The Bill Simmons Podcast - Luck Fallout, FFB Hall of Fame, and Julia Louis-Dreyfus's First Appearance | With Kyle Brandt | The Bill Simmons Podcast

Episode Date: August 27, 2019

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons talks the Fantasy Football Hall of Fame (1:44) before being joined by NFL Network's Kyle Brandt to discuss the ripple effects of Andrew Luck's retirement, athletes' "second acts," as well as some 2019 NFL season predictions (8:44). Then Bill sits down with actress and Emmy record-holder Julia Louis-Dreyfus to discuss being a sports parent, 'SNL' in the 1980s, 'Seinfeld,' 'Veep,' working with James Gandolfini, 'Curb Your Enthusiasm,' the 'Curb'-'Seinfeld' reunion, Larry David, future projects, parenting advice, and more (33:10)! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today's episode of the Bill Simmons Podcast is brought to you by ZipRecruiter. You know, having a high sports IQ, it's important. Bill Belichick, nobody has a higher sports IQ. He's so locked in. He didn't even know Andrew Luck retired for like 24 hours. Hey, when it comes to hiring, you don't need a high hiring IQ. You just need ZipRecruiter. So effective.

Four out of five employers who post on ZipRecruiter get a quality candidate through the site within the first day. My listeners can try it for free. Go to ziprecruiter.com slash BS. ZipRecruiter is the smartest way to hire. We're also brought to you by The Rewatchables, where we have a new podcast, Do the Right Thing. Sean Fantasy, Wesley Morris. I'm not on this one.

30th anniversary of that movie. And by the way, the rewatchable is 1999. It's coming back on Luminary next week as well. So heads up on that. Speaking of TheRinger.com, we launched the Fantasy Football Hall of Fame today. That was cool. I'm going to talk about that for a tiny bit at the top

after we get to Pearl Jam. Coming up, Kyle Brandt from Good Morning Football. We're going to talk about the ripples from the Luck retirement. And then, just incredible, the queen. If America had a queen, I feel like she would be the queen. Julie Louis-Dreyfus. She's here. Bucket list guest.

That's all coming up. First. Our friends from Pearl Jam. All right. Bring it on, Kyle, in one second. Wanted to talk about this Fantasy Football Hall of Fame thing we did quickly. I have been doing fantasy football. This is going to be my 30th year. I think I started in 1990. I was trying to figure it out. So I've been 30 years of fantasy football,

and as we were putting this whole thing together, I think the tendency is to gravitate toward late 90s on. You know, that's Terrell Davis. That was really when fantasy became more and more mainstream. Jerry Rice was, in my opinion, the first great fantasy guy. That was like one of those, if he was just on your team, it was so delightful and so wonderful. And he would just have these 160 yard, three TD games. You're like, wow, I love fantasy football. This guy has made it more fun. There's been some great ones over the years.

I wrote a piece for Grantland in 2012 after LaDainian Tomlinson retired, making the case like he never won a Super Bowl. But his legacy was that he was the most influential fantasy guy ever. Because by the time he came into the league in the 2000s and kind of rose to prominence, at that point, everybody was playing fantasy. And his 2006 season, I wrote about this in the piece. I was with the Hirshheimer brothers once, and we were talking about fantasy or Tomlinson or something. And they had had Tomlinson in 2006 and started talking about it like it was like one of their sons who had winning the high school championship or something. I think that's when I realized fantasy had really gone to another level where you actually have memories of it. Like they're real teams. It was, that was really not the case.

The first few years. I remember, I think I've talked about this before, but the first league I was in my high school buddies, um, who then went to Colgate and they had a league in Colgate and then I ended up joining. And my friend Camp was the commissioner. And he would calculate the stats on Monday mornings with the USA Today and then add the Monday night games. And then he would mail them to us. Kyle, can you believe this? No, I'd be out.

It sounds too much. I wouldn't be doing that. So we would have no idea if we won until the mail came. So like on Wednesday, Thursday, I'd be checking the mail like, ah, I can't wait to see if I won. And then you would get it and camp would have these handwritten updates or I'm sorry, typed updates with handwritten scores in it and a million misspellings.

Our favorite one was Irving Fryer was a big fantasy guy back then. And camp for some reason had his name Inving Fryer for like three straight weeks. So we just started calling him Inving. And this was just kind of how it went. And I don't even think we could change teams during the season. And then once we started having player moves, it started to get dicey because then you would have to call in the player moves. And I bring this up because it's crazy that this happened like within the last hundred years that we had

fantasy that didn't have the internet, uh, where you had to call your friend to put in waiver wire stuff, where if you did a trade, that was really the only way to change your team in a productive way. And then over the last 20 years, it changed. But I remember when I had my old website before I went to ESPN, writing about my fantasy draft,

I think in 97 or 98. And I think I did a running diary of just the whole day and, you know, just male bonding personified and people still sick from the night before throwing up there in the draft and all that stuff. And I remember handing that in and being like, or posting it and just being like, I have no idea if anyone's even going to get this, but I just feel like there's got to be other people that have leagues. Cause we didn't really know. And then when I went to ESPN in 2001 and I was trying to craft what my, my column was going to be, one of the things I really cared about was the fantasy football thing.

They didn't have any fantasy football at that point. They might've had maybe rankings from somebody. I don't even think they had that. And I did a piece in 2001. I did, I think it was 30 ways to insult your friends at a fantasy draft. That was one of them. I did a fantasy football manifesto. I did a running diary of my fantasy draft. And every time I told my editors I was doing that, they were like, wait, you're going to write about your fantasy league? What? That's going to be the column you turn in?

And I was like, I'm telling you, people care. And the thing is, people did care. But it was like, we didn't know anybody else cared. It was one of those things where you thought people cared. You knew it was a thing. There were magazines out. But it also seemed inconceivable where we would end up, you know, six, seven years later, all of a sudden, Matthew Barry becomes the Mel Kiper of fantasy. And, and, uh, and all of a sudden you could see

it. And by, by about oh six, you could see it, which is why I think that Tomlinson season was so crucial to this whole thing, because that was really when everybody was in on fantasy and it was not like Dungeons and Dragons and all that stuff. And it had become its own thing. My favorite season, the 07 team, I think I wrote a column about, yeah, I did write a column about this too, about whether it was harder to go undefeated in the NFL or with your fantasy team. And at the time I had an undefeated Patriots team and I had an undefeated fantasy team. It was the greatest team I ever picked. I had a young Adrian Peterson and I had Tomlinson and I had Wes Walker and it was just like a murderer's row. And I really thought I had a chance to go undefeated and I didn't. And I actually think it's harder to go undefeated in

fantasy because of the bye weeks and stuff. But I remember writing about that and everybody was just really passionate about both ways. Like, no fucking way. It's so much harder to go undefeated in NFL. You're fucking crazy. It's just hilarious. And now we're at the end of this decade.

So this is now three full decades of fantasy that we have. And probably at least the last two mainstream, where it became relatively mainstream. And it seemed like a good time to do this Hall of Fame. And my favorite ones, my favorite fantasy guys of all time

in no particular order, Tomlinson, Moss, Gronk, Rice, maybe Marshall Falk. That Mount Rushmore would probably be those four and then Marshall Falk, like always, coming up just short.

Just a little joke for the three St. Louis Rams fans. All right, let's bring in Kyle. All right, on the line, Kyle Brandt from Good Morning Football. I'm so excited for this because I got an email from a PR person at NFL Network pitching Peter Schrager for my podcast. So I was like, I got to get Kyle Brandt. This will now be even better because we've been talking about doing one anyway.

So welcome back to the pod. Hey, I'm thrilled to be here for the Kumite, Bill, as always. Andrew Luck, biggest story since you started your show, Good Morning Football? Well, yeah. I mean, it's the biggest surprise for sure. You got to understand, we started in the summer of 2016, so we were birthed directly into Kaepernick taking a knee, which is a great way to start a fun morning show um so that's big but luck's certainly like the biggest gut punch especially on a Saturday night dude was there any rumors

anything in the football community or did this just blindside everybody it's funny you say that because Schrager's the guy who like he's got he's tapped in he's a hashtag insider like he knows all that stuff yeah and he was floored. I text him when it happened. I was like, dude, luck! Exclamation point. And he's like, what? What the hell are you talking about?

He was on a call like on the Jets game. And he's like, that has to be a hack. Like he didn't believe it. And I didn't either. So like nobody, nobody knew. Are you buying the whole don't actually count out the Colts, Jacoby Brissett, they have a Super

Bowl contender around him anyway? Or is this the most pathetic narrative of all time? It's so funny. We were debating that this morning. We're already into it, Bill. We're already comparing this Colts team to the 99 Rams, to the 2017

Eagles. We had this impassioned thing this morning on the radio, on TV about, like, go with your heart or your head, you know? Kurt Warner came in for Trent Green, and I'm like, dude, Kurt Warner had, like, five Hall of Famers on that team. It was this most amazing loaded roster. Like, with respect to, like, Naheem Hines and Marlon Mack, like, I don't know if they have the horses.

Just like, you know, the Eagles team, when Carson Wentz got hurt, was a really, really good roster. So everyone's like, yeah, Jacoby Brissett is going to be incredible. I'm like, I kind of remember him being sort of not that great. Right. Yeah, like a little frisky. Fun when he's down 20. And with 18 minutes to go, he can kind of make stuff happen. But it's also, Bill like the Frank Reich factor is like

really Hollywood like this guy anytime he ever is exposed to like a big opportunity it's always like shit like I'm down 30 points again like his whole career in college and then the greatest comeback ever and then he's the Eagles coordinator

and they're just marching to the playoffs. He loses wins. We got to roll behind Foles. And then he gets the Colts job and then only because McDaniels lost it. And now finally he's like, oh, this team is so good. We're turnkey. We got luck. We're going to go.

