The Big Picture - The Ridley Scott Movie Rankings and ‘The Dog Stars’

Episode Date: August 28, 2026

Sean and Amanda are joined by Chris Ryan to discuss the newest release from his guy Ridley Scott in ‘The Dog Stars’ starring Jacob Elordi and Margaret Qualley. They share their takeaways from the movie, debate Elordi’s performance and evolution as an actor, and assess where the film fits within Scott’s career. Before diving into ‘The Dog Stars’, they reflect on the passing of Dolly Parton and Tim Curry, celebrating their remarkable careers and discussing what each of them meant personally. Then, they check in on the latest James Bond casting race and debate the strongest candidates among the six remaining contenders, before touching on Ryan Gosling’s developing ‘Flintstones’ project and whether it means Chris’s king is officially dead. Finally, Sean, Amanda, and Chris take on the daunting task of ranking all 30 films in Ridley Scott’s vast filmography. (0:00) Intro (1:16) Dolly Parton and Tim Curry (5:51) The next James Bond (15:46) Ryan Gosling ‘Flintstones’ spin-off (19:23) ‘The Dog Stars’ (50:33) Talking Ridley Scott (1:02:53) The Ridley Scott Movie Rankings Hosts: Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins Guest: Chris Ryan Producer: Jack Sanders Editor: Jamie Yukich Production Support: Sarah Reddy and Lucas Cavanagh It's on Prime. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Two and five Canadians will hear the words, you have cancer. That's why every step and dollar raised matters. On September 19th, join thousands in Toronto for the Princess Margaret Cancer Foundation Walk. Challenge yourself, friends, and family to walk 21 kilometers in support of life-saving research. Together, we can carry the fire and help create a world free from the fear of cancer. Register today at pmcfwalk.ca. I'm Sean Fennessee. And this is the big picture at conversation show about Ridley Scott.

Today on the show, we're reviewing the dog stars, a searing biopic of Keanu Reeves' his beloved alternative rock band. Just kidding. We're talking about Ridley Scott's new movie, his 30th, a post-apocalyptic thriller, starring Jacob Allorty, and we are ranking every single Ridley movie with our buddy Chris Ryan. We'll do it all. Plus some movie news right after this.

Okay, bud. What's up? No laptop. Not for now. Maybe when we get to the rankings, but I do feel like I almost remember my rankings. I've committed that to memory. The big picture, it's just, it's second nature to me now. Wow. It comes that easily. And yet still questions about third chair. We don't have to get into that. Okay. I don't want to. I feel like we're giving it more oxygen by discussing it all the time.

Who's we? Just like this podcast by talking about whether or not there's any, like I'm battling guys on all fronts. Did you feel that Bill threw his hat in the ring? What kind of happened earlier? Okay. Let's talk about some movie news. Very sad. news two very sad deaths, two 80-year-old icons, figures that are very notable to our youths and the youths of many. Dolly Parton, who passed away yesterday, as did the actor Tim Curry. And they both have a fascinating, sort of like modestly scaled experience for me personally, but very impactful and very memorable. Dolly, how do you feel? Sad. I mean, and it is a loss, not just to the country music world and to movies because she obviously had a huge impact, both on and off screen.

But, you know, not to the state of Tennessee, not just to the state of Tennessee, where I didn't grow up, but my family did. And I have, I have been to Dollywood. I have, I have toured the museums. I have ridden the log flume. I know what it is to be in Gatlinburg, Tennessee. But like the world at large, she was just one of the last, a great, good people, you know, always on the side of right. And so she'd obviously, she'd been sick for a while. She had been canceling appearances for the last few months and like, you know, sending updates. But you could tell.

And so hopefully she is, you know, more apiece now. But it's, it was one of those where I felt like for the first 24 hours, everyone reminded you of like, and another thing. And remember how she just paid for the Moderna vaccine. And like, you know, my child knows how to read because of Dolly Parton. And all of these things are true. You know, that great Eminem share. the letter that she wrote him when they were inducted into the rock and roll or he was inducted into the rock and roll. Did you see that? I didn't. I love that. That's a beautiful thing.

It was so lovely. Yeah. So she was sort of like, I'm not no hip hop expert, but I know that you're the best. And I really just appreciate your light and everything that you're bringing into art. That was the thing that jumped out of me. Obviously somebody and a vanishing amount of people who have the approval rating of somebody like Dolly Parton. But I really. thought it was cool, the way at which it seemed to impact the artistic community around her and the way, like, her peers and colleagues and the people who were inspired by her, everybody from like Sabrina Carpenter to Jack White to whatever, have been reacting to it. I mean, obviously, just a huge loss.

Yeah, and in the world of movies, she made a real impact. She didn't start too many films, really only this kind of 10-year period in the 80s and 90s where she was leading films like 9 to 5, Best Little Horhouse in Texas, twice nominated for an Academy Award. just last year, she received the Gene Herscholt Humanitarian Award for her work in part with children's education. She's helped deliver millions of books to kids around this country. So, like, truly an iconic figure, the rare, decent mega-celebrity. True.

I feel like I know too much about celebrity culture at large now, and it's so frequently heartbreaking. And didn't hear a single bad thing about Dolly Parton in my entire life. And I don't want to now. Nor do I. You're still reeling from what you've found out about Mark Woll. Walter. You thought he was just like... Yeah, I thought he was the new Andrew Carnegie, you know?

I thought we could believe in him and build a country around his ideas. You know, Tim Curry is sort of the opposite in that he was a famously very private man and wanted his legacy to be his roles on screen. And his roles on screen were huge and outrageous. Rocky Horror Picture Show, legend, my beloved Congo, my beloved Clue. Hunt for Red October. It, he was the original Pennywise and It. Muppet Treasure Island for the 90s kids

And home alone too lost in New York Who can forget? Never forget Who can forget? What is his credit card line? He's got one line delivery about the credit card Totally memorable but like an unmistakable screen presence Also a great and trained and skilled actor who performed on the West End for years And was in many many, many great theatrical productions Did he originate the role of Amadeus?

I believe he did In the play that was then trying to know I had no idea I think so. I think that's something that I learned after his passing. Okay. Yes. And, you know, somebody who for me is in the wallpaper of movies, you know, somebody who is always a part of movies because I watched so many of these movies at such a critical age. And I remember seeing him as darkness and legend at a young age, which is a real kind of gateway movie for me in terms of both fantasy and horror. And freaking out when I saw what he really looked like out of the makeup.

And that being a real movie magic moment for me, but I just loved him as an actor. I thought he was always a ton of fun in movies. So he's a big loss as well. Let's pivot to James Bond. Oh, sure. Okay. We've been intermittently covering this ongoing discussion about who's going to be the next James Bond. Just yesterday in page 6, there was a report that the race to be cast as the next James Bond has been narrowed down to six men.

Which, according to many people, means that's actually, it's been widened from two to six because we weren't happy with our options. So who were the two in your mind? I had heard a lot of unsourced and scuttlebut that it was between Callum Turner and Jacob Allerty. Okay. And now we just have some more names. Those two men are still in the running, but no one has nailed it down yet. And then there was another, and forgive me for not remembering where I read this, but another report that, That was about how it could be someone we don't know anything about.

It would be like a wide casting call. And unknown. Pluck this guy out of like a Netflix series somewhere and it's going to be James Bond. Well, you know, I think it's fair to say that one of the names and the most surprising name that I saw was Jack Barton, who is another actor on Heartstopper, a show I don't watch and whose work I'm less familiar with relative to the other five men who are up for this, which is Jack Loudon, Callum Turner, Jacob Allorty, Paul Meskell, and Harris Dickinson. So, you know, those are five of the most well-known under 40 Irish-British actors around.

Right. Plus, Jacob Allorty. And then in Australian as well. And I think that that is material given the role and the history of who has played the role. We've had an English, Irish, and Australian bond before, right? So that wouldn't be shocking. Any thought? Who are you rooting for?

on a personal affection level, Jack Loudon, but also may have played himself out of the role by being so good as a spy on slow horses. Also, he is Mr. Darcy in the upcoming Netflix Pride and Prejudice. And I really honestly can't have Mr. Darcy also be James Bond. Like that's deeply... That's too overwhelming. And at what point does, like, you know, continuum break?

There's... The Amanda continuum of popular culture? Yes. I'm really bad. I'm battling myself here because on one hand his performance is River Cartwright is excellent. The next season of Slow Horses is fantastic. That's

coming out in September. He actually is phenomenal in this season and gets to be paired off with Gary Oldman quite a bit, which is a real delight. Part of me wants him to get Bond just to see if the Sersha Ronan Bond villain thing happens.

She has been publicly advocating and campaigning for in somewhat of a tongue-in-cheek way. But... Would be delicious if he were cast. I would prefer him to mescal. I would prefer him to... A Lordy.

I'm, like, pretty okay. I'd be happy with Jack O'Connell. I think that would be... He's not in the running... But he should be. Yeah, he's not in the page six report. Okay, sorry. He would be my pick.

Just because as an actor, he's my favorite of those actors. I mean, we'll talk a little bit more about Allerty when we get into the dog stars today. Well, just... So on the overlapping, breaking... Amanda's basetime continuum. Can you have Paul McCartney and or John Lennon also being James Bond?

That's confusing. To me, he is not James Bond. That's Paul Meskell and Harris Dickinson. I'm just pointing it out, you know? Harris Dickinson, I think we know as an artiste, as a sinist. That would seem like an odd casting. I do think he has the appropriate look and style that would be a pivot away from previous bonds, but still fit.

And a second blonde. Bond. Yes. But also even a different kind of blonde, like it wouldn't be a replication of Craig who is sort of more shorter and stout and more powerful. Do you think this bond will wear barrel jeans? They can't, I mean, they can't have any of these guys be modern bond, right? They have to do a retro.

I wonder. I don't know. That's an interesting question. But I mean, I'm open to it, I guess. Bond on hinge. Can we do a bond running check for a second? Because we're going to talk more about the dog stars later in this episode. But I do want to check in now that we have recent evidence of Jacob Allorty running on screen to compare with recent evidence of Callum Turner running on screen for those of us who saw one night only.

Not yet. Me and me only. So just to recap for you, Callum Turner, some work to do. It's not very ergonomic. It's sort of like a chicken dance situation when running. And I would say that Jacob Allorty is more aerodynamic. He doesn't look silly while running around and the dog starts. A couple things.

One of the reasons I think why I'm intrigued by Jack Loudon is because he seems height appropriate. Also, I'll say to your point about slow horses, you know, Pierce Brosnan was Remington Steel. Sure. Like there is a history of sort of like pre-auditioning for Bond by showing that you can do components of the work before getting the job. Those slow horses is a different interpretation of the work and its components. He gets his ass kicked all the time. And it's just like, oh, shit, I did the wrong thing. It's going to be interesting to see how classical.

Bill Nouve wants to go with the storytelling. You know, does he want this to just be tuxedoed, shaken, not stirred, or does he want it to be something even more modern than what Craig was able to pull off? I don't know. We're going to find out. But these three of these guys are really fucking tall. And did... You're saying that like it's a bad thing? And like, you're

also not a tall person. But he's not Jacob-Bority tall. I'm not six-five. I mean, that's... And that's a lot. To your loss. Yeah. I'm getting along just fine. But I would say my height is Bond height. Oh, interesting.

Now, that might be the only thing about me to bondish. But I think six feet, and I don't even know how tall Brazen or Connery or how tall those guys work. Do you think you would be a good 007, like practically speaking? No. I think I love to drink martinis. Yeah. Doesn't really like international travel. That's not true.

You do like gadgets. I sure do. I just think it would be so funny. That would be my problem. They were trying to get in touch with you because there was a nuclear missile aimed at England and you were like, oh, sorry, I was at an Austrian film. I'll tell you what, it would be not surprising if I were distracted from time spent with a glamorous woman by my work. That is something that, you know, has happened from time to time. So I can relate to that component, you know.

Sorry, wish I could lounge on the beach with you, my dear, with the, you know, insinuating name. I have to go hang out with Q. A non. Yeah. What about you? Do I think I'd be a good bond? No, I'm too short, apparently. Yeah, well, let's break the paradigm.

I wasn't aware that there was such a narrow. height range, according to you, the person who cares the least about Bond at this table. It's very true. I am intrigued by this kind of thing, though, as you know, this is, this is the fun of movies. I just want to go on record and say that I do not think Jacob Lurdy or Harris Dickinson are too tall to be James Bond or anything else. Okay. They're not going to put this out in 2028, though. No. They can't.

