The Big Picture - Jenny Slate, Gillian Robespierre, and Elisabeth Holm on ‘Landline’ | The Big Picture (Ep. 19)

Episode Date: July 21, 2017

The Ringer’s Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins discuss Gillian Robespierre’s ‘Obvious Child’ (0:10) and her new film, ‘Landline.’ Then Sean is joined by Robespierre, Jenny Slate, and Elisabeth Holm to discuss growing up in the ’90s, the sacrifices of independent filmmaking, and collaborating on their second project together (10:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome to The Big Picture. My name is Sean Fennessey. I'm the editor-in-chief of The Ringer. We have a great show today. Four guests. Three of them were interviewed. One of them will be having a chat with me. The three guests are Jenny Slate,

Gillian Robespierre, the director, and Elizabeth Holm, the writer and producer. And we're here to talk about Landline, their new film, which I'm very excited about. But before that happens, joined by culture editor Amanda Dobbins. Amanda, thank you for being here with me. Thank you for having me. Amanda, I have a very exciting show today because I was joined by three other women earlier today. It's very exciting, already.

But I wanted to talk to you first because I'm hoping you can give us a little bit of context about Gillian and Jenny and Elizabeth and what they do. And also maybe we can talk a little more broadly about, you know, the movies that they make and what has happened to them. So, you know, help me understand what Gillian and Jenny did before this new movie Landline. So Gillian and Jenny, I would say, are both best known for a film called Obvious Child, which was Gillian's debut. And Jenny Slate's kind of first big post-Saturday Night Live moment. I guess she's famously known for cursing on Saturday Night Live and then Obvious Child. That's right. Obvious Child came out in 2014.

And the most basic description of it is that it is about a young woman in Brooklyn who has a one-night stand, gets pregnant by accident. And then- Like you do. Yeah. And then ultimately decides to have an abortion. That's the movie. And it is a rom-com as well because there is kind of a secondary will they, won't they with the gentleman in question from the one-night stand. Will there be a second night yeah but it was in addition to being a rom-com it's obviously a kind of very brooklyn situational film of a

certain moment that it was very well received at the time it was kind of around girls was still very much in its stride and it kind of was of that vein of like young woman in the city of a certain age, not quite having it together, but trying and was really beloved. Yeah, I think if you just go through some of the descriptional elements of the story, you'd be like, that's kind of a classic rom-com. But the look of it and the feel of it and the performances are just a little bit grounded. Is that a fair word to use? Yes, absolutely. That it's not it's not glossy. Right. It's not aspirational in the traditional rom-com sense of the word. And if you compare it

with, say, a Kate Hudson film, it's a little, not gritty, but messy. Yes. Messier. Very messy. And I talked about that with the three women earlier, just the fact that there's a lot of difficult choices that are made by people that sometimes seem ugly on the outside. And then you see people reconciling with those choices. And that's not totally the way, say, you know, your classical Sandra Bullock, Tom Hanks scenario plays out, right? Exactly. It's, they're definitely, the characters are slightly more, and I hesitate to use this word but unlikable off-putting how about that yes and they tend to be a little more r-rated for lack of a better word like the fact that an abortion is on the table here is a different conversation but that's not

a word that you hear in any rom-com ever sex is just you know they're just looser you were a woman living in brooklyn yeah when obvious child. I was. I still was, yes. You know, and when I spoke with the three of them earlier, I was relating some of my personal experiences to Landline and tried not to reveal too much. But, you know, the concept of like observing divorce in the 90s is very resonant there. Were there any aspects of, you know, the Obvious Child experience, maybe setting aside the deep personal, but just sort of the experience of watching that movie where you're like, this feels like closer to my life than something that, you know, maybe Nancy Meyers would write? Yes, absolutely.

Though it's funny, the first thing that, as soon as you asked that, the first thing that popped into my mind, I watched part of Obvious Child again last night. And I was just like, I wanted everything that Jenny Slate was wearing. I was like, wow, I would love that card again. I don't quite have that one. And it's, you know, a different, I relate to Nancy Meyers movies in the same way, which maybe says something about me. But yeah, the first date sequence in particular,

which is just a very crappy bar in Williamsburg after a comedy show that's in the back that you try to avoid. And chills just went up my spine. Yeah, absolutely. And there's this moment also, so she meets, it's Jenny Slate's character and Jake Lacey is the actor. And chills just went up my spine. They can't get rid of the other person and then suddenly awkward sex happens. Truly Brooklyn 2014 right there for you. Yeah, it was really, really intense.

