The Bill Simmons Podcast - Pete Holmes on Conspiracies, Humor, and 'Crashing' (Ep. 309)

Episode Date: January 4, 2018

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by comedian and star of HBO's 'Crashing,' Pete Holmes, to discuss his start in comedy, his favorite conspiracy theories (11:00), why roasts are therapeutic (22:00), the art vs. the person (28:00), the premise behind 'Crashing' (33:00), New York's stand-up scene (46:00), recording with Garry Shandling (55:00), Aaron Rodgers's UFO obsession (1:03:00), the power of boredom (1:12:00), and finding the weirdness with podcasts (1:20:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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My listeners can try it for free at ZipRecruiter.com slash BS. That's ZipRecruiter.com slash BS. Coming up, I talk to Pete Holmes, star of the HBO show Crashing. And the reason this is going to start abruptly, because the microphones were on and we had been talking and the podcast just started. So here's pearl jabe here we go Do you love the Doobie Brothers?

I mean, that's not the Doobie Brothers right there. That's almost famous. Yeah, that's Jason. Jason Lee, yeah. Billy Crudup. Yeah, it looks like a real band. Yeah. What are they called?

They were called Stillwater in the movie. Great fake band there. Yeah, great fake band. They have a nice job. What was it called? It was, they were called Stillwater in the movie. Stillwater. Great fake band name. Yeah, great fake band. They did a couple good fake songs. They do have a couple great fake songs. And every time I touch a mic. Sheeperdog was pretty good.

That's right. Right? It's not that hard. Not that hard. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Like, somebody can write a rock song. Yeah.

And if you put it in a movie and everyone's cheering, you're like, that sounds like a hit rock song. You ready? Yep. Were you taping that? Yes. Oh, all right. Were you taping that? Yes. Oh, all right. We started with Pete Holmes.

We were talking about, he was looking at my Almost Famous and Doobie Brothers posters. I don't love Almost Famous. I don't know why. You love it. I do love it. But I also have seen the case. This isn't me poking or goading you.

No, I've heard the case against it. It's a polarizing movie for people who love it. They're like dreams, I guess. And that's just one that I don't want to have over and over and over i don't know why interesting there's a lot of like fighting i feel like they're up unhappy so you're down on boogie nights then because that's another one like that buddy you like boogie nights i don't like boogie so you're helping me understand so you don't like fighting but guess what my favorite movie is but coco there will be so i'll be seeing my way out.

No, it's a Paul Thomas Anderson. There Will Be Blood and The Master are two of my favorite movies. I don't like ensemble movies. Interesting. That's that movie. That's why I don't like the X-Men. I'm a Batman guy. I'm not an X-Men guy.

I don't like groups. I don't want them being like, Wolverine, get in there. I just want one guy and one villain. I don't want like tennis over basketball. I mean, if I were, I like poker over basketball. I like lone wolf stuff, like one guy heads up that sort of thing. Baseball, I suppose, is more compelling to me, but even like basketball and I'm not a sports person, but like what I do identify is it's the the it's the sport that is easiest to be famous in meaning it's the most showboaty no helmet you know what i mean so the better photographs i

grew up obsessed with with jordan obviously so even though it is five on five it does kind of get reduced into it's all about kobe man you know what i mean so it is kind of a one player sport especially when you're at see it in person. It's the best sport to just kind of zone out and watch the guys at all times, even during timeouts and stuff. Really? How they interact, how they hang out at the foul line. What they're in.

Just what they're up to. You feel like you're looking into their soul. I don't feel like any of the sports like that. That's interesting. Because they know where to hide. There's no dugout. Yeah, you're wearing shorts and a sleeveless shirt. You're very vulnerable.

Everyone's staring at you. You're so sweaty. Yeah. And when I've been to basketball games, I'm struck by how close they are. Yeah. Baseball, you're like, oh, my god. My father, Red Sox, season ticket holders,

are seats, I don't know, first base line? OK. Is that what you say? First base line. I'm trying to be cute. First base line. Okay. Is that what you say? First base line. I'm trying to be cute. First base line? Yeah, so you're like section. Take a right at first base.

You'll hit us after, not the box seats, but way back. Oh, okay, so you're back. Back. Yeah, second level. Second level, I suppose. Not up, but on the ground, but back. So you didn't like baseball? Not a baseball person, no.

Didn't like going to, you're from Lexington, right? Here right here's why bill i'd love to talk about this okay there's a couple well it's it's really simple my dad and my brother had baseball and i just like i did the thing where i tried to get my dad's attention by pretending i also like baseball yeah it just didn't work it wasn't paying out so i went with mom oh interesting mom was paying out so i learned like to talk and to gossip and to like go on strolls i'm not saying baseball's stupid i'm just saying i didn't find what i wanted there i was actually good at baseball i'm left-handed left hand you're taught you're a secretly tall guy i'm a tall guy pull pull that ball right in the right field see there you go who have we had Who else has been secretly tall in the pod?

We've had a couple. Who was the one? Gyllenhaal. Gyllenhaal was secretly tall. How else was he? Coates was tall. Oh, Coates was super. Coates was like 6'4". Gyllenhaal's what?

Actor tall? I'm tall tall. Gyllenhaal was actor tall. You thought he was going to be 5'1", but he was what? Gyllenhaal and Ben Affleck are actor tall. They're like 6'1", 6'2", but it feels like they're 6'8", because they're actors. Yes. You meet Matty D, the counterpart to Benny A. He's fairly tall, but he'sck's tall. 6'1", 6'2", but it feels like they're 6'8", because they're actors. Yes. You meet Matty D, the counterpart to Benny A.

He's fairly tall, but he's not tall tall. He claims that he's like six feet, but he's like 5'10". That's why I love him. Yeah. But 5'10 as an actor is huge. He's real small in downsizing. He's real, real small. Here's what nobody said about downsizing.

Earthquakes. Come on, guys. I have to say. If there's an earthquake or a flood, you guys are fucked. If we're going to shrink you down, we should put you up in a tree or something. It should be on a system of pulleys. Or hanging, yeah. Birds?

There wasn't one bird attack in that whole, can you swear? Yeah. Fucking movie? Not one? Just do it. Just one bird. How funny would that have been? The downside of downsizing.

It could have been a great horror movie. Instead it was just like, am I going to find love? Is this woman's accent offensive? We don't know. I didn't see it. You're going to laugh at that riff later. No, no, no. Because there's a character that you're like, am I okay with this?

I know there's a weird accent character. And if you watch it stoned and she keeps being in the movie, you have one of these high moments where you're like, oh, this is a main character? Oh, no. You think she's like the color.

She's like, oh, that's funny. It's kind of like Mr. Jones, like the sidekick in Temple of Doom. And you're like, it's kind of weird. I'm uncomfortable. But it's probably just like a gag. Nope. She's the movie. That's the big deal. Which is great,

but also unexpected, especially while high. I get the screener, so I watch 90, 95% of them, but that one I just couldn't... What are you watching on your screen screen? I watched that. I was excited to watch that one on the screener. I'd heard feedback from people that I trust that would make me

seem that I wasn't going to like it. Downsizing. Yeah. I wouldn't say I liked it. But if I get high before... It was interesting. I don't smoke a lot of dope. But if I do, it means I don't think the movie's going to be great.

You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. I have respect. Do I know what you mean? And reverence. Yeah. Are you a literal person? No, I mean...

Are you one of those people that I'm like, I'm so hungry I could eat a dog. You're like, really? You're describing a whole genre. You're going to eat a dog. No, you're describing a genre of movies that I love. What do you mean? Well, the movies that really aren't that good,

but weed pushes them to another level. Did you see Disaster? No, I saw it, but I wasn't stoned for that one. But neither was I, because I wanted to really enjoy it. Right. But it made me feel as happy as if I was stoned. I really enjoyed it. But there's some that you don't want to be stoned for that one. But neither was I, because I wanted to really enjoy it. Right. But it made me feel as happy as if I was stoned. I really enjoyed it. But there's some that you don't want to be stoned.

Like, I think if I had been stoned for Good Time, I think I would have gotten freaked out. Oh, my god. Good Time is too intense. Good Time. Did we like Good Time? I think we liked it. I never want to see it again.

That's what I'm saying. Movies are like dreams. I didn't need to have that one. I get it. It's like Babel. Remember? It's like a whole genre of movie. Kids. Where it's just like. I definitely don't want to have that one i get it it's like babble remember it's like a whole genre of movie kids where it's just like definitely don't want to see kids again everything that

goes wrong can go wrong if the director of kids directed downsizing it would only be birds eating matt damon and they'd just be like that's how life is and i'm like yes i know i go to the movies just like remember good things and they're like nah fucking birds bro what about people watch eyes wide shut like 50 times yeah it's the nudity well it's the nudity and then they're also convinced kubrick's trying to tell us all these things i don't know if you've ever gone in a deep dive on this i do a deep dive on kubrick people now think that he was trying to tell us all about hollywood child pornography yes and and all the predators out there through eyes wide shut which i'm just not intelligent enough to see. I got to be honest.

I think you're one YouTube video away from being intelligent enough to see. You don't have to be smart. You just have to have a lot of free time and click a link. Because I went in a, I don't know why. I'm not very obsessive. Actually, I can be. But The Shining has a lot of hidden symbology. They made a documentary about it.

That one I kind of believe. And then you can go deeper on YouTube. Because there's stuff on YouTube that they're like, oh, I can see why they didn't put this in the movie. It's a little too weird. I've been going on the Reddit conspiracy page for the last couple months and really enjoying it. What conspiracies are you into?

