The Big Picture - The Five Most Anticipated Movies of the Fall Festivals. Plus: 'The Irishman' Is Almost Here ... and It's Three and a Half Hours Long | The Big Picture

Episode Date: August 29, 2019

Awards season is nearly upon us, and Netflix has landed on a rollout strategy for its big movies, among them the Eddie Murphy vehicle 'Dolemite Is My Name,' Noah Baumbach's 'Marriage Story,' and Martin Scorsese's hugely anticipated (and also quite long) 'The Irishman' (0:45). Then, with the esteemed Venice, Telluride, and the Toronto film festivals approaching, Sean and Amanda share the movies they're most looking forward to and what their festival showings will mean for the coming Oscar race (33:53). Hosts: Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to the Ringer Podcast Network. I'm Liz Kelley. With the NFL season a week away and the Ringer's fantasy football coverage gearing up, we have released our first ever Fantasy Football Hall of Fame. We assembled a panel of voters, including Bill Simmons, Cousin Sal, Robert Mays, Mallory Rubin, and more to induct the 25 best fantasy football players of all time. You can find the rankings by going directly to fantasyfootball.theringer.com. And for more fantasy football coverage, check out the fantasy football podcast on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Sean Fennessy. And I'm Amanda Dobbins.

And this is The Big Picture, a conversation show about unlocking the confusing world of the Fall Film Festival. Amanda, I wanted to have a conversation with you as we approach awards season. We're not quite in awards season, but we are approaching it about all the things that are coming. Now, I think if you were like me 10 years ago, some schmuck begging for change on the street, and you were like, the Toronto International Film Festival sounds so interesting, but I don't know how it works. I don't know how movies get in there. I don't know how it affects the award season. I'm just some guy looking at the newspaper and trying to figure out what movies are appearing there. And if you're inside this industry, or at least on the outer rim of this industry as we are,

you tend to look at it a bit askance. You tend to look at it a bit cynically and you see how these are chess pieces that are being moved around. So what I'm hoping we're going to be able to do here is talk about the movies that we're genuinely excited about, talk a little bit about how these things are programmed, how things appear, and hopefully unlock, as I mentioned, a little bit of the mystery around this stuff. How does that sound? Sounds great. I didn't know that we needed to be cynical in this podcast. I thought this was going to be a rare, I'm excited movie. It is. It is 100% an anticipation machine. There is a ton of stuff. And I'll say I'm going to Telluride this week for the Telluride Film Festival. TIFF is coming very soon.

The New York Film Festival is coming very soon. The AFI Film Festival is coming very soon. The New York Film Festival. There's so many things happening soon. Fantastic Fest, you up on that? That sounds familiar, but it always sounds too comic-con-y. So I never let the information into my brain. What is it again?

It's in Texas. It's in Austin, and it's more genre. So it's typically more sort of like horror, thriller, less superhero IP. Before we get too far, though, something interesting happened this week, and it's sort of related to what we're talking about, which is that Netflix decided to date the wide number of films that they're releasing this fall. Now, we've known and discussed a bunch of these films. We've talked about The Irishman at length. We've talked about Marriage Story at length. We haven't talked so much about Dolomite Is My Name or The King, but there's a bunch of movies here. And now all of a

sudden, they're upon us. Really soon, just this morning, we got a trailer for The Laundromat, which is the new Steven Soderbergh movie starring Meryl Streep and Gary Oldman, which in 2002 would have been the biggest thing in the history of movies. And now I guess it's just hitting a streaming service in four weeks. Well, is it hitting the streaming service in four weeks or is it hitting the theater in four weeks. It's a great point. It's a very great point. So I guess we need to explain a little bit of how this works. Obviously, last year, there was a great amount of contention around Roma and whether Roma would, should, or could play in movie theaters before arriving on the Netflix streaming service. It sort of did. None of the big theater chains presented Roma, but some of the smaller chains did. And the same is going to be true, I think, for most of these movies on the slate. And so what you have is these windows that Netflix has created, these one week or two week or three week or in a rare case, four week windows where you have to go out to a movie theater, though not your major AMC chain, to go find these movies. Or you can just wait a month and see The King and or see the laundromat or see marriage story what how do you

feel about that because you you're always saying most people aren't going to the movies because they can just get it at home soon and this is like a very clear demarcation of that exact idea yeah i think this is fascinated i'm really excited about this because i've been in a really rewarding email correspondence with my father for the last month about my dad's really into the streaming wars but somehow we wowed yes like honestly I the emails that I get from him it's just like subject line Disney and a financial times link and then it says love dad and that's it dad come on the big picture but but we have really been emailing back and forth because he's interested in from the business side and I'm interested in it from the industry side.

And last week, our conversation basically found its way to antitrust laws and why Netflix can't buy a movie theater and whether it should buy a movie theater. My understanding is that actually it can. It's not an antitrust issue. They actually did buy one. Yes. They bought the Egyptian here in Los Angeles. I think that whether they can or can't buy a movie theater chain is the big issue. It's an issue.

Then my father, who is an actual lawyer, seemed to think that they would probably be allowed to, but deemed it financially imprudent. And basically that they, he was like, I think they correctly judge. Again, my father doesn't work for Netflix, but that they judged that buying an entire movie chain would not be worth the price of winning an Oscar. That's interesting. There was a lot of conversation driven in part by the New York Times critic Manuela Dargis about the Paramount case and over the years, the way that the major studios were sort of broken apart, the monopoly that they created around the movie industry where they had what you're describing, where they owned movie theaters and they owned the means of production. And so they monopolized the the movie industry where they had what you're describing, where they owned movie theaters and they owned the means of production.

And so they monopolized the entire movie industry. There's been a lot of conversation over the years about whether Netflix was pursuing the same gambit. And the way that they have done so has been in a few different directions. One is to obviously flood the market with tons of product and to create a kind of heroin-like addiction to what they make every day. And the other way is to drive up prices and to overpay people and to bring in as much talent as possible to sort of like box everyone else out. I don't think though,

it's funny that these are the things that are driving some of that monopolistic conversation because these are not the things I would assume that have the most audience. These are not Stranger Things. These are not Bird Box. These are the awards prestige films. Yes.

And I think that I brought up the conversation or the point that my dad was making because it's like this story about when these movies are going to be in theaters and how long they're going to be in theaters. You and I and a lot of people treat it as like the clash of these two competing, these business models. But this is really the exception. The Oscars don't matter to the bottom line of either of these companies. And Netflix is trying to preserve its stranglehold on its distribution. And the movie theater, the movie theater chains are fighting for their lives because they are like probably basically going to be in extinct in five years. They're like CDs. I love CDs, by the way, just as I love movie theaters.

I know, you love DVDs also. I love physical media. I love physical experiences. Sure. Just saying. I like books. I collect books. That's my thing.

