The Bill Simmons Podcast - Ep. 172: Emergency Super Bowl Pod With Mike Lombardi, Cousin Sal, and Bill's Dad

Episode Date: February 6, 2017

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Mike Lombardi to break down the Patriots' incredible comeback and pinpoint where the momentum shifted (01:50). Then, Cousin Sal calls in to discuss how some outrageous prop bets paid off (27:55). Finally, Bill calls his dad to describe just how important this victory is to Boston (59:50). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Go there and check out all the written audio and video content that we did before, during, and after Super Bowl 51. And finally, we're brought to you by the heart medication that my dad took with about two minutes left in the fourth quarter of Super Bowl 51. I do not know the brand. I just know he took them. And he just said, don't judge me. All right, let's start the podcast. All right. It is Sunday night.

We rarely do this. Thanks to Jim Cunningham, one of our ringer producers, for coming in on very short notice. But we figured it was probably one of the three or four greatest football games professional ever played. One of the great comebacks in the history of sports. And maybe the worst football loss of all time. But we're going to talk about that later with Cousin Sal. We're going to call my dad, who's still in a puddle on my couch. And right now we're going to talk to the ringers, Mike Lombardi, who worked for Bill Belichick, both in Cleveland and in New England.

Did you ever give up? At 28-3, did you give up? Oh, you know, the game was so unpatriot-like. I mean, it was just so unpatriot-like. I mean, it was just so unpatriot-like. They were doing things that you didn't expect. I mean, first play of the game was the same play that Denver ran against us two years ago in the snow game in the overtime loss. You know, they busted for 40. And then they never got it fixed again. And it just didn't seem like, and then no receivers for the Patriots seemed to come down with any of those contested balls.

And it was one of those games where you just looked at the scoreboard and you thought, well, if Atlanta just keeps trying to score, how do they close this gap? Right. I was actually, when they did the onside kick, I thought it was when it was 28. I thought it was a mistake. I thought it was a little too early to do that. I thought it was the opposite. I was like, it's 28 to 9.

Might as well do the onside kick, hope we get it, because we've shown no signs whatsoever of stopping this Falcons team. I'm with you, though, in that first half. It was such an unpatriots-like. The coaching was off. It felt like the Falcons were better prepared. I had no idea why we weren't spreading them and doing basically the pass offense that they did in the second half.

The Falcons seemed faster. The Patriots seemed completely unprepared for those plays that you wrote about on the ringer this week, those little edge runs. Once they decided that they had to double Julio, it seemed like the whole field was open. And I just couldn't figure out. Even the special teams was a mess. That was about the worst half i've ever seen from bill belichick team right down in the pick six right i mean that was like a rookie throw by brady yeah i know he you know he everybody said well he got fooled in the coverage i don't

think he did i mean he saw it was one lurk he saw the guy coming down i think he just felt like he could get it in there and where the guy was going to get picked off but look the falcons played more man than maybe perhaps the the patriots thought they were going to get picked off. But look, the Falcons played more man than maybe perhaps the Patriots thought they were going to play. Even though they were playing man-to-man against Atlanta, they played man-to-man against Seattle. They put their corners out there. And really, Malcolm Mitchell was the one guy that was able to get separation.

I kept thinking to myself, Michael Floyd should have been active for the game. Yeah, me too. They just didn't have enough juice on the outside of the receiver position. And then on the last drive when they went to four receivers, they took Bennett off the field a couple plays, and they kind of got some matchups going. But it was an unpatriotic game. I just never thought that they would have to play from behind.

I thought the team that got the lead would keep scoring and put the game away. And it turned out the silver lining, and this is something we talked about at halftime, is we were trying to—the two silver linings that came up with halftime was, one, I'm glad I'm not there. I went to that one right away. It was like the only way this would be worse would be to be in the stadium. And then the second one was, I think the Pats had the ball for like 20 minutes in the first half because the Falcons had quick drives.

They got the pick six. And it just seemed like – Falcons only had the ball – Falcons had the ball like 11 minutes in the first half. Yeah, yeah, something like that. It was like 10 or 11 minutes. And then, you know, as the third period started, they stopped them at the beginning of that first drive. Pats come back.

They screw it up. Falcons come back and score pretty quick. Pats have a long drive coming back. They stop them. Then they have the field goal drive that happened. And all of a sudden it felt like the Falcons' defense was on the field for just a long time, and they just didn't seem as fast anymore. Couldn't you see them wearing down as the game went on?

Yeah, I think it clearly. I think it was a lot like the NCAA game, the Clemson-Alabama game, where Alabama's defense just got tired, and it looked to me like Atlanta just ran out of gas. We talked about their lack of depth in the defensive front, and it proved out, but look, they played 93 plays. It's hard to play good for all that amount of time. I mean, they just got worn down, and they couldn't do it.

I mean, it just, and that's when Brady started throwing the ball. I mean, the most important play of the game was calling heads. Because once Brady got the ball back, you knew they were going to score. I mean, everybody in the stadium knew they were going to score. Right. And I, you and I were texting during the game. Neither of us could understand why they weren't pushing the pace, why they weren't spread out. Didn't really understand. I think they must've thought thought blunt was going to overpower them and it just wasn't the case the falcons were so ready for him and their quickness was much better than the patriots anticipated and the stunts and the movement of the defensive front

was quicker than i think the patriots anticipated and that was a problem from the first first third and one when they didn't get it when blunt ran in there and lost a half a yard, you almost thought to yourself, like, really? This is not the Patriots. That's third and one is something they've practiced. They're ready for it because they know how important third and ones are. It just was Atlanta's game. Atlanta

was playing Patriot-like football for the first three quarters. Pats finally score. Gostkowski missed the PAT. It's just dead in the Simmons house. And I'm doing the math. I'm like, 19 points. That's 8-8-3.

It's three scores. We're still alive. You know, but it's like the only thing you're thinking is Tom Brady's on our team. But at that point, like, it just seemed like Julio had one giant play in him, right? It seemed like Freeman had one monster run in him. And you just need everything to go right. The Pats had already given up the pick six. They'd already given up a terrible fumble inside the 30.

So they'd given up basically, what do you call those? The four-point plays? They'd given up. Yep. They were horrible in the red zone. Atlanta was three for three in the red zone. They converted on third down. They had third and ten, and Hopper catches the big pass for the touchdown. They also, on the third down play,

when Coleman goes and man coverage against Ninkovich, not a great plan, scores the touchdown. Atlanta did exactly, they were three for three in the red zone. They were one for one on goal line. Look, Atlanta was doing the Patriot game. They were still on the Patriot game plan. There's no doubt. So if you just go through, like, you know, this was a borderline football miracle, I think, when you're down 25 in the Super Bowl.

Oh, no question. It doesn't seem like you can stop the team. It starts on that first drive down 28-3. They run basically a fourth down, I think, on their own 45-46, get it to Amendola to keep that first drive alive. Brady does the 19-yard sneak, which to that point...

Which might have been the longest play of the game, I think. Yeah, I think it was. It was the biggest play of the game for them. So the Pats score there and then they get the ball back and just end up with... They get a stop and then they get back and Brady takes a sneaky bad sack up the middle of the line of scrimmage. And, uh, and they ended up settling for that

field goal and they're still, they're down 16, but then the biggest play of the game happens with, uh, that third and one Falcons have it. They take a deep drop from Matt Ryan and he takes the big sack from high tower. Just walk, walk he takes the big sack from Hightower. Just walk me through the football science of that play. Was he trying to go deep? What was he trying to do on that? Because it was such a huge play. From the end zone copy, we never saw the route distribution.

We always saw it from behind Ryan. It looked like they were trying to throw an in-cut, and they had it fairly well covered. I don't know what Freeman was doing, because Freeman stepped up like he was going to block him, and then he didn't block Hightower. Hightower just went through, and he took a long gated drop, and he took a long wind-up to throw the ball. Third and two, you're running the ball fairly effectively there, and all of a sudden, even if you have to punt there, you're okay. The last thing you want to do is create field position for an offense

that was actually struggling. Well, and on top of it, it was third and one. That's the other thing. It wasn't like it was third and eight. Right. And so you want the ball to come out quick. It didn't come out quick. And, of course, naturally that turnover creates momentum.

