The Bill Simmons Podcast - Dame vs. Curry, NFL Draft QBs, and Flea on the Lakers With Chris Haynes and Danny Kelly

Episode Date: February 19, 2021

The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Chris Haynes of Yahoo Sports and TNT to discuss the Brooklyn Nets, the Jazz's ceiling, NBA trade rumors, Steph Curry vs. Damian Lillard, covering the 2020 NBA playoffs, and more (2:00). Then Bill talks with The Ringer's Danny Kelly about his NFL mock draft, first-round QBs, the Patriots’ QB problem, Russell Wilson trade rumblings, and more (43:00). Finally Bill talks with Flea of the Red Hot Chili Peppers about his Lakers winning the Finals, missing out on in-person games, Red Hot Chili Peppers stories, the eventual return of live music, and more (1:18:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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We've been doing pretty well on million dollar picks this year. I love the first month of the season because you have to go into the season thinking, I think Pittsburgh's going to be good. I think the Chargers are going to be good. I think Seattle's going to be good. And then trying to back what you think in those first few weeks

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Sleeping with the Enemy and Coming to America, two classics. Also did on The Ringer Dish, Dave Jacoby and I broke down episode 10 of The Challenge. We do that every Wednesday night on The Ringer Dish Podcast. Coming up, Chris Haynes, NBA, Danny Kelly, NFL Draft, Dave Jacoby and I broke down episode 10 of the challenge. We do that every Wednesday night on the ringer dish podcast coming up. Chris Haynes, NBA,

Danny Kelly, NFL draft, flee the Lakers basketball and music. It's an action packed podcast. It's all next first project. All right. Chris Haynes is here. You can read him on Yahoo. You can see him on TNT as soon as sideline reporters are allowed back. Right now he's home, enjoying the NBA season.

You've known KD for a while. He's been in Brooklyn this year in a bizarre situation. Kyrie's there. Harden shows up. They lose Jared Allen. They're basically a three-man team with a bunch of role players, but then a variety of situations happen where they never have the three at the same time.

Harden has a huge MVP performance the other night. What do you see from that team long-term? Because everybody I've talked to has a different opinion of what their ceiling is. I actually think their ceiling compared to everyone else in the East, I like their chances the most, even though they're not going to get stops. I just think they're going to be so hard in a playoff series, last five minutes of any close game, trying to match baskets with them them i think it's going to be too hard what do you see well i like their ceiling a little bit now more so than i did when they first all assembled

together and the reason i say that is because milwaukee has been so disappointing i did not think they would come out this flat they had arguably one of the biggest acquisitions of the offseason in acquiring Drew Holiday, and they haven't picked up where they left off at last year. So I will say that. I'll give Brooklyn that. Also, they're not done with their roster configuring. So I want to see who they pick up.

Obviously, they're looking for a big. JaVale McGee has been a name they're throwing out there. I haven't heard much concrete evidence to say that they're interested in Andre Drummond but they're still trying to you know add pieces so with that being said when you got those three stars together and hopefully they're they're well and healthy when it's the place when it's the playoff time and you know possible. But in the East, I like what Philly is doing. I'm not sold on it yet because we've seen what they've done

in the playoffs with teams like build a wall around Ben Simmons, similar to what they do with Giannis Antetokounmpo. So, Brooklyn has a great shot. Those three, it's the biggest victory we have in the league right now. I think they remind me a little

of the 08 Celtics where the Celtics really needed P.J. Brown. They got Sam Cassell too, but he didn't help, I don't think, as much as people thought. Maybe he helped off the court. But the P.J. Brown thing really helped.

It was a missing piece. Wasn't a huge name, but when they had a series against Cleveland, I think in round two, they needed him. And he was playing crunch time and made a couple of big baskets. That's the kind of guy Brooklyn needs.

It doesn't necessarily have to be Andre Drummond. It needs to be that guy who can occasionally play crunch time and gives them a little more size. I still feel like if they're playing Philly in a playoff series, I don't know what happens with the Embiid piece of it unless they get another big body. I just don't know who the big body is. On the flip side, I don't know how Philly is going to stop. Like, who's guarding Kyrie? You know?

Simmons can only guard one of those three guys. I guess they could play Thibel. There's still going to be one guy that they can't handle. And on the flip side, I don't know. But I look at that series, I think Embiid could score 40 points a game, and I still feel like Brooklyn could beat them, you know?

Yeah, he could. I mean, it depends. Like, if Brooklyn, I thought they were going to play with more pace than they are right now. And when I was looking at the Philly series, potentially the Philly series, Philly and Brooklyn series, I was looking at maybe they'll try to, you know, run Joel Embiid out of the game.

But it doesn't look like that's their style of play as of right now. But, again, they still have some roster tinkering to go on, so they can completely change their style of play when it's time for the postseason. So, yeah, it'll be interesting if we do see that matchup to see which style is going to be able to impose their will let's get to the good stuff you talk to a lot of players you know a lot of people you hear a lot of things what's the real feeling with the players about kd harden and kairi playing together and four straight playoff rounds trying to figure out who has the ball at the end of the game, the chemistry stuff, all of this. What do people actually think about those three

when it gets to nut crunch time? That's a good question. And I'm going to be brutally honest with you. Obviously, you know, when trades go down, you know, you start talking with players and getting a gauge on how they feel. There's a considerable amount of respect for all their talent. Don't get me wrong. These players respect. I think Draymond Green even said last week that he said they're the team to beat in the East. But there's not a fear.

You know, there's not a fear at all that, you know, we got to go through Brooklyn. I think that's a team that you look at their talent, you be like okay if they're all clicking they're going to be scary but it's not it's not a there's not a fear i haven't heard anybody say wow man that's a game changer once they all three got together and the reason because the reason is because james hard you know he's had a shaky time time with other alpha male players in Houston. Kyrie Irving, you know, his track record as well. And so, you know, those are the concerns. You know, can these guys really coexist when it's really time to play basketball?

And do Brooklyn have enough pieces? And so that's why I think there's not a fear. So I haven't met or talked to any players that have said, man, you know, we got to get by them. That's going to be an issue. That hasn't been the case. It's just that they're talking about them with respect, but they're not looking at them and saying that we got to go through them

to get to the finals. Well, that's the interesting thing about the East, right? Milwaukee, as you mentioned, it hasn't clicked yet. And the reality might be that this is year three of kind of the same version of the same team that has the same kind of flaws, even as good as Holiday is. It seems like their four through 12 have gotten worse. Teams are a little more used to playing them now. Giannis, I think whatever we thought he was going to be, this might be it.

He's still great. He's still one of the best seven players in the league, but he's never going to be, I don't think the LeBron Durant type of creator can match baskets with Diaz in the game. And then with the Philly piece, I like their crunch time five. Embiid has answered every question we've had this year. in the game. And then with the Philly piece, you know, I liked their crunch time five and bead has

answered every question we've had this year. Simmons, I think has had some, some really, really, really, really great moments over the course of the season. I don't know if I trust them in a series. I don't know if I trust MB to be healthy four months from now, you know, and if, if I had to bet my life on it, I think Brooklyn would be the pick. To me, the safest pick still seems to be, it's just the Lakers and the team they have. You know now they're going to be super careful with Davis. They're not going to care what seed they are. And they're just going to be there. That's the one team I know is going to be there.

Do you believe in Utah? Ooh, man, Bill, you hit me with one right there. It's a yes or no question. I'm going to... God, I'm going to get killed. I love Salt Lake. I'm going to get killed.

I don't as of right now. Tell me why. Well, they remind me of as of right now look I know I'm getting Killed but whatever as of right now They remind me of those teams that You know it's like those Chicago Bulls teams that were number one

With Derrick Rose Derrick Rose there got their number one and he just knew Like okay when they face Miami Or if they face Miami, they're not taking down LeBron, Chris Bosh, and D. Wade. I don't see Utah beating the Lakers in a seven-game series. Right now,

I don't see Utah beating the Clippers in a seven-game series. I think they're a good team. I think they've built confidence up. Obviously, Donovan Mitchell has proven that he's a pretty all-star player in this league. I've got to see more.

As of right now, Bill, I like what they're doing. They look like they're turning the corner, but you've got to show up when the games really matter, and that's in the playoffs. I just think when I look at that roster, Jordan Clarkson right now, by far the six-man winner, the leading candidate by far. But I look at that roster and I think, if you take Donovan Mitchell out the game, which you probably can if you give him multiple looks with multiple long defenders,

you probably got a good shot at taking him out. Even as good as Clarkson is playing everybody else. And so I just think that team has a lot more holes that can be exposed when it comes to playoff time. Yeah, my attitude toward them has been

every year we have that one regular season team that looks awesome. And it's usually a team that's been playing together for a couple years and they peak around game 50. There's a moment where maybe they can win the title and then we feel stupid two months later. That could be me.

I keep waiting to feel that way about them. With that said, 19-20 is nothing to shrug your shoulders at. They've had a really good prolonged stretch now with double-digit wins, beating good teams. And at some point, it's going to be undeniable

that they're a legit contender. I don't know what number they have to get to, but if they win like 26 or 27, something like that, at some point, there are really good signs with the math for, Hey, this team did this during the regular season. This means this. Now you could have said that about Milwaukee the last two years and they flamed out, which I guess is why I'm suspicious, but all the double digit wins and the way they've handled their business against teams that like Philly was didn't have them be the other night, but Philly was playing really well in that game. Simmons was outrageous.

And Clarkson had 40. You know, they have the ability to just, these different guys get hot. So I think I'm slightly more optimistic with you, but I don't believe either. So I guess I also can't go to Salt Lake. And I'll say, no, no. Hey, Salt Lake, I'm telling you, I love that city,

but you say anything negative or, you negative or perceived to be a criticism, you will hear from them. But I will say this. This season is a strange year because, like, take the Lakers, for instance. And I know the Lakers have done this to extended teams as well, that they're coming in here and they're not – like, Lakers, they were not trying to, like, be ready from the start. They were – if you look at Anthony Davis, and I think he would tell you,

I think if he's honest, I think he would tell you, he didn't come into the season in the best of shape. And I think the Lakers expected that. It was such a short turnaround for them winning the championship and all, is that they wanted to make sure they were kind of just cautious. You know, we're going to play these games. It's unfortunate. The players, they didn't want to get back to playing so early.

But they were just going to let them kind of, you know, get themselves back in shape, not try to force the issue. Like, you're not seeing the best in the Lakers right now. You're not seeing the best in the Clippers. I don't know if that's the case with Milwaukee, but there's a few teams that fit in that mold right there to where I'm like,

when it's time, you know LeBron's going to be ready. And teams taking that approach is left the door open for a team like Utah, even a team like Denver, who was kind of surging initially. Now they've fallen down to eighth. And so that's something

that people need to look at as well. Denver has the same issue the Celtics have. They're 3-12. I don't really trust any of them game to game. Basically, they have one and a half guys right now. Jokic, who's one of the best players in the league. And Jamal Murray, who

has just gone backwards. And Jamal Murray, I think, was somebody we were counting on and penciling in as an all-star type guy. And he just hasn't been able to figure out the consistency week to week that, if you're a true all-star, you're going to have. Like, you're going to know game to game, are you there or are you not there?

And he just has games where he's just gone. He's disappeared. I think that's one thing Mitchell's been good at this year. I don't feel like Mitchell, anytime I've watched Utah, Mitchell's there. He's present. He's doing stuff. He's Donovan Mitchell.

I look at the Clippers, though. That's another team. Look, I know they have a new coach. They're talking the chemistry's better, all that stuff. Why should I trust the Clippers? Why should I trust the same thing that happened last year isn't going to happen this year? Do you see anything that makes you think

we're not just going to repeat that? Well, you know, unless the league goes back into a bubble, I don't think we're going to see that version of the Clippers we saw. So you think it was bubble? You think that was bubble-driven completely? They fell apart. Okay.

Yeah, I do. Like, guys were depressed. You know, Paul George was depressed. They didn't want to be there. They, they, they didn't, they didn't want to be there. Um, Lakers didn't want to be there.

They, you know, it, it, it is what it is. Now, look, I'm not saying if,

if, if everything was all right, things were normal, the Clippers would have won a championship and got to the finals. But that, that, that was tough to deal with. You know,

even me, Bill, like I, I dealt with depression, you know, being there that that was tough to deal with you know even me bill like i i dealt with depression you know being there for three and a half months you know it was brutal but i still don't say i don't i still don't say i'm at a point where i feel like the clippers can be trusted yeah it still is the same personnel um their offseason was solid. They had a solid offseason. But Paul George, you know, he was talking early on, early on in the season, you know, when he went on a tear early on. You know, I'm back to my MVP playing days. Well, he never won MVP, but he was talking about when he was playing pretty well in Oklahoma City a couple years ago.

And then he's kind of tailed off a little bit. So I can't put all my confidence in the Clippers, but I think that we're going to see a better version of them now, now that they're not in that bubble. And to your point, Bill, about Jamal Murray, this always stuck with me because I was there in that bubble and I seen some things. Your boy Jason Tatum, he said

in an interview, and excuse me for not remembering what platform this was, but he said he was tripping out on the fact of some of the guys that were actually balling in that bubble that you're not accustomed to seeing balling. You know, it was like,

I think one player he was talking about in particular was T.J. Warren. You know, he was like one of the one player he was talking about in particular was TJ Warren. You know, he was like one of the star studs there in the bubble during the seeding games. That's not what you were used to seeing him in the regular season on a consistent basis. Jamal Murray, based off of what he did in the bubble, everybody anointed him to be the next star. Matter of fact, they were talking about it's going to be Jamal Murray and Donovan Mitchell. Those are going to be the two guards that's going to be the face of the league moving forward. And we're seeing that that's not the case yet.

So I think there's a lot of false hope, not to say Jamal Murray won't reach there, but he hasn't shown a level of consistency to be a star player in the regular season. We saw it in the bubble a little bit, but we saw a couple of players kind of take it to stardom player in the regular season. We saw it in the bubble a little bit, but we saw a couple of players kind of take it to stardom level in the bubble. Well, think of it this way.

He wasn't in Harden talks, right? When Harden was available there for three weeks, we were coming off the bubble and it's like, well, they're not trading Jamal Murray. Him and Jokic are perfect together. They're not going to fuck with that. And now that we're a month past it, it kind of seems silly that Jamal Murray wasn't on the table for James Harden.

Maybe they should have done that. Yeah, yeah. I mean, Drew Holiday as well. They were in on the Drew Holiday talks. Jamal Murray wasn't a part of that. It was always Gary Harris, Will Barton, combination of some other aspects of it. But no, never. Jamal Murray's untouchable.

Well, I'm sure if Beal ever becomes available, I would say they would become one of the suitors. They would have Porter as somebody that everybody wants. Yeah, you have to consider, like right now, you've got to consider throwing Jamal Murray in there as well when you're talking about

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And the ability to reach further with access to over 1,400 airport lounges worldwide. Redefine possible with Business Platinum. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms and conditions apply. Visit amex.ca slash business platinum. I never heard you talk about that you were having issues in the bubble because I've heard that from a few people. When did it hit you? When did you start struggling? Was it like the two-month mark? How far? Because you have a family of kids, obviously. When did it really you? When did you start struggling? Was it like the two-month mark? How far? Because, you know, you have a family of kids, obviously. Yeah. When did it really start to affect you?

No, I've never really told anybody. It probably started affecting me probably two months in, maybe. It was like at a point where the players and coaches were allowed to have family come into the bubble and you know look i'm glad to see you know fred van fleet i don't know if you remember that moment but you know when he first saw his you know little boy in the bubble and uh i think his son said i miss you daddy and you know his embrace and that that clip went viral you You know, I'm happy for him, but, you know, I got four kids that keep asking me, you know, a 9-year-old and an 11-year-old, and I have a 17- and 18-year-old,

but the little ones kept asking me every day, Daddy, when are you coming home? Like, when are you coming home? And I couldn't give them an answer. And, you know, it was tough, man. You know, I've almost gotten, you know, I'm being real. I've almost gotten to a I dealt, you know, I, you know, I almost got, you know, I'm being real. I almost got into a couple, you know, a couple fights, you know, with some of my own, my own people that I love. You know, people I, you know, consider to be my brothers there.

It was, I wasn't the easiest person to be around, especially that last month. That was tough. In the black community, depression is not something you even consider. If you're down, we're always taught to get over it. I didn't even really think about it being depression until I got out the bubble. I was like, wow, I think I was dealing with the same things Paul George and them. You know, they were just, I don't know if they were brave enough to just say it publicly. But, you know, then again, I'm a journalist.

Like, so what? I'm dealing with it. I'm not the story. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm here to document things. And but, you know, it was brutal. I remember, Bill, I remember. So the NBA finals, when the NBA finals schedule came out, you know, I'm so restless and I just want to leave and get out. The NBA Finals schedule from Game 1 to Game 4 was set October the 6th. Game five was on October the 9th.

So I'm like, when that schedule came out, I'm like, hold on, man. So games one to game four, there's a game every other day. But then after game four, we got to wait two days after for game five? I said, there's no, you know, there's no traveling. Like, why do they need to play, you know, game four on the 6th and game five on the 9th? And so, Bill, like, when the Lakers won the first two, I didn't care who won the first two or three.

I'm pulling for a sweep for whoever. Like, I just want to get out of there. And I remember the Lakers won the first two, and I was like – I was packing. Like, I sent things home. Like, it didn't look like Miami was going, I was packing. Like I sent things home. Like it didn't look like Miami was going to respond at all. And I was telling my girls, I'm like, yeah, daddy's coming home on the 7th.

You know, booked my flight and everything. Then Miami came out there and won game three. And then after game three, the NBA, the league has set up for us to have this dinner, for me to have dinner with some of the league staff after game two. And I did not want to go. Like, I didn't have no interest in being around them because I thought we were going to be home on the 7th.

And I just didn't go. It took Mark Spears calling me out. Like, he knew the type of, you know, funk I was in. He was like, bro, just come over here. Because I knew we were there again, at least, at minimum to the night. So the Lakers ended up winning it four games to one. But like I said,

I wasn't the coolest brother to hang around with that last month. Yeah, that's a long time. I remember the first year I was on TV doing the ABC show. It was the heat. It was the Ray Allen series, the heat spurs. And my, I had, I think my son was like five and my daughter was seven and a half. It was the longest I'd ever been away from them. Great. Granted, it wasn't

in a bubble where you at least got to go around and have dinner and stuff like that. But I remember that game six, I was so excited to see my family again and the Spurs are up five and I'm texting my wife, I'm going to be home tomorrow. This free throw. And then all of a sudden it's like, Oh no, Ray Allen's open. Oh, this is it. It was like two more days, but yeah, it's when you're on the road like that, when you're away from your family, I totally get it. And it makes sense why it really affected some of these teams. And that's why I look at a team like the Clippers.

I have no idea what to expect. Was it all bubble related? They have two of the best 14 guys in the league. You know, like, can that just be fixed quickly? I guess we'll find out. Any possible trade type of anything you feeling? Or is it all going to be after the All-Star break? Yeah, pretty much after the All-Star break.

Because we got, what is it, about two weeks after the All-Star break, and that's when the deadline comes. I believe it's March 27th. Anybody fun? Any teams you're looking at? Anybody getting frisky? I'm going to tell you right now, if we're talking big, it's going to depend on if Bradley Beal changes his mind.

I check in with him frequently to be like, hey, what's going on? What you thinking? No, he's cool. He's cool as of right now. That can all change. That can all be a tactic as well. But if he changes his mind and decides that this is not the way for him, needs to make a move right now,

then that's when the whole league is going to, you know, explode and get into a frenzy. But he's the one player right now that can kind of, you know, just set the league on fire in the next couple of weeks. And he very well can. I'm not buying right now.

I'm not buying that. He's just content. You know what I mean? I think he's saying what he'm not buying right now. I'm not buying that he's just content. You know what I mean? I think he's saying what he has to say right now. And we'll see what happens after the trade deadline, you know, Louis Post. I'm not buying it either.

I'm also not buying that it makes sense for the Wizards to have him when it's like, what's the point of having a guy who can steal three games a month for you and move you further away from being the worst team in the league? You know, I obviously am monitoring it as a Celtics fan, because it's no secret him and Tatum are really close. He was Tatum's big brother,

the whole St. Louis thing and all that stuff. And the Celtics, I think have the most desperation of just about any good team right now with what's going on with them. Now, whether it's been just, Hey,

everybody calm down. Marcus will come back. Tatum had COVID. We haven't had our team together. Just calm down. Don't panic. And then you watched them last night just get eviscerated by Atlanta. And you're like, all right, something's wrong. You can't tell me

Marcus Smart is fixing all of this. So I'll be interested to see if they get in on that. So Bradley Beal, that's it. No other names? You can look at DeMar DeRozan, his situation as well. He's a free agent at the end of the year. Nobody wants to lose a player of his caliber for nothing. You know, have him going to unrestricted free agency.

So, you know, he's a name to watch if he doesn't agree to it, if they don't work out an extension. Lamarcus Aldridge. Yeah, but he's LaMarcus' luggage at this point. Don't you feel like Toronto has to be taken seriously as don't count them out on doing anything crazy

with any player they have on their roster team? If they traded Siakam tomorrow, I wouldn't be shocked. Kyle Lowry, I'm ready for anything with that team. Oh, they're buyers. They're buyers for sure. I mean, they're discussing Andre Drummond, but I'm ready for anything with that team. Oh, they're buyers. They're buyers for sure. I mean, they're discussing Andre Drummond, but I'm not like... I've seen Andre Drummond a couple games ago,

and I've only seen about three Cleveland games. I need to see more from him. I don't know that he moved the needle for a team. Obviously, he can fit in right there with Brooklyn, but I just see the impact he made, and then somebody like Jared Allen would come off the bench

behind him, and he'd be like, wow. It's actually impacting the game. So I'm not saying Drummond can't impact the game, but it's going to take the right situation that I feel with the right personnel around for saying Drummond can't end back the game, but it's going to take the right situation that I feel with the right personnel around for Andre Drummond to come in and make a difference on the positive,

in a positive way. Yeah. As a Celtics fan, I'm hoping he ends up in Brooklyn somehow. Cause I think he would mess them up a little bit. I really do. Yeah. And I'm sorry,

you know, I'm sorry to say that. I don't want to, you know, I don't know. I'm just, I'm like, you know,

you look at some guys and you just look at the numbers. You look at the stats. And I think that's what a lot of casual fans do. They look at the stats and be like, man, that's a great player. You put him on this team, you know, they'll be legit. And, you know, they just don't have an impact on the game. And that is really important. Like making the right play at the right time, you know, things that don't show

up on the stat sheet being in the right place in the right time I'm not sure he's one of those guys and another we're talking basketball, Bill, and I can do that with you being at the right place at the right time things that don't show up on the stat sheet things you can't see

early on in the season, the Warriors still do this to this day. We know Stephen Curry. We know how he likes to get his shot off. He'll penetrate past the ball, you know, opposite side, and then he'll roam over there in the corner. And Stephen Curry is used to playing with, you know, high basketball IQ type players,

players who would know Stephen's going in that corner, and they will set a screen for him. You've seen it early on. I've seen it even with Kent Bazemore, who played with Steph before. You would see guys, they would get that ball in the corner, but they would shoot it instead of waiting for Steph to get in the corner and set a screen for him. Those are little things like that. Talking about making the right plays.

Now, it's not going to show up as an error or a turnover on the stat sheet, but it's going to show as it's going to be a blown opportunity to get one of the best shooters we ever had or the best shooter we ever had play this game. It's a blown opportunity to get him open. So it's things like that, just doing the right things. And Draymond is great at doing the right things that don't show up on the stat sheet.

Yeah, I love the Draymond-C this year has been enjoyable. The Warriors have been for a mediocre team. They've been shockingly fun to watch who Curry has reclaimed in the Curry Dame battle, which has been like kind of a secret stealth battle. It feels like Curry has the slight upper hand, but then every time I feel that way, Dane puts up like 43 and 16, you know, completely puts everybody at his back for a crunch time. And it's just crazy how similar their stats are, but how different their games are. You know what I mean? Like if you just look box score and impact and all that stuff, very similar.

They're swimming in the same pool, but I feel like they're completely different as basketball players. I love having them on the West Coast. Let me break them down, Bill. So every time I compliment, whether it's tweet or write a story about Dane, I get the Steph stans that come in and start attacking. You know, he's not Steph. He's not. And vice versa.

Anytime I tweet something complimentary of Steph, Dane fans, well, Dane could do that too. I think that boasts of just how similar they are as far as playing style. These are the best long-range shooters we have in the league. There's a difference between

these two. People got mad because today I started saying, D Dame is right now in my top three in MVP voting. And I don't have Steph in there. I don't have Steph in there. If you look at Dame, if you look at what Dame is doing without CJ McCollum and Yusuf Nurkic,

they're fourth in the West. And only people I put ahead of them right now in voting is LeBron and Embiid. And yet still with Embiid, yes, Philly is number one in the East, but they got the same record as Portland. Meanwhile, Golden State and Steph, seventh place in the West. And the other thing that's different about Dame and Steph is Dame and Steph,

they're averaging the same amount of points. But Dame is still required to play point guard. Now, I think people don't understand that. Yes, Steph is a point guard. But Draymond Green is the playmaker of that team. Steph doesn't have those obligations. Dame has those obligations. So he's scoring the same amount of points,

but yet he's still responsible for getting everybody involved. And he's the leader of the team. And people call him the best leader in the NBA. Steph doesn't have those obligations. And so that's why, you know, I'm not trying to pit Dame over Steph or Steph over Dame. I'm just telling you, like, they have different obligations. Dame has more of a workload to go through than Steph has. And it's always been like that. You know what it is? It's the most fun argument in the league now. It reminds me of like growing

like being in college when we would argue about Barry Sanders and Emmitt Smith. And people would feel passionately for each side, right? I was an Emmitt Smith guy. I was just like five yards a carry, 35 carries in any big game. Barry, he could get tackled

18 times in a row for one yard and then he'll break an 80-yarder. I'd just give me Emmitt. But it was a great argument and we'd go back and forth. I feel like Dame and Steph have moved in that direction. All right.

That is the perfect, that is the perfect analogy right there. Because Emmitt Smith, we all talk about, you know, I was a Berry guy. But Emmitt had arguably the best offensive line. You know, had the best supporting cast. Barry Sanders' offensive lines were trash. And like you said, one minute he may take a hit for negative five.

Because, you know, Barry, he liked to dance, you know, back there. That's true. But he'll break one for 80. You don't see him, man. So I've always felt like Barry was just athletically better and a better running back, but he just didn't have the support and cast. And that's one thing that Dame gets a hit on, gets knocked on for not going deep into the playoffs. Especially when it comes to Warriors, man. I think that's a bullshit argument when people say that. They lost to the Warriors like four times.

But they did make a Western Finals. They've had bad injury luck. Really, the only embarrassing year was that New Orleans season when the Pelicans just beat the crap out of them. I think that considering they've been in the same conference with Golden State, Houston, during the Harden run, I don't know. What else do you want from that team?

It's not orange and apples. You can't compare Steph and Dame and just look at the records because you look at the rosters and they don't compare. But, Bill, I would like to see, and I tell Dame this all the time, so I'm not saying anything I haven't told him. I just want him to, he's put so much on his back elevating the Portland Trailblazers, like repping that city, being proud.

To me, he's the greatest blazer of all time, period. I think if you look at the players that were there before that you could possibly put in that category, Clyde Drexler and Bill Walton. But I'm talking about name reps that city loves it, embraces it. And he's the he's the biggest face to come out of there because Brandon Roy wasn't on national commercials like he didn't have this. There wasn't this polarizing gleam of Brandon Roy, nor was there for Clyde Drexler, you know, and Bill Walton, you know, that was back in the 70s.

So Dame right now, like, he's that guy. But I want him to have a legitimate chance. And I think if you look at the track record, he's never – he's never not made the playoffs aside from his rookie season. He's always carried them to the playoffs with whatever he's had to work with. And he just – he hasn't had a legitimate shot. He has not had a legitimate shot to get there. And, you know, I just hope that, you know, I've told him, man,

sometimes you got to put pressure. You got to apply pressure to get what you want. Not pressure to lead, but apply pressure to get the organization to do more. Think about this. They're 18-10. McCollum's played 13 games. Nurkic has played 12 games. Kanter's playing 25 minutes a game. This is a guy who was like an afterthought for the Celtics last year.

My dad is still mad. My dad loves Kanter. Kanter goes with Port. Now Kanter's doing well with Port. He's like, see? See, we lost Cantor. Like, Cantor's the reason the Celtics are struggling. But for whatever reason, he's been good with them,

what they've got from Carmelo. I agree. Them being 18 and 10, Dame should be in the conversation. That's a good call. Before we go, tell me about Therese Paylor. I knew him a tiny bit. I thought he did a great job. He passed away a couple weeks ago.

He was a colleague of yours. And I know he touched your life and a lot of people. But you take the floor here. Yeah, no, Therese, he was like, I didn't, you know, I tend to live with regret. And it's something that I deal with and have a hard time um coping with and teres he was a guy we both got to yahoo around the same time and we might have had about four conversations total you know during that time there and whenever someone passes you know within the industry i tend to go on social media and and just check the dm

just see if like because i don't check dms i barely look at um my notifications or anything like that but i just go back to check did i miss anything and and um he did hit me up at one point and, you know, and I didn't see it. And so that's tough to deal with. We weren't, we were not that close. But I respected his grind. I knew where he came from. And, you know, there's not a lot of national black journalists that cover the NFL.

You know, it was very similar to the NBA. And for him to have been in that role, you know, I take it upon myself. I should have been more involved. I should have known him better than I did. So I can't come on here and lie and say that, you know, we were the best of friends and, uh, you know, I'm, I'm partly the brain blame for it, you know, not being as, uh, closer than with a word, but you know, he was a great, a great dude, man.

And you know, everybody I've talked to, I was shocked when I, when I got to lose my company and I couldn't believe it. 34 years old, man. That's 34 or 36. It's just unreal to have somebody pass. You know, I had, you know, Sekou. You know, Sekou was, I was with him in the bubble the whole time. And him going out, man, that was tough. When we were in the bubble, he told me,

we used to ride bikes every day in the bubble. When we were in the bubble, he was like, Chris, you realize we're in the safest place in the world right now? Like where we're at and when we get out of here, things are going to change. I never would have thought it would be this. That's something I'm still coping with to this day.

I'm glad I got to spend that time I did with him. We've been taking losses. Pedro Gomez, man. We've been taking losses these last three weeks in our profession like crazy. It's been a tough time. The Sekou one,

he was just there at every NBA event I ever went to. Any finals, any draft, he was just omnipresent. It was really fun because I remember he was blogging. I don't even remember who he was blogging for in the mid-2000s. Then to watch him

actually be somebody who became a guy. All of a sudden, you know, and he was all of a sudden he was on NBA TV and he was right in the MVP watch column and he was, you know, I, it was just fun to watch, I guess his ascent for lack of a better word, but yeah, that was, that was a tough one. I hope, uh, I hope it's a trend that stops. It was a pretty rough couple of weeks there in general. Um, all right, Chris Haynes, hang in there.

It was great to see you. I think that was a compelling Dame Curry. I think we might've started something. I'm looking forward to the arguments we start out of that conversation. I'm expecting blowback from that as well as Utah. Utah's like Portland. If you don't agree with how they feel about their team,

they're just bad. Yeah. I mean, it's cause you know, they don't have any other, you know, professional sports franchise. They're like that.

They're, they're near and dear, just their team. And I get it. And I respect it. I love it, but I'm prepared. I knew what I was going to say.

So, Hey, I'll take it. All right. It was good to see you. Thanks Bill. Appreciate you, man.

Talk to you soon. Danny Kelly from the ringer.com is here. He is still talking to me, even though I did a podcast with Russell Wilson that changed the course of the Seahawks season. Somehow he haven't held it against me. Thanks for coming on. The kiss of death.

Yeah. Sorry about that. Uh, mock draft, you do a mock drafts and great draft coverage for the, for the ringer. And you're doing it on the ringer NFL show as well as we get closer to the draft, but you just put up another mock draft on the ringer where you have Zach Wilson as the number two quarterback overall, right behind Trevor Lawrence. He went to BYU. There's a lot of Trubisky, one-year wonder stuff buzz with him. And the reason he's number two on everyone's board is because the Jets have pretty much made it clear they're taking him at number two.

Zach Wilson, yes or no? If your life depended on it, is this a good idea or not? Oh my God. So let me, I would rather take Fields, so I'm going to say no. Okay. I got Fields ranked higher. I don't think Wilson's a bad pick, necessarily.

I just think I would rather take Fields. The thing about Wilson is, you know, he played at BYU. They didn't have a good, they didn't have a very tough schedule this year. The one, I think the toughest game they had was against Coastal Carolina, and they lost the game. He played all right in that game.

I wouldn't say he lit it up. So when you compare that to what Fields has done over the course of his career, big game, went and played Clemson through six touchdowns, even though his insides were liquefied halfway through the game. I mean, he's just like a baller, a leader, former five-star guy, done it for longer. I think, so to me, the Wilson hype has just gotten a little bit out of hand. I do think that's where the wins are blown, though.

I think he's going to be the number two pick. This is hilarious that this is happening to Jets fans. They think, like, we leave bowl season and the Jets are like, all right, we didn't get Lawrence. That didn't work out. That's a tough one. He's a generational quarterback. All right.

We blew that one, but at least fields, that'll be good. He's really good. And now, and now they hit up with some dude at BYU. At least I guess the one good news with him is that he's not like 24 or 25. Like sometimes these dudes that come out of BYU, he's actually like only 21 years old. Listen, this to me seems like an overthink. And in general, the fact that the Jets are involved, I just have a bad feeling about it. This is one of those situations where if Wilson ends up going to a team like the 49ers or even maybe like the Panthers or something like that, or even Atlanta, I feel better about his chances of having a top-tier career.

The fact that he's going to the Jets is a little more worrisome. Just because, you know, obviously you got new coaching staff, new scheme coming in and all that. I think that gives him a better chance, I think, than what we would expect from the jets, but I'm still just, I don't know. I'm a little bit nervous about this whole situation. And the expectations factor with the jets and you have fields going forward to Atlanta.

Yeah. Which just feels great. Oh, that's a perfect fit. Yeah. And turf, uh, fast team.

He's got receivers already. They were like kind of secretly pretty good last year. They were the classic team. I don't know what their final record was, but it easily could have been four wins higher. Um, and then you put him in Atlanta, the kind of quarterback,

like a little, like how the Hawks got Trey young. And it was just like, Oh, this makes sense. Uh, with field, same thing,

like just has a little pizzazz and a franchise that has desperately needed pizzazz after how many years of Matt Ryan. So you think they would take him? What do they do with Matt Ryan then? I mean, I could see them honestly sticking with him for another year and giving fields like the ramp up time. Like we saw with my homes in Kansas city,

you know, you don't necessarily have to be the guy right away. Um, I think that the situation with his contract for Matt Ryan is still, you know, it makes him a little more difficult to trade. But again, we're seeing quarterbacks get traded with these enormous contracts and all this dead money. So I don't know if that actually even matters at this point. But yeah, I think in this scenario, in my mind, it be matt ryan for another year and then they give justin fields the chance to like you know get that get the system down get arthur smith let him get his

system down there in atlanta kind of just give them a year to kind of get everything together and go go forward in 2022 you know what else i i mean i love the draft specifically because i don't watch college football i I barely know anything. I just basically watch the bowl games and like three other games. To me, this is like the perfect scenario for Justin Fields. He gets passed out by the Jets. He drops two spots.

He's going to have a chip on his shoulder. He's going to go to a franchise and a fan base that is going to love him coming out of the gate. He's in a fun division. All of it makes sense. This is like the perfect thing. And then it'll be, we get to spend the next 10 years going, oh my God, I can't believe the Jets didn't take him at two. What were they thinking? A little like the Sean and Mahomes how with the bears at number three that year where, you know, that became part of the narrative with

them. I can't believe it. What were they doing? I would always rather have the guy who was, had some sort of grudge passed over chip, chip on the shoulder, whatever. I just, I love that fit for him. I really thought, I don't understand what happened. We left that bowl game and it was like, yeah, he's really good. That's going to be, that's going to be a great number two pick the draft. Everybody just stares at these dudes and they lose their minds after like three weeks. I want to be clear that I like Zach Wilson. I think I got him ranked 10th. I got him ranked 10th on my board. That being said, I just think to me, I feel a little bit like I'm taking crazy pills over the last couple of months. I mean,

Justin Fields, to me, it's just like, I don't understand how we got there because yeah, like you said, during watching them play Clemson, everyone's like, this guy is amazing. It really does kind of remind me of the Deshaun situation where the guy's a gamer, just an absolute baller, has all the tools, you know, has the pedigree like a former big, you know, big recruit, all that stuff. And for some reason, people still thought he was gonna be bad. I think, you know, people are definitely focusing on a few bad games that Justin Fields has had in his career. And I mean, it's not like he's been a perfect, you know, prospect throughout the process.

He had a couple of bad games this season. There's some some worries that he stares down his receivers and he can't go through his reads. You know, there's there's all the typical things that you'd worry about from a college quarterback going to the pros. But I mean, at the end of the day, I don't know. I just really don't get it. I'm with you. I'm on the same page. I'm just a little bit like you just watched him pick apart Clemson for six touchdowns on one of the biggest stages. And now we're talking about him being

the third, fourth quarterback. To me, it doesn't register. So he's my number two guy. Him and Lawrence are on a whole different plane for me. But again, that doesn't mean I don't like Zach Wilson. I just think it's just a little bit crazy right now. Yeah. I liked you said on the, uh, in the draft guide, you do like comparisons, like shades of, and you had a souped up that's Dak Prescott.

I thought that was a really good one because one of the things that stood out as I watched that bowl game was what a big duty was like, he's got like a big ass, like, you know, he's, he's just, he's thick, but he's thick and athletic. And I feel like in the NFL with the, you know, the amount of hits, even you've seen all the little dings and banged up things Mahomes has had over the last couple of years. Who's not, you know, he's the most talented quarterback we've ever had, but he's not a big, big dude. You know, you worry about him sometimes.

Fields, I would say by the time he's 26, he'll be 250 pounds and with speed, you know? And I just feel like he's, from a durability standpoint, that's who I'd want to make my bet on, right? When I, exactly, when I watch him, and in fact, it's not just him as a runner, and keep in mind, he ran for 1,100 yards and 19 touchdowns in college, in addition to throwing 67 touchdowns in two seasons as a starter for Ohio State.

But really, to me, what stands out, I think the Cam Newton comp actually came to me when I was watching him in the pocket. Now, he's smaller than Newton. Newton is on this whole different level in terms of his size. But the way that guys, when they're trying to sack him or tackle him in the pocket, they just slough off of him. He's just made out of granite in the pocket. And I don't know. So that comp really came to me. I think he has the athleticism. He might be a better athlete than Dak Prescott. I think he's around the same size in terms of their build, but he can really

add to the game as a runner. Going back to the Atlanta thing, I don't know if he's going to end up in Atlanta, but he would be the perfect fit for them just on the idea that they're going to do a lot of bootleg stuff, like what we've seen Tannehill do in his time at Tennessee. Ideally, you get that same

type of offense in Atlanta. I just think he's a perfect fit for that. But I do think he's going to be a good pro. I should do my own version of a mock draft guide from a guy who doesn't follow anything, but is a huge NFL fan and just has seen this stuff over and over again. First of all, if I'm the Jets, why wouldn't I pretend I'm taking fields and then try to get Atlanta to flip picks with me if they became enamored with fields and at then try to get Atlanta to flip picks with me if they became enamored with fields and at least try to pick up like a second round or two years from now or

something? Why, why am I even letting it float out there that I like the guy who's basically between eight and 12 on everybody's board. That's crazy. And then second, why not just take fields anyway? But then I see in your, uh, in your mock draft, you have Miami picking three, taking Devonta Smith, the, uh, Alabama receiver, who everybody said is the all time sure thing at receiver. And as we've seen in the draft over the years, the safest bets are these top six, seven receivers, safeties, um, shut down corners. Like you're with the Charles Rogers exceptions, you're very rarely going to go wrong. I guess my question is why wouldn't fields go third? Why wouldn't Miami who already has picks and all of these different things

they can do anyway, why wouldn't they be kind of dangling that pick around trying to get somebody to bite because there's good receivers in this draft anyway, couldn't they, this, you know, potentially get a King's ransom for the Justin Fields at number three pick.

I feel like they trade down. Yeah, I think that's definitely a good, there's a good possibility that, and I, and if I do trades in my next mock, I'll probably end up doing something like that just because, yeah,

I think you might be able to get Devante Smith later on in the draft too. You know, there's, there's a lot of, I think, concern out there in the NFL that he's a little too skinny. I know he's a, he's a baller and like, he's done incredible things. The stats are, are unbelievable really with him, but, um, he's listed at like six foot one, 175. So, um, that's on the very skinny side and there's just not a lot of guys his size in the nfl so yeah i think absolutely the dolphins would be smart to probably trade down from there um jamar chase is another elite receiver that they could get maybe like a few slots down because and then teams might trade up for not only fields but

you know some of these other quarterbacks whether it it's Trey Lance or maybe Mac Jones. I don't know if we'll see people go that high, but yeah, I think that's a good spot for them to trade back from. My guess is Miami pretends they're going to trade down and then Atlanta just flips spots with them. I don't know what the price is to go from four to three. Maybe it's like a late third round pick or whatever it is. Something like that. Yeah. I feel like fields goes third. This is really how we're going with the top two. I think fields has to go third. If he drops the

fourth, that's like a miracle for the Falcons that they just get this guy and they don't have to trade anything for it. You had, um, go into number 12, the fourth QB you had in the top 12 was Trey Lance from North Dakota State. There's thoughts Mac Jones could get in the top 12 too. I'm obviously looking at this as a Pats fan. The Pats are picking 15th. Not sure what I want them to do. I always felt like the concept of five quarterbacks going in the 14 picks before them seemed improbable

because every year with the draft, these teams are just going to draft for need. We just see it, whether that's the right move or not, they're just going to do it. If there's a really good left tackle and they need a left tackle and you're a GM and you might be gone in two years and they should build the right team.

You're going to take the left tackle. You're going to take the nose tackle that you love. You need a middle linebacker. You're going to take that guy and the quarterbacks will end up trickling down. So I feel like somebody's going to be there for the Pats at 15. But do you think there's a chance we could have five in the first 14? I think there's a chance, but I think I'm with you. I feel like it's a little, the odds are it's not going to happen. I feel like probably Mac Jones will be in the back half of the first round. And there's even a slight chance Lance could fall a little bit. I don't know. I think he's a good enough

prospect that he'll go decently high, but we always get very excited about the quarterbacks. And then some guys fall a little bit further than you think they're going to fall. Like teams are, like you said, teams are, and the idea of taking the fifth best quarterback, you know, in the first round, I think that maybe could rub some teams the wrong way. taking the fifth best quarterback, you know, in the first round, I think that maybe could rub some teams the wrong way. Like, we'll just wait, you know, until next year or try to get a guy in a trade. There's a lot of free agent quarterbacks out there this year. So I have the feeling, and in fact, I even had to tell myself, like,

I'm not going to get too crazy about putting Lance too high because I do think, you know, we might see, it's just rare to see like four or five quarterbacks in the top 10. Yeah. And you have these runs, right? With the draft where it's all of a sudden there's four teams in a row and they don't really need a quarterback and they end up taking whoever they, my dad and I, you know, I know, first of all, I know nobody's going to drop to the 15 that I'm going to like be doing backflips about because they're just far enough away. It's unrealistic. I also know if somebody did drop that, we loved odds.

Our Belichick would trade out of the pick anyway, because he secretly wants to torture all of us during these drafts who love the Pats. But I keep looking at Micah Parsons, the Penn State linebacker. And again, all I know from the draft is I do all the research. I'll check out the YouTube clip, stuff like that. But he seems like he's a potential monster. And by a mere fluke, by this whole quarterback rush that we might have, could fall to at least the bottom part of the top 10,

which seems stupid to me. And that's another reason why I'd be an asset in a draft room where I would just be at the table going, wait a second. Michael Parsons is going to go eight. This is stupid. This is too low for him. What are we doing? We got to take them.

Is there a chance he drops just because of the way this draft is with what teams need? Yeah, I do think there's a chance. He's a little bit raw, you know, relatively new to the position. And so I do think there is a small chance that that happens. You could see a run on different positions earlier on. And so I think he would be a perfect fit for the Patriots. In fact, I put him with the Patriots in my first mock draft. I know, but believe me, it was passed around in my circles. I got excited. He, to me, is like the ideal situation for the pass. Because he's actually a really good edge rusher.

Like, he would be the type of guy that you can use in sub packages to come off the edge. You know, in different situations, he can cover. He's super athletic. He's built really well. He's like the modern, ideal modern sort of linebacker type guy. And so, yeah, I think he would be perfect for that spot. And I do think there's a chance he falls a little bit. I look at the Pat situation,

and obviously it was modern and Carson Wentz, and going through the reckoning of if they traded for him, first of all, I have to talk myself into it because that's what you do when it's your favorite team, right? You have to talk yourself into the move. Seahawks traded for Jamal Adams. I don't know how much you love that trade, but it's two firsts.

Eventually, you just, what else are you going to do? You have to talk yourself into it. With the Pats, had they done the Wentz thing, I thought he was awful last year. It's funny, I saw some of the stats today after the trade and people were like, look how bad the stats were on Carson Wentz. He was 34th out of 36th here

and 35th out of 36th. This whole thing. And it's like, all right, those are cool. But I watched football every Sunday. He was one of the worst quarterbacks, if not the worst. I watched every week. What makes them think they can turn him around?

To me, this feels like a fool's errand for Frank Reich because I saw a guy who just holds onto the ball too long, tries to make these hero plays, and literally cannot snap out of that style. He always, always, always wants to make the best, greatest, perfect, and he's like

his own worst enemy. I don't see how you fix that. Can you fix it? I mean, the only reason, the best way you can talk yourself into it is that he's going to play for Frank Reich, who has experience

playing with him and did, you know, I think everybody's anchoring to what he looked like in 2017 when he was, you know, through whatever amount of games, the MVP candidate, one of the MVP candidates.

And I feel like coaches are always like, well, I can get him are always like, well, I can get him back there. You know, I can design a quick game for him where he's getting the ball out quickly. You know, we're taking some off his plate in terms of processing and all that. I think coaches are doing the same thing you're talking about where they can talk themselves into it. And he has tools, certainly. But yeah, I mean, when I watched him this last year, all the stats line up exactly what you kind of saw on tape. Like he was one of the worst quarterbacks statistically in

the NFL. And that's coming from like a clean pocket. He was bad from a clean pocket where you're not having pressure in your face and you can't use all these other excuses that you use with, you know, certain quarterbacks that are stuck behind bad lines. But yeah, I think I really don't know how I feel about it. I do think it's a good trade for both the teams in a sense, because if Wright can get, if he can get Wentz to like turn back into anything, even like closely resembling the guy he was a few years ago, then that's a win for them.

And then for the Eagles, they just wanted to get out of his contract. And that was like a deal to get out of their contract. And he actually I feel like they got a pretty good amount of draft capital for doing that. It was $33 million in dead cap money, but they end up

getting these two picks, one of which seems like it's a guaranteed first unless he gets hurt next season. Pretty much exactly. It's like 70% playing time without the playoffs or 75 in the playoffs. So yeah, I mean, they're almost surely going to get that first round pick unless he gets hurt.

Or unless they bench him, which I really don't see that happening because they don't have anyone else right now. And so, yeah, it's one of those things where I don't think I'd ever want to be the team trading for Carson Wentz. I wouldn't want my team to trade for him because we've seen that really that one season he had, that good season,

was the outlier for the rest of his career. And I feel like there's enough of a sample now that we kind of know who he is. But that being said, I mean, yeah. It's even worse than that, though, because he got hurt.

The guy who came in and was basically lights out for them the rest of the way and won a Superbowl. Nick Foles has never come close to approaching that before or since in his career. And you could just make the case. Maybe that Eagles team was really good. And maybe that was like this awesome race car that whatever driver you're going to put in the car, no matter how mediocre they were, they were going to look like an awesome race car driver. That would be my fear if I was, that was my fear at the Pats is Foles who has stunk since that whole run.

That has to mean something. Wentz has stunk since that whole run. What does that mean? The fact that both of them have stunk, maybe that team was really good. So I'm, I'm relieved. I get it from a cold standpoint. It's basically what two years, 44 million, which is pretty cheap on the QB side. Uh, now we're in the QB roulette game. Stafford has a team golf as a team. Wentz has a team, I guess Garoppolo is coming. Maybe Kirk Cousins, um,

Trubisky. I don't know who else is there. Uh, Oh, uh, Mariota, who I think is the guy that Pats are going to end up with. I just feel like they're Mariota waiting to happen. How do you feel about that?

I kind of liked that idea. I don't mind it. I, I just, he has his moments, right. But even in that awesome game that he had when he came in for Carr, he still had like two terrible plays.

And that was the rub on him in Tennessee. He would look good 92% of the time. And then he would have those two terrible plays and you would kind of, you could leave the game deciding how you felt, whether you're going to dwell on the two terrible plays he made or all the other stuff he did. It's kind of a rollercoaster ride. I feel like with McDaniels and Belichick, what they were trying to do with cam last

year, I do feel like they created a blueprint for, um, all right now, what would it be like if we had a quarterback who could actually complete a pass to a wide open guy? Right. Right. Um, could we have a guy who runs around, but then also actually completes passes? What does that look like over spending the 15th pick in the draft on like Mac Jones, who, by the way, we know the Alabama pipeline. If Saban thinks Mac Jones is going to be an awesome pro, the paths are going to take them at 15. So Belichick just defers to Saban every time. So those would be my two guesses, either Mac Jones or Mariota for the pets.

Are you bullish on Mac Jones? Have you watched him enough to really know? I don't, after Tua last year, I just feel like anybody who drives that Alabama race car, I have no idea if they're a good driver. Every year they have like three of the best receivers in all of college football. How do we know if they're good?

I'm exactly the same. I thought Tua was so freaking good. I thought he was going to be amazing. I thought he was going to light it up his rookie year because his processing was so fast. His accuracy was so good. And you can say the exact same thing about Mac Jones now. Some people even say he was better than Tua was

the year before in terms of just getting the ball out, getting it to exactly where it needs to be. He's very accurate, doesn't make a lot of mistakes, doesn't make a lot of bad passes, but his physical tools just aren't as good as a lot of these other guys. And that's the same deal with Tua, where his physical tools just aren't as good as some of his peers.

And so that's my worry. I almost feel a little bit snakebitten by liking Tua so much. I'm not even saying Tua's going to be bad because I think, you know, he didn't have a good support system in Miami last year in terms of skill players and all that. And so he could definitely still improve. It's funny how we kind of write people off after quarterbacks after one year now, whereas, you know, in the older days it would be like, okay,

by year three, if they're not doing something, then we'll talk. But yeah, I don't know. The Mac Jones thing, I think he's a, it's a pejorative to say it this way, but he's a game manager, but like a very high level game manager in the sense that he gets the ball out. He's smart with football.

Got like prototype size. I will say this, Bill. He does move around in the pocket. He looks a little bit like Brady. I swear to God, I was going to say that after you finished. He does. He maneuvers like young Brady did. Not the current Brady,

but the 2000s version of Brady. That's what reminded me of Brady. Just that one quality. He doesn't have the size Brady had. The way he throws is very Brady-like. His stance and stuff doesn't quite have the size, but I thought he was good.

But again, it goes back to what does this mean? I think with Tua, and we have some rookie cards in my house, so we're rooting for him to come back, some Tua rookie cards. That might have been a two-year injury. To me, I don't feel like we can judge. I didn't feel like he had speed or explosiveness. Like the guy in Alabama could scramble around and do stuff. The guy in Miami could not.

And until we know that that's gone for good, I don't want to write him off yet. Before we go, there was some Russell Wilson wants out of Seattle stuff happening last week and the week before. And you never know with this stuff. But is it conceivable? He wants out of Seattle.

Like the D when you heard that rumor that he might be receptive to a trade or they like, whatever, whatever the fuck was going on. Did any of it ring true to you? Or did you think it was ridiculous? I don't think it, it wasn't so absurd that he would think that it wasn't to me.

It wasn't out of the realm of possibility. I think it's unlikely that he's actually going to get me, it wasn't out of the realm of possibility. I think it's unlikely that he's actually going to get traded. I don't think he's going to be on a different team next year. But, I mean, if you put yourself in his shoes, I mean, he believes he's going to play for another 10, 15 years or whatever. He's not on the last legs of his career. He just gets done watching Tom Brady win a Super Bowl where he goes to this team that's stacked on offense,

built the team around him, let him have a say in who they're bringing in, basically did everything that they could to make it as easy as possible for Brady and make everything as explosive as possible for Brady, whereas the Seahawks and Pete Carroll have this history of being like very defensive minded. We're going to try to run the ball,

all this stuff, be balanced. Um, I, I think it's within the realm of possibility that he legitimately just wants to like, at some point in his career, go to somewhere else and play on a different style where they're going to be

doing the uptempo, you know, explosive stuff that he wants to do. But that being said, I don't think he's necessarily like trying to actually get out right now. I think he's, what he's doing is probably trying to put pressure on the front office to, to be serious about bringing in some weapons this off season in terms of

getting more guys in the receiving core, maybe another tight end, better offensive line. I think that was the big thing. And so I don't think this is just a fake story or conjured for fun because it's the offseason or whatever. I do think there's something there, but I don't think he's going to get traded, at least not right now.

It's three moves. They need one good tackle. They need a running back who can run and catch, whether they get that in free agency or in the draft and they need Adams to be healthy Adams was I mean he was on this pod last month that guy had two legit injuries he couldn't move his left arm

and you can make a case if he's 100% healthy in that Rams game maybe he single handedly swings that Rams game that Rams game you know it's not like the Rams were rolling up and down the field and Goff had the Rams were rolling up and down the field and Goff had the pins in his thumb and was dying to commit

a couple turnovers. So, I don't know. I think there's a version of that season last year where it works out a lot better for them. I don't feel like they're that far away. I honestly like

the direction they're going with Shane Waldron. Like, if Pete Carroll wants to be really heavily balanced and run the ball and do all that, the Rams offense is sort of the

archetype. It's what you want to do because they use so much motion, so much play action. It's very scheme-driven. The scheme is very smart, nimble. I do think that there's a chance we go out and we see the Seahawks have a very good offense again next season and kind of surprise people because the way they looked in

the second half this year was just completely dysfunctional. But I do think, you know, looking at Wilson's entire career and his entire track record, there's a good chance he's going to bounce back and, you know, come out firing. Should I have him on the podcast and like getting an argument with him to try to reverse the karma from the, maybe we got along too well in the last podcast. Maybe I'll start a fight with him or something. Um, last year, who was your favorite guy in your mock draft? Who is the guy that, who was like your, I bet my life on this guy, guy who was not like a top five pick. That's a really good question. Let me, did you have like a favorite that you were all in on completely?

Like at any position? For me last year in the NBA, Halliburton was the guy I latched onto after the top three where I was like, if this guy falls, I'm going to be mad at everybody. This is ridiculous. And of course, he fell to 12, and it was ridiculous. And now if you do the draft over again, he's in the top five. Did you have a guy like that last year? I think for me, it was CeeDee Lamb.

I love CeeDee Lamb. So he's a TBD, I guess. Yeah, he was really good for the first half of the year when Dak was in there and their offense was really cooking. But obviously as the second half of the year went along, he didn't play quite as much. He got phased out a little bit. Their offense was just bad in the second half of the year. So it's tough to tell. But I do think he

has a very bright future. And he fell a little bit further than I thought he would. So he might have that chip on his shoulder too. So who's that guy this year for you? Do you have it yet? Have you anointed anybody? It's got to be probably somebody in the 8-22 range.

Yeah. The first guy that comes to my mind is Jeremiah Owusu-Koromoa from Notre Dame. I don't know if you've watched him at all, but he's this undersized linebacker. In fact, I comped him to Jamal Adams. I think he is the most explosive athlete in this draft, maybe. He is just a ball of energy. He flies around. He's a little bit he is just a ball of energy. He flies around.

He's a little bit undersized for a linebacker. He's sort of this, you know, hybrid type guy, half linebacker, half safety can pass rush maybe a little bit. He's good in coverage, but he is, he, to me has been the most fun player to watch so far. There's some question about like his transition to the NFL, because when you're all, when you're a tweener type player, you know, you kind of have to land in the right situation, I think, to be an instant impact player. So I'll be closely watching where he goes. But to me, he's the most fun guy to watch on tape.

We saw that last year with Isaiah Simmons a little bit, right? Exactly. Where everybody got all fired up about him, but then he didn't have a position for 10 weeks. Then he finally started playing the last five, six weeks. He's exactly who I have in my mind when I'm touting this guy. I'm like, man, because I loved Simmons last year. But same deal.

You have to find a good situation for him, I think, in order for him to kind of do what he's been doing at Notre Dame. But he just flies around. Do you have a pick for before we go? The Patriots? Because Nephew Kyle's listening and he's dying to know more about the Patriots and how we're going to fuck up this draft because we fucked up like four in a row. Is there a wide receiver we're going to take in the second round who's going to break Kyle's heart? If you have to guess. I'll give you the prototype. 6'3", super fast and raw,

can catch balls in traffic, but maybe doesn't have the highest football IQ yet? So the first person that comes to mind is Kadarius Tony from Florida. And I like Tony. Okay. But he is, I comped him. He's a little bit like a Percy Harvin type player. Very explosive, breaks a ton of tackles,

and is fat. I don't know if he has long speed, but he's very explosive. But I do think he is a boom-bust type prospect. He's sort of a one-hit wonder, kind of developed in his last year and turned into a star, but hadn't really done much before. And so I think he's the type of guy who could get drafted late first round, early second round,

and maybe not live up to expectations. That being said, I do like him, but he is a boom bust type guy. Kyle, does that sound like somebody we draft? Sounds great to me either way. I see Kyle, Kyle buying his jersey and then sadly wearing it when it's 50% off on the Pats pro shop. Still, still keeping it going. All right. How many more mock drafts are you doing? I don't

know. I'm not sure, actually. At least two, probably, I would say. We'll do one when we update to 75 because we're updating to 50 next week. 50 players in the draft guide and then 75 a couple weeks after that and then right before the draft we'll do my final one at least. I'm sure they might throw

a couple more in there, but at least two more after this. And then right before the draft, we'll do my final one at least. I'm sure that they might throw a couple more in there, but at least two more after this. And we're doing a little NFL draft show on the ringer NFL podcast, right? Yeah. We're doing that today. Yeah. So how many,

is that every Friday until the draft? Is that the plan? I'm not sure what the plan is longer term, but we're, today we're going over my draft guide, the mock draft 2.0, kind of talking through all the different scenarios.

I'm not sure if it's going to be a weekly thing or not yet. Okay. And then Fantasy Football Show, which you guys had a great year. You and Craig and Danny Heifetz, who it became apparent

during the season, has really only seen three movies in his entire life. Didn't get any of your movie references that you or Craig had went over his head over and over again. No matter what movie you dropped, he had no idea what you're talking about. And then would belatedly pretend that he did. I really enjoyed that aspect of it.

Yeah, it goes both ways, though, because him and Craig always talk about random millennial stuff that I have no idea about. You know, I'm completely out of the loop with like TikTok and everything. I don't know what they're talking about. That's how he gets you back with tick tock. All right. Danny Kelly. Good to see you. I'm glad you're not mad at me. All right. You too. All right. I gotta be honest. It took me four months to want to talk to this guy. The Lakers won the NBA title in the bubble. I knew he would be in suffer about it. I gave him time to calm down.

Now he's going to come on and tell us that the Lakers have as many titles as the Celtics, even though they won five of them in Minneapolis. Flea, welcome back to the podcast. You know, I haven't, don't feel like I've had the opportunity to be as wildly and selfishly obnoxious as I would like to be about the Lakers winning the title, given the circumstances of the bubble and the coronavirus and whatnot. You might have heard about this coronavirus thing. So let me take this opportunity right now to say that I am, I don't know, are pigs actually happy when they're in shit? Is that true? Because I am a big, fat, pink, hairy hog rolling around in a pile of shit, happy as hell, kicking my feet in the air, thanking the Lord. The only thing you missed was, first of all, going to the games, and then second, raising the banner and being there and getting to do that. So you're watching everything from your house on TV.

What was it like? Man, you know, the whole thing of the NBA going on with no fans. And I think that my perspective on it now has shifted as it continues on with no fans. In the bubble for me, in the playoffs, it was really exciting. For one, it's the playoffs. It's the NBA playoffs. For another thing, it's the playoffs, it's NBA playoffs. For another thing, we didn't think we'd get them at all. So they came back, we got to see it.

And it was really kind of fascinating for me, you know, from the beginning of the bubble playoffs till the end. At first, it was such a novelty that there were no fans and and it was like this sort of like crystallized really pure hoops you know it was so cool like with no audience interference teams played different you could tell that the the teams that really run on emotion didn't do well and the teams that really have their shit together and are smart you know were were able to just like executed really well, really flourished in that environment. And it was so cool to see it. And, you know, the Lakers won the championship and it was just absolutely beautiful to see how they did it. There were so many great little triumphs among the macro triumphs

of being great. And they win this year and they have more than the Celtics. That's really going to be great. And they win this year and they have more than the Celtics. That's really going to be great. But now, as it goes on, with the no audience, it's starting to be a little bit disheartening for me personally. I don't know.

How do you feel about it? I feel the same. It's funny. The way you were just talking about it made me think of the difference of the football basketball was better in some ways, right? The shooting was as good as it's ever been. The intensity was great. And it reminded me a little bit of like, if you saw an awesome band in the smallest venue possible,

right? Like a 50 person venue where it's same thing. It's a different kind of energy and it's more intense. It's confined, which I'm sure you've been in that situation. Not as fun as playing in front of 80,000 people or being in an 80,000 seat NBA arena, but different kind of energy, right? Do you see a comparison with that? I never thought of it that way. But yeah, I guess so.

It was like, I guess like you mean like that, that close up personal aspect, I think it would be even more so if they didn't have the fake crowd noise and we could hear the players cursing and it was really like an eerie silence of the arena. Like that would actually be really cool. And I would like it better. But it, it, it, you know, I forgot what I was going to say. It was fantastic. Oh, but it, it, it, you know, I forgot what I was going to say. It was fantastic.

Oh, we got, we got basketball. Also, like we got basketball in October. Yeah. You know, what kind of a gift is that? Like that was just. Playoff basketball. Yeah. That was just like manna from the heavens, man.

We got basketball in October. And then not to mention the same month, the Dodgers won the world series. So it was just like raining, like reigning championships in Los Angeles. I don't know what happened for the Red Sox and the Celtics, but over here, man, it's unbelievable. Yeah, it was bad. I was glad I was trapped in my house and not being able to be around people. Do you remember the time that it was uh i don't know when it was it might have been the when the lakers won it in 2010 i'm not sure but it was a mid-season game and the lakers played the celtics

and i like the lakers won at staples and i remember like running out into the street like going to my car like all this big little light in my loafers you know like hopping around or going to the parking lot. And I ran into you in the street. You remember that? I do. I do. And I wasn't as happy.

I wasn't as happy as you were. No. Well, I think we missed... No, the Celtics look pretty good. No, we really don't. Don't patronize me. We don't look good. And I think we missed our window to play you in the finals last year.

And it's looking increasingly like a missed opportunity where Hayward gets hurt at the beginning of the bubble. And they're a guy short. Miami ends up getting in instead. And now the Celtics team, no Hayward. Kemba looks hurt. And the whole fan base is panicking. It's not great.

Whereas you guys, you felt like you almost lost Anthony Davis with a KD type Achilles injury there for a split second, where it looked very similar to it, right? Where he grabs the back of his leg and... Yeah, but he kept playing for a while. And you could see it coming

like he had grabbed it a couple of times. And what is it? They're calling it like tendinosis of the Achilles, right? Yeah. I thought it was a calf, which actually worried me more. I thought he might have gotten the Marcus Smart calf tear. Right. And I'm kind of waiting, you know,

because Marcus Smart does play on my fantasy team. He'll be back soon. Okay, yeah, I need him. I'm getting walloped here. Well, we need a third scorer. Marcus is going to come back and say, I'm the third scorer. Marcus is going to come back and say, I'm the third scorer. He's going to take a bunch of shots,

which will be both bad and good. Have you accepted LeBron yet as a Laker? Wait, what about LeBron as a Laker? Like, do you officially feel like he's a Laker now? This is year three, he's won a title? I felt like he was a Laker before we started the season two years ago when we got it. The day that we found out, like midsummer when we found out that he signed,

I was rolling on the floor in ecstasy that he was a Laker. And Cleveland or Miami didn't exist to me anymore. That part of his history doesn't exist. It's like, you know, it's... That first year when he came in and he broke, I remember he passed, I think, Kobe for whatever he said, whatever scoring mark, or he passed whoever on the scoring list, but he had just kind of gotten

to the Lakers, and the Laker fans are applauding, and it's like they had no history with the guy. But now it kind of feels like he's a Laker. Maybe it felt like that to you sooner. For me, honestly, like all jokes aside, it really did feel to me like he was a Laker like he's a Laker. Maybe it felt like that to you sooner. Yeah, I mean, for me, honestly, like all jokes aside, it really did feel to me like he was a Laker when he became a Laker. I didn't need him to prove anything.

I didn't, you know, I mean, I was just a kid when Kareem came over from Milwaukee, but I didn't feel like he was a buck. He was a Laker. Like when I was a kid and I wasn't like putting all that onto it, he was just a Laker. You know, he put on the purple and gold in his goggles and he was a kid and I wasn't like putting all that onto it, he was just a Laker. You know, he put on the purple and gold in his goggles and he was a Laker.

And that's how I felt about LeBron. And obviously he won a championship. He went through a rough season, probably the worst season of his career when he had the Lonzo Ingram, you know, that season. But I... Yeah. I just... He just seems like an LA guy to me. All right. Rank them then. Best Lakers you've seen in person.

That I've ever seen play in person? Yeah. Best Lakers you've seen in person. Because now LeBron officially counts on that list. Oh, Jesus. Well, Magic Johnson's number one. Fair. Kare Johnson's number one. Fair. Kareem is number two. Kobe's number three.

LeBron is number four. Shaq? Shaq's number five. Tough podcast for Shaq. You know, I mean, Shaq wasn't... I love Shaq you know I mean Shaq wasn't I love Shaq I can't make a hierarchy of these guys in order

no you just did it's going to be a news story now what? it's going to be a news story now it just happened you made your list all the newspapers are going to run with it this morning I was running with my dogs up in the mountains and I kind of had

that thought and I was remembering how, you know, it's a time when things hit you, you know, I remember like being really obsessed with the Lakers and met during magic's career and watching him every fast break, being so glued to what he was going to do. You didn't, you never knew what he was going to do. You never knew what he was going to do. Like Kareem, he got the ball, you know he was going to swing left and then go right and do the sky hook.

When LeBron gets the ball, you don't really know, but you know he's going to do the smartest thing and he's going to execute well, except for once in a while when he gets tired and he starts kind of jacking up threes if you feel like driving to the lane. You know, fair enough. With Magic, you never knew what he was going to do before I drive him to the lane. You know, fair enough. With Magic, he never knew what he was going to do.

Was he going to dish to Byron or Worthy on either ring? Was he going to go down the middle and get fouled? Was he going to pull up? He just had no idea. The man was constantly surprised. You know, it's funny, but we were having the same experience on the East Coast with Bird. And I think that's why those guys are so special.

And especially as the years pass, have not been replicated. Like they be, it's almost like in music where you have, we had Billy Joel and Elton John at the same time in the seventies. And then there's just been nobody like those guys since like these guys that can play piano and fill an NBA arena or fill a five, a 500 seat club. And at the end and they can just be the same, have the same kind of performance and the same kind of intensity and both things. But yeah, we just,

as the years pass, you realize like, holy shit, I'm probably not going to see that again. Yeah, it's not happening. Yeah, Arizona. And I, you know, that Bird Magic HBO documentary

might be the greatest sports documentary ever made. It's really good. It's gotten good legs, I think, for that. Yeah. The thing that's great about it is that both of these guys were really built up in the media. You know, like Larry being a working class, blue collar, hard, you know, guy. And Magic, you know, even though he's also from the Midwest, but magic being this like, you know, Hollywood swinger glitz and glamor guy, but it's true.

Like you watch it and you realize they actually are those guys, you know, even though magic is like, you know, a real family man and stuff, but he was embracing the Hollywood lifestyle and like all that bird stuff about him putting on his dad's shoe when his foot is broken because he's got to go to work anyways. Yeah. And his dad kills himself. And like mowing his lawn.

I mean, all that stuff. And the fact that they actually did end up bonding. And like much to Bird's chagrin, kind of. It was like Maddie was trying to be friends the whole time and Bird was just too damn grumpy to do it. And, you know, they really did have this, you know, they were like opposing North and South magnets,

you know, creating this powerful energy between them. It was amazing, man. We're lucky we got to see that when we were kids. Did the Chili Peppers ever cross paths with the Showtime Lakers in any sort of Los Angeles way? Because you're basically running in different circles, I would say.

Yeah, no. I've never really hung out with professional basketball players in my whole life. Not once? Not even when you guys became super famous? Never. It's never really happened. I'm friends with Steve Nash a little bit.

My wife is friends with some basketball players um but i'm i just have never you know i don't know why so you guys were never invited to the forum club in like 1989 1990 range no no it was never cool enough man i've never been cool enough to hang out in a foreign club with the basketball players. I used to hang out when Metallica plays. I'd drink beer with James Hetfield. But I never got to tip martini glasses with AC Green. Is this the longest you've ever gone without playing live music? It's the longest that I've gone. Yes. I mean, since I was like doing, you know, recitals in seventh grade. Yeah. Unbelievable. I mean, it's been, it has to

have been a year and a half, right? Cause you guys were rehearsing and you had had some changes in the band and stuff and you were kind of figuring it out, but you weren't on tour and you'd been planning on going on tour, but then there's no tour and now it's been at least a year and a half, right? Yeah, something like that. I think we did shows in

November of 2019. Yeah. I think those were the last ones. Don't quote me on that. You can quote me on it if you want Think about it I do feel like There's really no silver linings with the pandemic

But a tiny little silver lining Is I do feel like people are going to appreciate Sporting events and live music In a totally different way I knew I took it for granted I would have tickets for stuff I'd be like I can't fucking wait to go to an NBA game. I can't wait to go to a concert.

I can't wait to go to the Hollywood Bowl. I can't wait till life's normal again and we can go do this stuff. And I'm sure you feel the same playing. Well, that's the thing. Yeah, we're playing for sure. But even like, you know, attending sporting events myself, you know,

like, so I was talking about, it was exciting when the bubble happened in the playoffs. But now i still watch every single laker game and i watch other basketball but i like i find myself my attention wandering you know what i mean like i'll go like and pick up something else while the game's on and like miss part of the game like never done like i watch the game i watch everything unfold i watch try to figure out what kind of defense they're running, what they're doing. And now my mind wanders. And watching now, it's like, can you imagine if it was full of 20,000 people going bonkers right now? It just seems like a bygone era. It's crazy, man. But in terms of entertainment not happening, when the floodgates open, they're going to open wide and there's going to be a torrent of performance and everything. I mean, I know like for, you know, all my contemporaries that play in bands that I'm

in touch with and, you know, all musicians and like everyone is just like plotting to get on the road and waiting and chomping at the bit to get on the road and do gigs. And if there's going to be so much of it, I'm like, it's going to be too much. Every arena is going to be filled every night with somebody, every theater, every club is going to be packed and you know,

it'll be great, man. Well, it's had a huge impact because, you know, as the music business changed over the last 20 years, album sales aren't the same. And a lot of the bigger bands and medium-sized bands, a lot of how they made the money was touring, doing concerts, being on the road and not being able to do that.

Now everybody's going to want to go back at the same time, I guess for you guys, he, I mean, he basically had almost four decades of playing shows. Can you imagine if you had been really on the rise and just about to hit it and now you can't play in front of a crowd for like a year and a half? It's almost like an athlete losing like a year in their prime or something, right? Yeah, it's crazy. That would be really difficult. It's crazy. That would be really difficult. It's funny. I was thinking, yeah, this is a real tangent, but I can't help. But I was speaking, I acted in this film that came out

last year called Queen and Slim. And it's a film about social injustice. It's about a black couple who are pulled over by a cop and a scuffle breaks out. They accidentally shoot the cop. They go on the lam and it kind of, you know, examines social justice issues and particularly, you know, black people and the police officers. And I was thinking about, you know, how that works and, you know, racism and systemic racism and social justice. And I was doing an interview once with Melina Matsoukas, who's the director who made Queen and Slim. And she was talking to me about how many, you know, young black people get arrested at a young age unfairly,

or at least like definitely unfairly in context, you know, compared to white people and how it really messes up their lives. Because you get, when you go into jail and you're young, it's so hard to get a job. It's so hard to bounce back. It's so hard to do all this stuff. And I think about like, I had told this story that once when I was like, you know, when Chili Peppers were just starting out,

we might've made our first record or not. I can't remember. But me and I don't want another band member because I can't tell a story with someone else in the band about this. But another one of my band members and me and a friend up all night doing crazy drugs, drugs in our pockets, syringes, all this terrible stuff. We were out of our minds like five in the morning. Let's go to the beach.

Yeah, yeah, we'll go to the beach. You know, driving. It's like, you know, the sun's rising. We're driving to the beach yeah yeah we'll go to the beach you know driving it's like you know the sun's rising we're driving the beach we get pulled over cops see us and we're just like out of it you know like waste i remember the cop pulled me over i was the one driving my hands were shaking like crazy and uh the guy can you know my eyes are like two fried eggs i got all these drugs in my pocket and i was shaking shaking because I was so scared. I was, you know, I'm really going to get in trouble. And a cop just being like, all right, you guys, like, come on now. Like, you've taken it a little far.

Like, go home and get some rest, okay? Just get in your car, turn around, go home and get some rest. Yes, sir, officer, directly, right home. You know, and I thought, like, if we would have been arrested at that time, and if I would have gotten busted for drug possession and all that stuff, and had I gone to jail, like right when the chili peppers were taking off, it would have screwed everything.

Yeah. You know, what if I would have gone to jail for two years, you know, and come out and like dealt with the trauma of being locked up and good. Everyone else going off and doing other stuff. The world goes on without you. Would I have ever been able to have this entire career that I've been enjoying for the last 40 years? I don't know, man. So as that relates, it's a real extreme version.

It's a fork in the road moment, right? Yeah. Yeah, huge. Huge, man. Well, you made some news right before the pandemic because your old guitarist came back, John Frusanti, where that had been. When did he leave? Sometime in the early, mid-2000s? I can't remember the exact date.

Yeah, well, he left twice. He quit the first time, when did he leave in sometime in the early mid two thousands or I can't remember. Yeah. Twice. Yeah. The first time. And I think in 91 or 92 after our blood sugar record, um, left full and came back in like 99, something like that, 98.

Um, and then he quit again in 2000. I know when he came back, it was 10 years, like to the day that we announced that he left the first time. I know when he came back, it was 10 years, like, to the day that we announced that he left the first time. I mean, the last time. So he was gone for 10 years and just came back. But I think, yeah, he left, like, 2010,

came back, like, 2009, came back 2019. And, you know, our fans were kind of upset about they didn't feel that we announced it, uh, with enough poignant, um, explanation, but we just felt like, you know, look, this has happened. Let's just get it out and be done with it. We don't want to, you know, this is our business, you know? I was going to say it was handled in classic Chili Peppers fashion.

You sent out like a paragraph. You're like, Hey, this happened. Here's where we're going going forward. I was trying to imagine if an NBA team did that. Like, hey, we have the Lakers. We've decided to bring back Shaquille O'Neal. No further questions at this time. Yeah, well, there's some things that, you know,

aren't people's business, you know. Yeah. But, you know, were really uh loved josh klinghoffer and he was awesome and grateful for him and it's awesome and now we're grateful for john you know um so were you guys you you guys were rehearsing and then all of a sudden that had to stop so what what happens now oh we've been working we've been working steadily and i kind of feel hesitant to talk about exactly where we're at because it's band stuff. And I don't like, you know, we kind of have an agreement.

Yeah, I got you. Yeah. But we're doing great. We're flourishing. It's so interesting. You have all this history with all these different people. And especially in music and with bands, you know, it's like a basketball team. It's like you can play together for a few seasons and then this guy gets traded or this guy leaves and then the team's a little different, but you have those core guys and now you, you're basically back to where, where you started in a lot of ways.

Um, yeah, yeah, we, yeah. Well, you know, our original guitar player died. No, I know. But like, you were, you know, early nineties, late nineties. We got like, we definitely have a really, it's a very potent and powerful lineup for us. When you think back, I mean, now it's been a million years, but like there's been a lot of stuff about like, there's multiple Woodstock 99 documentaries going right now. Can you even

remember some of these moments? Like, like Woodstock 99, what do you remember about Woodstock 99? Cause you played on a Sunday night. The, the, the people are starting fires at that point. It's like complete chaos. And they asked Anthony, if he could calm things down and Anthony ends up, you guys end up playing Fire, the song Fire and kind of stepping into it a little bit but like do you even remember nights like that or they'll blur together? You know, I remember them. I remember

most gigs, at least something about them. Like someone can say to me, hey I saw you in Cincinnati in 1987 and I'll remember something about it. I'll remember the club I'll remember like the dressing. I'll remember the club. I'll remember like the dressing room was also where, but anyways, they had all the clothes in the dressing room.

I remember like putting them on, like coming out. And so I came out on stage in a purple sequined dress, you know? But yeah, no, I remember that one, the Woodstock 99 pretty well. Well, you were naked in Woodstock 99. You had, you decided to do no clothes for that, for that show. Yeah, I know. I went, You decided to do no clothes for that show. Yeah.

I definitely wore my birthday suit for that one. Yeah, no, I remember a number of things about it. I remember things I said on stage. I remember what was going on in my personal life. I remember everything about it. I remember rocking. Can you sense the energy from a venue and does it feel different from place to place?

Because one of the things like with Woodstock 99, there was talked about, there was like an anger, especially over the course of three days because it was so hot. And that was a big reason why things kind of degenerated. When you go out there, can you read the energy of the room? Because in sports, you can kind of feel it sometimes.

You can feel tension. You can feel whatever. I definitely have different feelings in every room that I go to. I don't know that my relationship to the stage and the music that we're playing and what's going on in the room is accurate in terms to like what it is like my relationship to it like i remember at that time when we played woodstock and i you could feel that there was an ugliness and an abusiveness in the audience and i didn't like it i remember feeling and I but I think like that was just kind of an era too like that really existed at that time you know it was something that was not um to you know

individual to the to the Woodstock performance it was like going on all over the place there was this kind of like real macho jockish um mean spirited thing that was being glorified at the time in rock music and i didn't like it i never liked it um but you know that's what was going on and i think that you know sometimes a big event like that it manifests in a big way and all the press is there and everyone's there so they feel it and they see it and they remark upon it. And it's the things that, that we remember in history. But I always feel like it's like, that's just one signpost of something that was going on everywhere.

It's just a barometer, you know? When you guys can do live music again and start touring around, where's the first place you want to play? LA? Yeah, we've discussed that, you know, we, you know, obviously, you know, we've been asked many times to do computer concerts, you know, for various reasons. And, you know, there's good philanthropy to be done. There's, you know, if you want to make money doing it,

there's money to be made. But it's really important for us that when we do that, especially since it's going to be our first time playing guitar, that we do it live for people. And I don't know where that's going to be. We've discussed it. And whether it's a benefit concert or it's a big concert or we just go do some little clubs to warm up or whatever.

But we're entertainers and we love to connect with people and play music and shine a light that way. So we look forward to doing it. Maybe it should be the national anthem for the Celtics-Lakers NBA finals. That could be your comeback appearance. Game one.

I would do that. That would be cool, right? I would be delighted if that happened. Do you think the Nets are going to make the finals? I do. I had Barker on my podcast on Tuesday, and I was saying, I think they're by far the safest bet.

He was way more pessimistic because he felt like they don't have the defense. They don't have the center rim protector type person yet, but they might get that person.. I just think they have too much offense. Who'd you have on? Charles Barkley. He thinks Philly is a safer bet because they're bigger,

they have more size and bead. He doesn't think Brooklyn Canino and bead, but I just feel like those three guys, Brooklyn has. I do think you would beat them though, assuming you're healthy. I think that we can beat them if we're healthy because we have the have the defense you know we get a little preview tonight um but the weird thing about the nets is like i can't figure this out with kairi kairi is probably might be the most skilled player i've ever seen i mean it's insane the way he can get his shot up

the way his handles his his quickness, the way he handles his quickness, the way that he cuts the angles, all of that stuff. But let me ask you, you know this better than me. I'm just a run-of-the-mill fan. Is he always injured all the time or is this load management? It just seems like he plays like every other game the whole season. I think these teams are being really careful with their stars with how hard the schedule is.

Especially the smaller guys too. Okay, so you just have like a little tightness in your hip or whatever you're sitting on. Just in case it could manifest into something worse. The real thing that's going on, I think and I don't know if I'm right, but this is my theory. Because there's not going to be

crowds for the playoff games. The seeds don't matter the way they did. You know, you saw in the bubble, like it didn't really matter where the games were. It was like, Oh, game six, Boston's the home team. Like who cares? It's they're playing in a bubble and we're probably going to be in a similar situation in the playoffs. So I think teams are thinking like three seed, seven seed. It doesn't really matter as long as our team's healthy. I think what's interesting in the West though, if Utah can get the one seed, that actually does kind of matter

because they have like that whole altitude thing there. And that will be like a slight advantage. Like if the Lakers have to go there, they're a little banged up. They got to play game seven in Utah. It's, you know, it's not a huge advantage, but it's not nothing you know Yeah but also

The advantage of just being the number one seed And playing the eighth worst Team that just squeaks in And fights for five other teams for that seed You know That's where the advantage is Well and then you get to avoid both LA teams too If you're the one seed

And LA and LA are two and three They have to play each other before you get to avoid both LA teams too If you're the one seed And LA and LA are two and three They have to play each other before they get to you So you only have to play one, not two Would be the other big advantage Are the Clippers better this year than they were last year? I feel like they're the same Honestly They're the same

Yeah, I just feel like It's two really, really good guys You know, two of the best 15 players in the league. I don't really trust anyone else to have. Especially in the playoffs. You see Lou Williams last year in the playoffs. I don't trust any of those guys. I think with the Lakers,

the shocking thing is that Caldwell Pope has become this reliable role player. Schroeder arrives to the occasion. You know you're going to have him. I like the team. I think it's a better reliable role player and Schroeder, like his shooter rise to the occasion, you know, you're going to have him. They, I like the team.

I think it's a better team than it is last year. The, the question for me is Davis. Can you stay on the court? Yeah. Well, wait, is this his first,

this is his first, no, it's the second injury this year. Yeah. Well, cause you had the bubble baggage where you played all these games and then the season starts right up again. And that it's hard. Miami had the same issues. Yeah. Well, because you had the bubble baggage where you played all these games and then the season starts right up again. And that's hard.

Miami had the same issues. Yeah. Well, they have to really take their time and not bring them back too quickly. What a beautiful basketball player. I had this guy over my house the other day who was saying, you know, I've never really been an Anthony Davis fan. He's pretty good, but he's so tall and has an advantage over everybody. And I was like, are you out of your mind there's a million tall guys in the nba every team has a

seven footer it's like it's remarkable watching him play you know i mean same with lebron too because you know of course i watched him before but i didn't watch him every game and i not since magic have i seen a guy that brings the players together as well as he does and uplifts all the other players. And probably maybe even better than Magic because he doesn't just do it in the way that he plays with all the assists and keeping the ball movement. But I feel like he, like locker room style,

really lifts the guys up and helps them to believe in themselves and believe in a shared ideal. He turned Dwight Howard into a redeemable teammate. That was an impossibility. He was the least popular teammate of the last 12 years. LeBron had him and he made it work. I fell in love with Dwight when he came back. You did? Tell me why. Because he was so earnest

and he was such a cheerleader and he was such a... They never ran plays for him. They were like, do the dirty work, get boards and putbacks and stuff. We're not running plays for you. Set picks, come off the bench. Sometimes don't play at all in the playoffs

because we don't need a big guy. And he never complained and he played as every fiber of his being every time he stepped onto the court. It was a beautiful thing to see. I was shocked. I thought he was on his way out of the league. It was really

impressive. LeBron said it was he said that title and the 2016 Cavs title over the Warriors were the two most impressive titles anybody's ever won. I don't think I agree with that, but I thought it was really impressive. I think to go through the bubble, to be away from your

families, all that, it really was something. I don't feel like it has an asterisk next to it or anything. I think your five Minnesota titles do. Those are asterisks. No, those are hard-earned titles. It's sad. It's sad that you have to steal from the great state of Minnesota.

No. That you have to steal their titles and count them as your own. It's sad. It saddens me. Teams move around. It's not like they became, they went from being the Seattle Supersonics

to changing their name and becoming the Oklahoma Thunder or whatever. This is a team that just moved cities. They didn't change the team when they moved cities. They didn't change the name when they moved cities. They're the same team. The Lakers have won 17 titles. You keep telling yourself this. It all

sounds like it makes sense. Yeah, it's true. The five minutes. You didn't even retire George Mikan's number. You're counting all his titles. They didn't retire his number? No. Retire Big George's number if you're going to count his titles. They really should. I didn't know they didn't do that.

You should have George Mikan night. You guys could play. You guys could be the house band for George Mikan night. Everybody will be dead who would have shown up for George Mikan because all that team's gone. George Mikan is the Buddy Holly of basketball. He was. He had big glasses.

Hey, it was great to see you. I'm glad all is well. I hope things are going well with your awesome school. Things are going well with that, right? Things are going so well with the school and I'm starting a new school in Watts that I'm really excited about. Whoa. Yeah. And, and you know,

we're just getting the last stages of getting all the permits together. But we're starting to watch Conservatory of Music, which is just a beautiful thing. And a lot of, you know, since the pandemic hit, it's been really, really great for me to be an Angeleno and to be involved in like all different parts of this city. And one of the things is to watch Conservatory of Music. So life is good.

When do you think that's going to open? Hopefully it will coincide this summer at the latest. Awesome. Congratulations. That's great. Thank you very much. It was great to see you.

I can't wait to see you guys on stage and for life to be normal again. But I'm glad all is well with you. Thanks, Bill. See you, man. That's it for the BS Podcast this week. Don't forget about the two rewatchables we did,

Sleeping with the Enemy and Coming to America. And on Sunday night, Ryan Rosillo is going to be joining us. We'll be reacting right after a whole slate of basketball games on Sunday. I will see you then.