They can't do it to us. Oh, just because that's too important a year? Yeah, it's just like that's. Because that's the vice year. We're going to go on Twitch for 365 days in 2020. Yeah, sure. Like, stream. We'll just stream.

You know, okay. I just saw a foreign film this morning. And one of the characters in the film was, you know, 30-year-old woman laying in bed playing video games. And I was like, hot. Is this it? Is this the way? Like, is this where maybe should my 50s be defined by acting like this? Acting like her or getting your wife to start playing.

video games. Why not both? Yeah. Okay. I mean, it's coming for you. I can't wait. I know the film in question and I wonder if there's anything else from that that you want to imitate and import into your own life. We'll get into that. Do you think we'll play Resident Evil too on some sort of gaming platform for people's entertainment? You want to do that? Yeah. Well, that's the key inspiration for Zach Craigers film. That's why I've heard nothing about screenings, no communication whatsoever about this movie.

I looked into seeing if there were pre-sales available, not on sale. Okay. The film comes out in 21 days. That's fascinating. Considering where things are right now with Dune tickets and AMC Zap crashing and Doomsday and all that. And Zach Greger and the anticipation. Yeah. I do feel like I saw, you know, a poster for it at the movie theater yesterday. There's a second trailer. They're marketing it, but it's not the same frenzy.

But I think it's actually going to be quite big. Me too. Yeah. Because there's also going to be this wide gap between a very popular movie coming out. There's also just like across generations, many men have reached out to me and been like, I like Resident Evil. That's beautiful. It was nice.

You know, you guys didn't have anything to unite you, so it's good that you have this. Will you play it as really the question? Would you play Resident Evil, too, with us? What happens in Resident Evil? Tell me about it. Tell me about the world. Sell me? Well, it's the film or the video games?

The video game. You're asking me to play a video game. Tell me what game you get to play as a woman named Claire. Okay. Who arrives in a city called Raccoon City. Centering a woman story. Uh-huh. Claire A-I-R-E.

Yeah. And I can't remember a lot of the vagaries of her character, but you have to solve a lot of puzzles and kill a woman in a video game. What a surprise. It's a zombie apocalypse game, the survival first person shooter game. Okay. One of the reasons why video games are so popular is that you get to project your own stuff onto the characters because you're playing as them.

So it would be for you, you know, whatever you're going through that day. You were Claire. Okay. What time of day would we be doing this? I don't know. What do you want me to make a commitment? I'm asking the questions. Chris and I will come over at midnight on a Tuesday.

Yeah. It's a good idea. And I'm interested, but I don't want to be on Twitch. Speaking of things I don't want. Okay. Ryan Gosling, reportedly, is developing a Flintstone's spinoff movie centered on the character of Bam Bam, who I guess is Barney and Betty's son. I've seen the Flintstones many times

Yeah he has very very blonde hair Like white blonde hair and he has like a club that he uses as a baseball bat Yeah, to say bam bam bam yeah Is there any way in this world where this is saber rattling to Mattel And Warner Brothers to make the Barbie deal And he's like if you guys don't do this soon I'm just going to go be a Flintstone And then I can't be Ken You know

I think that's a very generous interpretation. Yes. Otherwise, my king is dead. Yeah. Yeah. My interpretation was like,

is he somehow going to make this into a prequel for Barbie and connect the various universes? Because if you think about the character of Bam Bam and the character of Ken

as interpreted by Ryan Gosling, not that different. Well, that's what I'm wondering. Yeah. Is it basically like, I'll just take my money and go over here then? It's certainly possible.

It just said that the film is he's developing the film with his production company. It did not say that he would be starring his Bambam. I think that's notable. That's true. I do think Bambam. Adult Bamb. In this development is meant to be the teenage Bambam who we see in later season. There's like a spin-off Flintstones animated show.

I spent some time reading into the Hanna-Barbera lore the other day. This made me want to kill myself. So I just want to, I was trying to find ways out of this feeling by reading more about these cartoons. Somehow loop this in with End of Oak Street? Sure. Yeah. Bam Bam is introduced in 1982. Yeah, maybe he gets flashed into that period of time in history. That's possible. I don't know. You know, the gossiping thing is, it's devolving.

Yeah. That's what I'll say. And I hope this gets figured out soon, and he's cast as a violent assassin. A broken man boy. A motorcycle racer who, you know, is going through a hard divorce. That's what I need next from Ryan. Let's save this last bit to discuss as we go through the Ridley experience. Any other news you want to get off your chest? Any other personal announcements? Oh, hey,

thanks to the folks at American Cinemattock. For all three of us, we shared films this week with fans during that. You guys were at the Los Angeles Free last night. Born Identity last night. We were at the Arrow on Wednesday night. No, on Tuesday night. We had a great time showing out of sight, which was wonderful.

You know what's really good? Born identity. Oh, I thought you were going to say out of sight. And out of sight. Also really, really good. Both good films, yeah. And it seems like we both had really nice, raucous audiences and a lot of people who hadn't seen the films before. I know that was very, very exciting. And I talked to a couple people on the way out who were there for the first time. And they were just like, hey, that ruled.

Yeah, yeah. Really good pick. Pretty exciting. So I was pleased about that. Yeah, you think these things that are, that we talk about all the time that we feel like are endemic to the shows that we've been making for a really long time are universally understood. But you know what? That's like what you were talking about with Matt Johnson, where it was just like these people under 25. they're essentially driving the survival and revival of movie houses.

Yeah. They haven't necessarily up on all the born movies. Of course not. Yeah. And where should they go next after identity? I think the ultimatum, or not being sorry, supremacy. Okay, just because that's number two. Well, it's also, like, very key to the first film.

I thought you're going to say your sexual awakening, given Joan Allen's performance. Yes, that's right. Okay. Let's talk about Ridley Scott and the dog stars. So it sounds like an Australian pub band So this movie is based on a novel written by Peter Heller The screenplay is adapted by Mark L. Smith, a very seasoned screenwriter. Some notable heads of department coming in on this one

That I cited to Chris last night, Amanda, That No Darius Walski shooting this movie, two in a row now, Not Working with Relie Scott if we're working on many, many movies with Ridley over the years. David Fincher alum, Eric Messerschmitt, The Academy Award-winning DP is on this. Walski shot Resident Evil, which maybe explains why he isn't on this movie. This movie starts Jacob Allorty,

Margaret Quali, Benedict Wong, Guy Pearce, Alison Janney, set after a devastating flu pan... And Josh Brolin. And Josh Brolin. We'll get to him. Don't worry. I know. I just wanted to give him his credit. Yeah, we'll get there. I promise you.

Set after a devastating flu pandemic that is almost eradicated humanity, the film centers on Hague, a former civilian pilot, and Bangley, a hardened former Marine, as they confront outside threats and hold on to the possibility of a better life beyond where they currently live, which is in Colorado.

Yes. Amanda, what did you think of the dog stars? I mean, Yauza is what I think of it. It is many movies in one, which is not a compliment. But some of those movies are, if not, interesting, then at least soothing. I did think to myself about 30 minutes into this film, okay, so this is just a movie about Jacob Allorty feeding his dog for two hours, which I'm not not into. And I think that Jacob Allerty is the right height to do that and to wear all the immaculate.

So short guys can't feed their dogs either? Tough one for you. I'm good. I just don't understand. Don't ever get a dog. I can't reach. He's got to, that's good. I don't know.

Is that even true? he's got to bend down a lot. But, you know, he's limbered. That's good. Mobility is an important part of health and longevity. So he's working on it now. Thank you. You're like the doctor, Becky, for Pilates' moms.

I don't know whether that's really nice or the meanest thing you've ever seen. I think it means you've achieved your final four. Thank you so much. Yeah, he looks great in the car heart. There's an immaculate sweat jacket that shows up at some point. I have to, I have a lot I want to talk to you about. And then I guess the plot starts. I'm like, what's happening here?

And it doesn't seem like anyone involved really has any of the pacing or the narrative beats laid down. It didn't look as bad as it could have. You know, there are parts of the event that I think look beautiful. It was shot in Italy. Yes, devastating to me. Well, I did say that you, I was like, you know what? this is the first time that Colorado's ever looked appealing to me. Spoiler alert, it was Italy. I was talking to Chris yesterday, and I was like, well, you know what? I liked being in Colorado

for two hours. That was nice and he was like, sorry, bud, that was shot in Italy. I mean, they seem to have a delightful experience there, and they also shot a Chinchetta. Usually after we see a screening that I know that we'll be talking about, like, days later, I'll try to, like, leave myself a voice memo as I drive home, usually from Westfield. And it's a longish drive. And so sometimes, I can get lost in thought. This one I only had one sentence. Zach Bryan's, Cormack McCarthy's The Road.

I think I actually summed it up quite well. I agree with a lot of what Amanda said. However, it's been weird to see the Rotten Tomato score and the critical rejection of this movie. Because I'm like, it was bad, but it didn't suck. If that makes sense? I pretty much agree with that. Yes.

It's not. It's unsuccessful. But it's not incompetent. Right. Yeah. Yes. And there are two times we're like, why are you doing this? And I would have not done it.

But the answer is pretty clear is that it's based on a novel. And so this is part of the plot. And that they just made the- There is one particular sequence, which is the most audacious thing in the movie that is not in the novel. Okay. And that choice, I would say dramatically shifted my opinion of the movie. Because I was having what, it was sort of the way you were to. describing watching a Lordy do a lot of those things sounded like ASMR, like visual ASMR.

And this movie has a kind of like, I just love this terrain and I want to spend as much time as I can, as I can't exploring it with aerial photography. There's some beautiful aerial photography. There's a lot of kind of quiet, contemplative moments with this sort of like sad, beautiful man who's lost his wife. Right. And is figuring out how to live in this post-apocalyptic environment. It's narratively like dead on arrival. Like the movie has no energy or pace whatsoever. But it does look good and you've got very handsome actors. You've got this kind of like men's influencer energy of guys ripping tree stumps out of the ground

and using cross saws together. And it does have something going on. It kind of has like the most expensive like outdoorsman YouTube video ever made of like, God, it's really pleasant watching him just like work on an old plane. Or it's like, or fly the old plane or fish. It's like Maga Terrence Malick or something. There's just like something. Like it's not.

And so it looks kind of good. And you feel like you're watching a Hollywood movie. But as soon as you said, that the plot engine starts grinding, you can feel like I've seen at least 10 post-apocalyptic thrillers that are way more interesting than this. It's the inversion of what a lot of those post-apocalyptic thrillers do, which is typically spend a lot of time explaining the factions that are out there.

And, you know, like, oh, the reapers are going to come for you. or whatever. And this is kind of like, that's all brushed aside. Like, there are awareness or understanding the main two characters are Allorty who plays a guy

named Hig and Josh Brolin who plays a guy named Bangley. Yeah. And they have like basically created a fortress and an airfield in Erie, Colorado. And they are like

somewhat aware that there are bad guys out there who are kind of trying to come for their patch. But... And it's sort of suggested in the movie before we see them, that there might be, like, some zombie potential here,

but they're really more just, like, kind of crazed survivors. Yeah, it takes place in 2035, I think, right? I think that's right. Well, that's, yes. And so it's 10 years, I don't know when the apocalypse is supposed to have occurred, but I don't know. They've been doing this for a minute. And it's a pandemic-era novel as well, right?

I believe so, yeah. No, I think that it's pre-date that? It's 2012. Oh, okay. And so there's like an awareness of these people, but there's not, it doesn't get like bogged down in like the ideology and or state of the people who are coming for them. I will say I randomly happen to watch one of those mega trailers where they like cut together all the ads and different trailers. And I was struck by several things that are in the trailers that are not in the movie, including much more zombified looking figures. So I don't know if that was. I have a, once we get into spoilers, I have a follow-up question about that because it did feel there were some sort of visual faints or like clues in the movie that were never followed up on and it did feel like things were chopped up or that things just kind of didn't gel together.

I mean, it is also a Ridley Scott movie so we know that there's four hours of footage somewhere that Chris is going to do a director's commentary for. We could talk about his technical approach to making films and how that's impacted, how these stories are told at some point. Yeah, it just seems like he shoots a lot of footage with long scripts. And if he has an idea, he explores that idea really deeply. And then they kind of figure it out in post. And that was clearly true in Napoleon.

It was clearly true in Gladiator 2. A lot of the recent movies. He's shooting with 10 cameras. He's not shooting scenes with intention. But I think there's also, like, kind of a lack of fealty to hard story structure and script in terms of the execution of the movies. And you can feel like because they're all kind of baggy now. or they all feel like they're missing something.

