The Bill Simmons Podcast - Kenny Smith and Will Ferrell

Episode Date: July 1, 2020

The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by two-time NBA champion and sports commentator Kenny "The Jet" Smith to discuss what makes 'Inside the NBA' so authentic, stories from the 1994 and 1995 Finals runs, Hakeem Olajuwon, ESPN's 'The Last Dance,' and more (3:10). Next, Bill talks with actor, producer, and writer Will Ferrell about quarantine family time; youth soccer; HBO's 'Succession'; LAFC; his new Netflix film, 'Eurovision Song Contest: The Story of Fire Saga'; and more (48:05)! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Network, where we launched the Bakari Sellers podcast this week. He had Deshaun Watson on it. It was really good. He's doing it twice a week. Please check it out. It's going to be really good. I think it's going to be a useful one, especially as we head into whatever we're going to head into here over the next eight months. Um, I'm going to talk to Kenny Smith and we're going to talk to Will Ferrell and the Will Ferrell one was taped like a month ago, but we were holding it until his, uh, new movie came out, but this is a really good podcast. I hadn't had Kenny Smith on, on this version of the BS podcast. He doesn't really do podcasts that much, but, um, it was really fun having him on. Now I'm just going to force him to come on more often, but that's coming up in one second.

Quick programming note. This is going to be the last podcast of the week. We're taking a few days off here at The Ringer just because of the July 4th, all that stuff. There's going to be no Rosillo podcast on Sunday. This podcast will not return until next Tuesday. There is going to be a R rewatchables coming tomorrow night, Wednesday night, the perfect storm that's happening 20 year anniversary. So stay tuned for that. And then there won't be another podcast after that. And I think we're still on. I, we were probably not

going to do the Sunday night pod again until the second or last week of July, because now with the NBA coming back, assuming it does come back, I guess we'll find it to come back, we will see. We're going to be back in the grind doing those Sunday nights after games. And then when football comes back and Cousin Sal rejoins us, then we're going to have to figure out a different night for me and Rosillo. So we'll figure all of it out. It's a good problem to have because it means that sports will have come back. And I really do hope it comes back. But anyway, that's the schedule for the, uh, for the next week at least. And that's all you need to know.

All right. Here they are. Pearl Jam. All right, so a few weeks ago, I was doing Michael Jordan deep dive games. Stumbled across this game from 1995. Halftime show. Tim Hardaway, Cheryl Miller, Ernie Johnson, and a current NBA player at the time

by the name of Kenny Smith, who was doing halftime analysis. And it looked like that kid was going places. Now, 25 years later, you're still going. Do you even remember that? I do. It was funny because when you got to the point when you lose, TNT used to bring in players when they lost.

We still do it from time to time now. After the show, Michael Jackson and Tim Kiley at the time was producing and Mike Pearl go.

If you want to do this, you could probably do this for a living. I thought they just said that as a parting gift. You're good if you want to do this, you could probably do this for a living. And I thought they just said that as a parting gift. Yeah. Oh, you're good. If you want to do it. And literally a year, a year or two later, I was thinking about retirement. I got a call.

They were like, no, we were serious. Like, you want to come in and do this? And that's how it happened. But I never took it seriously at the time. But my ex at the time, my ex-wife, she was a, she used to do TV. She was an anchor in Arkansas. So how I learned about TV was watching her. And she used to say, okay, critique what I'm saying when you're home watching. And I'd sit home and I'd be like, oh, why was your hands there? Why did you say that? And then she started. And then I learned a little about who, what, when, and why.

So I was critiquing her and just taping her. And that's how I learned about TV. Well, you could see it even in this, it must've been 96 because you were out of the playoffs, but you could see it in the halftime show. You kind of knew instinctively what to do. Like you had put some thought into it. And, you know, that was like the wild, wild west of the halftime shows for 25 years, dating back to the seventies.

They would throw anybody on those things. They would put no thought into if the person was going to be good or not if they were comfortable what they were going to ask them and there were just a lot of misses a lot of well i think the one thing that tim kiley has i have to give my producer a lot of credit one day we're sitting in a production meeting and i go why am i here he's like because it's a production meeting so you could know what's going to go on you can give us the keys to the game and i said i'm not going to know what's going to happen until i see it right there's nothing going to happen in a basketball game i haven't seen her done or been part of so why am i sitting here like giving you keys that i don't know? And he's like,

that makes sense. So you get out of here. I haven't been, I haven't been to a production meeting in 24 years, 20 years, whatever I've been there. I only been to two ever. And because of that question. And so it's all spontaneous and thought process of what happened in your life. And then the second thing I was like, I think when you do it, like you looking at this camera, like they used to have that thing where you have to look camera three is your camera. Stare at the camera, stare at the camera and answer your question.

And I said to him, and I said, but if I'm saying a joke and I don't know if Ernie's laughing or not, how do I know? I don't know if itnie's laughing or not, how do I know? I don't know if it's funny or not. Can I just talk to Ernie? He says, okay, we're going to add another camera in the studio and we'll find you. Just look wherever you want.

And that was it. And then so Charles and Ernie and myself now and Chuck and Jack, we don't look at the camera. The camera finds us. And because of that, And it made us feel, and I think that's the thing I'm giving our trade secrets to other people. That's what makes us feel natural. We don't feel like we're looking at a camera telling a joke or telling why things are good and bad. So I almost did Countdown in 2012 and I was at the 11th hour and I backed out because I was doing Grantland. I was doing a whole bunch of things and I just at the 11th hour and I backed out cause I was doing

Grantland. I was doing a whole bunch of things and I just didn't, I felt like I had too much going on. I didn't feel like I was ready for it. And that whole 2011, 12 C it was 2011. Sorry. The 2011, 12 season LeBron's first title. I watched your show that whole year trying to figure out different things. Cause I knew I was probably going to be doing it in a year. Right. And one of the things was like, I'm never looking at the camera. I like how Kenny is doing this. Kenny's playing off the people that he's with. I'm, I want to do that. If I ever do this, I'm not staring at the camera. And then the other thing I noticed was be on one of the corners. Cause if you're in the middle, you're on a swivel.

You got, you got to look at this guy. You got to turn this way and you're like this and you look fidgety. And I would watch how you handled that while your whole body stayed calm, but you kind of did this left to right. And I was like, I'm not good enough to do that. I can't do that. But you're one of the few people I've seen who can do it. Jalen can now do it too. Well, I think the one thing is I always, when I'm on the set, my process is I'm in the locker room, I'm in the green room. I'm not on set. So how would I react? So now I don't have to think about my reactions, my comments.

I'm just, I'm normal. I have to feel normal because most of the things that I'm saying is reactions to what's happening in the game or to what Charles is saying. So the other part is listening. Like that's, you know, for us is the biggest thing, Bill. Because if Charles would say something like Shaq one day, you know, Shaq, when he first got there, he was not doing his homework. So he would come in there. He's like, I'm Shaq. Like, I'm the most dominant.

I'm like, oh, he's not the most dominant here, brother. But that's OK. We all have the most dominant. I'm just walking in. I don't pay attention. I'm not. When I want to, I do things. And so he said, yeah, so Tyson Chandler, you know, this is pregame.

A guy like Tyson Chandler is going to be big and all that. And normally you get your 30 seconds on most shows that just say your part and then somebody else says theirs. But because we listened, I'm like, wait, whoa, you said who? I said Tyson Chandler. He's not playing tonight. He's out. You didn't hear?

And we embarrassed him on air. And from that point on, he's like, no, I'm coming in and I'm going to know my stuff. Because we're like, you don't even know he's not playing? And we just, all night. So we were like, so the Celtics would come on, we'd be like, so Bill Russell is going to have a real good game tonight.

