The Big Picture - A 400th Episode "Ask Us Anything" Mailbag Extravaganza

Episode Date: September 28, 2021

It’s the 400th episode! To celebrate, Sean and Amanda are opening up the mailbag to answer just about anything you wanted to know, in the world of movies and beyond.  Hosts: Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins Producer: Bobby Wagner Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Watch is the latest and the greatest in pop culture from best friends Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald. Join them as they discuss TV, movies, music, and much more. Check out The Watch on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Sean Fennessey. I'm Amanda Dobbins. And this is The Big Picture, a conversation show about us. It's the 400th episode of this show. To celebrate, we are opening up the mailbag to answer just about anything you wanted to know in the world of movies and beyond.

Before we begin, Amanda, how are you doing today? I'm doing well. It's been a chaotic morning here in the Dobbins-Baron household, but it's fine. I'm excited to be here with you answering slightly invasive personal questions about our lives, but that's okay. We signed up for it. They're nice. They're all very well-meaning questions. I can't imagine the answers will be that interesting, but we can try. Let me tell you about my morning, Amanda. Here's what happened. Okay, great. My daughter woke up. I went to go retrieve her from the bedroom, grabbed her,

put her down on a pillow, and we sat and we watched the trailer for Licorice Pizza nine times in a row in my living room. And honestly, it was one of the best mornings I've ever had. The baby loved the trailer. I loved the trailer. I'm on cloud nine. There's a Paul Thomas Anderson movie coming out very soon.

Did you see it? Of course. I know what I've done. I've watched the trailer to prepare for this. I'm also just I'm really happy that finally your daughter has like gotten some good viewing decisions in her life. You know, I mean, they're not her decisions. They're yours. But I feel like a little bit better about her trajectory this morning. Yeah, it was delightful. Looks great. Can't wait to see it. Yeah, it's clearly a coming of age story starring Cooper Hoffman and Alana Heim.

Pretty much as advertised, this trailer has been playing in repertory movie theaters for the last couple of weeks. It's existed as kind of a myth out there. It popped up unannounced this morning and the heads are out. I got a couple of messages from people on the Internet who shared with me that they don't totally understand the PTA obsession. In due time, I will share my continued passion for the works of Paul Thomas Anderson. Let me ask you a question. How many minutes total do you think Bradley Cooper has in this movie? Less than 12.

I would say really does not seem like a lot. Is it enough to win a supporting actor? Well, how much would Judy Dench in, in a Shakespeare in love for like eight? What was it? Yeah, I think that's right. I think it was certainly sub 10. So it's plausible. I want to say, gosh, Beatrice Strait, the actress from Network,

who basically had two scenes, but had that one extraordinary speech. It looks like maybe Bradley and Cooper Hoffman have a moment in this film in which he shares his relationship with Barbara Streisand. So that could be worthy of of an award i don't know i the one thing that i really enjoyed about the bradley cooper of this was obviously the big moment where he's knocking off the mirror and smashing out the windows in the car which has already become a gif and a meme and probably will be for for the everlasting future but pta clearly understands something that bradley cooper realized a few years ago, which is that Bradley Cooper is at his best when he's being an asshole. I think when he was a young actor, he thought to himself, I'm going to be Robert Redford.

And then at some point in his 30s, he realized, I'm actually kind of a smug jerk, or at least I am appealing as a smug jerk. And playing John Peters, you could not lean into a more smug, bigger jerk. Right. I'm not sure how much of that is PTA's realization and how far on that journey And this playing John Peters, you could not lean into a more smug, bigger jerk. Right. I'm not sure how much of that is PTA's realization and how far on that journey Bradley Cooper has gotten. I mean, enough to accept this role, which why wouldn't he want to work with PTA? But I agree.

That's when he works best. That's why I'm like, oh, he'll definitely win the supporting actor Oscar for this and then still have a chip on his shoulder because it's not best actor and not like the serious role that it's not like him being Olivier, you know, which is great for us. I think it's great too. I think him having a chip on his shoulder just means more electrifying performances. Other highlights. I did not know Tom Waits was in this movie. Hilarious to see him as what looks like a TV commercial director. Really strong showing from Sean Penn, who I had forgotten was appearing in this movie. And just the vibes. You know,

the vibes are obviously it's 1970s in the San Fernando Valley. This is where Paul Thomas Anderson grew up and where he is most comfortable. And it really does feel like kind of a prelude to the story that is told in Boogie Nights. It feels like basically five years before what's happening in that part of the world and a high school story. Where are you at on Alana Haim seeing her on screen here? So because I don't read blog posts summarizing trailers that are only available in certain areas, I was not aware that she was just co-starring in this movie. I missed that until the trailer. And I was like, oh, wow, A Haim sister is co-starring in a PTA movie. Interesting. And that makes a lot of sense.

They have sort of the Valley connection. And I think certainly some of that Haim sister's visual mythology has been enhanced by PTA. He's directed a couple of their videos. You know, open to it. Sure. Sure. It's a wait and see. Yeah yeah they have some jams i'm pro uh i'm very pro cooper hoffman i thought he looked really promising i don't i've never seen him in anything before obviously the son of philip seymour hoffman

um so he has incredible pedigree i'm just i just really uh i just want to see this movie that's that's where my head's at i just i've been feel like I've been waiting for this movie for a really long time it'll be a fun November when we talk about it okay should we go to the mailbag? yeah 400 episodes you said? wait

before we bring Bobby on how are you feeling about 400? I mean it's not 500 you know you like Bradley Cooper always with a chip on your shoulder

unbelievable no not that. It's like, what are we going to make it? I mean, an incredible achievement. We did it. We yelled in microphones about movies like 400 times, give or take. I mean, it's mostly you. I, you know, I take some plays off.

So congratulations to you on 400 episodes and me for, you know, swanning in when I feel like it. But when you asked me, I often think about how, like in the early days of the internet, I had an editor who was just like, you know what? Enough with the 15th anniversaries. Five, okay.

10, great. 20 and 25. You guys are just like trying too hard with 15. And obviously the internet proved him super, super wrong. Bad take. Yeah, but 400 does feel like a little like 15. You know, it's like not quite, it's not quite 20. It's not quite 25.

It's better than 35, I guess. But, you know, it's great. We're all here together. Every 100 means something. That's how I feel. Maybe it's just our centennial mind, but I feel like every 100 has to mean something. What does 400 ultimately mean? Nothing. It obviously means nothing. I don't even know if

I counted right. Maybe this isn't the 400th episode. And if it isn't, I apologize. We don't number them actually. And there's obviously been some confusion over the years. This show started out on the channel 33 feed. It started out largely as an interview show. It has evolved over time. I would say this show really found itself when you joined full time and we started talking about the Oscars together. It's obviously been, it's a huge part of my life now and it's been an amazing experience doing it with you. So I'm very grateful, very grateful to all the people who listen to this show. And I'm always, always heartened when people say, hey, I checked out a movie because you talked about it on the show. That is the best thing that you can say to me

because that is the reason why I'm doing it. And also to spend time with you and to spend time with Bobby, which has been just a good experience. You did the nice answer. And now I feel like a real jackass. I forgot that post-daughter, you're really nice again. I really like doing it too.

There are some questions in here that I will try to be more sentimental in the answers I have. I can share emotions on a specific level. How about that? That's fair. You run a little cold and I run a little hot. Bobby, you keep us medium temperature.

Should we open the bail? How are you feeling about 400, Bobby? I feel great. I feel like we've done 400 episodes. This last year and a half has really felt like we've done 400 episodes just in that amount of time. But I'm obsessed with the frequency that we're vibrating at with Amanda saying 400 to start the pod. I love that energy. Like I said, hectic morning. I told you guys I forgot really to have like my breakfast before

we did this podcast. In case you're wondering, it just hit. But that's okay. That's going to keep me on my toes. I'm thrilled to be here with both of you. No, I kind of like it though. 400 is not 500. You're right. First question is an Oscars question, which is hilarious. James wants to know, I think that we've gotten this question or a version of it a couple times, but it's always fun to check back in with it. If you had to bet on one living actor or actress who has not won an Oscar to win one someday,

who would be your top bet? Well, I think there's one person that you and I have cited many, many times on the show who it seems almost inevitable that they will win at some point. That's Saoirse Ronan because she's been nominated so many times and she's not even 30 years old. So that feels like an easy one. Is there anybody that is outside of Saoirse Ronan that you feel like could be on the board? What is this? Like, I'm going to take your answer and then make you give another one on that. Yes, that is what it is. I mean, I know you so well. I knew exactly where you were

going and I was going there too. Well, one of the reasons, in addition to the fact that Saoirse Ronan has been nominated four times under the age of 30, which is astonishing, but because of Oscar history, which is really Hollywood history, and also, frankly, just there are still fewer roles for women than men. The women tend to, with the exception of Glenn Close. Glenn Close, we love you so much. Maybe you'll win an Oscar, but I actually wouldn't put money on it. But for the most part, you get nominated a lot as a woman.

