The Big Picture - ‘Furiosa’ Is Here! Witness It!

Episode Date: May 24, 2024

Sean and Amanda dig into a spoiler-filled conversation about George Miller’s newest installment in his ‘Mad Max’ canon—the Anya Taylor-Joy– and Chris Hemsworth–starring ‘Furiosa: A Mad Max Saga.’ They discuss how it compares to 2015's ‘Mad Max: Fury Road,’ whether comparisons are fair or useful, the performances at the heart of the film, its visual prowess, its spot in the year of movies, whether it will have any chance at the Oscars, and more. Hosts: Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins Senior Producer: Bobby Wagner Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Wake up, babe. Bandsplain is back. That's right. Your favorite extremely long music podcast has returned. And this season, we're talking grunge. As usual, there's goss, there's tea, there's an excessive amount of facts and info. And you know what? There's nine hours on a band that rhymes with schmurlschmam, plus much, much more. Listen to new episodes of Bandsplain with me, Yossi Salek, every Thursday. Get groceries delivered across the GTA from Real Canadian Superstore with PC Express. Shop online for super prices and super savings.

Try it today and get up to $75 in PC Optimum Points. Visit superstore.ca to get started. I'm Sean Fennessey. I'm Amanda Dobbins. And this is The Big Picture, a conversation show about Furiosa. Witness me, Amanda! Oh my God. Today we are discussing at length the fifth film in George Miller's Mad Max series,

Furiosa colon A Mad Max Saga. Nearly a decade in the making, this is one of the most anticipated movies of 2024, if not years. So should we dig in? Yes. Should we dig in immediately? So your relationship to the Mad Max series is what, Amanda? I have seen them all, and I respected all of you when you lost your minds about Mad Max Fury Road, however many years ago. And I also respected Mad Max Fury Road. But I would say in general, it is respect rather than enthusiasm. I genuinely think that they are a major accomplishment and i almost think of these movies um as like veering towards fine art um where this is an incredibly skilled filmmaker who is expressing so much through the visuals of just like big rigs crashing on each other and like and like push it it's like almost moving sculpture right and there is you know and the imagination in like the world building of

this post-apocalyptic future everything looks so specific and cool and gross and singular so there is like a real like visual language that he's invented and is iterating on over like many many years but i think i do respond to it more as like visual fine art than some sort of saga that I'm emotionally invested in. Right. Can there be a middle ground between those two things? I guess for me, there's probably a middle ground. You know, I don't think that I would not describe myself

as a Mad Max psycho. I think there are some people for whom this is their favorite franchise. It's a franchise that has existed for going on. I think it's 45 years now, the first Mad Max film, 1979. And there was a huge break in between episodes three and four of this story

between Beyond Thunderdome and Fury Road. And I don't think anybody thought we'd come back to it. And now we've got these two films in a 10-year period that are stylistically much more similar to the first three films that came along. I like the story, but I weirdly think that the story is ultimately somewhat incidental. I think it's like a frame to accomplish a lot of what you're describing. And also for Miller to explore, I think you're on point insofar as like there's a headier concept of myth and biblical power that interests him and maybe like nuclear fear and a

few other things that he's more interested in the big concept than in the specific experience of the individuals other than the physical like everything is through the physical expression and so it makes for very very exciting movies and in a way these these movies, and I've just rewatched all of them this week too, are this interesting salve from the last 20 years of franchise entertainment where you don't really need

to have seen any of the movies to care too much about what happens in the movie you're watching. Yeah. There's not a lot of homework, even though there are a lot of chapters beforehand.

There's not, the world building is kind of vague. And even the locations and the characters that recur you know you don't need to know too much there's not a lot of lore i mean i guess there is but the in george miller's mind but it's these aren't like plot monsters and in fact the narrative is pretty much the same throughout you know like the characters are introduced and maybe have slightly different motivations and how much Furiosa expands on or changes that character

or motivation is like something that we could talk about but you know it it's just it's people trying to survive through road war you know and it's like i mean and the ideas there are as you said a lot of ideas but they are more like visually signified and explored than they are narratively even or i guess the visuals are the narrative yeah i've often wondered what would happen if george miller let like aaron sorkin come through and write the dialogue for one of his films how different they would feel because there is something very direct. Yeah. And even in the previous Fury Road film

or in the previous Mad Max films, you know, Mel Gibson famously has very few lines of dialogue. There's a big echo of that in this movie where Anya Teller-Joy plays Furiosa. Right. And her older stage has very few lines of dialogue. It's basically the noisiest silent films of all time. That's what these movies are.

And so I was greatly anticipating it because for me, Fury Road is a, like a blockbuster masterpiece of the highest order. Like it is among, I think, the best movies of the 21st century. I think the way that you framed it is totally fair. But for me, that's delightful. Like I think it just, it works so, so well.

Yeah. And also the thing about Fury Road, it had been 30 years since Mad Max and it it's not that it came out of nowhere obviously like George Miller has been making wonderful movies including your beloved A Babe franchise yeah for many years but it did feel fresh and it was just like wow this this exciting how did they do that amazing level of filmmaking just was gifted to us out of a long time without any of that like marvelized franchise and it was also like very much in the heyday of like and here's your next installment of the MCU so it it was maybe not a surprise, but like a breath of fresh air and like really did come to signify, at least within like film nerd world, the, the best of the best when it comes to franchise,

you know, and it has, and it has like taken on a certain letterbox lore. Um, and that's not, you know, like Steven Soderbergh has just been out here. Like, I literally don't know how they do this. I rewatch it all the time. There have been books. Like, it is, it's a real thing. So making another one, like trying to capture the lightning in a bottle twice is also an interesting moment. Yeah, I mean, that's directly related to my anticipation for and reaction to the movie. I see Fury Road as in the lineage of, and I mean this sincerely, The Jazz Singer, The Wizard of Oz, Ben-Hur, Lawrence of Arabia, Star Wars, Jurassic Park, Terminator 2.

When all of those movies are the first time when you were like, oh, wow, movies can do that. Yeah. And they can do that in a form of spectacle and grandeur and awe-inspiring vision that is rare. And George Miller had made a ton of great movies before that, but that movie felt like this apotheosis of the practical world and the digital world colliding to make something very special that was familiar but new.

So this movie, for me, had a huge weight of expectation because of the fact that they had done this. Now, I wasn't like, oh, thank God they're giving us a Furiosa prequel, but I also wasn't mad that it was a Furiosa prequel. I was just, I was like, I really need this to be good. You've been hearing me talk about it for months and months. Were you like, I need this to be good, or is it just because it's a museum piece for you,

you don't have the same emotional investment? No, I mostly need it to be good so that you didn't have a meltdown. I'm very much like in the backseat of your big rig on this one. Or like guest strapped to the front like Tom Hardy or whatever. You know, there aren't like. You can describe that about many episodes of this show. I'm the guy with the guitar. The duphorier.

At some point, like here I am. Do you play guitar? No, I don't actually. I never learned. Because that wasn't considered like fine arts enough, you know. Okay. It was like I got the cello, violin, piano, did some organ, but guitar wasn't allowed. One day.

Yeah. An entire episode of this show will just be you playing the violin. I look forward to that episode. That was like, I don't really remember it because that, I was two years old. They tried the Suzuki method. Two years old? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

And there are photos of me doing like the Halloween recital in a snow white costume playing the violin. Trinkle, trinkle little star or whatever. That sounds like something that would go viral instantaneously. So I encourage you to post that. Anyway, no, I think Mad Max Fury Road, like, you know, I did feel just the like, holy shit. Like what I'm seeing is monumental and important in in film and and part of what was so significant about it was that I do think it transcended like the the Mad Max franchise enthusiasm to be like a standalone piece of art but I don't you know I'm

not like a Mad Max guy I mean love trucks learning more and more about trucks every day in my personal life um and and their capabilities and what they can do when smashed together but i think this had a little bit of like okay so you're you're trying to reheat a souffle you're like trying to build on the magic again. Can you do that? You've made some crucial changes in casting. And your first trailer, I don't know. So that was where my expectations were. So they were lowered because of all of that.

