The Bill Simmons Podcast - Francesa Fridays and Vince Staples (Ep. 321)

Episode Date: February 2, 2018

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Mike Francesa to discuss the latest 30 for 30, on Bill Belichick and Bill Parcells (7:00), the Mount Rushmore of NFL coaches (18:00), the media coverage of Super Bowls (28:00), Eli Manning's fourth-quarter magic (34:00), and picks for Sunday's final showdown (58:00). Then, Vince Staples joins to give his thoughts on the Blake Griffin trade and the state of Clippers fandom (1:04:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today's special Super Bowl edition of the BS Podcast on the Ringer Podcast Network is brought to you by ZipRecruiter. Whether you're doing business in Beantown or the city of brotherly love, you need talent to win. No one understands that better than ZipRecruiter. They are our 2018 presenting sponsor. They are fantastic at finding you talent. Let them help you. Let them use their powerful technology to identify and match candidates with the right experience and then invite them to apply to your job. They scout talent for you. My listeners can try it for free at ZipRecruiter.com slash BS.

ZipRecruiter, the smartest way to hire. Meanwhile, SeatGeek is the best app for buying and selling tickets to sporting events, concerts, and more for $20 off your first SeatGeek purchase on any game or sporting event. Use promo code BS. They're also offering a special promotion on Super Bowl tickets to all SeatGeek purchasers, not just first-timers. Use promo code BSSB for $250 off promo-eligible Super Bowl tickets. Once again, promo code BSSB for $250 off Super Bowl tickets. I was on a bunch of podcasts this week. I was on Against All Odds with Cousin Sal.

That's where we did our annual Super Bowl props pod. I went on House of Carbs with Joe House and gave a review for Major Domo, David Chang's new restaurant in LA. I went on the Ringer NBA show to break down the Blake Griffin trade with Chris Ryan and Justin Verrier. And we have a Rewatchables podcast coming up this weekend. Varsity Blues.

So that's happening. Also, don't forget to check out theringer.com. Not only did we have an awesome batch of Super Bowl pieces and videos from Minnesota on the ground with Kevin Clark, Jason Gallagher, Robert Mays, and others, and Roger Sherman. But I wrote a super bag. Super bag six, Everybody Hates Us, is on TheRinger.com right now. The annual mailbag that I've done six times now this decade.

This one's mostly about the Patriots because you guys hate us. Talk about that. I made a pick for the game too. I'm also going to make a pick right now with Mike Francesco, who's calling and coming up a little bit later. My old friend, Vince Staples, he's going to talk about the Blake Griffin trade because he's a huge Clipper fan. That's right. It's the podcast you've been waiting for. Two of America's oldest friends, Mike Francesa and Vince Staples. I know they hang out. I've known them, done a lot of stuff together. This is the only place you can get Mike Francesa and Vince Staples in one pod. We might even call my dad at the end. First, Pearl Jam. All right, on the line, it's Francesa Fridays.

I'm already sad. This is the last one. The football season is about to end. We're going to pick the Super Bowl in a little bit. But first, Mike Francesa,. I'm already sad. This is the last one. The football season is about to end. We're going to pick the Super Bowl in a little bit. But first, Mike Francesa, your review of the two bills, the latest 30 for 30 on ESPN. Well, you know, two weeks ago when I was in Florida, maybe three weeks ago now, I met with Coach Parcells.

I had dinner with him and went back and chatted at his house and he talked to me about the two bills and I hadn't seen it and really had not kept up on how it started and what went on. So he gave me kind of his view and then I watched it last night with my wife.

Now, I know a lot of this intimately and some of it was presented a little it last night with my wife. Now, I know a lot of this intimately. And, you know, some of it was presented a little oddly last night in that. I mean, some of it, I thought, gave you an inaccurate feeling like an example would be. They made it seem like if Parcells had not waited to leave the Giants, that Belichick would have been the head coach. That is so patently inaccurate. George Young, who was left behind, detested Bill Belichick. His problems with Bill Belichick were far worse than they ever were with Bill Fossels. George Young would have hired the janitor to be the head coach before he would have

hired Bill Belichick to be the head coach. By the way, I think that's what he did. It wasn't that what he did. It was Ray Hanley, the janitor. Yeah, he did. You know,

he hired a guy that was considered to be by many. They're a genius, a guy who was considered to be a mathematician, a guy who was considered to be a whiz kid. And no one knew just how strange Ray Hanley really was going to turn out to be. Yeah. And it turned out to be the most peculiar,

you know, coaching a couple of years in history on a lot of fronts. But people raved about him. I mean, Parcells used him to be his kind of timeout and his clock management guy. The guy was a card counter. He wasn't allowed in Vegas. He was a card counter. He was a mathematician. Oh, the guy's a mathematician.

He's a guy who was known to be incredibly smart. And they were all shocked by what went on when he became the head coach. So they were very all high on Ray Hanley at the time. But they made it seem that he depicted that. And I thought they really did that incorrectly. Because I can tell you, George Young told me this on numerous occasions when he was around. You know, God rest his soul, that he never would have hired Phil Belichick.

He didn't like Phil Belichick. Everyone knew it. Everyone in the Giants knew it. So, and listen, I'm not saying anyone could have ever predicted Phil Belichick's success. Nobody could have. But the point is, and everyone knew how smart he was. I mean, they all knew him as this brainiac coach. They talked last night about his nickname, which was very prominent.

Everyone around the Giants knew him was his nickname because he, you know, never smiled and stuff like that. But everyone knew how smart he was. Everyone knew how schematically smart he was. Marcel, I thought last night, captured for everybody more than anybody ever has. And leave it to him because he understands coaching so well, what Belichick's genius is. Belichick never throws away a kernel of information on a player, on a situation, or anything, and he's able to bring every bit of it back at a moment's notice. And that, his details, the genius is in the details, and his ability to do that, and then to have a guy on the staff like Dante Skarniecki,

who is a utterly genius coach, that's why their adjustments, that's why what they hold for the second half in their offensive blocking schemes, in their packages on defense. Just look what they did to Jacksonville in the second half of that game. They threw stuff. And when they were getting hurt, they said, no, not yet, not yet. We're going to wait. We're going to wait. And they were getting rushed, they said, no, not yet. Not yet. We're going to wait. We're going to wait. And they were getting rushed and they didn't go to it. And they were getting hurt

on defense and they didn't go to it. He will save stuff. I've seen him allow teams to go right up and down the field on him. And he'll save something that he knows is going to work until he needs it at the proper moment. That's the kind of genius that that guy has inside game situations. And you saw that, I thought, in the Jacksonville game. And I thought Parcells touched on that so well last night. And that's really what he brings. I think you saw one was fire and one was just this detail, you know, schematic genius. And Parcells is the greatest motivator of people I've ever seen in my life on any level.

And Belichick is as good a detail guy as we've ever seen as a coach. And that's what you saw on this place when they were together and at their best and not feuding, which they were at times. You had really a very tough group to beat. And there were some other very good coaches on both the staff, the Giants staff and the New England staff, and even that Jets staff for the couple of years when they came back to New York.

So I thought you learned a lot last night. There were some things that, like I said, that were contradictory, but I thought you learned a lot. And you could even tell how the leaving from the Pats, which I will still, some of which I will take to my grave, which I know which never some of which I will take to my grave, which I know, which, you know, never is going to come out. But let's be honest, you saw a lot of last night, this stuff that went on behind the scenes. There was a lot of skullduggery. There was a lot of

stuff that was going on. Kraft did what he had to do. Bostos did what he had to do. Belichick did what he had to do. And obviously it worked out brilliantly for the Patriots I have not watched it yet I'm going to watch it this weekend I do, you talk about the skullduggery with the Parcells leaving the Pats and all that stuff which to me is still one of the most fascinating NFL behind the scenes stories we've had

just because Will McDonough who at that time was the biggest writer in Boston was pretty close to Parcells. Very close. And was in this weird situation where he had stuff that he knew that he couldn't totally report, and then when he reported it, it was so inside.

