The Bill Simmons Podcast - NBA Draftapalooza, Part 2: Cade to Detroit and 2 Semi-shockers in Top Six With Ryen Russillo and Kevin O’Connor

Episode Date: July 30, 2021

The Ringer’s Bill Simmons is joined by Ryen Russillo and Kevin O’Connor to discuss the first six picks in the 2021 NBA draft in real time, including surprising picks by the Thunder and the Raptors. Host: Bill Simmons Guests: Ryen Russillo and Kevin O’Connor Producer: Kyle Crichton Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Hey, this is part two of Draftapalooza 2021. Kevin O'Connor, Ryan Rosillo. We did a part one was already up. This is part two, which covers picks one through six of the actual draft and our reaction.

There are a couple doozy picks in there. We did this live on Green Room as well. So that is all coming up. Here's Pearl Jam again. All right, part two of the BS podcast. Brian Rosino is here.

Kevin O'Connor is here. We're doing this live on Green Room. What could go wrong? 504 Pacific here. We're doing this live on Green Room. What could go wrong? 504 Pacific Time. We're about to get picks. They did something different this time. They had all the guys walk out with their families. I really liked it. All right. So

it looks like the Pistons are going to take Cade Cunningham. KOC, we okay with that? Great. That's the right decision. It's kind of a... I wouldn't call it a no-brainer but um because that just speaks to evan mobley and jalen green how talented they are um but it's as close to a no-brainer as it gets when you're talking about a guy who's six foot seven six foot eight can play make who can shoot off the dribble who can defend multiple positions who's a leader who

works hard like for the pistons here with their current roster you know as troy weaver said everybody's a fit, but Cade Cunningham is especially a fit next to their backcourt with Killian Hayes, Sadiq Bey in the frontcourt, and Isaiah Stewart. I love their young core, and the Pistons finally have hope. Someone who wants to be in Detroit too, it seems like.

Russello, I have my final rankings. Mobley won Cunningham 2, Green 3. I think Mobley is going to go down 20 years from now as the most impactful guy from this draft if I'm trying to actually win the title. All due respect to Cunningham, I think we basically had three number one picks in this draft. Sometimes that happens.

I just like Mobley the most, the way basketball is played now. What were your final rankings? I went back and forth on the two, and you and I talked about it a little bit because, you know, there are game evaluations and there are clip evaluations. And if you watch Mobley in clips, you can't believe he's not going number one. He does so many extra little things that are special for a big guy. You know, I was on with Chad Ford. He said one GM said he stopped looking at him as a center or four and start looking at him as a small forward.

I thought that was a bit of a stretch, but also speaks to kind of some of the projections for what he can be as a perimeter guy. But I kind of like Mobley is the idea of a five you can keep on the floor before we get to that because he's going to get picked here pretty quickly. The way the game is played today for Cade Cunningham to be 6'8 and shoot 40% from three and control things and not get sped up in all the big moments that he had in that second half scoring. There's just so much to like there. So if Cade ends up not being the best player in the draft 10 years from now, okay, fine. But it's hard for me to imagine with today's NBA game, the size shooting and passing, him not working out and having a big time impact. You can point to the turnovers. The more you watched full games of Oklahoma State this year, that was not a very good team.

It just wasn't. And teams would double him. He'd be fine. Davion Mitchell, who's terrific defensively, would get him sometimes. And then sometimes Cade would get him too. He was never, ever phased. He was always in control of the game. And I think that's a really special attribute to have

when everything's on you to make all those decisions. And Mobley didn't have to do any of those things. I think Cade is the safer pick, and I get it. I just like Mobley's upside. KFC, you're the tiebreaker. Who do you have? It's Cade. I give Cade the tiebreaker because he's one of those guys you can rely on to create a shot in a playoff situation in a game six, a game seven, when you need somebody to get a buck in. With Evan Mobley, I mean, he very well could become a guy who does that for you,

but it's much more of a theoretical skill than it is for Cade Cunningham, who already can. With Mobley, I mean, we'll see maybe if he goes third to Cleveland, he's going to be one of those guys who can play make for you from the elbows, maybe occasionally brings the ball up the floor, but Cade is going to be your primary source of offensive creation. And I'm always going to favor those guys. They're the most important players in basketball. Would you have tried to trade back? And do you think the Pistons tried to trade back here? They listened to offers for sure. They definitely did listen to offers. It's just as of now nothing was strong