It creates a situation where they can score quickly on a quarter of the field, something that if you just punt there, you're actually not worried. You know, they're going to go on a longer field. I couldn't tell the route. I'll see it tomorrow when I watch the game tape, but I couldn't tell the route distribution of the play because we never really got a chance to see it. That's the other thing I think we really missed as fans during the game.

Nobody was telling us how many plays Atlanta was playing. I know. They weren't telling us formations. They weren't telling us formations. They weren't telling us total plays on each side. None of that stuff. We never knew. Yeah. In fact, I thought Brady had 24 completions in the fourth quarter alone.

I'm thinking Cousin Sal on his prop bet. I was hoping he would get it. I never got to see what Brady's numbers were. I was like, how many completions did he have to have 24? He had 43. He had 43 for the game, but we never got a sense of how many plays they were playing. We never got a sense of how tired they were. And look, I will say this.

I think a lot in the first half, they were really – Atlanta was doing a lot of pulling and tugging. They got called for a couple holds, but you could have called them almost every time for it because they were just... They were going to take liberties with it and figure they got away with it. Patriots got away with a huge, huge face-match penalty on Logan Ryan.

That really won the game for them because if that's offsetting penalties there, maybe Atlanta comes to their senses because Matthews held on that play and then they just run it or try to get five yards. I mean, that was really a call. That was a double face mask, though, because Ryan Selma got thrown off, too.

Yeah, right. And actually, from the replay, the left guard, you could see Levitra had his hand on somebody else. Everybody had a hand on a face mask. That might have been the face mask play. When they got the Hightower fumble sack

and they showed Brady's reaction, that was the first time I actually thought the Pats had a chance. Brady was locked in. He had a reaction like they were down three

with four minutes left or something. He just got up and he was ready and he was rolling. I'm like, oh man. And then you start thinking this defense has been

on the field for basically the whole game and the Pats have found their rhythm now with all the receivers. The only thing is you start thinking, this defense has been on the field for basically the whole game. And the Pats have found their rhythm now with all the receivers. The only thing is, you start thinking, like, you know, he throws 62 times. Like, Edelman's out there basically every play. Bennett's out there a lot of the plays. James White's out there a ton. Mitchell, Hogan.

Like, those guys, how are they not dead by the end of the fourth quarter? That was the one part I don't get about football. Look, I think their conditioning is remarkable. Look, they run the hill. They take pride in running the hill every week. They do it. It's something they believe in. Their conditioning, they wear people down.

They're well-conditioned. Look, they just were able to outwear them. But I think the factor here is third and one, you got the ball. There's 8.31 to go in the game. Think about this. 8.31 to go in the game. If about this. 831 to go in the game. If you run it there and don't get the first down, the game's going to go under seven minutes. It's going to go under eight minutes. And I think that call right there

really was, obviously the turnover was huge. Well, wait a second though. That way, I mean, this may have been the worst football loss, at least professionally, that we've had. No, Atlanta took a brain fart from the eight-minute— when they got the ball at 944 to go in the game up 28-12, they started having brain farts. Because after the Pats scored to make it 28-20, there was one time when there was like five minutes left, and I think they got a first down. Yeah, they went 39 yards. They got a first down.

And he ran either the next play or the play right after that with like 22 seconds left on the play clock. Yeah. There's like five minutes left in the game. He was not looking at the clock. Yeah. Right, because when they went on the field with 9.44 to go, at that point in the game, the clock was their opponent, not the Patriots. Right.

This is where people don't understand it. The clock was their opponent because you had to reduce the clock. You're up by 16 points. So that's two possessions plus two points. Forty seconds. You've got to milk the clock. Forty seconds of play. And that's why I think Atlanta, that Atlanta just really,

they didn't realize their opponent was not the Patriots at that point. It was the clock. So anytime you could milk the clock, even if you've got to run it on third and one there, and milk 40 more seconds off, you've got a chance. So then on top of that,

so then the Pats come down, they score. It's 28-20. And they have that drive. They run the Kevin Falk two-point play, which is great. Oh, don't think my dad and I did say that right. I was like, oh, Kevin Falk, this play's been around for 100 years. So then they get to the 23 on Julio making, you know, just pound for pound,

one of the greatest football catches I've ever seen in my life. I don't know how Eric Rowe didn't tip it and yet Julio caught it. I don't know how Julio kept his feet in. He gets down on the 23. There's four minutes left. The game's over.

They're up seven. You could kneel three times and kick a 40-yard field goal and make the Pats use all their timeouts, and the Pats are down 10 with three minutes left and no timeouts, and I think it's a wrap. And instead they went backwards. When he throws it to Julio, it's 447 to go.

So at this point, you're up eight. You know, the Patriots still have their, they have three timeouts. Right. So two more first downs and basically the game's over. But even, let's say, but let's say. And a field goal, the game's over. Let's say they kneel three times and kick a field goal and make the Patriots use all

three timeouts. They're still up 10 with four minutes left. Like, whatever you do, don't go backwards. It's an onside kick game. Yeah. It's an onside kick game. Which, again, your opponent's the clock, not the Patriots. You've got to make it an onside kick game. Right. You've got to make it an onside kick game. It's an onside kick game. Which, again, your opponent's the clock, not the Patriots. You've got to make it an onside kick game.

You've got to make it an onside kick game, and that's what they didn't do. They didn't make it an onside kick game, so they throw it. I don't know how the ball got through Rowe. I don't even know how Matt Ryan thought that Julio was open. I have no idea. I would like to think it was the greatest throw since the Aaron Rodgers throw in the Cowboy game, but at least Aaron Rodgers thought that the guy was open. I don't know how Matt Ryan thought his guy was open.

He just made a play. That's the amazing thing about this game. When you go back and analyze this game, the Patriots receivers, for the most part, never really gave Brady a play. The longest play of the game is 28 yards. Hogan couldn't come down with a ball. Edelman had a lot of drops. Bennett had a chance to make a play down the field.

They couldn't make a play down the field to really loosen this defense up. It was the first Pats game where the Gronk absence was really noticeable, and it was ready to be one of my first three excuses if they had lost. There was no guy that the Falcons were really terrified of. I thought their game plan was excellent. Man-to-man, four-man rush. Neither of us thought they'd be able to pressure Brady that way. But when you look at the way that they botched those last eight minutes,

I mean, we didn't even talk about, not only did they go backwards from their own 23 and end up having a punt, but then after the incredible Edelman catch, which was God's gift for the for the tyree catch finally got us back right but dan quinn or the mario manningham catch yes dan quinn uses a challenge on yeah uses his last time out to stop the clock for us at 203 and then gives us another play and then uses all his time out so So when they actually got the ball back, they had the ball with 50 seconds left, tie game, you know,

and they had no timeouts. They had 57 seconds to go, but they had no timeouts. So it was easy for New England. Just all you got to do is tackle the ball. And then they took a check down for four yards, which, you know, that took another 20 seconds off the clock. They went 52 seconds to 32 seconds, and then they had to spike the ball so they give up a play.

You know, I got to give it credit. I think the superstar of the game was the ref who called it a complete on the field because from my vantage point on the couch, I thought it was incomplete. It wasn't until the replay that it looked like a completion. I thought it was an incredible call. And Belichick was going to have to challenge it had it been the other way.

Right. And that ref came flying in with, almost like he was in a sports movie. Like really tugging on that it was a catch. It was amazing. You know, so the Falcons, you mentioned that last minute. Completion, 20 seconds roll off the clock.

Now it's down to 32. He throws the five-yard out to the tight end. Guy gets tackled. Then they have to stop the clock. I mean, that was a disaster. I really think Julio has to be involved prominently with 50 seconds left. My fear as a Patriot fan was just don't throw it to Julio. Don't throw jump balls to Julio. Don't throw jump balls to Julio.