Of course, the other, the sex scene is set, is actually really lovely and it's probably the least realistic part of it because they're dancing around. Set to the title song, the Paul Simon song, yeah. It's a very well choreographed and like loving sex scene. But my whole impulse watching it was I wonder what the neighbors think about this song dancing, like blaring at loud volume at 4.30 a.m. And what's the volume level there? So it definitely evokes a very specific experience. Yeah. And the music is an interesting connective tissue, I think, to this new movie, Landline, which is set in 1995. As I said, the music that plays in the movie, there's breeder songs. We talked with Gillian about the fact that she couldn't get the Fugazi song in that she really wanted.

She was using all these hallmarks. But even though there is some connective tissue, I feel like Landline is a bigger movie. It's about a family. It's not just about one woman. It's still about the fragility of relationships, but also what people say and don't say to each other. Anna, what did you think of the movie? What do you know? What do you see in it? Well, bigger is it really?

It's a good word because it's just also in terms of the references. Woody Allen was the first thing that came to my mind. But Obvious Child, as we just demonstrated, like there's a very specific movie of a very specific time and a very specific person. And this is opening it up a little bit, both in terms of history and New York and the number of people are involved and there are kind of two, there's the relationship between the parents

and the relationship between the sisters and the, yeah, it's broadening its scope. I liked it. I think Abby Quinn in particular, who's the younger sister is just sensational. And I really love Jenny Slate. I do think that there was something so special about Obvious Child, and it's so special of its direct relevance to me.

Sure, yes. That it's very hard for me to look past that. But I certainly enjoyed Landline. I think the specificity of each of those characters is something that they do really well. Yeah, so what do you think about, you mentioned Woody Allen, which is, you know, that's a whole other loaded conversation, but it's kind of a,

almost a passe art form to be making character studies in big cities among families. You know, the fact that this movie even happened is pretty surprising to me. What do you think about the direction that this is going in? We've talked before about the general death of the rom-com, but even the family drama feels like something that is a bygone era. Absolutely. I think this seemed like an homage to me as much as it did kind of trying to reinvent the form. And I liked it for that. I like the homage concept. Yeah. You know, I do think it's nice to see it's nice to see someone doing it because Lord knows there's not a ton of it. It's true. Last week, I had our

colleague and friend Chris Ryan on the show. Yes. We were talking about Spider-Man Homecoming and, you know, like, what should John Watts do next? We were fantasy booking his career. Right. But as a fan of Gillian, what do you want to see from a Gillian Roast? Do you want to see her his career. Right. But like if, as a fan of Gillian, like what, what do you want to see from a Gillian Roast type person? Do you want to see her try to do a studio comedy? Do you want to see her

develop a TV show? What's a good execution? Should she and Jenny keep making movies forever? So I have some very strong opinions about these. Okay. Do not make a studio comedy.

Okay. No one has made a successful studio comedy this year. It's true. It's just a bad path. Yeah. Which is a whole separate conversation. But it seems like you don't want to see people who are talented and who you like kind of go down that dead end.

I would love to see her keep working with Jenny Slate. I was thinking a little bit on the way over here about there aren't that many female directors. So there aren't that many kind of female director and female actress pairings. You know, we're very used to it on the male side of like Scorsese and Leo and, you know, Christopher Nolan and his whole menagerie. But Sofia Coppola and Kirsten Dunst is the only kind of comparison I can think of. And I love all of their films. And it's fun to watch. You can kind of compare the performances in a way and compare the stories they come up with they're kind of creating their whole lady world i laid not lady was their whole world of women

lady world was a um a contender for the title of the ringer i mean we went with the ringer but lady world was a finalist um but you know you kind of you get to compare the choices they make which is very exciting and pretty rare for film just because they don't make films about women. So I always just think they make nice films together. I think Jenny Slate and Gillian Robespierre have like two successes, which is rare. So keep going. Just lean into what works. That's a great way to end.

