The Bill Simmons Podcast - Kurt Russell on His Career, Robin Williams's Humor, and Hanging with Val Kilmer (Ep. 200)

Episode Date: April 14, 2017

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Kurt Russell to discuss the origin of Mr. Nobody in the 'Fast & Furious' franchise (5:00), the alternate universe where he (and not Kevin Costner) played Crash Davis (16:00), the big chance to play Elvis on ABC (23:00), Snake Plissken's motivations in 'Escape From New York' (29:00), shooting 'Silkwood' with Meryl Streep and Cher (36:00), meeting Goldie Hawn (41:00), experiencing tabloid culture as a celebrity couple (48:00), Robin Williams's incessant joke-telling (53:00), working with Sly Stallone (58:00), Val Kilmer's on-set antics (1:04:00), bringing Herb Brooks to life in 'Miracle' (1:10:00), and his love of wine (1:16:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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And one reminder, I am on the Ringer NBA show podcast with Chris Furnan. End of this week to break down the first round of the 2017 NBA playoffs. You will not be getting basketball talk on this last podcast before the playoffs because you're getting Kurt Russell. And by the way, I wrote an MVP column that's up on theringer.com. So if you haven't seen that yet, check it out. And that's it.

Bring us in, Pearl Jam. All right, I'm here with Kurt Russell. Warning, there's probably going to be some snake puss can talk in this one. But you're in Fast 8. I thought you died in Fast 7 or you were close to dying. Well, it was a question as to whether or not I was. And we kind of wrote it that way, which is there's a helicopter on the way, and they decided to have the helicopter get there in time to save his life. You recovered from your injuries.

You did it. Yeah. Well, he's always sort of three steps ahead of the game, this Mr. Nobody character. And you don't know where his money comes from. You don't know what side he's on. You don't know what his history is. You don't know where his money comes from. You don't know what side he's on. You don't know what his history is. You don't know anything about him. I mean, Vin's character takes a real leap of faith with him in Seven

because he doesn't know who he is. Yeah. And none of the people ever know his name. They don't know exactly who this guy is, but he's obviously connected to something. And so far, so good. So far, he seems to be a positive positive influence yeah so when they tell you you're playing this character and they're like there's basically there's no background you just

kind of have to figure it out that wasn't written that way yeah um to be honest with you uh i was really impressed that uh when they talked to me about doing it and however that came about i'm i don't really don't know but um uh i i i said gee you know it'd be fun to kind of get in here and and have some fun but if you're going to do that let's let's make the guy interesting and uh i don't think a first lieutenant of a special ops guy showing up is really you know okay right whatever but i said let's make him a mystery character and let's put that on the shoulders of this character so that the other characters in the franchise

have to deal with, who is this guy? Where does he come from? And Vin's character has, Dominic Toretto doesn't really know, but he does take a bit of a leap of faith because he needs to, and some of him needs to, and he has his own gut feelings and stuff but by making him a character i said literally i think he should be called mr nobody

i'm not mr i said he's just nobody when he's introduced in the first one he just says who are you and he says i'm nothing i'm nobody and he's sort of developed into this mr you know he has a mr quality to him so i guess he becomes mr nobody right but But you don't know. And I think that adds to an interest of him and with him in an entertaining way. It's a movie that doesn't really need to be promoted because it's probably the most reliable franchise we have right now other than Star Wars. Through all your years of doing different movies, is there a right way to promote a movie? Is there a magic formula? That's a very interesting question. That's a really good question.

I'm of mixed feelings about it. I've done both, where you go out and promote it to the world, promote it to death. I've done it many times. I've done it in my past, probably to my own detriment, to where I just didn't do anything. Mike Nichols and I had a conversation one time about that. He was talking about the freshman.

What was his? The graduate. Graduate. And he said, you know, there was nothing about that movie. Mike Nichols was not someone the world knew or anybody knew outside of New York, really, in Los Angeles. Dustin Hoffman was brand new, etc. And he said there was absolutely no publicity about it. There was a screening, I think, a couple of nights before the movie was going to open,

and he came to the screening, and they were lined around the block. How did they know? That movie needed—it was going to literally live off the word of mouth. Now, granted, it's a different time, but you're always dealing with white noise and trying to rise above it. There are many different ways to do it. If you have a great, great, great movie that everybody just loves, somehow it comes out of that projection room, and the word starts to get out there. And then there are other movies you can promote them until the cows come home, and as Mike said, nobody wants to see it.

They just don't want to see it. So having done it both ways, I think that what you do is you kind of hope that the one that the studio is choosing is the one that works. And they have to do their best. I do think that that has changed a lot in the last 30 years in that I think it's very difficult now because I think they're all gone. All the guys who were artists at and in the marketing world at knowing how to promote a good movie. Now they know how to promote an event. It's very difficult for them to promote a good movie and get as much response to it as it deserves. And so they've painted themselves into an interesting corner now, I think.

But we always seem to find a way out. Yeah, event movies, comic book movies, franchise But we always seem to find a way out. Yeah, event movies, comic book movies, franchise movies, those seem to be able to promote themselves. Well, they don't, though. They have millions and millions and millions of dollars. If you put millions and millions and millions of dollars into, I don't know, Moonlight, would you have a movie that goes out there and does $400 million or $500 million? No. Because it's really good? I don't know. Again, it Would you have a movie that goes out there and does $400 or $500 million?

No. Because it's really good? I don't know. Again, it goes back to what Nichols was saying. They're either going to go or they're not. And then there's a George Lucas theory, the binary theory of filmmaking, which I also happen to believe in,

which is the minute they hear the title, understand what it's about and who's in it, they're either going or they ain't. Did you follow what happened with Get Out like two months ago? I thought that was a really effective marketing strategy. Yeah. Well, I don't know if it was a strategy or if it was just what they had to do. Yeah.

But the movie found its way. Now, I've done- But it was a good movie. That really helps. Yeah. That's the point. I've been involved with movies that were movies that eventually, because they heard about it, they wanted to see. Yeah. Only in my case, thank God for CDs and videotape and all that that came in.

Because if it didn't catch when it first came out, things like Big Trouble in Little China, The Thing, Escape from New York was fairly well. It was just a small release. So there was just nowhere to go with it. Tombstone, I mean, I can go on. Overboard, I've done probably 10 movies that had it not been for the afterlife, they wouldn't have seen the light of day. I want to talk about all those movies. I want to try something a little different with you.

I don't think I've ever done this on a podcast. I wanted to go through your IMDb. You said you've never done this before? I've never done this before. I've done a lot of podcasts, too. I've never done this before. Let. You said you've never done this before? I've never done this before. I've done a lot of podcasts too. I've never done this before. Let's do something you've never done before. I like that.

But going way, way back, because I'm a child of the mid-70s when all we had on was Gilligan's Island and Brady Bunch, and you were Jungle Boy on Gilligan's Island. Yeah. How old were you as Jungle Boy? I was 13. So you're one

of the rare cases of the child actor who actually became the successful adult actor and didn't go crazy. A lot of reasons for that. Um, because I think a lot of them just found another life that they preferred, you know, I think that, you know, they were, some of them were really good actors and they just decided to do something else. Others were more effective and perhaps best effective as a child actor. And then as they grew and changed, that became something that didn't work as well. I just never looked at it one way or the other. I just always looked at it as playing a part. I was a guy playing a part.

I never felt like I was a kid playing a part. Right. I didn't compare it that way. Do you understand some of the uh dangers of when somebody becomes famous or well known as a child actor and then it seems like it derails them a lot of times oh i understand it well yeah so what were the biggest dangers for you through it i've watched it i've lived it let's hear about it what were the big dangers my well the dangers have been documented i mean that have happened to many many of those young actors. It just

wasn't my future. It just wasn't where I was going. It wasn't what I was interested in. I wasn't interested in it for a lot of the reasons that I think perhaps made life difficult for some of those people. But it's not that I didn't experience the same pressures, the same realizations, the same difficulties. I just kind of dealt with it differently. Rode the waves. What do you remember about Goguen's Island? I didn't ride the waves. That reminds me of a thing.

I met a guy one time. There was a phrase one time, which was go with the flow. Yeah. That was just not me. I was never a go with the flow guy, no matter whether it was hip or not. And so, like I said, sometimes to my detriment, but it just wasn't my look at life I was doing other things too you know I had other interests and baseball was one of them and it was I was serious about that so I took that to the professional level and was injured out of the game after three years.

What position were you? Second baseman and And, you know, that was what I was spending the most and great part of my life working on because that's a season, and that's a continuous, you must quickly and continuously improve to be able to rise up the ladder, and that's a black and white game. How many runs did you knock in that year? How many big runs?

How many times did you pop up with a man on third base and nobody out or one out and not move the runner home? How many errors did you make? How many games did you cost us? What was your impact? Were you an impact player or were you just one of the guys in the club that kind of, mm-hmm? Did you play on winning teams?

Did you help? It's all that stuff. It's black and white. You can look at stats and say, that guy's good. This is not that business. This is a, what? It's a subjective look at your opinion of something, and it's entirely different.

One is a, you know, you can get into the weeds about it. One is a creative business where you go to work every day and you create something tangible out of thin air. The other one is tangible, period. Right. And the audience reaction is immediate. Strike three. Boo.

Base hit. Knock the run in. Yay. Feels good. Feels bad. You learn to pace yourself. Taking some of that knowledge into this business, which my dad did both. My dad was a professional ball player and he was an actor.

And we had conversations about that. And, you know, just sort of osmotically, I think I received a lot from my dad and other men around him in the world of baseball and in acting and sort of made my own way. What was the injury in baseball? Rotatorator cuff. Ah. Leading the Texas League at the time. Were you really? Yeah. Texas League, so that's up there. Yeah, good league. I was going to be going to Salt Lake in a week. And at the time, the second baseman for the Angels was hitting, I think, 138 or something.

So I was headed there. But again, people ask me all the time, you think you could have played in the big league? Well, of course you can play there. Anybody, you could have played in the big league. I don't even know if you could have played. Yeah, you could. It's whether or not you could succeed is the question that can only be answered by playing 14, 15 years, you know, again, without injury. Cause you'd even, you know, you might have three, four good years and then they begin to figure you out and, and you don't begin to figure them out and you're going downhill and you're out of the game you have to continually in that game uh figure out how you have to find a way so wait so what kind of second baseman were you were you like the power

and i was a bad amper were you a speed guy what were you no i had um i had a little better than average speed but i was uh i was a good infielder. Went to my left very well. Went to my right okay, but I turned a double play with anybody. Yeah. And I was, you know, my career average in pro ball was 293, and I was, before that, you know, I'd always hit well. I was a switch hitter. I could do a lot of things.

I could move runners. I was good at hitting the ball the opposite field. I was a real student of the game. My dad was a real student of the game yeah and I grew up with that and I was also a student of a man named Hank Robinson who was a a great again in an osmotic way great guy to emulate in terms of hitting and understand hitting and feel like a hitter and begin to understand the things about yourself whereas my dad was also someone who made me keep books on or taught me to keep books on pitchers and understand who they are and begin to find out who the man is and what he wants to go to in a certain situation. And then, of course, he's doing the same thing on you.

It's a real psychological game, psychological war. And, you know, all the players, for the most part, once you get to a higher level, they're all pretty good, you know. Quick break to talk about Lyft. Looking for a ride share option that will get you there safely with a smile on your face? With Lyft, you can get a ride in minutes for less than the cost of a cab. Every Lyft driver is fully vetted through their 10-point safety standard, including

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You get three free rides for up to $10 each. L-Y-F-T. Try it out today. Lyft. Back to Kurt Russell. I don't understand why you weren't in a baseball movie. They like a hundred baseball movies yeah they're all bad except for a few there was one that i was gonna do and it's actually kind of an interesting fun story ronnie shelton and i were together uh working on a different movie yeah uh i forget that it was uh

best of times i think it was and. And, which Ronnie had written. Yeah. And at one point he said, you know, we should do the baseball movie. It's never really been written, the one that we would like. And I said, yeah. And he said, what do you think that is? And I remember saying, because it's always written from the fan's point of view. It's always written by a writer who was a fan of the game.

It's not written by a guy who played the game, and that's probably why. And I said, I think the point of view should literally, and we both agreed because we were saying it at the same time, should be from the point of view of a woman. You've got to understand that baseball, especially in those days, I think it's changed a little, but at heart, baseball players are still the same. We would prefer to play in front of a full crowd of all women. We don't care if there's any men in the stands. It was of no interest that there were men in the stands. It was only that, who's that girl in the third row?

In the on-deck circle, you and the guy in the hole are talking about important things in life. Like, who is this? Do you see that blonde over there? And it had to be told from the point of view of that person, that view. And I thought Ronnie did a great job of locking into that and finding that. So anyway, make a longer story, fun story short, Kevin Costner ended up doing that movie because he could get a better deal with Costner at the time than he could with me at different studios and whatnot.

So you could have been Crash Davis. Well, a lot of that's my life story. As Ronnie put it, what do I do? I said, go make the movie and die. I say that as we remain great friends. And we got to do a movie that I really love doing with Ronnie called Dark Blue. And it's one of my favorite experiences as an actor. And Ronnie's a terrific writer.

It would have been nice to be Crash Davis, though. Yeah, I think so. I very, very rarely have written. It's a great speech in that movie. Oh, you mean the cock high fastball? Thank you. Yeah. Well, no, there's another speech, which is, you know,

the toughest thing a manager has to do is let a ball go. And that was how I answered my phone call to Ronnie when I was going to have the conversation about what happened here yeah um but no uh i forgot i was going to say there about ronnie but i'm a fan and i think he's uh has done some great stuff and terrific stuff and i'm just really glad we got the opportunity to work together he's been a good friend of mine for a long time and anyway there's only a few as far as i'm concerned um baseball movies that are really in any way, shape, or form connecting to the real thing. And even that one's got a little bit of a slap shot aspect to it.

It's a little more of a rom-com. I've never seen – I don't think there's ever been a movie, as far as I'm concerned, that is centered around a ballplayer that is a drama that you really get involved in. That's not just the fun, boyish aspect of what's great about the game of baseball and how it connects to Americans. What did you think of For Love of the Game? Because I think that tried to do a lot of what you're talking about. Yeah, I liked For Love of the Game. I don't remember seeing it a lot. I don't know if I've seen it from the top.

Was that the perfect game? Costner, perfect game. Costner, perfect game. got lost in like this whole rom-com side of it yeah the baseball stuff was much better again you know it's it that's you know that's it's good I remember reading it watching it and it's good oh what I was going to say I know what I was going to say I don't want to say it I've never written fan letters and anything but after and I was really you know I was I didn't really care if they did succeed it or not once I was going to do it because it hurt a little bit because it was a lot of my life.

Yeah. And I went to watch the movie the day it came out and I wrote Costner and Ronnie Shelton the fan letter and said, way to go guys.

You did great. You really did great. Because I was impressed with what Kevin was able to do. Had I played it, would it have been different? Yeah. And so,

you always, you know, ifs, ands, and Peter Paneter pans who cares field of dreams yes or no it's it's it's like the natural i liked it i like it for its uh i like it for what it's about you know it's a dream i love the natural it's a thing and and and i get what's really touching about it as a ball player it's not touching on the things i'm they that resonate with you yeah that resonate with me as i love to see major league i love to see it no that's just a clown show so that's fun i mean it's fun look it's fun but you again it's that's written i think you gotta write the movie you gotta do it well that's you know yeah mean, there's that possibility.

But now I'm long from being that interested in the game, you know. Listen, if Redford can play The Natural at age 55 or whatever it was, I think you can be a long- That answers the question. I'm a Robert Redford fan, but don't give me a- I think he was 46, actually. I looked into it and I was like- He was 46?

You know, but it's sweet. Wonder Boy was a cool- That's a cool- It's a Sandlot approach. It's like what's- It's what's dreamy about it. I was like, who's 46? You know, but it's sweet. Wonder, Wonderboy was a cool, that's a, that's a cool, it's a Sandlot approach. It's like, what's, it's what's dreamy about it. It's not, it's not the, the perils and the reality of the difficulty of the psychology of a human being who has one way out. And that is baseball. That's with a bat, a glove and and a ball, can you get to a level of living a life that you want to through those instruments? For me, because I lived it, it was a compelling thing.

It wasn't a clown show for me. And for me, it was interesting because wherever I went as a young ballplayer, to the fans who didn't know anything, Southern California, everybody knew. All the ballplayers know each other. And if you're going to play pro ball, you're going to go through Southern California at some point. So I knew about all the ballplayers, and the ballplayers knew me. But the fans that I went to, the visiting ballparks, they only knew me as an actor, a Disney actor. It was like, what is this what

what is this so it was kind of always fun for me and some of my ballplayer friends because they said well they're gonna find out this guy can hit right and um anyway that's what about what if you're a retired pitcher who decides to get back in just takes a ton of HGH to try to have one more season. That's not the way to do it. No? I worked at one time fairly closely with the guy who did come back late in age, and it's not HGH. There's only one pitch you're

going to do that with. Knuckleball. That's it. Jim Boughton came back with a knuckleball. What if you're a retired knuckleballer? Knuckleballers are never retired. If they throw the good knuckleball on the day, you ain't going to hit it, bud. I mean, that's just the way it is. But Bouton came to the Portland Mavericks, which was a club that my dad and I owned. But that was the Bob Forrest sequel, right?

Well, no. Have you ever seen Batter Bastards of Baseball? Yeah. Okay, so Bouton was with that club, and he was starting his comeback, and my dad gave him his chance, as it were, a place to go to get started again. And I caught him quite a bit when he was working. I had a pretty good knuckleball myself, so we kind of talked about it. His knuckleball really could move.

And when he had control of it, and he had – I think when he made it back to the big league, I believe it was with the Giants, and I think he went four and two. And he was, I don't know how old he was. Well, the Necro brothers were in their mid-40s. Yeah, I mean, if you can throw in 200 innings. Tim Wakefield, I mean, you can go through the list. So Elvis was your big break, you think? The TV movie?

I remember watching that as a kid. It was my big chance. Your big break is always your first job. Yeah. Which in my case was R. Mann Higgins. I don't remember where it was. So your big chance. But your big, my big, then I had a chance at Disney, you know, when I got, went over

there to do Follow Me Boys. That was a motion picture break. And working with Elvis Presley in, it happened at the World's Fair when I was just 10 years old. That was an opportunity. And then playing him. Was he still alive when you were filming it or no? No, it was written when he was still alive. Yeah.

But he died. And so it added a degree of difficulty to it because there was this sense of, gee, it's only been 18 months since Elvis died and they're already doing this. You know, that's sort of the way things were at that time. You didn't jump on that. It was bad form, but they're already doing this. That's sort of the way things were at that time. You didn't jump on that. It was bad form, but this was already in motion. But it was

stepping out so far. There's a really nice man, an actor, Treat Williams, very good actor. He and I were kind of some of the guys that were one of the three or four or two down to the last who's it going to be. And I remember Treet one time, he said, if you get this, are you going to actually do it?

And I said, what do you mean? He said, I said, what about you? He said, I don't know. And I said, why? What do you mean? He said, come on. It's like, you know, I don't know. It's playing Elvis.

I mean, this is like. Elvis was the biggest star. Yeah, I never thought of that. I just thought, well, it's just a job. It's just, you know, I don't know, let's be playing Elvis. I mean, this is like, Elvis. Yeah. It was like, I said, yeah, I never thought of that. I just thought, well, it's just, it's just a job. It's just, you know, um, but I had confidence in doing it and I'd actually kind of fooled around, you know, in my life. I, I, but I fooled around my life, imitating, thinking about Elvis, doing it with some on the, on the bus with ballplayers. But when you're going to do it seriously, it's a whole different thing. But I did have my experience working with him

for a couple of weeks to draw on, which had happened 17 years earlier. But that was primarily what I got to draw from. And then I had a lot of material given to me to be able to look at, because I didn't know much about Ellis Presley. Didn't, I didn't know a whole lot about him. Did you lip sync or did you actually sing?

Lip sync. And it made it more difficult because I thought I was going to sing. So I'm rehearsing these songs and getting them ready. And then about a week or two before we started shooting, in comes – they never, ever thought of me singing and doing it. And I was – because I – you know, and I was learning it from Elvis' songs. Yeah.

So I was – then I was learning to lip sync to Elvis, as it were, but I was going to maybe do the voice. We didn't know. And then they decided to go with, oh, it's terrible. I can't remember. Ronnie, yeah, it's terrible to not know the man's name. He was such a really good singer and also had the ability to imitate Elvis. But it was slightly different. And I realized then that I had to kind of sell Elvis a little more

because it wasn't his. You just saw the charisma. It just was different. I mean, it's not the original. The scowl, all that stuff. It's not the original. Well, you don't do that. You can't do that.

The faces? No. No, that's not the way to go about it. Bill, you don't want to do that. That's just not the wrong approach. That's the wrong approach. Tell me what you do. You understand the human being.

Okay. If I'm going to play you, I'm going to find out things about you. I'm watching the way you sit, the way you think. I'm sitting back. I'm sitting back comfortably right now. I'm sitting back. You and I are kind of different people that way. You're comfortable, but you're forward.

I want to say, if I'm going to play you, I'm not going to play you like I'm doing right now. Yeah. Well, now you're doing me. That's you playing me. But I'm just telling you how I would do it, which is you get to understand the human being. And what I learned about Elvis was that Elvis, in a way, learned to play Elvis Presley. He wasn't that. And when you see him early in his life,

he's quite different than he became five, six, seven years later. Did you have to gain a lot of weight for the last stage Elvis? No, we didn't do that. It was... Pull a De Niro? It was before that.

Ours finished in 69 when he came back in Vegas. And he was going to go back on and he was very nervous about it and very unsure of what was going to happen. I remember loving it. I don't think it's been on. Sometimes these things come back. I can't remember the last time it's been even on.

Sometimes they just disappear into the, you know, that was a good one. Yeah, that was a good one. Let's take a break to talk about Delta airlines. It's no secret that traveling can be stressful, especially if you have one or more small kids.

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than ever before. Download the free Delta app on your iphone ipad or android today i don't have to tell myself because i already have it all right back to kurt russell escape from new york one of my all-time favorites john carpenter great who also directed halloween which is another one of my all-time favorites i was predisposed to like this movie. An unbelievable premise. Although, in retrospect, it was 16 years later, New York City has been turned into a maximum security

prison. And now it's like 36 years later. Maybe they should have put that in 2050. I thought it was a great idea, too. It was unbelievable. One of the best ideas of any action movie. And I had. It was unbelievable. One of the best ideas of any action movie. Yeah.

And I had, it was, you know, but the fact that John Carpenter stuck to his guns and wanted to cast me at that time, at that age, with what I'd done in the past. Yeah. That was another continuing wonderful opportunity and break for me. Yeah. And very few directors would have looked at me and said, I want him to play this part. Because the part itself was quite different from any character like that at the time. He wasn't a great guy.

Well, that's the time. He wasn't a great guy. Well, that's the thing. All the movies with the, let's say the 40-year-old stalwarts of those kinds of, of a movie where a guy's going to get revenge or a movie's going to, but that was the point. I'm trying to jump the gun there. All those characters had social redeeming values.

Either their wives had been raped and burned in a Western, their family had been run over by, you know, the mafia had come in. Whatever the situation was, the lead guy had a reason that we knew of to go wreak havoc or to go do what he's going to do and not be very happy about it or not whatever.

This one didn't have that. This was a guy who was, something had happened to him. He was a war hero., something had happened to him. He was a war hero and something had happened to him. Who lost his way. No, he didn't lose his way, he found his way. When you're a psychopath and you don't know it, it's wonderful to find your way. And he just became a one man, I don't give a shit wrecking crew who wasn't, and what's interesting about the movie is he's not a wrecking crew. He's just, he's very, it's a very quiet movie.

People have a tendency to hear about Escape from New York, then see it and kind of go, oh, wow, that's kind of really different than I imagined from what I've heard. It's not an action movie. No. It's a movie about a guy who is there because he's got those things in his neck. Otherwise, he wouldn't be there, president or not. My favorite line in that movie is, president of what? He just doesn't care. He just doesn't care. If you get deeper and deeper into Snake Plissken, which is, they're

talking about doing sequels and things like that to it. You have to understand some things about Snake Plissken, I think, that are very important. First of all, he's American. There's a reason he's in that ring with a baseball bat with nails in it yeah because i'm playing him i'm pretty good with that bat in my hand yeah he was an american yeah he's not an international guy he's not james bond he's the negative james bond uh he's american that's that's a very important thing and the other thing is is that you know to get into him, and if you watch the movie and you see it, he's an escape artist. And the only thing he can't escape is himself.

And that's the thing that makes him the way he is. Yeah. So anybody who's going to do the, what he's going to do in the future should, I think, look at that and begin to understand that about that character. And you have to have a certain sense of humor, I think, to find the balance that makes him work for the audience. It's a Netflix series if it comes back. I think it's like 13 episodes.

Yeah, I don't know. We're in New York in a maximum security. I like to make remakes because they are flawed. Either they're flawed in casting or they're flawed in the screenplay. Yeah. are flawed. Either they're flawed in casting or they're flawed in the screenplay. When it's not, when you don't have that, you face an uphill battle. In doing

anything that you're going to do that John Carpenter did, you're facing a different battle. John Carpenter has a look at life that is just different from anybody else's. It's what gives him, I think, his great talent. My rule on remakes is if I can still watch it and I still enjoy the hell out of it, don't remake it.

Well, there's nothing sacred. I mean, John and I did the thing. I think Plissken's a little bit sacred. Well, yeah, I know what you mean. Because people feel that way. I wouldn't enjoy it unless... People feel that way. Or at best, or at worst, I become Sean Connery,

who is James Bond. I don't care. I mean, I know a lot of the guys that play. They're all really good. But Sean Connery is James Bond. That's just the way it is. So leave it alone. But I'm kind of that way.

But it's like John and I did The Thing, which is a remake. But John didn't do The Thing that was made as a movie. He did the book Who Goes There? they use the title of the thing and a movie. The thing is a movie that's connected to nuclear, the future potential of nuclear power and what's, what's going to fall on your head from above what's going to come to earth. The thing was a move. John Carpenter's the thing is a movie that, as he said to me,

I said, what's this movie about, John? He said, Paranoia. And I said, oh, great. Oh, that's cool. That's cool. A seven-foot carrot maybe was cool in the 50s, I don't know. And that's a great, Howard Hawks made a great movie. It's a classic

horror film. I like the sort of more thriller aspect or the psychological aspect of of paranoia and if you put 12 people 12 men in a in mcmurdo station in the antarctic and you give them this particular problem i i i like watching the human being the the decay you know the decomposition of everything happening through your own, and finally to the point where you don't know yourself if you're you. What if we're already all,

what if this happened and we're already just imitations of our ancestry? I love that kind of what if stuff. Did Snake you had to wear an eye patch the whole time? Snake, to me, was a guy who had been injured. I also wanted to, and John was great this way,

I said, I think he should wear an eye patch. And John immediately went, yeah, nobody's wearing an eye patch. It's John Wayne and Drew Grinnell. I like that idea. Why? I said, I don't know. It's just something about, I think that he's got an injury that he will physically, visually carry with him.

And if you look at my snake, he's always slightly in pain. It's something like something happened to his eye that wasn't quite fixed. And it's a constant... He's trying to constantly look past it. Yeah. Or it has abilities that we don't know about. Oh, that's... Because it was a futuristic picture yeah so maybe he's going to lift that eye patch at some time and shoot you with it something who knows you know the biggest flaw with that movie as much as i love donald pleasance and he was the

rock of halloween the american president with the foreign accent yeah well that was the no that's intentional what was intentional about it? It's the future. It's the future. Yeah, think about it. Even the future, the president doesn't come from here. That's a concern, and you got it. Silkwood, you're with Meryl Streep, the most successful actress of all time and the greatest. Yeah.

What do you remember about that one? Well, what I remember was, you know, meeting Mike Nichols. And he was great. Mike, when I met him, I was doing a play. I was, you know, making a career move doing a play in Los Angeles. I wasn't a stage actor, so I'd never done one. So I was going to do. And out of that came an interview with Mike Nichols to do this movie that he was going to be coming back after seven years of not having made any movies.

Meryl Streep was going to play that part, and Cher was cast. She was going to be Meryl. I'm pretty sure that was the case. They were casting the guy who's kind of with both of them as friends and lovers and that kind of thing. And I went to meet Mike and I knew who Mike Nichols was. I'd loved The Graduate and I loved Catch-22. And this would be interesting to talk about that stuff.

And he sits down and he says right away, he said, now, what would I know you from? Now, I was 32 years old. I'd starred in a lot of movies. I'd been around for, already I'd been around for what? I started when I was, I'd been around for 22 years. But it struck me as very simple. If you haven't seen me, you wouldn't know me from anything. So I said, nothing. What would you know me from? Nothing. I mean, that's clearly, that's clearly the answer. The answer, the reality is you wouldn't know me. If you don't know me, you wouldn't know me from, you don't, you've just said you don't know me you wouldn't know me from you just said you don't know me

and he went okay he said do you want to read and I said well I don't want to but you know I hate reading

I said when you cold read you just read yourself out of stuff so I said but if you want to read I'm here let's read

and he went nah I guess not no no and we talked for a few minutes and he said great

nice meeting you and I thought okay you know and that was that. And very quickly, Mike Nichols wanted me to do the movie. So I was going to do the movie. And then about, I don't know, maybe a month and a half into it,

somebody asked him, because it wasn't me, you know, why did you, why was Kurt your choice here? Because at that time I was still the kind of actor that people were going, why is Kurt Russell working with Michael Nichols? Share? I get Meryl Streep, I get that, but it was a mix that he was looking for.

And he said, oh, it's really simple. He said, when I first met Kurt, I asked him one question and he answered it honestly. He said, and I needed someone who the audience knew was absolutely 100% telling the truth, always. And I said, what was the question? He said, I asked you, what would I know you from? And you said, nothing. I said, so I had my guy. He said, yep, I'll tell you the truth. That's what you're going to get. So that was what you're gonna get so that was what he wanted to see in that character

and also someone who would portray a guy who was honestly in love with Meryl Streep's character and could make you feel that yeah she had a man who loved her very much and found her

sexy and beautiful and all that it was great working with Meryl too and Cher and found her sexy and beautiful and all that. It was great working with Meryl, too, and Cher. We had a ball. We all lived in close proximity, and it was just a wonderful experience, a great time. It always felt like we were just sort of on the set living together and off the set living together.

It was a real communal feeling. We were all young and enjoying, just enjoying each other's company a lot. They had children. I had a really fun time with some of the children that were around at that time. Cher's and Meryl's

and Don's children. Meryl and don and and i became friends friends on that movie and have we remained somewhat in contact with each other for the rest of our lives and wonderful people they're great she's a great person and so is don and shares a great a great interesting gal um it really just was a but mike was you know the leader of the leader of the little family that we yeah that we were having and it was a just a really wonderful experience and i thought really an effective movie one more break to talk about sonos one of our old friends here on the bs podcast if you want to experience tv movies and musics with music or musics musics

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everything sounds better on playbase see for yourself go to sonos.com and you can learn more once again look for playbase and go to sonos.com back to kurt russell swing shift is that where you meet goldie what's interesting about that was goldie hahn was now going to do this movie and i was living in colorado so i was coming in going to come in to meet the director and i thought well i'm going to come all the way from colorado meet the director that's great that i'm you know being considered for the male lead in in this goldie hahn movie but goal is Goldie going to be there? No. She's not going to be able to make it. I said, well, what's the point of me coming to meet the director

if I'm going to eventually have to meet Goldie Hawn? Because if it's a Goldie Hawn movie, I'm sure she's going to have to say yes. So they agreed with that and came in and kind of met. The reason I thought it was really interesting for me again young actor not youngish but young actor at that time I had just worked with the best and top of the line

dramatic actress in the world playing her paramour and now that was the opportunity to immediately do something quite different with the number one comedian who was Goldie Hawn, who had the title for that was like year 10 of having that title, too. Yeah. And and and she was producing the movie as well. Yeah. She was, you know, Goldie was, you know, yeah, very different in that in how far ahead of the game she was.

She was doing things no other women were doing. And getting that opportunity, I thought, was regardless of what it is almost. It's like, let's go do this. You want to work with Meryl Streep. You want to work with Goldie Hawn. This is a good thing to do. And I met Goldie for the first time, really. I married Susan Hubley off of meeting Susan when we did Elvis together. And I'd always been a Susan Hubley fan.

I'd seen her in some television shows. I just thought she was adorable. She was great. And we divorced less than two and a half years later or three years or something. And that was one of those things where, as a young man, I sort of said in the back of my head, well, okay, actresses and you are not a good idea. That's just not a good idea. Whatever your part is in it, Kurt, you're responsible for that.

Yeah. So take responsibility. Stay away. Just realize something about yourself that you don't see. you're responsible for that. Yeah. So take responsibility. Stay away. Just realize something about yourself that you don't see. And then I met Goldie, and for the first time ever, I'd never asked. I can't remember asking an actress out on a date.

I mean, I'd spent time with actresses, but I don't remember saying, you know, let's go here or whatever. But I remember shortly after, the first thing I said when I walked through the door to meet Goldie, and I was terribly hungover because I was with my dad. I had just received, I think, my divorce papers or something the night before, and I'd been with my dad at the bar until like 4 in the morning, had this early 9 o'clock meeting. So I got up early to get down there and make sure I was there and just get on the couch and fall asleep. And I told the secretary, I'm here when Goldie's ready. And she said, you're early.

I said, yeah, I'm here. Look, just wake me up and I'll go in there. Can I have some coffee? Yeah, it was really rough. I mean, I'd been drinking heavy before with my dad. We were going over things. And I just remember walking in the door. I opened the door and I walked in and here was this.

Now, I know who Goldie Hawn is, but I'm not a Goldie Hawn fanatic. I don't know everything she's done. I'd seen her once. One of my cousins had actually worked as an assistant director with her. And my best friend, Jimmy Van Wyk, that was Jack Philbrick, my best friend at the time. One of my two best friends, Larry Franco and Jimmy Van Wyk, who were both in the business and I was very closely connected to, had worked with her.

And they loved her. They just thought she was great. You know, she was a great person and loved her. Anyway, that was pretty much what I knew about Goldie. And I'd seen Laugh-In. I was not a gigantic La-in watcher. But Goldie and I had worked together in 1966 on the one and only genuine original family band at Walt Disney Studios. It was her first movie.

She was a dancer. Now, I knew of that, but I didn't, you know, she didn't either. She or I remember that specifically. I mean, we saw each other and we were, I was 15, 16, and she was like, I don't know, late teens, 20. And so now I'm meeting her really for the first time in 1982. And the door opened and she's standing, she had jeans on and suspenders and a tank top, you and i i just i it literally came out of my mouth wow you've got

a great figure i i have never thought of goldie hawn in a in a in that way you know in like you're built man yeah you look good and i and i literally caught my see instead of her going get the fuck out of here i don't know who you think you are. She kind of went, well, thank you. Oh, that's it. Now you know. She went, well, thank you. And I said, yeah, I just, sorry. She said, well, let's talk about the movie.

I said, yeah. And I watched her put one hat, I take one hat off and put another hat on, and I was immediately impressed. And we talked about it, and I wasn't having any trouble like with my hangover I was just having a great fun immediate conversation with this this beautifully figured really cute and increasingly

fascinating girl who was calling the shots and I didn't know where anything was with this and again I've just been that actor I didn't you know look what's going to happen is going to happen i didn't know where anything was with this and again i i just been that actor i didn't you know look what's going to happen is going to happen i didn't much care i i you you you can want something whatever you can go through your life wanting anything guys you know if it's meant to happen and you're meant to do it and it's going to happen or not and that was my that was my

point of view with it and um anyway she she decided that this was the one she thought was right for the movie. We then met again later with Jonathan Demme, who was young in his career. Wow. Became a spectacular director. You cut some good ones early. Yeah, I did. Yeah. And anyway, very quickly, though, when I met Goldie, I didn't.

The movie was the movie, but I very quickly was like, Hey, you know, that thing in the back of your head about actresses, fuck that. What's the, what's the deal with you? It was like the first day I went to work, I had to do this whole number with a horn and I'd learned it for two weeks. And all I could think about was, you know, we may have to dance in this thing and I really need to, I don't want to look bad. I want to look right. I know she's a dancer and she can probably help me but I need we need to go like get to some of that music and I said to her that day all you think about was that I was like hey you know we need to do this and she said let's do it and uh I think it was a Friday night it was a Friday night was that

was I went to work on a Wednesday I went went to work on a wednesday we worked we worked wednesday and thursday on the the musical stuff in the scene and we worked friday and friday night we we went out to go find a place i had to you know find the place i'm not a good date guy so i was like how do you how do you even do that yeah so i finally uh found it was the playboy club and uh you know uh did the playboy went to the playboy club to do the dancing sat down about two and a half hours later walked out never got up once

there was no dancing there I'd blown that and I didn't care neither did she and two and a half hours later we were on our way to 34 years

what's so that was a at the time a huge celebrity couple during the era when celebrity couples start coming actually it wasn't no it wasn't why do you say that it wasn a huge celebrity couple during the era when celebrity couples start coming.

No, it wasn't. Why do you say that? It wasn't. Goldie Hawn was a huge celebrity. I was a well-known actor who had been around. And I was not Warren Beatty. I was not Jack Nicholson. That's fair.

But it was still two named people dating. No, no, no. When you're not that guy and the Hollywood zeitgeist kind of wants that to be there, it wasn't an immediate acceptance. It was interesting. And then it quickly became, oh, wow. And at that point, my career began to be going on a different trajectory. And then that fit. But yes, over the next long period of time, yeah, we became- Paparazzi immediately? Yeah. And then that fit. But yes, over the next long period of time, yeah, we became. Paparazzi immediately? Yeah.

Your life changed? Yeah. Well, I always had a good way of being able to kind of move around. You can't do that with Goldie Hawn. Yeah. You know, it's just not. And then those days. Especially in 1984.

It was immediate. Yeah. And then it became, then i became more well-known myself and and um you know it became increasingly um the situation uh and it was just always we just it was in the beginning it was tough for me because it was like wait a minute i don't know if i want to sign on for this but it didn't matter because if you're in love you're going to figure out a way to deal with it you better figure out when did you hit the stage where you're reading stuff in magazines or whatever that just is completely not true?

Oh, that's happened since I was 10. Why that? The press never tells the truth. They're not interested in the truth. They're interested in what they want to say. It's just the way it is. Sometimes it can be good for you. Sometimes it can be bad for you.

Sometimes, you know, and what happens is sometimes you just look at it in amazement and go. Of course, my favorite thing about that is, and I'm going to just, I'm just going to pick a name here when I get to it. It's not going to be connected or true or anything like that. All right. But this is my theory on that. Because it's, I have to look to myself, like look in the mirror. I remember going to the, you know, you read stuff about yourself, and you go, you've got to be kidding me.

Where did that come from? How could they even dream that one up? I mean, what, you know, that's amazing. Yeah. And I became very well known for just saying, yeah, yeah, yeah, I did that. Yeah, that was me, yeah. I just said, I'm going to say yes to everything, and they'll let you guys parcel it out because none of it's true,

so it doesn't make any difference to me or those close to me. That's just not what happened. That's just I don't even know that person or that situation. I wasn't even in the country at that time, whatever it was. And so you know it's completely insane, and I always kind of think it's kind of funny. Yeah. And then at other times it's not.

It's kind of aggravating, but you just go, whatever. But I'm that person who goes to the grocery store, local grocery store, and then there's the whatever, the National Enquirer, the Star, the Globe, or whatever it is. They're all right there, right? And you're waiting in line because you've got three packs of cigarettes and an apple, right? And so you're waiting in line for the woman who's got the three babies and all the, you know, baby diapers she's got to get through.

So you've got nothing to do, and you're reading, and I open it up. And now I've read so many things about myself or people that I know that are just completely insane, right? But I'm the guy who goes there, open it up, and you're flipping around, and you go, oh, oh, that's kind of crazy. Gee, John Travolta. Yeah, you know, yeah. You know what?

Yeah. God. You just talk yourself into it. No, you immediately buy it. You immediately go, yeah, whatever. You flip the page, and there's another one about you, and you go, what are they talking? What are they doing?

And so when it's about you, you know and there's another one about you and you go what do they talk what are they doing and so you when it's about you you know that you know that it's insane but when it's about somebody else you have this tendency to just go uh-huh you know i've even had you know my family my mom and my sisters and i say guys guys just don't don't it's just what they do and now in the age of the internet it's's, I guess, even more so. I don't know. I don't kind of... Yeah, I think that was a better time. It's been so long now, and now it's that...

I must say that's kind of like history. I did a bad job of pacing because we have more movies to go through and we're going to run out of time. Go through and we'll do... You tell me. You tell me you got 30 seconds and I'll do it in 30 seconds.

I'll try to give you the highlight. Best in Times, that at your first sports movie. But let's Robin Williams really quickly. Tremendous talent. And finally had to go to Robin and say, Robin, I have to have this conversation with you. He said, what? I said, every time you tell a joke, I'm just telling you right now, I think it's incredibly funny and you're incredibly funny doing it. But I can't go through every day laughing all day at your jokes because I'm afraid if I don't, you're going to keep working at it and you're going to wear me out.

Trying to win you over. I have to just do my part. But I just want you to know, I think it's hysterical. I think you're hysterical. It's hysterical. And just know that because sometimes I'm just going to walk away and be thinking about something else. But you don't have to you know you don't have to think i didn't think it was funny he was great funny um he was just wild like that all the time

yeah he just had to always make people laugh all the time yeah yeah um tequila sunrise you played the part that was was it written for Pat Riley Or did you consult Pat Riley What was that deal It was written probably As Bob I've heard Bob talk about Bob Towne talk about that a little bit That Riley was his impression

In his head yeah In his head And I think he was interested in casting Riley That we never talked about that much But I worked closely with Bob on that Cause you had the Riley hairstyle in that movie Yeah oh yeah I mean I

Listen It's like I love to do that with directors It was weird that you were carrying Riley hairstyle on that movie. Oh yeah. I mean, I listen, I, I, it's like, I love to do that with directors. It was weird that you were carrying a clipboard though. It's like, who's your,

who's your, um, who's your, you know, I like to ask the director, who's your perfect casting so that I can understand what's in your head that you're going for so that I can kind of understand that, you know,

and you're not gonna hurt my feelings. I just want to know where you, where you were going in your head. And your head and it was a tremendous opportunity to work with maybe the best screenwriter we've ever had I don't know he's been referred to that many times I think he's phenomenal I think I learned from him how to read a screenplay and work on a movie and not only the desire for all actors to have not the plot move the story, but their characters move the plot. He's so deeply into the character so quickly that what the character doesn't say moves the plot. I learned that from him, from watching that with him.

Mel Gibson and I became friends on that movie. I just think the world of Mel. I think he's one of the funniest people I know. He's a very interesting man. I would say. No, he really is. I mean, he really is. He has taken...

It's a bit like... I understand Mel, because I come from a world of baseball where the sense of humor is absolutely slicing and barbaric at times. And I think deeply funny because it gets to the core of something about you and or the situation. Mel has some of that, to me, he has some of that culture from Australia, the Australian male. There's a culture there that's very different from the American or English or Spanish male. It's Australian.

And it is unique. And I think Mel carries that with him, what he somehow grew up with there. And as an American, he has an interesting combination of it. He can turn a phrase with anybody. And I just think sometimes what other people would find not funny, he has an interesting combination of it. He can turn a phrase with anybody. And I just think sometimes what other people would find not funny, I would find absolutely,

I did find and do find it hysterical. And I think he's a spectacular director. And all praises. Couple drinks on the set with Mel? I can think of no more fun way of spending a month, a month on an island than with Mel and endless boxes of beer and booze and just saying, let her rip, babe. I want to hear it all.

I just think because now, will you get to the point where you're going, Mel, Mel, Mel, Mel, come on, man. Sure. I guess I'm a little looser in that regard. I come from an era where we weren't quite so precious. I think people's feelings get, I just think we live in a time now where I kind of look at that and just, I've learned to kind of walk away and be quiet because I realize that, I mean, I should say I've learned, but I haven't succeeded. I mean, I still say things that to me are, you know, it's like, don't think it's funny as hell and somebody else might go god come on right that's awful and I go well what I'm it's not it's a it's I'm literally not I'm basing it on reality don't tell

me it's not but I'm just making a farce out of it don't you get that I mean and by the there's that trillionth of a second thought goes through your head? You just say, fuck it. People are very uptight in 2017. What's that? They're very uptight in 2017. Gee, you think? Yeah, I do. My mom and I talk about this a lot. My mom's like, oh,

these people. Oh, God. It's just generational. Your generation was a lot more seat by the pants, let it fly, Tango and Cash, Sly Stallone. Just Sly, all about Sly. And Swayze decided not to do Tango and Cash. My brother-in-law was producing it and found out immediately. He said, God, this would be great for Kurt.

He'd be great for this movie. And Sly liked me because I had met Sly before, and I really liked him. We got along. We had good laughs, and Sly was all for that. And very quickly, I was doing that movie. I wanted to do it because I wanted the mix, the opportunity, and the guilt by association of being a movie star.

I needed that. I needed to be. In an A-list action flick. I just needed to be connected to that. Yeah. And Sly was the perfect guy to do that with. Because we were good foils for each other. And we had fun.

It's on a lot. It did well. Oh yeah, it's a 15-year-old boy. Well, it's a movie for 15 to 17-year-old boys. I mean, that's your core audience, and we knew that. And Sly was completely, you know, he's completely locked into an understanding of that. Yeah. He was just, I was, you know, treated amazingly well by Sly.

He was great, period, flat out fantastic. And I love seeing him. Puts a smile on my face and a big feeling of fondness in my heart every time I see him and think about him. I just really like him. It might be the most sarcastic action movie of all time. Yeah, yeah. It's definitely in the top three. Yeah.

There's a lot of sarcasm flying around. Yeah, there's a lot of sarcasm. Fist and sarcasm. That could have been the name of the movie. What was your biggest what if that was in Bull Durham then? Because you said that one somebody else could have taken Tango and Cash. Is there a movie that you were like, oh man, I almost got that one, or I could have done that, but I was scheduling conflict? There was a lot of movies I didn't do because either it didn't fit into my life at that time. Yeah.

Or there was something about the movie that I wasn't going to feel comfortable doing. So what's the biggest, I don't want to say regret. You know what? I get asked that question all the time. Come on. There's two reasons I don't like it. Okay. I don't like another actor learning that.

It's not a good feeling for them. I've learning that. It's not a good feeling for them. I've learned that. I've named a couple of them in the past, and I've learned to just keep my mouth shut about that. I turn a lot of them down for a lot of different reasons. And it doesn't matter. Again, if Sans and Peter Pan, who cares? Not me.

And I have no reason to go, wait a minute, I wasn't the first choice of that movie that made me famous? A lot of actors are offended by that. I'm not, but they are. And I kind of understand why. Suffice it to say, there's been a lot of them. I have no regrets over not doing any of them. I have no regrets. My life is, you know, my life,

you're going to live your life. It's going to do what it's going to do. You're going to have whatever amount of control you have over it. And you're going to do things that are right and things that are wrong. And in terms of what was best for your career and all that, I just wanted a varied one. I wanted to do things that other people maybe wouldn't be interested in, but I was interested in. And I continue to do that. And it's the only way I know how to stay interested in this field. And I've been fortunate in that I've been able to many times do it. Are there things you want to do that you don't get? Of course. Sure. Absolutely. That's the game. Let's go 30 second shot clock. Backdraft? Always wanted to work with Ronnie Howard ever since we were young men. I mean, going way back.

You guys were child actor peers. And he'd become this really strong director. We had gone to each other with a couple of projects over the years that either he didn't want to do or I didn't care to do. And along came this one. And I had the opportunity to work on it as a, to work on the character in the form of writing with, I believe his name was Greg Wyden, for Ronnie. And the experience

with all the players. Billy Baldwin standing out, who's again just a sweetheart. Just a sweetheart. A great guy. All those guys were great. A great bonding experience with all the actors and firemen in that movie. And I thought that we had a challenge, which was to make firemen cool.

And we did. Escape from L.A.? 30 seconds. Only real sequel I ever... only real sequel to a to a movie they did the people just wanted it they weren't going to be denied for a long time yeah and we did there were some interesting things about that 17 years late 17 years after uh and escape from new york it was 17 years into the future yeah 17 years after that, we did Escape from L.A. I was now getting older, and I wanted to look. I would never want to do Snake if I didn't look right.

And I had one or two years left to where I could do it. And John and I had, again, just a terrific time working together. I love working with John Carpenter, and that was what that was. Tombstone. Being Snake again was pretty cool too. Tombstone was a very difficult experience. It was a grind. It was unfortunate in that our director just was a spectacular writer,

and he was as weak a director as he was good a writer. Who was the director? It was a man named Kevin Jarre who was a great writer and he was getting his opportunity to direct and it just was not working. And so, you know, he had to be replaced

and a lot of it fell on my shoulders in terms of I had gone out and got the money for the movie with Andy Vanya, another wonderful human being, and gave us all the opportunity to do a Western, which nobody really cared that much about. And I thought that that cast, those actors,

who very few of them have any idea really what was going on in some ways on that movie because it just couldn't be told. And I promised I would never tell some of it. And I'll hold true to the promise but the actors were great Billy Paxton amongst them was just a great human being but Sam Elliott was fabulous

to work with I can go through all the list of actors but I have to say my relationship from minute one with Val Kilmer was one that I'm so glad I've had in my life. He's really smart, very talented,

and oh, what a joy to be with. And he can also drive you completely crazy, which I think you've got to have in a great relationship. We went to Spain. We went all over Europe, actually, promoting, and Goldie was with us. And finally, there would be these times where I'd say, Val, I can't hear one more word. You and Goldie go out tonight.

You guys go out and do the town. I cannot listen to one more. And he laughed. He called me something blockhead. I think it was blockhead. Well, you blockhead. You're not going to ever come off of that position. I love him.

I just think the world of Val. And he is a fascinating guy in that there's a lot of relationships Val's had with people that, boy, they would listen to this and they'd go, I don't know what he's talking about. Val is a different person. And he's unique and he's, I found him to be one of the most compelling actors to work with in terms of his vision of what these people were and who they were to each other and why. Endlessly interesting and a great hang. Who's more fun at 4.30 in the morning

after like 15 drinks, Mel Gibson or Val Kilmer? That's a toss-up. Val might not be drinking. He might be doing something else. Yeah. Mel and I will be drinking. Val might be doing something else. You know, you're getting into the ayahuasca world,

possibly, with Val. You know what I mean? It's going to... That's a good one. That's a good night, actually. You know, you're getting into the ayahuasca world, possibly, with Val. You know what I mean? That's a good one. That's a good night, actually. Take that to the bucket of blood. Good guys, man. Dark Blue, 2002. Great opportunity to have a chance to work with Ron Shelton on a very different kind of a movie.

One of my favorite characters that I ever had the opportunity to play. Let's do it. Miracle. Miracle was a mediocre screenplay that had no opposite side to one of its

two... You were watching two things. You're watching a coach, a man, and you're watching a group of young men. The group of young men aspect of it was really pretty good, but we already knew their story. The group, as opposed to the one man, we didn't know that story and we didn't know the man. I met her Brooks because with Gavin O'Connor, the director, great talent, also great knowledge because he played high level football. It's important in that movie to understand we're going to have to teach you some things and you got to understand some of the aspects of the psychology and the personalities and how they deal with high-level sports, things that matter.

And I had the opportunity to meet Herb Brooks because he was coming out to Vancouver, where we were living, because our son was playing junior hockey in Canada, which is a religion up there. And Herb was coming out to scout. One of the things he was doing was scouting goaltenders, and Wyatt was one of them. So when we met, we spent the first hour and a half, two hours talking about Wyatt. And there were all these Disney guys around, and they found us kind of looking, and Herb said, and I said, yeah, we've got to get down to doing some business here.

And so I'm thinking, okay, well, I don't know. I guess this was the most fun year of your life. And he looked at me. It was like the two hours we had just discussed was like, well, are you an idiot? Because I didn't know the story. I just knew it was in the script and what I'd watched, of course. Do you believe in miracles and all that? And he looked at me. He said, are you kidding me? And I said, no, I don't know. He said, it was the loneliest year of my life. And I remember looking at Gavin O'Connor and saying, we have some work to do.

And was able to get a lot from his dilemma. He was a man who had three national championships, a future in NHL, and he was putting it all on the line for a concept that nobody else was buying into. Yeah. It was tremendous. He wasn't just simon legree whipping the boys going more more more more no it had to be put into context and it was nothing there was really nothing in the screenplay about what the coach was doing behind the bench

so it didn't matter we had to work on that and uh i think that uh i love that movie it's also one of my favorite performances from Kurt Russell because I got the greatest accolade I've ever gotten out of that which was when we went and had the premiere Herb's grandson who's like three years old at the time about about four or five minutes into the movie I was sitting not too far from them i heard his little voice go papa or poppy i forget what it was poppy or papa and he was pointing at me and i said that'll do that that'll do it for me you you nailed what my review would have been of that movie if you'd asked me mediocre script you were great in it it's a mediocre script it's not a mediocre movie no i disagree if you think it's a mediocre movie i said not a mediocre movie no i disagree if you think it's

a mediocre movie i said mediocre script yeah you said mediocre yeah i agree with that i think the movie worked but i think it worked because you were good i'm not laying something on the writers i mean i think they wrote the basics what are you gonna do but there were some things that we needed to change take out put in like you do on all movies there's nothing different about miracle in terms of that in terms of the you know terms of the working on a script but in particular it needed you needed to know what Herb had at stake so that every time you're with Herb, you just didn't want to get back to the guys.

It was like, okay, got it, Herb. You know, you want to win. Got it. No, you got to understand what somebody's putting on the table that they may lose for their entire life. And that was fascinating. A very weird thing happened there. I'm a pilot and I was flying on the day that Herb was killed in his car accident.

And I was flying from, I believe, Muskoka, Canada to Los Angeles. And I looked back on the time. I found out the time. I was almost directly over him when he had that car accident. yeah that's very bizarre I've never told that story before but I think I looked on my logbook and I kind of worked it back and I was within a within a four or five mile range you know at what would I be I would have been at 28,000 feet and And yeah, it was bizarre. That's amazing.

I think the problem with a movie like that... I wish he would have seen that. I wish he would have been able to see it. First of all, you're competing against the memory everyone had from 1980. So that's obstacle one. Then obstacle two is it's this team of 22 hockey players and it's just in a two-hour movie.

It's tough to keep everyone, just keep track of everyone, which is why the coach and whatever the performances are going to carry the movie, it's tough to keep everyone, just keep track of everyone, which is why the coach and whatever the performance is is going to carry the movie. That's Gavin O'Connor doing that. He made you know who those people were. By the end of it, yeah. By you knew who was who.