Don't throw to him in double coverage. Don't throw a hail mail. Anything with Julio, I'm out. Please, no. And it never happened. Then the Pats win the greatest coin flip in the history of the NFL, right?

Has there ever been a bigger coin flip? I don't think the Patriots should call anything but heads for the rest of their career as a franchise. Just to remind everybody that heads won them a Super Bowl because you knew when he got the ball back at the 25,

they were going to score. There was no way they were going to give the ball back to Matt Ryan again. They were tired. Yep. And, you know, I mean, look, it just took them how many plays in overtime? It took them three, six, nine plays to score. Yeah, they had last five drives of the game they scored 31 points eight for 85 12 for 72 led to the field goal five for 25 after the high tower fumble

10 for 91 to tie the game now they get two two points on those last two win the toss eight for 75 that i mean that that could not have happened in the history of football before. Even like, I don't remember what happened in the Frank Reich game, which is always like the go-to example for the great comebacks. The 31 points and five drives. It's just remarkable. I mean, it really is, especially with a quarterback who's gotten a lot of body punches thrown to him and his eye level never went down.

That's what makes him the greatest of all time. They hit him a bunch, and he just got stronger as the game went on. And once they got control of the pass rush because Atlanta was tired. Look, I didn't think Atlanta could rush the way they did. I think the two factors proved out. Atlanta was way better in the defensive front than I anticipated in terms of pressure. I thought Atlanta's offensive line was the weakness.

I didn't care what pro football focus had it as the sixth-best line. They gave up. They were one for eight on third down. Ryan was sacked five times in the weakness. I didn't care what pro football focus had it as the sixth best line. They gave up. They were one for eight on third down. They had Ryan was sacked five times in the game. It was a problem pass protecting when Flowers to me, which is an unsung hero of the game, you know, really that the sack he got, the pressure he created was really a problem for him. So, you know, to me, you know, when Atlanta looks back on this, there's a lot of ways they can go. But starting with nine minutes to go in the game, their inability to convert third downs. But they played, for the most part, the perfect game

up until the nine-minute mark of the fourth quarter. And as my buddy Hench points out, this is an email he sent tonight. We held them to 12.3 yards per pass and 5.8 yards per rush. Wait, what? How did this happen? It's the Falcons. Well, they didn't have the ball enough. I mean, they barely's the Falcons. Well, they didn't have the ball enough. The problem was

Atlanta didn't have the ball enough. And so they couldn't really do it. And when they had the opportunity, third and one, they go back and replay that game again. They're going to run toss-crack again. But that's what happens. That's why you play four quarters.

I didn't anticipate the game going this way. I thought New England would score 34 points. I didn't anticipate it going this way in terms of where Atlanta would be the dominant team for three quarters. Right. But the reality was, you know, New England found a way to sneak back into it. And I think, you know, you can talk about Pete Carroll's inability to run the ball on fourth and one. To me, Pete Carroll had to throw the ball there based on the front of the defensive line of the Patriots.

So to me, I don't think that was as egregious as third and one having a chance to run it and knowing who your opponent is. And I think Atlanta's going to look back on this. I mean, look, Arthur Blank was on the field. He was ready to get the trophy. That was under, I couldn't believe when they showed him, I couldn't believe he was out there.

Is that, you've been in football a long time. Is that the worst football loss you've ever seen? It's one of them. Yeah, I mean, those are ones. I mean, Atlanta, you know, I know everybody said after the game, Atlanta will come back and they'll bounce back from it. That's a hard one to bounce back from. That's a hard one to bounce back from because you gave it

everything and you just, you know, you did everything you possibly could do. You're going to lose your coordinator now and you know, you just had a chance to let the game slip right through your fingertips. To me, I think Mark Cuban tweeted this and I retweeted it. The winning's great, but those losses, they never leave you. The tuck game never left me. Games you just don't lose. Losing the Super Bowl to Tampa Bay's never left. I mean, you just don't ever let that go. And it's hard to bounce back again, because what most people do is what Arizona did last year is they think they can recline the mountain without climbing. Right. And Atlanta's got to start all over again. And that's the challenge.

It's hard to do. It's a hard thing to do in sports is to recline something once you've been so close. I already thought Brady was the greatest quarterback of all time. This clinched it. I'm just speechless. I just can't believe how amazing he was from 28 to 3 on. I just can't imagine another quarterback who could have done that. Do you think, especially after all the hits he took. Let me ask you this question. How many texts did you get at halftime saying, they better not trade Garoppolo?

I mean, I thought the game was a little bit like, I tweeted this, I thought this was the worst the Patriots have played since the Monday night game in Kansas City. Yeah, I agree. And after that game, everybody was calling for Brady's demise. And this was a little bit of a microcosm of that game plus the Bengal game. I mean, three quarters was the Kansas Citycosm of that game plus the Bengal game. I mean, three quarters was the Kansas City game. The fourth quarter was the Bengal game.

I got a lot of tweets, a lot of texts from people around the league, friends of mine that said, oh, he better hang on to Jimmy G. People were tweeting, you know, Jimmy G will be all the starting quarterback. I mean, Brady didn't look, his arm didn't look good. I don't think he got a lot of help from his receivers.

No, a lot of drops. And I think that was a problem. Yeah, a lot of drops. And all of a sudden they stopped dropping passes. And the contested balls, arm didn't look good. I don't think he got a lot of help from his receivers early in the game. No, a lot of drops. And I think that was a problem. Yeah, a lot of drops, and all of a sudden they stopped dropping passes. And the contested balls, they didn't make plays on the contested balls. I mean, Hogan had a chance, that deep ball that was over his shoulder, he had a chance to make that play. Last words on William Stephen Belichick? I mean, look, how about the fact, did anybody noticed there was not an emblem on his shoulder?

There wasn't a Patriot logo? Did you notice that? That's fantastic. There was no Patriot logo on his shirt. It was classic. I mean, look, the one thing is, in years to come, you know, we talk about the miracle on ice and the Herb Brooks speech. This game is going to be coaches around the world, soccer coaches, are going to show this in terms of teaching their team the element of mental toughness,

how to keep fighting. It's easier said than done. It never is going to go this way. I think if they played the last nine minutes of this game ten times, the Patriots win once. Let's be honest. And here's the other thing that we didn't even talk about. The Super Bowl halftime break really helped them.

And I remember when I was at the Rams-Patt Super Bowl, Super Bowl 36, we're up 14-3. We're the 14-point underdogs. We have incredible momentum. U2 comes out. They sing for a half hour. They have to dismantle it. By the time the game started again, it felt like we were watching a second football game.

It had no relation to the first half. And it did feel like the Falcons, going into halftime, it felt like they were going to win 60-0 or 60-3, whatever it was. And then they had the ball to start. They had the ball to start. I mean, you're thinking they're going to come out and do it. I mean, look, the Lady Gaga Super Bowl, I mean, she clearly didn't miss Tony Bennett. And she's not afraid of heights. I mean, like when she was up on the top of that thing, I was getting chills just seeing how the hell she was going to come down from that.

She's no produce, but it was pretty great. It was one of the greatest halftime shows I've seen. I mean, it really was. And I agree with you. It's hard to recharge. You practice that a little bit. I know the Patriots practiced that long halftime shows I've seen. I mean, it really was. And I agree with you. It's hard to recharge. You practice that a little bit. I know the Patriots practiced that long halftime. I'm sure Atlanta practiced the long halftime.

But I think really what happens is you've got to go into it with the mindset at 0-0, and you've got to score it. And if Atlanta scores and sets a tempo right away, I know they traded and they got up 28-3. But, you know, look, the last nine minutes, Atlanta's going to look back and say, God, we had a chance. It's situational football. We didn't play it. But for Falcon fans, look, with nine minutes to go in the game, you play that game over again, you're going to win nine out of ten times. Patriots are really lucky tonight.