We're going to lean into what works next, hopefully, with this conversation. Amanda, thank you for joining me. You're very welcome. Thanks for having me. I am joined by a trio of talented people. They have a new movie called Landline. I'm here with Jenny Slate, Gillian Robespierre, and Elizabeth Holm. Guys, thank you for coming in today. Thank you for having us.

We're very excited. This is very cool. So Landline is a really fun movie. It's the second movie you guys have made together. It's set in 1995, and I would like to talk about 1995 first, if that's okay with you. Sure. Why is this movie set in 1995 were you around in 1995 oh god yes i was i was i was a teenage boy uh but it's a very resonant

moment and there's a teenage character in your movie and so there was a lot to relate to cool yeah 1995 was a big year for us uh liz and I both are born and raised New Yorkers. We came of age in the 90s, and New York City was our playground for sure. And also our parents got divorced in the 90s when we were teenagers. Wow, same. Yeah. And a lot of our friends' parents got divorced or were already divorced. Not mine.

My family is perfect. Sorry. We'll talk about your haunted house. Yeah. No, no. And your dad's jammies. My parents are still married. They're just possessed. So, yeah, it was loosely based on that. that and um also we wanted to free ourselves of that scene you know the insert shot of somebody

going on facebook and stalking their you know loved ones who you believe are cheating on you oh that makes sense that does remove kind of an annoying thing to have to put in every movie or tv show you make now right it's so ugly i'm so tired of seeing like that shot of like a hand on the phone i think it could be done well. And I think that, you know, it's something that a lot of writers and directors are trying to figure out how to do it properly. And I think House of Cards does it well. You know what just did it well is on Twin Peaks

when the sheriff like pulls up his computer to Skype with the doctor. I love that part. It's like in a wooden thing in his desk. And I like have watched like Rewound that scene like a few times. Yeah, but only David Lynch I love that part. It's like in a wooden thing in his desk. And I like, I've watched like, rewound that scene like a few times. Yeah, but only David Lynch

could own that computer. Rewound it? Okay, well, I'm from the 90s. Jerry. What do you call it? What do you call it? If you go back?

Shuffle? Shuffle back? You say rewind. No, you don't say rewind anymore. What do you say? I watched, rewatched it? DVR back? I don't, there's no, there's no i don't there's no well i rewound it okay there's like mechanisms but what's the verb what do we call

it now go back i'll call it dvr i get the answer i went back in chapter chapter back i don't know okay so you actually named the movie landline yeah it's where archaic ledites who are idiots fucking is that why though is that was the movie always going to be something about communication was it always going to be it's definitely a movie about a family you know communicating or not and connecting or not and about humans needing to you know open up to each other. And to us, landlines always kind of meant home. They're really grounded and they are sort of the hearth of the family. And also, yeah, it's an easy way to remind people it's not 2017 when the movie opens. Were you guys big, like spending three hours on the phone talking to your friends growing up?

Oh, yeah yeah definitely and getting the cord like pulled out from under my door and then having to take the phone jack out to plug in the dial-up that then also got taken out of my room yeah it's the sound of that i'm so old we did not have that in our house we did not have dial-up in our house yet we didn't have it either but because we like we didn't have cable we just didn't have it either, but because we, like, we didn't have cable. We just didn't have that. And then we got the internet late. Like, I think we got the internet in 2000. Okay. But you got, you had ghosts though, growing up. Yeah, we had the ghosts for forever. Okay. But we, I had a phone in my room, but I really didn't have a lot of friends. So it wasn't until probably like my senior year of high school or maybe junior that I was talking on the phone.

Since you didn't grow up in New York, what was it like trying to figure out this character, Jenny? I mean, first of all, it's well written. So it's not there's not a lot of mystery there. It's not like I'm I'm playing someone from like a completely other culture or I don't understand what the references are. There's just a lot in there that is a roadmap. But, you know, I'm from a really small town in Massachusetts. It's very woodsy. It's sort of like pastoral and New England-y.

