The Bill Simmons Podcast - Andrew Luck Retires! What? Plus: David Spade on 'SNL,' Sandler Movies and Norm MacDonald | The Bill Simmons Podcast

Episode Date: August 25, 2019

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons shares some thoughts on Andrew Luck's surprise retirement (2:30) before sitting down with actor and comedian David Spade to talk '90s 'SNL,' talk shows, 'Grown Ups,' 'The Benchwarmers,' 'Tommy Boy,' David's new show on Comedy Central, his friendship with Norm McDonald, and more (31:28). Finally, Bill calls up Nathan Hubbard who shares his thoughts on Taylor Swift's new album 'Lover,' her career, and her future (1:49:34). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Tonight's episode of the Bill Simmons podcast on the Ringer Podcast Network is brought to you by ZipRecruiter. As you know, having a high comedy IQ is important. I think David Spade, he's coming up here in a little bit. High comedy IQ. I've enjoyed it for three decades and counting. Hey, when it comes to hiring, you don't need a high hiring IQ. You just need ZipRecruiter. So effective. Four out of five employers who post

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Download the SeatGeek app or go right to SeatGeek.com. We're also brought to you by TheRinger.com and TheRinger Podcast Network, where if you still have your fantasy draft coming, check out TheRinger NFL Show. The Dainesee Football Podcast has you covered on fantasy. And by the way, the Ringer Dish podcast feed, which includes tea time and jam session and our Monday pod. There's a lot of Taylor Swift stuff going on right now.

We're going to talk about Nathan Hubbard in a little bit. But on Ringer Dish, we have you covered with all the Taylor Swift discussions you've ever wanted but uh that's a good podcast subscribe to that when you have a chance coming up we're going to talk a little bit about this uh staggering andrew luck news and then david spade is coming on for the first time ever and then at the tail end my buddy nathan hubbard's gonna come on we're gonna talk about this new taylor swift album because he has has some thoughts. So if you ever want to hear two guys in their late 40s talk about Taylor Swift, hold on tight. First, our're taping this. It is Sunday morning.

We had actually finished this podcast. And as always with The Ringer, the biggest stories seem to happen on Saturday. Andrew Luck, out of nowhere, retiring from football. It happened. It was nighttime PT, and it was one of those sports stories where you think it's a joke. I saw the Schefter tweet.

I thought for sure it was the person who pretends to be Adam Schefter. Do you know those weirdos out there that pretend to be Woj and Schefter? And then I started getting texts about it, and it had this sense of, wait a second, is this real? Where you just can't believe it. And I can only remember this happening a couple of times

in my life as a sports fan. I mean, the most depressing version of this was when Magic announced that he had HIV, which happened, I was in college in 1991. And it was the same kind of reaction, like, wait, this can't be real. Come on. This is obviously a much happier story in the sense that he's just retiring from football, but same kind of five minutes of just utter confusion and thinking like, wait a second, he's only 29. He's only played seven years. What's going on here? And watching the reactions to this story over the last 14, 15 hours, I thought was really telling in a lot of ways just for where we are as sports fans in 2019. But I guess the first question, there's still some stuff we don't understand with this story. So again, taping this Sunday, 10.30 PT AM. It's unclear how injured he was. And that seems to be a crucial missing piece of all of this because he packed it in. He left the Colts two weeks before the season started.

But it seems like this had been in the works for the last 10 days or so. And the explanation made sense to me. He was on this four-year treadmill of just being hurt, recovering rehab, being hurt, recovering rehab, and his body wearing down and him just kind of losing his joy for football and the whole process, which we've seen happen before. But nobody's ever been able to pinpoint what the injury was this time, because it was obviously severe enough that he was like, fuck this. I'm not doing this again. But we've heard calf, we've heard ankle. So I'm assuming it was this injury that he would have just had to play in pain with for the entire season and rehab it and just not be a hundred percent. Or it triggered something in his head where he was

just like, I just don't want to do this anymore. He did this article interview with Albert Breer a few weeks ago. And he said when he got hurt and he missed the whole season when he had the torn labrum, he said, I put too much of myself word directly into how I was performing in the football field. And then I was performing in the football field. And then I wasn't on the football field. I felt quite empty. It was very unhealthy. First for me, second for the relationship with my now wife and my other relationships.

The result has been the best thing that ever could happen to me. It forced me to look in the mirror and do a character assessment, address the things I didn't like. And then the things I did like, and then get on the same page with the people I love and respect. And then later he says in the same interview, I'm certainly challenging myself to be a better quarterback than I've ever been. If I lose that motivation, then I think it's time to not play. I don't see how it would be fun.

So he, at this point, you read a quote like that and you're like, ah, that's somebody who's not going to play until he's 42 like Tom Brady. You don't think he's just going to call quits when he's 29. But you think about in the 21st century, how was another one of those, wait, is that real? Are they putting in fake booing sounds? Because they can't possibly be doing that. They did it. It was pretty terrible. And then even in the press conference he did afterwards, which was pretty abrupt. I don't think he had intended to announce this for at least until today or tomorrow,

something like that. But he admitted like, yeah, that really hurt my feelings. And by the way, it should have. But you think about how the concept of being a sports fan has changed over these two decades specifically. So when I, when I went to ESPN in 2001, one of the first columns I wrote for them, I really hated Roger Clements. He had been my favorite Red Sox player and he put on some weight the last couple of years. He had a pretty up and down performance

considering he was the highest paid guy in the team. And then the last couple of months in 96, he made like kind of a contract run and was great again. And he wasn't in great shape for him. He'd kind of let us down. He'd let us down in the playoffs. And this was just different time when you, when you just looked at athletes solely based on, is this guy winning or losing for me? And that's it. You didn't think of them as people. You didn't think of them as having feelings like you did. They were just these props in this whole sports fan game that everybody was playing.

And I wrote this column in 2001 because he went to Toronto. He got an awesome shape. He won two straight Cy Young Awards, which really, really bugged the Red Sox fans. And then he went to the Yankees, which was even worse. And we were like, fuck this guy. In 2001, I think my second or third column for ESPN.com was called, is Roger Clemens the Antichrist? And I laid out this whole case for just what a fucking asshole he was. These were my feelings in 2001.

Now, first of all, nobody would write a piece like this. You would just get crushed on Twitter for being too player unfriendly. But just in general, we just think about these guys differently. And even if you think about 2010, LeBron's decision, it was the same thing. He got rigged through the coals. People hated that Miami team. That first year, they were really sports' last villain. And it was all because Bosh and LeBron were like,

you know what would be cool? Playing in Miami with Wade. And they did it. And now we wouldn't care. But in 2010, we cared because we treated sports differently back then. We took it personally and we felt like the players should be loyal to the fans and to the fans and to the teams they played for.

And now we have seen a complete shift as this decade goes along. And it kind of culminated with this Andrew Luck story where he retires abruptly. He does it two weeks before the season. So he really puts his team, he really screws his team. Let's be honest. I mean, I, I'm not his team. Let's be honest. I mean, I'm not putting him down for it. It's his life, but his team got screwed by this. And I think 20 years ago, the narrative would have been, oh my God, can you believe he screwed the Colts like this? And now the narrative is, yeah, good for him, man. He got out. And I think that that's the narrative for two reasons. One,

I think we just think differently about athletes in general. And I think we try to put ourselves in their shoes as much as we can. I think social media has really changed the equation. I think we have just a better connection with these guys. I think it's generational too, because I think there's a lot of support the players, support the employers, corporations are evil, politicians are evil. So you have that tied in there too. It's not like anybody's gonna root for an NFL team owner

over a star football player. But when it's Jim Irsay versus Andrew Luck, guess who we're not rooting for? Jim Irsay. Guess who we're not feeling bad for? Jim Irsay, one of the worst owners we've had. So people look at this just from a human element, they look at it differently. And then from a football element, it's like, yeah, good for that dude, man.

He got out. He's probably only, you know, probably had at least one concussion that we know about, but, you know, probably had six or seven more that we didn't know about. You look at the list of injuries he had. This dude's not even 30 yet. He's only played seven years. He had a torn labrum in his throwing shoulder, which made him think he almost was never going

to play again and probably felt like his career was in jeopardy that whole year. Tore cartilage in two ribs. He had a partially torn abdomen. He had a lacerated kidney where he literally urinated blood. And then he had this mystery calf, ankle, whatever the hell's going on issue he has now. Not to mention whatever, how many concussions he had.

And you look at somebody like that who's a really smart guy and you say, yeah, good for him. He got out, made some money, doesn't get to take a beating anymore. And we gloss over the fact that, yeah, he just completely screwed over his team because we just look at things differently now. screwed because especially because they they let him keep all the money so not only do they season starts in two weeks they have to play backup but from a salary cap standpoint um not great for them but that's not the narrative anymore and maybe it shouldn't be but um i was thinking i was looking at some of the takes and this really has a, has a chance to be the Superbowl of take worse where you have everybody on one side. And, and then the people who are kind of brazen enough to swim against

the stream are all people that everybody kind of wants to jump on anyway. Like last night, the two people that were getting pummeled on Twitter, I couldn't help but look at Twitter last night. Doug Gottlieb, he had some sort of tweet about how this was a classic millennial move or something. And then OJ Simpson, who was mad that he had just taken Andrew Luck in his fantasy league. And people were furious and they're going nuts. And it's like, this is what social media has become. It's everybody just kind of prowling around

like Charles Bronson waiting for somebody to screw up. And then they get all upset about it. You're getting upset at Doug Gottlieb and OJ Simpson. What are you doing? Dan Dakit, she's another in Indiana. He said, I have family working in steel mills, cops, teachers making far less. And this guy is quote, tired, my backside.

And then people get mad about that. It's like, what are we getting mad at? Why are we getting mad at, at, at people who just say dumb shit? Don't worry about it. Move on. Who cares? This has become our country in 2019. Everybody just, just kind of on hold way. You just, oh, please. Can somebody say something dumb? I want to freak out. We talked about, I did half-baked ideas with Kevin Wilds last Monday. And I had a half-baked idea for a pandering fantasy league, where it's just on social media, you just pander.

And I mean, this is the pandering playoffs right now, this Andrew Luck thing. Everybody just going overboard to talk about how great it is that he took control of his life and all that. I just think, whatever, man. He retired. He's a football player. This can mean something big picture, which I think from a big picture standpoint means what I just said. But to get this emotional and upset about it, to get furious at the Indianapolis fans,

come on, have you been to Indianapolis? This is all they care about is the Colts. Of course, they were going to react badly. This is sports. People act badly. So anyway, the whole saga, and I'm sure it's going to keep going. I just look forward to how bad the takes are going to get. And I'm sure things are going to escalate. And I'm sure on Monday, you have these sports talk shows. Everybody's looking for their angle. The 24-7, the radio hosts, the talking head TV shows, there are going to be people that go really hard at Andrew Luck. And there are also going to be people really hoping and waiting for this so they can get really upset about it because that's what we do now.

I'd like to have a rational conversation about Andrew Luck for a second. I can't remember somebody's career where a guy was better, but the legacy he's going to leave, he never really had his one moment. Usually with quarterbacks, they have that one season and you go, oh yeah, oh that season. Like the Kurt Warner 99 season or like Brady 07, the Drew Briz 09 season, pick three Manning seasons. All these guys, all the great ones, Rodgers, when he went 15 and won that year, all the great ones have that one season where they just lay this back down. And I think from the time he was at Stanford, we felt luck was that guy. He was so good that Peyton Manning, who is one of the three or four greatest quarterbacks of all time, who brought Indianapolis to the Super Bowl, who's the most popular athlete in the history of Indianapolis, or Indiana.

He gets hurt. They get the number one pick. And everyone in Indiana is cool with them just dumping Peyton Manning so they can have 15 years of Andrew Luck. They just kick Peyton Manning to the curb. Great. Oh, well, now we have 30 years of a franchise QB. This is awesome. That's how good Andrew Luck was.

And now I look at what his stats were. 53-33 in the regular season. He was 4- four in the playoffs. All four playoff losses were blowouts. He was 0 and 6 against the Patriots. Got outscored 261 to 124. It was four regular season games, two playoff games. He never had a 12-win season.

His most fun year, I think, so in 2013, he had the one, he played in eight playoff games. The only really memorable one was to the KC game, which was memorable for a hundred different reasons. I had Indianapolis. I think they ended up pushing. They came back from 28. That was the game where Jamal Charles got a concussion and it was, and they just wouldn't

put him back in. And it was the first time where I like, Oh, concussions have completely changed everything. And then luck orchestrated this awesome comeback against this decimated Casey defense. He'd been in the league, I think two years at that point. And everybody's like, Oh yeah, this guy's the next one. And it never really totally happened. Even for one year, 2014 was his best season through 4,716 yards, 40 TDs. They went 11 and five in a pretty weak division. They beat

Cincy in round one. Congratulations. Everyone beat Cincy. They beat Denver in round two. That was, I think, Peyton Manning noodle arm year. And then got completely annihilated by the Patriots in the game that became the deflate game. And that was his one signature season. It's kind of a bummer. He never had the one, oh yeah, that was the luck season, which I think if you, when he was coming to the league, you would have bet any amount of money he was going to have a season like that. He was going to have his 09 Drew Brees season. Through 171 career pastities,

through his first 86 career NFL games, third most in NFL history, only Aaron Rodgers and Dan Marino had more, was hitting all the checkpoints and seemed like somebody that, the way he was built, big guy, seemed like somebody who could play until his late 30s at least. And if you're a Colts fan, you're thinking, we got 15 years out of Manning. Now we're moving into 20 years of luck because the game is different now and quarterbacks don't get hit as much. So here's the rub.

