The Big Picture - The King of Physical Media. Plus: The 10 Best Blu-rays of 2024.

Episode Date: December 11, 2024

Sean is joined by longtime playwright, actor, screenwriter, and physical media collector Tracy Letts to discuss his career and how he became such a fervent collector of physical media. They discuss what got them into the lifestyle, the state of their collections, what it has taught them about being a cinephile, the best physical releases of 2024, and much more. Host: Sean Fennessey Guest: Tracy Letts Senior Producer: Bobby Wagner Video Producer: Jack Sanders Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Ends January 31st, 2025. Complete offer eligibility criteria by March 31st, 2025. Choose one of five eligible charities. Up to $500,000 in total contributions. I'm Sean Fennessey, and this is The Big Picture, a conversation show about physical media. I am joined today by a legend in the game, the acclaimed playwright, actor, screenwriter, a Pulitzer Prize winner, a Tony Award winner, my friend, and perhaps more than anything,

the king of all physical media, Tracy Less. Hello, Tracy. Hi, how are you? It's such a goddamn pleasure to be on The Big Picture. Such a pleasure. It's such a goddamn pleasure to be on The Big Picture. Such a pleasure. It's such a pleasure to have you. I've asked you here because we were connected by our mutual friend and absent brother in physical media, Tim Simons. Timothy, not able to be with us today.

You know why? Why is that? He's too big. He is getting a little big for his britches. He's too big. He's on this Netflix show, and it's a sensation, and he's blown us off. How do you feel?

I feel like, do you know that now they no longer call him Tim Simons in the casting offices and at the studios? What do they call him? Hitmaker. Truly. Not the Hitmaker, just Hitmaker. Yeah. We have the show.

Nobody wants this. In fact, we're going to call it Nobody W. Yeah. We have the show. Nobody wants this. In fact, we're going to call it Nobody Wants This. Get me hit maker. He has really, he's elevated every property he's been a part of, but it's amazing what he's doing now. For a streamer too, you know, not for a company that produces physical media. He's doing it for, I'm not going to say the enemy, because you're a working actor as well.

Oh, no, no. There are no enemies. There are no enemies. But, you know, will there be a 4K edition of Nobody Wants This season one made available in Walmarts around the country? No, they don't really do that. I do want to talk to you about that because I do have one edition that I enjoyed that came from a streamer. But anyway, you're here because, honestly, when Tim and I started doing these episodes a couple years ago.

Hitmaker. Hitmaker, excuse me. When Hitmaker and I started doing these episodes a couple years ago. We used to call him Secret Sauce, but it turns out that referred to something else. He was Jonah from Veep to most people for many, many years,

and now he is Certified Hitmaker. And Tim knew I had a passion for this, and he knew you had a passion for this and he knew you had a passion for this. I don't think I know the story of how you guys came to know each other. I don't think that was ever shared with me. Is that something you can share publicly? He and I became friends on the movie Christine, Antonio Campos movie. He and I are both in that film and we became friends because nobody else would talk to us. But so we got along. I know that's not true. The nerds who got along with each other.

And then at some point, he knew about my collection. And some point a few years later, he just kind of popped up and said, I'm thinking about getting into this. Do you have any words of wisdom? So I shared what I knew about it. And the next thing I knew, he was on your goddamn podcast talking about physical media. And I wrote to him and said, how is this possible? You just now started doing this. And you asked me, and then I said, you didn't even mention my name. And he said, I thought you'd be offended. I was like, no, of course not. So that's how the introduction got. I mean, I honestly had a somewhat similar mentality where I was like, can I exploit this relationship with Tracy?

Can he come on the show to talk about this? Because in the hallowed circles, you are considered someone who has a really profound collection. You have a real passion for collecting movies. And when we first met, I was curious about your cinephilia, your interest in movies. Obviously, you've been a playwright and a screenwriter, but when does the relationship with movies start? Were you five years old as a kid?

Yeah, it starts really young. My folks were both English teachers, and the house was filled with books and records. They put a real emphasis on culture and the arts and creativity in our house. Christmases were all books and records, Christmases, right? And yeah, we saw a lot of movies. The folks took us to the movie theater a lot and they weren't modern parents in that they didn't necessarily take us to see just kids fair. I remember vividly them taking me to see Serpico when I was six. My boy is six right now.

I have a six-year-old and a three-year-old, and I can't imagine taking him to see Serpico. I think, as memory serves, they actually took me to see Dirty Harry, but Dirty Harry, uh, was canceled that night and they were, uh, previewing Serpico at the theater. Wow. Folks were like, wow, look at this Serpico. And I sat in the front row of the movie theater and watch Serpico. So there were, and we, you know, I grew up in a time when drive-in movie culture was a real thing. And the town where we lived, a small town in southeastern Oklahoma, had one movie theater downtown and two drive-in movie theaters. The Ship, which had a great old neon schooner out front and the Skyview, which was a pornographic drive-in. We called it the Skinview locally because you could see it as you're driving down the highway

into the city. Obviously, the drive-ins eventually went away, but we were regulars at those theaters and in those drive-ins. The only movie I ever remember my folks taking me out of was Taxi Driver at the drive-in when I was 10. Do you remember how far into the movie it was? I remember exactly. It's when Iris took Travis back to her fuck pad and my mom turned to my dad and said, I'm uncomfortable. We rented a car. Was it that they wanted to expose you to more mature themes? Anybody who has seen one of your plays staged, perhaps,

knows that you're unafraid of the transgressive. Did they want you to see those kinds of things? Or was it just that at that time, it was more common for kids to be exposed to the cinema of Sidney Lumet. I think they wanted to go to the movies. Uh-huh. And I don't think they wanted, I think they loved their kids and also didn't necessarily want to pay for a sitter.

So they just took us to a lot of shit. Yeah. And there was not a lot of, it wasn't like now in terms of kids' fair. We got the occasional bed knobs and broomsticks, but Disney was at a real lull in its history when I was a kid. And of course, I'm from the last generation where we went to see the new John Wayne movie.

When John Wayne movie came out, we went to the movie theater to see it. When the James Bond movie came out, we went to the movie theater to see it. So I grew up on that kind of stuff too. But they were also cultured. And I saw The Go-Between at a drive-in movie theater. Oh, wow.

That was back in the news last year when they used the score to that film, right? In the Todd Haynes movie. And I knew it immediately when the Todd Haynes movie started. I was like, that's from The Go-Between. That's so funny. So did that make you, you think, a sophisticated movie consumer? Or was there ever like a dip where sort of after your adolescence, you didn't care about movies? Or were you addicted from the very beginning because of those experiences?

I was always addicted. My older brothers, I have two older brothers, they were more into music than movies. They liked movies, but they were not the freak that I was. My grandfather took me to the drive-in when I was six, again, to see Frankenstein Must Be Destroyed and Dracula Has Risen From the Grave. These are Hammer movies. Yes. A double feature of full sentence Hammer titles. And we used to do those kinds of things. And oh my God, what an impact that had on my life. So I was always way, way into the movies. My dad also being an English teacher at this

small college in Durant, Oklahoma, he taught the only film class. So I would go to his, he would let me go as a little kid to his film class to see Battleship Potemkin or Nanook of the North or sort of the staples of film class. And how old were you watching those things? I was a kid. Like 11? Yeah. Okay. All right.

I was a kid. That's interesting. Cause that, I mean, you know, for me personally, my exposure to all of those things was film class was 19, 20 years old. Having Battleship Potemkin imprinted on you at a very young age, I assume, like informs, breeds, like an intense appreciation

for things. Is that fair? I think so. I also remember a time when my dad did a, he did a summer seminar at University of Texas. And so he was going down

to the UT campus for about six weeks and he took me with him. I was about 13, so this was early 80s. And the UT campus at the time had so many screens on campus and also commercial screens just off campus. But every day I was seeing three movies on big screens. I saw Gone with the Wind in a packed movie theater, North by Northwest, packed movie theater, to see how those things worked in a full theater, right?

Because they were designed to work in a full theater. The timing of some Duck Soup, Night at the Opera, I saw in a packed theater. That time is really vividly imprinted. And City of Women, the Fellini movie, was just out. And for me, that was a real mind blower. That was like a, oh, I didn't. It was that moment where you go, oh, I didn't know you could do that. I didn't know you could break the rules like that. I mean, it's not Fellini's best, God knows. But for a kid who had never seen a

Fellini movie, it was mind blowing. So does that mean you knew you wanted to get into the world of filmmaking because of your love for these movies at these ages? I wanted to be a wide receiver for the Minnesota Vikings. But it turns out I didn't have any athletic prowess or size at that time. But at least you have Justin Jefferson now. Yeah, that's true. You can at least appreciate what a true wide receiver looks like. By the way, how is it possible that we've gone this far into this conversation

and I haven't given you an opportunity to talk about Soto? I've recorded an episode just this morning and I shouted him out already today. And I'm happy to do it again. Juan Soto is a New York Met. This is one of the best things that has ever happened to me in my entire life a player that I have always loved now the last time this happened it was Aaron Rodgers a quarterback not maybe not a man but a quarterback who I'd really loved watching play I'm sure he ruined many a Sunday for you as a lifelong Vikings fan yeah I hate Aaron Rodgers but he was he was a magnificent quarterback and when he came

to the Jets I was quite happy because it's been a hard time. And I probably oversold my excitement there. And it's coming back to bite me. I pray to God the same does not happen with Juan Soto. I'm elated. Honestly, Tracy, it's great news. It's great to be with the right billionaire sometimes, you know? And I feel like in this case, we are with the right billionaire. What about the rotation? They'll figure it out. They still have a lot of money to spend. They've got a very savvy president of baseball operations. I'm really not worried, honestly. Lindor Betts, here's the thing. I'm a Cubs fan. Can we go down this road for a second? Go ahead. Yeah, we're potting. I'm a Cubs fan, and so I hate the Mets.

And I not only hate them, but I consider Mets fandom a kind of moral failure. Okay, that's deeply unnecessary on my show. I mean, when I think of the New York Yankees, I think of Mickey Mantle. And when I think of the Los Angeles Dodgers, I think of Koufax. And when I think of the New York Mets, I think of Lenny fucking Dykstra. What about Tom Seaver, Tracy? That's not the first person who occurs to me. All right.

Well, we have icons too. But I have to tell you that I've moved to New York a couple of years ago. My feelings toward the Mets have softened. Now, I'm still a hardcore Cubs fan and I still root against the Mets, but my passionate hatred for the Yankees has never been stronger. And because of that, I have to delight in the Mets sticking it to the Yankees by getting Soto. So, is it because you've been exposed up close to the Yankee fandom that you flipped so hard on the Yankees or was this just a lifelong distaste that the Mets seem nicer by

design? I've hated the Yankees my whole life. I just hate them more now that I live in New York. That's great. We welcome you. Also, you've become a friend and I don't like long droughts. I don't think it's good for anybody. I don't think it's good for the soul. And how long has it been since you won a World Series? It's been 38 years now, and it'll be 39 at the beginning of next season. Do you remember the last one? I was four years old.

