The Big Picture - The 21st Century Action Hero Hall of Fame

Episode Date: February 17, 2022

Shea Serrano joins Sean to break down the landscape of action moviemaking. With ‘Uncharted’ in theaters, featuring two generations of action hero—Mark Wahlberg and Tom Holland—we ask: What does it mean to be an action star in the 21st century? Sean and Shea build out the Hall of Fame with 10 excruciating picks. Host: Sean Fennessey Guest: Shea Serrano Producer: Bobby Wagner Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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From Spotify and the Ringer Podcast Network, I'm Claire Malone, and this is Just Like Us. The tabloids that change America. This series premieres on February 14th on the Ringer Dish feed. Listen on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Sean Fennessey, and this is The Big Picture, a conversation show about action. On today's show, we're looking at the landscape of action moviemaking. There's a new film in theaters this weekend. It's called Uncharted.

It's a long gestating adaptation of the hugely successful video game franchise. The movie stars two generations of action hero, Mark Wahlberg and Tom Holland. So I was wondering, what does it mean to be an action hero in the 21st century? There's only one man to ask and answer that question. Honestly, it's Shea Serrano. Shea, what's up? What up, baby boy? So I think action and I think of you. I think of all of your writings over the years about covering the action space. I think about all your podcasting on the rewatchables and elsewhere. I say action movie in the 21st century. Do you think we're in a good place do you think things are going well is are we in a downturn where what's the state of the the medium before we get into the stars it feels like we're in a good place

it's an interesting place to be we don't have action stars in the like conventional sense in the way that we used to have them i don't't think we ever will again, but I think that's okay because I think what's happening is similar to what we saw with what happened with rap when the internet showed up or what's happened with books recently. All that ends up happening is people realize you can't reach everybody at once, so we're not going to try to do that anymore. We're going to hyper focus everything and we're only going to worry about our thing. And so if you're a fan of a person or a movie genre or whatever,

you're going to have 25 different versions of that thing that are out there. All you have to do is access them. You just have to find your people and then, oh man, there's so much good stuff. Can you give me an example of an action movie that's occurred in the last 10 or 20 years that really speaks to that change where we're not just trying to get every living human to see Arnold Schwarzenegger in a movie, but maybe there's a more niche approach to action

filmmaking that makes sense in that respect? Yeah. So, okay. So what would the first version is we'll do the opposite of that. The opposite version of that is what Netflix tried to do do with the rock and ryan reynolds and gal gadot and they're like if this movie had come out 10 years ago it'd been the biggest movie on the planet but because of where we are now it didn't it didn't even like register it was like oh it's out you know what i'm saying like you didn't even know that it was a thing until it was a thing did you watch that movie red notice i of course i did and and did you walk away from it feeling like this is what i wanted this i got

what i needed out of this movie i walked yeah i walked away feeling like i'm gonna forget everything about this movie in seven minutes i don't know anybody's name i don't know what they were doing in it i don't remember who the bad guy was and the good guy and the teams i don't remember anything but for that stretch of when i was sitting in front of my tv watching it i was like yes this is cool this is fun let ryan reynolds do what ryan reynolds does you know what i'm saying so uh if we're looking for something that's like the the other way the thing that you're talking about is i think it was also a netflix movie it was another netflix movie with with eco ice the night comes for us when that

movie shows up and everybody who likes eco was like we knew that the movie was coming we knew that today it was coming out i was excited to like read about it on the internet i was excited to watch it um it just it felt different it was much smaller but it was more potent you know what i'm saying and that and and that seems to be like what's happened over the past 10 or so years is like we've gravitated towards that and that has become like its own version of prestige when you see a movie like uncharted being promoted tom holland mark walberg a video game movie are you like this is it this is for me this is what i want or does it feel because the movie to me strikes me as a little bit of a relic of a different time in movie going what do you think

it does it does feel like like you know 10 years ago or whatever 15 years ago. It does feel like that. But also, I like Tom Holland. I like video games, some of them anyway. And I have kids now. And so this was a trailer that when it came on, we were watching Spider-Man and they played it before the Spider-Man trailer. And all of us in our little row, me, Laramie, the twins, the baby, we were all like, well, we're going to go see that, right? And everybody disagreed. That's going to be the thing we're going to go see.

There's a space for that. There's more families now in America than there have been ever, ever. You need those types of movies where mom and dad can sit there and the kids can sit there and I don't have to worry about, like, anything getting a little too out of control. But it's also going to be kind of fun to watch a guy jump out of an airplane with no parachute and like, yeah, let's go for it. of fun to watch a guy jump out of an airplane with no parachute and like, yeah, let's go for it.

So you mentioned Spider-Man and seeing Spider-Man with your families. As I was trying to construct a framework for this conversation for us, I kind of stuck on superhero movies. Yeah, I noticed.

That's funny. Is Spider-Man an action movie in your mind? no it's not okay it's a it's a whole different thing superhero movies are a whole different thing they have action in them but they are not action movies the same way as they have like love stories in them but they're not love story movies i'm bumping on that dude i don I don't know. Because I feel like that is our version of the Stallone, Schwarzenegger, Bruce Willis movie in the 2010s and 20s. As close as we get to that,

the sort of the mainstream blockbuster that quote unquote everyone agrees on that features action and features romance and features some humor, features big set pieces. I know that these guys are wearing capes and i know that it's based on comic book mythology but i it feels like they're the the first genre you would identify that they would be associated with maybe it's fantasy but like to me comic book is not a

genre it's a format so i i i i'm gonna respectfully disagree with you i think i would i would closer associate them to science fiction movies. Okay. You have space, you have aliens, you have time travel. You know what I'm saying? You don't have a guy with a machine gun in a warehouse. That's, to me, the fundamental difference there. Okay, but what about this?

There's a film I'm seeing very, very soon. I won't say when, so as not to make people jealous, but I'm seeing a film called The Batman very soon. This is the new batman movie there are no aliens in the batman movie in fact this is a very grounded batman movie it's much more about him being a detective who punches guys in the head and drives a cool car now that's not science fiction but is that an action movie because it kind of seems like an action movie. That one is closer to an action movie, but I would still group it with superhero stuff because by this point,

we have watched Batman fight aliens. You know? Right, right. He's just not happening to do it at this particular moment. Okay. All right. And we're not on the same page with this,

but that's okay. I still respect you. We aren't. We aren't. I want to talk about what this Hall of Fame could be. And frankly, I want you to disagree with me and make corrections and also address, I think, the point that you made, which is right on, which is that you can be much less famous now and still be an action hero and star. So a lot of the people who would have been included if we had done this exercise, say, in 2010 and especially in 2000, I think it's clear that they represent something different.

So like Tom Cruise is not a part of this conversation. Keanu Reeves, because of Point Break, because of The Matrix, because of any number of films, Speed, he's not a part of this conversation. He's in John Wick and he continues to be a star, but we're not putting him in this new version of a Hall of Fame.

Schwarzenegger, no. Stallone, no. Jean-Claude Van Dam damme no i would say will smith was an action star well before this sort of new era kurt russell harrison ford antonio banderas nick cage jackie chan russell crowe sure certainly clint eastwood certainly one of the one of the archetypes Russell Crowe. Sure. Certainly Clint Eastwood. Certainly. One of the archetypes. Yep. Chow Yun-Fat, I feel like, is before all this. Absolutely. Absolutely.

That feels like, to me, as close as I could get to kind of the active roster of 90s action stars who are still working today and who still have a foothold in the game, but we're not going to address them. Did I miss anybody there? I mean, Steven Seagal should maybe get a mention. I don't think we should put him in there. But he's not even like, is he even still making action movies?

You know, I tried to look at people who are kind of still working in the space, you know? Ah, okay. Oh yeah, no, he's out of there. We're fine. We're fine with who you mentioned so far. Okay, so let's do the new version. This is people who largely launched

their action careers in the 21st century. Maybe they dabbled here and there in the 90s, but for the most part, they confirmed themselves. And I think the names will be surprising because there are some young people, but there are some people who are older who are making movies,

but didn't start until 10 years ago making action films. I'm looking at your list and I just realized we got to have we got to have Zhang Ziyi on here. So Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon,

Hero, House of Flying Daggers, The Grandmaster. So I thought about her. Would you say that she is more 90s or would you say that she is more 2000s? She's more she's 2000. When is it cut off?