Yeah. It was like he was too close to it. I'll tell you this right now, and I've never talked about this, and I won't talk about what happened. There were two people in the room that Sunday before the AFC title game in Parcells' office when they had a fight before the game, and they had a big one. Two people, Will McDonough and myself. Now, Will McDonough eventually reported that he was in the room. He never mentioned I was in the room. I was in the room because I was watching the Carolina Green

Bay game on the TV in his office. I was in there. I never said a word about it. I've never talked about it ever will, what went on. But Will eventually did talk about that that day. He never gave all the details, but it was amazing what was going on that week and what went on the week of the Super Bowl. Because it was not the climate under which a team should prepare for a Super Bowl. It really was not. No, and they a Super Bowl. It really was not. And everybody was wrong. And everybody

was wrong. And still, with all the mistakes, if they just didn't kick the ball down the middle to Desmond Howard, they might have won the game. So, I mean, that's how close they came. That team was so brilliantly coached that year. It was a good team getting better, but it was so brilliantly coached that year. It was unbelievable. That team played so well from about week six to the end of

the Jacksonville game. That team played so well. It was unbelievable. And it gave up big plays that it had some breakdowns against fall. It clearly did, but it was really the special teams and they preached all week. Do not kick it down the middle of the field to this kid. And you saw the play a hundred times. I'm sure you've watched it a million times. They almost get them twice, but it was just unbelievable. And that play after the long drive, they were right back in the game and it broke their back. But I actually thought the factors were better, to be honest with you. So I really, you know, that one didn't really, you know, it wasn't like there was a wrong result there.

But they really did a great job coaching that team that year. Yeah, they could have stolen it. It was Denver's year, and Brunel went in a mile high and just shocked Denver. Yes. But I think the next year it would have been the team. But unfortunately, Parcells was not the coach of that team. Can I ask you a question? Why can't this stuff come out now?

It's been 23 years. First of all, I was there in an unofficial capacity, so I don't feel it was ever my place. Willie was working, and Willie was there. And let's be honest, and I knew Will very well, and Will and Bill were very close, and Will had more were very close, and Will had more power

than any media member ever had as far as the NFL, because he had the NFL office and he had all the NFL owners. Every owner leaked stuff to Will. And the league leaked stuff to Will, like he was part of it. If Will wanted something from the league, the league gave it to him. I mean, they gave him everything.

They didn't give him something, they gave him everything. They didn't give him some things. They gave him everything. Will always knew everything. I mean, not some things. And listen, I knew Will very well, and I got along great. But Will was there that day, and he was the only one there except me. But I was there because I had been there all weekend. I had got there on Friday.

I did my Sunday show. They opened the building up early for me to do my Sunday show, And I went down to the office to watch the Carolina Green Bay game. Green Bay's kicking the heck out of it, out of Carolina. So you know it's going to be Green Bay getting ready on a sleety, cold day. I don't know if you were in the building that day, but it was a sleety, cold, rainy day that day when they played Jacksonville. And Jacksonville hung in there really well until the turnover and, you know, really was putting on a pretty good performance. Yeah.

You know, and, you know, it's funny, Tom, Bill beat Tom, who he loved, twice in the playoffs. He beat him with the Jets one year, 34-24. He beat him in that game. And then Tom, of course, came back to get Bill Belichick twice. You know, obviously, in games you remember very, very well. I do remember that. And stuff that people are rekindling this week

as we'll get to the Super Bowl. But I thought it was interesting, you know, knowing them as well. And I've never, you know, I was always in a weird position. I was so close to Parcells, I could not ever even deal with Belichick because at times they kept their distance from each other, even the later years of when he was an assistant with the Giants and before he went off on his own to Cleveland. I never had a relationship with him

because I was so close to the head coach that I never was that close. And they kept their distance most of the time. They, they work together. Well, they never really ever, they never socialized. So, uh, so, uh, I think this trade there, but they, but they talked about how much they helped each other's careers and you'll get a fascinating early look on how their ascendancy started, which is really very interesting and just shows you how quirky coaching relationships are. I want, at some point in my life, I don't know why you have to take all this stuff to your grave. It's not like it's a JFK assassination. No, but I just feel like if you're

not there, my feeling's always been if I'm there in a relationship that's not official, then I shouldn't say what I hear or talk about. And I never will. I haven't seen the documentary yet, and I can't wait what I hear or talk about. Let me ask you this. I never will. Yes. I haven't seen the documentary yet and I can't wait to watch this weekend. I think Belichick and Parcells, if you're doing an NFL coach Mount Rushmore,

I think both of those guys are on. I think Belichick, you know, you don't have to make the case for him. Parcells, as you said, the greatest motivator of any modern football coach. And I think,

I mean, the equal of Lombardi in that regard. Right. And I was never around Lombardi, so all I can go by is genius. But I think he was that great a motivator. And I'll tell you, it's fascinating. And this is something I've talked about many times, Bill, and something that I know all four of them very well.

So I feel this is enormously on the money. The Krzyzewski-Knight relationship and where their careers have gone completely parallels the Parcells-Elicia relationship. Oh, wow. That's a good one. Because they both were the mentors to the younger guy. The younger guys were more stable in that they were able to stay in one place for long. They also were more adaptable. They were able to keep their genius over long periods of time and able to adapt to circumstances, to people, to management, to owners, to Krzyzewski's case, athletic directors.

And both are very quiet guys, while the older guys, the night parcels are very over-the-top, dominant personalities, very verbal, very good in press conferences, while the other two are very introspective, very much to themselves, but incredibly talented, incredibly driven, have both stayed forever in each of their places and have unparalleled success. So to me, the Knight, Parcells is completely the same. And then Krzyzewski and Belichick. So I look at those as being completely parallel in their two sports. You know what's funny about that?

And I agree with you. And I think it's a good analogy that if Belichick was a college basketball coach and he was watching what Calipari was doing in Kentucky, he totally would have switched to the one and done philosophy that Coach K has now embraced, right? Had to. Had to because it was the way to adapt. Coach K has always been able to see what Knight never could do was Knight could never stop coaching the game that he loves and the game that he believes in. And so he never adapted

to the new rules, but he also never adapted to the style that players could be recruited to. No players would play for him anymore because they didn't want to play his system, which was give up the ball, screen, play defense, pass. No, no. They want to dribble, penetrate. They want to dribble, drive. They want to shoot the three. They want to show expression.

Duke did that, and he adapted the same way that you have watched Belichick adapt. The one difference in it is the role that Tom Brady plays, because that's the other part of this, is that Krzyzewski's had a million players, as you would if you're a college coach. He has not lived off one guy. Belichick has had this alter ego, this other piece to the puzzle that has been with him forever, this historic piece to the puzzle, which has made that so successful. And you wonder how good would he have been. And while people will always say who want to get

under Parcells skin, hey, look, Parcells never won anything without Belichick. Okay. Parcells can't say anything, but go say, hey, Belichick never won anything without Tom Brady. And it's the same way. Look at Belichick's career. It's average before you get to Tom Brady. So there's Brady and what he brings to the Belichick legacy and what Belichick brought to the Parcells legacy. So it's all fascinating stuff, it really is. That 2008 season when they went 11-5 with Castle and somehow didn't make the playoffs was the great lost Belichick year

because that was the one year he could really shove it to everybody who said he couldn't win without Brady. And they did. They kind of overachieved. They were 11-5 with a tough schedule, but the AFC was just stacked that year, and they ended up not getting in because of a 17-way tiebreaker. Mount Rushmore.

And it's funny because Phil Jackson, the same thing. 94, yeah. If Jordan left, if he don't get the terrible call in the Knicks series, he might win the championship with Pippen, and that year would have been an incredible feather

in Phil Jackson's cap and Pippen's cap, and if not for that call, they might have won the championship. Yeah, I think they won like 54 games. Pippen was a top three MVP candidate, and they really didn't have anyone else. It was Horace Grant. No, led his team in every category.

He's the only other player in the league who did it in modern times was Dave Callens. Quickly, Mount Rushmore, Belichick, Parcells, Bill Walsh, Lombardi. Is that the four? How many do I get? That's it. You get four. You have four spots. Lombardi given.

Belichick given. Landry for me, innovative and stood the test of time would be three. And the fourth one, I'm partial. I'll take Parcells. But someone could make an argument for either Knoll or Walsh. So here's my case against Tom Landry. And remember, you can't use him in the NFL, but the father of modern football is Paul Brown. You understand that?

But his NFL numbers are just not the same. So maybe Paul Brown gets the Parcells spot. I think we're probably both overrating Parcells. He's the two most important coaches of all time are Lombardi and Paul Brown. And the third one would be Landry in terms of what the league was built on. Paul Brown is the father of modern football. I think Landry gets, he's off Mount Rushmore

because in 1974, he platooned Roger Staubach and the other guy for like what, half the season? That's the dumbest thing ever. Amazing that he could not deal with the fact that Staubach wanted to break his place. It took him years to realize, I have to let him freelance. He could not handle Starbuck's freelancing. The genius of Starbuck was his ability to freelance.

And he could not deal with Starbuck's freelancing. It was a floor in Landry's personality. Can you imagine if somebody tried to do that now? Platoon quarterbacks, the internet would lose its mind. Every other play, every other play. Crazy. Let's take a break. Come back.

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that you have not had a radio show every day. When was the last time you didn't have a radio show during Super Bowl week? First, last time I didn't have a Super Bowl radio show would have been 31 years. Last time I didn't have an NFL job of some kind or some kind of connection to the NFL would have been over 40 years ago. Wow. The last month, I said to my wife the other day, this is the first month. January was the first month. I didn't get a paycheck of some kind in, uh, 40, I think 44 years. Wow. So, uh, so it, you know, from that standpoint, but this is the first time, uh, and

I had lunch the other day with Joe Brown, who was the longtime right-hand to Pete Roselle and Tackley Abu and all these guys, and really was one of the guys who was one of the really architects from a PR standpoint of the modern NFL and a guy I've known forever. He actually lived a couple of towns over. So he and I had lunch about 10 days he before he was heading to the super bowl we were talking about how much it had changed and it has changed so much i mean this year i'm glad i'm not there because i would not have loved the idea of doing my show next to a hardy's or next to a shake shack okay i would not have been that would not have been something I would have found very appealing to do my show, you know, squeeze between a, uh, a Chi Chi's and a, uh, and a Hardee's or a Shake Shack was not my idea

of doing a show. Was Radio Row, when did it really like lose its mind in the 1990s? They really, the first one, uh, when I, I'll give you an example. When we went to, uh, Superbowl 25, Giants and Bills, we were the only ones there. The next year when we went to Minnesota, there were like, and that was Buffalo-Washington the last time they were in Minnesota. That was Buffalo's second loss. That was the Thurman- helmet deal. That year in Minnesota, we saw the start of it. And then in L.A., for the first Dallas Buffalo one, all of a sudden there were eight, ten stations with us,

and they said, we want to put you in a place. They called us and said, we want to put you in a place. Are you okay with that? And we said, we want to put you in a place. There's more radio stations now coming. Sports radio is catching on. All of a sudden in L.A place there's more radio stations now coming sports radios catching on all of a sudden in la there's like 10 stations and then it just exploded and the next thing you knew there were uh platforms and studios and the next thing it was this radio row and also all the cable

tv and all the simulcast and all the networks. And then comes the Sirius and the NFL Network and Fox. And so now it's like basically it's a carnival. I mean, now it's like if you ever went to any kind of convention at the Javits Center or in Las Vegas, that's what this is. This is a convention Monday to Friday, and then it's a football game on the weekend. But it is a sports football marketing convention for a week, and then it's a football game on the weekend. And most of the people who go to Minnesota go home before the game. I'd say probably 80% of the people go home by Saturday. They don't even stay for the game. I remember like 12 years ago, I wrote a piece about trying to see how many

shows I could get on in like four hours. It was nuts. How many did you get on? The problem was I wasn't that recognizable, so I was wandering around hoping people would grab me, but most people didn't know who I was.

But I still was able to go on. You should go back and do it now. That would be a nightmare. But did you and Dog always get pole position on the best real estate at these things? You must have. As a matter of fact, we always got, and then here's what happened, though.

Dog went to where he had this, in the last 10 years, he actually had this bigger stage than me because Sirius was a rights holder. So they had this grand setup all the time, and I didn't have as much space as he had. So he always had this better set than me in the last 10 years because Sirius comes with 10 shows. They have all this stuff, and they have about 20 NFL shows, and they have the halftime show, and they have the rock and roll, and they have everything. And how about this week where there was actually a show of guys fighting on Radio Row? I know.

You have two clowns who want to – here's how I'm going to get publicity. I'm going to get to a fight with another radio host on Radio Row. Give me a break. I mean, that's what this business has become. That's where this is going. I know. I mean, it really is. I mean, it's just ridiculous.

It really is. Yeah, it's just ridiculous. It really is. Yeah, it's a very confrontational business now. I know in Boston, and I know some of the guys who are doing it, and I know it's partly an act, but, you know, a lot of it is like this guy wrote a negative piece about a Boston athlete. We're challenging him to come on. Come on our show and defend your peace. And it's very, like, in your face.

Right, and then the kid calls, and then the young guy who i don't know calls brady's kid a pissant now why would you call somebody's kid the name i mean first of all yeah that wasn't great i mean i'm not saying do anything to the guy people are stupid in our business probably what our business is this bill and i'll say our business meaning all of media what you have done and what you have been greatly successful at, what I've done and been successful at is, you know, in our different realms. But here's the thing. If it's a guy trying to be the next Bill Simmons or the guy trying to be the next Mike Francesco, I have to find a way to break through. I have to make people notice me. So I either going to do it by some ridiculous way or I'm going to say something really outrageous. And that's what these kids all think they have to do. They're not going to go there and try to be clever. They're not going to go there and try

and do it one good day at a time. They're going to try and see if they can break through and get noticed. And there's too much of that going on right now. Yeah, I agree. I think the internet and social media and the fact that if you do say something outrageous or crazy or whatever, it immediately gets disseminated and it's out there and people are dissecting it. Like that fight you mentioned. Ten years ago, we don't see that fight. What Ball does now.

I mean, what he's done. All the attention. I don't like the NFL. I don't like the NBA coaches trying to dictate what should be covered and what shouldn't. But I'll tell you right now, I would never give him the light of day. I would never, because I can see what a huckster he is. I would never give him the light of day. But I don't want them to tell me, let me figure it out. They don't have to tell me how to do my job. Let me figure that out. Well, what's interesting is in the mid-2000s, when this was really the first time this was starting,

and people didn't like it. And if you remember, like Stephen A. Smith, he had a show, and he became this lightning rod to the point that he actually left ESPN. And I actually think he's talented, and I think he's very good at what he does and he's prepared. And a lot of it is shtick. I got to know him a little bit. Yeah. I know Stephen A well. I mean, I like Stephen A. I know him very well. Yeah. And I think he toned down the shtick a little bit, but it's still a shtick to some degree. But I think now this decade,

especially in the middle of it, when he came back and he started to ascend on first take, people are just more used to it. And they more used to like here's my take i'm gonna say something crazy and people like it here's the thing skip bayless and and uh you know your buddy and a guy i've gotten to know recently jamie harwitz is a guy who was one of the guys who developed this stuff yeah and it's this idea of, I'm going to take this crazy take. And defend it. Skip Bayless has about five guys that he goes after, and he's going to do whatever he can, including LeBron James, as we know.

And that's going to be his take, and he's going to make his mark and try to get ratings based on taking that stance on those three or four subjects. That's become a way of doing this. And it's, you know, it's become a cottage industry. There's no question. Everything eventually becomes a cottage industry as we know. Yeah. I wrote, I did a mailbag today. And one of the things I wrote about was the conundrum Giants fans are in with the Superbowl between the Patriots and the Eagles. They are. What shocked me and surprised me, just about every Giants fan in my life

is rooting for the Patriots for two reasons. One, the Eagles, they love the 1960 thing. They love that they can just hang it over the Eagles fans. They hate the Eagles fans. They hate the Eagles, the NFCs. And then two, this is weird, and I didn't know this until this week, and I did a little riff about it in my mailbag.

The giants fans are starting to feel like the more the Patriots win, the better it is for Eli's legacy. And those two Superbowl wins. Oh, absolutely. No, this is the badge of honor. Oh,

absolutely. The giants are the only kryptonite to the, to the pats. I mean, that's it. We, the giants know that they completely and you want to call it the ghost of george jung if you can the giants stand between brady and belichick and

complete immortality yeah the only thing that stands between them being on a level that people don't even talk about they just genuflect is those two super bowl defeats. That's it. Now, listen, recently there have been contributions. The ridiculous Seattle coaching staff that decided not to give the ball to Marshawn Lynch. And then the Atlanta Falcons who, as I have said many times, if I could have taken the Falcons coaching staff and locked them in a room at 28-3, that game is over, okay? All I needed to do was get them off the field where they could not be destructive to their own players, and that game, Kraft would not be putting 283 little diamonds

into each one of those rings. That game was never coming back, because if I give that game to a midget football coach, if I give it to a guy who coaches 12-year-old players, he will take me home. There was no way to allow them to come back and win, give them kudos. And Tom Brady for his fourth quarter brilliance,

and he never gives up, but there's no way in the world. You have to go out of your way to be destructive, to lose that football game. Well, see, I would throw the Jaguars to be, we haven't talked since that game.

I thought the Jaguars, I went back and watched it. Um, two days later. And I couldn't believe how easily the Jaguars could have won that game and how many different ways they blew it and how lucky the Patriots were. They were flat out completely lucky in that game. Completely.

Give the Jack. First of all, the Jaguars played very well for three quarters. For three quarters. What happened is they, they refused to allow Bortles to attempt to make a play. Yeah.

And they were afraid he was going to lose the game. And when it came down, the push came to shove. They were afraid that he was going to turn into a pumpkin and it cost them a championship. What you have to understand is there's two things, and I'm sure the Eagles have presented this week, championship, what you have to understand is there's two things, and I'm sure the Eagles have presented this week, will not fall into this because I think their coach has shown that he's brazen. There's two things you have to do that the Giants did to beat the Pats.

Two things. Number one, you have to have fourth quarter pass rush, which means either you had to rotate guys, or you have to have fresh defenders in the fourth quarter where you've rested your guys. Because you have to have fourth quarter pass rush. The Jaguars were dead on their feet. So were the Falcons last year. They no longer had these racehorse guys coming to the quarterback.

They got tired. Number two, you must have your quarterback make plays. Eli Manning had two sensational fourth quarters against the Pats. One year he was 9-14 for 152 and a touchdown. The other time he made the throws to Manningham and he made two-thirds and long throws in those fourth quarters. You have to allow your quarterback to make plays. You can't play against them in a shell because they will get the ball back and they will beat you. You cannot do that. You can't stop playing against them. That is imperative that you play them for 60 minutes and understand that means never taking your foot off the gas pedal against them. And the Eagles have depth.

And the Eagles also get pass rush without blitz more than any team in the league, which is something you have to do to beat them. The one problem I have here, and we'll get into it, and that is Foles, after playing terribly, into the first half of the Atlanta game, and Atlanta clearly left them off the hook. I mean, they didn't move the ball well. Philly's defense played well, but they had chances late where they should have scored.

But here's the thing, and this is a different game when I think of Atlanta's here. I think Atlanta wins. I'm not sure Philly will because of the quarterback. He played sensationally against a Minnesota defense that somehow fell apart in the fourth quarter of the New Orleans game and didn't recover. And this was an historically good Minnesota defense on third down, which was taken apart by Foles, who had one of the great playoff games in the last 20 years in the Minnesota game. He had statistically one of the greatest playoff games played in the last 20 years. Can he do that again?

That's the question. The Jaguars played not to lose. The Eagles played to win. And when they got the lead, they kept going. They kept going. He's still throwing deep. The Jaguars-Pats game really reminded me. I don't know if you remember.

Well, you remember it, but I don't know if you remember the details. When Sanchez came into Foxborough and beat the Pats that year. And it was a very similar game where the Pats fell behind. They kind of rallied back. And I think it was 14 to 11 at one point. And the Jets got the ball back. And they actually went down and scored. And they put the game away.

And Sanchez finished the game, I think, with three touchdowns, zero picks. He played great. And played well, yeah. And Bortles, they just, the Pats basically stacked the line, and they were basically like, go ahead, throw on us, Blake Bortles. Go ahead, do it. They saved a couple of coverages. They knew he wouldn't try certain things.

They saved a couple of blitzes. They saved a couple of coverages that worked. And then Skarniecki worked his magic in the second half where they saved their blocking schemes and then are able to build that little cocoon. And that is the great unheralded part of the Pats, which has never been given the credit it deserves, is the pocket that their offensive line builds around Tom Brady

in these spots and how he does not get touched in the ends of these comebacks. He does not get touched. And you have, and you've heard me rave about him many times, and I know how high esteem Belichick and Parcells think of Dante Skarniecki. And Skarniecki, who they have brought out of retirement on multiple occasions, is a genius. He is one of the great coaches in the league. He could have been a star head coach. He never wanted to be. His schemes and what he does with his adjustments are so sensational. You know, adjustments are overrated at the NFL. They're not when you're talking about the Pats, because the Pats have such a reservoir of so many different things they can go to.

It's almost like someone else has four or five options. The Pats have 89. They can flip a card. They can go, we're going to do this now. We're going to go to this now. We're going to go to this now. They have such a reservoir of knowledge about the sport from their coaches. And they are so apt at being able to touch everything. Plus they coach their players so fundamentally differently where they're all versatile and they all understand when they have to flip the page. They do it at a moment's notice. And what you get out of average players, the possibility to get good performances out of average players is one of the greatest things I've ever seen in sports. They get more good quality, big moment performances from what are really run-of-the-mill players than anything I've

ever seen in my life. Well, for the Jag have a lead they have all the momentum and Gronk goes out of the game and at that point you don't have Gronk you don't have Edelman Brady has never been in a playoff game since 2006 that Rasheed Caldwell game which actually went and ratched on YouTube against Indianapolis where they had a million chances to put the Colts away, and he just didn't have the receivers. It was basically the same spot this time. Cooks can only just run that straight 20-yard turnaround and stop play. He had Amendola, who I'm watching the game with my nephew,

and I'm like, unless Amendola goes nuts this quarter, we're done. This is our only guy. This is the only guy Brady's going to throw to. And he goes nuts, and they We're done. This is our only guy. This is the only guy Brady's going to throw to. And he goes nuts and they win. How good was he? Oh, my. That was one of the best quarters any Boston athlete has ever played in any sport.

How good was he? It was amazing. Think about it. Look at what happened when the Chiefs lost Kelsey. They were done. Their whole offense stopped. Yeah. They did not.

This is what Andy Reid. They did not adjust anything. They stopped reed they did not adjust anything they stopped playing they couldn't get anything done and you saw the pats lose ground count they say okay now here's what we do we go to option the pats it's almost like all right let's try this okay no throw it out let's try this okay now and they just keep trying stuff until they probe and get what they want that's what they want. That's what their ability, and I thought Parcells, when you see the two bills, will tell you his ability to touch on situations, schemes. And he talked about last night coaching staffs and how good some staffs are.

This was Belichick talking about how this staff was great because we could use every blocking scheme. We could use every different defense. We could use every coverage. And even Parcells admitted it last night. And I thought in the past I'd seen some of the fights that Belichick and Parcells had had over coverages and stuff like that. He even talked about how much the adjustments Belichick used against the Niners worked and how Parcells, who was much more of a zone guy, let Belichick talk him into utilizing men which changed their

chances against the Niners, their ability to change and to just basically take the history. They can do anything. They have so many good coaches who have such a reservoir of knowledge. That knowledge, that brainpower, when with brain power than any team I've ever watched in my life. And that is without question an homage to their head coach because they have bright assistants and they have bright players. And that's versatile, bright, tough players. And that's why they win.

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That's code BS to get 25% off. ControlGX at ControlGX.com that's code bs to get 25 off control gx at control gx.com back to mike all right i'm throwing a couple props at you ready go ahead good mvp brady's four to five is there any scenario where the pats win the super bowl and he's not the MVP? Absolutely, yes. Absolutely, yes. So I would look for something. I would look for somebody on defense. I would go to a Chung or somebody on defense, somebody who could get a couple of steals.

Yes, I'd go to somebody in the secondary. I would go to somebody who gets me a couple of big picks and take them as a real out bet or a long shot, you know, a 30-1 guy or a guy who's the field and give me something like that. Because somebody on defense could win it, yes. The field is 20-1, and that includes like Chung and Gilmore and guys like that.

Or a deep back or somebody like that because I could see foals coming apart. That's why I say that. You could see foals coming apart. That's why I say that. You could see foals coming apart. Yeah. I know he doesn't throw picks. I just think this is a different game. I really – I think everyone is almost now – here's what happens, and it's a herd mentality.

And what I always like to say is if I haven't been there for the wedding, I don't want to be there for the funeral. And it's like people will have a horse go off at 80 to one. And then after the race, they'll say, oh, I should have seen that. The next race, the horse goes off at three to one and loses. Well, if you weren't there for the wedding, don't be there for the funeral. Two weeks ago, everyone said Foles couldn't do anything, that he couldn't make a play. Now, they're calling him Nicky Sixx, and he can't be stopped. Hey, there's a whole lot in between there.

His first couple of games, his quarterback ratings and the systems I use were under 50 for the first three games he played. Last game, he played one of the best playoff games, I'm going to tell you this, in the history of the NFL, he played the highest rated playoff game, I believe, in the last 12 years in that game last week. In terms of every throw, under pressure, his quarterback rating was like 125 or 130. He played sensationally well in that game. I mean, he played to the moon. He could never, but here's what that led the Pats to do. Instead of the Pats saying, hey, this guy can't make this play, that play, this play, they said, hey, he can make this play, that play, this play. So they go in now,

afraid of Foles rather than disregarding Foles, which is what every other opponent did the last couple of weeks. I think that's a negative for Foles. Now, the one thing I will say is the Pat defense is not good. It is not good. I'm just sorry. It can get pushed around. It has trouble making – it has trouble creating an edge. It has so many problems, it's unbelievable. I mean, really, they have put that together with bubble gum this year.

They can be had. They can be punished. They can be pushed around and all of that is possible and the Eagles have the ability to do all of it. The Eagle offensive line is underrated. The Eagle running game is good. The Eagles got backs. The Eagles have receivers. If the quarterback does not turn

into a pumpkin, they are going to be a pain in the neck in this game. They really are. Their goal kick is good and their coach is brazen. He's not going to play afraid. I don't think this coach is going to get in this game and swallow his whistle. I don't think he's going to coach afraid. And I think that's a positive

for them. I really do. Foles is minus 150 to throw a pick. I would be on top of that. I would say yes. I know he doesn't throw a lot of interceptions, but I think this is a different game and i think they're going to ask him to make plays here i don't think they can go in this game and try and coach around him i don't think that see they tried to do that early in the playoffs

and they weren't moving the ball and then they said you know what we're not going to play that way anymore yeah and they did it and they they made plays and he stepped up and he made plays. But now everybody has turned on him so dramatically off this brilliant game because the world always reacts to the last game. Completely reacts to the last game. We've seen that every round. Yes. Every time it happens.

It happens in every sport too. And to me, listen, I understand that every, I understand why people are on the Eagles. I understand why the big bets and the smart guys people are on the Eagles. I understand why the big bets and the smart guys have been on the Eagles. The line was a little high early. I understand all that. The Pats have had a history of playing very close in the Super Bowl.

Also, this team has been behind a lot in recent playoff games. They did not play well defensively in these playoff games. And the Eagles showed you a lot of ability. Plus, they have pass rush. Plus, they don't have the blitz to get a pass rush. They have depth. They have a good roster. Let's be honest.

The Eagles did a great job rebuilding this roster. They really did. And actually filling holes from the injuries they had this year. They had problems. They filled the holes. So give their front office credit. They did a very good job this year. And Foles is trying to be the modern version of Hostetler.

But what happened there was the Giants completely changed who they were when Phil went out because Hostetler couldn't throw it like Phil. So they went to it, but he could move. So they used his mobility and they went to a very much a two tight, sometimes three tight end offense and gave the ball to Jumbo and tried to – I mean, I gave the ball to Otis Anderson behind Jumbo and tried to make some plays there in the running game, and that's how they played.

And by the way, Hostetler didn't even score a touchdown in the NFC title game. No. Super Bowl – They're all going to win the game, yeah. Super Bowl props. Chung is 101. Devin McCourty is 100-1. I'll take both of them.

I'll take both of them. Wait, there's one. Malcolm Butler is 100-1. Gilmore is in the field. So there you go. So you like the secondary bets. I'll take McCourty and Chung as my guys, yes. All right, how about this one?

The obvious is Brady, of course, and I always think the quarterback's going to win, but I would take those 101 guys, yes. How about this one? Go ahead. The entire day, Sunday, Donald Trump, five tweets. Over, under? What do you think?

Over. Over, that's what I said, too. He cannot pass up that audience. No way. First of all, it's a big TV day for him. He'll have two big cheeseburgers, two filet-o-fish, and a chocolate shake. Yeah. And he'll have plenty of Starburst in front of him. It'll be in front of the TV all day.

He'll be a—and I don't know if he's going to do the presidential interview. I doubt it. It's NBC. He wouldn't do it on them. He'd do it on Fox. He wouldn't do it. They don't have the game, so I's going to do the presidential interview. I doubt it. It's NBC. He wouldn't do it on them. He'd do it on Fox. He wouldn't do it. They don't have the game. So I doubt he'll do a presidential interview.

He wouldn't do one with NBC ever. So from that standpoint, I would say I'm going to give you an over on the tweets. Okay. An over, yes. Will Justin Timberlake cover a Prince song in Minnesota on halftime? Yes is plus 200, although it's starting to drop. I say absolutely he will, yes. I don't understand why that's not like minus 300.

How does he not sing a Prince song? How about what he did yesterday? Is that the fitting end of the season for the NFL? Here's a guy who gives the typical doing the halftime show press conference and has asked a question about his son and says, would you like your son to be an entertainer or a quarterback? He goes, quarterback? What are you kidding?

He goes, I don't care if he plays sports. My son will never, ever, ever play football, ever, ever. That was rough. Here he is in Minnesota. I can imagine Goodell and all the NFL guys. Here's the guy doing a halftime show saying, what are you, crazy? They banned Costas from the city for saying football players have their brains scrambled. And here's Timberlake.

And what is he saying? Oh, man, I wouldn't let my kid near a football field. That Costas thing, I mean, you could tell how they're handling it. Obviously, he's still getting paid a lot of money by them. But it's clear that the NFL is like, that guy's not coming to the Super Bowl. They banned him. Get him the hell out of here. How about this?

They said leave him home. Yeah. Will a special teams or defensive touchdown be scored in this game? Yes is plus 180. No, I don't think you can ever count that because, you know what, they usually have to be short range if they're going to happen. Special teams I don't expect to ever get because they're really on their P's and Q's.

So I'm going to say no to that one. Okay. Tom Brady, 25 and a half yards favorite passing yards over Nick Foles, minus 165. He'd have to throw for 26 more yards than Nick Foles in this game. Lock. Seems like a lock, right? Lock, yeah.

Brady completions, 25.5 is the number. Hard to tell. That would really depend on how the eagles want to play them um uh that one i'd stay too close to call i would i would pass on that well you're going to be surprised to hear that's my lock of the of the super bowl i'm going over why because i think i think they're going to dink and dunk them i don't think they're going to be able to run the ball on the on philly's front seven and well that really that really that really tells you how the eagles are going to so you think the eagles are going to make them come the long field and they're going to be able to run the ball on Philly's front seven. Well, that really tells you how the Eagles are going to – so you think the Eagles are going to make them come to long field and they're going to give them the underneath stuff.

That's what you're playing – that's what you think the Eagles are going to do. The Eagles are going to set that, not Brady. It's going to be what they give them. And you think the Eagles are going to play them that way, not play them aggressively. I think they're going to no-huddle. And it reminds me of this Seattle game. I think the Pats – we might as well do our picks now.

I think the Pats are going to fall behind early, a little like what they did with the Jags game, a little like the Seattle Super Bowl, a little like the Atlanta Super Bowl, and do the thing where, you know, they wait, they wait, they wait. Now Brady's going no huddle. Now they're trying to wear the Eagles out. They want to get it to the point where it's the fourth quarter.

Conditioning comes in. Nick Foles versus Brady comes in. The fact that the playoff experience, which I think can be overrated sometimes, but there is real Super Bowl experience where the day is so long. And you've heard Brady talk about this, where you don't want to peak in the first half because you have the three hours before the game. You have the national anthem, then you fireworks and you get the flyby and there's so much energy in the building. And now you're playing football for 85 minutes.

And then there's a 40 minute halftime. And Brady said it took him like almost five Super Bowls to realize how to kind of pace himself during the game. Now you have the Eagles out there. None of those guys have been in a Super Bowl except for, I think, three of them. Quarterback who wasn't even starting two months ago. And I think they can get them in the fourth quarter. And I'm picking the Eagles to cover plus four and a half because I think it's a three-point game.

And I think the line is high for exactly the reasons you said about Nick Foles could turn into a pumpkin. I think that's been worth two points to the line is high for exactly the reasons you said about Nick Foles could turn into a pumpkin. I think that's been worth two points to the line, but this to me feels like a three point game. And I just don't think the Pat's defense, the front seven is good. You can run on them, you can throw on them,

you can get to the sides on them and Jacksonville was doing it and they stopped. And I think Philly is not going to stop. So the Pats are going to have to beat them. Because we kind of agree here. First of all, as you know, historically, the Pats clearly coming here with a defense is not very good, as we know. And they do have a habit of getting behind in these games.

And they keep getting behind in these games. Now, they don't want to push the limit like they did last year, but they still have done it a lot and made these amazing comebacks. And we've seen it now so many times in recent years. It's become almost a script that we keep seeing. So none of us would be surprised by that, nor would this defense. Would I be surprised by the backdoor cover if they're ever up? Exactly. Because they'd give up that, but they would exchange time for yardage

and a heartbeat, and I could see that happening late because they're just not a quality defense from that standpoint. And plus, historically, as we all know, they won their first three Super Bowls by three points. They have not been a very good favorite in these Super Bowls, losing twice to the Giants. Very rarely. They have no margin games. As we know in the Super Bowl, they've either come from behind to win or won by three points. So we know they have not had any or amazingly considering how many times

they've been here and won. They have no blowout team, a la the 49ers in these Super Bowls. So, and I think Eagles have some edges in the overall quality of play. I think they don't have a lot of weaknesses, the Eagles, although the quarterback matchup is one where I just don't think he can duplicate his last game. And I think he'll have trouble where Belichick will save some stuff for a late.

The emotional part here, my brother John has been, my older brother, uh, who is going to be 70 on February 8th has been a lifelong Eagle fan. He actually became an Eagle fan when they traded Roman Gabriel, his favorite player from the Rams to the Eagles. Wow. Many, many years ago, uh, his all time favorite Eagle is Wilbert Montgomery. He's been a lifelong crazy Eagle fan. And he told me all year that they were going to the Super Bowl, and

when the quarterback got hurt, I said my condolences. He says, no, I still think they're going to go to the Super Bowl. And I said, you're crazy. I don't think you're going to get there. And they got there. And I haven't asked him yet. I got to get his prediction. He hasn't given me yet a straight prediction on the game,

although I know he's going to hope the Eagles win. I don't know if he thinks the Eagles are going to win. But I'll ask him this weekend. But I'll be rooting heavily. But I think we're going to see more of the same. And the number that's been in my head all the time is 27-24 that's been in my head all, all time is 27, 24 paths has been in my head all year. And I'm just afraid of the backdoor cover with them. I don't think they're a margin team. Um, I think the more likely cover is the patch, but I don't have a lot of faith in

their defense. So that's the number I've had on the game all time is so we totally agree. I think patch win. I think Pats win. I think they'll win. But I think it's going to be close. And I don't know where the late money will go. It might not go anywhere. It seems there's been so much money on the Eagles. The number's down to four now.

I think it opened at five and a half, six in some places, and now it's down to four. So I know the Pats on the money line is still an expensive bet because it's still two to one. But that is probably the smart play if you want to get into the game, although it's pricey. I think the Pats will win. I think that Brady and the ability of the coaching staff to make plays and to make the right judgments is always there if they're behind.

They know how to do this. They've done it so many times, it's almost like they're ready for it and waiting for it. So we agree. I see the Pats 27-24, but I see the Pats winning. It's even weirder. I had 26-23. Oh, really?

Yeah, we were one point apart. Are you going to the game or no? No, after the second giant Super Bowl, I can never see another Pat Super Bowl in person. It was the worst. Have you ever been to a Pat victory? Oh, yeah. Have you ever been to a Pat win in Giant Super Bowl, I can never see another Pat Super Bowl in person. It was the worst. Have you ever been to a Pat victory? Have you ever been to a Pat win in the Super Bowl? I went to the first five Belichick-Brady games.

So I saw three wins. The Giants, my dad's 60th birthday present was to fly him to that Giants game to watch us go 19-0. And our livers were ripped out of our bodies. And then four years later, I was sitting on the 18-yard line where the Gronk Hail Mary at the end, where it seemed like he was going to catch it for a second, and that was it. And all the Giants fans are going nuts. I'm like, I'm never going to another Super Bowl with the Pats. I got to get out of here.

I love tread marks. Leaving. Well, it's good that I'm not there because I got to get out of here. I just want to, I left tread marks, leaving. Well, it's good that I'm not there because I have been at every Pat loss. Oh, Jesus. So I have been at the Bay loss. I have been at the Green Bay loss and I have been at the two giant losses.

So I have been at, let's see how many wins. One, two, I've been at, let's see how many wins. One, two, I've been at three wins, and I've been at four losses. Oh, well, I'm glad you're not there. By the way, here's this prop. Pats win by exactly three points. 7-1. 7-1 odds. I like it.

I'm on it. All right. I'm taking it. Will you pop on a couple times during 2018 I will we'll talk basketball and stuff

I'll come on when we get closer to the tournament or I'll pop on to say hello but thanks very much for having me this has been my only

outlet in my as you call it hibernation so I appreciate it thank you yeah and I'm here if you want to

announce anything you can come back on and tell us what's going on alright thanks Mike Francesa. You get it first, I promise. Thanks, buddy.

All right. Bye. Bye. All right, we're going to run a little interview I did Wednesday night with Vince Staples, who is on tour, an old friend of the BS podcast and the Ringer Empire. But I wanted to talk to him about the Blake Griffin trade. But first, let's talk about Pro Flowers.

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Proflowers.com, code BS, and press the one you love. Now, Vince Staples. All right, on the line. He's in Sacramento. He's been on tour for the last 17 years. And now he's ready to talk about his beloved Clippers who have blown it up yet again. Vince Staples, how are you? I'm good, man. How you feel? So you were upset when this trade happened.

Walk us through your emotions. No, I wasn't really upset. I just thought it was funny, but it was kind of a backward order of things. But, I mean, who really cares what you think about it? No one's going to win the championship, so everybody should do what they want for the next couple of months, couple of years. So it's blow it up.

You're back to square one. Nine years of Blake Griffin out the window. Were you sad? Are you going to miss him? I think everybody should blow their team up right now. If you haven't done a recent blow up like the Knicks or like the Timberwolves, everybody should slightly blow their team up. You got to prepare for 2024.

Because you're saying... I think it would have covered out. Because you're saying... I feel like it's coming down. Because you think the Wizards, I mean, the Warriors have locked it up now for the next five years. Well, you got like the Warriors, you got the Rockets,

you have the Celtics. I mean, it's kind of over for the Cavs already. It's kind of over for... I don't know. It's over for a lot of people. I don't know who can win. Like, who can honestly win a championship? Except for the Celtics, the Cavs, I mean't know, it's over for a lot of people. I don't know who could win. Like, who could honestly

win a championship? Except for the Celtics, the Rockets, or, you know, Golden State. Kawhi wants to leave because they tried to kill him. And that's pretty much it.

You think they tried to kill Kawhi? Is that what's going on? I missed that story. Yeah, and Antonio tried to assass kill Kawhi? Is that what's going on? I missed that story. Yeah, San Antonio tried to assassinate Kawhi. I didn't know about that. Oh, that's... San Antonio assassinated him. Breaking news here on the BS podcast.

Yeah, I'm with you. They like false diagnosed him with brain cancer or some shit. They tried to, you know, make him go through the ringer. No pun intended. Yeah, I mean, we've seen this over and over again with NBA training staff screwing up something with somebody. It seems to be a recurring theme. I would be very nervous going to my team-appointed doctor if I had a medical condition, if I was an NBA player. But that would be just me.

Look, man, just go to the real. Do they have health insurance? Yeah, I think they do. I think NBA players have health insurance. If you have health insurance, why are you going to the team doctor? You're a millionaire.

You're pathetic. Um. No, they're not the best doctors. Have you seen the, have you seen the new doctor's offices they put in the mall? No.

See, it's one, it's one in the West, what's it called, Corey? No, it's one in the, it's one in the Westfield Mall. I forgot what the name of the doctor's office is. Corey took the name of the mall and I forgot the name of the doctor's office.

But everything is kind of, you know, electronic. It's like Westworld. You ever seen Westworld? Yeah. It's like that. I would go to there before I go to Team Doctor. I like the fact that you're still going to malls. Oh, no.

I go to the new malls. I don't go to the old malls. I don't go to the old malls. You don't go to the old school malls? San Antonio has a mall that's in a time warp from 1988 that I walked through once during one of the finals. I was really impressed. It was like going back in time. San Antonio took the prospering rapper Tay-K from us,

and San Antonio also tried to take Kawhi Leonard from us, so you should really think about that place. The Alamo was in San Antonio, right? Yeah. Yeah, it is. That was an inherently racist event, so I should think about it. I'm with you on your theory that unless you think you can beat the Warriors in the next

five years, what's the point? I do think like when they... I'm not paying anybody $100 million and I know we're not going to win. That's a waste of my money. Well, what about $173 million? Because that's what Blake was getting. Blake got $173 million and there was no chance of winning an NBA title.

I would save them money. Yeah, when they did it I was confused, but I thought it was because he was trying to get a new stadium built and they were worried about season tickets and all that stuff, but I actually think basketball... They're not trying to get a new stadium built and they're not worried about season tickets, but who cares if But I actually think basketball... Well, they are trying to get a new stadium built and they're worried about season tickets.

But who cares if you're not going to win? That's the thing. You have to think about the Lakers have a brighter future than the Clippers and that should never be possible because the things that transpired out that way. Right. You don't want to elaborate on that? You know what I'm talking about.

You know what happens in the snow. It's called forward. Forward is the doctor's office where everything is a robot. You should think about it. Okay. Yeah, but when they gave Blake $173 million and they actually broke down the salaries and the last year was like $39.8 million

and he's already had seven surgeries, that made me nervous and I'm not even a Clipper fan. Well, Blake Griffin is the new Sean Kemp, and we should embrace that. We should embrace that. He needs children. He needs a lot of things that Sean Kemp had around this time. How many years is Sean Kemp playing Seattle?

Probably almost as many, a little less than Blake. I think seven. Yeah. So, okay, Sean Kemp played seven seasons. little less than Blake. I think seven. Yeah. So, okay. Now I can't play seven. So you see, so he should have been going last year. Right. Well, he has made the all-star team.

He didn't make the all-star team for three years. So if you're paying somebody now, he hadn't made it since 2015. See, I'm so far removed from successful basketball. I didn't even know who was on the All-Star team for the past couple years. But what I can say is Blake Griffin at Shire Camp, Chris Paul, Gary Payton, Austin Rivers is Nate McMillan,

and DeAndre Jordan is kind of shrimp, and he's the dude with the Afro Perkins. He's kind of a mix between both of those. So no one made that analogy before on this show. I just want you to know the Los Angeles Clippers are the Seattle Supersonics. We are taping this on a Wednesday night Pacific Coast time. So if DeAndre Jordan gets traded before people hear this, then it's not our fault. Did you ever think, it seems like he's going to get traded.

Did you ever think Doc Rivers was going to be the last man standing out of all of these people? I think Doc Rivers has always been the last man standing. I think that's part of his life. When Kevin Johnson punched the shit out of him, he was standing tall. I think that was when he was on the big. Yeah. When Dominique Wilkins got them in that gambling debt with Big Boy from ATL. That's based on a true story, by the way.

It's the story of Dominique Wilkins, if you didn't know. Doc Rivers was standing tall. I feel like he's done a lot of story, by the way. It's the story of Dominique Wilkins, if you didn't know. Doc Rivers was standing tall. I feel like he's done a lot of good things in his life. I have some friends who went to high school with young Austin down in Orlando. I kind of root for Doc Rivers now. Well, you're going to have to. Well, you don't really need to be good to be a head coach, and we've seen that over and over and over again.

Why can't Doc Rivers be a part of that Orlando magic, every New Orleans Hornets coach thing where everybody just sucks? Why can't he be a part of that? I mean, I've gone back and forth on him because he did win a title with the Celtics, but that also was a loaded team. Remember they took us seven games to beat the Hawks? Remember when Luke Wall was really the truth behind the Warriors' success?

Right. How's that going right now? It seems like there's three coaches that stand out, and then everybody else, it just depends on what kind of team they have. Or they can be worse than that. Popovich, Brad Stevens, aka Tiny Pop. Yeah. And who's the third coach that stands out to you guys?

