? It's kind of like the digital version of an autographed picture. Scaled into a billion dollar business in just four years. The F-Cameo has agreed to a settlement over misleading videos. After slashing Cameo's valuation by 90 percent? We are on a sinking ship From Wondery and Atwill Media, this is The Big Flop, where we chronicle the greatest flubs, fails, and blunders of all time. I'm your host, Misha Brown, social media superstar and currently available for booking on Cameo

at Don't Cross a Gay Man. And y'all, I'm so excited because today on the show, we have the perfect guests. They're some of my favorite Cameo celebs. They are social media influencers. They are actors, dancers, singers, comedians. It is the mean gays themselves, Aaron Goldenberg and Jake Jones.

Welcome to the show, besties. Thanks for having us, Aisha. Hello. And I should also say, ciao and hola. I also want to say Cameo is helping us get further from being broke. So that was interesting. I will say that. We have lots to say about that, but let's talk shit about somebody else first. Yeah, for sure.

I mean, so let's get it out of the way. What's your relationship like with Cameo? So I started years ago when I first started getting a following. That first year, I didn't really have a shtick with Cameo, and I think that's what limited the amount of requests I got. When Jake and I started doing our thing, around the holidays of our first like, Mean Gays thing, I was like,

Jake, I think if we did our characters as the Mean Gays, this would be a far more successful cameo than just us individually saying like, hey, how are you? Happy birthday, blah, blah, blah. And it was, we got so many requests immediately. And Aaron really had to convince me to get on Cameo. He did not think it was a good idea.

I have this like chronic illness where I'm like, I don't believe people will pay a dime to see anything I do. I have a feeling they don't even want to see it for free on the internet.com. I hope I'm giving you the best video you've ever been gifted because you just paid X amount of money for this shit. So I'm like, I have an anxiety about doing it, but I'm also hella grateful that anybody clicks purchase. Yeah. I mean, I want to say like, I use cameo a lot. I give a lot of my money that I make from cameo to charity. Last Christmas, I donated, like, thousands of dollars to No Kid Hungry because of Cameo, which was really great.

I mean, I've had this percent of it. Stop trying to make us look like a piece of shit, okay? We've had to call for ourselves. Can I call my landlord at charity? Because I have to pay my rent, Nisha. Jesus Christ. I will say, I beat Santa Claus last year over the holidays. So that was like my one claim to fame on Cameo.

You better work. But yeah, I love the app. I love what we get to do with it and connect with the people who follow us on social media. I'm sorry, I just have to pause. You beat the Santa Claus on Cameo is what you were saying. No, no, no, I whooped Santa Claus's ass. I thought you meant... He beat the real Cameo is the real Santa. saying. No, no, no, I whooped Santa Claus's ass. I thought you meant, which for all kids watching.

He beat the real Cameo. Is the real Santa. Is the real Santa Claus. Jesus Christ. Santa Claus, yeah, of course. Yeah. Well, today's episode is on Stephen Galanis, co-founder and CEO of Cameo, the app that lets you order custom videos from celebrities. Now, at its peak, the company was worth a billion dollars, that's with a B. But the valuation came crashing down when Stephen wasn't able to attract enough A-list talent. Oh, and his massive spending on huge parties probably didn't help things either. Now, full disclosure before we start the episode. We've been talking about I'm

on Cameo. That's right. It is a fun way for me to connect with people and it's a great way to raise money for good causes. But to find out how things got this far, let's dive in. So the inspiration for Cameo comes in 2016 when Steven is at his grandmother's funeral. Yeah, now I don't know if this is a hot take, but I'm just gonna say it. I don't think you should be brainstorming

app ideas at your grandma's funeral. Steven is 28 years old and works for LinkedIn, but he's got a pal, Martin Blenko, who works as an NFL agent. And at the funeral, Martin shows Steven a video. Again, maybe a hot take, but put your phone away at a funeral. Well, it's not like Grandma can hear.

What I was gonna say was like, the phone piece, 3,000% agree, but creativity flows in weird ways. I'm sure all three of us can agree to that. We've all had toilet ideas. If I'm at a funeral and then like a really solid idea pops into my mind for a video, I might still make that video. Yeah.

