The Bill Simmons Podcast - Part Two: The 2022 Finals MVP Draft plus All-NBA Picks With Ryen Russillo

Episode Date: April 11, 2022

In Part 2 of a two-part podcast, The Ringer’s Bill Simmons and Ryen Russillo discuss the lackluster end of the NBA regular season, the playoff seeding, potential Finals MVPs, NBA awards, All-NBA picks, and more! Host: Bill Simmons Guest: Ryen Russillo Producer: Kyle Crichton Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, if you missed part one of the two-part Sunday night podcast that Russel and I did, it's already up. Go check it out. We talked about the Masters. We gave our MVP picks. We talked a little bit about Brooklyn, stats, whole bunch of things. Go check it out. This episode is brought to you by my old friend, Miller Lite. I've been a big fan of Miller Lite, man, since college days when I was allowed to have beer. I think Nephew Kyle is a fan too. Miller Light keeps it simple for us. Undebatable quality, great taste. Picture this. It's game day. All the gang's here. You're tailgating outside the stadium. It's a great time for beer. Or how about when you're standing at the grill and the smell of sizzling burgers is in the air? Moments like that. Or when you want a light beer that tastes like beer, that's delicious.

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of one of the best modern Hollywood movies about Hollywood that's been made, a Robert Altman classic. Wait for that on Monday night. Check out the Prestige TV podcast as well. Don't forget about part one of this podcast, which went up earlier today. Part two coming up right now. Me and Marcelo reacting to the playoff matchups. We're going to give our all NBA picks

and a little bit more than that. First, one more time, Pearl Jam! All right, part two of the podcast. Lucille is here. It's a little past 8.30 Pacific time. Sunday night. Did this work, this game 82 with the play-in and it was supposed to be this big smorgasbord of all these different exciting games

and race to the wire and oh my God, what are the seeds going to be? And half the teams punted. You could have predicted where everything landed. The only interesting thing that happened was Luca, strangest calf. What can they do to improve this last day? I'm up for anything, man. I've watched basketball every night except for three

since October 20th. I've watched basketball every night except for three nights since October 20th. Just the other day, the Milwaukee-Boston game, 4.30 tip out here on the Pacific Coast. And I'm like, oh, whatever I'm doing today, I'm making sure I'm on my couch. And I see the lineups now. So I go, all right. So look, I am not one that loves everybody with their spare time and all the outlets deciding to fix everything. I'm going to give you two quick examples, college signing day and college football. No matter what day it is, everybody thinks it's wrong. So then everybody has a solution, right? Look at the NBA. People have been like, you know what? The draft should be after free agency. In the NFL, we have it that

way. And the people are like, you know what? It really should be before free agency. So I really think that no matter what you have, people are always going to find ways to poke holes in things. So I've never been a big fan of the fix everything crew, but we already know that Silver even said himself, which all of us already know, guys don't play enough games. This should be an awesome day today. And it sucked. Okay. It sucked. There was nothing from today, and I'm all for the top four seeds picking who they're going to play so everybody's playing until the end.

I think tanking has been better, Bill. I think years ago, you used to feel like a third of the league before the season even started wanted to lose every single game. I don't think the plan necessarily fixes that. I don't love the concept of playing game because I don't love that Minnesota

has a chance after winning 46 games, has a chance of not being the playoffs and the Spurs do winning 34. Granted, it's still waited for Minnesota. So I don't love that part of it, but I am, I am fully on board now with some dramatic changes to figure out a way to just have the games be more of guys playing more games because it's a major problem. And it today, the lineup that should have been celebrated, all these moving parts, it was nothing. Nothing mattered today. And it sucked.

Well, we did have teams choosing who they're going to play by choosing not to play their own players. I think Milwaukee chose who they wanted to play. They wanted to play Chicago and they wanted to get away from Brooklyn. I'm with you. I think if we're talking fixes, the season should be shorter

and I think it would be harder to, the season should be shorter and I think it would be harder to maneuver because we'd have less of a sample size. And I think it would be a little bit easier to force these guys to play. The longer the season goes, the more of a stretch there is. And you see like all of a sudden Phoenix and Memphis are way ahead of everybody else. And I don't know, 72, other than money and all these owners make plenty of money and the next media deal is going to be even bigger than the last one. Other than money, there's no other reason not to go to a 72 game season. Even me, the biggest history guy on the planet, give me the 72 game season. I'm fine with it. These guys

are sitting out left and right anyway. And if we had a little more space between the games, we'd have more guys who we care about playing more games versus them taking nights off here, nights off there, plus the way the end of the season. So that would be my one fix. The other one, I'm glad you mentioned the Minnesota-New Orleans thing

because it's ridiculous. San Antonio. I'm sorry, or Minnesota-San Antonio or Minnesota-New Orleans, either one. Sure, fine Orleans thing. Because it's ridiculous. I'm sorry. Or Minnesota, San Antonio or Minnesota, New Orleans. Either one. Sure. Fine. Right. Let's say Minnesota loses to the Clippers, which by the way, it would be on them because

then they'd be setting themselves up for whatever. But I do think like if you're under 500 and the other team is over 500, you're going to laugh. This is one of my dumbest ideas ever. But I swear if you think about it, you'll like it. Maybe you stake the team that's over 500 with a lead starting the game based on how many wins under 500 the other team is. So let's say, what's New Orleans record going to be ultimately? Like 34? What are they? 34 wins? No, they got a couple more wins than that.

No, San Antonio's 34. New Orleans is 36. So let's say New Orleans beats San Antonio. And then in the next round, they play the Clippers. Why can't the Clippers start that game just up five points? That's their advantage because they finished over

500 and that would be their playing advantage like how about this if you don't like that win half of your games then maybe you could avoid the play in where you're like minus 5 heading into the game that would be my fix you kind of like it I see like a small smirk no I'm just

open to it now I'm open to it in a way that I never was before like whenever anybody talked about the lottery and not tanking and then you go you should have the first team with the best record get the first pick and go in reverse order to solve tanking and i'm like yeah but that's ridiculous because then you could have a team like we've had teams in the west with what 47 48 wins that originally were a nine c and they missed out before we had the play and stuff and by the way the playing is fun we'll all enjoy it it's exciting it's a lot on the line all that stuff right but back to the point of what you and I both said

this entire time. I don't love that you can win 12 more games. Be a penalty. Maybe it's because I went to a G League game last week. Instead of dapping up every fucking free throw even after the misses, the first two, a guy gets three free throws and everybody

in the NBA daps up after the first two misses. Then guys get annoyed when they don't get dapped get tapped up the g league they just shoot one free throw until the final two minutes in overtime so just shoot one free throw and get the game moving like i again i mean the g league is insane because those guys get up and down the court and i'm not saying like i want the nba to be like that but there are there's just it's been it's we're year three of a weird year, but I think the player now is conditioned knowing that he can kind of get away with it.

And then teams will do what's best for their team, which I completely understand. But for the greater good of the league, this, this was a total dud today, man. And it's because we care that we're annoyed. The only pushback I would have to your 72 game thing.

And I'm not even saying that, no, don't do that. I think players are conditioned that if we had 72 guys to start playing 55, thinking that was normal. I think that's just what you deal with today, but to find any incentive to have

more regular season games matter, I'm all for it. I'm more open to it than I've ever been before. Maybe go to 76 and try that, see how it goes. They fixed a couple things. The play-in's fun I know you're a traditionalist but it's still fun it's fun

we'll watch every game it'll be good and you have to earn it Golden State had to earn making the playoffs last year they couldn't win one of the two games

and they went home I think the lottery stuff has gotten a lot better you're still gonna have your Portlands I don't really know what their incentive was to just set their entire team on fire and end it like they did because they only

ended up in the sixth spot. But if you're in the bottom four, you're basically guaranteed the same odds across the board, right? So what we saw was some of those bottom four teams I thought did play a little bit harder than usual down the stretch. And we got to see some of the rookies actually keep playing. Like what Jalen Green, in the old days, I think Houston just kind of buries Jalen Green down the stretch because they don't want to, you know, they want to make sure they get the number one seed, something like that.

I didn't mind that. So look, they're willing to experiment. I think this playing thing's a work in progress. I'm with you in that they have to figure out how it's a little bit more of a disadvantage to be 34-48 and be in the playoffs. That shouldn't just be like,

we're 34-48, two wins, and we're in the playoffs. It's like, no, it just shouldn't work that way. The Lakers almost made the playoffs. Right. Because technically in the play-in game, like Because technically in the play-in game, like Sacramento were in the play-in game and then lost.

The playoff drought continues just for bookkeeping purposes. Yes. And actually all the numbers sort of live mythically in their own little category. I don't know if you knew that too. Like they don't count

in some fucking weird way. I don't understand why they did it that way. It's either added to a regular season total and have 83 against that 82, or they should just be playing playoff games. Why not? Maybe they are playoff games. Maybe they cared about the records.

I mean, college football destroyed their record books by all the extra games, and then they did a weird thing where bowl game stats didn't count for guys before that were playing even less and now the bowl games that's count it's like barry sanders i think doesn't his bowl games don't count but guys have bowl games with extra games conference championships and if you're good enough to be in the playoff so i mean yeah portland i i get what they were trying to do i think they were trying to increase their odds and i think maybe

even a weird way go what if we were to land a guy like Chet, who maybe is somebody that likes actually playing in Portland? Because the other thing, every team is freaking out about, like, okay, we got a guy in here. Look at the Zion factor. I mean, all the Zion thing has been is

one really fun year to watch, and then a constant headache of whether or not this guy wants to stick around, even though he hasn't even gotten his rookie extension. So this stuff will start getting weirder. I mean, Portland played Reggie Perry, Didi, Brandon Williams, LLB, Keon Johnson, who's the kid from Tennessee, his first-round pick. Their starting five for the Trailblazers today

had less than 120 combined games with Portland. I mean, Presti sat Poku because he was too good. Yeah, Poku, you're going to need to cool off. You're too good for this game. All right, so it looks like we're going to have Miami versus Atlanta. I'm assuming Atlanta gets out of that Cleveland 9-10 thing.