enough to move off of kade cunningham which speaks to the type of player he could be i mean like kade kade is very it's very safe to say he'll be like a top 35 40 player it's just a matter of the heights he reaches like i mean i could see him becoming a top 10 guy he has that level of upside it's just a matter of if he can reach it or not. And I think with Detroit, they have the right surrounding pieces for him. And it's not going to surprise me one bit. If as soon as he steps foot there, we see Isaiah Stewart look even better. We see Killian Hayes look even better because he's one of those guys who makes everybody else around him better. Are you worried about your guy Killian? Not at all. Talk this through

now or now? Nope. Nope. Not, not, not even a little bit, Phil Killian not at all talk this through now or no nope nope not not not even a little bit Phil Killian this is a good thing for him because of Killian it's a good thing for him it's a great thing because he's in a situation here where there's less pressure for him to have to handle the ball less pressure less pressure he's not gonna be playing well he's gonna be playing he's gonna be getting stops on defense and facilitating just like he did as a rookie everybody looks at the poor scoring numbers. Bill, let's focus on the things Killian Hayes can do well. He'll develop his scoring over the course of time.

I hope he does. Look, by the way, Killian has to worry about Sadiq Bae at this point more than Cade. I mean, Sadiq's a better player than he is right now it would have been funny if they took if they took hal burton seventh to have hal burton and kate on the same team who are very similar with they don't need the ball a ton and they just can kind of fit in with everybody that would have been a fun backcourt all right the pick is in kate cunningham has been selected i like his. He went with the all black with the tie and the whole thing. He's putting on the Pistons hat. And there you go.

There was a moment in the last couple days when all of a sudden it looked like Jalen Green was getting worked out with Detroit. I found out Evan Mobley had a secret workout with the Pistons and he crushed it. And I think that was a schism a little bit on the Troy Rivers side versus Darren Tullum's side. A little bit? Yeah, a lot of it. Look, let's just share it with everybody because the entire week it turned into this whole idea that it wasn't going to be Cade, which I always kind of defaulted to Woj.

I don't think Woj is going to get this one wrong. I don't think Arne Tellem is going to do that wrong, do that to Woj. But for those that now that we share it, the story goes Jalen Green destroyed his workout. Cade Cunningham did not. Supposedly, one guy in charge wanted Jalen Green, and then another guy supposedly wanted Mobley. It was just in league circles, gossiping, bullshitting as we talked to everybody about it. You're like, wait, are you hearing this? What are you hearing? And then everybody, by the time last night, it was all coming together.

And I always kind of go with that, I default to Woj thing. I have a hard time believing Woj is going to tweet out two days ahead of time that Cade is going to be the pick and him not be the pick. But that was the inside part of it. The NBA circles, all the gossip and all this stuff. That's what's going on in the league the entire week with this number one pick. So it's kind of funny that it ended up landing

the way it did. And then there was a second secret workout with Evan Mobley who also crushed it. And I think, you know, I don't think we've seen a situation where there were three guys of the ceiling caliber of these three guys all kind of in play for number one for a team

that really had needs all over the board, right? KFC, there's any of these guys helped them. It wasn't a situation like with you know Drexler and MJ where they're like ah well we already have Clyde Drexler we don't necessarily the trait needed everything so you know they landed on the guy that wanted to be there who's definitely going to be really good but I still feel like Mobley is going to be a more valuable guy for winning a winning a title we will find out I can't wait this is going to be great we will find out and i mean jaylen green is a guy you didn't mention houston takes him number

two yes jaylen green he very well could become the best player in this draft too there's not a more athletic guy that's getting drafted than the top five there's not a player who has the scoring prowess from the perimeter that he does and And with Jalen Green, he did this. You had Jarrett Jack on your podcast, Ryan. I thought what he said about Green's work ethic and his desire to get better, it really connected with everything I've heard about him as a person throughout this whole pre-draft process. Like Jalen Green is somebody who wants to be the best possible player that he can be.

And with Houston here, I mean, he's going to get a lot of opportunities, a lot of shots early in his career to facilitate that development. Yeah, look, if you want to do a nice, like, kind of transition into Cade, like, hey, what are you worried about? And you're like, all right, he wasn't exactly dribbling past everybody. I actually thought he looked a little more athletic in high school than he did in college, but I also think teams are totally loaded up against Cade.