So the video is of Martin's client, the football player Cassius Marsh, congratulating a friend of Martin's who's just had a baby. And Jake, Cassius Mark is your favorite. Literally, I love him as an athlete and really just like a veteran in the field and what he looks like. Of sport. Yeah, just really great on the football. And he shows up well specifically on screen.

On screen, very photogenic, yep. So Martin tells Steven that his friend loved the video and this is the light bulb moment for Stephen. The idea, very simple. You pay a celebrity to make you a personal video and cameo gets 25%. So, when the site debuts in March of 2017, the roster of celebrities is not just small. It's... well, it's only one person. Cassius is the only celebrity they have. Mm-hmm. But, cameo, it's not gonna remain small for long because Steven has a background working in TV and their lead engineer is actually also a Vine star.

So, they've got the know-how to get stars on board. Early on, they managed to leverage those connections to get Tori Spelling and some popular Vine creators on board. Okay, if you were a celebrity, hearing about Cameo for the first time, what would you think about the app? Would you be jumping to join or pushing it away? Well, even though it had a name,

by the time that I joined, I was hesitant. I was like, I don't know that people are gonna buy these and also how much do I charge? I was like really, really overthinking that. Also, if you're charging $6.99, there's only gonna be so many people that are able to afford that. And...

$699. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Not $6.99. There's only gonna be so many people that can afford that. And maybe you only get 10 requests in two weeks, which I don't know for their ego or mental health might be kind of wonky. I don't know. I don't know.

I also think there's a little bit of a perspective on Cameo. If you are an A-lister making a Cameo, does it have the perception that you are selling out and just doing it for a money grab from these people that adore your work or your media, whatever it is, to make a minute long video that we all know isn't the most work of all time and then cash in that greatly?

I think it could come off kind of negative. I think I agree with you. There's a difference between, I think what he envisioned Cameo to be with these very, very famous people just going on there and reading Happy Birthday and cashing in thousands of dollars compared to us who are hustlers and also coming at it from a sense of community that we've built. Most of my Cameos are seeking advice and seeking a pep talk. There's a different magic to, I guess,

like people like you and I and a lot of other people who are on the platform, you know, connecting with our audiences rather than just trying to cash in quickly. So people seek cheaper therapy from you instead of getting a therapist? Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

There we go. And who's to say it's cheaper? And who's to say you might be... Because who knows how long these videos from Misha are. So true There we go. And who's to say it's cheaper? And who's to say you might be... Cause who knows how long these videos from Misha are. So true. So true. And if I'm correct, I think you get in an hour with a hair boost.

That's my hour. Yeah, exactly. Well, Steven is also a serious networker and a real people person, and he's aggressive about getting people to join. Steven's willing to pull out all the stops to try to woo celebrities. And as we'll see, this winds up being a problem later,

especially when he's chasing bigger names and has more company money to spend. But in these early days, Steven makes a really smart decision. He knows he won't be able to get the biggest stars yet, though that's what he's going to try to do eventually. So for now, he decides to go after celebs who are, as he says, more famous than they

are rich. Like us. As Steven puts it, my D-list celebrity might be your favorite person in the world. So Steven focuses on celebrities that people have nostalgia for or who are involved with obsessive fandoms. So for example, he signs up the Soup Nazi from Seinfeld, Kevin from The Office, people from Shark Tank, The Bachelor and The Real Housewives shows.

So there you go. So smart, honestly. Yeah. And Stephen's strategy, it pays off big time. In February of 2018, less than a year after the launch of the site, Stephen raises over $3 million for Cameo. And just a few months later, during their series A funding round, they raise another $12 and 1 half million.

Yeah. Thinking about the company's portfolio of they probably funding round, they raise another $12.5 million. Thinking about the company's portfolio of they probably have very little office retail space and their major expense is most likely software development. We are getting paid via the customer and they're taking a 25% commission. This is a really smart business model, which is why I'm sitting here and I'm like, I don't believe that valuation just tanked and nobody's into it anymore. Like, to me, I'm like, Cameo's still making their Kirsch money.

You're right, because they were making money because Kevin from the office, his real name is Brian Baumgartner, he brought in over $3 million. For Cameo or for himself? For Cameo. Whoa. Whoa. Whoa. Steven does run into some trouble early on though.