I just like, well, I love that JFK is my favorite. It drives me crazy that people think there was only one shooter. Oh, really? I'm convinced there was more. Sure. It's fun to believe. Conspiracies are great. His brains come out of the back of his head.

We got shot from behind and his brains went backwards. Like, that's not happening. Right. Somebody else shot him. Something happened. Right. So I love the one where they say, like, the Secret Service agent shot him. Was that one?

The guy was in the car. He turned around to see what the shots were, and his gun discharged. I don't know if I believe that. And that's why Kennedy's head was just basically blown off. That's part of Waco. Are you familiar with the story of Waco? Not really. They have footage of this, I say, as if that makes it true.

The theory is that who shot first at Waco is one of the, is one of the stories, right? Because it was like an accidental discharge. That's what the theory, and they have footage of it is there's SWAT guys climbing a ladder and you can see his sidearm go off totally by accident. It's in the holster.

And it's like, they think these people hypothesize that that was the first shot that like started the massacre. Very sad. The thing I like about conspiracies though, as a storyteller, is they're good storytelling. It's like very interesting to take. Like I love, there's a conspiracy that Jesus wasn't dead when he was crucified. They took him down because it was against Roman law or Jewish law to have crucified

people up over Passover. Yeah. So it's called the Passover plot. So Jesus made sure he was crucified right before Passover so they could take him down because you have to, but he's pretending to be dead so he could rise from the dead. Like, that's like, I don't believe that conspiracy, but I love the guy that like fell into that rabbit hole and it tickles a part of your brain. And tickle is the right word.

It feels kind of like, like it's sort of like what if it's exciting it's weird well the the moon landing is one of my favorites it's a great one but that's the shining that's them confessing that they never went to the moon and capricorn one with oj simpson was another one what's capricorn one it's basically they made a movie it's fictional but they made it about these three astronauts pretending in a studio stage that they were on some planet i don't remember and oj was in it and then they escape yeah and oj was in it yeah no way oj made a lot of movies in the 70s man yeah but even like he was in towering inferno and really oh yeah he's he was like a real actor i was in nordberg age towering inferno sounds like a movie.

You knew O.J. as Nordberg. I would have had to stand on my friend's shoulders in a trench coat to see Towering Inferno. Well, Towering Inferno was one of those where they just got like 50 famous people and had them in a burning building. Because that always works. The more stars the better. That's what we like. See that? It goes back to ensembles. I don't care for

one guy. The conspiracy, it gets dark. I don't care for it. One guy. The conspiracy, it gets dark. I don't like the dark ones, like the people who think Sandy Hook was staged with actors. Sure. That I don't get. Yeah, it can get dark, and you risk being disrespectful. You know what I mean? I think that's not even, that one isn't even a risk.

That's just like flat out disrespectful. I wasn't accusing you. No, no, I'm saying like that. I just don't like that one. It's tricky to say there's a 9-11 conspiracy that i don't like that one either i know but i'm not talking about like there's one there's 75 all i was going to say to you as a conspiracy person just to not don't even look into it there's a theory that there were no planes that they were holograms see that's that's fine oh you already knew well the holograms is crazy because there was people looking up at the planes going into the buildings.

And there's video out of this stuff. And videos from everywhere. But I mean, I'm not even saying you should. And it might be disrespectful. I don't know. But it's interesting, because some people found angles where you can't see the plane. I just wasted nine hours of your life.

You are going to smoke a doobie and type in no plane and bye. What about, have you ever followed the seventh, I think it's called World Trade Center 7? Yeah. The building that collapsed a couple hours later. But that is. And they think it was imploded. Nobody's been able to explain what was good about imploding the buildings.

Well, yeah. And the mayor. What was the business incentive to do this? It wasn't the mayor, but they have footage of, oh boy, I wish I could remember his title. Any good conspiracy theorist will remember titles like the Secretary of blah blah. I don't remember, but he says they made the decision to pull it, which

is the term for detonating it. And if you watch, it does crease right at the top and fall into its own footprint. That's what I like when people are experts on what a building should look like when it's being blown up. Yeah, but you know how up Watch how it folds in It should be folding out Why is it blowing in the first place?

Because They said there was too much heat Oh, you believe this one You don't believe that there's more going on to World Trade Center 7? That's not even a conspiracy They were like, ah, forget it It's not in the 9- That's just like, they were like, ah, forget it. The one that I-

It's not in the 9-11 commission. I'm not even, don't make me this guest. I love this. World Trade Center 7 is not in the 9-11 commission. It's like a thousand page book. They don't mention

the third building that fell like four o'clock that afternoon because two floors were on fire. It has been kind of thrown to the side. But that's a Google, that's worth a Google. See, I think the Pentagon, the fact that there's really no video at all of the plane going into the Pentagon. You're making me the worst guest.

This is great. I'm the worst guest. Who doesn't like conspiracies? I suppose. There's one grainy video of the plane going into the Pentagon. It's like four frames, yeah. Yeah, but nothing else. Rumsfeld called it a missile that morning.

Well, Clinton gave an interview once where he mistakenly said it was bombed instead of a plane. So people grasp onto that, like, see, he slipped. Well, again, I got really into this, too. They tracked the plane going over the flight path. First of all, the plane on the radar, because they have the radar of it or whatever, did a turn that a lot of professional pilots say is very, very, very, very, very, very difficult. Yeah. So here's a crop flying guy, crop dusting plane flying guy, flipping.

Anyway, why are we talking about this? Let's talk about There Will Be Blood. Let's talk about Crashing premiering season two, January 14. Let's talk about how you blew up the cover of Nevermind so the penis on the baby is as big as mine. There's funny things we could be saying. People are turning this off. I get fewer views. They love it.

What do you want to promote first? Crashing. That's all. When's the date? January 14. That's all we have to say. January 14th. Yeah, buddy.

Will the football be done by then? I didn't know football was happening. It is. Round two. Round two? Round two? Round two. NFL playoffs. There are two rounds of football now?

There's four. Four rounds. Yeah, there's been four for a while. Let's talk about sports. No, no, no. I think you're going to be done by then. What time is crashing on? It's at?

1030. Oh, yeah. Football doesn't happen at 1030. Football's done by then. You're great. What a great night that is. You can watch two football games. Sunday night HBO schedule yeah

and we're both from Boston yeah so I should like sports although Lexington I covered a lot of high school sports in Boston after college

and I was in a lot of oh was LHS good well Concord Carlisle and Lexington were two of my favorites to go to

because they had really nice facilities my high school yours and the Concord Carlisle and Lexington were two of my favorites to go to because they had really nice facilities. My high school. Yours and the Concord Carlyle. Those are good facilities. Okay. Yeah.

Because, you know, the suburbs, they pour a lot of money into the... Right. That's just where the kids smoked. That was the smoking parking lot. That's all I know about that. So you got out of there pretty fast, right? I'm six foot six. So I would walk down the halls of LHS and the coach would come up to me and go, why? Like, yell at me.

Because the truth is, I'm six six, not pretend six six, like on my stats. I'm six five and a half. I can just stand by the thing and cherry, isn't that what they call it? Cherry pick? You give me the ball. I have no talent. I'll just do a bounce. We could go into the rim and rim protect.

That's what I'm saying. saying like i'm just a giant so the best fastest you know through the legs fancy dribbling guy just runs into like and we're playing shirts and skins and i'm flabby and wet like i will fucking shut you down so you you want to know part of the varsity hoops what's that you didn't want to play basketball. Why? I don't know. You're 6'6". That's the only reason I can come up with. Why run back there? We were just there. Now we have to run back here.

Put the hoop. Put the hoop. No, no, I get it. I don't want to come off as somebody that doesn't understand why people enjoy sports. I totally do. I lack a certain type of competition. I think when a pitcher really wants to strike out a baseball player, a guy at bat, there's a certain level of, I don't know what to call it, cruelty is too much. You want to embarrass the guy.

The perfect situation is not only that you throw heat, but that he swings at it, spins a few times, and falls on his butt and starts crying. You want to vanquish him. That's what you want. And I don't have a lot of vanquish in me i i'm competitive in the comedian way like i want to get things like i feel jealousy when sometimes especially when you're starting your friend gets conan before you you feel a certain burn but it's personal it's like there will be blood it's not ensemble i'm not gonna like the story isn't gonna involve that guy it's

all internal work and stuff but i don't have that sort of like... This is a joke I've told before, but when we would play pickup basketball, I didn't count points. I counted friends I had made, which is true. When guys would fight and stuff, I'm like, fellas, it's fucking pretend. It's 11 to six.

Like, who fucking cares? We just made that up. That one's worth two. That one's worth two. That one's worth three. Like, it's all baloney. And like, people getting along mattered more to me than that. Again, we're back to like fighting. That's my favorite part of basketball.

Is what? It's the relationships. It's the playing and the going and playing. I'll tell you my favorite. You take that. Staying on the court for three hours, making like weird friends you'd never make normally. Never seen those people again after the game.

Nothing makes me happier than friendly competition. Guys that, when it goes south, and it would. People would get in fights and stuff. I'm just saying the things that would turn me off. And the way that you, like boxers. There's no way. You watch Tyson. The Tyson, they just put it on Netflix.

I'd seen it in the theaters. I love it. It's so interesting I love sports movies and I love things about sports I don't want sports you can't tell me that he's not visualizing killing that man oh definitely you know what I'm saying it's just it's just not the best of us right when when there's a big fight match coming out I'm just like there's a fist fight gonna happen and there's nothing we can do to stop it. Like, they're going to punch each other. So you don't like MMA?