We just had the joke running all night long about people who didn't play in the game anymore. And Shaq changed that night and he started doing his own one. Well, it's interesting because the first year he was not good and it really kind of screwed your show up a little bit

as he tried to figure out how to fit in. And this is a thing that I just don't think people understand. Like TV takes years. The chemistry takes years. The comfort takes years because i think shack is really good now but it's a 10-year odyssey with that right we had to learn him to build like it wasn't just him learning us we had to learn his rhythm and what he was good at

yeah you know i you know i was we talked all day i'm likeq is good at jokes. And we evolved to Shaq-ing the food. And then one day we have a meeting. It's just Shaq is not in the meeting. We have to have this big meeting, which is really odd. And so we have Charles and just myself in the meeting, and then Tim

Kiley, our producer, walks in. I'm like, this is weird. Ernie, no, I want to talk to you two guys. Why are you giving him a hard time? You're not letting him come in. You don't want him to be part of this. You don't want this show to be great. You're making fun of him.

And I'm sitting there and Charles is already pissed. So Charles is just quiet. So I go, when does someone come on our show and we don't make fun of them for not knowing something? And it's silent. And he goes, all right, get out the room. That's it. Oh yeah, you're right. He's like, do whatever you want to him. He's got to join in. And that's the kind of conversations that we've had because it's important to be authentic. Right.

And that really reads, if I'm like Tyson Chandler and I let him slide and don't say anything, then it's like it's not authentic. Well, the thing I was the most jealous when we were competing against you guys there for a couple of years, and this is the part people don't know, you said it before, if you're doing a pregame show, you're basically talking out of your ass. You don't know. You said it before. If you're doing a pregame show, you're basically talking out of your ass.

You don't know what's going to happen. You know, you can say whatever, but that's why you guys very smartly, you might go five, six minutes before the game. And that's it. When we were doing countdown, we would either do a half hour or an hour, the two years I was there.

And you would do these whole segments of like, what does Derrick Rose have to do against the Knicks tonight? And I'm like, nobody's going to care about this. Why? We should just argue about basketball. But then you guys would have this hour after the game. Right. We could react to what happened.

And we would have nothing. They would just throw it to SportsCenter. So I'm like, we're a pregame show. You have the one minute on the back end. Yeah. Instead of the front end. Yeah. Instead of the front end. Yeah. And it's like the only part people care after with a halftime show and a postgame show,

whatever, is like, what'd you think? Yeah. Hey, this happened. I always thought the best show I thought you guys ever had was after game five, LeBron in the Boston series in 2010 when he melted down. Yeah. And the way that you guys talked about that as like a real moment.

And Barkley was so disappointed, but all you were, but he was so disappointed that LeBron didn't have it. And he was just kind of so surprised, like what happened? And you guys, it was like, listen to a therapy session. You weren't even in the game.

That's what you get with those post-game shows, you know? And I think that's the in the game. That's what you get with those post-game shows, you know? And I think that's the part people miss. That's what we want, you know, Bill. I think for us is, you know, like I always call it the Bull Durham moment. You know, they used to, they go to the mound in the movie Bull Durham and the baseball movie and they go, every, all the pitcher, the catcher, the coach comes to the mound,

and then you start hearing what they're saying. And he's like, did you order chicken last night? And they're like, you're thinking that they're talking about everything, and sometimes they aren't. And so that's what we, I'm like, we have to be bolder a moment.

We have to let people into the mound and let them hear what, the only one who can really say what LeBron is thinking is Charles or Shaq. The only one who could say what, you know, Derek Fisher was thinking is me. The only one who gets, you know, only one could say what the coach is saying is me. So we, we kind of like, everyone has their role of what they hear and what they were saying in the mound. And that's what we try to just let people hear.

It's like, this is it. Did you order chicken today? Right. Well, you know, that's when Shaq found his voice, I think. And it took a while. But he's one of the best 15-pointers of all time. He was the best player in the league for three straight years. And especially with centers when it's somebody, you know,

I think the Dwight Howard thing was too personal for him because of the Superman piece. Like, he could never really talk about Dwight Howard objectively. But who was the guy last year? Embiid. And when, when he's going in on Embiid and then Barkley's coming in too, now you have two of the best 20 guys ever. And both of them are like, Hey man, we're disappointed in this guy. We think he has a chance to be great. We see it. We were great players. We know who the other great players are and he doesn't get it yet.

And to hear how that resonated with Embiid, I thought was one of the most fascinating things that happened last season. Like Embiid was like hurt, but I think it resonated with him. I do feel like it might've changed the destiny of his career potentially. Because he understood that,

how do you say it? You can fool some of the people some of the time, but you can't fool us. Like you could see through things by being in the infantry that you can't see if you're in the bird's eye view. So we're in the infantry. So no, that doesn't add up, brother. Like, you know, that doesn't add up. Like I get it, but that doesn't add up, brother. Like, you know, that doesn't add up.

Like, I get it, but that doesn't add up. And so when he heard it and he came Shaq as a big man, Charles as an all-time great. As a Philly franchise guy. And then you as somebody who played with one of the 12 best spies ever. I came in as a teammate. Right. How you're making me feel as a teammate.

That's what my thought process. If I was his teammate, what would I say to him? So he couldn't fool any of us. We came at him in all ways. He's like, that's right. I'm not doing that. I am. You're right.

Because you can't fool him. But your perspective was valuable because you played with somebody who was as gifted athletically as mb and is actually probably one of the four or five most gifted athletes in the history of the league right but then also had the work ethic and gave a shit and really really really put the time in and that's why it eventually pays off with the two straight titles and i i was with you guys i don't i don't see it yet with him and maybe he'll get there maybe it'll be something he figures out it's just inconsistent you can't be inconsistent if you want to be great you just can't yeah and and consistency is greatness that's what it is it's not the fact that like i always

say gary payton was one of the toughest guards I've ever played against. But he wasn't the best. He was just the most, he was one of the most consistent. Every night, 17 points, six rebounds, seven assists, 17. So he didn't get 40. Like I never had a game when I played against Gary and he gave me 40 points.

Right. And I, 40 points and 20 rebounds, like 10 assists. That never happened. But 17 points. Then you look tomorrow night, he played against Stock like 10 assists. That never happened. But 17 points. Then you look tomorrow night, he played against Stockton, 17. He's a Hall of Famer. It's the consistency that made him great.

It wasn't the highs and the lows. It was the consistency. He doesn't get it yet. Do you think it's unfair? I mean, you've worked with Barkley now for 20 straight years. People, he's now two generations removed from people knowing what a special basketball player he was. He's certainly one of the most memorable guys

I've seen in person. He was a one-man show. He was a one-man wrecking crew. He played with some really bad Philly teams and just carried them. I thought he was awesome on that 93 Suns team, which is about as close as you can come to winning a title and not winning it.

You guys had some good battles with them too. And he was a little physically, at that point when you beat him, he was past Apex. Yeah, he was a little more banged up. That's what he said. That's what he said. I always think about this.

It's one of the reasons I wrote my book where the years past people forget i do feel like people have forgotten with him i think the i always i mark him as one of the earmarks of basketball he's a and i say when you become that for me you're a rule changer so michael jordan they had the term illegal offense yeah well because you know it used to be have to you know the defenses back then you're like okay you had to be at least one hand distance away or it was called a legal defense so what the bulls did was like oh you got to be one hand away we're going to put four guys up on the corner and have michael play one-on-one and you have to be closer to your

man he'll score every time right so they made they made the term a legal offense for him. Kareem, there's no little dunk rule. Him and Wilt, like, there's no dunking in college basketball. They're too great. Barkley, we don't want you to have the ball for more than five seconds and back people down. Yep. So he was an earmark of changing in the game because he was so good

at something that they wouldn't, the league said that we're going to make a rule that you can't even do it anymore. That's greatness. Like how many guys can say that they have had rule changes because they were so great? Well, and then you played with the all-time.

Hey, it's, if you're going all-time, people forget how great this guy is Hakeem and Moses are in the finals and I don't know who wins but it goes seven games the Hakeem thing it's just gone now and he's not somebody who's in the limelight a lot

not on TV, doesn't have a show it's 25, 26 years ago doesn't have a credit account nothing he's the It's 25, 26 years ago. He doesn't have a credit account. You know, nothing. He just, he's the, he's Joel Embiid, Ben Simmons, and LeBron kind of rolled into one. But the defensive piece, I mean, you're talking about somebody who had, what was it, like 500 steals and blocks combined in a year?