And, you know, I did eventually rewatch the Napoleon director's cut, and I thought it improved upon the movie a little bit. But maybe not enough that it got to, like, you know, an A-minus, even though I think all three of us kind of had a fun time with that movie. Yeah. It's entertaining, but it's not the mega success that it should be. And he's now going through all these kind of series of styles of films. This is yet another genre zone that he's never really hit a movie like this before.

And so he's going down the list of stuff like this. And, you know, they're just not as sharp. You know, they're not as sharp as the movies in the early 2000s and certainly not those breakthrough movies in the late 70s and early 80s. But I still, I don't hate watching his movies. I really enjoy watching the movies. This feels like a case where both the script story and I think his general, like, truly unlocking of the world is working against it.

I also think I have some Jacob Allure. questions. And I think we should talk about it. It's important. Generally Like what? Compared to what? Well, I mean, he's very important to Amanda, right? She has grabbed him as one

of her guys, right? She's climbed him. She's climbed him. Not yet. A few more Pilates class. I liked his work in Frankenstein quite a bit. I thought he was a terrific Elvis in Priscilla. I think he's a talented actor. He's very

effective in the first two seasons of euphoria. Not the third one? I think the writing maybe failed him a little bit. Okay. I thought he was quite poor in this movie and I think he was like really lacking a deeper register that if you can't connect to this character

then you're going to have a hard time with this movie and maybe that's the circumstances or the script or the way that the movie is being filmed with 10 cameras or what but I just wasn't with him emotionally at all and so that's a big drawback for the movie. I'll say this. There's a clip flying around about with Guy Pearce talking about making this movie and he's like, well, you know, I've worked with Ridley before, really works very fast now. He shoots with many cameras so that rather than doing coverage and doing, you know, a master or two and then everybody's close-up coverage, there might be a camera on a hillside with a very long lens so that

that's your close-up, but then there's also these three or four other cameras and he's essentially cutting between the cameras like a live TV director and assembling the movie as he goes along. And he was like, so sometimes you don't know what camera you're playing to. And I was like, for Guy Pearce and Josh Brolin and Benedict Wong, that may not matter as much. Right.

For maybe actors who are still developing their craft and what they're doing, I think that might have been complicated. And there are times especially in the beginning of the movie where you're just sort of like, You're putting this guy in an airplane hanger with Josh Brolin and having them do a two-person play. And I think he actually is got something. I don't know what it is. But maybe not man with no name mystique.

Yeah. Well, I don't disagree. The first 30 to 40 minutes of this movie, as I said, is him feeding a dog. But it's also silent. And it is him doing outdoorsy stuff and flying plane. and being silent and being part of an image. And for the most part, they are very beautiful images. It is a little ASMR.

It does test how long I can watch Jacob Alorty doing manly things without getting bored. But at the same time, it is very soothing. So I think he's great at being photographed, which is part of being an actor and being part of a movie star. I don't disagree that once you have to get into the plot and especially the emotional motivation, that he's not really selling his backstory. But to be fair, the movie is not giving him much to work with. It's giving him, and if I can, do some light spoilers here, you know, ghost hologram wife who comes in and out. and he just has to play the same scene of sitting in one room, like, looking sad.

And that is supposed to be the entire explication of his past life and everything that he's lost. He was a simple guy with simple needs. Sure, he was a mechanic. Live in the dream. Maybe this is in the book, too, but the characterization of his character and Margaret Arquale's character is so oversimplified, and it feels like the New Hollywood and European cinema never happened. It's like this is just a purely good man whose wife died. Right.

Who loves his dog and he's a mechanic and he likes to fix things. And that's it. Like there is no depth. There's nothing he's done that he feels bad about. The one thing we see that he feels bad about. Yeah, like is he a Broncos fan. There's not a single personality trait. On a more basic level, I think he's too young.

Because even as you're doing the timelines, okay, I mean, he, Jacob Lurdy in real life is, I think, just turned 29. And I know that because I was a little taken aback. But even then, if you're riding him up to 34, then what, 10 years ago? He's 24. He's married. What happens when the hunky guys that you dig are closer an age to your sons than you? I don't like thinking about it. And I just, I don't think that we need to.

Me and Shaw are like first time. Yeah, Franco meme. Yeah. I think what you said, I think what you both said is right. Which is he's not given a ton of material to work with, and he may be working in a way that is very different from, say, the hyper meticulous Giyomo del Toro style, right? Where, like, he is looking for every specificity

and knows exactly what he wants. And, like, you know, I really was not a huge fan of that Frankenstein movie, but I thought he was fantastic as the monster. Do you like him in Salper? Yeah, I think that's a more simple part, but I think he was very good at it. I thought that was an example of a director using what at that time he was very good at and photographing him in a very elegant way,

but also like emphasizing his skills and hiding any of his weaknesses. I thought he was not as successful in Wuthering Heights. I thought both he and Margarabi were miscast. You seen Wuthering Heights? I haven't actually yet. It's okay. It's yet another like, actually I kind of liked it from CR. Yeah, not unlike Saltburn.

Or materialists. Yeah, it's right in that zone for you. But we're on the front lines, which will allow you to then pivot. Of course, it's where I love to be. That's what I love to be. But I would say even in Wuthering Heights, there is a similar problem here where he's not, there's nothing, you're getting nothing from him in that.

And so there's very little heat, there's very little, he's supposed to be longing and pining and, you know, this wild, untameable character. And he's just kind of like, they're smirking. What do you think? I agree. I was trying to put my finger on this. If Ridley Scott had had his way and this movie could have been made at any time

over the last 20 years, who do you think should have played that role? Like, is that, is that supposed to be Sam Rockwell? Is that supposed to be... No, I do think it needs to be

a more imposing physical presence. Okay, so now his height is okay. It doesn't have to be tall, but just a little more rugged, I guess. Like, could Val Kilmer have done this part? Sure. I'm trying to think of, like,

what, it's like pretty, but tough, right? Yes. Yeah, I have to say, this may seem like a superficial critique of the film but I was distracted by his wardrobe It's unreal It's Jacob Allorty's wardrobe Right? He's wearing like a big puff

Like a big floppy scarf Like a what do they call those? Besides scarves like but the way like the guys have like scarves That are like huge giant I don't know if they have a particular Big scarf for a guy That's totally fine He's like Kaffia what do you mean

No he's just wearing like a scarf that was popular Like a Paschina? Yeah. Kind of. But I don't think, I mean, it's Paschmena, so I don't think it is a Paschmina, but I know what you're saying. I think it's more about the Carhart jacket and the suede jacket and the jeans that fit just so, even though he's living desperately and sleeping on the ground every night. Like he's going full corp core. Yeah.

Those jeans are amazing. Yeah. And it's true that all of the clothes are still an immaculate condition. And he does have, I mean, we are shown that he goes back to his pre-pandemic. Excuse me, but it's, you know, right there home. So he maybe does have access to a full closet, but I would agree the variety, the cut, the fit. And he has 6'5. So I don't think it's that easy to find jeans that fit that well. He had everything tailored.

He invested in quality pieces. And when you do that, you can expect them to last. So there was a double Carhart moment when he's visiting the Mennonites one time. And then the sway jacket, which I am assuming is. Bataga because he has a like a deal with Batega but I don't know anyway. Well it took me out of the moment. I thought it was wonderful. I'm sure

you did but much like... Did it threaten you because you would like to be able to dress like that? Nothing about him threatens me I'm a 48 year old man. I don't walk around me like I don't know. I'm just like but listen like Carhart well-fitting jeans

a vest layering. I think he looks great. Colour palette. But it's there, it's in your lane. Like, you're doing it the CR way, but it is similar. But a character who had essentially been living off of, like, beef, chili and carrots for 10 years. Sure. Fixing shit and living with Josh Brolin would not look like he was throwing fits. I mean, he would be wearing one fucking coveralls, and that's it.

Like, you know? I completely agree with you. And yet, I didn't care. I know. I tripped out on the beef chili. And the preparation of the beef chili. It took two minutes to make it. Exactly. Thank you so much.

And all he did, like, I guess he did brown the meat, but then he just poured something else in. And he was like, congratulations, here's beef chili. I guess we're not shown the stew, so it may not be an appealing stew. We may sound insane. No, we may sound crazy, but you're supposed to think about that. No, there's time spent on these parts of the story. There's a lot of time spent with Jacob Allerty, not speaking, wearing jackets. That's a big part of the film.

There are other incidents that eventually do happen. We should talk about them. So Jacob Bellorty's dog is killed during the film. Yeah, and it's sort of Josh Boland's fault. And it's sort of Josh Boland's fault because Josh Boland is attempting to teach him a lesson by arriving at just the last minute to save his bacon when some survivors... Because he's been like... Hit his camp. Slacking on making sure he's not being followed back on his recon runs.

And Brolin, who is his partner in survival, and they have this kind of munitions and chilly tent together. It's an airplane hangar. It is an airplane hangar. It is not a tent. Even, but then a Lorty does sleep outside for like watch purposes? Well, it seemingly also he just enjoys that. Okay. Right.

Right. Right. They underdeveloped the title until the end there. Yeah. So when they're attacked. Much like the beef stew. Jasper, his dog, takes a bullet. and dies.

And this sends him into a kind of existential despair, and it leads him to leaving Erie, Colorado, to go find chase a voice that he hears over the radio in Grand Junction. Right. He doesn't make it to Grand Junction, quite, and he crash lands in the middle of a forest. Conveniently does not have his airplane destroyed landing in the middle of a forest. And he comes upon...

He's a mechanic. I just mean in terms of not hitting a tree. That was convenient that he didn't hit the train. Yeah, he picked a meadow he was going. Yeah, and he did a good job in that. I'm glad you approved. And he stumbles upon a small pioneer town style ranch. Well, no, he stumbles upon a magical donkey.

That's true. He stumbles upon a magical donkey, which he then follows. Time out. Time out. He is almost trampled by a herd of CJI. Bison. Yeah. Really, really, really, really tough. That was one of the one we looked at each other, like, oh, no.

I forgot about that. Thank you. Gladiator to Baboon Zoo from hell. Really, we gotta stop doing this. We really didn't need that either. No. That was just not necessary.

I guess maybe to show that one of the wings was somewhat damaged when he later fixes it. He could hit a tree. It's fine. It's fine. We didn't need to do by son. And so then he finds the magical donkey

who also survived the bison stampede. Yes. And leads him back to this homestead. Yes, which features yet another perfectly quaffed and uniformed, beautiful young actor in Margar Qualley. Yes. Who's the last thing she did before the apocalypse was Seaboy Genius.

Very much has that vibe. And her damned ornery father, who almost blows Jacob Allardy's head off, he's played by Guy Pearce. Now, as soon as Guy Pearce showed up, I was like, oh, good, a real actor. Like, no shots to Josh Brolin, who I love, but who I thought was kind of doing... Josh Brolin core.

He was doing Stick, yeah. He was like, I'm just kind of redoing my Sicario character, which is something that I enjoy, but was total schick. But he's also, like, doing push-ups in between takes. And, like, there are many, like, revealing shots of his biceps. Like, it's a lot. I know it's something that you enjoy. I enjoy it.

But Pierce, who also, I love. He's an intensity that's very well-com. But he brings something to the movie instantaneously where you're like, oh, okay, there's some stakes in this movie. People care. And he has an uneasy lack of trust for this man, as all, as people do of all outsiders there. but she naturally is drawn to this handsome 29-year-old man in Carhart

and a slow romance begins to evolve. And I guess this is really where the plot starts a humming a bit, but I also felt like the story never really took off either because we don't know what anyone is really after. I guess we think he's trying to get to Grand Junction because there might be something there. But I find that so interesting because what happens when they eventually do go to Grand Junction

in a narrow escape from this homestead. is something that is an invention from the book. Apparently. It's so funny because when I was watching the movie, and the film takes this really hard turn, and we are fully spoiling. We're now into the third act of this movie. I was watching the movie,

and the film has a kind of stylistic shift where tonally and visually, something has changed. It's moved from this kind of naturalistic, um, homesteading, adventure tale into something much more dystopian and absurd. And I was like, this is actually something in a great genre novel that you can do. Like, you can just turn the page on a chapter and just shift the vibe pretty dramatically.

Yeah. And you're like, I'm going with it, right? I'm in the middle of this story. I'm still in the lead character. Stephen King does that a lot. All the time. Yeah. Where it's like a story goes from being very natural, like, dream catcher is the number one version of that for me, where you're like in the middle of that story.

And then he just shows you what the story is really about. And you're like, oh, okay, it's this. So I was willing to forgive it because I was like, well, this is the novel. And then I learned that it's not even in the novel. And I was like, so where did this idea even come from? How would you describe this sequence in the movie? It is, it's sort of like, well, I recently on vacation state at the TWA Hotel at JFK Airport, which is a like a refurbished hotel originally opened in the 60s, very like Jetsons, mad many type looking.

And the TWA hotel has preserved as much as they can about this. experience. And then you get to watch planes, which if you have two sons is awesome. But so this was like the TWA Hotel from Hell. It does have, it's a highly stylized. And to your point, you turn to me, Sean, as soon as we got there and said, well, how do they have power? Like very angrily, because the internal logic of the movie is ruptured. But so bright, like retro futuristic, very, like, eerie, kind of Wario weirdo land

like something weird is going on in this there's something off the makeup is quite pale and darkened under the eyes

right and there's you know whether it's like stepfordy or robotic or something there is just clearly

like you're in some immediately in some uncomfortable vibe yeah yeah

and I guess it becomes clear that this is some sort of safe haven slash farm for

a small colony of cannibals. And Allison Janney is the leader of former stewardess who has had a Stalinesque rise to power in this community. True. And it just like totally tilts the movie over and unmoored me from whatever story we were even trying to accomplish. And I don't even really know what the story was at that point.

Well, because I think that other than that whole sequence, which like you said is at least not any published synopsis of the book, I haven't read Dog Stars and seems to be a film invention from Mark Smith and Ridley. It's a slightly dull but legible movie about a guy who's very nervous to open himself back up to human connection because he's lost everything, he's lost his dog. His mentor is telling him that they can't let anyone on their homestead because everybody else is a roach and we've got a good thing here where we defend what we have and we can just keep going just the two of us.

and then he meets someone, but by meeting her, he's like, fuck, like, what if I lose you too? That's all like... Yeah, And also, I still haven't let go

of my... Yes, former life. But this whole thing with, like, there's a grand junction thing, there's like... And there's also the weird cult. That's sort of the problem also of the second and third act

is that it's not just following a lordy. They're introducing a whole new narrative. and so, like, you cut back for a long period of time to Brolin's homestead, and which is raided, and it's, like, technically pretty exciting, and, you know, we- It's a cool sequence, but it feels like it's in a different movie. Yeah. Totally, and we like watching Ridley Scott, like, blow things up, and he clearly likes to do that as well, and it is also some, like, excitement in a movie that's been pretty laid back.

But you don't have any explanation of who those people are, and it goes on for so long that then it's a narrative strain that isn't really totally played out and then you dip to Grand Junction where Allorty is not involved in that scene. He's just kind of standing there for the most point. That's one of the things that's in the

trailer that I watched is a already has like a different scene with Allison Janney. It's a combination of the turn you get in a lot of zombie horror movies which is A, the place that we thought was Paradise turns out to be hell and B like these people have been like

we're not the first ones to come here like that we find all these passports from people who have tried to come to Grand Junction before and have obviously been killed for whatever reason. There's also, so when you first meet Guy Pearce, he has a very visible tattoo on his forearm that looks like the graffiti that's shown at the beginning of the film. And then when they show up in Grand Junction,

he starts rolling up his sleeves in a very specific way. And I was like, oh. Oh, God, I didn't even notice that. So are you? is there something here where you have a connection with one of the cold things and blah, blah, blah, but then you guys couldn't make it work and so you cut it out? I think that's true. Is that true?

That's really interesting. I didn't even notice that. I mean, it was just purposeful enough. Because their behavior at Grand Junction is strange across the board. Guy Pearce is not acting like the way Guy Pearce has been acting for the rest of the movie. Allorty is basically silent. Quali is essentially silent. So it's just a very strange sequence.

It goes on for quite a long time. in the book, apparently, they like touch down and take back off again. Essentially a trick where they're meant to just trip wire the plane as it's landing to track them there. But he sniffs it out and they take off. And they never really properly land at Grand Junction.

Yeah, but it's supposed to be like, oh, this place that I thought I wanted to go. I'm not going to go there. Yeah. So it's interesting that this has been inserted. Now, one of the reasons why I think it's been inserted is because it gives the Lordy's character a chance to be like a man of action where he's not really a man of action through a lot of the movie. And he's the one who...

finds, helps them find their way out of Grand Junction in an exciting, you know, 30-second sequence. Right. But again, like, I think you're right that if you're reading the sort of character's emotional context of this is a guy who is having a hard time trusting anybody and letting anybody in because of the loss he's experienced, that makes sense in a sensitive drama about a man who's moved out into the middle of nowhere, not in a post-apocalyptic thriller. Yeah. And so that's kind of the challenge of the movie if, like, we really had to get down to it is it's presenting as one. thing and then trying to tell you it's another, but it's just not convincing enough to become another thing. And so it's just an odd movie. And it does feel to me a little bit like a lot of Ridley Scott's movies in the last 10 years

where there's some really interesting stuff. There's some really beautiful photography. Maybe you get one or two performances or you're like, God damn. Guy Pearce cooked. But they don't totally congeal. And like, I think if you receive them, the way that we received House of Gucci, which is like, what a romp. Sure.

You'll have a nice time. They're all entertaining. Yeah. And they all look better than movies that have this level of preparation or we'll figure it out later normally do. Yeah. I think. Because he's such a pro. Yeah.

Because he's made so many movies. In recent years, I would say the decline of or his reliance on maybe fixing things in post or his CGI animals. reliance on on shooting with 10 cameras. And I think to your point about tempo earlier, there's like a, I think there's a cause and effect. If you're just kind of like covering everything and getting two or three takes and moving on

because you need to get to the next movie because you can't stop working, then it's like, what is any scene? Like what are you trying to do? How do you build up to something? And that's something that like, as you go through his filmography,

is 30 film from filmography at this point, up until the last like seven years, you would never say that about Ridley Scott. You would say everything is so... Composed. Composed. And like, it's every department working at the absolute peak of their powers

and somebody who is... Yeah, some of his movies are uneven and some are better than others, but you felt like a storytelling Ebb and flow happening and like a real, like, old master at work. For years on this show, because we've covered Ridley so much

because he's been so active in the last seven or eight years, I always say that he's a real... it's up to the script guy. And if the script doesn't work, and you go back and you look at the 90s and 2000s, and you kind of choose, like, if he has a gladiator script,

it's going to be a bang-on classic. And if he has like a G.I. Jane script, it's maybe not going to work as well. Yeah. And I feel like that's not true anymore. I feel like now, because of all of these changes in the production style that you're making.

There's an LA Times interview with him this week, and he was talking about how, because of Scott Free, his production company is so busy. They develop their own material. And he's like talking, Dog Stars was handed to him. Like, here's the screenplay. And he was like, the last time I took a script from outside of our development was Martian, which is also his last great film, I would argue.

His last classic. Yeah. Yeah, it's funny. I mean, we've now done both top five episodes and Hall of Fame episodes for him, because he has released five movies in the last five years, and he's released 20 movies in the 21st century, and he's 88 years old. And he's, and he is not stopping. The other piece of news is that he's developing yet another alien movie centered around Michael Fossbender's

David character, and he's going to keep going. And I see him in interviews, and I'm like, he seems like he's doing okay. Yeah, he's pretty sharp. And as you say, like this movie is,

in some ways, extremely well made. Like, it certainly seems like it's made by grownups and there's quality components to it. Right. So he shouldn't stop by any means. And, you know,

one question that I see online a lot is like, how does Ridley keep getting to make these 75 million, 100 million, $150 million movies because he hasn't had a major, major hit in a long time. And one of the reasons I think is because of what you're describing, which is that, you know, Scott Free is this huge business driver in Hollywood, that it's not just this production company that makes tons of television, but there's also a commercial house attached to it.

And he, of course, is one of the pioneers of the commercial director to O'Tour Pivot, which is something we've talked about in previous episodes. and he's responsible for some of the more memorable TV commercials of the 70s and 80s. And so he is big business in Hollywood to this day, even though he's 88. He commands a lot of power. So it's not shocking to me that he gets to keep making these movies,

but I don't, do you think this is, like, shifting his legacy at all? Because we talk about, like, the Scorsesies and Spielbergs, and they do one every two or three or four years, and Tarantino's whole bit about only making 10 films because great filmmakers like Billy Wilder lost it when they got into their late 60s and 70s. Do you think this is going to meaningfully impact how we think about him?

So we've been talking a lot in the last five years about, like, a great director's like last great film and interpreting many of them, you know, Coppola, Spielberg, Scorsese, etc. Will this be the last one? Is this a mission statement?

Like, is this, how does this explain the other work? And this is a swan song and all these sorts of things. And I think that Ridley Scott, he's clearly not doing that, but he's also so far not doing. doing away from doing that that I he maybe lets himself off the hook of the the last 10 we're never going to look at one of them and be like okay now it's time for Ridley Scott you know to really tell us

what the last 50 years of meant like he doesn't care he's what it's meant is just to keep working and we do have the original stuff and nothing is so terrible in the last 10 years that I I think it, he hasn't, as you said, he seems like pretty with it. He hasn't lost his curveball. He's just doing what he wants to do. So it maybe changes what the final, how we'll write about the final chapter compared with some of those other directors. And I think we as, you know, cinephiles do have a tendency to lionize like the last great work. And he doesn't have one.

But also that's very in keeping with his career. Yeah. Which is just putting up his shots. Yeah, it's true. Phymography is so chameleonic that it's hard for me to, ascribe a map that he was following in the first place that he somehow deviated from the path. You know, like, I think he's always been a grinder.

He has been incredibly prolific throughout his career. He changes genres almost every movie. He clearly has, like, images and ways he likes to see the world that he repeats and goes back to. I would say that the thing that probably disappoints me about, more or less that this decade, decade of work is that you can start to see the seams and that you can start to see not a cheapness but a speed at which he is working that I think he is actually cutting corners and so they even

movies like Napoleon which you should at least be able to trust like the battle sequences are going to be astonishing kind of look they look animated you know what I mean like we're just fine and lots of movies have that feel but I don't really Scott movies don't have that feel yeah I mean this was true in Exodus gods and King So I remember coming out of that movie and being like, what? Yeah. Is this Ridley Scott? And then the next year the Martian comes out.

So he's one of those things where like, I don't write him off ever. And I think he's still capable of great, fascinating visual ideas. And you guys are right. Like, he doesn't have some presumption of autorship that so many of the other people who are like the heroes of this podcast do because he's just such a grinder. and also that he is working so routinely that as he gets older and as the technology changes but maybe his facility with it or the teams that he's working with and their facility is evolving, it's not as sharp as it used to be.

I just, I ask that question to you both because the 30% Rotten Tomato score on this movie feels like a real like, we can say fuck Ridley now. Like we're more comfortable just like dunking on a movie. like this. Whereas I feel like it's, I think it's a little worse than House of Gucci and Napoleon and Gladiator 2, but not

like that much worse. And I don't even agree with you. You know what I mean? Like I think if this movie was directed by Francis Lawrence, we'd be like, that was pretty good. Right? Yeah. I mean like it would be, it would have the same issues. But if it wasn't like a Ridley Scott film and you were sitting down and like, all right, Blade Runner, show me what you got now. I think if this was just

like a work-a-day director, we would probably be like, that was fine. Yeah, two and a half stars and it didn't quite hit, but I'm glad I saw it. Yeah. Yeah, which is kind of where I'm out with the movie. Right. So it's an unusual thing.

The idea of him making another alien movie is really interesting to me too. I don't think it's going to happen. Well, why do you say that? Well, that was my reaction when I heard about Alien Covenant. I'm like, you just did Prometheus. Are we're not done here?

He's 88 and he's making Treasure Island in November, he says, and then he wants to make a BG's movie and he also wants to make a movie about an elephant. I think this is something he got asked about. I find... An elephant? I didn't hear about that one. Yeah, he was to be...

Is it gonna be a real elephant? I don't know. Is it Babar? I know. He's like, he's like, oh, I was greatly moved by this story I read it by Africa. Ridley Scouts, Babar would go so hard.

Oh my God. Would absolutely love that. Barbar runner? Yeah. It was like, Babar trying to tell off another elephant's an alien. Like a Last Emperor style, an ascendant young king?