No! What are they doing? Like, when they send the clips around, look at his leg break when he kicks him. I'm like, what the fuck is wrong with you? You run out of pigeons to dissect in your basement, you fucking lunatic? Go watch a sunset. Like, open up. What is this? It's the

worst of us. But I understand. I get it. If you want to watch MMA, I know. There better be more girls in high school if you played hoops. What's that? More girls. Yeah, but then what? Then I'm distracted.

Then I'm the fucking weird guy from Napoleon Dynamite. Then you're the tall guy who you're like, they know what they're getting. You're just tall. You don't really care. But they need you for your height. Oh, I see. That's a great situation. I can be like the gentle ben kind of guy

that's just like i just put the ball in the hoop and they love it as a bonus you just mean the girls no i'm saying i'm saying you're on the team for the coach right even if you're kind of mailing it in you're still giving them height right i'm like andre the giant are you doing a documentary about i am see i like characters like that and and there's something fun about wrestling how they like i don't like wrestling either but but I do appreciate the theater of it. Yeah. Where they're like, we're going to script it, so it's perfect. Right.

That's kind of fun. He had a pituitary thing, so he wouldn't stop growing. That's why he died. My favorite Andre the Giant story is that he'd drink. They had to give him surgery. I'm sure you've heard this. And they said, how much anesthesia should we give this man? Right.

So they said to him, they said, how much do you drink to get drunk? And he said, usually a bottle of vodka, I start to feel a little tipsy. Right. It's just like, oh, my God, this guy, we could live under his liver. Like, it's just like a giant man. It's incredible. It was so hard when doing the documentary to figure out what was the urban legend story versus the actual factual story.

Oh, my God. Because as the years go, people are like, I saw him drink 700 beers. Right. You don't know. I've heard that story, the 700 beer story. You don't know what the line is, what people actually saw. Not to keep bringing up the Bible, but I mean, one of the gospels says Jesus fed 3,000. One of them says 5,000.

We have this in the Bible. People are like, I'm pretty sure there were 5,000. There was no turnstile on the way to the funeral. That's why we wanted to do it, though, because he's one of these people that kind of became, you always hear the phrase larger than life, but he actually was. And then he died. And then the stories kind of became a little more crazy each year. Some comedians are like that.

I think Belushi was like that a little bit. The myth of Belushi has kind of become its own thing. Guys that just don't fit. Farley, I think, is like that. Usually the comedians that die young. Comedians in general, you guys are all competitive, but you're super friendly. And then when somebody dies, it hits the community

like no other community. Every single time, too. I remember Jeff Ross and I talked about this when Greg Giraldo died, who was really vicious in these roasts. Yeah. But playing a part. And then he died. Everybody's like, oh my god, Greg Giraldo.

And all I knew of him is this guy who was just nailing people at the roast. Well, there's nobody sweeter than the meanies. Right. The meanies are the sweeties. And the sweeties are the meanies. You must have done some of the roast stuff, right? I haven't done any roast. I love doing roasts. The meanies are the sweeties. And the sweeties are the meanies. You must have done some of the roast stuff, right? I haven't done any roast.

I love doing roasts. You're too nice for roasts. I love doing roasts. Really? I love doing roasts. I can't figure it out. You're too nice to play basketball, but you love doing roasts.

Roasts are different. Roasts, like, pointing out someone else's shadow is a loving thing to do. You know what I mean? Yeah. If we keep these things to ourselves, it's very cruel. And when we treat each other with such respect that we'll actually say the worst things about each other, it's actually helpful.

And if it hurts your feelings, that's probably where you should dig. You know what I mean? It's good therapy. Wow. Interesting. If it hurts your feelings, like, okay, work on that. That shouldn't hurt your feelings. But it's good therapy. Wow, interesting. If it hurts your feelings, okay, work on that. That shouldn't hurt your feelings. But it's shadow work.

You should pay thousands of dollars. Jeff Ross has made fun of me a bunch. If he makes fun of you and I make fun of Jeff Ross, he looks like I'm on mushrooms. That's how Jeff Ross looks. Why is his face shifting as I'm watching him? Somebody on Crashing,

in season two of Crashing, there's a roast episode and Jeff is on it. And somebody said, you look like a rapper's first manager. I thought that was hilarious. That's a great joke. His hats, his stupid hats. Get those fucking hats off. I'm just being mean for fun.

I fell for that dude as a comedian. He did this, I think it was the Shaq roast oh they they pay-per-viewed I pictured a Shaq in like 2000 I mean Shaquille O'Neal

yeah 2001-2002 Shaq decided he loved roast so he started doing this pay-per-view roast and Jeff Ross was on and he just went out and he like murdered

yeah and this was like roast had kind of been dead at that point yeah they had gone into this low when I was growing up it was like all those Dean Martin ones. Right, of course.

Guys smoking and just calling whoever the one female was a hooker, basically. Right, right, right. And then they kind of died. Yeah, they're not always great. No, they're not. The old ones have not aged well. No, poor Sammy Davis Jr. It's just like, shit.

Sammy took a lot of heat. Pull the nose up, guys. The plane is crashing This is feeling weird Where do you stand? I've asked people who have come on In the comedy world about the shifting taste lines And all the stuff that's going on

How sensitive people are It's an interesting thing But for your show that's actually good Because you can push the envelope Because it's a fake show What do you mean? It's not you It's not like like chapelle got in all this trouble this week because he was talking about um the louis ck accusers okay and that's his act that's i saw him doing so whereas if you did that on your show you could get away with it because it's under the guise of

you have a little bit of freedom it's an interesting thing the way that that I look at a lot of these touchy issues, and we've always had them, is it's like daytime you and nighttime you. There's different yous. We're talking about the shadow. People have different aspects to their personality, and they all beg for expression, if that makes sense. But the problem is that somebody takes, let's say, a Chappelle clip

that if you ducked into a bar in Amsterdam at two in the morning and sat in the back and nobody's filming and in between the burlesque acts, this comedian comes out and he does this stuff and it is offensive. I'm not saying it's not offensive. It is offensive. For some reason, that's what you were looking for that night. You wanted this sort of exorcism of these kind of darker feelings and thoughts. That can be appropriate. That's part of our culture. It's like, you know, having a space for these uglier feelings, uglier thoughts that we all have.

Nuns pouring creamer into their coffee in the morning sometimes go, fucking Diane. You know what I mean? And it's bad to keep those things locked in the basement because that's where they fester and grow into demons that take us down. So roasts, darker, more blue, more offensive stuff has a purpose. It's actually like a light filled purpose. The problem is we have that Amsterdam 2am in between burlesque show set. Now it's being filmed. It's being filmed by everybody. And then it gets posted. And now

it's 11am and you're wearing your starched white shirt and a cornflower blue posted and now it's 11 a.m and you're wearing your your starched white shirt and a cornflower blue tie and it's on your facebook because you thought it was funny to post it at 2 a.m last night and the head of hr is now watching it and he's like that's not appropriate and he's fucking right right you were right enjoying it at 2 a.m drinking absinthe and he's right saying it's not right at 11 a.m in a workplace like there are people here that are offended by that and you need to remove that both are right this is like complicated shit the stuff that i do i don't like offending people yeah it's not what i'm about it's it also just happens to be who i am as a person you know i mean i'm not like squishing down too many offensive thoughts to like do some phony baloney stand- up i'm just being me but i like

people to kind of like have a good time but i mean prior lenny bruce these are the greats you know what i mean these these are the guys that like uh john belushi it's a little bit different but like larger than life iconic crazy people prior beat his wife you know what i mean like prior had some demons man horrible thing yeah and that's that's that's an interesting conversation is can we enjoy Crazy people. Pryor beat his wife, you know what I mean? Pryor had some demons, man. Horrible things. And that's an interesting conversation is, can we enjoy the art of people who are monsters? That became the conversation two, three months ago.

I would argue even further because we all lost the Cosby show when we found out that he was a fucking monster. I mean, literally lost it. It's gone. I don't even know. Is it even on TV? I don't know. But even if you lost it. It's gone. I don't even know. Is it even on TV? But even, I don't know. But even if you own it on Laserdisc.

Yeah. And you watch it in your wood-paneled basement smoking a cigar and having a Jell-O pudding pop, something's different. When he's like, Theo, you gotta be a good guy. You're like, come on, cuz. You know what I mean? You know that's while it was happening. So that ruined it. But then people are kind of like, I don, cuz. You know what I mean? Like, you know that's while it was happening. So that ruined it.

But then people are kind of like, I don't know if you heard Fresh Air, where Terry Gross asked Greta Gerwig, who's one of my absolute favorites, I love Terry Gross too, about like Woody Allen. And it's like, yeah, there are people that kind of like squeak by and we don't understand why. Manhattan gets creepier each year. I mean, a lot of this stuff. And that's some people's favorite movie.

I know. I know. It's a tricky thing. I don't have the answer. I just know, can you still watch House of Cards? Some people have different levels. They're like, I can watch. Can you watch Good Will Hunting?