Anyway, but we talk about that clash the most when it comes to these Oscar movies and how long the Oscar movies will be in theaters. But it doesn't really matter to either of them. They're just fighting over a buzzword, I think, and something that will get people's attention. I think you're right. I've always been so fascinated by the idea of Netflix pursuing the big prize and then what happens after they get the big prize. Yes. You know, so will the thinking change if, and we haven't seen The Irishman and we don't know and maybe we'll see it, you know, it's supposed to premiere at the New York Film

Festival and maybe we'll see it before that, maybe not. This is probably the most excited I've ever been about their slate. I think that they have five or six movies that I am genuinely pumped for. And nevertheless, will movies like this be happening on their service in two years if the Irishman walks away with Best Picture? It's kind of hard to say. So it's kind of hard to know how seriously to take this kind of philosophical, capitalistic showdown that seems to be happening that your dad is just as interested in as we are. Right. And I think whether or not they're doing the Irishman in two years has nothing to do with how it does in the theaters, which is what's fascinating. That's right.

And we may never know how it does on the streaming service. Maybe they will. They've started selectively sharing streaming data in order to convince us that it's going well. And I suspect that they may share some of that throughout the Oscar season to try to, like, re-est that Oscar campaign. Yeah, and I remember this conversation happening at a similar time. The film that sticks out in my mind from the 2018 race was 22 July, which was Paul Greengrass's portrait of, I believe, the Norwegian massacre, the shooting that happened in that country. And very serious, very difficult film. I was not a

huge fan of the movie. And buried inside of a deadline piece about the way that Netflix was rolling these movies out were these really gaudy streaming numbers. Tens of millions of people had watched this movie, which was really the definition of a tough sit. Just an uncomfortable and difficult movie. It was well-made, but you wouldn't want to spend your Saturday afternoon

checking out the Norwegian shooting massacre. You know what I mean? I definitely did not. And so there was always this air of dubiousness, I guess, around how many people are actually engaging with this thing that they're trying to build another kind of energy around. And that energy is, of course, awards interest. Right. We're having the business conversation and the distribution conversation, which is very separate from the how you watch a movie, how you experience art conversation. I mean, the two things are related, but we can talk about preserving the theater

experience in terms of the way you connect to a movie forever. And I think you and I both feel that way. Here's an anecdote. Last night, I decided to rewatch Snowpiercer just because we'd been talking about director and getting ready for Parasite. And but it was like nine o'clock and I go to bed early. So I just decided to fast forward through all the really upsetting fight scenes, which is the most disrespectful thing I've ever said out loud. And I apologize. You've already seen it. It's OK. Yeah. But, you know, so I rewatched Snowpiercer. Did I get the full experience and the dread and the visuals? Like, no, I didn't.

I was like, oh, weird. Chris Evans was the star of this. I forgot that. That's 2014. Strange. And then, like, moved on with my life. So we should continue to have those conversations about how you actually consume and watch, like, art. I was doing air quotes. You can't see them on a podcast. But I think the theater negotiation is just about it's about money.

Do you think let's say you're not invited to screenings for these films and maybe you will be who the hell knows. But let's say you're not invited to a screening of The Laundromat. Will you go seek out The Laundromat at theley Theater in, I don't know, in Glendale or Burbank or where have you here in Los Angeles because you want to see the Soderbergh movie in theaters? I will, yes, but I am particularly excited for that movie. It kind of ticks a lot of my boxes. Would I seek out The King? I don't know. And I'm interested in The King and I'll definitely watch it. I would like to talk more about The King. I have some questions. We're going to talk a band that you like. You go.

It's an event. It's something that you maybe don't go as frequently as you used to. But for the things that matter, sure. Yeah, I agree. And I think that you and I have both gotten into a little bit of a lazy Sunday afternoon movie going habit where my gym happens to be literally right on top of the Arclight Hollywood. And so inevitably I go to the gym and then I just go sit in a movie theater for two and a half hours to cool down. Yeah, my husband has introduced something

called Twilight Golf into our lives, which like that's a separate podcast. But so he'll do that. I'd like to be on that podcast too. Yeah, and I go to the movies and it's fun. Yes, it is fun. Let's talk about some of these movies. We mentioned The Laundromat,

which is a sort of docudrama about the tale of the Panama Papers, which was this complex financial scheme that was revealed, was it 2013, 2014? I can't remember what year it was. It looks a lot like The Informant, which is Steven Soderbergh's portrait of another financial scandal in American history. And it's written by the same guy, Scott Z. Burns, who also has another movie coming out later this year with Amazon called The Report, which is also a docudrama, Scott Z. Burns, who also has another movie coming out later this year with Amazon called The Report, which is also a docudrama. Scott Z. Burns has a certain kind of interest in the mistakes

and nefarious deeds of people in American history. As I said, it also stars Meryl Streep. I'm pretty excited about this. This is also Meryl Streep's Erin Brockovich in a way. It has that vibe. And I don't know if you've seen the promo photo, but still they've been using as Meryl Streep's Erin Brockovich in a way. It has that vibe. And I don't know if you've seen the promo photo, but it's still they've been using as Meryl Streep in a bucket hat

investigating the Panama Papers. And let me just go ahead and say, there is, I'm against bucket hats. This content can be gotten elsewhere. But the one case in which you are allowed to wear a bucket hat in 2019 is if you're Meryl Streep in the laundromat. I'm psyched.

Detective Meryl is making a comeback from the big little live days. You love to see it, truly. You know, I don't know what else there is to say about it. I think it's fun that Antonio Banderas is in this movie too. He's about to be in the Oscar conversation for the next six months for Pain and Glory, the Almodovar film.

So after not seeing Antonio Banderas for a solid 10 years, he's now in two of the most anticipated movies of the fall. That's very strange. This movie does have, what is it, a three-week window, a two-week window? It's not the full month. So when it hits on the 27th, people will then be able to see it at some point in October. I want to say three weeks. Three weeks. I want to talk about Dolomite Is My Name. Okay. I've been hearing about this movie for a long time. It's directed by Craig Brewer, who made Hustle and Flow. And it stars Eddie Murphy as Rudy Ray Moore.

It's kind of a biopic. Yes. Rudy Ray Moore is the comedian slash kind of joke musician and star of the Dolomite films. Eddie Murphy has not been doing a whole lot lately. It was announced earlier this week that he's going to be hosting Saturday Night Live for the first time in over 30 years. Yeah, that was the flashing light, Oscar, Oscar, Oscar to me. That's exactly where I was going. Yes. Now, I don't know what to make of this movie. We've seen the trailer. It looks fun. It's got a great cast. The Eddie Murphy Oscar campaign out of the Netflix movie sounds

like a tough road to hoe to me. Sounds like it'll be challenging because Eddie doesn't like to do a lot of this stuff. You kind of have to prostrate yourself before the voting bodies. And Eddie Murphy's really rich and he's really sure of himself and he's really confident. And he hasn't spent a lot of time in the last 10 years putting himself in front of people. Do you? And we honestly have seen this movie before with Dreamgirls and he didn't get what he wanted out of that. Right. What do you what do you think is going to happen there? And I guess more generally, are you interested in Dolomite Is My Name? I'm interested in the Eddie Murphy of it all. I thought also the date of the SNL, which is December 21st, which is kind of late for SNL.