And I'm a very, you know, grew up in a really sheltered environment. Both of my parents are artists. I went to a private school. I never went anywhere by myself. And New Yorkers go a lot of places by themselves. And at once they like exist in kind of a dangerous environment, but are surrounded by people all the time. And that allows for like a real sense of reality. Like there are people around. If you feel unsafe, you can say something, but also a lot of those people might not be safe

people. You know, it's like you really have to kind of hedge your bets and be on your toes. And even my character, Dana, who's kind of square, she's still a New Yorker. And I like that. There's that real sense of like really being on your feet, just like real casual independence that New Yorkers have and that I think also was kind of really amped up in the 90s. Yeah. The 90s thing in particular is really well handled. There's a lot of tactile stuff. A floppy disk is kind of the orienting prop of the movie. How did you guys, was it fun to go back and put those things together and figure out the costumes and the music? Oh my God, it's so fun. How did you do it?

Did you all just get together and be like, this is my favorite Breeder song? Or where does that come from? Yeah, well, in the script, there was a lot of music cues. Some of them are still in the movie and some of them change after we shot it and started editing. Any heartbreaking cuts? Yeah, it was a Fugazi song that I really, really wanted. Which one? Waiting Room that I really wanted Allie to be listening to when she was breaking up with her boyfriend, you know.

And we just didn't go after it because he doesn't put his songs in movies especially movies that have drugs in them um he's very protective of his songs as he should be but uh so we have an archers of love song in there and it's it's really nice and i'm happy with that um but there was also i think a bjork song that we thought would start the movie and um on the page it's really nice but i in reality i think i love how we start the movie um just with the wood sounds and some grunting jenny did you and um did you and abby quinn who plays your younger sister in the movie talk about the teenage experience and being in new york given that she's a lot younger and that in a lot of you

you were probably not too far from her age at that time. Yeah, I graduated from high school in Y2K. So, yeah, I mean, my formative years were really the 90s. Abby was born in 1996. That's a year after. Yeah. We had to teach her how to use a payphone. Okay. Yeah. We talked about it a little bit, but really what was important was to just talk to each other about anything so that we could get a sense of each other's boundaries. You know, like she's like a very young woman from Michigan. You know, like she's a musician.

She has a totally different life and family history than I do. And we're in these scenes where we have to either really care for each other or really kind of claw at each other and have like a really irritating dissonance. And, you know, for our characters, I think watching it, it feels kind of good to see the way that they don't match up and the way that there's friction. But I think if you're going to do that kind of thing with someone, you just have to know what their limits are in general. It's kind of like if you're going to have to go on a business trip with a colleague. Right. Is there anything, I mean, do you guys have sisters, Gillian and Liz? We both have older brothers and I think we're sort of the closest thing we have to sisters is each other.

How much of your dynamic is between? There's an age gap, too. Oh, boy. Yeah, we're eight years apart. And Dana and Allie are 10 years apart. And I think we didn't totally realize it when we were writing. But as we were filming and certainly in the edit, it became more and more a sisters movie. And we were kind of like, oh, shit, this is more than a little bit our vibe.

You would say that out loud. We don't apply to each other as hard as they do. But we push each other in the writing room and while creating. And sometimes there is confrontation. And then it's always followed with, you know, love and apology and respect. And I think we have a comfort with each other like sisters, but in a creative way. It's very familial. Yeah. And we're staying in the same hotel room while we're here. We'll both like chew on the phone while talking to each other like that family.

But it bothers me. So the three of you, this, like I said before, this is your second movie. I'm curious, Obvious Child, such a great movie, so beloved. Did your lives change significantly after that? I kind of want to hear about that period before you started to make Landline. Oh my God, yeah. Sundance, the first time around, changed our lives 100%. Liz and I both had day jobs. We made Obvious Child on nights and weekends, took sabbaticals from our day jobs to shoot the movie. I almost lost my job while making Obvious Child. What were your day jobs? I worked at the Directors Guild of America,

just like a very pencil-pushy, non-creative job, and Liz ran the film program at Kickstarter, which was a creative job. It was a sweet job. It was fun, and it helped me make Obvious Child, and they were very supportive, and we did a Kickstarter for Obvious Child. We sure did.

Not a great one. That was pretty good. A lot of takes. That was pretty cool. I'm not very in front of the camera, kind of. But the movie came to life. It appeared. It appeared, and we sold it to A24.

