The Bill Simmons Podcast - Ep. 44: Week 17 NFL w/ Cousin Sal

Episode Date: December 29, 2015

HBO's Bill Simmons brings on Cousin Sal to discuss the NFL's final regular season week of the NFL regular season. Topics include: the latest Steelers/Tomlin meltdown, GB issues (8:00 mark), Bill's defense/explanation of NE's loss on Sunday (15:00), Coughlin's future (21:00), NFC and AFC homefield advantage scenarios (29:00), Bill's favorite new streaming series (40:50), the Peyton Manning saga (51:00), Packers-'Sota (1:00:00), Jets-Bills (1:09:00), Andy Reid's Andyreidness and possible Playoff Wonk Teams (1:12:00) and Bill's special holiday gift for Sal! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Happy post-holidays! Today's episode is brought to you by SeatGeek, our presenting sponsor and our favorite app for buying and selling tickets for sports and music. I actually just used it over the weekend and it was awesome. With SeatGeek Marketplace, sell your tickets without getting hijacked by a ridiculous after-the-sale cost. Go to SeatGeek.com slash BS to learn how to buy and sell on SeatGeek. Don't forget to download the free SeatGeek app and our promo code BS and SeatGeek will send you $20 once you've made your first purchase. Today's episode is also brought to you by MeUndies.com, the home of great fitting underwear that happens to be two times softer than cotton. I'm wearing them right now. They just launched a new line of boxers.

Wait a second. They haven't mailed me the boxers yet, Sal. What? How do they launch a new line of boxers. Wait a second. They haven't mailed me the boxers yet, Sal. What? How do they launch a new line of boxers and I don't have any? Stop the read. Well, I'm going to just finish this, but I'm going to finish it sadly because I don't have the MeUndies.com boxers yet.

But if you go to MeUndies.com slash BS, you get 20% off your first order of the world's most comfortable underwear as well as a money-back guarantee if you don't like your first pair. Free shipping in North America. MeUndies.com slash BS. And we're off.

This is a good one. Yeah. Clear enough for you. That's Jim. Jim's here He's helping us out today Tate's I don't know where Tate is

He's traveling the world Tate The Panthers lost And Tate may not be seen again That's it Is that That's true The Panthers lost

And Tate's just gone That's the cuz We love the Week 17 podcast Because there's all these Different possibilities Yeah That we think we know But then as we'll somehow Screw up and then people will tweet at you.

There's especially a ton of things going on this time. There's like 11 playoff spots out of the 12 or somehow in play. How do we not have more defined something at this point? This is supposed to be the easiest week to gamble, and we're owed it after the worst week ever, maybe, of gambling in the NFL last week. Well, we lost a holiday three-teamer. You know, how do you keep roping me into these three-teamers? Oh, come on.

That should have won. So we had a Christmas little Oakland Raiders on Christmas Eve. We had the Warriors money line. We had those two money lines. Money line. That was exciting. Raiders won in overtime. Warriors, that Warriors, Moneyline. We had those two Moneylines. Moneyline. That was exciting. Raiders won in overtime. Warriors, that was a game you had to kind of watch. That's fun.

So then the only one we have to win left is the Steelers against the Ravens. Double-digit favorite. Just have to win the game. Ryan Mallett, Clay Aiken. Who else is on the Ravens? Kamar Aiken. Did one person on the Ravens start in a fantasy Week 16 playoff matchup this weekend? I'm going to say no.

No, I don't think so. I don't think so. And they talk about what a rivalry it is. Oh, well, they won. It's a rivalry. Of course it's going to be fun. I don't buy that. None of these guys were part of the rivalry.

Ray Lewis is calling games on ESPN. Right. And Flacco's out. And I don't think Javorius, Buck Allen, he remembers when Troy Palamalo brought him down with a horse collar back in 09. He doesn't forget. Kamar Aiken, same thing. He will never forget what the Steelers did to him,

knocking him out of the playoffs. Mike Tomlin, come on. NFL rivalries seem to only last three to four years. Like the Niners and the Seahawks was a rivalry for three years. Yeah, right, right, right. And then they have little shelf lives. And I think the Ravens and the Seahawks was a rivalry for three years. Yeah, right, right, right. And then they have little shelf lives and I think the Ravens and the Steelers had a great run.

That's not a rivalry anymore. If our kids who are almost entering junior high school, if their high school has a rivalry with another school, are they pumped up about it now? Right. Oh, that's our rival.

That's our rival. No, they don't even know about it. That's what Buck Allen and Ryan Mallett should have. That's what they should be thinking. You derisively said the words Mike Tomlin. Yeah. I saw a stat that I thought was pretty alarming for Steeler fans and Mike Tomlin fans.

In the last four years, 13 times they've lost to under 500 teams. Wow. That's terrible. Yeah. I mean, some of those games are probably good. It's three and four teams. We actually, we wondered last week, given the Mike Tomlin history, whether this Ravens game would sneak up on them and something weird might happen. And then I came to the conclusion, this narrative all sounds awesome,

but the Ravens are terrible. There's no way the Steelers could. The thing I don't understand is how they only score 17 points. The Steelers? Yeah. 25th ranked defense? They score 17 points. The Ravens are awful.

Bad. Yeah. Well, that was. Pressure on them, too. Pressure. Like, Roethlisberger running for his life almost every play. Week 16 does feel like three-team teasers just get screwed up. There's always one or two or three or something.

You said it last week. You said week 15, 16, or 17. There's there's always something we got by on 15 it seemed too easy last week seattle loses pittsburgh loses who am i missing carolina loses uh that's seattle hang on seattle line was way too high and i didn't have the balls to bet the rams money just because it seems like at least once a year they play one of those teams tough. The Rams are, for whatever reason, a decent NFC West team, and then they suck against everyone else. It's really weird. They have a chance to go 5-1 in the division?

Yeah. We have them to win the NFC, which I still like. I still like that bet. It's looking good. I'd like to congratulate Jeff Fisher for going 8-8 for this 75th straight year. Yeah. He did it.

He's got to be the most mediocre coach in the history of the league. What was it, like six out of 24 years he was above 500 or something? Yeah, something like that. Maybe that's off. Now it's like six out of 25. Maybe that's off. I looked up his career stats, and I think he's still somehow 10 games over 500 because the Titans had that nice little stretch at one point yeah they're all against Seattle so what was the thing that shot that

heading into the playoffs did anything happen in week 16 that shocked you or made you change your mind on the destiny of where we're headed for the Super Bowl yeah I thought Steelers I know we're talking wild card or maybe not even a playoff team here, but Steelers and Seahawks were the team nobody wanted to play in January. And now maybe everybody wants to play them. Maybe. What do you do if you're Minnesota? That's a great Collinsworthy. What do you do?

It's not a fair fight, Al. Come on. If you're Minnesota, we're jumping the gun here a little bit, playing Green Bay. If you win that game, you host a division game against Seattle, or do you want to go to Washington? What would you rather do? Maybe host Seattle.

I don't want to play Washington as the road favorite in Washington when Washington seems to love to play as the underdog against these teams. Yeah, they do. Washington's worst-case scenario is when they're up seven or they're favored by like seven and a half against these teams. Yeah, they do. Washington's worst case scenario is when they're up seven or they're favored by like seven and a half against Brandon Weedon, Q being whoever. I think their worst case scenario is their quarterback taking a knee at the four yard line before half.

I was stunned that everybody was so apoplectic about what happened and perplexed. And Bill Cowher had like a minute long, you can't do that. It's like, obviously he just brain farted yeah right he just lost he just forgot he's you know he's playing quarterback there's a million things going on and he had a brain fart exactly yeah he's still been amazing yeah he'd probably not do it again if he had the choice yeah i guess he has regrets right but he's he's been really good he's gotten better as the year went along and that's not a bad team.

I think he's over 70% passing, I think, which is great in this league. And I think the big tight end has made mediocre quarterbacks, backup quarterbacks successful, even to a point where they can excel in this league. Jordan Reed makes catches that your tight end like 10 years ago just wouldn't catch. These guys are uncoverable. So which team feels more

upset-ish heading into Washington for round one for you? Minnesota or Green Bay? I can't see Aaron Rodgers going into Washington and losing to the Redskins. But I could totally see Teddy Bridgewater losing to them. I could see it

too. But what's going on with this Green Bay team? What are we thinking anymore? What if they even win by a field goal this week? Are they back to being good again? Why was everybody so certain that Green Bay, that wasn't a totally weird game by them? It's like, oh yeah,

they can't block. They can't play defense. Watching the game that Trey Aikman's, who was the announcer? Was it Aikman? I think it was. Was it Aikman and Buck? It makes sense. Whoever it was.

And they're pointing out like, oh, Green Bay is just, they're in major trouble on both sides of the ball. It's like, well, why didn't I know this a week ago? Right, I know. I've watched it. They seem pretty confident. Right.