Harvey Weinstein produced it. Well, he's not in it. OK. All right. We're finding. We're all figuring shit out. Yeah. And that's a personal decision. When you were figuring out what Crashing was,

part of it seemed personal, but then part of it's about the comedy world. And did you ever think, like, my balance has to be this or this, or did you kind of just kind of let it go and see where it went? I think Judd rightly, Judd Apatow produces it, and he rightly steered it

a little bit away from some of the things I wanted to get very personal about because when your wife leaves you the show's about a guy who's kind of like an open mic comedian his wife leaves and then he has nowhere to stay so he crashes on the couch of Artie Lang and then he kind of gets passed around the community

and this is kind of based on things that do happen in our world even though we break each other's balls and stuff, a lot of people let other people crash at their place. So I wanted to explore a lot of the heartbreak. I was like, nobody ever sees what it's really like, how much Chinese food and masturbation and isolation is involved when your wife leaves you. And Judd rightly was like, okay, he's very good at that. He's like, fine. Like, I'll let you do some of that. But you can't, I'll give you an example. Like when my wife left me, I had a psychosomatic problem where my balls

hurt. And Judd teases me that I would pitch it and repitch it and repitch it. That I was like, it's funny. Like I went to the doctor and they were like, there's nothing wrong with you. And they're giving me an ultrasound on my nuts. And he told me to, he literally said, don't exercise because it'll jostle them. And you should release every once in a while. And I was like, if masturbating and not working out are the cure, how did I get this? Like, I don't understand.

So I always thought that was like worth having on the show and jed was just like i can't have you he'd never he's never raised his voice i'm i'm yelling for fun i can't have you like grabbing your nuts and going oh like that's just not good television so we have a good thing where i am willing to talk about anything and he's very good at taking the smorgasbord of emotion that i show him and saying, well, let's take that and tell it this way. Like a good example is the third episode of the first season is a yard sale. In reality, I did not have a yard sale with my ex-wife. But a divorce feels like a yard sale, if that makes sense.

All your possessions are laid out for the neighbors to sift through and buy your memories. Like that's what it feels like. And that's Jed's genius is I'm like, you know, it's exposed and you don't trust anyone. He's like, how about a yard sale? Stop crying. How about a yard sale? You know?

And, and in season two, you know, Pete dates his first comedian. So that's the through line is, is reality. My wife left me for another fella. I got much, much more into stand-up. So it was this kind of like blessing in disguise. You never would have wished for it in a million years. I was very sad. But I started doing comedy so much more and without any reservation whatsoever.

Because that's your life. Yeah. You can relate to that. You were young, too, when you got married, right? I was 22 when I got married. Yeah, that's right. So I was 28 when I got divorced my real life is a little bit different from crashing in that I was doing comedy

for 6 years and was somewhat I don't want to say successful but more successful than my character and then the real yeah that was my one criticism of season 1 it almost seemed like he was too unsuccessful but maybe those guys are out there i was like can he be like 10 more successful like what way i there was i don't know like especially somewhere in the middle like fourth

third fourth fifth episode where he's just doing it for like two people yeah and it was almost like i love i don't know enough about comedy but But I'm watching it going, man, really? Two people? Is that too over the top? We would do shows for one person. Really? Oh, all the time. We'd have shows canceled.

In season one, it's kind of like, it's not a big moment. But Pete comes into the club after barking, handing out flyers for two, three hours. And just no one was there. That would happen all the time. It's just like, everyone went to the cellar. You know what I mean? So we're just like, eh. We were like the runoff club for the comedy cellar, which is a great club. And the Boston was like the shithole around the corner, at least when I was there.

So what we wanted to do and what we want to do on Crashing is usually when someone's a comedian on TV, they struggle for like the opening credits. And the next thing you know, they're just working. You know, Louis, the show, is about a successful comedian. Seinfeld is about a successful comedian. We saw all these stories because there is a lot of fun in being a successful comedian.

You know, you have a lot of free time. You have an interesting job. But what we want to do with Crashing is kind of tip our hat and show how painful it is. The show's called Crashing, not Flourishing. It's about crashing on couches. It's also about the kind of romantic, in hindsight, warmth to the struggle.

To like what it's like to really tell an origin story as close to real time as possible. Which means you get a break. Like in season one, Pete becomes a warmup comedian. It's a huge break. Then he loses it. I mean, that's what happens. Yeah.

One of the things we're exploring in season two is that like, you have to make it 12 times. You don't make it once. It used to be maybe in the seventies you'd get on the tonight show. Yeah. Then you could work. He'd call you over and that was it. Exactly.

But a lot of those guys, you don't know Tom Dresden's name. You you know like these are great comics that were big deals i knew all of them from because i was a letterman kid so okay he took care of everybody good or not good yeah or i shouldn't say not good but the people that either didn't make it or they made it big yeah they were all the same time so he had george miller on as many times as he had like seinfeld on well letterman specifically was booked to his taste yes like every comedian is letterman's sense of humor well he's also really low to the late 70s guys and that really was a quite a generation i don't know what's your generation who is in like my crop because you're late 30s right i'm 38 yeah it's like me i consider like me kumail melanie kroll um i'm trying to think

there's so many everyone has been on your podcast basically if you look at the first 15 everyone has been on your podcast three times yes all the repeat the three-time club the repeat if you're if you're a multiple repeat person that hannibal hannibal burris these were the people that like we started with and and there really is a class feeling. Aziz is the class behind me. Even though he's far more successful than me, I go, look, if I'm a junior, he's a sophomore. Yeah. Well, your generation, there was a roadmap.

And Jeff Ross is in community college. And Jeff Ross is like- He's in the parking lot of a community college smoking a joint. He shaved his head, and he's just the ageless Jeff Ross now Nobody knows how old he is He might be 60 He looks like he lives in a hollowed out volcano He looks like he should be fighting Superman somewhere

Yeah We wrote a couple times when I used to work for Kimmel Show And then Jeff Ross and I wrote For Kimmel hosted the AMAs a couple times So we would write for him Oh that's fun. And it was like 2006.

And Jeff Ross was so funny. He was like, yeah, I got to get away from this roast thing, man. I'm getting pigeonholed by it. And I just got to branch out. That's what Jeff said? Yeah. Oh, yeah. And he's like, I can't do the roast anymore.

And like five years later, he was the roast master. That is hilarious. And it was like a 180. I remember driving with him. We were on like Pico or something. And I'm thinking like, I was saying to him, I don't know if you should give this up. This is a really good corner.

Right. You're the only person on this corner. I would keep it. That's one of the themes of Crashing, too, is it's like Pete is, my character is realizing that he is kind of like a light, fluffy guy. Yeah. And yet he's hanging out with Artie and Attell

and all these guys that are kind of saying, you should be like us. He kind of feels like, I think I should be like these guys. These are the guys that play the cellar. But then season two, he starts to discover the alternative scene, which is a lot of the same comedians, but sometimes it'll be like in a comic book store or a laundromat or a improv

theater. And those are the places that were much, much, much more receptive to what I was doing. I got jokes about RoboCop and ice packs. And if you're following David Tell talking about like little person porn, it's hard to go up and go like, yeah,

we're looking at a sunflower. You can't. And I'm not saying like all my shit is like fluffy week stuff, but like, I want more of a theater crowd, like seated seven 30, maybe one glass of white wine. That's like my sweet spot.

I tell is more like the Jaeger bomb people. And he's amazing, but I couldn't find my place there. So one of the things that HBO was very gracious about was they were like, I was like, is it too much minutia to explore the subtleties of the difference between the club scene, Caroline's Gotham comedy cellar, and the alt scene, UCB, some of them

I can't even name anymore because they close so often. And they were like, the more inside baseball you can be, the better. Because that's what HBO is good at. They were like, it gets people talking. So i'm really excited for people to see my character stop he'll actually succeed a little bit more you'll like it he's yeah i don't like when he's for two people no he won't be for two people i always think like what i would do in that situation and i i would just i would i don't know i would crater i think that's it's so funny that you say that because i'm 38 now

i've been doing stand-up i don't know for a very long time over 15 years i don't know, I would create her, I think. It's so funny that you say that, because I'm 38 now. I've been doing stand-up, I don't know, for a very long time, over 15 years. I don't know what it is. And when we're doing Crashing, I'm like, oh, I couldn't do it again. Yeah. Like, I couldn't start over. Well, it's almost like you don't know any better. You don't know any better! It's like the moms who have three kids when they're 24, and they don't realize it's a suicide mission.

You didn't know. I have to think there's a sports parallel there. I'm not just saying that for you. It's like these kids that get into it, and they're running drills and stuff, and they're like, you know, I just watched the I, Tonya. You know, the 5 AM. I liked I, Tonya. I liked it.

It was OK. I thought it was fine. I enjoyed how Margot Robbie, who I think is really attractive, and I forgot it was Margot Robbie during that movie. And she was like, really, I was convinced she was Tonya Harding. She did a great job. She was good. I don't think she was. I thought it was Margot Robbie during that movie and she was like really I was convinced she was Tonya Arding she did a great job she was good I don't think

I thought she was phenomenal I think she might win an award she was really good and I thought her husband was great I thought the performances were great

I just sometimes I wonder if you'll understand well it's too dark for you we now know you don't like going dark There Will Be Blood is my favorite movie he kills a man

with a bowling pin but it's funny though There Will Be Blood is a funny it's a funny tragedy it's not a comedy with a bowling pin. But it's funny, though. There Will Be Blood is a funny tragedy. It's not a comedy. It's got funny scenes in it. He shoots his brother in the head with a small caliber pistol.

20th time, it's hilarious. You're right. There Will Be Blood is the darkest movie that also has seeds of humor in it. I think it's funny. For some reason, it speaks to me. He's the ego. A lot of P.T. Anderson's movies I feel like someone's the ego

and someone's the super ego. And Daniel Day-Lewis is playing the ego. He's just, I just want to succeed. I just want to put my dick in the earth and draw out oil. And then there's the guy that's like, oh, I want to believe in the Bible. And he kicks the shit out of that guy. And there's some darkness in me.