You eventually win. Chalamet is an interesting one, right? We compare him a lot to Leonardo DiCaprio and he has been nominated but it took Leo forever to win an Oscar. And there are, I think with the men, it

just gets crowded more quickly, especially the leading men. So Chalamet seems comparable to Sersoirse. Obviously, they've been in a lot of the same movies and are kind of tipped that way, but it doesn't seem as sure of a bet to me. I think in both cases for both men and women, they tend to make people wait. Glenn Close is still waiting. Amy Adams is still waiting. There's a long list of actors who are still waiting. You know, Chalamet and Saoirse Ronan

are so young. And you're right. Chalamet was nominated sersha ronan are so young and you're right chalamet was nominated for call me by your name sersha ronan been nominated i think either four or five times at this point and i mean it could legitimately be 30 years 40 years 50 years before any of them win i mean that's the i'm actually you know what forget that the academy awards will not exist in 50 years i don't know what i'm talking about at I was literally just like at that point, it's like who outlasts the Oscars? Yes, unless it's held in the volcano that has destroyed us all. I don't think we'll see that.

But there are probably fewer and fewer people who can emerge with the level of sort of movie star fame that those two have at the moment, or at least industry movie star fame that those two have, where they're sort of being recognized at such a young age. So I guess I'll go with them. Is there anybody who's like a little bit older who you feel like has a chance to win i mean you mentioned cooper that's that's a pretty good one right jill and hall seems like really gunning for it yeah who are the people who are still

just kind of like serious actors i mean amy adams is a great question right there's been the drumbeat for her for years she's also on quite possibly the worst streak of movies of in in recent memory she's very cold right now um god who else i mean we're 35 under 35 margot margot robbie didn't win an oscar right she was nominated twice and hasn't won yep nominated for itinated for I, Tonya, I believe. It has not won yet. Also, filmmakers we haven't talked about. You know, there's a handful of people like I don't think Barry Jenkins has won an Oscar yet. I don't think Rian Johnson

has won an Oscar yet. Paul Thomas Anderson. There's a long list of... David Fincher? David Fincher. There's a long list of great directors that we talk about on this show all the time. Some have won in the writing category, like Sofia Coppola won in the writing category but never won best director quentin tarantino and everyone best director so then we start splitting hairs where we talk about kind of like did you win one versus what category did you win it for etc etc gerwig bomback yeah

yeah that would be nice we shall see maybe with um the adaptation of don't tell those white noise that's me talking about licorice pizza but one year from now watching the trailer for white noise yes great okay what's next bobby courtney asks what is one movie you were totally out on when it was first released or when you first saw it but have since done a 180 on do you have one for this i do actually i had to think hard about it because as we all know i'm'm very stubborn, uh, and never changed my opinion. So it's not a recent one, but, um, I believe I was 17 years old when legally bond was released and I was in high school and it will surprise no one to learn super type a overachieving type saw it with two blonde friends. And I was like, I don't know about this. And these jokes aren't they aren't that

funny and my friends rightfully were like yeah but you're a nerd and you are like trying to go to Harvard whatever spoiler alert I didn't go to Harvard and you're wrong and this is a great movie and you know what they were 100% right it's an absolutely delightful 100% holds up movie I I don't think I realized that you were you blonde shamed. You were you were out on Legally Blonde. I mean, I just like I was 17. I was still trying to figure myself out. Then I figured out that, you know, Harvard sucks and it's good to have a sense of humor. That's interesting. I guess I probably have had some slightly more esoteric examples of that. I remember in 1995, a book came out called Spike, Mike, Slackers, and Dykes. It's a book about independent cinema in the mid-90s,

a certain by a guy named John Pearson, who was a producer. He worked in distribution. He famously kind of helped discover a lot of filmmakers. This is a book that covers Spike Lee and Richard Linklater and Kevin Smith and a number of other filmmakers during that period of filmmakers. This is a book that covers Spike Lee and Richard Linklater and Kevin Smith and a number of other filmmakers during that period of time. That book was very eye-opening for me in terms of how to make movies and how movies kind of make their way across the world. I had already seen Days and Confused by this point, but I had not seen the movie Slacker. Obviously, Slacker is literally in the title of this book. This is Richard Linklater's debut feature. And I watched Slacker. I think I rented it from Blockbuster in the mid-90s. And I was like, this is not good. This has no story. This has bad performances. It

looks like shit. And I had not totally wrapped my mind around the idea of independent filmmaking and how there is a difference between Universal Studios paying $75 million for a production and a kid from Austin, Texas, you know, spending six months catching as catch Ken to make the movie that's literally in his dreams with 30 grand. So it probably, it takes a few, it takes context, I think, to understand movies. That's the thing. I think we talk about this on the show all the time. Sometimes it's easy when you sit down and you're like, this is the Wizard of Oz. It will change your life. And it totally takes your breath away when you're a child and it expands your mind and makes you think movies can do anything. And then other times you see a movie like Slacker, which is this deeply

idiosyncratic and associative and just very strange parceled out movie. And you don't know how to process it, how to interpret it if you're 14 it might not make sense to you and over time i've come to realize obviously link later was on to was really on to something you know he had a real a real sense of time and story and uh the quirkiness of the individual is like a it's a hallmark for him and that movie is all quirkiness of individuals that's the whole point of the film so um that's my answer slacker i love slacker right from the start i'll bet you did independent cinema just you know it's my natural language yeah that was did your parents show you that while you were sitting on the pillow okay what's next um chad wants to know and this is

maybe an example of a question that we should hold and do in the future as its own episode. But should Hollywood retire movies like baseball clubs, retired Jersey numbers, forbidding a modern remake? What movies would you retire first? I think you're right. This is an incredible idea. This is a good episode. Amanda, you suggested this could be a West Side Story compendium appendix, something to tack it on to. Because, well, West Side Story, you know, it's not like west side story is perfect it's not perfect no but it's beloved and it's iconic

and so there's a question of should it beloved in iconic films versus films that are perfectly executed um i what what do you think let's define retirement like what should be retired in your eyes i i think movies where it's just a losing like exercise to even try to remake it and that's my anxiety about west side story even though once again it is steven spielberg making this movie with a script from tony kushner those two guys they're pretty good at what they do but you know they're not using the jerome robbins choreography which is like a big red flag for me and i think if as soon as it's just gonna be like the the blog posts of compare and contrast and a movie that lives so large in so many people's imagination that you can't even get past

it to have the conversation about interpretation and like oh this is doing this with it and this is updated and whatever some things are just kind of etched in amber for better or worse and i might be wrong about west side story but that's this question you know gets at my anxiety about this remake and the types the types of movies that i'm just like can we just can we leave it can we leave it yeah i think a reasonable example of this would be Casablanca. Sure. Casablanca, which Bobby has not seen, is... I'll watch that for the 500th episode.

Okay. Deal. We'll see you during 500 in hell when we are all burning. That's a movie that there's literally no reason whatsoever to try to do it again. It actually made so much sense in its time, given what that story is about and the sort of the setting that to remake it would be completely

foolish. And obviously it features iconic performances and, you know, beautiful, you know, it's filmed beautifully and it's an incredible moving romantic story, et cetera, et cetera. There's just no upside. Does that mean that it won't be remade? It might be remade. I don't know. If we get a hundred years away from Casablanca, maybe someone will say

we need to remake a new romance for our times. Nothing is sacred in Hollywood, but maybe we should just, we'll choose 10 that should be off limits in the future. What do we got next?

Mary asks, can we ever expect a pod of the top five best book to movie adaptations? Did we not do this? I really thought we did an adaptations episode. I don't think we did. We did it? Did we?

This is, that's how you know we're at 400. Maybe. We might have answered this in the mailbag. Maybe it was stage to screen. And that was the. Yes, we did do stage to screen. And that was the. Yes, we did that recently. Yes, I know. I and I know we talk about it all the time and we normally get like, what book would you adapt as a mailbag question?