And people made this point last night. And it could not be a more essential point. It was something we used to talk about at Grantland. I remember Bill Barnwell wrote a big piece about it, 2015 maybe, about Ryan Grigson, the GM for the Colts, who just completely fucked Luck. Comes into a situation where they tank the season. Luck's first year, 2012, they had all this dead

cap money because they had basically done this two-year plan of rebuilding the Colts around this franchise QB that they stumble into because Peyton Manning got hurt. They had a really good 2012 draft and then it's a shit show. 2013,

14, 15, not only do they completely squander the rarest opportunity you have as an NFL team when you have a franchise quarterback and a rookie contract. It's like literally unfuckable and they fucked it up. They had all these picks

and all this cap space in 13, 14 and 15. And they just botched them. You know, people, everybody remembers the Trent Richardson trade, which was awful. I, I killed it at the time,

but had no idea it was going to be that bad. Now they only gave up. I think it was like the 26 pick, but it was just such a mis-evaluation to him. But if you look at their 2014 and 15 drafts, it's an absolute shitshow. They whiffed both years.

They traded a first-round pick for Richardson. They took three offensive linemen. All of them sucked. They took Philip Dorsett first. They ended up having to trade him for Jacoby Brissett. It's a shit show. And what made it worse was they didn't draft an offensive line.

So Luck is getting the absolute tar kicked out of him. Warren Sharpe tweeted last night that under Ryan Grigson's watch, Luck was pressured 16 times a game, most in the NFL, and was hit most of any QB. I think any rational person takes over the Colts and says to themselves, you know what we should do is get an offensive line for Andrew Luck. That might be a good idea. Let's do that. And instead they just, they didn't care. What's funny is there's a sports illustrated piece from 2015 about Ryan Grigson and it makes

it seem like he's, you he's the next Jerry West. And he had some classic quotes. There's one part, Gregson thinks of his roster as a bonsai tree. And then he says, quote, I'm constantly pruning it. You're pruning it, all right. You completely screwed the Colts. There's another quote,

to Gregson, scouting is not just a skill, it's a state of mind. And it doesn't stop when the film does. You squandered the Andrew Luck dynasty? You suck. Then there's another quote. We have a mindset where we want to build a dynasty because we have the QB to do it. Well, he had the shit beat out of him. He retired when he was 29. So congratulations on that. Shocking night. I think one of the problems with the under 30 sports fans is they tend to assume that anytime something happens like this, it's the first time it ever happened.

And you could see that in some of the tweets. This has happened before, not just magic Johnson. I mentioned earlier who had a, you know, a different reason to do this, but Jim Brown, I think in the sixties,

people were absolutely flabbergasted that he walked away to become an actor. Bjorn Borg, who was the best tennis player of my childhood, and we just assumed he'd be playing until he was 35. He just left. Barry Sanders, that was another one. Calvin Johnson. So this has happened.

And I think with football, it's going to happen more and more and more and more and more. Got a few emails and tweets about what the Ewing Theory potential is here. Danger luck. It's a good question. They never really won anything with him. They made one AFC title game and they get lost by 38 points. I personally think that this is going to ruin their next couple seasons,

but I do have the Ewing Theory Committee on high alert to wonder maybe who knows how this happens. One other thing, I think the most stunning fantasy football-related moment of all time was when Tom Brady blew out his ACL eight minutes into the 2008 season. Because at that point, sorry, Kyle, I didn't, I should have given you a warning on that. Uh, because when that happened,

you know, he was a first rounder, you spent $40 on him and it just, you see, not only was the Patriots season over, but everybody who had them on a fantasy season was over. This one was, was crazy because I think people, a lot of people have had their drafts already and luck was like a top five guy. So, so yeah, if, if there are other most stunning fantasy moments of all time, send those along the mailbag at theringer.com. And then I have to mention the Patriots angle here.

Luck never beat them. He was 0-6 against them lifetime. Brady, many people have made this point, but it's just, I wonder what the odds were in 2012. Brady outlasted Peyton Manning and Andrew Luck. If you had said to me in 2012, all right, here comes Andrew Luck. I'll give you 20 to 1 odds that Tom Brady is still playing when Andrew Luck retires. I would have been like, I need better odds.

I need like 200 to 1. Tom Brady is still here at age 42, but this goes back to the love of football. All Tom Brady wants to do is be good at football and play football. And that's what he derives his joy from. He has his family side and it seems like he's been, he's figured out how to balance it. But ultimately every decision that dude makes is driven by, I want to play until I'm 45. This is, I'm obsessed with this. This is all I care about. And you read the Andrew Luck stuff and it's like, yeah, this is football is just something I did. And, you know, he's somebody that maybe he's going to be the NFL commissioner in 10 years.

He's a really smart guy. I think he'll probably travel the world. Who knows? Maybe he'll announce, but have really high hopes for his post NFL career. But the point is everybody's wired differently. And Tom Brady really does want to play until he's 45. I don't know when Andrew Luck decided, eh, I could be good retired before 30,

but he had to have started at least thinking about it in 2017. I do wonder the Josh McDaniels thing, I do wonder about with this, where it seemed like he was going to take the Colts job and something happened we've never totally found out what happened and he definitely talked to Luck during that whole time

and I wonder did he hear something he didn't like was there information passed along that made him think like, man, I don't know if this guy wants to be playing four years from now. I always thought he thought luck was more injured than he was, but obviously not. Cause luck was really good last year.

So he, he saw something in there anyway, uh, as I'm doing this podcast, there's a tweet. I'm telling you, we are headed toward, this is going to be the Super Bowl of takes. Don Vanata tweeted just now,

if this were a Hollywood movie, Andrew Luck would suddenly change his mind and play after a kindly angel like Colin Kaepernick, secretly inhabit Luck's injury-rindled body and win the Super Bowl for the Colts' unknowing fans. Quote, once upon a time in Indy. I don't even know what that means. I really look forward to the next five days it takes. We should mention, I guess,

the Super Bowl odds really quickly. I can't find six AFC playoff teams. So we're going to talk about this with Sal. Sal's coming in. We're doing AFC over-unders in a couple of days. And I've really started to do my homework. I've already mentioned how much I like the Steelers as a Ewing Theory team slash...

I think people are counting them out too early. The infrastructure of that team is pretty strong. Right now the AFC odds KC is plus 350 Pats are plus 350 Just for the record I'm personally insulted the Pats don't have the best AFC. Kyle how many Super Bowls do we have to win?

We already beat the Chiefs How dare they? Well you guys are dumb. The Pats should be the favorites. Cleveland has started at plus 650. Steelers are 8-1. Chargers are 9-1. And the Texans are 15-1.

The Texans just spent the last few days, according to Mike Lombardi, shopping clowny around because they need a left tackle desperately. You have Baltimore there at 20-1. Denver at 35-1. Colts are now 35-1. Tennessee 35-1.

Jets 40-1. Raiders 50-1. Bills 60-1. Bengals 60-1. And the Dolphins are 150-1. You can cross off those last couple. That's all odds to win the AFC championship. At gunpoint,

the only three teams I feel comfortable about that I just mentioned are the Chiefs, the Patriots, and the Steelers. I know the Browns, they're getting a ton of hype. Look, man, we don't know anything about their coach. We don't know anything about their coach. We don't know anything about their offensive line.

And we have no indication that they're going to handle being a signature team well at all. I don't think they're a sure thing in the least. Chargers, Gordon, who knows when he comes back. The little Justin Jackson, fantasy sleeper for you, Kyle? Dude, I got a draft in five minutes. I'm going to put him on the queue. Yeah, I got to wrap this up.

Kyle's got a draft. Don't take Andrew Luck. I'm not going to. The Texans, ugh. The Jaguars? Nick Foles? He's already sold his soul for a Super Bowl. He's going to win 10 games with the Jaguars?

I don't know. I don't know where we're finding six AFC title teams. And I thought the Colts might have a chance to be one of them. But anyway, so keep an eye on all the takes over the next couple of days and keep an eye on the big picture narrative here, which I think is going to be a generational thing with... Watch what happens. Good luck to Andrew Luck. I'm going to, uh, I'm going to bring Andrew

the giant back one last time when we do AFC over unders, and then he's going to retire as well. I know it's, I know it's going to be emotional for all the BS podcast listeners. And, uh, and that's it. Um, Colts fans, you know, I've never liked you booing. Andrew Luck was terrible. I'm trying to put myself in your shoes and, and, and try to understand why you thought that was a good idea. Sports. We all get bent out of shape. I'm the same guy who wrote the Roger Clemens is the antichrist column in 2001, but in 2019, man, that was, that was a tough look. You're going to have to really make up for that one. And Andrew Luck says he's going to live in Indianapolis.

I think that you might have single-handedly swayed him. Come to California, Andrew Luck. All right, coming up, we are going to have David Spade for the first time ever. First, I wanted to mention Luminary, a new podcast subscription with some of the best content around, including our podcast Break Stuff, the story of Woodstock 1999, which was fantastic. Stephen Hyden did it along with our Ringer staff. And I was really proud of this one. It was the first like really, really monster narrative podcast that we did, that we did.

And, um, I guess the second one, cause the Halloween one, I guess was the first one, but, um, you can get it on luminary.

You can also get the rewatchables 1999 when it comes back, which I think it's coming back this month. Actually, we got six more movies to go the luminary app free to download. In addition to the can't miss originals, use to download in addition to the Can't Miss Originals. Use it to listen to thousands of podcasts, including this one. Two months of access to Luminary's premium content

for free when you sign up at luminary.link slash Simmons. After that, it's only $7.99 per month. Luminary.link slash Simmons. Two months of free access. Cancel anytime. Terms do apply. All right, here's David Spade. We taped this on Friday afternoon.

All right. We're taping this on a Friday. I'm not sure when it's running. David Spade is here. We summoned on Never Done This. You have a new show. I've never done this with you. Yeah, you've never done this.

You've done lots of podcasts, though. I haven't done that many. Really? Yeah. Are you picky? I've probably done about three, yeah. Three? Yeah.

I would have assumed you've been on like a slew of them. I know, but I just try to get out of it because... You don't like it. Well, like they go, we got it to where you could, you'll only be doing an hour. I go, fuck, on Ellen I do like 14. I'm winded. I go an hour of me blabbing about stupid stuff. But I go to the comedy store and it's like jury duty.

Like everyone you see, hey, can you drive to the valet, do it in my mom's laundry room? Just come by whenever in the summer when it's boiling. You know, we sit there for four or five hours, shoot the shit, and I go, sounds horrible. So you have the strategy of you're just a blanket no. People know not to ask you. I don't know.

I mean, I don't want to be a, you know, you don't want to play too good. You just go, I only have X amount of stories. And then what I found is I went on one about two years ago, and then they were like dissecting it to see what stories they could put out to the press to get picked up. And I go, oh, okay. I mean, it's all biz. It's all work.

I get it. We don't do that here. We put the podcast out, and people want to write stories about something. Yours is like a legit guy that's doing a legit show. Thank you. He's been doing it a while. But, you know, now it's getting to be mandatory. My friends and stuff that just go, hey, I like to talk.

I lay around all day. Throw it up on some comedy network and, you know, let's see what the fuck happens. Some are good. Theo Vaughn is a funny guy. I didn't know about him, but then I started hearing about him. I've probably listened to approximately zero. Yeah. I listen to Colin Coward sometimes on an app because I have Sirius,

and then I hear Rich Eyes on there and Dan Patrick because of tying sports in. Yeah, but you're a closet sports fan, though. I do like sports. You don't advertise it, but you I do know that about you. I'm like a basic asshole. You're aware. Talks about sports. Oh, yeah, yeah. I like it. I'm a fan of football. I watch the Cardinals. I watch, I try to

root for Arizona. I'm from Scottsdale, but it's never quite in the mix. Yeah. After Kurt Warner. Yeah, they had like one glory year. When he took that hit on that freebie play, I was like, I hated that so much because he was like, I don't know if I'm going to retire. And he goes, you know what, I'm retiring.

Fuck this. That guy, that was, you know sports. It was a little unfair, right? I mean, it was fair, but it was like, do you really need to end his career and just say they love getting a QB when they get a shot, I guess. Arizona is such a weird sports city because Phoenix, Scottsdale, and Glendale are all nowhere near each other.

They're all, yeah. And you don't realize that until you go to like a Super Bowl or you go to, it's like, oh, I'm here. I'm staying over there. And it's like, oh, that's really far away. Yeah. I mean, when they did the Super Bowl there. It wasn't close to anything.

No, for once I was onto it because, you know, like Super Bowls in Dallas, you're like, oh, there's a freaking Maxim party over here. There's a Sports Illustrated party. You just get in the car and suddenly 40 minutes later, you go, what the fuck? Where am I? Am I still driving? And that's Arizona. I once got ahead of it because they showed me where the parties were.

And I go, these are nowhere in the vicinity of each other. Like, one's in Scottsdale, one's in Glendale. There was some Rihanna party I remember that was at Glendale, I think where they have the Super Bowl. And that was, I picked the wrong one, you know, you go, where's everyone going? If you pick the wrong one, there's no coming back. Oh, no. Because you're

an hour away from the next one. I was at this Aerosmith one, which is fine, but they're all bad. Believe me, it's just all a cluster fuck. I sound like I'm being negative, but you know, I'm not super tall. I'm in there just getting smashed. I went to the Rolling Stones last night. By the way, the Rose Bowl, forget it.

You went to the Rolling Stones last night? Yeah. What was that like? That's another reason I look like shit. How are they moving these days? A little creaky, but I tell you, when I left and I was going up those stairs, they were like, oh, someone here is older than Mick Jagger. I was like, eee. WD-40 on my knees.