I don't remember them being that close to Christmas. It's true. It's pre-Golden Globes, basically. But it is squarely in the... My movie came out two months ago or a month ago on a streaming service, and maybe you watched it or maybe you didn't, but now it is Oscar season, and here I am. And it's also going to the heart of his fan base. And, you know, I think Bill almost had a heart attack when that was announced.

He was very excited. Yeah, in a great way. So I wonder if they will try to invent kind of an Eddie Murphy specific campaign and doing those high value targets. I think that this is the kind of thing that the Academy loves in terms of someone late in their career coming back out of nowhere or who you haven't seen in a while. Absolutely. It's a biopic. It's just in a lot of ways I can really see it aligning. Yeah. The other thing that I think makes this a really notable Oscar movie is it's written by Scott Alexander and Larry Karaszewski. Now, one, Larry Karaszewski is one of the members of the administration of the Academy. He's on the Board of Governors. Two, he's a tremendous advocate for movies.

He's a great follow on Twitter. If you love movies and movie history, he has a lot to share. Three, those are the guys who wrote The People vs. OJ. Those are also the guys who wrote movies like Ed Wood and The People vs. Larry Flint. They have a long track record of successful, slightly askew docudrama that has gotten awards attention in the past. Martin Landau, of course, won for Best Supporting Actor for his work in Ed Wood. Ed Norton and Woody Harrelson, I believe, were not both nominated for The People vs. Larry Flint.

They're in good hands here. And Craig Brewer also was recognized for a lot of his work for Hustle & Flow. So there's a lot of pieces in place. This movie is premiering at TIFF. We won't see it on Netflix until October 21st. It's hitting theaters, quote unquote, October 4th. This is a very interesting case to me of like, would anybody go see this movie in a movie theater? I'm not even sure it has the same level of emotional necessity that The Laundromat might have as a movie theater

experience. Even watching the trailer, I was like, this kind of looks like a really cool TV movie, which is not a diss. It's just different. So can you engineer an Oscar nomination out of that? I think it's a fascinating test case. I agree. I just don't think it matters whether people actually do go see it in the theaters, you know? You're right.

So they just, they have to be in the theaters so that they're eligible for an Oscar. You know what comes after that one? Does it have to do with your ancestors in any way? Who am I? The king? Oh, I thought you were going to that. No. Well, no, the king oppressed my ancestors.

I suppose the king technically, yeah. If we're going all the way back, if we're going back to the sub-1000 era. Yeah. 1000 AD, that's when my ancestors and the English were really working together. I have no idea at this point where we are. I also know too much about your 23andMe results, which is a third podcast. But anyway. Yeah, please subscribe to my Patreon for that.

The King Comes Out October 11th. It's from David Michaud, who is the director of movies like The Rover and Netflix's somewhat maligned War Machine. He was on the show actually for War Machine. That was probably the first movie that seemed like an authentic bid for prestige consideration. Coming from somebody like Michaud, who had worked with A24, produced by Plan B, starring Brad Pitt. The king has got Timothee Chalamet. He's playing King Henry V, is that correct? Yeah.

And he's playing him in sort of like in different phases. It's a kind of a combination of the King Henry V Shakespearean works, right? I believe so. I was going to ask you this because I knew that he was playing Henry V and then I watched the trailer and then I was like, okay, so this is just like subversive Henry V? Yeah. Are they using the actual text? Is Timothee Chalamet going to do the hipster St. Crispin's Day speech? Or is it just a comment on those texts and the history? Because this is also the place where the Shakespeare plays are, in fact, the history.

They are so close to the events that they mythologize to all of these characters. Yeah. So I guess it's working off of Henry IV Part I, Henry IV Part II, and Henry V. There's obviously a very famous Henry V adaptation by Kenneth Branagh, which is quite a good film. And this one I think is wider in scope. What that's actually going to mean and whether they will be sort of fiddling with the details of history is unclear to me. The movie is written by Michaud and also Joel Edgerton, who is his Australian collaborator on films like Animal Kingdom. And I don't know what to expect. There's some question about whether there is a gay romance in the film based on a shot that people are seeing that they couldn't tell if it was Lily Rose Depp or Robert Pattinson. Robert Pattinson is in this film.

It also features Joel Edgerton and Ben Mendelsohn, who's also a longtime Michaud collaborator. So I don't know if they're just sticking to the core text or if they're kind of fucking with the history a little bit. I can't figure it out. I have a hard time imagining because Robert Pattinson is playing the heir of France of in France right yeah so they're gonna really have to twist history in order to get uh Prince Hal and the Dauphin in a in a romance but maybe they don't actually I I'm I'm not a scholar of that era so I will say Joel Edgerton is a very unlikely Falstaff yeah I mean that's kind of what I'm

saying is that they are they trying to undermine all of the the goofiness and the the Band of Brothers inspiration that is kind of that the Henry V story. If anybody is interested in the Henry V story, I'm going to recommend a movie. Please write this down. It's called Chimes at Midnight. It's an Oscar. It's an excuse me, an Orson Welles movie in which Orson Welles plays Falstaff. He wrote and directed this movie, too. For years, it was out of print and hard to find. I think it was released in the mid 60s. And it was released, I guess, a few years ago on Blu-ray.

You could probably buy it on iTunes at this point too. Incredible movie. Incredible. Like possibly his third best movie after Citizen Kane and Touch of Evil. If you're interested in Henry V, check this movie out. I would guess it's going to be a little bit better than The King. That's all I'm going to say.

Okay. After that comes The Irishman. Here we go. Here we go. I don't, you know, show it to me already. I feel like I've been reading about this movie for three years.

That's true. It's three and a half hours, Amanda. I saw that. I have no comment. What if it's a great three and a half hours? It could be. You know, like, once upon a time in Hollywood, it was two hours and 40 minutes, and I was like, give me more. Yeah.

Three and a half hours is, like, really long. It is. It is very long. It is unusually long. I just start going into survival tactics of, like, what snacks am I bringing? When am I going to the bathroom? What time of day is best for me to be able? Like how to what yoga stretches will I do before and after to deal with the terrible seats? Like it's I and I just I don't really feel like I need to be thinking about my health and well-being

throughout the run of your movie. You know, let me give you some data points. You ready? Love, love data points. Three hours and 15 minutes. You know how Let me give you some data points. Are you ready? Love data points. Three hours and 15 minutes. You know how long the movie I'm referring to, that length? No. Titanic.

Three hours and 17 minutes. Do you know the movie? The English Patient? The English Patient is actually... It's close. Not here. It's not on this list.

Three hours and 17 minutes is Schindler's List. Three hours and 20 minutes. I don't know. Another movie made by a male director. The Lord of the Rings. The Return of the King. Yeah, that's fine.

3 hours and 22 minutes. The Godfather Part 2. 3 hours and 44 minutes. Ben-Hur. 3 hours and 48 minutes. Lawrence of Arabia. 3 hours and 56 minutes. Dances with Wolves.