And Cade also had this habit of just absolutely destroying guys with his off arm think of that hardened stuff that harden gets away with brilliantly because he keeps it tucked in kate would have moments i was like my god he's just crushing these guys now then you pivot to jalen green like athletically there's not really much of a comparison and there's also as you guys know that's a much bigger step up college basketball to what we saw in the g league in a condensed version of the G League where the talent on the rosters is even deeper than it normally is because of the oddity of the season. Jalen Green is, and I'll say this a few times about some guys, he is somebody who has these moments where now you realize everybody that's around him all the time says, no, no, this is the guy. And Jarrett Jack loved him. There's another team that I've talked to where there's a connection to him when he was younger. They're like, no, no, no, you are making a mistake if

you're not taking green number one, because he has that elite scoring ability and all these things that you already want. I'm not telling you it was perfect throughout the G League because it wasn't. Some of the other numbers aren't great with him, but there were moments as a kid just right out of high school against much tougher competition where he looked like the most special player on the floor. I like the way most special player on the floor. I like the way he handled himself in the interviews. I do like watching the interviews, and I do think you can gleam stuff good and bad from it. And he just seems like an incredibly confident, well-put-together guy who was really focused. And had he played college for somebody, maybe he would have been the number one pick. I love this draft. I think for Houston,

if I'm trying to keep my job, as we discussed on the Sunday Night Pod, the green been number one pick. I love this draft. I think for Houston, if I'm trying to keep my job, as we discussed on the Sunday Night Pod, the green is the right pick. This will be a couple years. He's not going to come in and light it up right away. You can always point to like, ah, the potential, and you're hoping for kind of a slow boil. It would be the Richman's version of where we were

with Anthony Edwards last year, because I think he's a much better prospect. With Houston, he might lead the league in scoring. Eventually. No, this year. Have you seen some of the guys that scored this year for Houston? You think he hit the 30 points a game as a rookie? Kevin

Porter had a 50-burger, right? He had 55 points, I think, at one point. My favorite stat from this year is that guy was a Kyrie Thomas who took 21 shots in a game in his second career NBA game. Oh, my God. Well, can you... Kevin Porter Jr. has got to be like,

hey, man, we already said it at the spot here. Where do we need Jalen Green for? I thought we were good. I thought we had something. It is... My guess will be Jalen Green and Christian Wood will be the only two guys on this team that are on there right now.

Right. If you had to do this over again if you're Houston with the terrible Harden trade but it ends up getting you into the top three it was weirdly kind of worth it that the trade was as bad as it was.

They did the weird Levert piece of it. The old Depot piece didn't work out but it ended up getting them in the top three. Was that dumb luck or was that strategy, KFC? I think it was a smart idea. I said this at the time of the deal.

If you get Ben Simmons, you're playing towards the middle and you're missing an opportunity to have high draft odds and get an opportunity at some of these guys. We're talking all the time now about these issues with Simmons and how he fits somewhere and what Philly can get for him. I mean, did you really want that in Houston?

I mean, I'm not saying these draft picks will necessarily be better, but I think the overall aggregate of taking that approach, getting an opportunity in the top three here. In my opinion, it all adds up to potentially a better path forward for the Houston Rockets. You start off with Jalen Green instead of Franz Wagner if you get Ben Simmons. So, I mean, I like the Rockets' decision then. And I think those picks can end up being incredibly valuable for them down the line when it comes to trades and moves they can make to build around Jalen Green.

Plus, if you get Ben Simmons, you know, you get a proven fourth-quarter performer. Somebody who has shown he's not afraid of the spotlight at all. They just, on the draft telecast, compared Jalen Green to Bradley Beal. Who did you have for him in your shades of?

We had Zach Levine, Bradley Beal, and your guy, Malik Monk. Malik Monk. That would probably be the worst case there. Who do you have him as? Do you comparisons for solo I hate comparisons guy you don't like it I mean I'm not a big comparisons guy when they're right and it pops out I really like like the Luca Harden one I did on TV at ESPN and they wanted to laugh me off the set um yeah I was like okay

then none of you guys watched him you know none of you of you. When it pops, it's the best. But when every 6'11 guy who could dunk was Strohmeyer Swift for like five years, which I thought was disrespectful to Strohmeyer, you're just like, what are you guys doing? Like, all we're doing is looking at body types and length and be like, okay, he can't dunk. He can't dunk. Like, anybody that was a little off was Paul Pierce athletically. You know, do you guys realize how good Paul Pierce is?