I couldn't get out of there fast enough. But the Rose Bowl, are you from here? No, I'm from back east, but I've lived here since 2002, so I'm familiar with all this stuff. The Rose Bowl is a giant clusterfuck. A, it's far. They shouldn't even have a swap meet there. Like, everything, I hate it already.

It was basically a swap meet mixed with The Purge, and then they just threw a band up because I couldn't even get to my seats. It was five songs when I got in, so I got to my seats. I'm just walking around, what's happening? And then I was Mickey Mouse because everyone knew me. And I, hey, spadoodle. Just like wet ShamWow handshakes.

Because when they're drunk, no one cares. They're just like on you. And then I finally get too close to my seats, taking my coat off. You were right. I know. I did a good five minutes. And I get to my seats, but it's so jam-packed that they don't keep people out of the hallways. You know what I mean?

Out of the aisle. So I bought aisle seats on purpose so you can see a little better and you're not so, you got a little elbow room. Meanwhile, first problem, can't even get there. I finally get to my row. People in my seats are incensed I want my seats. Yeah. They look at me like they're squatters.

They're like, what? I'm like, what? He's like, what seat are you? I go, well, it's for sure not you. So it's probably me because I have the tickets. And he's like, all right. And then I've got to get like an injunction to get them out. Because no one's just like jumping out.

They're like, I don't know, dude. So I'm missing a whole song. That is an interesting move when the person who doesn't have the seat is litigating with the person who actually is holding the ticket yeah it was one standing blocking everyone me

it's not like he doesn't know it's not and then a girl walked by me and she goes hey fuck you because I was standing there I go and then I scream

all this horrible stuff at her and she goes oh you think you're special and I go yeah no I'm not special but she bumped me and then yelled

fuck you to me. Don't do both. Pick one. It's your fault. You rammed into me. I'm just trying to get my own seats. And then now, because there's people, there was this like Jimmy Buffett burnout, like thinking I'm so stoked he's standing. I'm like, you know, he jams next to me.

And he starts inching in the aisle with me into my row. And I go, there's some shit I won't eat. That's what my dad used to tell me. I eat shit all day. But inching into my row and you don't have a seat and you're standing in the aisle. And he's like, eh. So you had to do like the shoulder block backwards. And I go, I'm going to get in a fight.

I will lose. Is that good or bad for you if you get in a fight at a Rolling Stones concert in 2019? It wasn't a bad. 79. That's a great story. 2019, it's rough. One of my things I was thinking is it was packed to the gills. And I go...

I can't believe that. You know what happens? I saw them in 81. Yeah. And I go, this is their last concert. This is what everyone says every time. Yeah. They're never going out again.

This is it. And they were only probably 45 years old, but that was old to me. So I go, they're 45. They can't keep doing this. So we all went. And then like a couple years later, I go, well, this is it. So everyone goes. And now they look a little bit, and it sounds mean, like the Muppets.

Even Charlie Watt, I think he had his teeth removed. He doesn't need them. And he's like this. He just comes. Yeah. And I go, something's off. But Keith didn't have his bandana on and he looks a bit like a crow. But like, obviously a crow gets more, you know what, than anybody.

But, and Mick was fine. Took a hundred hour energy to get through the first three songs. Yeah. He was popping around. It was, that part was fine. I have no problem with them. It was the whole shit show that is the Rose Bowl. I like the analogy that it's like the purge,

but I saw the Stones in 89. I drove like four hours to the Meadowlands from college with the same mindset of like, well, this is going to be it. They're going to. And then I remember five years later, they were on a 90210 episode. And the whole episode was built around them going to a Rolling Stone show. And it was like, oh, man, this is sad for the Stones.

This will probably be it. Like, being the 90210 prop. They're fading out. And that's 25 years later. So they're selling out the Rose Bowl. I said that about Snoop Dogg. He's like, with Martha Stewart. I go, this is it for this guy.

And then everyone's like, he's got more street cred. I go, how is he going the other way? Like, he does every possible sellout thing, and he's even cooler. Yeah, it just adds up. He's extra cool. I go, how's he going the other way? Like he does every possible sellout thing and he's even cooler. Yeah, it just adds up. He's extra cool, I guess, because it. Yeah, when you were doing like Hollywood Minute in the mid-90s,

if you did the Stones are old joke, you probably, you would have told the writer to like take that out. Because that, in the mid-90s, that was a cliche joke. Oh, yeah, there too, yeah. I was like, all right, yeah, yeah, the Stones joke.

That's an easy joke. Nobody made that. Well, yeah, I did too, yeah. I was like, all right, yeah, yeah, the Stones joke. That's an easy joke. Nobody made that. Well, they made my share of easy jokes. But a bigger problem back then was if I do a joke that people, it was on the verge of people sort of thinking what they're thinking, but they weren't there yet. I did one about Jim Carrey, who I love. Yeah.

And they booed me. And I was like, okay. It's too early for that one. This was Hollywood Minute? Yeah. That was a rehearsal. The first couple of Hollywood Minutes, the crowd doesn't know. They didn't really totally know what to do with it.

They don't get what's going on. It's a stranger me who they don't know, and I'm just sort of making fun of. This is in the era of People Magazine. There was no even Entertainment Weekly. So it's just fawning over stars. I would watch an entire documentary about the Hollywood. Because this is six years before the internet is rounded into shape. And it's just me and my friends making jokes in college, but we're not seeing them on TV in any form.

Oh, and you can relate to that. And then you come on and we're like, who's this guy? And Dennis Miller's selling the shit out of you. So I was like, all right, well, he might. And then you're doing these really mean jokes and we're like, this is amazing. How is this on television? That's good. But now it's like.

You related to it. Yeah. Ten years later, that became the internet. But in 1991, nobody was doing that. And it became Entertainment Weekly was like snarky. And I was like, oh, now they're catching on. But in 1991, nobody was doing that. Entertainment Weekly was snarky. And I was like, oh, now they're catching on. It's not just fawning. By the way, I still do.

I make fun of everybody. But I like 99% of people. It's just like even on the new show, I sort of take it as if they do something stupid or screw up or it's just their news, you get one free shot. And then if you keep pounding them, then it's not cool. But you get one freebie. And I think everyone knows that. Well, you've also – you've been around long enough now that you're in kind of that zone. Yeah, yeah.

Where people, they get what you do. They know it's not personal. And you make fun of everybody. It's equal opportunity teasing. And they make fun of everybody. It's equal opportunity teasing. And they make fun of me and I hate it. I do hate it. I don't, you know, I drop all the rules. I go, wait, what the fuck's going on?

But, yeah, because I don't want to, I don't like to take it this way. But, you know. How did you sell Lorne Michaels on even doing that idea? Because he was so celebrity friendly. And that was right during his time when he really started to get a little star fuckery. Sometimes he would say it. I'd read it, read through

and I would sit the way the placement was. You might have seen photos. It's like Lorne at the top. Yeah. And a long table. So the first, it's Lorne

and to his right is a host. The host. Then it's me. And then it's like blah, blah, blah. Farley was down here. Sandler was over there rock was sort of closer to me up here and then the next layer is writers and then it's all crew anyone has to do anything with graphics like a set design when they read a sketch okay we're gonna need this everyone's just trying to get ahead of it yeah 45 sketches you know nine get on the show

so you're reading them but when i would read read Hollywood Minute, sometimes like a Paul Simon joke would be in there or something. And he'd go, I don't think you need it. Maybe next week. I don't think. Feels like it's just a little bit off. Like, okay. That was code. So would you put stuff in knowing that he would be mad because then you could get the other stuff in?

That was my old ESPN comic trick. Someone said that yesterday. You put three extra jokes in. Yeah. So they go, okay, took that out. Yeah. Come on, man. I wasn't that smart.

I was just treading water. You know Bob Odenkirk? Yeah. He's pretty much the one that gave me the idea because we were at the writer's room waiting for the meeting to start and i was reading magazines and just shitting on them out loud yeah just making fun of everyone on every page like it was like a roast you know like that guy he goes why don't you do something like that he goes nobody's doing that and i go it's a little rough he goes yeah sure so we tried to figure out how to do as a sketch this turned into into that, and then Lorne liked it.

I don't know why Lorne liked it right away. And I was on the verge of getting fired every year. I was only Rob Schneider done Cop Machine. We were feature players. Yeah. And we were buddies, and then he blew by me in a rocket ship. Once he got Cop Machine, they made him a cast member. And we came back from the summer, he was a cast member, and they kept telling my manager,

I don't know if we're going to keep him. We'll let him come back as a feature player again. So not only am I not – I was in no Ezekiel Elliott. I was just – I had no power. I was just saying – they kept telling me, well, you're just lucky to be there. So forget asking for more money. I was like – I was in the practice squad, basically, just getting paid to hang around, and hopefully they'd throw me in.

And then that was like two and a half years of that. Then I get Hollywood Minute, and Lauren goes, maybe. And it was pretty funny. And then the Monday meeting after, we're all there. I'm getting ignored. And then they go, he goes, David, maybe Hollywood Minute this week? I go, huh? Me?

I go, fuck you. And then I did it. And then like two weeks later, another one maybe? He goes, I think that's your voice. I think that's good for you. I go, yeah. Because I turn into be kind of like a Bill Murray-ish. I wouldn't say that with a lot of padding around it meaning he's the prototype for someone I would look up to

and say he's always kind of himself in his parts and he doesn't really disappear so I looked up to that to say I guess that's more what I am only because I'm not De Niro like Dana doing 90 characters I would do character stuff

but it was, Lauren was like yeah he didn't love it he would say just play yourself 90 characters, you know. I would do character stuff, but it was, Lauren was like, hmm. Yeah, he didn't love it. He would say, just play yourself. And, you know, it's not really the show to just play yourself. So I got a lot out of SNL, more than I probably should have, because Adam was great at doing characters.

Rob was doing stuff. They all do voices, and they love that stuff. Yeah. And Farley, you could throw him in anything. And, you know Phil Hartman everyone was just like disappeared

Dana Carvey Dennis just did the news and then he slowly just faded out of sketches and I sort of played myself most of the time and when

when you started getting that like Update was pretty static it didn't have it didn't become what it became which was just a bunch of people coming in yeah because they always had that A.ney brown guy was there for a while and yeah it was

yeah and so you mean it was a little like sort of it was a lot of dennis miller and maybe but there wasn't a lot of room to like test people once you found you know once we got that that was a place to go for the kill yeah because the sketches are too competitive try to sneak on update if everyone's busy because they probably will use one feature on update yeah and every read through there's probably three or four and then they go to dress with maybe two and then one gets on so it's tough i'd go i'd go in sandler's office and i'd write an update and i walk by his office i see him pull out a guitar and i go oh no oh j no. Oh, Jesus. I'm dead. I'm dead. It's too good.

He's going to go crush it. So I'd go, is that a sketch? That's for a sketch, please. I mean, that's how Eddie Murphy, when he had, I think it was Raheem Abdul-Muhammad or whatever, that was how he broke through. Because they didn't use him for like 10 episodes. Oh, so yeah. Then he was on an update and got in.

If you get through that, or you could do a character and then bring it into a sketch. Maybe if he did something like Gumby there. No, he didn't. Yeah. You could do that and then people like it. Then you break it into a sketch. And then it was like that last couple years of Miller, they figured out, oh, this is weekend update. Yeah, it's a good hot spot.

Do this, but then this is a good way to bring the people in. Instead of just straight news, bring in people. What was your first year there? 89? No. 90? Easy. I think 90, 91.

Yeah. I mean, that was like the most loaded cast year they had. It was pretty. Those two years. It was overlapping. So it was like the previous generation leaving and the new generation coming. Dana hung out. I was there to replace Dana leaving and the new generation coming. Dana hung out.

I was there to replace Dana, and he didn't leave. So I just was sort of nowhere's value now. No man's land. And then if someone came on the show, even though we were feature players, if it looked like Sandler, like, don't you forget about the macho man. Then Sandler would do it. And then if it looked like me, Dana would do it. So if it looked like me dana would do it so if it looked like schneider he would do it but i didn't it was hard for me to get in there because dana was just great so i can't even you know compete with that so i just wait and then dana stayed another year

another i'm like ah not his fault he's trying to just stay on as long as he can and kill it i just was just going i don't know what to do with me. And then when he left, combined Hollywood Minute, got me in more, got on Gap Girls, got a few bits in. Yeah. And then just milked as much as I could. And then Farley and Sandler left the same year. And I think Will Ferrell came.

He was great. I knew right away. I'm like, oh, this guy's great. Yeah, you were on that first season. Yeah. You were doing the, what was it? I was doing my own little chunk. And then that was hard.

That was hard because I just had one writer. It was me and a guy trying to figure out what to do every week in five minutes. You had a couple ones that stood the test. Because you had Aniston like at the peak of her Rachel-ness. Yeah. You had Terry Hatcher at the peak of her Terry Hatcher-ness. We had Terry Snatcher. We had Sean Penn give me a tattoo.

Sean Penn tattoo? That was a good one. I think he's coming on the show to do another one. How did you – I remember when that one happened. I was like – at that point, we just thought Sean Penn was the psychopath who just walked around and punched photographers. Yeah. And then he's getting a tattoo with you. I'm like, what's going on?

How did he unlock Sean Penn? Yeah. He was at a party with Lauren in L la david want to come with and uh i think lovitz was there hello and then lovitz was talking to sean and then i got to meet him just by standing like in the same little circle you know i didn't really talk to him and then when i went back to snl of course i was out of ideas and then i read in the paper that Sean was on Letterman that week. So I go, Lovitz, will you ask him if he'll – he was mentioning he did a tattoo on a potato or something. Yeah.