But they really seem like they can't block. Their receivers are never open, which we knew. And if they are, they drop the ball. How many Devontae Adams drops are we going to watch this year? Yeah. So many. And they can't get that running game going early, which just kills our offense. Eddie Lacy's getting into shape.

It's late December. Yeah, I'm going to write them off as I don't see them winning four straight playoff games. No, you're right. And that's what they'd have to do. If you're just talking about who's going to win the Super Bowl, I think we're down to usually we have like seven teams that you could talk me into. What do you think? Five now. Yeah.

Pats. Anyone else in the AFC? Just one? I mean, would you bet your life on any other AFC team winning? I don't think Osweiler, but who knows? I don't know. It feels like the Pats, the Cards, and the Panthers are at another level than these other teams. That's what I would separate those three. And as a Pats fan, the Cards are the team I don't want to see.

I think we'd have a hard time beating that team. That is damn good team I've been saying it we've been saying it all year and we're gonna make no money off them going to the Super Bowl I know and I like even last week I picked the Packers you did yeah the Honey Badger went out right Rogers be able to throw I think the pass rush would be that fierce but watching them offensively they have they have no fear they're like these other teams play scared you know like yeah third and three we're gonna I didn't think the pass rush would be that fierce, but watching them offensively, they have no fear. They're like, these other teams play scared. You know, like, third and three, we're going to run it or something. Carson Palmer throws downfield to guys you've never heard of, and then, like, now John Brown has to be the household name now, you know?

Right. They have no fear in their offensive game plan, and it's fun to watch, and it pays off. You know, they lucked out with this third down running back. Or maybe it wasn't luck. I mean, it was a good pick. But the fact that he's kind of rounding into shape at the perfect time. Right.

That guy's really good. Yeah. David Johnson. Mm-hmm. You know, running backs. More than Iowa, right? Running backs, you just kind of know one way or the other. It's not like they show fight.

They're either good or they're not. That guy can catch the ball. He can guys miss he can break tackles it's everything you'd want from a running back and they kind of stumbled into him in december definitely and now when i watch them and i think about the pats that the pats the biggest issue the patriots have is the teams that spread out with the receivers and have the one back who can run and catch that's the that's the one recipe like that's what pittsburgh was able to do a couple other teams and the two teams that can do that against the pats in the playoffs are pittsburgh and arizona and i don't know i just i

the the thing i'm holding on to is it's carson palmer but you think at some point he's going to turn into a pumpkin but maybe it just never happened you see a lot of similarities in the Patriots though with the with the Cardinals now obviously I don't want to compare Palmer to Brady but he steps up there he throws yeah throws the receivers you haven't heard of you have the older you have Dwight Freeney you have the defensive playmaker now all of a sudden is just playing out of his mind. I think we have a better front seven. I think Gronk's better than anyone on Arizona, but we,

the thing that kills this Pat's team, the Lewis injury, they've never recovered from. They don't have a running back. It's like they have the guy who can run or they, or they had the James White guy who can catch the ball out of the backfield. But whoever's in there, you know, kind of what they're going to do.

If James White's in there, they're not going to run with him. And if you have there, you know kind of what they're going to do. If James White's in there, they're not going to run with him. And if you have like Brandon Bolden or somebody, he's going to run. He's not going to catch the ball. There's no threat. Like the Jets had them so figured out. That's why I know you're going to get mad at me about this Pats-Jets game. Yeah, go ahead.

I want to talk about it. First of all. Let's talk about it. First of all, it was a very curious game by the Patriots. They almost approached it like a preseason game. Gronk was a decoy the whole game. All right. They never, the only time they ever really sent Gronk over the middle on a pass that he might get hurt on was that fourth and nine.

You know, they just, it was clear that they didn't want him to get hurt they didn't really want to show anything they ran a they ran like weird gimmick things like flea flicker and misdirection stuff and reverses and but they couldn't run the ball at all on the jets and if they don't get that collins td i think they check out of that game so you're saying it's not as much that they didn't take the Jets seriously as maybe they didn't take the game seriously. They don't think they need it as much. I know you want to say they don't want to play Pittsburgh.

I don't know. I think my read on it, having watched all the Pats games this year, was it was not our A game. Right. And I think they wanted to get out of there without getting hurt. That's why when we scored when it was 2019, I thought they were going to go for the two points just to get the game over Right. And I think they wanted to get out of there without getting hurt. That's why when, when we scored when it was 2019, I thought they were going to go for the two point just to get the game over with. I really did. I like, I was surprised when I saw Gus Kowski, but, um, it was so hard to move the ball. The offense scored 13 points in that game. They had one touchdown drive.

The only touchdown drive they had was that last drive, which they needed a fourth and two and a fourth and nine, where Gronk got crushed. And if Calvin Pryor goes eight inches lower, Gronk's knees go out again and the season's over, right? Right. He tackled him conventionally. But it was so hard to score just on that drive. I think Belichick looked at it and he was like,

our defense is playing better than our offense. If we can stop them, we get the ball back around like our 40, and we got to go 30 yards for a field goal. Why is that? Everyone's saying that. The Patriots, we get the ball back at their 40. All right, so if they don't call PI on Butler on third down, we get the ball on our 40.

Why? Where does it kick from? They're kicking from their own 25. Right. Right? So net 35 yards. All right, so we get it on our 35, whatever. On your 35, yeah. So wouldn't you take it on your 35 anyway to start?

No, because we were getting it on like the 15. I don't know about that. I just don't like it. You have Tom Brady on your team. And it's one thing if, like Mike Zimmer back in November kicked off in overtime because of the wind. If there's a factor like that, that's one thing. But you have Tom Brady.

The way they call pass interference like you said these days, the way there are missed tackles, the way kickoffs are run back for touchdown, you've got to take the ball. You have to. We did it two years ago. We kicked off to Denver to start OT. You forget that we have Tom Brady, yes.

Right. But we also had Keyshawn Martin, some dude named Harris, Michael Williams Stephen Jackson who could have been here with us two weeks ago he had no weapons Gronk was the only weapon in the team and it was clear from that game that they weren't going to

expose him over the middle on the Gronk passes one play one Gronk missed tackle away from winning the game on a touchdown I think he got so popped on that fourth and nine I think they were like yeah that's it I don't think they cared if from winning the game on a touchdown. Well, I think he got so popped on that fourth and nine, I think they were like, yeah, that's it. I don't think they cared if they won the game. The bigger question is Adrian Waddell.

Is that his name? Is that your left tackle? Well, that was another thing. The offensive line was decimated. Brady was really good at getting rid of the ball right before he gets popped, unlike your QB who just takes the hit every time and now has to have a plate grafted onto his collarbone. He's a man. What are you going to do? He's a man.

Takes the hit. Football. And you would never make fun of him for it either. Not you. You would. Sure. But no Patriot fan thinks, oh, Brady, come on, take the hit, man. It's smart. He's saving himself for the playoffs. But they're showing Waddle on the bench. I like that it's Le'Adrian. Brady, come on, take the hit, man. It's smart. He's saving himself for the playoffs, but

they're showing Waddle on the bench. I like that it's Le'Adrian. I think it's Le'Adrian Waddle. DeWaddle, who I can't say I'd heard of until about four weeks ago, and it's like, oh, this guy's out? Oh, no. It's Brady on his back yelling, Le'Adrian!

Why are you doing this to me? You can't win, Tom. I feel like we've used over 10 offensive linemen this year. And I don't know how many left tackles we've had. And then Vollmer goes down. I just think they wanted

to get out of that game. They knew they'd have to win in Miami. Miami's given up on this season. They didn't want to show their Jets anything because they might, you know,

they might have to see them again. So they ran, I don't know, it was a gimmicky game. All right. they might have to see them again. So they ran. I don't know. It was a gimmicky game. All right. I would have gone for two. Maybe go for two. You got to take the ball in overtime.

I don't even care what the stats say. You take the ball in overtime. It's like a slap fight. You go first or second. You go first. You don't know if you're going to go. You're going to be around for a second. The real advantage of having the ball first in overtime is if you think you can go down and score a touchdown and i don't think belichick thought they could go down and

score a touchdown he just watched a drive where they probably shouldn't have even scored a touchdown on that drive right so i don't know all right let's talk about uh the playoff implications we got 11 games that matter and we can cross off the colts need like nine things to win, right? I think one of them is that the Texans' plane goes down. They didn't put that at number 10. I think that's number seven. Or the Texans don't land in the stadium or the city where the game is.

Right, we could have the Colts. We could cross them off. Really, the most cut and dry ones are whoever wins Packers-Vers Vikings gets the three seed. So we know that if the Jets win, they're in the playoffs and the Steelers are out. We know that everything else is like, this has to happen that. So we'll just go through it. We're going to do a meaningless first, right?

Yeah. We'll do the week 17 lines. I wanted to mention quickly though, uh, don't forget to subscribe to the BS podcast as well as the channel 33 podcasts on iTunes, SoundCloud, or Stitcher. All links are available at bill Simmons podcast.com, or you can subscribe to the,

uh, at channel 33 Twitter feed where we're just about at 20 million listens for the BS pod and in, in just three months. So thanks for spreading the word for us. Channel 33 is going great too. And if you like the movie Heat, we put up a little holiday episode, me and Chris Ryan breaking it down for an hour.

It was the deepest of deep dives. You like that movie? Yeah, I did. I don't know why you stopped at an hour. You felt like it could have kept going. It could have kept going. Yeah. It's one of those, we could have gone three hours. Right. Yeah. yeah i love that movie it's also living here makes that movie even more fun they

did get rid of cape manuel anyways anyway all right so uh we're gonna go with meaningless games first there's five of them now these are all all 16 games are division games and they've teams have played each other i'm gonna give the score of the first time whether you like it or not uh the first time these two teams played okay what do we have giants eagles first yeah by the way i counted them we had a lot of crap for some reason we didn't do the patriots game the last week possibly the last two weeks we forgot to do them we forgot to do the pats jets game that's jets right yeah and the real tragedy of that was i was going to go through my whole case for how I worried that the Pats weren't going to really give their A game in the game which I did with house to send the Jets were one of my picks but I was going to throw this whole thing at you like

this would feel very Belichickian if they just kind of went vanilla and threw this game away and then you would be oh shut up Simmons yeah then we could have played it back recorded that anyway yeah but we ended up not picking the game at all, which was great. I counted, though. There were 16 here. We're going to go through all the games. All right, so I have Giants at home laying two and a half to the pathetic Eagles. What do you have?

I don't know why I went so high. I said five, but it is three. You get that one. Do you want to say sayonara to the 2015 Giants? Yeah, I think so. Okay. Because I think their fans still are saying to each other, hey, if we get in, watch out.

We've been here before. No, no, you can't get in. You've been eliminated. You know, we say this is meaningless, but it actually has meaning because the loser, we say these are loser leaves town matches. This is loser leaves country. The loser plays the Rams in London next October.

Oh, wow. Yeah. It's like the third place, fourth place, however it matches up. The loser leaves the country match. Right. Philly won 27-7 on Monday night back in October. Yeah, loser leaves country. I think when your best player blows off part of his hand in a fireworks accident

and then you start out the season with one of the worst time management losses of this century. Oh, yeah. Bad omens. The Dallas, yeah. Yeah. It's just the Giants, just one of those years where it didn't happen. Would you keep Kauflin or no? I think it's, have we said this before?

Like, you know, you don't want to say like someone should stop driving at a certain age until you see three times in a week an 80-year-old man drives through the farmer's market and takes out 10 people. But maybe there is an age where you can't coach in the National Football League. And I say National Football League to sound more important. Like 70? Maybe 28. How old's your dad? Yeah, my dad's 74, and he wouldn't come close to being able to get through you know the preseason yeah my dad's 68 and i i feel good when i found out that he walked to a

winter celtic game when it was a little icy and i got home without falling right right right so running the giants i think would be a little beyond him at this point biggest media yeah you don't want to deal with that no it's weird like you know no one's going to vote for the president if he's running at 74 right no well bernie sanders he's close yeah he's lingering i don't think he's gonna make um as a cowboys fan do you want tom coffin to come back sure yeah yeah it's better for the cowboys if he comes back yeah there's gonna be decisions like week one even though that was eli's fault completely but what's your worst case scenario for a new giants coach is there anybody out there is if he comes back. Yeah, there's going to be decisions like week one, even though that was Eli's fault completely. What's your worst case scenario for a new Giants coach?

Is there anybody out there that scares you? The best case scenario is Jason Garrett goes to the Giants. What's your worst case scenario? I don't know. No one out there scares me anymore. Do we even talk about Cower anymore and these guys that haven't coached in almost a decade? I think it's tough to be out of the loop for that long yeah for meal did it though right for meal was out for yeah 12 15 years

and it actually worked and he was successful i don't know if you do it anymore like look at chip kelly can't even go from college like that that should be a less of a step than coming back and not having anything to do with football for nine years, aside from calling it. By the way, thanks, Chip Kelly. We find out after the Washington game, two and nine on short weeks. Well, that makes sense. Chip Kelly's Eagles are two and nine in the 11 games that they played on a short week. Thanks.

Where was that stat before? I hate those. I also hate when the announcers tell us something in the first quarter that single-handedly would have changed my pick. Right. Well, they felt like they could attack their nickelbacks. Like, oh, great. Couldn't you have tweeted that the night before, Chris Collins? Unbelievable.

Well, two terrible seasons for those teams. We have the Bears and the Lions in Chicago. Yeah. You're going to get this one. Yeah, the Bears by three. Yep. I said four. I don't know why I went so high.

It's minus one only. Minus four. I don't know why I went so high. It's minus one only. Minus one? I don't know why. So people like the end-of-the-year Lions a little bit. I guess so. I played gutty in New Orleans and beat up on the Niners. Yeah. You know what?

37-34 in overtime this game. Let's do each other a favor and not talk about either of these two teams again. Yeah, we can go past this one. Rams at San Francisco. I had Rams minus six. All right, this is a 425 Eastern game. You said Rams minus six. I think we split this.

I said Rams by two only, and it's four. Oh, wow. Rams by four. This feels like the Jim Tomsula farewell. You like the Rams? I think Jim Tomsula. You think they get one year, huh? Yeah, I do.

I don't think they knew what to do after Harbaugh left, and I think they go big on a new coach. It's so tough when your quarterback just disappears, which is what Kaepernick did. I guess it's injury and everything now. You're going to be so scared of him next year in the Eagles. Kaepernick did. Yeah, I guess injury and everything now, but. You're going to be so scared of him next year in the Eagles. Kaepernick or Tom Sula? Is it a package deal?

Kaepernick on the Eagles would be really interesting and I hope it happens. What did they do with DeMarco Murray though? God, that was a weird signing when it happened. And now I just don't know what they do. Everything Chip did as a GM was either strange, weird, unexplained. Yeah, and yet people still picked the DeMarco Murray Cowboys not re-signing him as the top two reasons they didn't make the playoffs this year. Like, well, you had a good thing going with DeMarco Murray.

You got rid of him. I'm like, what? Darren McFadden had more rushing yards than he did. I'm pretty sure. The biggest screw-up of the Cowboys was not really appreciating how good Brandon Whedon was. Yeah, I guess so. You didn't give him enough love and time.

That just kills me, honestly. Him and Hopkins now, they're like Dan Fouts and John Jefferson in the late 70s. Remember how crazy I was about Tebow lighting it up and everyone loving Tebow? Brandon Whedon's much worse for you? This is worse. I mean, because not even

five years later, it's the same season and now they say Mallet is out of, not Mallet Hoyer, is out of concussion protocol, so maybe he'll play, but I can't believe this, Dan. I'm worried about you you always lose in gambling when you're just completely irrational. Yeah, you're right. I could see you doing

a three-teamer with Wheaton involved betting against Wheaton that he burns you and you just disappear for like a week and a half. That could be it for me. And it would be Chiefs that blew it. It's just playing out perfectly for us. Just perfect. Andy Reid laying like four and a half in Houston.

All right, your team. Playing the Washington professional football team at home. How about this? Two NFC East games are meaningless. Yeah. All the NFC East games. I think I would argue all 17 weeks were meaningless. I have the Washington team favored by four and a half.

Dallas won 19-16 on Monday night. You have Washington favored by four and a half. Yeah. I said Washington favored by four and a half. Yeah. I said Washington favored by three. It's Dallas favored by three. What do they think? Washington's going to rest everyone? I guess they're going to have to rest everyone.

Why would you want to win this game? Why would Dallas want to win? Don't you want to? Wouldn't you get like the third pick in the draft? Isn't it nice sweeping the NFC's champions? No, who cares? I'll take the third pick. We're winners out in Dallas.

I can't imagine why you'd want to win this game. I think it's either going to be fourth or fifth pick, no matter what. Win or lose. San Francisco has something to do with this. Well, the Falcons are our last meaningless game. They're home. Right. They won their Super Bowl last week by any Carolina season.

Probably celebrate a little too much. Right. They won their Super Bowl last week by ending Carolina's season. Probably celebrated a little too much. Maybe. Considering they had such a collapse over the course of the year. But I have them favored by four and a half over the Saints. Okay. I had four, and it's exactly four. So I get that. So what was your takeaway from the Panthers game?

Did you watch it? Yeah, I did. I don't know. They were just due for a stinker, right? Yeah, that was it I think they're like a 14-2 team anyway But yeah, so they probably shouldn't be losing to the Falcons But Falcons are decent, you know

They just lose at the end most of the time I thought it made sense Even though I had the Panthers on a teaser No matter how good you are Yeah You're gonna have one shit game Right The Pat shit game was philly and then

they were you know banged up whatever but it was still it was things happen dumb return dumb turnover and all of a sudden you're losing right the julio jones ridiculous matt ryan up for grabs which was smart because that you should probably do that with julio jones five times a game goes up makes an insane turns the game around. That's when you kind of thought, oh, okay. Atlanta's actually might win this game. Because I felt like Carolina was just going to do what they've done all year as I was watching it.

Yeah. And are they relieved, you think? They must be relieved to a certain extent, the Panthers. Yeah, I think. Get that out of the way. Having gone through it in 07 with my favorite football team, there's an added weight to it that's just, it can't be good if you're trying to win the Super Bowl.

Right. Just can't. That whole season was just the media scrutiny and the pressure of it. And the Pats were so exhausted by it, by the AFC title game. Phil Rivers kind of hung in there against the 07 Pats. I think that was the year he had the torn ACL. Oh, right, yeah. Remember?

He should have beaten that team by 40 points. The Pats kind of limped to the Super Bowl mentally a little bit. Well, now what it does is it forces Carolina to play in Week 17. And I don't think that's a bad thing for a team that's going to get a bye. You don't want to go a month with a meaningless game from the last meaningful game. The Pats are like that, too. They have to actually give a crap about this Miami game, which is good.

Same thing. Well, let's go to the – these games aren't meaningless. There's a couple of them. There's two of them here. They're both AFC South games. You labeled them sadly not meaningless. Yeah, right. All right, you go.

Well, no, Texans home for Jaguars. I have the Texans by six, even though I'm not positive who the Texans quarterback is. You get that exactly. I said five. Yeah, we still don't know if it's Hoyer or the great Brandon Whedon. Then I have the Colts by six at home against Tennessee. And I legitimately don't know who the Colts quarterback is.

What is going on with just take, put Hasselbeck out of his misery. The guy, it's a torture chamber he's entering every week. Right? It is. Now, Whitehurst is out too. And Luck might not be able to come back we've both had to uh put dogs down and i don't mean to demean how traumatizing that is but the hasselbeck thing is starting to remind me that a little bit because they always say the signs when you're putting

your dog down is like the dog's not moving the dog's uh doesn't want to eat right the dog just says that look to them like just please just take me yeah and that's when you don't want to admit it but deep down you kind of know it's time and Hasselbeck has that look to me he's just like just don't start me again please please don't put me out there basically saying it isn't it he's like I'm just your dog could talk that's that would be the only difference. Like, yeah. All he's missing is Mickey going, stay down. Yeah. Stay down. Maybe Adrian, too.

I'm sorry. What did you say this number was? Tennessee at Indy. I had the Colts by six, but you could tell me five points either way. No, you're right. It's exactly six. I said seven. Colts won this 35-33 in September.

Just quickly. Yeah. So we have this 35-33 in September. Just quickly. Yeah. So we have it. Here's what happens. Here's what has to happen for the Colts to make the playoffs. They need to beat the Titans. The Jags need to beat the Texans. The Falcons need to beat the Saints, which I don't understand.

I don't understand why any NFC team has anything to do with anything here. Is that in there really? Yeah. Oh, it's strength of schedule probably. Maybe. The Bills need to beat the Jets. The Dolphins need to beat the Patriots. That's going to happen. That's not happening. The Ravens need to beat

the Bengals. Not inconceivable. Broncos need to beat the Chargers. The Steelers need to beat the Browns. And the Raiders need to beat the Chiefs. That also seems inconceivable. Do they have this posted? This is played in Indy.

Are they going to list this? It's like a 3,001 parlay, I think. Something like that. It's not going to happen. I'm going to say it's not going to happen. Well, the first thing happened yesterday. They needed to. First of the 10.

So now we have five games that will affect the bye week teams. Right. And the first one is Card seahawks in arizona if the cards win um and the panthers lose let's just do both of them together the cards win and the panthers lose cards are the one seed if the panthers win they're the one seed cards are the two seed either way these are the top two seeds i have the cards by 7 at home against Seattle and I have the Panthers by 11 at home against Tampa. Alright, I had... This is going to get

confusing. I had cards by 3. It's 4.5. Really? Yeah, because they may start sitting, guys, halfway through as soon as they see that Carolina score. And we both had 11 and it was 10.5. But this is the important thing to know and I'm on board with half. But this is the important thing to know.

And I'm on board with you would screw this NFL. The Carolina game was an early game. And that would have let us make a nice parlay with Carolina Moneyline and Seattle. Remember the golden era of being able to do that? They moved it. We made a lot of money in the 2000s. They changed it. Yeah, they changed it.

They made that Carolina game late so you can't get an advantage, the gamblers. They're really just screwing the gamblers, and shame on them after last week for doing that. This was before there was a sophistication in the media and stuff about gambling, where we realized for about four straight years that there were ways to rig parlays so that you attach the second and third teams to the result of the first team. You basically locked it down with the first game. Can do it can't do it anymore so mad at that so you're saying if the panthers are up 20 to 3 at halftime the cards basically rest everybody second i think so right but the other thing is i don't know if seattle's trying to win either

well hold on seattle killed minnesota i know we don't know if Seattle's trying to win either. Seattle killed Minnesota. I know we don't like the way they played last week, but... Here's Tampa's last five. Lost to the Colts. Beat the Falcons by four. Lost to the Saints by seven. Lost to the Rams by eight. And lost to the Bears by five.

They are six and nine right now. Are we sure that Jameis can't get fired up for this game and at least kind of hang around for a half? Cause I think that Carol, that Arizona line's potentially too low. Carolina's got to be really pissed, but Doug Martin also going for a rushing title is another thing. So they might just pound him. This is like, we, we see this in this in 16 and 17, those two weeks.

The team that's not going to make the playoffs, so this is their Super Bowl. Right. It can't be ruled out for Tampa here. I guess it's not. But if Carolina, don't you think, so this is what we talk about with the undefeated. Like Carolina, I think, is angrier for this game

than they would have been if they were 15-0. So what's their running back situation? Because Fozzie Whitaker's out now too, right? And then Jonathan Stewart's not back. Artist Curtis Payne. Disney star Cameron Artist Payne. Yeah, he's back in there. Fresh off his five-season stint on Jesse.

Right. Man, that line seems high to me. I know. I think it's going to be low scoring. So you're saying the Seahawks, if, let's see. So the Seahawks are the five seed if they win and the Packers beat the Vikings. Yes. I have all this written down.

That's right. Because they beat the Vikings. If the Seahawks lose yeah they're the succeed no matter what happens and they would play the winner of green bay minnesota they'd go there right you're saying they would rather do that than go to washington i think they beat yes i think so i think so what's the difference they? They already beat up on Minnesota. Well, so if you go to Washington, you know you're playing Carolina in round two. If you're the sixth seed, you know you're playing Carolina in round two if you win round one.

I would rather play Carolina than Arizona. Right. Okay, yeah, that's thinking way ahead. But, yeah, I think... So potentially they could show Arizona nothing in this game, throw the game, take the sixth seed, know they're playing the winner in the NFC North, and then go and just throw it all at Arizona. It sounds crazy, but I'm more scared of Kirk Cousins at home

than I am of now Rodgers or Bridgewater. Yeah, I keep wanting to turn on Kirk Cousins, and I just can't find it in me. There's no reason to do it. He's actually confident. If the Vikings, if the Packers lose, they're the five seed no matter what. Yeah, because they beat Seattle. Right.

If the Vikings lose and the Seahawks win, the Vikings are the six seed. Mm-hmm. All right. Yeah. So we'll do that game later. Let's talk about the three potential bye week teams in the afc we have pats at dolphins broncos home for the chargers bangles home for the ravens so i had patriots minus eight at miami at the broncos minus 11 at home for san diego and i have the bangles minus 13 and a half at

home against baltimore what do you have no wait let's slow down i wait patriots so so minus eight have eight. Okay, I had six and a half. It's nine. So you get that one. That line should not be under 10. They won 36-7 back in October. Yeah, and they might even...

I wouldn't be shocked if you saw Edelman in this game. Really? Yeah. Wow. Playing? Yeah. Wow. Just to have them run around a little bit, take a couple hits.

So you like the Patriots much more than you like the Panthers to win? Yeah. You do? Well, I also, there's two things going on with the Pats. One is that they actually need to win the game. And then two, the Dolphins have thrown the season away. So bad. I mean, they lost to an absolutely atrocious Colts team.

They lost to Charlie Whitehurst who got put on IR. Did he get hurt during the game or after? Well, both, I think. I don't know. Some other dude came in at some point. Yeah, it's a mess over there. The Dolphins have, I don't know. I actually think they have some talent.

They brought in the interim coach, and he was just as bad as the original coach. Right, Campbell, yeah. And they're so bad at home, too. Like, why do they do this to the fans? So, so bad at home. You know what turns out to be a terrible idea? Is just spending just a shitload of money on one defensive player. Yeah, right.

Has it ever worked? No. Peppers, I guess. No, Peppers didn't even work. How many sacks does he have? Reggie White is like the only time it's worked that I can remember. Yeah. But Sue, they had salary cap issues anyway,

and they go and they spend all this money on Sue anyway. I don't know. I'm seeing Miami Dolphins. Dominick and Sue continues huge year. I'm sure he's doing fine, but for what they paid him compared to what their salary cap is. Maybe this is the onion I'm reading. That's weird.

All right. So I won the Pats. Broncos minus 11 against the Chargers. How's that one looking? Let me find this. Chargers have 17 players on IR. Oh, I get this. You went a little high there.

I said seven and a half, and it's eight. Jesus. Would you make a last night's the latest ridiculous Broncos win of the season? I thought those teams were almost identical. You have capable backups who seem to miss the long ball by

an inch. Demarius Thomas just missed a long touchdown. A.J. Green just missed a long touchdown. Capable backups backups and then you have defenses who play for a half like there's no way anyone's gonna score on that and then just have like three drives in a row like oh my god what's going on opposing quarterbacks going down the field I thought I don't know I could have gone either way I did not enjoy the game and I found myself drifting over to monday night raw i watched a lot of monday night raw with my son you did uh vince incredible vince mcmahon last night just incredible he was a game oh he brought his a game he he he their ratings are down right and clearly he's like

i'm stepping in and he just came in he's just they brought cena back who wasn't even supposed to come back he's like i can't get i can't give birth people probably won't even the wrestling fans won't buy that but i can get arrested right and they did like tmz has all these reports oh yeah cops are getting called for in real life yeah so then uh there was some basketball on i was watching freaking brooklyn won and made me so mad it drives me crazy when when Brooklyn wins. And I just wasn't that interested in the game. And I don't totally understand why other than the fact that it just wasn't well played. It was just two backup quarterbacks. Right.

I think I'm out on Osweiler. You are, huh? Unless he's hurt. Maybe I'll do a little caveat if he might be hurt. So inconsistent. Well, let's wait for Al Jazeera to write an article about him. I don't know which quarterback. That reminds me.

Have we not talked? We haven't talked about that. Have you seen the new show on Hulu? No. It's such a crazy coincidence. What is it? It's about this sports radio talk show host. His name is Al Jazeera.

Oh, wow. And he won't change his name. He won't do it? Remember who played Christopher who played christopher moltosanti on uh the sopranos michael imperioli oh yeah yeah it's him it's his comeback yeah oh good it's al jazeela and they keep time in the whole the first episodes about he's he's kind of on the rise he got into it late and uh and he's Sirius He's a national host I like that And they really wanted him to change his name He won't do it He won't

He's close to his family His family lives around there Jazeela is their family name Right, right, right His name's Al What about Alfred Jazeela? No, he's like, my name's Al And it's about the trials and tribulations of him

And how does it end up? Does he blow up? I only saw the first one Don't even tell me First one It was him and the program director end up does he blow up i only saw the first one you know don't even tell me the first one it's it was him and the program director we don't head to head that's great yeah it's good maura tyranny's sister is in it really yeah it's not maura tyranny it's her sister becky tyranny becky tyranny yeah younger i think it's a half sister oh i'm excited so yeah it's good i had hulu it's good i saw one i don't you know saw one I don't want to compete

This one, Al Jazeel is better It's for a different group It's an adult film I don't want to get anyone in trouble It streams on the Food Network Food Network app It streams on It's a New Year's Eve thing

It's called New Year's Adams and Eve It's an adult film it's it's adam carolla adam driver uh before he did star wars like it's early like a week now not just like a week before star wars and adam vinitieri and it's a foursome with eve eve plum uh jan oh how's she looking she's looking pretty good she gets it together for this thing is it sponsored by mangreer It might be sponsored by Mangria. It's a foursome. Well, you have to see.

And it's New Year's Eve. And actually, Seacrest makes a cameo. He counts down the last 10 seconds. I always knew Carolla was going to do porn. Isn't that great? I just always assumed it was going to be a solo porn, though. He got mad that she yelled Marcia, Marcia, Marcia in the middle of it. But he wanted his name

yeah well look out for those shows we're excited about this uh all right the uh bangles ravens i had minus 13 and a half we did broncos chargers we did i did uh 11 for that you said you got it yeah all right bangles uh what'd you say for bangles minus 13 and a half. Oh, wow. Oh, yeah. I went way high. You sure did. I hit it exactly. I said minus seven. What? Yeah, it's only minus seven. And who knows?

With A.J. McCarron might not be quarterback. Wait a second. The Steelers were favored by 11 in Baltimore. Right. I had coffee with McCauay a half hour ago. That's crazy. Yeah. We could be Keith winning at quarterback, the sixth rounder,

if McCarron's wrist doesn't check out. So if the Pats win, they clinch home field. Right. If the Bengals win and the Broncos lose, the Bengals get the two seed. If the Broncos win, they get a two seed. If the Broncos win and the Pats lose, the Broncos get the one seed. Right. So there you go.

I think it's going to be the way it is now. And we have our, I should say, another bizarre. I mean, people should just get a hold of our text exchange and bet accordingly because the Broncos were down 14-0. And I said, our AFC West bet is looking strong. With the Chiefs at plus 300 from a million years ago. Chiefs 3-1 to win the AFC West. And you're like, yeah, it is.

There you go. And then the cavalcade began. Like, Broncos score, score, score. I'm holding on to a 10% sliver of a hope that Phil Rivers is not afraid of going into whatever my Ohio is called right now right doing his thing he's won games in denver i could denver fans even though the chargers are a mess and decimated the whole thing denver fans a tiny bit scared of of phil rivers right combined with the osweiler not looking totally great thing how about cj anderson by the way oh yeah fumbles

gets basically not knocked out but unquestionably compromised right? Yeah. Like if that's boxing that's a 10-8 round the way he went down and didn't get up. Sure yeah. And then came back like a quarter later. That was it. He's like oh there's C.J. Anderson he's back. Yeah. He's back? Very strange. He's staggered off. He was carried off by two people. Very strange yeah. He's back. Concussion

protocol. I think they ran the ad for concussion like in the commercial break where they were taking a look at him. Yeah. Well, let's talk about Manning quickly. Actually, before we do this, I think this is a great time to talk about our friends at Simply Safe Home Security. We have a lot of friends now. We didn't have as many friends last year. Anyone who's helped sponsor this

podcast i always get excited when i see tv ads for them i saw simply safe tv ad i was like hey what's happening hey buddy our boys growing up yeah um well they worked with me to put together a massive security arsenal for our listeners entry sensors motion sensors glass break everything you need to stop criminals from ever touching your home. And right now, even though it's technically the Christmas is over, but it's still the holiday season. Uh, my friends at simply safe are offering our listeners an absolutely incredible package, $100 off a special holiday package that i helped create for them you get complete protection for your home again all hand-picked by me because i don't know i have thoughts on home security yeah of course i

like to know like i i have i like to weigh in on hey you should do this you should do that you did a whole podcast with chris ryan on uh home security yeah and heat heat's one of the great home security movies of all time uh no contracts no commitments and right now our special post-holiday gift to you get 100 off my hand-picked security package go to simply safe bill.com save 100 of my security pick simply safe bill.com we may have to get simply so i know you want to talk about Manning but Our friend Brad Won the

Fantasy league Yeah And he hadn't made the playoffs In six years He had been kicked out of the league Two out of the last Three years Yep

And so now the guy who kicked him out He's gone Paul Coors It's not looking good for him No it doesn't look good Kicked him out two times In three years Right

So that's it But here's what I'm worried about I'm worried about the trophy We have a nice trophy That that's it. But here's what I'm worried about. I'm worried about the trophy. We have a nice trophy that's been in the league for 20 years. I'm worried about giving Brad this trophy because I won last year. I have to hand it to him at our banquet. Oh, yeah. So maybe I can get SimpliSafe to set up Brad's apartment.

I think you do. I think you have to do it. He doesn't live in the greatest part of town. No. I think it would be nice to get SimpliSafe to rig know, rig it up and make sure that that's only half the battle. There is a chance also Brad will melt down the trophy and sell it for a case of a Mountain Dew or worse. But, um, but I do worry about us never seeing that trophy again. All right. I'm going to talk to my friends at simply safe about this. If anyone's how a partner needed protection,

it's Brad. Cause I don't want to lose the trophy. Exactly. Brad recommended this show to me called American Crime that was on ABC last year. This is a real show. This is a real show. Not quite as good as Al Jazeela. No, it had Timothy Hunt and Felicity Huffman, all these people. And Brad said it was the best network TV show he'd ever seen. Wow. Sent me a series of texts yesterday, uh, imploring me to watch it. So last night after the football game, uh, I wrote my wife into watching the first episode, which was on Amazon. And, uh, and we ended up banging out four and it's really good. Is it good? Yeah. I recommend it. ABC had it. Yeah. Oh, I'm interesting. It was one of those

weird things where they premiered it on Hulu as it was on ABC. You could binge watch it on Hulu. And I don't think America was quite ready for it. Really? But it was really good, I got to say. Excellent. Shout out to Brad. All right.

I'm going to watch it. It was a big week for Brad. Congrats to Brad. He watched it twice, you said? 11 episodes? Brad said he watched all 11 episodes twice. Hold on. Quickly, before we get to meaning.

I do want to mention how ridiculous fantasy football is one last time. Yeah, please do. Because Brad won our league. Hold on. I've got to find it. Brad won our league with a team that just makes no sense whatsoever. You just would not think like, oh yeah, that's the team that should have definitely won our league. So.

I'll pull it up here. No, I have it. All right, so his quarterback for week 16 was Tyrod Taylor. He had D'Angelo Williams get 27 points from him. By the way, waived by me in like week four. Yeah. Matt Forte, who he spent like $100 on or something.

Right. Brandon Marshall, really nice pick. I think he paid for him. Good pick. Deshaun Jackson, four points. Omari Cooper, another guy he picked, gave him one point. Walker, the tight end on Tennessee. Yeah.

Hauschka, the Seattle kicker. And the Rams defense, which I waved in like week eight. And he got 17 points for them. On his bench, Rivers, Bradford, Langford, DeMarco Murray, didn't even start him, and that was his most expensive guy, Joke Bell, Michael Floyd, Kendall Wright, Richard Rogers, and Carpenter. Here's my point. It's so stupid.

It's really idiotic. I actually might send my daughter to pick my team next year. Oh, really? Yeah, I'm thinking about it. She can't do better or worse than... I know. I know, I know. I'm looking at how much he must have spent.

Like Forte, in that starting lineup, he probably, of his $200 he spent, it's probably like $58 total. Tyrod Taylor, D'Angelo Williams, all pickups. Deshaun Jackson, no one wanted. Cooper's fine. I had Rogers and Carson Palmer, which I drafted.

I drafted Odo Beckham, Larry Fitzgerald, Jarvis Landry, and Julian Edelman. I drafted Dion Lewis. I drafted who should have been one of the top 10 guys. I drafted Dion Lewis. I drafted. Right. Who should have been one of the top ten guys. Yeah.

I traded for Eifert in week one. Nobody wants to hear us talk about the fantasy team. It's just like, I did a better job. You didn't do a great job. And Brad won the title. It bothers me. The consolation game, Bill Simmons started Odell Beckham Jr. Now, I don't know if you'd heard that he was suspended.

No, I did. My other choice was Travis Benjamin. I wanted to prove a point. Travis Benjamin at two points. It's a difference of like $250 and you have OBJ in your life. I wanted to show support for a great season that he had for me. All right, Peyton Manning. All right, yeah.

So, what was your take? My thing is the angrier these guys get, the more I believe them. The more you believe that they're innocent. Yeah, the more I believe that they're innocent. They say you shouldn't say anything in court. You must be quiet. If you're a defendant, no, stand up and say, I did not kill that girl. Right.

The jurors would believe it. And I believe it. And I just, you know, Al Jazeera, this, you know, this form that from Qatar, like, I think that's the only place Manning didn't go to get neck surgery. Qatar. I don't know. I don't think it happened. Now they're backing off. Now they're saying, we didn't say that.

We just said that this was all sent to his wife. We didn't make the link that he was. they did seem like they audibled on that but it also seems like that guy might have actually worked there in 2011 or at least that was what their information found i i don't know i have a bunch of different thoughts but my main thought is this like the guy had four neck surgeries and if he wanted to take hgh to help him heal to try to get back on the football field and he technically wasn't even really on a team. I mean, he wasn't playing that year. He was about to get released.

Ethically, I don't have a problem with it. Is it any different than taking a shitload of painkillers? I feel like... Whether he did it or not, these guys have a 10 to 16 year shelf life. I'm okay with it. I am too too and I know it's hypocritical And we're going to hear about this But I do think there's a difference If you're trying to regenerate nerves in your neck

Versus the Russian Who's trying to break the Clean and jerk record For steroids I don't know There's a big difference between this and luis gonzalez not that he's innocent or guilty but when he jumps from like 16 homers to 58 yeah that seems a little different than a guy getting back in the field or barry bonds the second shelf life his career had or clemens who looks like he's almost done in boston

as an ace and then rolls off to cy young's and has a soul. How do you keep track of it? These doctors are throwing all this topical shit at you to rub this on there. Like, yeah, all right. You have to be a chemist. You have to do so much research on it. Everything is an enhancer. Whatever paint colors you're taking, and they have some of the strongest paint colors in the planet, to me that doesn't seem any

better or worse than hgh i actually researched it i was going to do a column for grantland like two years ago when i was still playing pickup basketball i was going to do an hgh cycle really i was excited about it yeah i was like you know i'm going to do this is it gluten-free i don't know if you can it was it was gluten-free yeah they had gluten hgh and gluten-free HGH. So I researched it, and the one thing that scared me was if you have cancer lurking in your body, the HGH can kind of spur it on and get it going. If you have some tumor that's kind of hanging out in your chin or something, it can spur the growth of it. So I got scared.

I was like, that's not worth it. Yeah, it's probably not good but if if you're a professional athlete and you have a chance to lock down two more years at 20 million bucks or whatever maybe you take that risk sure you don't take it for a story but anyway my my my only point he nobody has refuted that they mailed hgh to ashley manning i've not heard that refuted yet by anybody and it's very smart to do the whole look that's her medical history it's nobody's business but i haven't heard anybody say that didn't happen nobody mailed her hgh if you remember this happened with roger clements stuff was mailed to debbie clements it was used for her i just want to like

we know a lot of people who are married right sure? Sure, yeah. You go out to dinner. Not as many anymore, but yeah. You go out to dinner. We had a dinner the other night with nine of our friends. Let's say Corolla. Actually, Corolla, I guess nothing can be ruled out with Corolla. Who's anyone else? Let's say our friend Daniel's like, yeah, Diane's been in a great mood lately. She's been doing HGH.

That stops the dinner conversation, right? All of us are like what yeah yeah why is diane doing hgh i don't understand what for what reason to stay fit like all of us are confused by this sure yeah so i know there's a couple different medical reasons why why a non-athlete would do hgh that part's a little strange to me i think peyton's best bet right now is to provide pictures of ashley before and after and if she's like hugely buff and everything like she's bodybuilding competition she's a nice lady i i met her at the espies a couple years ago i'm rooting for her to be exonerated by this whole thing right she's just come out and say one way or the other but uh i also want to say that if i was going to do hgh and i was a famous person and i had to pick up the hgh i would put the hgh in somebody's name that wasn't my way it wasn't mine probably right like my wife or the dog walker the gardener

so you're saying he's probably smart enough that if he did like it i i believe him because of that what i believe him i wouldn't if i was doing hgh i wouldn't have it sent to my wife you wouldn't have it sent to you i wouldn't either that seems like too traceable yeah that's stupid also i wouldn't say this this to me is what he should be suspended for. He said during his treatments, he watched a lot of Hoda and Kathy Lee. Yeah, that was terrible. I saw that. I think he's got a city year just for that.

It's a league that you just feel like everything's in play. These centers, offensive linemen, they stop playing and they're 50 pounds lighter. Right. You have guys who are just tearing their triceps for no reasons at all. offensive linemen, they stop playing and they're 50 pounds lighter. You have guys who are just tearing their triceps for no reasons at all. It only really happens in football and wrestling. Basketball players don't tear their triceps. No, you're right. You think about Ray Lewis

that Super Bowl season. Tore his tricep. God healed it. He came back. Dairy antler spray, all that. How fast was Terrell Owens when he hadn't played all year in that Super Bowl against the Patriots? How freaking fast did he look? Well, also the science is way ahead of the testing and they weren't really testing him. The NBA just started testing for HGH this year, but they give the guys plenty of heads up.

I'm torn morally on it because it does feel like cheating. But at the same time, I don't know how we can decide what drugs are good and what drugs aren't good why is hgh bad but toradol is good and like people want to point to the record books but look at those gloves the receivers wear now to me that's yeah that's better than any hgh like you're you're cold you're in minnesota making catches that you would not you know know, in 13 degrees that you wouldn't like. Let me ask you. Everything's different.

Everything. How about this? Is a hyperbaric chamber cheating? Like you can die in a hyperbaric chamber if it's like if, you know, something weird happens, you go in, your body shuts down to 40 degrees below zero. Like normal people don't have that ability to do that. So if I have a hyperbaric chamber in my house, that's legal. But if I take a little human growth hormone, that's not legal.

The problem is no commissioner, no players association guy is going to put that on his platform and say, all right, let's make steroids legal. It's just too, it sounds too shitty. Well, the steroids, like the ones that they were like, they use with wrestling in the 80s and 90s. And we've heard stories. Your late friend, Rod Roddy had some good stories about just the primitive steroids they took back then. They were terrible for you. Bad times.

Yeah. They were like, you took those for five years and you were shortening your life. I think the stuff's much better now. Right. It's almost like how coffee in the 1970s was terrible. Now coffee's really good and we've isolated the beans. Yeah, yeah, yeah. People paying $8 for it. I think's really good and we've isolated the beans. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

People paying $8 for it. I think people can cheat and we wouldn't even know until years later. Yeah, I'd like to see a big study on this exonerating. Anyway, I hate these stories because it reminds me

of the Brady deflategate where everybody rushed to judgment and said Brady was guilty because of a report. This time around, everybody's been super cautious. And Manning has so many defenders in the media, including just about everybody at ESPN. Including Brady.

And Brady. Yeah. I don't remember the Manning text to the Manning supporting Brady during the whole I think he did send a text, but Brady threw his phone out. So I never. Oh. Wow. Did you set me up?

I really did. Damn it. God, that ruined the podcast for me. But yeah, I don't know. It's tough. I believe him, though. Maybe it's chicken parm that rejuvenates nerves. Is that what we're going to find out?

It would be rough if this story just wasn't true, because people just seem to remember what happened initially. But he came out guns blazing. Brady didn't say anything right and it made him look you know then he just kind of let the story play itself out before he said anything which was bad too i don't know what the right move is i i always like the guy i'm suing you you guys you're out of line and i never did it i that's what i would always go with. Yeah. Tough to sue, though. No, I know, but at least say it. Expenses, your whole, they can ask for all this weird personal history.

Sure, it's tough. It's tough, but at least say it. All right. Sort of meaningful games we have? Yeah, we have four games left. These ones, so Chiefs home for the Raiders. The Chiefs are in the playoffs, but still have an outside chance to get a three seed.

The five or six seeds at play. And that's actually... I don't know if they can get a six. Could they even get a six? I guess they could. The Chiefs? If they go 10 and six... Couldn't the Jets leapfrog them?

I can't remember. Yeah, the Jets can leapfrog them. They can't? All right. And the only reason I think that's a little meaningful is because the 3 seed

is gonna be probably Cincinnati probably if the Chiefs are the 6 seed yeah going into Cincinnati

against AJ McCarron that's what you'd rather well that's pretty good for the Chiefs. Wouldn't you rather go to Houston? You wouldn't rather go to Houston? If I go to Houston, then I know I'm playing the Pats in round two.

Yeah. Fortunately, Andy Reid will... Yeah, he doesn't really... He doesn't look at this schedule. Anyway, I had the Chiefs by eight and a half. I could see the Raiders going all out in this one. I think this is a sneaky.

I definitely wouldn't put this in a parlay or tease. And Andy has not reared his ugly head in three months. No, I know. And it's a shame. He's waiting. It's a shame that this actually doesn't mean them getting into the playoffs. Because this is the kind of game he would lose if it meant getting in the playoffs. He might lose it anyway.

I had Chiefs minus seven, and it is seven. Okay. Nice job. So that's right about there. And then i had the steelers by nine at cleveland um steelers by nine to cleveland stuff the finest uh all right yeah you're gonna get this it's 10 i said seven and a half i'm so down on the steelers but what do you do now if you're cleveland with this johnny manziel and i like when they run them around 100 108 yards rushing he'll get hurt in five weeks but it's fun to watch i like i i think it's he's a little dangerous when he's running you kind of gotta let let somebody do their thing that's what

he does he's good at it i know it's a little like kaepernick like just let him run around but now what do you do you draft the memphis quarterback or the cal quarterback or you're stuck with manziel like what do you do if you're cle right now? Yeah, but you're Cleveland. You've five years of doing the wrong thing every single time. So they'll just do the wrong thing. You get a guy no one's excited about. Yeah. I think you just stick with Manziel.

All right. So these last two I'm actually excited for. I think this Jets-Bills game, it's a double revenge game. I put this at the best game. You had the game of the week, Packers-Vikings. I think Jets-Bills. I'd rather watch Jets-Bills. All right. Let's do Packers-Vikings first then. No, no. I think this at the best game. You had the game of the week, Packers-Vikings. I think Jets-Bills. I'd rather watch Jets-Bills. Alright, let's do Packers-Vikings first then.

I think you're right. I'm more excited for Jets-Bills. Well, I'm bummed at NBC for not saying this. Packers, first of all, I don't like the games where... Well, the Rodgers is they're going to put him on practice. I know, but I hate the game where you're probably going to see it the following week anyway. I don't like when they do that. Yeah. But, uh, alright, let's

do it. Let's do Minnesota let's do minnesota green bay i have the packers 30 to 13 in late november i had the packers by four and a half i don't feel good about it um i get this i said four and it's three and a half i've been wrong on minnesota pretty much every week for 17 straight weeks which which is impossible. I really like them as a possible playoff team coming into the season. They looked horrendous in week one in San Francisco. Threw me off the scent. Came back. I finally bought in.

They immediately got killed by Green Bay. And I feel like I've been wrong on them every single week. It does seem like this is a game they should be able to go into Lambeau and win. Yeah. They have a better all-around team. Green Bay has Rodgers. They pressure the quarterback. Green Bay falls apart when they're pressured.

And Green Bay already beat them. I don't feel like Green Bay is a 2-0 over Minnesota. It seems like they should split this matchup. Let me ask you this. Can I tempt you with a teaser? Minnesota plus 9.5? At least a one-score game. The only reason is because it seems like when they fall behind,

they're in trouble when they're down like 10-plus. I don't think Green Bay kill anymore. If not for that Hail Mary. Why am I so excited to bet against Bridgewater? Teddy two gloves? You don't like him? I don't know. Do you imagine him in a playoff?

I don't think he matters. I think he completes one 20-yard pass to Stephon Diggs, and it could be enough to win a game. So if they—let's say they win this somehow, and they're the three seed. And Seattle's the six. and Seattle already beat them. Seattle just says, Peterson's not doing anything today. Teddy Bridgewater's going to have to throw to 400 yards to beat us.

We're stacking the line. Throw deep. Challenge our dudes. If Minnesota goes to Washington, Washington probably does the same thing. My point is, Teddy Bridgewater is going to have to win round one This isn't going to be an Adrian Peterson 40 carries for 240 yards

Type of thing Because the teams aren't going to let them do that Rams defense and Vikings defense When they're playing their best are similar though If they went Russell Wilson had a shit storm Bad day Sunday trying to get away from that defense.

So who do you like? I would want to play Washington. So you like Minnesota at least to cover? I like Minnesota to cover, yeah. I think I do too. I have to give my picks on ESPN tonight because it's all college the rest of the week. Oh, Jesus.

I have to give Tuesday, Tuesday picks. Green Bay, I'm trying to think. What's their best win this season? They beat the Seahawks by 10 in Week 2. The Minnesota win was the best win. Yeah, they beat Minnesota in Week 11. And it wasn't even close. Are those the only two...

Those are the only two playoff teams they beat this year. I guess they beat the Chiefs in Week 3. Did you say they beat Seattle? Yep. Yeah. Seahawks, Chiefs, Minnesota. They have three wins against playoff teams. Yeah. I don't know. I'd be surprised if they won two playoff games

at Packers. Alright, game of the week. I think it's a game of the week. I think NBC's making a mistake. I'd do the colorblind bowl again. Whatever it is. Jets at Bills. So many revenge subplots here. Really, Rex Ryan and Fitzpatrick being the best ones.

Is Fitzpatrick good? Are we sure he's good? Yeah, I think so. I don't even think it's a, are we sure he's good? Is he good? Sure. Why not? You don't think so?

I think he might be good. Yeah, yeah. I was kind of scared of him in the Pats game. He's made Brandon Marshall an elite receiver, or maybe the other way around. Not that he's an elite quarterback, but... The one thing I did feel like the Pats were trying to do in that game was rush him. Mm-hmm.

And he was kind of moving around. He knows how to throw the ball, not up for grabs, but to give his guys a chance for him. He's got two big receivers. I like him on third down better than probably 22 or 23 quarterbacks out there. Third and seven. He'll do a little throw the sidearm every once in a while. He's not terrible.

I don't understand. The guy was like 30 games under.500 heading into the season. It doesn't make any sense. I have the Jets by three. Bills won 22-17 on the Thursday night game. Yes, I had Jets by three. Also, it is three. So I win the week here. Six, seven, eight. What?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like 11-8 or something. Here's the problem if you're the Bills. Yeah. Last seven weeks, they scored 22-13, 22-30, 20-25, and 16. Mm-hmm.