3 hours and 58 minutes. Dances with Wolves should not have been that long. You know, I rewatched Dances with Wolves on a plane recently. It was a long flight. It's a long movie. That's not one of my faves. Gone with the Wind is three hours and 58 minutes. No, I know.

So it's not like we're not in completely uncharted territory. I agree with that. I just don't think that we should confuse length with quality. I agree. No one should do that across any medium. I agree. I am a person who believes in brevity and in getting things right. I don't believe in excess fat.

I believe in editing. I believe in valuing other people's time. And I cannot go three hours and 30 minutes without a bathroom break. So those are my concerns. I get it. The flip side is I sit through so many movies every year, like 300 movies a year, 275 of them. I'm like, I just wish this would end.

I just wish this would be over now. Martin Scorsese movie, haven't had one in a few years. I agree with that. I'd like to have a long one. How long was Silence? That was long too. That's the longest long movie of my life. That movie will have inevitably a different energy though than The Irishman,

which is kind of him more in his wheelhouse that people, I think, have a little bit more of a popcorn attachment to. Sure. Here's my thing. I said this to you earlier in Slack. I love movies. Really into movies right now. Really feeling it.

Yeah, they're good. Very excited about the movie season when they release all the good movies. And we're just like, yeah, movies. And I've also been thinking a lot about that with respect to TV shows where I'm just basically out on TV except for Succession. I'm post-TV. And one of the reasons I'm post-TV is just because it keeps going. And I'm just like, I wish this were over. You're on the fourth season of what? I absolutely not. And so I need movies to respect their great power,

which is freaking ending, you know? Respect the power that you have and use it. The Irishman will end at some point. I anticipate greatly getting a chance to see it and then getting the chance to sit through the entire film without doing any yoga stretches. A couple more movies, I guess. Atlantic's was a film, a foreign film that debuted at Cannes.

There's a movie on here called Earthquake Bird Starring, which I had never heard of. It's directed by Wash Westmoreland, who I had never heard of. Right now? It's directed by Wash Westmoreland, who I believe was one of the filmmakers who worked on Still Alice. There's The Two Popes.

Yes. Which is interesting to me and is a little under the radar at the moment. That movie is written by Anthony McCartan, who also wrote Darkest Hour. So I think we can expect

that kind of energy. It's directed by Fernando Morelos, who made City of God. And it stars Jonathan Pryce and Anthony Hopkins as two popes, the titular popes. Yes, and they're literal popes and not sports popes or other popes. They're not sports popes, nor are they new popes. They're truly historical figures. They are popes who fuck, as the internet meme goes? It's really, it's an open question. If there is pope fucking in this movie, I will be greatly surprised.

I'm not expecting it. That would be really a twist on the historical data. And then Marriage Story. Yeah. Sign me up. I'm in. Let's go. Saw the trailer.

I was like, yes, put it inside me. Fill me up. Okay. Yeah. I feel the same way. I just think it's going to be a real emotional journey for all of us. Bring it. And that's fine.

We're all going to get to know each other by talking about Marriage Story at great length. Absolutely. Bring a tears bucket. Yeah. No question. Have you heard Bill threatening the Kramer versus Kramer rewatchables? Yes. For all the CODs here at The Ringer?

Yes. Me, you, Mal, and Bill? Yes. The divorce club, as we are known here. And he and I were talking about Marriage Story, and then he also brought up Kramer versus Kramer. So that may be the most dispiriting, but also emotional experience that the four of us have had

since our parents got divorced. God, I hope it's not that intense. That's a little troubling. For anyone who has not been listening to this show, Marriage Story, of course, is Noah Baumbach's tale. I guess somewhat semi-autobiographical tale of going through a divorce while having children. It just, it looks renting and very good. And I'm just a longtime sucker for his movies. And it'll be interesting to see the efforts that Netflix puts forward to kind of help everyone remember

slash reevaluate if you believe he is or is not a great American filmmaker. Obviously, you and I do. We love a lot of his movies. Absolutely. I think that's the whole lot. Of Netflix movies.

Yeah. So many. It's a lot. It's a pretty good bunch. I would say there's like a high level of anticipation for at least four of these movies and a curiosity factor about

the rest. So we'll see what happens. They've already got a whole bunch of other stuff in motion for next year. They bumped The Last Thing He Wanted, Dee Rees' movie to 2020 starring Anne Hathaway based on a Joan Didion novel. So that'll be interesting too.

One would assume that that goes into the awards conversation for the following year. So it's not like they're not already loaded up again. Should we talk about the Fall Festival Anticipation Index? I'd love to. I made all my lists as you asked. I love to ask and receive homework. Yes. I asked you for five movies that are premiering at Venice, Telluride, TIFF, or the New York Film Festival. Yes. I asked you for five movies that are premiering at Venice, Telluride, TIFF,

or the New York Film Festival. Yes. And all of these festivals are going to be basically concluded by mid-October. Yes. By mid-October, we usually know, I think we have a rough idea of what the 12 real contenders are for the Oscars. Do you think that there is more than one movie that we've already seen that has a chance at the Oscars? We know about Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. The Farewell is the big question, right? We've talked about that several times on this podcast.

There's a lot of stuff here that makes me think The Farewell is going to have a tough, tough time. Well, the flip side is I just think they did a perfect rollout for The Farewell. And that campaign has been, is definitely targeted to me. I'm just really consuming all the Lulu Wang content, like all of it.

Great Twitter follow. But, and the Awkwafina of it all brings it to a younger Instagram generation that is possibly not voting for Oscars, but in terms of making sure that people see it, making sure that people understand what it is and what role it would play in the Oscar season this year and making sure that people remember it now, what, a month or almost two months after it's come out? Yeah, I think it's been about six weeks. I think that they are doing very well. And I mean, you know, that's not surprising. It's A24. But I remain optimistic. I think that's reasonable. I think it does really have to go toe-to-toe with 15-plus movies. Sure.

Some of which are from Terrence Malick that could be contenders. Some of which are from Todd Phillips making a superhero villain movie that could be a contender. So it's a really, it's a wide swath this year. The one thing that is missing, I think, and then we'll get right into our anticipation. I don't know if there's any blockbusters here. And I think the Oscars should be a little worried about that. You don't think there are any blockbusters

in the festival list or just on the... Well, I think the festival list, with the exception of Cats and... I mean, I guess Star Wars, The Rise of Skywalker. Little Women. And Little Women. Those are the three that have a chance to be big movies that are not going to be at the fall festivals

that could draw major attention to the Oscars. None of those three are a lock. I mean, Cats could be a fiasco. It's really hard to say how that's going to turn out. Skywalker, who knows? Is it hard to say? Anyway. We're definitely talking about that movie a lot here,

so I'm not worried about getting to that. But a lot of the stuff that is here is very interesting. And the fall festivals don't usually launch blockbusters, but, you know, I don't see a Bohemian Rhapsody at the moment. There's certainly not ahapsody at the moment there's certainly not a black panther at the moment right and i think that then there's not a there's probably not a star is born now star is born hit a tiff last year and then took off like a rocket in the first week of october and became one of the movie sensations of the year so as we talk about these movies i