So I think 2000 should be the launch point. So she's on the long list that we're when is when is it cut off i so i think 2000 should be the launch point so she's on the long list that we're gonna go through now then i would say is that fair okay okay good yeah all right all right okay so i'll add shang chi 2010 yeah great all right so let's just let's just go through and i'm going to start in a very comfortable place um eco uas who you mentioned who is eco the star of the raid films and who is The Night Comes for Us is the star and is basically like largely agreed upon as one of the great action performers of this century. If you've seen one of his movies. When I wrote Movies and Other Things in 2019, there's like a little section in there about him. He's the best on-camera fighter we have ever gotten.

Wow. Ever. Like I'm talking about just straight up fight skill, not overall star power. You're never going to eclipse Bruce Lee in that category. Bruce Lee could do everything you needed this person to do. But Iko, we're just talking about turn the camera on and let him fight for seven minutes straight. Nobody's better. Have you spent any time with Woo Assassins, one of the shows that he stars on Netflix? No.

Is it out already? It's on Netflix now. And he's also going to be the star of a movie that comes out this week called Fistful of Vengeance on Netflix. Oh, okay. Okay. Which is one of the reasons why I wanted to talk about this, because it's not just Uncharted. It's also Fistful of Vengeance on Netflix. Oh, okay, okay. Which is one of the reasons why I wanted to talk about this because it's not just Uncharted, it's also Fistful of Vengeance.

I saw Fistful of Vengeance. I thought it was fun. Not as good as the Raid films, but I thought it was fun. Woo Assassins. Yes, I know Woo Assassins because that's like a couple of years ago. Yes.

I thought you were talking about like a new... Okay, yeah. Woo Assassins. Yes, Fistful of Vengeance. I have not seen. I didn't... How did you watch that one? Well, they shared

a screener with me ah that's nice that's all right i get it it looks great it looks great woo assassins i'm familiar with fistful of engines no but any of the eco stuff i'm going to watch it when it comes out so eco is really great what else is it about him that makes him special to you is it that he's been a part of projects that you really liked? Yeah, so that's a part of it. Okay, so the Raid and the Raid 2 are like, those are movies where when you're talking to somebody about action movies, that feel very like when you're talking

to somebody about rap and they mention MF Doom and you're like, oh, I get it. I know what you're in. You know what I'm saying? It's a shorthand for like coolness like this this is about this is a credibility voucher when you're like the kitchen fight scene and the raid too and you're like oh fuck let's go you're my best friend automatically so he's in he's in that stuff he's the centerpiece of those movies which which they would go on to

like become unbelievably influential you can watch john w Wick and be like, oh, you're doing that. They brought people in from the Raid movies to the John Wick universe. They let those guys beat up John Wick. They did. As a like, we know what we're doing. So yeah, so you have the guy who does that. But again, just his overall fighting skill. It's unbelievable to watch this

guy do the stuff that he can do it makes me so mad when i watch a movie that he's in and they don't let him do the thing that he does when you watch did you watch snake eyes i of course i did yeah the henry golding gi joe yes i watched in the movie theater when it came out, and I was like, ooh, Ico is in this. He plays a guy whose name is Hard Master. That's his name in the movie, Hard Master. He's a master at one of the temples or whatever, and Golding has to defeat him in a thing. But they don't even let him fight. He holds a bowl of water or whatever.

What are we doing? When you watch Mile 22 with him and mark walberg and he's like the bad guy good guy bad guy good guy and they finally they have like the big fight scene where he's handcuffed to the hospital bed and they just do a hundred quick cuts and i'm like what are you doing why are you remixing this just let him go you know what i'm saying he's he's the best he's so good it's a great point i knew you were a huge fan of his which is why i put him at the top of this conversation even though he's not the most famous person he's pretty he's he's must watch i think even if the movies he's

in are not necessarily must watch what he's doing in a movie is must watch he really is wasted in snake eyes that was a bummer i did i watched snake eyes on a plane i wasn't mad that i did it but but uh i did see it and I was disappointed that he was not allowed to, not allowed to punch people in the throat, basically. That's really what you want

to see him doing. This is like you draft Steph Curry and then you say, hey, no threes. Yeah, mid-range. Shoot from the mid-range, Steph. Okay, so Eco is in. I've got 23 more names

that I want to do here. And we only have nine spots now for putting Iko in. So you're good with that? I'm good, yes. He should be the first one. So some of these names now are going to get a little bit more familiar to people. Let's go with Charlize Theron. Now, do you see her as one of the signature action stars of the last 20 years?

Surprisingly, she's made a viable run at it i think a lot of people i certainly didn't know that she could do the things that she does in the movies um the the term i always like to use in this situation is fight confidence which is like you you watch this person on screen and they fight and you believe that they're fighting and she's so fucking good when she she has the fight scene in mad max fury road when she fights tom hardy and i remember sitting there watching it because you know it's going to come eventually she's the leader of the of the gang and he's on the other side and they're gonna have to square off and then she doesn't you're like oh shit she's fucking great in this in my head i picture head, I picture her as like the first picture of her

is when she popped up in That Thing You Do as Guy's girlfriend, just like all primp and proper. But then from that point forward, she just kept proving she could do it. When she was in Hancock, she has a great fight with Will Smith. When she was in the sci-fi movie, it was the Eon Flux. She could do everything. She's great. She should

be a contender for one of the nine spots. Okay. Atomic Blonde, the hotel fight in Atomic Blonde, what are we doing? I thought that I think most people would think, okay, Mad Max, Fury Road, and Atomic Blonde, that's really where things start, but I'm glad you hit on Eon Flux, which I don't think is super successful.

But then in Hancock, she's doing it. She's one of the action stars. She has to do the physical work, the wire work. She's... But also, are we sure Hancock

is in a superhero movie, Shay? It's a superhero movie, but we're just talking about fighting right now. I'm giving examples of her fighting. Okay. Fair enough. Fair enough.

All right. So Charlize, I'm going to put in as a soft yes. now eco is a is green green is go okay green go charlie's is a yellow maybe a go we shall see okay next one next one's pretty important christian bale woof no that's how i feel woof no don't be christian bell listen okay here's here's the argument against christian bell because this goes this is the fight confidence thing this is what i want you to do if you're listening right now and you're you're mad that i'm saying no go to youtube uh search christian bell equilibrium uh fight scene yes fucking awful just just awful just what like you don't know you look like you've

never been in a fight ever you look you've never held a weapon ever he's just spinning around with his little swords out or guns out or doing the whole thing it's so bad it is so bad great as batman maybe the best batman we've ever gotten great in westerns 310 to yuma. Maybe the best Batman we've ever gotten. Great in Westerns. 310 to Yuma, one of the best Westerns we've ever gotten. Great actor. He's great in The Fighter, but you notice he doesn't fight. You know what I'm saying? He's great, but he's not this. I have a counterpoint.

Go. It's called Reign of Fire. Have you seen Reign of Fire? Of course I've seen Reign of Fire. Now, Reign of Fire, 2002 science fiction fantasy movie about dragons starring matt mcconaughey and christian bill and uh i would argue that he's a very credible fighter very credible warrior in that movie and i i don't know man i don't know i feel like he can he gives good action here's how you know you're wrong the the iconic shot the iconic shot of that scene the movie is

not great it's fun to watch it's fun um i read what we rewatched it during the pandemic because my youngest son got into dragon tales the book series oh. Oh, yeah. And I was like, oh, you fucking like dragons. Have a seat, son. Have a seat. But in that movie, Matthew McConaughey is the guy. And the shot that sold the movie in the trailer is McConaughey, not Bale, but McConaughey, jumping and he's got his body parentheses backwards. He's about to attack.

Like, that's the shot they they did not pick a christian bale shot for that like it's just it's a fun movie he's not in you're saying out for christian bale i just want to be clear about that out yes all right here's another one scarlett johansson now what is happening right now? Now, you might think I'm crazy. You might think I'm crazy, but I recommend it. Yeah, yeah. Tell me about why Her is an action movie. That's what I want to hear right now. Well, it's an action movie of the mind.