I'm just throwing them in. Just keep going with me. My guesses would be Miami, Atlanta, Boston, Brooklyn, definite. Milwaukee, Chicago, definite. Philly, Toronto, definite. And then on the other side, Phoenix versus the Minnesota Clippers winner.

Memphis versus the loser unless New Orleans can beat the loser. Warriors, Denver. Dallas, Utah. And from a head-to-head matchup, out of all the matchups I just mentioned, the only one that's notable is Milwaukee beat Chicago all four times. And if you're going to bet, if you're thinking sweep, if you're thinking sweep bet, there's always at least one sweep. I would say Milwaukee, Chicago, or whoever Phoenix plays would be my two.

My question for you, everybody's trying to make these, like as we look big picture, who's going to make the finals, all that stuff. I think it's so set up for Phoenix. I can't believe, like even today, Luka, who strains his calf in this game, we'll see, they said he might be done a week,

who knows, but he won't be 100%. He was 100%. Didn't look awesome. Didn't look awesome. By the way, because when he hits, at first you're like, oh, it's knee to knee, but then when you watch it again,

you go, wait, the pain reaction was more delayed than you would think in the knee to knee, and when he turned to transition to go back the other way, he couldn't move. And then he had to be helped off,

and I'm going, what the hell is going on? So I hope it's nothing, but that's also the story of the players. Like two or three of these super important players are going to be helped off. And I'm going, what the hell is going on? So I hope it's nothing. But that's also the story of the playoffs. Like two or three of these super important players are going to be out. Right. It just happens.

But think about Phoenix. They have Memphis, who Ja has just been gone. And we'll see if he's back at 100% with the playoffs. Although they're still awesome without him. Right. Yeah, go ahead. But they're going to need him in the playoffs. Of course.

We haven't seen Curry yet. Luka just limped off. Jokic, it doesn't look like Murray or Porter coming back unless they're saving it for some giant WrestleMania reveal. Oh my God, that's Cody Rhodes. Oh my God, that's Jamal Murray. Clippers,

Paul George, yes. Norman Powell, yes. Kawhi, I'm hearing three on three with him. I haven't heard a five on five. I don't think there's any way he comes back until we hear about him scrimmaging. My point is it's lined up for Phoenix, who was a historically great team,

had one of the best 17 records of all time, and is a team that I think you and I, talk about the Utah game, because I know you were just thrilled by that the other night well I mean there's just down down 17 going into the fourth and then to see Chris Paul read what they were trying to do so you know like like always you knew they were going to come for Gobert and get switches but what they do is it's just crazy to me that even at the NBA level, you'll see stuff happen.

And you're like, well, why can't you do more of this stuff? Like Chris Paul does it. Like Chris Paul is not just getting the switch and being like, okay, I got go bear time to get space on a step back three. Oh,

I got go bear. So I'm just going to try to turn the corner on him because go bear is still like kind of ridiculous on showing and retreating. It's just when you get them further and further away from the hoop, any of these big guys, it's almost impossible to ask them to do this stuff. So they ran like two simple variations on it. So Conley from the left side had bridges. Yeah.

Paul goes left off the screen and Conley's already shading away to be like, all right, you're going this way. I know what you're trying to do. So I'm good. I mean, this is Mike Conley. He's a terrific player. Right. Goes, all right, I'm going to cheat. And as soon as Paul knows he's cheating, Bridges cuts, pass, dunk. They run it the other side. This time Paul keeps it. But the whole idea was that Aiton would trail it.

So Aiton wouldn't just stop. It's like, let the play get past you and then trail this. And he immediately turns around and Paul has no intention. And he did it. Right. the play get past you and then trail this and he immediately turns around and paul has no he did it right and paul has no intention of actually attempting a shot at the rim against all this traffic and gobert who is great at retreating and he knows the whole time he's like as long as they think i'm going to the rim we're good and he goes up left side and then just midair turns back around to a trailing eight and wide open dunk and it was two simple things whereas when i watch atlanta despite trey's numbers it's like oh you're gonna run that double screen left to right off the

top and then it's just what and sometimes it does work for them so it's not like they run this terrible play all the time but it's just kind of funny when you notice these little variations and you think why why can't more teams do this i guess it's because they don't have chris paul they are so lights out, unbelievable at the end of games. In a weird way, I think they're going to be a better playoff team than a regular season team. I was looking at... I laid

out a lot. I mapped out a big bracket and I was trying to figure out what's Phoenix record going to be going into the finals? That's how confident I am they're going to make the finals. Will they have two losses? Round one, it's going to be New Orleans or the Clippers. I think the Timberwolves will beat whoever and they'll be the seventh seed. They're sweeping either of those teams. Then you go to the next round and they're going to play the 4-5, which is Dallas-Utah. Dallas might win one. Now Luka is compromised anyway. I just... They're going to be better.

Everything slows down and that's like the greatest ever for Phoenix. Like with the stuff you were just mentioning with Chris Paul, forced movie analogy coming. Remember The Edge with Anthony Hopkins? Yeah, in the woods.

They're in the woods. Yeah, they're trying to figure out the bear and it's like, you got to like be careful with the bear. We need a they're in the woods. They're in the woods. They're trying to figure out the bear. And it's like, you gotta like be careful with the bear. We need a plan. You gotta back up slowly. And you know,

you don't want the bear to, Chris Paul was treating Gobert like that. Like, like the bear. He was going in and he wasn't attacking him. He wasn't step backing him. He was just kind of three feet away from him, fucking with him. And then just,

just decide. And Gobert is one of the best defensive players in the league and he had no idea what to do. Two thirds of the time on that. Paul's just mastered it. He knows his team. It's like an F1 driver. He knows his engine. He knows his pit crew. He's just fucking, he knows it.

He knows the landscape. And then they have Booker who's basically Kobe Light at this point. We're doing the Booker-Kobe stuff? That's a promiscuity of him. I think it's valid. I think there's some similarities. I think there are some triple threat movements where he jab steps you and pulls up

and hits jumpers that do look like him. He reminds me of him. He's not as good of an athlete as young Kobe was. I don't think there's any question. I think he's as competitive as young middle and older Kobe was. Definitely is. I think he's more fun to play with in a lot of ways than a bunch of different versions of Kobe.

But, you know, they have these two options at the end of these games. And anytime it's a two-point game or a three-point game, whatever, with five minutes left, I feel like they're going to win. And that's going to translate into the West. And if you told me Curry was 100%, Draymond was 100%, and, you know, I don't know what else we'd need.

Klay is going to be in the best version. Yeah, he's better. I still don't totally trust him, but I just think it's lined up for them. When we come back, we are going to do, instead of a better. I still don't totally trust him, but I just think it's lined up for them. When we come back, we are going to do, instead of a playoff matchup preview, we are going to do a finals MVP draft.

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your own way. Do great things this November. Sign up now. Just search Movember. All right, finals MVP draft. I think we should have Cerruti flip a coin. Cerruti, flip an imaginary coin. Tell us who's going first.

We'll call it it What do you got We're solo calls He's the guest That's No it's tails Sorry dude There's no way Cerruti was going to pick me No it's great

Listen dude Question my integrity It was tails Alright finals MVP draft We're going to alternate Snake draft Yeah snake draft We'll just do Oh you want to You want to have the two And the three picks No people used to always All right, finals MVP draft. We're going to alternate. Snake draft? Yeah, snake draft.

We'll just do... Oh, you want to have the two and the three picks? No, people used to always get annoyed with Scott and I for not doing snake drafts. It's like it's two people, guys. It's two people. We're pretty good at alternating. We're okay. All right, my finals MVP draft.

Number one pick. Kobe Light. We were just talking about him. Kobe Light, Devin Booker. I think he has to be the number one pick. I think that's the safest finals team by far. They are plus 120 on FanDuel. I'd be surprised if they didn't make the finals.

In the East, you could make a case for five teams. I really like three, but I would accept the case for five. In the West, I think it's Phoenix, and they're going to have home court. They're really good. They're motivated from last year. It's a 2014 Spurs. A lot of the same narratives.

Chris, your guy. It's all sitting there for him right now. And Booker's the best player in the team and the most likely candidate to win finals MVP. That is my pick, Devin Booker. Yeah, he's the only pick. Now I'm worried because this is going to go in a bunch of ways and go bad.

By the way, Phoenix is 32-9 on the road. Their road winning percentage is better than any team's winning percentage. Did you see the Boston road stuff? Which part? For the season,

they're like 7.8 plus 7.8 on the road. It's like the second highest in the history of the Celtics franchise. Grandy was tweeting some of it. They're like an amazing road team. Grandy had something where they

have had 20-point leads in 19 games on the road. Yeah. Now, some of it, there's been situations like Memphis, normally that's going to be an impossible game, and they play them today and Memphis is throwing it away. They had a Brooklyn game where

nobody played. They had a Brooklyn game where nobody played. They had... There's probably four that they just lucked out because of the schedule. But for the most part, they've been really good on the road and I don't really... I can't fully explain it. Booker's the best pick here and he's

going to put up the best stats if they were going to win the finals anyway, unless Chris Paul was really... I'm kind of torn on do I go with the Phoenix part of this and take the second best option on a Phoenix team oh wait on the Celtics thing quickly yeah Randy said they had

the best road scoring differential since 2008 08 Boston 07 San Antonio and 22 Boston three best road scoring differentials in the last 20 years that's not nothing no the statistical profile stuff for boston yeah it you know because i'll try to break it down by month or you know because sometimes i'll do after the all-star break and then i'm like all right it's too many games and then it could be too short of

games like atlanta's profile on some of the stuff as they've closed i guess you could argue that atlanta who's the most disappointing team in the east has played their best basketball their fifth and offense 11th on defense which i think would shock people um because it's like wait is atlanta gonna get left out of this whole thing or what if atlanta were to knock out brooklyn what if we had kind of a golden state in brooklyn this year where you're so impressed with gold state finding a way to stay alive and you go oh cool playing game now we have right stuff in the playoffs and suck and so then on the other side of this imagine Durant and some one and done scenario you know like is it is it crazy to think it feels like Cleveland's been exposed here so I know we're

going to do more of this I wish I'm in a very good team. Yeah. I wish they had everybody. Since January 1st, Phoenix 37 and nine, Boston and Dallas, both 34 and 12, Memphis 33 and 12. And then Philly is surprisingly 32 and 15. Anyway, you're up. All right. Yep. Took too long. Let me just take Giannis. Our board were similar. I was hoping he'd be there for me at three. Yeah. I can't do that. I can't give you... Because now you've got to kind of work against your own pick if you're going to take somebody else. I think Milwaukee is the most likely team

to make the finals from the East. Doesn't mean they will make the finals. But the fact that, you know, they played it perfectly. Boston was either going to be the two or the four. And Milwaukee kind of checkmated them by throwing away the game today. Now they get Chicago. They're going to be the two or the four. And Milwaukee kind of checkmated them by throwing away the game today. Now they get Chicago. They're going to house Chicago.