We screened at the library in a weird time, but everyone loved it. We came back to New York, and Liz and I went back to our day jobs for a couple more months. I remember 824 sitting us down and being like, when are you going to quit? And I was and sold the idea for this movie, Landline, to a company called Oddlot. On a pitch that was just about a family of women, three women in one family, and how they deal with divorce. And we were calling it Untitled Divorce Comedy for a really, really long time. But then when we started making it and writing it, it really became something a little bit darker and no longer just this comedy, but I think a little more heart than Obvious Child has in terms of exposing many ways people feel and walk through life. I think Donna in Obvious Child was dealing with one issue and something that a lot of people can relate to, which is grappling with your early 20s and dealing with unplanned pregnancy. And we just popped into her life in that moment.

And we're popping into this family's life in many moments. It's not just about divorce. It's about not communicating. It's about not knowing who you are within a relationship. It's about being in a relationship for 30 years and realizing that it's coming not knowing who you are within a relationship it's about being in a relationship for 30 years and realizing that it's coming to an end so we're we're pop we're dealing with a lot more issues and storylines than we did in obvious child and jenny what about you after obvious child i think a lot of people said this person's a movie star did that they were like we already know i don't know that that is really uh uh but i at least i think

for me it's weird like i don't within myself i don't define myself that way i mean as anything like or as a comedian or as whatever as my characters that i've played except for maybe marcel the shell i actually feel like this you you know, like that. And that's why that character even exists, because that is me expressing my inner self. But I was always dealing with this thing that was like, well, when am I going to be able to show that I'm an actress? Because I'm not really showing it. You know, I'm like doing performances. I'm like going on TV and like doing things. But a lot of this stuff is it's easy and I like it, but I want to do the thing that's like the thing that's deep within me. And that's what Obvious Child changed for me was that I was able to access these different

ways of expressing myself and performing that I hadn't been allowed to do before. I just hadn't been allowed to do that. And I really, really wanted to. And after I did that, I felt more legitimate within a community of actors. And I felt like, and I still feel that it takes a long time to shed the thing that's like, well, I'm not a comedian, I'm an actress. Because the fact is, I'm everything. I'm also like a woman and a house tidier and a gardener and a daughter. And you know, like I'm everything. I'm also like a woman and a house tidier and a gardener and a daughter and, you know, like I'm everything. And I would like to be everything at once. But I think we live in a world where people really want to try to say what you do so that they don't feel out of control.

And so that you can serve a purpose for them. And that's, I think, a weird way to be seen. It doesn't feel good to me. So it's still something I feel like I have to work on opening like constantly. I feel like maybe I'm projecting, but I feel like I constantly have to remind people that I am an actress. When in fact, it's probably that I have to become more comfortable with the fact that I'm an actress rather than remind other people, you know, like rather like become comfortable with the fact that something that I've wanted since I was a child is something that I have and that I've always had it. But now I'm able to use it and I and have to contend with the ramifications of those things. And that's not that doesn't always happen in the more pro forma Hollywood storytelling.

And, you know, I suspect you're you have to kind of figure out how to put that on screen in a very specific way. You know, did you guys know that you wanted to do something again immediately after Obvious Child and try to tap back into that? Yeah. I mean, I do think we like to tell stories about people that are complex or complicated or have, you know, personalities that want and feel many things at the same time. I guess I don't necessarily see what they do as making bad choices. I think we all make choices and every move we make is kind of a micro decision that has an effect on people we love and the rest of our lives. And I guess some of those choices might create more mess or wreak more havoc than others. But we try really hard to, you know, write our characters without judgment and with a lot of empathy for the choices people make and try and really understand everybody and where they're coming from. But yeah, I guess it's a lot of people like fucking up and trying. But I think that's where, hopefully where some of the comedy comes from and, you know, definitely where a lot of the heart comes from that people seem to connect to when you can relate to that decision or lack of decision. But we definitely wanted to work together.

That was our, you know, experience after Obvious Child. It was such a beautiful time for us, you know, collectively growing as individuals and then also as artists. And we wanted to continue that growth with each other because I think the three of us are really good at pushing each other and not just settling into our roles and staying there, much like this family. and we are much like a family uh so we knew we wanted to do it again we wanted to try new things write new things for jenny where she wasn't playing the same character that she did an obvious child push her push each other in the writing room setting it in the 90s was something that was, you know, more difficult to do as a director because you had to frame it in a certain way.