We're in the room. Jason Kidd just got fired, so free Jason Kidd from that bottle he's into right now. Definitely not Jason Kidd. He would not have been on my list. I would bet that Brad Stevens, Popovich, and who else? Steve Kerr? Steve Kerr. I think those are the three.

He's kind of like Jordan Punch himself. You've got to put him there. Jordan punched him, and Steve Kerr went I think those are the three. He's kind of like Jordan Punch himself. He's, you know, you got to put him there. Jordan punched him and Steve Kerr went right back at him and threw a couple punches that missed. But it was... This is my thing about Steve Kerr, he's going to fight with Jordan. Steve Kerr knew it was about the team and not Michael Jordan. And that's why he's a good coach.

Yeah. I don't think that's an easy team to coach. And I would say Draymond is one of probably the five hardest guys in the league to coach day to day to keep his respect and keep him in check because Draymond will just go off the reservation and he's done a nice job. Brian Winters was also a basketball coach let's not forget that I remember that. Who was? Brian Winters. Oh one of the first bearded NBA players. Yeah you you can't forget. He was out there in Vancouver causing havoc. Hey, since we started talking sports on my show way back when,

you became more famous and successful, which I think everybody expected because you're young and you're on the way up. You made fun of a lot of athletes on these shows. Did you ever run into them? Of course not. I live very far away from everyone. I live in the wilderness. And on tour.

But I've created a strong relationship with Andre Iguodala. Smart guy. I still have Harrison Mars, my friend from Iowa, as I like to call him. Me and Jordan Clarkson are cool. They shouldn't trade him, by the way. That's a very big mistake because he brings the party to the locker room.

And when Chris Paul comes through the back door, Justin Clarkson's going to punch somebody in the face. I promise you that. They're trading him, just for the record. They have to trade him. Yeah, it's happening. Why? Because they have to clear cap space for

LeBron because LeBron is making them think that he's going to come there and whether he actually does it or not, we'll see. LeBron James goes to the Lakers. I think that'll single-handedly ruin... That'll be his back to the future three. Ooh, I

like that. You can't go out west. You know what I mean? That'll be his back to the future three. Ooh, I like that. That's him. You can't go out west. You know what I mean? You started in Hill Valley. You went to the future. Then you came back to Hill Valley. And it's like, you can't go to the wild, wild west.

Just end it here. I think he's going to go to the wild, wild west is my prediction. I think that's what happens. Well, where's he going to play if he goes to Lakers, by position-wise? I think they're going to let him choose who's on the team if it happens. Let me ask you this.

Why does he own two houses worth more than $20 million each in Brentwood? Why does he own two houses in Brentwood? Have you ever been to Cleveland, Ohio? But why own two? Plus his business partner's here. When you you ever been to Cleveland, Ohio? But why on two? Plus his business partners here. When you spend your days in Cleveland, Ohio,

you want two houses in Brentwood. Trust me. Would you lose respect for him if you went to the Lakers? Would I lose respect? I would never lose respect for LeBron James because he's held onto that hairline for a very long time. Yeah. He doesn't care about what we say about him.

People always leave that part of the story out. The fact that everybody's told him to drop the top. And he's never dropped the top. And he doesn't even do the Chris Paul, Kobe Bryant, I'm actually ball. Right. He just keeps it there and says, I'm going to win championships with this on my head. That lets you know what you need to know about LeBron James. He cares about basketball stuff.

He's defiant. He's defiant. That's how I feel. I like LeBron James. I just don't see him going to the Lakers. I think he's, I don't know, I think he has too much wits about him to go to the Lakers because he's not going to win there either. So I'd rather not win in Cleveland.

It's better for my 30 for 30 because LeBron's thinking about a 30 for 30 right now. Yeah. And it's a multi-part. It's like three parts. It might even be four parts. And it's probably not going to be very good. So this is my proposed trade.

Yeah. Ty, what was our trade? Ty. DeAndre Jordan and Lou Williams. Yeahiam yeah ty my dj he's right here he's my consultant okay jerry west he's your trade machine yeah he's my trade machine for kevin love it was a kevin love deandre jordan and whoever else they want trade and then we have the blake griffin for we don't care trade like a couple picks yeah and we also have the lou williams austin rivers doc rivers trade for d'angelo russell and one of those rock trade, like a couple picks. Yeah. And we also had the Lou Williams, Austin Rivers,

Doc Rivers trade for D'Angelo Russell and one of those Roc Nation hats. That was our third trade. You get the Nets coach in that trade. The Nets coach is actually pretty good. See, and we want the Nets coach. I'm just tired of Doc Rivers, bro. So you're thinking Lou

Williams, both Riverses for D'Angelo Russell and Kenny. You bring back Danny Russell back to LA. Yeah. Because the Lakers took their best player for no reason. There was a reason. What did they trade their best player for? Cause they're trying to create cap space for LeBron. That's what I was trying to tell you.

All right. So yeah, like I said, the Lakers traded their best player for no reason. Yeah. And you bring D'Lo back to Los Angeles. You let him get his revenge. Like, remember when Kobe was threatening

to leave the Lakers and go sign with the Clippers that one offseason when he was hanging out in Turkey? Yeah, he used the Clippers. He used them. It's that narrative. And now we use, you know, the Lakers to get a point guard because there hasn't been a point guard in Los Angeles since, you know, Baron Davis besides Chris Paul. Like, there hasn't been a point guard in Los Angeles since Baron Davis

besides Chris Paul. There hasn't been a backup. There hasn't been anything. It was a one-point guard team for 10 years or so. Just get a lot of point guards and plan for the future because no one's going to win until 2024. See, I think LeBron, there's already been some buzz about now LeBron, the door's open to go to the Clippers,

Jerry West, all this stuff. It feels like Kobe in 2004. I'm glad you remember that because Kobe definitely used the Clippers. There's no question. All right, well, we got to wrap up. But this is what I'm going to tell you, listen. The Clippers need to blow it up. Everyone needs to blow it up.

Indiana blew it up, and they're doing even better. You know what I mean? This is the year of blowing teams up. Remember who said it first when every player is on a different team in the next couple years? Blow it up. Steph Curry-Kurt years. Will you come back on some point? Always. Alright. Miss you, brother. Thanks, man.

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Everybody hates us. Don't forget about all the podcasts we did this week. Larry Wilmore on Wednesday. We did Cousin Sal and who else was on Monday? Tate, Cousin Sal. No, who was the second one? It was somebody good. J.K. Simmons. J.K. Simmons. Yeah, we taped it a week before. That's why I forgot. He was awesome though. If you love Oz, check that one out. And also Ringer NBA Show is on there, broken down the break from

trade. Against All Odds with Cousin Sal, we did the Super Bowl props. House of Carbs. David Chang, Major Doma Review. And then this weekend, the Rewatchables with Varsity Blues is coming on. When do I get to come back on One Shiny Pod, Tate? Whenever you're ready. We're gearing up. I'm watching college basketball now.

Mid-February. Talk some gambling? Yeah, we're ready when you are. All right. You invited me on in December. We had a great time. We did a two-parter. Yeah. And Tate's got GM Street Sunday night.

Don't forget about that. Right after the game, him and Lombardi are going to be breaking it down. And hopefully, don't feed Lombardi too much food. I'll do my best. Try to, yeah. Keep him light. Did not call my dad. I can't,

we've had mixed results calling my dad on the Friday before, but I will be calling him next week after the game. Go Patriots. Let's do this. I'm ready.

Enjoy the weekend. Enjoy the game. Back on Monday. This is it. I'm ready enjoy the weekend enjoy the game back on Monday this Saturday I'm ready I'm ready I'm ready I'm ready

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