They know Brooklyn and Boston, one of those two will knock each other off. They'll hope it's Boston that gets knocked off. Then they would have Brooklyn in round two and they would still have home court advantage. So pretty smart. Yeah, Milwaukee. You can put the Brooklyn Miles in them. in round two and they would still have home court advantage so pretty smart yeah milwaukee miles on them i thought uh i don't like when teams duck other teams but i there was a decent case for it yeah maybe we just in the new nba it's when you win a title you're like we're good where it used

to happen if you won like three or you were in two or four finals and this was another run where you were always kind of in the mix the last five years and you kind of accept maybe we just look at teams and they go hey we want a title we're good because if you go last 15 and bucks fans know this statistically there's a lot of stuff there that isn't very good yeah defensively they've been a mess now for about a month again they have a negative net rating over that time they're below 500 against teams 500 or better i mean the only teams in the east that have a i would say a good record against teams 500 or better. I mean, the only teams in the East that have, I would say, a good record against teams 500 or better, Miami's six over, Boston's seven over, and Toronto

beats good teams. They're six over. Everybody else, Philly's a couple over 500, Milwaukee's just below 500, where when you go back West, the top teams are just better against better teams, and Phoenix is 31 and 13. 31 and 13. They just thrash everybody. Right.

And one of the best clutch teams in the history of mankind. Go ahead. Yeah. It's your pick. Milwaukee is the safest pick in the East. And you know, it worked out perfectly for them. I think there's three teams that really matter in the East plus Miami. We'll see what we get from them and broken in Boston.

They get to avoid one of them. My, uh, my third pick is Tato. I, uh, and Brooklyn and Boston, they get to avoid one of them. My third pick is Tatum. I really like that they went for the two seed today. Do you think it means something? This is like Olympic stuff with Donovan Mitchell and Dwayne Wade, right?

I saw what you did there. No, I don't think, I think Boston thinks we're really good. It also tells me that the whispers that Time Lord is going to be ready for round one. I don't think they do this unless they feel like they're getting Rob for

at least most of the round one series. If he's not in there, it's different. But I think with Rob, from what we've seen from Brooklyn, we talked about it in part one, they're going to have game seven at home. And as I said in part one, I value having game sevens at home.

They'll have Milwaukee game seven at home too if they can get by Brooklyn. It won't be fun to play KD and Kyrie. By the way, that is the best series of round one, like hands down, right? Brooklyn, Brooklyn, Boston? Yeah. That could be their conference finals.

All the stuff, especially how bad it was last year. Granted, Jalen was hurt, but you know what? He was picking him. Right. That was always kind of the team where because of all the Kyrie stuff, you would just go.

And I remember when we would be talking about the Celtics going, I can't believe how soft this team is. Like, you just lost to the Nets again. And first thing you do is go hug Kyrie for 12 fucking minutes.

So that part of it, now that they're good, now that they feel like they're good and then I think there's some Rob Williams stuff if he comes back you know is the Bruce Brown matchup

different because he stretches the floor and it takes Rob further away how do they counter that because Brooklyn would probably go small and just try to

surround everybody who's shooters you know I don't know just talk it out loud here alright so can I give you can I tell Kyle to turn the camera

on for a second here there's a Boston history run that would tap Can I tell Kyle to turn the camera on for a second here? There's a Boston history run that would tap into a lot of the ghosts from the past that is now laid out. And here it is. Nets, round one. Who beat them in 0-2 and 0-3 during the one fun time between the Bird era and the KG era?

The Nets. And they usually beat the shit out of the Nets, but they had two conference finals losses against them. Round two, Milwaukee. 1974 finals. What a battle. Good history. Alcindor

and, oh no, he's Abdul-Jabbar at that point. Abdul-Jabbar and Cowlitz. Some great battles. And then in the 80s, who swept them? Who swept the Bird-era Celtics? The 1983 Bucks. Then we go back. They sweep them in 86.

87's a classic series. A lot of history with Milwaukee. Round three. What if Philly beats Miami? What if it's Philly waiting? Philly is actually Boston's rival. It's not the Lakers. Over the years, they've played the most playoff series against Philly.

They have the most history with Philly. I think they've played the most playoff series against Philly. They have the most history with Philly. I think they've had a big playoff series against them in every decade. Philly round three, and then Phoenix round four, the Triple OT 1976 finals. One of the great games in the history of the league. And Phoenix-Boston, the rematch.

So the ghosts of the past could rise up four straight rounds. I wish you were still writing because ghosts of girlfriends past Celtics Playoff style is an amazing headline That's it I got the quotes I'll do it tonight I'm coming back alright you're up You're up you have the fourth pick You just over McConaughey's face superimposed

On yours just a little hair in the bottom Yeah right I don't know we're gonna keep Workshopping that alright so then that means I'll take Chris Paul sentimental If the stats aren't overwhelming The writers would love that stuff. Storyline stuff. Same thing as Iguodala getting the 2015 finals over Steph,

which he shouldn't have. But I'll take Chris Paul, Phoenix factor. So I had him fifth and I had Luka fourth, but now Luka has a strained calf. And I feel like I should stick with my initial list. Is it fair to change the list on short notice, or should I stick with the list I made a half hour ago? Have you seen Kevin Costner in draft day?

You've got to be malleable, man. Yeah, that's fair. I had Chris Phipps. I think it's a great pick. You're basically bucking the odds because, what is it? If Phoenix wins the finals, 60-40, Booker versus Paul for finals MVP, I would say.

Something like that. 62-38. I don't know. Good pick. I think the draft drops off. You think there's a tier of the top four? I think we've just dropped because those were the three teams

I liked the most. Oh, man. I'm afraid to take Luka. Luka was like my big sleeper. I was all excited. You know, the roadmap with him. That looked bad. Yeah, that didn't look great.

The thing I liked about them was they had Utah round one, and I think neither of us like Utah. I like them more than you do. The Mitchell fourth quarter stuff is pretty weird. The athletic had a big piece about it the other day and it backed up kind of what I've seen watching hoops. Like the, some of the Mitchell tight game stuff. I haven't liked the shot selection really for the last couple of years. And it's not the first time it's been brought up on this pod, but if it turns into turns into my team's best player against Mitchell,

I like my odds with my team's best player. He doesn't scare me in the last five minutes the way some other guys do. No, he's got some Westbrookie in him. He does. I mean, he's had it now for a couple of years. I've called it. I mean, I've talked about this. I still really like him a ton because of- It's not getting better. Well, I know. But then you also think of that ridiculous series against Denver. Go back and look at some of the stuff that he did in the playoffs. The fact that he actually has some

really nice playoff stuff built in. Yes, the decision-making, the forcing the issue thing. It can be bad sometimes. He seems way too happy with 27-footers and pull-up stuff instead of just doing the Wade, Dwayne Wade and go to the basket,

I am going to take, you know, I'm still taking Luca. I'm not going to be scared. Are you sure? Yeah. I'm not going to be scared off by his, his strained calf thing.

I'm not. All right. That was going to sit up for such a great podcast moment. Cause I was going to take him. I was going to wait for you to pass. You're trying to talk me out of it. I was going to go, all right, I'll take Luca. Okay, that's fine.

We have great technology today. I was reading about Ben Simmons trying to figure out how much of that Ben Simmons story was bullshit. Seems like 75% bullshit. I'm not saying the reports were bullshit. I think the team's telling the reporters that he might be back.

But if you deep dive it, he's doing some treadmill I've never heard of. It's like a gravity treadmill. Yeah, it's the one where it's like an apron around your lower... You go into this big cube, so it takes off some stress on your lower back. And he's been working out on that.

And then Nash was like, yeah, he's looked good in his 1v0 drills. He hasn't even played 3-3 yet. So, yeah, could he play 15 minutes in Game 6 and Game 7 in Round 1? Like, sure, puncher's chance. But he's not going to be guarding Jason Tatum in Round 1 of the playoffs.

It's not happening. I swear to God in his contract, and I'm going to give clutch credit for this, as soon as you get Ben Simmons, they meet with the social media team and they go, all right, we don't know if he's going to play. But, probably not.

But what we'd really like you to do is every few weeks, just post something from the team feed of him hitting a jumper. Right. Post something of him in practice gear. Yeah. Look at sweaty. But just like deep jumpers.

Pure. Wet. And we just get that out there. We just want to piss off everybody that he never takes those in games. We on the same page? Alright, cool. Because Brooklyn had it going the other day. He hit a three. Nice dribble drive. pull up, 15.

Looked great. It's going. Look out. They're like, oh, cool. We have more videos of Ben Simmons hitting jumpers. Terrific. Coming up next, I'm going to tell you why Ben Simmons can stretch the floor. According to this one Instagram video I saw.

That's next. Are you up or am I? Oh, you're up. I'm up. I think Luca. You have the sixth pick. So, so far, we've had Booker, Giannis, Tatum, Chris Paul, Luca. And the sixth pick is?

Ja. Man, we had the same list. I think it's good value. It's great value. What if he's 100% and they're just like, Lay low, dude. You're a crazy person.

We have to protect you from yourself. It's like when the baseball owners had to put in the crazy luxury tax stuff to protect the expensive owners from themselves. They had to protect you off from themselves. They had to protect Ja from himself. They were like, you're too crazy. You're up 30 diving into four guys on flying layups with two minutes left in the game.

We got to just, we'll see in the playoffs. I think that's what they did. Like when you get to college and everybody signs up for the credit card and I called my dad, I was like, hey, I got a UVM MasterCard. And he's like, no way. He's like, you sure about that?