I said, ask him if he can do it. And he goes, you ask him. I'll give you his number. Don't say you got it from me. So I just left a message to Sean. Yeah, everyone scared him. Yeah. So I left a message. I said, hey him yeah so i left a message i said hey i

that thing if you want to come do this thing and then he called back yeah okay and then i got scared i go oh am i doing this i gotta get a tattoo what it was the tattoo i forget it's so dumb i well i had we called stephen tyler to get his uh on his arm because I liked it. And if I have to get one, this one's pretty cool. Yeah. So I brought it down. It's illegal for Sean to give me one because he's not licensed, so we had to go outside of Manhattan. Then he got lost in the car I sent for him.

So he stopped to drink and then came in. I wasn't allowed to drink. And I was nervous just even to see him, just all of it. And then he came in, and he was very cool. He's been so cool since. I didn't know even to see him, just all of it. And then he came in and he was very cool. He's been so cool since. I didn't know what to make of him. But the guy goes, oh, he can't do this. So we had to go in the newspaper

and just pick the most basic thing he could do or pull the plug off. So he was like a very, very primitive tattoo person. Yeah, so the guy goes, if you haven't done it, we'll just do this little outline. It was Calvin and Hobbes. Yeah. It was that. Yeah.

So dumb. Yeah. So he goes, he can just barely do that. And I go, sure. It's like jackass. I go, sure. Just give me a tattoo of whatever. It'll be a joke that goes on forever.

It's a great story, though. It's a good story. So I go, it'll be worth it, I hope. So I interviewed him. And be worth it, I hope. So I interviewed him, and then the needle was noisy. So the sound guy, I mean, he's like, I don't know. I go, just go. We'll figure it out later.

We're already here. We'll dump everything in Chinese. I just got to get something out of this week. And then I walked around the tattoo shop and made fun of tattoos to kill time until he got there. And then we did it, and I just basically read jokes to him and made fun of him, and he would look up now and then. He just played it cool. That was my favorite part of that because I had really never seen him laugh ever in 15 years,

and it seemed like making Sean Penn laugh was probably the single hardest thing to do. It was huge. Of any human task. So even seeing, like, the side of his mouth curl up, I was like, whoa! Yeah, he's, like, smoking, and then he goes, mm-hmm. Then you look at me, like, uh-uh. of any human task. So even seeing like the side of his mouth curl up is whoa. Yeah, he's like smoking and then he goes,

and then you look at me like, because, you know, I knew him from well, Spicoli and all those things. I know that dude, you know, and he was so funny and then he goes right into like, really,

I think he was doing Casualties of War then. Remember that one with Michael J. Fox? He was like, hey Sarge, you're the farm girl, Sarge. Oh, Christ, Mallory. And Sean was like,

we're going to get some BC goo cores. That movie was nuts. You did. Remember that? You did Michael J. Fox, what was that, a Family Ties thing?

You did that on the show. Yeah, it was the, it was one of your best ones. Child Stars Bank Robbery or something. They all went bad. SNL had that stretch. Obviously a child of pop culture like you

where we all had 11 channels and we're all watching the same 19 shows. And then all those people grew up and ended up on SNL. And anytime they would do Partridge Family versus Brady Bunch I was like, this is for me. Someone told me that makes sense.

Maybe it was Lauren that everybody's favorite SNL seasons were in high school. When they were in high school. Right. Because that's when you stayed home and you had to be home at a certain point and you'd watch it and that was like getting away with something because it was dirty. And then in college, you're so fucked up, you don't even watch really as much anymore.

And then after that, you're just out you're just we were taping it we had i had uh i don't know how i guess the last two years we had um a vhs thingy vcr yeah so we would tape them and watch them on sundays and if you missed it like let's say the music was amazing too like fucking nirvana and people like the pro chip oh it was all the best people that were playing back then we're always star fucker too because, you know, you have a dinner break on Saturday before the show, 5.30 to 6.30, and there's like a little tiny cafeteria where you can eat stuff. Yeah.

So you can eat or watch the music. The rehearsal, yeah. So I would usually do the first half, watch the music, and then just go eat. But then they would come eat. So I sat with Nirvana both times they were there and just sort of kissed their ass, talked him they were blowing up but it was you know it's not like legendary like it is now but i remember the second time they were on it it was significant yeah first time it was like oh they're having these guys on cool second time

it was like whoa it was so big yeah back even when uh the second time pearl gems on i was saying you guys should do a live. And they were like, we did last time, dumb shit. I go, oh, you did? I wasn't really paying attention. Because I didn't know who they were the first time. Yeah. They were always getting bands.

They were early that time. Yeah, because one week we'd have Hot House Flowers, and then they wouldn't blow up. You know, they were trying to gamble. They'd get on someone early, like Nirvana or Pearl Jam. So you have to book them, make sure you're really rolling the dice. They're going to blow up. My favorite ever, and I've written about this because there's no copies online,

was the Crash Test Dummies were on. Oh, yeah. And they sang that mmm song. But the guy is like, I don't know what's going on with him, whether he had severe stage fright or he was just zonked out or whatever. And he's just making these crazy faces the whole time and it was on the internet for like oh and they did two weeks and then it's gone now so i've been just dying for that to reappear maybe he had some sort of like Tourette's or something i don't know but he keeps like kind of nodding at his bands and having these weird it it's the strangest fire. Was that when I was there? I think it was when I was there.

Well, they had like, when else would they have been on? It would have been like 93, 94. It is the weirdest performance of all time. Oh, I don't remember. I remember we had a couple that, you know,

Sinead O'Connor ripping up the Pope picture. That was weird. I mean, watching that one live, it just seemed like there was technical difficulties or something.

You didn't realize like. Well, when that was the first time that no one applauded yeah at the end of a band and we just went to commercial and i was like i was next to lauren he's drinking he goes irish and then and then i walked over and saw the picture on the ground so i took a piece of it and then i just put it in my pocket seriously yeah because i go that was smart it's kind of funny by the way i'm not a religious guy i don't even know really what the fuck was going on right I just put it in my pocket. Seriously? Yeah, because I go. That was smart. It's kind of funny. By the way, I'm not a religious guy. I didn't even know really what the fuck was going on. Right.

I didn't know how big a deal it was. So I get home. That Saturday. You didn't hang out there at the post party? No, she was really cute, actually. All the guys were flirting with her. She was adorable. And then everyone was like, stay away.

Bad for your rep. She's going to hell. Yeah, she was poison. No one would talk to her. And then we go to the party. Then that Sunday, I'm doing my laundry with my stack of quarters. And in my crummy dog shit apartment, I see an inside edition. It's a worldwide story now.

Yeah. Every news is talking about it. I'm like, oh, my God. I can't wait to go to work and see this. And then they go, the picture that was heard around the world. And they put the ripped up picture up. But one piece is is missing and i look down and i hold it up and i have that piece i go oh that's the real picture i thought they just like ripped one up to show like what it looked like yeah i go they have the real picture from the garbage on the ground like

and so the next day of course i went to work and of course i was telling like adam and those guys i got a piece of the picture. And they're like, cool, cool. And then, Lauren wants to see you. I go, huh? So I go into his, Kenny Amon, who's a great guy that works there. And he had two security guys. Spade, do you have anything we should know about?

I don't know. Lying immediately. I don't know. And they go, they heard you took the picture. Someone sold it to Inside Edition. And I go, oh, I don't know. Yeah. What picture?

I played too dumb. Who was on the show last week? And then I said, I do have it. I had it on me. And so I gave it to him. He goes, we'll take that. And I was like, meanwhile, they kept it. Instead of me keeping it, they kept it.

He probably like framed it. Put it in like a Hampton house. They found the stagehand who did it. So stagehand sold it. Yeah. Wow. Savvy. Ten grand.

Trying to think if that's worth it for Inside Edition. I guess. Get a segment out of it. I know it was big, but you know, if they kept... Is there a mosquito in here? If they kept it... Oh, I got him. Gross.

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and then they scatter after the show and they don't stay in touch. But you had, it was like this weird, it was almost like you guys were college dates while living in a house. Yeah, that's like this weird it was almost like you guys were college like we're still close yeah that's that's a miracle i it's very unusual question let me think

i knew rob ahead of time we did stand-up we knew sandler from doing stand-up drake say there he wasn't on but he was on my young comedian special and then we met we knew judd from apatow from stand-up and then we and then me and Rob got the show. Then we put in a word for Adam. He got on the show. Wasn't because of us, but that was good that he got on. So we all knew each other. So we sort of gravitated to each other.

Farley and I. Farley just seems like everyone gravitates to him. Yeah, we just like him. And we shared an office, so we just would screw around. But we got along great. So that was. And then Chris Rock. And Chris Rock. I just was nice to him because i heard he's a great stand-up and he's always like spade you were the first guy that was nice to me showed him around and stuff

because when you get there everyone just closes the door because your competition i thought they'd be like four he's the jolly good right you gotta you we're having a surprise party for you because you got the show and everyone's so excited for you you walked in it's just crickets they go be here at one on monday no one else got there till five i'm just walking around in circles going is someone here in the office on 17 and finally someone goes in and goes go wait by lauren's office so i sit there for two hours i see white writers trickle in we can't i can't even meet jim downey he's like my boss but he finally shows up. He goes, all right, here's your pad and pen, you know, like a yellow pad.

Yeah. No computers. And here's like those little square desks, like almost, you know, you get in school. And he goes, here's your crummy office. And just, you know, write sketches this week. Host is Tom Hanks. And you go, that's it. Oh, Jesus.

No coaching. No how long. I would have sat him with a thousand questions. That was your first host is Tom Hanks. And you go, that's it. No coaching, no how long. I would have sat him with a thousand questions. That was your first host, Tom Hanks? No, it wasn't. It was either Alec Baldwin

or one of these guys. It was a good one, though. It was whoever it was was the biggest star I've ever seen. I had four shows before this summer. One was Dice Clay

for his crazy, legendary appearance. And one was Alec Baldwin's first time. One was Candice Bergen. Maybe Corbin Bernson. So, and some good bands. I didn't know what the hell. I wrote a joke, a sketch about a puffer fish for Lovitz,

and it was like 17 pages. I didn't know. Probably 45 sets. It was probably a million-dollar sketch. I didn't know. And I hand it in, and I'm like, what's this shit? They didn't put it in read-through. They go probably a million dollars. I didn't know. And I hand it in and I'm like, what's this shit?

They didn't put it in read-through. They go, this is ridiculous. I go, someone tell me something. I don't, I'm a middle act.

I'm not even a headliner. I'm a stand-up. I don't want to write for people. I just want to be on the show and be famous. I don't want to do anything. And they're like,

write for Dane or write for Mike Myers. I was like, these guys are too good for me to write for. And when I look back, you know, it's Jack Handy

and Conan O'Brien and Bob Odenkirk, Smigel. That's just the writing stuff. Downey, the Turners, and then Dennis' writing stuff.

Was Smigel there still? Yeah. He was, right? He was there for a while when I was there. And then Adam's writing his own stuff he's great schneider's smart everyone's i didn't know how hard that would be i had no idea that everyone

was so good and then i didn't get it took a year to just formula how to write a sketch and make it make sense and not be embarrassed and then start getting them on but that's also your popularity when they want you on and yeah they can take any i think jay moore was saying like you know you don't get them on right away and he and he even knew it when he came in i remember jay saying i i know how it is it's tough here but you can't freak out you gotta just pace it out yeah and i think the first show he goes hey did a sketch you got some laughs but you know it's the way the ball bounces and then a week later yeah my sketch killed but you know fuck them and then it deconstructed quicker than normal three weeks later he goes fuck this place he threw his phone

out the window and i go jay you you saw it coming and and you know it and we all hate it but he's like i know but once you're you're in it, it's too much. It's a pressure cooker. But everyone says the same story. You've heard it a million times, but it's all real. So just randomly you end up in the same office with Farley. I think we asked because we stayed at the same hotel the first day and walked. I said, oh, are you Farley?

I called his room. I said, you want to walk over he goes yeah he was new yeah so we walked over from wherever they put you up and then we just were laughing and then we got there and then they said you get your office and i was sitting with him they go you want to just put a desk in with spade and he goes yeah so we went there and then adam was in rock were through our office what was the What was the first fart from him? Like within a minute? Three minutes?

You know what he did do at read-through? You know, he'd walk in the office. I didn't know this, but he'd flick my light on and off twice. Like it's a stick light, you know, the old days. And then he'd go, let's go. And he'd tap the exit sign on my doorway. I didn't know anything about OCD or anything. This is all he did every time.

I thought it was to be funny. Oh, he had OCD? But he did. And before we do a take in a movie, he would lean over and he'd pull up each pant leg twice and then stand up again. Oh, and touch the ground once. And I thought he was,

and honestly, I was like, he's stretching out. No one knew what OCD was. I don't know. Yeah. But once he was doing it so much and then someone called him on it i go we i don't think there's a name for he was just like it's habits it's like performance ocd anxiety or something yeah but oh i'll say lick and read through you can ask adam we all watch his sketch is coming up and it gets close and he pulls his wallet out,

pulls each bill out and licks each corner and puts it back in his wallet. And everyone goes, he looks at me and I go, psycho. He goes, fuck you, across because he's so nervous. He starts going like this. I go, bananas. You're scaring. But I never even, now that you know what sort of OCD is, these things that people do,

or tics or trets, there's something going on. Nervous habits, we called it, I don't know. But there was something for sure he was doing. And no one cared. He was funny. And it just made us laugh anyway, whatever he was doing.

So at some point, you guys just all became a gang. Yeah. And everyone agrees. We're all in there together. And then there's Dennis Miller, Lovitz, and Phil Hartman. Those are the old guard. Jan Hooks, Nora Dunn.

And they were all. And you have no internet. Nobody's on their phones. Nothing, yeah. You just guys are killing time, making each other laugh for long, long hours. And writing. This is funny. You want to write this up with me?

Let's go eat. Laugh. I wasn't really drinking. Wasn't doing any cola. The one time you should have been doing talk chalk all night just to stay up. But I was not really a night person. So I'd write till 1, maybe 2. But you're allowed to go in at noon and write.

No one does. Everyone just puts it off. And that's why they write all night. Well, you also have to time your body, right? Because you have to peak at 11 30 at night which is i'm not like that yeah because on the new show is weird because we shoot in the day and at 2 30 i get so nervous and then i come down i go this is so weird after a few days i go i'm not used it's always night always stand up yeah even movies you don't really peak that much nerves like I do on the Comedy Central show, Lights Out, because I can't. That's so crammed into one half hour.

Yeah. That it's getting closer to it and depending on who's on or I'm not prepared enough or I go, I don't know if the show is great today. And I got to go see these people and i don't want to disappoint them and i want to make it easy for them but some shows i go shit and it seems to come together at the end because i'm cramming harder and getting ready but it's also a big fuck off because when you have three people talking i was gonna say for you you reminded me of jeff ross because who i got to know he was just always on like he's you could plop him in the middle of nowhere and he's just gonna start making fun of like

the usher in the movie theater. He's actually better at it than me because this isn't really a roast and you know, no one knows what it is until we start doing it.

You're seeing the humor of, that's why your Instagram I think took off. Yeah, I'm doing, trying to do slightly drier stuff

but the first couple shows people thought they were there to just roast me and I was gonna go after people thought they were there to just roast me. And I was going to go after them, so they were going to go after me first. I'm like, it's not even like that. But, you know, find your way. Like, they saw I wasn't really fighting back hard.

I wasn't really going after anyone. We're just making fun of the stories. So they thought it was like a roast master show of us? They didn't know. Like, they were going, hey, Spade, you fucking dick. I'm like, hey, okay. Trying to get the show off the ground here. But all the bits we do

and we did one last night about Mumford & Sons being I'm interviewing bands to see if they're good enough to be my house band so we interviewed Rascal Flatts

Mumford & Sons it's always like really good bands yeah and then I I'm on the fence about them so I just so Mumford & Sons

I go you look like you're kind of like an Aerosmith with allergies and then all I do is make fun of them and look at my list of questions and go blah blah blah So Mumford & Sons, I go, you look like, you're kind of like an Aerosmith with allergies. And then all I do is sit there and make fun of them and look at my list of questions and go, blah, blah, blah. Mumford & Sons, you sound like a vacuum cleaner repair store in the valley that's going out of business. And they just stare at me.

Basically, I just do jokes about them and then go, I don't know, I'll let you know. And then I leave. And last night when we aired it, luckily, when we came back as a bumper, we used them laughing at one of my jokes because they were like, we're not supposed to laugh, right? Just to show that they are in on it. Right, right, right. It was just fun because I wasn't there to make them look bad or anything. They were nice. What did you want to accomplish with the show? I was surprised but also happy that you decided to do it.

I think because my last— Because I'm sure you'd had offers before to do different types of things. It was a combination of my last movies were out of town. I started to get burned out on the travel because my stand-up's out of town. Then the movie's out of town. So you go to Boston, it's raining every day. You know more than anyone. Yeah.

God, grown-ups, everything we've done there. Father of the Year, grown-ups, grown-ups 2. You know, morning. Yeah. God, grownups, everything we've done there. Father of the Year, grownups, grownups too. We did one other one there. And it just, it poured 90% of the time. I guess when we go March, April, May, it's just like. Yeah, it's not a great time to go. So tough. So I just thought I'd like to be in town.

My whole life has been traveling. And people say this, but this sounds like a good opportunity because I go, I like to make fun of stuff. like to make fun of hollywood i like instagram and so i started getting dms about my instagram from executives going this is sort of weird would you want to do this on like a show if you could think of a way and i go i don't know let me think because instagram is a throwaway joke. Little to no thought is put into my stories. I walk by something, if it's funny in my head, I just film it. I don't

do another take. I just do it. It's for free. If you don't like it, don't do it. You've mastered the corner of that person across the street is doing something goofy. I'm going to mock them for a minute. Yeah, because they're taking selfies. That's a good gimmick

and why don't then they should be more embarrassed why aren't you embarrassed i yell at them be more embarrassed yeah be more embarrassed look what you're doing you're standing in the middle of the street taking selfies with you you know so different things made me laugh and just dry and i said on this show i don't think that translates because there's more pressure on it like this isn't that funny it's like yeah i know it's funny when you sort of stumble into it and you go that's not bad yeah what do i want from an instagram story i can't expect the world so oh it's got a talking balloon in this one you know whatever and then when we do the show we have to use all your brains in the room to go is this funny enough for the show is it too weird weird? I go back to Letterman.

I go, I like dry stuff. I'd rather take a swing that's weird and doesn't kill, but at least you go, all right. Yeah. It's not the same shit everywhere. So the show is similar to a lot of shows.

It's just more my sense of humor. And I interview people, but it's more just talk. You have three guests together. Three guests. Come on, do a quick cold opening about whatever. Maybe just a joke to camera. But I film it myself, so it's more relatable to what's going on in the world.

A lot of people FaceTime. A lot of people look down at their phone. So just that little thing is different than just filming it with cameras. I just walk in saying my joke. And then? I do a monologue. I like monologues. I always have.

Out of the talk shows, I'm the only one who's actually came up as a comedian. Now they're all good at it. But they weren't comedians. But I go, I should do a monologue. And then the guys write great jokes. I put my twist on them to try to make them more my voice. And then I have the panelists watch the monologue, and then they laugh if they want, and they jump in.

So sometimes they... Then you can play off. Like yesterday, someone goes, boo. I go, for what? And they go, that joke? And I go, I know, it's sort of shitty. But I just talk. I comment on the monologue while I'm doing it and on them.

They pick fights with me, and sometimes I go, I do a joke, and then I aim it toward them at the end and then uh they fight back but it's just screw off then i sit with them we talk for a commercial or two about different subjects what's going on the news miley cyrus got it worse whatever stories we find dumb stories and then we usually do a field piece i go out and tape something we had schneider do that rich meister copy machine guy the other day he came in to do that uh interviewed the bands or we had the stand-up comedian thing where i put an earpiece in people and i just we make them do stand-up but the audience doesn't know it that one was our best one i think that one came out great oh i i showed how i run the bachelor so same thing i sit in a booth and tell the bachelor on

the tv show what to say it looks like so when they're about to talk i go maybe just say something stupid about your parents and then the guy goes you know my mom has a chicken ranch i go too stupid back it up back it up but back it up. But it, it, it came off kind of funny, you know, to show that. And so that one,

you know, and then they get passed around a little bit and then comedy central says, do that one again. Or they've been pretty good at going, just do whatever you think is funny and we'll let you know when it's really bad. So they don't, they're not all over our asses to change.

I think that Instagram part of this is hilarious that. Oh, I do Instagram bumpers too. No, just that it took that for them to be like, Hey, this David Spade guy. It's like,

yeah. Well, I was getting at that. So we did a pilot called verified. That was a good name. It was about Instagram, social media and strong name and all that shit. And I go,

I just want to do this for the name. It's a great idea. We came up and then that was so they brought me in and they said we tested it i thought it was over i did it pilot i didn't hear for three months so i'm doing my other stuff and they go i was prepping this movie in hawaii and they go before you go here's our test people like this and this. Do you want to get it picked up for 10 episodes once a week? Or we'd rather you flip it and do it every night because the tests are strong. So we want you to do it every night after the daily show where At Midnight used to be.

Just run with it. Expand it a little bit. Do whatever you want. We won't even tell you. Just you figure out a show there. And that was where it was like too fun. It sounded too fun. You didn't trust them.

I'm in town. I did trust them. I said, I'm in town. My own manager at Brillstein, Mark, was going to be one of the producers. I go, he already works with Jim Jefferies. They like them over there. Everything was going well. It sounded like a big challenge.

So it's like the first three weeks of a relationship where everything is just perfect. And you're waiting for the other shoe to drop. It's good and you go, it's going to be hard because I'm not even stupid enough to know it's going to be... It's not even stupid enough to... I'm not dumb enough to go, I know it wasn't your

trainer. Kidding. No, I'm joking because the other guy's ripped and, you know. Tommy. Tommy, he's ripped. I saw a solo flex he just took out of his trunk. He's like, just a couple reps while this guy blabs for an hour. So, I don't know what I was saying.

But the show is hard to do, and I know it. I know how hard it is. So, I go, it's going to is hard to do and I know it. I know how hard it is. So I go, it's going to be hard. Got Frank Sebastiano. He's a good roast writer, old SNL writer, a buddy of mine.

Dragged him in. Anybody we could grab. And then my buddies started going, I'll come on it. I think it's funny. That's been good because I said,

no stars, three comics a night. They're comedy store guys. They're headliners. But I get stressed when they want stars and then you gotta, you know, we're not gonna beat the ratings. So you want your friends to volunteer, basically.

Well, I go, I don't want to ask them for sure. That's gross. But if I think of a bit just for them, that's the hard part. So, Aniston, hey, will you do this one thing I thought of for you? And I go to John Mayer and I talk on instagram i go if i think of a bit for you he goes yeah i like you yeah for sure let's do something and some just

say no i don't want i'm gonna wait and see i'm like all right don't be too honest gross so i don't want to see if the show does well before they agree interesting and i go i get it i mean my manager pr first thing they do is their first reflex is to say no to anything especially if it's new yeah you're not the guinea pig let's wait like amy schumer no one's on her show the first year second year people asked to be on yeah so we got lucky where people started to say early on that sounds funny yeah yeah i want to do that one and then come on and then the comics that come on, they go, oh, it is kind of fun.

That wasn't hard to get comics. Even good ones. I mean, we get, obviously anyone who goes in the comedy store, we got Adam Eget who books the comedy store and who's a buddy of mine

to book this because- Is that the Norm Macdonald guy? Yeah. He has access to every great comic in the country. And so I'm like, why are we hiring a guy let's get him

so he does the comedy story anyway so he's like this guy's great he's in town you want this guy and they talk every day anyway and so we started

loading up a month right away Leno called me last week told me how great the show was he loves it likes it just jokes I can't believe you didn't do a Leno impersonation

right there I was waiting for it because it's bad so easy just jokes he goes i love monologues you do monologue people chime in that's new because you do these bits feel pieces i don't see coming he goes love it he goes i'll come on you want me to come on and so he's coming on in a week i said for sure uh he goes i love it just place go do jokes and but he goes i called you to support you know because you're doing a new show. And I did, you know, 22 years of it or something. He goes, I'm just telling you, you're on the right track.

So keep it up. That was nice. That was nice. I did that show, you know, 20 times. So nice to hear from you. I mean, you've done everybody going back to probably Carson, right? I'm like a big talk show guy. I did one, yeah.

So you've done everybody basically since 1980. Yeah, pretty much. So Letterman. Mike and Matty. Kilborn. All the old ones. Yeah, I probably did Kilborn once. I knew Kilborn.

I'm sure I did. I did early Conan, mid-Conan, and then famous Conan. Yep, because Conan was one of my buddies from SNL. And did Letterman a bunch. That was like a big deal. Did Letterman when Crack Him Up was the hardest. Like it was the funnest. And then at the commercial,

he'd whisper something and I'd be like, uh-huh, swooning. That's how I found out about just about everybody from Letterman. Like if they go on there. When I was a kid, like if people like Seinfeld would go on.

Yeah. And if they were good, it would felt like substantial. Yeah. You know, because I think Carson was that guy for the people in the 70s. But for the 80s, for our people, it was letterman. Maybe because he was tough. You know, he doesn't laugh a lot. And he's weird.

And he likes weird bits. So I liked his show and the whole dryness of the tone. And then if he had a comedian, he kind of laughed. I go, oh, he's laughing at that guy. Yeah. It's a good trick. And he would have weird people that Carson would have never had on. I remember George Miller.

He had all his buddies on for a while. And then I'm like, is he that good? It took me a couple to go, oh, it's his buddy. Jeff Altman I saw early on. It was funny. I was convinced George Miller was amazing for three years before slowly realizing that maybe he wasn't Seinfeld. He would have some good stuff. But I can see it because

it's all his buddies at the store, and then you get your own fucking show, and they're like, well, you're obviously putting me on, right? And they're like, he's like, well, right now it's tricky, because right now I'm the head of my show, so it's hard to blame anyone. I want to, but they just,

and he's like, who's they? It's you. It's your show. No, but I was like, God, I've never been in this position. I mean, I loved Leno in the 80s. He was the best Letterman guest he had. He was on every four weeks and he killed every time. That's where I was into Leno. I'm like, look at this guy. He's got more shit.

Like I'm sitting at home going, I never wanted to be a stand-up. I was just like, this guy's funny as shit. I didn't think of being a stand-up until out of high school. Never showbiz. And by the way, never SNL, nothing. Just when I did stand-up, my biggest aspiration was to be a middle act. I go, if I can just middle. You're from Michigan, right?

I'm from Michigan. Yeah. And then it was Arizona after that. But kicking around the Arizona clubs. So you started going there to the clubs, getting your ass kicked? I told Colin Quinn, I go, I started when there was like no comedy scene kicked i told colin quinn i go i started when there was like no comedy scene in arizona he goes there's still no comedy scene it's true but i i caught this weird way where i just did it out of the blue i saw in new times some comedy club i go

well they have a club where people just like the people i see on carson yeah so i went down there and just i was 18 i watched and even the guys that were shitty, I go, they just walk up. I was floored and mesmerized. And then I saw Barry Sobel do an hour. I was the first guy I saw do an hour. Barry Sobel. Wow. He was great.

Yeah. And I go, are you making this shit up? I was like, my mom, she thought I made up my whole hour, you know. And then she goes, you did some of the same jokes when I saw you. And I go, yeah, no shit, mom. It took me five years to get that hour right oh one time i did a show in her spokane where she was working and she invited everyone from work to see me i booked it basically to visit her and get paid for it and then yeah and i was new they wanted me to do 45 and i had about 35 so i really sque it out. And then she had everyone from work

stay for the late show. And she goes, just do different stuff. I go, what the fuck are you talking about? I barely got through that, Mom. That was a squeezed out 45. I have 35. I had to go to the crowd. Where are you from? Oh, you're all from Spokane. Okay, didn't work. And then she goes, no,

do different stuff. I go, Mom, you don't get what I do. I'm an artist. God. Let's talk about Hotel Tonight, who has been with us, I think, for the entire time I've had this podcast. Here's an insider travel secret from Hotel Tonight. There are tons of empty hotel rooms out there just waiting to be booked.

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So you still have... I threw that in. You still have the need to just work the muscle? Everyone was like, you're the best one here, blah, blah, blah, whatever. Who cares? I still do have the need because it's so hard. I think that's why Ellen did it again. Yeah.

I think that's why Eddie wants to do it again. Sarah Silverman was talking. I had her on three weeks ago and we were talking about it's like golf you just got to kind of keep going out there by the way i i'm only three times a week yep i got to take my act out for a walk because i don't remember it and i don't remember the connective tissue between the bits and i don't remember how to do an hour so i go to the store but it's only 15 15. and it's almost impossible to do like four different 15s you're ready for an hour because you sort of get into it the same way and they're not always in that chunk you know so it's almost pointless but just to walk up the night

before i go on and do an hour i'm doing brea improv that i'm doing. I'm doing Oklahoma, this hilarious named casino, but with Dennis Miller and Norm. Next week. Norm? Where the IT actually shows up. It's so funny. I don't know. And he goes, David, how are you getting there?

He's hitting me up. I go, oh, no. I go, I thought you were getting a private jet. What? Who told you that? Because he wants me to get one. So I play Norm in his own game. And I go, oh no. I go, I thought you were getting a private jet. What? Who told you that? Because he wants me to get one. So I play Norm in his own game. And I go,

oh, you got a jet? No, I just said I don't. Oh, can I go with you? No, you're not listening.

I play his bullshit game. He plays dumb all the time. And then Dennis goes, I think we should just all go together because it's so funny. I did the same gig with Dennis and look, will you look that up? Where that gig is? Windstar. We should just all go together because it's so funny. I did the same gig with Dennis.

And will you look that up where that gig is? Windstar. Oh, Windstar Casino in where? Oklahoma, right? It's a hilarious named city. Oh, the city. You want the city? Thackerville.

Thackerville. So me and that's why it's so funny. I played it before and it was fun. It was packed. It was me and Dennis. And then Dennis goes, Spudley, I want to get out of here. Why don't I go first? I go, you're the headliner.

Right. And by the way, following Dennis is almost impossible. Yeah. And so I got it this time. It's me, Norm, and Dennis. I don't even know the order, but they're both hard to follow. They do great. Norm has replaced Super Dave now as comedy's biggest enigma slash beloved with all the other people. Crazy man.

Yeah. But he is always funny. Everyone has nine Norm stories. Even I have like three Norm stories. Someone said you have some connection to Norm. He wrote for Greatland. Oh. We had mutual friends.

And he wanted to write a golf column about like golf gambling. Like, great. Did four. And then just we never heard from him again. Disappeared, yeah. Then saw him two years later. He was like, hey, I love doing that golf column. He's like, what happened? Here's what happened.

You cut off the world. Yeah, we emailed you repeatedly, and you didn't answer anything. It was classic. Sounds about right. If we were in a court, I'd go, I can vouch for that story. I know nothing about it. I believe your version. But with me, I go, Norm.

He goes, David, you want to have dinner? Yeah. And then I go, yeah. Me and you eating dinner and then talking about fun old times? Sure. How about tomorrow night? Yes. And then no word.

Doesn't follow up. And then four weeks later at three in the morning, hello? And then 301, David, answer me. I go, Norm, I can't play this anymore because it's funny, but it's... Letterman's love for Norm MacDonald is one of the most... I would watch a documentary about that, too. Yeah, by the way.

He seems like he just appreciates and loves it the most, and I have no idea why. I busted Norm wide open because that last Letterman. Yeah. He the way. He seems like he just appreciates and loves it the most. And I have no idea why. I busted Norm wide open because that last Letterman. Yeah. He went on. This is how he got so solidified in. Yeah. So we have the same manager, me and Norm.

So I go, hey, Gervitz. He goes, ah, did you see Norm on Letterman last night? And I go, no. I saw some chick bawling. Why, was Norm on too? And he goes, I'm going to tell him. I go, no. I saw some chick bawling. Why, was Norm on too? And he goes, I'm going to tell him. I go, please do. I go, Norm, were you crying on Letterman?

He goes, no, I got teary because I go, that's crying. Go ahead. Yeah, tears are crying. He goes, no, because I love Letterman. I go, I know, but relax. Right. I go, we all go on there. We all love Letterman.

And then I go, well, guess who's producing your show? The Tears Pay It Off. Letterman, will you do my show? Remember me? I was crying. I'm like,

what? Baby alive cries real tears. I know, it's funny, but it's a good thing to bust his balls. Actually, I have to say, one of my favorite things I've done,

and I haven't seen, is me on Norm's show on netflix i oh it was probably a year or two ago a year ago when he did his show he had 10 episodes i was the first one yeah so i didn't know what i was doing i didn't know if i knew it was on netflix i didn't know i just he said isn't it yeah our friendship's a total one-way street will you do me a favor and then when you ask me for one, I'll disappear. I go, of course not. So I go, all right. So I go on this thing. And I'm sort of just shitting on it.

I didn't know we started. We're just talking. Yeah. You know, like we were talking when I came in? Right. And then he goes, all right. No, he didn't say that. He goes, let's go to a commercial.

And I go, oh, are we on? And we're going to a commercial? I go, no, all right. No, he didn't say that. He goes, let's go to a commercial. And I go, oh, are we on? And we're going to a commercial? I go, no, we started. I had like a can of LaCroix or something. I go, I can't have a can up here, can I? No one's even. I was talking to my assistant. I was just screwing off, waiting for the.

He's going to just sit down. No one says a word. And it was funny. And I liked it. And then people would say, I like the show because, first of all, some would go, I love that you guys are great friends. Some would say, are you guys even friends? Because it was such an oddball weirdo thing that,

and I didn't even let myself watch it because I go, I just like the idea of remembering it and going, it was weird. And then I would bust his balls about something, and then he would drop me about something and get on my ass. And, it was weird. And then I would bust his balls about something and then he would drop me about something and get on my ass. And then it was over. And I gave him another hard out, but I gave him 90.

And he goes, I hear you have to leave after. And I go, you have to fucking continue life, you asshole. Who wants to sit here for 90 minutes and talk stupid shit? Anyway, I go, I have 10 minutes of stories, Norm. And you want me here for 90. So 80 is going to be dead air. Are you aware of your outsized impact with the younger generation

because of the two grown-ups movies? I am. I found it. Is the whole Sandler universe fully properly aware of how many times those movies have been seen by basically anyone 18 and under i i love listen i always appreciate i don't act like it i always appreciate anything fans they go people say bye-bye to you they say and you are right sort of like old catchphrase i go let me they go does that bother you i go the whole point and victory of being on saturday night live is going what if one day i had a catch what if i wanted something someone said when you're watching

it home it was so fun for me how cool and dana's going isn't that special and to stumble into one without really force feeding it we did bye-bye twice right i did receptions three times so to have something the audience knows what they want, so they like it, or they don't. You could do it 10 times. No one says it again. You go, I force-fed it. They didn't want it.

But to have something like that, and then Grown Ups comes along, which was a great idea of Sandler. Grown Ups is going to be eternal. It might last for 75 years. The bye-bye, you know, the SNL sketches, unless they make a YouTube run. You don't have to add this part, but yeah. No, but you know what I mean.

Grown Ups is streaming right now probably on the front page of Netflix in one of the top eight movies. It's never going to end. Someone did a joke on the show about me. They go, if I need you, I can find you any day around 3 p.m. on TBS. It'll be there. Dickie Roberts, Ben Schwimmer's, one of the nine grown ups. I go, exactly. And you know what?

Great, because it's just another wave. There's people that go, dude, I love your career. I go back to Grown Ups 1 with you. And I go, wow. Grown Ups 1. Jesus. They don't know what the fuck. You know what I mean?

They don't know who Farley is. They don't know anything. I've been fascinated by how much my kids love that movie. It's kind of everything they want. And it's not a bad, Adam's good at, he made it a family movie.

Yeah. That's what it is. It's not dirty. It's a family movie with dopey stuff happening. It's a tiny bit dirty like where they go, hey, hey, hey,

but nothing bad. And then Grown Ups won, that's a basketball one, right? We're all playing basketball. And that was a good lesson and it was like nice. Plus Sandler like secretly just wants to show off

that he's good at basketball yeah by the way Boston hoops in the summer all day is not the way to go outdoors he goes

well I go we got a week of basketball scenes today and Rock's like do we all have to play Rock hates basketball I'm the only black guy who does not want to

jump on that court and we were playing and we were just like, get one shot of Rock making it. I was trying to do trick shots. Hopefully they're rolling the camera. They would put them in the credits. I like seeing their strategy of every once in a while. He just makes a movie because either he wants to hang out with his friends or he wants to go to some awesome location.

I do have to say. He just made a movie where he was like in Monaco with Jennifer Aniston. Yes. Just like, oh, cool, Monaco for two months. He did one with her in Hawaii. Yeah, Hawaii is another one. I just did one called The Wrong Missy, and for

once, I got Hawaii. You did? I've never had it. Hawaii is undefeatable as a location for a movie. By the way, it works every time. I caught myself complaining one day, and first of all, if you're ever in a movie, you can't complain to anyone. Yeah. It's the ultimate goal of everyone in the Screen Actors Guild.

So if you're like, I'm doing this fucking movie. And they're like, you have a movie? Yeah. Okay. Sorry. Wrong audience. But actually, there's no audience for you to complain. There's only other people in the movie or other people that are in movies.

Then you can go, how was the movie? And they go, great, great. Then you whisper, it was this. And they're like oh my god my movie this but you can't tell real people because they go is there are you kidding there's something wrong and you're in hawaii so i sort of kept it shot on that one it was great movie the wrong missy with lauren lapkus that was the hard part it's about this crazy girl i go on a date with. Yeah. The quick story is I'm a normal divorce guy. Yeah. I got a date.

I go on one like Tinder crazy date. She's bananas. So I say, no more of this. I want to meet real girl in real world. So I meet Molly Sims out at, I bump into her at, you know, airport and we talk. I get her number. So I start talking to her and I go see I have a girl now this is a real girl I met in real life so I'm texting

sexy and then my friend goes invite her on your work trip to Hawaii and I'm like oh it's too much I haven't even gone on a date with her we're just texting so I finally get the nerve and she says of course I'd love it so I get to the airport I'm getting and I engine I can't find her I get on the plane and I'm waiting and I run into that stupid girl that I went out with. And I go, what are you doing here? She goes, what the fuck do you think I'm doing here, dick? And then she walks by me and I go,

Jesus, I'm on the plane with this chick. And then I look at my phone and I go, hmm, I realize I'm texting this girl the whole time. I never once texted Molly Sim. So I'm like, oh my God, I just invited this girl on my flight. So I get in. She's sitting in the seat next to me.

She's like, hey, love bug. And now my boss comes over and meets her. So now I go, okay, you have to pretend you're my girl. Now I'm on a two-week trip with her. And let me tell you something. Everything that can go wrong does. But it was really funny. And we got Lauren. And you got to be in Hawaii.

She was great. She was great. Hawaii was great. And that comes out in seven years on Netflix. Oh, it's on Netflix? Yeah. Oh, yeah, Bill. The only thing actors can really complain about that I can kind of see it is the press tours. When the people are like, oh, my God.

Even we did grown-ups. Because doing an interview over and over again is actually like at some point you lose your mind. Normal people. I'm saying normal people, people that aren't in showbiz even get that when you do, they still hate you if you complain. But when you go in and sit down in those little director's chairs and you do 45 in a row, that was the minimum in the old days.

9 a.m. till 6 p.m. It's like a t-shirt cannon. They're just shooting t-shirts, but they're actually interviews. It's fucking Groundhog Day. David, what was Chris Farley like? What was Chris Farley like? Tell them about your character. What about the movie?

What about this? Ha, ha, ha. Next person. Hi, I'm from Entertainment Tonight. David, what's your character? Tell them about the movie. And you do it. And I go, can I just do it once

and then pass it around, but they won't let you? Netflix is the only place that goes, hey, Ted Sarandos is over there. You know that guy at Netflix? Yeah. They're three blocks away. He's like, why don't you do Stern, Ellen, Fallon,

a couple podcasts and call today? And I'm like, great. He goes, you're already in our algorithm. People are coming to you. You're in grownups. You're algorithm friendly. Oh, yeah. I think he just gave me this movie.

Give great algorithm. Listen, be in the vicinity of Adam, who's like Andy algorithm over there. When they gave him that huge deal, I was like, obviously. There's some reason. Yeah. It's not a fluke. It's like when all of a sudden they had all those true crime documentaries. Something's working.