This is nighttime, Pete. I'm not showing this movie some darkness in me. This is, this is nighttime Pete. Yeah. I'm not showing this movie during the day. That's what I'm saying. But is it fucked up that I enjoy a movie that explores some really dark kind of tortured psychologies? I don't, I don't think so.

I think it makes me a happier, fuller person. I think that I'm, that I'm okay. Spelunking into my own cave. Cause I can return. Some people go in the cave and they fall because they I'm okay spelunking into my own cave because I can return. Some people go in the cave and they fall because they don't practice spelunking enough. You gotta fly the kite

into the black hole and pull it back. That's what life is. Anyway, I got on a tangent. I think I, Tanya, even though it's good, I think it's better than people think it is because I think some movies trick you into thinking they're better. With flashy

kind of fast cuts and a lot of talking to the camera. And every song... That movie had a lot of tricks. That's what I'm saying. I thought it was great. I don't like the feeling of every song is a hit song. Every song. You just go one bad one. She gets in the car

and it's like, Springsteen. I'm like, can you stop? There doesn't have to be a montage of her lacing up while you play the who. Like, I don't need it. Like, fucking let the performances speak because they're good on their own. I just like simpler movies, like Lady Bird. Like, that is a movie that's like no frills, just performances. And that's just more my speed.

Lady Bird was one of the few movies I've seen in the last 10 years that I was actually disappointed and bummed out when it was over. Yeah. I was like, it's over? What happened? I thought we had 10 more minutes here. That's a great compliment. Everyone always goes 15 minutes too long, or sometimes 30 minutes too long.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I liked Molly's game, but it was 20 minutes too long. And it was a two-hour, 10-minute whatever. I think the superhero movies could trim 45 minutes and three characters. I'm the wrong person to talk about this. No, I'm there. I'm right there with you.

I don't do superhero movies. I want to be very clear. When I say I didn't like Superwoman, I didn't like Wonder Woman. And it wasn't because it was ladies. It's just because I was like, I think I'm done. It just happened to be the one. If it had come out before Iron Man, I would have been like, yeah!

I have superhero fatigue. It was great. It was as good as the others. But it made me question my love of all of them. I just can't do it anymore. No. We've had 50 of these in the last 12 years. It's starting.

Well, you know I did the Batman parodies. I don't know if you know that. I'm Batman. Don't tell anybody on YouTube. And it got to a point where we can't even make fun of them anymore. First of all, I don't have the time because we're doing Crashing. But secondly, it's just like they're so, I keep looking at the baby's dick. I'm sorry.

They're so, it's not a bad thing. I'm just drawn to it. I'm going to have to move that over here. I can't look away when my dog is shitting. I should be the one looking at a baby's dick you should you should be looking at that doobie brothers i'll move some stuff around i'm looking at that brother's next one sure did charlize comment on the baby dick i don't think she did really charlize is in right there didn't even notice the baby dick any genitalia is gonna

draw focus it's like it's like a boxing match you know there's a football game a baseball game and a hockey game and then there's a fist fight. Everyone looks at the fist fight. Baby Dick is the fist fight of this room. So I should have naked babies fist fighting, and I would never be able to get any attention. Then you'd be good. Then would be billionaires.

So your comedy style is more, because I think it's getting harder and harder, especially as this decade rolls on, where it's so niche now with everything. What makes people laugh and how to hit somebody's funny bone. There's so much content out there that it's really hard to strike oil with people unless you're just hitting it. But you seem to be like, you're trying to be a little more general appeal to more than just one type of person. Yeah, I suppose. It's not really that calculated. trying to be a little more general appeal to more than just one type of person yeah i suppose it's not really that calculated it's meaning bill hicks has this great quote where he talks

to young comedians about like just be you be as you as you can be it's like a dr seuss thing yeah it's like today you are you that is truer than true there's no one alive who's you or than you that's a dr seuss thing that's good advice for a comedian and bill hicks didn't reference dr seuss but he was saying if you're being authentically you 100 you you will be the only one that can do that yeah and you'll have supply and demand covered if you want that i'm the only one that can do that i really don't like there are some people that like go clean or go broad for money yeah and that's not what i'm doing i swear a lot but people still think i'm a clean comedian because i think the transmission is still pure you're still understanding i don't think you're a clean comedian i think

i was i was talking more about the analogy you were doing with a towel and him i'm not and then you come out and you're trying to. Right. Yeah. That just happened by virtue of self-exploration. Anybody that's a writer or a comedian or a performer or even an actor, you're just trying to go, what is me? What do I sound like? What are my opinions? I had a manager who didn't sign me when I was young named Rick Dorfman. And I've actually thanked Rick many, many times and phone calls and stuff.

I love this advice. Because he didn't sign me. I was very close with Mulaney. Mulaney is one of my best friends. And this is 10 years ago. And he signed Mulaney and he didn't sign me. And I'm glad that I was brave enough to say why. I was like, not in a shitty way. He called me to say, we're not going to go that way.

And I just was like, is there anything you can say, uh, like that I could work on? And he gave me like some of the best advice. He was just like, when I watch you, it's just another, just another guy, just another man, another white man. And like, I don't know what you're afraid of. I don't know what you're passionate about. I don't know who you are basically. Like what gets you going? What are you excited about? You're just telling jokes about fabric softener. Yeah. And that's fine because when Seinfeld does it, you get a picture of a person of like a very thin,

neat sports coat, well, Long Island kind of thing. He can, his transmission is clear through that. I wasn't coming through in the type of material I was doing. So I started trying to find the way I write now, for example, is if I'm really passionate about something, just talking to you right now, if I'm like, find that, Oh, I, something lit up

inside of me. That's a bit, you just go, that's a bit for me. It might not be hilarious, but I know I can get on stage and speak, communicate authentically and presently with an audience there, see where the laughs are, hone, repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat. And then you have a joke. Are you one of those people that has to go to clubs all the time to swing the golf club, so to speak, even if it's for 10 minutes? It's funny that you ask because yes and no. I was when I started. I was very very very adamant that you had to go up

every single night which is why new york is a great place to do stand-up but now i look at it like a big heavy machine with gears and this is the stand-up machine and i love the stand-up machine but the problem is if i keep it running all the time, having brunch with my wife is very dull. You know what I mean? It's almost like, oh, God, I'm so heady, so self-important. But it's a little bit like the Ring of Power in Lord of the Rings. Have you seen it? No.

Really? No, out on Lord of the Rings. Let me see. It's almost like the Stanley Cup. Keep going. No, keep going with Lord of the Rings. No, what I'm saying is, you know Gollum? Yeah. OK. I know all about it. I'm just not a Lord of the Rings. No, what I'm saying is, you know Gollum? Yeah.

Okay. I know all about it. I'm just not a Lord of the Rings guy. You don't have to be. Yeah. The Ring of Power, stand-up is a power. It's a thing. It feeds you, right?

But if you believe it's hype, I think you start becoming like in a cave, holding it, surrounded by nobody, no real friends, no real family, just kind of fans and your mic, you know what I mean? And that's a danger to it. So I do it as much as I can without getting sucked into the black hole of it. Because I value having a somewhat relatable life. That's good for my art. That's also just good for my heart. You know what I mean? It's just good for me as a person so i for example i'm doing like colbert on monday or something you fucking traitor what what do you mean i don't understand because i'm doing this no i'm just kidding i'm doing that on monday so i'll book spots like i have a spot tonight i have a spot tomorrow to get to get the machine going right

so that when i sit down with him and if there's a lull or something i'll just be a little bit sharper but like when we're writing i might go up two two three times a week so that's sacrilege to some in our community but i feel like some people need it though it's almost like they can, they got to do it every day or they kind of lose their bearings. I think doing it every day, I sometimes like, I'll see a billboard for some celebrity and they have like their ninth show. You ever see those people that have like nine shows on at once? And all love and respect, and I could be wrong. Maybe I'm projecting.

But when I see that, I just go, I should have an intervention or something. Get this man to a lake. You know what I'm saying? Because it is addicting. Doing stand-up comedy, I've never done cocaine, but I have to think if it's so popular and what people say about it, I've seen all the movies, it must be what stand-up is like. That's what stand-up is like. Stand what stand-up is like stand-up feels so good that when you get off stage and you have a really good and it's similar to a baseball only if you do well no it's similar to a baseball game you actually want to be down in the seventh inning you want to be down and then you want to come back in the ninth just like a good baseball game you wanted to have the drama you can't just go up and kill that's like a twilight zone episode where

you just destroyed who fucking cares Like you just got off. You wanted to have a little nuance, just like a fan of a baseball game. And you're watching your own set like you would watch a game. So you get off. And if the crowd is rowdy and they're drunk and they're heckling and the people before you are eating shit, like some impossible scenario. This is made up. But let's say Kevin Hart goes up and even Kevin Hart can't find them. This never happened, I'm just saying. That is the table set. That is bases loaded. That is bottom of the ninth. You know what I mean? And you're at the bat,

at bat, you're at the bat, you're at bat, and you go up and you crush. And if you really find the audience and win them over and get them to stop being a bunch of individuals and whip them into a show, into a crowd, into one solid thing. When you get off stage, the feeling, the endorphin release, the bliss, the joy, it's ecstasy. And people will come up to you and they'll say, do you want anything to eat before you go? And you're going, be normal. Be normal. They don't know you're high. You're sky high.

That being said, ring of power. I really believe this. If you do it all the time. I love Mad Men. Do you watch Mad Men? Yeah. Roger Sterling says, when this job is good, it meets every need. He's talking about advertising.

