The Bill Simmons Podcast - John Madden’s Incredible Career With Bryan Curtis, and Most Regrettable NBA Contracts With Wosny Lambre and Joe House

Episode Date: December 29, 2021

The Ringer’s Bill Simmons is joined by Bryan Curtis to remember legendary football coach and broadcaster John Madden (1:40). Then Bill talks with Joe House and Wosny Lambre about NBA playoff contenders and replacement players (34:15) before drafting the 30 most regrettable NBA contracts today (52:11). Host: Bill Simmons Guests: Bryan Curtis, Joe House, and Wosny Lambre Producer: Kyle Crichton Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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putting up a same game parlay for one of the NBA games on Wednesday night. We're on a little streak with same game parlay with million dollar picks and also with the NBA parlays. I think we've hit three or four in a row. Somebody throw some water on us, cool us off. Coming up on this podcast, Brian Curtis and I are going to talk about the impact of John Madden, who passed away, we found out today, at age 85. Just an incredible career, which we're going to try to lay out for you in a half hour. We'll see how we do. And then Wasney Lambry, Joe House, they're coming on, talk a little bit about the NBA season, but really to talk about

the most regrettable NBA contracts of the 2021-22 season. We used to call it worst contracts when I wrote for Grantland in the ring. We're trying to be a little nicer as we head into the holidays. We'll call it regrettable NBA contracts. So action-packed podcast today. It's a good one.

First, our friends from Pearl Jam. All right, we're taping this part of the podcast. It's about 5 o'clock Pacific time. Got Brian Curtis in. He's on vacation. Very few people, I think, would have prompted us to do an emergency podcast to talk about somebody's death. But John Madden, I think one of the most influential sports media members of my lifetime. He might even be in the running for first. Passed away today, age 85. The timing was kind of crazy because we just had this documentary

about him on Christmas day. And there was this whole resurgence of kind of Madden's impact on sports and beyond and all this stuff. And so kind of as shocked as I probably am going to be about somebody who is 85 years old, but I got to say, Brian, I was shocked because it felt like we were just talking about him all week. Absolutely. And you know, you and I were texting during the documentary and the big part of that was John Madden had not been on camera in a really long time. He's done interviews from time to time. I talked to him a couple of years ago, but he, he hadn't done anything. And then you see him on that Rinaldi doc and he sounded really good. He looked good. He, you know, he had that recognizable John Madden voice, which every time you hear it, you and I are children of the eighties and you get excited and you feel like, oh my gosh, here, here's John Madden voice, which every time you hear it, you and I are children of the 80s and you get excited and you feel like, oh my gosh, here's John Madden. He's telling a story

and then you get a little bit of that voice kind of going on. And I don't know. I'm just, I'm absolutely stunned right now. He, one of the many great things about his career was it took three turns, right? Where you have this Raiders coach turn where he's one of the most successful NFL coaches just by winning record of all time. He was the guy when I was growing up, we had to beat the Raiders. We could never beat the Raiders. The Raiders gave the Patriots the worst playoff loss of my childhood. And Madden was the guy. And it was like, you only knew a couple of the coaches. You knew Tom Landry, you knew Chuck Knoll, you knew John Madden. And then it was basically everybody else.

And then he leaves, guess he got burned out, whatever it was, and immediately goes into announcing and immediately is unbelievable. He's so good at it. And I remember as a kid, I was like sixth or seventh grade. He even hosted SNL. And at that point, like Cosell was the only person in the media that you ever could have imagined in a million years would actually host SNL, you know, out of any sports media person. Nobody else was doing that. But it was like a comet watching happen. He was so much better at announcing football than anybody else we had. It wasn't close. He was competing against Merlin Olsen, Bob Trumpy, Tom Brookshire, whoever was on Monday Night Football. They were never good.

He taught me about football. He entertained me. He was this character. He kind of became almost like a family member, right? When somebody hits like he hits, you feel like they're in your family. And that's how I felt with him for two decades. Here's how big he hits. You feel like they're in your family. That's how I felt with him for two decades. Here's how big he was.

CBS decides he should be the number one NFL color analyst on the NFL on CBS, which was the broadcast, right? And they do this in-season bake-off for the guy who's going to be his play-by-play guy between Pat Summerall and Vin Scully. Now, think what a legend Vin Scully was. 40 years ago, CBS decided he was insufficiently good enough to be Madden's partner and kicks him to the curb and he goes to NBC.

I mean, that's incredible. I read that story and the logic actually made sense because they were like, however, Terry O'Neill was, I think, the guy who was pushing for the decision, he was the executive, and he was saying how, hey, look, Scully is great, but he talks. Madden, if we're going to make this work, he's going to talk a lot. It was one of the rare times in sports TV history that somebody's like, these two are great, maybe not necessarily great

together. Put in Summerall, he's not going to say a lot. It could be like the perfect balance. Boy, was that assessment right. Summerall and Madden are still the greatest announcing team of my lifetime. I don't think there's ever been a better one. I don't even know who number two would be. I think they're so far ahead of everybody else we've ever had. No, and it caught Pat at the

perfect moment because Pat had been this big star in the 70s. He was just a big guy, a former NFL player, and he needed a second second he needed a boost right he needed a boost so he they put him with Madden and you know first and ten uh you know Montana Rice touchdown boom get out of the way and then John Madden's got all the time he needs to fill fill it up with sound and to use the telestrator which they used to call the CBS chalkboard back in the old days. You did say something about there was no competitor. I will say this.

When Madden starts, late 70s, early 80s, the guy is still Howard Cosell on Monday Night Football. That's fair. Yeah, you're right. He's still the guy. And Rinaldi's doc made this point, but John Madden came in and like everybody else who's been ever been good at anything. You know what he said, Bill,

he said, they're doing this the wrong way. They're calling football the wrong way. And the thing they're doing is Howard is great at personality. He's great at the morals of the game and the big stories and storylines and stuff, but he's scared of football itself, the way it's played on the field.

He doesn't understand it. And he doesn't think the people at home will understand it. And John Madden goes, actually, the best way to understand a football game is to figure out all the complexities of football and just explain it to people at home in a way they understand. He'd done this class at the University of Cal Berkeley, and I talked to him. So he, and I talked to him about this once. And he, what he did is he told me he'd go up on a chalkboard and he draw football plays. And he's now there's people in class who are not football people,

right? They're people that like watching football on Sunday. And he'd go, okay, you know, when he's going here, when he's going here and he would watch them and he would watch the moment he lost them. Right. So he's explaining a play and says, I'm going to watch the moment their eyes glaze over. And I'm going to walk right up to that point. Or I'm going to explain it in a way that doesn't make their eyes gloss over. That's really funny. That's the way you announce a game. You don't run away from the game.

You just explain it in a way people can understand. And I saw people on Twitter here last few minutes going, well, you know, Madden was a great coach. He was a great announcer. He was a video game guy. I want to add something to that list. He was a great explainer of football. And in that way, he's not just like, well, Madden, you know, you can draw a line from Madden to Chris Collinsworth. You can draw a line from Madden to Kevin Clark, to Bill Barn to everybody to Zach Lowe in basketball, right? Everybody who says, I'm going to show you how this game is played and make this complicated thing understandable to you. That's what John Madden could do. When I was a kid, the announcers were mostly terrible. We had, by today's standards, right? It was very, very like, well, you know, it's a big spot for

them here and this will be a huge first down if they're able to get it. And the most basic stuff and Madden came in and it was like, honestly, revolutionary seems like a weird thing to say about a sports narrative. So it really did feel revolutionary. I was so used to this generic stuff, unless it was Monday night. Monday night was like this good old boys thing. I grew up with Meredith and Cosell and then Meredith got bounced. And then it was like GIF and this rotating cast. And they always tried to make it kind of light and fun, but Cosell overpowered everything. He was such a force of nature. Madden was the first one who was like, oh, I feel like I'm watching the game with somebody. I feel like he's on my couch with me telling me what's going on.

And he was so much better at it than everybody else that it actually led to that old, oh, other people trying to do the Madden. It's like, nobody's doing this. Stop. And he became like, basically it's him and Cosell. And I don't know if Stephen A is on that same level because I don't think ESPN hits as many homes, but these people that kind of transcended sports and became something else, you know, it was realistic that he could host Saturday Night Live. It was realistic that they would name a video game and put his name on it, which was the third arc of Madden's career. And like how my son knows him. Brian, you're going to, I hesitate to tell you this. There was a commercial for the Madden documentary and it's on and my son sees it and he looks at me and he goes,

John Madden was an announcer? No. Like completely serious, like had no idea. But this is how somehow Madden lives on through that game and through his announcing in the game, which is weird because I think it kind of undermines how incredible of an announcer he was. And then the other thing is people kind of remember the end of his career announcing, which was not what it was like in the 80s and 90s, obviously. I had to write a piece about that at the time because, you know, everybody was taking a shit on him. I think this was around 2005 and going, you know, John Madden, he repeats himself. He's just doing this boom, whap, oh, look at that lineman, 300 pounds running down the field thing. And I was like, we got to this point where we learned so much from John Madden that we took it all for granted. Like we had learned by that point, 25 years of football from him. And we were

like, wait a second, but you're totally right. And it wasn't just John Madden was better than everybody else in the early 80s. Remember when NBC would get a Super Bowl in the mid 90s, early 90s, and you'd be like, ugh. Right.

Can't you loan Madden to NBC for the Super Bowl so it could be a better game? Yeah. Are we really doing this? We're not going to have John Madden calling the Super Bowl. I mean, and that's, you know,

that's like when they do that Hall of Fame numbers thing. Well, he was great for his era, but who was the second best guy? You can do that for John Madden's whole career. You're right. Bob Trumpy was the number one guy. Merlin Olsen. Merlin Olsen. That 97 guys at Monday Night Football.

Dan Deardorff was in there. Yeah. Collinsworth. And without insulting too many people, the gap and I think most of those people would admit it, the gap between Madden and them was huge. And we should add the other thing to this, by the way.

Not just explaining football and all that stuff. He's just funny. He was a great entertainer. I said this on your pod the other day. When the game sucked, and it seemed like every Super Bowl John Madden called pretty much sucked during the 80s because they were all blowouts. You just feel like I got this. I absolutely got this.

We're going to draw things. We're going to draw the moon. I'm going to circle the moon. I'm going to circle the bucket on the sideline. Here's the mama bucket. Here's the bat daddy bucket. Here's the baby bucket that the Gatorade. I just, I got this.

I can, I can do an hour of airtime. Now tell me the guy on television right now, calling any sport who can do an hour of airtime now tell me the guy on television right now calling any sport who can do an hour of airtime and keep you entertained in a blowout it never felt like schtick either two other things with him as an announcer because you know I think about this a lot the impact of people and then they're gone and they're kind of never discussed again because Cosell was like this too. Cosell wrote autobiographies in 1973 and then 1974. He has two like 700 page autobiographies in a row.

Just wrote it again. Yeah. It's like, hey, I had more to say about my life. Like it just, and he still had 10 years to go at that point. But with Matt and like two things within that, I think illustrate like how important it was. One, if your team had a Madden game, it felt like you were like chosen,

you know, it was like, Oh my God, Madden's doing my team. I had this experience probably less than 10 times because Patriots wrong conference, you had the Cowboys. So he's doing your team all the time. He just lived, he just lived in Dallas. I mean, itboys. So he's doing your team all the time. He just lived in Dallas. I mean, it was unbelievable. When he did your team, it was like, oh, this is cool. I'm actually going to learn stuff about my team. And also there was a weightiness and an importance. Look, football, probably sports will never mean as much to me as it did the first 22, 23 years of your life, right? That's just everything's life or death and you're just going nuts. When he was doing those NFC games in the 80s,

late 80s, early 90s, those Cowboys Niners games, Giants Niners, some of the games in Candlestick, the games in Dallas, like those great Emmitt Smith. What was the game when Emmitt Smith had the separated shoulder

and he's still like gashing the Niners? Madden was so crucial to those games. It was like, it took it to nine other levels that we had the best announcer who ever lived doing these amazing football games. Absolutely. I remember that Emmitt game. I think that was against the giants. If I'm not mistaken, when he separates his shoulder and Madden came down to the locker room, I hope I'm getting this right. And said, that was the bravest thing I've ever seen. He did. He did. He was saying that during the telecast, he was like, I'm in awe of what this guy's doing. He's hurt. Nobody understands how hard this is. That was built. Like the Pope had blessed Emmett Smith. I mean, when John Madden said that it had this like extra

weight, right? It wasn't like, Oh, you know, Chris Collinsworth made a great point on Sunday night football. It wasn't in that list at all. was just like it was a different thing and you're right he was on television all the time we should say so you had john mann calling the game and then you had tenacton you had miller light at the beginning you had the video game later on he was just he was just on tv selling things great business guy oh unbelievable well barkley i should have mentioned when we were talking about, because I think Barkley's probably third on that list. He's in that pantheon. Yeah. Where he just transcended. He made you watch stuff that you didn't even know you were going

to watch a postgame show, but you ended up staying up an extra 45 minutes because you want to hear what Barkley says. And that's the hardest place to get to. But with Madden, two other things, two times when a network needed credibility, when they're acquiring football, what do they do? Fox, which you've written about for Grantland and for The Ringer, Fox needs credibility for football. What do they do? They get John Madden.

