The Big Picture - Our Thirst for ‘Trap’

Episode Date: August 5, 2024

Sean and Amanda dig into a heap of news that Sean missed while he was on vacation (0:55), including the latest on the MCU (1:25), the fall festival landscape (18:27), and the just-announced Britney Spears biopic (30:5r0). Then, they dive deep into M. Night Shyamalan’s latest, the twisty serial killer thriller ‘Trap’ (38:05). Hosts: Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins Producer: Brian H. Waters Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hi, I'm Tara Palmieri. I'm Puck's senior political correspondent and host of Somebody's Gotta Win, brought to you by The Ringer and Spotify. The 2024 election has been upended with Joe Biden off the ticket and Donald Trump facing a new challenger, Kamala Harris. If you want to hear what the insiders are really saying about the race, join me Tuesdays and Thursdays as I break it all down with lawmakers, journalists, and political strategists. We'll go deeper than the headlines to the anxieties at the highest levels of power. And of course, we'll chew over all the hot political gossip as we head into this historic election. Be sure to follow Somebody's Gotta Win at Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Get groceries delivered across the GTA from Real Canadian Superstore with PC Express.

Shop online for super prices and super savings. Try it today and get up to $75 in PC Optimum Points. Visit Superstore.ca to get started. I'm Sean Fennessey. I'm Amanda Dobbins. And this is The Big Picture, a conversation show about trap. We're talking today about M. Night Shyamalan's latest feature film. We will get into the nitty gritty of the story, performances, twists.

But first, I've just come back from vacation. I missed, what did I miss? Did I miss a lot? I have so many news items written down here on our outline. And I feel like it wasn't that noisy, but there were a few critical critical things that happened did you feel like I was missing out on a lot I felt like you maybe missed out on some things that you care about yeah especially because you went on vacation you left on your birthday so you weren't able to attend comic-con I wasn't unfortunately you know never been marvel once do you think you'll go maybe I honestly it sounded like the midnight boys had a

great time it yeah it did i mean they seemed sort of in and out yeah you know even for them they were like we can't be that close they did a good job of getting me excited about the things that i probably would look at more cynically if i were not listening to them talk about what transpired at com right which we'll talk about and marvel like is once again back to its evil genius of synchronizing like the deadpool wolverine box office success with all of with comic-con and all of their announcements which you know as van said he was very moved so that's great that's the people who care were very moved and i still can't really get clarity on who wins in a fight between galactus and dr doom they really evaded that question it sounds like maybe you'll have to see the film the

avengers colon doomsday right well probably i think the avengers will win potentially but you know that's again if the people are happy then the people should be happy great job you mentioned the the deadpool box office which i i lightly concerned trolled when we discussed the movie with the with the midnight boys a couple of weeks ago and um it seems to be doing pretty well yeah how much money did you make on on what from the deadpool wolverine box office zero dollars unfortunately for me um that's tough maybe i should have waved at someone like all of you who have worked so hard should start asking for, like, back ends yourself. Just from

covering this content? Yeah, the Midnight Boys deserve a check. You're working hard. Yeah, I mean, in fairness, the Marvel Corporation started many years before they were all born. These characters have been around for a long time. I mean, Deadpool has made roughly $820 million

already. Sure. Sorry for looking out for you. And for the future generations. I just don't expect the things I love to love me back. That's the complicated relationship I have with culture. I did notice, though, in looking at the box office, that Inside Out 2 has made $1.5 billion

in six weeks. I would not have predicted that six weeks ago. Not even close. Because that's an extraordinary amount of money. That's the 10th highest grossing movie not adjusted for inflation

in the history of movies. Right. And it's still in theaters and still doing well. So it has a chance to maybe be the 7th or the 8th highest grossing movie ever.

Which Inside Out 2 was good. It was fine. Yeah. It was solid. But it's a movie you can take your children to in the summer. Yeah. I guess it's...

And also a movie, as we discussed, where around six, the age starts, and then it catches the next generation of kids who liked the first In-N-Out, and then all of the parents, and every... You know. I think... It spans a wide age audience. I think I'm always interested in the unusual quasi outliers in box office performance. Like, of course, Deadpool and Wolverine did well. We knew it was going to do well.

That was a movie that's projected to do well for months and months, years even. They were like, this will be the thing that gets everything back on track. You know, a movie like Avatar, even though some people doubt Jim Cameron, those movies always do well. You know, there's certain movies you can identify as like really going to be huge performers. And then there are movies that are like their sequels or their slightly unexpected properties. Like Jurassic World was kind of a version of this to me when they brought Jurassic World back. Well, I don't remember what happened in Jurassic World, but I do remember that it made a lot of money. In fact, it is also one of the 10 highest grossing movies ever.

That's the one with Blue. I remember that one. Isn't Blue in all of them? Well, I can't testify to that but I know she's in the first one. Do you know that Scarlett Johansson and Mahershala Ali will be in the Jurassic movie? Yes, I do.

And whatever. Okay. I think I'm just fascinated by the success of that movie in particular. There's going to continue to be movies that are going to do well this year. Probably nothing even close to as big as Inside Out 2. I noted it with interest, as I often say. Jamie Lee Curtis apologized to Marvel over the weekend because of her comments about how Marvel was in a downturn.

Are you prepared to apologize to Marvel like Jamie Lee? For what? For your comments. Which comments? The collected comments of Amanda Dobbins. Circa 2017 through 2024. I feel like I was very, like, neutral to Posse. Were you? On Deadpool to Wilbur.

Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I was like, I don't really care. But what about everything else? Why do you need my apology? I don't need it. Yeah, like, why does anyone need it? What if Kevin Feige needs it? Why does Kevin Feige?

Kevin Feige just made another, like, here's the thing. You know. What is the thing? To quote Sir Ridley Scott. Like, get a life you know like the lady on the podcast did not validate my world you're like who cares you guys have all the money in the world like they're gonna make so much deadpool and wolverine and wolverine in the deadpool stuff you know they're gonna make like deadpool babies you think they're gonna make like

deadpool or wolverine this year um i i am actually starting to get really stressed about Halloween costumes, which is a separate conversation that we can talk about. I just I need the Philadelphia Phillies to license a Philly fanatic costume for toddlers. Like, oh, wow. You know, that sounds dangerous, to be honest with you. Knox is obsessed with the fanatic. Yeah. But he calls him the green friend.

I see. And like we have spent so much time watching the philly fanatics instagram in the last two months i'm sorry to announce that this is the end of my relationship with nox because i cannot support philly fanatic content we do also but some of the so he only wants to watch the videos you know if you pick up a photo he's just like louder louder and i'm like okay well um but some of them feature mr and mrs met as well because when they all went to london they went as a group yeah and so we have watched some mr and mrs met kind of a challenger situation there the fanatic sure mrs met yes sitting in the middle for the fanatic they list mr met skills and mrs met skills and the fanatics skills their

skills yeah but mrs met skills are like a little disrespectful. It's just like giving a nice kiss and being supportive. Giving a nice kiss? It's like it is basically about that. That sounds very dangerous. Anyway, I don't think that Knox knows about Deadpool and Wolverine yet.

And I'm, you know, I'm sure that he will one day watch the movies and find them funny. Zach, my husband, hasn't seen it yet, but he like he will go and he will. Yeah, maybe I can go with him. You know, I'd like to see it again. But that's the thing. That's great.

You all have that. And I don't need to be part of it. OK, fair enough. The other big news in the MCU is that Robert Downey Jr. is coming back to portray Dr. Doom. It's been talked about a lot in the last week or so since it was first announced at Comic-Con. You and I have not had a chance to talk about it. This is the rare case where I feel like everyone is right. I feel like the people

who are really happy that this is happening, the exultation from the fans in San Diego when it was announced, I understood that and I felt great for them. And I felt like maybe there is a world where this is a cool storytelling choice. And then the people who are just like withering assholes who are just like our culture is dead and we don't have any ideas left they're also kind of right and so we'll see you don't you don't care

like so here's the thing I have lived and died by like every episode of and just like that the sex in the city revival so like I am in no position, you know? Okay. When the famous people, you know, try their other things, sometimes win their Oscars, sometimes don't, and then come back home and keep making just pure nostalgia, slightly brain dead stuff to take my money. Yeah.

To satisfy your last satellite. Yeah. If they're making it for me like that's great okay i can't wait for season three you know like so more power to you if you're excited about robert downey jr coming back as dr doom who is tony stark but isn't we don't know that's just the supposition sure i mean a variant of tony stark that was cool i guess like my one note that i'd give to everyone who just started diagramming all the different ways. I was like, let's keep that in our private journal.

I feel really good about how I've moved on from that. Let's put the password on the message board, you know? So you're just among your friends when you're doing that. Put a password on the message board? Yeah. So that it's just not everyone not everyone needs to see that. Okay. Okay.

This is just my tip to them. What were you looking at? You were looking at social media? Yeah. Okay. I must have missed that on vacation. Congratulations. Yeah, I feel good about it.

I didn't see a lot on social media over vacation. There were a lot of commercials during the Olympics, so. I did watch a lot of Olympics. I watched a lot of Olympics and then I watched a lot of social media while waiting for the the races to start again how about Willem Dafoe's Nike

commercial by the way I haven't seen that you haven't no he's just it's really good you would like it a lot did he direct it no but he's narrating it and it's very funny and I'm happy for him I want him to get more money yeah exactly so I whatever your feelings are about Dr. Doom I kind of think that's on your own time and it should maybe be a little inside. Let's talk about Robert Downey Jr., though. Yeah. Because obviously he just won an Academy Award this year for his work in Oppenheimer. Many people hailed that work. You hailed it less than others. I thought that was an incomprehensible third hour of a movie. There was some suggestion that this would signal a return to the kind of quote unquote real acting as opposed to working in this franchise stuff. I personally was a little bit skeptical about that. One of the reasons why I really responded to the documentary Senior about his father, Robert Downey Senior, which is on Netflix, is because I thought it was a very interesting snapshot of a wildly successful person who is deeply unsatisfied with his station in life.