You know, Her is all about exploring unusual romantic relationships with non-existent AI beings. No, I mean, honestly, like, look at her career. Look at her filmography. Unusual romantic relationships with non-existent AI beings. No, I mean, honestly, look at her career. Look at her filmography. This is a person who's been in a solid number of action films. May I point you to The Island, for example. Yeah. You know, starring Ewan McGregor and directed by Michael Bay. I mean, who says action more than Michael Bay?

You know? Might I also point you to a series of MCU films in which she, as Black Widow, is asked to do a lot of hand-to-hand combat, perhaps the most grounded of the MCU characters?

If we are to agree that superhero movies count, then she has a case. Because she's great as Black Widow. She has great fight confidence. I'm not excluding her because she can't do the thing. She's great.

Well, I got one more thing for you, though. Oh, don't say Lucy. Lucy, yeah. I'll fucking karate kick you through the screen. What, you don't like Lucy? You're out on Lucy? No, I don't like Lucy.

I don't like Lucy. That's actually surprising. I would have thought you would have been into it. So Luc Besson. I thought I don't like Lucy. I don't like Lucy. That's actually surprising. I would have thought you would have been into it. So Luc Besson. I thought I was going to love it when I saw the trailer. Any sort of like souped up human.

Yeah. They're like, oh, this is limitless is what this is. Yeah. But it just wasn't fun is the thing. Any kind of souped up human

like a superhuman you mean? Like a superhero? Yeah, like a super. Like I love superhero movies. Okay. We should do a superhero movie hall of fame, Scarlett Johansson, first ballot. No question. No question about it.

Action movies? ScarJo's out. ScarJo's out. I feel like you are doing the Shay thing where you're going to make some reckless choices here. Am I wrong? No, I'm solid. You can't tell me nothing about reckless choices when you put robert downey jr on your action movie hero list we'll get to that you're getting

ahead of yourself okay oh sorry sorry let's go to an interesting one because this is a guy who didn't really get in this conversation until he was in his 50s but his name is liam neeson liam neeson best best known in the 90s as a beloved actor in serious dramas from Ireland. He did a little bit of action work, but not until Taken came along did it seem like he was really the new Clint Eastwood for our times in a lot of ways.

Some might say the Charles Bronson for our times, but he strikes me more like an Eastwood figure. And he's continued to make action movies. This has basically been the dominant mode of his career ever since Taken took off. In fact, he's in one that just came out that apparently is not very good. I have not seen called Blacklight, but he's cranking them out. They come out every 45 minutes. There's a new Liam Neeson.

I have to avenge something action movie. And because of that, you have to include him. He has to be a yes here okay because here's here's what's important about liam neeson is there's always like a tentpole moment when things shift and they everything starts moving in another direction when he showed up in taken everyone was like liam neeson is doing an action movie what are we talking about and then it comes out and you're like oh shit he fucking rocked in this he's great he's not like a super great uh fighter but he's just he just has

so much gravity as an actor you're watching him do the thing you're watching the phone call scene from the from the thing you're just pulled into it um it it it began the like the run that we have are still on of like older actors doing action movies yes liam neeson is the flashpoint for that so the same way you would argue like you have to like have a certain rap album even if the entire rap album isn't great you have to have it in the conversation of like great rap albums because it was like a moment in music that's what liam neeson is with with taken here and he's had a few really really good ones the taken franchise sort of fell apart after the first one i agree um but you have that one you have him and the gray is incredible like even if he just had those two but he just kept on doing them every sort of like he's on the one with the

train like everything that can put him on a train put him on a plane put him on this put him on that like he he's a marking point so you have to include him here so he he did get to sharpen his sword in dark man many years ago in 1990 and then and then he appears in the star wars prequels as as qui-gon jinn and then he you know he's in a few obviously he's in bat Begins and Kingdom of Heaven. So you could say, alright, he was kind of greasing the wheels here. But these contemporary set action movies, not franchise films, not science fiction, not superhero. The fact that almost

all of his movies are about a regular dude with a special set of skills is kind of amazing that he's been able to because it's now been, this is the 14th year that Liam Neeson is doing this stuff. Taken was 14 years ago.

It's pretty remarkable. My favorite is Non-Stop, the one on the plane. That's the one that I think is great. It's really good. The one on the train is pretty good too.

What's the one on the train called? It's also called Non-Stop. They're just all called Non-Stop. I like that. Okay, so you're saying Neeson's in. He's got to be in yeah all right i'll rock with you on that so far you've not let me down uh robert downey jr you mentioned him you're

met you're mad you're big mad big mad about rdj uh just you know we didn't talk about this ahead of time but you you got this superhero being your bonnet you know you're big mad about iron man no he's a great iron man he could he could maybe be the greatest superhero ever you there's probably a valid argument to make there um if we're talking about just general skill he's funny he's smart he was an important piece that like he set everything off like he's the guy who they gave the line deliver the line and then die and everybody is just in tears yeah you just spoiled endgame but sure yeah okay great if you haven't seen endgame by now fuck you how about that robert downey jr as an action hero it just doesn't fit you

this sentence doesn't even sound right it doesn't't, coming out of your mouth. Let me point you to a little film from 1998 called U.S. Marshals. This is the sequel to The Fugitive, the spinoff, in which he played Special Agent John Royce. Not buying it? No, I'm not. He's good in it. Okay. But you know who would have been better?

John Cusack. Put John Cusack in that role. Wow. The movie does better. Interesting take. That's fair. I'm going through his filmography and I'm like,

I don't really think I see another action. Well, okay. What about this? What about Guy Ritchie's Sherlock Holmes movies? Yeah. Those are fun. Those are fun. If he had six of those movies,

yeah, we can have that talk. But he doesn't. He has two. And they're both fucking great. They're so much fun. I don't know if I totally agree with that, but that's... Oh my God. It's nice that you feel that way um what about do little is that a

strong action performance do little is the is the only movie that ever made me dislike animals i'm like you know what fuck animals i don't like them anymore i usually love animals but i'm mad right now that's that's That's a good take. RDJ's out. Here's another one. Angelina Jolie. Angelina Jolie. I feel like yes.

I feel like yes. You have Wanted. Yeah. You have Salt. Yeah. You have Tomb Raider. Fitting since this all started with Uncharted. That's right.

You have enough there. She has fight confidence. She is cool. We haven't talked enough about that there. She has fight confidence. She is cool. We haven't talked enough about that yet. An action movie star needs to be cool. Like just unbelievably cool no matter what.

No matter what they're doing or what they're wearing or what they're saying. Interesting point. Charlize Theron and Angelina Jolie both have had dreads in a movie

at some point. Interesting. Would you say those were good choices when they had dreads? I would not. I would not. I would not say they were good choices. But it's interesting that they've had them.

Gone in 60 Seconds for Jolie is that one. But yeah, she's there. She's there. Have you seen the film Eternals? Yes. Okay. Didn't understand any of it. I struggle to understand it as well.

I would say one of the few things about it that I really liked was they really make you wait a long time to see Angelina Jolie go apeshit. But when they do, she does have a really fun fight sequence. And she's still, I think she's,

I mean, she's got to be approaching, how old is she? 50 years old? Something like that. And she's still an incredible athlete and a great onscreen physical performer in a way that I never would have guessed when she first came around in like Hackers and Girl Interrupted. I didn't see her as that kind of actress, but she is now like almost more well known as an action star than as a serious film actor.

Would you agree with that? Yeah. Because she can, I mean, she's just good she's just good and it's so much fun when an actor who is good can also do the other thing it's why we it's why we love charlie's it's why we love uh the liam neeson's movies it's why we love her movies because it's just like it feels special when they're doing it you're like this person could be winning an oscar right now if she wanted, but instead she's going to curve a bullet around a room and kill all of these assassins all at once. And then herself, like, I like it. So we're through two, four, six, seven people.

We've got three in three out and one, maybe this is, there's gonna be some hard cuts here as we go through this. Here's a, here's a big one. I don't know if it gets any bigger than this. Dwayne The Rock Johnson. You got to have him. You got to have him. Here's the complication with The Rock, who I love and who as a wrestling performer is among my favorite ever, definitely in my top three. The Rock makes a lot of movies that I don't think are good. Awful. Go through the list. Go through the list. Let's go through The Rock's filmography. Let's just do a snapshot. We'll just, let's choose six, any six consecutive years.