I'm sure I have five. I definitely have five. But the book to movie transition is often more fraught than I mean, it's, you know, inspired most of the great films. And it's also if you actually love the book, can often be pretty frustrating. Yeah. I mean, you've, I think you've cited The Secret History a couple of times when we've talked about this as a film that you'd love to see. I've cited a couple of movies. I mean, I might've mentioned White Noise, I think a few years ago, which is, and you know, sometimes you can will it into existence by saying that but the secret history

and white noise are very difficult books to film we saw with the goldfinch a couple of years ago just how difficult it was to translate that donna tart novel so it's a real careful what you wish for circumstance i think if you really have a special relationship to a book that doesn't necessarily mean it should be a movie. In fact, oftentimes mediocre novels, we saw this in the 70s all the time, mediocre novels turn out to be great books. You know, Jaws is like a good book and it's an amazing movie. And that happened over and over and over again. Stepford Wives, I thought was like a good book, really cool movie. I don't, do we get that as much now? Do we get the mediocre book

to incredible film adaptation? I feel like that level of, maybe because there's just not as many adaptations that are made these days. Maybe we don't see it as often. I mean, I don't know if I would put

Nicholas Sparks quite in like the mediocre category, but like the Lee and Murray already turning into Big Little Lies, which again, now that's going to TV and the notebook is based on

like non-literature, but these things were where it's plot. And then the plot can be jazzed up, does still work as a book to movie experience. Um, but I think you're right that our lists would be like, you know, weird over thought, like great novels that then don't totally work out on the screen. But speaking of this, can I make a book recommendation right now? I'm I'm I haven't finished it yet. So no guarantees. But I'm in the middle of The Great Circle by Maggie Shipstead, which I believe it came out earlier this year is like one of the celebrated books of the year. I'm not like breaking new ground here, but it's about a lot of things. But in some ways, it is about adapting.

It's really about biopics, but adapting someone's life to the screen and movie adaptations and, frankly, just how wrong everything is. As someone who loves biopics, it's really interesting to read. There's a lot more going on here. And it's just like a novel-ass novel if you like reading those sorts of things. You know what I mean? It's just like I'm 400 pages in. We're still going. There are lots of characters.

We're covering space and time. But I think it's wonderful. And I have been thinking a lot about movie adaptations as a result. Yeah, I was thinking about this recently. Eileen, my wife, just discovered George Saunders. And I think she heard him on the Ezra Klein show. And was like, he was phenomenal. Who is this? And then just started reading. That's an Eileen. I love you so much. Perfect Eileen story.

She's best. But like, and now maybe I'll put Lincoln in the Bardo and Eileen's hands, but like I, so many times I have read Saunders stories or books and been like, this should be a movie, but like none of them can be a movie, you know, like Pastor Ali, it can't be a movie, but I feel like it should. And that to your novel ass novel point, you know, there's so many books like that. They're like Gaddis books that I was reading in my early twenties when I was interested in that version of fiction. You know, obviously the DeLillo novels I saw, I think it was announced that Theodore Melfi is making Libra, which is the DeLillo JFK movie.

And it's like Theodore Melfi, you know, he made hidden figures. He's got this movie, The Starling that just came out, which is the DeLillo JFK movie. And it's like Theodore Melfi, you know, he made Hidden Figures. He's got this movie, The Starling, that just came out, which is okay. But like Libra is a major, major, that's like a CR Bible. That's one of Chris's favorite books of all time. Makes me a little nervous, the idea of adapting that. So it's, I almost like, I'm afraid sometimes when it gets announced that a book that I like is being adapted. Okay, let's go to the next question.

CD asks, if you three were in charge of the rewatchables, what would be the next three movies on the feed? Casablanca, so Bobby watches it. I want to know Bobby's list. I'm probably going to get a chance to do many of the movies that I want to do on the rewatchables I don't know when I'm going to do them like the things that we agree on so you know not okay so if we were doing it together yeah so it wouldn't be like the deep cut action movies that you guys love and I'm like wow I didn't know about this until it shows up on the rewatchables feed and I learn a lot from you guys every week it's really special um in a lot of ways I feel like the rest of the world is like sometimes learning what it's like to work with

you bill and chris when it's just like huh this movie yeah okay i'd love to learn about it um but it's but that's but in a nice way it's nice to work with you guys so i think no no one believes that no one believes anything you're saying. It's like the more you say, the less believable it gets. Exactly. It's just spinning your wheels. It's unbelievable. Okay, so I think Casablanca is a good example

of like if the three of us were doing it, you and I love that movie, Amanda. It'd be a great opportunity to expose Bobby to it by necessity, not just by suggestion. Wag, so what's one movie you would you would want us to focus on on the real well i didn't think a bit about it necessarily as like i would have to be involved in it because i thought of immediately i thought of a rewatchables movie that i feel like a lot of people around my age talk about and love and have a lot of long-winded conversations about

is eternal sunshine of the spotless. I want no part of that. I do not want to be anywhere near a podcast recorded about Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. It's too deep. It cuts way too hard. But I do think that that would be good fodder for rewatchables. So, you know, Casablanca to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, double feature.

What do you say? What do you say? I, as you know, I love Eternal Sunshine. I think that we have not done right by jim carrey on the rewatchables jim carrey probably probably the the is he like the signature star of my youth i don't mean that he made the best movies i don't mean he was the best movie star but in terms of like a person who kind of owned the youth culture from 1993 to 1997 or 98, he was dominant. He was everywhere.

Will Smith, I think, is in that category. Sure. You know, like, and I know that he's, it's just a couple of years after Jim Carrey. And so you're a couple of years younger than me. So because of that, like, I think Will is your guy. I don't know if Jim Carrey is like like my guy but we watched him go through the stages of fame that like dustin hoffman went through in the 70s and like he in a very strange way he represented the arc of movie stardom during my youth and i don't think we've ever done a jim

carrey movie oh that's so interesting i was gonna say that adam sandler would be that person for your generation but that's more that's like a SNL that's like a Adam Sandler's super famous obviously I don't mean to imply that it's like a pet project or like cool liking Adam Sandler but that you guys kind of focus on him as opposed to Jim Carrey makes sense yeah I love Adam Sandler as you know it's it's it's not that I probably like Adam Sandler ultimately all in more than Jim Carrey. But we spend a lot of time on that show. Bill obviously has a lot of films from the 80s that are really important to him.

And he's filtering that appreciation through the show, which is awesome. And Midnight Run has always, since I've known Bill 10 years, for 10 years, Bill's been writing about Midnight Run for 20 years. So obviously stuff like that is hugely important. Chris is kind of the bridge between us. He's kind of right that middle age between among the three of us. So I think sometimes we converge on stuff like Thief, you know, the Michael Mann movie. But there is a whole bunch of stuff out there that I think from

my generation, from your generation, Amanda, or whatever, your kind of like micro mini generation, and then your Spongebob generation, Bobby. I prefer to think of myself as the Forget sarah marshall generation when craig horlbeck the producer of the rewatchable suggested that one i was all all in craig and i have talked about those comedies where we're like that is just they got to talk about it they're just so funny yeah i mean craig has had some influence too you know we've done some movies because craig has said

you guys really should do x craig is too powerful powerful you guys gotta knock him down a couple of times maybe so um anything else any other movies you want to see is amanda is there one like in your heart of hearts that you're like why can't we just do this movie i mean there are several we still i was promised four weddings and a funeral and i was taken away because no one else at the ringer wants to do it wow like yeah Like, yeah. Is that true? Yes. Like Juliet does not like that movie. Bill's wife loves that movie.

So I'm like, hopeful maybe one day we'll be able to do it together. But like Bill was going to do it. Anyway, it's fine. Four weddings and a funeral. You know, we've never done Sleepless in Seattle, which I think would be a really interesting one. We have done When Harry Met Ty. We have done You've Got Mail.

The random 90s non-rom-com one that I just really need to do, my most rewatched movie is Apollo 13. Yeah. You know, not to bring up Space Camp again, but just like, oh my God, let me do Apollo 13. That's a great one. That's a really great one.

And then there's obviously like a list of classics that are being held on ice over time. Yeah. The Pulp Fictions and the Boogie Nights, etc. So, okay. We'll never be in charge of that feed. So this is all but a wish. What's next?

Jen asks, will studios regret moving upcoming releases to theaters only? How specific was Shang-Chi's success to that film and or that type of film? Studios are going to regret everything, man. It's a tough time for them. I feel like the noise is getting loud on what is the point of the streaming wars right now. Yeah. Because Shang-Chi is doing really well.

Shang-Chi, it's only like the 16th most successful MCU movie, but given the context, you know, this movie is now bigger than stuff like Ant-Man. You know, like it's actually doing really, really well. It has not even been released in China. And so there is a sense that they may have miscalculated that, that there's still a hungry audience. On the other hand, it's MCU. So there's built in audience and there's an expectation that there's going to be at least a kind of quality to this movie and a reason to see it because of its connectivity that we've talked about so many times on the show. If you work for NBC Universal and you're making moves towards Peacock, okay, let's say Halloween Kills, the new Halloween movie that comes out in a couple

of weeks, straight to Peacock. How will you know whether you screwed that up or not? Is there any way to know like did you sacrifice bottom line dollars and that the stock price is taking a hit? Or do you drove X millions of subscribers to the service? Like, Amanda, for you at least, you know, we're lame in this process. But how do you figure out if something worked or didn't work? Well, I think the answer to that is really in the flip side. You can't know if you won, side you can't know if you won but you can definitely know if you screwed up and I don't know how many blog posts you read the

headlines of this weekend that were like dear Evan Hansen is failing but on streaming it could have been a success um which that and that was just the take people trotted out which frankly I don't really understand why why can't we just let a bad movie fail sorry sean i know that you cried a lot but um it's just mean there's no reason for that but but i do think i mean that again is a universal movie and could have gone to peacock and i think there is an argument that on streaming it at least would have found the younger audiences who are perhaps less mean than I am and, you know, relate more to the subject matter. And whether that's a good thing or not is a separate conversation. But so when you take a chance on something and you put

it in theaters and it fails, like everybody's going to let you know big time. And so I think maybe now in some ways, not publicly failing is a definition of success. And I think that's certainly true for stock prices as I understand stocks, but again, a separate podcast. Yeah, I mean, this is obviously- That's a podcast I want to produce. Just all the things we understand about stocks.