So I remember the energy is what I recall. My dad was very, very happy at that. So that gets into father-son shit. So how am I going to root against that? Also, I'm a big Lindor fan. I think he's... How could you not be? I think he's a fan.

How can you be a baseball fan and not be a fan of that guy? Yeah, no, he's wonderful. And I'm so happy he has a running mate. And I have nothing bad to say about the Cubs. I rooted for you guys to win the World Series, to break that curse. And I have nothing bad to say. I'm a lifelong Cubs fan

and Vikings fan so fuck everybody shall I toggle back or do we do more sports we can do as much sports as you like I'm honestly game I'm a sports caster

that never was in many ways you know obviously you become this huge cinephile and you set out to have a career in the arts.

And how did that go? Was that hard? Was that easy? Having a career in the arts? Yeah. It's incredibly hard. So tell me about why it was. Because I feel like it intersects a little bit with how you start to become a collector, right?

So when I was 15, I did my first play, a community theater play. And I was bitten by the bug early. And so I did a lot of community theater. I didn't have much of a high school theater, but what there was, I did. I did one sort of drug-addled semester at college, and I did theater there. But I just got very deeply involved in the theater and in storytelling for the theater. I had written a couple of screenplays. They weren't any good. I tried to get them made. Moved to Dallas when I was, after my semester of college,

I moved to Dallas for a couple of years and worked in the theater in Dallas. But it's not a great theater town. There is Dallas. But it's not a great theater town. There is theater there. It's not a great theater town. Were you working as an actor at that time? Were you trying to get plays staged? What were you doing? I was working as an actor.

I had not written any plays at that point. I was trying to, you know, they were making a lot of movies in Texas at that time. They were touting it as the third coast and they'd built these sound stages out at Las Colinas. And they made a hell of a lot of TV in Dallas and in the surrounding areas. That's the time of Tender Mercies and Places in the Heart and all these kinds of movies that were made in Texas at the time, La Bamba. And so I was trying to work in film and TV and I was failing. But I had a girlfriend who was going up to Chicago because Steppenwolf Theater Company had become nationally and internationally known because of some productions

they had taken to New York. The True West they made for PBS with John Malkovich and Gary Sinise. I mean, it became a real destination point for a lot of actors who, for whatever reason, didn't want to go to New York and Los Angeles, who maybe wanted to just do some good theater. And so I was part of that immigration to Chicago in the mid-80s. So I was fully invested in the theater. Now, again, forays into film and TV, but Chicago's just not a place

where they've ever made a lot of film and TV. A lot of people have come from there and maybe have gone back there, and some have even made lives there. But still, when they shoot the bear in Chicago, they're casting from New York and Los Angeles. They're not casting much out of Chicago. So if you're in Chicago, Dennehy used to say, if you're in Chicago, you're here to do the work. You're not going to make any money. You're just here for the work, which is because Brian Dennehy constantly went back to Chicago to work on stage. So it was a great theater town, but not a film and TV town. But I remained a fan and I continued to write bad screenplays and try to get things done. How many would you say you've written?

How many bad screenplays? Half a dozen. Okay. Not like 50, half a dozen bad screenplays. Was there ever a point where you thought, this isn't going to happen and I should stay in Chicago or I should continue on this track and this will be where I make my life forever? Well, so after about 11 years in Chicago, I moved to Los Angeles in the fall of 1997. And I was 32 years old. And I thought as an actor, I thought I was, well, I was a character actor slash leading man. I played those parts in the theater. I got to Los Angeles and found that wasn't the case. And I couldn't get arrested.

I mean, I came here and I did some things. I did a Seinfeld episode. I did a- Very good episode. I did a Drew Carey show. I did these weird fucking guest stars on Profiler or Pretender. I can't even remember these. Sure.

I didn't really know what I was doing. Network TV you were being cast in. I was being cast, character roles and guest starring parts, network TV. I wasn't even getting auditions for series regular kinds of things. Still writing at this time? Still writing. Now, I had had a couple of plays in Chicago that had been successful, Killer Joe and Bug. They had been very successful for the American theater, but still a kind of cult success.

They never played theaters larger than 100 seats. Okay. They never made me any real money, more money than I was used to making, but never any real money. Was there any thought to catapulting from the notoriety of those shows to screenwriting work, that kind of like for hire style work? Well, when I came to LA, I took a lot of those meetings, but to this day, I don't know what I was thinking or they were thinking. I don't know what I was doing in those meetings. I remember going to Disney, and I think it was Disney, where I had a meeting. They were making a baseball comedy called Mr. 3000. I think they eventually

made the movie. I believe Bernie Mac is the star of that movie, right? Yeah. Years after I took a meeting on it, by the way. So this had been floating around Disney for a long time. So they had me in to talk about rewriting this. And I was like, have you read Killer Joe? Have you read Bug? And the guy I was meeting with actually came around the desk and he sat by me in the chair and he showed me a sheet of paper and he had written on the sheet of paper, there was a series of names. And he said, see, these are all the people that I told I have to meet. And after I meet them, I put a check mark by their name and then I've met them and I'm done. And I was like, oh, okay. So I, in other

words, my being here is to just put a check mark by the name on your list. And he said, yeah. What a brutal industry. But okay. So demythologize that just for a second. Is that because you have an agent who has a relationship with that studio and they're like, I've got just the guy for you. And then you step in like John Turturro and Barton Fink and it's all confusing. Like, why does it happen? I don't know. If you don't know, what hope is there for any of us trying to understand how this works? I don't know. I met with somebody who wanted to remake Willy Wonka. Again, years before they did remake Willy Wonka. And I was so naive. I said, you know, there is already a movie

of Willy Wonka. It's in color. It's in color. It's pretty good. It's pretty good, yeah. That's very funny. So you're in Los Angeles. You're getting the network TV work. This is around when you started getting into this, right? It is. So I moved here in 97 with a girlfriend. She died four months after we got here. Her name was Holly Wontuck. There's no way in a podcast I can do credit to her, her life, the impact that had on my life, continues to have on my life.

Within a year, I was in another relationship with Sarah Paulson. It's public record, so I don't mind saying it. And she's a, she's a dear friend of mine now, but I should not have been in a relationship a year after this death. I was grieving. I was desperately sad. My career wasn't going anywhere. Uh had left an artistically satisfying place in Chicago where I wasn't making any money. And I had come to Los Angeles to find that I had no currency as a writer. I had no currency as an actor. I remember vividly sitting in a movie theater watching the talented Mr. Ripley and seeing Jude Law and Matt Damon and the talented Mr. Ripley and seeing Jude Law and Matt Damon and the talented Mr. Ripley and going, oh, that's not going to happen for me, right? I think most

artists have that moment, a moment where you go, oh, the thing I dreamed about that I thought about, it's like, I have to adapt. You adapt or you just, maybe adaptation means getting out of it completely. For me, it meant focusing on other things. So I was not in a good way when I was in Los Angeles, even though when I eventually went back to Chicago, they said, well, why'd you come back? Seemed like you were doing all right. And we saw you on Seinfeld. You know, it's like, yeah, it's not enough to feed the soul.

So it was in that state of mind that I started to see a shrink in West Los Angeles. Is this too? I'm loving it. All right. So I'm seeing the shrink in West Los Angeles, and I don't know how the talking cure works for you if you've ever taken it, but for me, it always changes the world, right? If I go in feeling bad, I leave feeling maybe not better, but altered. If I go in feeling good, I leave feeling bad pretty invariably. So I would always get out of my shrink session and just feel very off kilter. And my shrink was right by cinephile video, which I believe is still there, still by the New Art Theater. Yeah. Yes. And they had eclectic sections, movie sections, not the straight sort of drama and comedy of Blockbuster,

but Nasty Nuns or, you know, Trouble on the Highway or whatever the fuck. Great curation. Yeah. Yeah. And they had a Jollos section. I had seen a couple of Jollos. I had seen a couple of Argento movies, but I didn't realize they were part of this sub-genre of movie. So I got interested in these Jallos and these Jallos became a kind of post-therapy cooling out. It was so nice to go see my shrink, go to Cinephile, rent a giallo,

go back to my place, watch the... Paulson, I have to say, had no fucking idea. He was like, what the fuck are you looking at? What is this? Like Italian garbage you're watching. You're putting a blade in the dark in front of her. Yeah, it's confusing. I watched everything on the shelf. I got a book called Blood and Black Lace,

which is also the title of a seminal Mario Bava. Make a book later in our conversation. Make. And the book is a Jallo film guide. We should probably say what a Jallo is. I've discussed it on the show before. It's an Italian style of thriller horror film that features several significant tropes. Probably the most memorable is the black gloved killer wielding a blade of some kind, often murdering women.

But there is a sort of whodunit mystery aspect to these films. There is a kind of opportunity for extraordinary color, often the color red, hence the title of the kind of film. And they're sort of like heavily influenced by American and British films. And then those films have now heavily influenced a lot of American and British horror movies in the last 30 years or so. Right. Huge influence on De Palma. Giallo is the Italian word for yellow.

A lot of the mysteries that came out in paper back in Italy had yellow covers on them, which is why it wound up with that title. Anyway, so I get this book, Blood and Black Lace, which is a Jallo film guide, 200, 250 movies that might be classified as Jallos. And I just made it a goal to see all these movies. Well, it was the nascent days of internet shopping. And so trying to track down these films, I got some weird DVD-Rs and crappy videotapes from London.

Now, I was still broke ass for the most part. And so I didn't even have a credit card at that time. I had to get a friend to use his credit card to buy these movies online. And he's buying titles like In the Folds of the Flesh. And he's like, am I buying porn for you? And so I would write him a check. So that's really the beginning of the collection. I started to fill a shelf with some of this Jalo stuff. Moved back to Chicago. My relationship with Sarah ended and I moved back to Chicago in 2001. I took a literal vow of

poverty. I mean, down on one knee, I am going to go to the city that I love to make the art that I love where I felt most fulfilled. I know I will never get paid for doing that. It's profound. Yeah. And I moved back to Chicago. The first thing I did when I got back was a production of Glenn Gary, Glenn Ross at Steppenwolf Theater directed by Amy Morton, great late Mike Nussbaum playing Shelley and a wonderful actor named David Pasquese, a dear friend of mine who was playing Roma. And it was the time of my life. What part did you play? I played Williams in The Office Manager. I've never seen the film. Is it Spacey in the film? Yes. It's a great part. It's an undervalued part in the thing. And I just had the greatest time doing that. And it totally justified my

decision, I felt, to go back to Chicago. At the time, I was living at 40 East Oak, which is a nice address. It was a partially furnished studio apartment. I'd put all my shit in a storage cube. So all I had was suitcase with clothes, three cats, and a fork. It was all I owned. I remember combing my hair with that fork before rehearsals for Glen Geary. Wow. This is a truly monastic era of your life. It was. And during this time, I mean, because it was partially furnished, it had a little TV and it had a disc player. And I was in a Tower Records in Chicago and Contempt, the Godard film, was on the shelf. And I remember doing the calculations.