And I was like, yeah, I'll be fine. He goes, what's the credit limit? I was like, oh, it's good. It's like, no way. He's like, you sure about that? I was like, yeah, I'll be fine. He goes, what's the credit limit? I was like, oh, it's good. It's like 500 bucks. He goes, yeah, okay. He's like, I'm not worried. Sounds good. All right, Jaws, the sixth pick. Is Memphis

the number one wild card for you in these playoffs? That's Golden State. Ceiling basement team? Who's your ceiling basement? Most floors between the basement and the ceiling. Well, I don't see Memphis losing in the first round. The Memphis thing, it'd be great if it was everybody and we already knew, but even without everybody.

I mean, this team won 56 games. Their point differential, I think, is what? The third best in the NBA? Actually, Utah has tied with 56 games. Their point differential, I think, is what? The third best in the NBA? Actually, Utah has tied with Tampa's third best point differential, even though no one seems to like them. I'm not sure that I'm picking Dallas, even if Luka were healthy. Because Dallas does some weird stuff statistically where they've won a bunch of these games,

but they're not off the charts in a bunch of things, too. And I still don't always love the heliocentric NBA teams in the playoffs. They don't have great history with that. Even though Luka, we feel like he's just unstoppable. We've talked about them. The Dinwiddie pieces totally work. They're opened up. They're not as exposed

with Kristaps out there defensively because he still has to get his minutes if he's on your team. I'm not totally married to the idea of Dallas is just going to roll through Utah and now we'll know about the Luke apartment. So if we're going ceiling on this... So you're saying Philly. Philly, highest ceiling basement team.

That might be the call. Yeah, that might be the call. There's a world where Philly just loses in five to Toronto and we never see Harden in a Sixers uniform again. And Doc's the Lakers coach. And there's Zach Levine, Sixers rumors. And I'm prepared for anything. They went

one and three against the Raptors this year. Oh, I'm aware. Okay. And the problem is when I was doing all the team versus team stuff, then if you really want to spend a great deal of time on it, you can start digging in and going, all right, but who is playing who? Like, Golden State is 1-3 against...

They're 1-3 against Denver with two one-point losses. Steph played three games. Klay played two. Draymond played zero. So what am I supposed to do with a 1-3 record for Golden State against Denver on that? Some of the numbers are good reflections. A lot of them aren't. And you have to kind of dig through everything with this. So I think Philly actually is the right answer here.

Because they lost to Toronto with the way they're coached, all their different options. But the problem is, I'm just... Don't you think Embiid... Even if we're doing that, maybe it's more of a Philly thing. But how the hell are they going to stop Embiid over a seven-game series with their front line? Ken Burch?

I was impressed by how hard Toronto made it for Harden in the game the other night. That was my one takeaway. I don't know. I'm with you on the Embiid thing, but let's say he scores 35 a game in the series. Could Toronto still beat them? Yes.

Let's give Embiid 35 and 12. I still think with how bad Philly's bench is now, Niang, who knows if he plays in round one, there's some stuff on him, whether he's going to be healthy. bang. Yeah, he's good. There's some stuff on him, whether he's going to be healthy. Bang, bang. Yeah. He's good.

I mean, he's one of the guys if I'm the Sixers, that's one of the only guys I trust. And they can just throw athletes at Harden over and over again and try to make him work on defense. Here's what I don't like about them, about that matchup.

I was looking at slowest pace. Who do you think had the slowest pace in the league this year? It's Dallas. Hold on, I knew this. Oh, yeah, it is. All right, go ahead. Go ahead. Yep.

Dallas is one. I wasn't going to guess that. Miami's three. Toronto's four. Philly's six. And there was that Philly-Dallas game a couple Sundays ago that I watched because I bet on Dallas. And Philly beat them.

One of the reasons they beat them is the pace, that slower pace when you're, you know, remember what Brooklyn did to Philly that first game when Kyrie went at Harden and the whole thing? And Brooklyn was like, we're just running on Philly. And after the game, KD was like, yeah, we knew, we know if we ran on them, they couldn't hold up.

Boston can run on them. Milwaukee can run on them. Boston's seven in pace, but I think they can play up and down if they need to. And Brooklyn and Milwaukee can run on them. Here's why I mentioned this. Philly in the first two rounds is playing two slow-paced teams. They're playing Toronto and then Miami. And those are like those 97 and

92. Embiid's not going to have to be sprinting back. Everything's going to be deliberate slow. It might actually be good for him. So I'm a little, as much as I want to take Toronto, I got to study that one more. I'm actually going to go back and watch probably their last two games and

get a better feel for that. Because I think Toronto's going to be the sexy pick. They're going to be the sexy round one upset pick. It's going to happen. I'm telling you. Well, especially with the last matchup, which Toronto didn't have Van Vliet or OG. And that OG and an OB stat of their record with him

versus without him is one of the more insane stats you're going to see. You'll be like, wait, you're that much better. And I like him too, by the way, but it's dramatic. And I don't know if that's half because of scheduling and some of the stuff they ran into, which can always be the case there too. But I like your thinking on that.

Because you're right, Miami isn't going to want to run. But then even though we love Bam, I think all of us love Bam. I think every single fan base would love to have Bam out of Iowa on their team. And he's probably defensive player of the year in the top three if he plays a full season this year. But seven games of banging with Embiid.

You don't be fun about Philly, Miami. Who's Harden covering in that series? Whoever he's covering, they're going to be calling that guy over to set a pick for Lowry or here or Jimmy yeah yeah they're gonna be just they're gonna make Harden work and what we've seen from Harden in these games is the teams that make him work defensively eventually eventually he just stops working but as we're talking this out loud too it's the old Bill Russell thing if you ever interviewed him and you'd say hey how would you handle shack and he'd be like how would shack handle me he's like i would run him to death now granted i mean bill was gonna have a hard time holding up the post against chick against

shack but if you're bam and so much the offense runs through bam so you can have the size advantage with a beat but that's actually on the counter side of it for miami as i'm thinking this out like that's not a great time you know what i mean if? Because if you're Embiid, you're like, so I have to stay on this guy at the elbow extended, and I got to deal with this guy rolling behind me all the time too. I mean, remember when they just ate up the Celtics two years ago in the bowl season on those trailing lobs to Bam? I mean, that's just a really tough thing to have to cover. We've also, in Bede's history

in these playoff series, is the games are so intense and he's so into it, he usually wears down as the games go along, especially if it's every other night. Harden's going to have

to carry him. Harden's going to have to have one of those games. Maybe he gets a bunch of free throws in one of these, but I think that's the best choice.

I think that was a good call by you. High ceiling baseman. I don't trust Philly at all. Let's take a break. We'll finish the draft. set spending limit. More cash on hand to grow your business with up to 55 interest-free days and the ability to reach further with access to over 1400 airport lounges worldwide. Redefine possible with Business Platinum. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms and conditions apply. Visit amex.ca slash business platinum. All right, let's finish this really quick.

I have the seventh pick. I'm going to take Steph Curry. I think this is the right territory to take a Golden State. Good value. I have no idea if Steph's going to be 100% for the playoffs. I assume he'll be relatively close.

And if they win, he will be the finals MVP because he's the best player in that team. I would say if they do get to the finals, I would just throw a dime down on Jordan Poole just to put a tiny one down because I could see him just going nuts in the finals. I'd be like, oh my God, Jordan Poole's averaging 30 a game in the finals.

This is crazy. But Curry would be the smartest pick, so I'm taking Curry. Kevin Durant's still on the board. I know, I know. So I'm going to take him from you. Yeah. I had him next to him.

Because I knew you would take him next. I was on the fence about it because there's still one guy I want to take. I think it's the right time in the draft for him. I think we feel the same about Brooklyn's ceiling

if Simmons isn't able to come back and give them some real minutes. I just don't think they're deep enough. I don't think they have enough size. And I think you could give Durant, Kyrie 65 points a game. And I think it would be still hard for them to win three playoff series in a row. So that's my case. I'm taking Bam Knight. Just best available heat guy on the board. And I think he's a more realistic finals MVP in a Phoenix series than Butler is. Because I think Phoenix would wear the living fuck out of Butler in a series.

Whereas Bam, I think, would be the key guy in that series from Miami's standpoint. If they actually won the series, I think it would be because of him more than anybody else. All right, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to go ahead and take the guy we were just talking about. Instead of Butler, I'll take Embiid. Okay. I had him 11th on my board. So that's your

10th pick. Are we going 30 rounds? No, we'll go eight rounds. I'm taking Kyrie. Just a value pick. I'm on the record as saying I think it's Boston, Milwaukee, or Brooklyn

in the East. I would have Miami as the fourth choice. And with Brooklyn, Kyrie could easily get into the finals and average 35 a game and demolish Phoenix and a big Kyrie. Oh my God, the most unlikeliest finals MVP ever. Only played 20 MVP games.

A hero to the non-vax community. Blah, blah, blah. I can see it. Voice for the voiceless. Yeah. All right, you're up. 12th pick. Give me somebody with a lot of voice. I'll take Jimmy Butler here. Oh.

First guy you've taken that wasn't on my board. If the Heat are in the finals Jimmy Butler has a great chance I'm with you Maybe even better than Bam I was just matching him up against all those Phoenix guys And it just felt like Jimmy Butler shooting 37% In that series

I'm going to take Listen there's no great pick left I'm going to take Drew Holiday, there's no great pick left. I'm going to take Drew Holiday. I want to get another buck off the board. I thought he was really crucial in that finals last year, and Giannis is winning if they win the finals, but Holiday is a good backup choice. You're up.

I'll take Aiton. Hmm. I have Mikael Bridges. It's a run on Suns. Wait, we took four Suns? Yeah. Why not? They're making the finals.

Then I'll take Middleton, who I almost took a couple picks earlier. All right. I'll take Jalen Brown. Oh, we're going nine. All right. Nine rounds. Jalen.

Jalen Brown. All right. Give me... Clay gets... Just walking on the sun. Hot redemptive art of all my God. It's like the end of the notebook and it's like, there's the, there's the easel and the, and the canvas.

I don't, I walks in Twitter might actually have an orgasm. Yeah. That'd be the number one moment in the history of basketball. Twitter clay hits 33 is in the history of basketball Twitter. Clay hits 33s in the finals and wins finals MVP. So the big lessons from us, we loaded up on Phoenix

and on Milwaukee and on Boston. And that I think Embiid's probably best value. There is. There's a world. And I think we didn't load up on Boston, by the way.

We took two guys. Well, the box in the top 12 or 13. Right. If Philly's the one that I'm not, even though I'm writing them off, the door is slightly ajar, just in case Harden, for whatever reason,

just starts playing really well. I don't think he has it in him. I think we've had a two-year sample size now with him. I don't think he's the same guy as he was, but who knows? Could he be playing possum this whole time? I don't know. Can't rule it out. No one took him. He'd probably be a smarter pick than... I think with Harden, you're talking about an entire career of playoff failures that would make me a little nervous to think all of a sudden

you'd put it together in four rounds. There's also like, you know, I don't think that situation is a good situation. I'll just say that. I have my emergency heart and sheet ready to go at any moment. Playoffs. If this was our TV show, we would just be constantly putting that up on the thing.

All right, Quick questions. Why was the Milwaukee more afraid of a game seven with Boston in Boston? Love the Chicago matchup. Avoid Durant. They won a title last year. They had to come back from two. Oh, so I think those are all the things you add to it.

I don't, I don't love, I remember last year and it was like oh the Clippers are such losers they're trying to avoid you know playing the Lakers it looked like they wanted to play Dallas and all that kind of stuff I get the arguments for people being like if you're real then who cares you know it's a bit like the Clippers thing when people thought maybe Kawhi was going to come back to which again you touched on it earlier I don't know man and again the Kawhi lesson that I've tried to share with everybody, as soon as somebody tells you they know

what Kawhi's doing, don't listen to them. Because he's just not telling anybody what he's going to do. This is the way he operates. He's not telling anybody what the plan is. So if you're really good and you're Phoenix, you're like, alright, fine. Cool, you get Kawhi and Paul George. We don't care. Let's go ahead and play. So I think that's the thing

with the Bucs. It was too long of an answer, but there you go. I'm not just saying this cause my team ended up, um, throwing this smack down and trying to play them. I would much rather play Brooklyn around one. Cause I do think what if, what if Simmons is back in time for round two and they can get 20 to 25 minutes of good defense.

I was looking, I looked at everybody I voted for. Oh, MBA for the last six years. And I forgot, like I had Simmons OMBA for the last six years and I forgot I had Simmons in the third team in 2020 and I think I toyed

with him in 2019 too. The guy, if he's healthy, is somebody you could put on Jason Tatum and he would at least make Jason Tatum work for baskets, which is a problem for the Celtics because that's really the only place they have to go in the last five minutes of a game that I totally trust. Um, from Milwaukee standpoint, I would have just wanted to play them and get it over with. Cause I think they would have beaten them.

I think it's weird that they avoided. I know Chicago is an easy game, but I don't totally get it. If Milwaukee didn't win last year, Bill, though, they're getting crushed for these next 48 hours for doing this. Yeah, I agree. Will we see Time Lord in round one? I say yes. I defer to you

on that one because I don't have any info. Well, we'll see. The schedule of the games has not come out yet. By the way, the Lakers-Nuggets game is in OT as the Lakers are trying to avoid 50 losses. The schedule of the games has not come out yet. There's a feeling, so there's a Bruins game on Saturday at 1230.

And there's a feeling that the Celtics, this 2-7, if it's going to be Brooklyn, that they would put that 2-7 on Saturday night. And that it would go Saturday, Monday, round one, round two, which would actually be bad for Boston because that would be, I don't think Time Lord's ready for those two. But I think as the series goes further, I think we're going to see them, would be my guess. Next question. Young star most likely to make the leap. I'm going to give you Tatum. I'm going to give you Ja.

I'm not going to give you Booker because I feel like it happened last year. No, no, he's not. I mean, I'm going to give you one more name. Carl Anthony Towns. Tatum Jot Towns. Tatum Jot Towns. Those three.

That would be the order. Okay. That's right. You? Yeah. I think Minnesota. Edwards has had some knee stuff. And there was a stretch where he was just shooting threes

and he, I don't think, was looking like crazy athlete Anthony Edwards there for a little while. And there were some pieces written about it that I thought captured that. Starting to look like himself again. And I think that team's a wild card. I don't, you and I both like them. I've enjoyed them in league pass this year. I just, my point is, I wouldn't just throw Memphis into all your parlays

and just assume that series is going to be a walkover. I think Minnesota's like pretty good. I have liked it all year. And, you know, when we talked about them this summer, I felt like they closed with just a different personality, which I thought was like exciting because you thought, can they grow on this? And, you know, sometimes you're right, sometimes you're wrong.

And that clearly carried over. Um, Edwards looked like he was frustrated at times too, with the role. I think D'Angelo Russell, despite the cell job that he's a different guy now. Um, I don't,

I, it's been better, man. And I know he's still capable of putting up big numbers because he's a very talented player, but I don't think it's always a great time to play with. And I think Edwards, you could see where it just like, okay, so I'm just going

to watch you. And that's tough for somebody like Edwards is such a gifted score, but he had 49 the other night against the Spurs. He was making plays and hitting shots. He reminded me of the guy that when we started freaking out about him early in his second year being like, okay, this is a guy now, this is somebody that's exciting. He's almost a point in watching so i think this has been a great story and all this stuff but i almost feel like you're underselling maybe we've under like i think we've been very pro memphis but it hasn't sounded very pro memphis so far on this podcast i don't think minnesota can beat memphis i really don't i don't think so either i am pro memphis i'm just saying i think people are just going to assume minnesota this like could lose

to the clippers and be the i i think minnesota is going to beat the could lose to the Clippers. I think Minnesota is going to beat the Clippers and I think they'll do an admirable job against Memphis. I think they're better than the average person would think. Will Steph Curry be 100% again this season? I don't think so.

I just don't I think if he were like why is he going to be 100% game one here in a couple days you know don't you think they would have tried to get him

I know they said they didn't care about seed they didn't care about seed when guys were still playing but maybe they just collectively figure it out because they've been through

so many wars before but I hate I hate that injury against the Celtics because I actually thought Golden State was starting to turn a corner there. They had the Milwaukee one. They had

the Denver win at Denver. It looked like maybe they're going to start figuring this thing out here. I would have thought if he were close to 100, then they probably would have tried to get him some minutes at some point to get some continuity going here. But if he comes back, they're going to try to guard everybody to death, meaning Poole, Clay, Steph

playing a lot at the same time and just going, can you guard all of our guys? I think it'll be like 2016. He'll be able to play. I don't think he'll be 100% the Steph we're used to. But maybe it's season. I mean, he didn't break anything. He didn't tear anything.

Well, it's not the playoffs if we're not sitting around debating whether or not Steph is 100% or not Yeah fair Last question Will this be Pop's last game in the playing game Starting to feel that way There's been little breadcrumbs Little breadcrumbs being sprinkled left and right

I think he's probably done after this year I don't have inside info, though. Just a guess, reading the tea leaves. It's been a very common topic of just bullshitting with people, but I've never heard anybody be definitive about it. It was a really easy version of it to sell that no one was going to report. It's like, hey, he's going for the record, he's going to get the record, and then he's going to bounce.

And that's why they didn't tank this year, because was his last year and he had an awesome quote the other day about tanking just going you know philosophically i don't know how you look at young players and say we're not doing everything like if i'm not doing the best how are you not doing the best he's like and by the way it may be stupid which i think you could certainly make an argument against like what's the point san antonio you don't really have i mean dejante big improvement this year there's some nice pieces there's some little role pieces there I think we all kind of like. So I love the spirit of his quote. Even if maybe forced to agree or disagree, I disagree with it.

So then I know that that's part. There was also another one that kind of floated around was that if Becky Hammond knew she wasn't going to get the job, that's why she bounced. And did they already know that they had a succession plan for pop and then when she knew it wasn't her again it's a theory that's been out there i have no idea if it's true or not just talking here on a podcast so there's a bunch of tealy as you said the crumbs tealy's whatever you want to do there's things that have been talked about with just bullshitting nba gossip stuff with people about hey all of this adds up to him leaving, but nobody's told me, hey, he's definitely leaving. So I don't know. I think that guy would have a really hard time not being a coach, by the way.

He's 73. He's two years younger than my dad. I could also see him being super happy he's not coaching anymore and just traveling the world and drinking wine. Playing games. Brooklyn, Cleveland. Poor Cleveland. I was so much more excited for that playing game two months ago. Who knows? Maybe we'll get... Is there any chance we get Mobley and Allen in that game? Well, Mobley's playing. Mobley's back. No, but I mean like the good versions

of them. The versions when it felt a little Twin Towers-y. Who knows? Well, he basically. Brooklyn's going to win. It's a broken finger with Allen. And he said if he's ready to go, he'll go. So.

How do you heal from a broken finger? Broken finger is going to heal and then you play. You can't like come back early from that. Put in a splint. I actually think you kind of can. We could put in a splint and tape it but he could have done that three weeks ago i'm surprised more guys um can't play with broken fingers to be honest with you i think atlanta is going to beat charlotte the no hayward thing um is it to me a deal breaker for Charlotte.

I think they need Hayward to actually win a game. If you bet on Brooklyn and Atlanta to be the two playing teams that advance and are the 7-8 seeds, plus 290 on Fan Rodulo, FYI. Minnesota Clippers. I have Minnesota in that. Who do you have? Minnesota Clippers.