Over 500? Shit like that, like stuff that and blocks combined in a year? Over 500? Shit like that? Like stuff that doesn't happen anymore? No, he's the only player I play with as a big, or even anyone, that in a pick and roll, he would defend the pick and roll. When a guy would set a pick, he would defend your guy and get back to his guy to block the shot. When that first happened,

I actually went back my first year playing with Houston. It was like the third game of the year and it happened. Like he defended my guy out front. They threw it inside. He went back and he blocked it. I ran back in the locker room right at halftime. I said, let me see that play again. Because I thought something else happened.

I couldn't believe that he actually did it. And so they rewinded. I'm like, this dude guarded my guy. And then went back. Oh, I'm going to win a championship. I was like, I'm going to win a championship. I remember when he went head-to-head against my beloved 86 Celtics. And he was young.

I mean, he's like a babe in the woods. And he had a couple moments in that series. Especially in game six in Boston, the Celtics blow them out. But he has this one stretch in the Woods. And he had a couple moments in that series, especially in game six in Boston, the Celtics blow them out. But he has this one stretch in the second quarter where he just completely demolishes Bill Walton. And there's a level of athleticism he's at. And the crowd's kind of like, wait, what's going on?

Wait, we got to do something. What's happening? Yeah, he was different, Bill. Yeah, he was. It was, like, again, I've never done that. I've never ran into the locker room at halftime to see a defensive play that someone else did on my team. Only time in my whole career.

You know, I'm like, I didn't think that he actually did it. I said, maybe they swung it, and then somebody else hit it, and I just didn't see it because I was, I got hit in the screen. So I didn't know what happened kind of. And I was like, it's impossible for him to be that in two places. And he was. I remember there was one year where he was unhappy in Houston before you guys won the titles.

You were there yet. You were there at that point, right? And I remember driving around Boston and they were having a sports radio argument about whether you would trade Reggie Lewis for Hakeem. We loved Reggie Lewis. He was great. Right. And there are, they're literally arguing about this and I'm in the car.

I have no column. I'm nobody yet. I'm just random dude. I'm like, what are you guys talking about? Of course we should trade Reggie Lewis for Hakeem Olajuwon. Are you guys insane? He's unbelievable.

What are you talking about? I'm glad they didn't do it. God bless Reggie Lewis, but I'm glad they didn't do it. What was he so upset about? What happened? What was his deal? He didn't think that the organization

wanted to win. And he was to have these, because he and I, we came really close and he'd have these conversations. And then he hurt his hamstring. And so he was taking his time getting back because he was already upset.

He was taking his time. And then they said, he's not really hurt. And the worst thing that you could do to Hakeem Olajuwon, I'm going to tell you one thing. He is the most honorable man I know. There's no one in the world that I know today more honorable than him. If a question is honor, he won it out. Right.

He was like, that's it. And so when they said he's not really hurt, the owner said, I don't believe he's really hurt and he could be playing. He said, I won out. He says, Kenny, I'm not going to play here another game. He questioned my honor. He questioned me. And says, Kenny, I'm not going to play here another game. He questioned my honor. He questioned me. And I was like, whoa.

And he sat out like another week. And then I convinced him, because we and I were really close. I said, King, play. Just play. He's like, okay. So he plays the game and he's kind of not in the... You know, he's not a king. He's just going

through the motions. And I'm like, we're not going to. He's just going through the motions. Yeah. And I'm like, we're not going to win, and they're not going to trade him. So this is a true story. So I go, I call him in the locker room. We're talking, and I'm like, let's watch the film. And he's so honorable.

So I'm watching, we're watching the film, and I'm laughing at him getting scored on every time he gets scored on. I'm like, oh, he's killing you! Because I knew that would get him going. And I was like, oh, he's killing you, you let him go! And then now I got the whole team, and we're all talking, oh, look at Keem, he can't go, he's getting scored on by Will Purdue and these kids.

All these guys that he just killed, like he would normally kill. Bill Whittington is killed. And then the fire just got lit again. Because they weren't going to trade him, and he was not going to play hard because he was so upset at what they had said about him. If I had been a GM, he would have been on my team. I would have gotten him. I would be like, how many picks you want?

Oh, you want more? Okay. You want four first-rounders? Okay. Let me tell you a crazy stat. Everyone always asks me this, Bill. They say, wouldn't you guys, you know, the documentary with more? Okay. You want four first rounders? Okay. Let me tell you a crazy stat. Everyone always asks me this, Bill. They say, would you guys, you know, the documentary with Jordan? Yeah.

Unbelievable. They go, would you guys, you know, our two years kind of got glossed off in it. But that's another story. Like it didn't happen. But he was wearing number 45. But anyway, would you have beaten him? And I said, we would have definitely beat him one year. There's no come out in my mind.

Two things that factors that. We would have definitely beat them. Michael Jordan is the greatest basketball player we've ever seen. That is not a doubt in my mind about that either. But during their first championship run, regular season, it's not the playoffs, we were 6-1 against them. Three years. That's why I'm sorry.

6-1. And we didn't even have, and Cassell and Ori were just coming in. They were getting there late. So that's the first step. And then the one championship, the year we came back as number 45, Horace Grant was in Orlando. Everyone leaves this part out. They had no good guys at all.

And Dennis Rodman was still in San Antonio. Yeah. So if he was playing, they would have been still too small for us. So Akeem would have just, they would have had the double team. We would have been shooting threes. Michael would have been great. That would have been the year that they lost. They wouldn't have won eight straight.

They would have lost to us one of those years. But you're also talking 100 games a year for five straight years and the odds of them staying healthy, I think there's no way. We've seen how Scottie Pippen was upset. Maybe that's the year he now goes out. All of those things could have happened, but eight straight and no Horace Grant, no Rodman.

No, you're not beating us. Not beating the umpires with a key. You're not beating us. So we did a pod like during the documentary, making the same point, basically that the 95 has now been chalked up to Jordan coming back from baseball.

He didn't have it. He still averaged like 30 a game in the playoffs. That wasn't why they lost. They had Will Purdue and basically a bunch of 10th and 11th men. That was the one year that they couldn't control the boards. Couldn't control the boards.

I agree with you. I think you would have beaten him. I think you guys were lucky to get into the finals that year. And I think, you know, what were you, a six seed that year? Six seed, no home court advantage in any round.

It's crazy. But the three-point line, you had the goofy three-point line that year, though. No, it was a regular. No, we had the regular one. I thought that was the one that was closer in 95.

No, it was a regular, but no one's done it. No one's not had home court advantage in any round and won an NBA championship but us because of that. Like it was a different. Yeah, we were just built for the playoffs and not the regular season. So the playoffs came out. We just took off. But I never told you this.

That was one of my great gambling wins. You guys were like five to one underdogs and I couldn't believe it. I was like, Hakeem Olajuwon is the best player in the league. He's a five to one underdog? What's happening? So it was a big bet. And the thing is, everyone remembers it now

is the sweep and oh my God. And I was like, first of all, game one is awesome. Orlando Chokes, the famous Dick Anderson game. But then game three is really good because that was shown recently and that was Clyde's big game. And Clyde had a couple of good playoff games, but there's a couple of Clyde playoff games

in that run where it's like, oh yeah, that's Clyde Drexler. He's one of the best 50 guys of all time. And he had one of those. Yeah, I think what I didn't know about Clyde was his demeanor, his attitude, but his passing ability. But Clyde was a very different addition to our team.

We were, other than Akeem, even Akeem at times, he's rah-rah. Like, yeah, let's go, let's go, Kenny, let's go. We're all rah-rah. Clyde was like, so. That's Clyde. He was a whole different beast. And so he brought a calmness to our locker room that wasn't there before. You know, we were very like emotional team.

We wore everything on our sleeve. The referees make a bad call. The whole team could get a tech. Like everybody would get a tech. You'd be like, tech out! Tech! Tech! But he brought a calmness to our team that allowed us to win the second championship. And without

him, we definitely wouldn't have done it. Well, you also had, you're trying to go back to back. Once you get that first title, the guys who sacrificed in whatever way, Pat Riley called it the disease of more, you got young guys on your team who's like,

all right, now it's my turn. I call it fat cat-itis. Yeah. You got fat cat-itis. You got young guy like Sam Cassell, like, all right, now it's my turn. You got Robert Horowitz, like, hey, now it's my turn. And you're juggling all this stuff.

Wouldn't that team go like 47 and 35, something like that? We had, we had the first year you walk on a bus, you know, guys would be locked. We had the second year, more sunglasses on the bus.

And when we're going to try to go back, they got more guys in sunglasses when they walk on the bus than you could ever imagine. Like it was the funniest thing we our 13th man on the team he was he was like he only played he was like on ir in and out in and out timbro yeah he had a local commercial you know for a betting company and he's doing his commercial he's the 13th guy on the team oh my god he's got a commercial in a local market, and he's a big guy star. He owns a night club. He's the 13th

guy on the team, man. Everybody had it. We all were in that vibe until Clyde came and was like, whoa, no, no, no. And he didn't just rah-rah us out. He was like, no, we can win it again, right? He just was calm with it, and it helped us out. It's a completely

underrated playoff run because as you said you had no home court the the phoenix series the game seven is out of control kevin johnson it was it was on and by the way we've been in quarantine for four months all i have is old basketball games kevin johnson has like 45 in the game seven you guys are all seven feet off him he's like completely. There's no way to even stay in front of him. You somehow pull that one out. Then you have the famous David Robinson series

where he gets the MVP. You've told that story a billion times. Hakeem's eyes are narrowing watching this ceremony. Does he get enough credit for being a killer? Hakeem? I feel like he doesn't.

Because he would get in fights early in his career. Oh, my gosh. I mean, you don't think of him that way, though. No, he led by example. He led by fierce. He led by vocal. And what changed is when he really got deep into his Muslim religion, what changed about it, he harnessed it.

He was able to direct it in the right moments. Like before, it was like you see him on the plane, his mood, his attitude would change in a car ride or on the bus. But it was like when he really became a devoted Muslim and he really took his religion seriously, he was able to channel it at moments and say, okay, now I'm going to bring this out. I'm going to bring this out. No, right here, I'm not, but I'm going to bring it out. And so that was, that's what I saw was the difference and made him arguably the best center that we've ever seen

at that position, at that size. Like, he's in a – there's no one like him. Like, Kareem was – you know, and Wilt was so huge in size. But his speed and athleticism, I don't think there's anyone who's used it like that ever in the game. Yeah, if you're putting together all-time teams and you're just, like, having fun throwing five guys together, there's an all-time team where you could take

Hakeem, LeBron, Pippen, Jordan, and Kawhi and just create this crazy athlete, awesome killer team that I think would probably beat all the other teams if you put it together. Definitely Hakeem, Pippen, Jordan, and probably Kawhi. You just take those four. I don't know who the fifth piece would.

These guys are just going to trap, double. They're just going to lose their minds athletically. Good luck. Good luck. I would agree with that. It could probably happen. When you watched that Jordan doc, nostalgic? Like, what was, walk me through your emotions

as you're reliving this era that you were a part of. I was surprised, you know, obviously playing with Michael in North Carolina. I was surprised that he was unveiling his thoughts,

that you hear it privately. Even though I didn't play with him in Chicago, but when you're 18, 19, 20 years old, those are the formative years that you, like guys, they say things to you and you have relationships that are different. And I think that's why most people say my best friends are from college or from high school.

It's just a different relationship because you, you're more open. So for him to like reveal that, that was the most surprising thing to me. Like I, it wasn't nothing I hadn't heard or thought. It was that he was actually revealing it. Yeah.

Revealing that, no, Clyde Jackson, he was just a threat. Gary Payton, I had no trouble with Gary Payton. That type of revealing, that's strictly in a small circle. And I think

that's what people were seeing and made the documentary so great. Because his whole career, he was so guarded on that. And we don't have social media. He wasn't tweeting. He wasn't Instagramming. We didn't see his home. We didn't see his home life. I don't think there's a picture anyone could find

really of Michael Jordan's house, him just running around his house. There's no video of that. Right. I know what LeBron's house looks like. You know what I mean? He goes around and he's in his house with his kids and they're dancing. We saw none of that with michael he was a mystery uh for most people

so to for him to do that um and be so honest that it was that it was an honesty that was piercing you know it was piercing because it was it's what every competitor thinks but we all can't back it up right and he actually thought it he backed it up and then he told me he backed it up again right well the other piece that made me nostalgic for that era and i sound like the old guy now is just the whole concept of a team staying together and the ups and downs that you have. And even you talk about your rockets, you know, you take the 92 rockets and it keeps unhappy and you put them in 2020, he's getting out of there. He's gone. He's on another team or starting in 1991, he's planning his exit. And that's just the way basketball is now. And it's a bummer.

But at the same time, I just like the old way. I like the ups and downs and the ebb and flow of a team. And even you look at the Miami Heat, the four LeBron years, and the moment they had adversity, it was over and they all kind of splintered.

Which way do you like? Do you like everything going nuts or do you like the team staying together over the long haul? I mean, me personally, I'm a loyalist. If you look at the places I've been in terms of what I had to choose,

I'm loyal to that. My high school is Archbishop Malloy. Tradition, Jack Curran, Hall of Fame, high school coach, going on to college, tradition, North Carolina. So I'm a traditionalist. When I have my choice to picket, I'm the one who's going to, I'm going to ride and die with you. And if someone says something bad about you, even if I don't,

if I know it's true, I'm still riding with you. And then I'm going to pull you aside later and go, yeah, that's true. You need to change that. But I'm never going to say it in public about you. That's just me. I'm a traditionalist. So seeing the movement of players and it, it's uneasy for me. Because I'm more of a fan of a team than I am of a player.

So now I have to be fans of players because they might move than more being fans of a team. And I've never been that. But that's why we're the old guys. I think if you're under 30, you're like, no, I root for players, not teams. I want the players to go do what they want to do. I never, I rooted for the Knicks. Yeah. I didn't root.

Then Walt Frazier happened to play there. And if he went, if he left, I'm not rooting for you. So it wasn't, it wasn't, I have a different mentality. I root for teams. So, but I understand if I was a current player, I would say, no, I'm going to play where I can get the opportunity to win a championship based on the current environment and the way things are. Quick question and then we'll go. Do you think we have an NBA season this year?

Does it come back? I think we will know by Monday of next week. The spikes and the curves, they cannot continue to go up. And we go to Florida, where the biggest spiking is happening. And so I don't think that that. I think by Monday of next week, these next six to five or six days, we'll get a good indication. If it goes up, I think that my recommendation, we shouldn't blame. If it's going up, it's impossible with people working, people around.

It's the most contagious virus that we've seen in our lifetime. Why would we risk everyone to do that? That's how I feel as well. And I'm with you. I think next five to six days, we'll know. We'll have the answer. Tell us about the Jet Academy really quick. Oh, yeah, the Jet Academy, man.

So I'm sitting at home like we are in the pandemic. And all my son's basketball camps are canceled. My daughter's place canceled. My camp is canceled. And so I was like, what i want to do is create a streaming process where i could be a personal trainer or these players could be a personal trainer for two hours a day so i called like kimball walker i got trey young and i got uh victor ladipo i said nba all-stars then i went to i said i got i wanted to make it where women as well. So WNBA, I got Breonna Stewart, Sue Bird, and Brittany Griner right now.

And I just said, the first streaming service where it's live. It's like this. It's not like it's a live interaction. You could ask questions, and you get two hours, and you could do it on any device anywhere. As long as you have Wi-Fi or you have a cell service, you can actually just put it and you just, you're live with your favorite player. And the funny thing is, I was talking to Kemba, so Kemba goes, all right, we're doing the camp,

I love this idea, blah, blah. I said, Kemba, you gotta show us the pullback. You know the thing. I wanna show the kids that. He's like, oh, no problem. I said, no, but you gotta tell us when you use it and why. He's like, oh, you want me to give all the secrets? I said, you got to.

If we're going to form this community of, like, your training kids, you got to give all the real secrets. He's like, all right, I'll give 98%. He's like, there's one player in the league that can say one thing. He's going to have the advantage on it. So I'm not going to say it, but there's one thing I won't say, but everybody else doesn't play me that way, so no problem. So that's what it is. It's

JetAcademyCamp.com. You sign up and you get virtual training live from the NBA and WNBA's best. That's awesome. Good luck with that. What NBA player reminds you of you, by the way, right now? It's funny i was a um early in my career i was a less version much less i was 40 percent i used to think like russell westbrook because i was fast so i was like let me just go as fast

as i can get the guy on his heels and pull up, you know, or I get to the, go get a quick dump early in my career. And as, as my career goes on, I just became any, any other guy on the rockets. Now I just stand in the corner. You, you would have liked that on this harder team. You could have done it for another six years. Oh, I was, I was born in the wrong era. Cause scoring was the easiest thing. You know what, Reggie, before we go, Reggie Miller and I, we have this, we do this thing where from the 90s,

we take the draft and we draft it based on the way the game is played today. Oh, yeah. So we were like, in our draft, we were like, David Robinson would still possibly go one. Reggie Miller would be the second pick instead of the 13th pick now. He's a three-point shooter, six-foot-seven. I would be third in the draft because

I was fast and shot the three. You shoot layups and threes. That's all you did. Okay, you're going to be in and out. I was in a dunk contest and a three-point contest on the same night in the NBA. Also, you know, with somebody like you, you're getting 14, 15 years out of you

and different points of your career, and then the last four years, you're just a shooter. And load management never exists. I was third in the NBA at 175 pounds in league in minutes played one year. Oh, my God. And my body's not built for that. You see the way I walk. My body's not built for that. You see the way I walk. My body's not built for that.

Third in the league. When I was in Sacramento, no load management, nothing. I was going to say you did the tour of duty in Sacramento. All game tapes have been destroyed. They got me. They got me in Sac, man.

Those are the fun things that, you know, you think about now, what would have been. But we have a great job now and, you know, appreciate you bringing me on and we having some fun. Reminisce it a little bit. Yeah, I want you to please promise you'll come back when we

actually have basketball and we can actually shoot the shit about things that are happening in real time versus 25 years ago. You know what? And I appreciate that. You know, and I want to, you know, because one thing I do like about your podcast and your ability is your honesty. Because you speak as a journalist and a fan at the same time. Like, that's hard to do.

Yeah, I can't help it. One's a fan, one's a journalist, but also, you know, I would like to hear from, tell the audience, like all of the things that you've been feeling in terms of the social pressure about all my, my company and, you know, diversity in my company, how do you feel and how you handle it? I'd like to hear it from you because now you're my guy. So I want to hear it. Yeah. I mean, you know, this last month, I think the thing that's been most surprising for me is you think you're doing a good job and then you really assess it.

And you're like, oh, I could have, I should have done way better at this, this, that. I thought I did this and maybe I could have done way better at this, this, that I thought I did this. And maybe I could have done this instead. And it's one of those moments where you, you, you, you know, it hurts honestly, where you're like, fuck, I didn't do well enough. What, what should I have done better? Why did I think I was doing well enough? Why was I making excuses that certain things weren't happening? And, you know,

I think it's important when something like that happens is to try to think, all right, where am I going to be six months from now? What did I learn? How can I do better? And that's really all you could do. That's all you could do. How can I be better? And I appreciate the honesty on that.

You know, I always say, if you're thinking about every decision that you've made, you make you're thinking about how to affect other people, especially in the community of the black community. How is it affecting them? Then you're kind of the reason I say that, Bill, because every decision I made in my life, I had to think, how is it affecting the white community? Every decision I made. Right. So that, I always had to think of that. So it's just, but it became habit. So I think now people are starting to say, man, you know, I'm making that decision. I can't remember what it was who said, you know, they said, I don't like it.

He said he walks in his office and they said, you know, I don't have enough women. Can you believe that, Bill, John, Matt? He's like, I don't have any women here. You're right. Like, you don't think that you're doing it and you're part of it. Because sometimes it's an undercurrent. And now you're

woken to the undercurrent. That's great. Yeah, I'm excited for where things are going. And it's, you know, it was an awakening in some ways, but I think it's been an awakening for a lot of people, especially people that if you have a platform, there's a certain responsibility that goes with that platform that I think some people can take for granted sometimes.

And I definitely feel like in my case, I did. Yeah, it is, brother. All right. All right. Please come back. Good seeing you, Kenny Smith. Okay, brother. All right.

All right. Take care. From The Ringer, Kenny Smith. Okay, brother. All right. All right. Take care. From the ringer, I'm Tyler R. Thomas. When I spoke to NFL star Cam Newton in January, his mindset was clear. I want my whole career to be in Charlotte. Cam won't be getting that wish. He was released by the Carolina Panthers in March. Cam is a complex figure, Cam won't be getting that wish. He was released by the Carolina Panthers in March.

Cam is a complex figure, and my interest in him goes far beyond his exuberant smile and transcendent style of play. Cam broke the glass ceiling in American athletics, ascending to a place in the sport that few black quarterbacks have ever reached, making his fall that much more dramatic? Over the past year, I've traveled the country speaking to coaches and teammates, friends and family, reporters, and even briefly to the man himself, trying to unravel the enigma that is Cam Newton. I've covered contradictions at every turn. How can the hardest worker on the team be depicted as a bad leader? And how can a franchise icon with an NFL MVP and Super Bowl appearance on his resume be so abruptly cast aside? The Ringer NFL Show presents

The Cam Chronicles. The series premieres Monday, July 13th. All right. Will Ferrell is here. We're taping this at the end of May, but we're holding it for as we get closer to your new movie. But we're in the quarantine. I was excited for your quarantine hairdo, and it has not disappointed. No.

It's as bushy as I've ever seen it. Well, and you know what? I kind of blew it. I actually put a little bit of product in to mat it down. This is nothing. It has a whole nother level to it. Mine goes up too. I think we have similar hair that the longer it gets, it goes up and sideways instead of down. Most jealous of the people with the long hair that it just goes down mine just goes up but now you you um it looks like you you did a little grooming on the side there you've got it high yeah i uh i bought i bought like a really nice electric razor thingy on amazon and had my wife and my daughter cut my hair so that it was tighter because my

hair, my face just becomes like this round planet, you know, where, where, uh, I forgot to use my microphone by the way. Uh, my face just becomes this round planet. Yeah. And, uh, and I, you know obviously not ideal so i had to tone it down we um we just had somehow my middle son my 13 year old convinced my 10 year old let him cut his hair oh that led to tears i bet well and bless his heart the 10 year old did not get get it in writing that he could then cut his older daughter's hair. He just said, because you've got to get that in writing. You've got to get, you know, you've got to do pinky swear. I don't know what you've got to do, spit in each other's palms and, you know, have a Tom Sawyer handshake or something.

But he just said, okay, I don't have to. And, oh, Matthias, Matthias is the 13-year-old. Axel's the younger guy. And he just gave him the weirdest haircut that was shaved, but a little bit of a mullet. Shaved a smiley face in the back of his head. And at first, it was laughter. Axel was going along with it. And then it led to tears. Yeah. Yeah. It always ends badly. Yeah. You're stuck in your house with three sons who probably haven't been together this much in their entire lives. What's that been like? It's actually been better than I thought it would be. In fact, they're even commenting like, do you see how good we're getting along? Yeah. Yeah.

And I said, I, yeah, I, I'm, I'm really shocked now. It doesn't, of course there's massive flare ups,

but, uh, um, but for the most part, they're just, they're forced to have to hang out. And, um,

they have developed a game in the backyard with one of the soccer nets we've set up called sexy Tim and they play sexy Tim. Now what all it is is one kid plays goalie and you defend until you've let a ball go by you. And then the guy who scores now rotates and is the goalie. Oh, but it's called Sexy Tim. And we don't know who Tim is? We don't know who Tim is and we don't know why it's sexy. But so after dinner, they'll just say, hey, let's play Sexy Tim. You better make sure it's not some neighbor with a telescope that they befriended or something.

Or it's not some euphemism that I don't know real meaning of it. It probably is. Do you feel old with these kids now? Do you feel like you're of a previous generation? Because I have moments with my kids where I just feel like I'm the old guy and I don't know really what happened because you don't realize that it's happening

until it's actually happened. Yeah, for sure. because you don't realize that it's happening until it's actually happened yeah uh yeah for sure and i'm i'm i'm not on social media so i'm out of that loop um smart yeah and you're not missing anything let me just tell you i feel so confident that i'm not um and yet it is still tempting every now and then to like oh it'd be funny to comment on this. But yeah, for the most part, I just know that that grass is not greener. Uh, yeah. Uh, yeah. I mean, yeah, yeah. I think it's inevitable that you, uh, um, even though one of the boys is mistakenly when he, when he feels like, uh,

my wife and I are out of touch, he refers to us as boomers. You guys are such boomers. Yeah. Which is incorrect. We're too young to be boomers. I think we're Gen Xers technically. I think the boomers thing has taken a different meaning the last six months. Have you been referred to that?

Yeah, it started on social. It just means you're old. It's a new way to insult people for being old, the boomer. Then there was a backlash to the boomer because people were saying you're old shaming people. It's a mess. The internet's a mess. Stay away.

Yeah, but I have, during this quarantine, I have taken one of the boys' phones and purposely threw it out the window of the car as we were driving. Really? Which sent ripples through the family. And it's something you always threaten to do you know yeah and then actually but it was all it was all premeditated i knew i was going really slow and it was on a

street in our neighborhood and i i spotted like a big cactus plant i knew it'd be easy to find and i'm like hand me your phone hand me your phone and i just threw it and the shock um the effect only lasted a couple days though 48 hours of good behavior that was right back to it's like a coach screaming at his team for effect just gotta keep everyone on their toes for a couple days but other friends of ours were that they've been able i think that story's been more useful for other friends of ours to tell their kids. You know, we, our kids, we have kids like around the same age and your kids play sports. So you go to these games and I've been at games that you've been at a couple of times. It's, it's a weird life for you.

You can't really blend in cause you're tall too. So it's very obvious that you're there. And, you know, I think in LA, for the most part, there's a little bit of a code in LA not to badger celebrities, but it's still, you know, I always feel for you in those situations because you just want to go watch your kid play sports. It's pretty good. In fact, I was just thinking this, you know,

right now we have just missed Memorial Day weekend here. We would have normally, we were always down in San Diego at this big AYSO soccer tournament. Right. The Top Gun tournament. And I was just thinking, oh, wow, we would have been there. And yeah, I usually wear a big, you know, shade sun hat, which probably calls more attention to me.

Makes you taller. Yeah. But no, I mean, most, most, most families are pretty good, but yeah. It's weird. It's weird having the weekends back. Right. But the, you know, the other thing, the other thing that is, is fascinating to do. And that was part of uh you know for for once again these teams and i don't know if you've had to do any of the refereeing for soccer that i've stayed away i can't i can't handle it yeah you've done that oh yeah i've done the uh i haven't done the center

ref but i've done the sideline ref yeah Yeah. And that, I kind of love that because they don't recognize me until about the end of the first half. And then a kid will come over to my sideline to take a throw in. And he'll just look at me. Wait, is that that guy? Wait a second.

Okay, and then the other boys will start talking and pointing. And by halftime, they're like, Hey, you will throw. Hey, Oh, what's up?

And, um, and I love that. That's, that's such a fun reaction to watch them slowly as they distract themselves in the middle of the game. It could go one of two ways, right?

You could actually like negatively distract them or they could step it up because you're there. They're like bring something better out of them. Some sort of outcome on the game. In fact, they should really ban me. I remember LeBron's son was playing, played a game before my daughter's basketball game in eighth grade and then stuck around to watch the first quarter. And I was like, oh man, I don't know. I could see the kids completely freezing or going the other way. And they went the other way.

It was like Hoosiers. Everyone was making shots. We're up 15 in the first quarter. I'm sure hustle plays, dives for loose balls. Yeah. Did you follow what SNL was trying to do with the at-home stuff and trying to keep the show going when basically on Zoom? What did you think of that? It was pretty ambitious, right? was you know really inspired on one hand to be able to kind of create that stuff while everyone is uh you know separate and not together at the same time i think it also shows that you know the

the original format for how it's done is really the value of the show. And you, at the end of the day, while there, of course there were funny things, uh, you really miss watching it in the studio with the band, with the musical act, with,

you know, it's an institution and, and you see why it is. Um, uh, but I mean, I, I think it was probably fun for them to them to at least just get to do something

and definitely fun for an audience to finally have a little change of pace yeah there's some things that WWE was weird they like this too where they've been trying to do these you know pay-per-views and weekly shows with no audience and you just realize how important the fans are

to just every single thing in wrestling. So have they been doing wrestling in an empty arena? Yes. Yes. I missed that. But they come out, they do the entrances, but they're doing their whole thing, but nobody's there. It's the music, it's the pyrotechnics, but it's empty.

It's an empty stadium. Pretty much. Yeah. Yeah. it's the pyrotechnics it's and but it's empty it's an empty stadium pretty much yeah yeah so so that the weirdest part is the guys walk out and they have to have like that swagger that you have when 20 000 people are either cheering or booing you but there's nobody cheering or booing and and that swagger plays really well in front of 20,000 people. Right. Looks probably a little ridiculous when no one's out there. Well, you realize, like with SNL, the weekend update was probably the weirdest thing

with no audience, because you just realize how important the audience is for that specific segment, right? If they don't laugh at a joke, that's almost funny in itself. And that segment specifically is such a uh such a rhythm a rhythm segment to you know that's basically just telling jokes and yeah the rhythm and you need you know that's that's as close to uh to come kind of playing a piece of music

as any of the sketches are so yeah i i i, I, I could see how that would be, you know, not the best. They're, they're doing this thing now, the whole cancel culture thing where they go 20 years ago, 15 years ago and find something somebody did and then try to get them to apologize. They just did it with Jimmy Fallon. Do you think you had that sketch you did with the dogs where you were yelling at your dogs?

The infomercial. Do you think retroactively people are going to come at you that you were mean to animals in 2000? You have to apologize to a Cocker Spaniel. Yeah. It could happen. It could happen. I'm sorry when I said to Fred the dog, I didn't mean it. I did not mean to burst the eardrums of Fred,

the Cocker Spaniel. By the way. Oh, no, no. I was thinking of another fake commercial. The one, the infomercial where you,

it was like belittling your dog. Yeah. That one. I was thinking that my name in that commercial was Way Blazing Game. Old pitcher for the Astros. But that was a different... I was a really bad

injury attorney. Yeah. I remember that one. Stars on his face. Yeah. Being attacked by a dog. Yeah. Anyway, two different sketches.

Well, I'm sure they all blend in together at this point. Yeah. I can't remember. I mean, I can't remember entire years of my life, much less the actual nitpicks of different things. What else have you been up to during the quarantine? Are you productive? You just watch the TV?

Any TV obsessions? You know, it's, you know, that's been, it's been, I'm sure you've found this for yourself, is how quickly the days kind of go by in a weird way. And yeah, there, uh, yeah, there's been, there's been tons of, you know, like everything else, Hollywood is kind of shut down. There's still tons, tons of things to read and look at and, uh, uh, you know, uh,

now when and where and how they will ever be executed is another question. But, um, so there's still a lot of, of things. And, uh, I've, uh, but I've, although otherwise, yeah, trying to kind of, you know, exercise. That's been good. Exercising. I walk the dogs now. Nice. Do that. Um, and, and uh and then what forcing the kids to watch weird things on tv like the um ken burns civil war documentary which just trap them on the couch totally and it's like can we watch tv yes good news and bad news yes you can watch tv on a school night. Yes! Okay, Ken Burns. What is this, Dad? It's Ken Burns' Civil War documentary. And that is like, what?