New York City doesn't look like the 90s. There's a lot more moving parts with an ensemble and working with more actors and pushing myself that way. And I think that that growth is really exciting. And why I'm in filmmaking is to collaborate with really smart, amazing women. Was it harder or easier the second time around doing it? Both. Yeah, I mean, for many reasons. Yeah, it's just a different, it was hard for many reasons,

but also wonderful for many reasons. And like with Obvious Child, I was kind of like the only person really in that movie. I mean, there are other people in it, but like- You were in every single frame. I spent most of the time on set feeling like I was either in a personal interaction that was more felt alone

or like with someone who was just there for the day. You know, like the Polly Draper who played my mom, I think we had like two days with her. Yes. You know, like the Polly Draper who played my mom, I think we had like two days with her. Yes. You know, like that's nothing. And it's not a lot. Or even Jake Lacey who played Max. I feel like he had five days.

Well, the whole movie we shot in 18 days. That's true. None of it was a lot of time. My experience of that was like felt pretty solo. But each day was like, you know, 12 to 14. Yeah. Whereas, you know, 12 to 14. Yeah. Whereas, you know, so this was different and that was really nice to be in more of an ensemble thing. But there is

pressure coming back in and you just have to acknowledge that. I think it's weird to be like, no, there's none. It doesn't, you know, because there is and that's fine. It's, I think you got to be curious about that and then readjust so that you can do your work in a way that isn't like panicked or cheap or like that you end up posturing in one way or another because that stuff spreads. I think it really does. And then also like personally, I was getting divorced while we were making this movie. So it was just really hard. It was really hard to make a movie about a woman who's questioning her own belief system within her partnership and isn't sure of what her voice can be and who is.

And also in general, I think, you know, there are three women in this movie. And in one way or another, they all feel a little bit silenced or unseen. And they're all major talkers. They all have a lot of energy. And it's odd that they would feel that way. And in one way or another, they are rejecting that. You know, Allie, especially, she feels that there's silence, that the truth is being withheld.

She's constantly telling people that they're hypocrites and that they're not saying what needs to be said. And she becomes rather jaded by seeing this over and over again that people are hiding their truth. And Dana, my character, is really suffering because her truth is really starting to bloom within her. And she doesn't know if she's allowed to acknowledge it. And I think personally, I was coming into this film being like, everything just fell apart for me.

The only truth that I know in my life is that I don't know what's going on. Do you say that to Liz and Gillian when you guys are writing the script? Do those things collide in any meaningful way? Well, when they wrote the movie, I was still married and honestly had a lot of faith in working through it. And so I didn't know I would be coming in and being like without that relationship anymore. But when they were writing this script, we had a lot of talks about making sure that Dana's story in the end has basically nothing to do with who she ends up with, but in fact, where she lands and whether or not she seems like a person who has learned that it's her right to grow and change. And that if she's in a partnership where she feels that she can't ask the questions she needs to ask, then that's when

she should move on. But that a partnership is worth it if your partner will grow with you. And Jay's character, he plays Ben, Jay Duplass plays Ben, my boyfriend, in the film. Fiancé. Fiancé. His whole thing was like, you never even gave me a chance. You never even asked me anything. And what I love about their partnership is that it's disappointment on equal sides. It's not like he was weak and boring and she's needy and horny or something, you know. They're actually just two people who have done the thing that a lot of long-term relationships kind of do, which is you bond, you're delighted by that bond, you spend years together, you build a life, and then suddenly you confuse stasis for stability and you feel grossed out and scared.

And a lot of times another person can come in and make you feel fresh and you're just like running towards that breeze. And that's not sustainable. And you know, you mentioned the ensemble and that exact dynamic is represented really in Edie Falco and John Turturro's characters' relationships too. And you see, you know, you can see Jenny's character kind of casting forward and thinking about what can happen to her life. And then you look at Abby and the relationship that her character is in. You know, one, the cast is incredible. So I'd love to hear a little bit about how you guys got it.

Edie especially I thought was just wonderful in the movie. Yeah, she's amazing. And also just how, what it was like to write those characters and how to fit them together. You know, it is a little bit of a classical James L. Brooks-y kind of like this all works together. How dare you? Yeah, we love James L. Brooks. He's just like Spanglish.

He's a coffee machine though. He don't know how to work and everyone's always like, get out of the wind. Why do I know that movie so well? I don't know. I've never seen it. That's how you know maybe it's better than you think. Yay. In terms of getting this amazing cast, I think we did one thing and really one thing only, which is we sent them the script.