You know what's the great thing about him, though, in the G League? I look at synergy and your possessions, which is a really good indicator of what kind of player you actually are, like how much ISO are you running, how much spot up, how much pick and roll ball hand or pick and roll man, meaning the role man, on that. He was actually 25% of his

possessions were pick and roll ball handler, which would surprise you for them to allow him to have. And look, the overall numbers weren't great on it, but it was, it was a lot more than spot up in ISO for him. Like they were trying to get him involved in the offense and running more

stuff, but he does really project, as you guys said, as a two guard, Russ, Russ is a Laker. I don't know if Shams got it first or Woj got it first. Shams had Westbrook, a second

runner in 24, a second runner in 28 to the Lakers for Kuzma, KCP, Harrell, number 22. Russell Westbrook, another team for him. So he wins the 2017 MVP for OKC. Ends up in Houston, Washington, and the Lakers all in the span of five years. I would not have predicted that. So anyway, there you go. I wonder if we'll get more trades today. What do you hear in KFC? I hope we get more trades. I mean, this is a big one. We did our pod reaction

earlier about the Russell Westbrook trade. I hope that's not it. We did also hear Evan Mobley going to Cleveland. That's official as well. Is it wrong to say I feel bad for him? Evan Mobley going to Cleveland. That's official as well. Is it wrong to say I feel bad for him? For Mobley? Yeah, I don't know if Cleveland's a team that I would have wanted to go to.

I don't know if they're particularly well... I don't think they're particularly well run. It seems like a team that's always in constant flux. You got to deal with the Kevin Love. What happens with him? I guess they're going to try to buy him out now. But if I were him, I would have much rather somebody traded into that spot.

Am I overthinking that, Rizal? I just don't know why you would be like, I really don't like Cleveland, but you'd like Houston. No, I wouldn't have liked Houston either. Yeah, yeah. I would have been rooting for somebody to trade up and save me like Toronto. Yeah, but with all of this stuff, with the trades,

we hear about a million things and then you have to crush it to even justify it. And then you're like, all right, well, if I just take the guy at three and get it wrong, you might not know until four or five years from now. Whereas if I trade for another guy and the other kid's awesome immediately that I just traded, then I might lose my job in two years. So you always

have to remember that part of it. The Jared Allen thing, he's an asset and you want to two years. So you always have to remember that part of it. You know, the Jared Allen thing, like he's an asset and you want to keep him. I just, when you aren't a good basketball team, I don't care about the draft pick and how he does or doesn't fit. My hope is just better than the other guy. Right.

And if he's better than the guy that's supposedly like a duplicate position, then okay, we upgrade it. And that's, I just don't think it should be that complicated. So, but he's the right pick at this point because I felt like it was those three guys, even though I do really like sucks.

I wish Rosillo had been, uh, I, I wish media worked like athletes. Cause Rosillo would have taken trade. So personally, if it was like, well,

it was just like the, so, and so I was agreed to trade Ryan Rosillo for the Kuzma Caldwell, Paul peril package. I feel like you would have been mad about that for like two months. No? No, I think I'd be like, hey, I'm really overpriced

and I haven't won a ton. I'd be incredibly honest. Realistic. All right, so Mobley is going. I like his suit. He's wearing like an Aqua Miami Heat type of look, which is going to make like his suit. He's wearing like an Aqua Miami Heat type of look, which is going to make no sense in Cleveland. This episode is brought to you by Movember. The mustache is

back with a vengeance. Look at Travis Kelsey. Before he rocked that Super Bowl ring, he rocked that super soup strainer. Grow a mustache for Movember. You'll do great things too. You won't win the Super Bowl, but your fundraising will support mental health, suicide prevention, and prostate and testicular cancer research. And if you don't want to grow a mustache, you could still walk or run 60 kilometers, host an event, or set your own goal and mow your own way. Do great things this November. Sign up now. Just search Movember. The draft is starting right here with number four.

We think Suggs goes to four or you think they trade out of it? I feel like Suggs is going to be the fourth pick. I just don't know who's taking him. What are you hearing, Cassie? There's a lot of mixed signals. It seems like Suggs is the favorite at number four, but Toronto has absolutely done their due diligence on guys like Scotty Barnes out of Florida State,

James Booknight out of UConn. So we, Jonathan Kaminga as well out of the G League. So we could see Masai Ujiri and Bobby Webster from the Raptors do a zig here when everybody's expecting them to go. Oh, a zig. With Jalen Suggs. Not a zag, a zig.