This is terrible. I'm like, okay, well, then we can just go to bed. And then they end up kind of liking it. Yeah, you wear them down where it's just, it's this or nothing. They're going to like anything more than they normally do But the one shared experience That's been kind of great

And they've been into it just as much as we have As so many people have The Michael Jordan thing, the last dance And they found it equally fascinating Just because To them Michael Jordan Is just a name That's the first time they've seen just because, you know, to them, Michael Jordan is,

is just a name. They never, they, that's the first time they've seen extensive footage of him actually playing basketball. Yeah. It's really interesting to watch that generation go, Oh, wait, this guy was phenomenal, you know? And, and yeah, and just, you know, as a fan of that era, growing up in that era, just all that insight that has been,

I could have watched that for the rest of the year. I wish they had 100 episodes. Yeah, generationally, I think it's like the cutoff's probably like 28 years old, where anyone under that, LeBron's kind of the guy. He's the guy. I think it's like the cutoff's probably like 28 years old where. Yeah.

Anyone under that LeBron's kind of the guy. He's the guy. Cause they weren't there for Jordan. They didn't see it. Right. But it was, it was fun to see them go, Oh,

Oh, right. This guy, LeBron, you know, LeBron's great, but so was this guy. You might, you might have to do a last dance parody to add that to your creative,

whatever. I actually got to, uh, I was trying to remember. It's funny. And I may, I, I saw Jordan play twice and there are two kind of interesting places. One was as a, as a, uh, eighth grade basketball camper at Dean Smith's North Carolina basketball camp. You went to that? I went, I was the only kid from California. It was like 300 basketball players. Wow. All my family's from North Carolina. So I was, I thought, well, I'm going to, I'm going to try out for freshman basketball

going into, you know, my freshman year in high school. That'd be cool to go to a basketball camp. And I went and I was immediately homesick. And I was like, all these kids, everyone goes with their team. So there were all these cliques of kids hanging out. I'm like this kid from urban California, just like sitting in the cafeteria. But we got to watch this pickup game between the current team and like north carolina legends and there was this skim guy michael jordan out there and uh so i got to watch him

at the old michael gym and then we uh we watched him on that Bobby Knight Olympic team in 84 in LA. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, you went to one of those? Yeah. We went to watch them play, you know, I don't even remember who it was, but, uh, yeah, it was just funny watching, uh, Michael Jordan under Bobby Knight, Bobby Knight, it's so funny too, for all of his mystique and his... I don't think he said a word to that team. They were such a good team. He just was like, okay, really calm.

Granted, I think they probably beat Lithuania by 30 points, but I don't know if there was anything to yell at the team about. But it was just so funny to watch him be just super calm and not, not say a word. That was a weird time because there were way less NBA fans, obviously. And Jordan,

that was the famous, they took Sam Bowie over Jordan draft. Yeah. And it was really weird at the time. Cause Jordan was such an exciting college player. Like people just couldn't wait for him to go to the pros, but like not everyone realized it. And then he did the

Olympic team, and it was kind of like everybody's like, oh, so this is going to be how it goes. But it was weird that people didn't know that before the Olympic team. No. It was also weird to growing up in Los Angeles thinking,

oh, the Olympics. Yeah, I don't know if we'll go even go see anything. Traffic is supposed to be horrible. And credit to my mom, she drove up and she bought like four groups of tickets to a bunch of different events. And it literally was one of the greatest, you know, just amazing to go to an Olympics, even though Russia wasn't there. It was to sit in a full coliseum and watch a full day of track and field. Oh, yeah. We saw soccer at the Rose Bowl. We saw basketball.

It was really cool. I went in 2012 when it was in London. I'd never gone, and I was really fired up for it. It was even better than I expected. It was absolutely incredible. It lives up to the hype. No question. When you were growing up at Irvine, did you realize that someday it was going to become the most prestigious youth soccer location for any tournament?

Cause you have the Irvine spectrum is close. You got a mall to go to if they're if the games are four or five hours apart you can actually go to an outdoor mall it's huge i uh in fact yeah not only that no i had no idea that that was it was going to become the mecca it's the msg of youth soccer in california but i actually took my boys to one of the old fields i used to play at there's this big sports complex called harvard park um uh which they were not that yeah they were that cool that they whatever can Can we go to Inno? But yeah, that's... I just... I was like, where was this?

When I was... I mean, we were playing on dirt patches. I judge all my youth sports locations by if we have three to four hours to kill, where are we going? And if the only option is a Buffalo Wild Wings next to a Greek pizza place, you're in trouble. Just in the middle of nowhere. Well, I can remember because

I had played just AYSO a couple years and then they started a soccer club in Irvine and I tried out and made one of the first teams. And we had to play in Chino and out in Norco. Oh, Norco. Don't worry, Norco is still going hard and strong. And they've got I think they have like amazing fields now out there. But I literally remember having to hop a fence and run through, and you had to be careful not to step in the cow manure to get the ball.

Right. And just driving for hours and wondering, was it really worth it? By the way, we're still wondering that in 2020. i think when we got our weekends back these last three months it was like ah maybe maybe driving around every every weekend maybe that isn't a great way to spend a saturday yeah i don't know um hey are you still involved with succession i am i'm a i mean i'm by name but that's but that kind of has its own mechanism. You were involved in the original piece of it, though, right? Yeah, yeah.

Were you surprised by how well-received and awesome it became? I mean, it's probably the signature show of the last three years. So crazy. Definitely. Only because you just don't know. I mean, you know, Jesse, who writes, he's super smart, funny writer, you know, great writer. So that's kind of a surprise. But you just didn't know if just the intrigue of this billionaire media family would be enough. But yeah, it is insane as to how many people from all different people who I wouldn't think would even be into the show are like, that's a great show. It's really well cast, too. I think that's the other thing.

It's so well cast too. I think that's the other thing. It's so many good actors. And in a lot of cases, actors that I didn't have a real background or baggage with, you know, like kind of follow the stories and the characters even, you know, when you, when you don't, when you don't recognize who you're watching, they become, they become real people. And, and at the same time, just, it's just fun to kind of give those opportunities to, to, you know, new faces. That's probably about in terms of just a production company developing a show that's about as good of a success story as you're going to have right you find a good creator

it lands at hbo yeah cast well people like it that that's that's unusual it doesn't usually play out that way no it's they're few and far between and uh um uh we're kind of having similar success with this other show dead to me on netflix yeah which is kind of uh obviously different different show but maybe skews more towards towards a female audience but um still the same sort of thing like you know find great casting great showrunner uh just a solid premise that once again you're like oh no this seems interesting i don't know if it'll work and then it it takes off but you're yeah you you're kind of for every one of those there's at least nine others that for whatever reason it it's just kind of fizzle. There's some hiccup along the way and then that's it.

Yeah. Dead to me was a big show with the Simmons ladies in my house. Okay. Season two came out and they just banged it out in like nine hours. I don't know how many episodes it is, but they watched all of them in a row for nine hours. I'm like, what do you guys do with her?

Go away. Leave us alone. It's funny how, I mean, I guess because I just, because as you brought up earlier, we're getting, we're old. I'm still, it's still hard to, I mean, I can go two in a row, maybe three in a row. Then I got to shut it down and take a little break, digest, maybe come back the next day or a couple of days later. But I can't do the nine hours in a row. Depends how much is going on with the show. Like Ozark, I could not do more than two in a row because there's just so much going on and it's such a dark show. You don't want to go too far. Yeah. Yeah. That one's a good one. Yeah.

You'd like that one. What's up with your new movie? Uh, well we, uh, this is a movie that is, it's 20 years in the making. Um, no joke. Well, not in the making. I take that back. I've had the idea of wanting to do something on this cultural phenomenon for 20 years which is the i don't know bill if you're familiar at all or if any of your listeners the eurovision song contest which is uh takes place in may every year um and it it was basically kind of this thing that they started in post world war

two, 1950s, just to kind of, uh, unify Europe in a way. And, uh, and it's, it's basically, I mean, it's, it's essentially a singing contest between all the countries of Europe, uh, including Australia and Israel for what reason? Oh, shoehorned in. Yeah, I don't know why. But it's gone on for 60 years, 65 years, but ABBA kind of got discovered at Eurovision and Celine Dion kind of got her break there.