really stoked for ford versus ferr. I don't know if that movie's going to do $400 million in business. No. And if it doesn't, fewer people are going to care about the Oscars. At least that's been my theory for years. So I'm kind of fascinated by that as I've been kind of compiling all my lists. Yeah, I don't disagree with you. And I did even notice in my lists that they are a different Amanda type of of movie but i just have a lot of people talking in rooms movies which i'm psyched about me too but that is that's even different from a star is born which still had movie stars and big concert set pieces and was like a a big loud movie so there is that aspect of it it does feel like a different movie year. It is also like

nothing's a blockbuster anymore. So that's that's just kind of baked into the conversation. And I think I don't think you're wrong that having smaller movies means that fewer people will watch it. I just kind of feel like we're there and we just have to set different definitions and expectations of what Oscars are, what the movie industry is. I mean, we are have to set different definitions and expectations of what Oscars are, what the movie industry is. I mean, we are going to be forced to redefine what the movie industry is. We're doing it every week. Yeah, in the last few weeks, I've just kind of felt like,

oh, we're here at the change that we have been anticipating for so many years. And I think we're kind of here. I agree. The kind of movie that could have been a Star is Born-like hit is The Irishman. You know, that's the kind of movie. The Departed was a big movie hit. It was a big mainstream. A lot of folks went on a Friday night to see it. And this movie, even though a ton of people are going to see it, probably more than have seen perhaps any Scorsese movie ever, which sounds ludicrous to say, but given the amount of subscribers that Netflix has and the way that they're going to be platforming that movie, just in terms of sheer eyeballs, they may reach more people than ever before. But it's not the same.

Somehow it's not the same energy. And so I guess— I'll just say one really obvious and, like, rude thing. Sure. The Departed had Leonardo DiCaprio and Matt Damon. Sure. And this is— This movie's got Joe Pesci. What are and Matt Damon. Sure. And this is...

This movie's got Joe Pesci. What are you talking about? Sure. Pesci is back. There's a generational thing that I'm trying to highlight here. Yeah. No, there's no... You think the Anna Paquin heads are not coming through?

I don't know. Okay. Because we'll just have to wait and see. Give me your number five anticipated film. Okay. I just want to say I did a top five as requested. I also have categories for honorable mention and curious about. Just, you know, I wanted to... your number five anticipated film okay i just want to say i did a top five as requested i also have categories for honorable mention and curious about just you know would you like to share those

original cat because i can share mine as well for honorable mention and curious about yeah well let's do the top five first because then we can just buzz with the others number five is as previously discussed the laundromat i mean meryl streep in a bucket hat doing her own erin brockovich everybody's having a good time. Beach scenes. Steven Soderbergh. Thank you. Great.

Not in my top five, but put it inside me just like all the other movies. That's Adventist and Tiff. Yes. What's number... I guess I'll do my number five, which is Uncut Gems, which is maybe going to be a Telluride. The thing about Telluride is that we don't know what's on the lineup until the day before. So I'll be on a plane headed to Montrose, Colorado, and then I will find out what movies I'll be seeing.

It is not in any of my three categories, but I hope for you and for your Telluride experience that it is at Telluride. I know it means a lot to you. I mean, there's just too many things in this movie for it not to be very important to me. One, of course, is Adam Sandler, a person who I always want to make good movies,

even though he insists upon not making them frequently. The Safdie brothers, whose movies I love. You know, Kevin Garnett's in this movie. Lakeith Stanfield, our sports pope, Mike Francesa is in this movie.

Eric Bogosian, Idina Menzel. Okay. Why is Idina Menzel in this movie? I don't know. She's a Jewish queen. She is. And I think that's what she's playing in the film. I think she plays Sandler's wife.

It's shot by Darius Kanji, who is really one of the great living cinematographers. He shot Okja. He shot The Lost City of Z. He shot The Immigrant. He's worked with James Gray quite a bit. He shot Panic Room. He's like a straight up genius. So this movie's going to look great. Can I ask you a question? Of course. Do movies like this like give you any sort of existential angst just in the sense of like it's so for you and has so many of your things that it's a little strange? and like maybe do you do you feel

like you're part of a community when you see something like this or do you feel like oh my tastes are not my own ah wow that's complicated the latter part of that is really complicated I think it mostly makes me feel like Thanos great where's like, of course my plan worked. Okay. Of course the design was perfect. I've arrived at this moment just as I imagined I always would.

I am inevitable. I don't want to acknowledge the Thanos part of it, but I think the rest of that is pretty true. So congratulations. You're right though, in my darkest hour,

I may struggle with realizing what it means to get exactly what you want. I think we all struggle with getting exactly what we want. And maybe I won't like the movie. I mean, maybe it won't be what I want at all.

But anyway, my number five is Uncut Gems. I'm really looking forward to that movie. Number four. This seems disrespectful that this is number four. The Truth. I'm so excited about this. I am so excited about this. So this is from Hirokazu Kurieda, who obviously did Shoplifters.

And Catherine Deneuve, Juliette Binoche, Ethan Hawke. And I believe the plot is that Catherine Deneuve plays an actress who writes a memoir, and then her daughter, Juliette Binoche, is mad about it. Or I don't know whether she's mad. Who knows what happens? This is the Amanda zone. I was just like, oh my God.

You should watch this movie in a hot air balloon. I know. I mean, and again, like, your tastes are not your own. I was just like, Jesus. I know. I know. It's great. This is his first film outside of Japan.

And Corrieta, of course, total genius. The Shoplifter is one of the best movies of the year last year. I'm very excited about this as well. I don't know. I guess this is going to be at Venice and TIFF, I presume. I don't know what kind of release we're going to get. I don't even know if it has an American distributor yet, honestly. So it may not even be a 2019 movie.

That's possible. Oh, well, okay. We'll have to prepare for that. That's going to be true for some of the stuff we'll talk about here, especially I think some of the sort of we're curious stuff. Some stuff has distribution, some doesn't. Some have defined dates that they're coming out. Some don't.

There are some movies that are in the kind of green book or a Star is Born execution, like Hustlers, which is coming out very soon. Yes. But it's premiering at the Toronto Film Festival. And then there are others that we're not totally sure where they're going to go. The Truth actually is apparently sold to IFC, according to what I'm reading. Okay. So then we more than likely will see it this year. I don't know how that will work for foreign film film if it will be submitted from France, from Japan. Kind of hard to say. I would suspect also that Portrait of a Lady on Fire, which is probably in my top 10, though not my top five, which is Celine Sciamma's movie, which was a huge hit at Cannes, is more than likely going to be the French international film submission. So we'll have to see what happens with the truth.

I'm stoked about that one too. My number four is Ford versus Ferrari. I've talked about it a bunch. I don't think there really needs to say much more. James Mangold, the director I love. Two tremendous movie stars. Period piece. It's going to look great.