And obviously Robert Downey Jr. has had a lot of demons, a lot of struggles over the years. He's overcome a lot, has a family, has all the money in the world. He has some architectural experiments in Malibu. Is that true? Yeah, it's like a whole artist installation that you can live in. Sort of like a tent thing it looked very cool it was in t magazine um that sounds nice i'm glad he's putting that money to use he just doesn't seem like a person who cares about what other quote-unquote cinephiles want him to care about

yeah who can blame him like i don't he wants to be adored and he wants to ham it up and this is an easy way to do that was sort of evident even during like the oscar campaign and he kept it like pretty locked down for most of the campaign but the closer you got the more he was like i don't care about this in his oscar acceptance speech i was like wow this is not giving a fuck exactly yeah yeah and so like the cards were showing but by the end which was fine because he had sewn up the Oscar. And I'm sure that meant something to him. Also, they're made up awards. I don't really, I don't need 10 more Oppenheimers, you know, from Robert Downey Jr.

But you do need. From Josh Hartnett, absolutely. We'll get to that. Yeah, from RDJ. Like, that one hour and, you know, a young senator from Illinois or whatever is enough. I'm good. So if it makes you guys happy, then I'm happy. The Kang Dynasty is out.

Jonathan Majors is out. They're retooling that movie to be about Doctor Doom. Okay. Avengers Doomsday. It's coming out in 22 months. 21 months. Yeah. Will this show exist? Let's make a bet. I mean, I have absolutely no idea. They were announcing stuff for 2027 as well.

Isn't that when like the Secret Wars happened? Correct. Yes. But didn't they already do the Secret Wars? They did Secret Invasion, which was a dreadful television and olivia coleman was in that she was in that yes and so they wasted that bullet yeah as was amelia clark who became the most powerful figure in all of marvel and then pretended like that no did someone different i don't remember her name you don't even know her name and she's the most powerful person in the world and she can defeat dr doom she was like the steph curry of marvel it was just She could just score from anywhere. It didn't go well. All right. They did Secret Invasion. They did not do Secret Wars. They're going to do Secret Wars eventually. We'll probably all be dead, honestly. My mind actually can't stretch to 2027. 2026 is the World Cup here in the United States. So I'm trying to stretch to

take it back to a world cup match. Interesting. So you think that will go well when he's four years old? I mean, yeah, he loves sports, you know, and he loves clapping. It's going to be pandemonium in those stadiums. I know the recent security events didn't make me feel great. Also like Philadelphia is hosting. And I was like, should we take him to the one in Philadelphia? See his grandparents? And rendezvous with the fanatic. Yeah. But I don't know if I...

The people of Philadelphia love them, though. I do. They throw snowballs at Santa. Yeah. I won't be attending anything in Philadelphia anytime soon. Blade's still on the calendar. Okay. Mahershala Ali, Blade movie, which apparently does not have a script or a director and is

supposed to come out in 14 months. Did they respond at all to the Deadpool jokes? Did who respond? Mahershalael ali or the did he publicly respond or i don't know i'm asking you that would be awesome if he got on they had a whole conference what else is happening at comic-con yeah i don't know i don't know i'm that movie is not coming out in 2025 okay let's talk about other stuff i won't make you talk about mcu anymore i thought that I held my own. I'm not criticizing you. I just know it's not your preferred mode. Is that fair?

Do you want to talk about Charlie XCX's birthday party? Glenn Powell was there. I think it's better if I don't. Glenn Powell was there. It was Attendance of the Trees. Isn't that funny? Oh, really? Yeah.

In Los Feliz? Yes. On Saturday night. Happy birthday to me, Greta Gerwig, and Charlie XCX, who did not invite me to her birthday party at Tenants of the Trees, but I would have come. Wow. Yeah.

I don't think having your birthday at Tenants of the Trees is Brad. I'm just going to put that out there. I don't. I don't. I do not. I'm sorry. I know I'm very old, but that's just an opinion that I'm going to hold here. Speaking of old, Horizon Chapter 2. Yeah. The film was taken off the slate. I can't believe I'm not going to Venice. I can't believe I'm going to hold here. Speaking of old, Horizon Chapter 2.

Yeah. The film was taken off the slate. I can't believe I'm not going to Venice. I can't believe I'm not going to Venice. It's a shame. I really am excited to have this child, you know? Definitely. But, like, fuck.

They're going to be so excited to listen to this podcast one day and be like, wow, my mom regretted not going to see Horizon Chapter 2. It's just more of a timing thing, you know? It is. But you make choices in life. I would have liked to have been there too because Venice is interesting. So Horizon Chapter 2 will premiere there. Who the hell knows when Warner Brothers will actually distribute the movie. Queer will be there.

We know that for a fact. The new Luca Guadagnino film starring Daniel Craig. The Room Next Door, the Pedro Almodovar movie. Maria, the Pablo Lorraine movie, which we've talked about a bit. Joker, Folia do. We saw that trailer together and I was like, this looks good. I will not apologize for thinking Todd Phillips is talented. I will not.

I'm sorry. I know that that's a controversial take. It looks good to me. Baby girl, new A24 movie, Nicole Kidman. And Harris Dickinson. And Harris, I'm sorry. And Harris. It is the, it is the fall of Harris Dickinson.

Oh, that reminds me. I should tell Zach to put Harris Dickinson in GQ. Okay. You want to say that? Zach, can you put Harris Dickinson in GQ? Anyone at GQ is listening. Okay. You think anyone is?

I don't know. Sometimes they do. I used to work there. Did you know that? Yeah, you were the Justin Timberlake character in Friends with Benefits. Based on your life. In more ways than one. The Brutalist is a movie I am eyeing.

Okay. Brady Corbett. Oh my God. Former actor. I hated that movie so much. Vox Lux. Director of Vox Lux. We were talking before we recorded

about movies that aren't even deserving of the ire that I have, but I'm just deeply allergic to them. And that is maybe top five. I also disliked Vox Lux immensely. The Brutalist is a three hour movie shot in 70 millimeter. An independently financed movie shot in 70 millimeter. I am at a minimum intrigued if only because it has a pretty incredible cast. Adrian Brody, Felicity Jones, Guy Pearce, Joe Alwyn, your boy, Jonathan Hyde, a handful of others. It's a very Venice movie.

So Toronto, we know, is getting Night Bitch, the new Mariel Heller, Amy Adams movie. The Fire Inside, which is Rachel Morrison's directorial debut, written by Barry Jenkins. Amazing. An Olympic story, actually. The Wild Robot, the animated film that Universal's putting out this

fall there it's this fall september 27th i mean how many ads have i seen for the wild robot already well i mean it's a universal movie so it's on the olympics a lot uh we live in time the a24 movie with florence pew and andrew garfield yeah eden which is a new movie from ron howard starring sydney sweeney and anna de armas which I do not believe has American distribution at the moment. If I were Ron Howard, I would not want to be promoting a film this fall. Well, he's going to get asked. And he's going to have to say one thing about Hillbillyology. And he's going to have to prostrate himself.

I'm just saying. I mean, if it doesn't have American distribution, you could just put it right there. I bet Amy Adams gets asked about it when she's given some sort of tribute at TIFF for Night Pitch 2. It's going to come up. I'm sure. Glenn Close, when will she pay for her sins? Yeah, but Ron Howard is the director of it. It's just a movie. Who cares?

It's just a movie. It's just a movie of a bad book by a bad person. That's it. That's what it is. It happens. There's been plenty of bad movies based on bad books. I know. I'm just saying. I wouldn't want to be answering the question. I wouldn't either. You'd be like, well, I fucked up. Okay, so the New York Film Festival has only announced Nickel Boys, the Rommel Ross film based on the colson whitehead novel the room

next door the pedro movie right and blitz the steve mcqueen world war ii film right which is all three of those films are premiering elsewhere those are not premieres right we don't know what else is premiering at the london film festival which you sniffed at, but given its subject matter, seems appropriate. You think it's a tribute to the subject matter of Bliss. I mean, it does seem like site specific, you know? Sure, of course. I sniffed at it. Yeah, you were really, really rude.

And then Chris made one of the funniest jokes all year. I don't remember. What was that? He was just like, where do you want it to play Berlin? And that was, yeah, that was not appropriate, but funny. It doesn't work because, you know, Berlin is in the spring. Okay. Yeah.

That's why it doesn't work. I'm very excited for Blitz. I am too. Did you see Saoirse Ronan and Jack Loudon got married? I didn't know they were dating, but that's great for them. They've been together for like eight years. I do know they were in Mary Queen of Scots together. That's where they met.

Yeah. Good for them. Seeing that movie sitting next to you was one of the more awkward experiences of my life. What? Like once the, you know, once the sex scene started, I was like, I just don't want to be sitting next to Sean. You feel awkward when sex is happening on screen and I'm in the room? That was like, I mean, and good for them for showing. I don't even remember the sex sequence.

Okay. Well, never mind. Was there like penetration? What happened? No, it was more like cuddling us, but you know. the sex scenes. Okay. Well, never mind. Was there like penetration? What happened? No. It was more like cuddling us. But, you know. Oh, wow.