I don't think you made the Falcons fans feel better right there. I know I didn't. I mean, trust me, I'm sure your Twitter was getting killed by every Falcon fan in America. I didn't look. I will say this, though. That has to be the first NFL overtime game where one team had the ball for 93 plays and the other team had the ball for 46. It's really remarkable. That's how weird that game is. It was like the championship game. I mean, Atlanta defense just wilted. I mean, Dwight Freeney looked like he had found the fountain of youth.

He really did. I mean, it was unbelievable. And I think the Patriots did a really bad job of changing the snap count. And that happens to you when you get it when you're playing from behind. You don't manage the game correctly. They didn't play the snap count very well. Atlanta was getting off on the ball just as much as they were. And, you know, look, it was one of those where the greatest player.

I've never seen anybody like Tommy Brady in my life. I mean, that was remarkable. His will to win and his ability to make some of those throws that he made after he had the hell beat out of him is remarkable. And at age 39. I mean, let's all agree there's never been a better performance by an older athlete than what we saw tonight. I was trying to avoid superlatives for this whole podcast,

but I think you just have to put this at the top of any late 30s, early 40s, mid 40s, maybe Nicholas at the 86 Masters. I don't know. But yeah, unbelievable. So you'll be on the Ringer NFL show this week with Mays. I hope midweek going, breaking down really some of the technical assets of this game. But in the meantime, thanks for coming on on short notice, my friend. I'll talk to you soon.

Mike Labarde. It was great. Thanks, Bill. All right. Thanks, man. Thanks, Bill. All right. Bye-bye.

All right. On the line right now, the Cuz. Cuz and Sal, we're taping this. Usually we do Monday mornings. Today's Sunday night. Worst football loss ever, greatest football comeback ever, or greatest gambling moment ever? Pick one.

Can I say worst gambling moment ever? You didn't give me that option. Okay. What if I bought it up to plus three and a half? Would you say that's the worst gambling moment ever? That's pretty horrible. You didn't really do that, did you? Oh, yeah, sure.

That was my Cousin South Shore thing pick. I thought you took the Patriots. I didn't even look. No, no. I'll tell you what. I listened to that and when we did the podcast and I was like, you know what? That was such a Patriots jerk fest.

These guys are too confident and I'm sure that's what happened just 20 minutes before this part of the podcast aired. But I thought I had the right side. I really did. I thought the Patriots hadn't faced a quarterback like Ryan. And I was like, they're not going to be ready for this. And they were ready in the second half, that's for sure.

I think you made a great pick. I mean, I think that's one of the flukiest football games we'll ever see in our lives where you have one team takes this huge lead but barely has the ball and their defense slowly wears down the second half and then you have you know the best quarterback of all time and the other team and then lombardi just said if you played the last nine minutes of the fourth quarter 10 times the falcons win nine of the 10. And the shots in the foot that they did to themselves over those last eight minutes really helped,

not to mention the Patriots making all the plays that they made. But I don't want to say fluke because the Pats made so many great plays, but man, if you played that game 40 times from Falcons 21 to3 at halftime, I don't know how many of the Pats win, maybe two or three. And you don't think when a missed extra point followed by the same kicker getting in the way of his own onside kick, which the Falcons didn't capitalize on,

and then combine that with the Julio Jones magnificent catch, top three Super Bowl catches of all time, putting them at the 21-yard line, those three things together, that team doesn't usually lose. But I will say Belichick's legacy now is largely due to two of the biggest coaching brain farts in the history of football. We have to admit this at least, right? He has the first down at the 21 after that great Julio catch

with three and change, and you go empty backfield? You don't even get them to use timeouts? How do you not go up 11 there with three minutes left? It was the 23-yard line. Lombardi said there was 447 left. I thought there was less. No, there was less. Yeah, I mean, if they kneel three times and kick a field goal,

we're basically screwed. The Falcons did so many bizarre things. Even, like, you notice how Ryan didn't milk the play clock all the way down to zero a few times there in the fourth quarter. And just, even when they got the ball back with 50 seconds left, my dad and I were just. Well, I was going to say, that's more Belichick goal. Like, you have two plays.

You know, it's second down. Either way, you have two plays for, you know, second down. Either way, you have two plays or third down. Right. Right. You don't have to, you don't have to snap that ball with 57 seconds left or whatever it was. That was crazy. I think the momentum and just weirdness of that game kind of broke the Falcons mentally

a little bit because there's just never been a weirder football game. You know, the Patriots ran 93 plays and the Falcons ran 46? Yeah. I know the Falcons, I know, had more points at halftime than they had plays or offensive plays. Yeah, it was spectacular. The numbers don't make any sense if you add this up. And somehow Julio Jones only had four catches for 87 yards.

I would have guessed that he had 17 catches for 190 yards or something but it just felt like those are the most impactful four catches you were at a party right? I was and at that party let me just say long time Patriots fans Dickie Barrett

the Mighty Mighty Boston's and Kevin Hensch left early Kevin Hensch left early? Kevin Hensch left early? They thought, they think, and to your credit, you want to do this podcast right after the game, win or lose. I will say to your credit, but did you give up? Would you say you gave up? I did not give up.

I think my dad almost gave up. I didn't give up just because when it was 28-9, it was still touchdown, touchdown, field goal, even though we would have needed the two points. It was still doable. Because the thing I kept thinking in my head was that in the Seattle game, which my dad and I just watched on Thursday night two years ago, they were down 10 points with the ball with 11 minutes left, the Pats,

and they scored two touchdowns. So I kept thinking in my head, if we can just get it within two touchdowns with 11 minutes left, the Pats. And they scored two touchdowns. So I kept thinking in my head, like, if we can just get it within two touchdowns with 11 minutes left, it's not dissimilar from that Seattle game. But the thing I couldn't figure out was how the hell were we going to stop the Falcons since we weren't doing a very good job of it. It helped when Coleman went out. Yeah.

And it helped that Alex Mack was probably playing on a broken leg. I think they kind of figured out how to use that to their advantage. How did they hide that all week when millions of dollars are already wagered on this? Are they going to get in trouble for hiding a broken bone in a guy's leg? It came out today, though, right? Today. That's what I mean. All week. It felt like that should have affected the line maybe by a half point. I don't know.

I'm going to say something controversial. 28-3. Go ahead. I'm waiting for it. Tell me. No, no. 28-3 with 7.5 left. They have 22 minutes to score one point and they couldn't do it.

The Falcons scored 21 points. Their defense scored seven. Brady, I get it. He had 466 yards. He's not the MVP. I think the defense is the MVP. They're crazy on me right now. I'm telling you.

I give it to Trey Flowers. Two and a half gigantic sacks, four tackles, and like I said, they held the Falcons to 21 points and really held them to nothing with 22 minutes left in the game let's say the Falcons win the coin toss and they go down on a long drive and they and they score a field goal and then there's a kickoff on like something happens could Brady have won the MVP even if the Patriots lost does the winner have to win the MVP even if the Patriots lost? Does the winner have to win the MVP? Well, I mean, they don't have to.

The winner doesn't have to win the MVP. Because I don't know, who was the Falcons MVP of that game? They had a lot of guys play well, but there was nobody that really jumped out, I guess. I know. We were saying in my house, we were saying if they had just won the game because of that amazing Julio catch and kicked a field goal and clinched it, I might have just given it to Julio. It would have to Julio. That was the greatest. I mean, that was just a gut-wrenching catch. And then the Pats somehow flipped it with the Edelman catch. What was your reaction to the Edelman catch?

Well, I figured, I said, you know what? The tide has turned. At that point, I had no doubt that the Patriots were going to win. And I wish I could have bet the two-point conversion because I would have bet 50 grand to win $5 that they were going to convert that two-pointer at the end. But that, to me, is like you pass

the Giants. Oh, for hatred? What's that? I think, no, no, no, not for hatred. Although I will say, countrywide, I bet they are the most hated team now. I don't think you have anyone who's in the rear mirror there.