There's a danger to that too. If we believe our own hype and accept fan praise and cheers and laughs as actual love and don't find it from someone like a wife or children or your dog, or just sitting alone and being with yourself and being enough just in yourself, you can end up just a straight up motherfucking addict where you're just like, I can't. I can't stop. I can't stand being still. And there's a danger to that. And I feel for my people that get hooked in that manner.

Do you think there's how many comedy TV shows about a comedian have there been? Too many. Too many, but I would argue not enough, too. Yeah, no, I know. Because you're in the comedy world, which is a totally different show than just like, Seinfeld, he's a comedian, but he wasn't a comedian on that show. Right.

It was a very loose thread, but it wasn't about a comedian. Yeah, I'm totally joking. I don't think there are too many. I think one of the reasons there are so many, and crashing is different because it's on the ground. Yeah. It's not a flyover of standup comedy. It's like,

here's what it would be like literally to walk up to a club and say like, hello, I'd like to do your open mic night. Like that's a scene. And then like showering and getting ready and being nervous and running the joke by your friend. These are all scenes. Like we're really going in real time as,

as in real time is, is tolerable and pleasant. But what were we saying? What was the- I was asking- Oh, why there's so many shows about- Yeah. I think one of the things that's interesting is that comedians will always be compelling leads of vehicles because they're funny.

They have an excuse to be funny. You ever watch ER and you're like, why are these doctors so funny. They have an excuse to be funny. You ever watch like ER and you're like, why are these doctors so funny? They're all hilarious. Yeah. All these quips. It's just like kind of a buy. It takes you out of it a little bit. Which who cares? You're watching ER. But I'm just saying, comedians, I can be funny when my wife is leaving me because I'm a comedian. Not only is it okay, it actually serves the story. It actually tells you why she's leaving me because I won't stop making jokes, and we like that.

But also comedians, almost like in The Sopranos where Tony is going to therapy, a stand-up is going up on stage, so you're seeing their inner world presented. And I think that's one of the reasons why, even though it's not the most relatable profession, people can project themselves onto it. Because a comedian just wants to be heard and respected and actually loved for their thoughts and for their feelings. Which even if you're an architect or chef or

schoolteacher or a mother, you know, stay-at-home mom, you still have that desire and you can still project it onto a comedian. It's a pretty empty vessel to go, oh, there's a funny guy trying to come grow into his life. You know what I'm saying? And he's making jokes while he does it. OK, even though I'm not a comedian, I can relate to this person, and I'm not sure why. But I think that might be why. It's interesting that Jed came back to this after Funny People, which seemed like that was his way of diving into this whole

world i know now he's back i and he also has a comedy special on netflix called uh the return yeah i sometimes you know you think about like how i met my wife and like what if i hadn't you know yeah what if i hadn't gone to the club that night or whatever? I sometimes think like, I pitched crashing to Judd on the set of Trainwreck. And when Judd was on the set of Trainwreck, Amy Schumer was going to the cellar. And Amy Schumer was like, you should come with me to the cellar. And the cellar's the best.

And Judd went up and he got the bug again. It's like the free sample. Yeah. He had a little bug and the hook is in him again. So here's Jed after like, I think it was like a 10 or more year hiatus from doing standup, started getting into it again.

And then I come in, we knew each other just a little bit. He had done my podcast, a live episode. And I came in, I flew to New York just to pitch him the show about a guy starting in stand-up in New York while he was a guy starting stand-up again in New York. So the fortuitous, fortuitiveness, fortuitousness?

Whatever. It was very fortuitous. It was fortuitousness? Fortuitousness. Yeah. Fortuitousness. That's the name of my band. No one comes.

Fortuitousness. We're fortuitousness. Two, three, four. Stillwater? Is that what they're called? Stillwater. They open. Fever Dog.

We're big. We actually play Fever Dog at the end, both bands together. It's really amazing. It's great. He shocks by the microphone and falls over, and I go, I don't like this movie. Just like I can't believe how fortunate I was. Because that's what you hope. When you're talking to a big dog like Judd,

you hope that what you're selling or trying to paint in his mind, he has some frame of reference for it. And the fact that he did. And the fact that it was while Judd had... Judd's always doing several movies he's producing, maybe one he's directing, and then a TV show. And there was one slot open that I didn't even know to make another show. And that was his limit.

I really got in under the wire. You had the last Gary Shanley podcast. Was I the last one? I think you might have been. I'm not. I think that sounds right. He died shortly after. Within a couple months of when he died, right?

I think it was about two months later. It's obviously so, so sad. I think about Gary so much more now, actually, in death than I did. We weren't like close. That podcast was maybe the beginning of us having a relationship. It's a regret of my life is that he had suggested

that we get lunch or something. And just like everybody, you just go like, oh, I'll get to it. I replied, obviously. I was like, yeah, let's do it. But we didn't go like, Thursday. You know what I mean? Like, let's make this happen. Because we were both busy.

And then, you know, death happens. And you get that reminder that you're like, oh, shit. And this kind of goes back to what I was saying about making sure Gary was very good about that, about having time for the richness of other areas. Although I'm sure he would say that he was a hard user, a heavy user of stand-up in his 20s, 30s. Yeah, he's an interesting guy because it really seemed like he never replaced the Larry Sanders show. He never what now?

Never replaced it for the rush he got from that show. It was like he didn't really know what to do after that. Oh, that's interesting. He would try different things, but he would kind of keep drifting back to that. I always thought it was fascinating when he did the DVD where he went back and interviewed all the people. And he spent all this crazy amount of time on it. They're great extras. And it was almost like he didn't want to try to top that show.

It's funny. When you make a show like that that really does redefine comedy, you know what I mean? I mean, it did. A lot of people say that, but I mean it really did. It really did. Even crashing to a certain extent, the idea of behind the scenes, what are these celebrities or stand-ups really like,

have them play exaggerated versions of themselves. Yeah. We, you know, I know Ricky Gervais said the office came from Larry Sanders and then the office, the British one, obviously begot the American office, but it also begot the whole like mockumentary style, which, you know, you could also say Christopher Guest and stuff, but like these are the icons of, of comedy. The thing that I think about most with Gary is how much he balanced his life, how he was,

when you, if you listen to that interview, he talks a lot about his Buddhism and his exploration of, of reality and, and art and, and beauty and inner work and stuff. So again, just like anybody that can kind of wean off of the rushes of adoration that you get from standup and, and find a quieter place inside that that's what I take from Gary as much as Larry Sanders do. If you could tell people to listen to one podcast that you've done. Well, it depends on what they're after.

Well, what's the, what's the one that well give me like three give people people like three that you've done that you're like oh this one would still hold up well i mean i don't mean to be cocky it's more of a endorsement of my guests i suppose that i think they all hold up and what's interesting here's a better answer than just they all hold up what's interesting is if you go back the peat that started that podcast it must have been it's almost 400 episodes and each episode is about two to three hours so it's a lot of talking and every

one of them is too i knew some of them were long i didn't know all of them were that long two is about the minimum so you basically have them trapped yeah but. But you know, I mean, I say this all the time. It's in the second hour that everything happens. The first hour is, it's like this. You feel each other out. Yeah, you feel each other out. And I like to think I'm a good guest, so I come in ready to play. A lot of guests, you see their shoulders slump down.

They're not protecting their neck anymore see their shoulders slump down like they're not protecting their neck anymore with their shoulders they relax i've been vulnerable enough with them that they start to feel more comfortable that they know i'm not gonna like i don't debate on my podcast i don't judge i try and find ways to understand how they're thinking yeah and in that second hour that's where everyone if there is going to be tears shed it's in the second hour oh you want i never want anyone to cry oh sure i get super uncomfortable well you're we're doing this in your moments when it was veering that way and i was i would like veer the other way i just didn't want it to happen i tommy gets very uncomfortable is it because you don't you feel uncomfortable for your guests like you i just feel like if somebody's

gonna come on the pod and i'm going to shoot the shit with them and they're spending the time, I don't know. I understand. Try to keep it a certain way. But I also get the other way of like, if you're going deep dive two and a half hours, shit's probably going to start happening. Well, we talk about a lot.

We talk about comedy or art. Sometimes it's a musician or an actor or a scientist or an author. And usually the first hour we talk about their craft. Yeah. Second hour, we usually talk about family. We talk about love, relationships,

that sort of stuff. And then we always talk about the meaning of life and death and how they, Jesus. Yeah. How they get, yeah, exactly how they get into that. Um,

so where they are, a lot of these people, I think, appreciate, like I said, we say it's all green lights, like no wrong answers. What do you what do you think this is? Like, what is this conspiracy of molecules? We call reality, like, how do you interpret it? What is the story you tell yourself in the car? I'm Bill Simmons, but your heart is beating, your lungs are are breathing you're you're perceiving me in your awareness right now it's fucking crazy well how do you how do you tell the story to yourself how do you make sense of it do you make sense of it and 90 of the time they're atheists and then we uncover that they actually have some sort of secret like narrative that they kind of hold on to.

Nobody ever got mad at you? For what? Just during the podcast that I was getting too personal or you were going somewhere they didn't want to go? That's interesting. I don't think so because if they don't want to talk about it, they can say I don't want to talk about it. It's not that sort.

It's not a trick. It's not like I'm going to be like, okay, but. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But usually by the second hour, what happens, and you're doing this great as an interviewer now, is that you offer about your life. If I want to tell you, like I told you, I didn't get the love I wanted from my dad by being good at baseball, so I quit. You know what I mean?