Two great coaches. The Kawhi part of it is real. I'm sure there's some Clippers two great coaches the Kawhi part of it is real I'm sure there's some Clippers that would love to beat Patrick Beverly who put on a show he was just out of control tonight in this finale, he got tossed from the game he was doing all sorts of stupid shit in the free throw thing where he was at the three point line

he was trying to pretend he was going to do something they finally called it on him and he got annoyed so maybe there's a little bit i just feel like minnesota is still really complete and they have multiple options you know they have there's just there's just a different you know we've already talked about it with minnesota i i'm a little two favorites on the plane i don't have like a sneaky one for you i'd like to pick against atlanta but they're probably paying the best the best stretch and when i talk just talent like it's still frustrating to me that atlanta's not closer to pick against Atlanta, but they're probably playing the best stretch. And when I talk just talent, like it's still frustrating to me that Atlanta's not

closer to four or five seed than they are barely being in the play-in tournament. I kind of like New Orleans against the Clippers. That would be my one surprise pick. If you have Minnesota

and New Orleans, that's plus 550 on FanDuel. I kind of like that one. I think New Orleans is hard to play. I think they have... Herb Jones can guard basically any swing man at this point and at least make them work.

They have multiple scores. They have some size. I don't think they'll be afraid of the game. And I just wouldn't be shocked. Let's take one more break and then we'll do all omba and wrap it up who do you have for rookie of the year do you know yet yeah i'm going with k really i am i'm not as caught up in the one lost record rookie of the year

i never have been i think he's the most important player on his team. And as much as I love Scottie Barnes and Mobley, I love both those guys. They've never been asked to do... And look, Barnes has had some incredible nights where he's run the offense. I mean, he can do a million different things. Cade has to figure out every single possession for not a great team.

And I thought he ended up being a really, really enticing player there towards the end. So I know he's probably not going to win it. I haven't read much about it. But I'll probably be in a smaller group. But I'm picking K because I thought he had to do everything. Who do you have second? Barnes, then Mobley.

I have Barnes, Mobley, K. Yeah, I think more people are going to go Barnes, Mobley, K. I just don't really care if you're putting up good stats

and doing a lot on a team that sucks. And I'm with you. He's been a revelation as a rookie. He's done everything you could possibly

ask from him. Since January 3rd, he's basically 19-6-5. But, I just if you do not look the metrics are bad

21 team I don't care look the metrics and all that stuff are bad I love Barnes Barnes passed Moby for me that was the big thing that happened over the last

three weeks I just thought he was a more important player by the time this season ended to his team now you could say Mulvey was important too because Cleveland was never really the same

after those guys went sideways. But I just think Barnes, we're going to be watching the playoffs and people are going to go nuts. I don't think there's a ton of casual fans watching Raptors games. And I think people are going to watch Barnes in the playoffs and be like,

what the fuck is going on with this guy? He's really good. I'm excited for him. Who do you have for most improved? Poole. I had Poole too. I thought I was like the only one. I thought I was the only one. We haven't talked about this prior to this. No, we have not. I don't get the

Ja thing at all. Ja was good last year. I think it's because it's the leap that he was in with the MVP. Who the fuck knew knew who jordan pool was a year ago well pool had some really good stuff last year on on the overall from it but i i look i can't tell you how many times like i watch pool and go this guy is a serious problem like he's a serious problem. Like he's a serious problem. How about he has this new thing now where he does this step under move on that? Like he does like that last level of score where it looks like he's going

to shoot and then does the duck under. I, he just has, he's not just a three point shooter is my point. He's got like an actual arsenal of shots. Do you want to make the announcement that we just found out other than that the Lakers just avoided 50 losses?

We heard Woj just tweeted, Frank Vogel has coached his final game for the Lakers. A decision that's expected to be shared with him as soon as Monday. Sources tell ESPN. I guess they shared it with him right now when they leaked it to Woj a minute after the season ended.

I wonder, what do you think the Lakers, I wonder what their beef was with Vogel after saddling with the team they saddled with. I wonder what, as they look at Vogel, like, man, he should have done blank. What the hell is he going to do? LeBron basically thinks every coach towards the end isn't any good. So that's basically what happened here

it was an impossible job because you can't have that many guys with that many resumes on the team at the same time so I thought it was going to take him a couple months to even figure it out and it went even worse than that oh we should mention we were predicting the Russell Westbrook hit piece I thought it was going to happen this summer because I think I was surprised

that they'd want to affect his trade value. But no, the season wasn't even over and it was written. And I think their game plan must be to just leak all kinds of bad shit about him, about what a mess it was with him and blame him and hope he takes a buyout. It was very early.

Is that the game plan? It was ahead of time. Super early. It wasn't the one I was expecting, which will happen, but it was an appetizer. And my favorite part of it was there was a part, Ramona Shelburne wrote it, and this is what's being told to her, so I don't blame her for writing it, but

it was the crafting of the westbrook acquisition where very early in the piece it was like well westbrook had had told lebron he would accept a different role so in some way it absolves blame for lebron wanting westbrook it was like a at, here's how we're going to spin this. And it was like, well, Westbrook fucking told me he wasn't going to take terrible shots and just freelance on defense all the time. He told me he was going to totally change every way he's played.

They blamed LeBron for the transaction itself and then absolved him for Westbrook apparently misleading him. Yes, Westbrook misled him. I'm going to change how I play. It's like, if there was one guy in the last 50 years who was never changing one ounce of how he played at any point, it was Russell Westbrook misled him. I'm going to change how I play. It's like, if there was one guy in the last 50 years who was never changing one ounce of how he played at any point, it was Russell Westbrook.

I don't know how they fell for that one. You want to know why? Because that didn't happen. Yeah. It didn't happen. But it was a step in the LeBron distancing himself from fully signing off on it.

Listen, I'm so glad that he didn't play the last two games ago for the scoring title, because as I said a few days ago, I thought that was beneath him. I said that to house on Tuesday. It's like one of the great players of all time. Number two on my list. What does he care about a scoring title? And like, he didn't make the playoffs, pack it in and go home. You're going to try to chase the scoring title on a sprained ankle? It's beneath him. It's a better player than that.

I'm glad he didn't do that. I think he saw the light. But I think he was going to chase the scoring title until his team saw some of the feedback about how that looked, where he's ducking the hard games, but yet he's going to come back to play OKC to put up a 60 spot on them.

That would have been terrible. I'm glad he didn't do terrible. Yeah, I really do think that he changed plans because I think he was going to play against the bad teams. But the thing is, it kind of felt like he couldn't really win because I thought, well, there's no way he'll sit before they're eliminated.

And then he did. And then it's like, wait, if you sit before they're eliminated and then you chase a scoring title, you realize you're going to get crushed even more than you think you are now. And he wasn't really, because I think people got distracted with the MVP stuff, which has kind of dominated all of NBA Twitter here the last week or so. But I had one little final thought on the whole thing, is that how did you feel in the moment with the David Robinson 71 point game?

I don't mind it. I don't mind it. If the guy's healthy and is, uh, no, it's like, like whatever. If,

if it's last day of the season, I didn't mind when, when the Gervin David Thompson, I grew up on that. That was from my generation. It was an exciting moment. If it's last day of the season, you was from my generation. It was an exciting moment. It's the last day of the season.

You're going for it. It's the same thing like if you have a chance to score 70 points. We've had guys who had 60 points get taken out of the game when they had a chance to just go for 70. I'm okay with it. All right, but you do. I don't know if you remember. I didn't remember everything because, I mean, when you're in college,

you're not paying as much attention to the day-to-day. Oh, you mean the actual details of the game? I don't know if you remember. I didn't remember everything. Because, I mean, when you're in college, you're not paying as much attention to the day-to-day. Oh, you mean the actual details of the game? I don't know what happened. I just remember he had 71. They were fouling with two minutes left on purpose to get David Robinson more possessions. Oh, I'm not in that. It actually was really gross.

Yeah, that's bad. And then the Clippers started complaining. And then John Lucas was kind of like, all right, baby. He didn't care at all. So it got gross at the end of that game. I have Garland second for most improved. Garland's

another good pick, yeah. I just think the leap that he made from last year to this year was pretty crazy. Coach of the year, Monty? Monty won. Spoh two. Udoka three. Hmm. I don't know who my two or three is yet.

Defensive player of the year? I'm going Jaron Jackson. Interesting. I think he's so versatile. When you look at some of the stuff, he's 50 more block steals combined, stocks, ahead of anybody else. And I just think he gives them a lot of stuff.

And I know that the award slants towards the bigger guys, but at the end of the day, I kind of think the bigger guys are more important defensively. It's a little bit like the quarterback thing in football. I think I'm taking smart. He's one of the best, not a homer pick. I just think he had what he was doing as a defensive guard the second half of the season

was some of the craziest shit I've seen in a while. Quick follow-up. Just completely disruptive and an absolute nightmare and was just everywhere. It was like watching an awesome cornerback and an awesome safety at the same time. He's guarding everybody. He was completely unafraid.

He set the tempo for the team. The defensive metrics on the team are crazy. They didn't stay up to the level they were when Williams got hurt. Just an absolute sick. I think it's really hard to find guys who do what he does as a

guard and be that disruptive. But every year we can find three or four big guys who can be disruptive. Who is the number two guy? Who is second to all the stuff he did at that position? Nobody. No, but you have Drew first team? I have him second team, I think. So who's your other guard then?

I think, well, I have to look at the minutes. I was going to do this tomorrow, but I thought Tybalt was unbelievable. If he played enough minutes, I think I'm going to vote him first team in the guard. I have smart first team. Can I ask you a quick follow-up? Yeah.

The Embiid MVP campaigning bothered you, but the smart defensive player of the year campaigning did not. But I felt that way when he was 16-1 on FanDuel and we went on Ringer Gambling Show, and I was like, I don't understand why he's not the favorite. He's absolutely sick.

He started doing a lot of like, no one likes me. You're just like, all right, relax. I don't like that. Yeah, you're right. I wish he hadn't done that. Yeah. Didn't impact the voting thing. I just, I would rather have a... How about this?

I don't like when any player lobbies for a pick and plays the pity card when they're trying to go for an award. Just don't do it. Yeah, and I would not let it get in the way of my thing. I probably had smart two. If Bam had played more games You know, if Bam had played more games.

I think if Bam had played, I don't know, three-fourths of the games, I'd probably pick Bam. I didn't like that Jackson was 27 minutes a game. It was just... I just couldn't get there with it. Bridges, maybe a little love as well. Love Bridges.

Looked at him. Bridges was the other one. I probably had... I think I had smart... I don't know how it's going to go, but it's going to be smart, Bridges, Jackson, in some order.