NBC, they need credibility as they're getting this Sunday night package. What do they do? They get John Madden. He has a three-decade run where the stamp of approval of having him involved with your football game was the most important thing you could tell the public. And there's nobody like that now. People would say Romo's like that now,

but honestly, you got to earn that. That's got to be like a 10, 15-year thing. Romo's not even close to earning that yet. No. And you and I've done all these stories before, but to me, John Madden's free agency at the end of 93 when CBS loses the NFL rights, it's the funniest thing I've ever seen.

So you had Romo, that was ESPN versus CBS. John Madden was CBS versus NBC versus ABC. Yeah. And it looked like he was going to go to Monday Night Football at that point. NBC offered John men, a train car to come to NBC. He had the bus and they said,

okay, Dick Ebersole said, okay, we're going to give you a train car and we're going to have, they were GE at the time. And we're going to pull the train car from city to city so that you can go announce the games. I don't, I don't remember people offering Tony Romo like a 747.

Right. That's part of the deal. But that's how badly they wanted him. Because you're right, it was instant credibility. And the Madden Cruiser was part of, there were a couple of things that boosted him to a whole other level, even though he was the best at what he did compared to everybody else. But all the side stories about him on the bus and there would always be some

announcer. Like, what was that? Like every 18 months, somebody would write the feature about, I went on the Madden cruiser with John Madden. Yeah. By all accounts,

like an incredible guy to just hang out with. Like when you do that guest, that thing about who are the four people you'd want to have dinner with. Madden was always on that list for, I don't know, 20 years. We were like, man, it would be just amazing to hang out with that guy and hear football stories from him

on top of his whole Raiders thing. And then the video game piece, I don't think we can sleep on that. You know, the game probably happens anyway. But the fact that it was called Madden made me want to buy it. I was the prime demo. I'm in college. I'm buying football games. And it's like, oh called Madden made me want to buy it. I was the prime demo. I'm in college.

I'm buying football games. And it's like, oh, Madden has a game? Okay. It was Madden or Tecmo. And then Madden just took it. And then it became the standard. I don't know how much money he made from it, but I hope it was enough. It should have been.

Yeah, it was a little bit like him giving his blessing to Emmett Smith. Because I remember it hit me the same way. You were like, oh, John Madden's vouching for this. Okay. So it's not going to be Tecmo. It's not going to be the 10 yard fight or whatever crappy football kind of thing we had before that. Like it's going to be actual real football. And then it just explodes. And you're right. And then the old thing, it's funny you say that about your son, like John Madden used to be an announcer because remember the first version of that was John Madden used to be a football coach. Right. Right.

And he was an awesome football coach. Yeah. We won a Super Bowl and people blank that part. Now they're blanking the second part. But yeah, he was remember he was still in the game a lot. You were the one who always wrote about how Pat Summerall was replaced by video game Pat for the last couple years of his career. That was one of my favorite jokes. First and ten.

49ers. What a throw. And Madden was like, remember you'd be playing the video game and be like, oh my god, John Madden is announcing my video game. And he had like, I remember the funny one. There was one year where he had something really nice about all the quarterbacks. And then he got to

Scott Mitchell of the Detroit Lions. Remember that one? And it was like, Scott Mitchell attended the University of Utah or whatever it was. You know, like he didn't even have a compliment for Scott Mitchell. Like even Madden couldn't

bring himself to say something nice. Well, I'm old enough to remember when they like voice, announcer voices was a gimmick to sell football video games.

It was like late 80s, early 90s, where it was like, you're going to have an announcer. And it was this computer announcer who'd be like, caught by Herman Moore. And then they had like the 50 lines.

And it'd be like, oh, it kind of feels like an announcer. And then by the mid 2000s, it was like, oh my God, John Madden's literally announcing my game. Like I'm playing with my buddy at four in the morning after we just got back from a bar. And here here's that was late nineties, whatever it was. Um, I think when you add his

career up, I think it's one of the most important football careers ever, which is weird to say, because he never played. I think there were better coaches, but if you're talking about impact on the general public, making them care about football, like football, enjoy football, just the spending time in people's lives, he has to be in the top five. He just has to. He has to be included with Brady and Lawrence Taylor and Jerry Rice and Vince Lombardi, all these other people, I think he belongs on whatever short list that is. I'm so glad this guy passed through my life. I'll never forget having him in my life as a football fan. He was a salesman for football.

Yeah. You know how when you get a great writer and you're like, man, he makes me want to watch basketball more or watch wrestling more or whatever it is because he's just so good at it. He's kind of selling me. He's being a good writer, a good broadcaster, and he's also selling the sport. John Madden was that, right? He made you want to sit down and watch a football game because he was a salesman for football. It's interesting. Basketball never really had that guy. Barkley was the closest, but he was never doing games. He was a postgame guy. Baseball, McCarver never got there, but there was a stretch where it was like, this guy's really making me smarter about baseball. And then we all kind of turned on him a little bit because he got a little long-winded. But in general, even if you compare

him to other sports, it's like, who's this guy competing against in any sport? I don't even think it's an argument for who's the best color guy ever in a sport. I don't think it's an argument. I think it's Madden, and then it's, all right, let's talk about who second place is. It's like the Jerry Rice thing. It's like Jerry Rice is the best receiver of all time. There's no other argument. We can talk about second place, but first place is done.

Yeah, and I think the interesting argument is the best broadcaster in sports ever. Let's forget football analysts. Let's forget analyst analysts. Let's just start with, is there anybody that did anything better on television and sports than John Madden did at Colin Football? No. I don't know what my list is. I really don't.

I mean, I think we could throw the Al Michaelses out and the Vince Scullies and all those big guys from the 70s, 80s, and Costas, all those guys, and they'd be on the list somewhere. But is there any but one of them that was better at what they did than John Madden was at what he did? I don't think so.

Maybe Larry Merchant interviewing boxers on HBO. Kind of a little niche. Yeah. The fearlessness. Now, man, he's, I think it's so hard,

especially in sports media, where the tendency is to immediately either turn on somebody or get tired of somebody that it really never happened with Matt. And even near the end, as he got older and he, it became way more like a little more Madden karaoke. He was in like year 29, year 30 at that point. That's what

happens. But I always liked him even then. He was with Al, too, at the end. We forget. I mean, talk about a super team. He found Al late in his career. They were Al's at the top of his game. Madden is, as you say, kind of at

the end, but he's like, we're still really, really good. And that, and that Monday and then Sunday night team was really, really awesome. I mean, I just, I go back to what I said a second ago, just imagine you have the best guy at explaining football on TV and you pair him with the most entertaining guy explaining football on TV. It'd be like if Charles Barkley knew lots about basketball analytics and X's and O's. Charles Barkley's funny because he doesn't know about that. That's his corner, as you would like to say. John Madden was the best at both at the same time on the same broadcast. And that's, again, where are you going to find that skill set with anybody in sports? Like I said, when he was, when he comes along, the 49ers, Bill Walsh, that's just

blowing up, right? So John Madden has this palette, like, Ooh, I can explain what Bill Walsh is doing here and here. And then LT comes along and I can show you how Bill Parcells is trying to screw up what Bill, Bill Walsh is doing with the 49ers. The reason we know about that stuff in the age of newspapers, we didn't have like people grinding tape on Twitter is because of John Madden. And we also had all these lines that we were doing on the playground on Monday because of John Madden, because he was also saying funnier things than everybody on TV. Again, I just, it's so hard now to explain to people who weren't around, who were like, oh, these guys are good.

But you're like, man, he was doing both at the same time. Well, here's one way to explain it. We can wrap it up on this. Just take away every podcast you're listening to and 99% of all the stuff you're reading. And just imagine you're only reading your local paper and you're reading Sports Illustrated once a week if it was a beefed up Sports Illustrated. And that's really it. And that was where you got your football

other than your friends, right? So for me, when in the 80s, as I'm trying to learn about football, Dr. Z was like incredibly important on Sports Illustrated, Paul Zimmerman. And he would have his all pro things at the end of the year where he would have like his big all pro thing where he would name the best players. And like, to me, it's like, I hadn't seen most of those guys.

So it's like, oh, this guy's the best cornerback. Okay. I trust Dr. Z completely. Ever to all? Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I was like, okay, that guy's the best left guard in the league now. Fantastic. I believe you, Dr. Z. We just didn't have the information. And Madden was the same way. When you watch the Madden game and he's like, you know, they're playing, I don't know. It's like the bears are playing the Cowboys. Right. And I see Walter Payton twice a year and Madden in 1984 is laying out to me why Walter Payton is so important. It's like, watch this block. This is what makes Walter Payton special. It's not just the running.

It's watch this guy's coming on the outside. Walter Payton sees him and blocks him and saves his quarterback. This is why he's the best player in the league. There was nobody else doing stuff like that. So if Madden wasn't telling me that, I wouldn't have ever known the stuff Walter Payton did because none of the announcers were doing it.

Yeah, the one of that that gets me as a Cowboys fan, this was in the doc was Nate Newton, you know, the kitchen, right? His guard for the Cowboys and the Superbowl teams. And I never in my mind could figure out how good Nate Newton was versus how obsessed with Nate Newton, John Madden was. I was like, was Nate, Nate Newton's not in the hall of fame. Right. But I was like, was Nate Newton really that bad-ass for like three or four years? Nate Newton's not in the Hall of Fame, right? But I was like, was Nate Newton really that badass for like three or four years? Or did John Madden just think Nate Newton was awesome because he had a big belly that hung over his football pants?

Well, he definitely was infatuated by certain guys. The beefy guys he always loved. Tough quarterbacks. The quarterbacks who could take a hit. The running backs like Walter Payton. The guys who weren't just like runners but could catch and block and stuff like that he he would go after strategy but not too much because there was like a little bit of coaches club like he wouldn't like destroy another coach but he would

absolutely be like wow they really i think they blew it i think they should take that time out before the two-minute warning he would bring up stuff like that that you hadn't heard on a broadcast really yeah i remember when barry switzer Switzer goes for it on fourth down against the Eagles, the famous Bozo, the coach, New York Post. I just remember John Madden. I was as furious as I ever heard him on television. I can't believe that. It's crazy. I can't believe that. When he got mad, that was a big deal. Well, and he was also really self-deprecating, right? If he was wrong, he would admit he was wrong. Like a good example is the Pats Rams Superbowl, which I didn't see the broadcast till after, but when the Pats were going for it in the last drive, he's like, this is, I wouldn't

do this. I think this is risky. I would just take, I'd try to get overtime and then they're getting in field goal range. He's like, wow, that was wrong. I have a chance to win. I can't believe it. I thought this was crazy, but he would absolutely admit if he blew it,

if he had the wrong call, if, you know, somebody shoved it in his face, basically. That's the end of Madden Summerall, right? That's their last game before Madden then leaves for ESPN. Am I getting my dates right here? Yeah. And that was a real great way for them to go out. By the way, can we say a couple of things about how cool Madden was? You know, some of the lesser known stuff or stuff

that wasn't as talked about. Madden had a place in the Dakota in New York City. Right. So it was Yoko Ono and Madden. Unbelievable. Not in the same apartment. Not trying to say anything here. But John Madden had a place in the Dakota. What? Yeah. Like Madden was kind of the coolest rich guy ever in sports broadcasting. I have been to a lot of these guys' houses. Absolutely no offense, but there's a lot of kitchen straight out of Chip and Joanna Gaines. And yeah, it's, it's fine. John Madden had a place in the Dakota. John Madden had a bus. That was John Madden had his guys that he put on the bus every week. Maybe Sandy Montag, his agent, maybe some younger producer types. And they just kind of hung on the bus with John. John was

negotiating with Rupert Murdoch directly back in 1993. John hosted Saturday Night Live, as you said. That's just awesome. I'm sure he had all the executives of whoever was running whatever network he was in, just calling him talking football and just, just wanting John Madden in their life. Yeah. When I was mentioning the times he jumped, I forgot about the ESPN one. That was kind of the hidden one in there between with CBS, Fox, ESPN, and then finally he ends up at NBC. One other thing that I think is important with him, when he was gone, he was gone. Like he stopped announcing and he never kind of hung around. He wasn't like the guy who went off to college and then kept coming back to hang out at the high school bars with everybody. He was just out. How many times did we hear from him in a football analysis way after he retired?

So he was gone and he went out as the number one guy. And I'm so glad you brought this up. I was talking to Jim Gray one time, who was good pals with Madden from their CBS days. And he goes, two people maybe ever in the history of television walked away under their own power as the number one guy. John Madden and Johnny Carson. Right. They didn't have to go. Everybody wanted them to come back and they were going, they weren't going to set, they weren't getting a salary cut. They weren't getting shoved out. They were still absolutely number one. And they said, you know what? I'm gone. And when I'm gone, I'm gone.

I'm not coming back. Right. Carson was just, he was in, where was he? Malibu. Yeah, Malibu. He was gone. He popped on Letterman's show like once or twice. That's it. But yeah, he was never hosting some correspondence dinner or anything. He was just like, I'm done.

I'm out. Had a good run. Made a lot of money. You'll never see me again. And Madden could have come back. I'm sure he had tons of offers to come back, call football, do anything he wanted to do. But he was the number one guy. And he say, he got to that point

where he said, okay, I'm still really good at this, but I'm going to walk. And you're never going to see me again. And one, it's really cool. He was able to do that. But just think of the, think of how good you have to be.

Think of how powerful you have to be to be able to call your own shot like that on television. Cause as you know, everybody gets canceled, right? Everybody in the old or shoved out. Yeah, exactly. Everybody gets the boot, you know, like we're looking at, you know, what's going to happen to Sunday night football, right? Some executive is going to make a decision and go, okay, you go over here, you go over here. John man was on the number one football broadcast. He was the number one guy. And he goes, I'm all good. I'm going to walk away on my own power.

They're going to beg me to come back and I'm going to say no. And somehow he lives on through a video game, which is the weirdest outcome that I'm sure he made incredible amounts of money on. But, you know, I think Madden and Summer are my favorite announcing team ever. I don't know if they're the best.

I think Madden's the best. But could Joe Buck have been just as good with Madden? Probably. But they are my favorites. Madden added 20 years to Pat's career. I love Pat, right? I'm with you. But Madden was the best thing ever to happen to Pat Summerall at that point in his life because he was the guy that was with the best guy. Pat Summerall at that point in his life, because he was the guy that was with the best guy. And Summerall was influential because if you remember when Joe Buck came up and I think Joe Buck is the best guy now. Yes. Um, but when Joe Buck comes up in the two thousands, he's basically doing a Summerall and he's, he's trying to be as concise and, and that's gone goodbye, you know, and it's somewhere else shadow hung over a certain breed of play-by-play announcers before everyone realized like nah you know what i should just do

my own thing so buck's like now buck's like a person more kind of gregarious pat summerall i would say his style yeah right there's still some of the dna pat summerall was great at this moment needs no more words other than touchdown. Dwight Clark. Get out. Yeah. Pat Summerall with Madden was a counter puncher. Yes.

That's what he was great at. If you watch those things, I remember Gilbert Brown, that big old, uh, green Bay nose tackle. Yeah. He would, he would, you know, Madden would go, can you, can you imagine that guy landing on you? Can you imagine with that? Imagine being that guy and imagine, and Summerall would come back and go, imagine being the ground. You know, he had the big, dry, boom, counter punch line like that.

You're right. I think Collinsworth told me one time that Madden, it was almost like John Wayne. Remember when everybody now, of course, this makes us sound old. Remember when everybody would do a John Wayne impression in your head? He was like, when I started announcing, Madden was kind of like John Wayne, and you were just always trying not to do an impression

of John Madden. Because he was that big. You mentioned the whole thing. They tried to clone him. There were baby Maddens on TV. Matt Millen was a baby Madden. He knew John Madden. He was a raider and all that stuff. He was kind of trying to... I don't think he was copying Madden, He knew John Madden. He was a Raider and all that stuff. But he was like, he was kind of trying to, you know,

he was his own. I don't think he was copying Madden, but he was kind of in the, in the school of Madden. I'm going to sound effects. I'm funny. Yeah. A lot of energy,

some humor. And it was just like, no, that's not why Madden's great. It's no, he does have energy, but he's also like the smartest football guy we have. Well,

John Madden, age 85. Apparently it happened. It wasn't like this just happened, but they announced it. So I think it happened a little bit earlier in the week. But one of the great careers in the history of sports media. Brian Curtis. Can't think of anyone I would have rather talked about him with than you. Same here, Bill.

Thanks for popping on really quick. Appreciate it. You got it, Bill. This episode is brought to you by Movember. The mustache is back with a vengeance. Look at Travis Kelsey. Before he rocked that Super Bowl ring, he rocked that super soup strainer. Grow a mustache for Movember. You'll do great things too. You won't win the Super Bowl, but your fundraising will support mental health, suicide prevention, and prostate and testicular cancer research. And if you don't want to grow a mustache, you could still walk or run 60 kilometers, host an event, or set your own goal and mow your own way. Do great things this November.

Sign up now. Just search Movember. All right. We're taping this. It is 1.45 Pacific time. Big Waz is here. Drunk House is here. What a holiday special this is. Holy mackerel. Why do we have Drunk House today? What happened? It's a milestone birthday. One of my brothers, my littlest brother, hit a big number, has a zero in it. So we went out early. Here in the DMV, thank God, it's warm enough to get that golf ball going. So we did that. We visited the Snack Bar Shack on number eight. We sat out by the fire pit afterwards.

We went inside. I mean, you know, we made a good day. It's the holidays. It's the holidays. If you have a bad podcast, I'll say after that we all got to look in the mirror and do some soul searching. And then you could pull a Jalen Brown and be like, no, I'm not doing any looking in the mirror

or any soul searching. Did you see that last night? I missed it. What happened? I did not. What happened? They had a terrible loss to Minnesota. They lost to Minnesota's G League team,

which included Greg Monroe, who I didn't even realize was still playing basketball. He came in, was playing crunch time, Celtics lose. And then after it was like the classic Emmy Adoka threw everyone under the bus, which he's done like five times this year. Horford talked about soul searching and all that. And then it went to Jalen Brown. He's like, no, I'm not going to, we don't need that. We just, let's just start playing ball. This Celtics season was who's more bumped out this year. Me as a Celtics fan house getting, uh, honestly Dick tease by the whiz for two weeks.

And now they're headed sort of below 500 or, or was who went all in on the Hawks and was a, was a full believer. And now that team is also a train wreck out of the three of us who should be the most disappointed? I'm going to be the person with blue balls, but I would say the Celtics for sure. Because, you know, there's this idea of like, well, the supporting cast was what it needed to be last year. Brown and Tatum, they're still young kids and they're going to get better and better and better.

And they're so good and they're so amazing. And we've been patting them on their asses for five years now. And, you know, like the results are in. It's been like, like the sample size is pretty huge now with those two guys being the focal points, the undisputed, unchallenged leaders of the team. And it's been a failure. However, you know, for me, and again, like the Hawks aren't my team,

but I'm only loyal to my own takes and predictions. And so I predict the Hawks would overachieve this year, 50 wins. They would challenge for Eastern Conference finals. And it's been a mini disaster with all the injuries and the defense regressing and the Capella extension, which we're going to get into at some point. But yeah, I would have to say the Celtics fans, because y'all had actual legitimate expectations this year, and it's

been bad. Well, and we have excuses, House. We have the, well, I haven't seen the lineup. We keep getting COVID and people leaving and I don't know what kind of team I have. You're in much worse shape because Dinwiddie looked good for two weeks and you were comparing him to Chris Paul and Oscar Robertson. That's a

falsehood. And what possible argument do you have to be upset about the Celtics? They're the exact same team as last year. They stay. It's the same 500, sub-500 team. They didn't do anything in the offseason to change the arc, the narrative, the direction of the team. They're the exact same treading water franchise.

The Wizards did something that actually helps the team, the direction of the team. They're the exact same treading water franchise. The Wizards did something that actually helps the team in the offseason. They got rid of Russell Westbrook. It's an absolute franchise miracle. We got three months of the best version of Russell Westbrook that he had to offer. He dragged our

sorry asses into the playoffs. And then look, here we are. This team is exactly where they should be. They needed to collect all those wins at the beginning of the season. I'm talking about Washington. To build up, December is a brutal month for them. They had to go West Coast, and they played all these very good teams. All I want them to do is tread water, be around 500,

and then catch a nice spot in the schedule. Maybe we'll catch a little bit of a COVID break. Anything like a couple games above 500 is terrific. And in the East, that's going to be good enough for a five or six seed. That's wonderful. I like this Wizards team. I don't think you're going to be a five seed, a six seed, a seven seed, or an eight seed.

You can have your opinion. You can have your opinion. I was looking at the east and what's funny is two teams have to basically two teams aren't even getting invited to the plan and if you actually look at it right now you know brooklyn chicago milwaukee miami i think we can lock them in i'm locking in philly unless some bead gets her. Cleveland, I've been a believer all year. They're 20 and 13. I think they're in. And then you move into this weird, everybody's one or two or three games below 500 or above 500. The Wiz, 17 and 16. Charlotte, 18 and 17. Celt, 16 and 18. Toronto, 14 and 16.

Then we do cutoff line. Knicks, 15 and Hawks, 15, 18. And the Pacers 14, 20, who are probably going to be sellers. But two of those teams aren't going to make it. My bet would be Washington and Toronto, but I think the Celtics are in the mix for potentially are the Celtics in the mix. Yeah,

they are. Sorry. Yes. Celtics. Dennis Schroeder and his $6 million contract. Get the fuck out of here. The Celtics are sorry. They're sorry sorry they can't

afford a single injury and when was just said it Tatum and Brown when are we going to see them play well together well we we've seen it we've seen them make the conference finals together that was the thing that happened in the butt in the bubble they won two playoff rounds Kimber Walker also had a functioning knee at that time. We can never forget, like, Kimball was there like crunch time, operator, pick and roll. He was getting

stuff done. There was one game against the Raptors, late game, where he just put Sergi Baca in the blender, and I was like, damn. That's just like the one thing the Celtics possess in that series, that as much as you love Kyle Low Lowry or you love OG, you love Siakam. They don't have a guy that could do that. And that seemed to be the difference in that series. But again, that's the last time Kimball was good. Yeah. Was that he wasn't even good in that series. He had he had

like two good games in that series. But you're right two times he was good right i have a take for you i have a take let's hear it i'm not prepared to the further we get away from that bubble thing the more and more i'm just calling that summer camp like those you know they won the congratulations to the lakers for winning the summer camp championship you know all of the out though not none of those performances have have held true none of those performances reflect the true character of those franchises or or their direction where you know i know denver has jamal murray injured and you know portland has been where portland's been but like the in the celtics toronto toronto miami that's right yeah. I think I'm more bullish on that summer than you just because I felt like it was so unique.

I'm happy they did it. No, no, I am too. I agree with you on that point. I just don't think it can be paired to another playoff postseason that we've had. I agree with that. The challenges were different. The country was going through a whole bunch of stuff. Everybody's stuck in hotel rooms. Like whatever obstacles you had to deal with as an athlete were

completely different that year, but it was, you know, really positioned well for the guys who were like the real workers who stayed in shape, who were ready to handle like 10 weeks in the bubble. Somebody like LeBron, who's just like, he knew this was a 10-week sprint. Adande made this point initially on my podcast, but just like, yeah, instead of like having to play 82 games, then four playoff rounds, you had, what, 55, 60 games, then a break, get in shape, and just get ready for this haul that he was mentally prepared for and some of these other guys were. Wes, how do you think of the bubble two years later now? I mean, for me,

I watched these guys from the gate, out the gun. Everybody was playing balls to the wall 100% as hard as they can, even in the regular season. Like, an effort level that I wasn't used to seeing in regular season basketball, which showed you that the dudes were just

really excited to just be back doing what they love. And so for the level and just the skill level of basketball that was played, I thought it was at an insanely high level. I agree with that. You could say Miami sort of got hurt at the end. But the clips clipping and the Lakers beating up on Harden and, you know, a very young Nuggets team. Like that seemed like something that would hold true in any environment.

I don't know. Maybe that's just me. I'm surprised Bill got an alley-oop to discredit a Laker accomplishment. And he didn't just take it and dunk it. I'm shocked by that. Well, I'll tell you, it's just to me, I'm going to remember it as a completely different 10-week stretch than anything the league's ever had.

But I think Waz made the key point. House, you were on here. We were talking about it as it was happening. The level of play was great. It was really intense and it was different. But I think you're right in that some of the results are pretty weird when you go back and look at it. You're like, how did that happen? How did this happen? What happened to the Clippers?

Would that have happened in a normal season? Is that a team that, you know, if we just had a regular way it would have unfolded, would that have been the toughest team the Lakers had to play? You know, we'll never know. I'm still impressed that whoever got through that 10 weeks and survived, I think is an accomplishment. I think you're right to be dubious. Celtic fans can't brag that we made the conference finals. I think you're right. It was weird.

I admired it. I'll always admire it. It just was radically different. If I'm not being a jackass, I will always regard it as... It was a real miracle to have that back in our lives and have those guys playing the way they played and for the league to figure out a way for that to work. But, you know, there is a little bit of jackass in me. And I say, look, it looked like a summer camp tournament to me a little bit. I think that we're older than was, but 99 was a little like that too, where just

the way that season played out and it became like a survival of the fittest 50 game sprint, five games and seven nights and you know, seven games and nine nights and some of these crazy things and to win it was amazing. But at the same time, you just have to factor in like, all right, this was a really weird season. And it really helped if you had Tim Duncan and David Robinson on the same team. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, right? I think like if you try to tell a Knick fan that 99 was some aberration or fluke that the four point play by LJ is somehow discredited because it was a 50 game lockout condensed season. They literally spit on you, right? And I think if you're a Laker fan, you can say, look, like, we came in ready.

We were the most prepared. Like, this was the most groovy, adverse circumstances ever. Like, guys went away from their families. Like, the truest hoopers, you know, shone through. If you're not a Laker fan, you can be like, oh, it was bullshit. It was a fluke. And it should be discredited. I think that's just how most sports arguments sort of shake out i always notice that like

whenever somebody thinks that i have a shitty take on the internet it's like the fan of a team or a player who i'm saying something negative about that's generally the weather vane of how good or bad a take is and i think that would be the same thing for these seasons that we're talking about. Like, if you're a fan of a team that did well, you're like, man, that was an incredible showing and evidence of how great we were. If you're not, you're just like, yeah.

Guys are scared of COVID. Let's move on. Guys wanted to go home and be with their families and their side chicks. It was done. They were done with it. Well, you think like two of the weirdest playoff results we've had. 99. The Knicks are in eighth done. They were done with it. Well, you think like two of the weirdest playoff results we've had. 99. The Knicks are an 8 seed.

They make the finals. That's the only time that's ever happened. 2019. Miami's a 5 seed. They make the finals. That's something that never happened.

Even if you go to 2012 where Miami makes it as the 2 seed and they play Oklahoma who is also a 2 seed. But you had that Celtics team that was 39 and 27, a four seed barely and came within a stone's throw of almost making the finals with a team that we all thought, you know, what the hell is going on with this?

So I think, you know, it's like, like when the Leicester city in the premier league, when they won the title that year, when they had it's the smaller the season is, or the more you condense stuff, the weirder the results can be versus like when you have 82 games, four rounds, usually unless there's a major injury, there's three or four teams that are going to get there. And that's it. And last year we saw, you know, I, you could still make a case if Murray doesn't get hurt. Denver might've been there last year you know when you think like could that have been them instead of the suns absolutely well and last year was was had his own weird character and and this year also is going to have its own weird character right last

year was disrupted many times over by the covid interludes that that intervened and you know we some teams didn't play games for three weeks. The wizards damn near played no games in the month of January of, of, of last year. Um, the, the interesting thing of 2021, I mean, um, and, and now here we go again, uh, where we're going to have to look, we'll look back on this season. Now I feel like there's an opportunity here. I'm interested in y'all's take on this one i absolutely love this idea of expanded roster

letting some g league dudes come up and get some minutes introduce us to some players that we wouldn't otherwise see that creates some genuine interest to me over this 82 game marathon slog kind of schedule. If you want to make this, the, the rosters, 22 guys, and let me see dudes that I wouldn't otherwise see. Let me see some more, you know, a great Greg Monroe, Joe Johnson, where it's up to where Harold miners around. He's got to be doing something right. But, but seriously for the G league guys, it's, it's, it's, and, League guys and guys drafted in the second round that otherwise wouldn't get any run, I

personally have enjoyed the last couple weeks. I wish it didn't come with the price of dudes. Nobody's really gotten sick, right? Has anybody gotten sick? Not that we know. House, I'm with you. The biggest lesson to me from the last three weeks is how many people can play 15 minutes

in an NBA basketball game. I didn't realize, I thought the list was like 200. It's like the list apparently is like 1200. I was watching OKC two nights ago and they had this kid, Aaron Wiggins, was he a Maryland guy house? Maryland Terrapin. Yes, sir. Yeah. So I barely ever heard of him. And he had, I think like 22 or 24 on Sunday night, he had an alley-oop from Giddy and crunch time and just looked really comfortable. And I'm thinking like this guy never in a million years would have played in a basketball game this year, next year, whenever, if we didn't have all these COVID scratches. So it's weird. There's going to be some opportunity for some people. And also there's like

some nostalgia. Wow. You never thought you'd see Joe Johnson again. Now he's weird. There's going to be some opportunity for some people. And also there's like some nostalgia. Wow, you never thought you'd see Joe Johnson again. Now he's back. I saw Joe is back. Joe Johnson is back. I was watching the Hawks the other night. Born ready. Lance Stevenson, Brooklyn's own is back. It's pretty exciting stuff from where I sit.

And one last thing that I will say about this. We would never do this with football. It's like, you win the fucking Super Bowl, you won. That's it. It doesn't matter if it was COVID, who was hurt, whose leg got snapped in a divisional round. Nobody gives a fuck. If you win the Super Bowl,

that's a championship. Nobody's taking it away from you. Nobody's asterixing it. For whatever reason, we like to do this with the NBA, and I'm just not going to, Bill. I'm going to give these guys the credit they deserve for achieving whatever they can under, you know, difficult circumstances for everybody.

Emotional stuff from Wes. I'm tearing up over here. We'll see if he says that when it's a Memphis-Cleveland finals in June, and everyone's going, wait, what the fuck is going on? Kevin loves it. The finals.

Good. What happened? Bite your tongue, Bill. Bite your tongue, Bill Simmons, please. God,

no bad enough. They put the damn all-star game in Cleveland. Oh my God. Well, I think the weirdest thing about this season is golden state and Phoenix are operating. They're levitating at a level above everybody else. And then Utah's is kind of like,

hey, if you check the standings, we're only two games behind the Suns. But don't talk about us. We're good. We'll be over here. Don't even have one conversation about us. Just let us get the underdog thing going. And then you got Memphis,

and then the West just drops. And then you go to the East. Brooklyn, who we just haven't seen together Chicago, who was looking great and then got killed by COVID as much as just about anybody Milwaukee that we doesn't feel like we've seen full Milwaukee yet. And then Miami, and then it drops off too. So we might know the eight already. We might know the eight that have a chance. I'm willing to throw Memphis in there because I do think they have, there's a three for one or four for one trade that they have. I think in them, because they just have so many assets, you know, and it's hard not to watch them

and just think like, man, what would it look like if you just put some bonus on this team or just pick any of the guys that are available? Um, but they won a nice game last night in Phoenix and I've been impressed by them. Um, listen, this is all foreplay for why you guys are here. We're going to try something after the break that I've been dying to do for a while. And we're going to do it right now. What does possible sound like for your business? It's having the spend that powers your scale with no preset spending limit. More cash on hand to grow your business with up to 55 interest-free days. And the ability to reach further with access to over 1,400 airport lounges worldwide. Redefine possible with Business Platinum.

That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms and conditions apply. All right. So when I was at ESPN and when I was at Grantland, I think this was a borderline tradition for me. I would do the worst contracts every year, worst contracts in the NBA. I would try to figure out, I would go in descending order, which we're not going to do today from like 35 to one, just try to figure out what was the worst deal. The NBA is great for this because the genesis of bad deals usually comes down to a couple of factors, right? Somebody had an awesome contract here. House and I, our favorite one ever is always going to be Jerome James when he had that run on the Sonics in the playoffs. And as it was happening, people are like, oh God, Isaiah Thomas is going to end up giving him too much money. You could see where

the, and then it actually happened. Isaiah Thomas overpaid him and Jerome James, James has never heard from again. So you have that, you have like the contract run guys, you have the franchise in a pickle, giving somebody franchise money, even though they know he's not a franchise guy, but they don't really have any choice because they don't want to lose him. You have the guy like house's dude Bertans who is feels a specific skill. People get it. They get what he does.

And then a couple people want it. And then all of a sudden he's making $80 million for five years. So you have those guys. Then you have the guys that the contract made sense at the time. And then for whatever reason, it didn't two years later, like the Kevin Love types. So what we're going to do, we're going to have a draft. We're going to have a worst contract draft and we're going to see who ends up with the best team of bad contracts. And we're going to do the snake fashion. So whoever has the first pick, he goes one, two, three.

Then the third guy has the first pick of the second round. My question, House, should we give Waz the first pick since he's a newbie? Yes. On this thing. Is that fair to give him the first pick? And you and I have been doing this for so long. Like, I already know how you're going to do this. I love putting Waz on this. And let's get some new flavor. And let's get some takes on this that don't feel like me and you talking to each other on the phone the last 30 years. House, do you want the second pick or the third pick? I want the third pick.

Third pick. Third pick. All right. I'll take the second pick. That means I get to go back to back, right? Yeah, you get three and four. So that could the second pick. That means I get to go back to back, right? Yeah. You get three and four. So that could be an advantage.

Yeah. So, Waz, you're going to get one, six, and seven. You'll have three of the top seven. And I will have two, five, and eight. Okay. I sent you guys a list. All right. So.

You've seen most of it. There might be a couple guys missing. You're not going to pick the worst contract right now now a couple caveats before you go us one is that these contracts aren't quite as fun as they used to be because they have the four-year limit that's what i was gonna say yep the four the four year makes it not as bad as it used to be and i think like and i know this is said a lot on like dork nba twitter and like people who really haven't understand it for the salary cap and how this stuff breaks down. But we call stuff max contracts like Tobias Harris's contract is the max contract.

But so is Clay Thompson's. And they don't get paid the same. Right. Like it's all based on your years in the league. And so like these things are bad by degrees. And for the most part, like all of these deals can be moved. Like we've learned over the years that there are no untradeable deals. Even Russell Westbrook, if the Lakers like wanted to, like if they made it their single mission to trade him, they could figure out a way to put stuff around him and sweeten it to just get him off their team. So it's not like it used to be like when Chris Webber gets a seven year contract

from the Sacramento Kings for 123 million, then his knee is cooked like a year and a half into it. And it's like, holy moly, we got five more years of a superstar who's not super anymore and has one good knee. It's just different now, but it's still fun to think about these deals and i wanted to i'm i'm killing two birds with one stone here with with my first pick one i have a reputation online for being quote-unquote xenophobic and hating euros which i'm not afraid to wear and two joe house is my man and i love him but I gotta do it. Davis Bertin is my number one. Wow. Oh my god. You know I felt for sure it was gonna be there for me at the number four

and I understand where Waz is coming from on this. I wanna hear Waz explain why he picked it because I know why I would put it in the top five. I know why I would but Big Waz why is he your number one? He's my number one because

he was that classic good stats on a bad team guy. The term that Bill invented, but it's like, yo, it's this big dude who's getting off a bunch of shots and, you know, he's relatively young and he's in a contract yet, but he was the telltale sign, guys, that Dobbins pretends knew he was about to steal money. When the bubble restart, he said, nah, I'm good. I don't have any, I have no interest in relitigating what it is I'm about to do in the off season. No, no, no, no, no. I'm locked into a deal, not showing up. He is just a completely and utterly one-dimensional player.

And let me, man, let me just pull up. Wait, can I give you the stats for him? So he signed two years ago, he signed a five-year deal for $80 million. He's in year two, 16, 16, 17, and then a player option in the 24-25 season for 16. House, I'm going to guess that he's exercising that. That's so funny. So there you go.

Again, a guy who's completely one-dimensional in that if he's doing anything, it's just that he's shooting a three and absolutely nothing else, and they paid a ton of money for him. Jeff Van Gundy, I think I heard him on Zach Lowe or somewhere. He was like, and you know, Van Gundy doesn't like to rip people. He really doesn't. He was just like, yeah, I think they're looking

back at that deal and kind of second-guessing it. Well, I know House you liked it for a while, but you finally turned on him. Well, the reason I turned on him is because Waz is calling him one dimensional. And the problem is it's only half a dimension. He does not.

The one thing that he's supposed to be good at, he's only good at half the time. Like he doesn't come in and give you a guaranteed three to four, three balls a game. So it's like an instant offense, you know, change, change the arc of how the game is going kind of thing. He might come in and miss six straight shots and he'll take all six of them. The thing that makes it plausible is he literally cannot guard another player in the entire NBA. There's not one player in the NBA that I think Davis Bertans can guard. And the funny thing is that what they essentially did, this Wizards team, they took Jan Mahinmy's contract, which was four years, $16 million.

The year that ended, they signed Bertans essentially into that slot. So I just call this the Mahinmy. We have nine years of a $16 to $17 million a year player who really can't play NBA level basketball for any variety of reasons between the two guys. But, you know, that that's the slot. They gambled twice and lost both times. House, I don't think you're going far back enough. I mean, you've had the 16 to 17 million dollar guy for, I think, 15 years. The highlight, maybe of my life, was when they signed Andre Blatch,

that massive extensin. And then they amnestied him before the extension kicked in. Maybe we should call this the Blatch. Well, I wanted them to do that with John Wall. And I'm sure we'll get to John Wall soon enough. Yeah, we might get to him right now. All right, so I'm up.

But first of all, congrats to Bertans. I don't think anybody felt like he was made a compelling case. House backed it. I think people thought Westbrook or Wall were going to be here. I'm going to take a guy just because I know House has his eye on him with pick three or pick

four. I'm taking him early. It's controversial. I just can't get my head around how staggering the numbers are. Six years, including this year, an extension that kicks in next year. Denver is on the hook for six years and $177 million, including this year. It's $177.7 million for Michael Porter Jr. Who is now out for the year. I feel bad. I loved watching him play, but this contract is an absolute nightmare. I don't know when we're going to see him on a basketball court. We've seen him miss two seasons now with a back issue. When he was in the draft,

I mean, he fell out of the top 10 basically because of injury risks. And I just think like, I would be so nervous to have this contract on my books. I have to take it second. I feel bad, but I'm doing it. House? Well, you're right. And I was going to take him if he dropped to me. The problem is they had all the information they needed to make a reasonable judgment about his health forecast. And that's really the thing that, that, you know, is the most, uh, colorable argument you

could advance against Denver for making this kind of investment in that kind of size over this kind of period. You, if you aren't going to get the dude playing all of the years, then you can't justify it. And also, they didn't have to do it, which was the key point. They could have just rolled it over to next summer, and it would have been like the DeAndre Ayton situation.