So, Call Girl's missing in Nebraska. When I did, you know, plus they have all just shoot me. Yeah. Rules of engagement. So, my name is tied in these things. And then I'm in

the movies on there, Benchwarmers, people like. And then you turn it around to the do-over I did with Adam. Yeah. So,

now I'm grandfathered in with Adam. And then the do-over was their biggest movie of all for a while. Yeah. Then they gave me Father of the Year. Now, I did that for less because I go, yeah, I want my own movie.

You know, it would be fun, and they wanted this director they liked. But it was all low budget. I go, I like this. I think I can score with this. It was in Boston. I had an accent from New Hampshire. It's bananas, right? We do it.

They tell me later, this is our most watched movie for two weeks. We don't even believe it i'm like you don't believe i don't believe no one believes it so they go do another one now i got my own now i'm in my own one that's working now you're getting like your own search right people start typing da and all of a sudden you're nine david they come up with the wrong missy and they go this is you and then we find some some woman to play with you and now that comes out and i don't know what we just finished it but that was great so now i'm in the mix over there and ted's from arizona so when i met ted i was selling a house and they said the guy who's

buying it is a guy that works at netflix ted sarandos yeah oh i go netflix because it was newer and i go shit i'll probably be working for this guy one day so i go stop negotiating that works at Netflix, Ted Sarandos. Yeah. Oh. I go, Netflix, because it was newer. And I go, shit, I'll probably be working for this guy one day. So I go, stop negotiating. Honestly,

I go, just take that last one. Sure. I don't want to beat him up. So he took me to dinner. He said, hey, I got your house.

Let's go to dinner. Grew up in Arizona. Here's all the clubs you played. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

I worked at a video store. I went to this, this show, this show. My whole thing. And I go, we're like buddies, exact same age. He knew everything about me. SNL, everything. We had a blast. And then now

I just see him out because he's just a cool guy. Didn't know he'd be the king of showbiz. Even then, I just go, Netflix is doing alright. And then I wind up... I didn't even do a show for them. I've the king of showbiz. Even then, I just go, Netflix is doing all right. Then I wind up... I didn't even do a show for them. I've never done a show for them,

which was sort of tragic because I do love it. But now I got this. Yeah, that's why with this whole Disney thing, everybody's like Disney versus Netflix and the apps and all that stuff. Netflix has six to seven years of the algorithm

that tells them exactly what people want. When Father of the Year came out and they tells them exactly what people want when father of the year came out and they go there's nothing like you know we did grown-ups that comes out does okay in america then we go over we open it in spain yeah a premiere there one day next day we go to dublin next day we go to berlin that's like two months after you know they take the reels put them over there when netflix they go yeah's going to open in 180 countries tomorrow at midnight. I go, are you shitting me? So in one, two hours after it opens,

here's my Twitter. Like, hi, I'm in Mongolia. Hi, I'm in any, just watch the movie. Like, I was instantly probably known in places I never would be known in. Never in a million years would they, and then they go watch Do-Over because I was in that, you know, and then they jump around and that just really helps everything.

At some point, they're going to create the Netflix super comedy algorithm where it's like Grown Ups 3 combined with some other, some horror movie where something's wrong with the house. Yeah, because it's everything they have. It's like a hybrid of all the things that have worked and they'll just. I thought Grown Ups

was smart of Adam because he took every, everyone that could do their own movie and jammed them together. And it was like the Warriors or something where you go, oh,

let's get this guy from this team, this guy, and just cram them together. I always thought like, remember those like Valentine's Day, New Year's Eve movies where they would just get Bradley Cooper.

Oh yeah, yeah. And they would be in for four scenes. They'd overpay them. But then you put everyone together and it becomes a movie. And then it makes $200 million. Yeah, that was a smart move. Then they were like Groundhog's Day, New Year's Day. They were doing any wispy Arbor Day.

Leap year. Just to get them in there and cram. Here's Jennifer Garner. Arbor Day. And Jessica Alba. Yeah. Believe me, I wanted to be in one of those. I go, I think I could work three days for a million dollars.

That'd be great. Bet off like Bradley Cooper. They're all like, sure. By the way, I'm not comparing us to the Warriors. I was just saying the idea of like. I 100% wait. You get what I meant. Okay.

Yeah. You're taking a bunch of headliners. By the way, did you like Benchwormers? You know, I still hear about Benchwormers a lot. Yeah. I hear it from MLB guys. How many years ago is that now? I just retweeted some dumb thing

about Richie Bitchie because that was somebody in the World Series was, Little League one was crunching down and some writer or some sports guy

put, yeah, it looks like Spade and Benchmormers or whatever and I didn't even know it. I go, oh yeah.

So I retweeted it. It's in 100,000 in two seconds. I go, what? Those weird movies like that. Sports movies people watch over and over again. And it's dumb but funny, and Swartzen's in it and funny,

and Napoleon, I mean, John Heder. That was one I am proud of those things. And people go, you were in Benchmowers. I go, I love Benchmowers. And to see kids like it and to see Little League World Series, favorite movie, Benchmowers, I love that stuff. And then you see pros like it because they were kids

and they grew up watching it. So it's so fun. That's fun for me. Alright, so your show is 11.30 Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. I feel this is a wrap up. It is, right? Going over an hour. Did I go over an hour? I could keep going, but

you complained earlier about when you're with somebody for 90 minutes. I know. I'll complain after. You can come back. Oh, this is Norm. Are you on his show right now? Norm. I'll tell him I did this and get him mad.

I wrote 30 golf columns for him. No, it was really four. Do you like tweets to get one like? Come to my site. I go, you can't describe putting during, you know. Not describe putting. That's fine. But he just is a play-by-play announcer of a golf game.

It's the weirdest use of Twitter anyone's ever done where he's like, good putt by Tiger. I know. That's why you like him, though. Great wedge by Koepka. I go, ooh, go back 10. You got three likes on this one. But I go, it's only because no one can keep up with it. They're like, oh, I want to.

Oh, there's another one. There's another one. I feel like it's a bit on how dumb Twitter is I go, it's only because no one can keep up with it. They're like, oh, I wonder, oh, there's another one. There's another one. I feel like it's a bit on how dumb Twitter is. Yeah, maybe he's just doing a long play. Yeah, it's a seven year long play. I can't wait

until he's on the show because we were saying, who should I put him with? And he goes, David, I love your show. He like analyzes it. He's smart. Yeah.

And he also goes, I like when sometimes it's comics that don't know. Oh, I won't say that. But he just says, David, I won't do any written stuff. Let's just do something. I go, of course. I go, what's written? We do.

We bring up a subject. Miley Cyrus makes out with that chick. She likes a little whisker biscuit now. Right. Just say whatever you want. That's all I do. I go, she eats at the soup kitchen. I go, just say whatever cracks you up. And he do i go she eats at the soup kitchen i go just

say whatever cracks you up and he goes yeah she dines at the y and he goes yeah stuff like that and then i go well when you want to come on crickets and then three days later great show last night here's every i want to sit with you no one else around you respect me don't you i will tell you the good and the bad of the show. And don't worry. It's mostly good. I go, great. Of course I want to hear what you think.

You're good. David, do you understand? No one else can be there. It's me and you. Oh, he doesn't want two other people. I want. No, just when he tells me. Yeah.

Dinner. He goes, you're doing a lot of things right. And I want to confirm because if you respect me which i think you do who cares what these other motherfuckers say i'm gonna tell you i like it that means it's good i go of course he has to reiterate that 50 times i go when do you want dinner crickets nine days later hello david do you still have your phone yes Norm I just was asleep at 3am like the rest of the planet

do you think there should be a podcast of just people discussing their experiences and friendships with Norm MacDonald everyone loves Norm because it's too everyone loves Norm

nice name in the title it's too interesting because he's this is what Super Dave is like you don't know how much is an act what's not but he does get you and he doesn't want to drive.

And then I go, no one ate because he lives like a marina. I go, no one wants to come get you in the marina. No one's going to the marina for anything at 6 o'clock. If you want to go eat. And then Uber came. I go, Norm, now we're going to be best friends. I'll pay for it. I'm going to send an Uber.

He goes, I don't want to get in that car with a stranger. Oh, we had this whole thing fixed. You don't want to get in a car with a stranger. Oh, we had this whole thing fixed. You don't want to get in an Uber? Jeez, it could be easier. When does he officially move to Palm Springs or Palm Desert or one of those types of places? In retirement. Like Super Dave did.

No, and then just constantly tell you he's coming back. Hey, I'm going to be in LA on Tuesday. I know. That feels like the next phase for him. I get excited because he's very elusive, so it's fun. We hang out. He's Brett Agarbo of the comedians. Yeah.

But he is. He is funny. And he's good looking. I always say you look like Paul Newman. Huh? You know you're tall and cool looking. All these girls were into him, like, quietly. Like, you'd hear these girls.

Norm's hot. He's still my favorite Weekend Update guy. Yeah, he's great. He's crazy and weird. He really, really thrived on not getting a laugh. Yeah. He enjoyed it more than anyone who ever did. And I go, by the way, your whole thing of not getting laughs,

you don't have to drag that whole thing to my show. I just never see it in the weekend. Do the crazy one where you get laughs and then go back. Have you heard Corolla? Oh, sorry. That wasn't. That was my zipper. Corolla is coming on. Yeah. Yeah, I would say Corolla. That was my zipper. Corolla is coming on.

Yeah. Yeah. I would say Corolla would be good for this format. He's coming on. And I saw him the other night at one of those clubs. He's great. Yeah. We're ready for him.

We got all these. We got Bill Burr and I think Jim Jefferies together. Bill Burr would be good too. We've got just pretty much every comic eventually coming on so it's good well thanks for coming on this I appreciate it this was fun

good luck with the show I'm glad you're doing it sorry I got lost in the lot but it's understandable with this lot thank you

alright we're gonna bring in Nathan Hubbard in one second I wanna tell you about three ringer podcasts that you should know about the first first one, the rewatchables,

where if you missed fatal attraction last week, well, that's on you. Do the right thing is coming this week. You won't want to miss that one. The ringer dish, which we mentioned before is covering celebrity culture. And I think my daughter's going to be on there this week too. If you've never heard her, she really breaks down teen culture like nobody's ever heard. I wish she was this intelligent around the house. Podcasts raise our argue by 30 points for some reason. And then the third one is the Ryan Rosillo show, which is currently called Dual Threat, but will not be called Dual Threat for much longer. But you can subscribe to that now before we change the name. And in September, we're going to have him three times a week, Monday, Wednesday, Friday, football, basketball. Uh, he said this week, quote, I just want to do some weird ones. I don't know what

that means. I'm frightened. Um, but I would subscribe to that podcast because there's about to be a lot of them right now. It is called Dual Threat with Ryan Rosillo. The name might be changing, but that will be the feed. Subscribe now wherever you get your podcasts. All right, let's bring in Nathan Hubbard. All right. Currently he's the CEO of Rival. He used to run Ticketmaster.

He is my friend who has more opinions on the music business than anyone I know. And instead of just calling him about, uh, the Taylor Swift album, which he has some hot takes on, um, we just decided to call him. So here he is on the pod. Nathan Hubbard. How are you?

Hi, Bill. Um, you texted me today. You were delighted. You were excited. You were out of your mind. This is hard to do.

This is hard to do. Like, what did uncle Tony tell you? Remember what Uncle Tony, you told me Uncle Tony told you about writing? Yeah. What did he say? What did he say? He said like in my early forties, my fingers would stop working. Right. Well, this woman, like you've written a bunch. I made five albums and ran out of gas. This woman is 30 years old, never had a childhood and she's still going. Like the singles that she released from this record were not good.

Like you played them for Z. She was not happy. I played them for Haley. She was not happy. And this album is bringing heat. This might be her second best album ever. Wow. And it came out of nowhere. is bringing this might be her second best album ever wow and it came out of nowhere

so do you think she went back to the basics and cause she she had some detours there and it seemed like it was all heading

the reason I'm fascinated by this I'm sure people are listening like why the fuck is he talking about Taylor Swift to me it's the career and the approval rating she has and the fact that she's raised been raised in this generation of superstars knowing that they have to reinvent themselves over and over again only she was doing

it from a teenager on it was like she was a a test tube baby from this weird generation and has left her career that way and my my issue with her was always, it never seemed authentic. It always seemed like carefully crafted and calculating, which is why I never was never really appreciated it. You were always on the other side. No, she's, she's a possible genius. She's going to have a long career. This is the Madonna of our generation. I just never believed you. So when I was a ticket master, her dad would call me incessantly.

She was playing as an opening act for a bunch of country artists in the amphitheaters. You know, the Jones Beaches and Irvine Pavilions and Great Woods Pavilions of the world. And this guy, who I had no idea who he was, he'd call me up, I mean, multiple times a year and say, my daughter sure Sunday's going to be a star, but you know, the experience is not good enough. There should be more people selling this. You should have different foods. Here's how you make the lines better. The experience is going to be better. Like from 13 years old, this child was conditioned and trained to be a star, but, but yes, by her family, but she just knew it. She was going to be, I mean, that's how I think about it. She had no childhood. She's had almost no life experience being normal, you know? And so she's constantly in search of

who she is. That's the genesis of her art. And in that context, it's easier to go on her journey and for me to appreciate it. So you're almost giving her like a degree of difficulty as you think about her. I looked at Miley Cyrus's tweets this week and I thought, okay, I love that she's sort of had this evolution, but even she has acknowledged that like, you know, she's had a rough go, to say the least. I mean, outside of Timberlake, and who knows, there's probably 80 bodies buried in his house for all we know. But outside of Timberlake and T-Swift, I'm not sure who the child star is who's been okay yeah and what's fun to root for in taylor is that you know she's okay i mean look she is our second most vilified woman well she's our second most vilified white woman of the 2000s right besides 2016 popular vote winner, Hillary Clinton. And like Hillary's electoral college failure,

there's some kind of fucked up entrenched alternative system that was built to preserve the status quo, at least in the music business that is always resented and rejected the fact that Taylor wins the popular vote every time, every time. And it's fun to get behind her in that way. But it's funny because they both have the same flaw, right? They have the same thing that people don't like about them, which is that people ultimately didn't feel like Hillary Clinton was authentic. And they didn't totally believe in her, the people that were against her. And with Taylor Swift, it's the same thing.

If they don't like her music, they concede that she's talented and has made good songs over the years, whatever, but it always comes back to the authenticity. But everybody says that in a one-on-one setting, Hillary's great. The place where Taylor is at her best is in her songwriting and in her music. So there's a tune, you know, the, the, the single that they released called the Archer made no sense when they released it as a standalone thing. On the album, it follows the song called The Man.

And it's basically an outro for the song The Man. But on it, she's saying, you see right through me, which is like a super vulnerable statement. And when we sort of appreciate the beauty and complexity of this woman who had no childhood and who is still searching for who she is, it kind of all makes sense. Like I think about Jay-Z, I think about Taylor at this phase in their careers, right? You look at what Jay-Z did with the NFL, super controversial, Kanye supporting Trump. Like there's people who would say they've sort of lost their way in terms of sort of fighting for what they believe in. Taylor got the criticism on the other side, which was like,

why don't you use your voice? Why don't you use your results quietly? And you see it in that song, The Man. You see it in the dollar lawsuit she filed against her harasser. You see it in a bunch of the political things that she started to do. As other artists evolve and get comfortable, they sell out their communities. They give away their voice. Taylor's only gaining resolve. And I love that about her. She's also, she's 30 now, right? Right.

You kind of are who you are at age 30. You might evolve and things might change and who you care about might change and things like that. But ultimately, by 30, you're a semi-finished product, I think. I think that's right. And look, there's plenty to criticize with her. If you're going to criticize this record, you'd say, hey, she seems to be kind of at the edge of the forest of what can be done in this format.

There's Bressie Taylor singing airy high register notes that sound a hell of a lot like songs from Reputation. In fact, there's like three songs on this album that are almost carbon copies of what's on Reputation. There's this tune called Miss Americana and the Heartbreak Prince. It's exactly like the song So It Goes from Reputation. It's this tune called Miss Americana and the Heartbreak Prince. It's exactly like the song So It Goes from Reputation. It's literally the same key. There's a song Afterglow that's a total carbon copy of Dress. London Boy is like an analog of this is why we can't have nice things. And so one argument is she's kind of running out of material or running out of things that she can sort of do musically. The other is, and why I

sort of geeked out on this album, in case you can't tell, is that it kind of breadcrumbs her transition back to where she started. So there's songs that are almost mirror images of what was on Reputation, but then a huge chunk of this album is teasing at what the fan base has been talking about for a while, which is she's got to come back and do a stripped down acoustic country record. And she brought in the Dixie Chicks to do a song about her mother. There's a whole lot more acoustic guitar. You know, the guitar player for Reputation basically was like, you know, he was basically a backup dancer. He didn't really have a job on the last tour because there was no guitar. Guitar player is super fired up for the next Taylor Swift tour because he's actually got notes to play.

And so there's this sort of career evolution at this point where she seems to be hinting at where she's going to go. When you couple that with this whole Scooter Braun drama where she now has declared she's going to re-record her catalog, which means 30-year-old Taylor, and probably because she can't release it for a couple of years, 32, 33-year-old, you know, possibly married, you know, mother Taylor Swift is going to be re-recording songs from when she was 13. You know, she's going to have to tap back into some of that me and an acoustic guitar in front of a small club at the Bluebird in Nashville kind of stuff. And what's cool about this album is she's breadcrumbing that journey. The headline, we're taping this on a late Friday afternoon, the headline on TheRinger.com, Rob Hervilla wrote about it, was Taylor Swift is back in control over

her music and her narrative. Why, why do you think she lost control other than the whole group of that childhood thing? Cause I don't know that she knows who she is. Yeah. Like you said, I don't know that she knows who she is and, and she knows sort of some things that she believes in. Um, but, but, you know, I think it's impossible to be a normal human being when millions of people worship you like a god at 13 years old.

You don't know really how to relate to other human beings. And, you know, Taylor has always been the CMO, like all the great ones, right? Like, Sean Carter is the CMO of Jay-Z, and Bono is the CMO of U2, and Madonna, you know, is the CMO of Jay-Z and Bono is the CMO of U2 and Madonna, you know, is the CMO of her brand. Like the great ones all manage their brands. Not all those people had to do that at 13 years old. And not, not even, not even our, our greatest athletes start having to do that. LeBron's probably the closest analog, right? I mean, he's definitely a child star. Yeah, but he did not have millions of people coming to see him at 16 years old and worshiping him. But he had games on ESPN and he was on Sports Illustrated. He's another one.

You mentioned child prodigies or child stars, how rare it is for them to turn out okay. I think LeBron has to get thrown in there. When you're driving a Hummer and you're on SI and you're on ESPN2 and you're being called the chosen one when you're 17. The first song in this album is called I Forgot That You Existed, which I thought was really good. And it seems like it's on the surface, it's about somebody she dated. And now she's like,

I've not only have I moved on, I forgot you existed, go to hell. Um, I wonder if that is actually not about somebody else. It's like one of those tricks. It may well be about herself. The thing that struck me about it, it was like all of the anxiety that I had about listening to the record. I was like, oh, this is going to suck because I just wasn't into the singles. But it disappeared when I heard that tune

because I was like, oh my God, she's actually having fun. And there's some songs on this record that are meaningful and that are lyrically intelligent and aren't just sort of pop schlock that are fun. I forgot that you existed. It's fun. Paper rings, super fun. It almost sounds like, uh, you know, you're the one that I want from grief, right? Yeah. There's a bunch of those, of those things threaded through here and you can hear the

influences. I mean, the best song on the record for me, I think, I think without, I mean, look, Death by a Thousand Cuts, I think is the best song on the record for me. And if I think if you analyze it mathematically and musically, it's a hell of a lot. Like the penultimate tune from Hamilton, It's Quiet Uptown, which I think is why I love it. Like she's talking about her country, like musically it's the same. You can hear a lot of threads of her influence in that, but like finally, you know, every year the, the paparazzi covers her like girl party at her beach house in Rhode Island. And finally, some of these tunes sound like what she's putting on the speakers and getting on the table with her friends and dancing to instead of like the manifestation of her anger at Taylor Swift or at Kanye West. Yeah.

Maybe she's finally over it. How many years ago is that? Too many. Yeah. It's funny. Your daughter's a year older than mine. Living through the arc of a musician, what they mean to somebody who's like under the age of 16, right?

Where you have both, both of us have had it, especially when you're driving your kids around. They go on these runs with different artists. And I remember five years ago, Taylor was definitely, you know, one of the OGs of the car rides and the whole thing. Absolutely. And then suddenly stop being in the mix about, I would say a year ago for my daughter, which I thought was,

I thought it was going to be a decade long run. I'll be interested to see if she can bring back people. Cause usually when kids move on, they just move on. So I just never had the experience before of like, is my daughter going to be listening to this album constantly? Is she going to be back in? I've never seen her go back in with somebody. Well, and Harville made the good point today,

which is the last two albums, the singles that they've released have been the worst songs on the record. And like the back half of Reputation is great, but the intro stuff was just off-putting yeah i played it for my daughter actually like you instagram a video of your daughter hearing it for the first time and she ran back up the stairs and was like no it's not even close right yeah i forgot about that and there's some and there's some things on this record that are like more like 30 year old like taylor really wants us to know that she drinks like almost every song she's like i'm drinking it's like miley really wants us to know she smokes weed taylor definitely wants us to know that she drinks like every song. She's like, I'm drinking.

It's like, Molly really wants us to know she smokes weed. Taylor definitely wants us to know that she drinks. She wants us to know she's in the backseat a lot. She wants us to know she travels. Right. I don't know. She,

she, she has these abnormal interactions with society. Like all she does is ride around in the back. Not all she does, but when's the last time she drove a car, right? A bunch of these songs are snapshots that she sees out the back seat of a, of a, you know, Cadillac Escalade as she goes from one place to the next. It's not super relatable to a 16 year

old girl, but I put the album on this morning for my eldest as I drove her to the bus stop and she was like, Whoa, it's good. And this is album number seven for her. I mean, the start of this podcast, I assume you played Pearl Jam, right? You and I both grew up ready to run through walls and lighting ourselves on fire for that band. If we're really, really honest, the first two albums, Tenon Versus, were absolute fire, game-changing, you know, stay with us for life.

After that, is there an album you gotta play every time? I don't know. I've been to a show with you. If they show up and don't play one of the songs from the first two records, we'd go home pissed and demanding a refund. Well, I think Rock... Taylor Swift could... Yeah.

Maybe it's different, but... Go ahead Yeah. I was just gonna say rock. Usually it's the first couple that are always the, you know, those are always the ones that are going to stand out. But even Madonna or, or you like, I just, Taylor could play a show in a stadium. And by the way, this is not a stadium album. I hope she plays arenas. The chatter is, she's going to play stadiums but this is a better arena record

but she could play a show in a stadium and not play a song from the first two albums and go home with everybody feeling like she threw a full on right hook every tune she played what a victory lap for you because as Taylor

Stock was dropping you were just buying it up left and right. You were done. You were, you were an offshore website. I'll grab some more. You just were banking it. You, you were, you were resolute that this was, this was going to happen. I knew it was going to come back. I was buying Apple stock before Steve jobs came back in fun. Taylor stock before she came back. There was never a doubt.

I mean, the last piece of this now is for Trump to do a shitty tweet about one of the songs. Maybe she'll try to provoke him. You think so? He's mother, he's mother fucked everybody else today. Hopefully, you know,

he dropped the market 500 points today. He can hit Taylor and drop it another 500 on Monday. We'll see. Can I get your take really quickly on the Jay-Z NFL thing before we go? Look, it's not my place to judge, right? I'm not really in a position where I can judge. I think he is one of the most incredible brand managers and business people of our time. And I know that your DMs and texts are busier than mine with athletes and activists whose eyebrows have jumped off the top of their head out of surprise that it happened. And I think the question is, did he get You know, I understand his point, which is, hey, it's time for action,

and this gives me a platform to do it. And I think he has certainly earned the right to see how it goes. But listen, I'm not in a position, I'm in a position of privilege, so it's not my place to judge. I'm in the camp of he's earned the right to at least let's see how this goes. Yeah. Cause he's also done a lot of good things over the years.

And, uh, and for the most part, I think has made good decisions. I don't, I'm still not a huge fan of, uh, the whole behind the paywall music thing he created,

but, um, yeah, that's not working so well. No. But everyone's entitled to their little mistakes. Listen, we've all done made mistakes. Yeah, what's happening now is,

I mean, there is a lot of muffled dissent because I think there's a lot that, even though there's a lot that's leaking out, there's a whole lot of duck's there's a lot that's leaking out, there's a whole lot of duck's feet moving underneath the surface questioning this. But I think the man, you know, walk, talk, and let's see what he does. It could go one of two ways.

Either he has a master plan and we haven't seen it yet, or he's just hit that stage that people hit when they become old and rich and they've been around for too many years and they kind of lose touch with or he's just hit that stage that people hit when they become old and rich and they've been around for too many years and they kind of lose touch with maybe what the, what the right idea is sometimes, which we've seen over and over again with, uh, with musicians and actors and whoever that have just been famous for an

incredibly long amount of time and they start swinging. So I don't, I don't know how it plays out, but I think, I do feel like he's earned the benefit of the doubt a little bit. I agree. But to bring it back to Taylor, who is now accelerating into her own activism and, and seems to be willing to ruffle the feathers. Yeah. There's a, there's a, she's got the tune. The last tune is called on the album is called daylight and it finishes with

her saying, you are what you look. And look, for millions of her fans right now, that seems to be enough. So we'll see. We'll see whether or not it'll be an interesting dichotomy to see how those two individuals affect the state of their world, given the platforms that they have at this moment. Any thoughts on the Battle of Englewood? Or do you abstain? I need to abstain from that for a lot of reasons. Any thoughts on,

will it be easier for me to go to Clippers games this year at the Staples Center? Or do I have to stand in a line for 37 minutes as they take forever to get everybody through? It should be easier. It will be a lot easier, I think, if Mr. Ballmer builds the arena of his choosing. The bigger question is,

when are you getting back on the golf course? Because I figured out the driver. Oh, okay. That's all I needed to know. I got a lesson from the brother. He's back on tour. I know what to do. Let's get you out there.

Come on. I'm ready to sing my own praises. All right. Well, congrats on your Taylor Swift victory lap. We're all very proud of you. Thank you. Wait, what's your Twitter? People can follow you on Twitter.

Cause I know, I know at some point this weekend, you're probably going to have some 15 tweet rant as you're on your, like your third glass of wine and you get all emotional about Taylor. And then it's like, Oh, I have some more thoughts. We're recording this at 4.30 in the afternoon. I'm already emotional about Taylor. So yes, at Nathan C. Hubbard. Let's do this.

All right. Thanks for coming on. All right. Thanks to ZipRecruiter. Don't forget to go to ziprecruiter.com slash BS. Thanks to Hotel Tonight. They show you incredible deals at cool hotels you'll actually want to stay at,

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So until then. On the wayside, never once said I don't have feelings within On the wayside, never once said I don't have feelings within