And it's, of course, two weeks before the season, true Frank Reich brand, the quarterback just retires unprecedented. It's like his whole life he's been down 20 points and starting one in five. So if there's ever a guy who could like pull it off and pull out the miracle, I guess it's him. There is an incredible amount of Ewing theory potential. And I mentioned this on my Sunday pod and I've been looking at it for the past 48 hours and reading all the luck stuff.

And I do think luck was one of those guys. He was, you know, he was a prodigy comes in, everybody assumes he's next Peyton Manning, he was a great fantasy guy when he was healthy the results weren't totally there especially the first couple years where he took a couple

pretty lousy cold steams to the playoffs and stuff like that but he never had that one great season the 0-6 against the Patriots is like that. But he never had that one great season. The Owen six against the Patriots is like, that's a real stat. That's the team you have to be in the AFC. Never beat them.

So I do feel like there is some Ewing theory. I just don't know if Jacoby Brissett is nearly good enough to be the Ewing theory shepherd for this. Yeah. And you need a shepherd. You got to have that big hook. And if they, if the Colts do win it, then like,

I look at someone like Deshaun Watson, I'm like, all right, well, you're not a star. Like, Deshaun, the white unicorn of quarterbacks just retired.

Like, this is on a platter for you now. Yeah. Foles, eh, Marcus Mariota, and it's like, you have to win it if you're Deshaun Watson

or like, you're not ready to be a superstar. Who are the, who, let's go through the biggest winners now that we've had a couple days to digest this Luck thing. The biggest winners of Luck's retirement, I think number one has to be Deshaun Watson,

where that division now just belongs to him for the next eight to 10 years if he wants it. I don't even know who's- Yeah, I mean, you should take the thing over now. This is done. I would also say, though, I think that over the weekend when he retired

was one of the greatest days in Tennessee Titans history. That is a great red-letter day for them because it's like, if you look at Titans moments in history, it's like the Music City miracle and all the Steve McNair, Eddie George, and then the day that Andrew Luck retired

because we played him every year and we were 0-11 against him. It was like they were so dominated. I almost feel like they almost started to like it from him. It was like it was getting weird and like their safe word is retirement and they just got it. So he's gone. I mean, they loved it or something. They were like Giamatti in Billions.

They were on the floor with clamps playing the Colts every single time with Andrew Luck and he just beat them, and they loved it. Yeah, that is Luck's legacy. He goes 0-6 against the Pats and 11-0 against the Titans. That's a tough legacy, though. Yeah, I don't know. That's got to mean something. Another winner, the Patriots.

And I talked about this on Sunday, but Tom Brady outlasting 30 years of Colts QBs that we thought we were going to have on paper. We thought it was going to be Manning to luck through 2028. Now Brady's the last one standing. He beat luck like a drum this whole decade. And now it's like, now I guess my homes is the next guy who he just beat, uh, in January. And now that's the next target is Tom Brady continues to be eternal and, and plans to play until his sixties. And isn't it so perfect too, that like the next guy that's following him is this following Andrew Luck is

this Jacoby Brissett, like that Belichick knows and had in, you know, I'm inside and out and pick them out of his teeth. I do think though, that like the Andrew Luck news has made me appreciate Brady even more. Like the whole, like I just lost my love for it.

And I, I'm wealthy and I want to do other things. And I have this cool wife and like, it just makes me look at Brady and he's just, he's just such a fiend, like such a fiend. And football, football is such a pain in the ass.

Like anybody who even played high school or college, like even if your team is good and you're winning, like there's always this huge wave of relief. Like, God damn, the season's finally over. I'm so happy. Like Tom Brady just doesn't have that. It's, he's, he's a fiend for it. It's like, he reminds me kind of of the way people talk about Tom Cruise, like on sets, but he fiend for it. He reminds me of the way people talk about Tom Cruise on sets. He just lives

for it. He just wants to keep doing these wild Mission Impossible movies. Tom, can't you just downshift and do a thoughtful western? No, I want to be hanging off a plane. They're the same guy in a way. That's what I'm also like. More podcasts. Rewatchables.

Let's do another one. We're doing, we're taping Eyes Wide Shut tomorrow. Oh, you are? Shit. Yeah, I don't know. Nightingale, man.

I love it. Yeah, it's, you know that I've been binging the rewatchables. Like, people are, everyone's watching Succession. I didn't find the rewatchables until recently.

So I hit off like three a week and I'm obsessed, man. So what's the number one so far for you? I mean, it's a loaded, loaded category. The Fugitive one is fantastic. Wow. Really, really good. I wasn't expecting that answer. I'm a huge Dr. Charles Nichols guy. Love that. One of those movie lines that I say with my

friends, like if they interrupt you, I'll be like, Richard, I'm in the middle of the speech. And I just love Charles Nichols. True romance is fantastic. The Drexel scene breakdown alone is riveting. I have a real soft side for the Bloodsport rewatchables because I'm just a big Bloodsport guy. But I would say this. It's down to two, Bill. If anyone has not listened to it, the Top Gun rewatchables is in like an hour 47 minutes. It's almost longer than the movie. Mallory Rubin in particular is great in it. And I was like, I think I've heard everything that's said about Top Gun and the volleyball and all the lines. And then there's like a 15 plus minute breakdown of the very small scene when Mav goes to Charlie's house to ask to take a shower. That is outrageous.

It is so good. Thank you. And your takes on her are so different. And you start thinking like, really asking to use the shower might be the boldest move that Pete Mitchell makes in the entire movie. Right. And like, this is a guy who was in a 4g inverted dive with the mig 28 at a range of about two meters, actually about one and a half,

but same to an older woman. You barely know, like, can I use your shower is insane. I mean, she's like, no, yeah,

my, my razor's in there. No, no, get the hell out of here. And you guys go so deep on that. It was killing me. Yeah.

There's a lot of cocaine in the eighties. So much. That's a lesson. Yeah, there's a lot of cocaine in the 80s. So much cocaine. That's a lesson, yeah. But honestly, dude, I can't give the number one spot to anything, but the Heat Rewatchables, Chris Ryan is just absolutely unconscious in it. And at one point, you decide to kind of break from the format, and you kind of just do like Vincent Hanna karaoke. You just start ripping off

lines and pushing away from the mic and I'm on the bike exercising and doing them with you and I'm doing my Vincent Hanna. And it's, I think that really is the standard, the rewatchables of heat. It's so good. Well, we had, we didn't, I don't think we had all the categories in place yet. So we're going to do it. Yeah. We're going to do for the hundredth episode, we're going to redo the heat one and make it two and a half hours because

Chris is at the point with heat now where if there's any chance to do a Wayne grow, I got to get it on man. Like he's just going to do it. He doesn't care. It could be a business meeting. He could be with sponsors. He could be with like, you know, his pastor and he's just going to break it away and grow like Wayne grow. That's the iconic moment. Wait, um, I have to do one more winner for Andrew Luck. All right.

What do you got? The 20 somethings really, really, uh, really enjoyed that. He stepped away. This, this, this, uh, this did feel a little generational to some degree like that. He, that Andrew Luck took control of his own destiny. He has his body intact. He's going to move on. He's going to do other things.

And meanwhile, he really did screw the Colts over. Like he left the Colts 12 days before the season. And, you know, I talked about this on Sunday and I keep thinking about this. I've just, we're, we're at this really weird post sports fan point of sports right now, where we are so player friendly with how we think about everything. I just can't imagine how this would have been handled 30 years ago. If he did this, I think people would have been villainized.

And now we're just at a different thing. And now I think people are even afraid to say publicly, like, oh yeah, he fucked the Colts. No, you can't do that. You'll get absolutely destroyed if you do that. And it's funny you say about the young athlete, like, there was a little postscript on it that I thought

really spoke to that. I think it was Ian Rappaport tweeted that Andrew Luck's plan is that he's going to leave and travel the world. And I'm like, is that not like the most 25-ish type thing to say that we're going to backpack? And like, that's my plan. Because as an older guy, like I'm 40, and I'm like, Andrew, that's not a next chapter. That's like a month. And you're going to get really annoyed, and your wife and you are going to start fighting. You just want to come home. Like, that's not the solution. That That to me, make me think like,

well, if that's his plan, then he's coming back next year. Yeah. You know, I felt the same way with Gronk too. Like I wanted Gronk to retire. I love Gronk. Gronk is like a top three favorite Patriot of all time for me. And one of my favorite Boston athletes ever. And that dude just took an insane amount of punishment. He did everything we ever could have asked for, for him. And that dude just took an insane amount of punishment. He did everything we ever could have asked for, for him. And by the end of it, I was like, man, good for him. He's getting out. I felt the same way. I think a lot of people feel about the luck thing. And I think that's, what's changed the most about football this century specifically is the way we think about these guys kind of just, oh man, it's great that they got out.

Like it's almost like they're like in Vietnam or Korea or something in the 50s or 60s where we just want them to get out intact. I didn't, you go back to the early 2000s, you know, even like the Madden, you remember they used to do those Madden trailers for the upcoming Madden season? And it would just be guys getting absolutely annihilated,

like wide receivers getting crushed over the middle. And, you know, and violence was such a big part of it. And we just loved it. And then over the last 10 years, it just changed. And now we, it's like, we wanted Eddie George, like give him another 600 carries, just keep running them. And now I do, it's just like, we want like Willem Dafoe to get to the chopper and escape like in one piece. And I feel the same way about Gronk. Like I probably, since you're such a Pats fan too, like you don't want to see like 60% Gronk. It's hard. Like I,

like I grew up in the Chicago suburbs in the 90s. I grew up Jordan and still one of the images that I can't get out of my head is Jordan on the wizards, getting his jump shot blocked by Paul Pierce, like noted leaper, Paul Pierce, like that scarred me a lot and I can't unsee it. I don't want to see that with Gronk and I'm glad he's gone. I don't want him to come back.

This is how I feel about Johnny bananas on the challenge now. Okay. It's so many, so many titles, such a legacy. Really? It's him and Jordan, such a legacy. Really, it's him and Jordan, I think, as the two biggest winners that we've had the last 50 years. And just walk away.

It's time. You don't need this anymore, Bananas. Yeah, walk away at the top. Everyone's gunning for you. Don't you feel like a little robbed if you would do that? I don't want to see him leave anything on the field either. For the Andrew Luck thing, I know people, no one wants to come out and say he shouldn't have done this. that like i don't want to see him leave anything on the field either like for the andrew luck thing i don't people no one wants to come out and say he shouldn't have done this but i'm always here

for the second act like i feel like luck not playing into his 30s like imagine if we had never seen patriots era randy moss like he just never did it he hung up the game or like we only only shack we ever knew was on the magic or Dave Grohl never gets to the Foo Fighters. Like that's, we never saw Andrew Luck's talent into his thirties. And like, there could have been miracles, Superbowls, MVPs. We'll never know. Well, it also, I don't know if quarterbacks take even 25% of the punishment they took

15 years ago. It's, it's such a dramatic, um, kind of evisceration of the Ryan Gregson era that in this day and age, a quarterback could take that much punishment that physically they wouldn't want to play anymore, even before they turn 30. Like, it's pretty, you look at the way Brady plays quarterback and, you know, during the regular season, at least, he's just not, he's refusing to take punishment, you know. No, he doesn't to take punishment, you know, in the playoffs. No, he's just got, he'd rather dump the ball and start another down over take the blindside hit or hold the ball that extra split second. And the fact that luck couldn't even get to that stage, you know,

where he figured that out. I don't know. I, I, I'll be really interested to see where we go with football this next decade with career longevity. Cause we, it might be Brady Rogers and breeze might be the last three that really want to be playing football that long. We might have other guys just be like, yeah,

I'm 32. I'm getting out. My friend, Sully, his son was a state champion football in high school for a situate and didn't want to play in college. He was like, I'm out. I won a title. I got out intact.

And he's playing basketball in college at Suffolk instead. And it's a smart move. Why would you want to play football in college if you can play basketball? I know. I'm the classic guy who's got the kid who's got a five-year-old son. And people ask me all the time, is he going to play football? And I'm like, have I'm the classic guy who's got the kid who's got a five year old son and people ask me all the time is he gonna play football and I'm like

I don't know like I hope he's a professional golfer or any I don't want him to play football but like the reason you play football though is cause it's fucking awesome when it's good

like it's it's better like it's it's better to score a touchdown than hit a three pointer like that's what's always the drug that will keep them coming back it's so awesome to play

I think my son's gonna end up playing in high school. You do? Yeah. You all right with it? I have complicated feelings on it. I have one of those kids that he's just going to, he likes bouncing off other kids, you know? There's just certain kids that are wired that way.

I know, and you tell early. If he's not going to do that, then he's going to play lacrosse or he's going to play some sport where you're bouncing off other kids. And it's like, all right, is lacrosse like 100 times safer than football is? No. I do think we're playing football more safely, but I don't think it's safe. But, you know, my daughter's been playing soccer for 11 years. Are headers safe?

No. I think all these sports have scary things about them. Basketball is probably among the safest. Even baseball. You can get hit by a pitch. You can line drive back to the box. There's stuff going on. I think football has become safer.

I will say that they have accomplished that. I still don't think it's safe, but compared to where we were 15 years ago, Jesus, I'll never forget that Raven-Steelers game, whatever that playoff game was, when McGahee was out for like 10 minutes. Oh, he got knocked out, yeah. But like

three guys got knocked out in that game. It was nuts. You know what's crazy about that? I remember in that game at Heinz Field, they played down on the corner. Like when he was down and people interpreted that, that they played it because Willis McGee, he was out and they were like firing up their fans. Like they played that song by like CCR.

And I'm like, shit, you're playing that cause he's out. And like, that was kind of like a cool bad-ass thing to do back then. Right. Um, give me three predictions for the season.

Um, all right. The Kansas City Chiefs, dude. I'm in. I'm 100% in. My only reservation I have for it is Andy Reid, but they're my Super Bowl pick. I think the Chiefs are going to win it.

That's your only reservation? The coach that has not come through every year of his career? But at some point, you've got to do it, right? I mean, we've seen it before. Okay. I think that in that second half of the AFC title game, I feel like Mahomes figured him out. It's like, I got this shit.

It's no problem. I just needed to adjust at halftime. He completely lit him up. The same defense that shut down McVay and Goff and all that, that great Patriots defense. Mahomes was absolutely unconscious in the second half, and he had it. And they got better this year. I think the Chiefs are going to win. I'm into the Chiefs.

Okay. Second prediction. Second prediction. We're in a crazy era with defense, this Aaron Donald thing. Yeah. I feel like this is one of these great eras, we're going to say, back in that decade. Remember when Aaron Donald just. Yeah. Like, I feel like this is one of these great errors we're going to say back in that decade. Remember when Aaron Donald just shut it down

and he was by far the best player in the league in any position? He's going to win defensive player of the year again, and I actually think he's going to take a run at the sack title, too. Aaron Donald is so, so, so good, and I wish he was playing back to that other conversation back in the 80s,

because if he could hit, you know, whoever it is, Jim Harbaugh or Montana or anything, it would be so beautiful, but he can't do it. So Aaron Donald for the sack title, you like those odds? It's a deep odd, but I like it. He's off the board for defensive player of the year. As good as Khalil Mack is, as good as some other guys. Like Aaron Donald plays an interior lineman, and they still can't do anything with him. He's that good.

But yeah, they do. All right. Third prediction. The Antonio Brown thing doesn't work at all. Donald plays interior linemen and they still can't do anything with him. He's that good. But yes, I do. All right. Third prediction. The Antonio Brown thing doesn't work at all. It falls apart. I was looking at the over-under for him in Vegas and it was like. What did I got? It was like over 1,200 yards and it was like 100.5 catches.

And I was like, I rarely do unders because it's not fun to just root against other human beings. But in that case, I'm like, I feel like this could be one of the disasters of this decade. I know,

it's going to be fantastic. He's off his rocker. Is he Tyson zone? Oh, yeah. He's a thousand percent Tyson zone. If you say you're going to retire because of your helmet and you have a $30 million deal,

and I listen to those odds and I'm like, God, they really think Derek Carr is good. I'm not even sure. I don't know that he's not, but I really have no idea if Derek Carr is good at all. And if he's not, it's going to go really bad really fast because Ben Bratwiger might be a pain in the ass, but playing at Pittsburgh, you're always good.

You always contend. You always get the ball and they still couldn't make it work. And now he's going to go to Oakland and then they're going to move to Las Vegas next year. Come on. Yeah, I'm glad you brought up the car thing because we've seen this with the Diva receivers. You saw it with Moss in like 06 and some of the TO seasons

when the quarterback, they just feel like the quarterback is beneath them. It goes horribly. And I think there's a real chance that car, that Brown will feel that way by like week three. And they're like, Oh man, this guy sucks. Why didn't anyone tell me this year?

And we also may see a quarterback who thinks the head coach has been at them with Aaron Rogers. Like that's a great one to watch. I mean, that, that thing is bizarre. I look at the floor with the Packers, and I'm reminded greatly of Eric Spolstra, like, coaching LeBron. And, like, dude, you better be up to my level.

I don't suffer fools. I'm the most talented guy in the world. Like, this is your gig? Fine, go ahead. But you better be great. You better keep up with me. I see that going cool, too. Yeah, to bring it to your real world,

real world, I can't speak, real world roots. Real world roots. Rogers is the roommate that everybody gets annoyed by within a month. And then somebody starts drunk screaming at him at three in the morning. And then there's a meeting the next day to smooth the air. But then three people start screaming that they think he's better than them. That's kind of Rogers the last,

I would say six years. And the move is, and this is autobiographical. The move is if you really want to control the narrative, as they would say, is have the fight, but then go into the confessional camera and pour out your heart to the confessional camera, give them lots of great soundbites that aren't in front of the roommates. That's how you control that thing. And that's, that's a classic Rogers move. Classic Rogers. Right. You get the camera time.

You don't give the roommates the satisfaction of admitting that they were right and you win both ways. That's Rogers. That's how you do it. All right. That was a great ending. Good luck with the show this year.

It's really good. Say hi to everybody from me, even Schrager. I will. I will tell him. And Bill, like Mav, tells Charlie on his way out, I enjoyed being here. Talk to you soon. Better, man.

All right, we're going to bring in Julian one second first. CBS Sports HQ. As I've talked about on this podcast before, sports television changing not always for the better. Lots of yelling, beating topics in the ground, hot takes that I'm not sure the hosts even believe. Well, CBS Sports HQ is looking to change that

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Watch anytime from anywhere on your phone, at home, under Apple TV, Roku, Fire TV. Could not be easier. Download the CBS Sports app and watch CBS Sports HQ today. And since we're here really quickly, don't forget about the Ringer NFL show. If you're looking for fantasy or gambling stuff, don't forget about Against the Lodge with Cousin Sal. I'm going to be on there this week as part two of our Over Under's pod. And don't forget about Rosillo's

podcast, which we are relaunching in September and he's going to be doing three a week. So you want to be ready for that as well. All right. Here she is, the queen. Well, cross another one off the bucket list. Julia Louis-Dreyfus. This is great. I'm really excited for this. I am too. You brought your son, one of your sons. I brought my son, Henry. Huge fan of yours. Oh, that's nice to hear. Yeah.

I was asking you before we started about parenting, how they leave. Yeah. But then you get them back. If you're lucky, they come back. You've gotten both of them back. I got them both back. Here's a key. Make sure you have really nice sheets and a really comfortable bed.

That's it? That's what wins them over? Food in the fridge doesn't even matter? Sure. That goes without saying. But people undermine the value of a very comfortable bed. So expensive, clean sheets. Hyper big.

Soft sheets. Yeah. They don't have to be super expensive, but just get a good thread count. What about pillows? You go extra on pillows or not really? Totally. Okay. The whole deal. That's good. So they're back. Was it sad when they were gone? I mean, it sounded like you didn't have a job. Devastating. Devastating both times. You got to walk me through now that my

daughter's 14 and it was all easy until right around now. Really? Yeah, because she's going to ninth grade. Like, I know what's waiting. Right, right. The key for me is just a lot of, I get most of my info on the car rides. Very important. Because you're also a sports parent. Don't say anything, just drive. You drive and eventually they're going to start spilling stuff.

That's correct. And you can break them down. Especially, we just had this tournament where it was like the drives were two hours each way. Oh, yeah. And I was like, oh, my God. I'll feed her. She'll get a little groggy. Then I'll be able to find out everything that's going on.

Although I will say with our younger son, both boys were athletes, are athletes. But with our younger son, he would go absolutely ballistic when they lost a game. And then it was like, it was a negotiation between me and my husband. If we happened to be there in two cars, who was going to take this sourpuss home? Oh, to hear the tirade on the way home? Oh, the screaming. There was nothing we could say.

If we said, hey, you played well, or better luck next time. It didn't matter what we said. You don't have any idea. He would go absolutely bullshit. What was the sports parent experience for you when they actually made the dance and now they're like showing you on TV and all that

and there's this whole protocol for how the parents are supposed to behave. You don't want to look like a lunatic in the stands and be on Twitter and stuff. Yeah, I will say that being famous under those circumstances was a bit of a drag. Because I had to be aware of, you know, I'm a very anxious sports parent on the side. I mean, I try not to let that out. But in fact, I am.

And I don't even like to sit next to my husband because— What's he like? I think we both get anxious. And he just makes me more anxious and i can't i can't hear anything that he says it drives me nuts and and and this is a reflection reflection on me not him i mean he's perfectly because he's doing like running commentary stuff not necessarily it just doesn't matter what he says i can't hear it God love them. Anyway, so I get anxious. So, you know, but I'm aware that there's a camera there. So it's like, it's not like when I'm at their high school games, you know, I can just be myself. So all of a sudden I have to be, you know, I had to wear makeup, you know, have to put makeup on and

try to look reasonable. Anyway, but it was divine. We loved every second of it. It was really fun. And I remember I was at South by Southwest when I heard they made it into the tournament. It was super exciting. And yeah, made it to round two. It was nice.

I noticed during Wimbledon, Coco, the 15-year-old prodigy who won a few rounds and her parents were there. Yeah. And now that I can, not that it's happened, but I can envision myself in situations where you're the parent in the box or the parent in the stands. Calmness is the key. Yes, you have to remain calm. There's some line you just can't cross.

That's right. And I've found that way when i'm on the sidelines watching watching my kids is initially i was like too into it but there's there's got to be this serenity what do you mean into it were you screaming there might have been a screaming face yeah right oh but not not at the kids but just like just getting into it yelling at the refs and doing all that everyone has that one and then you kind of realize, oh, I shouldn't act this way. This isn't great. I don't think I behaved badly, but I just got very into it.

So even if I look calm, I was dying on the inside. Can we go back to the 80s? I'd rather not. Come on, please. Sure. So I'm an SNL baby. Okay. What does that mean exactly?

That means I don't remember life without SNL. I was like probably six when the show started. Okay. So how old are you, if you don't mind my asking? I'm 49. Okay. So in the early 80s, I'm an only child, and Eddie was my guy, and the SNL was super important. Oh.

And then you showed up. All these new people showed up. I was like, hey, new people. But you were on the same show with Eddie for like two years there. Yes. And he was actually like a real life superstar who just happened to be on the show. But you were there when it like went it descended to a whole other

level. His stardom? Yeah. 100%. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He was in his own universe. Like he hosted the show with Nick Nolte. Were you there for that year when Nick Nolte called in sick or something last second? And then Eddie's in there? I can't remember, but it sounds familiar. It was a long time ago.

Yeah. But you were like 21 at that point? Yeah, I was. I was really young. And then you're thrown into the show that's still really battered. And then Eddie's on it and he's like a phenomenon. Yeah, Eddie's a phenomenon. The show itself wasn't that good.

But Eddie was great. It had its moments, though. It had its moments, but it wasn't like what it had been. And it certainly, I don't mean, I'm not dissing Eddie in any way. He was fantastic. But, you know, and then it went on to get super good, but later. But yeah, I came, I was also sort of an SNL baby in the sense that when it first came on the air in whatever, what was that, 75? 75, yeah. Okay. So I was in high school or junior high or whatever and so you can imagine I mean I was just out of my mind

I felt like these people were my people you know and there's nothing like it on television it was so irreverent yeah there's quite literally nothing like it and so then to get cast on it was that a dream like

someday I'm going to be on that show? Because in college you were doing like improv, all that stuff. Yeah, I was doing improv, but I mean, I was doing plays. I went to Northwestern and I was in the theater school there. So I was sort of an actress. And then I worked in Chicago, you know, with Second City. But primarily the big, huge part of my life was a practical theater company. And it was with that, we were doing a show with Practical Theater Company.

And that's when the SNL producers came and they hired us all right there. Yeah, they took all of you. All of us, yeah. I remember, I want to say it was the first show. It was, I think your husband was in it. And who was the other guy, Gary Kroger? Correct. Who was on.

And it was a sketch about, and it ended up with milk coming out of somebody's nose. And it was, when I was like 12 or 13, like the Heineken, I was like, this is this is all I've ever wanted from television right here

is milk coming out of somebody's nose well I'm glad we could provide entertainment for your 12 year old self yeah so then

the rest of the 80s like you'd been on the show and it's like what's gonna happen with her yeah and then there was a couple shows

and nothing happened for a long while you had the Family Ties guy. That was like a big show. Well, you know. Because he was a thing at the time. Yes.

Gary Goldberg, my guy. But that show never made it though. Well, we did two seasons. Yeah. So that's something. I did actually, the first real proper job I got, because I came out here,

I did SNL for three years and then I wasn't getting any work in New York. And so I went to, I got for the, uh, cause I came out here, I did SNL for three years and then I wasn't getting any work in New York. And so I went to, I thought, okay, I've got to go to LA and, uh, which I did sort of begrudgingly cause I really didn't like it here. And, um, why didn't you like it here? Well, I, you grew up on the East Coast, right? Yeah. It was just so completely unfamiliar. It didn't have any reference points for me as a city. Yeah. The way everything does on the East Coast, sort of.

Architecturally, it's kind of a shit show and it's sprawling. It was also a lot different back then. I feel like L.A. has more of a shape probably than it did 25, 30 years ago. Yeah, that may be the case. Perhaps LA is a little groovier than it was when I came. But I don't know. Anyway, I didn't love it. The ride sharing helps.

The what? The ride sharing helps this generation. Sure. If you're there 30 years ago, it's like, how do you get anywhere? I don't remember. I think I rented a car. Ugh. Right.

And I was living in the fucking Barham apartment. Oh, my God. Apartments on Barham. Oh, like where they would put. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, right. That's kind of sad. Oh, yeah.

Were you married at that point, though? No, I was not. Uh-uh. But I was looking. Anyway, I came out here looking for work. And I got cast in this pilot, which was a spinoff of Family Ties with Scott Valentine. Nick, Nick had a moment. There you go.

Look at you. No, you're in good hands right now. You're not throwing anything at me that I'm not going to be ready for. That is, first of all, impressive. Nick was a thing. Nick was huge. Nick was like Nick and Mallory were a real, a couple that I rooted for in the mid eighties. I did too. Yeah. Anyway, so we did that pilot.

It didn't go anywhere. Didn't get picked up, but it was out of that, that I got cast in a day by day, which is the Gary Goldberg show. I did that for two years and I actually had a great time doing it. And Andy Borowitz ran that show. Really? Yes. So what'd you learn from that show that you took to the next show? Anything? What did I learn? Well, I had fun and it felt good. And I hadn't been having fun up until then. Right. Yeah. It doesn't seem like you liked SNL that much. No, I didn't. I mean, I certainly made friendships there. Yeah. And I learned an enormous amount. I mean, the learning curve was big.

But I didn't, it was sort of a cruel, the culture was pretty cruel and misogynistic and druggy and stuff. But that was, I mean, it was the 80s. That was like the height of the cocaine era, right? Yeah, that's right. The 82 to 85. Yeah, that's right. Coke, everything. Actually, I don't even know what I mean.

I don't know what else they were doing, but whatever. They were doing drugs, a lot of drugs. And, but it was, anyway, I just didn't have a great time. And I was incredibly unprepared going to be a great time and I was incredibly unprepared going to be on the show I was really unprepared I think you were the youngest female cast member

probably ever right? I don't even know if they've had anyone younger since I don't know possibly not because the other thing is you have Eddie that first couple years but then that last year then that's when they got all the all starsstars and all the sort of like Martin Short, Billy Crystal. Those guys were like finished products at that point. Totally. They were like practically senior citizens. Yeah. So anyway, and they were great. And I mean, you know, I had made friendships

with Mary Gross and Tim Kazerinsky and Larry David, by the way. But it was fundamentally not a good time. So having fun in a job, you know, where like writers would write for you and you would get jokes that you could sort of score with. That was like, oh, my God, it was amazing. So that's what it was like doing day by day. I loved that, you know. I know everyone says this to you,

but this is actually really true. Because I love Seinfeld because he was one of the best Letterman guests. Uh-huh. And Letterman had like his seven guys. Letterman was my favorite show. And he had like the seven guys that were really regulars, like Leno, Seinfeld, George Miller.

That's right. And, you know, Seinfeld would just go on and kill. Yeah. So I actually saw him twice, just once in Stanford and one in Boston. And it was always like rooting for him. It was like this guy. So when he got a show or the pilot or whatever, it was like, they gave him a show? Like, I just couldn't believe it.

And then so I was in from the ground floor, but you weren't on the first one and then you showed up. I think the first season though ends with you guys end up together and then it's like never addressed again. Is that the first season? Or the first full, the 13-episode season, like the first extended season. The deal episode.

Yeah. And it ends with it's like, oh, they're going to end up together. And then it's like they pretended it never happened from that point on. Correct, yeah. Why did they pretend it never happened? Or did they expect, like, I wasn't supposed to remember you ended up together? You know, I think the whole idea of turning, I think it was a big actual creative fight between, I remember vividly, Larry and the powers that be at Castle Rock at the time. Yeah. I remember vividly, Larry and the powers that be at Castle Rock at the time,

over how to handle that particular episode and that particular scene. That episode is incredible. It's one of my favorite episodes. It is? Yeah. I really like that episode. I just, everything, the beats of it, how it ends, it's just like really well-constructed. The negotiation between them on the couch was, there was a lot of arguing about that, I remember vividly. How that would go.

How that would go. How to play it. And because Larry was absolutely adamant that that was not meant to be a romantic scene in any way. Yeah. Right. But when we were doing it in the rehearsal we were actually playing it somewhat romantically and he went nuts and the and the castle rock went nuts because they wanted it that way because they wanted sort of like a will they won't they i mean i mean, I think, you know, sort of more sort of standard. That was the moon landing era where will they, won't they was the move.

Was that the move? And by the way, that's been a trope for. Cheers. Yeah. Hundreds of years, shall we just say. So, and I remember actually very vividly going home and telling my husband Brad about this. And I sort of tried to explain how Larry wanted me to do it, but I wasn't quite understanding what Lair meant. And then Brad sort of said, oh, no, no, no, I get it. And he was explaining to me what Larry meant and he was right. And so I went back the next day and was able to sort of do it correctly in rehearsal. And Castle Rock was not thrilled with, I mean, I don't know if they'd cop to that now, but they were not thrilled, the various producers from the studio.

But who cares? When did you stop worrying the show was going to get canceled? I guess after season three, I guess. That's also my answer. Because I remember like Cheers was ending at some point, one of those years. And at some point, somebody wrote a story about how NBC was thinking Seinfeld could be the next Cheers for them.

Right. And I was like, oh, so they're not going to cancel it. I was worried the whole time. Well, yeah. Because everyone always canceled my favorite shows. So I was just oh so they're not going to cancel it I was worried the whole time everyone always cancelled my favorite shows we were getting beaten all the time by Jake and the fat man Jake was a beast at the time

beast so killing us content machine Jake and the fat man I don't remember what the premise of that was I don't think I watched it and Home Improvement was on at some point I can't remember what the premise of that was. I either do. I don't think I watched it. And Home Improvement was on during this at some point. I can't remember.

But anyway, whatever. So it was then. When we made the first four, they made the pilot. I wasn't in it. Then they made the four episodes. And we made those. And I thought, well, this is so not like anything on television. And it is so good.

I'm thinking to myself, it will never see the light of day. I was utterly convinced. I really was. They're too stupid to pick this thing up. That's how, I just assumed that's how it was going to play out. Right. I was still traumatized when they canceled It's Your Move with Jason Bateman after one season. After that happened, I was like, I'm not trusting these people ever again. Which shows I like. Yeah, that's good.

That show should have been on five years. Okay, well, I never saw it, but I like Jason Bateman. It's good. He was, the whole plot of the show was, he was, he's a single mom. He's a single mom? No, he was his, he had a single mom. And the neighbor liked him.

Yeah, he's like a kid. He's like 13. Oh my God. And the neighbor a single mom. Oh, because he's still a kid? Yeah, he's like a kid. He's like 13. Oh, my God. And the neighbor liked the mom, and all he did was like, fuck with the neighbor, and that was the entire show. That's a great premise. It was great. I was child-divorced, so I was like, this is great.

I hope this gets renewed for nine seasons. Did you ever see that show, The Courtship of Eddie's Father? It was a little before my time, but I remember the reruns. Yeah. What was the premise of that one? It was a dad and a son. I don't know if they used the word divorce or not. People let me tell you about my dad. Yeah, it was great. Yeah. That's who the dad was. Yeah. There's not enough divorce content. I know. Because Kramer versus Kramer, we're going to do a rewatchables podcast on Kramer versus Kramer with me and three other ringer people whose parents are divorced. And it's just

going to be like a divorce therapy session about the movie. Well, my parents are divorced, so I'd like to be in on that. You want to be in? We'll get you in. We'll get you a fifth seat. I'm not fucking kidding. It's the best divorce movie of all time. I mean, I could give you my power rankings, but that's number one. The squid and the whale is way up there. The jerking off into the book. Yeah, I wish that wasn't in there. That was Noah Baumbach was feeling himself. Have you been in a divorce movie? Well, it wasn't really about divorce, but I've actually played a divorced woman a number of times. I did a series about a woman divorced with a child. No, but I mean like a movie where divorce is the theme of the movie. No.

No. I did a movie called Enough Said. The mother's divorced, but really the movie was about a kid going to college and starting a relationship with James Gandolfini. Oh, yeah, yeah. That was his last movie. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that was. What was he like?

Very surprising to me. Very lacking a lot of confidence, which is surprising. Really? Given his incredible talent. Yeah. Even at that point? Like Sopranos is done at that point.

Well, but remember in this particular movie, he was playing a different kind of role. And he was very, very questioning as to whether or not he kept thinking, he kept making jokes about, you can fire me if you want. Anyway, but he was a lovely guy. I loved him. We're taking a break to talk about SimpliSafe.

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Wait, I have to go backwards too. Yeah, go ahead. Elaine. Okay. Because I don't, you probably know this. This is going to be awkward for your son. Elaine was like everybody's dream girl in the 90s. That is so depressing. I know.

It really was. It is. We all wanted our Elaine. Yeah. And not even somebody that we date, just somebody like that in our life. Right. You know? I'm like, oh, man, it'd be cool to have somebody like that.

I could talk to them about stuff. Right, right. Who knows? We might like each other. It might not work out. Right, right. Who knows? We might like each other. It might not work out. Yeah, right. It was kind of like the dream, late 80s, early 90s relationship.

Make out once, and maybe nothing happened. Then you just settle into a friendship, but I can still. But maybe it might happen again at some point. I think she became the defining character for that. Yeah. I think that's how guys saw that character.

Uh-huh. She was sort of one of the guys, I think, to a certain extent. But also, like, the confident friend who would tell you the things you needed to hear. Right. You know? Like, if you had a, like, sister's a bad way to put it. But, like, if you had an older sister, like, I noticed it with my kids. And my son's wearing something,

and my daughter would be like, take that off. What are you doing? Like her ability to give shit to the other characters, that wasn't really something that was on TV that much. No, that wasn't. It was usually like the sarcastic little sister and what's happening or family ties or something. That was really the only time you saw that. Yeah.

Sort of a, sort of a heartbeat type as opposed to what you're describing. I get it. You get it. You still don't like it though. You didn't know where I was going on that one. So I can sit back. No,

I'm just thinking about the, the look, you know, her look. That was a, that, you know, just looking back at that, that's like, oh, Jesus. But anyway. Like the clothes and stuff or the hair? The clothes, the big hair, the whole. That was what the night, that was early 90s. I know, that was the look.

That was the look. I don't like looking back at, do you find that? Like if you. I wasn't on Seinfeld. No, no, no, no. I'd probably watch no no no i mean like if you're looking back at in a photo album you see photos of yourself oh they're horrible yeah so you see my point the 80s were even worse the late 80s late 80s were kind of the nadir and

then early 90s got a little better but not really 70s has sort of turned around yeah it's come back cool again but there was a period of time i looked back on the 70s i sort of turned around and become cool again. But there was a period of time where I looked back on the 70s and thought, holy fuck, what is that? What are those barrettes? So when you're flipping, I mean, it's still always on when you're flipping channels, do you see yourself and you're like, oh no! That outfit!

Yeah, I don't watch that stuff very much. But it's still funny, but I don't watch it too much. I mean, when the kids started, Henry specifically, when he started to watch it and then, and, and he would say, Hey mom, I'm watching this one. And I, then he has to remind me what happened. Cause I don't really remember, but, and, uh, and so then maybe I watch it with them or something, but not very much. It's weird. The streaming thing has given a new life to all these shows that were dead and buried. Seinfeld, Friends, even more current shows like The Office. And I watch it with my daughter's generation, and they're just going through all these old shows. And you can binge them in a way that, I guess maybe 10, 12 years ago, you had DVDs where you could just buy all the DVDs or rent them or whatever. Yeah, I have a lot of DVDs. Now it's easy to plow through them. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, what do we do with had DVDs where you could just buy all the DVDs or rent them or whatever. But yeah, I have a lot. Now it's easy to plow through them.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. What do we do with our DVDs now? I'm not sure exactly. I've been thinking about throwing mine out. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like that might be the move.

Right. CDs, same thing. I know. That's a hard move to make. It's a tough one. It's a tough emotionally. Yeah. And also there is a little

thought in your mind, which is am I going to regret this in 25 years? Are these things coming back? Well, like records, for Christ's sake. Right. Just saying. I had Larry David on the podcast when I was at ESPN,

so probably like six years ago. Yeah. And we did a whole thing about the finale. And he talked about how he felt about it. And I guess he had never really talked about it that much in an interview. And it became like a two-day news story. You're kidding. Yeah. What did he say?

Forgive me, I don't know. What did he say? He felt like it was underrated and he felt like people didn't get it. And he felt like it should have had a better legacy. But he was funny about it in the way that he would be funny about it. I think it was, I think I personally, first of all, I haven't watched it that much, but the doing of it, I loved doing it. Yeah. And I understand why people maybe had an issue with it.

But you know what? You can't, I mean, think of all the people that watch that thing. You know, fuck it. You're not going to appeal to everybody. And nobody wanted to see the show go off the air anyway. So, but I just remember, I look back at that particular episode so fondly because when we were sitting in that courtroom, it was like we were watching our show.

Yeah. So all of these guest stars came parading through and doing their bits, and it was all we can do to keep our shit together. We were just howling, laughing. Nobody was a bigger fan of the show than we were. Yeah. In it. The series finales in general, Pete, it's just really hard to win.

Unless there's a natural ending where you know the person's going to die at the end. We just had this with Game of Thrones. There was no way Game of Thrones was going to end that people were going to be 100% happy with it. Yours, it seemed like people, for Veep, it seemed like it was about as positive as it's going to be. But even then, people are just mad that the show's over, you know, and it's never going to live up to what they had in their head. Yeah. I think we did our finale well, actually, the Veep finale.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that came off pretty well. Because it was like you say, you know, you say, well, unless somebody's going to die, you're waiting for them to die or something like that. But then you know what's going to happen. And what I like particularly about our finale was that it sort of – everybody's sort of character arc within the show was sort of resolved on Veep terms.

Right. And also you didn't see it coming. Did you think that was going to be a whole decade of your life? I hoped it would be. So you thought signing up, you're like, this might be my 2010s. Well, yeah.

I mean, I hoped. I was really excited. When I made the pilot, I had a pretty strong feeling. I was going to say, you probably have a good shit detector at that point. Yes, I do.

That's why this interview is ending in the next two minutes. Was it weird when the showrunner left and the other showrunner came in? Cause I always think that's a hard one to pull off. Yeah. Tricky, really hard. So what happened? Walk me through it well um let's see armando inuchi who's the genius creator and original executive producer of veep um left after season four he really wasn't there much for season four in fact but he left officially left after season four. Now, he's British. And you probably know that in Britain, people don't do years and years and years of television.

That's not the culture of making entertainment. Right. So he was, he'd had it. It was enough already. And, which I totally get. And, but I didn't want to end the show. And so. That was it.

That was it. And so, so, and, but he understood that. It wasn't like there, there wasn't any friction about that. He, he understood that. It's just that he couldn't do it anymore. Also, his family was in the UK. It's a very, making that show is very labor intensive. I'm telling you, it's the hardest job I've actually ever had.

And so, and we shot the thing up until that point, we were shooting in Baltimore, Maryland. So he was, you know, flying back and forth from the UK. And, you know, it was hard. And all the writers were British too. Anyway, but I didn't want to end it because I loved it, and I wanted to keep going. I thought we had more story to tell. You're right.

Yeah. So then it was just a question of finding who is going to run this thing. And I say just as if it's like low-hanging fruit, this guy, that girl, whatever, you know, but it ain't. And, and fortunately for us, Dave Mandel was available. And Dave Mandel and I had worked together, of course, on Seinfeld and also on Curb Your Enthusiasm. And, and so we met and talked at great length about where he thought the show could go. And we were definitely on the same page. And by the way, up until that point, he was a huge fan of the show.

And he was a big government major at Harvard. So he was politically very astute. So he was sort of right for the gig. But it was, talk about divorce. Not that it was, it was not, um, uh, uh, negative in that sense, except that it was because I had to maneuver my whole cast about which I felt them. I felt very protective. And the show we'd made thus far and move it into this new universe with this new guy running it and all new writers with the exception of three

that we brought with us from the UK. And we moved the show to California. So it was a big undertaking. It's a fucking miracle it worked out. I was gonna, that's why I brought it up. It seems like that usually goes horribly. It was a big gamble. It could have goes horribly. It was a big gamble. It could have tanked.

It was a huge gamble. Because there's like four different ways that could have gone wrong. Oh, yeah. Many more ways it could have gone wrong. I'm telling you, I was shit in my pants the whole time. I was. I was really scared. Well, I think that show also, when real life starts getting super weird too,

that also helps from a narrative standpoint. What do you mean, Trump? Man, just like, yeah. No, that made it harder. You think? Why? Well, because, let's see.

Trump, we were doing, oh God, yeah, season six. And we were about halfway or more through the season of season six and he gets elected, right? Trump. Yeah. And then we're getting ready for season seven. And then I got breast cancer, so we had to shut down. And so we had about 10 months there of Trump, shall we say, feeling his oats and kind of putting the pedal to the metal. That's a very diplomatic way of putting it. Well, I'm trying to say reverent to the office only. And so his behavior, you know, and this show was about, you know, in front of the curtain and behind the curtain behavior in political culture.

Well, now all of a sudden there is no curtain. This asshole's behaving like the orange turd that he is. And by the way, his behavior, well, for example, the pilot episode of Veep, Selina Meyer gets in huge trouble for saying at a public event that she was hoisted by her own retard. And that was the scandal. Can you imagine? That is a non-story today. Yeah. It's a non-story.

It doesn't even go on my Apple News feed. Correct. That's, yeah. It's a non-story. It doesn't even go on my Apple News feed. Correct. That's right. And so, so things really morphed. And so we, so Dave Mandel likes to joke that he gave me cancer, so that gave him time to figure out how to, to, to morph the show into what we did in the final season, which was decidedly, I think, different tonally, but in a good way, than what it was originally. You know, I mean, all television shows morph over time. I mean, that's just the nature of anything that has any life to it, you

know? Do you follow or do you care about like where stuff's going just from, you know, what we grew up with was the 22 episode season and then cable kind of shifted that and now 13 episode season, some comedies now are eight episodes. Then you see a show like Fleabag, where it's like a six episode, 25 minutes per episode. It's almost like a six part movie that's two and a half hours and you're done. And it almost leaves you wanting more. And I wonder if that's like where we might be headed, at least with some of the creative ideas we have.

We are headed there. We're there. That's good for you though. It's great for me. Could be for your next project. Totally. One there. We're there. That's good for you, though. It's great for me. I love it. Could be for your next project. Totally. One episode and you're out. Yeah.

Or you're filming six 25-minute ones. You're done. Yeah, completely. Just enough to get like the giant, that HBO, that 14-story,

you know, on Sunset? Yes, of course I do. Yeah. Just enough to get in that building. Just enough to get your puss up there. Yeah. Are you thinking about next projects? I am. Yeah. Just enough to get in that building. Just enough to get your puss up there.

Yeah. Are you thinking about next projects? I am. Why do you have anything? I'll do it. That sports mom angle is pretty good. Sports mom? The whole, the sports parent thing.

I like divorce. Uh-huh. You like divorce? A Big Little Lies season three would be fun. No? Well, I don't know. I don't know. I'm just throwing out ideas.

You put me on the spot. I did. But it's interesting that you are pitching me Big Little Lies because I don't think you work on that show. No. I was just trying to think of something that would be easy for you. I was trying to think six episodes and out. Your kids are back in LA now. Yeah, right.

You don't do like 100 episodes. No, God, no. I can't bear that idea. I'm looking episodes and out. Your kids are back in LA now. Yeah, right. You don't do like 100 episodes. No, God, no. I can't bear that idea. I'm looking out for you. Yeah, yeah. I hear you. I'm actually in post-production on a movie that I made right after Veep ended. So I'm working on that.

And then I don't know what my next move is going to be. I'm thinking about what that is. I mean, I definitely want to keep working, and I love the pace of working in television. Do you have the Emmy record yet? Your son will know this. Does she have the Emmy record yet? I think so. Is it tied or she has it alone?

Tied. I think you're tied, right? Wins and nominations, I don't know. You might have the most nominations ever. I don't know. Like you might have the most nominations ever. I don't know about nominations. I'm tied with Cloris Leachman. Oh, we got to take her out. How many?

She has eight? Yeah. Yeah. You got to pass Cloris. We'll see. We love Cloris Leachman. She's great. What did she get for Mary Tyler Moore?

Yeah. She was amazing in Mary Tyler Moore. Did you watch that show? That was so... Too girly for you. No, it was like two years too early for me. My generation was like Jefferson's Good Times, that whole era. That's when I was really...

Did you watch the live reboot? Oh, yeah. That was Jimmy's idea. I know. Yeah. Wasn't it fabulous? Yeah. Wasn't Wanda good? Yeah, he was telling me about it.

And I'm like, you do the thing when your friend's telling you something like, yeah, that'll be cool. And I'm thinking like, he's not gonna be able to do that. It was great. Wanda was good. Yeah. I loved every second of it. It was really interesting to watch it in the context of some of the stuff they're talking about. 1973 is weirdly relevant in 2018.

You're going to be in the next one. I bet you'd be delighted to have you. I could be Maude. Maude's a good one. So that was like two years before my time too, but that was like the first kind of show like that. Yeah, Ballsy Lady. Yeah, Ballsy Lady.

They weren't doing that at the time. So you definitely want to keep working. Totally. Ballsy lady. Yeah. Ballsy lady. They weren't, they didn't, weren't doing that at the time. No. So you definitely want to keep working. Totally. All right. I'm glad. I'm glad to hear that. Oh yeah.

I definitely do. I just don't know. I'm, I'm, I'm fairly fried from doing Veep because it really was, I'm not kidding you a lot, really quite a lot of work to, to get that right. But, um, and, and finding just the right thing is obviously not an easy task. And you're totally healthy. A hundred percent. Yeah. Touch wood.

Yeah. Congrats. Thank you. Let's take one more break. Hey, Labor Day weekend is coming up. Everyone knows about the risks of driving drunk. You get in a crash, people get hurt or killed. But here's some surprising statistics. Almost 29 people in the U.S. die every day in alcohol impaired vehicle crashes. That's one

person every 50 minutes. Even though drunk driving fatalities have fallen by a third in the last three decades, drunk driving crashes still claim more than 10,000 lives each year. Drunk driving can have a big impact on your wallet till you get arrested and incur huge legal expenses. You could possibly even lose your job. So what can you do to prevent drunk driving, especially this weekend? Plan a safe ride home before you start drinking.

Designate a sober driver or call a taxi or a ride share. If someone you know has been drinking, take their keys. Arrange for them to get a sober ride home. Don't screw up your life. Don't let somebody else screw up their life. We all know the consequences of driving drunk. One thing's for sure. You're wrong if you think it's no big deal. Drive sober or get pulled over. Back to the podcast. I want to ask you about Larry David because I'm fascinated by him. Do you think he's a genius? Yeah. When did you think he's a genius yeah when did you realize he was a genius i think back in snl days really oh yeah i mean he's crazy i mean it's crazy crazy genius

but he was sort of like my friend who was a crazy genius you know so yeah and then it became quite apparent doing seinfeld like almost immediately were you because he was not what i really loved about larry is that he didn't give a shit yeah and that is a great asset as a creative person especially in 2018 i mean and by the way it can blow up in your face you know especially in 2018. I mean, and by the way, it can blow up in your face. Especially in 2018. Yeah. But he really, he was very, and he had a very specific point of view. And it was fantastic.

So yeah, that's, I don't know. Were you surprised that he was on television as the star of his own show? Did you have any idea that was his destiny? Well, I knew it was a stand-up. I never saw him do stand-up. Except there's some story. I think Jason Alexander was in the audience. Do you know this story?

He wasn't getting laughs, so he started swearing at the audience. It's true. He completely lost his temper. He berated the audience? Berated. But, I mean, in a legit way, berated. I think he might have called somebody a cunt or something. Oh, no.

I swear. But don't quote me on that. Oh, yeah, right. I'm being recorded. Yeah. Something in the neighborhood. Yeah, something in the neighborhood. Right. But. Something in the neighborhood. Yeah. Something in the neighborhood. Right.

But anyway, he went nuts. He had a temper. But a temper that was, could also be somewhat appealing. Endearing? Yeah. So when you're watching Curb, were you like, oh my God, this is Larry. How did, how is this happening? Or did you feel like he was my God, this is Larry. How is this happening? Or did you feel like he was playing a –

No, it made sense. I mean, oh, yeah, he's playing a version of himself. Yeah, that's what I mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's not what he's really like. Yeah, yeah. I think, unfortunately, for him, people think he's like that. Of course they do.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. But he's not, although that is sort of a hyped-up version of himself. You know, it's what he wishes maybe in his fantasy that he could be. Right. But he's not, although that is sort of a hyped up version of himself. You know, it's what he wishes maybe in his fantasy that he could be. I feel like we need that show more than ever right now because we've hit this. It's coming back, man. I know, but we've hit this incredibly uptight time in our country, which I think the last season of Veep definitely helped too.

But we need people on TV like pushing stuff and making fun of stuff. It's really the last way to do some of this stuff. Yeah, to make a point even. So when do you think you're going to get rid of your younger son from your house? Like 2023? How many years? Is there a time limit in your head as a parent? No, he can stay as long as he wants.

That's how I feel with my kids. Yeah. If they're back, they're back. It's great. Totally. I mean, Henry lived with us for, I don't know, how long were you living with us before you moved out? A while, right? A year.

A year. What did we not cover, Henry? When you first got the Seinfeld scripts and what about them were special? Were you like, oh, yeah, I have to do this. Oh, that's a good one. Henry suggests this topic. Yeah. So you get the Seinfeld scripts

or any other script that you've liked. What are you looking for? First of all, actually, here's a story that's sort of a little bit interesting. So prior to getting the Seinfeld scripts, so I actually had a development deal with Warner Brothers, which was a big deal, to develop my own series.

This was off of the success of Day by Day. Success, I'm saying in quotes. Yeah, it lasted. And so, but they offered me this deal. And so, and I was developing a script and then, and the script came in and I didn't, it was not me. It was not for me. Okay. And I had an out in my contract that I could opt out if I wasn't happy with material. And it wasn't, like I say, for me. So I did. And a couple of days later, I got, my agent called and said, hey, your friend, I don't know if they

knew that we were friends, but Larry David wrote these scripts and there are four of them and do you want to give them a read? They're interested in you for this. And so I was like, okay. So I read them. And frankly, I didn't, in two out of those four scripts, I had almost nothing to do. It was pretty small. Yeah. So I was like, hmm. But the other two, I had more to do.

But more importantly, the material was like nothing that was on television. Yeah. You know, it wasn't set up, set up, joke, set up, set up, joke. There was an actual rhythm pattern to the way sitcoms were presented back then. And sometimes they, I mean, I'm not knocking on sitcoms, obviously. There were plenty of sitcoms at work. It was definitely not like anything. Right.

And so I thought, wow, this is super interesting. So I go in and I met Jer. Now, I wasn't a stand-up. I didn't know that universe. So I sort of, sort of recognized him, but you know, Oh, maybe that guy was on the tonight show. So, you know, but whatever, but Lair, of course I knew. And Jer and I read this script together or scene and went super well. He was eating cereal. I mean, it felt like I was with it for true. And it felt like I was just like with guys that were my friends. I mean, it felt like I was with it for true. And it felt like I was just like with guys that were my friends. I mean, it didn't feel like, um, uh, an audition with fancy people,

executives and stuff like that. It was like, you know, uh, the, the nut jobs are running the asylum here. And so, uh, great. So anyway, made the deal over a weekend. They were quickly, they wanted to shoot these four episodes like the following week. So I remember my, they were crafting this deal over the weekend and we, we make the four episodes. And at some point in there, I get a call from my attorney saying that Warner Brothers wants their money back. They're threatening to sue you because you went and made this other show. It was called Seinfeld Chronicles at that time. And I was like, but I didn't do anything wrong.

And he said, well, yeah, but they really, they don't like the way that came down. Because it was, I mean, they were, one project was really butted up against the other. Right. But I had done nothing dishonest or illegal, nor would I, right? So I was like, well, so what should I do? And he said to me, well, I think you should just give them their money back. And I didn't like the feeling of that because that implication, of course, is that I did something untoward. And I was like, I don't know. So I called Gary David Goldberg to bring it

full circle back to our conversation, who created Family Ties and Spin City. And I explained to him the situation. And he said to me, you know what? Keep the money. I don't respond to bullying. Tell them to go fuck themselves. Yeah. But understand something. I was like a nobody. This was Warner Brothers Studios. I was a nobody. And so I did that. And I never heard from them again. Wow. That's a good story. It's a good one, isn't it?

Yeah. It was scary. It was a scary moment. And ironically, then I was at Warner Brothers years later. So did you tell the assistant to go fuck themselves or did you send a letter saying go fuck themselves? I don't know. I just told my attorney, I'm giving him back, go tell him fuck off and we'll see what happens. And then I just kept my fingers crossed. You talked about how that was like, it was all male writing staff or mostly male writing staff? Yeah. With the exception of one woman and then two women. Which is just the way it happened.

Oh, pardon me. Yeah. And Jen Crittenden, actually. Yeah. All right. So let's say this same show, 20, you could take How We Do Things Now and put it back in the mid 90s how do we do things now

there's more diversity I think in the writers room at least like toward the end of this decade right yeah how is Elaine different if there's more women

in the writers room that's a good question you've never gotten that one before no look at it I can tell you're impressed well

she probably would have had more material, frankly. I mean, I will admit to you that certainly, and Larry and Jerry will back me up on this. In the early days of Seinfeld, or for the first half of Seinfeld, I would go in periodically and beg them to put me in more of the show. And I'd usually end up crying because I couldn't help it. Really? Yeah, I did. It's true.

Because it was initially a Seinfeld. It did feel like a Seinfeld and George vehicle. Correct. And then Elaine and Kramer were kind of the side pieces. Right. You're like on an NBA team, you would just come in and get some threes off and then leave. There you go. See, I knew sports was coming up. Yeah. Right. You're like on an NBA team, you would just come in and get some threes off and then leave. There you go. See, I knew sports was coming up.

Yeah. I've been trying to shield you from the sports stuff. I can talk sports. Yeah. Sure. But so you wanted some plays called for you. I did. So was there a moment where that you got an episode that was like, this is what I'm talking about right here?

Well, I thought it was pretty significant, the contest episode. Yeah. Because that could have easily been a show about three guys not masturbating. Yeah. But the fact that all of a sudden you're talking about a woman masturbating and it's whatever, 19. Yeah, 92 or 93. Yeah. Nobody, I mean, nowadays nobody cares, right?

But then that was racy stuff. And I kept thinking, they're going to shut this down. I don't mean cancel us, but they're going to tell us we cannot do this show. But they didn't. It's funny because that's an iconic episode now. And what's been lost is what that show is like in the moment of like, oh, my God, they're doing this? I know. It really was like watching somebody jump off

a 10-story building or something. Right. Because that stuff just wasn't on television. No, my God, are you kidding me? Nobody talked about it. And we didn't even use the word masturbation there. No, that's why I was smart. It's very smart, yeah.

It was when I was writing for ESPN, especially the early years, they had all these media criticism rules. And I would figure out all these ways around it of making fun of announcers without overtly making fun of them and do little tricks. Yes. And it was like that, where you were able to do it basically because you never actually said it. It was all roundabout. Well, you know, that's how the, I don't know which episode it is in which somebody thinks that Jerry and George are gay, a gay couple. But not that there's anything wrong with that.

That was born out of a concern from the network. So not that there's anything wrong with that. It was tagged on to any time anybody referenced somebody as being gay or whatever. That would be the phrase right afterwards. Oh, that was a network note? Yeah. Wow. How do you feel about the Curb Your Enthusiasm comeback season now for that show? It was like 10 years later. I know.

I'm excited to see it. No, I mean the Seinfeld when you guys all came back on that show. It was like 10 years later. I know. I'm excited to see it. No, I mean the Seinfeld when you guys all came back on that show. Oh, pardon me. I thought you meant the next season for Laird. Oh, I loved it. I thought it was really cool. I thought it was fantastic.

I loved it. It was so fun to do. It was so weird. It was so surreal. What was the response to it that you were getting? I don't know. I don't remember the response to it that you were getting i don't know i don't remember the response was it i felt like people were happy with it yeah well it was what was so great about it was that it was like a seinfeld reunion but but not really our terms yeah and i

loved that yeah but it was so bizarre to uh go back i mean it's always bizarre to go back. I mean, it's always bizarre to go back. It was like when I went back to host SNL. That was so weird because I had all of this. I'd had the experience of being on it, and then I sort of grown up. Because I hosted 2007 or 6, maybe, right? And I left the show in 85. So there's a big space of time. So going back, it was like going back to high school with all of your adult knowledge and perspective.

And to a certain extent, the same was true of going back and doing, even though it wasn't as much time had passed, the same was true of doing the Seinfeld so-called reunion show within Curb. It was gobs of fun. Speed round. Funniest person you've ever been around. That I've ever actually been around? Yeah. Will Ferrell.

Sorry it took me so long to get there, Will. It's a good answer, though. It is a good answer. Favorite Seinfeld episode ever? Pony remark. Interesting. Wasn't expecting that one. Yeah.

Give me the case for living in LA and the case for living in New York. Okay. So the case for living in New York is if you're hyper wealthy and you don't care about having any space, that's the place for you. Okay. If you really dig traffic, like a lot, so that to get anywhere, and I mean even to the market, is going to take you an hour and 12 minutes. Okay. And also, if you like forest fires, then you should move to California. Okay. So take your pick. So you're anti-both.

Why not? I'm trying to stay negative all day today. Are you still in the speed round? Yeah, best Obama interaction. Oh, that I've had with him? Either. Could be either. Either Obama. Could be any Obama. I dance with Barack Obama.

I swear to God, it's true. That's a good answer. Where'd you dance with him? At the White House. Was it like one of those dinner thingies? Yeah. Actually, they had a blowout party before they left. Yeah.

And I went to that. And they were playing Brick House, and I danced with him. I know. Shit is right. It was a highlight. Did he give you the, I really like Veep?

Give you that, like, sneak that one in or no? I don't know if he said it like that. I don't know. Imagine him dancing and talking to you at the same time. He was making jokes about me being Veep. Speed round. What was the jokes about me being Veep. Speed round. Part you're most jealous of that you would have loved to have had

in an alternate universe. Helen Bonham Carter in Room with a View. Oh, that's such a good answer. That's a great one. I just watched that recently. I watch it every six or seven years. That's one of my most favorite movies of all time. Most surprising celebrity who mentioned to you that they liked one of your,

one of the shows that you've been in. Supreme Court Justice Elena Kagan. Which show? Beep. I mean, it wasn't a specific thing. She just likes the show. I'm surprised you're not reacting to that. Do you not find that amazing? I was trying to think which one it was. I was trying to think in my head. She's on the Supreme Court. No, I know.

I was trying to think what she looked like. She's one of the three women on the Supreme Court. I know. I was trying to get in my head which one. Well, it's not Ginsburg. That's a pretty good one. Yeah. Not Ginsburg.

And it's not Sotomayor, Mayor. That's a good one to end on. Any parent advice for me as my kids are about to hit high school or one of my kids? Yeah, keep driving them everywhere. Keep them in the car. Keep them in the car with you. And keep all of the car keep them in the car with you and keep all of the gatherings

at your house oh that's smart it is smart that's what you did? right hen? uh yeah it's a good idea that way you get

you can keep sort of tabs you can see if there's any you know bad eggs and oh that's true you're doing a lot of silent judging scouting and judging there's any, you know, bad eggs. Oh, that's true. You're doing a lot of silent judging, scouting and judging.

And also, by the way, it makes it sound like you're CIA or something. You kind of are, though. Yeah, but then you get to know the kids, get to know your own kids even better. You know, it's not like you're in there with them talking, but you're, you know, sort of hovering around seeing the scene. You're sizing them up. You're sizing them up. That's exactly right. I think that's a lot of fun. What's your drink, by the way? You go to somebody's house and they're like, can I get you a cocktail? Yeah. And you're like, oh, you actually can. I'll have this. What is it? That's not wine. It could be wine. I love wine. White wine? Both. Either, depending on the mood. Actually, all three. I also like rosé.

I love wine. Big decade for rosé. Yeah, I know. It's a little much now. It's kind of almost a little cliché. It's a little too cliché. That's right. And I like tequila.

Tequila? I do. You just got a grunt from Kyle. What the hell, man? He loves any liquor conversations. I do. I love tequila. I do. You just got a grunt from Kyle. What the hell, man? He loves any liquor conversations. I do. I love tequila. Just on the rocks.

Without crap in it. All right. So I'm going to spend a lot of time thinking what your next project will be. And I know you value my input greatly. Well, listen, if you want to. I think you should do the fleabag route of the six-episode season. Well, that is for certain. Where you're just in and out.

You should tell your agent. That's my next thing. But that's easy peasy. In and out. I understand that. But the real question is, what's the content? See, Bill, you've got to think about what the— I'm not there yet with the—

You're just thinking about episodes. Yeah, I'm just thinking structure first. The hook. The hook we'll get to. Character. Well, who haven't you played that you've wanted to play? Who do you want to inhabit?

There are a couple things I really would like to do. Yeah? I'd like to be in a movie musical. You've never been in a musical? No, not on film. Can you sing? Yes. Couldn't you tell when I sang the Courtship of Eddie's Father theme? I still wasn't sure. It was so gorgeous. So you're like one of

those celebrity sneaky singers. Correct. Because Kate Hudson, they did that thing with the parents. Yeah. And Kate Hudson sang Shallow and she was amazing. It was like, you can do this? Yeah. Good on her. Sneaky celebrity singer. Yeah. So that would be fun. So movie musical. Movie musical. Okay.

I'd like to do that. Oh, excuse me. I'd like to play a superhero or a supervillain. That would be fun. Either. Sure. But just, you know, do some fighting and shit like that, flying around. Oh, we do the thing where you got in like amazing shape and you worked with some karate dude for four hours.

What do you mean got into amazing shape? Look at me. What are you talking about? Superhero fight shape. I'm ready to kick your ass right now. And I also, I mean, and I'm definitely going to look into doing some more dramatic work. I'd like to do that. I'm not saying I'm not going to do comedy, but, you know, that's something that would be really interesting.

Okay, good. And you got to get one more Emmy. You just got to set the mark. You want to be in the Wikipedia when people are looking up Emmy winners for some reason. You're just right there. Okay. Yeah. It's important.

Well, it's all about trophies. It's all about trophies. That's it. It's important. Well, it's all about trophies. It's all about trophies. It's a rings culture. Yeah, exactly. Now, I think it would be cool to watch you do a whole bunch of quirky, different, like you in a musical. I'd be like, whoa, really? Yeah, I would love to do that. Yeah.

I would love to do that. In fact, I heard about a project they're making. They're putting Little Shop of Horrors on film. But I'm not the right age. Such a bummer. Did you ever see that show? Yeah. I mean, that was a big early 80s, mid 80s.

I know. I loved it. They used to have the commercial all the time. That and Evita. They would always show the commercials for those too. That's right. Evita. And Sunday in the Park too.

Yeah. This was a pleasure. Thank you for doing too. Yeah. This was a pleasure. Thank you for doing this. Likewise. It was really fun. I'm sorry it got so hot in here, but we had to turn the other air conditioner off. Why? Because it would pick up on the podcast.

Oh, so isn't that always the case? No. It sounds bad. We care about audio here. All right. Thank you, though. Thank you. Good luck with the sons in L.A.

Thank you. Good luck with keeping your kids at home. Thank you, though. Good luck. Thank you. Good luck with the sons in LA. Thank you. Good luck with keeping your kids at home. Thank you. I'll try. All right. Thanks so much to Julie Louis-Dreyfus. Thanks to Kyle Brandt. Thanks to SimpliSafe.

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And thanks to the NHTSA, if you think drunk driving is no big deal, you couldn't be more wrong. You can get in a crash, people get hurt or killed, and you could get arrested, incur huge legal expenses, or even lose your job. Next time you plan on drinking, like this weekend, Labor Day, make sure you plan ahead, designate a sober driver,

or use a ride service to get home safely. Drive sober or get pulled over. Back for one more podcast this week with the cuz doing afc over-unders and then nfc over-unders on his podcast can't wait see you then I don't have.