The Jets, well, this will be a low-scoring game because the Jets the last seven weeks, 17, 17, 38, 23, 30, 19, and 26 within the OT thing. So this will be in that 22 to 20, 20 to 17. A fourth-quarter turnover. 19 to 17. Right. So now it's like Tyrod Taylor, who seems to do one really dumb thing per game.

He's kind of lingering. I got to say, I think the Jets are pretty good. Yeah. I was impressed by them in that Week 16 game. You can't run on them. You just can't. And then they have two receivers that can make plays. And Ivory, he's always got some sort of nagging injury,

but when he's actually playing, he's scary. Yeah. And Bile Powell fills in nicely, too. I'm just thinking about the NFL psychology and how we're all like, oh, my God, the Jets stole this playoff spot from the Steelers, and now we're going to be like, oh, my God. The Jets blew it. Jets got blown out, and the Steelers took care of business against the Browns.

I don't know. I don't know that that's the case. That's how this stupid year has gone. I don't trust it. Well, if you're worried as a Jets fan, this might make you feel better. In the last six weeks, they have two wins. They beat the crappy Texxans team i don't remember who the quarterback was in that game uh they did score 30 points on the texans right which

maybe is a red flag if you're just going to beat the cow then they beat the cowboys which was way closer than it should have been definitely doesn't really feel like a team that's going to be like let's win this one for rex because i don't think it's been a very fun season right that carlos williams is good though he's i could see him running on the jets a little bit maybe trying to bang through that hole and it's gonna be tough i think this todd bowles is good i think he gets his team up for the games that are important my buddy jim grady diehard jets fan thinks uh he looks like bunny from the wire he calls him bunny oh that, that's a good one. Yeah, it's good.

He actually does look like Bunny. But the Jets fans are quietly confident, which is very uncharacteristic for them. Every Jets fan I know, usually they're bombastic or self-hating. This time around, they're just playing it like poker face. No. Oh, yeah. I guess we could make the playoffs. They're not saying anything.

I love this game. I do. So who do you like i think i like the jets i think i do too like the jets i think the jets are good i hate with what happens with the league and how teams should win but i think the jets went so the jets are they locked into the six seed unless the chiefs lose? I have this written somewhere. Hold on. So if the Jets go 11-5 and the Chiefs go 11-5. Yeah, the Jets would be a six seed. They're a six.

And then they would go to Cincinnati, we think. Yep. So you know how I keep track all year of legitimate wins, legitimate losses, and then either-or games? So New England is 12-1 with three either-or games. The Chiefs are 10-3 with two either-or games. The Chiefs are good. Like, I looked at last year's stats.

If you get to 10 legitimate wins, you're a good team. Arizona is 12-1 with two either-or games. Carolina is 10-1 with two either-or games. Carolina's 10-1 with four either-or games. I mention this because the Jets are 6-5 with four either-or games. That sounds right for a wild card team. Yeah. Washington is 5-5 with five either-or games. Minnesota's 8-4 with three either-or games.

The Seahawks are 7-2 with five games that could have gone either way. And the Bengals are 8-1 with six either-or games. The Seahawks are 7-2 with five games that could have gone either way. And the Bengals are 8-1 with six either-or games. And then this is my favorite. Denver is 4-3 and played eight games that could have gone either way. Wow. Wow. Eight seems low. So anyway, I think you can make a case the Chiefs are actually good,

or you can make a case that they just had a shitstorm of a schedule for three straight months and they took advantage of it. They did lose five straight. They did. What were the odds for them to win the West after 0-5, or after they lost five straight? My friend Connor, Chiefs fan, said it was plus 1,400. Wow.

Yeah. Let's try to get that back. I think he might have put an illegal wager on it. He did? Yeah, I think he might have. He's going to jail. Well, he had the Royals win the World Series. Right, right.

And now he has this improbable Chiefs comeback. What a year. To me, the most amazing thing that's happened this year is that Andy Reid has now gone... Week 5 was the last Andy Reid game where they lose to the Bears. That's a long time. 18-17. That was week 5. Now we've gone 12 weeks without an Andy Reid game where they lose to the Bears. That's a long time. 18-17. That was week five. Now we've gone 12 weeks without an Andy Reid game.

Yeah. It has to be the record. We don't mention him. Right. Nothing? No weird clock thing? Oh, my God, I can't believe they... Nothing.

Right. Just he's thrown a no-hitter for 12 weeks. It's very strange. And no Jamal Charles. None of it adds up. So, Connor's theory on this is so much of what the Chiefs did was geared around because Jamal Charles can't play all the time, so you have to kind of gear the offense around him.

And now that he's out, they just have these running backs, and they're just an average offense now. These guys come in, they play running back, and they don't have to worry about, oh, we've got to get Jamal involved, oh, we've got to do this, we've got to do that. But it's not even like Kelsey is lighting up the tight end, who we love. It does seem like their wide receivers can make plays, which was unlike last year.

Yeah, Macklin's good. I still can't take them seriously. I'm just going to be honest. If they came to New England in round two, I'm not going to be like, oh, shit, here come the Chiefs. The Jets worry me a little bit. A little more than I want to admit. Yeah. Yeah.

You don't want to play them. You don't want the Jets grabbing the six feet. I think they do a couple of really good things. You know, it's really hard to run on them and they can throw. Whether they beat you or not, the Jets have the Patriots number. The Rams have the Seahawks number. No, they don't have our number. I'm not saying like that.

It's always a game, though. We almost beat them with our second string. It's always a game. Last year, it was a field goal game, like twice, like the Thursday night game. The Buff Fumble was only like two years ago. Right. Right. Come on.

It's always a decent game. Just settle down. Settle down for me like 5%. I can't. You're going to win the Super Bowl again. This is so boring. I hate it. It does feel like New England, Arizona, and Carolina.

Let's do it. Let's do New England, Arizona. Usually we have seven teams. So who's every year? I always call it the wonk team. What am I calling them? Yeah. Every year there's that wonk

team in the playoffs that's like they get in nobody expects anything else and they're doing well there's like eight teams that could be the wonk team this year right i'd believe any of them like green bay is a total wonk team candidate nobody feels good about them they they're gonna they could lose this we'd be the sixth seed or the five seed whatever and people are they suck blah blah they lose they stumble into the playoffs and then Rogers gets hot. Right. They're a little wonky. Maybe it's Minnesota too.

Who knows? I know. I don't trust any of them. After last week, I do not trust one team. Anything to plug? I'm at TheCousinSal on Twitter. We're running reruns on Kimmel but you should still watch

and on ESPN I give my picks tonight, Tuesday night never in two years have I given out back to back losing best bets so look for that to happen What lost last week? The Steelers, wasn't even close Well thanks to Simply Safe Home Security

remember right now they're offering my listeners an absolutely incredible offer. Get $100 off my hand-picked security package. Get complete protection for your home. No contracts, no commitments. Go to simplysafebill.com and save $100 on my security pick. And hopefully, they'll soup up Brad's apartment so we don't lose our trophy. Thanks to HBO for being nice enough to give you my own television show that launches next spring thanks to seat geek the presenting sponsor of both the

bs podcast and channel 33 subscribe to both podcasts on itunes stitcher or soundcloud and here's my little holiday gift to you what is it i exchanged a couple emails with mike francesa you did uh in 2016 when I'm back in New York, I'm going to co-host the Francesa show for the entire show. Yes. Five hours of me and Mike. Why am I more excited about this than the HBO show? Five hours of me and Mike.

Wow. When is that? You know how you bring stuff to people's house? Yeah. Like, hey, how are you? Bring like a six pack. I have to bring like a 12 pack of Diet Coke, right? I just have to.

Right, right, right. Do I put it in a cooler? Do I bring a cooler with the ice? Yeah, he'll love it. He'll love it. That's going to be great. When is it? You don't know?

Whenever I go back. Probably January, February. I don't know. You better be careful. He might not let you go. They're going at it as hard as they can. Mike and the Simmons on the fan.

Good afternoon, everybody. Bill Simmons here. They're doing that. Do we go to that thing? They're doing that whole charity thing. They're doing it, right? Where is it? It should be streamed.

That's got to be on TV. The Yes Network should step up and show that. Somebody's got to step that up. All right, happy holidays. Happy holidays. I look forward to losing money this week. I'm not positive that we're going to have another podcast this week because Tate is away and I don't know.

We like this guy, Jim. How can you trust him? Jim's good. Yeah, who knows? We'll see how Jim turns out. But we might be gone for the week. We might not. So you might not have Joe House this week.

If we don't have Joe House, just check out his Twitter feed for his pics at House from DC. And that's it. Happy holidays. Good job by you. Good job by you. We about this bitch. Anytime y'all want to see me again rewind this track right here close your eyes and picture me rolling