That's a vulnerable, it's not super vulnerable. Yeah. But you're now- You're four times more likely to tell me something about your dad if we wanted to. I'm still upset that you didn't play basketball. I know. I can barely touch the rim. You could have given them like 20 minutes a game off the bench at least.

I guess. I don't know. It is funny, though. Every bigger high school or college has that one tall kid that drives the coach crazy. Yeah, who didn't play. And every time the coach sees that fucking guy i used to yeah i don't know what it is i should have i should have played i think if you do if you get to do your life over again like 10 times one of the times you should get into basketball i think

you would like the camaraderie of it i bet i would like it you know what i would like is the bus ride to the game the bus ride is great the locker, the jokes. You really would have enjoyed it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm friends with Aaron Rodgers. He's a friend of mine. Not like a good friend of mine. He's been on the pod, right? Has he been on the pod?

There you go. Hey, Bill Simmons fans, if you want to listen to a podcast of You Made It Weird, start with Aaron Rodgers. In the first 15 minutes, we talk about how he saw a UFO. Get into it. Right. I remember that. What are you waiting for?

Don't you want to know what Aaron Rodgers thinks happens when you die? That one got a lot of publicity. It did because he's super famous. You know why? And also, yeah, you put Aaron Rodgers UFO. I didn't do that. No, I'm saying anyone. That's a headline.

Right. People are clicking on that. It got picked up as a huge story. Aaron Rodgers UFO, click. He was wearing a hat with like an ancient aliens thing on it. So I was like, what's that hat? I really stepped in shit in the best way. And he was like, well, I'm a big alien guy.

And I'm like, here we go, man. That's what it is. You made it weird. I want to talk about weird things. If you've seen a ghost, I want to talk about it. If you lost your virginity in a strange way, I want to talk about it. Oh, shit. I should come on and tell my scurvy hotel story.

You saw a ghost? I absolutely had a ghost experience. Really? I've never. Oh, shit. I should come on and tell my Skirvin Hotel story. You saw a ghost? I absolutely had a ghost experience. Really? I've never believed in that shit. Well, what happened? I was staying there 2010, December. Where is this? Oklahoma City.

Uh-huh. Was there to go see the Thunder when they had KD and Westbrook. Oh, KD. And there's this famous haunted hotel called the Skirvin. Uh-huh. And I like ghosts. I'm like a horror movie guy so i told the lady at the desk put me on the floor with the ghost and she's like oh you want to meet effie i'm like yes

so they're always named effie effie well the story always fell in a well or down an elevator yeah yeah this one this one was a woman who was being kept up there, allegedly, by this owner of the hotel who she was having an affair with. And she jumped out with her baby out the window. It's always a fall. If you want to be a ghost. In like the 1920s. Get falling. Baby's not a ghost?

I go out. No, I think they're both. I think it's the mom who's the ghost, but both of them went out. Or the baby got killed, something. But the mom jumped out of the window. Yikes. So I went out, had dinner, drinks, came back, forgot about it, called my wife, went to bed. And I'm one of those people that when I fall asleep, I never wake up.

I've had two kids. My kids would be screaming, and I won't wake up. That must be traumatic for them. I woke up, yeah. My kids are just covered in their own feces. So I woke up because I felt like somebody was in the room with me. And my body woke up before my brain broke up. I love it.

And my hair and my arms were like total goosebumps, like what you see in a movie where it's like, oh, yeah, my hair was standing. It was like my hair was standing, my heart was pounding, and I thought somebody was in the room. And I looked over, and the bed was here, and the window was over to my left. And I thought somebody was in the room. And I also have contacts, so my glasses are off. I can't see. So it's pitch black, and I'm like, somebody's in the room. Hello? And I turn the light on, and I put my glasses are off I can't see so it's pitch black and I'm like somebody's in the room

hello and I turn the light on and I put my glasses on and there's nobody there I left out a crucial part of the story one of the things that woke me up

was I thought I heard a baby crying shut up I swear to God so this is 2010 so one of the reasons I woke up I thought I heard a baby crying and then I felt like somebody's in the room and you just kind of my body woke up the reasons I woke up, I thought I heard a baby crying.

And then I felt like somebody was in the room. And you just kind of, my body woke up and my brain woke up. Like when you can tell a tiger's looking at you. You just kind of like. Just something was wrong. And nobody was there. But where I thought I saw, or I thought the person was, was by the window. Yeah.

So now I'm like freaked out. And I'm like, I go and I make sure the room's locked. And I'm like going to the bathroom. And nobody I go and I make sure the room's locked and I'm like going to the bathroom and nobody's in there. Cleaning the shit out of your pants. And it's like 3.45 in the morning and I can't fall back asleep because my heart's like pounding, which has never happened to me before. So I went online, I had a Blackberry and I'm like, all right, I got to Google this hotel

and I find this hotel. And it basically said that this lady jumped out a window. That's how I found out about the window part. I was like, well, there's a window right there. And then right around 345, four o'clock, guests have heard, guests have been woken up by this ghost. Shut up. And now I'm like, what the fuck?

So now I can't, now I'm just up the rest of the night. I'm watching like bad HBO movies. And I'm just up the rest of the night. I'm watching bad HBO movies. And I basically stayed up until it got light up. And then I was like, get me the fuck out of this hotel. I have one question. Yeah. When you went to bed, were you scared? Were you like, I hope nothing weird happens?

Or did you just go to bed? I forgot about it. I love that best answer. That was the thing. I went to bed. I just took my contacts out. And I forgot I was on the floor. Yes.

So the baby crying was weird. Because I had just had, my son was probably like two and a half, and it was one of those things where you're asleep, you're like, oh, my son's crying. Wait, I'm not near my, wait, my arms are, my hair's on my, wait, was somebody here? And then you, and that was it. Wow. So anyway, I believe in ghosts now, because unless the hotel rigs it with guests for the story, and they put things in there, who knows?

I mean, see, those are the types of things I don't like when people are like, well, Occam's Razor, the hotel is benefiting. And they play out. I'm like, yeah, OK. Enjoy your world. I'll be over here going, ghosts! Well, it's a famous NBA hotel, because there's not a lot of nice hotels in Oklahoma City. Oh, OK.

So the players stay there. And there's been a couple of times where the players have gotten freaked out. I believe it. Well, that could be rival teams. I forget. Who was the player? Derrick Rose? Or Nate Robinson?

It was Rose. Rose definitely. Derrick Rose went and slept in one of it. One of the other players is room. Cause he got freaked out. Really? So yeah. That's amazing. I've interviewed a lot of NBA players,

not on the podcast. I'm trying to think who else have I had? Oh, I'm going to forget his name. Ah, shit. And famous NBA player. I Kyrie on the TV show,

but I had another sport player on the show. I was on Cordon with him. Can you Google PJ Reddick? Oh yeah. You had JJ in your podcast. He's great. I just, I knew it was an acronym and I was like, what is his name? He was really interesting.

And I, you know, what's fun about me, I guess is I don't give a shit. Right. In the good way. Yeah. Like I like talking like you, you know, your stuff. A lot of times I get interviewed by people who don't care. It's actually kind of nice. You can just talk.

But these guys are, you know, the cheers these guys get. I've never been, you know, about to get the ball and done this thing. You know, I know it's a podcast where you ask the crowd to, like, whoop it up a little bit with your arms. I do feel like you can get a good feel for somebody if you spend an hour and 15, hour and a half talking to them like especially somebody like rogers who i interviewed too oh really and he's there's something cool about him he's like a snickers bar well you think about all american and just kind of delicious he's he's he's like

packed with peanuts well you could see him like in a a huddle with three minutes left to go on the road. Yeah. That's a guy you'd want in the huddle, telling the guys, we're good, guys. We're going to go down and score. I asked him. I hope you didn't ask him. I was like, what do you think the fact that you have a square jaw and you're a good-looking man? I know.

It was a joke. No part of me thought you asked it. This is my podcast. We ask this type of question. I'm like, what are the chances that you look like a leader and you aren't like, which came first? Do you think you looked in the mirror and was like, well, I guess I'm a leader or like also square jaws are linked to testosterone levels. Testosterone is linked to a decisiveness. This is why women are like unconsciously attracted to square jaws because too much testosterone will kill you.

You know who told me that? Shane Moss. Great episode of You Made It Weird. He's been on three times. We talk a lot about psychedelics. We talk a lot about psychology. We talk about everything. Well, there's a handsome quarterback theory that handsome people, when they're kids, get more attention

and affection from people, which gives them more confidence. Then if they're also a good athlete, the confidence from the good looks from age six on would then make them a good quarterback. It's the definition of unfair. It is unfair. But it's also boob men. Guys that like boobs, I won't even ask you, but guys that like boobs are considered more confident because it means when you're developing your idea of love, you're either on the ground wanting to be picked up

and seeing legs and asses, or you're being picked up to where the goods are, tits. So there's all these weird things that, when we're children affect who we become so what i'm saying is i've never heard that one that's phenomenal picked up more you might be more of a boob man and if you were on the ground more you might be more into asses that's just what of course this is just a theory interesting it makes sense to me so that like i like that theory with aaron it was in the movie Crumb. Great documentary.

And he's an ass man. And he was like, the woman that told him the theory was like, yeah, you were neglected. You were on the ground all the time. And then there's me. I love both. I was the only child. I was not neglected. Yeah, yeah.

Fucking weird, man. Only children are weird. Oh, super weird. What movie did I just see where there was an only child and they were like... We're super creative, though. Yeah, super weird. What movie did I just see where there was an only child and they were like... We're super creative, though. Yeah, I know. Jamie Lee. Although now I think if you're an only child with all the devices and all the shit you can just get on the internet, I don't even know why you would ever have a human relationship.