The coach has to be awesome. Well, you also knew by the end of the movie, you knew enough about hockey to realize that the last four or five minutes you're playing defense, you're trying to prevent, you're trying to hold on to the victory and and you the audience understood you know there's not a lot of people that are

going to understand the intricacies of defensive hockey and gavin o'connor had the the difficulty of trying to subtly teach the audience through the personalities of the people and through the coaches wishes and desires and style. You learned enough that by the time you get to the end, you're sitting there going, hold on, guys. Hold on. And that's what was going on in that arena. And when you're watching at home, it was the longest nine and a half minutes of all time. It took five hours.

It was 10 minutes. It was nine and a half minutes of one. It's like, oh, God, please let this be. And they were a juggernaut. That team was, I think they'd won 48 games or something like that in a row internationally. I mean, that's like an eighth grade team beating the Yankees in the seventh game of the World Series. It was that crazy. It's the greatest tape-delayed sports moment of my life.

I agree. It was real simple. They outworked them. Yeah. At the end of the day, the complexities of the game all mattered. But the work those guys put in, Herb realized something. I got young legs. If I can build those young legs up and I can get them to believe in themselves in terms of what what i think will work we can out skate them

and that was that was a genius concept it was like what nobody can out skate it's the it's ice hockey yeah you have to say these guys are the greatest skaters and in game terms in the world and he he they warm up um you took you took like a four year break from 07 to 2011 was it a retirement or a sabbatical no I got interested in wine I'm doing Death Proof with Quentin Tarantino this is

he's my favorite filmmaker I think he's Orson Welles of our time I think he's great and he's a blast and he's brilliantly And he's a blast. And he's brilliantly talented. And I'm doing death proof, having a ball,

playing this stuntman Mike character, just having a ball. But I've always wanted to make wine. And a friend of mine was talking to me about it at the time and saying, if you're going to do this, you need to get going on it. I said, yeah, I do. I just don't know how to do it or what to do in it and now I'm sitting there with Zoe Bell strapped to the hood of the car we're for three weeks and we're going to be doing this scene and I'm driving and she's sitting there we're talking and behind her and I always look at where I was just off the side of the road with the

walkie-talkie waiting for them to say come on hopefully they've shut down all the roads because we're going to literally be doing 90 to 100 going down this road and hopefully and the you with the walkie-talkie waiting for them to say, come on. Hopefully they've shut down all the roads because we're going to literally be doing 90 to 100 going down this road. And hopefully, you know, the camera car's in one lane, you're in the other, and there's no room for anybody else coming the other way. So, yeah. And but as I was waiting, I'd always be looking at this vineyard, sort of daydreaming, thinking, God, I'd love to own a vineyard.

I'd love to make one. The next year, I met the people who owned a vineyard in Santa Rita Hills, California, because I wanted to make Pinot Noir. And I wanted to make a Burgundian-style Pinot Noir. Wow, you're getting super technical on me. I just knew what I wanted to do. Yeah. But I had no idea how to do it, go about it. Through a man named Greg Gorman, who was an old acquaintance, who was a great photographer. He introduced me to Peter and Rebecca Work,

who own Amplos Cellars at Amplos Vineyard. Yeah. Amplos Vineyard was the vineyard I was looking at when I'd sit on that corner. So now I've had the opportunity to start making wine with that vineyard and those people. And Peter in particular kind of took me under his wing as it were, and I became their wine apprentice. And they let me make the kind of, they helped teach and continue to teach me and help me reach some of the goals that I want to reach in terms of winemaking. And my gogi wine, G-O-G-I, is my wine. People always ask me, where can I go? I go to gogiwines.com.

And my wine has taken off. I mean, I make a really good high-end pinot. I'm going tomorrow to the Disney Wine and Food Festival for three days, and they have my wine at the best restaurants around Disneyland, Disney World, Shanghai Disney, and it's also all over Los Angeles and some places in San Francisco, Wally's, and it's all around. I mean, my wine is growing, and I'm very proud of it, and I have my, And nowhere on it other than on the back is my name. This is not a situation of a celebrity horribly slapping a name on a bottle and making a claim. I love the whole world of learning, being a part of making, blending, farming, anything that has to do with wine.

I love it. And I preferred the fun that I was having doing that to the screenplays I was reading. And I'm fortunate. I made enough in my life to have my life. I'm stunned by this. I had no idea. If you like Pinot, go for a go-go.

I love Pinot. Pinot's my favorite. I've probably had this. You like Pinot Noir? Pinot's my favorite. Oh, well, okay. My Pinot's go for a go-go. I love Pinot. Pinot's my favorite. I've probably had this. You like Pinot Noir? Pinot's my favorite. Oh, well, okay. My Pinot's made for Pinot drinkers. It's a complex...

I have a whole lot. Stop. This is going to sound like a commercial in five seconds. But if you like Pinot, Bill, that's the deal. My mom is a wine lunatic. There are wine fans and wine lunatics. My mom's a wine lunatic. So I've had it basically the last 30.

You're in California? I'm in LA. My mom's in Beverly Hills. Okay. Well, you're- Yeah. So she's- Go to Wally's.

I eventually- I've been to Wally's. Go to Wally's and say, hey, I'm looking for- If you can't remember Goge, just say, I'm looking for Kurt Russell's wine. I think I'll remember Goge. And also, do you like Chardonnay? Nah, I do red. I'm done with white. I've retired from whitesogie. And also, do you like Chardonnay? No, I do red. I'm done with white.

I'm getting more and more into Chardonnay too. I like that because I like Burgundy and white. Anyway, I did that from bicycle trips with Goldie. Started learning that I... there was more to the bicycle trip. Tate, was that the most shocking revelation on the podcast? Really? I had no idea. Kurt Russell. All right, we're wrapping up. was that the most shocking revelation on the podcast? Really? I had no idea.

Yeah. Uh, Kurt Russell. All right, we're wrapping up fast eight coming out Friday, which I think is when we're putting up this podcast. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. The 14th. By the way, are you going to be alive for fast nine? Can we say, I have no idea. I have no idea. I just sort of,

Mr. Nobody. I have no idea. You know, I have no, I have no idea what they're going to do. Um, you know,

talk about next time around. All you care about each time is that movie. And I've seen it. It delivers. I can recommend it. Thanks for coming on. This is great. All right.

Cheers. All right. Thanks to Kurt Russell. Thanks to SeatGeek, our presenting sponsor. Thanks again to the Fly Delta app for sponsoring the show today. The FlyDelta app makes your entire flying experience seamless, real-time bag tracking with RFID, passport scanning during check-in, easy access to your boarding pass and gate info, and so much more.

It's actually silly if you don't use the FlyDelta app. It's with every step of your trip, giving you the timely information you need. Download the Fly Delta app and start flying in style. I don't need to do this. I already have it. Thanks to Sonos. For epic sound you can feel from a speaker you'll hardly notice, you need Playbase from Sonos.

Playbase adds pulse-pounding sound. Pulse-pounding. I always have trouble with that one, Tate. To whatever's playing from movies and sports to TV, game, and music. And you don't even need to read the manual. The Sonos app guides you through every step of setup. One power cord, one optical cord. All it takes.

Everything. Sounds better on Playbase. See for yourself at Sonos.com. That is Sonos.com. Don't forget to go to the Ringer NBA show if you want to hear me break down the first round of the NBA playoffs with our friend Chris Vernon, who's already headed for, I think, a sad ending in round one with his Grizzlies.

We're going to talk about that. Don't forget about my MVP column on the ringer.com. Don't forget to catch up on our other podcasts. I did a mailbag on Monday, a one-man show. Tate chimed in a couple times where we just try to cover as many mailbag questions as possible.

And then on Wednesday, Joe House and I went over the last vestiges of the MVP race. And we talked to Fast and Furious producer Neil Moritz. And if you like the franchise, I would highly recommend that one. Lots of tidbits. That's it for the BS Podcast. Go Celtics. Talk to you next week.