It's going to feel great. I really like James Mangold. I like the movie stars. It feels real Oscar- great. It's going to feel great. I really like James Mangold. I like the movie stars. It feels real Oscar-y to me. Very Oscar-y. In the positive and negative sense of that as well. So I will see it when it comes out. I think that there is a very interesting

Once Upon a Time in Hollywood kind of double feature there about two guys at the end of an era who represent something, who are losing something, feeling a fall between their fingers, very American. Anyway, I'm just putting that out there. For those of you who are booking- I look forward to your essay. Please file it before 11 at night so that when I edit it, I have some time to actually give some notes. I'm just here for my repertory brethren who need to book double features. If the

Metrograph is listening, please go ahead and grab that one. Number three. Knives Out. Yeah. You mentioned this last week with Wesley.

This is going to be a TIFF. This is Rian Johnson's movie. Now, in a just world, this actually is one of those kinds of movies we're talking about that is like pop and also maybe even

an Oscar movie. I don't know if it's going to be. Probably not. I don't think so because this is like a I'm part of a community. This is like my interest set, but I'm also aware

that it is so my interest set that it's probably not other people's. And I just feel lucky that Rian Johnson wanted to make a murder mystery with Daniel Craig

and Chris Evans. Thank you, Rian Johnson. Like, I really appreciate you. This is uncut Dobbins. Yeah. I'm great. So it'll be great. I'm excited.

What am I on number three? I guess Marriage Story. Wow. My number three is kind of, it's kind of waving around a little bit. Okay. Where's Marriage Story going to be at not, if not at number three? Number two or number one. Okay. It's very high on my list. Okay. I'm very, very excited. Yeah. Okay. What's number two for you? Parasite. Yeah. You know, I was supposed to see it a couple weeks ago and I missed it. I still haven't seen it. I think I'll see it this weekend.

I mean, I am extremely excited. Me too. A colleague of ours, I won't name him, I do believe illegally downloaded this film and watched it. I'm not going to do that. Well, I'm definitely not doing that. I mean, I'm disrespectful enough to fast forward through Snowpiercer, but I'm going to go see Parasite in a goddamn theater and be excited.

Yeah, I showed the trailer to my wife and she got very, very excited by the Hitchcock vibes, too. It's got a real kind of paranoia thriller thing going on, so that's great. I wrote down number two, Dark Waters, which is a movie that we have not yet discussed on this show. Dark Waters is the new film from former Big Picture guest Todd Haynes. And there's been a great air of mystery around this movie for a long time. I think it's because it didn't really have a title. I think it only arrived at the Dark Waters title officially like a couple of weeks ago. So, I mean, here's the logline on the movie, which is coming from Focus.

A corporate defense attorney takes on an environmental lawsuit against a chemical company that exposes a lengthy history of pollution. Now, that is not the description of a movie that you would think would come from Todd Haynes. It's not really his style to do a kind of, I don't know, issues-oriented docudrama. Now, I guess if you describe the plot of a movie like Safe or Far From Heaven, you might be like, oh, well, actually there is something kind of thematic and down the middle about it. you see the movie it's much much different much more art house much more personalized vision the movie stars mark ruffalo and ann hathaway among a whole bunch of other people tim robbins and victor garber and bill camp i think it's just a curiosity factor that has it so high on my list and there is a like look out for this as the dark horse winner

because it's going to be about something that is going to be quote unquote important right so maybe not and i love todd haynes's movies but even aside from the general aesthetic interest i have i'm just sort of fascinated to see how this hits is there a release plan in terms of when it is coming out i believe it's november 22nd okay which is very Oscar-y as well. Yes. That was right around the Bohemian Rhapsody kind of release time. Though I'm curious whether mysterious release works at all for movies anymore.

Like, it is the end of August, and I knew that Mark Ruffalo and Anne Hathaway were in a Todd Haynes movie that we didn't know a lot about. But even I had to have that moment jogged of like, oh, that movie. And is it, are you too late in late August? It's a really good question. I mean, we can look at kind of what the Thanksgiving slate's going to be, the 22nd and the 27th of November. These are the movies that are coming out. 21 Bridges, not an Oscar movie, but a Chadwick Boseman movie.

A Beautiful Day in the Neighborhood, of course, which is also premiering at TIFF. Dark Waters, Frozen 2, Knives Out, Queen and Slim, which is a movie that is, I think, premiering is the kickoff movie at AFI, Melina Matsoukas' new movie, and The Two Popes. All of those movies are all coming out within five days of each other. So that's pretty noisy, and you got to cut through to kind of emerge. And I think you kind of need three to four to five months of name recognition and anticipation just to get people to see your movie at this point. I completely agree. It's going to be a challenge for them. But, you know, Anne Hathaway is famous.

Todd Haynes is a master. We'll see what happens. There is always one like, oh, you got to see this. Exactly. Number one. Marriage story. Hands down. I mean, I don't need to share anymore now because I'm going to share too much in the see this. Exactly. Number one. Marriage story. Hands down. I mean, I don't need to share anymore now because I'm going to share too much in the coming months.

I'm extremely excited. If I see it on Friday or Saturday, should I say nothing? That's a great question. You're not too bad about spoiling things. I know. I respect spoiler culture. I guess I don't. Could you imagine, like, how would one spoil marriage story?

Well, I mean, that's the thing is that the only way that you could spoil it is either being like, I was, like, devastated by it, or I wasn't as devastated or connected to it as I wanted to be. And either will affect how I experience it, so don't tell me anything. What if Thanos shows up in the after-credits sequence? I will honestly be impressed that Noah Baumbach sold out that much. So, and I hope that he bought like an extra nice townhouse with that money. My number one is Waves, which is a movie that Wesley Morris raved about here on the show last week. Trey Edward Schultz's third film. It stars Lucas Hedges

and Sterling K. Brown. It is not a musical, which is something we were led to believe for a long time, but apparently is just more a story of a family and something traumatic that happens to that family almost immediately after we recorded that podcast last week a24 announced a release date and the fact that it would be at fall festivals and that it is now officially a part of the yeah for lack of a better term award season wave wesley he knows what he's talking he knows what he's talking about um you know i'm stoked i'm pretty sure there's gonna be a telluride like you know it's no one's confirmed that but it certainly seems like it's obviously going to happen it's also going to be a tiff we should say dark waters is going to be a tiff a marriage story i think is doing the trifecta

i would guess it'll be a telluride and i'm it will definitely be a venison tiff uncut gems telluride probably and tiff ford versus ferrari probably telluride tiff parasite probably Telluride, Tiff, Parasite, probably Telluride, Tiff. They're hitting all the spots. It's happening. It's happening. There's a few other, there's actually a lot of other movies here on the list. I mean, I just made like kind of a running list for us to look at. And there's a lot of stuff that I think you're going to be like, get this the fuck out of here. And there's gonna be a lot of stuff you're gonna be like, I'm interested. Yeah, I told you I have honorable mention and curious about. I'll tell you my honorable mentions. Dig in.

At Astra. Absolutely. I honestly thought about putting this in the top five. I love James Gray and then the Brad Pitt moment. I'm living in it. I want to swim in it. This is fantastic. The pit pool.