Sure. Come on. You also forgot the film about banking. which you're going to star in He's making a banking movie? I'm reading here I'm reading from R. Ridley Scott In an interview

with a British newspaper of the Times Scott revealed that in addition to a pirate film, a Western a World War I epic, a BG's musical and a film about banking he also has a quote marvelous film

about an African elephant end quote in development. Yes. And then also another David movie for Alien which I would welcome but I just I think at some point that's a lot of movies. Time is going to come

everybody. Why don't you tell us about your banking movie script? I could never do it. I could never do better than margin call. Yeah. Does he have any great unmade movies? He must have dozens. What are they?

Let's look at his unrealized projects page because that's another fascinating component of this. He was one of the guys attached to Neuromancer, which is now finally coming to the screen on television. It did look good. It did look good. Callum Turner. I mean, look at all of these films.

Just look at the Wikipedia for his unrealized projects. He's also one of the great yappers. So in interviews he'll be like, and then I would love to make blackbeards delayed. And everybody's like, oh, my God, you know. I mean, he was attached to Blood Meridian. He was attached to the passage. He was attached to Red Riding. He was attached to several Robin Hood sequels.

He was attached to the Wolf of Wall Street at a certain point. You know, some of it is the yapping and some of it is just like Scott Free is big business. So everything goes through them as well. And like if they put their nymphs, names on a movie like that, or they option something, then they're going to get a chance to do something big. It's such a big career, and we've tried to put our arms around it multiple times, and I still feel like I'm scratching the surface.

I watched Kingdom of Heaven last night for the first time in a long time, and I was like, this okay, and I don't want to hurt your feelings. The director's kind of? You were like, this is okay. Orlando Bloom is terrible in the movie. It doesn't matter. He really does. He's the star of the movie.

David Thulis is in that movie. He's absolutely cooking. I know. I just, my opinion of the classics has not really changed at all. And when I sit down to watch whatever, his seven to 12 confirmed great films, I feel the same way about Alien as I did when I was 19. And I feel the same way about Gladiator as I did the day that I saw it, which is to say Alien is like five-star masterpiece and Gladiator is like a four-star. Like, that was fucking good. But it doesn't mean as much to me as it does to a lot

of people. But some of the other stuff, like I didn't rewatch all the money in the world, for example. That's a movie that I think we often forget is a really movie even though it came up on Monday's I've only seen it once. Is that a movie that anyone needs to watch a second time? I've only seen it once as well. Same. And then they made the FX series

that's essentially about the same thing. Trust. Yeah. Yeah. Did Danny Boyle make that? Yes. Yes. Strange.

He directed the first one at least. How did you think about going back and looking at his work for this discussion? To be totally honest, I just knew that I was doing it with the two of you, so I went back and rewatched the counselor, which was another movie that I have not watched.

Yeah. And I did in fact watch it while sitting next to my son who was home from school. So I'm mother of the year. That was pretty much it. Because we have done so much Ridley stuff. And for whatever reason, whether it's other Hall of Fame, a lot of these are pretty fresh in my memory. So the counselor, I hadn't seen it in a while, wanted to give it its time of day. It's pretty great.

Yeah. You know, we'll talk about my big note. I scanned through some of the turkeys because I was like, is there anything here that I, like, 1492 is terrible. So bad.

I went back and looked at, I had done someone to watch over me. It's not a turkey, but I checked that out recently for rewatchables. What else did I have to get my list out now? Okay. He made it very far.

You made it well over an hour before. Congratulations. You need to break out the laptop. I mean, should we dive into a proper ranking? Yeah. This episode of The Big Picture is brought to you by Amazon Prime. What pairs with a good comedy? The cozy blanket arriving with Prime.

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Alien, Blade Runner, Thelman, Louise, Black Hawk Down, Gladiator, Kingdom of Heaven, the director's cut. American Gangster, Prometheus, the counselor, the Martian. I'd say the most controversial leave-off was Matchstick Men, a movie that has a cult. Controversial for you? I think just in general. That was the one that was sort of like, the counselor's very divisive. He was talking to Jamie before we recorded. He gave it a go this morning.

He was like, I don't know about this one. You know, it happens. There are divisive movies in the catalog. Did you get to the Ruben Blade scene? Yeah, he said yes That I can't help you The diamonds And that's the one where he's like

The world where you made your mistakes And the one where those mistakes can be undone Is not the same world You are at the crossing Wow We're a fucking movie We've lost Tony Scott and Cormick McCarthy now Yeah

It's really sad Any other mistakes you see here In this work This 10 or 11 films That we talked about from that Because in theory, you'd say, well, those films need to be in the top 10, so a lot of the work here is going to be about 30 through 12. I think I...

I think I basically have the same 10 here. I stand mostly, yeah. Yeah, I have different order, but the same 10. And I think you can comfortably say five of these movies... This isn't in order. It's just chronological. Yeah. Yeah, that's the chronological order that I just read.

Yeah, the whole thing. Yeah. I have those 10 movies in my personal top 10. I think. And I think the top five are widely considered, if not all-time classics, truly great movies. You know, I put Alien Blade Runner and Thelman Louise in like kind of a class of their own. Yeah. I think many people would have Gladiator in that conversation as well. Black Hawk Down was kind of kicked up again.

Tarantino put that at the top of his 21st Century list when he did his, I think, a kind of a politically fraught movie. But stylistically and aesthetically, like, mind-blowing. And then the other five, some of them are. personal preference. Some of them are more accepted the Martian, one of the great crowd pleasers of the 21st century. Did we ever talk about that for 25 for 25?

I don't think so. Are you a fan? I like it. Yeah. It's wonderful. I like it a lot. It was interesting to go back and watch it for Project Hail Mary because I don't think I had in at least five years. And even the Martian watching it with 20, you know,

with hindsight, is a little shaggy in the Ridley Scott sort of way. It's like two and half hours. And they spend... It's cute, too. Yeah, exactly. Which was interesting just because I don't think we received it that way at the time.

We were just like, well, remember a good old time at the movies, but it does predict sort of what's to come in the next 10 years. A lot of the NASA stuff is kind of Tweed. Sure.

In retrospect, but... Dogglover and Kristen Whig and all that stuff. That's one of those movies that I don't even know if I can articulate this. It's actually better to just watch 30 minutes of it

when it happens to be on than it is to sit and watch the entire thing. Well, I think that brings up a challenge with a lot of his filmography in general and including his all-time classics, which is like, he's a great big screen director. He's one of the great canvas painters.

That's his whole thing. So when you watch these movies at home, like me watching Kingdom of Heaven at home, even though it's on a beautiful 4K, it's not the same. It's never going to be as enveloping. No, but I will say, I was watching Thelma last night when I got home

and I was like, it's fucking ridiculous how good this movie looks. You watch the criterion. Yeah. It just is beautiful, though. You're just like, this is just like two ladies on the run. Like it doesn't have to look like this. It's his Western.

That's the thing is it's a beautiful. It's him doing a John Ford movie with those two actresses at the center. I don't know. Anything else like pop out that you're like, we're missing something here before we start kind of getting into the nitty-gritty of it? In the top 10? Or whatever, in that top zone. No, I think kind of the medium zone is what's going to be the trickiest.

Like what do we want to give credit? to and what do we want to put kind of in just like this silly Ridley tier? Because everything else you are to the Martian point kind of picking for like the magical 30 minutes or the magical achievement of, you know, how it looks or a great performance or just the audaciousness of. Yeah, you get into Cameron Diaz and a windshield. A lot of personal preferences. Yeah.

Yeah. To me, when I was thinking about it, I feel like both white squall, And Black Rain have shooters. You know, those are movies that, like, people are huge fans of those movies. They're never huge movies for me personally, so I don't feel like I need to defend them when we're having a conversation like this. But if you were like my number nine is Black Rain, I would get it. Super stylish movie. Yeah.

Would it be in your personal top ten? No. Okay. Let's do it. I mean, what's his worst movie? Let's just start a 30. I had 1492 there. Exodus Gods and Kings is also pretty tough.

It is pretty bad. I'm just going to put that there. You know, it can be 29. It can be 29. It doesn't have to be 30. Excuse me. I just saw what you have at 29. And I think that you're going to need to reassess some stuff.

Okay. You know, my computer. Let's keep the audience at home engaged. Yes. You know? Sure. Would you like to share? So 1492 is the turkey?

I'll say, I would say Exodus Gods and Kings then 1492. Okay. Are 30 and 29 in some order. I had Gooch. He had Gout. House of Gucci at 29, which I just think just you've lost your joy of life. Maybe. Perhaps.

I'm sorry. Adam Driver and a turtleneck in the Swiss Alps or the Italian Alps. Excuse me. Lie. Yeah. Like a pigeon. I just, I'm sure I was nice about it when we did it because I was just going insane at home or whatever. Yeah.

It was funny in the moment when they're having the weirdly violent sex on the office desk. And what is it, George Michael's faith starts playing for the wedding scene? It was pretty good. I had a nice time. I don't get 29 is fair, Chris Ryan. I think it's entertaining. I have not revisited it. It may be a while.

Do I own it on 4K? I do. Okay, good. I do. I got the whole stack. I got the whole Ridley collection of home. You're putting that over G.I. Jane? I like G.I. Jane.

Don't you? Okay. I don't know. I think there are worse movies in every direction. That's about a woman who achieves in a place where nobody expects her to do so. You know? Absolutely true. So true.

You're right. Okay. So we're okay with 30 So 30 Exodus Gods and Kings 29, 1492. Conquest of Paradise starred Gerard Depparview. Which is a biopic of Christopher Columbus. A French guy, yeah.

Yeah. 28. Now, some people would say House of Gucci, we can keep talking through that. I would probably submit a good year, which... I was also going to... Absolutely not. Why did we read...

Did I rewatch this? Did we do a 2006 draft again? Possibly? Is that why did I... You think a Goodyear is good? I would quit if a good year is ahead of all the money in the world or is behind that? I would say they're comparable to me. It's a beautiful...

First of all, who... Did you fucking get body snatched? I was like, okay, so you can appreciate the setting of a good year but not House of Gucci? I like the setting. You don't like the people... Like, people are having fun in House of Gucci. It's a guy who plays tennis and makes wine with Mary and Coteyard, right? I know.

Yeah. But it's just, it's kind of like sad and weirdly. It's boring at emo. I'm talking about it. And House of Gucci, they're killing people. They're in Milan.

There's fashion. Tom Ford shows up. Not really, but a version of them. I think we're splitting hairs here between two unsuccessful movies. This is also, it's funny.

It's like, this is what happens with these rankings is that like we all fucking assassinate one another about what's 29? Yeah. And there's like 11. It's like,

I don't give a shit. I mean, that's going to happen. because you and I are going to start crying about Alien Covenant. And it's going to be like, whatever. But, like, I'm not against that. I'm just not interested in it. Right, right. And I just, I don't really know why you need to be against House of Gucci.

On paper, a Goodyear is very Amanda Coded. Jeremy Irons sitting in the garden in House of Gucci, just being Jeremy Irons. Come on. It's interesting because, you know, Provence, where a good year is set, is a very important place to you. But you're also a fashionista. Right. So is Italy. I'm going next week.

You know? Like, I contain multitudes. That's true. Be careful. Don't break any laws. In the southern Europe and here. Don't hurt Chris. No, I know.

No violence against him on camera. It'll be held against you in a court of law. Why are we choosing between a good year and House of Gucci at 28? Why can't we also have? I don't think all the money in the world is that bad. But why can't we have that in the conversation? I did. I put it in the conversation.

I would honestly put. G.I. Jane is not really for me, but that's fine. Did you like dog stars more than G.I. Jane? I guess G.I.J. is more of like a whole movie, even if it's not a very good one. So, okay, dog stars. They're all different sides of the same coin. You know, it's a Dungeons and Dragons die of interesting visual components and unsuccessful narratives. Why aren't we talking about Gladiator, too?

Well, because I had Denzel. Sure. And I thought, I think I didn't hate it. I think he didn't hate it. I didn't hate it either, but it did have a lot of CGI animals. I really did. You can listen to the pod that we did. I think you were on leave when that.

It was. Yeah, yeah. But I went and saw it at 10 in the morning by myself. It's got big problems that start and end with Paul Meskell, in my opinion. I think that was unfair. That's my feedback on your podcast was it's not Paul Muscle's fault. I root for him. What a shock.

But can you have? Paul McCurtney and Maximus's son. Maximus's son then also be James Bond. That would be... I don't think that that world. The Amanda Triple Crown. Why are we not asking it about

whatever guy he played in normal people? Connell? Was that his name? Connell. Yeah. You're so dismissive of television now. No, I love normal people. I think that was great.

Daisy Edgar Jones, she's got the juice. I think dog stars all the money in the world for me, Robin Hood, a good year, G.I. Jane, and, and legend are all in this zone. Yeah. I think all of those movies are all in that, like, 27 to 22 zone. I agree with that. So.

I think I have. And each one has something about it that I like. And that's maybe why I'm not as dismissed. And House of Gucci, I should add that to the list here. I have a good year in Robin Hood at 18th and 19th personally. Well, you have a beautiful, yeah. And you have a beautiful heart. Chris, we saw Robin Hood together.

It was pretty cool. It was not cool. Oscar Isaac is cooking in that movie. And they start out of it's so vividly. We've had a few of these. Chris and I've had a few of these, right? Miami Vice is the number one. That's the number one version where we went together,

and I was like, I don't know about all that. And you were like, I have seen God. Yeah. And I was like, is this my best friend? Like, who is this person? You're getting worried about this because you're like, if we agree 99% of the time, and the 1% is so upsetting for you.

rather than it just being like 50-50. No, it's only upsetting when you get on podcast and, you know, like, this movie changed me as a man. Like, talking about 2010's Robin Hood, which stinks. What are you talking about? I was there? It's like a dirge. It's so boring. Do you care about Robin Hood, generally speaking?

Not really. Did you see the death of Robin Hood? No. And did you see the news that the uprising will be a secret Robin Hood backdoor film. Yeah. Sort of like what they were going to do with Tony, but that didn't do. I mean, there's the end is he just say, and I'm Robin Hood. There's a guy.

Andrew Garfield singing Robin Hood Little John Walker that would get me in the theaters. Not getting the sense that's the tone of the film. But it is from your guy Paul Greengrass. And is it because it's public domain you can just throw Robin Hood I think we talked about that didn't we? And when we talked about the death of Robin Hood? Or when we like

this is a story that you can just kind of keep doing and you don't have to license anything. Just like Mickey Mouse who's also in the public domain. Just like Moses. Yeah. Right? Damn. Good point. Nobody owns the IP for Moses. Yeah. That would be cool if they were just like Anthony Tony. I mean, he made Exodus Gods and Kings, right?

Okay, so what, let's put some numbers against these titles. I'm going to just start throwing some ideas out. How many times have you been to Provence? He just said, let's put some numbers against these titles. I'm going to start doing this. And then you were like, how many times have I been to Provence? Yeah, what do you like about it? I've been ones and it was phenomenal.

Yeah. Truly one of the most magical places in the world. It's a guy who's like, I'm tired of the Rarries. I've inherited this this you know a state Yeah And then he gets in touch with the things that actually matter Right, it's under the Tuscan sun

But for guys Yeah For wine boys Yeah You also don't like wine Yeah I do What's up with you in wine right now I've been loving the rosé

That they're serving at Kavelle I mean like I've just been You missed a lot You had two kids You missed a lot of developments on my side You know I've been on some wine vacations with you.

You as well. More with him. That's true. In our early days in Los Angeles. I know. And we all heard about the edibles and the Spanglish, right? But like, so we all. What about the young men and women who just started listening to this show four days ago?

You've told the Spanglish story on this podcast before. I'm not afraid to say it. I took an edible with my wife. I did not really experience with it. I don't think we took the proper amount or we took too much. We went into a K-hole and we tried to watch Spanglish and it seemed like it lasted six hours. And then my wife was like, I need to go walk outside. And I was like, I don't know if I'll ever find you again.

Spanglish, not directed by Ridley Scott. Let's stay on track. Number 26, House of Gucci. What's 28 and 27? 27. I can't believe you're going to bed for a good year. My head hurts. We barely started this.

Do you want me to be here to agree with you guys? No. Is the Roset, Kovil, from Pimons? No, it's Italian. Did you say it was 18 a good year on your list? 18? Yep. Right after in Robin Hood's 19.

I have a good year in Robin Hood over dualists. All the money in the world 27. Wait, what? Yeah. Or the dualists? Yeah. I mean, listen. What happened to you?

The duelist is a little... What did you guys ever watch? Come on. Who watches the dualists? The last time that we did this, I watched the duelist again. And I was like, okay, it's good, but like, it's a little slow. It's it. All right.

And now his mind is melting. But over... But over the good year? The duelist? That's fucking, you should go to the hay for that. Are you kidding me? What kind of Ridley Scott fan are you? What are you talking about?

I just, I don't need to, I watch the duelist once. It's like take your driver's license test once, and then you drive for the rest of your life. Yeah, right off the fucking cliff like Thelman and Louise. Spoiler alert. You wanted to rank 30 movies. You knew this was going to happen. and if you guys Yeah, you came holding a fucking grenade

and you pulled the pin and you're like, let's fucking drop this thing in the middle of the room with a good year and Robin Hood. Robin Hood is also over dualists on this list. I haven't seen dualists in a long time. I'm sure it's fine. It's excellent.

It looks kind of gauzy. Yeah. Okay, all right. All right. So we're missing number 28. Right now we have 30 Exodus Gods and Kings, 29, 1492 Conquest of Paradise. Do we have any Hannibal defenders here?

I have Hannibal. What, 14? At 9? 22. You know, it's just not really in my interest set. Is Dog Stars 28? Sure. All right.

Yeah, I had it at 26, so that's totally fine. Yeah, and you had Gucci at 29, and we're moving it up at least to 26. You know what? I feel like my list is getting a lot more scrutiny than your list. I haven't made a list. Yeah, I'm making it here with you right now. Oh, so I did the work, but I'm getting criticized for it. As always.

We've got 30 through 26. Okay. All right. 25 through 20. I'll do 20. You can put it as far up as you want for letterboxed. Excuse me. How dare you?

Watch your mouth. 21 G.I. Jane. 22 Hannibal. 23, Napoleon. 24, Gladiator 2 and 25 legend. I'm not a big legend guy. I'm not a legend person. I'll put Legend to 25.

That's good. You know, if you put it any lower than that, one day after Tim Curry's death, you should also be sent to the Hague. But the film itself is, I think, quite dull. And Tom Cruise is... Just give me another sentence. I don't care.

Wow. Another spoiler alert. GI Jane. 24. Yeah, 24 for G.I.J. Seems good. Okay. And also mixing it up a bit.

There are some very interesting aesthetic things about that. movie, I think to be more doing her absolute best. Vigo Mortensen, excellent in it. Worst Chestens in that movie. Yes. I did rewatch it, I think, for our last conversation. Got it. It felt like it was fine. All right. Okay. So this is where we start to get into Hannibal Robin Hood territory for me personally. Sure. We can do that. We can drop a good year in Robin Hood down and move duelists up. Hannibal is a freak show, right? Like, it's a very silly sequel that is significantly worse than its predecessor. I don't, I don't mind watching it.

It's a diabolically toxic movie. I admire it for that. Yeah. But yeah. It is quite gross and quite evil seeming. As I said, it's just, it's not my bag. Not your interest set, yeah. But that doesn't, if you want to, you know, that's the way you're doing for it.

Right, that's fine. Well, the one in which his brain is being eaten on screen, yes. I, to me, the three Crow movies are not successful. So Robin Hood, Good Year. And Body of Wise. Now, I know Body of Lise is one of your favorites. That's one where we've got a problem then. Well, I'm willing to broker with you.

That's why I bring it up because I'm saying I'm not, I'm not letting Robin Hood in a Go much higher here. Because I don't care. Put it right there. Put it right there. Because I know that you do have a place for body of life. No one said anything about a body. Well, Sean did, but not me.

Okay. Leonard DiCaprio with a new piece and his Nokia rolling around with Isaac, Oscar Isaac. Once again, what we're talking about right now are Robin Hood and a good year. Okay. Yeah. They can go down here. 23, a good year, 22, Robin Hood. How do we feel about that?

I mean, I like a good year more than I like Robin Hood, but. That's fine. Swap them. That's fine. Okay. I mean, they both stink. Italian. Italian.

Italian Rose. And I'm not there. The invitation is open to you. I was actually thinking about bringing the kids to the home state near you. And then, like, combining a home state coval experience. Sure. So I could try this Italian Rose. Seems like a really relaxing wine bar night out.

Well, outside. No on the drive here. Oh, okay. You were thinking about that on the drive here? Yeah. You know. You're about to go. Well, sure.

To Italy for 10 days. When are you going to go to the wine? You're going to have Italian wine in Italy. Why is this on your calendar? Okay, number 21. I'm living out loud, you know. What is number 21? Let's see.

So what's left that? Do you like you listen more than someone to watch over me? I think it's Napoleon. Oh, yeah. We got to get Napoleon. I think Napoleon is. If we're doing the bottom third. I think what you just said that disrespectfully.

But I think 21 is the right place for something that we enjoyed. I can neither confirm nor deny the P.T. Anderson rewrote the script for this movie, but all the things that we talked about in the episode that we thought were so funny in that screenplay and everything that Joaquin Phoenix is doing,

which I think, I don't know if it saves the movie, but it at least shields it from some of the jankiness of the classical historical drama stuff that you expect to be so buttoned up in a Ridley movie. It certainly feels like Paul Thomas Anderson's script when it is funny in that way. The lamb chop. Yes.

Yeah. And all the sex scenes and the... The way that he's characterized is this buffoonish guy. Okay. Okay. So Napoleon at 21. This is the hardest work, 20 to 10, in my opinion. I think this is, we're in someone to watch over me, Black Rain.

I agree. Last dual territory. Do you want me to do my 10 to 20? Yeah. Let's hear it. My 10 to 20, covenant 10. I don't know how I have this. Go from 20 to 10.

Okay. 20, I dualists, Robin Hood, a good. a year. Someone to watch over me, Black Rain Last Duel. Okay. Match stick men, white squall,

Body of Lies. I have American gangster at 11. I don't know. It was in the top 10. New Free Covenant at 10. We didn't have that originally in. And I have Covenant at 10.

Yeah. So I would say here we should do white squall. No, we should do Black Rain, someone to watch over me, white squall and last duel.

Yep. I'm okay. with that. Does that make sense? Sure. Yes. I think we're actually, we have a lot more in common

than we think. That's beautiful. And that we're like, generally we have tears that are very similar with some exceptions. Yeah. We're getting a little caught up

on a good year in Robin Hood, but like we're a lot closer. I just like so red meat and I just chased after it. See R. looks like good year soon as when. I've always liked that movie.

I don't know why. You know, it's the only movie of his not available on Blu-ray. Maybe it's because it lives as a memory for me. sure so black rain someone to watch over me

white squall and we said what comes after that do you think you'd ever send your sons on the last duel yes on a boating like yacht summer camp with jeff bridges as their only mentors no

I don't I don't really think I think they would need at least like one person per boy on a boat I don't trust you know, we need man-to-man coverage at least until they're 18. Let's play a little white squall game, okay, Manda. Okay.

Scott Wolfe or Jeremy Sisto. Oh, um, in nine, in 96, Scott Wolf. Scott Wolf or Ryan Phillipy. Scott Wolf or Balthazar Getty. Balthasargetty. Scott Wolf or Ethan Embry. Or excuse me, Balthusargetti or Ethan Embry. Balthasargetty.

Balthasargetty or Zeltasargetti or Zeltazardgetti or Zeltazardt. Co. Evonick. Chris, James Rebhorn or Zelchkoe Ivonic? I think Ivonic. Okay. Yeah. Is there anything you want to say about Black Rain, someone to watch over me, White Squall, or The Last Tool? We spoke of the last duel on our Flops draft.

Yep. White Squall is decent. It's just decent. A good example of he can take a 65% movie to an 75% movie just by by his like eye alone. This is one of his most

famous bombs actually and this never came up in our flopst draft but this movie only made 10 million dollars despite its starry and exciting young cast and I think a setting and an idea of a movie. Yeah, it is but it's it has exciting components but it really didn't work

which is kind of unusual but he has a number of these over the years I guess. Someone to watch over me I've never really joined Bill's cult on that movie I mean, it almost exists outside of like the Ridley Scott Cannon if it was directed by I don't know, Carl Franklin. John Badham, you would be like, yep.

Like it's just like a kind of good... An atmospheric thriller. Forney cop drama. Yeah, yeah. Black Rain's super cool. Yes. A little problematic. It looks fucking incredible. It does.

I don't think there is a single street in this movie that hasn't been hosed down beforehand. Yes. It is a wedded pavement. Yeah. Yeah. Michael Mann-esque crime oversees drama. Okay.

