The Big Picture - The Snyder Cut Will Be Released! But Why? Plus: How to Watch 100 Classic Movies.

Episode Date: May 22, 2020

After years of lobbying Warner Bros., the fans are getting what they want: the Zack Snyder cut of 'Justice League,' exclusively on HBO Max in 2021. What does that mean? Is that a bad thing? Does it confirm our fears about toxic fandom? Sean and Amanda examine the news and then dive into the mailbag to answer listener questions about which movie made them obsessed; how to watch the essentials in film history; and what to expect from the movie business in 2021, 2022, and beyond. Hosts: Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, and welcome to The Ringer Podcast Network. This week, The Ringer is launching a new podcast feed called Boom Bust. It's a new hub for narrative podcasts documenting the rise and fall of companies, celebrities, and trends. Season one, hosted by our own Alyssa Bereznack, takes you through this spectacular journey of HQ trivia, the once $100 million industry-altering company turned disaster. Alyssa interviewed dozens of former employees, investors, journalists, and fans, bringing you the behind-the-scenes story of how HQ crumbled from within.

Subscribe to Boom Bust HQ Trivia and check out the first two episodes out now on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Sean Fennessey. I'm Amanda Dobbins. And this is The Big Picture, a conversation show about releasing the Snyder Cut at last. It's upon us, Amanda, the news you personally have been waiting for for months and months, years and years. Way back in 2017, Zack Snyder was no longer able to complete his vision of Justice League. Joss Whedon had to step in. And ever since that movie came out and was not terribly well received, there has been discussion about a mysterious cut somewhere in the ether that had been overseen by Zack Snyder. A noisy contingent of fans of the DCEU rose up demanding to see Zack Snyder's vision.

And now, several months later, almost a full year after you and I first talked about this with Rob Harvilla on The Big Picture picture comes news that HBO Max in the year 2021 will release the Snyder Cut. Now, there are a lot of things to discuss and dissect about this particularly complex and scurrilous story in the movie industry. You want to just give us your first impressions of the news of the eventual release of the Snyder Cut? Whatever y'all want. Okay. Congratulations. Good job. I genuinely actually hope that this made some people happy because that's probably the only good thing that's going to come of it. And we need good news right now. So if you are genuinely happy that you are getting the Snyder Cut, I wish you well, and I am happy for you. And we don't share the same taste,

but that's okay because taste to an extent is subjective. And that's great. Be happy. Find things to be happy about. Earlier this week, we had a conversation about Tenet and the future of movie theaters. And I wasn't quite sure what to do on the back half of this week to give this conversation about the state of movie going and the movie industry and fandom what to do with the Friday show. But I had a strong sense in my mind's eye that we were going to get some big news this week. Now, I thought that that big news was going to be about the rescheduling of Tenet. I did not think it was going to be the official confirmation of the Snyder Cut. In a perverse way, I'm grateful to have this news, to have something to discuss here in this fashion.

We're going to have a full mailbag full of questions, including some questions very specifically about this topic. I don't want to go too much further into it before getting to some of those questions. So, Bobby Wagner, why don't you help guide us through our conversation, at least about the Snyder Cut, and then all things movies and recommendation related. Incredible premonition by you. And just an incredible tweet thread of hundreds and hundreds of questions that the news dropped right beforehand. Okay, this first question comes from Jareen, Andrew, Matthew, and a million other people. Does releasing the Snyder Cut set a dangerous precedent? This is probably the most important question about this entire issue.

So I mentioned this campaign, which Rob wrote about in great detail, and the nature of online fandom and aggressive action around getting what you want. I like to get what I want. I have a very specific vision of things that I like that I'd like to see in the world. I do not use online terroristic activity to get the things that I want. I think that the release the Snyder Cut campaign has been a fascinating experiment. I think there are obviously people who are sincere and in good faith. We're just using a hashtag on Twitter to drive interest in something that they care about. Even if you

don't like Zack Snyder's movies or the DC movies or Justice League or the idea of a new version of Justice League, I do think that there are people who just wanted something and tried to get it in as clean and safe a way as they can. And then there's another contingent. I don't know what percentage makes up that contingent.

It was very hostile and would dive bomb into every conversation about movies, the movie industry, anything Warner Brothers related in a bizarre attacking fashion to get something that it's still confirmed didn't actually exist. A big part of this story is that Zack Snyder is now getting an additional 20 to 30 million dollars to revise and rebuild and finish i guess his movie so you know it was premised upon if not a lie a complete misunderstanding of the circumstances but it worked and you know zach snyder is getting that extra 20 million dollars and hbo max is footing the bill for this new project. So I'm not sure if the precedent is dangerous. Dangerous is a complicated word in these times,

but it does, from my point of view, Amanda, it confirms that a certain kind of angry and hostile approach works. I mean, it worked in this case. Yes. I agree with everything that you said. And I think it's important to say that danger is an extremely relative term in this time, especially, and we're just talking about danger to the movie industry and, I don't know, civilized discourse or whatever, but the danger is already here. It's here and this is a confirmation. And we can talk about fan culture and how people express themselves online.

I don't think that's limited to the release the Snyder Cut. And be kind to each other, I guess, would be my message. But to me, this is more a confirmation about how good movies are screwed just and where resources are going to go and what's going to be priorities for people are not coming up with new big tent ideas and movies. And even like perhaps say a good version of Justice League in or a good version of a movie like Justice League. I don't I'm not trying to slander blockbusters. Please give me a good blockbuster. But instead of putting resources towards new ideas or even new movies,

we're just going to be recycling stuff in order to give fans what they want on streaming services, which, as you noted, it's 20 to 30 million extra dollars, which is, frankly, jump change in terms of what is spent on making major IP movies and TV shows now. And it's not going to go to theaters. It's just going to go

to HBO Max. And a lot of people will be happy. And I think it's interesting. It's not coming out till 2021, but it's being released now because HBO Max is launching next week and they're driving interest. This is just a pure business play. And this is what makes money now. And so we're going to get more of this. And whether or not you're interested in Justice League or the Snyder Cut, I think that if you're interested in good movies, perhaps you should be a little bit concerned now that

what is like, quote, premium content that people are giving their attention to is like recycled, half-finished cuts of movies that didn't work in the first place that involve a lot of IP. And I don't know. It just, it bums me out. And on the one hand, we knew that the world was kind of like that and we knew that projects like this and and fan attention like this are really what give a movie or a franchise value but but here we are the thing is this is not a new story in the history of hollywood the idea of the artist being pitted against the corporation the studio and the differing visions of how to tell stories is something Hollywood's history is premised upon that very

idea. Orson Welles, in many ways, builds big parts of his mythology around the idea that he wasn't really allowed to do what he wanted to do after the success of Citizen Kane in many circumstances. There's these stories of battles with the MPAA over the years

about things that can appear in movies and ratings. And that part of it isn't new. I think what's new about this is it does valorize the conspiracy. This is one of the first things that I can think of in the movie world where a group of people with no real information are convinced of a truth that has not been verified about something that they think they deserve. And flogging that conspiracy, it does have shades of some of the uglier parts of our culture. And a lot of the things that have happened in terms of the news media and the political world and the way that we communicate with each other about what is true and what isn't true. And the dilution of facts is all a part of the Snyder cut story. Now, I don't think that Zack Snyder in particular likes that or even thinks of it that way.

I think he thinks he's an artist and he makes films and he wants people to see his vision of his films, which is his right. And Ben Affleck's support of this campaign and Gal Gadot's support of this campaign, I think, has a lot to do with supporting Zack Snyder. And Zack Snyder cast Gal Gadot as Wonder Woman. You know, he cast Jason Momoa as Aquaman. Those people actually owe him a great deal. And they've gone on to be a part of these big successful franchises that, as you're saying, just dominate this world that we cover every day and every week on this show. I think it's also just important. You're right, as you pointed out, that the history of Hollywood is kind of littered with this studio versus director conflicts and movies being taken away from the director. And I think we'll talk more about that.

But, you know, this was a special case that Zack Snyder stepped off the film because of a family tragedy and was not able to to work on the film. And so in a lot of ways, he is certainly presenting it as a chance to finish what he was not able to finish because of personal reasons. And I think that it's important to keep it in those terms, at least for him. Now, I think you're right that the dialogue around it and what happens in certain corners of the internet does have a slight conspiracy tinge to it. And that's true of pretty much the entire internet. Though also, these fan campaigns, there's a history of them being like, save this show, save Friday Night Lights, like, please write this. It's just an interesting confluence of internet dialogues all at once

on this one and definitely reflects certain truths about how we talk in general right now. Yeah. And when fans were lobbying networks to bring back a version of their favorite show in 1997 or in 2005, they would coordinate campaigns that were oriented around sending hundreds of cans of tomato sauce to executives at the network. And I don't think those were malicious acts. They were just shows of faith in the thing that they cared about. I just think that the thing that has changed is the internet discourse has become increasingly hostile over the last 10 years. And the kind of irreverence and fun that I think came with a lot of those campaigns over

the years just has a little bit of a 4chan, 8chan veneer on it now. And it gets a little bit scary. And so when something like this is confirmed and happens, even though this is not Zack Snyder's intention, intention obviously it does indicate to people especially people who are more fringe that this can work and that's that there is something a little bit unnerving about that um i don't want to make too much of it i think we run the risk of being a little bit paranoid and kind of overstating the negatives of this i think ultimately what we're going to get is a three-hour cut of a movie that we both didn't really like

very much in the first place and maybe it will be marginally better, but like, and a little bit tonally different, but I'm not really sure what actually we're going to be getting. That's so significantly different from what we originally saw. For the record, I never saw it. The, um, I have not seen justice league in theaters, nor as he notes in the Hollywood reporter piece has Zack Snyder. So that is one thing that Zack Snyder and I have in common. We have not seen the officially released version. Yeah, I got concerned about the six TV part aspect of it, which was that. So it became clear that the Snyder cut isn't like finished and locked somewhere, which I think we did all know based on the course of events and why Zack Snyder left the film.

But it's not like they've been toiling in secret making it and they can just release it all at once. It does seem like all of the work is ahead of them. And so there's not a lot of clarity on what the Snyder cut will actually be. It could be a three hour cut. They are also saying like a six part TV like affair, which sent a real chill down my spine. I'll just I'll let you know that right now, just from the prospect of having to watch it for the purposes of being employed and being on this podcast. Well, you know, it's part of a bigger conversation, I think, that we'll start to get into a little bit with Chris and Andy next week on The Watch and on The Big Picture just about what HBO Max is, what streaming services are, what is the difference between a television series, a movie, and content. this amorphous, agglomerated thing that can be many parts or can be one whole.

And the way that you break it down indicates time spent on site and engagement and all of the metrics that are used to indicate success on so many of these projects. And so I'm sure we'll talk about this a lot more in the coming months as more of these services come along. But you remember, I think it was about a year ago when The Hateful Eight hit Netflix and Quentin Tarantino agreed when it hit Netflix to kind of chapterize it and to make it more like a TV series than a movie. You'd think of all people that Quentin would be opposed to something like that. But in fact, he thought it was an interesting idea and it gave him a new way to think about the movie

and it gave that movie new life. There was a new conversation about watching that movie. So I think that there can be versions of this that can work. I think unfortunately, at least for the purposes of this show, there's an understanding that like Justice League just, you know, what was its ceiling? You know, like I don't want to get ahead of ourselves here, Bobby, but somebody asked us literally how could the snyder cut possibly be good i i don't know i mean there are a couple of zach snyder movies i like i think 300 and his dawn of the dead remake are very effective for what they are i think he's very good at a very kind of aggressive visceral action filmmaking but he always struck me as the wrong person for dc I never got Man of Steel I that was one of the

worst viewing experiences I've had in a movie theater Chris and I remember we went together Chris Ryan and we hated it and Batman versus Superman is okay has a couple of things to recommend Affleck in particular seems to be trying very hard but like it's not it's not good and Justice League was a car crash they're shortlist so much in batman versus superman and i appreciated that yeah cavill looks great a handsome guy but that's really all i remember i don't i don't know what else to say about i know and i know that we are i don't know if we're in the majority or the minority i mean those films certainly have a huge fan base and i'm sure that those fans right now if we're in the majority or the minority. I mean, those films certainly have a huge fan base.

And I'm sure that those fans right now, if they're listening to this show, are like, fuck these two. But it just wasn't my thing in the first place. So it's fascinating that this has become this object of this political football. This thing that represents so much about

fandom and the future of movies and the rights of the artists, because how good can it be? I just don't think it's really all that good. The one thing that we should say is that Justice League was unfinished when Zack Snyder had to leave it. And if you want it in the spirit of goodwill, the only way that it could possibly be good is that if he actually had a vision from the unfinished version to this coming version and the material is already there and he just didn't get a chance to finish it i which and then that joss whedon finished it in a very dramatically

different way from from what he saw and i think that that is at least a part of the animating belief behind release the Snyder cut though. It certainly mutated and some weird directions and, and maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, I don't know because it is different than like,

this is a disaster and we're battling over notes. I'll give someone the benefit of the doubt that they didn't get to finish a first thing, but do I think it will be good to me, Amanda Dobbins? Absolutely not. That would be tight if it was as good as the Goonies, you know, if it was just an incredible thrill ride for young people around the world. That would be awesome. Yeah. Yeah. Bobby, what's next? Nate wants to know if a Snyder cut could be released of any other movie of your choosing what movie would you choose and why I assume both of you are going with the cats

famous butthole cut here which we got a lot of questions about there's so many cuts there's so many evil cuts out in the world that one already allegedly exists so it'd be easier and it wouldn't cost 30 million more dollars I refuse to believe it exists.

I mentioned Wells and the great story about Wells is that his version of The Magnificent Ambersons, which is just lost. And there's an extant 90 minute cut that you can buy a version of the, on the Criterion Collection right now and watch it and see what he was going for. But there's a much longer and deeper version of that film that has been lost to time and has been written about over and over and

over again. I think anybody who considers themselves a serious film fan or film scholar would want to see that version of Magnificent Ambersons. The only other one that came to mind for me was, I don't know if there is a different cut of Sydney slash hard eight Paul Thomas Anderson's first movie but that movie was famously taken away from him by the studio and is a pain point for him in his career and I don't I don't know materially what was different I think I once at one point I did read the original script that he shot but that just seems like the kind of thing that would be insightful about the directions not just the things he was interested in

but the directions he took as a filmmaker after that experience so I'd like to see what they decided to cut do you have any versions of this? there are some more famous ones one that came to mind to me more recently was all the pretty horses the Billy Bob Thornton cut of that

which i think matt damon has talked a lot about about that was taken away from billy bob thornton and really butchered and and that was painful for everybody and i'm curious about that um i love that cormac mccarthy novel i otherwise i couldn't think of anything specific because the ones where you know they're taken away there there are a few kind of director's cuts that are now available and they're obviously the famous ones but otherwise I do kind of believe in notes and this is not to say that the studio can't ever really fuck things up studios screw things up all of the time but my response to all of this isn't always like, please give me the six hour uncut, pure director's version of something unless they're

a true genius. And there are very few like true geniuses. Orson Welles is a true genius with all respect to Zack Snyder. He's not my kind of genius. How about that? So I don't have that many things where I want to see like eight hours of uncut footage and that's what I find so fascinating about the Snyder Cut is like even if the studio and everyone else screwed it up which is possible and happens all the time

and as you said there are so many bad cuts my instinct isn't just like give me like the unfiltered footage I don't know and that's another reason where I just like I can't imagine the Snyder Cut being good because without constraints very few things are ever truly good. So like Apocalypse Now, 20 years ago, we got Apocalypse Now Redux, where Francis Ford Coppola reinserted all of this footage that he shot during the making of that film, I think made a lot of sense because it informed a lot of why the Vietnam War happened and it gave the film some context, but it also really slowed the film down. And Redux, I think, is a fascinating experiment in recontextualizing

your own work, but it doesn't work as well as the cut that Francis Ford Coppola just put out, which was another cut, which I guess is the final cut and doesn't now, I think has excised that storyline completely, but has added more and other scenes around other aspects of the film. And like, obviously Blade Runner is a very famous example of this. There are several cuts of Blade Runner that are, that are out there in the world. And the one that you can find now on Blu-ray is supposedly the final director's cut, but maybe 10 years from now, there'll be another version of that. Ridley Scott also famously, there's a, there's a, like a three and a half hour cut of kingdom of heaven. His movie that hardcore fans like Chris Ryan and Jason Concepcion are both huge fans of that super extended cut of that movie, which doesn't even really have

a profile in the consciousness, except for being a movie that has a cool director's cut. Like nobody ever talks about kingdom of heaven, except to say that. So this cult of the director's cut that you're indicating has cropped up kind of post Orson Welles. The thing is, is we frequently see them. You know, they find a reason to let the director go back and revisit that stuff to make more money. And that is actually what it has in common with the Snyder thing, as you pointed out. It's a business decision. You know, that's why we're seeing this. And art can intersect with the business, but the business is driving the decision. All right, last Snyder Cut question. Adam wants to know how much money would it take for Amanda to watch both Justice League cuts back to back for 24 hours? No money because it's your job? I was going to say, Amanda's salary.

Well, but it's not my job to do it for 24 hours. I also had that exact thought. I was just like, well, it's my salary. But you're not going to, I don't think you can like reasonably ask me

to do it for 24 hours in the context of a job. There would be some, there would be some workplace complaints. So what about for charity? Right, exactly. That's what I was going i was gonna say for charity i would do it but it's it would be it would have to be a significant donation to charity like we would have to raise like six 20 to 30 million six figures

off the bat but i agree with bobby that let's let's you know keep going in terms of... I'm just also not good without sleep. So 24 hours, it would get really dicey. So we'd have to factor in some money for the legal concerns once I say things at hour 19 that we have to apologize for. So a lot of money is the answer. I think what we want to see is just you on mute, but watching just your facial expression through 24 hours. How do you think that would go? You know, speaking of charity, I just want to say I was really serious about buying the light from the lighthouse in the A24 auction. And I really wanted to do that. And I was disturbed to find on in the opening hours of that auction that somebody bid $80,000 for the Fresno light from the lighthouse. And that number never moved. It somebody bid $80,000 for the Fresno light from the lighthouse.

And that number never moved. It sat at $80,000 throughout the entire week. And I want the person who paid $80,000 to come forward. In fact, if that person is not a criminal or inhumane in any meaningful way, I want them to come on this show and explain to me why they felt it was necessary to show me up because I'm hurt. Because they were giving $80,000 to charity, Sean. Okay. So that person isn't a criminal. Okay. That person gave $80,000 to charity.

They did attack you. And perhaps you guys can have an emotional conversation about what the lighthouse, the light from the lighthouse means to both of you. Because, you know, I know you want to talk to someone about that and it's not going to be me, but $80,000 to charity. We're not going to hold anyone, you know, up for that. I had done some bargaining with myself about how I would tell my wife that I spent $10,000 of our money on a light that went to charity. I was seriously considering that. I was like, you know what? You know, we haven't chosen a cause recently. It'd be good to give money to charity. I was seriously considering that. I was like, you know what?

We haven't chosen a cause recently. It'd be good to give money to something. This is part of a bit on the show. It's a movie that I love. I was doing the whole spiel in my head, only to find out in hour one that some ghoul with 80 grand sitting around just had to show me up. And frankly, it hurts. I just wanted to get that on the record okay i want to get it on the record that i think donating eighty thousand dollars of charity

is a great idea and if you have the means to give eighty thousand dollars to charity go for it the big picker endorses charity in the world at large that person is a hero in my insane personal roman coliseum that person is my enemy okay that's fine i accept that what's our next question bobby anybody got any lingering snyder cut takes to get out before we move on from that for good see you in 2021 seven hour pod please 24 hour pod for charity okay ryan asks do you put any stock into the idea that the oscars might be postponed this was a pretty wishy-washy news report about the fact that the oscars could or could not be postponed off of february 28th next year um i think that there's just an extraordinary amount of uncertainty around the whole movie business we talked about it on monday there's no one knows what's going to happen.

The speculation started to heat up this morning that Wonder Woman 1984 should go to SVOD. And that whole major price point thing that you and I have been jousting about for the last few months, I saw somebody suggest $49.99 was the right price for Wonder Woman if it actually went to VOD.

For us personally, we're going to be working from home for a long time. And I think our doubts about movie theaters opening were verified. The people that I spoke to after that episode went up were just like, yep, I don't think we're going to see a movie for seven months. That wasn't, you know, that wasn't a deeply informed opinion. It was just that it was a gut reaction based on how everything is going right now. So if that's the case, you probably have to postpone the Oscars because I don't think the Oscars

is going to feel comfortable giving Bad Boys for Life best picture. Right. And also the Oscars are technically a live event that are then produced and broadcast to millions and millions of people across the world. And that requires a lot of logistics and safety guidelines and and millions of people across the world. And that requires a lot of logistics and safety guidelines and all sorts of practicalities that have not been worked out yet.

So I think you have to assume that it could, you know, the possibility is there that it could move. I think there's a possibility that literally anything in the movie business is going to move in the next six months. If we, there's one thing we want to say over and over again, it's as if we don't know what is going to happen. And it seems like very few people do. It's really in a state of flux. One thing that Gregory Elwood from the playlist has been adamant about that I agree with him on is that it's extremely unlikely that the Academy is likely to fuse two ceremonies that they will postpone for a year and then make it a two year Oscars that in fact, just given the arrangements, the circumstances, the historical precedent, we mentioned last week or earlier this week on the show about how the Academy needs the money from its TV contract.

So they will find a way to put on a show of some kind when it can be safe and reasonable. So I don't expect there to be a doubling up 2022 Oscars. I just think if it moves into March or moves in April or May, I mean, we're watching it happen in the world of sports right now. You know, if basketball comes back in June or July, they'll figure it out.

They'll figure out a modified game plan for the rest of the season in the playoffs. And the same is likely to be true of, of the world of movies. Jeremy wants to know, what do you think the ramifications of a potential sale of AMC to Amazon will have on the industry and the theater experience I don't I you know personally I don't really see the upshot here for Amazon I don't totally because it seems like paying for something

that you don't need you know that obviously Amazon is producing films but they're producing films to draw attention to Amazon Prime, which drives revenue for their bottom line. They're not producing films to save the moviegoing experience, and they're not even really producing films to make money on films, although that's a nice outcome if it happens. So what did you make of this? The same thing. I don't understand why you what did you make of this the same thing I just seems on I don't understand why you would do it especially now um given the rapid change to the theater industry and I think you know no matter what happens with movie theaters and once again we are nobody knows

and it is like very uncertain times but you have to think that the movie theater experience, which was already undergoing massive change, is going to be changed dramatically. And I don't know that as a distribution model, Amazon in particular needs it because Amazon already has a functioning distribution model of its own. And I don't know what a major theater chain would enhance for them specifically for all the reasons you mentioned. Yeah, the kind of acquisition that makes way more sense to me from Amazon's perspective is something like Lionsgate, a small studio that has a lot of active IP that they can then use to leverage new opportunities. You know, if they could get

their hands on the John Wick IP, they can build a whole world under the Amazon banner around something like John Wick. That is a much more tried and true strategy. I mean, it seems like this would be really beneficial for AMC, which is in a great deal of debt. And obviously, the state of movie theaters is very complicated and perilous right now. But I couldn't really wrap my head around why Amazon, which is booming, frankly, during this pandemic. I don't see the logic in that acquisition. I mean, is there a chance that it's like a data acquisition? That was what MoviePass eventually turned out to be, is they wanted to sell all the data back to other companies and make money that way rather than through the $9.99. It's true. And it would not be above Amazon to make a corporate decision like that.

But it's a pretty limited data set. I think AMC's subscription service is Stubbs. And Stubbs is fairly young. And I know people who subscribe to it, who are members, love it. And I know I'm very jealous of them when I go to an AMC movie theater and I see them cutting the concessions line because they have a special pass that I don't have. And I feel it. And I know I'm very jealous of them when I go to an AMC movie theater and I see them cutting the concessions line because they have a special pass that I don't have. And I feel sad. But I'm just not sure how much data is actually even there. Could it be one one thousandth as powerful as the pre-existing Amazon data? Right. I mean, every American is engaging in Amazon in some form or fashion, right? Even if it's just through web services. Yeah. The data that they have is already so much more expensive than anything that they would get from AMC, especially at this current moment. You might be onto something, Bobby, that there's something in an acquisition like that that we don't see, that their analysis would make meaningful

for them, but I don't know what it is. Could just be like what type of person would spend more money for media consumption, you know? But I guess that Amazon Prime is already accomplishing that. I don't know. Who knows? Tyler asks, Steven Soderbergh wrote a sequel to Sex, Lies, and Videotape during quarantine. We the people are seeking comment from Amanda and Sean. Shout out to my friend, Steven Soderbergh. We are proud of you

for making the most of this time. And we look forward to whatever you want to share with us. I want to know what Laura San Giacomo is up to these days.

So I'm in. Like, I want it to be the original cast. I don't want it to be like a new batch. You know, it's not, this is not Saved by the Bell, the new class.

You know, I want, I want the core. I want new batch. You know, it's not this is not saved by the bell. The new class. You know, I want I want the core. I want Spader. You know, I want McDowell on Laura San Giacomo. Who's the other one? Peter Gallagher. Yes.

I want them all back. If they can't be back. I'm not as interested. But you trust Steven Soderbergh to do that, right? Sure. Sure. I trust him to corral the forces.

Trust in him to make the right decisions. I certainly do. He's just frequently putting every human person in a creative field to shame with his level of productivity. People are having emotional crises every day around the pandemic and he's like, I finished two scripts. What do you got next, fuckers? It's amazing.

He's the best. Thank you, Tyler, for being an active and understanding listener of the show yes jed wants to know will the last dance be oscars eligible and if so what are its chances it will not uh after the after the oj made in america campaign the oscars changed its rules to disallow films that were not just in terms of length, but specifically made for television. And this film was made for television. So even though there's some confusion around what's going to qualify for Oscars this year, this film, I don't think there was ever a strategy to put it into movie theaters. And so it's not going to

qualify. In fact, when the Academy's CEO, Don Dawn Hudson gave an interview about the new eligibility requirements, she cited The Last Dance as a wonderful documentary series that would not be eligible for an Oscars. I believe that was in The Hollywood Reporter. So it was great. Love The Last Dance. Very happy to have had it. Yeah, probably not. Do you have a final take on the 98th season amanda now knowing the results and everything uh you know congratulations to the chicago bulls for their continued

accomplishments tough beat for the knicks all right dennis wants to know to the extent that it applies to this pod what are your thoughts on the peacock i have no idea i have no take i haven't engaged i'm not a comcast subscriber so i haven't had early access to the service you know i think that there's a probably a broader understanding that not all of these services are going to survive it's interesting that peacock is last to the table the hbo now lineup the originals lineup i would say is not that enticing for someone like me but the library is pretty sick and I'll be curious to see if the peacock does something similar in terms of trying to build out its universal movie library the same way we're going to get a taste of the

Warner Brothers movie library which I think you know Amanda you and I both saw a lot of stuff in that first offering that is pretty cool. Yeah. No, I mean, it's a great list. And it has something for everyone. I have been making a lot of jokes about the HBO Max marketing, which perhaps we can talk more about on a lesser episode. But I don't think that HBO Max, with its emphasis on its larger IP and superhero elements, is necessarily marketing to me, Amanda Dobbins, and that's okay because they have other things on their library that I am unbelievably excited

about. I mean, they just have years and years and years of film history that they're going to make available. As for Peacock, I was thinking very idly about this and I should possibly, you know, develop and inform this take at some point, but Peacock, I was thinking very idly about this and I should possibly develop and inform this take at some point, but Peacock will involve advertising. Isn't that correct? That's going to be interesting to me specifically because I know that I have a very knee-jerk reaction to the idea of paying for a streaming service and then having to watch ads, which is for me personally, no thank you. But that's just because that's my behavior and that's how I've learned. And I think that's how a lot of people who subscribe to, say, Netflix have learned. And it will be interesting to see how people adapt to that.

Yeah. Just as a small microcosm of the point you're making, I was having trouble sleeping last night and I found myself on YouTube, on Apple TV, watching old interviews with Clint Eastwood for a future episode of this podcast. I was watching an episode ripped onto YouTube of Inside the Actor's Studio, which was a fine program that I loved a great deal. And as I rewatch episodes of that show, I realized just how much I'm ripping it off as we do interviews on the show. Nevertheless, there was an episode with Clint Eastwood and YouTube throws to these five to 10 second advertisements, which are fairly unobtrusive and manageable as advertising goes,

as commercials go. But still, I found myself enraged by the fact that I couldn't consume this illegal content ripped to YouTube for an hour at a time. I was like, this is unjust at 1.30 in the morning. And I'm somebody who is respectful of the advertising model and the fact that I know that media at large needs it to survive in many ways. So I think it'll be an interesting challenge for Peacock to try to integrate something like that because the audience is pretty finicky when it comes to it now because of exactly what you said, because of Netflix and because of the way that we've been told that we deserve everything free all the time netflix stole hulu's lunch for me in that respect the 80 second ad is just it's it's too much uh you both

mentioned hbo max michael f asked what is the first thing you plan to watch on hbo max tough choice between the maltese falcon and the snyder I assume. Well we won't have to worry about the Snyder Cut because that's not coming for another year. Allegedly. You know I think one of the complicated issues around it is the Criterion channel exists but then a huge bulk of the Criterion collection is also going to HBO Max

and so there are going to be some films I believe that are going to be on HBO Max that are not going to be on the Criterion collection but then they're also going to be a lot of films that the Criterion Collection essentially leases for a period of time that you can watch on their service. And so I'll probably go looking for the variance there in terms

of the films I haven't seen in the past. As far as the TV shows go, though, like if you're an HBO now or go subscriber, you are almost certainly going to get HBO Max. That's something that people should know about it. And so since you are Amanda and I am, I think a lot of the HBO shows,

we already have access to those. That's not new. And I'm not necessarily planning on digging into the Anna Kendrick scripted love life dating series. Nor am I. Yeah. No. So I'm not scoping out Craftopia.

Okay. I don't know what that is. The Elmo talk show that's also on the slate oh okay well congratulations to children that's good oh i didn't like the muffet right he's a sesame street character yes please be respectful oh i'm sorry i'm sorry yeah sesame street i love elmo on. I just wanted to make sure there wasn't someone else. The red guy. This is not for you, but they're rebooting Looney Tunes as well on HBO Max. Checked out a couple of the installments. Pretty good. Brought me back. I watched Looney Tunes.

I was a child once. Once? Fair enough. What's next, Bobby? Are there any episodes of television you would pay to see in a theater this comes from jody the suitcase i that was one of the first ones i thought of too i also like maybe a fleabag in one sitting this the second season of fleabag and i thought maybe you could probably i loved normal people so much I thought it was so wonderful I was very moved by it um and I think part of the reasons that I was moved by it

is because it was it had a very filmic quality it was good it was well made beautiful to look at with future movie stars type of tv you you could probably make a two hour version of normal people that I wouldn't want you to because I liked it in TV format. And that's the thing. Why would I pay? Because all of the TV shows that I want to watch in a theater that I would pay to watch in a theater, I would pay because I think they're good enough and they worked at home so why would I pay money for them but I think normal money could work as a show as a as a film I mean yeah so you've raised the point that like I'm kind of I'm this is kind of stepping on what I want to talk about next week too when it comes to HBO max but there's a moment right now where there's a couple of series that I'm watching I'm in the middle of normal people

which I agree is I think just fabulous really brilliantly well done and Mrs. America I'm watching. I'm in the middle of normal people, which I agree is, I think, just fabulous, really brilliantly well done. And Mrs. America I'm watching, which similarly is like those are two TV shows that are basically just movies. They're telling very confined stories. They're obviously elongated in their script process in an effort to fill hours. And I don't mean that in like a critical way about the art. It's just the nature of television just demands more hours. And so you're seeing more and more things that 10, 20, 40 years ago, the Phyllis Schlafly biopic is something you might have seen 25 years ago from Mike Nichols. And now it's a nine hour series on Hulu on FX. And they have a lot of the same beats, the same feel. You know, the normal people's story about a love affair over a series of years, that's a movie.

It's not a TV show. And as miniseries started to eat movie concepts, that's part of what we've kind of lost in the movie world. But I will say, I mean, I said the briefcase because the suitcase rather. The suitcase? The suitcase. Suitcase. I will say, I mean, I said the briefcase because the suitcase rather the suitcase, the suitcase, which me, you and Andy Greenwald once upon a time did a podcast about that episode, which I think is really one of like the, I would put it up there with many of my favorite movies of the last 25 years. I think it's such a brilliant piece of writing and acting and

directing on Mad Men. I just would like to actually see if I can get a new context for something like that, that I only experienced at home. The same way I think with Better Call Saul is one of those shows, too, where when you're watching it, I'm always like, this is very filmic. You know, there's a lot of purpose and choice, intentionality going into the way that it's shot and the way that it's staged. And I'd love to get a sense of what that looks like on a big screen. But you're right that it doesn't necessarily make me enjoy it any less that I only watched it on TV. Right. I had a similar thought as listeners will know. I'm a huge fan of the crown and I was like, oh, what I want to see some of the crown on the big screen. But like, honestly, I am worried that I would start to notice the production shortcuts and the things that they did for filming the crown on television, which is, I think, just a tremendously

well-made, well-written, well-acted show. And they do so much in terms of the costume drama. But I can tell that Buckingham Palace is CGI. And I can tell that on my small screen. And you put that up on a big screen, and I'm going to be really mad. Now, would I love to see the film version of The Crown where they, you know, I mean, if they filmed the actual crown at Buckingham Palace, like, yes, like I'll move into the movie theater with proper safety guidelines. But I do wonder whether you would start to see some of that, not even cracks, because TV is a different medium, but especially visually.

That was my hesitation. I'd like to see some of these things shot on film, too. That's the other thing is all this stuff is shot on digital. And so it just looks a little bit junkier and it has that kind of Netflix, um, that sheen on it, you know, that kind of like flat brightness that is,

is different. It doesn't have the depth. Like that, that sounds like annoying movie nerd shit, but go watch an old movie and then put it up next to a recent episode of i don't know what we do in the shadows a show that i love it just doesn't they don't look as good i wonder if something like maniac works better in a movie theater because it's just so weird and your phone is away and you're not you're less likely to tune out i i think it's a good call i'll never know

because i i had a much harder time with it because of what you're saying you know it might have been more interesting in a movie theater. I mean, that's true of so many things. We're, we're kind of constantly grappling with that. I think on this show in particular, I think the,

the myriad ways in which we can be distracted while engaging with the number one thing we care about is just an amazing quality of life right now. Can I flash my young white ringer dude badge and say fly from breaking bad would work really well in a movie theater of course but we know ryan johnson knows how to make movies you know so when he makes an episode of breaking bad it's like oh yeah okay so the guy who made you know last jedi or knives out who's like literally one of the best living movie directors of course he could make a tv show worthy of a movie theater. And did they do that at some point with Breaking Bad?

Was there like a moment where you could see them? I know you could see El Camino in theaters, but did any of the theater chains ever do that? I wonder. I don't know. Maybe it's a new business for us, Amanda. We outbid Amazon to buy AMC and we only show TV shows

that are available on streaming networks. Would that work? Okay, that's great. We are the future moguls of America. Congratulations to us. They blocked us from the light. Yeah, exactly. Good thing we saved our money on that.

Okay, Will. Will wants to know, Will has a friend who wants to discover the classics and deepen his knowledge. What is the best approach? Should you pick a genre and work through the best ones or should you pick a director? Should you start with the top 50 list?

What's the best way to do it? What would you advise here, Amanda? I have the boring traditional recommendation, which is I think it does help. It doesn't help. But what I would do is start with the classics, start with a list of all the things that people have said, you know, this is one of the greatest whatever movies made because they're good for a reason. Like we're all about challenging consensus and finding underrated things. And, you know, that's all like well and good, but people can can be right. And it gives you a real foundation and you can try a lot of different movies and you can understand what you

respond to and you can identify directors and actors and genres and then go down the roads that are most interesting to you. But I kind of think to know what's out there, because what if you pick a genre that you you doesn't work for you or what if you that's a lesson in a way. But I kind of believe that if you're going to be educating yourself about classic cinema for fun, like enjoy it. You're that's what it's meant to be. It's meant to be educating yourself about classic cinema for fun, enjoy it. That's what it's meant to be. It's meant to be enjoyed. I think there's probably a handful of people, a handful of filmmakers you can point to and say, you can't go wrong.

You can't go wrong with Alfred Hitchcock. You can't go wrong with Billy Wilder. There's a couple of people who I would say unequivocally just dig into their filmography, see what happens. I used to say that about Woody Allen. I don't know if I can say that anymore. The easiest hack is probably just to go to the AFI 100 years, 100 movies list that I think they most recently updated in like 2005. And it is not a complete accounting of the history of American cinema. It's not perfect. It has some flaws. It has some biases as all lists do,

but it's pretty close to getting a sense of what those classics are that you're talking about, Amanda. And I know as a young movie watcher, it was very helpful for me. You know, it really did. I talked about Mutiny on the Bounty on the at sea podcast we did a couple weeks ago. I only watched that movie as a teenager because of that list, because I watched that CBS special that they aired and I saw Charles Lawton in the clips and I was like, who is that? What's going on there?

That, that acting is my favorite kind of acting. So I think it's a, it's like not a bad place to start. And then from there, buy a couple of books, buy Roger Ebert's great movies book, go through it,

seek everything out. That's a great way to start. Hey, it's Bill Simmons. I just wanted to make sure you were listening to podcasts on Spotify. Here's how you do it. First, search for your favorite podcast on Spotify's app. They have a library of over 750,000 pods at this point. So let's say you're searching for the Rewatchables or the Dave Chang Show or the Rer NBA show. Once you find them, click on the follow button. That's how you subscribe. Then click on those letters near the top of the app.

That's a podcast. All the pods you're following will pop up separated by episodes, downloads, and shows. Wait, it gets better. Spotify, you can adjust the speed of the pods to seven different speeds. 0.5 times is the slowest. I actually sound drunk at 0.5. You can do 0.8 times, 1.2 times, which is my favorite. Everyone sounds like they just had a good cup of coffee. And then there's 1.5 times, two times. And if you're completely insane, three times. Anyway, Spotify's app connects directly to many of the best automobiles in the

world. It even has a CarPlay feature. That's pretty cool. Best of all, it's free. Download Spotify on any device and you're good to go. Should you be embarrassed that you're not listening to podcasts on Spotify? Well, I don't want to app shame you. But the answer, unfortunately, is yes. Make the move.

Listen to podcasts on Spotify. Back to yours. Okay, next up from Justin. Need more recommendations, but want to go back in time. Most underrated movie before 1970. Underrated by whom? Yeah, I mean,

the answer is like there are thousands and thousands of them. So, I don't know. I just picked a movie that I was thinking about the other night. I was like, we don't talk about this movie enough, even though I talk about it a lot. And it was made in 1968. It's called The Lion in Winter. And it stars Peter O'Toole and Catherine Hepburn. And it's about once again, it's about really old kings and queens of England and at one time France. But it's one of those great historical dramas with a lot of larger themes.

I was quoting it to my husband. So it's good. We should talk about Lion and Winter more. I just watched The Big Heat this week, a Fritz Lang noir film that's on the Criterion channel. Is it underrated? I don't know. It's unbelievable. It's like it's one of the Criterion channel. Is it underrated? I don't know. It's unbelievable. It's one of the best movies ever made.

I don't really know how to answer a question like that because I don't know what people's frames of references are. You could go rewatch any Fritz Lang movie made between 1925 and 1960 and probably get something that'll blow your wig back, but your mileage is going to vary

based on what you've consumed in the past okay next question is from ian uh just finished watching the 39 steps commentary on criterion and thought it added a lot to the overall experience do either sean or amanda have movie commentaries available on streaming that they would particularly recommend well uh the raging bull commentary is on the criterion channel right now with scorsese and it's a no-brainer and it's a great film much like the 39 steps is a great film made by a great filmmaker criterion channel in particular is very good at including commentaries not just with filmmakers but with scholars um i think there's one for anatomy of a murder which we talked about recently on the courtroom dramas episode.

It is very good. It's tricky. I mean, my favorites are the ones that are more antic. You know, the Paul Thomas Anderson Boogie Nights commentary in which he explains everything he stole from Martin Scorsese is like the best film school you'll ever take. It's just so funny to watch somebody just talk specifically and deeply about their influences, while also maybe a little bit addled by substances. Every Ben Affleck commentary is iconic. Yeah. Every commentary about Ben Affleck in movies is also iconic.

Yeah, that's my pick is the David Fincher Gone Girl commentary, which I Googled quickly here and I'm very sorry. I don't know whether it's available on streaming. It doesn't seem like it but it is absolutely worth your time both to get into the mind of David Fincher and also to get into the mind of David Fincher as it relates to Ben Affleck

was there one movie that made you realize you wanted to talk slash write about movies for a living this is from Cullen do we get this question every time we got some variation yeah do you have an answer for this i always say the wizard of oz i i tend to think the wizard of oz is the most wow i didn't know they could do that movie ever made when you're a young child when you see it

and you're like oh my god black and white to color look at these creatures look at this song you know there's like so much invention and wonder in that story and if you're five years old you don't realize that there can be a such thing as a tin man and it like normalizes imagination which is i mean that's what movies that's what's great about movies that's why i love them you know they they take you to a new place yeah i think you know my childhood version of that was Mary Poppins, which has a similar they go to other worlds and suddenly everyone is singing and dancing. And then 25 years later, you learn it's about the banking system in the in England in the

early 20th century, but whatever. But I don't have a movie where I was like, now I will become a movie journalist. I think, quite frankly, this question implies a level of deliberateness and strategy with respect to my career that is just not there. So I can remember movies where I was just like, oh, movies are really powerful. I think When Harry Met Sally was a big one for me in terms of just being like, oh, the way that I think, but way smarter and better can be in a movie. And then also a movie can be about anything and be really pop and also excellent and speak to larger issues and and again become a reference point I guess like the the place that movies have in like our own lives kind of revealed to me that the

place they have in my life specifically those are are my best answers. The other thing that happened for me personally is having consciousness of a generation of filmmakers that came out of Sundance in the early 90s and getting kind of hooked on reading about those people and getting deeper into their lives. I've talked a lot about Tarantino, obviously, in this respect. And there was like a kind of instant academia around Tarantino's movies, like almost almost after reservoir dogs there were books about him and about his writing style and filmmaking style and then obviously right around that time you basically got spike lee soderbergh richard linklater kevin smith there was allison anders was frequently talked about robert rodriguez like that generation it was it

was like following superheroes it was like being into comic books you know you or being a fan of the new york knicks you could like look at your team and figure out who you were rooting for and why and you couldn't even find all the movies i remember trying to find alexander rockwell movies in the mid 90s like in the soup i would read about in the soup in premier magazine and then i'd be like how do I get this like my blockbuster doesn't have it so like what do I do and then it became a treasure hunt and I think that that part of it probably informed more my desire to kind of get into this world professionally as opposed to just being in love with movies which is probably more like what

the Wizard of Oz does okay Jordan wants to know about your thoughts on Defy Blood's trailer. I'm in. Yes. Show us new movies. Yeah, I mean, it looks like... Let's go. It looks like a treasure hunt movie. It looks like a heavy flashback movie. I'm an avowed Delroy Lindo stan. I don't know what he's been up to. I think he does a lot of series television now, but he was one of my favorite actors in the 1990s. He's worked with Spike before. He's in Crooklyn.

And I'm ready. I love that Chambers Brothers song, Time. That was awesome music cue on that trailer. Let's go. Let's do it. We get to have a Spike month on the big picture. It's awesome. What movie improved the most for you upon a re-watch this is from dalton

hmm did you have an answer to this one so i was preparing for this podcast and i g-chatted my husband in the other room and i was like can you think of a movie that i liked more when i re-watched it and he just wrote back ha ha ha ha ha ha ha um that's that's like verbatim I have a screenshot of it so that's an insight into my marriage for sure and also I think a true reflection of of me probably for it's probably for the worst I think that if I I think I would be a better person if I had more answers to this list. But I don't really in terms of movies that I had a strong negative reaction to. And I rewatched and I was like, oh, I was wrong.

That's just never happened. It probably never will. Movies that there are a lot of movies that have like deepened for me or that I've understood more the more times I watch them. Little Women is a great recent example of the Greta Gerwig adaptation of I was very moved by it the first time. But the second time I watched it, I was like, wow, Greta Gerwig is like the smartest person alive. And there are a lot of things that I discover in many movies that just, you know, both how they work larger themes. I think a great

movie is always it's a it's a good test of a lot of movies not all of them i was gonna say like i was i forgot that my joke answer to this was gonna be inception but um that's a that's an example of a movie that has a great first experience and then maybe isn't rewarding in the same way just because so much of it is in that reaction, that instant, oh my God, I don't know what's happening, which is very valuable and very hard to pull off. But yeah, I don't have an answer to I was wrong. I just don't. I'm sorry.

I talked about an example on the Dunkirk rewatchables because I was pretty blah on Dunkirk and revisiting it I think I got a better sense of what worked and frankly it made me understand a little bit more what I'm interested in and Chris Nolan's movies and what I like about them and what I don't like about them and Dunkirk does more of the things that I like than the things that I don't like I still think it's a bit needlessly fussy in terms of how it's organized. Don't think that totally pays off. And that's kind of my,

my issue with a lot of his movies is I don't think that they totally pay off when you spend any time thinking about them, but he's got such a sense of grandeur and such an incredible visual sense. And he gets great performances out of people, which shouldn't be overlooked. So that's probably the one that I can think about most clearly. And I might not have revisited it

if Quentin hadn't asked to do it on the show, if he hadn't suggested that. I don't know if I would have picked that up of my own choice anytime in the near future. We know Sean is the spreadsheet wizard and is now on Letterboxd. This is from JK. How does Amanda track what films she watches and has watched over the years?

I have a good answer to this for the year 2020, which is that to bring it back to my friend Steven, I am doing a Soderbergh-esque list of all of the movies and TV shows that I've watched, the books that I've read, which are primarily novels. And then also all of the recipes that I have been cooking for the first time, which nobody but me cares about, but I'm making a list of that. So that's just on my phone on a notes app. And I update it every day before I go to bed. There are no records existing prior to 2020, which is how I like to live. You know, just don't don't leave anything in writing. So I don't have I don't keep track of it. And this has been the list has been interesting. I find it reveals more to me about what I was doing on a day to day and how I was feeling than anything

about like what I've learned about a particular genre of of art but that might just be because of because I'm not watching in any sort of disciplined way but it it's interesting well I will conclude it at the end of the year and I'll decide whether I want to share it with people Sean how far back does your list go like do you have written out lists from the 90s of movies that you watched? 2011. I have a yearly list since 2011. And I don't know if I'm... That list may be obviated by Letterboxd, which is just... What a platform.

Shout out to Letterboxd. I was thrilled to see myself called out in the Insane Letterboxd Reviews Twitter account. That was iconic. I just really feel like I'm participating in something that is very special. Shout out to everybody on Letterboxd because it's a great platform. It's a great time killer in a time like this. As Amanda

and Bobby know well, I am an obsessive list maker and it's a great home for lists. I've got so many private lists that I won't be sharing with people anytime soon until I complete them and perfect them. Stay tuned for free content you're welcome let's move on molly wants to know who do you think will write the best movie about coronavirus and what genre will it be my money is on adam mckay and then this is an interesting follow-up kind of same vein

brian says i could be open to a little shot in quarantine on an iPhone film, as long as it had a cool concept and the right people were behind it. Can you think of a writer, director, actor, couple or family who could pull such a thing off? I shudder to think what the mumble core COVID-19 movie is. I don't want that.

Somebody did ask me last night. I was, when I was chatting with that same friend, like why hasn't there been more production, you know, in home production around things? And I'm sure that there will be at some point. The other thing that's notable about this is that I think media companies, because they're also hurting out of necessity, are getting projects going. Michael Bay announced that his company was producing a COVID-19 related movie. Michael Bay, who makes nothing small, who only makes big. So if you're competing with Bay and Blumhouse also announced that they're going to start

production on a film, which may or may not be COVID related, but it is at least trying to operate inside this time where they have a smaller set, a smaller production group, and they're trying to make a movie like next month, they're going to start shooting. So it's got to be tricky to make the next Blair Witch Project when you're competing against Blumhouse and Michael Bay and also when you're competing against the whole world who has just been live casting every zoom and Instagram live I I really I do not have an appetite for COVID related uh scripted stuff right now, partially because like we're living in it and that's just not how I process my own things.

But also just because I do feel like we have gotten a lot of the content live and with the same production value that say like a found footage like Zoom movie would have so i get it i've had plenty of it what i want is actually real production values and people making things about life outside of this little zoom channel that we are on i'm sure that people will absolutely figure it out in in in creative ways and that you know it's, it's funny, my response to the, who will be the first person to make a movie about this, like on an iPhone was absolutely Steven Soderbergh, but of course he has already made one. In terms of the family question, I just, again, I have, I've loved all our Zooms and our Instagram lives to everyone. And I don't know how many more I need of them, but

did you happen to see that Ethan Hawke and his and his family, his daughter, Maya, they did a little I guess it was like a music video. She is a singer or musician as well as being an actor. And he was she sang and he played and the other siblings were there. And it was very sweet. And I really enjoyed it. And they could probably make some more content that would be interesting from a family perspective. Ethan Hawke and the Hawke family can provide whatever is available at their disposal and I will consume it. So I'm in. Okay. A question for another recommendations question here.

This one comes from John. I really enjoy anthology films like the ballad of buster scruggs and wild tales what are some other anthology film must sees i love anthologies this is a great question this got

me scratching that part of my brain uh horror movies are by far the best anthology movies because most horror movies don't need to be 90 minutes they usually need to be about 30

minutes so when you can fit three or four 30 minute movies into one movie, I love that. A couple I would recommend trick or treat from about 10 years ago is really fun, really clever. Creepshow is a classic George Romero and Stephen King teaming up VHS slightly more in that mumble core vein, more low budget, indie budget. One of my favorite Martin Scorsese movies of all time can be found in an anthology, in the anthology New York Stories, which is an okay movie that features three short films

by one short film each from Francis Ford Coppola, Woody Allen, and Martin Scorsese. But Scorsese's installment, which is called Life Lessons, starring Nick Nolte, is an absolute banger. And if you haven't seen it, I would recommend you check it out. Coffee and Cigarettes, Jim Jarmusch's anthology. It's pretty cool.

Features a conversation between the RZA and Bill Murray. That's tight. You guys seen Fantasia? A wonderful animated film from Walt Disney, the Walt Disney Company. Very touching. I don't know, Amanda, do you like anthology movies? I don't.

Sorry. Oh my gosh. I was wondering how long you were going to go on before I had to just be like, watch a TV show. This is a hot take for me. In fact, I have recorded a written fiction version of this hot take on the podcast, The Hottest Take, about short stories. It's just not my jam. Do the whole thing or, or do a TV show. I want full

complete things. I want, if you're going to ask for my attention, give me the full finished product. That's, that's where I am. That's me. Just absolutely despicable. What you just said. I know. Just horrible. That's fine. fine that's you you gave like 85 anthology recommendations so they'll all be happy okay okay let's let's do one more question and this came from a lot of people so it's a good one to finish on uh brennan and a bunch of other people wanted to know a lot of focus has been on when already made movies will be released what do you think 2021 and 2022 will look like since there are no productions happening right now? Will we have less movies than normal?

It's a head scratcher. I mean, I'm not sophisticated enough to know how to predict how the next couple of years go. I think that there is like a, there's a decision point that has to happen where studios have to decide if they're willing to take a loss or a modest gain on their 2020

movies by putting them out in streaming platforms now. We've seen some smaller companies, Paramount sold the Lovebirds to Netflix. And so now, today, you can watch the new kamil nanjani isa ray movie we also just saw this week that sony sold greyhound a tom hanks naval war movie to apple tv plus the buzz on greyhound is not very good people did it's moved a bunch it's date it's not it's not the same as as moving steven spielberg's west side story to apple tv plus but, it's a Tom Hanks movie that is going right to a streamer. So if this starts to happen, that does materially affect the question. It affects the fact that the 2020 movies are actually going to come out in 2020, and then there will be a big gap between new stuff. And the pipeline in television is starting to run a little dry.

We've seen shows like Billions say that they can only put out a certain number of episodes and they won't be able to complete their season. That's going to continue to be the case the longer this extends. And the movie stuff, while there's a ton of stuff in the can, and it's been interesting to follow. I don't know how much you follow Paul Schrader talking about his gambling Oscar Isaac poker player movie, but he got to like, sounds like 80 to 90% finished with his production of the movie, but missed the final few days of shooting. And so now he's in this position where he's like, can I finish my movie remotely and then find a way to show it to people and sell it?

So it has distribution without the traditional film festival apparatus. So like frequently on this show, the last couple of months, we've been talking about all the big movies we know are coming, you know, Wonder Woman and Top Gun 2 and all this stuff that we have a lot of anticipation for. But then there's this whole other category of stuff that has been shot that doesn't have a distributor that doesn't necessarily know what its future is, that was planning to play the festivals for the next 18 months before figuring out its fate that stuff might get elevated and move more quickly into the marketplace because when the pipeline runs dry they'll be looking for more stuff so it's just a long-winded way of saying i don't know and then

there are a ton of variables involved here but my gut is that this isn't the last quote-unquote emergency podcast we're going to be doing about news about something getting moved up. Because I just think that as people start to cope with the fact that movie theaters can't open at large, there's going to be bottom line decisions that are going to get made. I think that'll make sense. And that's just that's 2020 and part of 2021. And then you have to get into all of the movies and TV shows that are just not in production and the new ways that they have to figure out production, things that were planned in a pre-COVID world, both in terms of logistics, but also various availability, writers, directors, actors, and how that puzzle all gets put together. It will get put together very differently, just necessarily. And so sorting that out will take time. And that's 2021, 2022, because these things are done

months and years in advance. And then you do have to wonder about, will they make giant movies in the same way, just from an economic standpoint versus the conversation that we keep having about if your priority is streaming, are you spending differently? And are your budgets different? And are the types of movies you're making differently? And do they look more like TV shows? And that conversation will continue. I don't know if we have gotten to the last mega event movie moment or not. I don't, I really don't know if,

if end game marked the end of something. And that sounds so dramatic. And I think people get a little cranky with us when we, when we say stuff like that, but I'm trying to be practical. Like I, I really don't think that the movie culture, it was already in a difficult position.

And what the, I think the ramifications are, are, are serious around specifically what you're saying, which is that it's going to be harder and harder to make these big top productions at the same scale that they've been doing them in the past, which is contradicted by the fact that those are the only movies that get people really to come out in droves and into repeat viewings. So it's going to be very challenging. It's a bit of a dour note to

end this conversation on after our rejoicing over the final release of the Snyder Cut. It's just a real shame. I don't know, Bobby, when will you be going back to movie theaters? About the same time I'll be going back to baseball games, which is shrugged emoji. I don't know. It's a very complicated situation. You know, speaking though of new movies, we're going to talk about the lovebirds next week on this show. And, and more specifically,

we're going to talk about a very specific kind of movie that I really like, which is the all in one day movie. So Amanda and I are going to put some top fives together and we'll see you next week on the big picture. Thanks to you both for doing this.