Like, is it worth it? Not cheap. How much was it at that time? Do you remember? $29.99? Something like that? I think you're right on the money. Was this the Criterion edition of that movie?

It was. Just out, as I recall. And I bought it. And that was really it. It really began there. Now, the collection over time, there have been lulls. There have been long periods of time where I haven't contributed at all to it. August Osage County sort of blew up my vow of poverty.

And suddenly, I had a lot more resources with which to, so I would say the collection probably doubled at that point, and then probably doubled or trebled after the pandemic, really kind of exploded with the pandemic. Interesting. So just for some context, you mentioned that when Tim did the first episode where we talked about this, he was at the beginning stages of his collection. Hitmaker. Hitmaker. Excuse me, Hitmaker. When Hitmaker and I spoke, and then the second time he came back, he had really gotten the bug.

Now, I have been a collector my entire life. I know you have as well. I would say I was kind of shadow collecting for many years, but not with a heavy focus, sort of like acquiring DVDs as early as 1997, 98, but not thinking of myself as someone building a library per se, just getting stuff I wanted. And then something clicked 17, 18, 19, probably correlating to when I started doing this more for work. And correct me if I'm wrong, because you've been in the game longer than I have, but it does feel like roughly in that time, something also clicked in the space where the amount of things that were available, the way that they were being crafted and marketed changed, and it became closer to a proper collector's hobby instead of,

I got to get this disc, I got to get that disc at Target, at Walmart, at Best Buy, at what have you. And now I feel like we're in this bizarre glory period if you like to do this. And so I assume that when it doubled and tripled during the pandemic, part of that was because you were being super served with something that was maybe not as available previously. Yeah. I think there are a lot of reasons for it. Certainly, the ability to buy, to purchase on the internet, right? It's like you can do all of that shopping on the internet, right? I got a credit card, right? Like you can do all of that shopping on the internet. I used to have to go to Amoeba. Yeah. Right? Yeah. I got a credit card.

Right? So. During the pandemic was your first credit card. I got my first credit card at 43 years old. That's crazy. So, I think, I think all of that is true.

I think that's right. I, I recall the early days of collecting. I was collecting movies I wanted. That's sort of what I'm saying. This was stuff I wanted as opposed to what I felt I's right. I recall the early days of collecting, I was collecting movies I wanted. That's sort of what I'm saying. This was stuff I wanted as opposed to what I felt I should have. Right. But another thing that happened is just the explosion of quality. Yeah. It's one thing to look at these Jollos when they're shitty DVD-Rs that have been shipped to you from London. And it's another thing to see them in on Blu-ray or 4k. And you look at them and you realize,

well, people worked really hard on this. This isn't just like Italian shit show. Just like let's show up and, you know, uh, kill naked ladies, uh,

cinema. People worked really hard on these things. And the, the screenplays are sometimes really thoughtful, really convoluted. I mean, bizarre and ridiculous, but also sort of operate in this weird moral gray area. And it can be quite transgressive. And the, yeah, the art direction, cinematography is some, sometimes it's, try checking out that 4K of Blood and Black Lace, man. That is a fucking work of art.

Yep. It's really something. So I think that's another reason for the proliferation. You sit there and you look at these and you go, oh, some of these movies that were sort of crappy, guilty pleasures for me are actually really good. Mm-hmm. are actually really good. Okay. So then let's talk about the amassing of the collection and how you go from making decisions versus feeling a sense of obligation.

Because now, your collection is very large. About 10,300. And you track everything that you've acquired? I do. And is that in a spreadsheet? It's on an app.

It's Collectors with a Z, CLZ. So they're getting an acknowledgement here from me. Where you actually scan the barcode of the movie and it enters all of the information into a spreadsheet. So when you say you've got 10,300, first of all, obviously, staggering number, incredible. A stupid number. I mean, it's a stupid number. It's aspirational. If you can do the math,

I could conceivably watch five movies a day and get through them all before I die, but I'm not going to do that. I was going to ask you that. I mean, you and your wife are known for watching a great number of movies, tracking them over time, sharing them on social media, saying, here's what we watched. Of those 10,300, are they, they're not all individual films.

Are there duplicates of a number of films in different formats? Most of the duplicates have been weeded out. Sometimes I keep them because there'll be some special features on one that are not on another. Okay. A few for sentimental value, but not many. How do you store these guys? What do you do? Is there a room with an extraordinary series of shelves?

I have a lot of shelves. And you have access to everything? I have a lot of shelves. Is most stuff present in your home? It's all in my home. All available to you at any given time? It's all on a shelf in my home. Is the room climate controlled?

Yeah, sure. Is there natural light in the room? Natural light. Yes. Sunlight able to make its way into the space. No. Is there a screen in the room where you can watch things? All of the movies are in two rooms.

One of the rooms is the theater where the screen is. Okay. At this stage, we have this, you know, there's this evolution. There's VHS, Laserdisc, DVD, Blu-ray, 4K, UHD, Blu-ray. Yeah. For some people listening, they're like, I just want the movie. I want to spend $9.99 and get the movie on DVD or Blu-ray. I don't care. In the last 10 years or really more, five years or so, 4K has taken a huge step forward. A lot of titles are now being made available in that format. Some of

these movies look so much better, to your point about Blood and Black Lace being elevated to this format. Are you only buying 4K now? Are you, how do you make decisions with? I buy 4k and Blu-ray. Occasionally I'll buy a DVD if that's the only way I can get the film that I want to see. Okay. But that's very occasional. Do you have a list of wants? Are there things that you're like, I, I I'm waiting to get this or I'm waiting for this to be made available to me or? Well, I have a list of things I wish they would bring out. I mean, why do we not have a Paul Mazursky 70s box? It's insane.

Why not? I don't get it. I know. Last Stop Greenwich Village, what are we doing? Why do we not have a- What are we doing? Yeah, I agree. Harry and Tonto.

I agree. Everybody bitches about Art Carney winning the Academy Award over Al Pacino. It's like, maybe if we watched Harry and Tonto, you'd realize why he won that goddamn award. It's on DVD, I think. It is, and I own it on DVD, but I would like... How about Paul Mazursky's Tempest? A greatly underrated movie. I saw it a couple years ago on the Criterion channel.

It's fantastic, that movie. Why is that... Come on. Come on, somebody. Well, that's an interesting thing because obviously as your collection grows, I assume you have increasingly obscure titles, but the Paul Mazursky movies made for the studios in the 70s and 80s are not obscure titles. I don't get it. And so it's very confusing when there are huge swaths of movie history. Like

The Heartbreak Kid is a very famous example because it's currently owned by like a medical supplies company. So there's no way to kind of disentangle the ownership of the Elaine May movie from that. Somehow they found their way to becoming the licensors of that movie. Right. I have that on DVD too. I do as well. But when it comes to stuff like that, that you're talking about, you know, these movies are made for like mgm and and columbia isn't a lot of it music rights some of it for sure um so when you're making your list is it because you know that these are movies you've seen and love or is it because you have a vast knowledge of like the movie libraries in cinema history and you're trying to fill out those libraries yeah i'm not trying to fill anything out okay so what So what drives it at this point then? The labels.

The individual labels and the work that they're creating. I mean, I'm talking about the Blu-ray labels and the work that they're creating. That drives a lot of it. I mean, there's a real focus on genre work from some of the labels, and they can do a great job of sort of upselling you on a bad movie in a nice package. But the truth is that some of the work that some of these companies putting out, not only great movies that we're seeing, I mean, you're seeing so clearly for the first time i mean for the first try watching mccabe and mrs miller on a 24 inch tv uh tv broadcast i watched that vhs 1970 i mean and then try watching the 4k mccabe and mrs miller it's a different experience for that matter uh try watching underground railroad watch the first five minutes of underground railroad on Blu-ray.

Something I brought in just special today. And then watch the first five minutes of it on Amazon. You watch this and you're going to say, oh my God, that's a work of art. And you watch it on Amazon and you go, oh, that's a TV show. Yeah. So do you try to watch as much as possible then in these formats? Like, will you still stream TV? We do stream TV. I mean, we work in TV. I hope to work for Amazon. I just trashed.

But we do work in TV. We like working in TV. Plays are better than movies and movies are better than television. It's just the truth. I knew you would get there at some point in this conversation. So you store everything in your home. Now, you play golf, right? I do. You're pretty good. I'm okay.

You and Hitmaker, he's pretty good too. No, he's good. He's playing pro-ams. He's better than you? He's quite good. Yeah, he's much better than me. And you're also, what are you, 43? 42, yeah. 42 years old and hit makers around the same age.

So, you guys have enough self-awareness to know that nobody gives a shit about your golf game. Nobody cares. I've tried to avoid discussing it on this podcast. Nobody cares about your golf game. Maybe the guy you play with cares only because he wants you to care about his, but no, you know, not to bring it up even in polite conversation because nobody cares about your golf game. That's how I feel about the display of Blu-rays. Nobody gives

a shit. Why do they look? Nobody needs to see your- I have to correct you. I hate to correct you. You're like a wise, gifted, and thoughtful person who's been very kind to me, but you're wrong because here's how I know. When I curate a screening at a rep theater here in Los Angeles

and do a meet and greet afterwards, there are some very lovely women, but it's a lot of men. And those men, they want to chat. They want to say, hey, thanks for doing this. I appreciate it.

They want to shake my hand and they want to show me a photograph on their, hey, thanks for doing this. I appreciate it. They want to shake my hand and they want to show me a photograph on their phone of their Blu-ray display. And how much do you care? How much do you care? Well, as an ambassador to this hobby.

You feel like you have to care. But what I want to do is have empathy for the experience that they're having that I also enjoy and that I'm frankly fascinated in with you as well.

Like I'm asking in part because it's a sick thing. You pointed this out frankly fascinated in with you as well. Like I'm asking in part because it's a, it's a sick thing. You pointed this out too. This is a, this is a sick thing. And you very generously sharing your personal experiences and how they led to this.

Yeah. I think is an identification of a very safe and gentle sick. Do you want to talk about the sickness now? Shall we talk? Is it, do you see it that way? Do you see it as a sick thing? Yeah, I do. Sick is a strong word. You're trying to fill an unfillable hole with physical media and you're just not going to fill it that way. No. Some people fill it with booze and hookers. Some people fill it with golf. Some,

you know, people fill it in different ways, the unfillable hole. Trying to fill from a lot of different angles. So to fill the unfillable hole with physical media, there's lots worse ways you could go about it, right? It's a pretty benign illness. I mean, it can cost you. This is a key thing. The shelves, the reason nobody cares is because they look like shit. The books on bookshelves are fantastic. They look fantastic. And there's not a better home interior decoration than books on bookshelves. I believe this is changing. There is something that is happening

that is correlated to the financial aspect of this too, which is that a great many people can't afford to collect, certainly not at the level that you're collecting, not at the level that I'm collecting. Oh, and ours are tax deductible too. Let's be fully honest about that. That's a very good point, which is a great benefit to me as the movie podcaster

and you as the creator of art. For example, one of my new favorite labels is Cinematograph, which is an offshoot of Vinegar Syndrome. And they are doing actually the thing that you're describing, which is they're like a series of films from the 70s, 80s, and 90s that are studio pictures, often Paramount, that have been undistributed on these formats. And they're not only licensing them, they're licensing like Little Darlings

or Paul Schrader's Touch or a lot of different kinds of movies, but they're packaging them really beautifully in these hard boxes with slip cases and booklets and extras and often 4K UHD. And if you put Little Darlings on your shelf, two things will happen. One, if you have a three-year-old like we do,

they'll pull them off because they're like, what is that pink thing? I'm really interested in that. Sure. And two, they look good in your house. Do they not? Do they not look like those books on the shelf there? You don't know. If they all looked like that, maybe. But they don't.

Most of it looks like plastic shit. And it looks like you live in a fucking GameStop. They just don't look good on a show. Yeah. It's not untrue, but I'm working toward a greater beauty in the world of home video purchasing. Well, to that end. But that's expensive is my point.

These editions are very expensive. They're not like- They're very expensive. That's another change that's happened, right? I mean, the DVD market has shrunk down to literally something like 1% of what it was 15 years ago. But these companies have produced these beautiful specialized things for collectors. And now, I mean, how much do you pay for it? I'm so grateful to you for finding the right to syllabic emphasis on a cinematograph.

I've not known how to say it. It's not correct. It might not be correct. I may be getting it wrong, but I don't think so. Cinematograph. I think, so I try to wait for sales, candidly. I don't want to spend top market dollar. In fact, when Tim and I did the first episode.

Hitmaker. Hitmakers. God damn. It's going to take a while to stick there despite his stature. I think I made a rule of I try to not go above $35 if I can. Now, I've broken the rule. I've broken the rule many times this year.

Many times. So it's not really a rule anymore. It's not a rule anymore. And I've broken it and I was mostly keeping to it when I said this two years ago and I'm not keeping to it now because

there are more specialty labels than ever. There are higher quality editions than there ever have been. They are more super serving the collector than they are serving the common casual target shopper who's grabbing stuff and dropping it into their cart.

And so I get drawn in. Now there are exceptions, obviously, like for example, there's a, there's one on your list. I think the conversation is one of the, one of your picks this year that had kind of like a very expanded edition. I think it was like 79.99 or something like that. Like a very expensive edition. That's a lot of money to spend on a piece of physical media, especially for a movie that you probably already owned in at least one format. Yeah. That comes with a cassette tape of the score. It's like, what the hell am I going to play this on? You don't have any tape text left in your house? It's funny. Like I've been doing these semi-serious, semi-joking videos about unboxing. You're familiar with the unboxing phenomenon. And there is,

I found my LaserDisc copy of Seven Samurai and I broke it out because Seven Samurai was just reissued on 4K UHD by both Criterion and BFI. And the first Criterion I ever owned was Seven Samurai DVD. And I also had it on VHS when I was a kid. So I have all four editions in front of me.

Is that your most purchased movie? Well, that was where I was leading was sort of like, at what point are we done adding on top of the pile? Because there's going to be a new format. It's going to happen. You know it's going to happen and you know you're going to buy it. So you're not done. So are you resigned to just being screwed with this, where when they introduce 8K,

that you'll just be like, I'll start replacing? I am now. Yes. Okay. What does your wife think about that? You've got young children to think about. I have a six-year-old and a three-year-old, and a wife who's so lovely and patient. Again, this conversation about nobody gives a shit.

So I told you we've got two rooms. There's the theater proper, which has a lot of shelves in it where the movies are. And then there's a little room outside the room, also in the basement. When we moved into this house, the basement, it was finished, but it just looked like a Marriott ballroom.

So we went down and we put a couple of walls in there to seal off a little enclosed theater. And there are shelves inside there. And then right outside there, there are other shelves that we had put in. And so those are more public, right? You go downstairs and you see those shelves. So I thought for my wife, wouldn't it be nice if I made them look like something, right? That didn't look like you lived in a GameStop. So I tried to make them, I tried to arrange them by label and by color. Now, this is so against every organizing principle I have.

Honestly, I'm having a panic attack hearing you say that. That's awful. But she doesn't know where to find anything anyway. So if I am looking for Invasion of the Body Snatchers on 4K, I know, oh, it's in the arrows. Oh, and I know the box is white. I can find it pretty quickly. So you're organizing by label first, then color through label. In that outside section. Now inside I have, inside the theater, I have box sets. I have sort of A to Z by title. I hate it, but the directors have been pulled out so much for the labels that I don't feel I can organize by direct. So that's just

like an A to Z by title. And then I have a couple of sections of TV documentary. For shame, TV. There's some TV in documentary. For shame, TV. There's some TV in there. For the longest time, the only way you could watch Homicide was on DVD. That's right. My Barney Miller set

is treasured to me. It's the greatest television show that's ever on TV. Has that been issued in 4K? Barney Miller is not. It's just on DVD. The Prisoner on Blu-ray is a must-own for me. It's a great pandemic watch for me and my wife to go through The Prisoners.

So you and Hitmaker asked me about my organ. And I didn't want to even talk to you about it. I was so. You're embarrassed. I'm embarrassed by it. I was so, I find. You're embarrassed. I'm embarrassed by it. It's horrible. But it's a lovely thing you did for, did your wife, was she like, thank you for doing this, sir?

This is what I was trying to explain. She's so lovely and patient. I can't tell you the number of times I've tried to engage her in this discussion and bring her down and say, now look, I'm thinking about doing this. And her response is always, you should do what you want to do. It's your collection. You should make it the way you want it. It's very nice. And it's very sweet. Then when I'm out of town, I get some angry calls like,

I can't find Sinbad. I was like, well, if you had engaged in the discussion, you could have found Sinbad very easily on the shelf. It's nice that she's even just looking for anything while you're gone. Well, the kids, you know, my boy wants to watch Sinbad movies. Well, do your kids, have they been exposed to the collection? Are they aware of this as like a way to watch things? My six-year-old boy is very aware of it. And now he has his own shelf.

Really? Yeah. of it and now he has his own shelf really yeah he has his own shelf of stuff that he can go and look and say pull something out and say i want to watch this that's would you mind share it was there one thing that he's really feels passionate about well he's a he's a godzilla freak again the pleasures of physical media before he had ever seen anything. I had the Criterion Godzilla, the big box, which is a big book with big comic book style illustrations. And he was obsessed with that as a two year old or three year old.

He wanted me to teach him the titles of the movies. He, you know, could, he learned all the titles of the films. So obviously I'll be fluent in Japanese of an age. I put a Godzilla movie on for him, and that was it, man. He is hooked on kaiju. Wow.

My kid is hooked on kaiju. That is fascinating. I wonder if that holds the same way that your predilection for the transgressive held through your adult life. Perhaps. A monster way. predilection for the transgressive held through your adult life you know perhaps he has seen uh he's seen all of the godzillas multiple times he has seen all the gamma the arrow has a couple of great camera boxes he's seen all he could he can identify the different eras of the camera movies he has a lot of collectibles oh my, my God. Tracking down some of that shit. Tracking down the Frankenstein monster from the movie Frankenstein vs. Baragon. Oh, God.

A particular Japanese Frankenstein from the late 60s. And there was an action figure. And we found it. And we bought it. And it is a treasured toy of that kid. That is fantastic. Yeah. Your wife is okay with him becoming addicted to this now?

Oh, yeah. He watches maybe a movie a day, maybe not. No more than a movie a day. He prefers movies to TV. He has some TV shows he watches, but mostly he's a movie kid. He's been through all of the universal horror he loves. My proudest moment was when I put on Creature from the Black Lagoon, and as soon as it started, he said,

Yay, it's in black and white. I was like, oh, okay, all right. You have trained him well. There will be a rejection at a certain point, right? I imagine at some point he was going to be like, Dad, get the fuck out of here with this. He was like, Dad, you're a total dork and I never want to see you again. That is genuinely heartwarming. And I have to seriously consider it.

Do you, because you obviously watch a lot of contemporary films as well. You're an Academy voter, for example. You keep up with a lot of stuff. Obviously you're working in the business too. Do your kids care about contemporary stuff because of, despite having this access to all of movie history, essentially? I don't know. I don't know what they care. I don't know why they care about what they care about.

He loves the Dark Crystal. That's one of his favorite movies. We showed him Dark Crystal. There's a great 4K of Dark Crystal. And he loves it. He's seen that movie many, many times. He's really after my own heart with the creatures and the horror. Amazing. he's really after my own heart with the creatures and the horror.

Amazing. We tried, I, without trying to steer him into any one thing, we did try to present him with a lot of handmade stuff early, as opposed to CGI or, or that, that sheen. I mean,

Carrie said toy story early to me. Now, I've never actually seen Toy Story myself. It's a wonderful film. She wanted him to see Toy Story. She had shown it to her baby brothers when she's older than her baby brothers. And she had remembered showing it to them. And I didn't fight her on Toy Story. I did say, I'm afraid once we introduce that computer Sheen animation to him, it's going to be hard to go.

I'm afraid he's not going to want to watch universal horror movies after seeing them. Wasn't the case. She showed him Toy Story. He thoroughly enjoyed Toy Story. He had a great time. He never asked to see it again. Interesting. Yeah.

I mean, maybe there's just a kind of certain kind of storytelling that he likes too that can't be accomplished in Lion King he loved he's watched Lion King a bunch okay he's watched it a bunch interesting

my concern yeah was computer animation versus hand-drawn but my daughter to this day this Sleeping Beauty is probably her favorite film that's like one

of the most beautifully animated movies ever made we do try to he's seen all the Disney stuff we don't lean into the Disney stuff right because he likes creature features once it's I mean of all that universal So he's seen all the Disney stuff. We don't lean into the Disney stuff, right?