That's a tough one because at the same time, and I don't know, we'll see how it plays out over these next few days, Brady's will to win in that game and how unbelievable he was at the age he's at there's there's there's a little bit of michael jordan and you know in utah 1998 level of edge to it right i think which you know one thing about americans whether you love a team you hate them like when somebody goes really to a crazy crazy high level there's usually a little bit of a respect that goes with it i wonder i guess we're taping this on a sunday and I'm wondering like the next couple of days, I do think, I think Dan Quinn and Shanahan and Matt Ryan are going to take a beating,

you know, just the sacks that they took and the calls, the Dan Quinn challenge with 203 left after the unbelievable Edelman catch when, you know, the ref was so adamant that he caught it. And, you know, just let it run down to two minutes and then watch it on the replay 20 times. The whole thing was weird. I think Shanahan started his tenure with the 49ers about three and a half minutes too early with a chance to go up 11. And, yes, you're right.

I think that challenge is ridiculous. Yeah, let it go down to two minutes or like i i felt like we had seen the replay twice before the flag came out anyway like there's got to be someone watching in the booth that could alert them to the fact that that was a catch what was it like what was it like rooting against brady there in those last i don't know quarter and a half or whatever so much fun so much i mean did you just feel like he was going to complete every pass because i'm i'm rooting for him i don't know what it's like i said to carola who and i should i should have just told everyone that carola had the falcons also so that

why didn't you announce that uh he did it like a few minutes before the game and i said i said listen to me adam at halftime the patriots are five to one to win the game five I said, listen to me, Adam. At halftime, the Patriots are 5-1 to win the game. 5-1 odds was 21-3. With nine and a half minutes left, it was 28-12. You were down 16. There were 10-1 odds to win the game. I said, we must jump on this because this is going to be the worst loss of all time if we don't get plus three, if we don't cover this. No, no, no, no, let's ride it out. And sure enough, that went to worse. What was the, at the party, what was the biggest reaction for any play? I think it was when Brad spilled a four liter bottle of Orange Crush, but, oh, just game-wise, you're saying?

I didn't even know it came in four leaders, but he did it somehow. I got to say, one of the big moments. The catch. The Edelman catch was the biggest. The Edelman catch was. I mean, that was like, Edelman finally has a catch to maybe the Seattle catch two years ago when he got concussed and just kept running. But this one, it was just the perfect play to illustrate

what it's been like to watch Edelman the last seven years. I don't know how many receivers would have attacked the ball that way. It was almost like he, not just to keep them from intercepting it, but to keep it up. Amazing. I mean, that's going to be his legacy play forever. And he gets two rings. For sure, yeah.

I don't know. For sure. I think, you know, I guess because he threw 62 times, you could say that Brady should have had more interceptions than he did. I counted about four, but there were a lot of tip passes. And the tip pass that Bennett caught that really looked like the linebacker had sized up the return from the touchdown, that was obviously the Edelman one but um yeah spectacular 37 first downs for the Falcons 17 and that's how you win do you I have a couple a couple things for

you Tom Brady now has more Super Bowls than both Manning brothers. Right. That was Chris Berman's last primetime. Oh, that was it, right? When he did it, I actually watched it because I was waiting for Jim to get here to do the podcast. And Berman did the highlights. It was it. It was his farewell. The greatest football highlights he'll probably ever rattle off

other than the Frank Wright game. He was in rare form, too. It was great. I love that. Steve, circle the wagons. It was great. I'm going to have to go back and watch. I might tear up. Should we go over some of these numbers, some of these great odds that paid off and didn't pay off? Yeah, let's do it. Hold on. Before we do it, let's take a quick break to talk about books. I keep telling you, we have Valentine's take a quick break to talk about books. I keep telling you, we have Valentine's Day coming up fast. Stop procrastinating.

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Use code bill for 20% off back to the podcast. All right. Real quick. Some of the stupid ones luke brian under two minutes nine seconds i think it was like 204 205 and he held it out right so uh my son was next to me who my son i definitely think is gonna gonna be a gambler to watch down the road really loves gambling and i told him you bet on the under and what it was and he digested it. And we, we got my, my phone out and we timed it. And it got closer and closer and he was as excited as I've ever seen him. And I really feel good about his gambling future. He got through, he's like,

yes, I'll did it. Yes. I was like, exactly. This is gambling. This is it. Very good job. He's going to have to live with me this summer. I'll teach him. Aside from that, we should mention the overtime. If New England wins by a field goal, if they win 31-28, that's a push on both ends, the over-under and the spread. A lot of betting. Oh, my God. Like a lot.

Yeah. That would have been interesting. Do you think that's – has that ever happened? I don't think so. Not with both. Maybe one of those Cowboy Steelers games was close on both. So that touchdown hit Pats, Tease with the over. Yeah, everything.

It hit just the straight on Pats plus the over parlay. Mm-hmm. Yeah, okay, anyway. That's amazing. Let's just go over some of these. There were no kneelers as far as I saw, right? So that was minus 200. Over one and a half times they showed Giselle.

Over? One was a replay. Still counts. No Gatorade shower. So you're getting your money back on that. Lots of fun, your team is. Not even one Gatorade shower. Well, it was complete chaos,

and then there was the chance that his knee was down before he scored the touchdown. Oh, that's true. And they would have to clear the confetti. I think they just decided there was a touchdown. That was enough? Yeah. Lady Gaga, the field wins.

Any other song? Because she did, what did she do? She did whatever my country tells her to do. What did she do? Some kind of American. I got to be honest. I had it on mute as I tried to talk my dad off the ledge. Oh, really?

Oh, for the halftime. Yeah, my dad was in rough shape at halftime. He's very upset. He didn't like our game plan. He thought that was it. We may or may not have had the should we keep Jimmy conversation that may or may not have been had. Really?

Just should we? Is it a mistake to trade him? Maybe we shouldn't. That might have been kind of floated a tiny bit. Wow. Not by me. But why are we so unprepared? There's a lot of that.

They did seem unprepared. That was the word that I threw around a lot. They really just did not seem ready for that team at all. Very sloppy. It doesn't matter. And I think they were completely stunned that the Falcons just had the four-man rush, man-to-man, and just did the 2007 Giants blueprint on them, and it was working. I don't think they knew how to audible away from it.

And then eventually they realized, spread the receivers and just let Brady do his thing. But it took three quarters. So crazy. Coin toss was tails. No big deal there. This is a good one. We should maybe look into this for every game next year. Shortest touchdown of the game

under one and a half yards. Always seems to happen. I think it was in the playoffs, somebody emailed me this before when we talked about that bet. Ten of the 11 playoff games had a one-yard touchdown. Wow. Amazing. Over four sacks both teams. Shattered.

It ended up being ten. I was very surprised by that. We talked about that, right? Didn't you like the under? I would have gone under. I didn't think what did I see from either team that made me think they were going to get to Brady? I thought maybe Pats would have a couple sacks, but that's it. I think next year people have to go against our Super Bowl props

because my two favorites were the Pats scoring in the second quarter and Isaiah Thomas outscoring the Patriots, which he did not. And he was getting 200 points. I think he had 28. So I guess he would have. Yeah, I know, but he had a slow second half, so I think he finished with 28. And I guess he would have outscored the Pats

if it wasn't for the overtime. And I had Aldrick Robinson over six and a half yards, and I swear to God he didn't dress for the game. I didn't see him at all. Oh, he didn't dress? What are you going to do? I don't know. He did, but I didn't see him on the field at all.

Over on the largest lead, 16-and-a-half, that went over, obviously. Overtime, will there be overtime? Seven-and-one odds you get that there's overtime. First one in Super Bowl history. This is the one that killed me. Will one quarter be scoreless? I said no. I had that in a parlay.

Yes, hit. It was plus 450. I mean, 62 points scored, and there's a scoreless i said no i had that in a parlay yes hit it was plus 450 i could i mean 62 points scored and there's a scoreless quarter missed extra point i remember missed extra point we discussed it or looked at it and that hit and then wasn't will there be yeah and wasn't will there be a two-point conversion was a bet and there were two of them i didn't even i don't even remember if there was a over under for one and a half two point conversions that would have been interesting right and even an attempt was almost even odds like that that's that's a good bet uh was there well pat scored yeah what was the over under for when my dad pulled out uh this little tin box that had heart

pills in it because because at the end of the first quarter no it happened at the two minute warning after the Edelman catch with the front of the fourth quarter. Oh, that way. Yeah. It was a great night for the Simmons family because they all came in and somehow rallied and really kind of rallied the team and everybody stayed in there.