But this is the other... That scares me. Do you know about this? Steve Jobs, they were interviewing him about the iPad. And at the end of the interview like almost colombo style the interviewer's just like uh just kind of one last throwaway question they're like what do your kids think of the ipad i want to know too you have the ipad it's about to come out or it just came out what do your kids think this is amazing and he's like we don't let our kids

play with uh technology which i this was on NPR, I think. Fascinating. It's called dogfooding. Dogfood company owners, once a year, some dogfood companies, will have a meeting with all the blah, blah, blahs, I don't know the term, and they'll open a can of their dogfood and eat it

to show how quality the ingredients of their dogfood is. It's called dogfooding. So a lot of companies will use their own product. It's the same thing as a mayor putting a cup in the lake and drinking it. It's the same sort of idea. But grosser. It's way grosser.

Yeah. Although if you said it was Campbell's Chunky, you'd just be like, oh, it's a lot of meat. Good sirloin. It's good. I like these flavors. But Steve Jobs does not pass the dog fooding test. He limited how much his children,

and you know, I'd like to have kids, and I think we're gonna be, Valerie and I right now are trying to limit our screen time. We're trying to parent ourselves because I find that boredom is like a still lake, and your ideas are like fish, and when the lake is still, you can see the ideas, but if it's always choppy

and always being stimulated and and swirled it's very titillating yeah that's like non-stop movies non-stop everything uh but you're not gonna see your own shit i was so fucking bored kind of goes back to what you were saying like if i had been in high school and i had been like a athlete and a celebrity of the school because i was tall and good school and i had been like a athlete and a celebrity of the school because i was tall and good center and i started drinking i'm not saying everybody drinks but i didn't drink in high school i didn't have girlfriends if i started drinking now i'm getting laid and i i don't know if i would have been able to handle it i'm very grateful that i was fucking bored as shit and taking out the tape recorder and making little radio shows to send to my friends because that made me into a late blooming artist as opposed to the early flare up athlete.

And I'm not saying sometimes that really pays out. Like when I interviewed Kyrie, I'm like, holy shit, you're 20 whatever. You have a billion dollars. Yeah. Cool as fuck. Cool. But there's also a lot of guys that went to my high school, even with the great facilities. They were out there getting a third base.

I don't even know what third base is. And smoking cigarettes, listening to Teenage Wasteland in the cool parking lot. And it's like, yeah, I'm not putting those guys down. You didn't have those people in Lexington. Don't shoot up so fucking fast. What's your rush? Be bored. Boredom is good. What do you mean no i was kidding about lexington no i'm with you i i do worry about that because i think there's so much stimulus all the time it's bad for all of us it's bad for i i just took mushrooms the other day and i was uh one of the images that i saw was

an eyeball that just had like one of those drinking birds that was just going ding ding ding ding ding on my eye it wasn't like a full on hallucination. It was something I saw when my eyes were closed. And I was like, that's what I'm doing. I'm constantly, constantly just feeding myself stimulus, computer to phone. We know our phones are making us depressed. We know it. You never feel better after you go on Facebook. Never. You've never felt better. Never. And you know, and I know. What about the Reddit conspiracy page? I mean, it's hard to say. And you know what? I think podcasts are a hot medium. You have to

kind of imagine there's like a different level of involvement. It's almost like an audio book. There's good stuff and there's bad stuff, but like checking that my friend thought The Last Jedi sucked. And it's not even my friend. It's some fan from a show in college in Iowa that I did 12 years ago. I have to know that he hated

the puffin-like creatures in Last Jedi. What is this adding? And why are we adding anything? Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. How about just like getting to a place where you can just fucking kick it yeah and just watch the fire are you on on twitter and all that stuff or not really i do uh for for biz i think it's interesting i i do feed into other people consuming because i like to tweet jokes i only only tweet jokes. Yeah. Just little things that I hear. Because I like keeping that part of me fresh.

You think of a joke, you tweet it, you're done. I don't check it. I don't look at my at replies or anything. But that's one of the things on the podcast is we're all trying to figure out how to navigate. We do have to parent ourselves. That's a crazy idea. Because we've all been told that meeting all of your needs is the key to happiness. Yeah.

Like if you're hungry, order nachos. If you're bored, watch a movie. If you're horny, watch pornography. Like, and we're one of the really kind of esoteric, strange things that we're figuring out is that's not the answer. What an interesting place to hide joy in a boring spot, in like an unfulfilled spot, in a boring spot, in like an unfulfilled spot, in a complicated spot. We're not lab rats that keep pushing the pellet button, E24, Grubhub.

Now, fucking, what's a porn site? RedTube. RedTube, thank you. Tate. You see what I'm saying? It's like, it's not that I'm against any of those things necessarily. It's just like, it's an interesting,

it's 2018. The predicament we find ourselves in is the answer isn't always more. And when we grew up, it's just like we never even thought that that might be where contentment is hiding. It's actually just sitting on your porch or going to the park or some shit. I think you make a good point about ideas.

The boredom lake. I had that thought yesterday. When you're driving around. I was happy about that one. In the old days, think about it. You're driving around, you get an idea.

That's it. There's a radio commercial and you're just going 40 miles down some street and you see something and you're like, Oh, that reminds me. And then all of a sudden it's the seed of an idea and now it develops into something. Now, if you're at a stoplight, you look at your phone.

Check your phone. Oh, somebody texted me. I wonder what this is. Yeah. We're forgetting how to give. We're forgetting how to create. Instead, we just receive. That's why it's very dangerous to check your email

first thing in the morning because you're setting the standard that I am a reactive a reactive entity you want to be an active entity you want it like breaking bad i'm what goes bump in the night motherfucker you read what i write right and i'm not talking about artists i'm talking about everybody what are your thoughts how do you feel in the morning why do we need to pollute it with shack big tweeter i had a burrito last night who fucking get the fuck out of my awareness. Like, I don't need that shit. I don't follow any of it. That's it.

What's that? I've tried, I've muted almost, I've muted a lot of people. A lot of muting going on. The muting's great. Muting's great. You know what's good is Nuzzle. What's Nuzzle? Nuzzle's an app that takes all the stories that people tweet on your, that tweet on your

timeline that you follow. Yeah. And then you can just kind of read all those stories without having to read the tweets about Shaq having a burrito. You mean it takes like the hits? It basically takes all the links in videos. It's basically all the news links. That's funny because when I'm going on, I'm like, what happened? Exactly.

I'm like, just tell me what happened. So Nuzzle just tells you what happened. Really? And you have to find out about Shaq's burrito. you go yeah unless shaq's burrito i mean it might have been a great burrito you never know it was a fantastic burrito but yeah that it's an it's an interesting pretty you have kids i do have two kids and the logan paul thing i taught one son oh yeah one logan paul thing b.o.s yeah let's confirm a rumor on your... I looked you up on Wikipedia. Oh, Jesus.

His initials are B-O-S because you're from Boston. It's not a rumor. I've talked about it. Well, it's... We named him Ben. Citation needed, citation given. We named him... This podcast.

We want to name him Ben. And my last name is obviously S, and it just seems so easy to do the... I had a friend named his son Wynn. His son was born the year the Red Sox won for the first time. Yeah. So he named his son Wynn. Now we've won three World Series, and there's no stories like this anymore. Isn't that interesting?

Yeah. But that kind of goes into what we're saying. Yeah. It's like, what is a good stand-up set? It's going in when you're down. What is a good World Series? The Red Sox fans were so much more lovable when we had it won. That's what I'm saying.

Boston's won 10 titles this century. Everyone hates us. And buddy, we're similar age. I grew up also with the collective feeling that my sports team was a losing team. Well, you were like, I'm- I was 86. I was Bill Buckner. Yeah, I'm like eight years older than you.

Yeah, your generation was like, all we do is lose. Yeah. I know my it's, it's like, again, I got like church from mom. I got some sports from dad. I've heard so many times that we, we traded Babe Ruth to the Yankees for the money for the production of a play called no, no Nanette. This is a joke in our family. Yeah. We're like all for no, no Nanette. We got rid of the babe. It's almost the 100-year anniversary of that trade. Is that true?

I think it is. People are still pissed. But it was so much more fun. I'm still mad. I wasn't even alive. This is one of the things that, like, what gives life richness. And this is what I really like about sports, is we can see that the underdog quality is what gives the whole game juice.

When we're just winning, it's like, when we're just winning, it's similar to us just eating, fucking, and napping whenever we feel hungry, horny, or tired. You know what I'm saying? So we want the losses. That's what we don't know. And sometimes sports can give us an insight like that, where you go, it's the losing that gives it the thrill.

I'm not just saying, and later we'll be winners. I'm saying the losing juices the whole game. And then when the Red Sox started winning a whole bunch, nobody cares as much. Did the Cubs win? They didn't win. They won last year, yeah. They did win. Now we don't have any good underdogs.

It happened right before Trump became president, so nobody remembers except the Cubs fans now. Who are the underdogs now? The Alligators? There's not a lot left. That's why people are excited about the Buffalo Bills. They made the playoffs for the first time in like 19 years. It's so funny. And it's adorable, and people love Bills fans,

and they've been super tortured. That was like a nice sports moment for underdogs. It's going to take another 50 years to create a fresh batch of underdogs yeah for a while we're just gonna have it almost reminds me of how everybody does have everything these days even if you're lower middle class or something chances are you probably do have an iphone or some sort of smartphone yeah like everybody's kind of doing better at least than pharaohs and ca. