The Bill Simmons Podcast - Ep. 144: 'Friday Rollin' With Mike Lombardi, Joe House, and Bryan Curtis

Episode Date: November 17, 2016

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons brings on FS1's Mike Lombardi to discuss the Pats' lackluster D-line (6:00), ways for the Titans to win the AFC South (10:00), Doug Pederson vs. Adam Gase (15:00), Raiders-Texans in Mexico (23:00), and Ben McAdoo's many Post-it notes (27:00). Then, Joe House joins (33:20) to give the best NFL picks for the weekend and to discuss the best burger joints in L.A. (40:00). Finally, The Ringer's Bryan Curtis comes on to give insight into covering the 2016 election (48:00), the Cowboys' return to prominence (58:00), and Tony Romo's locker room rapport in Dallas (1:10:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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That includes postage and a digital scale. Go to Stamps.com. Click on the microphone at the top of the homepage. Type in BS. And since Tate's here, check out the Ringer University podcast, Ringer U. Tate and Mark Titus breaking down college basketball, and it's good. Start listening now because you can get to March Madness, and you'll actually have opinions on stuff.

You won't just be reading the USA Today Monday section. Listen to this one, though. If you like college hoops at all or if you care about the upcoming NBA draft, I highly recommend this. Mark Titus. I knew he was going to be good at podcasts. It was a slow burn, and now he's good at podcasts. I was waiting.

I have a lot of Titus stock. Anyway, check that out. Ringer U is the name of the podcast. And we're off. Here we go, Joe. Check that out. Ringer U is the name of the podcast. And we're off. All right. At the end of every week, we have Mike Lombardi, my old friend. Now he's on FS1. He's on Fox on Sundays.

And he's here all the time. And we've been doing this forever. And we're licking our wounds this week. Our Patriots didn't come through. Well, it's not your Patriots anymore, but you still kind of have a vested interest. I have no problem saying I'm rooting for them. We tried to tell everyone for six weeks

that the front seven was not good and the front seven was not good and they single-handedly rejuvenated Russell Wilson's season. What was your takeaway from that game? Well, I think my takeaway is that they've made every quarterback look better than they are,

whether it's Landry Jones or Russell Wilson. And I think Russell Wilson's a really good player, but that was his finest hour. And coverage was bad. The rush was a little bit better. But more than anything, and, you know, people talk about Jamie Collins, and they don't have somebody to cover.

They play flat. They play with no emotion. They play like they're playing, going through it, and I think that you can't play defense like that. You can't control the game emotionally with your offense, and that's what the Patriots have always done. They try to control their game, and I think that defensively, the Super Bowl year was the best defense they've played in a while because they could actually get off the field.

But forcing a punt is almost like an aberration now because it just never occurs. I was going to say, Malcolm Butler is the only guy who's flying around on every play. And I don't know what's happened on that end. I do know this, though. You're not winning the Super Bowl with a bad defense. I don't remember the last team that's done it. It doesn't travel well. I mean, every game you play, you're just worried.

You know, they'll go play San Francisco this week, and you know San Francisco. Kaepernick will look better than he is. Of course, Landry Jones looked better than he is. So, you know, the hard part for me is usually players in the last year of their contract always perform at a higher level. And you get scared to pay them because you think, is this really who they are?

What are we doing? And the reality here is the players not under contract are not playing well. And you would think they would. So I think that's going to take some – I think that they need to refocus and try to simplify their ability of what they're doing, and then I think they've got to play a lot harder. If Belichick had to do it over again, would he have traded Chandler Jones? You know, in retrospect, looking back on it now, I would probably say no, because Chandler can at least rush the passer, and the players that have been added,

you know, Trey Flowers has done a nice job. I didn't think any of us anticipated Jabal Shear did not play to the level that he played a year ago or has in his career. And then Chris Long has not really rushed as well as I think they'd hoped for or we all hoped for when we signed Chris. And part of that, too, is how the Patriots rush, too. I think sometimes the players get a little bit of a bum rap here. The Patriots try to control the quarterback in the pocket, and usually he ends up getting out of the pocket.

It's the damnedest thing I've ever seen. And they have a hard time, and they don't really rush on edges. They kind of rush down the middle, which doesn't really help Chris Long very much. So it's really more of a compound problem that starts with how they rush, how they control. But, look, they rushed two guys the other night. That was embarrassing. Yeah, that was bad.

I mean, rushing two guys, I've never seen that before in my career. And then they throw a touchdown pass when you rush two, or they complete a 20-yard out when they rush two. I think this defense needs to reevaluate where they are philosophically, scheme-wise, and how they play and turn intensity. This is just not all about the players either, and I think Bill would be the first to admit that to you. Yeah, where are the blitzes?

Where's like the, oh my God, guys are coming from everywhere. People want to blitz, and I think blitzing is great, but the great coordinators in the NFL blitz, it's a tactical blitz. The blitz is to attack the protection of the offense. So when you blitz, you want the guy to get home. It's like trying to make the field goal to win the game. You don't want to attempt the field goal to win the offense. So when you blitz, you want the guy to get home. It's like trying to make the field goal to win the game. You don't want to attempt the field goal to win the game. You want to make the field goal to win the game. So you want to be in position to do that. Same thing

with blitzes. You want the blitz to have a rusher come free. That's the goal. You attack the protections, and you can do that. Wade Phillips does a nice job with it. Jim Johnson, the old coordinator, was great at it. Seattle does it at times when they do blitz, not often. But I think you'll see coordinators that know how to attack the protections very well, and they get home. I think what's happened in New England a little bit is they've run these blitzes, those double-A-gap mug blitzes that they've run, and I think people are used to it.

Now there has to be a counterpoint to it. So I did, my daughter woke me up at 4.30 this morning, and I've been up ever since. So I went down. I did a whole bunch of research. Not that I don't do research before every pod, but I really – I went to deep, dark places because I had nothing else to do. It was like 5.30 in the morning.

So I looked up all these different stats, and some of them seem to be sustainable and other ones don't now now here's a simple one Tennessee's last six games they've scored 195 points their offense they I know you love rushing attempts as an indicator that they've had they're one of only two teams that has 300 rushes the other one is Dallas. Is Tennessee for real? Do you believe in that offense? I think Tennessee has a good team. I don't think they have a great team. And I think in a league

filled with a lot of bad teams, Tennessee looks better than they are. But I think Tennessee has the ability to go and play anybody because they can control the line of scrimmage. They can run the football effectively. And Mariota's a good young quarterback. I think he's got a chance to be somebody who can make a lot of plays, make throws. They're not skilled-wise. They're not great. I mean, I think that's the problem. But when you break this team

down, they average 50 rushes and completions a game, which is really good. Which is really good. And so they're able to control the pace of the game. They're able to control the game. And that's critical. That's critical. And their defense can rush the passer. I think Arakpo is playing really, really well, and that helps them. And they play the South. I mean, look, your Houston Texans are 6-3 in the South. My Houston Texans.

Tennessee has, right now they have 37 plays of more than 20-plus yards, which is third in the league. Unfortunately, they've given up of more than 20-plus yards, which is third in the league. Unfortunately, they've given up 38 plays of 20-plus, which is fourth worst in the league. They're just—the games, they're going to be high-scoring for the most part, as long as the other team obliges. And they're in a lousy division. If I—gun to my head, I would pick them to win that division because I don't think the Texans are winning this week. And Tennessee's going into Indy. They're only getting three points.

If they take care of business against Indy this week, I think they are clearly the favorite in the AFC South. What do you think? And I thought this the same time only when they were playing Indy at home. I thought they were going to win the South. And then Indy goes in there and beats them. And that just drove me crazy because Indy shouldn't be able to do that. Indy's not good enough.

They should be able to run the ball effectively on Indy. They should be able to control the pace of the game on Indy, and they should be able to rush. I mean, Andrew Luck's been sacked 13 times, 33 times. He's been hit more than any quarterback in the league. And I thought Tennessee would be able to control the pace of that game, and they failed. They turned the ball over. I think what Indianapolis has to do,

the way for Tennessee to win is they have to run the ball for more than 125 yards. Last time they played them, they didn't do that. They didn't make a big run. The longest run of the game was 14 yards. They've got to find a way to control the pace and run the ball. Indianapolis can't. Indianapolis has enough weapons on offense. Even though Luck gets hit like

crazy, they can make enough plays. And I think when you play them, if you control the pace and force them to play from behind and force that bad offensive line of Indy to have to pass protect, then I think you gain the advantage. To me, this is the statement game for Tennessee. If they want to win the South, they've got to win this game. So the Rams

have scored 93 points in their last six games and they are now switching quarterbacks which they probably should have done a couple weeks ago unless golf is a complete disaster the dolphins going in there the dolphins are only two and a half point favorites against the rams the dolphins their last four games kind of sneaky sneaky, nobody talking about them, but they beat the Steelers in Pittsburgh, they beat the Bills at home, they beat the Jets at home, and then they went into San Diego last week and beat San Diego. Do you believe in the Dolphins yet?

No, I don't, and I think the Dolphins' offensive line will have a tough time blocking this Rams' defensive line. I think they'll struggle to do that. They're not good enough, and especially now that Albert's not going to play left tackle. I think that becomes problematic. And look, they've done a good job the last four weeks. I think there's no doubt. I think Chris Forrester, their offensive line coach,

has done a wonderful job of zone blocking and really running the Mike Shanahan run game. And that's why they've been able to stay in these games. They've played better on defense. They haven't just gotten smothered in the running game like they did at the first beginning of the season. But to me, it's still going to come down to Ryan Tannehill. And I agree.

I heard you talk about it with Sal the other day. He made some incredible throws in that game against San Diego. But as soon as I endorsed Phillip Rivers for the MVP candidate in the league, he throws five interceptions. So I feel really responsible for Phillip Rivers having a horrible game. I'm not buying Miami because I think Miami, Pittsburgh,

Ben got hurt. It was home. They stayed out in Los Angeles for the extra week. I worry about that. Okay. But, right, I know you're conflicted about DVOA this year because of some of the results, but Miami is sixth in DVOA right now, and Philly is still first. And Philly kind of vindicated it with that Atlanta game last week, which I watched,

and I thought they really kind of manhandled them. It made me wonder, you know, I know Atlanta is a finesse team, high scoring, but it really made me wonder if Atlanta is a team that could potentially swoon down the stretch as it gets colder. What do you think? If New Orleans could have kicked an extra point, I was going to say I think New Orleans is going to win the South. I really think New Orleans is playing better on defense. I think New Orleans is not going to be great on defense. But where New Orleans has excelled, they've only allowed five conversions of third downs in the red zone this year. So their red zone third down defense has been much better. And for a team that

can score as many points as New Orleans, that's where it's going to come down to. Because if they can make you kick field goals and New Orleans is scoring touchdowns, they'll win the game. But Atlanta's problems, and I've said it all season, their guards are not good enough. Andy Levine, Chris Chester, when they play against a team with Fletcher Cox and Benny Logan, and the Eagles are a different team with Benny Logan playing in the defensive front. Benny Logan's a really good football player. So when those two defensive tackles are rushing inside against the bad Atlanta offensive line,

it really affects Matt's, Ryan, ability to step up in the pocket. It affects his ability to drive the football down the field. That's where you get to the Falcons is inside pressure, and that's why the Eagles, to me, were easily the team that was going to beat Atlanta last week. Now, I don't love Philadelphia on offense. I think their play calling is, I think, you know, really, to be honest with you, I think Doug Peterson has just taken the Kansas City playbook

and stolen it with him. You know, he needs to put out a new album. I mean, he's like a cover band. He's just playing a bunch of cover songs from other albums. You know, he needs to do something different. But I like Philly's defense. I don't love their offense. New Orleans is only two back from Atlanta,

and they host Atlanta in Week 17. Just throwing that there. I forgot to ask you one thing when we were talking about the Dolphins, because we had a lot of new coaches this year. You and I have not been a fan of some of their works, including Doug Peterson's Andy Reid cover band, Ben McAdoo with the Cheesecake Factory menu. I think I like Adam Gase.

I think he might be the winner of Best New Coach Award. Is there somebody else you like as Best New Coach, or is it Adam Gase? I don't think. I think Gase has done a decent job. I think here's where Gase has really benefited from the fact that he's decided to take Ryan Tannehill out of the game essentially. I mean, the running game has saved them.

They've really run the ball effectively, and they've been able to control the game, and their defense hasn't played great, but it's gotten better. I think Vance Joseph has done a better job defensively. So, yeah, I give Atlanta – look, Miami could have gone in the tank and quit on them because they were some ugly losses. They should have lost to Cleveland at home. Yeah.

And they didn't. But I give them credit for that. I think they've done a better job there. And from all the teams that I've watched offensively, some of these guys are supposed to be, you know, McAdoo gets a job essentially because he's the coordinator and he's an offensive mind. They run the same plays over and over again.

Peterson, he's a cover band. He's playing all the Rolling Stone hits in a bar somewhere. And so I think that, you know, to me, at least I give Gaze credit for originality and what they're doing. Okay. Lions, they've won five games this year by two points, two points, three points, three points, and then an overtime touchdown, six points, which was their biggest win, but the game went into overtime.

They are somehow in pole position in the NFC North, and they play the Jaguars this week who are in a free fall. I just can't imagine Jim Caldwell and this Lions team in the playoffs, but somebody has to win the NFC North. Whoever wins the NFC North gets to be in the playoffs. How do we stop this? Who stops them? I don't think there's a team that's going to stop them. Here's the game they're playing this week. They're playing the Jacksonville Jaguars, who I think are 31st in the league in margin of victory. When they win games, they win it by two points. I think they're

32nd in the league. And then the 31st team in the margin of victory is your Detroit Lions. So this is two teams that are playing. And you want to say, well, Jacksonville should play better. You know, Jacksonville, when you really look at them, they play decent defense. They just can't turn the ball over. And oh, by the way, their offense is a turnover machine. So how do you ever stand behind them? And Bortles, to me, is at some point, Jacksonville's going to get off the Bortles train. They're going to have to say to themselves, you know what? We probably should have picked Garoppolo. We definitely should have picked David Carr. We might have gotten

the, you know, besides Manziel, we might have gotten the worst quarterback in this draft. And you have to have an honest conversation with yourself. Now, they won't do that, but as for Detroit, I think Ebron's played really well. I think their offense is good. Now, they're going to get better on defense because I think some of their players, Slay's coming back. They might get Levy back at some point. And their two defensive linemen, Ansu and Nada,

those should be back and healthy. So that's really going to help them. But look, Jacksonville has the potential to beat them because I don't think Detroit's very good. Jacksonville's got to wonder. Look, they signed Jared Odrick and pay him a ton of money. He gets one sack on the season. They signed Malik Jackson. He's got one and a half sacks on the season. I mean, at some point when you pay that kind of money, you want more production. Speaking of quarterbacks who they might have to turn the page on, the Texans are in a different situation because they have a chance to make the playoffs. And Osweiler was terrible yet again last week. They barely won.

Now they're in Mexico. They're playing the Raiders. If he stinks again, is this it? Is this his last stand? Would you go to Tom Savage? I would. But, I mean, look, I can't understand how Brock Osweiler—this is one of the great stories of all time. I mean, he's going to have about four homes all over the country from all the money he's been guaranteed.

And he's going to sit back and say, boy, I got him good. Yeah. You know, because, I mean, look, he's just not good at playing quarterback. He threw for 99 yards and they won the game. How is that possible? It's amazing. How is that possible? And I think Savage is the best quarterback on their roster.

I think, to be honest, and on Undisputed today I talked to him, I think they should make a play for Tony Romo when he's available next year. It would be the ideal place for him. It would be ideal for him because a lot of skilled players, Romo could come in, it's a good team with a good defense, and you could win the South, and it's not that far from Dallas. So, again, this is the hardest part of the NFL. You have to have an honest conversation.

Jacksonville won't have one about Blake Bortles, and I doubt strongly that Houston will have one about Brock Osweiler. The Chiefs last five weeks beat the Raiders by 16, beat the Saints by 6, killed the Colts and Indy by 16, a crappy game against the Jaguars, but Nick Foles was involved, came back, beat the Panthers by three in Carolina last week. Not bad.

Not a bad quintet of wins. Why don't we have them in the top tier? I think they'll win the West. I thought they'll win the West. And I think they could have a first-round bye. I do. I think this is a good team defensively. They're starting to play even better.

Defensively, they've been good. They've turned the ball over, but they're playing better on defense than they did early in the season, which was the case last year as well. I like Oakland. I think Oakland will make it, and I think there's three teams from the West that are going to make it. I think Denver will make it, only because Denver has somehow found a way to win

games that look like they have no business winning, but they do. But I think Kansas City is a tough out. Kansas City plays the kind of game like it would be basketball, where they just, they slow the game down, they run it, they convert third downs, they make enough plays to drive you crazy, and they turn the ball over. And if you're a turnover machine, like, you know, if Tampa Bay goes in there and thinks they're going to just, you know, and Jameis Winston's going to throw the ball over the lot, they're going to get in trouble. And that's why they win. They don't beat themselves, which is to me the best kind of teams. But my sleeper team, Bill, I don't know

what your notes told you at five o'clock this morning. My sleeper team is, and will be, is Baltimore Ravens. Okay. Well, you realize that means you don't have Pittsburgh in the playoffs, if that's your sleeper team. I don't. I don't. I don't. I think Pittsburgh's defense is going to be the end of the death of them. And I think losing to Miami in Miami is going to be the death of Pittsburgh. Wow. You don't have Pittsburgh in the playoffs. Well, I think three teams

from the West are going to make it, and I think Baltimore's going to win the North. Pittsburgh's 4-5 right now. They're at Cleveland this week, so that's 5-5. At Indy on a Thursday night. Can we give them that one? Alright, six and five. Home for the Giants?

They'll get that one. They'll beat the Cheesecake Factory menu. Let's face it, the Giants, and I said this on my podcast, the Giants are... Look at the numbers on the Giants. The Giants are almost like Bernie Madoff. It's a Ponzi scheme. There's no numbers that support what the Giants are, look at the numbers on the Giants. The Giants are almost like Bernie Madoff. I mean, it's a Ponzi scheme.

There's no numbers that support what the Giants are doing. There's no numbers. They're bad in almost all these categories, and they turn the ball over way too much, and they're winning games. I mean, and I think when the weather turns cold, not I think, I know, when the weather turns cold because eventually it's going to get cold in New York, you've got to run the football a little bit, and they can't do that. They are minus eight in turnovers, and they're six and three, which if that's really everything you need to know.

They're 30th in this category. They're 30th in that category. They're one of the worst first down teams in football. They can't convert third downs. I mean, there's no numbers to support six wins. There's no numbers to support them. They can pressure the QB a little bit. Beckham makes plays. Somehow they just figure out a way to make like five or six swing plays in a game, and they hang on. I don't believe in that strategy long term, but I think that's why they're 6-3. I don't think it lasts. It's a Ponzi scheme.

It's going to fall apart. All right, so wait. Hold on, though. So if Pittsburgh gets by the Giants, so you're saying that they sweep the next three, that's seven and five, then they go at Buffalo, at Cincy. Cincy's broken. I don't know if Cincy comes

back. Then they're home for the last two, Baltimore and Cleveland. So there's a road to ten and six. They could go six and one the last seven here. Possibly. Yeah, but they have to. And Baltimore, I mean, look, Baltimore's got a rough road. They have to go. They play New England at

home, and they have, obviously, Dallas this week. But Baltimore, they've got Dallas, then they've got Cincinnati and Miami at home. They go to New England. They have Philly at home, then they go to Pittsburgh and Cincinnati on the road. But the one thing about Baltimore that I like about Baltimore is their defense.

They travel well, and the weather's going to play into a factor for them. The weather will help them. I mean, you know, Cincinnati, cold weather, Andy Dalton's not going to throw the ball. They're not going to run the ball. Philly, they get all these cold-weather games. When you can play good defense, you're benefited. And for the whole month of December, they're in cold-weather games.

Miami at home, New England at home, Pittsburgh, Philly at home. I mean, New England, they're on the road. And Pittsburgh and Cincinnati, those are all cold-weather games. That's why I like them. The kicker doesn't miss kicks. He's never missed a field goal. They're good in the kicking game. They're really good on defense.

Here's an interesting stat for you. They only allow 3.3 yards of rush. And one of those rushes was an 85-yard by Crowell of the Browns in Week 2. You take that rush out of the stats, teams average under three yards of carry running the football against

them. I think they have the worst offense by DVOA. It's really a bad offense to watch. It's really bad. But they can make plays. They can make plays. They have ability to make plays.

I mean, Dennis Pitta is the only guy the quarterback trusts on the team, and he has zero touchdowns. I think we should go head-to-head for dinner, and we'll go to the Cheesecake Factory, and we'll take photos. You and me, we'll dress up Tate as Ben McAdoo in one of those Ben McAdoo outfits. The three of us will go. What I love about it, and I said this on my podcast, he's got postage notes on it. It's like, what is it, pick up Chinese on the way home?

Like, what are those postage notes? He has three pages of plays. It's passwords. Who could have three pages of plays? It's passwords for his Microsoft Surface. I mean, I don't understand it. And you know what people don't get? He's running a generic offense.

He's in the 11 personnel 95% of the time, which means he's not doing anything creative. So what does he need all those papers for? He's killed enough trees. Stop him. We've got to get the environmentalists to come out and stop him. We'll go to Cheesecake Factory. If Pittsburgh wins, the AFC North, you pay. And if Baltimore wins, I pay.

Got it. And we both pay for Tate McAdoo. Oh, absolutely. So Oakland this week in Mexico, they're favored by five and a half. They're playing Brock Osweiler, who threw for 99 yards last week. They're a borderline contender. Probably they are a contender, but I almost want to see them take care of business. Who the hell knows what's going on in Mexico?

You've been dubious to them this season as a young team. Can they handle success, all that stuff? What happens in that game? I think the bye week, you've got to wonder if they can handle that. Teams that have come off the bye haven't looked as sharp. I think the Patriots didn't look so sharp coming off the bye. I think it's been pretty much consistent because you have to get the players four days off. And it's hard to get back into the groove again.

It's like, yes, you get rested, but you're not as well-tuned for football. And Houston's coming off their bye as well, so it'll be an interesting game. Look, if the Raiders play the way and the style and the manner of which they play the Broncos at home, I think

they can beat anybody in the AFC. They should eliminate their defense, play Little League baseball for defense, play 25, 26 minutes for their defense, control the pace of the game with their offense, run the ball effectively. I think that's the right formula. I think they found their formula when they played Denver. Now they have to keep it.

Now that's not a sexy formula, but that's the one that's going to win for them. It's going to keep their defense off the field. It's going to be fascinating if they play the Patriots in a playoff game because I think they'll have over 500 yards offense, but they'll also have 15 penalties. And it's really hard to beat Belichick if you're going to have 15 to 17 penalties, which I just think that's who the Raiders are.

They're going to be the ones that shoots themselves in the foot. And it feels like it already has the makings of the classic Belichick Patriots game where you come out of it and you go, oh my God, I can't believe we won that game. How did that happen? How did we do it? They had 21 penalties. I could just see it playing out that way. I'm afraid of the Raiders. And I think the Raiders have that confidence of winning on the road, so going in there. But, again, weather is going to be a factor here. Their offensive line is big enough.

But Brady, against their defense, will be pretty disruptive. And then it's going to come down to, look, and this is why I think it's so important, weather. Third and one now is the most important down to, look, and this is why I think it's so important whether third and one now is the most important play to get you in the playoffs. You have to convert thirds and one. It's really, people don't understand. You know, you give up a third and one in the second quarter,

and you're like, damn. You know, and it comes back to haunt you. And teams that convert third and one, that's why Dallas, to me, is a huge threat. Not only one, that's one of the reasons they get all their third and ones. They're 16 for 20 on third and ones, and they've only had to throw it three times. And when you can do that, you control the game. And playoff times, it's like baseball. It's about pitching in the playoffs. Well, it's about short yardage offense when you want to reach the

playoffs. And teams that do it well always advance. Will you promise me something? If it's a Raiders-Patriots playoff game, the week of that game on like a Wednesday, you're going to come over to the office and we're going to watch the snow game from start to finish and Facebook Live it and just with the cameras on you and me during the entire snow game.

I just want to get you on camera for when it's second and two, and all you need is a first down to win the game, and the next two plays that Gruden calls. I just want to get that on camera. I want to see what your reaction is. Well, I mean, Frank Middleton went the wrong way on one of the plays, and Charlie Gardner went the wrong, I mean, it was just, uh-oh. You want me to, that cost me a year of my son Mick's education

at Fordham right there. That's one year of Fordham right now to dream. That's reliving that memory. It's horrible. We're doing it. We've got to do it. That's your worst loss, right? Did you have a worse loss with the Patriots or the Raiders?

That's your worst loss. No, my worst. The Cleveland losing to the fumble with Ernest Biner was a hard one. Although, you know, only if that game was— if Webster Slaughter clears out to the back corner of the end zone, then Jeremiah Castile's not there to make the tackle. But still, there would have been enough time for Elway to come back and score. So that was a very painful loss there. That was terrible.

You know, they're all—the loss to the Patriots, that game there, especially when I thought we won the game, I actually got yelled at by the New England press staff because once we got the fumble, I screamed yes, and there'll be no cheering in the press box. That was crazy. I still... Everyone mentions the tuck roll, and nobody mentions the kick Vinatieri made to send the game into overtime,

which was like 46 yards. It threw a blizzard. Nobody mentions that it was the first game ever. It was the first night game playoff time. Ever. Okay? Ever. And if we would have played it at 1 o'clock,

there would have been no snow on the ground. Yeah. We would have got through the end. It did not snow until we got on the start snowing, until we got on the bus from the hotel to the stadium. And then, of course, we got stuck there. We stayed. How do you like that?

You just got beat, and you have to stay. You're at Logan Airport for the next six hours waiting to get clearance to take off. We didn't. It was brutal. Do you know that I could have gone to that game and had tickets and decided not to go because of the blizzard?

And it's probably my, it's in my top three biggest fan regrets of not going to something that I have. Yeah, you probably would have been, you would have been, when we got off, when the game was over in the old stadium, you had to take a golf cart to the locker room, right? So all the Raider coaches, all of us were in that golf cart,

and all the people were just, you would have been one of those people throwing snowballs at us. Yeah. Just killing us with snowballs going down the hill. Or I would have been standing next to my buddy Jaybug going, no, no, stop. You're going to hurt somebody as he just whips snowballs at everybody. I mean, that was, what a great way to send out one of the worst stadiums of all time. It really was.

Really one of the worst stadiums anyone has ever created. All right, Mike. Oh, wait. Last quick, quick, quick question. Cardinals at Vikings. Can we write off the Vikings? I mean, Jake Long. Jake Long got hurt, and we all knew Jake Long was going to get hurt.

God rest him. God bless him. But, I mean, he just can't stay healthy. You cannot win with the tackle situations. They can't move the football effectively, and defensively it wears down on them. And I just don't think Minnesota has enough juice. I don't think they have enough gas in the tank. I think Arizona still has enough juice.

They can do it. Now, they lost their left tackle, too, and they're a problem. But when you lose your left tackle in pro football, it's hard to keep winning. It always shows up because the protections become a problem. Well, the Cards have a – their defense statistically has been surprisingly sneaky good. So who knows with them? They might make a late run too. All right.

Mike Lombardi, as always a pleasure. We'll see you on Sunday. And what's the name of your podcast? Make Me Smarter Football Podcast. All right. Tune in. All right. We'll talk to you next week.

Thanks. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. All right. We're going to call Joe House for the Callaway Part 3. But first, we launched this podcast in October 2015. MeUndies sponsored the first one. They sent me a big box of comfortable underwear.

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All right, let's go to Joe House. Last week we went 3-0. We're now one under par in the Callaway Par 3 since we teamed up together. Every week he picks one, I pick one, then we do a joint pick. I'm excited. House, try to contain yourself. Don't

shout too many stats at us. And leave a little room to talk about basketball. You go, your first pick. We're going right into the picks. My pick this week, I know that this is going to sound like a broken record. I'm going against the dead skin.

Oh, no. Why? And everybody, I'm going to be accused of the reverse jinx and all the rest of it, but I honestly am concerned about Green Bay.

I think Green Bay is very dangerous at this moment. They're 4-5 jinx and all the rest of it, but I honestly am concerned about Green Bay. I think Green Bay is very dangerous at this moment. They're 4-5 coming off of a blowout loss. That division is still very much up for grabs. History is against the Deadskins. They're 1-8-1 against the spread in this series. I went to the last time these two teams played. The Deadskins hung in there for a quarter and a half, and then Aaron Rodgers took over. So I still have the taste of that in my mouth.

The power ranking suggests the Green Bay on a neutral field. That's disgusting. The taste in your mouth? Yes. In any event, it was a bad taste. On a neutral field, Green Bay would be a two-and-a-half point favorite in this matchup.

So Green Bay, so that suggests it's kind of a pick-em game. So Green Bay getting points feels like value. I'm taking Green Bay. So Sam Shields will not play in this game, and their D-backs have been killing them all year. Clay Matthews practiced this week. Unclear if he's going to play. Like Collinsworth said on my podcast this week about no Sam Shields,

no Clay Matthews, they just can't get stops. So maybe if Matthews comes back. I don't know. I continue to think you underrate your Washington Native Americans. I just do. I think they're pretty solid. They're not going to win the Super Bowl, but they're competitive. They can throw the ball.

Who's the receiver? The Sean Jackson's out this week, right? So you have no deep threat. Jamison Crowder. I mean, that turns Jordan Reed into the deep threat. You get a Jordan Reed up the seam kind of play. Okay. All right.

For my pick, I actually like this week there's it could have gone a couple ways i was looking at titans plus three in indie i was even thinking about the saints tonight in carolina i like that extra half point i think that game's going to be close yeah i like the arizona cardinals in in Minnesota laying one point. I think that by Sunday this line goes to three. Arizona has a good defense. Surprisingly good. Shockingly good.

In DVOA, they're in the top five. David Johnson, they can run the ball with him. They need it. Every game basically is a must win for them. Minnesota needs it, but they don't really need it because it's probably going to take 8-9 wins to win that division Minnesota is in a little bit of a swoon

to say the least their last four games they lost to the Eagles 18-10 they lost to the Bears 20-10 and what we'll remember is Jay Cutler's last great moment for Chicago they lost to the

Lions in overtime and they lost to your Washington Native Americans last week 26 to 20 they are not a good football team and they cannot block and their defense is still banged up they cannot make big plays and I just think Arizona is better and I think they need it what do you think I don't have any reason to argue with you. Minnesota and Green Bay are so similar right now in terms of the swoon. And it's a little bit alarming that Detroit has the inside angle because I know that you and the Cousin Sal have a wonderful Detroit not making the playoffs thing. I hate to even bring it up to put any stink streak jinx on it,

but I understand exactly what you're doing and why you're doing it. I was so impressed by Sam Bradford, ironically, last week, because that Minnesota team has presented no reason for anybody to ever do anything to defend the run, and I actually thought that Bradford, under those circumstances, was decent. I like very much Arizona in this position as well. And this is really just a vote of confidence for Arians. I think he's kind of straightened. Things are getting straightened out there.

You know what I think position they're in now? In San Francisco, the way they played them last week, they're kind of expecting it almost. It's just run the ball and play defense. And Carson Palmer's not the same guy he was last year by any stretch. So, accept it. Just change who you are.

You've got to grind them out. These are grind them outs. And I think that's what they're going to do. This feels like a 16-13 type game for me. All right, so our third game, Lombardi poo-pooed it a tiny bit. It didn't scare me off. The Dolphins in L.A. to play the Rams. You and I are aligned on this one. This is our pick. We love the Dolphins in LA to play the Rams you and I are aligned on this one this is our pick we love the Dolphins minus two and a half I think the only reason

this line is under three is because of the Dolphins and their offensive line versus this Rams defense which can run the you know rush the passer and do some stuff there's some fear of Tannehill the thing is though Miami Miami has kind of quietly made big plays this season. They have – you missed the story about how I got up at 4.30 in the morning because our daughter decided the hallway light wasn't on and came into our room to tell us. Oh, my gosh. So I was up doing research.

Miami has eight 40- plays this season like they they kind of the new running back Joseph Ajay yeah how many of those were Ajay runs I don't know but he makes plays he moves the chains and Tannehill looked really good this week and maybe Adam Gase is half decent

and maybe their defense isn't bad I don't know what to make of Miami but I know that the Rams are terrible and I know that those games have no atmosphere and Miami likes playing on the road and I think we're in good shape with this one. Well, here's the most underrated thing.

I wish we could have bet on this before. You just went through a whole analysis of this Miami Rams game without once mentoring the quarterback for the Los Angeles Rams this week. That is the most compelling piece of information about this story. My main man, former Ram Eric Dickerson, gave Goff a D for his preseason performance this season. I think that's generous.

Felt very close to F to me. Felt like a big fail. And his performance on Hard Knocks did not help matters any. I did not feel like I would be going to him for financial advice or for strategic advice or for really advice on

anything having to do with anything important in life at this stage. I hope that the past 10 weeks of him sitting on the bench and watching Case Keenum manage his way down the field has been helpful to him, but I have no confidence that's the case.

I think it's an insult to game managers to call Case Keenum a game manager. Well, he's a poor man. I mean, I don't even know what... You know what he is? He's the man who receives hikes from the center and either hands off or throws.

He's not a game manager. He's superior to Fitzpatrick. He's not actively causing them to lose games. Well, not every week, but some weeks he has. Some weeks, yeah. He had that four-pick week. Yeah, I think we're in pretty good shape with this. Yeah, I like this one.

The power rankings have Miami on a neutral field as three points better. What does the LA Coliseum, if not a neutral field? This is exactly the right line, and I love Miami. Well, the word's already out that it's not fun to go to the games, so I'll be interested to see how quote-unquote filled it is this week.

It's really hard to get in. It's really hard to get out. You can't get an Uber. You bake in the sun. Now, it might not be hot this weekend, but if it's like 75 to 80, the word is out. Do not bake like a fried egg in the Coliseum for three and a half hours. Tate, you haven't been to a Rams game, right?

Yeah, I went to Panthers. Was it miserable? Oh, I was in the shade, thank God. Oh, Tate was in the shade. People were sweating. People were sweating. They ran out of water, all that stuff. Yelling at Lyft drivers.

All right, so our three picks. You have the Packers plus two and a half in Washington. That's our first one. We have combined on the Dolphins minus two and a half in L.A. And then the Cards minus one in Minnesota. I like week 11. Historically, one of my favorite weeks to pick games. I feel like we have enough statistical evidence

on most of these teams and it gets a little less wonky and there's been enough practice time, all that stuff. All right, very important house. Cheeseburgers. We've been having a big argument in the ringer office about whether in and out is good or not i am this is one of my all-time corners i will die on this hill i just don't think in and out is very good i'm sorry i just don't i don't get it i came out here in 2002 actually it's my fourth yesterday's my 14year anniversary of the day I came out to Los Angeles

to live here, and I was terrified. And now I've been here 14 years. One of the first things I did was I went to In-N-Out. The legend of In-N-Out. Oh my God, this is going to be amazing. It was alright. It was fine.

I was so worried. I thought when you said, I'm prepared to die on this hill, I was going to have to proclaim and declare that you're dead because I thought you were going to go all the way up to the very top of In-N-Out Mountain and claim that In-N-Out was good. It's not good. Not only is it not that good, I just don't get it.

I don't understand it. I don't understand why people get passionate about it. I don't understand. It's sentimental is what why people get passionate about it. I don't understand... It's sentimental is what it is. It's sentimental. People wait... It was a departure from an era of truly inauthentic fast food. heyday in the late 70s, early 80s of essentially styrofoam food, In-N-Out took a slightly different path. And the food is slightly more authentic than what we grew up with, the fastest of fast foods. But it's nowhere near, it's not even worth, it's an insult to many, many fine burger-making institutions

in this day and age to mention In-N-Out for any other reason than sentimentality. It's worse than that, because you don't live here. And, you know, my daughter, her team used to practice at Hollywood High, and there's an In-N-Out right next to hollywood high on orange and to get there you know you'd have to go down the street that the in and out was on and the line would not only be all the way to the end of the drive-through but it would actually like lean out onto the street and it was like this traffic quagmire and i'm thinking like these people are waiting 20 minutes to get an In-N-Out cheeseburger. I don't understand. I wouldn't wait three minutes. Here, like Shake Shack

just came here on Hollywood Boulevard. Oh. Oh. Oh. Five guys. Now you're talking. Now we're talking about a cheeseburger, brother. Five guys is on Wilshire.

The ringer staff went insane that i thought five guys was better than in and out it was like i committed here like are you crazy five guys is better it is better i'll tell you another thing i think fat burgers is better i'd rather have a fat burger i'd rather have a fat burger than an out burger and not to mention original tommy's which i've never taken you to i'll tell tell you this. Oh, how dare you? For 10 years you've been there. 13 years. No Fat Tommy's in my life.

14 years. Original Tommy's is better. Yeah, I want some of that. All right, I'm glad. I'm glad you agree with me on this, because I thought I was crazy, and there's some sort of cult of In-N-Out Burger. And unfortunately, I don't have to drive to the Hollywood high practice anymore and sit and watch the In-N-Out people because we're not allowed to practice on that field anymore because there's this crazy girls soccer inequity thing that happens in L.A. that I just don't understand that I might actually have to mobilize and start doing something about. The boys get all the good fields, the preferential fields. They have 90 percent of the academy status for teams.

You've been talking about this. This is your corner. It's insane to me. I don't understand it. It's 2016. I thought men and women and boys and girls were supposed to be equal. And yet in soccer, not even close. It's like the 1950s.

I'm trying to figure out what to do. This might be another hill I die on. Equality for soccer practice fields in California. I don't understand it. It's amazing. It's like the boys are more important. Really? The boys are more important? Our men's national team sucks.

Our women's team is a hundred times better and more popular. People like it more. Why don't we care about girls soccer in America? This is going to be one of my passion projects. This is going to be like when John McPhee started writing about rocks. This is going to be big. Remember when Simmons lost his mind about

girls soccer and then he just devoted his life to it? That's going to be me in two years. Abby Wambach was one of the very best guests on any given Wednesday. R.I.P. She was tremendous. I you know, they're on that corner with you. That's a pretty formidable team, Simmons and Wambach, doing the equity for girls soccer thing.

I mean, I support it. And what's interesting is it's not even just the youth soccer. Then you go to, like, the pros, and, like, the women had to play on turf for the World Cup, which they were like, we don't want to play on turf. They made them do it anyway. They couldn't mobilize. They couldn't put grass. It would cost a certain amount.

They didn't care. The pro league, it makes a little more sense because at some point it's economic. Brian Curtis is here, by the way. He joined us. Hey. So, yeah, remember the Women's pro soccer league and hope solo took all those pictures of how terrible the field was right and people were like oh that's terrible on the other hand it is a business and if people don't want to pay to watch you play then it's

not like you can have the same facilities and travel as the men's teams i kind of get that what i don't understand is when it trickles down to the youth level and the boys get all the preferential treatment. That seems weird. It's crazy to me. You have a daughter. Yeah, I do. Do you want to live in a world where your daughter has inferior soccer fields?

That's not a world I want to live in, no. I can't even contemplate that world. House doesn't care. House only has a son. He's like, hey, it's great for my kid. Yeah, as long as there's a burger place down the street, right? No, he doesn't play soccer, so I don't care. House doesn't care about soccer in general.

This is where House and I fall apart as friends. Do you have a take on In-N-Out Burger, Curtis? Yeah, so I was listening to that. Yeah. I do love Five Guys. I feel you can only kind of do it once per year because it just messes you up in a spectacular way. It's like going to Austin and eating barbecue or something where you're not the same for like 12 hours.

Right. And I wish I had a higher tone, but there's an Arby's right next to the Ringer HQ here in Los Angeles. And it's right before I get onto the freeway when I'm contemplating this giant drive. And it's like my drug dealer, you know, you just, you drive by that one corner. Oh my God. If he weren't, oh no, the drug dealer. It's like the drug dealer sold cheese whiz and onion rolls.

Right. There's the meat. Yeah. I think there's Arby's gyro sauce all over my steering wheel from last week right now. I'm just happy to admit that. How should I? We drove to Vegas once and there's a stop in Vegas and it's basically the last place you can stop for two. It's like about an hour and a half from LA toward Vegas.

And there's this one stop. It's got a bunch of restaurants and gas stations. And then that's it. It's like you're just driving for the next two hours. And we stopped at Arby's. I don't remember what year this was, House. I think Jacko was with us. It might have been the year of my bachelor party.

Yeah, what was interesting was I was worried about you getting in trouble at like a gentleman's club or something, but it ended up you made love to the Arby's. You made love to like 17 Arby's sandwiches. I've never seen him enjoy it more, and we just were driving for an hour. His house just continued at the Arby's. Arby's is delicious.

That really is the new adultery for us married men. I always tell my wife, I'm not going to wake up with anything in my bed when I'm on the road except a pizza box. Right. That's the moment.

That's where I've cheated. Cheating with bad food? Well, House is a serial adulterer with bad food. I really, I've been, it's been a long time too. 20 years, 25 years.

I'm an addict. There's now a bad food comeback. Yes. It's been glamorized. Yeah, there's been a backlash against eating healthy, and now you're seeing Twinkies. They've redone Twinkies. The deep-fried Twinkies.

Yeah, the pizzas. Everybody's going in. At ballparks, right? The biggest thing to sell is that terrible state fair food. Now it's at ballparks, right? You get the three-foot-long hot dog dog and you parade it around. Look at me. I did it. Did you think the Dodger dog was underrated, overrated,

or properly rated? I haven't had it in long enough to remember. Underrated. It's kind of underrated. Is it? Yeah, it's pretty good. I've got to rediscover it. It's good. I expressed lust. My golf podcast partner, Jeff Shackleford, big Dodgers fan, was tweeting at me while he was at the Nats Dodgers

playoff series. And I was saying that I, yeah, the Dodger dog, God, I wanted a Dodger dog. I was rooting for the Nats, but I really wanted a Dodger dog.

Well, friend of the BS podcast, David Chang, one of his passions is to have good stadium food. And he has this MSG. What is it? Chicken, I think he has at MSG, like a chicken or something. And it's apparently outstanding.

It's like at Staples Center. They just won't commit to just better food and service. It's terrible. It's just mystifying to me. It's like a bad airport. You walk in and it's like, oh, McDonald's is here. Why do I want mcdonald's at the stadium you know and pretzels yeah and they have like one chicken place and they have

like one kind of healthy place that has salad and for some reason sushi and all the workers go super slow so like it's halftime you have 15 minutes and it's taking they're taking five minutes to get a coke and it's it should be fantastic. There are many, many, many bad things that one can say about the Washington professional basketball team here. But I will say that the team is collaborating with local hero chef,

Jose Andres, on some exquisite and innovative Andres-type cuisine. And you can get Chick-fil-A on the concourse. Oh, Chick-fil-A on the concourse is huge. That's actually much more important. Yeah,

that's big. That would change the Staples Center. We were talking about, uh, we were to meet in the office yesterday talking about the death of the soft pretzel. Ooh. When I started going to Clipper games,

there was a Wetzel's pretzel stand and it was always 30, 30, 35 people deep at halftime every game and now it's like you just walk right up and get one really get the pretzels with the sugar on it yeah because it's like that's there's this whole all these gluten things that everybody is now they have like the scarlet letter on them and i think soft pretzels is right up there and they haven't had their moment right cheeseburgers have had their moment meatballs have had to come back right barbecue yeah the pretzel has never really been reinvented i don't know how you reinvented had their moment, right? Yeah. Cheeseburgers have had their moment. Meatballs have had to come back, right? Barbecue.

Yeah. But the pretzel's never really been reinvented. I don't know how you reinvented it. It's just dough with some stale salt on it. Well, look, I have to go, and I have a very quick aside to Brian Curtis. I still just hate the Dallas Cowboys. I can't hate them anymore. It's in my DNA.

I mean, this Thanksgiving game, I'm going to eat so much that I'm ambivalent about the outcome, but goddamn, the Cowboys are good. I hate that. It really hurts my heart. Speaking of reinventing, I have a very quick observation to make about reinventing your golf wedges. Tour-level wedge customization, Callaway Customs, at CallawayGolf.com.

Have them ship for free using promo code HOUSE. And on that note, HOUSE out. Wait, hold on, HOUSE. One more thing. I'm here. I'm here. We're doing the Callaway Par 3 on Monday next week, and we're picking the three Thanksgiving games. Oh, spectacular.

So I'm going to have the Cuzz on Monday, and then we're going to call you the last 15 minutes, and we're doing those three games. So start thinking about them now. Oh, me, you, and the cuz together? Yeah. We're doing all of them. I'll try and keep my hands out of my pants. Okay.

Joe House, thanks as always. All right, fellas. See ya. All right. We're going to talk to Curtis about the Cowboys, but before we do that, I started using Lyft after they made a deal with LAX. Just download the app.

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People are actually getting rid of their cars and relying on Lyft to get around. And you know what? I don't blame them. Right now, Lyft is offering our listeners a special deal. Get three free rides up to $10 each. That's a $30 value up to, when you enter promo code, Bill Simmons. That happens to be my name. Again, up to a $30 value up to when you enter promo code bill simmons that happens to be my name again up to a $30 value download the free lift app today promo code bill simmons in the payment section three free rides for up to ten dollars each what do you have to lose all right brian curtis editor

at large at the ringer did a lot of political duty for us the last month or so who was writing on deadlines you loved it it's amazing i felt like uh jack germond you know where i was just getting i got another column gotta get you can build some more political cops some more political news you know put on a fedora head down to the pub have a drink come back right get drunk with jfk on the airplane and help him into his car it was i, it's a once in a lifetime, kind of three months of content for everybody. It really was. I don't even, I'm still kind of recovering.

I think our office is recovering. And it's important to know that we didn't expect this. In fact, I wrote a memo to the ringer, which I'll save forever, saying how boring this election was going to be because it was going to be Hillary versus Jeb or Hillary versus Rubio. And it'd be like 2000 pre-recount. we'd all slog to the end and feel so bored well

that didn't happen it totally changed kind of what our vision for year one was of the site it was supposed to be sports and pop culture and tech and like a whiff of politics and in the in those last four weeks coming up it's like how did you read about anything else oh yeah i don't i don't even know if we had enough politics by early summer it was kind of like i think i think trump's the story i don't think the chicago cubs is the story i think trump's the story it's a man the poor cubs they finally had their moment they was irrelevant in like three days erased unbelievable and now the cowboys are having their moment oh my god perfectly situated we should mention you're from texas i am where'd you grow up fort worth Unplaced. Isn't that funny? And now the Cowboys are having their moment. Oh, my God. Perfectly situated.

We should mention you're from Texas. I am. Where'd you grow up? Fort Worth. Fort Worth. Dallas Cowboy Country. Convenient 15 minutes from the current Cowboy Stadium. We're going to have you on the podcast at another time to talk about how dumb it is

that the Rangers want to build another stadium. Did that get voted down yet? It passed. I got bad news for you. It passed? Yes. Oh, my God god it's amazing when did you build the last one 94 this is the dumbest thing that's ever happened how do owners get away

with this it's just it's unbelievable i was just i had just gotten used to the new one because i grew up in the in the first one right stadium and it had just kind of gotten lived into me yeah and now it's gonna be gone wait what i and it was like one of it was on the forefront of the new state-of-the-art baseball stadiums it was a son of camden yards son of camden yards yeah with a lot of fake history because it was in arlington texas right right i remember they had a sign that said hit it here and win a free suit it's like i don't remember what's having haberdashers in arlington when I grew up. I think that was part of the scene. Fake history.

Right next to six flags. Yeah. All I remember about the Red Sox playing Texas when I was a kid was just the announcers just talking about how hot it was. Because somehow we would always play there in July and August. We'd be like, it's hot one today. It's 118 degrees. Right. And this was the cell for this new Dome Stadium, right?

It's like, oh, it's blistering heat during the summer. It's like, yes, you live in Texas, byas right away glad you noticed yeah so that was the cell it was just like we roof air conditioning it's too hot now more people will be able to come to games and it is really hot it is hot and those day games like opening day even in april yeah there was some there were some scorchers yeah but so i could see it but why not have the dome in 1994? So I guess we should blame those people. 1972, when they moved to Arlington, right? Right. Didn't George Bush own the team?

He did. He did. So we can add this to the list for George Bush for getting to put a dome on the 94 baseball stadium? This is like number 101 on the George Bush downside list. Didn't build a dome when he had a chance. Didn't quite crack the top 80. No. So when is this dome thing

getting built? I don't know. Next couple of years. We got a couple of years to say goodbye. I can't wait to go say goodbye. This is not a goodbye I was expecting to say.

Right? We were all talking about Tony Romo goodbye. I think we're in. I didn't think it was going to be ballpark goodbye. I wonder if part of it is that the Dallas Cowboys

stadium is so cool and the mavericks have their little state-of-the-art nba arena for them it's almost state-of-the-art mostly i'm sure cuban will blow it up and build another one soon but yeah and then you have this baseball stadium that's kind of the ugly brother and it's literally across the parking lot from the cowboy stadium yeah so you see it and you say oh that red brick looks really cool yeah but then your eyes just go go to the big thing right yeah never mind let's let's look at the cowboy stadium so the cowboys wow are you all in now i'm all in you've been writing about them for the ringer every every sunday you kind of fall into it you're like i'm not gonna do it this week and then

something happens you gotta do it again how could i not how can you not i'm not right about that steelers game it was amazing didn. It was a great game. Didn't that feel like something out of the time machine from the 70s? It's great. And not just the fact that it was Cowboy Steelers, but the fact that just the quality of light, like the darkness seeping into the field. They were using a little old NFL Films music on Fox's air outros and stuff like that. And I felt like, I was like, this just feels like from a different time.

The uniforms. Also, the NFL's back, right? It just felt like the election's over and now, oh, a big NFL game that everybody's going to watch. Yeah. Three touchdowns in the last two minutes. It was a whole day of it. It was amazing. Elliott is fantastic to watch.

Prescott's been really fun. I mean, it's fun to watch a really poised rookie QB. The Romo storyline's amazing. The Jones luxury box shots. Dez has been relatively quiet yeah for him you know he'll be heard from absolutely and uh and they're clearly the best team in the nfc east i don't see where this gets derailed unless uh poor thanks for the jinx well unless uh poor prescott unless romo jinxed him with that press conference, or if the Elliott thing becomes a thing, this story.

Prescott will have a bad game, right? He's got it. I mean, I'm just waiting. Every Ricky QB has. And I just, every week I circled the next week. So, okay, Steelers not anywhere. So now Ravens, on the road, coming off a big win, right? Team that's not great, but that's very dangerous.

It happened to Brady. I can't remember what week it was. And it was somewhere between his fourth and eighth start. He just stunk. And I think he had like three or four picks. And he just stunk. And that was it. But there was one time when he just didn't have it.

Right. And it's going to happen. It's going to happen. It's going to happen. And Elliot's going to have the two fumble game. You know, where he has a nice little, you know, 85, 95 yard day and fumbles twice. I don't know. Nobody touches him ever.

I don't know. He'd have to hit his knee on the ball or something. He's like Emmett too. He really reminds me of Emmett. Yeah. I'm wary of any comparisons to the 90s Cowboys because that was just a different thing. Yeah. But the way he doesn't seem to be, all of a sudden it's a one yard game that turns into

a six yard game. Yeah. And that sort of run to daylight at the end of the Steelers game game Emmett did that a billion times where he just didn't seem to be touched he was just gone yeah you know it wasn't like a Barry Sanders move back but he just hit the hole and he was just he was he was it was and he always got four yards yeah and also the way he's like young Emmett he sees the safety and he lowers his head it's like I want the safety right I'm taking this guy yeah yeah old Emmmet was just like uh sideline see you later right preserve the body but elliot went for it elliot's still in that i'm gonna play a million

years mode which is really exciting so adorable and cute it is it's terrible it kind of sad when they finally realize like oh this is stupid right when we meet 50 year old zeke elliot and we kind of go oh god you know what the basketball equivalent is is the guy in the layup line who's doing like crazy dunks. The first three years of Blake Griffin, he's doing a slam dunk contest. And then by year five, they're like, oh, yeah, I only have so many dunks at my knees. And then it's over. They start looking around at old Kevin Garnett and people like that.

Why was they wasting him on the layup line? Yeah, what am I doing? But it's always adorable when they waste him. So just quick tangent yeah i didn't have a column from like 93 to 97 maybe 92 tonight i graduated college 92 yeah five five years i didn't have a column my my number one non-boston argument to get into at bars with my friends anything was emmett smith first barry sanders i loved emmett smith i was i just didn't understand how it was an argument non-Boston argument to get into at bars or with my friends, anything, was Emmitt Smith versus Barry Sanders. I loved Emmitt Smith. I just didn't understand how it was an argument. Barry Sanders

to me was the king of the 75-yard run and then getting stuffed for two yards on the next 25 runs. I was like, just give me the guy who runs for four yards every time and occasionally breaks the 20-yarder. Totally. And also, what was the game against the Niners? The separated shoulder? You rushed for like 130 yards? I think it was the Giants. Or the 20-yarder. Totally. And also, what was the game against the Niners? The separated shoulder?

He rushed for like 130 yards. I think it was the Giants. Or the Giants, yeah. John Madden came down to the locker room and said, that's the bravest thing I've ever seen after the game. Amazing moment. Emmitt was unbelievable. And he's a victim of how bad he was on TV afterwards.

Whereas Barkley is the flip side of it. Barkley was so good on TV after that. It's kind of elevated where he was as a player, where it was really like, you know, Barkley is one of the 20 best players ever, but it's kept him relevant as how great he was. Whereas Emmett,

it's gone the opposite way. And I think Emmett's just, people don't even think about him anymore. They really both suffered too when they retired because everybody remembered Barry for the 97 yard, you you know amazing run and going outside and video games and they they sort of falsely remembered emmett as oh he just got four yards a carry and just played forever yeah like they kind of hank erin ended up the cardinal hank erin him at the end yeah which was also unfair to hank by the way right right they're like oh you know he was just like this guy who

had a great offensive line. He ran five yards and fell down. No, no, that's not what Emmitt Smith was at all. No. And the way he made people miss inside the tackles was incredible. You're right. It's like an underrated sports argument of the 90s. People forget about that.

I think it was the number one argument. And every year they exchanged rushing titles. You know, Barry got hurt one year, and then he was way ahead, and then he got hurt, and Emmitt it was it was it was a nice little argument and the other part that helped barry was video games really took off super tecmo which we actually wrote about in the ringer this week was i think 92 but then madden kind of kicked in somewhere in 94 95 96 range and sanders was a god and he was one of the first gods emmett was great in madden but it wasn't like he wanted to be barry sanders and i think that really helped barry say there was a

mystique with barry sanders yeah i don't ever remember being in a video game he wouldn't have been that exciting and i was the biggest fan there was right so yeah that was one i'm trying to think what what were the other great pre-internet basketball arguments? I guess like Jordan versus Wilt was huge for years. I remember. Yeah, that was a good one. Carl Malone. It was like sports radio, early 90s sports radio. You'd get that like once a week.

Carl Malone won the MVP over Jordan right before the internet started going. That's one that would have. There's no way he wins the MVP if the internet is rounded into shape. Yeah. And is at the right level that's funny there's no way we block that the true squad would have been like no no no i wrote about it in my book it started with like this jackie mcmullen sports illustrated piece in march it just got momentum and i didn't have a column and i'm like wait a second are we not going to vote for michael jordan for the mvp he's going to win 69 games what's happening? He's the best player.

And then he just laid the smack down in the finals. I mean, an SI piece could move the world like that. Yeah. That was probably the last one or one of the last ones that the internet kind of took over. There was, to tie it to the Cowboys, there was a Tony Romo cover story a couple years ago, though, that I think really turned people on Romo in a good way. You know, right before, I think it was 2014, right before it was i think 2014 right before you had that really his last did you agree season man that's well it's true 2014 was his last good season did you think

he did the right thing with the press conference i don't know if he did the right thing he did what i thought was a wildly magnanimous thing yeah it was our it was our second peaceful transfer of power this week somebody people put it on Twitter, right? That's funny. Obama to Trump and Tony to Dak. It's funny. So here's the thing about Romo. Remember that comment years ago when he lost the playoff game and he said, it's not the worst thing that's ever going to happen in my life.

Yeah. After the game. Everybody took that personally. They killed him. And it was totally unfair because, of course, the sports writer is wrong and Tony Romo is right. He's going to have a long, interesting life, we hope. And football games will not be the be all end all right but Peyton Manning never would have said that and Tom Brady never would have said that and it tells you something about the way football is situated in Tony Romo's life and I don't believe Peyton would have given that statement right they wouldn't were Brett Favre they would have raged against it and they

would have gone to another team. And I think there's a, Peter King said this this week, I think there's a scenario where Tony just maybe retires even. He's just, football to him, and I don't say this critically, I admire him as a human for this. Football to him, I don't think, is in the same place it is with a lot of top-tier quarterbacks. Well, he also has the security blanket

of making eight million dollars a year on tv absolutely as soon as you cannot underestimate any network takes him right now and it's his pick of jobs it's like do you want to be our number one game analyst do you want to do studio once a week what do you want to do you tell us here's a big fat check yeah and that's i'm sure he's got to be thinking like physically he's you know he's fucked up he's got a herniated disc that has allegedly healed i don't think those things ever heal no i think they get better and more manageable i don't think they heal and if he'd been the only guy there with the cowboys in a way it's a relief that you can walk away and say oh dax got this right yeah if you were the only one there you'd kind of have to keep coming

back right because you'd be letting have to keep coming back, right? Because you'd be letting your teammates down. So Sal and Jimmy are friends with him, and we hung out in January, and I never spent any time with him. And he was as good of a hang as you'd think, and was just really fun to hang out with and talk football with. But he was so bummed out that he had gotten hurt the previous season because he really felt like that was a good team. And he was just like, that might have been my chance to win a Super Bowl.

And it went up in smoke. And it was genuine. He wasn't like, ah, it would have been fun to go. He was just like, I think about it every day. That was like, if I hadn't gotten hurt, I think we win. I think we get there. So now you have this team. There's an even better chance.

And I don't know, man. There's no way for us to understand what that feeling's like. No. And that argues against what I'm saying a little bit. But I think you do feel like you let everybody down in a way. Yeah. I'm sure he feels like that. He didn't. Didn't do anything wrong, but I'm sure he feels like that.

Do we want to get into conspiracy Curtis here about the way the Cowboys felt about it? You know I love conspiracies. There's conspiracy Bill. All times. Conspiracy Bill's illegitimate. Conspiracy Curtis. His uncle from Texas. His bastard son, yeah.

Are we sure, are we absolutely sure the Cowboys locker room loved Tony Romo pre-DAC? Or are we sure that they were really close to Tony Romo? Is it weird when Troy Aikman goes on broadcast like he did this week and says, you know, I'd be real careful about taking Dak Prescott out of the lineup. I'd be real careful about that. Wink, wink, wink. Yeah, Troy Aikman, who never really says anything that controversial. He feels like he knows something.

Ed Werder had a report. Troy Aikman knows everything. He's wired in. Ed Werder had this report. It said there might be a revolt in the locker room if they took Dak out. This was, of course, before the Steelers game when this was still an idea. Of course, he wouldn't do it now. I just wonder.

And there's a couple good reasons for this.ony is a lot older than almost everybody in the locker room now he's like about 10 years older right he's new quarterback comes in he spreads the ball around in a different way so he makes cole beasley is suddenly a big star he wasn't a big star he dropped balls all over the place he loves dac prescott i don't think tony romo trusts him so yeah there's like this kind of thing but i just wonder, you haven't seen an up note. Where's the guy who goes and says, you know what? Tony Romo was the face of this franchise for 10 years. This guy was our guy.

Who's pounding on the table for that? It's been kind of interesting how you haven't really seen it. And again, I'm not saying there was like some, they hated him or anything like that. I just wonder how close he was to those guys the last couple of years. This is something Collinsworth mentioned when we did the podcast this week about aaron rogers and how he's like 10 years older than the guys he's playing with at receiver and he makes way more money than them and i think the romo thing's an even better example because he goes on vacation with the coach every year yeah he makes a ton of money he's 10 12 years older than cole beasley and ezekiel elliott and these guys yeah

and i don't know maybe maybe they feel like dax more than this happened with brady and bledsoe to some degree brady was like the young guy who was you know he made friends with all the offensive linemen and he was going out in boston and you know i do think that that counts yeah and i think that's one of the things we're going to find out after when Tony plays for the Broncos next year. It's going to be a classic sports writing. We love these. Now they tell us, you know. Oklahoma City was the master.

Yeah. But, you know, he really wasn't this close to the team the last couple. Oh, now you tell us. Yeah, Durant and Westbrook. They're not friends at all. No. Wait a minute. Why do you think?

Yeah. I mean, you're probably my number one sports media whisperer. I don't want to say expert. It belittles your feel for this stuff. Whisperer is good. Whisperer is good. Why do you think these guys are so afraid to spill the dirt until after they leave? Is it just they don't want to run into the person?

There's less repercussions if it's after the person leaves? I think that's part of it. I also think fans don't really want to read it yet. You know? There's this funny thing where when everything's going well, fans will tell the sports writer, can't you just enjoy it? Can't you just let us enjoy it? Right.

And as soon as things go upside down, then they go to the same sports writer and go, why aren't you just let us enjoy it right and as soon as things go upside down then they totally they go to the same sports right and go why aren't you doing your job why aren't you asking the follow-up questions of the press guy this is like they want some a totally different product yeah and i do believe whether it's oklahoma city with dallas wherever they like when soon as that guy leaves they actually want the nest you know they want the the nasty stuff that's what they crave right they don't want out he was a great teammate the whole time he was here. We just love him. I hate that he left.

I always respected Michael Hawley, who covered the Celtics during one of the first Patino years for the Boston Globe. He was young, pretty much the same age as the guys he was covering and really had good sources. And it was like Antoine was on that team and Ron Mercer and Bruce Bowen, all these guys. And he wrote this piece. And Patino was was still there all these guys were still there and he wrote this piece like a behind the scenes the season how the how it was basically about why the players kind of quit on patino this season with all these inside anecdotes and it's the kind of piece that now when they're get when they get written it's after patino gets fired right this was written when he was still there. And Michael Hawley had to see him like a week later.

And it was like, I wonder if that era is kind of over. Yeah. You still see him every once in a while. Well, now you see him like that weird piece that ran about the Warriors and Draymond, which I didn't totally understand. Yeah. You'll see the occasional anvil drop, right? Yeah, and it almost seems when it happens, it almost seems like the reporter's going,

I don't have the same connections anymore. I might as well. I was saving this for later, but now I've lost this guy, this guy. I'm not saying that happened with the Warriors piece, but I always feel like there's always an extra reason for it. Right. This is the puzzle of insiderdom, right? We don't know.

Yeah, we never know. We don't know or we think we know. But the connection is so deep. And the reporter is saying, well, here's my move. I'm only going to write this kind of piece about this guy. But if this guy hates that guy, maybe I'll write a different piece piece about that guy and it's all very hard to sort of puzzle out you need to be like a criminologist to understand well a lot of times the franchises butter up the younger reporters i don't think there's any question yeah well it depends on the franchise yeah yeah i think nba nba seems pretty

bleak true you know nba's gotten nba's gotten bad, I think. Yeah, that's a whole other, we should devote another podcast to that. But yeah, to the sense anybody gets buttered up anymore. I guess it's the younger guys, right? Or maybe it's the blogger, you know, who's kind of like, who doesn't want to, you know, he's doing a little bit different thing than the columnist, right? He wants to understand the team. He wants to kind of talk about what they're doing. I don't know if the access is nearly the same as it was even 10 years ago much less 20 years ago where it's like

even if you're hanging around like let's say you're hanging around okc right now it's not like you can go up to russ at his locker and get 15 minutes in private just you and him no it's it's that's good that era's gone the big the big people do right i was in the lakers locker room the other day just kind of hanging around and um you know everybody does the scrum right we get we get to it was it was after the warriors game we get to rant and we get you know a few minutes with steph curry and then and then they're kind of shooing everybody out of the locker room you look behind you and ramona is with durant and jay adande is with draymond right and good for them by the way i don't i'm not saying that i I mean, that's great. Yeah.

They earned it. I'm envious, but that's what it is. And they're kind of having the private chat, right? But everybody else is going out. Ramona is the best I've ever seen at it.

Yeah. She's so good at it. The way she collected really good sources over the last six years was awesome. I feel that there's that reporter too that you just see you look around like what are they doing here my best experience of this

ever is like magazine once sent me to go to phil sims's house in new jersey yeah to do like a little x's and o's thing very harmless little piece i get that's kind of fun i'm not a phil sims fan that's kind of fun i walk as a player i mean i walk into his house i get into his living room and peter king was sitting there it's like peter king scooped me he lived there i didn't even know this was a competition yeah like peter king was on the couch literally and i said what are you doing here it's like i live here what are you talking about everywhere right this is one of my locations we uh we unfortunately have to go but let's let's continue this another time because I think talking about NBA media access

we should just do a whole podcast and call a couple people and get thoughts on things there we go thanks to stamps.com stop relying on the post office just buy and print official US postage using your own computer and printer sign up for stamps.com use promo code BS for a four week trial plus a $110 bonus offer

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thanks to Brian Curtis and thanks to theringer.com check out the Ringer podcast network do you have any pieces coming up? I've got a few

alright I don't want to jinx it oh yeah no teases alright what was your favorite Ringer piece you've written so far? Joe Buck was fun yeah I've got a few. All right. I don't want to jinx it. Oh, yeah. You don't want to. No, Jesus. All right. What was your favorite ringer piece you've written so far? Joe Buck was fun.

Yeah. You got in early on the Joe Buck. Joe Buck's done a lot of media since. We got the first stab. I missed a few revelations. Yeah. I got most of the story. You didn't know we had seven left. I didn't.

Yeah, that was good. I thought I'd squeeze that orange dry. All right. Brian Curtis, thank you. All right. Brian Curtis. Thank you, Tate. Thank you. And, uh,

we'll be back on Monday and check out the last two. We did two other podcasts this week. So check those out too. Enjoy the weekend. Thank you. I don't have a few years with him on the wayside

I'm a person I never was I don't have a few years