I don't even know if they were lowered. I'm not really sure that I had expectations. Okay. I decided to show up to see a great filmmaker at work, Sean. That's what I try to do every day. My expectations were insanely high. This was, I think this might've been my, when, when Tarantino's movie moved out, I was like, this is my movie. And I'm here to tell you that this movie is really, really, really good. And I don't think great. And I'm working through that. I've only seen it one time. And it, the reason that I don't feel that. And I'm working through that. I've only seen it one time.

And the reason that I don't feel that it's great, very simply, and we'll talk in great detail about what is in this movie and what works and the changes that are made and the way that it evolves the previous Mad Max films, is that while it is

an incredible accomplishment, again, of this collision, of the physical, practical, and the digital, there are four major set pieces in Mad Max Fury Road. There are four major set pieces in this movie. There is some pretty amusing performances in this movie, the same way that there were in the last few Mad Max films. There's this real sense of like epic scale and storytelling, but it's just a little bit too similar to the last movie and not as good.

And I don't really know. I'm still trying to wrap my head around why he wanted to make this movie, like what it was about the story of this film, which has some interesting contours, but feels very iterative on a lot of things he's done, not just on the Mad Max movies, that holds it back. I've been reading reviews of the film, and I've been looking at people's responses,

and people have been saying, it's not only as good as Fury Road it's better and I can't really figure out yeah I where that opinion is coming from I agree with you I mean it's undeniable what George Miller does like it's just it's like and it's still and you know I there were concerns about the CGI after the first trailer, and I raised my eyebrow. And it looks beautiful and amazing. And the set pieces are just flipping stuff over and blowing stuff up. Two in this film in particular that are the wowest of wows you can get from that kind of work. Totally. I think that, I guess, structurally and visually, you're right, it is very similar to Fury Road. And then I think the ways that it adjusts it didn't work for me. And I think narratively, it's sort of reaching its limit.

Yes. I really liked, but I was like, okay, so you're just like doing a different movie now. This is very, very strange and is taking away from everything else that the movie commits to. So I found it, I guess, maybe not disjointed, but there were a couple of different movies in it somehow. Yeah, I think Fury Road, because there's that 28-year gap between that and Beyond Thunderdome, it feels like this incredible leap forward in terms of filmmaking style, where he's doing a lot of the same things visually, like those quick, crazy zooms, all the tracking shots where you've got cameras mounted on cars riding alongside trucks.

It's the same stuff, but the technology has gotten so much better, and I think his sense of fun has gotten even crazier, that it feels different. This movie doesn't feel that different from Fury Road when you're watching it. The thing that is different is what you're describing, which is that this movie takes place approximately over the course of 15 years. Fury Road took place over like a day and a half. Yeah.

And that was a pure, as you said, like road war movie. Like it was just a series of siege battle sequences over and over and over again, interspersed with the emotional crisis of the Furiosa character. Mad Max is like, is incidental to Fury Road in many ways. This movie is trying to set up really the entire emotional arc and a deeper understanding of Furiosa,

who Charlize Theron portrayed in the last film and who Anya Teller-Joy portrays here. Movie just like the last one is written by Miller and Nico Lothoris. Big difference here is that Simon Dugan shot this movie and not John Seale. I feel like John Seale is a big Amanda DP.

This is the man who shot... Witness, talented Mr. Ripley, and English Patient. Yeah. Academy Award winner for English Patient. He shot Fury Road. He's in his 80s now and he effectively retired.

George Miller said, I really need you to do this. And John Seale said, I have grandchildren I'd like to spend time with after ignoring my own children for 50 years making movies. We respect that decision.

Sure, yeah. I would have liked to have seen John Seale's version of this movie. Yeah, I was just going to say, we appreciate any time grandparents want to spend time with their grandchildren instead of me.

But, you know, George Miller has been working largely with the same department heads for 30 plus years on movies in Australia. One of the new entrants in his world was Junkie XL, Tom Hulkenberg, who did the score for Fury Road. He also did the score for this movie. I have a lot of thoughts about the score of this movie and how it informs like what this movie ultimately is and how it's different. The story is like pretty straightforward. It's a prequel that shows us how Furiosa was taken to the Citadel, kidnapped essentially by a band of outlaws who work and live for Immortan Joe.

And how, you know, she effectively becomes this central figure in this battle for all of these spaces in the wasteland of this world there's a significant new character named dementis he's a warlord dementis is the most i think actually the most significant character in this movie for a variety of reasons he's the character played by chris hemsworth who gives the movie character and shape and without i can't imagine the movie without him to be perfectly honest with you yeah but also he is he's doing chris hemsworth stand-up he is like talky uh-huh and and and like no one else talks in these movies um and so in some ways he's like the contrast and he like you know gives like a stoic power to the people who aren't saying anything and in fact at some point when anya taylor joy is for you to start speaking i found that very jarring i was like no no no no actually he's the loud mouth and you just need

to keep glaring at him um well he takes up a lot of space. Both physically and emotionally in the story. It's an odd character. Most of the heavies and the villains are fairly quiet characters in the Mad Max films. He's the true new thing in the story, which is that he is both the muscle, the might, and kind of like the anxiety of power that I think is a big part of these stories. Where he's a person, he's kind of a classic, he's not quite the final boss. He's like the boss at the end of the level

before you get to the final level in the video game. Right. And the whole movie is kind of organized around his desire to be in charge and to be at the center of power in the Citadel to use Serp and Morton Joe to take over Gastown, to take over the Bullet Farm, like all these places, these worlds that we've seen over the last five movies.

It's a really interesting choice. Hemsworth, an Australian, I imagine the Mad Max films are very important to him. I really like him as a performer. He's basically never gotten the chance to do this. He's often the guy who is the hero. So I can't recall if he's ever played the heavy in a movie. I don't think he has. Is he in the Russo Brothers Europe movie with Ryan Gosling that you hate?

No. That's Chris Evans. Is he in Spiderhead? He is in Spiderhead and he is kind of the villain in Spiderhead. You're right. Because

the thing is is that he's the villain but he's still just wisecracking like Marvel Thor basically. He's doing the same smug routine. And he's very villain but he's still just wisecracking like marvel thor basically he's doing the same and he's very good at that and i find it very charming but it is a very different vibe than everyone else and really then the nature of these movies which are very serious. Like, everyone else in all five movies,

except for maybe Tina Turner, is, like, very earnestly serious about it. And even... There's usually a comic relief, but it's very rarely in the villain. Yeah. The gyrocopter pilot in the second film is a sense of comic relief.

I think, like, some of the henchmen of the toe cutter in the first film are comic relief. It's like some of the henchmen of the toe cutter in the first film were comic relief. It's very rarely the main bad guy. Like Immortan Joe in Fury Road is just evil.

Like he's evil. It's kind of a funny characterization and ridiculous character, but he's dangerous. Dementus is like kind of a goof. Yeah. And I really liked

Chris Hemsworth in this movie, but you're right that we have not seen something like this in a Mad Max movie before. But it is, the tones of the movie, they take their stakes very seriously. Like, we talked a lot about that with Dune and Dune 2 and what a difference that is from all the superhero stuff that we've been doing for the last 20 years and that Chris Hemsworth has been pivotal in of like, you know, to your winking action point, the Mad Max movies are like, no, no, no, no, this is like life and death and apocalypse and road war.