A bunch of people have sung there. And it's this thing that they get 180 to 200 million viewers every year. And I first saw it when my wife and I went to Sweden for the first summer. And we sat down and her cousin was like, should we watch, shall we watch Eurovision? And I said, I guess, I don't know, what is that? It's like, oh, you don't know, let's watch. And it was the final night and all the acts sing

and then they have this vote tabulating system and it's like a three hour show. And I was literally, you know, and it's from the ridiculous to the sublime between the types of songs and just crazy staging and some are legit like good songs and some are the worst songs you've ever heard um but I just was always like oh this is this is a movie and right and I I never I just thought I just assumed I would make it. And no one ever did. And about four years ago, I started talking to one of our producers and a writer buddy of mine. I was like, let's fly over a movie and so that was the year that this this uh conchita versed one for Austria uh she's trans and um she won the the song she won

Austria in this kind of amazing spectacle thing and uh, and that's when we sat and talked with, uh, the Eurovision people and, uh, uh, we're like, would you let us make a movie? And they were like, yeah, I think so. Sure. Uh, and so, uh, yeah, so, so myself and, uh, Rachel McAdams are, are, uh, are participants from Iceland and we are, uh, yeah, we are, yeah, we are not supposed to win the Icelandic contest. We kind of get in on a technicality and we go on to compete in the entire competition. So you had to do an Icelandic accent? I did. It's a little monotone, right?

Isn't it a little like this? I kind of leaned on my Swedish accent a little bit. And that was it. And that was it. Yeah, it's basically crossover. Wait, I got to ask you about the Swedes. Yeah. Because we got, we got bought by Spotify, Swedish company. Oh yeah. And I'd say, you know, after, after you get bought, you become a Spotify employee. You have to fly to Sweden, but obviously we can't fly anywhere, but they fly every person who becomes a Spotify employee. You have to spend four days in Sweden, but I was going to have to go there a bunch of times. And I was like boning up on All the Sweden stuff but now I can't go anywhere

But give me some Sweden tips Or are you going to go to Stockholm I would think Right? Yeah Stockholm Well Eventually you'll get to go And yeah great city Handsome country Handsome yes

Like Pretty much you'll walk down stockholm men and women are just beautiful people yeah yeah i noticed i did an event for them in september and it was half the swedish part of the company and half the american part and it was just like wow i can kind of tell who's here from sw. Just like a handsome group. And the Americans all look very disheveled. Brooklyn beards. No, I saw some of the most well-dressed people and they're just out on their lunch break,

walking around in perfectly quaffed, beautiful Scandinavian features. Yeah, you'll have to, there's a lot to do. You have to go to my favorite museum in probably in the world, the Vasa Museum. What's that? Which is a, it's a ship from, it sounds weird.

It is a ship from the 1600s, a big sailing ship that they dredged up from the bottom of the Harbor. Wow. And is perfectly preserved, perfectly preserved because it just sat there for 500 years. And, you know, and everyone knew, and it's this really fascinating story of Sweden at the height of their colonial powers and the kind of hubris of King Gustav Vasa wanted the tallest warship in the world. And he wanted it built to these certain specifications. And the shipbuilders kept saying, we can do that, but it's going to tip over immediately. Just so you know, like it's too narrow and it's like, keep going.

And then they checked in with him later. They're like, just so you know, once again, we want to have another little chat. How's the shipbuilding? It's going great, but just so you know, we again, we want to have another little chat. How's the shipbuilding? It's going great. But just so you know, it's going to tip over. And then he's like, I don't care. Keep building it. And the shipbuilder dies. And his son takes over.

And even he tries to sit down with the king and says, I'm just about done with it. It's looking great, but it's going to tip over. And it's not going to work. And sure enough, the day they decide to sail, a big wind, it sails for maybe 30 seconds, and the wind catches the sails. All the cannons lurch over to one side. It throws, and it sinks in like five minutes and there it

just rested and because the conditions at the bottom of a Stockholm Harbor are it never ate the wood away and and they knew it was sitting there and so here was Sweden in the 1950s just flush with cash after World War II because they were neutral, so they didn't have any damage. Smart move. We've got money. Let's dredge up the ship. Yeah. So they did this huge engineering thing.

Anyway, it sits in this museum, and it's this crazy thing that you wouldn't think looking at a ship would be that interesting. But it's everyone we go, you know, when we go every summer, we bring our friends like, come on, we have to go drive into Stockholm and go to Vasa and people are like blown away by it. So that sounds like something that sounds like something Trump would have done. No, keep building it, keep building it. And then when it sank, he just would have done no keep building it keep building it and then when it sank he just would have blamed everyone else i told them it was gonna sink and that's what this guy kind of did they were they were like hearings and they they first they said uh was it witchcraft well i don't know let's look into it it was like very similar like they had commissions to try to figure out

and the ship the shipbuilding family kept saying, we've told you 80 times. It's still too tall. Right. Listen. They're just pointing fingers at everybody else. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

All right. So that comes out what day? July 20th or June 23rd? June. That is June 22nd. June 26th. I'm just going to keep shouting out dates until it's the right one. June 26th. June 26th. I'm just going to keep shouting out dates until it's the right one. June 28th? June 20th?

Anywhere from the 23rd to the 26th. Just tune into Netflix. You've got a good chance of seeing it. Oh, it's on Netflix? It's Netflix, yeah. Oh, look at you. It's one of those movies where, you know, we're like, thank God we're with Netflix right yeah. Oh, look at you. It's one of those movies where we're like, thank God we're with Netflix right now.

Yeah, seriously. All right. Well, it was good to see you. How do we feel about LAFC? MLS will come back at some point soon, right? Well, they're going to do this tournament, right? Yeah. And then they'll try to maybe play games after this tournament. Yeah. For people who don't know, you're a minority owner of the LA NFC team. That was smart. That was smart to get in on that. That was smart smart I have to

Slightly pat myself on the back I mean they leverage you a little bit You have to work when you're at the games You have to work on the video screen When you get shown stuff like that But No I just

I just remember When they talked about this stadium was going to be next to the Coliseum. Yeah. Soccer only. I remember thinking, this is going to work out. It's one of the best executed start to finish launches of a team that I've seen.

Because they even figured out how to make it seem like the team had a tradition in the beginning with the fans and the, the Eagle, is it an Eagle or Falcon? It's a Falcon. Falcon. Um, yes. All that, all those little twists. And it seems like they've been around for 30 years. Meanwhile, it was created like two years ago, but it doesn't feel that way. They had, uh, tom pan and the team you know the team president everything from yeah every move they've made is is been strong to uh yeah cultivating that fan base also to uh john thornton that the gm had never been a GM before too. And he's great moves with the players. And yeah,

I'm kind of like, I think everyone would have been happy if, if they, you know, just would have been 500 or, you know, and they, on top of everything,

that amazing atmosphere, they turn out to be really good. It's, it's a cool thing. The size of the stadium was really smart too. That's why I'm hoping when Balmer makes the Clippers Arena, I think there's real wisdom in a smaller arena where it's more compact.

It feels more special to be there. I think you should just do like 2,000 seats. That's it. It's really tight. It's like Pepperdine size. Yeah, exactly. Pepperdine says. Yeah, exactly. Pepperdine. Yeah.

Every seat is 5,000 a game. All right. Well, good luck with the movie. It was good seeing you. All right, Bill. You too. All right. Thanks to Kenny the Jet Smith.

Thanks to Will Ferrell. Thanks to Zip Recruiter. Again, we are going away now until next Monday or Tuesday of next week. There is a new Rewatchables, The Perfect Storm. Don't forget to subscribe to the Bakari Sellers podcast if you haven't subscribed already. We are going to announce a new podcast next week on the Ringer Podcast Network.

Stay tuned for that and enjoy the rest of the week. Enjoy your July 4th. Stay safe. See you next time. I don't have a few years with him on the wayside on the first I never said I don't have

a few years