They figured out you can't leave the spot you're sitting in because it's bad luck, all that stuff. And I do feel like the karma in the room and maybe other rooms around the country might have helped a tiny bit. out you can't leave the spot you're sitting in because it's bad luck all that stuff and and i do feel like the karma in the room and maybe other rooms around the country might have helped a tiny bit but when my dad put out the heart pills that's when i really felt confident oh no yeah because i've seen him do it before i've seen him do it before the heart pills works so yeah yeah and then ben probably put him in a wrestling move right did he have a skull crusher or something

well you know this from your oldest son Ben's now on the stage where you go to school the next day and you taunt all the kids in your class so like the other team so he's all excited about that that's a great era for elementary school it's going to raise Pat's jersey and do the whole thing I have to say I was going to say that to you you don't really you never really had experience

that like I remember being afraid to get on the bus when the Cowboys lost three NFC championships in a row. I was like, I'm going to hear this crap. I know, I don't want to hear it. You really dodged that your whole life. No, no, I didn't dodge it, because when I moved to, when my parents got divorced and then I eventually moved to Connecticut,

and that's when the 86 Red Sox and I was in, you know, the furthest part of Connecticut toward New York, so it was all New Yorkers and I was in Connecticut you know the furthest part of Connecticut toward New York so it was all New Yorkers and I watched game six

at a high school party at Tom Demas' house but not good so I have fully experienced that you had to go

but yeah but you never went on a bus I mean you've never been on a bus in your life oh you mean like in third grade yeah yeah no I don't know that Brady will or that either quarterback will break the passing record of 414 was plus 350.

Patriots by four to six points, plus 750. Patriots to score exactly 34, 12 to one. Same for Falcons at 28, 12 to one. What was Brady's MVP final odds? I think it was minus 110 and Devontae Freeman I think was 9-1 for first touchdown

was it that high? I thought it was like 7-1 or something I don't know I don't think it was that high what was Brady complete I was going to ask what were the odds for when fox waited until the ultimate moment to run the boston titles versus atlanta titles montage which i thought was flat out cruel just for the record even though my team was the winner in that

having been on the other side of that uh especially 2003 and 04 with baseball they waited they they could have they could have run that when it's 21-3, when it was 28-3. They waited until the Falcons fans were at a very weak moment and then just rattled that off and reminded them, oh, yeah, you've never had a team win except for the Braves. I thought that was mean. There was like four and a half minutes left when they did it. Anyway.

And that's when Rembrandt Brown reached into your dad's hard pill box. It was like, these are for me. What do I do? I'm afraid I'm just going to wait until Rem texts me. And it might be five years from now. Give him a few days. Yeah, I'll give him a few years. This is like a first date kind of thing.

You got to just flip back off for a second. Yeah, I think so. Brady, over 41 completions. 40 to 1. 40 to 1. 40 to 1. Oh, that got a Jim Cunningham turn red on that one. 40 to 1. 40 completions.

It only went up to 41. Like, 41 plus completions was 40 to 1. Matt Ryan, 281 to 300 is 7 to 1 odds. Matt Ryan, total completion, 17, 80 to 1. Interesting. How about the Pats had 37 first downs, and those odds had to have been – I mean, they probably didn't even have a bet for that. I don't see that.

37 first downs, Sal. What's that? 37 first downs. That's a crazy, crazy number. Yeah, 36 in the second half. No, not that many, but a lot. This land is my land. That was a Lady Gaga song.

Plus 225. Edelman, 7-1 odds on 81-90 receiving. Hey, Sal, what were the odds of Terry Bradshaw calling James White, James Lewis on the Super Bowl postgame podium stand? Did he do it? Oh, yeah. They interview Belichick and Brady. And he's like, let's bring up James Lewis.

James, get up here. Poor James White. The greatest moment of his life. He's called James. What do you do? Do you correct Terry Bradshaw at that point? I think you do, right? I think you smack him in the back of the head.

I know. Maybe you're just happy he didn't call you Huey Lewis. I don't know what you do right i think you smack him in the back of the head i know maybe you're just happy he didn't call you huey lewis i don't know what you do there or slappy weight let's bring up slappy weight devonta freeman was plus 850 for first touchdown that's what it went off of and those are those are the big ones as far as i know so was that do you think that was the biggest coin toss of all time? Oh, yeah. I was trying to think of like what are the biggest coin tosses I've ever seen. All of them would have to be football or college football. I'm sure there's been some massive ones in college football.

But in college football, you know you're getting, you know, one team gets it, the other team gets it. So it can't be that massive. Yeah. Did you have any doubt that you were scoring there? Like, I think like fourth and five from the 40, I think you're even going. Like, you didn't even get to third down, I don't think, on that drive. This is going to sound weird,

but I'd never been in this situation before where my team had run so many plays that we're talking about like how do the receivers how do they have anything left you know Edelman you know we ran 93 plays Edelman's probably out there for 80 of them and for the entire second half those guys are just running across the middle running wind sprints Brady's taking you know 20 hits including a couple really bad ones and he's 39 years old and it's the fourth hour of the game

I did not feel like it was a lock that they were going to go down and score didn't you feel Atlanta was way out of gas at that point to me Atlanta felt more deer in the headlights when Matt Ryan we talked about some of those moments,

but even when they had the ball back with 50 seconds left and they had the one first down and 20 seconds rolled off and then he threw the four yard out to the tight end, I was like, wow, he's just, this moment might be a little big for him. Yeah, he just seemed like he was self-combusting a little bit. For sure. big for him yeah he just seemed like he was uh self-combusting a little bit so sure i i felt i felt better about that but i still felt like you know i mean you've rooted against julio he yeah he's fucking terrifying and i just even with 50 seconds 30 seconds whatever you just think like just if they throw it to julio we're screwed like they'll get a pass interference or something

will happen. But everything was, like, miraculous with him. Even that catch over the middle where he had to, like, wrestle it around. Like, I think that they did what they normally do. They put two cornerbacks on Julio or two D-backs on Julio. And then their best one, Butler, was on Sanu, right? Like, isn't that what the Patriots do? And it freaking worked. I think it worked for the most part.

What seemed like it was sitting there all game for them were those running backs running in those quick, hard screen passes that were almost like forward sweeps. And that play that Coleman scored on on the goal line when he started on the left and as soon as the ball was hit, he's

flying across and Nikovich just wasn't fast enough. And I thought that's how they would just kill us over and over again. But, um, right. Wow. So I, this is a,

I didn't realize you lost money in this. This is yet. It's been a run of terrible losses for you going back to, uh, going back to the NBA finals. I still made money on the year somehow on Cousin Sal's short thing. But, you know, my other props were Deion Lewis over two receptions. Friggin' Brady threw the ball over 60 times.

He only had one reception. They didn't use Lewis. Yeah, it was weird. You just don't know with Belichick. But, yeah, I mean, plus three. The fact that I bought it up to three and a half and the game's going over. Like, you know, all the nonsense, all the two-point conversions I've had to go through for it to get to overtime

and then to not even lose by three in overtime. I was thinking more of, like, you had the NBA Finals, the Cleveland comes back three to one. You had the Trump came back and you had the Pats come back. Those are three straight, straight like historic comebacks. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

It had to be something else. I don't know. It was something. I wonder what the net. I'll enjoy the break. I'll enjoy the break. I somehow didn't have the Cleveland Indians. What was the reaction when,

when the Pats actually won at the party? Just tell me, because I just was with like five people. Most of the people in the room had the Patriots. It was like 40 people. Our friend Daniel was going nuts, even though he has crazy bets, like safety is the last score and everything. He bet the Pats at halftime 5-1. It was jubilation.