Yeah. And I was just like. And good for them. Good for them. Going low. For them to show that is great. But I was like, I don't want to be seen. I have no recollection of this.

I know. I, you know. I was just like, I'm uncomfortable. Your mind is a complicated place. I bring all this up. Yeah. Because these are all movies that are relevant

to the Oscar race and the rest of the year in terms of movie releases. Telluride, of course, does not announce its lineup. And you have some anxiety. Well, I'm just,

I'm kind of like plotting out what's probably going to be there. It's almost certain that Conclave will be there. The movie about the selection of the next

Pope the Thriller from Edward Berger. Nickel Boys, I feel like there's a good chance Conclave will be there. The movie about the selection of the next Pope, the thriller from Edward Berger. Nickel Boys, I feel like there's a good chance that it will premiere there. The Piano Lesson, which is a movie we have not talked about and has been backburnered in my mind for some reason, but it is Malcolm Washington's debut directorial feature, Denzel's Son.

It's an adaptation of an August Wilson play that stars Samuel L. Jackson and is apparently a nifty awards contender. Maybe alongside Emilia Perez, Netflix's big play this fall. Got it. Okay. And then maybe Joshua Oppenheimer's The End. Maybe this movie Better Man. Have you read about Better Man at all?

This is a biopic of Robbie Williams, the British pop star. Oh, interesting. It's directed by Michael Gracie who directed The Greatest Showman and it has songs by the guys who wrote the songs from La La Land. Okay. Maybe I got that wrong.

I might have just gotten that last part wrong. It obviously has Robbie Williams' songs in it. But it's a Paramount movie that I wasn't really paying much attention to, but now there's some speculation

that it's actually quite good. Robbie Williams is in it and then there's another actor who portrays a young version of him in it and he dealt it's actually quite good. Robbie Williams is in it. And then there's another actor who portrays a young version of him in it. And he dealt with addiction. Oh, and Robbie Williams is playing himself? Yes, in later life. Oh, interesting. I like Robbie Williams.

I do as well. Sure, I do too. Robbie Williams is like the really quintessential UK. They just absolutely love it. And I'm just like nodding. Like, uh-huh. It is their culture. It is not our culture.

Obviously, with Millennium, he had like a very brief moment in the US, but was not a big star. But I just think it's interesting. It's also very rare for a Paramount movie to go to Telluride, but it seems like that could happen. I thought that was notable. And Piece by Piece, which is the Morgan Neville directed Lego animated Pharrell documentary. Yes.

That's a really weird lineup for Telluride. I can't really figure out what else would be there, especially because it seems like at this exact moment, these movies will not be premiering at a festival. One Saturday night, which was just confirmed to be a 2024 movie, you'll be missing out on that one, Amanda, which is Jason Reitman directing a film about the first ever.

I'd like to take everything negative back that I said to this baby about his timing because I'm just going to... Listen, I like Saturday Night Live too. Have I seen a Jason Reitman movie that I like ever? I don't know. I've seen a few. I'm very, very mixed on his oeuvre. Some of his movies I really like.

Some of them I think are not good at all. I'm willing to give this movie a chance. It basically is the starter kit for the 2027 episode of 35 Under 35 on the big picture.

It's a lot of young actors who are very promising and interesting. That's the next time we're doing it? No, I just think that's when it would be most appropriate to put

some of these actors on that list. Worst case scenario, it's a catnip movie for me. Yeah, absolutely. I helped put together a Saturday Night Live theme week at Grantland 10 years ago and it was a huge undertaking. movie for me. I mean Yeah absolutely no. I helped like put together a Saturday Night Live theme week at Grantland

10 years ago and it was like a huge undertaking. I've read dozens of books about Saturday Night Live. I love Saturday Night Live. I've only recently just truly fallen off

from watching the show on a regular basis. So I'm at least going to be curious about it. It's also the 50th anniversary of SNL starting this season. So big year for them.

But I don't think that's going to play anywhere. Maybe it'll go to Telluride but it doesn't seem like it. Gladiator 2 probably not going to play any festivals right? Yeah why? Do they need to? i don't think that's going to play anywhere maybe it'll go to tell your eye but it doesn't seem like it gladiator 2 probably not going to play any festivals right yeah why do they need to i don't think so i didn't love how the trailer looked on the big screen yesterday can i tell you that it started just before you oh yeah i was late yeah um okay but you know we weren't at one of your my fancy premiere projection experiences so we weren't yeah they didn't maybe they didn't give any of those

screens to trap, which is their loss. That was unfortunate. But, you know, that's the cost of moving up one week. We can talk about that. Here, the Robert Zemeckis movie

that takes place in one room over many centuries. Where's your, like... We're ready to have an emotional breakdown about the movie. Okay, great. I'm kind of normally

where I usually am with all Zemeckis movies. Like, why did you do this? What happened to you, sir? But also, maybe it'll be good. Right. Nosferatu. Yeah.

Probably not going to debut anywhere. I think that movie's going to do really well. Okay. Wicked Part One. Yeah. Wow. Those ladies have just been everywhere in Paris. Ariana Grande.

Yes. And Cynthia Erivo have attended every event sort of in costume. I mean, I do understand. Synergy. Yeah, of course. And it always says, from Universal Pictures, wicked. They are making it work, but they're also working. Do you own Comcast

stock? No. Okay. Maybe I should. Buy the dip. Think about it. There's a lot going on in the world right now. The last movie I want to mention that I don't... I'm just getting ready for industry. That's a good point. I'm looking forward to that, too. A Complete Unknown.

Oh, that's right. We didn't. We've not had a chance to talk about this. Okay. It is coming out in December. This is James Mangold's biopic of mid-60s, early to mid-60s Bob Dylan starring Timothy Chow. You're like tensing up right now. You're like, you're hugging yourself.

I feel so tense. I feel so tense. This movie is my crisis. And I'm trying to not. I can't. I can so tense. This movie is my crisis. And I'm trying to not... I can't help but overdo it. Okay. Because I watched the trailer and I was like, no.

This is not right. Why? What's wrong? I don't... Tell us. That's not what New York looks like to me in that time, in my mind.

And it is not, like, beautifully lit. Okay. It's, like, a little dirty and a little gross and he's a poor kid from minnesota who came there and it's not like a magical like glorious spectacle of genius okay obviously it was narrativized that way by the press but i could be 100 wrong it could be an amazing movie I'm not as high on Walk the Line as you are. But it is Walk the Line, the Bob Dylan version.

Or at least that's what it looked like in the trailer. So I'm a little, I don't know how to feel. I'm a little mixed up about it. Okay. Can you help me? No, because I'm one of the only two living people who is like, I really enjoy musical biopics by James Mangold. So I was like, well, looks like exactly what I thought he was going to do.

I thought Timmy sounded like pretty good. Yeah, he sounded okay. You know, and it was very much that Joaquin in Walk the Line thing where he's, I mean, almost mimicking, but it still sounds like the person while also singing in the style of. So I was okay with it. I didn't dislike the singing. I did like what I saw from Edward Norton.

I do think that that could be a very good performance. The bald cap is quite something. He looks good. Yeah. I just. This is very uncomplicated for me like i'm just going to go to the movies over christmas and i'm just going to be like take it away bob i think if you have a very like comfortable informed but not obsessive or analytical relationship to bob dylan i'm a

bob dylan scholar so please know who you're speaking you don't know about this no that i like took an undergraduate bob dylan course and then I had a paper published. So I'm like quite literally. Published where? I don't remember. Some undergrad. It probably doesn't exist anymore. Published like in a zine?

No, like in some sort of undergraduate journal. I never really followed up on it. An undergraduate journal? Of sorts. Maybe. Well, someone needs to go track down this work of scholarship. This was like at least 20 years ago. My professor wrote and was like, do you care if we submit this?

What was the subject of the paper? I don't remember. It ain't me, babe. But I don't remember what beyond that. Of course you're excited for this film. That's exactly what this is. It's that era. That was the other thing.

I'm a person who, you get older, you go through different phases of when's your favorite Dylan period. And there are times when this period that is portrayed in the movie is my favorite period. But not right now. This is not a period that I'm super interested in watching be portrayed on screen. You can just read too much about something. You know? No, I know. It's kind of similar to the Marvel thing. Yeah, no, I know.

I was listening to Greenwald talk about Deadpool and Wolverine. In a way I was like, you've read too many comics, dude. And I don't mean that in a negative way. Sometimes you can just read too much about something you care about and it completely refracts and distorts your enjoyment of something.

It is the curse of getting what you want. And your movie tastes in various forms. You've just been getting what you want for a long time in various forms. But this one is very close and also not quite close enough it is you know that's a really good segue to the news that broke today which is that david lynch speaking of getting what you want will and said that he will not be making any more films today

unless he can do it remotely because he was diagnosed with emphysema and so he is particularly um uh like covet in particular would be very damaging for him. Yeah. So he can't really go out in public anymore. So, you know, it's long been speculated that there would be another David Lynch feature. Yeah. He hasn't made anything in quite some time. It seems like that's not going to be the case.

And then also last week I saw that Martin Scorsese during a screening of some kind announced that he would no longer be making big productions. Like films that have lots of extras and big production budgets. He no longer felt like he could do that. he was going to focus on small intimate stories he's obviously made very good small intimate stories before but um that's notable to me that like two people who are in my dork canon right who i always look forward to like i kind of like clock my calendar over the years based on what they're going to do are not going to be making movies anymore i was a little saddened by that. Yeah. I mean, we are all getting older together.