Because he likes creature features. I mean, of all that universal horror, Creature from the Black Lagoon was his favorite. And he's, well, he's pretty much into Frankenstein too. He went as Frankenstein for Halloween. Yeah, he likes all that stuff. I really, I don't know if I'm jealous, but I'm fascinated by his ability to get that far into that stuff at that age. It does remind me of, yeah, I would sit in the library for hours and just look at books about monsters and try to understand the creation of monsters and mythologies. That's his first question about any movie.

Are there creatures in it? So he loves the Harryhausen movies. He loves the Sinbad movies. He loves that stuff. Okay. Well, talk to me about labels because then we can use that to talk about what's been good this year.

Are there any labels that you think I must own everything that they do? Yeah. Radiance Films. This is the big winner of 2024,

I feel like Radiance. You have to own everything on Radiance Films. Can you explain who they are? It's a UK company and they are purveyors of... They seem to specialize in a kind of, well, some forgotten titles.

A slightly overlooked world cinema, right? Absolutely. But that's not... It's not highfalutin. These are not arthouse movies for the most part. No, it's... First of all, they do have a couple of American titles like The Hot Spot, Dennis Hopper movie, or Miami Blues, a great transfer of the great Miami Blues. They had another one, they had The Landlord recently as well. Landlord, early Ashby, right?

Panic in Year Zero, I don't know if you've ever seen that. I haven't. Ray Moland, well, you should see it. It's bonkers. He directed the movie, Ray Mol Panic in Year Zero. I don't know if you've ever seen that. Ray Milland, well, you should see it. It's bonkers. He directed the movie Ray Milland. And it's post-apocalypse, and now everybody needs to get a gun to survive. It's really kind of scary. Sounds relevant. Scarily relevant. Messiah of Evil also was a big release of theirs. That was my favorite release of last year. Right.

Yes. But Italian gangster movies like Tony Arzenta with Alain Delon, which is great. I'm a hit man getting out of the business. Come on. We've seen it before. We'll see it again. The 1960s Yakuza movies. Some of these titles I did know,

like Sympathy for the Underdog and Yakuza Graveyard. These are Fukasaku movies. They are great. Big Time Gambling Boss, Yamashita movie that I had never heard of. This was one of their first releases and a good indicator of what they're doing, which is they're really mining for kind of micro classics,

for lack of a better phrase, like films that in their home countries or to cinephiles in those countries are meaningful movies or meaningful contributions, but that were not picked by Criterion or Kino Lorber or any of the other kind of classics titles

and giving them a huge spotlight and amazing transfers. So I feel as a collector, a responsibility to buy everything that they put out, not only because I want it, but because I want to support that company and what they're doing. And because I'm in a position to be able to do that. So if I already have a perfectly fine transfer of Brideware Black and and they come out with their edition of Brideware Black. I'm still buying the Radiance. I bought that one as well. One of my picks for this year is Daigothic, which is three ghost

stories from the Japanese studio that produced Rashomon, some of the Kurosawa classics, one of the most important Japanese, sort of government-funded Japanese movie studios of the 50s and 60s that, in the great tradition of Japanese ghost stories, created some movies. I'd never heard of any of these three films. They're all fantastic. They have incredible features like Kiyoshi Kurosawa talking about why these movies are impactful and how they informed his movies. Radiance is a great company. A great company. Thumbs up, Radiance. More? Give me a couple more, yeah. Canadian International Pictures.

I'm at a loss. Break it down. This is why you're here. It's a Canadian company, and they focus on forgotten Canadian cinema. Love it. They are platformed on Vinegar Syndrome. Vinegar Syndrome is their own label, but they also platform a trilogy of crime films, Dirty Money, Rajan, Padovani, and Gina, all really good, low-budget crime films. It's like, what if Ken Loach made a crime film?

There's some social consciousness to them, too, but really good, interesting stuff. And you realize watching that stuff, it's like, oh, every country has its own cinema and its own heritage, and some of it we just don't, have never had access to. Incredible. Have you spoken to Hitmaker about this label?

I feel like he is, as he digs deeper in, he's like starting to get a little bit intrigued by the smaller outfits. He's too big. He's too big. I can't get through to him anymore. He's just buying Warner Brothers discs at this point. Yeah. He's just, you know, on the lot. He's on the lot. All of the lots. Okay. One more. What's one more? I see you giving love to smaller and powerful new labels, which I appreciate. Flickr Alley. Yes. They focus primarily on silent cinema, but they've also teamed with an organization called the Film Noir Foundation to put out some obscure noirs, including a couple of Argentinian noirs.

The Bitter Stems from 1956, which Carrie and I watched last year, which is fantastic. You are digging in the crates, Tracy. You have brought your A game to this. The Bitter Stems. The Bitter Stems. I'm going to add it to the watch list right now.

I'm not familiar with that title. And El Vampiro Negro, which is an Argentinian remake of M from 1953 intriguing okay uh i got two more i have to yeah shoot mention fun city editions huge fan i've got a couple and i buy again i buy every release this is a new york company i wish they were a little more prolific they really only come out with about one title a year. This movie, Deep in the Heart, was a revelation to me. I did not know that movie at all. I purchased this because of your recommendation. Oh, my God.

It's so good. Also, bizarrely relevant film right now. Bizarrely relevant. It was in 1983 or something. Oh, man. And a Texas production, to your point about moving to Dallas, right? Yeah. And this is their edition of Bad Company.

Bad Company, which we needed on Blu-ray for a long available for a very long time uh they also put out a great edition of rancho deluxe uh the frank perry movie smile michael richie's uh satire of uh beauty pageants cutter's way which is always on the list of movies you haven't seen that you need to see and certainly one of my favorite movies. All-world John Hurt performance in that movie. And another one that's not on those lists called Heartbreakers. Bobby Roth movie from 1984. Do you know this film?

I do. I've watched it this year. Nick Mancuso and Peter Coyote. Back when Peter Coyote meant something in a movie. True leading man performance. Yeah. Very curious film. Cur man performance. Yeah. Very curious film. Curious film, yeah,

but a very specific personal point of view in that movie. So I really admire that movie. They also did a couple of box sets of TV movies from the 1980s. They called them Primetime Panic. We saw, Carrie and I watched a movie called Freedom from 1981. You know this movie? I haven't seen it, no. Directed by Joseph Sargent, written by Barbara Turner, who's Jennifer Jason Lee's mother.

And she would later write a movie called Georgia, directed by Ulu Grossbard with Mare Winningham and Jennifer Jason Lee. Mare is the star of this movie Freedom, and it's about a mother and a daughter who cannot get along. The mother is played by Jennifer Warren, who you would know best from Night Moves, the Arthur Penn movie. Yep. The mother-daughter scenes, they're not getting along in the movies about the daughter who is, they're going to legally emancipate the 15-year-old daughter

from this family. The scenes between the mother and daughter in that movie are better than mother-daughter scenes. I mean, it's just like, wow, this is so good.

This is so well-written. These are so beautifully performed. This has also been added to the watch list. That's in the Primetime Panic Box. Yes, Primetime Panic Box. Very good box very good and you know tv movies used to be well i guess they still they still make tarantino about this many times because he has this

incredible knowledge of television movies which was a just a huge thing 60s 70s 80s 90s even they're they're joseph sargent you know directed taking Taking a Pill in 1, 2, 3. I mean, this is, in theory, a major filmmaker who's just making movies for ABC at a certain point four or five years after the release of a major studio movie with a big star like Matthau. So, yeah, some of that stuff has lost time. That actually could be the next wave to pilfer from collectors over time

is the rediscovery of a lot of titles like this. Cause there's still so many that are untapped. So hit maker was in a, a mini series, uh, about, uh,

the, uh, housewife in Texas who murdered her neighbor with an ax. I'm not going to come up with any titles here. They may, Jennifer Beal, be, be Jessica Beal,

Jennifer Beals and Jessica Beal. Jessica Beal was in this with hit maker. Is this the center? No, that's a TV show. I was on. We're talking about candy is a series that candy that hit maker was on and candy came out the same time candy came out the same time as another story with lizzie olsen

playing right that was the max series yeah well what nobody remembers is that this story was filmed in the 1980s directed by stephen gyllenhaal uh with barbara hershey playing the mother in a performance that will knock your socks off wow she's fantastic is it called murder in a small town or killing in a small town one of the actors the reason i know that movie is because one of the actors in that film was Dennis Letts. My dad plays the sheriff. You didn't share this. The role that Justin Timberlake plays in Candy,

my dad played... Somehow, so it's Killing in a Small Town, 1990 film, with Barbara Hershey, Brian Dennehy, John Terry. Your father, Dennis Letts,

is listed here on Letterboxd. There you go. This was already on my watch list. Wow. Now, why is that? I don't know. How did I know about this film, and why did I edit? I don't know.

Maybe Hitmaker, well, he didn't know about it. After he'd shot Candy, I said, you know, they've already made it. He was like, what? Hal Holbrook is the sixth lead of this film. This is a murderer's row. It's really good. I mean, she will chill your blood. It is a great performance.

She's a great underrated actress. You didn't tell a tale of your father, who, after years as an English teacher, did become a performer. Both of my parents had amazing second careers, which is not supposed to happen, really, ever for anybody, and certainly not supposed to happen really ever for anybody and certainly not supposed to happen when you live in a town of 12,000 people in southeastern Oklahoma. But my father, who was seeing me go down to Texas and audition for films and stuff, decided he'd start doing that

too. And he made about 40 films and television shows. Looking at his Letterboxd page here, it's just populated with tons of Hollywood productions. Yeah. He worked with Robert Zemeckis. He worked with Glenn Eastwood. He worked with Francis Ford Coppola. I believe he was cut out of The Rainmaker, so I don't think you'll see that credited here.

But he worked with some big names. We were all worried when he retired from school teaching early. It was like, you're not going to like that. And he never looked back. He had a great time doing that. And then my mom wrote a book. Her first novel was picked up by Oprah Winfrey for her book club. It was called Where the Heart Is, which was eventually turned into a film as well with Natalie Portman and Ashley Judd. So yeah, they both had remarkable careers. When you were a kid, did you know your parents

were very creative? Yeah. My dad did a lot of community theater, college theater. I think the first play I ever saw was To Kill a Mockingbird with my dad playing Atticus at the college. So he did a lot of theater and mom was always writing. How my mother raised a family in a pretty traditional, family of all boys in a pretty traditional household where she did everything and worked full-time job and wrote books. I don't know how the fuck she did it. I'm struggling just to gammer twice a week about movies on this show it's honestly insane the way that people are able to do that do you and do

your kids know that you guys are creative you and your wife not yet maybe who knows because now it it kind of gets it's just in the drapes like they have a

couple of they have carries action figure from Ghostbusters and they're just like oh mommy you know they've got that. That's crazy. You know, there was even a little like stuffed sheriff figure from Fargo, from her season on Fargo. So they have two mommy dolls.

That is fascinating. Do you want to shout out any individual picks this year? You've made a list. I know you've made a list. I brought some of what I have from your collection though. Of course you have more than I do. Well, I guess I was going to talk about just some of the 4k releases from, I mean, because in terms of those smaller labels, the things they're finding, the things they're unearthing are the story. In terms of some of the bigger labels, it's not so much what they're

unearthing. It's the 4K restoration of these things. The presentation. And it's extraordinary. We just watched Happiness the other night. It's the first time I'd seen it since I saw it at the Angelica when it was first released. And of course I've worked with Todd since then. I made the movie wiener dog, uh, with Todd. Uh, that's an amazing movie.

Incredible. That's an incredible piece of work. It's a, it's one of those titles that you're talking about that people were begging for basically, because it's such a, a signature 1990s film and such a signature independent film. And yeah, hopefully Todd makes his next movie soon. I think he lost.

I know. He lost financing at the same time that Todd Haynes was losing his movie. It was really depressing. Very sad. But this is an incredible addition and a deeply uncomfortable in a good way film. I told Carrie. Carrie had never seen it, but it was a rewatch for me

and I told her, I said, you know when you read the comments and there's horrible, like troll-like, you know, like the Nazis

who were on, you know, I said, always in my head what I picture is Philip Seymour Hoffman's character in Happiness. That's the person

I see writing. And that's one of the ways I keep it in context. I keep that stuff in perspective. Yeah, yeah. I think that's healthy. Okay, what else is on your list? Pat Garan and Billy the Kid in 4K. Oh, my God.

Another movie that we yearned for in this format for a long time. And R.I.P. Chris Christopherson, obviously. It's the last great Peckinpah movie, right? He would not make another great movie after. I am pro Cross of Iron. I am pro Parts of Convoy. What else? What am I forgetting?

Keep digging. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Garcia is before this okay very similar time frame oh it's after this yeah it's right after

so that's Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Garcia that's alright but maybe the last masterpiece how about that

okay okay I've actually I'm about to rewatch this because I'm doing an episode on A Complete Unknown and I'm about to re-watch this because I'm doing an episode on A Complete Unknown and

I'm looking at Bob Dylan at the movies and this is of course a Bob Dylan performance and soundtrack score and he's also an expert with knives and if you remember

the end of Dune Timothee Chalamet is an expert with knives have I told you my Dune 2 quandary? No. Well, we haven't seen it,

and I don't know how to watch it because I'm quite sure my wife doesn't remember any single thing that happened in the first Dune movie. It's the same issue that I'm having. My wife, obviously, she also watches along with many of the Oscar films with me at this time of year. We usually do it in a screener's circumstance,

and she can't remember what happened in Dune. And she's like, I don't have five hours and 45 minutes to watch Dune part one again and Dune part two. It's funny. That's exactly the situation we're in. Not only can she not tell you what happened, she can't tell you who was in it. She knows that there's sand. And she remembers at the end me turning to her and saying, I'm pretty sure you could take Timothee Chalamet in a knife fight. You've met the man. Is that true? And she could take Bob Dylan in a knife fight too.

He's not very gifted ultimately. Great movie though. Okay. What else? Peeping Tom in 4K. Wow. Look at you. As much as I could.

I'm pretty up to date on my criterions these days. An important release, right? The movie that, for all intents and purposes, ended Michael Powell's career. It was very unpopular at the time, but very influential and great horror movie. And nice round shape to your giallo introduction because this is obviously a hugely influential movie on those Italian filmmakers. Okay, what else? Great horror movie. And nice round shape to your giallo introduction

because this is obviously a hugely influential movie on those Italian filmmakers. Okay, what else? Let me see what else I have. McCabe and Mrs. Miller. I don't have the 4K, unfortunately. I only have the Blu-ray, so I didn't bring it with me. Well, again, I go back to the earlier point.

Try watching it on a 24-inch screen in 1978 and then try watching it in 4K now. It's revelatory. They really are revelations. You go, oh my God, they will actually change the meanings of some films for you when you go, I never realized that's what that person... Well, in the Panit scan,

when those movies are on TV, you can't see 40% of the film. The edges of the frames are just gone. So yeah, now with the way that televisions are and the way that these restorations are working, a movie like that is fascinating because also Altman as a director, obviously the way that the camera moves is unlike most filmmakers and what's happening over here matters. So to lose it, you're right. You're learning something new. Great recommendation. New information.

Altman would have turned 100 next year. So I'm doing a big episode about him and about his films and hopefully his lost films, you know, the 80s stuff. I auditioned for him once. What was the film? The Company. Oh yeah. The ballet film. Yeah. Which he shot in Chicago. I didn't get it. Was he? He was running so late in the auditions that he stopped taking people individually and he started taking us in groups. That's not common. It wasn't great. Great director. What else? Blood and Black Lace in 4K from Arrow.

Here's that. Oh, man. It's fantastic. This is a beautiful movie. Invasion of the Body Snatchers, 1978. Phil Kaufman. I watched that this year. It's just... In the hit maker text chain that we share,

you were touting this quite loudly a few months ago. Oh my God. There have been a couple of editions of this movie now. This movie has really been rediscovered and reappraised. Actually, Adam Neiman often regularly, I guess, on the show. This is one of his favorite films of all time. He's written about it multiple times, I think, for The Ringer. But absolutely amazing movie.

Also lost Donald Sutherland this year as well. That's right. One of his great performances. That's written about it multiple times, I think, for The Ringer. But absolutely amazing movie. Also, lost Donald Sutherland this year as well. That's right. One of his great performances. That's right. What else do I have? Can I keep matching you? Wages of Fear?

I have that. Wow. I'm doing good. This is Wages of Fear. This is not the Criterion edition of this film. Right.

This is the BFI version. In 4K. 4K restoration. Which is obviously the film that Sorcerer,er friedkin's your collaborator and friend uh sort of adapted for so he would always say it's not based on the wages of fear i'm like yeah but he's like well it wouldn't exist without the wages of fear i was like yeah that's true too i've been joking that there's a certain kind of man in los angeles recently whose

whole personality is i love sorcerer i don't know if you're aware of this, but like guys who just go to rep theaters, Hitmaker might be one of these guys actually. He also loves Sorcerer. But if you really are a Sorcerer boy, this is a film you should watch. We have a nanny slash friend. She's a dear friend of ours. When we get really busy, we have to double nanny. And so she lives in Los Angeles. She's going to come up and introduce herself to you at a movie theater at some point. She says she sees you there all the time. So she was with us for a few months while Carrie was in Thailand making White Lotus. And so I showed her some movies.

She had never heard of Sorcerer, had never heard of it. And I showed it to her, and she's like, this is now my favorite movie. She's the one who made us watch all those goddamn Mission Impossible movies. What do you mean all those goddamn? You mean all of those wonderful features? All those superb Mission Impossible movies. It's just not our genre. And Carrie and I watch it and we go, okay, we don't see a lot of this stuff.

And we're happy to know that that's one of the best examples of that kind of stuff. Can you give me just like a couple of minutes on Friedkin and your experiences with him and getting to know him? I adored him. He was such a lovely, generous man. He was so good to me and my family. I just adored him. And, you know, I missed the days of Hurricane Billy and all the kind of wild behavior and stuff, but he was very open in talking to me about those days. And he was the kind of guy you could say,

hey, tell me about Megan The Exorcist. And he'd just sit down and talk to you for a couple of hours about Megan The Exorcist. He loved to tell the old stories. He was such a great guy. Bug was happening in New York, Michael Shannon and Shannon Cochran in the New York production of Bug, and he saw it, and he called me out of the blue while I was actually acting in a production of Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf at the Alliance Theater in Atlanta, not the one we eventually took to New York. But I thought it was a joke. I thought somebody was playing a joke on me. Hello, this is William Friedkin. When he eventually convinced me he was actually who he said he was, he just said he saw the play and then he thought

it was great and he left it. And that was it. He called again 24 hours later and said, I want to make a movie of this. I can't get it out of my head. And I said, great. He said, I'll fly you out to Los Angeles tomorrow. I'm like, I'm doing a run of a play. I can't go. So I finished the play, flew to LA. I met with Billy and he's one of the few people I ever dealt with in the movie business who did everything he said he was going to do. I mean, he was just a straight shooter and such respect for the writer. Just a great guy. I was not on set for the production of bug or killer joke. Cause I was doing plays during both of those,

uh, when, when they shot those movies, but, uh, was always deeply in conversation with Bill while he was making those movies. And he continued to be a part of our lives and the lives of our kids and

stuff. And he's just, uh, I miss him terribly. He's a great, great fellow. Those are such great films and that actually

I think there is a Bug 4K restoration that just came out on Kino Lorber and do you have a special place in your home for your work

do you own those things it's in the A to Z baby no true democrat I do not put it on a separate shelf you want to keep

rolling through titles Paths of Glory yeah I think I have I think I forgot to bring it yeah a separate shelf. You want to keep rolling through titles? Paths of Glory. Yeah, I think I have. I think I forgot to bring it. It's both on Eureka and Kino Lorber on 4K. I think maybe the Eureka is... I believe it's just Blu-ray, the Eureka. I think the Kino Lorber is 4K.

The other way around? Eureka, I think they're both 4K. Oh, I only have one. I don't remember which one. I think I have Kino Lorber. And I think the Eureka is... What does that mean when you say a touch better? Because people, they'll go shopping, right?

They'll look. And for example, Inglourious Bastards is available in 4K. It is now available in an Arrow 4K. The Arrow 4K maybe has one more special feature and nicer packaging, original artwork, but it's the same transfer. It's basically the same movie.

Then I would say it's not worth the double dip unless it is to you, unless you say, I want that Arrow packaging on my shelf or I want that special feature or just the completest in you is just like, I need everything associated with this movie. I need the poster. I need the cassette tape, all the bells and whistles. Who knows? I fall somewhere in the middle. I like a nice hard case for the presentation. I do not need any of the toys. I don't need the toys either. Have you seen The Third Man? I have. I mean, it's my favorite film of all time. I did not buy that

edition because I don't want that toy in my house. I don't need it. I don't need a Ferris wheel. You open the box. Not only is there a pop-up Ferris wheel, but the score plays when you open the box. I do love a zither. Wow, maybe you've compelled me. I think that might be sold out, actually. It may not be available. I want you to know that that transfer is a legit. In anticipation of this podcast, I looked at it again compared to the other...

I mean, Third Man's one of the most purchased movies in my house. And yeah, it's worth it. I am waiting for them to issue just the regular edition of that, and I will get that. Right.

Kino Lorber this year. Oh, you talked about the conversation. Yes. That transfer as well, whether you want the big packaging and cassette tape or not, that transfer is really impactful. You know, when the movie first starts, it has that kind of waxy 70s film look where the credits look a little blurry and you're like, oh, shit. It looks like an episode of MASH, right?

It's just like not quite. And then the movie proper starts and you've never seen it with such clarity. Okay? It's just like not quite. And then the movie proper starts and you've never seen it with such clarity. Okay. It's really superb. Kino Lorber, High Noon, North Dallas 40, prime cut last year at Marion Bud. Two of those.

I don't, I have prime cut on Blu-ray, so I didn't bring that in, but I have High Noon here on 4K, one of the most significant American films ever made. And Last Year at Marion Bed. Yeah. Bill Simmons' favorite movie, I would guess. I don't believe you've seen that film.

But we can call him if you'd like to speak to him and ask him. The Alain René durational mindfuck that is Last Year at Marion Bed. It's not for everyone. I'll just say that. But for those of us it is for, that transfer is superb. This is a general question since you're such a cinephile. Better to see a movie like Last Year of Mary and Bad, which is narratively challenging when you're 19 or when you're 45.

They're different movies at 19 and 45. For the longest time I was I would have ranked several Fellini movies above La Dolce Vita and now that I'm an old man La Dolce Vita is the shit La Dolce Vita is

maybe I should revisit it as I get on in years it is it's tops on the list it's an amazing movie Eight and a Half was always my favorite okay is that it's tops on the list. It's an amazing movie. Eight and a half was always my favorite. Okay. Is that it?

I have a few. Opera on 4K from Severin. I couldn't get my hands on this. I believe it's gone. Really? I believe it's sold out. This is a late Argento or a mid Argento, I guess. Late 80s.

Maybe the last great Argento. I wonder. I was introduced, I've told this story before, I think I might have just told it, that I was introduced by Argento when a friend sat me down to watch Deep Red. And I very quickly went down the hill and watched all the Jallows

and got very into them. And around that time, the Stendhal syndrome was coming out. And I went to the art house and it was the first time I saw an Argento movie in movie theaters. And I told people the Stendhal syndrome was good. And it is not very,

it's not my favorite of his. It's not actually very good. But I believe trauma comes after opera, and trauma, I think, is pretty good. There are good parts. There are good parts of trauma. And I love the American actors like Frederick Forrest and Piper Laurie, who are just, like, having the time in their lives.

Like what is this crazy like head lopping shit I'm in? I mean, it's no different than David Hemmings cropping up and you're like, what is David Hemmings doing in this Italian movie? It's a trip to Italy for some of them, right? That's right. Okay. Have you got through your list? I think I have. Okay.

I think I have. I have a couple more I want to add to the stack. Please. your list i think i have okay i think i have a couple more i want to add to the stack please so i mentioned cinematograph i've got two of their titles from this year i've got red rock west the john doll neo neo neo noir i've got going south which is one of the very few films directed by jack nicholson. What do you think of that movie? I really like Mary Steenburgen in it. Yeah, he discovered her, right? That was her first movie.

She's very, very good. I think it is a bit over-cranked, but I love Nicholson. I've always loved him. Nicholson is a real portal into movie history for me, so I had to own it. Two more criterions, very simple. More movies that I've wanted to own for a long time, which are Greg Araki's movies, which were very, I would say,

creatively instructional for me as a young movie watcher. More movies that I didn't know you could make movies like this. Oh, right. Particularly Nowhere, which is his sort of like omnibus tale of, you know, slightly disassociated existentialist teens. His shortcuts. His shortcuts, well put.

And then Trainspotting, which I want us to bring with me for a couple reasons. One, I love Trainspotting, of course. This is a 4K edition. I just hate what they've done with the packaging of this film. It's a real fuck you to people with shelves. It is longer than all the other titles here. You can see, if I can just show you

that these don't match. Why the fuck did you do that, Criterion? Don't do that anymore. That's not cool. And then the last one I wanted to point out, I had a director named

Arkasha Stevenson on the podcast. She directed The First Omen, which is the prequel to the Omen movie, which I liked quite a bit. I think she's a real talent.

And at the end of every episode, I ask filmmakers what's the last great thing they've seen? I'm going to ask you that question momentarily. But I asked her and she said, Hollywood 90028. Are you familiar with this? Oh, let's see. I don't know this at all. So this comes to us from Grindhouse Releasing and it is a 70s independent film that is, gosh, what is the American Jacques Demy film that takes place in Los Angeles? Oh, my goodness.

Starts with an M. Oh, my goodness. You know what I'm referring to. Yes, with Gary Lockwood from 2001. Yes. I'm going to look it up right now. See, I haven't had any protein. I knew this was going to happen.

Starts with an M. Sure of it. Model Shop. You were right. Jacques Demy's Model Shop, which is like one part arthouse movie and one part weird genre. Guy picks up girls

and has sex with them movie. This is kind of a version of that. It is one part arthouse existentialist drama, one part horror slasher movie. Arkasha is actually quoted on the back of it, as is Ty West, as is Sean Baker. This is one of the major genre discoveries of the year.

Grindhouse Releasing doesn't put out very many films. I also have their copy of Death Game, another movie I love. I don't know this at all. So this is a... I've put you onto something. You have put me on something. I don't know at all.

You watched it. I watched it. Thumbs up. Thumbs up. Yes. Cool. It is not exactly what you're expecting based on the packaging here, but actually the pink will probably likely draw in my daughter as well in the future. Got it. Though I don't think she's ready to watch that one just yet. It's been a great year for this sort of thing. What sort of thing? $59. Oh, yes. 4K UHD editions. Yeah. Can we, you know, that conversation box is pretty pricey. The third man is pretty pricey.

It's what we were saying. This is where it is now, though. I mean, there are just fewer and fewer people who buy these things, but the people who buy them are so passionate about owning them. The collectors are passionate. You're going to stick with this, like, till the end. This is your lifelong hobby now? There's no other way. There's no other way to live. Again, I'm a sober person. I've been sober for a long time. I don't have any hobbies to speak of.

I've been collecting these things for 25 years. I gamble on sports, but I'm very conservative about it. I have a business manager who's also got a lot of years of sobriety, so he's watching me. So I can't go crazy with that. You're putting money on Sam Darnold? I have been winning with Sam Darnold this year. I'll have you know. Congratulations. I hope that continues. So I don't think there's any other way for me. And the truth is, my wife, she does love it. She's patronizing about the collection, but the truth is she loves it. I will tell you about our movie nights.

Please. So during the pandemic, I had amassed this collection, but we never watched it because we were always doing theater. So we never had a chance to watch movies. And then the pandemic happened and the quarantine, and we all found good qualities to the quarantine. And one of them was that we would put our son down at the time. We didn't have a daughter yet. We would put our son down and we would clean up the kitchen and then we would go down and watch a movie.

We watched a movie a night. And it was a time when everybody was sharing the way they were getting through a difficult time. And we weren't baking bread and we weren't watching the Michael Jordan documentary, though we eventually got there and watched that. But for Carrie, I think it was, she just started tweeting the title of the movie, hashtag movie night or hashtag quarantine life or whatever. She would do this every night

and people enjoyed it. No review, no thumbs up, no thumbs down, just here's what we're doing. And instead of watching Friends or Tiger King, you could also watch McCabe and Mrs. Miller.

You could also spend your time doing something like that. I feel like The Devils was one of those where when she tweeted, did you guys watch The Devils together? We did. There is a very good BFI DVD of The Devils. It's never come out on Blue, but it's actually quite good DVD. And she had never seen it. And I had not seen it.

Again, I had watched it on fuzzy old television back in the day, but it's one of my favorite movies of all time. I mean, it is a great, great movie. And so she thoroughly enjoyed Movie Night and she continued it even beyond the pandemic as we would watch movies and she would enjoy movies from the collection. It's gotten a little challenging now because Twitter's, you know, all of the Nazis. There's Nazis all over Twitter. It's not what it used to be. That's for sure.

So she's trying to get off of Twitter. About Blue Sky. She's gone to Blue Sky. I didn't even know that. And she started sending out the movie Night on Blue Sky. Oh, I didn't know. We have just joined the Letterboxd community. Yeah, let's speak about that.

I'm so glad you brought it up. Well, it's because of Nazis on Twitter. That's why we're on Letterboxd. Yeah. I did an episode with Chris last week, and we talked about is there any concern about the kind of gamification that comes with Letterboxing. Of course, my first instinct when you were telling me titles

I'd never heard of was to go to Letterboxd and add it to my watch list and make it a part of my, the spreadsheet of my life. But I find that it's just an amazing, for the most part, a very nice community of people who actually care about movies. And if you go to the right corners and recommend the right things, they will pay it forward, which is a really nice thing. Right. So we've done that. She's continued to, here's another unique thing about my movie night with Carrie. I choose 100% of the time, I make the choice of what we're going to watch. Now, before you decide that I'm, you know, some caveman, uh, the truth is it's her choice that it's my choice. She's like, I'm overwhelmed.

Your collection is, I'm overwhelmed by it. I make choices all day long. I don't want to choose. I don't want to be part of this. She's overwhelmed by streaming, all the tiles on streaming, all the different streaming services. She's just like, you put something on, and I'll watch it. That's been our arrangement for many years now. Of course, she has veto power. She's never exercised it. There's not a single kind of movie that she won't want to watch or, well, God bless you both.

And it makes the curation, I mean, I feel a certain responsibility about the way I curate it, right? I'm not going to follow the Clint Eastwood movie with the Dirty Dozen with Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid, right? I don't think I would do that anyway, just for my own tastes are more, I hope, a bit more diverse than that. But I'm conscious of the fact that I have an audience that I'm programming for. And so, and I've even said to her, hey, do you want to try and do like a deep dive on Bunuel? Like, shall we spend a couple of weeks? And she said, I'm not in film school. I don't, this is not what this is for me.

I like the variety. I like mixing it up. I like going from movie to TV, from comedy to drama, from old to new, just mix it up for me. So it's a great arrangement. That's wonderful. If this wasn't my job, I think I would probably try to do it a little bit like that. And maybe one day I will be able to. My wife is very similar.

She is very much, I'm in your hands, and this is something you care about. And there will be times occasionally where she'll say, I want this. But for the most part, she lets me roll with it. It's a nice way to be. It justifies the sad amount of time I've invested both financially, emotionally, and personally. How does she, what about when she doesn't like something? Does she tell you to take something off? Not usually, but I can't show her the devils.

That wouldn't be in conversation. She wouldn't watch that. She wouldn't care for it. She wouldn't care for the substance. She wouldn't... I know what kind of thing she's going to like, but she's very open-minded.

There is just a limited... Extremity, I think, is just not going to work. Everything else, she'll roll with. I think there's some extremity I haven't shown Carrie. Like, martyrs.

Which is like, I'm not going to put martyrs on for Carrie. I don't think that's her One of the most extreme films ever made. Yeah. I can show her upsetting things.

She'll watch an upsetting thing. And a lot of the times, obviously, we're watching movies I haven't seen either. Right? So, I was like, I have no, I bear no responsibility for this. Right, right. Yeah, I mean, I tend to have an overwhelming amount of information about movies before I even sit down to watch them, unfortunately. So, I tend to know what we're getting ourselves into. I also, I laugh, I cry. I'm very emotionally involved. My wife is just, she doesn't, there's nothing. She's just dead inside. She's a,

that's after my own heart as well. Yeah. It takes a lot to move me. There's no fucking response. And I was like, I had to stop showing her W.C. Fields because I'm just over there just chortling and crying. It's just nothing. It's just like, oh, wow. You don't even respond to this humor at all. It's like, I'm going to stop putting myself in this position. I think she saves all the emotion for the work, you know? Are you enjoying your time as like a, you're a true that guy now.

You know, you're an esteemed playwright and an incredibly gifted man. But like, you're now a person who's like, oh, hey, Tracy Letts. I know that person. Yeah. Isn't that something? I mean, it's got to be a great way to make a living. No? Not a great way to make a living?

It's a mixed bag. I mean, being an actor can be pretty degrading, really. How so? Well, you're... Because you're the show pony? Yeah. Okay. They move you around and they say, do this, don't do this?

Yeah. And they... Oh, don't tell him that. He's an actor. You know? And I've been on the other side of the table as a writer. It's like, no, no, don't tell them that. They're actors.

They don't... You know, it's like you can't handle the truth. Do you feel more sensitive or less sensitive than when you first moved to first moved to LA back in the 90s about all of those things? Define sensitive. About the way that you're treated and understood as a performer. I don't know. In some ways, my skin is so thick because I'm a playwright and nobody, nobody fucking takes the beatings that playwrights take. We take a beating like, no, most people could not handle the beatings that playwrights take. So the skin is pretty

thick. I'm very fortunate. Well, I'm fortunate in many, many ways. I'm very fortunate that my wife's career has continued the sort of upward trajectory, which has put me in the position of, you know, I can do something or I don't have to do. I do something I want to do. Yeah. That's kind of an odd thing to ask, but I'm going to ask it. It's like, she's become a big star. Yeah. Big star. I mean, a big, at a minimum, a big TV star. I mean, she's a part of a number of shows now that have a huge following. She doesn't ever get recognized. Really? Anywhere ever. Stop. Anywhere ever. I find that impossible to believe.

Just from the leftovers alone, which people have built shrines at this company, people have built shrines to. I mean, it's worshipped. I'm telling you, man, she doesn't get recognized. That's fascinating. Well, that's nice for you guys. And yeah, it's rare. She's, you know, you guys are around the same age. And normally it's a time or has been historically a

time where jobs for women tend to fall off a table and hers have just continued to sort of go up. And so it has allowed me a certain freedom to say, to be choosy and say, I'll do this. I won't do that. Also, we've got two young kids at home. So the first question both of us ask is where does it shoot? You know, the idea that we're she went to thailand for six fucking months for white lotus and it was really challenging with you know two little kids i was a single dad living in westchester for six months it's hard yeah that's a one season show though so in theory white lotus oh yeah yeah yeah okay well at least there's that but it's but 15 million people will watch it is that meaningful A lot of people will see it. And it's obviously proven to be kind of a golden ticket for a lot of actors who do it.

She loves Mike, and we both love Mike's work. In fact, after she got the gig, one of the first things we watched was Chuck and Buck. She had never seen it. I owned it on DVD, so I showed her Chuck and Buck. Still not issued on Blu-ray. Another 90s Sundance classic. Yeah. That's funny.

You feel good about the state of movies? There are many, many amazing artists doing amazing work in this country and internationally. It's always been hard to make movies. It's always been hard to make good movies. It will always be hard to make movies and make good movies. So I don't necessarily, I mean, what's going on with streaming and exhibition of movies and all those kinds of, I don't,

I don't pretend to know any of the answers to any of that, but I pretend to know them all the time. At the end of the year, you look at the list and you say, there's a lot of good movies there, right? Invariably, whether they're movies,

whether they're domestic product or international product, we've, we've been international voters in the Academy since I joined. And, and we love it. We love watching those films and we see some pretty obscure stuff as a result, but there's always a lot of great, great work going on. So look, man, artists are, I give it up for all artists everywhere. It's hard to be an artist in this country, in this culture. It is really hard, especially struggling artists who are struggling to get their voices heard. It's really hard. So I, I'm not doom and gloom about the state of the art.

Then I'll tee you up for the way we end every episode of this show, which is by asking filmmakers, what's the last great thing that they have seen? What have you seen that you've liked? Have you prepared for this? Did you know this was coming? I didn't. Okay. Because I,

because I'm here, you know, as soon as we started this, I could almost hear the groaning disappointment that hit maker was not on your physical media show. No, sure. Groaning disappointment.

No, he, he, he would have run the risk of self parody if he had been here for a third time. So we don't, we don't want that for his ascendant star. That being said, you will come back with him,

and then we will have a bit of a sad nerd-off, I think. And I'm not going to give anything away, but there's a chance that I'll be back on this show maybe for... We have given you... I don't mind saying it right now... We have given you... I don't mind saying it right now. We have given you the run of show,

the pick of show that you'll join us for a draft and you can choose the year. See, because my... I've already won this draft. Okay, settle down. No, I've already won it.

Okay. I mean, that's a foregone conclusion. I'm not playing to win the draft because I've already won it. This is what they all say. I'm not playing to win the draft because I've already won it. This is what they all say. I'm playing for third chair.

You know, Chris is getting a little bit sensitive about this because he believes that it is his birthright, you know, just given how close we are. But many, many new voices have come to the show in the last few years. You now have staked your claim. And when you win, what do you mean by win? You mean voting by the people or you mean in the cosmic knowing? In the cosmic knowing.

Okay. There will be no question. Did you choose your year yet? I think we have. I don't remember. I think you were toggling between two. No, I think we chose. All right, well, don't reveal it yet.

We'll reveal it later. You'll be back. Do you want Tim to be on that episode? Hitmaker? Do you want him to be? You episode? do you want him to be you really held the bit I give you credit would you want him to be that fifth participant in that draft?

sure he's available I've won it you bring whoever you want bring your friend Quentin Tarantino I'm winning it one season with Sam Darnold this is what you get did you see something good recently? Bring your friend Quentin Tarantino. I'm winning it. One season with Sam Darnold.

This is what you get. Did you see something good recently? Can I give two? Of course. I'll give a modern one just because people should see movies. The Devil's Bath. I still haven't seen this. Horror fan that I am.

It's literally in my queue at home on Apple TV. I think it's on Shudder. It is on Shudder. Is it possibly on Shudder? Yes. It's literally in my queue at home on Apple TV. I think it's on Shudder. It is on Shudder. Is it possibly on Shudder? Yes. It's really good. This is the filmmaking duo that made Goodnight Mommy, right? Yeah. Okay. And The Lodge. The Lodge, right. It's really good. It's disturbing and it's dark, so it's not for everybody. Did Carrie sit for that one? She absolutely did, and she loved it. Oh, great. Okay. Yeah, she loved it. Maybe I'll watch that tonight. St. Jack.

Oh, yeah, please. We watched it. I was surprised to find that it's on Blu-ray. I didn't realize it had been out on Blu-ray for a while. And the Blu-ray, shit, I'm- Is it imprint? Is it overseas? It's not imprint. Imprint, a very good Australian company.

Yeah, I don't own it on Blu-ray. I have it on DVD. Shit, I left one out. Yeah. Real quick. Yeah, shout a very good Australian company. Yeah. I don't own it on Blue. I have it on DVD. Shit. I left one out. Yeah. Real quick. Yeah. Shout something out.

Second Run. I don't know Second Run. Second Run is a British company. They specialize in a lot of Eastern European cinema. It's a very, it's a small label, but they're really good. And the guy who runs that place is really passionate about his thing. And I didn't mention them, and I want to.

Okay. The Hungarian Masters box set is excellent. Interrogation by Ryszard Bugaski, 1982, is a harrowing movie about living in a totalitarian state. I advise you all to familiarize yourself with it. I love seeing you transform into Gene Shalit.

It's amazing. You were born to do it. Tomorrow, I'll wake up and scald myself with tea. That's the title of a film. And it's a great movie. And my memoir. It is a Czech sci-fi comedy about neo-Nazis who get a time machine and go back in time to deliver a hydrogen bomb to Hitler. And it is hilarious.

I'm making a note of this film. Tomorrow, I'll wake up and scald myself with tea. Jindrik Polak. Yeah. Love it. You mentioned St. Jack. St. Jack is a great movie, a great underrated Peter Bogdanovich movie, an underrated Ben Gazzara performance, and then watched him a few days later in Happiness.

That guy was good and stayed good. The goodness never went away from that guy. We also watched for the first time, we had not seen Lars von Trier's Dogville. And Ben Gazzara is great in Dogville. Remarkable movie. Yeah. He's just always great. But St. Jack, that's the shit.

That's really good stuff. That's a great book too, by the way, for those who are. Paul Theroux. I believe he pronounces his name differently than his nephew, Justin Theroux. Paul Theroux is the author of St. Jack. I don't know how that could be possible, but nevertheless, you're just, you really, you brought it today. I really, it is with great affection that I say thank you for joining the show. You are something we are aspiring to as, not as an

artist, because I'm not an artist, but as a collector, certainly, I can reach for your stars. I love this show. You guys are great. Thanks, man. I disagree with you guys so frequently. I hear it sometimes. And yet, I don't hate listen to the show. I listen because I have genuine affection for you guys and the work you do on here. You're clearly, you're working hard to make something look very easy, which is just great. So, I really enjoy the show. That's very kind of you.

Thanks, Tracy. Thank you so much for indulging all of this magnificent physical media here. Thanks to Jack Sanders for his work on this episode. Thanks to Bobby Wagner. What are we doing later this week? We do have a draft. We have a very strange draft, actually. It's the 2021 movie draft. 2021 was when you were starting your movie nights, or I guess in the middle of your movie nights it was a harder time and it was a ultimately a very weird have you already done this we have yeah we pre-recorded with amanda before she left great and uh well it went off the rails that's what i said tune in for that later this week we'll see you then Thank you.