It really was. All right. It was. But congratulations. That's another big win. Thanks, cuz. I guess he's the greatest of all time. Why do you guess?

Is there guessing now? Is there guessing at this point? I just don't think there was much. I know Montana came back against Cincinnati that won game. But it seems so chaotic with some of these Brady games. I know. came back against Cincinnati that won game. It seems so chaotic with some of these Brady games. I'm sorry. I thought he could have thrown like four interceptions.

That's not the game plan you wanted where he throws over 60 times. You figured it out and they won again. They really did. Super Bowl odds are out for next year. You want to hear them? Give me the top six. Pat's 9-2. Cowboys 7-1. Cowboys 7-1. Cowboys 7-1.

Atlanta 10-1. Pittsburgh 12-1. Green Bay 12-1. Oakland and Seattle 12-1. Casey 20-1. Browns are at the bottom at 250-1. Casey's interesting because what if they get Romo? Right.

Yeah. Wow. Could load up on that. Well, I'm not ready to think about next year yet. I'm going to soak this one in some more. Enjoy it. Congrats on at least finishing in the positive on Cousin Sal's Sure Thing year one. Thank you.

I don't know how I did it, but I made a little money. And congrats to you. And congrats to Vladimir Putin. He gets another ring. I know. Terrific news. We're going to mail this one to him. He's not actually taking it.

We're just going to mail it to him. Oh, we didn't even talk about Goodell. Maybe I'll save that for my dad because I'm going to call my dad. Do you have any Goodell? I'll give your dad a call. Did they all shake hands? They were good friends, right? I thought he bolted off the podium. Oh, really?

Yeah, I would love for somebody out there to study the time that Goodell spends on the podium for all these other Super Bowl celebrations during this one. It seemed like he hightailed it out of there. Right. Kraft was, I crafted a magnificent job with the speech. I was very proud of him.

That was great. I thought two years ago was the best. But after what we've endured the last two years, and I'll leave it at that. That was great. Does Goodell have Dan Quinn in Shanahan? Does he call him into his office and threaten their lives? I think both of them might be floating in some Houston oil field tomorrow. It's very possible.

The Cus, a pleasure. Great season. We will talk to you before March. We'll do Oscars. We're going to do Oscars props before. Oh, yes. Let's do it. Good job by you. Congratulations. Thanks, buddy. Let's take a quick break to talk about Lyft.

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Back to the podcast. We're going to call my dad in one second, but just don't forget to check out theringer.com for all of our Super Bowl 51 content and the Ringer NFL show, the big wrap-up show on there and that podcast tomorrow and then Mike Lombardi and Mays, probably on Wednesday,

breaking down the whole thing. But I think tomorrow is Mays and Kevin Clark. Danny Kelly will get involved at some point. Check that out, the Ringer NFL show. Subscribe on iTunes, Stitcher, wherever it's told. Wherever you subscribe. I can't even talk anymore. I'm officially crashing after one of the great Boston wins of all time.

My dad's on the phone. He's actually at my house. Dad, are you still alive? I'm still alive. I just took another hard pill pill but i'm hanging in there i told sal that that that those came out right around the two minute warning and i asked if you covered the prop when the heart pills are gonna come out i didn't think you were gonna need them during the game but then then the game started getting exciting but after the strip stack uh

and the momentum seemed to change everything Everything was different, wasn't it? Yeah, I felt like you quit at halftime. I did feel like you, I thought you checked out. Oh, no, no, no, no, no. I thought you checked out. I mean, we're down, when we were down 25 points, my concern, I kept looking at the TV, was the clock. How much time do we have left?

And would we be able to stop Atlanta when we got the ball back? Why did you ask me, why did you say to me, I think we should keep Jimmy Garoppolo? What did you mean by that? Halftime. Did I say that? Why did you say, maybe we should keep Jimmy Garoppolo?

I thought it was one of your quotes at halftime. I just don't remember saying that. I just like him. I thought that in five years he could take Brady's place. Let's talk about, there was an incredible seat change at halftime. There was. We started it. We started out, I was on the... Let's face it, we were getting outplayed,

and you and I changed seats, and then your wife and the two kids came in to join us, and all of a sudden, plus your mother left. My mother left. All of a sudden, the momentum changed. Everything changed. Yeah, my mother, I think she came to put the Maloik on the pats because she's upset that she feels like Belichick and Brady are friends with Trump.

And, you know, I don't need to say what side of the fence she's on on that one. And the moment she left, it was like a cloud lifted over the game. Now, she did go home and she does a shrine sometimes for me with the Boston thing where she puts little pictures. Good luck. I think she felt bad that she put the Maloik on the pats and she ended up, she ended up getting the shrine, getting it up. She sent me a picture and it was right around when the comeback happened. So maybe that was another factor that helped.

Thanks to her. My exciting moment was when they won that game and everyone in the room went leaping in the air, including your two kids. It's a moment none of us will ever forget, like anybody who was watching that game, greatest game ever. Greatest game ever you're giving. Wow. That I've seen in my lifetime. I obviously don't remember some of the United games and that they say, that championship game that many people call the greatest game ever. In my lifetime, I've never seen a better game.

You know, we came out as victors and I say we, somebody who loves the Patriots, but. Well, think about it. We had, we started rooting for the Pats in the early seventies and it was, the seventies were pretty miserable. Right. And the eighties were pretty miserable. And then we had the one good year and then we got killed in the Superbowl and there was a cocaine scandal. And then the late eighties were really miserable. And the 80s were pretty miserable. And then we had the one good year, and then we got killed in the Super Bowl, and there was a cocaine scandal. And then the late 80s were really miserable. And the early 90s were even worse. And the team almost moved.

And Parcells and Bledsoe came, made the Super Bowl, lose again, kicked off to Desmond Howard. Parcells left. Pete Carroll. All hell broke loose. Now we're rock bottom again. Belichick shows up we go 5-11 or 6-10

I can't even remember and then Mo Lewis hits Bledsoe and from that point on one of the most unbelievable runs ever in sports and it ends with this you and I talked about it before the game that we've had 16

as football fans, 16 unbelievable years that no other city can really appreciate. And it's probably why so many people across the country are anti-Patriot fans. Oh, I don't think it's probably. I would say it's definitely. Right. It's been a crazy run of good luck and great games, and some that we lost. But just like, you know, this started in 2001, a couple months after 9-11, and goes, I mean, I guess February 2002,

but you start with the tuck roll, which was January 2002, and goes all the way through now. And this, you know, two years ago they won a Super Bowl because on the one-yard line our cornerback jumped a slant route and intercepted the game-winning touchdown. They had studied extensively before the game. And I was just – In preparation. And I was just assuming that that was going to be the greatest Super Bowl win that ever happened for me as a Patriots fan.

And then today happened. I almost can't even process it. Like I just did a podcast with Lombardi and Sauer. We talked about the game a little more technically. But like the whole comeback part and just how crazy that was, I don't think it will set in for a couple weeks. The 0-4 Red Sox, remember that 0-4 Red Sox? We didn't really fully digest what happened until December.

It took two months to sort it out. I feel like this game's going to be like that too. Yeah, I think the more newspaper articles you read, the more repeats of certain plays that they'll play all week long. I understand tomorrow it's obligatory that the MVP of the Super Bowl has a press conference with the commissioner. Did you know that? No. The Monday morning after?

No. That's going to be interesting. Everybody would love to know what Brady said when, out of the blue, Goodell put his hand out and tried to shake his hand, and he did, obviously. It looked like he held the handshake. He held it for a couple extra seconds, Goodell. He just gave him a nice firm one. I kind of wish Brady had pulled his hand away and looked the other way, but he was a gentleman, obviously.

The right move was to be cool about it because he won. He shoved it right in his face, so be cool about it. Yeah, that was – and I was just telling Sal Goodell, definitely hightailed it off the podium. It seemed a little faster. Are you kidding? A little faster than usual. He was gone.