And they read it and they connected to it. And then I just met with Edie at a coffee shop. And I think she just wanted to make sure I wasn't crazy. We had the same crazy check meeting with John as well. And then I had tea with John in his apartment, well, in his brownstone. And we were both recovering from colds, listening to NPR and just talking about relationships and politics. And again, just, you know, making sure that I wasn't crazy. Can you see the look in their eye when they have accepted you and they say, I want to work with this person? Do you know that?

I think they were relieved that I wasn't a baby. Even, you know, even though you can see on my Wikipedia page my age, I think a young woman and it's their second film. We're just curious to make sure that they feel legit. But they also were fans of Obvious Child. Both John and Edie watched Obvious Child and kind of fell in love with that, I think, after reading the script, which was nice. And we worked with great casting directors, Doug Abel and Stephanie Holbrook, who are based in New York. And, you know, I've worked on many Kenny Lonergan films, Wes Anderson films.

The Doomboats Mozart in the Jungle. They've done a lot of amazing stuff and have a really good sense of authentic humans. It was really important to us to have this be a real family that looked and felt like a real family down to Jenny and Abby and John's amazing curly hair on screen. Yeah, and that these were real New Yorkers and that you just bought this, you know, long history and intimacy and familiarity. And luckily, John and Edie had that because they were friends. John's cousin was on The Sopranos and they've had many Thanksgivings together, but never been in a movie. They both are, you know, actors who came up in the 90s in New York as well. So they had an intimacy before we were ever rolling. It was friendship. And their characters had that deep friendship.

You know, they didn't have love any longer, but the friendship and the respect had to be underneath all of those very, you know, brutal fight scenes. Yeah, they're also like a tactile, credible New York couple. You know, they feel like New York parents in a specific way. What happens when you show a movie like this that is so specific and has a lot of feeling and emotional confusion to your families? You know, are they drawing conclusions from what you're writing or how do you communicate about that? I've got very proud New York parents who are so excited for me. And they also had a we also had a very long conversation before I sent them the link.

What was in that? Just to hear this is what this is going to be about? Yeah. You know that there will be some things that they recognize. But it's, you know, a story that took off once we were in the writing room. And it's written by two women and it's not just you guys on screen. It's really about a family that Liz and I created based off of our childhoods and the people that we were watching the closest were our parents and our siblings,

but it became something else. We were also observing life around us and other people's parents and how our friends, you know, dealt with divorce and growing up in New York. And it's based on so many experiences and also a lot of made up things. So, you know, they heard it and they watched it and they felt proud. Of course, there are always questions like, i really like that i'm like mom that's not you you know and just reassuring her but they're so proud and um i'm you know happy that they just have been very excited about me being a filmmaker and very a force behind that since i was a kid what about you can i top out of answering such questions sure that's why I was talking so long yeah it's hard uh there's a lot that's very personal and as Gillian said a lot of our own experiences I think underneath it all I know my parents are proud and sure all the same questions am I really

like that do you really think that well What will my friends think? But again, you know, you start with what you know and then try and create something new. And for me, the movie was very personal for my own experience and like connecting so closely with Allie's character and her journey and, you know, writing this the summer I was getting married, connecting with Dana's questions and the idea of really needing to actively choose your choice, you know, were all things that I was thinking about. So sometimes when I talk to my parents about it, I'm like, what about me? Like, forget your deal with it. But I think it is a kind of movie that is hopefully so relatable that everybody thinks we've had like nanny cams in their apartments and that this is about a lot of people. And often we do get. They say that. Yeah, people come up to us after the screening. I went to Benihana or a CD skip

while I was having sex as a teenager and i those are actual things that people have said to us after screenings um so it is universal even though it's loosely based on our little universe so to wrap up what happens next do you guys do something else are you going to work together again well jenny will have to go through a rigorous audition process i hope that we work together again. I will always show up if they ask me to. Are you guys writing anything right now? No.

Well, you know, thinking about stuff. But I just directed two episodes of a Hulu show called Casual. And I'm directing two episodes of an HBO show called Crashing. But always, you know, writing in my head and thinking of new fucked up things to say. That's probably a good place to end. Jenny Slate, Gillian Robespierre, Elizabeth Holm, thank you very much for joining me today. Thank you.