What six consecutive years should we do? Okay, let's do 2000 and... Let's go, let's start with, let's start with Snitch, 2013. do like snitch though if i'm being real me too okay so oh you know we we just start with fast five we just start with fast five because that's like okay an all-time great and you have to start out with a good one okay so fast five is a good example in in 2011 he made one movie fast five home run Home Run. Yes. One of the great action movies the last 10 years. So good. In 2012, he made a movie called Journey to Colon,

The Mysterious Island. This is a Journey to the Center of the Earth sequel. I've definitely never seen this. Have you? Yes, I have. Family favorite. Okay.

Okay. It'll be Friday family movie night. We watched it. Let's go to 2013. This is the embiggening of The Rock. Yes, exactly. The Rock made embiggening of The Rock. In this year, The Rock made five feature films. Yeah, baby. Here they

are. Every other month. Snitch, which I thought was a pretty nifty little crime thriller directed by Rick Romanois, who's a very good action movie director. Then he makes G.I. Joe Retaliation. Thumbs down. Not a good film. Then he makes Pain and Gain. Very very controversial movie I like it

yes hell yeah thumbs up great love to hear that from you then he makes Fast and Furious 6 yeah mid-level mid-level yeah yeah and then he makes a movie called Empire State which was direct to video and I've never seen it mm-hmm so that is that's seven movies in a row yeah not not not the strongest track Mm-hmm. So that is, that's seven movies in a row. Yeah.

Not, not, not the strongest track record. A couple of gems. A couple of obvious hits, but a pretty mixed bag. And I think he's in full mixed bag mode at the moment. So still,

when you look at his career, he's done so much. Mm-hmm. He's anchored the Fast franchise. He's now entered the superhero DC universe. He's, so much. He's anchored the Fast franchise. He's now entered the superhero DC universe. He's, you know, on the front of the poster of Red Notice, which though it wasn't very good, was one of the most watched movies of 2021.

This is really like a volume question, you know? It's like if you are... Let me think of the right basketball analogy here. When James Harden was going for 36 a game a few years ago, even though we knew his team was not going to the NBA finals, he was undeniably

essential to the story of the NBA that year. You can't talk about the NBA without talking about when he was, you know, his efficiency was so extraordinary and he was scoring so many points. I feel like The Rock is very similar. You kind of can't tell the story of 21st century action without him. You can't.

You can't. He's the closest we've gotten to like a global movie star, to like a 1994 movie star. The Rock is the closest we've gotten. And he was able to do it because he was doing seven movies a year so even if you missed six of them you still saw dwayne johnson in a movie and if you just cherry pick his best stuff like his best action movies we're talking about uh we're talking about long what will uh the rundown yeah we're talking about Walking Tall. We're talking about, you'd have to

include Fast Five, probably Furious 7. Hobbs and Shaw is not that great, but it's fun, and he yanks a helicopter out of the sky with a chain. I did like that part. Yeah. You have to include him. He can put

up, you take his five best action movies, and you're like include him. He can put up, you take his like five best action movies and you're like, all right, you're in the conversation for the top level. You just have to. I know, but still he makes Baywatch and Rampage and Skyscraper. Baywatch is funny. Rampage is bad.

Skyscraper is bad. Skyscraper, they were like, we ran out of stuff for you to fight. I guess fight a building i don't know and he fought a building he fought a building and then they just fucking that he was like at the end i'll just turn the building off and then i win or whatever where do you land on san andreas oh i'm thumbs up pro yeah yeah yeah yeah so the thing with watching the rock movies is you're not watching them to watch a good movie.

You're watching them to watch the rock. That's it. And is he going to do the things that you want him to do? Santa Andreas was fun because he was actually trying to act in it. I was sitting in the theater. I was actually in LA when I watched this movie. And I was sitting in the theater by myself. It had just come out.

And I'm watching it. And there's the helicopter scene where he's in there with his ex-wife and it's supposed to be like the emotional turn. And I was like, man, if Will Smith was giving this monologue right now, this entire theater would be in tears, but it was the rock.

So we were just waiting for another wave to come so we could watch the next thing, you know? Yeah. I think about him in the context of somebody like Keanu where Keanu has such great taste and his his highs are so high John

John Wick and John Wick 2 speed point break the matrix these are forever movies they are maybe not maybe not John Wick 2 but the other movies I mentioned are movies that are like come on they're in the first sentence in his obituary.

The Rock doesn't really have any of those. I mean, I guess you could make the case that Fast Five is one of those, but it's the fifth movie in a franchise that he joined late. So I'm still waiting for him to make his Terminator. I'm still waiting for him

to make his Point Break. Do you think he'll do that? No, I don't think he's that kind of star. He's not a star because he makes good movies in the way that Keanu is. He's a star because he's a star. There's a difference. He's like, let's put The Rock in this

and it'll be fun. Alright. That's the end. That's the end of the critical conversation. That's a little disappointing. I want my stars to make great movies. That's what makes them super duper stars to me anyway let's keep going okay interesting one here chris hemsworth who is no question famous specifically for being thor that is what put him on the map now he has made appearances in other big films um you know he famously played uh captain Captain Kirk's father

in the Star Trek movie. He appeared in Extraction, one of the most successful action movies of recent times. So good. So good. He was a very physically imposing computer hacker

in the movie Black Hat. Why was he so big? Why were they like, let's get the big muscular guy? How do we get a jacked hacker uh that was an incredible twist that no one saw coming he doesn't have a long resume when it comes to action movies aside from thor but he's done a handful of things when you look at him is he in yet is he still working on his resume he's not in yet he has shown that he can do it he can absolutely do it extraction is a

perfect example extraction is just from the moment it starts until the moment it ends we're just fucking sprinting through the jungle as fast as we can with our eyes closed is what it feels feels like just great great action the great director it just he's great in that movie i love that movie i love him doing that kind of movie but he doesn't have enough yet he just doesn't because we can't if we're not we can't count thor sure he fought hulk but like that's a different thing i want to watch it i want to watch him fight eco in a movie you know let me see that i want to tell you about his next three films, and maybe we can revisit this in 2024. But later this year, he's in a movie called Spiderhead.

Oh, man. Here's the description of Spiderhead, which we've talked about quite a few times because CR is obsessed with this movie. In the near future, convicts are offered the chance to volunteer as medical subjects to shorten their sentence. One such subject for a new drug

capable of generating feelings of love begins questioning the reality of his emotions is that gonna is that gonna put him in the action hall of fame that one alone won't but keep going down the list of what we got coming extraction two i'm so glad he made it i'm so glad he made it remember your wife when you watched it at the end and you're like man he died on the bridge and then the kid comes up in the water and you see the figure in the background

and you're like it was like everything stopped like did he live? fucking did he? I was on the internet immediately please be alive

let me ask you a question do you think that can you remember the name of Hemsworth's character in Extraction without looking? Tyler Rake oh god

yes Shay that's why you're you I love it. So the third and final film that's on his IMDb, which apparently is coming in 2024, is a little movie called Furiosa, which is a prequel

to Mad Max Fury Road. Hell yes. I believe he and Anya Taylor-Joy are the two stars of that movie. So that's pretty exciting. Perfect casting. Please. So Hemsworth is out,

but he's got a bright future. Yeah. Here's an older fellow. Curious for your take on this one. Hugh Jackman. Super big action in The Greatest Showman. But I'm going to go

I'm going to go no. I'm going to go no. His main thing is Wolverine and again I'm just X-ing him all off. Any of your superhero people you show up with that's a different

that's a different episode. Great, great, great as Wolverine. Loved Logan. I like the first one that everybody sort of shit on. We get introduced to him when he's in the bar and he's doing the fighting. Yeah. I realize he's a mute.

This is a great character introduction. I like Hugh Jackman. I don't think he belongs here. He can do it, but he doesn't belong. What about Van Helsing? No. Who liked Van Helsing? You probably got the Blu-ray.