And then Chris Hemsworth is like, well, you know. It's a good point. I hadn't thought about it this way. It was a little, and I find that charming. Yeah. But it does somehow for me. De-escalates the stakes. De-escalates the stakes of theescalates the stakes yeah i think you're right i think you're i actually really liked him and wouldn't want

to replace him but maybe that also somehow impacted because the movie otherwise has this doom-laden score it has these chapter titles and it's broken into these three acts what was the first one her odyssey begins no it was not it was not. It was like the importance of something. And I mean, I just muttered, oh, brother, to you as soon as it started. Hold on, I'm going to find it. Boy. So the first chapter title in Mad Max Furiosa is The Pole of Inaccessibility. Which I got to doff my cap to that.

That is the, there's a kind of like obtuse grandeur. Yeah. That appears in a lot of George Miller's films. I think if you want to better understand this movie, you should probably just rewatch his last movie, which I was not a big fan of called 3000 Years of Longing, because it is in the same register. It has this huge affection for these ancient tales that have been told over time.

And these characters who kind of recur through those stories, you know, the magical genie-like character or, you know, the way fish fairy or, you know, like he's really into that stuff. You know, Babe is kind of a treatise on those stories too. He keeps going back and back. But when you're sitting down to Furiosa and you're like, I've been waiting 10 years to have my soul cleansed and to see something truly special. And then it says, the pole of inaccessibility. It does seem very silly.

Yeah. And you're right that the Hemsworth character feels somehow out of step with a movie that is working in that serious mold, especially a movie that opens almost exactly the same as Fury Road, where it has this portentous narration at the beginning. And then you see that nuclear image of the black and white trees swaying as we feel the world ending, like the green disappearing from our planet.

That's exactly the same as Fury Road. So we're meant to go right back into that headspace and and then we see a guy with a fake nose uh cracking cracking wise about his power right that's true i did that intro made me wonder i i don't i don't want to see george miller do this but i am interested like in the disintegration of this world like how it all happens you know like that's a prequel I would watch it would be very different

from this it probably wouldn't be a Mad Max movie this would be the events between Mad Max and the Road Warrior effectively is what you're saying because Mad Max

yeah is like things are starting to get a little hairy in Australia right but also like he's still having dinner at home with his family still working as a cop

still like in normalized society. I did also find myself wondering, like, at some point in this movie, like, what's going on outside of Australia? You know? It's crossed my mind as well. Like, is America just normal? And no one can get off the island of Australia? Because, like, one of the first, this movie, like a spoiler alert.

Spoiler warning. the first this movie i guess spoiler alert spoiler warning after that prologue it zooms in to the green place and you see where the green place is located in australia and it's hanging on but i was like okay so we're not far enough along that everything's gone. So this is just what's happening on Australia, which, as I understand it, I've never visited. I did threaten before this podcast to move there for half the year because I just can't handle May Gray anymore. But it seems like a lot of the topography is like pretty arid already so in fury road we hear furiosa tell the women from the green place that she's been gone for 7 000 days so she's basically the what you know she's gone to the citadel for roughly 20 years right so also in that time i think a lot of the mad max kind of rise and fall is happening you know like right right right but the world of furiosa looks like it's already a destroyed world so i have some questions i guess about the timeline

but it doesn't sure but it's also like i'm not i'm not my questions aren't about timeline my questions are about like okay like much of australia as i understand it is like a desert right now in fact it's like much of where they filmed this the wasteland at least this part of the of australia i don't think the entire continent is safe but it's like as i understand it you the all the coast is like very habitable and you can have it as you go inward but you know it gets a little it gets a little desert-y or i don't know what the correct... Should we do one year stay in Australia next year? Geography or topographical terms are. Anyway, I just, I want to know what's going on elsewhere.

You know, like what's up in America? What's up in Asia? What's up in South America? I mean, you have to assume that Amazon's like gone already at this point because it kind of is. Sounds like you have a rich future as a development executive at Warner Brothers where you can expand

on this precious IP and find more stories to tell. I do have a rich future as a development executive except I don't want to go to meetings. So people can just call me. Okay. You want to have phone calls?

No. As I said that, people can text me. Okay. And then I'll text back. That's how you want to do your entire job as a development executive. Understood. This movie is, like I said, a lot of the story is, it's critical, but doesn't feel new.

It's about a young girl who's taken from her mother, taken from the green place. You see this very obvious biblical allusion at the beginning of the movie of removing the apple from the tree. Very shortly thereafter. Is it an apple or a peach? I don't know. It was definitely a biblical allusion to an apple. I think you're correct. I think that was more of an emoji joke on George Miller's part.

No, but then there's a peach pit. Oh, you're right. That she's carrying around throughout. You're right. And that pit is given her by her mother, right? I think so. And then that's the seed that she will plant later in the film. Yeah, exactly.

I think that basically every time the movie is like, it's set piece time, basically like when the abduction starts, I was very locked in and engaged. And when the movie slowed down, and this is very different from Fury Road, and was sort of showing us the world a little bit more deeply, I kind of lost,

I wouldn't say I lost interest, but I felt much less connected to the movie. And I wonder if that is like a difficulty of trying to make a story like this more epic than it already is. You know, like that short time frame for most of these movies that take place over a series of days, trying to make this more expansive. I wonder how audiences are going to feel about that. I think the people who are Mad Max psychos, which is in many ways just an extension of big pic psychos,

will be incredibly excited by the set pieces. And then I didn't mind the first hour, I would say, of exposition, which is, I mean, maybe hour is too much, but so little Furiosa, who is played by Leela Brown, who I did wonder at some point whether they deep-faked part of Anya Taylor-Joy's face back onto Leela Brown.

It was really uncanny. I read something that maybe they did do something with her eyes to make them more similar digitally. Now that the Fall Guy has explained all of this to me like I just see it everywhere another reason to see the fall guy did you get a check

from Universal on this one you've been working very hard for the film it's on VOD I enjoyed the film the fall guy more than this film they're really two sides

of the same coin are they I think so expand I don't think David Leitch is. Are they? I think so. I think so. Expand. I don't think David Leitch is a master filmmaker, but I think he knows how to make fun movies. And I do think George Miller is a master filmmaker.

This is a less fun movie than what he's done in the past. I think that's fair. And I, as you know, I like to have fun. So did I have more fun at Fall Guy? I sure did. And did I also learn about deep fakes? I did. So, I mean, I knew about them already, but they opened my eyes to the possibility of their use in movies. So, Alila Brown, who plays young Furiosa, she's very good. You know, you put a young kid in peril and I'm

invested. You know, I'm just like, oh no. And that held my attention for a while. I guess also because that at least is different than Fury Road, right? This first sequence, which I find really, really, I thought it was really cool and I look forward to seeing it again. Yes. It's basically just a motorcycle chase across the desert. And so you've got these abductors who are, you know, four or five guys who live at the Citadel who have taken Furiosa. And then her mother hops on a motorcycle and chases after her. She's played by Charlie Frazier

who we last saw in Anyone But You. She was Glenn Powell's ex-Australian fling. And that scene is unlike anything in any of these movies. It is much more

sort of like magisterial. It's very beautiful and very sort of subtle for an action sequence. It's quiet. The score is sort of like quietly churning and thumping and percussive, but not that like doom that you tend to hear.

There are motorcycles, but it's less machinery and more people. Yeah. Based because you're also, it is like a mother trying to protect her child, which is a slightly different valence than the other. I mean, I guess he's always trying to protect some child and avenge, you know, his child. But it's a new version of it, right?