Yeah. Hustlers. I'm excited about that. Saw it and loved it. Can't wait. Jojo Rabbit. Yeah, this would probably be number six for me. Yeah. Iustlers. I'm excited about that. Saw it and loved it. Can't wait. Jojo Rabbit. Yeah, this would probably be number six for me. I'm fascinated. I don't really know what to expect, but there's been a little bit of like bullshit controversy around it already because people don't get Taika Waititi's tone sometimes. I'm looking forward to that. That'll definitely be a tiff. I don't think it's going to be a telluride. As I said, Hustlers will be a TIFF.

And then also my honorable mention is Pain and Glory, because everything I've heard is that it is both peak Antonio Banderas and really major Almodovar, which is exciting. Yeah. It's been a few years since we had a major Almodovar film, and this one sounds super autobiographical. I think the movie is literally about a filmmaker who's sort of passed his prime. So that'll be exciting. I remember they had a couple of other ones. I certainly am quite fascinated by Motherless Brooklyn. And I'll definitely be seeing it. So that's in you're curious about?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm looking forward to it. I'm a long time Ed Norton stan. Like going back to high school, I was like, this is the guy. Like we got our Brando when he hit the scene. So I've always been a believer. That's what I'll say.

I would like to quote a Sam Donsky tweet here, but I won't. So let's just keep it. Okay. Well, maybe you guys can go hunt that down for yourselves. What else is in your, what's I guess curious about? So the king is in my curious about Wasp Network,

which I think that the U.S. release is still undetermined. This is Olivier Assayas' new movie. Yes, our friend and blog expert. Also starring Penelope Cruz. Yes. And then, do you know about Burnt Orange Heresy? Did you read about this? Can you, let's break it down a little bit.

I didn't even put it on the list, but yeah, it's notable. Speaking of just kind of like the tic-tac-toe of interest. So this movie is, is directed by an Italian director, Giuseppe Capotondi. I did my best, but starring in it, Clay Spang,

Clay Spang, I don't know. Apologies if I didn't do that. Yes. Pronounce that correctly. Elizabeth Debicki, Donald Sutherland, Mick Jagger, filmed on Lake Como in Italy, and is about an art heist and the underworld.

Wow. I was just like, wow. Did I not make this up? Someone else did? I can't believe that didn't make it to your top five. That's only at Venice, right? Yeah. I just don't know enough about it.

It was one of these things where I was going through the list. I believe it's Closing Venice. Yeah. And I was like, huh, I wonder what this is about

that investigated. Well, they do like to close with an Italian film. It's possible. I don't know a lot about the filmmaker's work, so I'm not an expert. That is an interesting cast.

It's been a minute since Mick Jagger's been in a film. Yeah. You like Mick Jagger as an actor? Sure. Okay.

I'm curious about a lot of stuff. I'm very curious about First Cow, Kelly Reichardt's new movie. I'm hopeful that I'll see that over the weekend. You know, I'm definitely curious about Lucy in the Sky, which I know that you did not have a strongly positive reaction to. I have not seen the full trailer because I started the trailer and I heard Natalie Portman's Southern accent and I turned it off. You know what? I am not. I don't pull that I'm Southern card very often. I don't know what that shit was. Also, does she have to be Southern?

I think it well, it's based on a true story about the woman who fell in love with another astronaut. And I remember the sensational story, but I think that we could probably, it's a film. We can take some license so that Natalie Portman doesn't have to embarrass herself with this accent. I thought she sounded great. I'm on the record about Natalie Portman. She's a queen. I think that she's also a queen, but she's not this kind of queen. Yeah, it could be a stretch.

As I said to you in private, the premise of this movie is i really want to fuck john ham yeah so i think that's gonna work out okay that's just my take now it's from noah holly who people may know as the creator of fargo and um the tv series and is i guess relatively unproven as a film director so this will be a test like desire is what i think of when i think of his work or frankly natalie portman's oeuvre. Maybe it's ultimately not about desire. Okay, well. What else is on this list here?

You know, there's a bunch of movies I don't know a whole lot about that I've seen mentioned quite a bit. The Climb is one of those movies. This is a cycling drama that was made independently that apparently is quite good. There's a lot of good buzz about it uh seberg which is a jean seberg uh biopic kind of about the uh actress played by kristen stewart who was kind of ensnared in an fbi scandal in the 1960s sure yeah why not um have you followed much of the conversation around the aeronauts no but that's the... I was about to say it's a Tom Hooper movie, but it's not. But it just

feels like it would be, which is so disrespectful. But it is... That's Cats. I know, unfortunately. It's Eddie Redmayne and Felicity Jones back together again. Correct. This is a movie that Amazon is releasing. The release date has moved around a couple

of times. It's meant to be a big, grand-scale, widescreen adventure. It's an IMAX movie. They're hot air balloonists? Sure. I don't know. Yes, that sounds right. The movie, I think, is going to Amazon

two weeks after its release in theaters. So we had this Netflix conversation. Amazon is starting to play with this too. The same will be true of The Report, the movie they're releasing in November 15th. I think two weeks later, it's hitting Amazon Prime. So Amazon is shrinking the windows even further and limiting the box office potential of their films.

But a movie that is about hot air balloon adventures in IMAX on Amazon Prime I'd like to clarify I've googled it two notes number one the director is actually Tom Harper so I wasn't that far off and I sincerely apologize to Tom Harper sorry Tom and uh number two it's apparently a survivalist hot air balloon drama oh so I don't know how that changes the visual scope of it, though. It's just like maybe them, I don't know, like weaving baskets for two hours, which would make more sense on an Amazon screen. That sounds terrible. Also, apparently there's a scientific experiment element to it. Okay. Here's the thing. I basically don't believe, I don't care about theatrical windows

because people aren't going to go, if someone's going to go see it in a movie theater, they're going to go see it in a movie theater now. And if they're not, they're not. And they'll watch it at home. And I just, theatrical windows are something that is made up by the theater company lobbies in order to protect their business. And they have every right to protect their business because otherwise it definitely would not exist anymore. But like, who cares? Why wouldn't Amazon make it available to as many people as quickly as possible? I agree. I mean, that made a lot of sense for the report because I think the desire to get that movie in front of a lot of people for a long period of time. And there was some feeling that

like Black Panther, for example, being available to you on iTunes or on Netflix when voting was happening was meaningful. I guess we're in kind of an in-between stage with this stuff, you know? I think the concern is that ultimately Amazon would just not make it available in theaters because they own it and they don't need that money. And they're probably losing money putting it in theaters in some respects. And that's a loss if all of the companies who own this stuff just decide that it will no longer be available in theaters. But we're already kind of operating on their goodwill to an extent anyway of how they decide they want to release it anyway. So, you know, we just have to hope that they continue to do it in ways that that we enjoy.