They did it anyway. Did you think it was crazy at the time? I remember thinking, they must really think he's healthy, not knowing that he wasn't healthy, but man, it's the kind of contract that can kill a half a decade. I didn't find it crazy at the time because, again, it's Denver. They're not

a free agent destination. This core has actually accomplished stuff. They've actually gotten to conference finals. They looked incredible for the very brief time that they had you know Gordon in house and Porter was

playing and you know fuck what's his fucking name Jamal Murray Jamal Murray was playing right before he got hurt and like they looked incredible. So like if you saw what they

were able to do with all four of those guys were on the court and, you know, kicking ass and taking names. I understand the investment. However, as Bill said, again, like this guy's medical is legendary

amongst just wait. Just wait till next summer. Let's let's see him play. I don't even think, how many games do you think he's played career? If you had to guess, how many career games has Michael Porter played for the Nuggets? How else do you get first guess? 110. I mean, he beat me to the punch.

I would have said 120. 120. The answer is 125. How about them apples? Pretty good. So he missed the 18-19 season, played 55-20, 61-21,

and then 9 this year, and they shut him down. He has only played 3,080 minutes, not including playoffs. Look, the Nuggets, after the season and the injury happened they put out a statement basically like we're charting a long-term course for michael porter jr we think

he's going to be part of what we do for years down the road we're not rushing this like this guy is part of the denver nuggets situation and you, I look at somebody like Dwight Howard, who, man, I think the Kobe, Dwight, Steve Nash thing was like 2014. And he was having back issues then. As a younger man. Yeah, 12, 13. Okay, so I'm standing there 10 years ago. Yeah. He was having back issues then.

He's still in the league. He's looking pretty spry. I guess there's a way forward for guys. It's somebody who's still as young as Porter jr. Is if Denver feels like their medical people could get this in order over a two year span, then maybe it doesn't turn out so horribly, but it, my goodness, it's not looking good right now. All right, house you're in the clock with two picks.

So you used a phrase earlier that really makes a lot of sense to me. And that is the franchise pickle guys. We have two guys that I'm going to put up here. Both of them are pickle guys. The franchise has found themselves stuck. They wanted to make the investment. They felt like they were at a crossroads. These are half sour pickles.

I'm a pickle guy. I love pickles. But these are not your delectable like garlic crunchy dills these are half sours it's got to be john wall and it's got to be d fox now both of those guys caught their franchises at moments when the franchises were at a crossroads john wall unfortunately got hurt and one thing um bill sim, you and H-Bob were exploring what kinds of things are possible under a new collective bargaining agreement. What kind of innovation would you like to see potentially in terms of more flexibility with salaries and so forth? I think that if you sign a guy to a big max like this, there ought to be some kind of cap accommodation for injury.

Because John Wall, over the course of this contract, speaking of games played and minutes played, now Houston is deliberately not playing him this season. But they signed him to a super extension, and the dude got hurt and basically couldn't play any competitive basketball for damn near three seasons. Now, I mean, that's the same kind of risk we just made fun of Denver for. But John Wall didn't have a known kind of injury history. He'd had a couple knee troubles.

He had some, you know. But what he did in the combination of a knee then and Achilles was debilitating, and it just hamstrings the franchise for years. D Fox was, is, is not injured, but the numbers are not kind when you compare, you know,

and the numbers are coming out right now. Halliburton is starting to catch fire. He caught fire right as Fox went out with the, with the protocols. That was tough. Halliburton is the guy that should have the ball that should be the decision maker none of the advanced metrics are kind to Fox but but Sacramento is stuck and I don't know now we talked before the season started this this panel right here

what about Ben Simmons for Fox I feel like Darrell wouldn't do that deal now. I don't think he would. No, and you know, it's tough because I'm a I've been a Fox guy traditionally just like his talent what he's been able to do like on the ball in spits and spurts in his career as far as being like a guy that nobody can stay in front of

and you know, shown some flashes as a defensive sort of on ball menace type of guy, head of the snake type of guy. Every now and again, his jumper will wax and wane, but the numbers in the clutch are just awful. Like, in late-game situations, like, you basically, you can't do anything with him. And again, like, he goes down and, like, your teammate,

who basically plays the same position as you. But to accommodate you, he's playing off the ball. They slide him on the ball and he immediately has the best stretch of his career playing your position. That's just like ultimate indictment. It's tough. And as much as it pains me, I think this is a great, bad contract pick on the part of Joe House here. You know, two things with him.

I don't love the shots he gets in the last four minutes. And, you know, if that's your chief decision maker, and I think that's one of the reasons they just haven't had success with him. I think he's talented, but it's a little like Colin Sexton to me, where if that's the guy who's going to have the ball for you at the end of games, that you're probably not going to win most of your games. That's one. Then two, you go in big on a guy like that at a position that's by far the deepest position in the league. There's point guard, the league's teaming with point guards all over the place. I think he's a hard guy to trade. Just go on the trade machine, try to find the Fox part of the team that probably makes the most sense is the Knicks. But now you're taking back contracts. You don't necessarily want either. Like RJ is not going to be in that deal. You know, I don't even know if Toppin would be in

that deal. So I'm with you guys. So just for the listeners, the numbers are wall two years left, including this year, 91.7 million. You could argue he should have been the first pick in this draft because we know for a fact he's untradeable. They basically just sent him home and they just sent him checks. And then Fox is in year one of a five-year $163 million extension, which is rough. Anyway, I am up. I'm going to take a guy, incredible value here. Super excited about it. Um, he's a guy that we know can't be traded because the Lakers would trade him right now if they could and they can't. And I don't think, well, as you said, you said, if history's taught us anything, it's that anyone can be traded. I actually don't think there's a trade for Westbrook

because the trade, the trade would have to make the Lakers even worse. Like for instance, could you trade him to the Knicks for Fournier and Kemba and New Orleans Noel? Like, sure. But is that going to help the Lakers? Like, no, um, no. So the internet has over the the last 48 hours, has stopped treating the John Wall for Russell Westbrook trade as a joke. The internet is now treating that as something that the Lakers ought to consider. Oh, man. I think Kevin O'Connor said it. I don't know why the Rockets would do it. Why would the Rockets want this in their building again?

They're like, what? We did this. How is this any different from the John Wall thing where you intentionally sit the guy? Why would the Rockets want this in their building again? They're like, what? We did this. And how is this any different from the John Walton where you intentionally sit the guy? It's the same contract. There's one team. Same length. There's one team.

Go ahead. And I don't know if they would do it. But if the Lakers called the Clippers and said, hey, Reggie Jackson and Marcus Morris for Westbrook, what do you think? We'll even throw in a future pick in 2052. I don't think they would either. They can't do that.

But think how crazy that is. Westbrook single-handedly, along with Beal, brought the Wizards to the playoffs last year, and he can't even get traded for two rotation guys. That trade actually makes the Lakers way better. They're way better. Right. It would really help them. Way better. A secondary ball handler who actually makes the lakers way better way better right it would really help better a secondary ball handler who actually makes threes in reggie jackson uh which is just

hilarious like reggie jackson as a young kid thought he was too good to pass the ball to kevin fucking durant and west russell westbrook he's now just way better outright than russell westbrook is and couldn't be traded head up for the dude. Straight up, he's just that much better of a player. And then that's it. It's kind of crazy how that's gone. Like, if you're the Clippers, like, I'm trading the two better pieces

in that deal for Westbrook. Like, he doesn't make sense on the Clippers for what they want to do. Yeah, this is it. Two years, $91.3 million for Westbrook. So there you go. All right, Waz, you have the sixth pick and the seventh pick. Who are you going with?

I get to keep my God bless America trend going here. Keep the NBA great again. Ben Simmons, terrible deal. Okay. He's making $33 million this year. He will make $40 million in 24-25, and he's a glorified lunch pail role player. He gets paid as if he's a guy who's a possessions-eating wing threat

who adds just great offense by just showing up like he's the number one or number two offensive dude he's the number four offensive dude on any real team of any substance of course we know what he does on defense but again the diva act the haven't improved your game in four years thing uh the fact that he just like willing to sabotage a season again after just a horrible playoff showing and you're paying this dude in 24, 25, $40 million to do so. This is a horrible deal. And I think the fact that Philly hasn't had people just banging down their

door to give up shit, to get this guy into their building. Just speaks volumes about what people think about what he adds to a team. It's a horrible deal. Get Simmons out of here. He's off the board. So Simmons, the numbers are pretty staggering. He signed a five-year $177 million deal that kicked in last year. He's in year one of four years left for about $147 million.

That's what's left on that deal. And I do think Waz is right. House, part of the reason teams aren't jumping all over each other to give an all-star to Philly for Ben Simmons is because that's a really big contract for somebody that we're not positive he likes to play basketball. It's not worth the risk. We haven't found the team yet that's willing to make that gamble. I think that team is out there. It's Dallas. I think it's going to be Dallas. It makes a ton of sense for Dallas, doesn't it? What can Dallas give back that is desirable to Philly? I was trying to figure out a three-teamer with Dallas and Portland

where Philly ends up with basically Brunson, Nurkic, and who is the third guy? Brunson, Nurkic, and Covington. Portland gets Porzingis and then Philly gets

Dallas gets Simmons, basically. So they'd be giving up and, and Dallas would get, I think one more piece from that. I can't remember, but I was trying to figure out how could Dallas get Simmons. And I think Brunson and Porzingis have to be in it. So they would, they'd have to get Simmons and something else in the deal. I think to get it back anyway, uh, that team makes the most sense for me because I could see Simmons with Luka as a combo. Not against it. Who knows?

No, it makes sense. They've been lacking perimeter heft as far as being able to guard the Kawhis and the Paul Georges and the LeBrons of the Western Conference. They've been needing that sorely. I guess, theoretically, Ben Simmons solves your secondary ball handler

where Luka's not being so heliocentric on offense, where everything is the be-all and end-all and revolves around him. Theoretically. But, again, this is the same dude Doc Rivers was throwing under the bus after last season. Like, can this guy be your point guard of the future of a championship-level team? Hell no. Like, can this guy be your point guard in the future of a championship level team? Hell no.

Like, I don't know. I guess. You got to shake stuff up in Dallas at this point. So I get the inclination to want to do this, but I'm not seeing it. All right. So we're six picks in. Bertans, Michael Porter Jr.,

John Wall, Darren Fox, Russell Westbrook, Ben Simmons. We will continue the draft right after this break. All right, Waz, you're on the clock. You have Bertans and Ben Simmons on your team. You still have no American players. Your strategy has been executed to a T. Who do you have with the seventh pick?

This is where I throw a curveball at you guys. Clay Thompson. This is the guy. Oh, my God. Yeah, it's Clay Thompson. Amazing. It's Clay Thompson. He's going to make like $50 million at the end of his deal.

And this is a dude, you talk about injury. He's coming off of an ACL and an Achilles heel. He gets paid as if he does for you what Jokic does, what Steph does, what Giannis does, what Kawhi does for your team. He's paid as if he's one of those guys, but he's just not. And the injury component compounds that fact. And yes, when Clay Thompson is right, he's one of the best perimeter defensive players. Like his versatility in guarding from LeBron's to Westbrook's to Chris Paul's to John Morant's. Like he's been that guy traditionally.

But coming off of those two major, major injuries and he's basically got two years after this one where he's getting paid $50 million a year to play uh clay thompson is on a bad contract i know he's got the highest q rating in the nba right like nobody has a higher approval rating q rating as far as like universally he's beloved um amongst basketball fans and just people around the league but that's a bad deal so So it's got three years left, 122 million. He's 43.2 in the last year of the deal with the trade kicker, which would bring him to the 50 if they traded him. So that's a lot of money for a guy with a torn ACL and a torn Achilles who seems like he's going to be healthy, but those are

two horrendous injuries and we have no idea if he's going to be the same. Will it be worth it if they win this year? Another ring this year? Well, he's also untraded. They would never trade Clay. I think Clay, Draymond and Curry are all untradable for them barring some sort of incident. So they don't even really care about the money, but you know, for, for a guy who's had two major injuries, who is moving around and you need quick release with your legs, all that stuff. I have no, people are penciling him in like he's in widow. They had clay. I have no idea what we're getting with clay. I'm rooting for clay. I want it to work. I know the, uh, the rehab and stuff has been inspiring and what durant has done i think has been you know probably the best advertisement for you can come back from an achilles but i don't know what it's going to be so but definitionally bill he hasn't played for two years he has not of a basically 200 million dollar deal like just by, it's a poor value contract, right? Like, and now we're like two years and plus two years and a quarter of no production from a guy for $200 million.

It's a bad deal. Well, for my pick the eighth pick in the draft, I'm taking somebody. I almost took with the fifth pick. I'm just, my scouts are delighted. My green room is high-fiving. Can't believe this guy's still there at eight. He's has a contract where he has three years left for $112.3 million. I saw him in person nine days ago. I can't tell you a single thing he did during the game. His name is Tobias Harrison and he's fine. Oh yes. Tobias, this is a good, he's fine. Oh, yes. Tobias, he's great if you're paying him $12,000, $14,000.

But when he's a max guy, which I think he is by any definition, and I can go to a basketball game. Yeah, he's max, $35 million. Yeah, I can watch you for two and a half hours, and you don't jump out in any way. And you're just kind of standing in the corner on one end, and you're getting attacked on the other end. It's a pretty tough contract.

I also think they'd have a lot of trouble trading it. So three for one, 12.3. Tobias Harris, you're off the board. House, you're up at nine. Well, speaking of guys who are getting paid and not playing basketball, and I still don't understand what it is that the team that signed this gentleman to this contract saw in him that made them want to make an $18.5 million a year commitment, give or take.

Markel Fultz got a $50 million contract for playing 70-some-odd games one season for the Orlando, where he averaged 12 points a game on 46% shooting and, and, and, and he's getting, you know, 16, 18 a year. What is going on in Orlando? How does that make any sense? I don't understand it. What, what, why did they, he get a $50 million contract? Well, they gave him an extension, then he immediately got hurt, which was bad luck. But he's in year one of three years, $50 million, at a position that, as we covered earlier, is probably the easiest position to find either guys in the draft or to get lucky

with somebody in free agency or whatever. Not a good contract. Poor Foles. It's not that he got hurt. It's just, what did they see? What did he show us that would convince anybody that he's worth that level? They thought he was the next

Michael Carter Williams. What? Well, I was just taking a second to register that one. He did. Alright, House, you're on the first pick of the fourth round, too. Are you going to Orlando again? Is this an Orlando double?

Wait, I get to go again? Yeah, you get to go again. No, you get to go again. Come on. Come on, drunk house. Well, I mean, just for posterity, I got to do Kevin Love. I mean, it's just, he's the OG. He's, he's been a bad contract really since LeBron left. Uh, he, he has, he's a number of times he said,

oh, I'm going to, I'm coming back. I'm going to do, he tried to do the Olympics. He rope adoped us all into thinking he showed up fat. They cut his ass. I mean, he's the OG of a bad contract in this modern era. Two years left. So many sweet things about the Kevin. I was going to say, two years left. Two years left, this year and next, for $60 million. Go ahead, Wes. The best part, there's so many sweet, sweet, sweet details about the Kevin Love deal.

One, he signed that extension as a Dan Gilbert LeBron revenge. Like LeBron left for the Lakers and Gilbert was like, I'll show him. I'll extend Kevin Love because we're just going to keep the good times going with this championship core. That was great. Obviously, a stupid move to Kevin Love is actually the poster child of demanded trade when nobody wants to trade for you. Like rule of thumb, guys, like if Dave Lillard would have demanded a trade last summer, teams would have been lining up at Portland's door.

Like, how do we get this guy into our building? It makes sense that he would demand a trade. Like his team could trade him, get a bunch of shit for him. Like, obviously, like, okay, he's demanding a trade. Kev Love demanding a trade is like, bro, you have a horrible deal. You're basically a backup big at this point. Why would anybody be thirsty to bring you into their building? It's like, bro,

stop demanding trades when nobody wants you. It just makes everybody feel, makes everybody feel awkward and look silly. Well, the good thing with Love, he actually accepted his fate and kind of reinvented himself

as a really good bench guy and a good team, right? He plays like 20 minutes a game. He comes in, he attacks the other team's subs and he's been an asset. I've actually been amazed that he's cool with this, but he, it seems like he's cool. It seems like as long as they're winning, he's happy with it. But yeah, they're paying $30 million a year for a guy to play 20 minutes a game. Not ideal, man. There's

a couple of guys left on the, I just, my scouts, we didn't expect a couple of these names to still be here. It's tough. I could go for the comedy pick or the pick I should just make. Which one? I'll let you guys pick. Comedy. Let's see comedy. All right. Talon Horton Tucker makes $10 million a year. He's in year one of a three-year deal is three years for 30.8 million

what does this guy do what am i missing i've watched lakers games i've been watching basketball my whole life what does taylon horton tucker do what is he a g leaguer What? I can't for the life of me understand the, the excitement that was around him even last year where like, you know, I'm talking to Laker beat reporters and they're like, yo, he has like six man of the year potential and starting point guard and like a fringe all-star. I'm like, yo, fringe all-stars of Mike Conley Jr. How the hell is Talon Horton Tucker ever going to get the Mike Conley Jr. How the hell is Talon Horton Tucker ever going to get to Mike Conley Jr.'s level? Or like, I don't know, Terrell Brandon or something

for my washed heads out there. Like, I never, ever understood the THT thing. The only thing that makes sense, obviously, is the In Clutch We Trust connection. His agency, which is, you know, he shares with LeBron. And, you know, obviously they have they hold a lot of sway in the Lakers organization. But the deal, just the love and the deal. And then, you know, you add to the fact that they let freaking those at home playing the Waz game drink again.

Yes. Alex Caruso. For the same price. That's right. For the same price that's right for the same price that's right it's just house do you want to guess how many games horton tucker played before they gave him a three-year extension for 30.8 million dollars like registered a single nba minute is that the question yeah okay uh i'm gonna say 90 not 80. I'll say 65.

House is good at the guessing game. He's played 71 games. 30.8% from three as a rookie. 28.2% last year. Where do you think he is this year? Three-point shooting. Waz, I'll let you guess first. This year at three-point shooting? Waz, I'll let you guess first.

This is an 18-game sample size, 29.5 minutes a game. Talon Horton Tucker. I'm going to say he's improved to like 32% this season. House? No, I think he's going the other direction. I'm going to put him at 24.5%. House again. He's at 23.4% from three. I know.

I've watched him. He's terrible. Oh, 2.2 free throw attempts. All right. So I can't get to the line and I can't shoot from three. What? Which brings me back to my question. What is he?

I wish him the best, but he's, yeah, he's not like he's like Rondo. He's the freaking court vision. Do not know what that guy does. He's not Alex Caruso. That's who he is. Not Alex Caruso. There was like a four-week stretch where he was getting thrown in as the key piece in trade rumors for real guys. We haven't

seen him have a real stretch yet. Anyway, Waz, you're up. I think that's like a propaganda. Like, yo, THT, we're willing to put an asset on the market to improve the roster. The asset, and who's that?

THT. That's Laker propaganda to media guys, which I understand media guys got to run with it, but we all have eyes. We watch basketball. That guy's nobody's idea

of an asset. With my pick, and, you know, I think Bill's going to really enjoy this one because he tends to roll his eyes whenever people get and, you know, I think Bill's going to really enjoy this one because he tends to roll his eyes whenever people get in, you know, get in his face about heat culture. It's got to be Jimmy Butler.

Oh, wow. Was that expecting it to go? Yeah, that's it. It's just a crazy deal when you look at the numbers, like jimmy's deal goes into 25 26 okay he signed an extension for four years 184 million dollars uh again he's missed a shit ton of games this season already and it's not like traditionally he hasn't been somebody who's been on the pond for injury reasons as well. So there's no reason as he gets older this staying on the court thing

is going to get better. He's not somebody who's like a lights out shooter. So he's very dependent on his athleticism to be effective. I love Jimmy Butler. He's one of my, in my top 5, 6, 7 favorite guys to watch play when he's on his shit.

I love watching him play. But this is a horrible contract. Like it's a terrible deal. And it was made by a guy who's probably going to be long retired by the time it even matters. And so Pat Riley. And so, yeah, Jimmy Butler, terrible, bad contract. So congrats to Waz's scouting department because I didn't factor in. I forgot he signed the extension. So he has $36 million this year, $37.6 next year. Then the extension kicks in, $45.1, $48.8, and then $52.4 in 2025-26. Total package, $220 million for this year and the next five.

It's a lot of money. The one thing I'll say, if I'm trying to be glass half full about it, is think about how skeptical we were of the Chris Paul contract. This feels like a similar kind of extension. And all Chris Paul has done is drag a franchise that was at a certain level and elevated them. And he did it not just one season. They're right back at it again. I'm knocking on wood.

I want him to stay healthy. I want the Suns to be healthy. The league is better with the Suns playing. These guys have been a revelation that's fun to watch. So I think if your best-case scenario is that Jimmy Butler, either for Miami or for another team in those last couple of years at those giant numbers, and the cap will keep going up, you would expect if the world calms down a little bit

and we can get back to some normal revenues, the salary cap will go up, and those numbers may not be as crazy. They feel right now. You know what? Great value. I think, you know,

he's 12th in this list. I think it's fair. I also think it's fair to say he's one of the 15, 20 best guys in the league, but yeah, man, 52.4. That's a tough one.

That's a lot. Well, it has Jimmy Butler and Clay Thompson. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Well, it's a tough one. Waz has Jimmy Butler and Clay Thompson on his list. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. It's a combination back-to-back all-star team. I love it.

Waz, you're up again. A lot of value left. I know where I'm going. Clint Capella. Again, you guys know I'm in the tank for the Hawks. Down the stretch, back half of last season, Clint Capella single-handedly propped up this Hawks defense, got them into the top 15 of the league.

Obviously, their top four offense, they easily score every night no matter who's in or out of the lineup. Clint Capella got an extension, you know, on the back of what he did last year defensively, both in the regular season and playoffs. And he's just been an unmitigated disaster on that end all season. Like, in fact, the Hawks are better when Clint Capella is on the bench. The Hawks are a better defensive team with Clint Capella on the bench. He's getting the extension pays him about.

It was a three-year extension about $22 million per on that and it's hard to justify it right now. He looks horrible and single-handedly the defense which he was basically entrusted with propping up

is why the Hawks are having a terribly disappointing season. Clint Capella is my pick here. Sorry, Clint. I love you. Great value. He is including this year four years for $82.5 million, which I have a big draft class in the middle here, just big guys that you can get a big guy for $5 million.

Why not pay the guy $5 million instead of $20? We've seen this over and over again. Unless it's a difference maker, which he kind of was last year. I gotta be honest. I don't know what happened to him this year. I'm with was house. I don't know how much Hawks you've watched, but Capella does not seem like the same guy. And it's one of the many reasons why the Hawks look like they're giving up a land, a layup line. All right, I'm up. I feel bad on this one. So bad I might not even do the pick. No, I'm going to do it. Jonathan Isaac,

who I think is talented, but had a four-year extension for $69.6 million. We haven't seen him this year. We didn't see him last year either. He played a total of 136 games for the Magic. We've never seen them succeed. And now they're in a position where with Franz Wagner,

with some of the stuff they got going there, I don't even know where he plays when he comes back. And it's year one of a deal where he's coming off major knee injury. Hopefully he'll be healthy, but I'm pretty sure this contract's not sitting there for him again. So I say it sadly, four years, 69.6, Jonathan Isaac. You are the 14th pick of our draft. House, you're up. I really, really, really wanted to do Josh Richardson here because I think it's hilarious that you try to talk yourself into him for four and a half minutes.

Not this guy. Never. No. No. Never. Never. No. Yes, you did. No. No. You did it. No. You did. No. No. Never. Yes, you did.

You did it. No, you're wrong. I did not like the trade. I don't think he's good. There's no evidence that I liked it. There are receipts, Phil Simmons. Me, you, and Rosillo. When we did the forecast for wins, you were not

as adamant as you are right this second. No. He's not at any point liked it. But go. He's not my pick. My pick instead is Joe Harris, who to me is damn near a glorified Davis Bertans. At this point, he is one dimensional. And I'm not sure that he's more than then he might be three quarters of a dimension with his one skill but what the hell another guy who i i just say that the last year's playoffs

he really doesn't seem to have recovered from you know just it was a disappearing act uh and you know they're they're that's another guy that's getting $17, $18 million a year, one skill set. And for a team that needs scoring from wherever it can get it, as it waits on Kyrie and gets through the injury, waits for James Harden to get his, you know, fat self, I would love to have a meal with James Harden at some point, by the way. That fella, he knows how to how to eat and i i admire you know he's just been playing himself into shape

look it's starting to look good now but uh he is harris should be able to i just mean stats wise he's looking pretty good he look i mean he he dominated last night uh joe har Harris is my pick. Okay, he has three years left at $59 million. That's a lot of money. That's a lot of money. And did not look good in the playoffs,

I think is an understatement. I don't know if he sold that one hard enough. He was a disappearing act. He was really, really bad. And it was unfortunate. And I'm with you. He would have been my next pick. As an aside, before we go to break,

my daughter went to the Nets-Clippers game. Knows barely anything about basketball. Sent me a picture of James Harden during the game. And was like, what's up with James Harden? He's kind of chubs. This is my daughter. Knowing nothing. Just was like, wow, that guy James Harden? He's kind of chubs. This is my daughter. Knowing nothing. Just was like, wow, that guy's kind of overweight for a superstar.

And yet he destroyed the Clippers anyway. So maybe this is the new weight for James Harden. I don't know. Maybe he's just comfortable. This is a body positivity podcast, Bill. Yeah. With the Gen Zers already. All right.

We're taking a break. We got to, we still have to pick five more guys each. We got to move faster. Five more each? Yeah. Come back. House, you're up. First pick, sixth round. I think it's fair at this point just to

pick on some lower level dudes. I just did Joe Harris. Is Daniel Theis still in the league? Yeah, he is. Who's he play for? Yeah, Houston.

Theis. Theis. Yeah, well, it's the same difference. Theis. I'm not going to. I come from the Bill Simmons school. The rural Theis? Yeah, that's right.

I come from the Bill Simmons school of name mispronunciations. Fair. Three years, $28 million. I don't know what he does for Houston. I don't know what he would do for... I guess he's a ninth or tenth

rotation guy on a decent team. Not really. He was on my team. I don't know if that's true, but go ahead. $9 million a year. Now, that's not killing your cap, but it's money that could bucks a year. Now that's not killing your cap, but it's money that could go to a role player that you can actually spend some minutes on. That's my guy.

See, this is where, now the glory days of what I did for a living, especially when my fingers worked, when the GMs were so bad in the mid 2000s, early 2000s, mid 2000s, just half the guys were just terrible at their jobs. And it was great. There was so much comedy year after year.

Now it seems like people are better at their jobs, you'd think, for the most part. And yet over and over again, just paying big guys who aren't much different than guys you can get for the minimum to pay a big guy $10 million when you could just get Enos Cantor for a million. Enos Freedom. Sorry. Enos Freedom. Third try in his name. But just to get a minimum

guy who's basically going to give you the same production as this other guy you're going to pay $10 million. I just don't fundamentally understand it. Sorry, Wes. No, it's all good. And like you said, the deals cap out at four years so it's like you can't really really really really screw this up

you know Jerome James style anymore well I am just so excited two great picks left on the board at least in my tier one and man Porzingis is just sitting there staring at me

and yet yeah i'm gonna take him all right poor zingas even though he looked good last night he had 34 last night poor zingas is three years 101.5 million bucks left You have no idea if he's going to play four weeks in a row. You have no idea really what he is in a playoff series because we haven't seen it that much or he'll usually get hurt. I don't trust his lower body. If I were them, I'd be trying to trade him like this week, next week, because he actually looks pretty healthy right now and he might have some trade value and you would have a chance to get off this contract because that contract gets worse as it goes wow is any any porzingis thoughts

yeah again he's one of these guys he gets paid to be uh if he's not all-star he should be on the fringes right like he should be knocking on the door of making all-star teams and being integral part of why your team wins if he's getting paid 30 plus million dollars a year. And that's just straight up not the case. You can't point to one elite thing that he does positionally besides floor space. He's still a bad rebounder. How many years into his career? His rim protection waxes and wanes. And obviously, we know he's not a one-on-one threat. So it's tough. At that number, with that many years left, plus the injury history,

this is a good pick by Team Simmons for sure. House, $36 million player option for Porzingis in the 2023 23-24 season I'm going to say he picks that up probably might be in Philly alright Waz you have two picks oh this is great I'm very

I'm very happy about my next two picks first up is Luke Kennard again he's played much better, obviously, than what he did in the playoffs when he was just straight up getting coaches, DNPs. And I think that's sort of clouded what people think about the deal. But, like, again, as soon as they traded for him, they gave him a $64 million extension, which everybody was just like, why?

Why is Luke Kinnar getting $60 million to be a role player bench guy? He's got two more guaranteed years left on his deal at $14 and $15 million. He's lucky that the Clippers are in desperate need of what he does on the wing. So he plays. Luke Kinnar, just a bad, bad deal. Wait, hold on. Before you finish that, he's, so his second year was a four-year, $56 million deal,

but there's all these easy-to-accomplish performance stuff. So it's basically three for 47 left for him, we'll call it. Right. The last year is not guaranteed, to be fair to the Clippers, which, wow, yeah, congratulations. You got him not guaranteed for the right to pay Luke Kennard

50 million bucks. So, yeah, Luke Kennard off the board. My next pick, look, man, this is, when it comes, like, not many NBA players confound. I'm confounded by like what, why, and what's the point of this guy and why is he always on a team and why is he always getting deals to, to keep the white American ballplayers slander going,

Bill Simmons, TJ McConnell. I mean, like, wow, not a minimum dude. Like I don't under like somebody has to explain to me what T.J. McConnell does for teams. He can't shoot. He can't dribble past. He was not a free throw guy.

He's a decent defender, but he's short as hell. And like, I don't understand the McConnell thing. He's white is Smith to me, which God bless both of them. They deserve to be in the NBA. But like, 7.5 this year, 8 million the next two years, and then a $5 million guarantee after that. For what? I don't understand what T.J.

McConnell does for a team that you can't just find off the scrap heap on any given year. He plays in the right market, that's for sure. T.J. McConnell, well, you find off the scrap heap on any given year. He plays in the right market. That's for sure. TJ McConnell. Well, you're off the board. If they pick up his extension in 24, 25, it would be a four year, $33.6 million contract.

If they don't pick it up, they still have to pay him out 5 million bucks. So there you go. That felt like a wizardry kind of a signing house. I'm thrilled that they didn't do it. I like that Waz goes into each set of picks with a plan. That was just his white point guard slander thing. I am just over the moon that this guy is still available because I almost took him last round.

By the way, I want to say something to our white listeners out there. If we start counting the half white homies in the league, there's way more white American players than probably ever before. Probably since the 80s. People don't realize it, but there's so many biracial homies in the NBA. If we start, you know, I remember when Skip Bayless was like, why can't I claim Blake Griffin? He's from Oklahoma like

me. I know his mother. She's a white woman. He's a white American player. We need to start doing that with more mixed race homies so that we don't have to cling on to the TJ McConnells of the world, man. Get Devin Booker some love, y'all. I have nothing to add, house.

I'm going to move to my pick. I'm so excited this next guy's available. I didn't really understand when they traded Gary Trent for him. And then I really didn't understand when they gave him a five-year $90 million extension. Norm Powell. He's on my board. Yes. I like Norm Powell. Good guy to have on the team. Good heat check guy. Fun guy. We know he can play

in a playoff series, not be afraid. But I'm positive I don't want to pay him $90 million for five years. So he is my next pick. The problem is that he's a six-foot three small forward. I don't know why you would pay because he's not a pick. The problem is that he's a 6'3 small forward. I don't know why you would pay, because he's not a ball, he's not like somebody

who you can just give the ball to and ask to create offense for you as far as pick and roll shot creation. He's not good at guarding point guards. He's a small forward who's 6'3 and all that that entails. I like him.

I like his fearlessness, like you said, but for probably half the bread. House, you're not going to believe this, but they paired a 6'3 small forward with two undersized guards who can't really guard anyone, and now they're bad at defense. I personally didn't see that coming.

I thought it was going to work. I thought maybe it was a Jedi mind trick thing, but it turns out it hasn't worked. No. Speaking of hasn't worked, is my pick? Yeah, you have two picks. Yes, this is wonderful. I don't know how this guy felt to me.

It really feels like a blessing. I thank both of you. Another franchise pickle guy, Pascal Siakam. Welcome to my board. Talking about a dude that's been in trade rumors for two years basically after he signed the extension it turns out he he's speaking of sour pickles he might be a sourpuss dick like there is there's a constant undercurrent of pascal siakam you know maybe not getting along maybe not being on the program. Yeah, well, and here's the thing I want out of my guy

that's making $35 million a year, making the max money off the extension. Got to play the games. Pascal Siakam keeps missing games, keeps playing incomplete seasons, whole variety of different kind of ailments and injuries. And it feels like, you know, they're definitely not going to get value for him, uh, commensurate with what they

paid, what they're paying right now. But he, he's still one of the most eligible trade ships out there. I think, am I wrong about that? BS three years,106.3 million, including this year. It's tough. I mean, you could argue that would have been, like Daryl wouldn't have taken that for Ben Simmons a few months ago. Now I don't know. If it was Ben Simmons and Siakam as the principals, maybe.

I don't, I think that contract is appalling. Especially like the one time we've really had to see him tested as a borderline franchise guy was in that Celtics Raptors series when he was just awful. Like really, he was like the most important thing going on for the Celtics was how bad Siakam was in his post-up.

So, Waz, how do you feel about Siakam quickly? I loved Pascal that playoff run um where they won the championship with kawaii and just like his defensive versatility and offensive versatility transition attacking closeouts hit the occasional open corner three but like that shit don't scale right like when it becomes like he's the guy that has to be the hub of your offense, he's being paid money that's commiserate with that. He's not on the floor, and he hasn't shown an ability to do that.

The jumper hasn't improved. It's just, you know, I like what he's developed into. Nobody could have foreseen that he would be this good when the Raptors brought him in, but yeah, he's overpaid at this point. All right, so here are our teams so far. Waz has Bertans, Ben Simmons, Clay Thompson, Jimmy Butler, Quinn Capella, Luke Kennard, and TJ McConnell. I have Michael Porter, Russell Westbrook, Tobias Harris, Taylor Norton Tucker, my favorite pick of the draft, Jonathan Isaac, Chris Tapps Porzingis, and Norm Powell.

House has John Wall, De'Aaron Fox, Markel Fultz, Kevin Love. The other Harris, Joe Harris, Daniel Tice, Pascal Siakam. And now you have the first pick of the eighth roundhouse. Three more rounds to go. I am staring my man D'Angelo Russell right in the face. He's looking back at me with his $30 million-plus contract. Is he the third best player on Minnesota or the fourth best player on Minnesota?

So I think the Minnesota fans are going to kill us because he's actually on's on the off course. It's been all right. I've been kind of been incredible this season. Look, look, it's going to take a lot more than two weeks of good basketball from D'Angelo Russell for me to be convinced that he's now, you know, this lead ball handler, lead dog, quality offense generating type of guy. But this year, the raw numbers suggest that he is. But again, I'm I ain't buying it. Y'all could buy it if y'all want. Minnesota didn't sign him to the four year, 30 million dollar deal. That was that was Brooklyn. And, you know, he is a scorer for sure. No, but no doubt that he has the ability to score at an NBA level. But up to this point, and in the past two weeks that we're talking about, what are the impactful minutes that he's

delivered for the 30 million bucks a year? That's why he's on my team at this moment. House, you left off the key D'Angelo Russell point, which we talk about all the time when we talk about players. Would it be fun to play with? My answer is a resounding no. It would not be fun to play with. Now, he's been playing well lately, but I just don't see it. I think Minnesota even having a little bit of success this year

is more of a product of how weird the West has been and all the guys that are missing. I'm suspicious, I'm suspicious with that said, I love Ant-Man, Ant-Man. I'm all in and towns has been, I think this is my favorite town season so far. I mean, he's, he's been 24, 10 and he's actually seemed competitive in some of these games. So, all right, I'm up. There's some great choices left. Some guys I didn't expect to be on the board this late. God, Evan Fournier was just so much fun to take him here,

but I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm holding off, holding off. I, I got to put Al Horford here because, and I've actually liked Al Horford this year, and I think he's been valuable. It's just the money is so out of whack. This is why, you know, OKC took Kemba and a first round pick.

Boston got Horford back. Kemba's contract was worse than Horford's contract, but Horford's contract wasn't a picnic. He's got this year and next year, 53.5 million. They can buy him out for 14.5 next year, which I think honestly would be stupid. I would rather just have them as a $26 million expiring, but that's just way too much money for a big, that's not like an impact big. So I'm going to take Horford. Two for 53.5. You're up, Wes. Oh, let me see.

Let me see. Oh, okay. Buddy healed. This guy, there was a point where he was pretending that it was offensive that the Kings didn't offer him a contract at 100 million bucks for four years. I think it ended up around like 80 or 90 something million dollars.

23 this year, 21 the year after, and 19 the year after that. At least you can say it's de-escalating the contract. I know the cat nerds love that. But again, this is the guy that you can't even do like a throwaway trade for. Allegedly, he was a starting level quality two guard at the time of the deal. And now like Sacramento can't pay teams

to take this guy off of their hands. Two years after this one at 40 mil per, he's a sieve on defense and he's basically just a chucker. Yeah, sorry, Buddy Heald. And also, he's 50 years old because he lied about his age. Yeah, Buddy Heald, get out of here.

To be fair, he's 20 million per. Three years for 61.5 million is left. I still feel like that was a better outcome for the Lakers than getting Westbrook. What was that trade? It was Buddy Heald. Well, it's better because they still get to keep KCP or Caruso.

It's basically Buddy Heald, KCP, and they got to keep their number one pick. I would love to see Buddy Heald on a good team, but I agree with you. His contract deserves to be on this list. To pay $20 20 plus million for a guy who... It's unclear what kind of a chemistry guy he is, too. Is he better

than Malik Bunk? Who's on a minimum deal? Is he better? Maybe not. Maybe not. All right, Waz, you have two picks left, so use them carefully. You can use one now, and then you have the last pick of the draft. Who do you got? Fournier's

right there. I don't want to do that to my friends. It's embarrassing. Fournier hasn't been taken yet. We should all be embarrassed. Gordon Hayward. Gordon Hayward. Basically, a hundred million dollars left on his deal, including

this year. Look, he hasn't been, Charlotte has been surprisingly good since he's got signed, but Gordon Hayward's production is not on par or on the level of what his salary is. Everybody banged their head against the wall

when they saw the Wiz, excuse me, when they saw the Hornets give him $120 million. You were like, okay, Bartlestein is a freaking wizard. But yeah, this is a bad deal. I'm sorry. Gordon Hayward at $100 million for the next three years. No, thank you. Get him out of here.

He has this year and the next two for $91.5 million bucks. Yikes. He's looked pretty good, but the problem with him is we haven't seen him play full seasons. And there's always, it's one injury or another, and the Celtics,

he couldn't have had worse luck. But I think that's the right spot for him. All right. I'm up. I have two picks left. And Fournier can't last any longer. He has to be on my team. I'm so happy I have two picks left. And Fournier can't last any longer. He has to be on my team.

I'm so happy he's still here. Fournier, it's basically three for 54. Now, you could argue, all right, he's taking seven threes a game. He's making like 37%. Even if he's just doing that, there's some value. He's terrible defensively. Really, really bad. He didn't respond with the MSG crowd the way I thought. I actually thought he would rise to the occasion there.

It's kind of been the opposite. It's just you can watch the league, and there's so many swing men that you would rather not pay $17 million. He's one of them. There's some others that have already been drafted, but he feels to me like he's a seven or an $8 million player who's making 18. So I'm taking him unless you have anything to add, House.

No, well, it's funny the way you compiled this list. You put five Knicks together and it's basically like, which Knick do I want to choose? 48, I think, got a contract put five Knicks together and I, and it's basically like, which Nick do I want to choose? Fortier, I think got a, got a contract from the Knicks because of how he played in the Olympics. He was pretty, he was pretty good. He was, he was good. And you know, and, and it was easy to say it was a bad fit, uh, in Boston. And he did look up to it for the first handful of games with the Knicks. I actually thought there was going to be some real Fournier MSG

symbiosis there, but it has not worked out. The Knicks continue to try and find their way here a little bit. I need them to get to 500 for the futures over that I bet on them, and it was not a small amount of money. That's not happening to us.

41 feels like it's still an attainable number. I don't know what to tell you. Is it my pick? You have two picks and then you're done. Why don't I just take two Knicks because we're on a Knicks run. I could take Kemba and New Orleans Noel back to back.

The funny thing is for the Knicks, they had all that salary cap room and they tried to deploy it by bringing in, you know, they tried to woo free agents. And there was no free agents to woo. I mean, they basically, they discharged Alfred Payton and Reggie Jackson and turned those guys into Fournier and Kemba, essentially. Kemba, two years for $18 million. Who else in the NBA was going to pay Kemba Walker $9 million a year? I'd like to know.

Well, especially anyone with league pass or second spectrum or anything. Guys, guys, Kemba Walker's a New York City legend, guys. Come on. He's having a nice run right now. It's lasted four games and we haven't seen his knee can hold up. Well, because he had a nine-game break.

If you're only going to play him in these stints, like 10 games off, five games on. If he's only playing 45 games and you feel like that's good value for your nine million bucks, then by all means, New Orleans Noel I feel a little bit bad about

because isn't he still suing? Did they resolve the deal between him and Clutch? Did they work that out? They've not, but listen, this is the best thing that's happened to him that he made this list because that means he actually got overpaid for once instead of dramatically underpaid. I think

New Orleans Noel'swells has looked pretty decent this year like he's looked springy in his minutes I like the way he moves around and also I can never go against a fellow Haitian-American so I can't do that to New Orleans-Dewells I got my biases y'all

So House you would rather have Derek Rose at two years for $28 million than New Orleans-Dewells for two for $18 would rather have Derek Rose at two years for $28 million than New Orleans-Nuel for two for 18? I know what Derek Rose does. I know what he can do. I think he's a very viable contributor to a playoff team when he's healthy. Poor New Orleans can't get any minutes. And his specialty is supposed to be defense.

And his coach, his head coach is a defensive minded head coach. I mean, he gets one and a half blocks a game in his 23 minutes. He gets six rebounds in his 23 minutes and he gets one steal. If he had anything at all,

Tibbs is dying to play him, right? I can't wait to make my last pick. It's my favorite pick of the draft. It's an absolute fuck you to house. And I think it's going to be one of the biggest surprises of the draft. I have Spencer Dinwiddie at three years for $54 million. After this whole thing about,

oh my God, oh my God, it's like we have Chris Paul. I see a guy who makes 33% of his threes, is a 13-point-a-game guy, five assists, five rebounds, and unfortunately, if you're the Wizards,

seems to think he's the best player on the team. And it's like, last eight minutes, it's like, I've got this, I'm're the Wizards, seems to think he's the best player on the team. And it's like last eight minutes, it's like, I've got this. I'm Spencer Dinwiddie, which is kind of what he's brought to the table for his whole career. It's like this irrational confidence,

which I respect. On the other hand, that's the deepest position in the league. And night after night, I don't feel like he's necessarily winning the matchup. He's shooting 39% for the season. And I think he's one of those guys that you're paying somebody 18 million a year. Who's really like a third guard, but seems to think not only is he a starter, but like there's might be some all-star buzz for him. I think he's so whatever his perception of his own game is,

is so out of whack with what it actually is. i think that's one of the reasons the wizards have gone in a tailspin house your response well the part of the the reason the wizards have gone into a tailspin is because he and beal can't play together they can't defend anyone when the two of them are out there and over the balance of this season i think we will see a version of those two where it can work. We have not seen it yet. Over the first 15 games I came on this podcast, the Wizards were 10-3 on their season. And I was singing his praises for the very reasons that you were just giving him a hard time, which is he has that swagger.

He has some alpha dog in him. The problem is he is playing with a kind of uncertainty that belongs to a player who hasn't played in two years and played high level, night in, night out. And so he is right this second. I'm going to be charitable about it. He's inconsistent. He's just a little inconsistent right now. I, he, he should be the guy who has the ball at the end of games.

Once the ball at the end of games, you know who that guy is. And, and, and, and to his credit, he does see the floor. Well, I love his oops. IQ, the swagger he showed over the first 15 games, but our end of game guy is Kyle Kuzma. And I made a joke about my Twitter avatar that I had Westbrook up there because he dragged him to playoffs. And when we signed Kuz,

I'm like, I might put Kuz up there. I'm a huge Kuz fan. I'm all in on Kuz. That dude rebounds his ass off. He plays hard. I am on Kuz. It's soounds his ass off. He plays hard. He plays hard. He's got a motive.

I am on Kuz. It's so clear that he was just on the wrong team with the Lakers, where he's just on a team with one of the best players of all time who plays the exact same position as him and was always a tough fit. All right, Waz, you have the last pick. Some guys that haven't been taken, just for the listeners. I'm just going to read the guys who are still in the green room, wondering what happened.

Steven Adams, two for 35. He doesn't know what he did. He thought for sure he'd be gone by now. Derek Favors, two years, 19.9 million. Derek White, four years for $70 million. How did we not take him yet? Doug McDermott, three for 41.3. Earmuffs, Knicks fans.

Julius Randle, five for 137. Just throwing this out for you, since this seems to fit your scouting profile. Duncan Robinson, five for 90. That seems high. And Josh Richardson, who somehow hasn't gone yet, two for 23.8. Your last pick was, is. This is a lifetime achievement award, this last pick.

And it's Andrew Wiggins. Throughout the course of his career, of this contract, Andrew Wiggins has absolutely not come close to fulfilling the value of this deal, which was a max rookie extension at the time that he signed it. And the owner of the Minnesota Timberwolves, the great Glenn Taylor, said, I'm giving Andrew this deal because he promised me that he would work hard on his game and fulfill the promise of this talent. Glenn Taylor gave Andrew Wiggins a Max Ricky extension on a motherfucking promise. So, yes, thisobili and Parker. Right. Like it's a plug and play. They get guys to believe they get guys to buy into this system. They play hard every single night. He's now been slotted into that system. So it doesn't seem as egregious as what it truly is. But Andrew Wiggins is going to make $31 million this year and $33 million next

year to be the fifth best player on the Golden State Warriors. If that, maybe possibly, this is one of the worst contracts in the league. So Waz has two Warriors. All right, our final teams. Waz picking first. Bertans, Simmons, Thompson, Butler, Capella, Kennard, McConnell, Heald, Hayward, Wiggins, kind of almost like all that. I'd actually would watch that team play. It's a great team. It's a great team. I don't like that team. I think that team would play well together. My team, Michael Porter, Westbrook, Tobias Harris,

Talon Horton-Tucker, Jonathan Isaac, Porzingis, Norm Powell, Al Horford, Evan Fournier, and Spencer Dinwiddie, just for comedy's sake. I would not want to watch that team play. Me either, no. Yeah, that's like a 2009 Wizards team. How dare you? House has Wall, John Wall, Darren Fox, Markel Fultz, Kevin Love, Tobias Harris, Daniel Tice, Pascal Siakam.

No, I have Joe Harris. I'm sorry. Joe Harris. Yeah. Daniel Tice. Joe Harris, Pascal Siakam, D'Angelo Russell, Kemba Walker, and New Orleans Noel. We'll have to have the listeners. Maybe the ringer can do a Twitter thing, a poll of who picked the best,

worst contract team. Congratulations to Davis Bertans for being our 2021. Davis Bertans, 2021-22 winner for worst contract in the NBA. Special bonus section right now. All of our teams need some youth. You get to add somebody on a rookie contract

for your team. Waz, you can go first. You can have anyone on a rookie contract. Man, I was I started getting to rookie deals and I couldn't really come up with one.

But like, you know, Wiseman? He's like, you know, Wiseman? He's like, you know, another warrior. I know, but like,

he's the number two pick. So he like, high draft picks now make like 11, 12 million dollars a year. That's real money as far as the cap hit is concerned.

So like, yeah, give me Wiseman, bro. He hasn't shown me dick. I'm trying to think. I think Wiseman makes real money. Hold on.

I'm checking this out. That's a nice pick house. I'll give you the second pick while I look this up. Oh, Wiseman. 9.1 million this year. 9.6 next year. 12.1 team option in 2023, 24. That's nice.

All right. Wiseman rookie house House, who do you have for your rookie pick? What we're saying is... This is just basically like a bad draft pick, essentially. It's functional equivalent of

who got drafted too high. Yeah. That's what it is. Okay. I understand what's in front of me. Don't say Denny Abdi. He likes Denny. He plays defense with his chest. He genuinely likes Denny.

Poor Jared Culver. Let me see. I'm clicking on him right now. Taking six. Now, he's the guy that the Sixers took, right? They traded for him. Is that right? No, it was the Hawks. That's right.

That's right. No, but you can't take Jared Culver. He's only got one year left. There's two nominees. Killian Hayes has a few years left on his day. I don't know if you've seen him play basketball. He's just hurt. He keeps being hurt. I've seen him in summer league. I don't know if you've seen him play basketball. He's just hurt. He keeps being hurt. I've seen him in summer league. Killian Hayes. I don't know, man. He dribbles like he has oven mitts

on. I don't know. I'm taking Killian Hayes then. So he's got 5.5 this year, 5.8 next year and a team option for 7.4. And he's another one where I just don't understand what he does. Fundamentally. Who do you have, House? So I can't take Culver.

You can take Poku just for comedy's sake if you just want Poku on your team. I like Poku. I think he's... What do you like about Poku? He's funny. Look, Washington drafted a guy like this. Oh, God, what's the kid's name?

He looks like Stewie from Family Guy. Oh, I'll remember. Pecker, Pecker, Pecker, Pecker. Pecker, Pecker, Pecker, yeah. Yeah, right, right, right. I'll take Poku. That's fine. All right, so our three rookie picks. James Wiseman,

Killian Hayes, and Poku. That was really fun. I'm surprised Bertans was first. I really went into it thinking Westbrook and Wall would be in some order, and somehow they didn't even go top two. It's just a deal that has been universal. Like, everybody has taken their turns panning that pick. And I will say this, Bill.

We could call this the worst contract, or we could be charitable and say agents earning their commission deals so i was going to ask you about that about well we're in this new sensitive era where you say like where's contracts it sounds harsh i was thinking maybe regrettable contracts i mean we just spent an hour and a half murdering the guys and like we took the guy and then we say here are all the bad things about the guy why i can't live up to the contract? We, it was, it's a player assassination show that we do here today. We're calling it the most regrettable contracts of the 2021,

22 season. It sounds, it sounds nicer. Okay. Hey, look, I had a good time. I don't really care what anyone says.

It's the holiday season. Junk house. Happy holidays. Happy holidays. Fellas. Big was, um season. Junkhouse, happy holidays. Happy holidays, fellas. Big Waz, I guess, when are we starting your Ringer NBA Sunday show? This Sunday,

Weekends with Waz on the Ringer NBA feed. We're talking to a bunch of people around the league just having fun with it. Sunday weekend observations, general league observations. We're going to have fun with this one. So yeah, check it out. Every single Sunday on the Ringer NBA feed.

House, did you know about Weekends with Waz? It's going to be a new addition. I want to figure out, how can I call in? I want to call in on this. Is the call in? I don't know if they have drunk guests. I'll hit you on the hip, House. I'll shoot you a test. There we go.

Good to see you guys Happy holidays Alright, that's it for the podcast Thanks to Brian Curtis for hopping on on short notice to talk about the great John Madden Thanks to Big Wiles, thanks to Joe House Thanks to Kyle Creighton for producing this one, as always I will see you on this feed on Thursday with another

Action Pack Pot this feed on Thursday with another action packed pot.