Yeah, in Fury Road, it's the echoing visions of who Max could not protect and seeing these sort of dreams that are haunting him. This movie feels like making those visions the movie. You know what I mean? Like turning that sense of torture and a haunted parent or a haunted society that has lost sight of its children and is unable to protect them is a big part of the idea of the movie. I really thought that that first scene was really the one that felt new and different to me.

And exciting and engaging. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, not that the to me. And exciting and engaging. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, not that the others aren't hugely exciting and engaging, but it also fit. I bought those narrative stakes, which isn't hard with like small child mom. Right.

It's very easy to get emotionally invested in the movie early on. From there, we start to learn a lot more about Dementus and we see his relationship to the wasteland and the Citadel and how what he aspires to and what he wants versus what is happening in the society. You can see that Immortan Joe is like much younger, played by a different actor than in the previous film, how he is starting to really control natural resources in that space. Right. We get this hint towards the, um, the breeders breeders you know the women who are saved in fury road and then very not i shouldn't say very quickly but fairly quickly the movie moves through the introduction of all of these spaces and then we go to a more modern time where furiosa after

escaping or being traded by dementis to Immortan Joe becomes a part of the world of the Citadel. Right. She learns to work inside the machinery there. She spends a long time in the cage with Dementus roaming around.

She does. Longer than I expected. I kind of expected for it to be that prologue scene and then cut to Anya Taylor-Joy. And you do get a while of Lil Furiosa in like a clown cart.

Not saying anything and following Dementors around. And this, that long stretch at the beginning followed by another longer stretch in the middle of the movie

makes this movie two hours and 25 minutes, which makes it the longest of the Mad Max movies. Yeah. I think this was a mistake. I agree. I don't think it the longest of the Mad Max movies. I think this was a mistake. I agree. I don't think it radically

hurts the film, but the Mad Max movies are really lean. And they've all been getting longer and longer. The first one's, I think, 93 minutes. The second one's 91 minutes. The third one's I think like an hour 45. And Mad Max

Fury Road, one of the most epic movies of the 21st century, is a shade over two hours. This movie is, it is kind of suffering from that same bloat that we're feeling a lot of these movies having.

And I think, and all of the scenes that we're talking about are places where Chris Hemsworth and the Dementors character really get certainly a lot more time than Max and Tom Hardy get in Fury Road. And this is a two-hander, even though it's called Furiosa. And to some extent, I understand that because it's setting up like a final showdown between these two people.

But it is serving two, it's trying to serve two characters at the same time, like to be about both Furiosa. And then it's like, I think that's my other issue, not issue with Dementors, because I think Chris Hemsworth is very funny and very alive, but like you can feel the movie being like, okay, so maybe this is his movie for a while.

100%. And I think some of that is the performance, and he's just undeniably charismatic. But the movie's also like, oh, okay, but this is kind of interesting, and I'm going to go with this for a while while Furiosa just sits in a cage. And to not be able to make that choice, I think, adds to the runtime, obviously, but also some of the tonal confusion. I think regardless of how the character is written in terms of like or the joke performance

style that he's bringing to it I think it's most interested in what he represents I think it's most interested ideologically in this guy feels less than and he's going to do terrible things so that he feels better than yeah and that that is basically what leads to like the fall of societies is when people take on these outsized personas to dominate and hurt other people in the process don't think about other people george miller clearly seems like very zeroed in on that so we're spending all this time with this character we previously did not have a relationship with and i think you're right like is tonally a little bit different from anya teller joy who is playing like the classic gritted teeth Mad Max part. You know, the like, I don't speak, I am a warrior.

We watch her go through the paces of learning how to become a stronger and stronger woman inside of this cutthroat world. But in that period between the abduction and this oil rig siege that comes, I don't know, roughly like an hour into the movie, I was like, this is moving at a pretty glacial pace. I'm surprised that this is the pacing that they've chosen for the movie. Once the oil rig scene happens,

I felt like it was a little bit lighter on its feet and started to move a little bit more. Yeah. But the interesting thing about that scene, which introduces this Tom Burke character, the actor from Your Beloved Souvenir, who plays kind of like a, he's almost like the inspiration for the furiosa

character he's a rig driver he looks very similar to the way that charlie snyron looks in fury road and he's responsible for transporting gas you know out of gas town into the citadel while being protected by the war boys that we saw in fury road and the movie kind of becomes a Mad Max movie as soon as this next rig chase happens. Now, on the one hand, holy shit, like it's crazy what they accomplish in this scene. On the other hand, this is the third oil rig chase we've seen in a Mad Max movie. Like it's a very overt homage to what we saw in Road Warrior. And then obviously much of what we saw in the transportation of the breeders in Fury Road. As you said, the man loves an oil rig chase.

He just loves a big rig, you know? And at some point you are coming to see big rigs, right? Do amazing stuff. So I don't begrudge anyone that. But as I kind of said, when we did our action set piece draft, which we've just gotten wonderful feedback on. Everyone's as usual. Thanks so much for listening.

Just for, you know, embracing us and our ideas. You're wonderful. And your opinions are also really politely expressed. Are you looking down the barrel of the camera right now? Yeah, I just,

I want you guys to know we appreciate all your positivity. You're looking for like a breakout moment here? I just think that's funny. Anyway, we didn't draft a Mad Max set piece. No, I hadn't revisited it before we did that. And I guess you could say that there were in Furio these four distinct moments.

But to me, the movie feels like this breathless chase the whole time. This movie doesn't feel like that. This movie, it's actually, you can quadrant the movie. Yeah. This moment's happening. Okay, 38 minutes later, this moment's happening okay 38 minutes later this moment's happening okay 27 minutes later this moment and then 28 minutes this moment and that's when i revisit the movie i'm gonna try to not spend my time like anticipating the next one yeah but like that's why you're going like that it's okay it's okay to be like hey here's another big rig you know it's just whole societies are built on the back of of young men and old men and and many women alike that's right like yes yes women are doing the work another truck does Furiosa answer

the question can women have it all I think it does I think you too can be an oil rig driver I think that's what at what cost you know truly that an oil rig driver. I think that's what... But at what cost, you know? Truly. That's what they don't tell you. And your hair. In the Atlantic. Would you ever consider that? Did you consider that look?

The all black, the grease smeared across your eyes for this pod? Listen, we're doing video. It's like hard to iterate at some point. Who knows what I'm going to have to do. Yeah. This is really where Furiosa like learns to be not just a great oil rig driver but like a great

warrior she learns from this Tom Burke character as they are sieged upon they survive this siege and there's just some amazing filmmaking in this scene I did feel

a little bit like okay I'd seen this before but it was very very exciting I think the move what recommends the movie most are the two sequences that happen after that.

At a certain point, it becomes clear that Dementus is trying to make moves and Immortan Joe is trying to fire back. And Dementus, while running the bullet farm, is trying to maintain power and take power from Immortan Joe. And then we get this raid on Gastown where the Tom Burke character, who is called Praetorian Jack,

again, sick name. These movies have sick names. Because they always put an odd Latin phrase in front of like Steve or Jim, which is just a good strategy. At what point during the collapse of society

Consequential Sean, that would be my name. does Latin come back as like the only language of influence? I don't know. We'll have to end the world to figure that out.