But I think Jackson's going to be third for me. All right. First team all NBA. You want to go first? Yeah, I have... I tried to figure out how to put luca at forward because because it solved a lot of problems

and i did it didn't we just last week talk about how like hey this is the way we've been doing it it says do it by position you can't make it up and the first thing you say well here's the thing i try to get luca forward i voted for him at forward in 2021 and 2020 so two years ago i had him at forward and i was like why wouldn't i do that again and i looked i looked at all the lineups they played i thought he played with brunson and did witty more he really didn't know that yeah when you sent me that text today i didn't today, I didn't want to jump on you. Yeah. They split him up a decent amount. Yeah.

Luca was just a guard. It's a stretch to put him at forward. It's a huge stretch. I didn't feel good about it, so I didn't do it. Okay. So, Yoka, Giannis, Tatum, Luca, Booker, which I think most people, I think that's going to be the five, unless you cheat and put Embiid and Jokic together. I went back, I looked

at the last six times I voted for All-NBA dating back to 2016. In 21, I had Jokic one and Embiid two. In 20, I had Davis one and Jokic two. In 19, I had Embiid one and Jokic two. In 18, I had Davis one and Embiid two. I just, I think you should pick one center. I've done it the whole time I've had a vote and I don't see why we would change that this year. And I think as we discussed in part one, I had Jokic a hair over Embiid. I feel bad. Embiid had an awesome season, we would change that this year. And I think, as we discussed in part one, at Yoka, Yoka,

your hair over Embiid. I feel bad. Embiid had an awesome season, but this is the shit that happens when you do all NBA. So that's my five. Who do you have? I have the exact same thing. Yeah.

I didn't, I didn't screw around with it. I put it by position and, you know, it sucks for Embiid. There you go. Um,

okay. Second team. it sucks for Embiid. There you go. Okay. Second team. We both have Embiid? Yes. We both have Durant? Yes. I really tried to go down the road with figuring out him

for 55 games for first team all NBA, but the bottom line is Tatum had a great resume. There's no reason to bump Tatum for first team NBA, but the bottom line is Tatum had a great resume. There was no reason to bump Tatum for first team. He was really good. If Durant had played 10 more games, he gets the Tatum spot, but he played 55.

Bad luck. He was out for 21 games. The records for him when he played versus when he didn't play was probably the most significant of anybody we're talking about, right? He was, I'm looking it up right now, 27 missed games. There were 35 in 19 when he played, 8 in 19 when he didn't play. It's too bad. And he's had a lot of bad luck with this stuff over the years where I think untimely injuries or 20 game injuries here and there.

Anyway, I have Embiid, Durant, DeRozan, Curry, Jha is where I landed, which I think that untimely injuries or 20 game injuries here and there. Anyway, I have Embiid, Durant, DeRozan, Curry, Ja. Is where I landed, which I think is what most people are going to pick. You had that? Yeah, we did not talk about this ahead of time. I have the exact same thought. Look, if you're going through it, did I want to put Chris Paul in the Ja Morant spot?

I did. I just couldn't get there. I thought the Suns were that good this season. And the thing with Chris, he was 15-4 in 11 assists a game. He was 49-32-84. The three-pointers were lower than I thought this year, the percentage for him. His usage rate was 19.7, which I thought was amazing. 17 missed games.

There were 53 in 12, 11.5 without him. And his stats would be better if he cared about stats, which he doesn't. But it just wasn't quite good enough. And Ja, even though he missed 24 games, he meant so much in those games. I think he gave that team a championship aura by how good he was.

And I just thought he deserved second. And he was insane when he played. And he was insane when he played. I know they won a bunch of games without him, but then I didn't feel good about putting the other guards that are in the mix ahead of him because I thought when Ja was in, it was that dynamic.

And they won a bunch of games with him. We know they won a bunch of games without him, which is crazy. But, you know, and if you're going to do KD, second team. You have to do Javid for KD. Yeah, that's a combo. Third team. Let's see if we have any changes.

I think we will on this one. Guards, Chris Paul and Trey Young. Yep. Last time we did it, ran through it, I left going, okay, I'm not leaving Trey off. I'm not 100% comfortable with the financial implications for it. So I think if it's close, I would probably go in that direction. Now, there's no way I'd put Trey any higher than third team here because they were extremely disappointing despite all of his numbers.

And then when there was a moment where I was like, would I put Trey over Chris Paul if I put another guard? Because I don't love that I put Trey over Chris Paul if I put another guard? Because I don't love that I don't have Donovan Mitchell in the mix because the numbers are absurd again for Donovan Mitchell, and they're still a good team. They're not great, but Utah's been good. I started playing with these scenarios. Imagine if Chris Paul were on the Hawks.

Would there be a four seed in the East? I know that sounds like an anti-Trey thing, but look, here's the point. It's Trey and Chris Paul are both my guards on the third team. And once you get through it and you go through all the guards, the only other options... Mitchell is the only one with a case.

Yeah, and Levine in passing to say his name, because to say it, to say it, that we're aware, we looked at it all and all that kind of stuff. But I'll tell you, this one wasn't... The only thing I really struggled with was the other forward spot for the third team. Well, let's get there.

Who'd you have for center? I had Towns. Towns. I put him in over Gobert. There's a possible cheat code where you could go... Bam. Bam or Gobert at center and put Towns up forward. Because if you watch the T-Wolves,

even though Vanderbilt's listed as a power forward, Townsend is, I don't even really know what position he is. He's kind of like a center forward. And if you wanted to get creative. Well, offensively, yeah, he'll mix up his position quite a bit. I didn't think Bam played enough games, and I didn't want to reward Gobert. Siakam is in one forward spot for me.

Siakam, I was looking at all the votes I had over the years. I had Siakam third team in 2019. I had Siakam third team in 2020 and I have him third team this year. So three of the last four years, I had him as one of the six best forwards of the league. What, five, six months ago, we were like, would you trade the Kaminga pick and Andrew Wiggins for Siakam? Nah, I wouldn't do that. Siakam, I feel like he could have been had in a trade

for about three months there. Remember, the Siakam stuff got weird, though. It got weird there for a little while. Yeah, that's why you could have had him. Yeah, so he's been unbelievable for the last however many months. I mean, he took over the game the other night. And then there was a fourth quarter game, though, and another game where he was going at him, beating that Philly win.

I mean, that was incredible. And then he had another game that wasn't all that great. But the overall numbers, the point is, look, everybody's up and down. It doesn't matter. But his overall numbers now for a long stretch

have been really, really good. So I have... He's almost a 23 and 10. Five assists. Yeah, the assist numbers. 49% shooting. He's only missed 14 games. And that team's a five seed.

And he's, I think, a worthy forward. So then the other forward spot. I fucking hate it, but I had LeBron. Why do you hate it so much? I don't like it. I don't like it. I know it's disappointing. I know he picks spots.

He put up huge offensive numbers here again. The forward crop is light to get to six. He's disappointing. I know he picks spots. He put up huge offensive numbers here again. The forward crop is light to get to six. He's in. That's why I had him. There's other years. I thought it was last year I got my years mixed up. Two years ago, I kept Beal off because he was a good stats, bad team guy.

I'm on the record over the years. I don't like the good stats, bad team. I don't care. Here's the point, though. Just like the good stats, bad team. I don't care. Yeah, but sometimes, here's the point though, like just like the MVP stuff we were talking about in part one. If you present Embiid's case in a vacuum, you're like, how does that guy lose MVP?

And you're like, okay, but you're comparing it to everything else. So in your Beal argument, you may have had a better option that you felt better about. In this year, to get to six forwards, you have to do something you probably don't like

based on your criteria of good stats, bad team guy. But LeBron's still deserving of one of these six spots. And by the way, the Pascal-Jimmy Butler thing was really tough for me. It was really tough. Butler, though, has better efficiency stuff. Yeah, I have him.

I have him over Pascal. I have him over Siakam. They were 38-19 with Butler, 15-9 without him. 23% from three-point line this year. He had the weird incident with three weeks left, and he missed a ton of games. All right, but the on-off thing favors Butler over Siakam. The defensive plus-minus stuff favors Butler pretty significantly.

The PER stuff is like almost four points, well, no, three better. There's some stuff with Butler on the analytics side where you're like, wait, I don't know how much of an argument this really is. So I think this stuff with Spoh, whatever. I mean, it looked bad. It looked like Jimmy Butler. It's not new.

And if it were new, I don't know how much I would have that, like that really gotten your, I mean, if you want to just tell me you like Siakam better as a player. Okay, fine. You might be right. I might be wrong. The Spoh thing didn't factor in.

I like Siakam more as a player. Okay. I think the second half of the season, I thought he was excellent. He was. And I'm looking up his splits. What were his splits after the all-star break? He was almost 25 points a game. I mean, he was really good

the whole year. The assist numbers too? November, he was 18-7. And then from that point on, he basically took off. And eye test wise, I think that team needed him to really step up,

especially in close games against good teams. That team did really well against other good teams this year. And he was the guy they went to most of the time. It was him or Van Vliet, but really Siakam if they had the matchups. Whereas Butler, you watch them and honestly, it seems like Harrow is their most important guy at the end of a lot of these games. But they kind of ride or die with him. And they're running him around screens and he's the guy who's creating. most important guy at the end of a lot of these games. But they kind of ride or die with him.

And they're running him around screens and he's the guy who's creating. I don't know. I just thought Siakam was better. But I do agree that it was close. I wanted to put Butler in the LeBron spot. I couldn't get there. The Lakers finished 32-50. They were 25-31 when he played.

He missed 26 games. He's plus 3.4 on off. There's historical stuff where it's like the players, here's the complete list of players who missed at least 23 games on a losing team and made all NBA since the merger. Pete Maravich, 1978.

He made first team for some reason. He missed 32 games. Still don't understand it. Bernard King, 1985, made first team for some reason. He missed 32 games. Still don't understand it. Bernard King, 1985, made first team, deserved it. It was 33 a game. It was an absolute tornado. And then Kevin Love, second team, 2012. He missed 23 games and he made it. The list of players that have missed at least 23 games have made first, second, third team. It's less than 15. So Curry did it recently in 2018.