So 16 through 11. Amanda, what do you say? So, and we're agreed that the top 10 from the Hall of Fame have to stay the top 10, or do we want to? No, we can do some trade. I don't think he has changed. I would say that different films since we've done the top 10 have risen higher for me and some have dropped down. So how is Gladiator 2?

not yet on the list. Oh, we fucked up. Yeah, we messed up. I think Gladiator 2's got to go somewhere maybe between... You're right. We're going to have to fix some of this. Do you want to put Gladiator 2

in front of... Do you think it's better than Napoleon? I don't. So do you think it's better than a Goodyear? I think it's right in that zone. Okay, so put it between Napoleon and Goodyear. So, yeah, let's make 21 Gladiator 2. God, it's probably worse than that.

Like, is Gladiator, I don't know. Will you ever watch it again? Probably. because I don't respect myself. Yeah. Like not like randomly to like. I just think Denzel's having an absolute blast. I think Fred Hackinger is having so much fun.

And Joseph Quinn, they're both there will, that part of the movie is very entertaining and gaudy and silly and just kind of great off the rails Hollywood stuff that I really enjoy. It's like Peter Rusanov was reborn. So I really dig that stuff. All the Palmaskal stuff I find very dull. And I find the CGI animals. Upsetting. Very disappointing. Yeah.

The shark stuff's kind of funny. Fill in the Coliseum with water. Yeah. And it turned out that there was some truth to that, that they did do some version of that back in the day. It's a cool idea. Sure. It just feels very... Not very well.

Yeah. Yeah. No, it's true. How you doing there, guys? Everything going okay with resetting? Okay. I know. This is hard work.

This is really not easy. Okay. So now we're down to 15. Okay. So what we have... Covenant Body of Lies. from outside the top 10. Match dick men.

I feel like duelist at 15 is respectable. Okay. And Hannibal. I like that. Oh, Hannibal is still there too? Yeah. Oh, I thought we put Hannibal down. Okay, my bad.

No, we didn't. So... I think Hannibal goes after Napoleon, personally. At 19? Yeah. I'm good with that. That's fine with me. Let's put Hannibal at 19, and that makes the duelist 14.

Okay. You going to be okay with that? Yes. I felt my battle and I lost. It's okay. Okay. I think you should give the duelist another look Sure I'm not trying to be a dick

I was like I just happened I'm being honest about How many like what movies I have returned to Kytel in period pieces Undefeated Unable to change his accent So just some guy from Brooklyn Just showed up

I know Body of Lies has to go at 13 because I don't get it Like I get why you like it As a lionist prequel but like I don't get it Okay. Do you get it? This is, I, it's one of those things where I better understand Chris through it. Yeah. Based on the novel by Washington Post columnist David Ignatius.

Uh-huh. Maybe I should look at this again. There are some things that I treasure as a, as a way to, to feel closer to you idiots. And Body of Lies is on the list. So I'm not going to stand in the way. The first hour of this movie is incredible. The second hour. It's, to me, it's just, you know, spy game. and it's okay.

And the second half of it, I think, lags a little bit. Russell Crowe is at his insider weight and is acting from a backyard in Bethesda, Maryland, for most of the film. Just with a Bluetooth headphone on. I mean, what do you want? What do you want from movies? It's really true.

And it's a perfect distillation of what you want from a movie. We should get you a Bluetooth head. We haven't really done enough comedy with that. Like, in general, I advocate for more props, but him with a Bluetooth. Let's, you know, many things are possible in this life. Has anyone ever asked you to appear in a film as an actor? No. I was hoping to be cast.

Van and I put ourselves forward to play parts in Linus. Oh. Yeah. Okay. Like two guys in a truck. Like guys with data entry. Yeah. Like, and all the crazy shit is happening.

So you don't want to play yourself. No. You want to be someone. You want to be like a. of Easter eggs. I feel like this is possible for you. It's cool. We're getting closer. We did a bit about it on the pod and we put up an Instagram clip

and Michael Kelly, the great character actor who said that's fucking funny. And then Zoe Saladana liked it. All right. There you go. Wow. Okay. That's that's real forensic analysis of social media. I was unaware of this. I was made aware of this.

So people who have liked the watch clips on social media so far. We've got a list of two. Zoe Salton, two famous people. Zoe Saladon, Travis Kelsey. Yes. Okay. Anyone else? We should add to the list?

Not that I know of. I don't look at the likes generally. Yeah. So someone let you know about this. Kyle let me know. Was it, did she call from a body of lies style Bluetooth headset? Sierra have some news. Okay, there's two films that need to go at 12 and 11 given our list.

Those films are Alien Covenant and Matchstick Men. I think that's great. I think Alien Covenant is 12 Matchstick Men is 11. Agree. I like both equally. Exactly the same. Exactly the same. There are different kinds of movies.

I did revisit Alien Covenant this week, and it is a... It's the male version of a bodice ripper. It's just like... Sci-fi, dork fantasy shit of just, like, people's innards being thrashed at every turn. Probably the greatest cast ever assembled

that he then kills within 40 minutes of the film starting. Yeah, which is a great trick. Something I always enjoy. And that leaves us with 10. Okay. And this is the 10 from the Hall of Fame and now we have to order them. Okay.

We can do it. I believe that alien is his crowning achievement. I think we're unanimous at the table. I start there as saying, I think that's his best film. I think Alien and Blade Runner are the top two. Yeah. Would you want to make a case for Thelman Louisa's number two? I think there's a case.

No. I mean. Because it is a different register. An alien and Blade Runner are so interwoven in terms of like the worlds that they're creating and living within science fiction and the kind of like, paranoid doom-laden quality of those movies, where Thelman-Louise is very different. Yes.

I mean, I think in terms of influence, all three have their own, like, very significant lane. But, I mean, Alien, for my money, the greatest sci-fi. And then Blade Runner just, you can't watch another movie or TV show or commercial for the next 40 years that imagines the future in any way without Blade Runner. So I do think, you know, the ending of Thelma and Louise and that final shot, not to mention everything about it and featuring two women

in a movie that people wanted to see is important. So it's equally important, but three seems fine. Like Blade Runner is like his brand after Alien. Nope. You think we'll ever do Blade Runner on the rewatchables? I hope so. I think it's kind of

undeniable and it's begging. I think also Bill would love I think Bill would love like the idea of like what's the right version of it and like all the production stuff. Great cast. Great cast to talk about the career. Right and he also loves what's their

Sean Yang. You love Sean Young? Darryl Hannah. Yeah. And oh my God, Joanna Cassidy also fantastic. Okay, number four. I guess Gladiator right? Yeah, probably. Oh, I don't have it anywhere near that. Okay. Let's talk about

that. I thought I was the gladiator Well, I think we're talking about some of my favorite movies here, so it's not a big deal for a gladiator. I had it at eight. Oh, okay. Do you have Kingdom of Heaven at five? I have Kingdom of Heaven at three for my sins. I think I have... It's a little rich for my blood.

But I care about you, and I want you to feel good about this. Kingdom of Heaven one to one, I think is better than Gladiator. I haven't rewatched in a while. I did see it Not the director's cut, obviously but I remember seeing it in theaters It's terrible movie And it was terrible

2005. Yeah, I was in college And they added 45 minutes to the cut Yep I guess I've revisited some of it I mean gladiator run the Oscar You know It's fun

I understand that we want to like be cool But I don't know We can be that cool Taking some smarrows in this episode I am I just think she's really not over The idea that I'm drinking wine without her.

Because I didn't know. I didn't vibe with it as much as I thought I would. And I didn't participate in the director's cut stuff. I thought I did. And I understand why it's improved upon the original. But it being a number four, I don't. But I thought Gladiator would have been a concession at four from my perspective. Like just for my money personally, I would rather,

watch Black Hawk down, Prometheus or the counselor. And the Martian. I would rather watch all four of those movies. I think Prometheus is the best of the bunch. Amazing take. Whoa. Amazing take. Oh, sorry. This is great.

Well, have two C-sections, then call me. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't look at that again, though I've seen it at least four or five times. Yeah. I, like you've revisited the counselor. That movie is, extraordinary and worth noting

a personal favorite of Ridleys probably also because it was such a... His tribute to his brother, right? Tribute to his brother, yeah. I think he's also like, this is sort of when my style of filmmaking works best is he did that in essentially like two weeks.

Yeah. Well, he tells that story about the script came in. He's like, Cormick's words are perfect but will change nothing. And then within five days, the entire cast, which is one of the stariest cast of its time.

You know, Pitt, Fastbender, Bardem, Cruz, Diaz, like all those actors. Down to people doing one scenes like Rosie Perez and Ruben Blades. Who's the diamond merchant? I thought that was Ruben Blades. No, Ruma Blades is like the guy who's like...

It's Bruno Gans. Yeah, Bruno Gans. Yeah, he had the audacity to put Ruben Blades and Bruno Gans in the same movie. I don't think the Covenant can be number four. No, no, no. I don't have Covenant number four. No, no, I meant I don't think the counselor can be number four.

Sorry. I would go... It can be... So you're not a gladiator person either. This is so interesting I think it's really good Yeah And I'm with you

Like I really enjoyed it For stars And it's not some like Classics major type thing at all I honestly Just I guess I'm not that much Of a Russell Crow person

I think it's really good And I think all of the buildings Look really fake And I just it honestly has aged very poorly From a technical It makes me It makes me hype as fuck, but I don't think it's actually a particularly profound film. You know what you mean?

I think it's kind of like says what it does on the box. Strength and honor and all that. Wow. But I mean, also. You put me in the position of defending Gladiator. I thought I was going to be the wet blanket about this. I think it should be in the top five. Because I mean, so what's our audacious pick at four?

Let's say Gladiator's five. What's four? Or is Prometheus? Prometheus or Martian. I think Prometheus is a. a better movie than The Martian. I do as well. Then let's put for me three.

Yeah. Let's get freaky. Let's get freaky. Yeah. I like it. And I will do, I would accept the counselor at six if you want to get really,

really, really weird with it. I think that Cameron Diaz is, you know, not good at acting in this movie, but that's okay. You could only, but would she also, well,

let's, I'm sorry. Let me rephrase that because what she does, physically is forever. I've never seen an actor achieve her goal more clearly. That is true. I would say that I don't think Cameron Diaz is good at line readings in this movie. I think she had an idea.

She knew the text. Yeah. And that's okay. And then that didn't quite jive. But it doesn't matter because she does the other things with such force. What do you think of Javier or Bardem in this film? Well, listen, he was in his groove from Skyfall on. You know?

Just like, you know, you put on some hair and some crazy accents. Do you guys watch him on Subway Takes talking about his love of metal? Yeah, it was fucking awesome. It's so good. It's just so good. He likes a lot of bad metal. Yeah. Like really bad.

He was like rock is back. And then did you? But I love his passion. And then did you see Penelope Cruz talking about how she just like researches, reads medical texts at night when this was one of the interview, not the interview, the invite, like, press junket things. Where that's her hobby. She was like, I don't have a degree, but I go home. and I read like very thick medical texts about the nervous system. That's awesome.

Wow. I mean. Such a learned people. Yeah. What a life. Much to admire. Yeah. I think they probably have a spirited marriage.

What do you think? Based on this film, yes. Yeah. So seven is going to be... Martian? I think Black Hawk Down. Oh, okay. Yeah.

Sure. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. I rewatched it. There's a moment before the true mayhem begins. when the helicopters are loading up and the men are gearing up for the battle.

And Jimmy Hendricks. Stevie Ray Vaughn's cover of Voodoo Child starts. And to me, that was cinema. Like, we are in this list already valuing imagery over message. Say hello, Ridley. And exactly. And that's in the spirit of demand. There's no doubt some discomforting perspective

on African identity and how that's their story should be told. And there's this sort of like weak faint towards the African perspective in the film, you know, that really kind of undermines its goal because it's so one-dimensional. Yeah. And it is, you know, it can be read as an expression

of this kind of jingoistic American power military propagandist machine. I don't think that's what it intends to do and mostly evades that, though there are sometimes where there's some glorifying going on that is not ideal. There's one particularly horrible Eric Banna moment at the end of the movie that I wish was just completely cut out of the movie. There's another issue. I mean, this era from 2000 to 2010, you get some wishy-washy actors and main roles.

I mean, I do feel like every time we talk about a movie, I'm like, well, Eric Banna is in it. And so that's really, yeah, and Bloom are in these movies and, you know. It's tough. Are you also, is this like a Munich shot? You're connected to? Yeah. Wow. Well, and I rewatch that.

I was like, this is a stone cold masterpiece. I think that it is a stone cold masterpiece except for the performance. That performance. Yeah. Are you kidding? What about his work in? This is 40. That's more... Pretty funny.

To bring it all full circle. Pretty funny. Mark L. Smith, who wrote Dog Stars, also wrote Eric Banna's Netflix series Untamed, where he plays a Forest Ranger in Yosemite. I haven't seen it. Okay. Is it good?

Yeah, that's some real Dog Stars core. I've gotten pretty into mountains in the last 24 months, like watching content about mountains? My brother. Yeah. Join me and tell you ride. Come on, come out.

What mountains? Well, did you watch the series Dark Wizard? Yes, in full. What are you talking about? I don't know. It's a climbing documentary. You know, I've seen you all summer.

Told Zach about it. It's a docu drama about an Alex Honnold's sort of main rival in free solo climbing. Okay. And what else does I watch? A lot of stuff like recommended if you liked this.

Okay. So, America. The Alpinist. The Alpinist. North American mountains, primarily. The Alpinist is in Alp. What's your favorite national park? I don't know.

I don't think, do I have one? It's not, it's just like not really my scene. But you do know that I love the American Southwest. So I went back to New Mexico recently. And I thought the boomers were evil. And you got to get into Utah. The, archers. The natural scenery and everything.

Yeah, but. Arizona? I don't know. Do you know I find deeply moving and also really some ambulant when I want to go to bed? Ken Burns is national parks. Yeah.

Wonderful series. Yeah. Okay. What about you? Do you have a favorite national park? I love Big Bend in Texas. Hmm. Never been.

Been to Yellowstone? Is Shenandoah? I don't know if that's a national park. Like what would be that area? It might be. Let's see. Shenandoah. I see you've closed the giant laptop.

Is that not the Adirondacks? It's a national park in Virginia. Yeah. Shenandoah. Yeah. Okay. That's Blue Ridge, right? Yeah.

So now I'm Googling Smokey Mountains National Park. Oh, Great Smoky Mountains. National Park is I guess my answer in honor of... Did you go there as a child? Yeah, of course, all the time. Because I mean, that's where like Dollywood and, you know, Knoxville's not that far from it. Chattanooga, Ruby Falls. Arches and Zion for you?

Zion was life-changing. I need to go back there. Although I'm so much physically weaker than I was when I first went there. When I went there, I was like, I'm probably the strongest I'm ever going to be. Don't underestimate yourself. I got to get back in the gym. We have 10 through 8 to do. Okay.

What's left? We need to put American gangster, Kingdom of Heaven, and the Martian on the board. I think it probably goes, for the purposes of our podcast, I think we all know it's going to go American gangster. No, Martian American Gangster. King of Heaven. No. Hannah's American Gangster. opinion. I agree with that. I think you

misunderstood... Oh, you were on that way. Do you think American gangster is better than the Martian? No, I do not. Oh, okay. So the Martian number eight, Kingdom of Heaven, Nine, American Gangster, Ten. I think that's right. You agree? Yeah. I know you want Kingdom of Heaven higher. That's okay. What do you want to take out? You want to take Gladiator out, put Kingdom of of Heaven in there? That's what you really want. I mean, that's what I said. I said that I think it's actually secretly a better film. And when I say secretly,

secretly, according to me. I mean, your strong point of view is part of what makes this such a special company, you know, I think this is... Not even joking. I don't know, Amanda, what's your zanious opinion here? What's something that you, when you look at what we've done here and ranking these 30 films, which will probably be our last ever release God episode. We will not need to speak about this.

God willing, he lives another 20 years. But we won't re-rank these movies. We'll be outlive this podcast. Okay, so right now we're looking at May 28. We've extended it. We've pushed it because of X-Men. We got April will be Beatles. No, you guys have to keep it going until Heat 2.

What are you talking about it? Oh, okay, so when's Heat 2? A late 28 probably. But weren't we told that that's yours? That's yours and Bill's? Bill already claimed Chris for Heat 2. I know. I heard about this.

Oh, he did? Yeah. To your face. Yes. I see him a lot. It's hard to remember everything he says. I don't know what podcast it was, but he was just like, I know you're always on the big picture and you got a lot of loyalty to those guys, but for Heat 2, you're mine.

All right. Good to know. So we don't have to wait for that. We can wrap it up with X-Men. And then what are you guys going to do? Surf. I'm going to learn about the national parks. Lucrative.

No, I'm going to move to Provence. A bit of a winery. With Eileen? I'm going to talk to myself. Sure, of course. My whole family. I'm going to move with Marion Cotillard. Yeah, that's what I was wondering.

That would be kind of weird if I left my family and moved to province. If Leia Sedu is waiting there. Man. It's special. Yeah. Any Zany takes? Any top rope stuff you want to do here at the end?

Don't we feel that most of the Zany takes are in the list? Prometheus at 4 is zaggy, but in a way that I like. Counselor at 6, you know, it's the most honest version of Ridley Scott. So the conventional wisdom would be that matchstick men should be higher. I assume gangster should be higher. Kingdom of heaven and counselor should probably be lower. I think Prometheus and counselor are very divisive, very divisive. you and I especially have always been into them.

In fact, I don't know when we wrote about Rid... Did we write about Ridley for GQ? Or Tony for GQ? I thought we did Ridley for Grantland. Maybe we did Ridley for... Because wasn't it the genre finding inside height of each of these movies or something like that?

Yeah, and we did something about Fincher. But at Grant... At GQ, we wrote something about Tony Scott. We were sort of like... It was when Unstoppable was coming out and it was like, why doesn't anybody talk about Tony Scott? Tony Scott is one of the great otors. Let's revive him in a kind of a mainstream way,

even though he was basically just... kind of like a fur hire director. Sure. Yeah, genre guy. And then we did a couple of different versions of that. We wrote about Ridley. Was it on for Prometheus or was it for the council? I think it might have been Prometheus because that would track with like when you had moved

out here. We went and saw Prometheus at Cinerama. With Andy. Yeah. So those two movies were always very big for us, but they were sort of similar to my Congo story earlier this week. I'd read reviews and people would be like Prometheus one and a half stars. Yeah.

That was crazy. I don't really understand that. But there's very few people I think would put. put it at four, even though we all like it for different and similar reasons. It's interesting that he has made three alien films. I never would have guessed that 10 years ago. He's mad that he doesn't get to make Blade Runner still and that he lost the rights of that. Yeah, that is so interesting.

All right, I'm going to read the order. Is there anything else you want to share? Nope. I think that I made my best efforts to revive Good Year on this pod. You got to share your point of view. Yeah. Right? Did you feel that you got to do the same?

Absolutely. I'm still reeling on the mountains, think, from the last 24 months. What about oceans near mountains? That's really, wow. I don't know you anymore. She doesn't want the mountains because she feels traps. No, no, no, no. It's flat spaces.

It's flat spaces. It's flat spaces. But I don't. Like the planes, yeah, Montana. When you asked my favorite national park, I couldn't be anything in Montana because when I went to Montana, I was like, where do you hide? Well, there's a lot of mountains in Montana, too. Well, I was on the plane.

I was in big sky country, and it was just like it went on forever and ever and ever. I like mountains. Did you ever decide who you're hiding from? You never know. But like dog stars hiding or? Yeah. Okay. Well, it just, no, not like survivalist.

It's just like a very primal every day I wake up and my job is to survive, you know? And I got to be scanning. What are you talking about? If you could be a movie podcaster or a reclusive writer. of mystery novels who lives on top of a mountain. What would you choose? I have to be on a mountain? No, well, it's funnier that way, but continue.

Well, I mean, it matters. If I'm living by the ocean and I'm... In this hypothetical scenario, it matters? Yes. Because if I'm living, like, by the ocean, and I'm writing mystery novels. Never just get a straight answer to you, you know? That seems great, but mountains, eh, I pick this podcast.

So there you go. That's heartwarming. You know? That's nice. Altitude really fucks with you or fucks with me anyway. It takes one day and then you're fine. Yeah, but I don't know. I just like I like them and I like beholding them.

Before Dogstar started, I turned to Amanda and I said next year, or no, 2028, I go to Venice, you go to Tell You Ride. And she got really tight and like nervous, like anxious. Which what we should do is make her go to like a drive-in movie theater festival in the middle of nowhere where there are no hills like in big sky country. Okay. Number 30 is Exodus gods and kings. Number 29 is 1492 Conquest of Paradise. 28, the Dog Stars, 27, all the money in the world, 26, House of Gucci, 25 Legend, 24, G.I. Jane, 23, Robin Hood. 22, a good year.

21, Gladiator 2, 20, Napoleon, 19 Hannibal, 18, 18 Black Rain, 17, someone to watch over me, 16, white squall, 15, the last duel, 14, the duelists, 13 body of lies, 12, alien covenant, 11 matchstick men, 10 American gangster, 9 Kingdom of Heaven, Eight, the Martian, seven Black Hawk down, six, the counselor, five Gladiator, four Prometheus, three Thelman Louise, two, Blade Runner, and number one in the Red, Ridley Scott, 30 film, all-time rankings from the big picture is Alien. How are you feeling? I actually thought of another question I wanted to ask you about Jacob Lurdy's clothes. Go ahead. Do you think that if the world functionally like society collapsed tomorrow, would you, if you were one of the survivors?

Yeah. And had, let's say, pretty decent access to clothing. Let me finish. Oh, sorry. Do you think you would continue to iterate your style? Or do you think you would stick with the clothes that you were wearing and the style that you had the day the society collapsed? Well, don't you think necessarily at some point, if you survive long enough, you do have to iterate because the clothing. So you would change the leg cut of your jeans?

Well, at some point, if you're wearing the jeans and wearing them out to the economy. extent that Jacob Lordy is because, you know, he's doing manly stuff like fishing and feeding dogs and sawing, then theoretically, because this is not a world that is producing new things, right? Like, he has access to supplies because he has a plane and he actually still has weapons. But he could probably go to Uniglo in Denver, but where else, you know, it's like. Right. And, but like, he can get some things, but he's going to run out of, he's going to run out of supply of vintage Levi's that fit him specifically, right? Because, and I was thinking about like, okay, so that's a, that's a pretty long cut of Gene, right? For six, five. You know,

it's like a big and tall store situation. So he's going to run out and I guess you have to iterate. Oh, but for me. Oh, I'm sorry. Do you have somewhere to be? I do. Okay. For me. I've just been checking my email here and continue where do you have to go you know it's only my daughter's first day of kindergarten so you know okay so anyway I'm just kidding

I just wanted to know whether you think style is a function of like consumerism or whether like you would have like I think it's a function of consumerism and also a function of to me it's an expression of of self, an expression. But I think that the ways in which I would want to express myself

were I just surviving and trying to find continuing contact supply would change. And I probably wouldn't need the reinvention on such a regular basis. I would shop at Dick Sporting Goods for the rest of my life. Thanks for joining the big picture. You guys done? Thanks to Jamie and Sarah for filling in in Jack Sanders' absence.

Appreciate you guys. Thanks to Lucas Cavanaugh for his production support. So next week, I got one with you and I got one with you. That's beautiful. With you, we're previewing the fall film slate. I'm going to tell you this right now. Here's what I'm thinking. You choose five movies you can't wait to see.

Yes. And then you choose three movies you think everyone should see that you've already seen. Okay. Sound good? I can do that. I'll do the same. Beautiful. You?

Yeah. We have something fun planned. Very special. We've seen the film Enslot, and it inspired an idea, which I'm loosely calling the Black and Chrome Action Pack, which is a very specific kind of movie. Think The Terminator. That Enslot is paying homage to, and that Chris and I will build a kind of tribute to, a canon. Should I still see Insidious for that pod? I haven't seen it yet, and I don't think that's necessary.

We're going to do a 10 movies we missed later in September. Okay, Amanda can see Insidious for me then. You know, I heard the jumps scares are pretty good. I'm not against seeing it. Okay. Yeah. But I feel like our mission, which we have accepted already, will be more than enough.

And soon you'll be disappearing. That's right. Into the wilderness of Europe, like Jacob of a Lordy. I'm doing the fall preview. So will you not be here for Resident Evil? No, I'll be back by then. She'll be back. Okay. But will she be on the Resident Evil podcast?

Oh. I'd like to see it, but we don't know anything about screenings. Not a thing. Yeah. Until then. We'll see you next time. Two and five Canadians will hear the words you have cancer. That's why every step and dollar raised matters.

On September 19th, join thousands in Toronto for the Princess Margaret Cancer Foundation Walk. Challenge yourself, friends, and family to walk 21 kilometers in support of life-saving research. Together, we can carry the fire and help create a world free from the fear of cancer. Register today at pmcfwalk.ca.ca.