It's very little, candidly. It's less than little. But this is a... Get Chris in on this. I know. Have you noticed he'll just start citing the Fed every once in a while? It's really amazing. He'll just be like, cheap money, Chris.

Janet Yellen. Hi, we love you. This is a business question, though. I'm interested in the business. And I bring up the business on this show all the time because I think that that context question, though. I'm interested in the business, and I bring up the business on this show all the time because I think that that context matters, too. But let's use Licorice Pizza as an example. If Amazon decided to buy MGM UA six months

before it actually decided to do so and pay billions of dollars for it, it's possible that that deal could have closed before Licorice Pizza was going could have closed before Licorice Pizza was going to come out. Licorice Pizza is definitively made for a movie theater. It is a movie that is designed to be amplified on the biggest screen possible through the best sound system. Not because there's incredible CGI, not because it costs $300 million, but because Paul Thomas Anderson is a cinema artist. And that sounds highfalutin, but it is true. It is something that he is very specifically

committed to. There are obviously a lot of filmmakers who are still committed to it. We're going to get into that with Denis Villeneuve later in October, because he obviously is one of those people with Dune that is thinking the same way, though doing things in a slightly different way. Watching Licorice Pizza at home, if it's the only way you can watch it, of course, that's great. Being able to expose people to culture that way is wonderful. But if you have the chance to see it in a movie theater, it's better to go see it in a movie theater. And just because licorice pizza is... Licorice pizza is not going to make $100 million at the box office. It might not even make $50 million. This is a coming of age story starring two people that most people have never heard of. So the expectations in the business sense are probably low. But what a success.

Would you regret releasing Licorice Pizza? No. If you're Mike DeLuca and you work at MGM, you're like, I bankrolled a Paul Thomas Anderson movie after giving him his huge break with Boogie nights i participated i contributed to the ongoing vitality of film going so that's like that also is kind of sentimental and a little bit like touchy-feely but you can't fail by putting licorice pizza in a movie theater you can lose your job but you can't fail that's my that's my passionate pitch i think i think it's beautiful and i wish more people thought that way. But, and you're probably right, but that's true,

what, for maybe five directors. Anyway, I'm excited to see Licorice Pizza in a theater. I hope all the old people near me wear masks. Could the old people just put your masks on?

I think everyone should put them on personally. I agree, but. Okay, what's next? Brian asks, can I get a Wikipedia summary of your biographies? Been piecing it together, but it's tough. I feel can I get a Wikipedia summary of your biographies?

Been piecing it together, but it's tough. I feel like I need to know more about what makes you two tick and Chris Ryan as well. You want to start by giving the Wikipedia summary of Chris Ryan? Started as an MI6 agent, came over here to Grantland.

Yeah, no. He was born in a coal mine in 1876. And he dragged himself out of that mine circa 1957. And he's just been wheezing ever since. He drives a Ford F-150 through the desert and he tries to track down people killing other people. I like the idea of CR as like an immortal vampire. You know, he's been around for hundreds of years.

What's your Wikipedia bio, Amanda? Like, what am I supposed to start? Break it down. And what references do you have? How can you confirm some of the details you'll share? Oh, yeah. This is very stressful. I don't know. Are we supposed to do early life, career? Are we breaking... Am I doing the sections or am I just doing the top line? Let's do the top line. We only have an hour here. I don't know um i i'm a person who has worked in media since the mid-2000s i don't know are you doing wikipedia

voice yes a person who has worked in media the wikipedia of it all made me nervous i don't know i don't like this at all. It makes me very uncomfortable. I moved to New York after college. I worked on the internet and then I worked at New York magazine. And then I, at some point moved to Los Angeles and worked with these guys. And podcasting didn't, podcasting did exist when I started my career, but I wouldn't have said that I would ever have thought that I would be doing this, let alone on a 400th episode. Yeah. I've talked to, I don't, I've talked a lot about my background on this show and on other shows. And I did a whole episode of long form

once upon a time where I talked all about my life. Um, as far as podcasting goes, yeah, I don't, when, when we started the ringer, I was like, I will not be podcasting goes yeah i don't when when we started the ringer i was like i will not be podcasting i very specifically was like i do not want to be podcasting so um that has been a big change in the last five years um and like there's a variety of reasons for that you know obviously the industry has evolved a lot our our business our company has evolved a lot um but i don't know i'm from new york i'm from long island knows that. I talk about that on the rewatchables all the time. That's true. Yeah. Hell yeah.

Hell yeah. Long Island. Long Island. The Mets, Bobby, you know about the Mets? There's a Mets question coming out. Don't worry.

I'm very excited about that. I don't, is there anything I haven't revealed that I should reveal Amanda about my, my biography? I don't think so. If, if there is, I'll be sure to do it in an embarrassing fashion later on this episode or future episodes.

One of the things that I like about the show and especially doing the show with you is it does reveal true aspects of my personality. You know, my like insane unhealthy competitiveness, you know, my overweening sense of organization, my sincerity. I think you bring out it because I like to rub up against your frictive nature and be a little bit more emotional. I wouldn't be quite so emotional with another host. That is true. That's nice.

Yeah, I prefer to reveal your biography and anecdotes. I think that's the best form of storytelling. And we've already told the birthday dessert for one story here on this podcast. So that's, if I had to tell Sean and describe Sean in one story, that's it. So sometimes a man needs his cake. That's all I'll say.

Okay, what's next? Well, now that we're talking about your friendship, I'm going to skip around a little bit because somebody asked specifically, Amanda asks, when did you two realize you were friends? What was the moment? I'd love a Sean and Amanda origin story. I'm assuming, Amanda, that this is not you who asked this question. I didn't ask this.

I'm not trying to relate this. Thank you to the other Amanda. But just, you know, I'm getting really uncomfortable. I will say, so Sean and I met through my husband. And it is 10 years ago this week that I met my husband. Wow. Yeah, because it's the 10-year anniversary of the Anna Faris film, What's Your Number? And I very famously met my husband outside an all-media screening for that terrible film.

And then we didn't speak for like three more months but so you and i would have met sometime this fall as well i think 10 years ago i i i think the first time we had a conversation was i guess it was 10 years ago but i want to say it was at a christmas party um yeah at the woolly at the woolly um which is also when i identified that you and zach were going to get married yeah it's very sweet sean actually told that story in his toast at our wedding so that's a true true story it was someone asked if zach baron is real as one of the mailbag questions and like when is he gonna come on the podcast be so mad it's like that's just someone that just listened to the podcast.

Zach Barron is a very public GQ staff writer. Yes, Zach is, he is realer than real. Trust me. I pray for both Amanda and I that Zach is real and not a figment of our imaginations. Otherwise, it's been a tough go last 10 years. It's quite a movie. But yeah, I think we met at that party.

I mean, we probably said 10 words to each other at that party. I don't remember having some big conversation. was very crowded yes very intense that was a different time in our lives and felt like frankly a different time in the media when a new york magazine christmas party was the place to be at that time but um i don't we told the the avengers screening story i felt like that was a big one oh yeah that was it that's true and that's also when i met andy greenwald for the first time because we went to flatbush farm afterwards um and you guys taught me a lot about comic books that real that really does set everything in motion i was like okay so who are these people yeah and then and then you guys shared let's let's go back to that that post avenger screening if you could know at that time

that you would be roped into several dozen podcasts about the mcu and lord of the rings and all this bullshit that we talk about would you take it or leave it it's such a great question how much knowledge do i have about kind of what the mcu becomes because the thing what if i recall like avengers they were like know, jokes and it was like very getting the gang together. And I was like, Oh, that seems pretty charming. This is how you guys spend your time.

That's cool. And then it was like long paragraphs dictated at me about what the movie did and did not get right. So, but you know, I was just like trying to make nice. It helps that Zach also didn't know what was going on. So it was,

it was the two of us just kind of like nodding and being cool. Being cool in scare quotes for what it's worth. In that moment, I guess I would have signed up. But the 25th recitation of those blog posts in person does wear on a person. Sean had to explain what the Infinity Gauntlet was to you at that screening. I don't think it would have lasted.

Is the Infinity Gauntlet in that movie? No. No, but the stinger is going deep into the comics. Yeah, the stinger was literally

the first time we saw Thanos. That was the first time he appeared in those films. But I will say, behind the birth of your child, that was the greatest moment of your life, right?

Gosh. When will I show I was thinking? Gosh. When will I show? I was thinking about this. When will I show my daughter all the MCU movies? And will she give a fuck? Will they seem like, you know, the Indiana Jones movies by the time she's old enough to recognize? Anyway, long story short, at that drinks, it was not just me and Andy Greenwald who were talking about this stuff. But Sean Howe was there, too.

Our friend Sean Howe, who wrote the definitive history of Marvel Comics he wrote an incredible book about Marvel that I would recommend anybody that's listening to this show read just because it's a great like cultural history but you know nobody knows more about that stuff than Sean so he was like and also an authority that was there for us so you really like slipped into the nerd chamber like I'm actually behind Andy and significantly behind sean in terms of my knowledge of that stuff so that was a that was that was tough exposure and nevertheless you came to work at the ringer and we've been friends ever since that's true doug you know what i that sounds like really you looked into the middle distance like what have i done that was tough do you want looked into the middle distance. Like, what have I done? That was tough.

Do you want to know the honest truth? I was thinking about Flatbush Farm and I was thinking about how it was like we were probably there at 11, like still drinking beers, just like totally free having the time of our lives. And even if it was talking about weird nerd stuff and just I was thinking about when will I ever do that again? That's that's honestly what it was haven't been out at a bar past 9 p.m. in years now we've now entered years that's pretty scary the first time I met Sean I was engineering a podcast about succession and the first time I met Amanda I was covering jam session and she was talking about a Beyonce cover shoot

so oh that's nice very on brand for both of you guys. What year was it, Bobby? 2018. What did you think when you first met Amanda? This is a dynamo. This is a true talent. This is someone who I'm going to work closely with and help mold into greatness. We were recording in the terrible chapel studio. So to be honest, I was not worried about like interpersonal dynamics.

I was a lot more worried about screwing something up because I was like, this was my job until an intern and you were also so far away yeah i was like through a glass wall so it wasn't really a meeting situation so much as me afraid to to break something did i record a podcast about succession yeah about the succession finale yeah we had to do all our famous favorite characters right and i did did Tom because I was right. When I was working as a writer, I don't know if you felt this, Amanda, when you were working as a writer, but I feel like I'll never forget any piece I've ever written. I feel like I know the sentences that I liked, the sentences that I hate. I don't have everything committed to memory, but I know everything I've written. Podcasts, man, they're slipping through my fingers.

I have no recollection of recording a Succession podcast in my life. That's great. I mean, I love Succession. I adore Succession. But that's weird that I don't remember that. I should, I, boy, I'm losing it. I think it's good to move on. I'm trying not to carry all of that with me.

Okay. All right. What about you, Bob? You've engineered thousands of podcasts now. I don't remember any of them, including the ones last week. Fair enough. I hardly even remember the beginning of this podcast. Doug asks, after a few years being on a podcast together, when you watch movies now, how often do you find yourself wondering what your co-host would say about the movie? I honestly, I do this every time now. You do? Yeah. Oh, that's nice i would say i was gonna say

that for the most part especially with like mediocre movies i mean we watch a lot of movies and not all of them are like the things you get really excited about so for most movies i have a sense of like this is a sean movie like he'll be interested in this or like this will speak to him um but i will say for like the exciting movies or the big movies i still maybe have a sense but like sean is one of like the only people that i actually want to talk to about the movie which is like the the nicest thing that i can say about sean basically that is nice i i think i'm most excited not to figure out like you know not to predict whether you liked it or didn't like it. But if I if I have an opinion of what I think your opinion is and then you go the other way, that's usually the most exciting version.

I think of the show of the conversations that we have where I'm like, oh, you actually liked this. And this is and you like really know clearly why you like or the or the other way where you're like, this is why this really doesn't work. And I'll tell you why um i think it's really hard because right now we've had a couple of examples recently like i obviously i hated free guy i don't know if you saw that the free guy the scene that i talked about in the movie like had a big moment on the internet this weekend i did yeah um where i i want to i can't josh lewis the podcaster posted the scene that I talked about on Twitter and like, was like, this is just horrible. This is really the worst shit ever that I saw somebody, you know, applaud for in a movie. And a lot of people kind of went after him and they were like,

let people love things. And that whole bullshit narrative started again. It was bad. But anyway, you know, that movie, Dear Evan Hansen, we've had a couple of movies recently where we were like, whoa, we really hated this. Like this really, This really did not work. Most stuff, most films, most TV shows are not horrible anymore. Most things are just okay. We're in this massive ocean of okay. And even stuff, there has been stuff that I think people have piled on to Wonder Woman 84, Malcolm and Marie, where people were like, this is garbage. And even I had struggled to see those things as garbage. On the flip side, very few things are transcendent anymore. Very few things are like, this has filled me with the spirit of excitement and joy. And it has opened my mind to the way

that this stuff works. So it gets tricky to one, like how you're going to feel about something specifically it's exciting when you're like this is shit or i absolutely loved this but it doesn't really happen that often honestly i think especially we've been in an 18 month slog sort of in terms of really new exciting things because a lot of movies have been held back and a lot of other movies just do kind of feel like they are getting slotted into the content you know holes that they're meant for and and maybe that's a little bit our fatigue too of like it's 400 episodes and it's like okay i know this is gonna be for this and we're gonna you know we're just like we're all trying to do a job while doing other things so i'm excited for

all of the fall movies in part to get to see really good movies but because I do think we're gonna have like that exciting moment of like oh my god we loved this like Mank you and I are two of the only people who really enjoyed Mank I've been written out of that narrative but that was so exciting also because after like months of just being like okay trolls world tour I have to say very slowly and you know whatever else just hearing the name of that movie really sense memory holy shit oh my god early 2020 darkness um we had something to actually be excited about and to be like oh what did you think and you know what about this and what about that and these choices um so i think we still get very excited about it. It's just, it's been a slow going season for it.

You know, I was thinking a little bit about 2019. We had this incredible period of time where Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, which was a big movie for both of us. And then we had Parasite and Marriage Story and Portrait of a Lady on Fire, all in this very concentrated period of time, all four incredible

films. And I hope we're getting back to a moment like that. Nothing I have seen this year is really on that level. I've seen some good movies. I really like The Power of the Dog. I saw The Last Duel on Friday, which I am very much looking forward to talking to you about. I think there's, I think this October- Oh, that was sad. You're the face that you made that no one else can see it's fine i'm like i'm you made a face no no that was not negative i i i i'm i'm i'm not allowed to share my opinion about the film but um it was not a negative opinion i promise you there's a there's a fucking venom movie coming out on friday you know what i mean like there's stuff for me to look forward to here but it's not it's not the same as tarantino fincher etc with licorice pizza maybe there'll be maybe there'll be joy maybe maybe or maybe you'll hate it and you'll shock me and then i'll have to uh

excommunicate you from the pod i'm not cruel i'm i'm often difficult but i'm not cruel and put that on a poster often difficult but not cruel well it's true I like I can't imagine like leaving licorice pizza and not feeling anything okay

Bob are you excited about licorice pizza I'm very excited yeah okay I think that Phantom Threat is one of the last movies

that I felt that strongly about in the theater experience and so I'm excited I was just looking while you were talking about your

you'd be excited if licorice pizza made 50 million dollars Phantom Threat made 47 million dollars at the box office worldwide that did good business And so I'm excited. I was just looking while you were talking about you. You'd be excited if Licorice Pizza made $50 million. Phantom Thread made $47 million at the box office worldwide. That did good business. But it also starred Daniel Day-Lewis. Exactly. So a slightly different situation.