You got the Blu-ray behind you, don't you? The director's cut with 67 extra minutes. I've watched the commentary track on Van Helsing five times in the last six months. I don't think I commentary track on Van Helsing five times in the last six months. I don't think I've even seen Van Helsing if I'm being truly honest. What about Real Steel?

I feel like that one's underrated. That is underrated. That's a fun movie to watch. Boxing robots? Yeah. That looks pretty good. But that doesn't put him in, right? He doesn't have enough. We can't count the superhero stuff, so he doesn't have enough. Okay.

Here's a really divisive one. Ryan Reynolds. I think you got to have him. Oh, really? I think so. I think so. But let's have him near the bottom of the list that we can bump off. Like, I think he's below Charlize.

Okay. You have to have her before you have him. But he's just, again, he does the thing that he's going to do in each of the movies. Come in, make some jokes, do some, he's good at fighting. He's got some of the stuff that's supposed to be like grittier, like the one that he did with Denzel. He's got the sillier stuff. Yeah, was that two guns that he did? No, Safe House.

Safe House. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's good in Safe House. I thought he was like... I go back and I rewatch it every so often, but Smoke and Aces, he's just... I think that's his lane right there. He figured it out in that moment. And then he has a great scene at the end

when he's just breaking down in tears when he realizes everything's going on. And he's just unplugging the stuff and taking out his. It's great. It's great. He can do it. I don't think you would ever put him on the list of like greatest ever. But we're talking modern action hero Hall of Fame. He is very much a modern action hero in that he like does a thing.

And he's a little bit bland, and he doesn't have his own franchise exactly yet, and he's never going to give you Terminator or Rocky or anything like that, but he's going to be there making Free Guy, which was fun. How do you not like Free Guy? What are you doing, Sean? Shay, Free Guy is terrible.

Terrible. No. Shay, I'm'm gonna reserve the potential right to decline the ryan reynolds submission but i have veto power on this podcast fortunately but we'll keep him as a yellow for now he's a maybe he's he's a yellow we we went and saw that one that's a good family movie again and when they do the captain america bit everybody laughed everybody laughed can i tell you something you need to respect your family That's a good family movie again. And when they do the Captain America bit, everybody laughed.

Everybody laughed. Can I tell you something? You need to respect your family more. Just show your children a little more respect. You want me to take them to go see? Hey, kids, pack it up. We're going to go watch licorice pizza. Come on.

Let's go. Let's go have a good time. Phantom Thread tonight, baby. Buckle up. Shay, leave me alone. For real. Just let me like what I like. All right, baby. Buckle up. Shay, leave me alone. For real. Just let me like what I like. All right, man.

Okay, Michael Jai White. Oh, green. Automatic green. Auto. Auto. Auto. Auto. So he, to me,

is the first since Eco of a person who is a slightly more niche star, but in his niche is widely celebrated and beloved so just talk about what what he is and what he does and why he should be in beloved um okay number one super cool number two super funny like you nobody knew that he could do what he did and then he showed up in black dynamite and you're like black dynamite oh my god yeah he can he can check off every box uh number three he has done whatever the biggest

movie you want is every his scene in joker i mean a joker um the dark night came like a like a meme like this is like a great thing he can he has that prestige but also you can throw him in the like strip center restaurant version of an action movie and he can just carry the key the king the absolute king of the like we had a movie that came out and did pretty well we're gonna make another one but nobody from the original is coming back let's get michael jai white because he can do it never back down to undisputed 2. I guess Batman 2. He's in that one as well. The second movie, you need Michael Jai White in there.

He's so good. The most crushing thing that ever happened to me in my life, Sean, in my life, is that the video came out of the retooled Mortal Kombat several years ago, where he plays Jackson Briggs, and he's interrogating Scorpion. And you're like, oh my God, they're making this movie with Michael Jai White as Jax and then it never happened.

It never happened. Oh my God. Heartbreak. He was the ideal Jax, really. Oh, he's so good. He just, I love him. You know, he was also, he was in Undercover Brother 2

a couple of years ago, which I didn't know existed. But he was not the original Undercover Brothers. Fascinating. There have been a few Never Back Down movies, huh? There was a movie called Never Back Down, No Surrender. I definitely never saw this one. His track record is so spotty,

but he's always reliably good in his stuff. It's a tough one. He would be the- He takes it serious tough one he would he would be the he takes it serious he does he would be the he would have the worst the number of the highest number of bad films but with the most likable personality in those films him and the rocker kind of like the the funhouse mirror images of each other in a weird way and he also did spawn so he could do the superhero thing too. He did. He can do everything and if you're just like

if you just love action movies sometimes you want to watch an action movie where you just want to see the person do the cool thing. Okay. And you get Michael Jai White in there just beating the shit out of people. He's so big and bulky and fast

and just like cool. And it's great. He's in there. I like your confidence. I'm going to rock with you on this one. This next one is really interesting to me because this guy has what Michael Jai White has, but he's missing one piece.

His name is Scott Adkins. Scotty, baby. Let's go. His name is Scott Adkins. Scotty, baby. Let's go. So situate Scott Adkins in the action hero conversation in the 21st century. He's Michael Jai White, but like minus five is what he is. Is what he is. Scott Adkins came to be this iconic action movie person for action movie nerds when he showed up. I think his big moment was when he's in a movie with Michael Jai White, Undisputed 2.

Yes. And he's the heavy in that one. And he was so good that they just gave him his own spinoff of it. But he's like a stuntman who can do all of the things. I subscribe to this Patreon by Jordan Cruciola, and she writes about action movies all the time. And she does this regular series on there, or she used to. She doesn't do it so much anymore.

But she does this regular series where she takes like one person and she writes about whatever their finishing move is. And Scott Adkins is like, he belongs in this. If only for his flying kick moves that he does, nobody has ever done them like this guy. He's just like an athlete phenom. He's that fucking LeBron James of kicking people. It's unreal how good he is. You go watch the clip.

You can just watch. They're like Scott Adkins kicking people compilations on YouTube and it's just him doing the craziest shit you ever saw. There's one

where he's in the middle of a fight and he jumps and this is when he's fighting Michael Jai White at the end of the movie. So he's saving all of his best shit for then.

And he jumps and he does like a spinning roundhouse. So he's like trying to kick Michael Jai White with his left leg. So picture, I don't know how tall this guy is, 6'5 or something. 6'3. He's a bigger guy. He jumps. He comes 10 feet off the ground. He's spinning in the air. He tries to karate kick Michael Jai White in the face with his left leg, but he misses. And his body is spinning. And as his body is spinning, he just decides, I'll kick you with my right leg then. And he kicks it backwards at Michael Jai White as he's spinning

away from him and connects. And when he did that in that movie, you're like, well, you've got to do something like that in every movie now. Every single time you show up, you have to do a thing we've never seen before. he always delivers it's so good the first time i ever saw him it was definitely not in that movie it was in universal soldier day of reckoning yeah yeah yeah which is the sixth universal soldier movie which i don't think i saw three four and five if i'm being real but so many people recommended this movie they were like it's so good and it's a little it has this like sort of POV opening sequence. It's way more kind of like science fiction horror-y.

But Atkins is really the star. Jean-Claude Van Damme and Dolph Lundgren are in it. But Atkins is the one who's kind of like the central character in a way. Yeah. And he's really good. He's really convincing in a franchise that has featured JCVD and Dolph. So I like it. Are you sure you're going to be comfortable including Scott Atkins really convincing in a franchise that has featured JCVD and Dolph. Oh my god. Are you sure you're going to be comfortable including Scott Adkins and not

including some megastars of Hollywood history? I would absolutely be comfortable with that. Listen, I really enjoy the thing that happens when you watch a movie and you see a person in it and you're like, they do something incredible and you're like, I want to see more of this. And then you look for them and you realize you've seen them in other stuff.

And you get to go back and watch it. Because that happened with me with this guy, Scott Atkins. I watched him in this in Undisputed 2. And then I was like, oh, let me go see the other stuff. And I searched and I realized he was in Unleashed with Jet Li. Oh, yeah. He's like a fighter. They fight in a pool.

And I was like, immediately, let me go watch that scene. Sure enough, he's in there fucking jumping and kicking. He's doing a fighter. They fight in a pool. And I was like, immediately, let me go watch that scene. Sure enough, he's in there fucking jumping and kicking. He's doing his thing. This is an interesting point. Because Scott Adkins is like, he's a YouTube action star. His stuff is fun to revisit on YouTube. But are the movies good? Are they worthy?

They're not. See, this is a tricky thing. The Undisputed movies are good. Those are genuinely good movies. yeah see this is a tricky thing the undisputed movies are good those are those are like genuinely good movies but some of his other stuff is like i don't want to watch the whole movie i just want to watch when he does the triple kick kicks people yeah okay when he runs up the guy's body like remember that remember okay remember the seat this is why you have to have him in there remember in the matrix when morpheus and neo are fighting the first time and keanu does the kick where he kicks him like three times on the way up yes and then comes down

scott atkins does that in real life with no ropes he runs up dot dot dot you can watch it on youtube he was fighting this giant guy and he kicks him kicks him kicks him and then comes back down this is like incredible he's like the do you remember the NBA player Anthony Randolph where he's like he's got all the tools, you know, I remember Anthony Randolph. He had all the tools. He was an athletic freak. The bullies get bullied.

We bully the bullies. Okay, here's a tricky one. Daniel Craig. Oh wait, that's Zach Randolph. You're thinking of a different dude. Who is the Zach? I feel like Michael Jai White is really the Zach Randolph. That's Zach Randolph. You're thinking of a different dude. Who is the Zach? I feel like Michael Jai White is really the Zach Randolph of this list in many ways.

You know, he's just so powerful, so overwhelming. Powerful and beloved. Yes. You know, by purists. Basketball purists love Zach Randolph. Action movie purists love Michael Jai White. Yeah, and rappers in Memphis

are terrified of both Zach Randolph and Michael Jai White. We all are. Daniel Craig. He's James Bond in a number of films. And rappers in Memphis are terrified of both Zach Randolph and Michael Jai White. We all are. Daniel Craig. He's James Bond in a number of films. And James Bond is our most reliable action franchise in the last 50 years. Where are you at on Craig?

More than Mission Impossible? More reliable? I just feel like it's got a longer track record. I prefer the Mission Impossible movies myself. But there have only been six of them so far. And so it's a little bit tough to measure that against the dozens and dozens of Bond movies. And I think particularly the Daniel Craig Bond movies are well known for being really hard knuckled. With real, well executed, not just big explosive set pieces, but a lot of hand-to-hand combat. Daniel Craig is a very physical Bond.

He's my favorite Bond. Okay. I like him a lot. I like to watch him fight. I think he's a soft yes here. A soft yes. I would put him below Charlize, maybe above Ryan Reynolds, just because of the pedigree of Bond.

And because those movies are like, we're going to sit down and rewatch this movie for real. We're not just going to wait for the joke to come and then keep it moving. He has not done a whole lot of action beyond Bond, is the thing. He did Cowboys and Aliens, which was not super successful. But super fun.

That's really it. I mean, Girl with with the dragon tattoo defiance these are not really action movies they have action elements but they're not really action movies and I kind of like that for

him or about him is like I like when they I like when a person can do something and they decide like I'm not going to spend all of my time doing that because I can also do

these other things he I'll be fine when we end up eventually not including him in this list, but right now where we are, let's give him a soft yes. Really gave away the ending. That was a spoiler alert on this pod, Shay.

Okay, next one. By the way, this is delivered in an order that I invented based just on my own methodology. This is not alphabetical. It's not based on relevance. I'm just going down the list as I thought of people. Next one is Gal Gadot.

Gal Gadot, if you had asked me four years ago if she was going to be on this list, I would have said indisputably yes. Now I feel like the bloom is off the rose. People didn't love Red Notice. People are mocking her performance in Death on the Nile,

which came out last weekend. She had the Imagine video. Things are not going great for Gal. Wonder Woman 2 people didn't really enjoy very much. And yet, really the most credible Wonder Woman we've ever had in that first movie is still strong. The first movie is still strong.

She's great. And Zack Snyder's Justice League. What I really like about a thing that they do in that movie that I really like is oftentimes when they want to show how fast something is or somebody is, they slow it down. And so they're like, you see the bullet coming,

and they're like, and moving slowly out of the way. But in that one, they just let her be fast. So the part where she's like blocking all of the bullets when they're shooting at her it just looks cool as shit and like I would like to see I would like to see more of that but yeah same as you when she showed up in Wonder Woman

in particular the part when she's like running across the war field and you're just all fired up on the inside when she did that you're like give her a franchise give her the action movie franchise. Let's go get it. She's a great Wonder Woman.

I think Superhero Hall of Fame. I don't think Action Movie Hall of Fame. Okay, I just want to suggest that maybe she took a turn that she didn't have to by becoming Wonder Woman. Because her previous films before this, Fast and Furious, Date Night,

Night and Day, Fast Five, Fast and Furious Six, Furious Seven. her previous films before this fast and furious date night night and day fast five fast and furious six furious seven seven all of those movies are pure action and her role in date night is an action role her role in night and day is an action role she was kind of on like a linda hamilton-esque trajectory here and she she she gave up the ghost. So I wonder, I don't know. I just don't think she's a strong deliverer of dialogue. And that's been true for some of our best action heroes. You know, like Steve McQueen was great

when he was not talking. He would cut lines of dialogue out of his movies because he was like, I can do it with my face. I don't need to say anything here. And she's kind of in the same mold. You know, people should be, her agent should be going through her script and just crossing her lines out

and being like, gal does the thing where she blocks bullets. You know, like that's all she needs here. I don't know that I agree with that because I like when she's, I like when she's getting after Superman. You know, I think it's good. All right.

Is she in or is she a maybe or is she out we can include her maybe but i don't think she's gonna she's definitely gonna go out she's behind daniel craig for me okay here's an interesting one somebody who is very hot for a minute i would say that i think it's it's cooled a little bit but i wonder if his contributions are enough tony ja the, the great Thai martial artist. You know, so here's where I have a question about this. Because are we, what all

are we including for, like what are the requirements to make it into the Hall of Fame? Because if it's just action, like if it's just pure fight and shoot and jump and run, he has to be in there. I mean, if you tell me he has to be run, he has to be in there. I mean, if you tell me he has to be,

then he has to be. He's the war elephant protector. He's got the... Jordan Grugiola, she wrote a column about him, about his flying knees. He's got a signature move that he can do.

And he fucking fought on an elephant. And he was in the Furious 7, which is either the best or the second best of the Furious movies of all. He's the guy that fights Paul Walker in the bus. He's got the small stuff. He's got the giant stuff. He can do it. He's funny. He's like a funny guy.

He pops up. What was that movie where he popped up and he played himself? Oh, it's so funny. He just think it was let me see i feel like snow dogs for some reason i feel like he was in snow dogs but i might be i might be super wrong if so i have not seen that yeah it wasn't that one there's something else where he plays himself well so obviously he's got the angbok films right the angbok films, there's a trilogy. The first one in particular is a pretty special action movie. He makes a series

of other films in Thailand and in Asia for about 10 years. Then you mentioned that he shows up in Furious 7 and he starts doing a couple of other US productions. He did XXX Return of Xander Cage. He did Master Z The Ant-Man Legacy. Then he did triple x return of xander cage he did master z the

it man legacy and then he did something last year that was not i don't know it wasn't hugely noted but it's a big deal internationally which is he was he was in detective chinatown 3 which is a movie that um not a lot of people in the united states i think are familiar with but is basically the highest grossing r-rated movie of all time. It was released in China. It made $700 million. Oh, yeah. Which is a lot, considering it barely played in the United States.

And so, I don't know. He was also in Monster Hunter. Did you ever check that one out? The Paul W.S. Anderson movie? What did you think of that one? I did. Not great. Not great.

Not great, but, you know, I watched it with my youngest son. He's like, it's got monsters in it, let's do it. When you name your movie

Monster Hunter, you need to freaking live up to that title. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, you gotta be better at hunting monsters

if you're gonna make that a successful movie. But you think just on the strength of Ong Bak, he's in. Yeah, I think it's a signature action movie franchise. You got to visit it when you're going through the list.

Get groceries delivered across the GTA from Real Canadian Superstore with PC Express. Shop online for super prices and super savings. Try it today and get up to $75 in PC Optimum Points. Visit superstore.ca to get started. I'm just going to give you a quick recap as we get down to the final five names, which we're going to do more quickly because we've been taking our time. We've got two, four, six, seven locks for in. We currently have four maybes and we've only booted out four people thus far. So we got some hard decisions

in front of us. You mentioned, you mentioned Zhang Ji, star of Hero, Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, a number of other films. I would say she is not necessarily best known as an action star,

but she's been in some great films as a martial artist. Yeah. Is she in? I think, I think we'll say yes right now. Okay. I will accept.

I feel like she might be on the chopping block here. Yeah, she's probably like second ballot. Okay. So Matt Damon. Ooh. Foreign supremacy is... I mean, I kind of feel like you've got to include them, but I don't want to.

You tell me. Oh, I get to just pick? I don't have to... Yeah, I don't want to include them. I don't want to include them. Matt Damon out. Matt Damon out. Matt Damon out.

Scott Atkins in. I'm going to make sure everybody hits you on Twitter about this, okay? Listen, listen listen the thing is Matt Damon can be included in a bunch of other Hall of Fames

okay that's true Scott Adkins can't Scott Adkins this is his one shot this is this is his shot right now

this is like Eminem says you only get one shot at triple kicking somebody you gotta land it you gotta land it I loved when m said that at the super bowl at the halftime show that was great when he quoted that line about triple kicking dudes i enjoyed that okay here's an interesting one donnie yin donnie yin yes yes uh personal

personal favorite of mine okay personal favorite the it man series is so good he has a signature move i don't know what the official name is i've been calling it the gatling gun punch when he just fucking punches you 25 times before you hit the ground um he has that great that great scene where he like i think every action hero you need one where you're fighting a bunch of dudes at once he's got that um the he fought scott scott atkins in a movie i love how unbothered he is if you go watch his like fight clips when he's fighting just like he made a conscious choice this is going to be my thing when i fight is i'm going to not look like i'm fighting in the face okay he's just like but he's so fast yeah he has so sharp he has a serenity to his fighting style

that is very unique. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I agree with you. Like a subtext to it. I love how Rogue One, the Star Wars movie, exploited that too by making his character blind.

And so he almost was like channeling his calmness every time he had to do battle. Okay, I'm going to let you put Donnie in, but nine people are in and we got three left and they're three big ones.

So this is tough here. Okay, one is vin diesel are you familiar with vin diesel's work i've heard of his name i don't think i've seen any of his movies what was he what was he in he was in a bloodshot that was one yeah remember bloodshot he was in a saving private ryan yeah yeah yeah. Gotta deliver that letter. He did the voice of the Iron Giant. Remember that? The Pacifier? He was in that movie. I think if we... So here's the thing. Vin Diesel

can't... He's gotta take up two spots because if you put Vin Diesel in there, you have to have Michelle Rodriguez in there. They have to come as a pair. so are you willing to give two spots i mean no i mean i don't really like those movies as you know so i i don't want but but you know i also it's your worst thing i trust you and i believe in you and i always have and so if you tell me if you look me in the eyes over zoom on this podcast and you say to me,

we're creating a grave error if we put Zhang Xiyi and Scott Adkins in the Action Hall of Fame and we don't put Michelle Rodriguez and Vin Diesel in the Action Hall of Fame, I'll go with you. It's getting tough. It's getting tough right now. It's getting tough. Let's go through. We're going to finish the names. We'll make our list and then we'll kick some off at the end right now vin diesel and michelle rodriguez because if you just were like hey name an action movie okay anybody in america name one they're gonna it's probably you're gonna name a furious movie you know i would suggest that they would not be eligible individually if not for the fast franchise yeah that's true i so maybe we'll keep them as paired all right and keep bearing in mind this is a completely made up act and there are no ramifications for any of our work here so we're gonna do what we want ultimately two more names

second to last one is mila Jovovich who has been been the star of a great many Resident Evil movies has appeared in movies like in those ultraviolet and month the aforementioned Monster Hunter Monster Hunter yeah yeah and I

don't know I feel like she has emerged as a pretty dependable B grade action star she's of course married to Paul WSS. Anderson, who makes a lot of those movies. Where are you at on Mila? I like Mila a lot.

Really good fight confidence. I enjoy the Resident Evil movies. Sometimes you want to be a little bit scared while also watching somebody fight some stuff. Yeah. I'm all for it. I think she's a yellow. I think she's a yellow. I think she's a yellow.

All right. That means she's going to be out. It's tough for her. Okay, last one, and this one's funny to me because I don't really have a good feel for this at all. Jason Statham. Yeah. You got to have him.

You got to have him. Well, I don't know if you got to have him because we've got more than 10 right now. You got to have him? You got to have him. You gotta have him. Well, I don't know if you gotta have him because we've already got more than 10 right now. You gotta have him? You gotta have him. Just based on Crank? Based on Crank.

Based on Crank 2. Yep. The most statham-y movie that's ever been based on... So he has... Number one, he has the franchise.

He's got the transporter. Yep. He's got the like the weirdo action movie where it's just like, turn them loose, which is the Crank series. He did the, like, he did, I'm going to try and kind of be serious about it, the Guy Ritchie Wrath of Man one,

which is not that great of a movie. The score makes it so much more fun than the movie actually is. It just makes everything feel super intense. But he did that. He did Hobbs and Shaw. He's fucking hilarious and spy. As the like over eager spy.

He fought the biggest shark ever in the Meg. And put his like hands on the shark. I think we've had this conversation before. There's a difference between the Meg and Rampage. The Rock never put his hands on the shark. I think we've had this conversation before. There's a difference between the Meg and Rampage. The Rock never put his hands on the animals. Statham was eye to eye with the shark. Hands on.

The Meg is one of the only movies I've ever wanted to truly walk out of. Like I just got to put that out there. Are you going to watch the Meg too? Probably because I hate myself but yeah we spent uh i bought tickets for that i bought the like super imax ticket we spent like 98 dollars for my family to go watch to go watch the may uh the meg's not good but okay statham you're right he does have he basically has all the

pieces he also i mean he has good movies he's got the he's got a bunch of guy richie movies got the bank job you know he's got he's got um the parker movies that he tried to do snatch yeah he's italian job that was a big one yeah the one that he did where um oh what was it the mechanic yeah the mechanic i really i really like the mechanic him and ben foster together yeah it's a great pairing. He's appeared in the Expendables movies. You know, he's got a lot on his resume. He's an action movie hero is what he is.

Okay. And he knows it. Okay, so Jason Statham is in. So now we have to go through the very painful process of cutting names out officially. Okay, so here are the people who we've already decided are out. Christian Bale, you laughed at. Scarlett Johansson, you mocked me for. Robert Downey Jr., you basically pulled my pants down

on this podcast for even uttering his name. Chris Hemsworth, we had a spirited discussion about him, but he's not in for now. Hugh Jackman, you lauded his work as Wolverine, but otherwise he's out. And Matt Damon, I think you were just trying to make a point by dissing Matt Damon in this pod.

And I don't know what that point was, but Matt Damon is out. So that leaves us with 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16 people that we need to go through. You want to start with the yellows? You want to start with the greens? No, you know what I want to do? We should do the ones you know have to be in there. We do that first. So this is what I'm

going to do. I'm going to make a compromise here. We have to have Iko in there. I think Iko is going to be, he has to be in there and he's also going to make up for us not including Scott Adkins in there. Wow, you're cutting Big Scott. Yeah, I think so.

Because Iko is very much in that, like, they're all in the same sort of camp. Him, Michael Jai White, Scott Adkins, Tony Jaa. These are, like, that's a section of the internet that's a section of of movie lore and eco is the best among them okay so we have you know him being in there is like scott's pretty much in there too it shows that we respect that type of movie when you're not being excluded because we don't like what you do you know okay so you're saying eco is in and scott is out that's the first compromise there has to be more there has to be're saying Eco is in and Scott is out. That's the first compromise. There has to be more. There has to be more.

So Eco is in. You got to have The Rock. Okay. So The Rock has to be in there. Okay. Because of just the global star power thing. You also have to have Jason Statham in there.

Just because he, maybe more than anybody else, is like an action hero. Okay. But the, the rock is big. He doesn't do like, then do the action hero stuff that Jason Statham does.

So there's three. I'm going to move these guys in order so that we're following along closely. And then it gets, and then it gets tricky. So let's get you out of here. I'm making, I'm making notes on my list too. Okay.

Okay. So right now we've got, we've got eco UAS. I'm making notes on my list too. Okay. Okay. So right now we've got we've got Eco U.A.C.E. We've got Dwayne The Rock Johnson and we've got Jason Statham. That's three locks in place. I'm going to start throwing some names at you.

Charlize Theron. Yeah, let's do it. Okay. Let's do it. That means you're going to have to make a tough cut here. That's okay. I'm with it. I'm with it. Okay. Let's do it. That means you're going to have to make a tough cut here. That's okay. I'm with it.

I'm with it. Charlize is in. Charlize is in. That's four names. Yeah. Here comes the next one. Liam Neeson. Oh, my God.

I don't want to do this anymore. I don't want to do this anymore. You got to do it. You signed up for it. I have five spots left. One, two, three, four, five, six, seven. I have five spots left and eight names that I want to have in there. Seven names.

This is painful. Painful for you. I'm sorry. Yeah, I'll put them in there. God damn it. Uh-oh. You're in big trouble here. Okay, here's a tricky one. Angelina Jolie. I think Charlize is a better version of Angelina Jolie. Okay. So, same as how we got rid of Scott, Charlize is better.

Okay, I can rock with that. So then Charlize is in, but Angelina Jolie is out. Here's another one. Ryan Reynolds. I think the rock being in there makes up for Ryan Reynolds not being in there. I agree with you. If you told me that Ryan Reynolds needed to be in, but Angelina was out,

I would have gotten very mad at you. Yeah, yeah. That's not going to work. Okay. That's not going to work. Michael Jai White. Michael Jai White has to be in there. He's a lock.

People are going to look at this list and be like, you guys are on freaking cocaine. Because they haven't watched Undisputed 2. That may be true. I hate that. Oh, how can you say that? Watch the other movie, you fucking idiot.

That's how I said it. I watched the other thing. Tricky one here. Daniel Craig. Daniel Craig, he's not going to get there. Oh my God. He's not going to get there. Wow.

He's a great actor. He can do a lot of stuff. You just shit on every Bond fan. He'll show up other places. You's not going to get there. Wow. He's a great actor. He could do a lot of stuff. You just shit on every Bond fan. He'll show up other places. You shit on every Bond fan. Apologies. The Bond movies are awesome.

Gal Gadot. No. Superhero movies aren't going to make it and that's her. Nah. Her best role is Wonder Woman.

Tony Jaa. Tony Jaa. Oh my God. I'm going to end up having to pick between Vin Diesel and Michelle Rodriguez alright yeah Tony Jaa in okay so just to recap here this is important so people can keep track at home

Eco's in, The Rock is in Jason Statham is in, Charlize is in Liam Neeson's in, Michael Jai White's in Tony Jaa's in. Yeah. That's seven people. That's seven. You got three spots left.

Well, you got three spots. We're doing 10? I thought nine. No, 10. Nine. That would be weird. Oh, I'm golden. You're all set?

Why did I think it was nine? I don't know. So, Zhang Jieyi. You're putting Zhang Jieyi in? I am not. Okay. This is who I'm putting in. This is who I'm putting in oh we'll go through go ahead continue please well i mean there's only a few spots left here only a few spots it's matt damon donnie yin vin diesel michelle rodriguez and mila jovovich

i'm gonna go michelle rodriguez has got to be in there okay so there's eight donnie yin has got to be in there okay so there's nine so you're choosing between vin diesel and mila oh no you know i'm choosing between mila's out mila's out okay i'm choosing between vin diesel and matt damon well but i know what you're gonna do here what is like i see that's that's the thing though i feel like michelle rodriguez does what vin diesel does but she does it better than vin diesel okay so i'm okay breaking them up what we put her if we put her at the forefront what is happening right now you're taking if we put her at the forefront yes you're taking vin diesel out of the action hero hall of fame you the bard of fast and furious i love the movies this is how you know that this

is legit i love those movies but several years ago several years ago i wrote a thing about how michelle rodriguez was the secret mvp of the fast and the furious franchise i remember and i gotta i'm gonna stick with that that was years ago she's been i've been on team rodriguez since girl fight i i gotta i gotta do it i'm gonna do it blown away right now that you just you x'd out you x'd out vin and also imagine imagine if imagine vin's reaction to you putting the rock and jason statham in yeah and keeping him out because they're different it's different worlds it's different worlds i i'm not including any of the like fast and furious stuff it doesn't have to be included on the rocks resume to get it you can take it all off and he gets in you could take it off for

statham and he gets in vin vin diesel michelle rodriguez took your spot i'm sorry but he would he would be fine with it now let me just see if I've got this straight. So you're saying Matt Damon is in? I'm saying Matt Damon is in. Yeah. But the Bourne Supremacy movies are same as we're taking. Like a marking moment. We're doing a fast camera moving it all around type shit. Don't get me wrong.

I think this is the right pick. I'm just shocked that you made it. I'm trying to maintain credibility. I want to treat the Hall of Fame with the respect that it deserves. This is, we greatly appreciate this here at The Big Picture. The fact that you have these kinds of,

these kinds of ethics, I think is really profound. Let me just make sure we've actually got 10 here so we haven't made a big mistake. It'd be great if we only had nine. I'm going to, here's the list. Iko Uwais, The rock jason statham charlie's their own liam neeson michael jai white tony jaa michelle rodriguez donnie yen and matt damon the only white american on this whole list matt damon he's the only one no liam neeson's white he's not an american jason

statham's white jason statham's not an american yeah but it's i mean nah Liam Neeson's white he's not an American Jason Statham's white Jason Statham's not an American yeah but it's I mean what are we doing it's white it's I just said white American

okay yeah I like I like that list you feel good about this I feel good about I feel good about this list yeah

it's it's it's strong it's strong I feel like we can check off every kind of action movie we want every kind of thing we need with this group of people right here it's not too late to swap out jason statham for scott adkins if you want to do it i i don't want to i kind of want to now that you said it. I don't think you should.

I think people will look at this like you're an insane person. Yeah, I can't do it. I can't do it. I can't do it. But I'm going to, as soon as we get off this, I'm going to go watch a bunch of his videos on YouTube. There's, oh man, what's the name of that show where they talk to, they interview like stuntmen.

Have you seen this? It's on YouTube. No. Stuntmen React. That's what it is is is that what it is yeah that sounds right yeah uh i think that's what it is stuntmen react and there's one where they're they're sitting with scott atkins and he's just like he's such a charming and fun person and you can tell he just loves what he does. And I really enjoy watching him. I'm so sorry he couldn't be on here. I got him as close as I could. Interesting how you

completely betrayed him on this recorded podcast. I know. I know. Oh, my God. Danny Trejo never even got mentioned. Wow. I'm sure we forgot someone too.

Honestly, this was not a scientific endeavor. And so when we miss someone, people are going gonna be like, you screwed up big time, pal. Yeah, yeah. He should have got mentioned. Henry Cavill?

Nah. Okay. No, thanks. Just throwing that out there. Shay, where can we hear you, read you, learn about your life and world? Oh man, just type my name onto the internet with books and then just buy all those books that you find. Movie rap basketball those are my main things how is your your scott adkins biography

going it's almost done we're on the 17th pass it's 900 000 words they keep telling me i gotta get it shorter which i don't agree with so it's like the new Encyclopedia Britannica series, which just kicks. I really, really look forward to that. Shay, thanks for doing this. Always fun to chat with you about movies because I have no idea what you're talking about

most of the time. Thanks to our producer, Bobby Wagner, for his work on this show. He's the greatest. Please tune in to The Big Picture next week where my old pal,

Alex Ross-Perry, is going to come back. We're going to talk about Texas Chainsaw Massacre, the new one on Netflix. We're're going to talk about Texas Chainsaw Massacre, the new one on Netflix. We're also going to talk about the most disgusting, depraved, disreputable movies in movie history. We'll see you then. you