Ben Warbeck did some good stuff on Yahoo about this. He said basically players who played 50 plus games for a legitimately bad team, like 40% record or worse for winning, had a vintage season. It's really only LG Baylor, 1960, Will Chamberlain, 63, Kevin Garnett, and Dwayne Wade, both 2007. So I think it has to be a famous player

having a really good season, and he qualifies. And it's like, should there be a little cachet for being LeBron James? Yeah, maybe there should be. But I don't feel great about it. Okay, but do you still think he's one of the 15 best players? I do. Well, do I think he's

one of the 15 impactful guys that we watched this season? Yes. Yeah. I think it's okay. I think it's okay with all NBA to, and I'm not talking like it's some career achievement thing, but I think when you watch a full season of games and you go, do I really want to put 15 guys ahead of LeBron?

I didn't want to do that. I did this. I was like, all right, I'm going to switch LeBron and see Occom. Are the Raptors worse or better? Are the Lakers worse or better? Raptors are probably a little bit better. I'm going to switch Butler and LeBron This year from what we saw Is Miami better? Yeah probably

Probably a couple Games better So you start thinking that way and you're like alright what are we doing I don't like the fact that I just I didn't think I went to those four games That's what I couldn't shake out of my head Watching the guy leave timeouts

And just walk as far away from his team as he possibly could. He wanted to get out of that season from February on. He just did. You could see it if you went to the games. And he was looking for his own stuff, and that's fine. I don't blame him, because he's

playing with Russell Westbrook and a bunch of washed-up guys. But he's also partly the reason they were there. Yeah. But he's also partly the reason they were there. Yeah. Yeah. But you have to, whatever your rules are, you end up bending them

if not breaking them at times to get to year 15. And next year, all your rules. I didn't vote for him in 2019 and I think that was the right move. I think he made it 13 All-NBA in 2019, but I voted for

Siakam and Aldridge, who were both on really good teams. By the way, speaking of the Lakers, they avoided 50 losses with that win tonight against Denver. They sure did. Right. So Vogel, just moments ago, his quote about whether or not he's been informed

that he's been fired, his quote was, I haven he's been informed that he's been fired. His quote was, I haven't been told shit. Amazing. Did Magic fire him? Magic's going to be our first take tomorrow. Being like, well, I hit up Frank, but I have his old number. So we're going to try to talk to him today. I love that thing you did about Magic,

how he keeps resurfacing. Well, TV, I know who calls him. I know how it works. Well, we know how it goes. Right, and I don't blame anyone from ESPN going, do you want to come on the show and cause a fucking ruckus? Here's the thing. When he does that, though,

the insinuation is that if he was running things, it would have gone a lot better. First of all, I went back and listened to our over-under pod we did about the Lakers. I went under.

I think you went under and I think House went over. All of us were like, Davis and LeBron, throw anybody with those guys and you're still going to be one of the most talented teams in the West.

We don't like the Westbrook trade, but we all said that. I'm going to jump in and give you credit. You were more of the most talented teams in the West. We don't like the Westbrook trade, but we all said that. I'm going to jump in and give you credit. You are more down on them than any of us were in the pot. But I never said like, they're going to suck. I was just like, I don't, I don't think he's going to help them, but they still have Davis and LeBron. They're going to be fine.

That was where we all landed. I don't think anybody was going. I wonder what Simmons and Rosillo think about Westbrook. Like, I don't think anybody was going i wonder what simmons and rossillo think about westbrook like i don't think anybody was was shocked by this and honestly me as being probably yeah it wasn't a lot of news breaking stuff from us although i loved i don't know i almost i almost sent it out maybe i'll do it for you later tonight there was some fan site that was throwing out uh westbrook's totals like not his averages but his totals oh yeah and so like in 10 categories westbrook was first or second because i can't wait like if westbrook is moved someone on tv is going to say like look he's still 18 7 and 7 like you know and you you

little tweak a little tweak there and i'm like you should just go to china dude just go to china get like 50 after this $47 million thing. Cause you're, you're anyway, we've already done all this Westbrook stuff. I read some piece about trying to think of Westbrook trades. And one of them was like, if Charlotte wants to get off of the Hayward Rozier contracts, Oh my God. Get out with Westbrook. I'm like, I'm pretty sure they're not going to want to do that. There's no home for him. They're going to be stuck with him. And I think they're going to keep undermining him and hope that he just demands a buyout. I think that's

the end game for this. But I thought Ramona's piece that was really good in the sense that she was like those around Westbrook, like the idea of a buyout is such an insult to him because he thinks of buyout players as like, oh, you're washed and then you took a buyout. So I thought that was really a good insight in that piece. I'm never going to say never about any ridiculous contract. I'm never going to say never about any player that looks like nobody would want him. But as we've talked about, the landing spots for him are really, really complicated

because even bad teams with nothing exciting, even if you wanted to say, well, maybe Presti would do it for a sweetener or whatever. And you're like, yeah, but these guys are trying to develop all the guys they've just been drafting. And to throw Westbrook into the mix. Like he's, he's the weirdest fit because he's just going to show up and want to do all of his shit there too.

So like if you're rebuilding, it's like you're making an indie movie and the producer's like, Hey, I know we're working with all these young actors, but I got Nick Cage. Like, Oh, cool. I knew where you were going, but I didn't know where. And I think you. I thought I landed the plane. Yeah. No, Nick Cage is really good. Well, what's a better one, though?

If you give yourself some more time to think about it, like who would be the guy to come in on an indie film at this stage of his life? Oh, it's like it's like Burt Reynolds in the late 90s, past Boogie Nights, like five years after with big bad wig on. Just still thinking he's Burt Reynolds. What if it was like some Columbia film student and it was Ed Norton? It was like...

Oh, Ed Norton? Yeah. Rumored to be difficult on the set. Do you know... Matthew Modine? No, I don't want to start that up again.

Oh, don't get... Don't feud with Modine. Do you know Tracy McGrady in 2004 made second team all-NBA on the 2004 Magic that were 21 and 61? Did you know Antonio McDyess made third team all-NBA in 1999

and the Nuggets were 14 and 36 in the strike season? So those are our Nate Deers. All right, but I'm telling you, the level of talent that we have at the top now, there's some lean years when you go back and start digging through it. Like, it's incredible. I'll have nights where I can't believe

what I get to see, you know? We were a couple forward short this year. I just don't think LeBron should have made it playing 56 games with a losing record. But he was the best choice. It is what it is. That's it. Who do you have in the finals? I still have Buck's sons. I've never

wavered since October. We're too similar on this. Well, we watch basketball. Give me Phoenix-Boston then. What a dick. Just so if Boston makes it, I can say you never believed in them and I knew it.

I believe. Just to torture you. I think they can make it. I was going to pick Suns-Bucks, but now I'm not going to. I'll pick Boston. Well, I'm doing the thing. I actually laid out. You'll like this. I did my whole bracket.

You got any 512s? Oh, you'll notice. If you stop moving it. Oh, you have Boston in the finals. I do, but I subscribe to the theory that you can't change your pick from the start of the season unless there's a really good reason, like the guy got hurt or it's just like,

if you had the Lakers in the finals, you could change your pick. But I feel like if the pick that you had before the season is realistic, you should try to keep it. If I was betting, I would bet Phoenix-Boston because the odds are better. And I think it's a toss-up between Boston and Milwaukee.

So there you go. Who does Cerruti have? Man. I mean, it's Phoenix and the West. I'll go Bucs. It's a shock. Although, I think you guys are underselling Durant and the Nets. I don't know.

I'd be scared to sell them. Listen, at no point did I ever not say I wasn wasn't scared of kevin durant now you're a little dismissive i i'm giving him the 35 a game in the series i'm already giving it to him yeah but that's not what the point is we're not talking about stats we're talking about caring and he almost did it last year exactly brooklyn and brooklyn for the defensive stuff it's actually kind of crazy how the last 15 they they finished out a really nice net plus six. They were the fourth best offense. They were the ninth best defense.

But something did feel off going into that Knicks game where I'm like, what the fuck with these guys? Come on. Where is it? I know Seth Curry being in and out doesn't help. The Harris thing obviously was done a long time ago. I imagine they're probably just going to go small

and try to just horrify you with amazing ISO players. And, you know, actually, efficient ISO players can get the job done in the playoffs when they're really hard to guard. I don't think Curry's healthy. Yeah, I don't know.

I think he's going to play, but... So, if I said to you before this season, the Nets aren't going to have James Harden. They're not going to have Joe Harris. But instead, they're going to have Seth Curry at 80% and Andre Drummond. They're going to get nothing from

Blake Griffin at all. Zero. Nothing from Paul Millsap. And Kyrie will have played 20 games. How far do you think the Nets are going to go in the playoffs? I would say not far, but if you told me before everything that happened last year that Kyrie, KD,

and Harden were going to play eight games together and then they were going to lose Kyrie and then Harden was going to blow out his hamstring and they were still a three-pointer away from being in the Eastern Conference Finals. I mean, that's crazy. And it still almost happened. Let's end on this. The Brooklyn-Boston

series is going to be awesome. Durant against the Bucs last year. 29-10 to 32-4-6. 30-10-5. 28-13-5. 49-17-10. In game five when they were up 3-2 in the series. If he's going to put up 49 a game, I'm not feeling as good.

32-11-3, 48-9-6 in the overtime loss. Here's my dream scenario for Celtics-Nets. The series ends, Celtics win. The long, long hug between Tatum and Durant followed by the announcer going, what did KD say to you after that game? And Tatum

just goes, I'd like to keep that between us, but he did say, you're next young buck. That's what I want. That's what I want from this series. What if you read lips and he says, how attached are you to that Pritchard guy? No, he leans in and goes,

why didn't you tell me about Kyrie? I've known you for seven years. Everybody told him. No heads up. Everybody told him. They really did. Oh my God. All right. We'll end on that. You can listen to Rossell's podcast. everybody told no heads up everybody told they really did oh my god uh

all right we'll end on that you can listen to Russo's podcast he has a couple this week I will have a couple as well

might pop on the ringer gambling shows at least once this podcast was produced by Kyle Creighton thanks to Dylan Berkey and Steve Cerruti

as well good to see you Russo thanks as well. Good to see you, Russo. Thanks.