As I learned this weekend at dinner with you, yourin is not strong these days despite your classic studies here's what i know the v is actually a u so that's really that's there we go it's deeply helpful as you're sounding things out on the monument so it's not so it wasn't really about translation it was about in the of a in a day-to-day sense it was about being able to read the great works you know and i guess translating them that way it sounds like you couldn't read them i did i could read the ennead okay but not anymore how does the ennead stack up to this film um you know the ennead's sick he gets up to a lot of stuff not all of it good because ultimately you know he's a colonizer and

builds rome but what are you gonna do okay he's born of wolves i think maybe 100 episodes spinoff show you and i textual analysis of the indian i think there's an audience for that you know dido and carthage and all that good stuff i haven't read it okay i mean i would love to start i think that'd be great there are some translations, so you don't actually have to do the Latin. I would consider reading it in English, the only language I speak, unfortunately for me. This third set piece to me is the movie. This is the reason to go see the movie. This is the coolest thing in the movie. It is a little bit more of a stationary act where Furiosa and Praetorian Jack are arriving at Gastown and attempting to kind of like take out Dementus. And once they feel the need to escape

is when the movie really takes off where there's this sort of sniper sequence where Furiosa is perched and is shooting at Dementus while Praetorian Jack is trying to escape with the gas. I don't really know how you podcast about this. Like, it's just fucking sick. Like, I don't know what to say.

Like, I don't want to spoil it for anybody. I hope I'm going to watch it like 3,000 times. It honestly would be funny if like on the deep dive that you guys are going to do, that you do try to describe what's happening. Yeah, but don't write it down. Just do it off the top of your head. Be like, and then this, and then this.

I saw it six days ago. So it's a little hard to go right back to it. But this is the top of your head be like and then this and then this i saw it six days ago so it's a little hard to go right back to it but this is the price of admission like this is really the reason to see the movie it's really really exciting i think it's a blend of action styles like it brings some of the early mad max films into the fury road style where you know it's a gun battle it's a car chase it's his sense of geography and cutting style has always been world-class. Like he, he might literally be the greatest action filmmaker of all time, but you know, it's like Spielberg is like, I don't know how George Miller does what

he does, but in particular, a scene like this in 2024 would be so laden with CGI by any other filmmaker that even when there is CGI in the sequence. And I think the image in particular that people really hated in the trailer that I still don't love is the bullets flying over Dementus as he is hanging from, I don't know, the bridge in Gastown. I don't think you needed that. I think part of like the charm of the Mad Max stories is this sense that even if there is a digital effect, it feels real. That's one of the few times in this movie where it doesn't really feel real,

even though we're in an unreal world. But otherwise, I just want to say this shit rocked very hard. And I'm very excited to see it again. Did it like meaningfully contribute to making the movie a great movie? I guess so. I try not to like break movies down into their component parts too much and grade them based on that. But in a movie like this, it's almost sort of asking you to do it.

So to me, it's like this movie is an 8 out of 10 automatically because it has this scene. I don't understand what's wrong with that. Nothing. Like I, yeah. That's the price because i wanted it to be like everything well and it's unfortunately it's not everything yeah but it does have this and it does have i think a like a fitful conclusion which is that eventually we do get this showdown that you alluded to between furiosa and dementis along the way furiosa has lost her arm

she's learned to build this mechanical arm she She shaved her head. She's had this realization of this warrior mode that she needs to not just survive in this world, but get the revenge. This is a revenge movie. It's a 70s revenge movie, just like Mad Max was, where in the original Mad Max, his family is killed, and he needs to seek revenge. And this is a major echo of that film. The reason that she shaves her head and the role that it plays,

I thought was... Break it down. So she shaves it in order to create like a wig that she wears so that when she is summoned basically

to be a breeder, the war boy, whatever that is. Rictus is the... Rictus? Yeah. Is it Rictus or Rictus? He's Morton Joe's son.

Sure. Oh, right. Who I think is maybe not that bright we saw him in Fury Road and he grabs her by the hair but it's actually

by the wig so then she's able to escape and then she fits in as as a war boy you should start doing that for Knox

and then you know when he goes in for a handful of hair and then whoops there it goes and then you've you've got your Furiosa outfit on

I like that part two and then i thought the trap and capture of dementis near the end of the film is was very well done yes um i don't know how into detail you want to go into that it's the movie itself and this is really a challenge of a movie like this is ultimately kind of predictable because we're we know that fury road is coming there's... The stakes are instantaneously lowered because Furiosa will survive and probably will emerge victorious even though she's carrying all this pain with her.

Yeah. There is a show... Like a showdown, an exchange of words between Furiosa and Dementus. And it is really the first time that Furiosa speaks at all. But she is speaking

opposite Chris Hemsworth like full banter mode. And that was a little confusing to me. So you were not crazy about Anya Taylor-Joy in this movie? No, well that's not fair. That's... I thought that Chris Hemsworth kind of stole a lot of that character's gravitas

and and so you know there have been reports that obviously I mean these movies are hard to make you know it doesn't really seem like the most fun to be stuck out in in the desert with things exploding all around you and um your life at risk every single day, but Anna Taylor-Joy has talked about the particular difficulties of this shoot for her, about her complicated relationship with the character's silence. And I like, I watched the scene and I was like, well, I get why you're frustrated because if this is like really the only payoff

that this character gets and it's against Chris Hemsworth hamming it up and stealing like a lot of your thunder that is sort of a bummer i understand yeah i mean she did sign on to make the film sure presumably read the script beforehand so it's a little hard to accept that i think particularly you know if you've read any of the reporting around the making of fury road charlie starin and tom hardy did not get along during the production of that movie. Both actors seemed utterly bewildered

by what George Miller was doing. These films take hundreds of days to make. I mean, they really are doing something industrial when they're making these movies. And I think it is bewildering to the performers and that sense of confusion when they're working, especially big stars who are used to being let in on the creative decisions of filmmakers at on a constant basis who are

regularly informed of i'm spending an entire day making you do this so that we can get this and george miller who's 79 years old and who is a a different generation of filmmaker and also always has been a slightly more inscrutable filmmaker in terms of his approach to making the movies, I think just confounds these big stars. But it is interesting that Annie Taylor-Joy and Chris Hemsworth signed on for this movie knowing what we know about everybody who's worked on a Mad Max movie and is like, this was really hard.

Like, no shit, you're in the desert for 300 days. This is going to be fucking impossible. Yeah, and I think in these movies in particular, the actor is no more important than, like, the wheel of the truck. Like, they are all truly pieces, pieces of machinery, honestly, for George Miller to manipulate in pursuit of his art. So, and you're right, like, everyone who's been a part of these movies has talked about that. You can see it. But I do think, I'm sure that's like bewildering, as you said. And then I just, I walked away from that final scene and that standoff, even though, as we know, based on the movie's title and Mad Max Fury Road, like she emerges quote unquote victorious. notorious i was like oh you like this you didn't get the same moment that chris hemsworth does and maybe that's because she didn't like the performance she didn't get for it you know the i think it's the character writing i think you're right it's the script she signed on to do it but i was like oh

i felt unsatisfied about that character's moment and i was like oh i get why you might feel unsatisfied too i can understand understand that. I think, I think she's very good in this movie and I think she has a very challenging job. I think that the best moment that Charlize Theron

has in Fury Road when, you know, they've arrived at meeting the women from the Green Place and she, in the night sky, like falls to her knees

and screams and has that primal scream. That just shows us that 10 years, 15 years later, however many years later that is, she's still not guy like falls to her knees and it screams and has that primal scream that just shows us that 10 years 15 years later however many years later that is she's still not over the pain so whatever sense of catharsis you want to get from this revenge that she's attempting to apply to dementia like doesn't solve the loss of her mother and the pain of the movie and this sort of like transformation the loss of her arm like not to be like this is a movie about trauma but it is definitely a movie about trauma like it is

definitely that is the core part of the story is what has been taken from this girl and ultimately what has been taken from normal society and so like it isn't ultimately that satisfying because she doesn't there's no resolution for her you know it's a prequel it's setting up right watching fury road and then seeing her get some sense of catharsis at the end of that movie when we see her being lifted at the end and kind of triumphant as max scatters into the crowd which is like to me one of the great movie endings the last 120 years like such a great moment this movie doesn't really have that moment for us you know it's not it doesn't resolve it just kind of ends well actually how it ends is that after like a little postscript about the peach pit it cuts to that's charlie's in the

very last shot right it like cuts to footage from fury road which i have to be honest i was like come on i like it's. It's a tricky. Actually, I made this joke to you when we were seeing the movie If. In the movie If, there's a sequence where Fiona Shaw's character is watching Harvey, the Jimmy Stewart movie about his imaginary friend Bunny that only he can see. And I said, this is a sin. You should never. Well, no, first you said, oh, I love this movie.

I did say, well, I do love Harvey. But you should never remind people of a better movie while watching a great movie. Now, obviously, movies break this rule all the time. I love Babylon. You know what Babylon shows you? Like 30 other movies that are better than Babylon. I get it. But to show us.

Can I just tell you something? Zach was watching Babylon at home last night. Yeah. He was downstairs. And I was upstairs doing stuff. And I was like, what is that fucking raucous downstairs? I was like, what is he watching? That is the rowdiest shit I've ever heard and I went downstairs and of course it was the opening 30

minutes of Babylon and I was like I should have known that is my brother for life um have you seen the commercial for the NBA finals using no the the score from Babylon as the music that's like the theme music of the NBA finals this year is is Voodoo Mama from Babylon. Wow. Okay. So, again, we're so back. Who's getting that check? I hope Little Damien. I have to assume. No, the Paramount Corporation, probably. Oh, good.

Which I think they need it. They do need it. Yeah, I guess. So hopefully they get some more money. I think showing us Charlize is logical because if you're watching the movies chronologically, the next movie you would watch would be Fury Road. Yeah, but it does also, like, Anya Taylor-Joy is much physically smaller than Charlize. She is. Which, like, no judgment.

Like, I think she's just shorter. Mm-hmm. And... What a face on her, though, Anya Taylor-Joy. I mean, listen, this is not, like, a judgment. It's not that one is better than the other. It's just I noticed it was, like, not a one-to-one body doubleone body double situation i was just like oh that person is much taller than the person who we just saw in the cave like five minutes ago it's a tough task i i i think she's up to it i just

think that the movie is so similar to fury road where it's just not giving her as much to do as you want yeah and so you don't get a chance to become as invested uh aside from the obvious setup with the abduction and the death of her mother. I think it's a really, really good action movie. I think it's like a B plus as a contemplative drama, you know, about loss and power. And because of that, and I do tend to feel this way about a lot of his movies. I tend to think that the crazy stuff in his movies works really well. Like Witches of Eastwick I think is a blast and really fun, but also kind of his movies. I tend to think that the crazy stuff in his movies works really well. Like Witches of Eastwick I think is a blast

and really fun but also kind of a mess. And so Lorenzo Zoil I think is like kind of beautiful but also doesn't work at times. Like he is a kind of a messy filmmaker and willing to try things that we don't think are going to work well. Like I would have never guessed I would

have enjoyed a movie like Happy Feet. But you know he's like the fact that he's willing to put it out there I really appreciate is there anything like that this movie is about that maybe I haven't been able to put my finger on or we haven't discussed yet I don't I don't think so and if anything I think that that's like another thing that's hindering me is it's obviously you know it is revenge and i guess it is also about middle managers um you know and it and it is and it is once again like about the earth hates middle managers hates and like the earth and how we've how we've squandered it um and how we can't get it back it's a deeply pessimistic movie uh which i guess is sort of a tricky like revenge movies typically are supposed to give you

some hope well i mean yes i mean i think catharsis you know i think we all know that that like actually seeking revenge in real life is not going to lead you anywhere good but historically in the movie it's like you want the hero to like the, the hero gets the person and you're, like, cheering. And, I mean, this is an interesting, it doesn't give you, like I said, that moment of validation. But as, for me, narratively, it's so similar to Fury Road. That I was like, I assumed all of this, you know? And so, did I need to see anything except the big rigs? Not really.

Yeah, it doesn't surprise, I guess, is the thing. Other than the Dementus character being as central to the story. I think like, you know, belief versus will is something that I wrote down. That you can't just assume that everything is going to work out well. You have to do it for yourself. Like the Furiosa character is the person who is just like, I have to take my fate into my own hands. I can no longer let other people dictate the terms of my life because I will die or I will be a prisoner or I will be a breeder.

And so I have to make that change. I think it's a powerful concept. Prequels are tough. I was trying to make a list of the best prequels of all time. You did a good job. And I don't know. Did I forget anything? I mean, invariably, when you start talking about prequels,

you're necessarily talking about IP and franchises. Just by making a prequel, you have created an expanded universe for your story. Some movies are sort of incidentally prequels or only partially prequels. Like The Godfather Part II, arguably the American classic of all time is sort of a prequel and sort of not it is a continuation of the michael corleone story but it's also veto as a young man in living in italy do you like the godfather part two of course okay um i put the tahoe house on my list of best movie houses i

forgot about that. Wow. That's a good house. Which pod was that from? Rewatchables? Yeah, that was War of the Roses. War of the Roses. That was a good pod. Thank you.

Yeah. Do you... Mal, Bill, and I like to talk about divorce. Don't we all? You know, it's a resonant theme. I actually woke up yesterday to like a text, that text thread was just popping off about irreconcilable differences. Oh, yeah. He had mentioned that film to me yesterday too. He was trying to explain to meconcilable differences. Oh yeah, he had mentioned that film

to me yesterday too. He was trying to explain to me what it was and I was like, sir, I have made a Nancy Meyers podcast, okay?

I know from irreconcilable differences. Godfather Part 2, The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly, which is, again,

not really pitched as a prequel. It's just when you're watching the movie, you're like, oh, that's how the man with no name

got the outfit that he wears in the first two movies. That's like literally how you know it's a prequel. Twin's just when you're watching the movie you're like oh that's how the man with no name got the outfit that he wears in the first two movies. That's like literally how you know it's a prequel. Twin Peaks Fire Walk With Me one of the best movies of all time.

Very upsetting. You don't like Twin Peaks? No it's I just you know it's a little bit like Here Come the Lynchheads again. Just be brave. Say it.

You think he's a fraud. I don't. Is that what you think? I don't. He has nothing to say. I think Dave Lynch is wonderful. I like I sometimes get tired of listening to all you guys. Just be like Who's you think? I don't. He has nothing to say. I think Dave Lynch is wonderful. I sometimes get tired of listening to all you guys.

Just be like. Who's you guys? Well, all you little Lynch guys. Who are you talking about? Name names. I'm right here. You and Andy. Like, all right, I get it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Lynch is good. Inland Empire rewatchables? What do you think? Sure. You just convince Bill. Do you like Rogue One? Yes, but when Chris was describing Bill. Do you like Rogue One? Yes,

but when Chris was describing Darth Vader showing up in Rogue One, I was like, I have absolutely no memory of that happening. I would encourage you to watch it on YouTube the same way that I do,

which is just high as a kite, laughing maniacally. How often are you getting high these days? Not very often, honestly. I have to wake up

at 6.30 every day and care for a child, so I just find it quite terrorizing to get super stoned and then be tired the next morning. Okay. It makes you that tired? Yeah, usually. Okay. That's tough for you. Maybe you should investigate like a different vehicle for the... Heroin? No, I was thinking like, I know you like gummies, but you know, maybe a salve? What's that?

It's like a balm. Oh, maybe a salve. What's that? It's like a balm. Oh, like a lotion? Yeah. Like something I put on my hands? Yeah. But is that only CBD? Is that also THC? I'm sure they make a THC variant.

Can you just put THC like in your cheeks? Maybe. Wow. I think you can do anything now with THC. It's like literally their only weed stores in Los Angeles. That's it. That's all we have. Alcohol is doing fine for me. Good with it congratulations in moderation of course so rogue one you hate

no i really i liked it when i saw it prometheus yeah i like prometheus yeah very very very very good film pearl starring mia goth yeah i gotta see that before maxine i'm so excited about maxine and did you watch the Long Legs trailer? No, I didn't. I've added Long Legs to the Maxine episode. Great. So it'll be a double whammy of pain for you. All right.

Maybe I'll love it. You don't know. You know what? I don't. I'm content in my ignorance. X-Men First Class. You're a fan of this one. Yeah, I love this one.

Star Trek, J.J. Abrams first one. Oh, I like those a lot. That is technically pretty cool. Well, I like the first one, yeah. Yeah, the first one's great. Also featuring Chris Hemsworth. That's right. Yeah.

He plays James T. Kirk's father. Right. What was his name? He was like Romulus Kirk. What was his... Captain Jimothy Kirk. What was his name? I don't know.

Let's see. Chris Hemsworth. Star Trek. Captain Joe Biden Kirk. George. George, okay. Star Trek. Captain Joe Biden Kirk. George. George. Okay. All right.

Rise of the Planet of the Apes, we just discussed recently. Yeah. Someone pointed out that Fast Five is technically a prequel. By someone, do you mean your god, Vin Diesel?

No, I just wanted to note it, you know, for the fans at home. don't respect it. Okay. That's your advice. Did you see that there's been talk of lowering the stakes of the next Fast movie? So they don't respect it okay that's that's you see that they're there's been talk of

uh lowering the stakes of the fast five the next fast movie so they don't have to go to space this time uh it sounds like they're not going to leave los angeles oh okay they're really gonna come down it's just they've been filming outside my house for the past like two months this morning someone pointed out to me actually that this exact weekend last year was the Fast X weekend. Oh. I had like a crippling meltdown on the pod. So like the past week, like back to black. Yeah.

And so maybe Hollywood has located that weekend, the third weekend of May, as a time to hurt me. Got it. Yeah. So it's the weekend after Mother's Day, before Memorial Day. Correct. Heats off. Yeah. People. Graduations. Before Father's Day, really, is the way to think about this. Oh, okay. Yeah. You got big plans for Father's Day? No. What should I do? What would you like to do? It's your day. Really just nothing,

you know? That was, it was Zach's birthday. So I, and this is, so Zach's birthday is May and then Father's Day is June. So I have like a real back-to-back situation. But his gift was doing nothing while I watched our child all day. Yeah, that's my plan. My plan is to go to Target to buy roughly $28 worth of candy. Okay. Just sit on a couch.

Just fire up a film from the 70s about a guy who's really having a hard time. But he's also a crook. So he's trying to avoid the law. That's really, that's my happy place. So let's talk a little bit more about the sort of wider expectations around this movie. So Miller has already said, like he thinks he wants to do another one.

He's obviously getting on in years. It seems like the films are so hard to make. I can't imagine being like 86 years old and trying to make a Mad Max movie, let alone being 70 years old and doing it. Sequel to the prequel?

Would you do... I know you said you would be interested in a story between one and two. So, how would you... The sequel to the prequel is Fury Road

because she's literally like the very last... I mean, I guess you could... You could insert it in those whatever 10 years that are signified by the peach pit in the tree or whatever. Would you bring Charlize back and do Furiosa on top in the Citadel? I would love to watch that. I think that is like more narratively interesting, right? That's something new.

You think I should bring Mel Gibson back? No, I don't. What did you tell me that Mel Gibson voiced recently? John Smith in Pocahontas. Oh my God, Alice. I just, I'm going to come over and I'm going to show her some new stuff, you know? I've been trying.

Yeah, no. I think that I guess they can't bring Charlize and Tom already back. I don't think that will happen. But maybe Max is not in it. It's fine. He wandered off into the desert. Just give me Charlize. And Zoe Kravitz. Yeah. And Rosie Huntington

Whiteley was killed, unfortunately. She dies, yeah. Riley Keough? She's a big star now. Sure, yeah. Riley Keough should come's a big star now. Sure, yeah. Riley Keough should come back but do her character from Zola in the film. I mean, are they that different? That's really rude. I think you're thinking

of American Honey and Zola. Those are similar characters. Okay. Do you think that that... Did you say they have to sell Graceland? Who's they? It's like under the state or something.

There's like an auction for Graceland but Riley Keough is challenging it. She thinks it's like under the state or something. There's like an auction for Graceland, but Riley Keough is challenging it. She thinks it's fraudulent. Graceland's for sale. I'm upset about that. Sounds like Austin Butler's fault. Any other sequel or prequel ideas for this world? Like I said, I would love to actually see.

Well, I'm very curious what's going on in the Amazon, obviously. And then also and then how the world actually disintegrates like the i guess the 15 years between mad max and maybe mad max too i mean how much time elapses between mad max and mad max too it definitely feels like a few years because things have gotten significantly worse. Yeah. And he's also learned how to live entirely on his own as society has crumbled around him. Right.

I don't know if they specify. I can't remember. Can you just briefly do your Mad Max power rankings? I think we're going to do this next week with Chris and Jen. Oh, okay. this next week with with chris and joe okay i i understand that the original mad max is like very significant and starts the franchise and blah blah blah blah but you know it is also the oldest technologically speaking it's a very low budget movie yeah so that would that would be five oh wow that's you think that's behind thunderdome holy cow listen i don't feel that all you mad

max nerds are putting enough respect on Tina Turner's name. And this is like basically the second just absolute disrespect of Tina Turner in the movie space in two weeks because she also features heavily in the film If from the mind of John Krasinski. Utterly bewildering set piece in the middle of that movie. RIP to the great Tina Turner who does not deserve anything going on in If or Your Slander. It's kind of really got nothing to do with her.

I think that movie has got a terrible script and is so terribly paced. Well, I like Tina Turner, so I would put it at four. Okay, that it at four. Okay let's add four. And you know it is also like it's really weird but at least visually there's like when all those little weird pig kids are you know what's going on but it's memorable. It's an elevation of the visual style for sure.

And then I guess Furious at three. Mad Max 2 at two and Fury Road. I think it's pretty close to the right my order. I think it's pretty close to the right, my order, the way I would do it. Let's talk box office and awards. Okay.

They're very expensive movies. Yeah. The last film was ultimately a modest success. It was not the billion dollar global world eater that I think we tend to think of it as now because it has such a strong critical

reputation and it's rewatched and it's very beloved and you're right that the letterbox heads of the world and the Steven Soderberghs of the world are just marvel at its innovation box office is not good right now obviously it's not going well um this is this is the kind of thing though that we've been saying that just sort of like this movie in IMAX or in Dolby, you know, it's going to work. And it's also if you make a good movie for your base, as kind of we saw with Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes, which honestly wasn't that good a movie. But it like met expectations, which were not crazy expectations but there are people who want to go see it

and I think there are plenty of people that want to go see Furiosa and I like the base of fandom for it is is pretty large I don't

put a number on it I haven't looked at any of the tracking so I don't even know what people are saying I think in the 40-50 range yeah 46 is what I was thinking

yeah which you know it's okay okay does that hurt your feelings I think in the 40-50 range. Yeah. 46 is what I was thinking. Yeah. Which, you know. It's okay. Okay. Does that hurt your feelings? I'd like it to succeed. I think it's really, really, really well done and exciting.