But that's... I heard that Ford v Ferrari snub, Sean. You just snubbed it in 2019. I like it. I like it. But I'm not in your weird dad gearhead mode of like, vroom, vroom, give me the cars stuff that you're into bob that's not my thing uh okay let's go on to the next question aaron asks what are your go-to

yearly movie traditions for example watching a christmas story on christmas eve i don't i don't have movies that i automatically put on on holidays except muppet christmas carol which my wife is obsessed with which i've mentioned in the past. She wants to watch that every Christmas day. But I do like to watch Jaws once a year. I do like to watch There Will Be Blood once a year. There are a couple of movies that are in my personal rotation. I assume you have some nightlight movies that you like. Yeah, of course. I mean, for Christmas, I do Sound of Music every year and I will like watch it on ABC with the commercials, even though I also own it. So, you know, that that's just like a tradition of growing up and being used to it. I I like to do You've Got Mail

in the fall at some point for the, you know, the cranberries scene with the bouquet of freshly sharpened pencils if you haven't seen it in a while like a pretty delightful fall movie especially if you're not on the east coast as i am currently not i i mean i definitely have a lot of movies that i revisit but none those are the two that like are attached to a calendar i would say yeah i guess maybe maybe we'll start some yeah my family grows you know we'll start popping out what should we put on like uh solo every thanksgiving you know that'd be great what about what will you show her for halloween um faces of death probably good yeah

you know just something just light watching i can't believe how many absolutely horrifying horror movies i've shown this child already. I really can't either. It's truly insane. I don't know what I'm doing. I'm just unfit. Okay, what's next? Well, speaking of your child,

Jeremy wants to know, can you make a top movie list that are must-sees for your kid? His kid is about a year old, and he's been thinking about this for a while. How do you come up with a reasonable list of movies that they need to see at certain ages? I genuinely don't know

the answer to this question. I hope he doesn't mind me saying this, but Brian Raftery, our friend who hosted the Gene and Roger show, his kids are very film literate and he's done a great job of introducing them to stuff.

And they're very open-minded and broad-minded. They'll watch old films. They'll watch animated films. They'll watch films with adults. You know they have their receptors are open and like that's really the only thing that is important to me um if as long as she is willing to accept all the different kinds of movies because that's really like one of my personal missions on the show is like high and low american and international absurd ridiculous difficult ridiculous, difficult, complicated, serious, funny. I just

want there to be like a flexibility and an open-mindedness in the taste. I don't have like a viewing schedule. I know that's probably hard to believe given how I organize my viewing life, but I don't intend, with the exception of The Wizard of Oz, which I always talk about on this show, there's not anything where I'm like, we have to show her blank. What do you think? Should there be some sort of syllabus? Well, I don't know. No, there shouldn't be a syllabus, God.

Please spare your daughter from spreadsheets as much as possible. I'm going to just march in and tear them up as I can. But I remember as a child having certain movies presented to me. And I think you do as well. And that's kind of our shared interest. I know like you remember wizard of Oz. I remember sound of music. I remember Mary Poppins.

My husband remembers star Wars and he remembers like galloping around like the TV that they would roll out to the, to the star Wars theme, which is really cute because it's really hard to imagine my husband is a little child otherwise um your husband who is a real man who is he's a real person but i honestly like his kid pictures they don't really look like him there's we should do some investigating anyway wow no are you saying he's like a plant or like a cyborg what is going on here here? My mother made us Christmas ornaments last year because we couldn't go home for Christmas last year because of COVID and we always travel.

So my mother very sweetly made two Christmas ornaments like for our Christmas tree. And one was a picture of me as a tiny kid to go on the Christmas tree. And there was like another picture in the box of a child. And both Zach and I were like, did she forget to put a photo in it? And then we took us a second. We were like, oh, it's Zach.

So that's not just me. Wow. But he really loved Star Wars. And he remembers those moments and those like movie nights with his family. So I don't know whether you have to like make a rigorous schedule but i think like at some point once kids are allowed to have screens which i i don't understand how all that stuff works me neither like that idea of being like now now we'll try this you know don't you get nervous though that she'll hate stuff yeah that's why i don't want to put too much on her you know actually eileen and i

had a conversation this weekend about bambi you know because bambi of course is you know considered one of the great disney classics but also is this very traumatic story about death about parental death and on the one hand i think like i i want this child to have the same kind of like hollowed out but but sensible uh approach to life that i you know, where it's like you can take the difficult stuff because you've been exposed to the difficult stuff. But also she's a perfect little completely uninformed on it, you know, influenced thing. And her sweetness is every that's the whole thing. It's like this is there's been no bad has happened yet. Everything is safe. is every that's the whole thing it's like this is there's been no bad has happened yet everything is

safe and so the idea of exposing someone who is having that experience regardless of how old they are to something scary and dangerous is intense it's just a totally new way of thinking about culture um just like anytime you watch it i watch a movie now where something happens to a child i'm like fuck this is the most dangerous movie ever made how did they get this movie into theaters this is wrong so i i honestly don't know what i'm gonna do tough advice for jeremy but you know you gotta make sorry sorry jeremy jeremy go with go with your heart that's my yeah share the things you want to share and and you know if you make it special i feel like the kid understands that it's special or at least sean and i did my parents are not big movie people But they did show me Star Wars and when I was like 16, they were like it's time to watch goodfellas Here's your culture. That's great. It's really good. This is phenomenal

All right, Liam also explains why you work here at the ringer Bobby it yeah Well Liam asks a movie is being made about the ringer. Who is in the cast? Who directs? What happens in the film? Is Chris Ryan the villain or the hero? I don't know. That's kind of binary. Is Chris the villain or the hero? I think he's like good cop, bad cop.

All in one. He's a complex, key supporting figure. Right? We did make a few of these short films back in the day. Remember this? He was the star of many of those films. And Chris was always the star of them. And also, in some ways, the villain.

Remember the... What was the basketball morning show spoof? Oh, yeah. Wake Up and Dunk It. Yeah, yeah. With Tyler Parker. Where Chris was. Wake Up and Dunk It. Yeah, yeah. With Tyler Parker. Where Chris was both the director and the villain. Yes, that's right.

He was a John Milius-esque madman behind the camera. Famously, Take Hunter. He was Take Hunter. That's right. That's true. He and Jason Concepcion and Micah Peters were, I don't know, Take Investigators? What was their job? Did they have a job? I don't know take investigators what was their what was their job did they have a job take honors that was a that was a special time yeah uh i don't i mean i think

bill would be uh angry if we did not cast matt damon as bill um i think he's made it known how much he admires the work of matt damon um cr i think, probably played by a young Jason Statham. Okay. Yeah, that's good. In the past, we've said, I think I said Anne Hathaway for you

and you said Ed Norton for me. Yeah. That's fucking perfect. I think that still tracks. Yeah. Wags, you'd be played by Chris Pratt.

No, please, God. Can you give me Logan Lerman or something? That's pretty good. Yeah, that's pretty good. Who would direct this movie,anda i'm thinking roland emmerich make it a disaster film yeah probably that's a good one i don't know would it bobby is there anybody you'd want to see uh lensing the ringer story but it wouldn't be a very good story honestly just a lot of people

like just kind of bitching at each other all day and then there's a lot of cross talk at the ringer story but it wouldn't be a very good story honestly just a lot of people like just kind of bitching at each other all day and then there's a lot of cross talk at the ringer I was gonna say it's probably a Sorkin movie you know that was horrible that's like that's that's a nightmare I agree but it's just like a bunch of people mouthing off it's so funny and they really like sports you know I feel like when was young, I wonder if you felt the same way. Sorkin obviously influenced by all of these kind of screwball fast-talking movies from the 40s and 50s. You watch those things.

You watch Sports Night. You watch The West Wing as a kid. And you're like, I want to be like that. I remember watching shows and movies where I was like, I love how smart those people are. I love how reference-bound all of their conversation is. Lo and behold, we find ourselves in reference-bound conversation every day on this show.

But now I look back on it and I look back on that aspiration with cringe and self-loathing. I'm like, this is absolutely so lame that I watched this show with like five Gilbert and Sullivan references. And I was like, that's the coolest thing, man. And so, but that would be a just fate if they sorkonized our career work here. That would be, not that anything has really happened of note that would be emblematic of wherever media is going,

but that would be just desert. I agree. It would be, I mean, let's just be real. Anything made about The Ringer would be mortifying. But I will say as someone who's currently watching The Morning Show and has watched every episode of the morning show, it just a new fan respect for Aaron Sorkin.

It is, it is hard to do what he does and make it look corny, but successful. Yeah. I still like Aaron Sorkin. It's more just seeing yourself rendered in Sorkin is, is terrifying. Okay. Matt proposes a hypothetical situation. If both of you were a successful director or actor, pick one movie that has already been made

that you would star in and one movie that you would direct. This is not a remake. This is a time machine situation. You get to replace the person in history. Okay, so I have a follow-up question. So I just get to be the other person and take credit for the work of film?

Yes, just the one work of film. I don't think that you get to be the other person and take credit for the work of film or. Yes. Just the one work of film. I don't think that you get to steal their entire filmography. But also, do you actually direct the movie or do you just get credit for directing? They say, do you want to have the experience? I think you just like put yourself in right when the movie gets released. And it's like, Sean, you directed this. Congratulations.

Now go talk about it this is a tricky question because do you want to direct something that was not successful that you could potentially improve or do you but i thought that you're not changing the result of the movie this is not a remake situation this is right now just this is like you are francis ford copppola when The Godfather comes out. So my answer is obviously it's Sleepless in Seattle so I can be Nora Ephron. But is it that you're becoming Nora Ephron

or you're becoming like the essence of Nora? I'll honestly take anything with regards to Nora Ephron. You are just ascribed the authorship of a film. You made it now. I see.

Even though Sleepless seattle is like my third favorite nora affron film but she didn't direct when harry met sally that's the one i would pick and i've already mentioned you've got mail on this podcast but i have no idea how to answer this question i mean i there are obviously millions of movies that would be wonderful to be credited with having created. It's like, I don't know, The Maltese Falcon, Dazed and Confused, Avengers Endgame. Those are all good choices. I don't really.

Please don't do Avengers Endgame. I'm a little bit. But that's the most successful movie of all time. If you get the money, then feel free to do Avengers Endgame. I like that movie. I have no shame about that. Gosh, I don't know. I mean, there are some movies that,

you know, like Ocean's Eleven, for example. Like everybody likes Ocean's Eleven. If you don't like Ocean's Eleven, you're suspect. So it would be cool to be like, I made Ocean's Eleven. I could just walk into the room, walk into a room for the rest of my life and be like, do you guys see Ocean's Eleven?

And that was me. I came up with all that stuff. Also, then you would be Steven Soderbergh, which is a great answer. I should probably say Steven Soderbergh, which is a great answer. I should probably say Steven Soderbergh as well. Okay. As far as actor, I don't want to act. I don't want to have credit for having acted.

I have no interest in that whatsoever. I think it would be really fun to be Pierce Brosnan in the Thomas Crown Fair. Everything that he's doing in that movie, from wearing the suits to going on vacation to the lifestyle that he's living, it seems from wearing the suits to going on vacation to, you know, the lifestyle that he's living. It seems pretty great. I want to change my answer.

I actually want to be one of Paul Schrader's lonely men. I don't know which one. I don't any of the movies. American Gigolo, First Reformed, Cat People, Light Sleeper, The Card Counter. Any of them will do i just i want to spend three weeks with paul schrader where he tells me about what's inside of his soul and how i have to reflect that with my stoic personality my guy i know he's crushing it right now with completely problematic takes extraordinary time for paul schrader one of the absolute genius monsters ever i love him okay Arnold asks, which golden age actor or actress

would you most like to see in a modern movie and what genre of movie would it be? That's a cool question. Yeah. I mean, there are a lot of answers. I'm going to go with Gene Kelly because we're in an age of musicals right now and they all suck.

So bring back Gene Kelly. Yeah, that's a good one. I like that. I was thinking about a certain kind of character actor slash heavy that i really like in movies i really like richard widmark i feel like every time richard widmark would show up in a movie he'd be like whoa this guy is gonna make trouble and i like an actor it's like when you see michael shannon in a movie and you're like oh this guy he's gonna he's gonna blow somebody's top if not his own um so i would mark would be cool i think um i'd love to know what how a an actress like

joan fontaine would be modernized like what happens when you put somebody who feels so or claude colbert or someone like that who's so definitively of a time and if you transported their look like what would they even look like with modern styling i always want because those those actors from that period especially the 30s and 40s they're almost like a they're almost not human they're styled in a way they're speaking that sort of like that deep atlantic informed speaking style that you know katherine hepburn had they just don't feel carrie grant had the same thing they don't really feel like humans you know, Catherine Hepburn had. They just don't feel, Cary Grant had the same thing. They don't really feel like humans. You know, we've moved so far into naturalism and now into sort of like ultra naturalism in our acting. So it's like Robert Downey Jr. is

like the ultimate version of ultra naturalism. You know what I mean? He's so mannered, but so regular at the same time. I am always interested what someone who is like Rita Hayworth is an example of this Ingrid Bergman is an example of this he's like deeply romantic vivacious beautiful but also kind of otherworldly figures if you just transpose them into modern times anybody like that for you that you just love to just see on screen well I mean carry good Rita Hayworth is another person I actually do think you could put in the musicals with Gene Kelly and that would be fun. She like, you know, there is she is certainly otherworldly in her beauty, but approachable. Some of them could get there. Cary Grant, though, like George Clooney has just been trying to do that for 25 years.

Sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't. That's true. Devotions 11. Catherine Hepburn, they've, you know, given people Oscars for being her in movies, but it would be fun to see how she would adapt. Like they're really fun. You couldn't, could you remake bringing a baby now? Like, I don't know if that zany energy works and those people kind of shrieking at each other.

It would feel so bizarre, but I wish we could still make movies like that that's what i would like to see feels like licorice pizza has a little bit of that energy yeah it does but there's also i i didn't answer the what movie oh i did because i would have said thomas crown affair that's who i would want to be but it would be really fun to be katherine hepburn and bringing a baby also i mean you would need to have impeccable timing, which I don't. You need to be Catherine Hepburn to pull it off and have Cary Grant opposite you. But I would love to see a lot of the more screwball people and screwball comedies that just, as you said, we don't do the really arch hyper-stylized screwball movies anymore. Yeah, it's true okay what's next bobby what

a asks what movie do you most closely associate with your own life again i need more info here how did you interpret this well i asked zach this sometimes when there are like questions about you know my opinions or things i run them by zach because he has to live and die by them every day and he sometimes knows the answers better than I do and he was just like that seems like a very personal question what movie do you most associate with your life I was like I don't really know so I like I have I have no idea how to answer this I think is it what movie feels closest to experiences that you've had in your life or what movie you think that's what it is bobby yeah i i think it's not like what movie feels most close to you personally like affected you the most i think it's what movie built a world

that you recognize reality in probably man Man on Fire. Mad Max Fury Road. I mean, I've mentioned I've mentioned Adventureland a couple of times. I think that that's pretty close. You know, Greg Mottola is from where I'm from. He clearly had similar experiences

to the ones that I had. He was like kind of an arty kid but also trying to be popular trying to appeal to girls working a job very middle class backgrounds you know like a little awkward but also a little overconfident like I I really identified with like the the the setting the world like the the characters that he created in that movie you know he transposed it to Pittsburgh but it's clearly just Long Island.

And so that's probably one of the biggest times I've seen a movie and been like, whoa, this is scratching my brain, you know, in a very specific kind of way. I think also like Almost Famous came out when I was like, I will be a rock journalist. You know, I will write about music and talk to musicians for a living. So that was probably one that resonated too.

Yeah. I think the early years, the Nora Ephron movies, I were like, oh my God, I didn't know you could do this. Not that that reflected my world. I did not. Grew up in New York City and did not have access to like, you know, sparkling conversation and arguing about caviar as a garnish but but definitely like recognize something in those characters and the way they talked and the the way that a life could be that resonated with me that that that I wanted to experience and the later example of that is is Greta Gerwig which I'm I'm not as smart or funny as anybody in a

Greta Gerwig movie but what she sees and how she expresses it up on the screen like definitely something inside me like wakes up and it's like oh I didn't know that you knew that but then you put it on the screen also one addendum to my list is American Gigolo just going back to that what's next we're calling an iso for amanda here because aaron asks what is the definitive ranking of nancy myers's kitchens i'm so ready for this i'm gonna go off the top of my head okay number one controversial choice because it is being renovated in the context of the movie but i think the original something's got to give kitchen pre Steve Martin expansion is really what I'm looking for. I love that, you know, the Island, but it's not like, look at my two Islands and a Nancy

Meyer's kitchen, you know, beautiful cabinetry. You've got the, the nook for seating, which I think is an underrated aspect of a kitchen. You want a place for people to gather. I'm very partial to that, that Santa Barbara home in, in Something's Gotta Give. No, wait, it's complicated. It's complicated is the, the Meryl Streep, Alec Baldwin, Steve Martin one. Number two is Something's Gotta Give.

Sorry, I'm messing up my Nancy Meyers movies. They aren't very specific, but titles, which is the Hamptons Kitchen. That's like the archetypal Nancy Meyers movies. They aren't very specific, but titles, which is the Hamptons kitchen. That's like the archetypal Nancy Meyers kitchen, but I like something with a little more character. Number three, it's outdated at this point because it's nineties. The father of the bride kitchen is very lived in, very nice, um, very functional, which you want. Number number four this is just a writing credit technically but I think a lot of Nancy Meyers is in baby boom and you can't sleep on the Vermont baby boom kitchen

which is very beautiful inspired like cabin whatever on Instagram for sure check it out if you haven't seen it what movies am I missing missing? The Holiday, I don't really think. Obviously, that's real estate focused, but they don't really spend a lot of time in the kitchens. And the Cotswold Cottage is very cute, but not a super functional kitchen. What about Nancy Meyers' actual kitchen, which we got a chance to see once upon a time?

Oh, with the two islands. Yeah. I mean, it's beautiful. I think it's not. I guess I would put it above the Baby Boom Kitchen and maybe like tied with Father of the Bride Kitchen. I'm going to say my lowest is the Intern Kitchen. It's a little too HGTV makeover for me personally. And I know that's what they were going for. That's obviously the most recent.

Too mod. I think it's, well, and i think it's probably accurate with what is in a brooklyn renovated townhouse in 2015 or whatever that movie was released but i she's comfortable in california and the hamptons you know that's when they really shine that was a bravura performance that was a lot of like i just watched michael jordan take shoot around just a lot of detail about kitchens i can't say i've identified any off top that was just not there were no notes i feel very strongly that the it's complicated kitchen does not need to be renovated even though meryl streep's character is like that's what she's always wanted to do

is expand the kitchen because she's a professional chef. But she has the professional kitchen to make the croissants when she needs to to impress Steve Martin. You're literally more interested in the sanctity of the existing kitchen than having a plot device

to move the story forward to make the movie happen. That is a commitment to kitchens unlike any other. That movie is so good though. It's just, it's so beautiful, you know? I like that movie. Okay, so we called an ISO for a bundle.

Let's call a quick ISO for Sean. Kyle asks, what movie best describes the last 20 years of rooting for the Mets? I don't know if this is an ISO. This sounds like a collaborative project for you and I, Bobby. I have an easy answer for this. It's Saw.

I'm going to go actually even more bleak if one can go more bleak than Saw and say John Hillcoat's adaptation of Cormac McCarthy's The Road. That seems like really how things have been going. I read this morning

that over the weekend, the Mets confirmed officially their 10th losing season out of the last 13. This is a team in Nework city for crying out loud with a 200 million dollar payroll 10 out of 13 seasons losing what the fuck what is going on fix it that's all i can say fix it i feel like i just opened pandora's box um i'm so mad about sports right now. I need licorice pizza immediately because sports is destroying my life.

I'm at home all day. It's fucking awful. When was the last time the Jets had a winning season? They went 10-6, I think, in 2016 under Todd Bowles. Yeah, but prior to that... Why didn't you have a better attitude about that? Because they didn't make the playoffs. They went 10-6, but they missed the playoffs. they haven't been to the playoffs in 10 years and they

look like garbage amanda i know it's it could it literally could not be worse right now i know it's not fun to hear me bitch about this on the podcast holy cow it is mock five level garbage no we got a lot of positive feedback from your completely random and uncalled for mets and jets rant in rant in the last episode. It just came out of left. And you were talking about movies that made you upset. And you were just like, speaking of things that make me upset, the Mets and the Jets. Well, you know what it is? There's honestly a reason for this. Obviously, I really care about those teams and I watch a lot of sports. I work at the ringer for crying out loud. But being at home with the baby a lot, you can't do as much active watching. So you have to do more passive watching.

So I can't necessarily always fire up a movie or a TV show. I need something that can kind of be on while I'm tending to her or doing the dishes or whatever the hell you're doing in your house. So sports is actually on even more than it has been in the past. And it's so bad this year. It's punishing.

It's like it's mocking me for spending more time with it. So I'm seriously considering cutting it off for a while because it's making me really unhappy. And everything else in my life is making me so happy. So it just feels like I need to make a healthy choice for myself. I stopped watching the Mets about 10 days ago. I can't do that anymore. Very smart.

I think that's good for both of you. Thank you. I'm reading books. It's phenomenal. Going outside. All those things sound really healthy. Okay, Neil asks, after the major triumph of getting to do a commentary

for a Criterion Collection release of Visions of Eight, what potential future title on the label would be on the wishlist for another Shawn Amanda Chris commentary? I still can't believe that happened, by the way. That was cool. That was very cool. Definitely imposter syndrome for me, but cool.

Do you have an answer? I have one. Well, I want to do something that I love, but i think would also make us all a little bit uncomfortable you know like well there's two ways to go there's there's like should we do the snyder cut but for criterion you know i mean like should we find a really bad movie that we can make fun of that's i wouldn't be fun i mean i'm in the pta mindset and it's like something like inherent vice I think would be really fun to do where it's like even if you don't love the movie there's so much to unpack and unravel and talk about that is interesting Inherent Vice obviously not on the Criterion Collection right now that something

like that that is like contemporary but old like older minded and has lots of nooks and crannies and kind of wormholes that we could go down to discuss. I think that'd be really fun. What about for you? I guess mine's similar. I want to do Moneyball, which should be on the Criterion collection. And also you and I were not a part of that rewatchables. And it was very early rewatchables. And that's just an incredible film. And, you know, all of our interests, sports, Brad Pitt, Aaron Sorkin, all of the above.

I like your pick. Great thank you wait also speaking of moneyball did you happen to watch uh the nfl game last night and then aaron rogers's interview afterwards i did how can you not be romantic about football which he just did a moneyball quote i lost my mind that was fantastic god bless and rogers you're back one i've always been pro Aaron Rodgers. Great to see him thriving once again. Two, I don't know if you know this actually, but the Mets need to turn over their leadership entirely in the off season

because things have gone so poorly of late. The number one person who has been tagged for that job to run the team next season, Billy Bean. Really? It's a no for me, dog. It's a no for me, dog. We can unpack that later. We only have time for one more question, but it's just going to be a no. me dog it's a no for me we can unpack that later we only have time for one

more question but it's just gonna be a no the amount of times i've used how can you not be romantic about baseball in a shit-eating way in the last five years is just um okay like i said time for one more question yeah claire asks could you name your all-time favorite cinema experience so i'm assuming this means like in movie theater, right? And not just like favorite movies. Yeah, I think that's right. In theater. I have a few.

I'll never forget on my first official date with my now husband, we went to see Margaret, a 9 p.m. screening of Margaret at the Quad Cinema in New York. And you know what? We survived and now we're married and that's going great. But that's a really iconic one. I just can't imagine. You want to put any context around Margaret, the three-hour Kenneth Lonergan American tragedy?

Like truly one of the saddest, darkest films ever made? Right. There you go. I'm like still kind of shocked by it. We went to, is it the commodore is that a bar in parks low afterwards at like and it's like 12 30 by the time you actually get there and just i remember kind of like sat silently like we didn't really speak to each other for a long time we were just like huh okay so we saw that movie do you think Zach was scheming on the proposal

like at that moment? You think he was like, this is it. I found love. I found love in the afterglow of Margaret. He's still defended. He's like, yeah, I was on the cutting edge. You know, they waited however many years to release it. And finally we saw Margaret.

That's tough. I don't, I've talked, I think in the past about a couple of ones that I've really loved like a grindhouse came up on the on the show recently the you know death proof and um planet terror the rob robert rodriguez and tarantino double feature that was just a pure like I went to the movies by myself and I don't know if I've ever had more fun for four hours but the one that sticks out of my mind and I feel like I may have mentioned this in the show before, it's not some great masterwork of cinema, but I was 11 years old. And unannounced, my dad was like, I'm bringing you and your friends to the movies for your birthday.

And the day after my birthday, Robin Hood Men in Tights, the Mel Brooks classic, semi-classic, not quite classic. Imagine being 11 years old and seeing a Mel Brooks movie for the first time. And then that opens a whole portal of a world to the producers and Blazing Saddles and Spaceballs and all of those movies that I fell in love with. I still worship Mel Brooks to this day. Speaking of people who I'd love to talk about on the rewatchables, Mel Brooks would be another one.

But yeah, I mean, me and five of my friends went to go see Robin Hood Men in Tights. We were introduced to Dave Chappelle for the first time. First time any of us really saw him on screen. And we're totally transported. Loved, loved, loved, loved, loved it. And had the best day. So movies, they're really special.

They can change your day. Is that it? Are we done? Yeah, I think that's it. Great. Well, thanks to everyone who submitted a question. Thanks to everyone who listens to this show. 400 episodes in.

Amanda has agreed to formally do at least 400 more. I'm still in negotiation. So you can expect an 800th episode mailbag, Amanda only, which will be really exciting. Thank you, of course, to Bobby Wagner for all of his work on this show, not just today, but over the years. Really appreciate everybody. Later this week, we're pivoting back his work on this show, not just today, but over the years. Really appreciate everybody. Later this week, we're pivoting back to TV on this show, because

there's a Sopranos film coming out. And so we're going to be talking about The Sopranos, but there's also a Sopranos movie. It's called The Many Saints of Newark. It's a prequel. We're going to be welcoming on the Sopranos expert here at The Ringer, Justin Sales, who on the website, theringer.com, is ranking every single episode of The Sopranos expert here at The Ringer, Justin Sales, who on the website, theringer.com,

is ranking every single episode of The Sopranos ever and writing about them. I have been told that this piece clocks in at over 30,000 words. It's done. I've been tracking the word count and Justin's still with us. I'm pleased. Justin, of course, is a great guy. And in addition to Justin, who, of course, is a special guest and perhaps even more special guest the man the myth the legend David Chase creator of the Sopranos

he and I had a nice conversation a couple of weeks ago looking forward to having you hear that we'll see you then on the big picture Thank you.