Trouble that involves Brett Favre. Jake, that's another one of those sports guys. No, I love Sporup. Yeah. Brett Favre, the famous... And he's attractive, yes. And he did. And he was... And he dated that famous...

So hot. Yeah. Yeah. Now, Brett Favre is not without controversy when he's not too busy getting accused of harassing women with inappropriate text or getting involved in a corruption scandal. I never found him attractive. Let's just say that. I have never enjoyed him.

I think he's not even that good at the sport. I just want to say I initially said those things and no one believed me. Yeah, that corruption scandal allegedly took millions of dollars in public money that was supposed to go to needy people. But besides that, Brett is available to send you a personal happy birthday video on Cameo. Now we must say Brett hasn't been criminally charged with anything and he declines to comment. So allegedly is a thick word these days. Allegedly. It's a thick wide word. Mm-hmm. But Brett himself isn't what causes a problem for Cameo. In November of 2018, Brett and Soulja Boy

get tricked into recording videos that contain coded anti-Semitic messages. Now, this is an issue that could potentially bring the entire company down. So celebrities are not going to be using Cameo if they think it's a PR nightmare waiting to happen. Yeah. So, Steven reacts to the coded messages situation with some of those people skills that I mentioned.

He meets with Brett in person and reminds him about all of the happiness that his other videos have brought people and does a massive round of interviews to generate good press for the company. And it works. Stephen's able to get Cameo over this potential disaster and Brett doesn't just stick with Cameo, he even decides to invest money into it. But from there, Steven and Cameo, they just keep growing, getting bigger and bigger. In 2018, Time Magazine features Cameo on their list of genius companies. In 2019, Stephen raises $50 million,

and the company grows to having 100 employees. I have to ask, when you say raises, is that raises from investors or raises as in the commission they're making from users? Raises from investors. Whoa. That's crazy. I mean, yeah, it's crazy, but it's also like they've proven to be a profitable business.

And as like any good tech startup, they would probably raise around the same. And that's what I was thinking. But I'm so glad you used those words and said it. Yeah. Now, two of those investors were Snoop Dogg and Bethany Frankel, and they also joined the app as well. And a lot of people say those two names side by side all the time. Yeah.

They're like, they're really in the same lane. They share similar brands. Lord knows I say that all the time. I mean, it's almost an iconic duo as like Tom Cruise and Charli D'Amelio. Yeah. Mary Kay andAmelio. Yeah. Mary Kay and Ashley Olsen. Yeah. People are always saying those names together. Now, by January of 2020, there are more than 20,000 stars using Cameo,

and the company has offices in Los Angeles, London and Australia. But there's still something that Stephen needs to do if he's going to take Cameo to the next level. Cameo's business model is simple. The bigger the celebrity, the more money they charge for a Cameo, which means more money in Cameo's pocket. Now, right now, they're making Kevin from the office money, but if Steven wants to start making Taylor Swift money, he's going to need even bigger stars on the platform. Like, you know, Taylor Swift. Still, things are looking up for the company in January of 2020,

though we all know what happens shortly after that. I don't remember. In January, my Viagra patent ended. My aunt broke her knee. Well, Viagra, the patent ended, so now you can get generic Viagra. That's right. I'm shocked you don't remember that. Those were huge things that shook the world.

Well in most big flop stories, COVID and quarantine would send a company into its flop era, but the pandemic actually proves to be a huge break for Stephen and Cameo, taking them to even higher highs than before. I did read this. Yeah, because people like couldn't go to their mom's birthday. So they would be like, here's your favorite housewife saying happy birthday since I can't be there. Mm hmm. Yeah, people had a lot of time on their hands. They also wanted to connect, right? Specifically with celebs. And celebs had a lot of time on their hands. They also wanted to connect, right? Specifically with celebs. And celebs had a lot of time on their hands.

Yeah. Famously, they were not used to having so much time on their hands. Now, Cameo's revenue quadruples to $100 million that year. And just like the rest of us, celebs also have more time on their hands during COVID. and they're happy to use some of that time to make videos for their fans, and also a few extra books. Over 10,000 new stars joined the platform in 2020 alone. Is that when you joined? I think that's when I'm one of the stars. You're one of the 10,000, baby.