I think we need movies to succeed at the box office in general. And I think movies like this. Like, you know, candidly, not having Marvel and DC movies is hurting the box office you know it's not necessarily hurting my taste for movies but so what you want is if you're going to get

franchise stories and Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes and this movie are very thoughtful movies you know whether they work or not for everybody on all levels

are I think an improved version of what we got what we saw in Black Adam so it's this V Garfield right when will you v. Garfield, right? When will you be seeing Garfield?

That actually sounds like the prequel. That sounds like Furiosa v. Garfield. I had a ticket to the Garfield screening on Saturday. Skipped it. Oh, okay. It was nap time, so didn't align with my interests. Sure. Shouldn't all the screenings for the kids' movies be at 10 a.m.?

I agree, yes. Right? Not at noon or two? sure what shouldn't all the screenings for the kids movies be at 10 a.m i agree yes right not at noon or two i but i think what they're saying to us is like we don't actually want your toddler who still takes a nap yeah like your child has to be able to stay awake all day and use the potty to be able to come to our movie screening and that's fair and that's something i too would like to say like we're over two on that right now. Okay. All right. I'm like 0.8 out of two. Okay. That's good. No, Alice is doing great.

We're doing well on potty training. Naps still going strong. Yeah. Uh, Garfield could win the weekend. Will win the weekend. I have, I literally haven't looked at this, so I don't even know what to expect. There's a world in which a movie like that makes a lot of money. Sure.

Because children love Chris Pratt. Chris Pratt dominating Hemsworth while just voicing Garfield? Tough times. That would be, if I were a Hemsworth, I would be in my feelings about that. He's in Australia. He doesn't care. He seems to have a great life. Did you see that Elsa Pataki, his wife, had not one but two roles in the film? You said that to me as we were leaving. I recognized her in her first role. Okay. She's part she lives in the green space. She hands off

the peach pit I think. I believe so. When did she come back? I don't know. I think she was playing a character in a mask which is probably something that was fun

for her to do. Yeah. One of the marauders maybe. Sure. Okay awards. Yeah. I hinted at this yesterday with or

for our episode earlier this week with Cannes not seeming like a space for Best Picture nominees right now. I mean, you know, Charles was right. We're like generally in a tough place movie-wise right now. Yeah. Not a lot is like hitting at the level that we've become accustomed to. I feel strongly right now that Dune Part 2 is going to be nominated for Best Picture. I do as well. I do not really think anything else that has come out now

or has even premiered at the festival. And I guess there's a couple of movies, the Cronenberg movie and the Sean Baker movie, Menorah premiered today while we're talking, and they both got rave reviews. And those are the first movies that I've seen that have gotten really positive reviews. This movie, Fury Road got 10 nominations

and six wins and really dominated below the line. It was the Oppenheimer of 2015. Nominated for picture and nominated for director.

Yeah. Did not win in either of those categories. I wrote over under 11 nominations which is actually more than Fury Road, but it's a kind of a weak field.

Yeah. This year. I'm not really sure what to expect with this. Now, you got to keep in mind too, it was also nominated for sound editing and sound mixing, and that has been collapsed into one category. I'm going to go with under. Do you think significantly under?

Well, some of it is just, is this going to be a year where we only have like six Best Picture nominees? Because you don't have to have 10. No, I thought that they changed it again. Oh, you do have to have 10 again? It was 10 and then they were like, I could be up to 10 and then they went back to full 10. So it is 10 again?

I believe so. Am I losing my mind? Oh, Lord. I'm fairly sure. Jack, check in on this. Bobby, is it 10? Yes. Yes, they're 10. There has to be though. Yes, it's I'm fairly sure. Jack, checking on this, Bobby. Is it 10? Yes. Yes, they're 10.

There has to be, though. Yes, it's required to be 10. Okay. Well, that's going to get weird. Then maybe it will? Was there anything at Sundance? Maybe A Real Pain, the Jesse Eisenberg movie? It does.

Is Julie Delpy in that? No. Okay, so that's a different movie with Kieran Culkin that Julie Delpy in that? No. Okay. So that's a different movie with Kieran Culkin that Julie Delpy was promoting? Yes. Okay. So that's good. Um, I know that the Cannes enthusiasm, at least the critical enthusiasm for this has

been very strong, but I don't know if this movie like breaks the real Fury Road Boys to the larger world. And I think that applies to voters as well. So I think obviously in the technical categories. But then it will get nominated for some. But there is also that kind of, no, we already rewarded you for this. Yeah, although it will have been 10 years. Right. In the execution of this podcast,

are you the blood bag or am I the blood bag? It's kind of you, ultimately. I'm the bag. Yeah. Okay. Because you're doing all the spreadsheeting and all the seeing of the bad movies so that I can ascend

to greater heights with my takes about. Witness you in Valhalla. Yeah. Only seeing good movies. In a world where we have to be Mad Max characters, does that unfortunately make me piss boy? Just putting out all the fires of the podcast? Without question. Well, unless you want to be Doof Warrior.

I'll take it. It's better than piss boy, podcast. Without question. Well, unless you want to be Doof Warrior. I'll take it. It's better than Piss Boy, probably. Yeah. I mean, I am a blood bag, but I'm also Mad Max. So, you know. But I thought that Mad Max, like, I thought Amanda was Mad Max because she's strapped to the front of the truck. Oh, good point. We're all kind of everybody.

Yeah. The power of Mad Max movies. The universal in the specific yeah i think six academy award nominations and no best picture that sounds right to me but like what are the best picture nominees gonna be man dude i don't know it's kind of fascinating i guess it's just gonna be like joker folia duh and bliss well it's all like i'm pretty dubious the same way that i think that this movie is gonna struggle a little bit

with recreating that thrill of the like oh wow we never Joker was kind of a similar thing

obviously not as amazing an achievement but like we haven't seen a you know a village

in origin story no no no I don't I don't really don't

know what the big noisy 500 million dollar movie is that's gonna get nominated for

Best Picture besides Doom Part 2. And then even stuff down the line. That might be it. You okay with that? I mean, it seems like it's going to be. I would love for things to turn around at the movies, you know? I love Challengers.

But I'm ready for some new energy. So I don't feel great about it, but we're still in Q2, you know? You're not back here on the show next week. Correct. You're traveling. I'm traveling. What are you next doing? Oh, the Richard Linklater Hall of Fame.

Yeah. Are you excited about that? Of course. Have you been revisiting his films? I'm going to start now that I have finished revisiting all of the Mad Max films. Do you know the first movie

that Glenn Powell and Richard Linklater worked on together? I was just reading this. Is it before Everybody Wants Some? It is. Years before, in fact. But it's not Spy Kids. It's not Spy Kids. That was... Spy Kids 2. Not Spy Kids 2. No. That's not a Richard Linklater film. No, I know. But that was part of his induction into the Texas Film Hall of Fame. Which, congratulations to Glenn. What was the first one? Fast Food Nation.

Oh, really? Yeah. Okay, I should revisit that then. Worth checking out. He has a very small role. Yeah. He's a wet-behind-the-ears kid in the film. Good for Glenn.

Very exciting. Okay, Amanda. Any closing thoughts on Furiosa? You said three out of ten. That was your final rating? No, I didn't. I said like... I don't know.

Like as filmmaking nine out of ten, as movie watching experience, seven. Okay, cool. Thanks to Corey McConnell. Thanks to Jack Sanders. Thanks to Jack Sanders. Thanks to Bobby Wagner, our producer on this episode. Next week, we'll be back to talk more about Furiosa with CR and Joanna.

We'll see you then.