He was off the – if Atlanta had won, he'd still be on the podium. I kept thinking about the end of that game for him was like one of our favorite movies ever, Shawshank. When the warden, the police sirens are coming and he goes and he opens the safe and it's the Bible with the rock hammer in it. And he's like, you're right, you're right, warden. Salvation did come with it. And he just had that look on right, you're right, Warren, and salvation did come with it. And he just had that look on his face. It was a picture that was good to have. Yeah.

Oh, man. With the exception that he didn't pull the gun out and put it under his chin. No, no, thank God. That would have been, that would have marred the whole celebration. Well, we've also, well, hold on, a couple more big picture questions. Okay.

Is Brady now at the top? Yes. Of all the Boston athletes? Would you put him over Bird? Oh, of all the Boston athletes? Yeah. Yes. I think I would, too.

I mean, five championships. I mean, Bird won three. I was thinking... We hoped he'd win a couple more, but it didn't happen. Yeah, the longevity makes it separate. I wasn't there for Russell. The longevity makes it different. Or, obviously, got cut short.

And I wasn't there for Russell either. But you're also talking about a smaller league when Russell played. You're talking about the NFL the last 20 years has gone out of its way to create, in their minds, parity so that there would never be another dynasty. Yeah. And not only have we won five Super Bowls in this century, we've won two of the last three Super Bowls. I know.

That's crazy. And I wrote this a couple weeks ago. You know, this is going to end soon, and then they're going to be like every other team, and, you know, we probably won't win another one, and it will just be like all these other teams. Well, but that's why I said keep Garoppolo around so in five years he can take over.

Okay. I think Brady is the unequivocal one, and I will say, like, when it was 28-9 or whatever, counting the points and trying to figure out how he'd come back, it was really only because of him. It wasn't like anyone else on the team was playing well. It wasn't like you're thinking, oh, the defense. The defense played well in the second half,

but not to the degree that you would think they had any. That would have been the fulcrum of it. Obviously we needed Brady and, and, you know, he was there, he was still locked in. He was getting the shit kicked out of him. And you, because you left to go do the podcast, you missed a lot of the interviews with the other Patriot players. Yeah.

And to a person, to a man, every one of them brought up how Brady would not let them lose. Yeah. How they had confidence in Brady. How Brady made them feel like any comeback was possible. I mean, he's such a unique... We won't see his likes again. No.

Maybe in Boston, but certainly not in the NFL. Well, we felt that with Bird. When Bird was done, we knew. I mean, we knew it was never going to be the same,

but then, man, that void the next six, seven years and then you go back and you go, oh, I wish I had appreciated that more. And then,

and then, you know, it'll be like that with Ortiz to a lesser degree. I don't, you know, obviously, shorter career and he's a DH and it's just hard for him to have the same day-to-day impact

that somebody like Brady had. No, but he did win three championships. He did, yeah. Just like Bird. Yeah. But, you know, there's going to be a void, but it's baseball. There's a lot of guys on the team. The Brady thing, you know, I just think the beating that he took in that game

and all the passes he threw, 62. Well, you know, in his press conference, which I think you missed, he talked about he really got beat up. Yeah. And he did. Not in the fourth quarter, obviously. As you and I were talking during the fourth quarter, it was obvious Atlanta got tired.

And Coach Quinn in his press conference said they really got tired. Did you know that Atlanta ran 46 offensive plays? Yeah, 46 to 93. We ran 93? Yeah. Unprecedented. Never heard of before. No wonder they were tired.

Next question. Is that the greatest Boston win? For you? Of all of them? I think so. I think so because you know when in the Bird Championship

those three championship years We never had the hammer great win. No, we never did. I mean, the 86 team, you know, we played Houston, and we never felt like Houston was going to beat us. 84 game seven was great, but that wasn't a very well-played game. It was super exciting and incredibly we were both there.

It was the passion and everything was just off the charts. But it wasn't like a magical game. You know, you wouldn't watch it a hundred times. The only thing I could compare it to for me in my lifetime were the Yankee games in 2004. That's what I was thinking. Yeah, I mean, we're down 3-0. Because we were there. Yeah, we were there.

We went to the games. We're down 3-0. Yeah, we were there. We went to the games. We're down 3-0. Nobody had ever come back from 3-0 in the playoffs. And I think it's comparable. For me, they're two of my best memories ever. Yeah, I would say it's comparable because of how insane the game was. And also, you know know the last two years of the flake gate and the end of brady's career and this possibly being the last brady belichick

thing i i think you know it's tough to compete with 86 years of getting your ass kicked but um well the irony is just what you just said i just read an article on ESPN that the Patriots are the overwhelming favorite to win the Super Bowl next year. Pretty funny. The Malcolm Butler game was pretty crazy. The first pet, the Pats beating the Rams was way up there. I mean, we just had a really, really fortunate win. The Malcolm Butler game, though, I always felt that that game,

we should have won that game more handily and it never should have been that close so it was a different feel in that game than this game we're 25 points down in this game have you ever felt worse for another team that we beat to win

a championship I feel awful for the Falcons fans I mean that was that was an absolute car crash of a loss. And that was the one thing that made me feel bad. It was. I know somebody's got to win. I remember you and I in 2008 at Glendale, Arizona, walking out of that stadium, and we felt pretty bad.

So it's hard to compare i know we had but we were going for the perfect season yeah but we already won a couple super bowls i would say you're right it's not quite the same this is more like i mean this is honestly more like the buckner game for them for them yeah you blow a 25 point lead lead. You're on the 23-yard line with the ball up seven. First down, four and a half minutes left. And you haven't won a Super Bowl ever, and you have one title ever. It's pretty bad. But one of the other ironies is that I thought during the first three quarters of this game,

Kyle Shanahan's offensive play calling was superior to McDaniel's. But now, reading online and also a couple of the comments that were made on the NFL network, they're highly criticizing some of his play calls in the fourth quarter. Yeah, I agree. Particularly when they had that third and one and they passed and got strip sacked and da-da-da-da. So it's funny how the warm turns a little bit. Good for us. This has been an unbelievable run.

I don't really know what happened this century, but five Super Bowls, three World Series, a Celtics title, and you got a Stanley Cup. And a Bruins title, yeah. I mean, that's nine. That's nuts. That's pretty unbelievable. The other thing is I'm flying home to Boston tomorrow,

and I'll be at the parade either Tuesday or Wednesday when they hold it, and what a parade that's going to be I will say out of all the parades that have ever happened in Boston I think the ovation for Brady will be the biggest ever right? yep, most definitely

Brady and Belichick obviously yeah, but the Brady and the Goodell and just everything he went through the last two years and the character assassination and all that stuff I think you know it's really hard to explain you know unless obviously all the Pats fans lost their mind over this

the Flakey thing I include myself but to watch him get his revenge and have Goodell have to come over and shake his hand was just a little extra bonus. Well, it was our dream scenario. It really was. We'd get to see him up on the stage with Roger Goodell. Dad, it was fun to watch it.

I'm glad the kids were able to help out. As always, thanks for making me a Boston sports fan. I'll see you when I get home. It was fun to watch it with you and your family. I'm glad I had my heart medication. And hopefully we win number six next year. All right. I'll see you in a little bit.

Thanks. All right. Take care. Bye. That's it for the pod. Thanks to Books. I'm going to send myself flowers. I might send myself some books after another Boston title.

Remember, Valentine's Day is right around the corner. You are almost out of time to send myself flowers. I might send myself some books after, after another Boston title. Remember Valentine's day is right around the corner. You are almost out of time to find a gift. Thankfully books has you covered with a wide array of farm to table and artists and flower bouquets and accessible price. You can save 20% when you order early and you better because these will sell out. Don't wait, go to books.com, get 20% off your order using offer code Bill.

Thanks to Mike Lombardi. Thanks to Cousin Sal. Thanks to my dad. Thanks to Jim Cunningham for coming in on short notice. Thanks to everybody who's been listening during the whole football season. We will be back with more podcasts later in the week. Thanks to Tom Brady and Bill Belichick. What a game.

Wow. All right. See you later in the week. I don't have you