That's crazy. Wow, you were early. I wasn't until like late 2021. Is anybody that joins Cameo considered a star? Is that just the... I think we're all stars. The heavy lifting term. As fun as my mom is on Cameo. No.

And I purchased videos from her. Well, you're lying, but that was really funny. But some of those 10,000 stars, we're talking Akon, Mandy Moore, hi bestie, Busy Phillips, Mike Tyson. Sean Bong. Yeah. Now, Cameo sets up a gong in their office that they bang whenever a new celebrity signs up. Maybe they banged for you, Aaron.

Oh, I doubt it. But also, I would hate to work in that office. I know. Yeah, could you imagine? Gong banging like a hundred times a day. No, no, no. No, thank you. To explore what celebs are on the app at this point, let's play a game.

I love games. So, one key part of the cameo concept is that it's up to the celebs to pick how much they want to charge. It's kind of a window into how celebrities see their own star power. So, I'm going to name a celebrity, and you have to guess what they charged for a video on cameo. This is everything. Whoever's closest wins, and we'll switch who goes first with each question.

So, Aaron, we'll start with you. Okay. All right. Lindsay Lohan. Oh, so she was on Cameo for a hot minute. She's not now, I don't think. Maybe she is. She is.

Okay. I'm going to guess Lindsay was 3000. Wow. No, Lindsay was a little bit more mindful, a little bit more demure. I think it's maybe a crispy, like, 999. Ooh. Like, right under a K. The answer was actually $375.

What? From Lindsay the Lohan? Yes. Famously, her middle name is The. The? Yeah. Yeah, Lindsay the Lohan. I'm sick of rumors starting. You're sick of being followed. I'm sick of being followed. Alright, next one, Jake, you'll go first.

Thank you, Jesus. Snoop Dogg. I want to say he was at like a crispy 450. That feels low for Snoop Dogg. Well, now that I just heard Lindsay Lohan at $375, I'm a little insecure. I'm going to say $1,000. All right. Well, Snoop Dogg, he started out at $420.

Yes! Jesus! Do you want to bring it down? He started off at $420. That's very smart, very good branding. Yeah, we expect no less from the Snoop. But major disappointment, he eventually raised his rate to $500. Which, come on, Snoop, what's more important,

the extra $80 or your brand? Wait, so... $420 because of weed. Did you understand that? Oh girl, yeah. Can you give me just a second to sing my piece? I feel like everybody's raised their price. Snoop is a businessman first and foremost,

let's remember that America, okay? Wouldn't we respect him to be like, I actually don't have enough time for the 420 girls, I need to bump it to 500 to be optimal for my time, my value, and people pussy potty. Here's the thing what I would say with Snoop Dogg, if you're gonna raise it, raise it. Like going up $80 to me, almost... Like I said, I think he's a businessman.

Doesn't seem... I think he's in a middle good medium market. I think he's still getting hella cameo requests. Who's next, Misha? Jake, you might be very excited about this one. This one is Jeff Probst, host of Survivor. Okay. Can I tell you something I'm afraid of? He just orgasmed.

I'm afraid people paid hella money for him. Because people ride for that man. Like when you said cult following, I maybe want to say like a sticky but sweet $6.95. Hmm. What about you Aaron? I'm gonna say $3.50. This might shock you. $20. Yes. I just came. He says that he keeps his videos inexpensive so that he doesn't price out any of his fans. But also he would get- See, this is why he is a golden human being.

He would get so many requests. How does he keep up with that? They've got to be 15 second cameos. You can cap your request per day. That's true, that's true. Well, as 2020 goes on, they're getting ready to sell their one millionth Cameo. And to celebrate and promote the app, Steven and Cameo decide they're going to do something crazy expensive. At

this point, Steven's got a ton more money to throw around and he might be thinking, hey, we're an app full of celebrities. It's time to spend like a celebrity. So they're going to send a celeb and one of their fans to space, of course, and they're calling it one giant leap for fan kind. Yeah. So ultimately, though, Steven decides not to go ahead with the promotion after George Floyd's death and the protests that followed. But Steven knows that if the app is going to keep growing and pulling in even more money, it's going to come down to one thing, which of course is getting even bigger celebrities. And Steven is pushing to get those names on the platform to the point where it maybe starts

to look a little desperate. Cameo's talent managers are told to contact celebs a minimum of 100 times a day and doubling that during Cameo's busiest season, the holidays. From what I understand, that actually manifests the exact opposite of what they want to happen. Yeah. I don't know if Steven wants to call me and we can chat through that. I understand that actually manifests the exact opposite of what they want to happen. I don't know if Steven wants to call me and we can chat through that, but that is also labeled as harassment.

Allegedly. I also am, I'm far less likely to open an email from somebody if they're like, this is our third time trying to contact you. Trying to reach you. This is our third time trying to contact you. This is our third trimester and we're struggling. Yeah, same. But if things are getting a little desperate behind the scenes and Stephen's spending is maybe getting a little out of control, to the general public, Cameo still looks like

a sure thing. Because in early of 2021, Cameo raises $100 million from investors and gets valued at $1 billion. So not too shabby. So with Cameo at its peak, Steven throws a massive company retreat called Cameo Palooza. Now once again he's willing to spend big bucks. He pulls out all the stops for this bash. There are performances by Kenny G, Vanilla Ice, and cast members from Hamilton. They feast on fondue fountains and seafood towers. And there's a singing contest judged by Paula Abdul. Yeah, I mean, he had all the star power

and all of these things. It was, this party was for 300 employees. By the way, these 300 employees, he calls them the Fami-O. That's actually cute. I like that dad joke. And see, I'm thinking like cameo, palooza and Fami-O, like he needs a couple of the girls in the gays on his like branding name team.

So as far as most people can tell, things are looking great for Stephen and Cameo, but in private, some people are feeling like Cameo may have gotten as big as it's going to get. Bethany Frankel, who remember was one of the earliest celebrity investors in the site, sells her Cameo shares for a seven figure return. for a seven-figure return. And even Steven and other Cameo founders sell some of their shares. So that makes people nervous. But why do you think Steven and other Cameo shareholders might be getting nervous and selling off at this point? I think with COVID not being as... Like, COVID itself was a very profitable time for Cameo. And then with the pandemic

coming to a close, they probably saw a decline coming. I also think like part of the natural behavior of having any level of equity in a firm is at some point selling it. And sadly, the trend is once one person sells it and cashes out pretty well, other people get the idea and harness that and wanna go with that. I think all of those points are very valid and probably contributed to a lot of why they were feeling a little bit nervous.

I also think that he had a very particular idea of what he was selling, and that was those A-list celebrities. And I think they're starting to realize that they were gonna be a lot harder to get than he expected. But whatever the reasons in public, Steven and cameo are still spending like there's no tomorrow.

They spend $60,000 a month to rent a swanky Beverly Hills mansion with a big pool. And they call it the cameo house. This is going back to his like content creation ways when he was friends with people from Vine. They're like, let's, let's do like, you know, Hyo House. This is going back to his like content creation ways when he was friends with people from Vine. They were like, let's do like, you know Hype House? You know Hype House, right? We gotta do something like Hype House. I mean, I feel like, yeah, he's like, hey, Brad Pitt, if you come join Cameo, you can come party with us

at the Cameo House. It's just like Hype House. Brad Pitt, have you ever been in a big house before? Yeah, but it does, again, that reeks of desperation to me, which I think people were starting to smell. But he's throwing around even more cash, trying to get bigger celebs on the platform, and it's starting to look, like I said, more desperate.

They spend six figures just to get Ian Summerholder from The Vampire Diaries. Okay, but here's the thing, Ian... He needs to be captured on film often. Yes. Yes. I feel like I would pay for a cameo from Ian Somerhalder. I would not because I can Google search images and videos of him.

But I want him talking to me. Cool. And saying like, remember when we were lost on that island together? Well, Cameo is spending massive amounts of money trying to get new talent on the site and it is not working, which could spell serious trouble. So what does Steven do?

He throws another huge party, of course, a friends giving at Cameo House. For the Famio. Yeah. For the Famio, exactly. You know what they say, if at first you don't succeed, do the same thing over expecting different results. Period. And that...

People say this all the time. That does not mean you're crazy. That does not mean insanity. That's not the definition. Well, speaking of the same, they've got guests like Paula Abdul. She's back. Oh, I miss her so much. She was like, I've been sitting on my hands waiting for this invite. Paula, I've missed you, babe. Well, by the time 2022 rolls around, Cameo employees are extremely fed up with Steven.

That's right. The FamiEO, they've had enough. The FAMEO's pissed. They're pissed. I guess throwing big company parties aren't a substitute for being a good boss. Now, once a week, a portion of every staff meeting is dedicated just to Stephen's thoughts, AKA Stephen Riffs about whatever pops into his head

for as long as he wants. I mean, he overshares in big ways, talking about how he has a longevity specialist and that his specialist said that his biological age is 44, even though he's only 35. It's like... What? Wait, that's horrible to say. That's a really bad thing.

My biological age is so much older than bad... Why would you share that? My biological age is so much older than I am. Are you dying quicker? I'm only 36, but I have the lungs of a 72 year old. Yeah. And these are just some of my thoughts I'd like to share with you guys. Maybe employees would be willing to put up with all of this

if the company was doing better, but it's not. Period. Steven's still not able to get this A-list talent he's wanting. And at this point, Steven and Cameo are getting desperate enough that they're willing to start booking people like the Tinder Swindler and Andrew Tate. Now, that's just smart. They're also looking into people like Billy McFarland,

Mr. Firefest himself, and Martin Shkreli on the app, along with Rachel Dolajal. Now, you may recall that Billy, Martin, and Rachel have all had their very own Big Flop episodes. It's like Stephen is going through our archives and finding people to join the app. But the fact that Stephen is welcoming these folks with open arms doesn't just piss off employees. It also causes some celebrities that Cameo does have

rethink whether they want to be associated with the app anymore. Be a part of the Famio. Totally. Because it's not always like when you're here, you're not always Famio. You know what I mean? Yeah.

And it's also not like Twitter or Instagram where anybody can get an account and it's not, you know, like this is invite only. So, how does Steven respond to these worried folks? Steven basically says these crazy employees and celebrities don't know what they're talking about. He belittles anyone who raises concerns about the type of people doing cameos.

This is how you treat your famios, Steven. Now, Steven also does what so many other tech bros who are totally out of ideas did at the time. He gets really into crypto. Mmm. Mm-hmm. He has Cameo start selling NFTs, so that'll definitely turn things around, right?

Aaron, do you know what an NFT is? A non-fungible token. I can tell you anything else an NFT is? A non-fungible token. No, I'm proud of you. Can I tell you anything else other than that? No. But I do know what it stands for. Do you know where they sold it? On the internet.

Online. Well, the owners of these Cameo NFTs aren't just getting art. They also get access to exclusive events and parties at the Cameo house. Geez. I do love that that was on accident. Join us at the Partio. Just everything is with an EO at the end for Cameo house. Jeez. I do love that that was an accident. Jordan's at the partio. Just everything, everything is with an EO at the end for Cameo, yeah.

Where's the bathroom EO? Yeah, it's over there, yeah. Steven, he always finds a way to bring things back to the partio. So let's check out what these Cameo NFTs look like. Oh, uh-huh. Okay, I see the Cameo symbol on the first one. On the first one, yeah. Can you describe these for the listeners?

Sure. I'm gonna be so honest with you, Misha. I wouldn't even know where to start. This first one on the left kind of looks like a trippy power, like neon, just sign symbols. It kind of looks like I could have made it in like a children's science museum.

Yeah, this looks like my 15 year old girl bestie in high school got some glow in the dark markers and then was like, watch this. And then she brought out her like portable black clay and this is what came up. It doesn't look yeah, it's I wouldn't pay for this. Number two, I actually, I like it. I like that little puppy dog just like laying there, living that life. It reminds me of my previous puppy. And I also love the octopus toy right next to it. I'm going to be honest, if I would have bought one, it would be this one.

And then the third one just looks like AI made this mess. I'm, yeah, it's like toast. Do not get me wrong, I do like the third one. I think it's like fun, rambunctious for the listeners. It is a bunch of hands kind of just elongated, loose. Chaotically in the kitchen. All over the kitchen counter. Making coffee.

Toast, we've got a poached egg with bacon. It's like Mr. Stretch from the Fantastic Four. And then they're looking out a window and the Horizon has a piece of toast looking at the yolk of the egg, cosplaying as the sun. Yeah. Yeah. So strange.

Well, now in fairness to Steven, when it comes to NFTs, he is putting his money where his mouth is. He spends over $300,000 on a bored ape NFT of his own. So Cameo's business is starting to dry up and it may take a while for the NFT end of the business to take off, but at least Steven can rely on investor cash to help get them through this rough patch, right? Well, in March of 2022, it starts to look like interest rates are going to go up.

Spoiler alert, they do. And that means it's going to be a lot harder for companies to pull in the massive amounts of investor cash that they've gotten used to. So it's big trouble for Cameo. Just two months later, in May, Stephen fires a full quarter of the company's staff. So this is a huge turning point that could make or break the company, and Stephen is laser focused on one thing, throwing more parties. I had a feeling you were gonna say that, Misha.

Wait, so now the really extravagant party for the FAMEO is only for 150 people rather than 300? Yeah. That means you'd probably get to kiss Paula Abdul on the lips this time. Yeah. Wow. But actually, this next massive bash in Miami is just for the people who bought cameo NFTs.

Oh. Okay, discriminatory. Got it. I feel like there was not a gay person in sight, is my guess. Just off the top of my head. I would say, I mean, I know this was subjective to where they held the event, but I'm sure there was, I don't know, the event coordinator... Oh, sure. ...probably was a homosexual and probably was standing off to the side,

like, I can't believe I just did this. Yeah. Yeah, I sold my soul. Well, you will not be shocked to learn that Steven's focus on partying and NFTs does not help Cameo turn the business around. What? No. This is shocking continuously. I knew we were on the Big Flop podcast, but I did not expect you to say that. No. Yeah, I mean, once everybody finally realizes

how dumb NFTs are, the price of Cameo's NFTs plummet from $630 all the way down to less than $8. Now, Aaron, that is not a good thing. Just FYI. Yeah, that's not a good, I understand that's not good. I don't know much about money, but that doesn't sound good to me. Steven's also finding it impossible

to attract new investors. Maybe because he's spending too much time partying. I don't know. But as the company burns through more money, Steven has to make even more cuts. And by 2023, they're down to just 33 employees. And Cameo's valuation, which was once a billion dollars, collapses by 90%. And that I also feel like is probably not good, right?

Am I correct in saying that? So it turns out that's not gonna be good either. Yeah, that's not. Trust your instinct on Just, yeah. Trust your instinct on this, Aaron. You're doing great. Maybe I should start a business. I literally think you're like an econ expert at this point. I think I could just start any business and throw fewer parties,

and it would be a success. So, there are even more celebrities leaving the app. Elijah Wood and Mike Tyson both got off the app in 2023. Elijah Wood, you love him? And as if the financial problems weren't enough, just this year, Cameo reached a settlement with attorneys general from 30 states because they allegedly didn't properly label videos

in which stars were making paid endorsements. They, of course, admit to no wrongdoing. Shit. No. That is so sad. Now, there is good news, though. The fine is only $600,000. But there's also bad news.

Steven and Cameo don't even have that much cash. Okay, I'm sitting here like, the amount of Cameos we do, and the amount of money they're making, knowing that they at that point only have 33 employees, where's that money going, Aaron? I don't know. Probably-

Alicia, where's that money going? Cause they're making heavy cash flow, okay? They have to pay Paula Abdul for all of her appearances. I was just gonna say the same thing, Paula Abdul's expensive, Jay. I'm sure her rate is crazy. It's at least $699 per appearance. Yeah.

Well, they do reach a settlement where they only have to pay $100,000, but if they mess up again, they're going to be on the hook for the other half million. Now, at this point, that's a payment that could bankrupt the company. I mean, it's an incredible fall for a company that was once worth a billion dollars. Yeah. So, if you were in charge of Cameo, how would you try to turn this around?

I think we go back to what worked, like, what made Cameo successful in the first place, and I think that would mean, for me, we start another pandemic. Yo, that is so smart. Yeah. I think that's a really good idea. Just go back to what was working.

Yeah. I do think maybe like, it sounds like Stephen with his e-gyo, his ego. You have to stop. I got to chill out. Yeah, I'm so sorry. Stephen with his ego, I do wish more CEOs stepped down when they weren't doing a great job.

Well, let's do a little, where are they now? So Steven is still the head of Cameo and he seems to have given up on the dream of making Cameo a hub for A-listers. He recently did an interview where he said, we would rather sell $1 million, one dollar cameos than one million dollar cameo. Okay.

Once again, Stephen's ignoring the good ways the platform can be used and the people doing good work on there, but he's happy to make Cameo the place to go if you want to spend one dollar on a birthday greeting from a potentially very shady person who you may or may not have even heard of. Now, some more bad news for Stephen. His bored Ape NFT that he purchased was stolen by hackers,

along with almost $70,000 worth of his crypto. No. Not Ape Man crypto. Not that. No. Not hacking. Not hacking. Not NF Non-Fungible Token Hacking. I thought he was so safe. We thought this was going to start really going well for Steven.

So, here on the Big Flop, we try to be positive people and end on a high. So, are there any silver linings that you can think of that have come about because of cameo? I have like just the silver lining of if the company is up and running, profits still remain and you don't be overly ambitious with this like crazy capitalistic country that we live in where every single year you need to have capital growth of like over a hundred percent. I think we keep forgetting that a company that's able to stay afloat and still give people good jobs including being able to make

talent money the way they are in the safety of their home, not leaving but also giving great gifts to people, maybe it's those pep talks like that's the silver lining in it all. I will say that even just from our silly cameos, there are people that have DM'd us afterwards being like, oh my God, my sister was crying when she got your cameo. In a good way. It provides some kind of special touch of a gift

some kind of special touch of a gift or joy for some people or just like a connection with somebody they may have thought they would never ever meet or speak to in their life. And it's bringing them into their phone for a video they can keep forever. I think the more we get used to parasocial relationships and the more that becomes the norm, I do think that these are special little gifts

and a way for people to connect. And I, like you, I've gotten many, many DMs and messages saying that the Cameo meant something to them and was very helpful. So I think there's a lot of excitement to it and a lot of potential there. Well, now that you both know about Cameo, the company that went from being worth hundreds of millions of dollars

to having trouble scraping together 500 grand, would you consider this a baby flop, a big flop, or a mega flop? I'm gonna say a big flop. Not quite mega because they are still around. It's not like, uh, and they're still... I mean, I don't know what their profits are for this year, but they're still around. There, I don't know what their profits are for this year, but they're still around. They're still huge celebrities on there.

And it doesn't seem like they're going anywhere. Maybe there's more stuff going on behind the scenes and decisions being made. But I'm going to say big flop just because they've had some hard times. Obviously, like if you have equity in cameo, huge mega flop. Like, sorry, girl. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But from somebody on the outside feeling and not knowing any of this information to start and actually being a part of Cameo in a very small way, I literally think it's such a baby flop.

Cute. Well, thank you so much to our guests, Cameo stars, Aaron Goldenberg and Jake Jones. Go check them out on Cameo, for joining us here on The Big Flop, and thanks to all of you for listening. If you're enjoying the show, please leave us a rating and review. We'll be back next week with an all-you-can-eat flop,

the restaurant that couldn't fathom how many shrimp constitutes an endless buffet and didn't realize we were all there for the Cheddar Bay biscuits anyway. It's Red Lobster. Bye. Bye, Amisha. Thank you guys so much. Bye, everybody.

Mwah, the big flop. Bye. If you like the big flop, you can listen early and ad free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple podcasts. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at Wondery.com slash survey.

The Big Flop is a production of Wondery and At Will Media, hosted by Misha Brown, produced by Sequoia Thomas, Harry Huggins, and Tina Turner, written by Anna Rubinova and Luke Burns, engineered by Zach Rapone, with support from Andrew Holzberger. The video podcast is edited by Olivia Vessel. Managing producer is Molly Getman. Executive producers are Kate Walsh and Will Malnati for At Will Media. Legal support by Carolyn Levin of Miller, Korsanek,

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