Yeah. Yeah. Who will be our Kamala Harris in the film world? You know, will it be James Mangold? It could be. Yeah. Well, I guess she hasn't announced yet as of this recording who the VP is. Are you willing to be James Mangold's Josh Shapiro? That's my question for you. I'm really, next question. I've talked enough about Philadelphia already. I don't really have. Actually, and we have more Philadelphia to come. Oh, we certainly do.

I did want to note that we're going to talk about Sing Sing later this week. Yes. Which is essentially the first big challenger to do in part two in the Oscar race. It's been a slow first seven and a half months of the Oscar prognosticating. We've hardly done any of it on the show because there hasn't been much to talk about. Yeah. I do think this is the first film that will at least be a part of that conversation. Last year at this time, we had Oppenheimer, we had Barbie, and we had Past Lives. So we're a little bit behind.

The fall festivals seem like not a lot of locks there. It's going to be an interesting year. It is. It is. Maybe that's fun. I'd love for everyone to go back and watch Challengers again.

You know? Yeah. Well, I think what queer is and how it works or doesn't work will be a big dictator of what happens there.

But we'll see. Last bit of news britney spears biopic announced yeah a complete known some might say based on the woman and me her memoir yeah john m chu directing who has most recently directed two wicked films another director who sometimes i like and sometimes i'm not so fond of what he does. Britney seems involved, which I think is good, given everything that we know about Britney Spears' life for the past, I don't know, 30-something years, however old she is. Did you read that memoir? I did not. Moments of, like, really fascinating and dispiriting clarity and then like clearly a lot of things that she was

like i don't really feel like talking about this so for example you know anything having to do with her music or like her performance or really like her career she'd just be like yeah i i were it's like a paragraph i i rehearsed that really hard and i'm like i know but i would like to hear more about the mtv awards where you dance with the snake that was like a hugely important cultural moment to me so i it will this will probably be more emotionally focused the moment when britney spears dance with the snake was a hugely important cult yeah that you. Yeah, that doesn't live on for you? That's an image I can see in my mind's eye.

I don't know. What did it represent? Yet another example of a young woman put in a situation to become sexualized by a predatory music industry. Yes, but also she was like, sure, I'll dance with the snake. Ruthie met the snake recently. What? Yeah. There's a picture of Ruthie meeting the snake at a party. That snake is alive? That snake goes on party tours. That

snake is still making money. That's how central it was to our formation of womanhood. Listen, it wasn't a great time to grow up, but here I am. You did it. This explains a lot actually, hearing you say that that was a formative moment for you. It really, do you know how much time I spent watching TRL? Yeah. And that really is the difference between us, isn't it? It was only two years, but I just, I lived and died by what was going on. That really is the difference. That's very notable.

I was watching MTV nonstop between 1993 and 1998. And you were watching between 1997 and 1996 and 2001? Probably 98. Yeah. That's interesting. Anyway, in the last 15 years, we will have had musical biopics of James Brown, Elvis, Biggie, Tupac, Aretha Franklin, Brian Wilson, NWA, Whitney Houston, Elton John, Queen, Amy Winehouse, David bowie bob marley

and soon pharrell bob dylan michael jackson madonna the beatles and britney um this is this isn't this is not good like i i know i'm i'm just looking through i liked the brian wilson one one of the rare films that did not follow the traditional format. I liked one half of Elvis. I didn't, but okay. I mean, he was good as Elvis. Austin Butler was very good. I didn't think the movie worked. Okay.

I feel like Rocketman kind of got forgotten. It certainly did. It wasn't bad. It's going to be a long long long time before i see that movie again me i mean me too yeah um yeah i didn't really like any of the rest these movies aren't good yeah they're not good michael jackson is a tremendously complicated person there's so much fascinating work about his life. That one's going to be really tough.

We can't help ourselves because I'm like I want them to make Madonna one. If she directs it you want to see that? I mean in some ways that's more interesting. I guess that's true. I guess that's fair. I understand why the trend persists. A lot of these movies have done very very well. We talked about Back to Black earlier this year the Amy Winehouse movie a terrible movie

I really really bad this is tough I don't know I know it's IP and that's what studios are trying to identify and I know that the Beatles and and Michael Jackson and Britney and Dylan these are oh and I forgot to mention Bruce Springsteen with Jeremy Allen White that's another one all right but you're like I signed me up for that I am and I forgot to mention Bruce Springsteen with Jeremy Allen White. That's another one. Oh, right, but you're like, sign me up for that. I am, and it's very similar to the Dylan thing. I'm not as much of a Bruce head as I am a Bob Dylan fan,

but that iconography is so strong that trying to represent it while the person is still alive feels challenging. I don't know. I just, I'm sorry to rant about this, but it's a very bad trend, and it doesn't usually create interesting work, in my opinion.

It does create Oscars, though. It does. It does. And a lot of box office. You can't look at Bohemian Rhapsody and not see why they keep greenlighting these movies. Yeah. The Britney thing is just very complicated and I'm not particularly optimistic about it.

But I mean, John Chu and a Universal movie, it'll be a big fancy production. You know what I mean? Like it's going to be a legitimate thing. You know, like the moral of literally everything of the last five years

is like, leave this person alone, you know? Yeah. And what is like the most tragic about it is like she is involved in this. She cannot,

like the world has been created such like she cannot even leave herself alone, you know, which is like very, it's very sad. If the movie were more about that, if it were a film, and maybe it will be,, if it were a film and maybe it will be.

But if it were a film about the paradox of stardom and being chewed up by the systems that create that stardom and then need it to survive and then what that does to a person, that would be an interesting movie. But I don't think it can be with Universal involved. And I mean, she tweeted about it. So I think she is in some way. I'm sure she's an EP. Yeah. Yeah, no doubt. If they're i think she is in some way she's an ep yeah yeah no doubt if she if they're licensing her memoir which like again given everything it's yeah she should have some agency in it totally but it's just not going to make an interesting piece of work so i don't know i i'm sure fans will love it and that's really all that matters ultimately if you love her music you'll get to see i love her music Do you want like a 10 minute segment where Baby Hit Me One More Time

is like recreated starring some 20 year old actress we've never heard of? Always want that. Like I told you that when we talked about Respect, the Aretha Franklin biopic, which is, you know, it's just like once they're in the studio and you're like, wait a second, someone just said Socket to me. Like they're doing Respect! Yeah, of course, it's so exciting! I mean, I'm stupid. Like, that's my version of Deadpool, but yeah, of course. But like, we're gonna see that with Bob Dylan

writing Blown in the Wind. Like, kill me. Like, literally, literally drown me in a river. Maybe they'll do it in an exciting way. Like, get like, arched over on a kitchen table, swallowing the lyrics. And it was like, one of the worst things I've ever seen. Heinous.

Heinous. Awful. Yeah. Anyway. They do that in Walk the Line with Ring of Fire. And it's just like Joaquin just being like. No, no, no. It's Reese doing it first.

Yeah. Okay. I don't know. Shall we take a little break and then talk about Trap? Okay. In 100 meters, turn right. Actually, no. Turn left.

There's some awesome new breakfast wraps at McDonald's. Really? Yeah. There's the sausage bacon and egg. A crispy seasoned chicken one. Mmm. A spicy end egg. Worth the detour. They sound amazing. Bet they taste amazing, too. Ah. Wish I had a mouth. Take your morning into a delicious new direction with McDonald's new breakfast

wraps. Add a small premium roast coffee for a dollar plus tax. At participating McDonald's restaurants. Ba-da-ba-ba-ba. Okay, Trap. Now, interesting thing about Trap, you and I have not done an M. Night Shyamalan podcast. I've actually done two on this show. One was about old, which came out in 2021, which van joined me for. And then in 2022, my friends, Elric Kane and Brian Sauer from the pure cinema podcast joined me. And we talked about Shyamalan.

I don't know why you didn't let me do old. You were on leave during old. I don't, I don't know if it was a let situation. I feel like, I feel like you were not available. Okay. I want to say you were not available.

I remember I saw it. I mean, you were on leave during the release of Knock at the Cabin. Yes, exactly. And yet, I know you're a fan of his movies. Mm-hmm. And so it's interesting that we haven't talked about it. So Trap is his new one. I think it's his 15th movie.

He's now into his third, going on his fourth decade of movie making which is fascinating um he wrote and directed it as he always does this movie stars josh hartnett ariel donahue salika shamalan his daughter hayley mills and allison pill notably shot by uh sayambu mukti pram who is uh an amazing cinematographer who does not often work in Hollywood features. He shoots a lot of the Pichupong's movies. He shoots Miguel Gomez's movies. And he is, of course, Luca Guadagnino's cinematographer of choice. He's in that very short list of, is this the best guy with a camera in the world?

So that was cool that he chose to work with him on this movie. It's a movie about a serial killer who is attempting to evade a police blockade that has been set up at the concert of a kind of Ariana Grande, Taylor Swift-esque pop star, Rihanna-esque pop star. And the serial killer and his daughter go to the show. And it becomes very clear, if you've seen the trailer, that this entire concert is a trap that has been designed to ensnare the serial killer. Right. It becomes clear because an employee at the arena explains to the camera, both in the trailer and in the film, that this is a trap to catch the serial killer. So we're not in spoiler territory. Yes.

It is and it sort of isn't, which is an interesting part of this discussion. I won't say anything more than that. Let me start with this. Did you like Trap? Oh, I had a great time. Yeah, me too. Yeah, of course. We saw it together on a Sunday afternoon.

Like a pretty full screening. Fuller than I've ever seen at that particular theater. No, I thought it was delightful. I mean, if you want to go to an M. Night Shyamalan movie starring Josh Hartnett as a serial killer at a pop girl concert then you will have a fantastic time it is what it says on the label

yeah I think that I don't want to get tripped up by other people's reactions when I talk about this in fact I have not read any reviews

but I couldn't and I was trying to avoid seeing anything about this movie this is the first time probably in years, that a movie that I anticipated that had story and twists

that I wasn't going to see a press screening for, one, because Warners didn't screen the movie for press, but two, that I was on vacation for. And so I just, I had to live through whatever five or six days

without knowing anything about it until I got a chance to see it. Challenging for me, given how I engage with movie culture. But good for your vacation. It was. You would have been proud of me. Yeah.

I felt like this movie was just like every M. Night Shyamalan movie for better and for worse. Mostly for better, which is how I tend to come out on all of his movies since The Visit. He's clearly in a second era. He has, quote unquote,

returned to form, where he's basically primarily focusing on intense thrillers. Those are the kinds of movies he's made. He put After Earth and The Last Airbender and those big sci-fi spectacles behind him. He's trying to make Shyamalan movies. And so every movie,

you're getting something that is rare, which is like a mainstream studio released thriller that's on 3,000 screens that is an event. It's like my favorite thing. Yeah. So I'm always going to be interested. Almost all of these movies to me are like three out of five star movies.

They all have things where I'm like this, something here doesn't work or I have some notes about this or I didn't totally respond to this. But I always, always, always had a great time, and I'm always glad I went. You're always engaged. And also, at this point, and I had this experience watching Trap, you are primed for the M. Night Shyamalan of it all if you are a student. And so you keep thinking, well, that can't be all. Yeah.

You got to do something else weird. And like, how weird is it going to get? And you expect it to be ridiculous or over the top. And you kind of want it to go to a place where you're like, I don't believe, you know, laughing or disbelief. It's a very special mind space of, I am not only like checking my disbelief but I really want you to like poke it I I think that's very well said I it's it creates an active experience with the

movie yeah which most movies for me having seen like thousands and thousands of movies it's hard to get me get the wheels turning aggressively while I'm watching not just because I'm trying to solve it per se but because I'm i'm trying to kind of feel what's around the corner of the next move and next act of the movie and this movie roughly 35 minutes in 40 minutes in clears the trailer it clears what you've seen to that point and then it's a bit of a ride the second act of this movie in particular i thought was very good and it's kind of the case often with many mhk movies because they're all high concept to an extent but um this movie in particular I thought was very good. And it's kind of the case often with many M. Night Shyamalan movies because they're all high concept to an extent.

But this one in particular, this is my highest possible recommendation. I got to the movie theater a little earlier than you. I was like, do you want a snack? I was getting in line to get candy. You're like, yeah, I'll have a Diet Pepsi. Got you a Diet Pepsi. Got myself a Diet Pepsi. I never get Diet Pepsi.

I never get anything other than water in movie theaters unless it's like a cocktail. So I sat there and I drank Diet Pepsi got myself a Diet Pepsi I never get Diet Pepsi I never get anything other than water in movie theaters unless it's like a cocktail so I sat there and I drank Diet Pepsi and of course I have to pee I had to pee so bad

I drank all the Diet Pepsi and I'm sitting in an M. Night Shyamalan thriller and you can't leave you can't you can't get up I was like I can't

not just because I have to podcast about this I don't want to get up but I'm in incredible pain right now that's awful that's the worst feeling I really am sorry I get it like have to podcast, but it's like, I don't want to get up. Right. But I'm in incredible pain right now. That's awful. That's the worst feeling.

I really am. Sorry. I get it like 10 times a day. Yeah, it's the worst. And also, I'm old now. I'm like waking up at 4 o'clock in the morning. So just the slightest, it was a small pep scene still. Nevertheless, I would not for anything have gotten out of my seat and not seen what was happening and how the movie was going to unfold and what different steps were going to happen

because each scene matters. You know, it's not schindler's list i'm not trying to make it seem as though it is this like a totemic work of art but it's engaging um and also it's it is genuinely fun and funny even and it's like shaman has talked about like he was really entertaining himself writing the script and you can tell like it is it's not like meta but it is aware of what it's doing it's really enjoying it the the filmmaking is delighting in the same way that it wants the audience to um and like it did it is also like genuinely laugh out loud funny in a lot of parts so you know at the beginning of Shyamalan's career he was very famously compared to Steven Spielberg as this wide-eyed auteur who told stories from the

perspective of children that had kind of like mystical or um it's kind of like gorgeous renditions of scary worlds he's always really been much more Hitchcock and Hitchcock especially when Hitchcock becomes kind of self-aware yeah in the 50s he's just making been much more Hitchcock. And Hitchcock, especially when Hitchcock becomes kind of self-aware in the 50s, is just making a lot of really funny movies. You know, North by Northwest is very funny. And the whole idea of someone like Cary Grant being put in a position like this

is one big wink at the audience. Casting someone like Josh Hartnett in this role is the same thing. So wonderful. I couldn't get Hitchcock out of my mind watching the movie. The Josh Hartnett of it all is also one of those things where like oh they made a movie for me you know yeah just because it is such a specific late 90s early 2000s trl amanda yeah

like trl amanda and also then amanda discovering sophia coppola uh and virgin suicide figure for you yeah and and then also like the knowing of what happened after his failed like teen star rom-com career um so i did feel a little bit like oh this is this is really aimed at me as much as it is like a fun thriller for everybody but i yes i know because of the character that he portrays and like we we're kind of lurching towards. Are we going to Girl Dad? Well, I mean the movie is a few things. But one thing that it really is, is this great big showcase for Hartnett. Yeah.

Who was, we were told, was the next big thing in Hollywood in the early 2000s. It didn't really work out. He made a couple of movies that I like that you like. But after like Wicker Park and Lucky Number Slevin and a couple of those movies in like that you like but after like wicker park and lucky number slevin and a couple of those movies in the late 2000s 40 and 40 days and 40 nights 30 days and 30 30 days no it's 40 days and 40 nights oh 40 days and 40 nights but he also made 30 days of night which is a vampire movie yeah um i mean pearl harbor you know yeah not a good film um 30 days of night i think is actually like his last big studio movie that he was in.

I think that's like 07, 08, 09. 07. And then he kind of goes into obscurity. And now, I want to cite three people who have brought him back. The first and most important is Guy Ritchie. Because Guy Ritchie cast him in Wrath of Man and then put him in Rue de Guerre. And really utilized his quote-unquote iconography in very smart ways, him in Rue de Guerre and really utilized his quote unquote iconography in very smart ways, especially in Rue de Guerre.

Then, of course, last year, you mentioned before he was in Oppenheimer. He's great in Oppenheimer. He's the tallest man in America in Oppenheimer, surrounded by all these scientists as Dr. Lawrence and now Shyamalan. Well, you also did you watch The Bear season three on vacation? I haven't seen it yet. I know. I know he's in it. You haven't spoiled that for me, but I did know he's in it. Yeah. So thank you also, did you watch The Bear season three on vacation? I haven't seen it yet. I know he's in it. You haven't spoiled that for me,

but I did know he's in it. So thank you to Chris Storer as well. And that sweater, you know? He's an immaculate guy in a sweater. I look forward to it. I underestimated my ability to watch an entire season of television while in a house

with 10 children under the age of six. Okay, yeah. That was a huge error on my part. Yeah. I watched zero minutes of any non-Olympics television. Okay. All week.

Did you watch any films for children? So many. What were the hits? Split decision because it was five boys and five girls. The boys were locked in on the Ice Age movies. Okay. The girl and the boys are a little older. Yeah.

The girls, Moana, Frozen, Tangled. Oh. The Rapunzel movie. And A Little Encanto. So what's playing in your house now? Like what were the takeaways? Well, nothing because we watch too much TV on vacation. So we're trying to table that for the moment.

But we're just, we're princessed out, man. No, I know. But like, are we moving towards Tangled? Like, did Rapunzel capture her attention or? Yeah, well. Is Rapunzel a princess? I mean, she's in the tower. She can't help herself.

Well, she is the lost princess of the king and queen. And Mother Gothel has kidnapped her and siphoned ageless power from her due to her hair. Right. That's why her hair continues to grow because Mother Gothel needs that power. This is a whole other pod. I should do a Disney princess pod. I'm fucking locked in right now. And Rapunzel is different than Rumpelstiltskin. Yeah.

Tune in to JMO third hour. We'll do the Princess Week. It'll be amazing. Women Wednesdays. Yeah. It's really exciting. It'll be amazing. Are you prepared for when Kamala, if Kamala wins, then the JMO is just all Women Wednesdays?

Yeah. Yeah. It's very exciting. Who will replace me and Chris? Who will be joining you? You know, it's TBD. Probably Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, she's a big fan of your work. Hartnett. He's exceptional in the movie. Oh my God, he's so good. I thought he was terrible in the first 20 minutes. But that's what's so funny about it. And this movie is very wisely tipped.

The first 20 minutes are Josh Hartnett being an awkward dad who is like also very clearly a serial killer from the beginning accompanying his daughter to a concert and i was like is it just a little too close for you you know um i spent so much time thinking about you accompanying alice to various concerts i mean uh and trying to make the jokes and trying to do all the things it It was really, it is powerful. I mean, that will happen. I know. I know that was what was so great about it.

I would feel much worse about relating so deeply to a movie about a serial killer if I didn't already know that it was designed that way and M. Night Shyamalan in some ways relates to this serial killer. This is a very intentional construction that he has created. And the thing that I liked most about it is this movie is like a genuine and at times sentimental treatise on being torn between like striving for success in your chosen field and also that like pull of being a great parent. And the weird duality of that, except in this case, the striving for success is a serial killer. Right. Trying to successfully murder people without being found out by his family. Mm-hmm.

That's so funny. That's super funny that M.I. Shyamalan was like, this is me. And then. Because he cast his own daughter in the movie. He builds like a large part of the movie around his own daughter, an aspiring pop star, who is the Taylor Swift or the Ariana Grande figure. And does a lot. She has to carry the second act of the movie.

Yes. And then he also puts himself in the movie in the traditional way but like like he plays a larger part than usual I feel because he's really drawing the connections between the dad

and the daughter I mean it's delightful it's so funny and so sick and crazy to watch as a father of a daughter like it really is

a father of a daughter movie in multiple ways I think we'll probably start to get deep into spoiler territory. So if you have not seen Trap, we've just given you an hour of conversation. I hope that was enjoyable for you. Go see the movie.

We both recommend it. We do have to talk about the twists and turns and maybe even some of the other ideas in the movie. We can't do that without getting into the plot details. So turn off if you haven't seen the movie yet or don't want to hear. The first twist to me was actually that the trailer, the trailer is pretty much played out within 10 minutes. Yeah.

15, 20, I thought. I looked at my phone to see when we saw the salesperson who was selling the merch. And then that's kind of. But Josh Hartnett goes into, whose name is Cooper in the movie, by the way, which is really funny. Very funny. Josh Hartnett goes into, whose name is Cooper in the movie, by the way, which is really funny, goes into the bathroom and checks the security footage before the reveal of, oh, this is a trap for the something. So you see the police pretty quickly. But I want to say within the first 10 minutes, he is like making that weird face that you see in the trailer and watching this guy on his phone. And you're just like, oh, so you are a serial killer.

The movie is like not trying to hide it. And you did you did note his performance is purposefully really stilted because he's trying to be. A goofy dad who's actually like an OCD serial killer and really hamming up both aspects of it. So. Because he is feeling immediately upon arrival the tension of seeing all of the FBI and police that are at the event. And so he has been triggered in a way.

Right. And he has become skittish and his eyes are darting back and forth. But also he's trying to be a really engaged father and have this great moment with her where she is and she is over the moon for this moment but over the course of time in the movie she like

all children like really clocks when her parents are being weird and he's being really weird throughout the first 40 minutes of the film because he keeps leaving his seat going to do things he starts looking for escape routes once it becomes clear that they're trying to trap him in this space the performance goes from like what seems like bad to kind of interesting to I thought like amazing at the end.

I thought he was so interesting and fascinating and having so much fun with the script. I really, really liked it. I think does a great job of pacing the full level of his psychosis and also how good he is as a serial killer. Because the first 30 minutes are him trying to get out of the arena. And everything he comes up with, the police have outsmarted him. And so he never gets quite caught. But you were watching him being like oh this guy's sort of bumbling and like he's kind of a cheesy dad and also he's like trying to get past the drunk woman except now there's like a SWAT team and he's trying to get on the roof but there's also

a SWAT you know it's like oh he's he's out of ideas he's not he's not gonna make it yeah you can see it does the thing that a lot of serial killer movies do where it shows you that this figure is incredibly improvisatory and quick on his feet and knows how to be successful

at capturing and killing people. Yeah. But by setting it in this gigantic arena which is a challenging thing to do cinematically to basically make something

like this look good because of the way the space works and especially because of the like what M. Night Shyamalan is interested in in terms of like what the camera's looking at and performance he's a really intimate filmmaker he's like really into close-ups

he's really into like asymmetrical angles and deep focus and big noisy spaces like that where the sound is strange and so the sound mix is very important in this movie too what we think the cooper character is hearing what we're allowed to hear right when and why so he does manage to like he gets all the way to the last stage of getting free a few times yeah every time like you say thanks to hayley mills the serial killer

profiler in this movie which is such a funny thing that he's done here I was not aware because I'd been avoiding things so the credits go and it says Hayley Mills and I said to you that Hayley Mills and you were like yup that was one of the very few things that I had spoiled for me then three minutes in

it becomes clear I was just like oh so literally just because she was in the parent trap it is literally just the whole joke is just like, oh, so literally just because she was in The Parent Trap. That's it. It is literally just the whole joke is just like Hayley Mills, Parent Trap. That is so funny.

I agree. I was looking at this this morning and I think this is the first U.S. movie production that Hayley Mills has appeared in

since 1966's The Trouble with Angels, which co-starred Rosalind Russell. She's been in a lot of stuff. She's been a working actor for years, mostly in Britain. She does TV work all the time, but like a mainstream US movie,

I think it's been 60 years. She's genuinely just... To play a serial killer profile in an M. Night Shyamalan movie for one joke. And maybe five lines. Like she's just sort of a spy. It's delightful. Very funny. Just A+.

If you don't think that Shyamalan is having fun, all you have to do is see this. See that, of course, this is like, it's a serial killer thriller. You're meant to be on the edge of your seat. But also, it is in so many ways trying to make you laugh while you're going through it. I thought the blocking and the staging

of the stuff inside the concert was pretty good. I think it's very hard to do. I think I did feel like the first third of it, in part because I had seen the trailer, was a little bit leaden and I couldn't quite figure out the performances. And every Shyamalan movie has this stilted dialogue. You kind of have to accept it

and get on its wavelength. This happens basically every time I watch a new one of these where I'm like, oh yeah, no one talks like a real person. It's a stylized choice. This is the only way he really knows how to write. And you need to make sure that as the story starts to unfold, that becomes less relevant to the kind of propulsive nature of the storytelling.

It is also, I mean, it's been advertised and we even keep talking about it as like, you know, Taylor Swift, but, you know, Heiress Tour. But it's not on the scale of the Heiress Tour. No. You know, and they do basically stage an arena show. In Philadelphia. Well, but it was not on the scale of the Heiress Tour. No. You know? And they do basically stage an arena show. In Philadelphia. Well, but it was not filmed in Philadelphia. And I just want you to know that I didn't, I recognize that while watching it. So the people of Philadelphia, I give you a hard time, but, you know, I'm paying attention.

I'll tell the fanatic. But they are staging like a full arena show, which is really hard to do. Very tough. But it's not the Heiress Tour. And we've all seen a lot of footage of the Heiress Tour at this point. Unfortunately. And so you're like, oh, okay. So it's not as many dancers, you know?

No. And there is like a very funny trap door or like, I mean, that's what it is. Yeah. It's a trap door. And someone rises from the ground right by them. A guest performer, yeah. You know, but it's like, it's a pretty rickety trap door.

You know, it's like. Yeah, I mean, this is a modest, I think it's like a $30 million movie. Yeah, which is fine. And that's like also that probably like true to the character. Like it's not the heiress tour, but you're watching the

same stuff for like 30 minutes and you you tend to notice the the differences yeah i mean i felt like the movie really picked up when hartnett conspires to have emma chamelon's character who is the lady raven the salika chamelon character uh uncle. I don't know how he identified that he was her uncle. Did I miss something there? He essentially goes up to him at the show. I mean, he's wearing the badge. Okay, let me go back.

This movie is fucking so outlandish. I mean... You gotta put, not just suspension of disbelief, you gotta put disbelief on Venus. It's ridiculous. None of it makes sense. Why the hell would police organize a trap for a serial killer in a space with 20,000 people?

This makes no sense. It is apparently based on a real life operation that happened in the 80s where they invited, like, a hundred suspected something to, like, an NFL thing. Okay. And then it sounds like the film Black Sunday. I mean maybe it was. I was just reading Wikipedia primarily to confirm that this was not filmed in Philadelphia. I see. But I agree. There are also. You gotta

roll with it. We'll get to the revelations but I have some other notes about how certain participants uh in the scheme would or would not be allowed to be there absolutely there's a lot to take apart um and it's okay to take apart a movie like this and still say you had a good time that's honestly how i feel about it uh eventually he conspires to get his daughter to be the girl who was selected to be brought on stage during the closing moments of the concert. Right. And he convinces Shyamalan's character, M. Night Shyamalan's character,

by telling a story about how she has just recovered from leukemia, so she should be picked. She is picked. She goes on stage. And this is where I was like, it's only been like 40 minutes. Like, where is this movie going? And then it becomes clear that this is his way out because he's gotten his daughter on stage. They're going backstage. Right.

He's already escaped a couple of close calls, but he can't find his way to the door. Because the cops are basically just any dad, unaccompanied dad in the audience. Or, you know, dad, no mom. It's just like being plucked out. Hauled off. Yeah. Which is, that would be a little alarming if you were at a concert and you saw several dozen people

being hauled off to be inspected. Sure. I did really feel like the numbers of parents in the auditorium were low. Oh, you thought it was more kids. Well, they share a data point, which is that there are 20,000 people at the concert and 3,000 of them are men.

Right. Grown men. Right. Grown men. Yeah. Does that seem like it would be an accurate representation of the Eros tour? It's kind of a mom and daughter situation. I don't know. Like, Bobby went. I know, like, a lot of.

Sure, sure. I'll never forget. You make Bobby sound like a serial killer when you say that. No, lots of people. Lots of men went. I'll never forget when I went to see the Red Tour from Taylor Swift. And Zach, my husband, and our friend John Caramonica took me to their Red Tour in Newark. And I went to the bathroom.

Took you like in a gurney? What do you mean? No, no, no. I mean, it was very sweet. Like John arranged the whole thing so I could have like a special moment at the Red Tour. It was lovely. But I went to the bathroom before the show started and I walked out and it was like a sea of, you know, 12 year old girls and these like two grown up men standing.

And I was like, I need to get back to them so quickly. Like it is really not OK for them to be unaccompanied at this concert. Yeah, I'm so screwed. I can't believe it. We had a wonderful time. So in that sense, 3000 seems high. But they also make a point of saying her fans were teenage girls. And most of these people look like 25-year-olds just jamming out.

The young girls in the crowd, you mean? Yeah. Well, the young people in the crowd. And it is like there are men and women all around their section. None of them particularly 12-year- old seeming, but that's okay. I personally got a lot more excited about the movie when it became clear that they were not only going backstage, but

that this was going to lead to a place like I had not really considered. You know, that's that thing you were talking about where you're so engaged with where the story is going. So his daughter's character, Ariel Donahue's character, gets to meet Lady Raven backstage after dancing with her on stage. Josh Hartn daughter's character, Ariel Donahue's character, gets to meet Lady Raven backstage after dancing with her on stage. And Josh Hartnett's character, Cooper, decides to take this opportunity to pull her aside, Lady Raven, and just come out and tell her, I'm the killer.

I'm the guy you're looking for. It's amazing. And you really don't see that coming. And it's after Lady Raven is huddling with Hayley Mills in the Situation Room backstage so he overhears everything which is very convenient but whatever once again we are in an M. Night Shyamalan movie and you think that he's going to do another she has leukemia or she has something blah blah blah and he just you know he has that magical face flip and the

the psycho lights come on behind his eyes. Yes. And it's not everyone can do that. And it is very powerful. And you're also like, well, then, like, what's your fucking plan? Like, what's happening? It's exciting. It's really exciting.

It becomes a bit of a cat and mouse movie from there on out, effectively between Salika Shyamalan and Josh Hartnett. Alison Pill also eventually plays a big part in this but this is a I mean there's been a lot of jokes about like the Nepo baby quality of this movie.

Earlier this year M. Night Shyamalan's other daughter directed a movie for Warner Brothers. There's been some speculation about that. There's a The Watchers

billboard ad in the film. In the movie. Yes. So like the Shyamalan family industrial complex is very taken care of here. Yeah. In the execution of Trap. I thought like the Shyamalan family industrial complex is very taken care of here in the execution of Trap. I thought something with Shyamalan was okay.

I think it's like a big ask to be like, you are Rihanna and also you are face-to-face with a serial killer. Yeah. That's a hard part. I thought she was adequate and definitely made what I thought was the best sequence in the movie work really well, which is because

Josh Hartnett's character has this person trapped in a basement, he threatens her with whether or not, like that he's going to kill this person unless she comes along with him and becomes essentially his life vest, his body armor to get out of the stadium. So they get out and they decide,

she decides to go to the house where he lives. I guess trying to determine if there's any way she can do something. She can alert the family. She can find a way to free the prisoner, whatever it is. And she somehow manages to get his phone in her hands and she runs to the bathroom and locks the door. Right. And in that moment moment because he had been taking a photo his phone is still unlocked and she goes to the app where the video is of the man who

he has ensnared which is password controlled instead of face recognition which i thought was a real validation for me and my ethics because you are an ocd serial killer no i just that's another thing i don't i don't do any of the touch, swipe, face ID stuff. Yes, we know. Well, I know, but neither does the serial killer. So, you know, that's... You mean that's a validation of your actions? Yeah, it means that the higher security, you know?

He's thought through it. I thought I was going to be the one identifying with the serial killer more on this episode. Eventually, Sean Millan does a smart thing. He doesn't show us anything that's happening outside of the bathroom. He keeps the camera on his daughter's face as she tries to free the prisoner, alert the authorities, get the hell out of there. This is where Hartnett's psychology starts to become a much bigger part of the story. And the movie started to feel a little bit more

like Split to me, the James McAvoy thriller. Right, right, right. Where you're seeing him kind of like verbalize and identify. Earlier in the film we had seen visions

of a woman who turned out would be his mother. Yeah. And that he is not well, particularly in a men's bathroom he sees this older woman who would be his mother

just washing her hands. And you know, something is off. And it's very like Hitchcock psycho pop psychology 101 stuff. just washing her hands. And you know something is off. And it's very like Hitchcock Psycho, Pop Psychology 101 stuff. But he

effectively loses it and then it just becomes his attempt to escape becoming captured. And he does so multiple times over the course of the third act. He eludes capture. Which is to me completely unbelievable and delightful every time. I think that

this movie the way this movie is shot in those sequences is better than in the first part of the movie yeah I feel or at least it feels more comfortable for him there's a lot of his tricks like split diopter shots where two characters faces are in focus in the foreground and the background or like seeing

Hartnett's face like in the bottom right corner of the screen which creates like a psychology of like something is off or something is wrong here throughout the movie. This is like small stuff, but if you pay attention to it, it's all very purposeful. It's all very designed and does a really good job of getting you in the mind state of like a person who's hiding something,

you know, like those closeups are important because you need to be able to see his face and you need to be able to see his face and you need to be able to see Salika's face because she's supposed to be terrified. But she's also got her wheels turning

because she's trying to, like, free someone, help, figure things out. I thought it was pretty effectively done, I gotta say. Another thing that's very nifty about it is ultimately

what the thriller is revealing, which is both, like, is he gonna get away with it? But also a little bit, like, why is he going to get away with it but also a little bit like why is he doing this and i typically when the big reveal of a thrill is like oh well it's a literal psycho who has mommy issues i mean it is as you said like the oldest story in the book and it it's sort of stakesless you know it's like well he's a psychopath so can't be held responsible

for anything but because that is like the framing of the movie and the the thrust of it and their real question is how are they gonna catch him and are they gonna catch him like the whatever complaints people might have about the third act and the sort of like the you know the dead mom showing up or whatever which doesn't matter as much because like the movie's not staked on that big revelation that's right it is a movie about the psychological state of a person but their psychological history is less interesting or relevant yeah the parts that are important are the ocd parts and And I'm eager to rewatch the movie and see all the ways in which

there's an early moment. I don't know if you clocked this. When they first arrive at the arena and they get some food right after they've walked in. Yeah, and he's doing the napkins at Shake Shack. Yes.

Yes. He's doing the napkin at Shake Shack. And the camera is holding on him, folding a napkin just so. And you're like, there's something wrong with this guy. Now, I am a person known to have expressions of OCD in my life,

as you well know. I very much understand what is happening there. But the movie is very interested in capturing in miniature over the course of an hour and 40 minutes how that expresses itself and what it ultimately means. I thought it was really well done.

Is it like a kind of like dangerous pathologizing of something that a lot of people struggle with? Yeah, of course. Yeah, but it is also, I do think it's aware of it. Like there is,

it leads ultimately to, like I guess the last reveal is like how did this all get set up? And it's another it's his wife who has suspected him played by allison pill um and and this movie is about like psychopath dads but also like just straight up bad moms uh because like it is revealed in addition to josh harden's mom being like i knew you're a monster pretty early but what am I supposed to do about it um which you know is a good question and I thought about that for a moment well I was supposed to do I was like well what am I supposed to do it's like oh how early is early

and then what am I supposed to do um so it turns out that Allison Pill has been who is Josh Harden's wife uh has first suspected that he was having an affair. And then there was something about how he always smelled of cleaning solution. She followed, which is really funny. That was great. She follows him. She finds like the empty, like an empty house. And he is a firefighter.

And so he's aware of a lot of abandoned spaces where he does a lot of his serial killing. It seems essentially that like she is also had a little bit of the spidey sense of like something is off here and like maybe this is the person. So she contacts the. No, she doesn't even contact. She leaves a clue. She leaves a clue in the form of a receipt for this concert. And I was like, well, we'll just see what happens. And then just allows her child to i mean keeps living in the house but then allows her child to go to this concert that is by far

the most ridiculous part of the man we're it's insane you would never i would never in a million years if i suspected that my partner was a serial killer, not only allow them to be around my child, but to be caught in a siege. Right. In an arena. Yes. For his life. Well, it's not clear that she knows that it's going to be a siege because she's just left the receipt. Right. But I,

at this point, I'm like, I'm not allowing my child to go solo with you to a concert. There is another flimsy aspect of this. And then maybe, maybe this can be easily explained by just saying that Alison pill told the authorities this, but it doesn't seem like she did.

But what if he just bought tickets for his daughter and she went with a friend or she went with her aunt or, you know, like, yeah, I mean, like how would they even know he was going to be there? It's all really

questionable. It's a thing you've got to roll with. Yeah, but you do also, if we're talking about parents in this movie, she's not winning parent of the year. No. No. Alison Pill is really good though with that nervous, smart, I fucked this up energy.

And the quivering jaw. Yeah. She's got those little like chiclet teeth. It was very newsroom for me. So you, I mean, you find this out during what I thought was just like a tremendous scene where she's allegedly home alone. And again, you're like, okay, if your husband has just been arrested as the butcher, like they're a cop car, like you're not. We've already seen their secret compartments in the house you know like sneaking in and out tunnels everywhere we know that you're not just gonna be like left alone or whatever

unless but whatever uh so she is she's making tea then he shows up it's very chilling and they have like the heart to heart where he's just like in full psycho mode. And during this, he literally just removes his shirt and then neatly folds it on the table beside him, which is incredible sequence. It's just the most wonderful, hilarious. Once again,

we've really, they've made a movie just for us. I'm really happy. A movie about a serial killer. Great for me. A movie about Josh Hartnett not wearing a shirt. Great for you. One of my notes for the first 30 minutes, I was like, there's no way that a dad like who looks like josh hartnett

is like roaming around this arena like uncommented on by other kids by the other moms the other parents like someone's got to notice and so then they did finally notice and they just had him being like here's the how i plotted to kill all of these people with his shirt off and then you know folded behind him just so but then it turns out she found his bag and she like poisoned him or yeah tranquilized him i guess yes um and then he has to have a whole like vision where hayley mills is his mom you know like whatever I really enjoyed uh the representation of all the tasers yes that was good uh and the various angles you know and him like Christ like with like the taser things from like eight different angles I mean they had

fun with it I honestly think is a better conclusion particularly the final moments in the in the paddy wagon yeah he's being hauled off after he's been arrested. And he manages to in standing up his daughter's bike and having a sentimental moment. Right. And also well a sentimental but also slightly OCD moment. Absolutely. Because like what he wants is to turn

it upside down. And like you kind of know it's coming because you're like. Does he pull a spoke or does he pull the pin from the pump area from the. I thought it was the pin from like the nozzle but he pulls it and then he unlocks himself and he's free and he has this big smile on his face very like classic like it's fun twist ending um it is i think that the movie overextends the third act a little bit more than I needed.

I thought particularly the, like grabbing Salika shot lady Raven in the car and the limo and then driving and then driving right into traffic in the middle of Philadelphia. Like, is that something a firefighter would do? But then he escapes. But just barely. I know,

but when he got out, I was like, whoo, you know, that's when I was just like, this is absurd, but lol. I heard you say like, what? Yeah. When he got away, yeah.

Because it doesn't actually make sense, but at that point, you don't care. You're going with it. Yeah. Yeah, I agree. I think the conversation, this sequence between him and Allison Pill is great. Dynamite. It's super fun. It's like, it's the John Doe in the backseat of the car moment where he's explaining himself

and she's like, I can't believe this is fucking happening. I can't believe this is fucking happening. I can't believe this is my life. It's tricky because it's a twist ending. It's not like a mega twist because we know he's the killer, as you said, in the first 10 minutes. So the twist is more what? That his wife knew

and that she conspired to bring him down? Is that ultimately what the twist of the movie is i mean i guess so i still also think like one of the genius twists of the whole thing is that you're rooting for him throughout you know well i'm glad you brought that up and so the real twist is once he gets down with the bike and you're like you know that that would not happen in real life, but he needs something. And the last shot is of him undoing his handcuffs and like grinning in a beautiful Josh Hartnett maniacal way at the screen. And you're like, yeah, the psycho dad. I mean, I totally agree with you.

I wrote here that this is a weirdly empathetic portrait of a of a sick person. Yeah. And the funny and awkward series of exchanges with this giant handsome dad and his socially anxious daughter, who we learn in the movie is having some difficulty making friends or keeping friends, living as a teenager in this very weird world. There's some mean girls. Some mean girls. But then there's that fascinating moment when she hugs him before he gets in the paddy wagon. Right. She races over to him.

Also completely implausible that they would let him see his children after he's being hauled off for murdering 12 people. But his children race out of the cop car and his son goes up to his mom and his daughter runs over and races and hugs him. And there was a part of me that was like, what did she inherit from him? You know, like, was she in dispute with these kids because there's something wrong with her that she doesn't know how to act or something this really got to you so i did it did but the the movie like lets you feel that now is that ridiculous of course the whole movie is ridiculous but it's like it's it's a pretty clever composition and i keep saying hitchcock because there's three hitchcock movies that were rattling around in my mind the whole time. Shadow of a Doubt

Suspicion and Notorious all three of those movies are about a woman who is either married to or the daughter of or the niece of a powerful man who she's close to but whom she suspects has done

something terrible or a series of terrible things and then she becomes a part of untangling that but she also feels kind of complicit and emotionally complicated about that this movie is just like that like if you watch Suspicion starring Cary Grant you're like this movie is fucking weird like this is a movie about a guy who maybe

wants to kill his wife and we don't know and we go all the way to the end and have to find out what's going to happen it's goofy and it's funny and it's also a little bit scary and this movie is the same thing so people i've seen people who are dismissing this movie as awful if you think it's awful you just don't like a night shot you know what i mean their vibe that's fine this is my vibe it's very fun really fun uh what did you think of lady raven's music well i guess it's better than it had to be or than is usually the case in movies about fake musicians. So I wouldn't say that I like walked out.

I couldn't sing a song for you. No. You know? Nor I. And I also like, again, the staging was of a limited scope compared to what I have become accustomed to in the era of our Lord Beyonce. Yeah, it's no renaissance tour. Yeah. But I thought it was like perfectly fine.

It's not brat, but that's okay. What is brat? That's the question everyone's asking. The streets want to know. Yeah. What is brat? I listen the question everyone's asking yeah the streets want to know yeah what is brat i i've listened to it so much really yeah and sometimes an ox will listen to it and sometimes he'll be like no brat which is really funny wow i don't think i could get that far maybe i should play uh no brat i think i should play blonde on blonde for alice today see what happens yeah that'd be great complete. Sure. So because we haven't had

the Shyamalan conversation before. Yeah. Where does this stack up for you? Like, if you look at his filmography. I mean, it's just so uniquely, like, poppy in just the right way for me that it's pretty high. Yeah.

Because the Josh Hartnett and the, like, pop girl of it all is more exciting to me than, I don't know, I really liked old too, except the old, the twist, I was mad. So that's what I was going to say is, I think both the twist and oldest bad. It sucks.

I think in an otherwise very good movie, very interesting movie that looks beautiful as well. I rewatched it last night and I was blown away by it. But I agree. I think it's like straight up like shitty Twilight Zone. Yeah. Which is too bad because it's a movie that has tons of consideration put into that movie. Knock at the Cabin, I did not like the ending of that movie either.

Oh, I still haven't seen it because kids in peril. I won't spoil it for you then. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I like Jonathan Groff though. I think it's worth seeing and is a movie I liked, but I did not like the choice that he made in the ending. It's not quite the same as a bad twist. It's something a little bit different. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I thought this was the best of those three. And to me, this is the truly modern era. He's not iterating on The Sixth Sense or Unbreakable or anything like that. I kind of hope that this is just what he's doing now. That he's just doing a new thriller every 18 to 24 months with like a B movie star. Right. And making cool mainstream thrillers. But something accessible and poppy about it.

High concept always. I love that. If it's an adaptation, like Knock the Cabin was an adaptation. I thought he did an interesting thing with it until he got to the end. I think it's hard because like the heights of old are the best thing he's done in a while in my opinion. Yeah. But the lows are pretty

low. It's like that's a movie with Garcia Bernal and Vicky Crepes like incredible actors in that movie. Right. And everything that is happening on the beach is creepy and memorable. Yes, very much so. But... When the girl who was like three emerges as pregnant, that's mind-blowing stuff.

Anyway. But the ending doesn't, is bad. Whereas The Visit, I don't know if you ever saw The Visit. The Visit is very horror. I didn't. This was his big comeback. And that's probably the most purely satisfying movie he's made since i would say signs this movie is not breaking the you know six cents unbreakable signs no yeah

absolutely not quartet the village is probably the least but also a very interesting movie and then i think it's right there with you know split old knock at the cabin like i think they're all really good. And good in different ways and very compelling. Split is very similar to this movie to me where I'm just like, even if I don't like where it ended up at the end, I was locked in the whole time. I was very engaged with the way he was trying to tell that story. I really liked the lead performance from McAvoy, someone who, like, I think, and maybe will get more, but, like, certainly deserves more than the career that he had had up until then. Well, he's, I mean, we'll talk about it when Speak No Evil comes out.

I can't wait. But he's trying to figure out how to be a different kind of leading man after being in a few franchises and doing some other things. Anyway, yeah, this is a cool movie. I'm glad you liked it, too. I was a little nervous, but I figured that Josh Hartnett overall, he would try him for you. He's an interesting tool for a filmmaker. I wonder what kind of thing he'll try to do next.

Right. He's like... This is the right scale, I would say. He's like soft Adam Driver. You know what I mean? There is something so big, like the scale of him. You know what I mean? There is something so like big, like the scale of him. Did you see the anecdote?

Like on one of the talk shows, he was like, I gained like 30 pounds for Oppenheimer. And then Matt Damon was just like, never gain weight after 40. You'll never take it off. And then spent the whole time, the whole shoot just being like,

yeah, man, you're just never going to take that off. And he was like, thanks so much, Matt Damon. Did he take it off? I think so. I also looks great. I mean, yeah, man, you're just never going to take that off. And he was like, thanks so much, Matt Damon, for your advice. Did he take it off? I think so. He also looks great.

I mean, it doesn't, you know. Movie stars are built different. But there just is something about his size that reminds me of Adam Driver. Yeah. I mean, it's very rare to see a six foot four man in a movie. Right. It just doesn't really happen that much. Well, that's Trap.

I'm glad you enjoyed it. It was great stuff. As I said later this week, sing, sing. We'll talk about some movies we missed. How are you feeling about the movies we missed stuff?

I mean, I've seen some movies. That's that's what I liked. Did I see anything I liked? Real mixed bag this year. Yeah. You know, I'm trying to keep my heart open. I really liked trap.

So, yeah, that's great. I'm happy for you. Thanks to Brian Waters for filling in for our producer Bobby Wagner on this episode. Bob's on vacation. Stay tuned. We'll be back later this week. Thank you.