Going with a zig, not a zag here, Bill. Do you think that's the right choice though to go with Jalen Suggs or should they be looking in a different direction here? And also, there could be trade possibilities as well. Can I be Toronto GM for a day? Sure. I'm taking Suggs.

I am offering Siakam and Lowry sign and trade to Philly for Simmons and Tobias Harris. Let's go. Two for two. Nobody throws in anything else. And then next year, I have Simmons and Harris. I have Suggs. I have Van Vliet. And I'll go get some big guys, and I'm right throws in anything else. And then next year I have Simmons and Harris. I have Suggs. I have Van Vliet.

And I'll go get some big guys and I'm right back in this thing. And I just sell Ben Simmons. I'm like, it's a new start in a new country. Let's go. America didn't work out for you. You did great in Australia. You moved to America.

Mixed results, let's be honest. Now Canada, this is going to work. This is it here we go no i you just threw so much at us with so much salary that immediately i was like wait a minute now tobias harris is in there too like i'm sort of my mind well he's there siakam he's like five like four or five million more than siakam and then laurie simmons like i actually think that would work as i think everybody that's a Boston guy, whether you're a fan or at least tied to the team

and watch them all the time, all of us downgrade Siakam because of the semi-augele series. We don't give him enough credit. He's like, look, I'm not telling you he's the number one guy on a really good team, but he's probably better than me. We just feel like once you figure out

his one move near the hoop, which isn't fair, it isn't true. I don't know. I don't know what Philly's going to end up doing here, but you're right in the idea that you would have to be adding guys that are ready to go right now. Well, we think Suggs could be effective next season. So for Toronto,

who had this really weird year, where they definitely weren't the fourth worst team in the league, but they had the fourth pick, there's two roads that it could go. One is you just suck it up and you pay Lowry and he finishes Cruz Raptor or you try to use him

in a sign-in trade. I think the dumb move would be just letting him sign somewhere. What do you think is going to happen, Cassie? We just got it from Sham Sharani at Toronto was selecting Scotty Barnes with the fourth pick. Scotty Barnes from Sham Sharani.

So they're not going with Jalen Suggs here. There's a lot of noise leading up to today that it was going to be Barnes, which means Orlando at five for weeks, for weeks, it's been Barnes and number five. And so now the question will be what they're going to do there. But for Toronto, this isn't right. This is not like it was mentioned, but not a for sure thing, though. No doubt about that. And I mean, like for now, it seems like Toronto is keeping this pick. There was trade conversations with Oklahoma City who would have liked to move up to number four to get Barnes. So can't rule that out yet as we react live here.

But for Barnes going here to Toronto, I mean, that kind of fits the profile of so many of the guys they've drafted over the years versatile you know selfless ability to play different roles on either end of the floor so for Toronto here I mean if you have OG in an OB Pascal Siakam Scottie Barnes and a front court together you're you're talking about a team that could switch across positions so does this does this mean they're resigning Lowry Lowry? Because that's the only way this makes sense to me. I don't think Lowry has anything to do with it. Really? I agree.

No, I think that they re-signed Van Vliet knowing they may lose Lowry. The other problem was with anybody that they wanted to trade Lowry to, they kicked the tires of what Lowry's price tag was. He was asking for which is his right, but at $35-$36 to ask for 25 million a year per year on an extension that scares some other teams off they also have to marry make a

gary scares me as well right so there's gary trent decision that they have to make because that's why they did the norman powell flip but barnes is someone who when you watch he really like everybody says oh can guard through one through five he actually did it not in switches he would be assigned to the opposing team center and then other times picking up a guard full court. It was incredible. The only problem, look, we're talking about somebody who might be arguing for the number one pick if he could shoot. He's 27% from three, 60% from three throws, didn't show that he could shoot, but everything else about him is great. He's also a freshman who didn't even start a ton of games with him. I think he only started seven games for Florida State, but when he come into the game,

he was telling guys what to do positionally. Like, no, no, you're in the wrong spot. No, no, you're on the other side. Okay, no, no, come down in here. And he was right all the time. That's a really, really special thing to have in a freshman who wasn't even like the main guy because he was coming off the bench.

And he ran point for them too, Ryan. Insane. He legitimately played point guard. And whenever he talked to GMs about it, we'd talk about Scotty Barnes, we were always like, Hey, don't stick them in the corner and let everybody else play guard, you know? And maybe that's your Lowry point. I still think it's separate of it. You have to still let him show you some of the things he can do offensively, decision-making and passing. Because if you take that away from him, then he's a waste because he's

just can't shoot right now. And some people think he's never going to be able to shoot. And that's why he went four. I have a couple takes. One, I would have taken Jalen Suggs. I think he's going to be a better player. The whole Barnes, is he ever going to be an asset offensively thing is a little scary.

The way somebody compared him to a little bigger Scotty Pippen, potentially defensively. Now that'sllowed ground. I think Scottie's one of the three best perimeter defenders we've had. But if he could be a Pippen-level defender at some point, maybe not quite as good.

Maybe like 88% as good. I feel like he's more Draymond. All right. Well, either way, if he's on that level, I can see it. But man, I just feel like Sugg's dropping to five to Orlando.

I assume it's going to be Orlando. What a great thing for him. What a good chip on the shoulder moment for Jalen Suggs, right? Toronto didn't want me. He already said earlier in the week, the teams that pass on me are going to regret this. I've been a winner at every level.

He was minus 500 to be the fourth pick on FanDuel. Minus 500, really? This is a shocker. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, I mean,

I'm not a little surprised the odds were that strong on him going number four to be honest with you. But if he does go to Orlando here, and I'm sure we'll find out soon, for them,

for Kevin Clark, I'm happy. You know, you get them for Kevin Clark I'm happy you know you get a guy like I know you drafted Cole Anthony last year but Cole Anthony is not your face of the franchise all those guards are miserable right now yeah RJ Markel Cole Jalen Suggs is going to push them all out of the way Ryan

all right yeah is there a way somebody tries to move into this number five Orlando spot like at this point couldn't Golden State come flying in with seven and 14 for five to try to get Suggs? I guess. I mean, they may want to because this is something else that we brought up, right? Will Golden State want to use both picks with the tax bill where they're at right now? Did we talk about that long enough?

I guess... We didn't. You and I talked about it on the phone, but I don't know if we talked about it. I texted KOC about it too. They're going to get slaughtered by the tax with the 7th and the 14th. We figured out what the 14th pick

was potentially 20 million in tax. Yeah, I'm not sure on the exact numbers on this, but when we were texting about that last night, Bill, it seems like if they use the seventh and 14th pick, the total impact on the luxury tax

would be 30 million for the seventh pick and 20 million for the 14th pick. And that's annually because of the luxury tax penalty. And if they can move up to five for seven and 14,

that tax number goes down. Are you making up trades, though, or did you hear this one? No, I just think this is logical for Golden State. If I'm Orlando and I was going to take Kaminga or Scottie Barnes, but I wasn't really focused on Jalen Suggs, I'm like, oh, I'll move back two spots and take Kaminga. There were some rumblings that Barnes could go for. Suggs is the favorite going in,

but this isn't completely out of nowhere at all. And Orlando just took Suggs, so I guess they're not going to trade. There you go. Well, I'll tell you this, Ryan Russo, it was out of nowhere for me because I would have bet Scottie Barnes at plus 275 to be the fourth pick. I did not actually think Toronto was going to do it.

Toronto, they must have absolutely loved him. I still can't figure out the Lowry piece, though. What's the best sign and trade for them if it's not Philly? Is it, I don't know, Tyler Hero and something else? What is it? What I've heard is that Toronto is a little bit scrambled here in terms of they were hoping to have more sign and trade possibilities.

But because you have Dallas and New Orleans who have created enough cap space, and New York for that matter, who can make an offer to Lowry that appeases what he wants, around $30 million annually, that means a team like Philadelphia or Miami is less realistic of a possibility for the Raptors to do a sign and trade. So for them, we'll see how this pans out over the next week or so. But my understanding is that it's, as of today, Thursday night, more likely he would go to a team into space, which would suck for the Raptors. Suggs in Orlando. Suggs, Cole Anthony. Fultz.

Jonathan Isaac. KFC's guy Mo Bamba. Isaac's in. He's working out. Looks good. I don't know what the timetable is for his return from what I heard. Wendell Carter? Wendell Carter. You need to remind yourself of it. But it's not a very exciting roster right now because it's basically the floor of a bunch of guys other than Cole who had his moments as a rookie but basically the floor of a bunch of guys other than Cole who had his moments as a rookie but closing in kind of a weird season so um I think Jalen Suggs has

the kind of mentality or like when they were getting their asses kicked by Baylor I felt like he was the only one that like was still taking it seriously down 15 and that part of his game the football mentality the fighting part of it, the stuff he notices, that block that he had in the UCLA game, and then saves it and then passes it. I mean, he's just doing that kind of in-between shit I always talk about and that I love that you don't always get even from the best players. So I can understand the upside part of who Barnes could be at that size, but Suggs is arguably a more finished product than anybody other than Kate.

I love this moment for the Orlando magic, the much maligned Orlando magic, the relatively hopeless Orlando magic. They actually had something happen in the draft that worked out for them. And they got a guy that they can build around. What was the last, I can't remember the last high pick. I guess maybe Oladipo,

but even that one, nobody was crazy in love with Oladipo that year. This is an actual guy that they could build a franchise around. I really like Sucks. I think he's pretty good. No, it's a great point, Bill, because think how many years they were the pick after the lottery was like. And you're like, oh, cool, we got Hersonia.

You know, it's you know like oh this is um you know obviously oladipo but oladipo was never the best for it wasn't even close to like the awesome version that we saw oladipo later on especially with the pacers he wasn't that kind of player is there any chance be playing devil's advocate here that that's happening again it's like with toronto this is a smart organization that has typically made all the right decisions in the draft i was told earlier this week that sugs had a poor workout with the raptors which might have be one of the reasons they've made this decision on draft night is there is there any reason to see that jalen sugs might turn out

might not turn out to be this very good player like ryan you and I both think he will, but just playing devil's advocate, what would have to happen for Suggs not to be a good player in the NBA? I think the shooting part of it, that even though he was, what, 34% from three, three and a half attempts, the free throws check out, which is something, don't listen to us, listen to the guys who do it for a living. When something's wrong, but your free throws in the high 70s, low 80s, everybody's like, oh, okay, We got something here. I think Gonzaga

was surprised how well he shot it because coming in, when you ask around, what were the expectations of this guy? We knew he was an all-time recruit and that kind of stuff, especially for this program, but he still shot it a little bit better. I think they're like any of these guys. If you want to play the negative game,

it's a little harder with Cade because I almost want to build in excuses for every play that didn't work out for him because of how bad the team was. But Jalen can take some awful long twos and drives that go nowhere. And when you're 18, it's raw. When you're 22, you're a mistake prone guy. Jalen can definitely get too aggressive on drives. He can get a little streaky shooting. But he also did something that I think is really important.

It also plays to the Baylor guys. Then we'll get to them a little bit later. But Baylor was very unselfish with its guards. We saw the same thing with Gonzaga. Jalen wasn't going to have the ball in his hands the entire time. So we got to learn how to run it, but also know how to play off of it, which I think is really important for a young player. Are we sure

that Orlando's keeping Suggs and that OKC's not going to come off the top rope with some sort of 5-6 swap and a whole bunch more? I'm looking on Twitter. Two tweets I saw. Kevin Clark, our guy, I cannot believe the Magic are getting Jalen Suggs.

I cannot believe something good is happening. That's the mindset of the Magic fan. Tyler Parker, ringer contributor, ringer legend, OKC fan, that Celtic game was stupid, and so was that Clippers game, and so was this draft. So they won two games they never should have won this season,

and they ended up getting the sixth pick instead of the fifth. And now there's a legit drop-off, in my opinion, from Suggs to everybody who's left in this draft, correct? Well, yeah, it depends on what you think of Book Knight. I mean, Book Knight's probably

the best bucket getter, but he doesn't shoot it consistently enough. We'll get to that when he comes up. Kaminga, does that scare you if you're kind of interested in Kaminga and then Besai didn't take him? Because Kaminga was always the fifth guy the top five was all season long it was Cade it was Mobley it was Green it was Suggs and then Kaminga was always the fifth and then that started to change like a month or so ago so you can you could feel that way but I look anybody that tells you they

know what OKC is doing it's like trying to figure out Kawhi Leonard. More Kevin Clark tweets. The Magic have not caught a draft break in well over a decade. This is a break. I don't know how to act. I don't know what to tell you. It's been a beleaguered franchise. The best player they've drafted in the last 25 years was Dwight Howard,

who is probably the most unlikable superstar anybody had. So now that this unlock, does this unlock Mo Bamba? Yeah. What are the Mo Bamba ramifications? 100%. I mean, I don't know if it's going to unlock Mo Bamba.

I don't know if Mo Bamba will be on the Orlando magic next season. But I still believe, I still believe in Bamba. I still believe you do what a little bit of belief let's sell before that's for sure i would i would sell whatever is left i take the tax return loss chris vernon tweeted out a great video from bomba's draft night where he is he was compared to a hybrid of joelle and bead and Anthony Davis. I thought that was great. Pretty accurate. KFC is loyal to his guys to the bitter end.

Who knows? Jalen Suggs might unlock it. All right, we're going to wait. We're going to wait for this OKC pick and then we're going to end part two. And what we're going to do is we have to take like a two minute break to mail the podcast files to Kyle. But we're going to stay on Green Room

and we're going to keep going all the way through basically to probably pick 14. files to Kyle, but we're going to stay on Green Room and we're going to keep going all the way through basically to probably pick 14. But OKC, we think this is book night or do you guys have any intel? What do we think? It's been a lot of noise about book night, but you've also heard a number of different names, too. You've heard Kaminga here.

So, I mean, we'll see. We'll see with Oklahoma City. There's also the possibility of the trade because with Memphis even though OKC is here at six Memphis is trying to move up to six seven eight nine and it sounds like for Oklahoma City I just received a text that it could be Josh Giddy to Oklahoma City with the sixth pick at yeah by the way yeah and Pokaszewski just tweeted out don't take that clown Wagner. So take that for what it's worth. And now from Shams,

OKC picking Giddy at six. That was indeed the case. So Giddy goes six. Oh my god. What do we think of that? Most polarizing guy in the draft, Priscilla. So here's the deal with Giddy. I was talking to one of my sources

down under, and I get how special he is because you go, my God, the way he sees the floor. I know this sounds funny, but the special stuff that Lomelo has with the passing and vision and manipulating you, Giddy has this stuff the weird thing is he's like six eight plus he's below the rim all the time he doesn't really get past anybody he's a little loose with his dribble and he can't shoot but feel for the game right but there is this this elite level of of dissecting a team's defense without even being able to shoot, which is pretty impressive, that people are like, look, there's just a thing about him. Giddy has a thing. When you're around him, you watch him, he just carries himself a certain way. So there's been a lot of

buy-in for the people that were very pro-Giddy. Hey, this sounds like Mac Jones. It kind of sounds like our guy Mac Jones, KOC. It's just a thing about him. We'll see if Mac Jones has the same success taking the QB one job that Giddy could take into ball handling responsibilities in OKC. I don't think he's going to steal the ball from Shea Gildas Alexander too much, but I like the balance of those guys. Look what Oklahoma City's building here. Last year, they draft Poku, seven footer who can handle the ball a little bit super

raw but he can handle it on top of shea gildas alexander who was just his year that he had super underrated i mean he was unstoppable getting to the rim until they chained him to a radiator in the locker room so he couldn't play anymore as they should have tyler parker knows it tank away but you have now giddy six eight do you have a bunch of big tall playmakers okc has the potential here to build us out a roster where gildas alexander is the shortest guy in the floor like that's going to be really hard to defend if these guys pan out over the next three to four years so i get if they don't trade if they don't trade some of these guys can i say i mean the weird thing is is Gildress Alexander

felt like he was available now for a couple weeks. So, I don't know what that means. Can I say quickly? Yeah. This definitely feels to me like a look how smart we are pick. It's just a classic.

Look, he's earned it. Presti's made some great picks. I'm not as sold on Poco as some others as a smart pick. But this feels like a Estes made some great picks. I'm not as sold on Poco as some others as a smart pick. But this feels like a, not only there's no way to evaluate this pick for a couple years, but it's also going to really help them suck again

for this year, right? Because now their lottery pick, who they tanked the whole year for, is 18 and probably isn't going to have much of an impact next year, right? Is he even going to play more than 15 minutes? Bill, the OKC was a near 500

team before they did change to the Radiator. So, I mean, that was pretty misleading. Their net rating was awful. They still ended up on the under when it looked like they were going to smash it. And I still

think it's funny. The Celtics were still trying to win and Oklahoma City didn't want to win a game for them. That was a disaster. And they beat the Celtics. Do you think Poku is going to be threatened by Josh Giddey's cross-court no-look passes that will actually connect to the shooter, unlike with Poku? He's going to be like, how come...

Wait, so when you throw them, the guys catch them? Wait, I thought those were supposed to go into the third row. All right, that was part two of Drafted Palooza 2021. It was produced by Kyle Creighton. Listen to part three, which will cover from the Warriors pick all the way through about pick 15, and then part four will be winners and losers. Stay tuned. On the wayside I'm a person Never lost it

I don't have To ever forget