A couple of more movies. Just Mercy. Just Mercy is also, I think, in that category of like, could this come out of nowhere and win it all? There was a pre-fall festival screening of the movie this week. I did not attend. This movie stars Michael B. Jordan and Brie Larson, and it's about Bryan Stevenson, the civil rights attorney. And it's directed by Daniel Destin Cretton,

who made Short Term 12, and who is the forthcoming director of Marvel's Shang-Chi. Also a docudrama, also about a meaningful issue. Also a little bit of a mysterious rollout going on here. This movie's going to be a tiff, and then I think it comes out in December. I think it's a Christmas release. I've seen it percolating a little bit of a mysterious rollout going on here. This movie is going to be a tiff. And then I think it comes out in December. I think it's a Christmas release. I've seen it percolating a little bit.

I would agree with you. I'm curious. Yeah. You know, I don't think we're not forging new land here by saying that this might be an Oscar movie, but it feels like we haven't talked about it a whole heck of a lot, but I sense an energy building around it. So we'll put a pin in that and we'll talk about it when we get closer. And then the last thing is Joker. Oh God,

I actually had forgotten that we didn't talk about it. There's a new Joker trailer today. This is Todd Phillips's something, something. Is it a re-imagining? Is it a continuation? Is it a reboot? Is it a sequel? Is it a wholly original tale? I don't know. I don't know. It stars Joaquin Phoenix as a guy who wants to be called Joker. That's all we know. Yeah.

It's premiering at TIFF. It is. Let me say something. One, Todd Phillips and I are from the same town. Two, he's made a lot of good movies that I like. Three, most of them don't look like Joker, but that's let me say something one Todd Phillips and I are from the same town two he's made a lot of good movies that I like three

most of them don't look like Joker but that's okay I like somebody going out of their comfort zone trying something new and he's been edging towards darkness you may recall

War Dogs Jonah Hill Miles Teller 2015 comedy I don't know that I recall it but now that you say it it exists somewhere in the back of my brain

sure that's a movie that was sold as a comedy but is much darker than that if you watch it. And also features one of the all-time flex Bradley Cooper cameos. You know, at a minimum, I'm curious. I would say for the movie itself, I guess I'm curious. I mean, I think Joaquin Phoenix is a great actor. Some of those Todd Phillips movies are funny. I'm also just kind of like, why are we doing this?

We literally did this 10 years ago and Heath Ledger won an Oscar for it. It seems even within the realm of we reboot things all the time and everyone adds their comment and superheroes or they did like modern mythology or whatever. This seems a little soon so it's a movie i'm curious i'm wholly uninterested in the discourse i i essentially don't want to participate and it's difficult because we have this podcast but well whether it i think for the most part you won't have to participate unless it has that kind of whiz-bang, holy shit, this movie is an Oscar contender feeling out of tiff, which is possible. It's possible that people see it and they're like, my preconceived notions have been shattered or they've been exceeded.

And this is now officially an important movie this year. And then we got five months of it. Yeah. That's one of the ones where I don't trust those people. I will determine that when I see it, which I will see it. What do you think is going to win the audience award at Toronto? It's always something terrible, right? Well, I think the last five Best Picture winners have been TIFF audience winners.

Right. But that means, well, no. Green Book, Three Billboards. No, Shape of Water. No, but I believe that Three Billboards did win at Toronto. You're right. And then Shape of Water won. They've all been nominated. Excuse me. Yes. So what is the movie that has a simplified understanding of American politics that will be the Oscar controversy all year long? Because that's what will win the audience award.

I really don't know from this group of films. It's very hard to say. I mean, Ford versus Ferrari is the kind of movie that could win. It's kind of flashy. It's kind of a throwback. You know, I don't think I think Joker is actually going to be quite divisive. So I don't see that happening. Yeah. It's really hard to say. I mean, maybe a movie like Knives Out, which I don't think necessarily shotguns it into into the Oscar conversation, but that could be a crowd pleaser of a sort. Yeah.

I mean, maybe this is a place where Parasite gets a chance to get in there. Probably not. I mean, here are the winners in recent years. Last year was Green Book, of course.

The year before that was Three Billboards. The year before that was La La Land. The year before that was Room. The year before that was The Imitation Game.

Twelve Years a Slave. Silver Linings Playbook. You know, that's almost 10 years of lockdown Best Picture nominees and in some cases winners, you know? Yeah, I could see something quieter, like even Marriage Story going for this because Marriage Story is ultimately about divorce. And like you and I are talking about how it's our personal story, but what like half of the world now at this point can relate to that central narrative in some way. And I think that has value in an audience award. I don't know. We'll just have to wait and see.

We got to send a quick shout-out to one other thing premiering at the Toronto International Film Festival, which is Briarpatch. Andy Greenwald! Shout-out to Andy Greenwald, co-host of The Watch, close pal of ours showrunner and creator of Briarpatch

a forthcoming television show that is premiering at TIFF mind-blowing shit it's amazing you saw the trailer? I did did you see the animal that's in the trailer?

there were a couple I thought there's a key one there's a giraffe a giraffe my favorite animal and also someone golfing with something that's not a golf ball

I think it was a beer bottle. Yeah. I just, I wish nothing but the best for Briarpatch and for Andy. I hope it wins some awards at TIFF. That's very exciting.

Any parting thoughts about the fall festival culture? Well, so you said at the beginning that awards season has not started yet. But when does it start? Is it Friday?

Well, it starts for the big picture next Wednesday, which is when you and I will be doing the first episode of the Oscar show. Though, honestly, this was really an Oscar show if we think back. But yeah, we'll kick off with the Oscar show again. We'll bring back some of the categories, some of the approaches that we do. I'll tell you guys all about the stuff I saw at Telluride and what I thought.

I'll tell Amanda what she should and should not see, what will enrage her and what will delight her. I won't listen to any of it, but that's fine. I'm my own woman. I guess you're probably right. It probably begins precisely tomorrow when films start screening in Venice. That is when it all officially starts going down. Can I just share something that I feel about this? I've decided that I'm really into just all the movies being good at the same time.

I know we complained about it all year long and we've spent like the last nine months being like they don't release any good movies, even though they have. They've released some movies that we really enjoyed. A couple. But it's exciting. It's like movie season. It's like back to school.

We're going to focus all our attention for a few months and everyone's going to talk about it. And I am excited. I'm pro the consolidation. This will be a portal of positivity and enthusiasm and maybe slight skepticism. Is there any movie that's going to emerge? I guess we won't know the answer to this, but as the wife of 2019. I already said, where'd you go, Bernadette? But we saw that. We're still talking. Well, I know, but it just. It needs to be something that

we are sort of half ignoring. I'm sure there will be, but that's the thing is that it's already been in theaters and gone at this point because the wife was literally in theaters in August for two weeks and then went away. And then you and I, that's the other thing. You and I tried pretty hard to see the wife. That's true. And we were not able to. Did I tell you that I met the fellow who sent me the screener of the wife? No. He came to a reading that I was participating in, introduced himself. Lovely guy. Thank you so much for doing that. Yeah, well, hopefully someone will be able to identify to us a movie we haven't talked about.

Right. That maybe we should be talking about immediately. So maybe we leave it in the hands of the listener. Should we? Anyway, we'll discuss. We'll see you soon. And I'll see you soon, Amanda, when we're back with the Oscar show next week. Thank you.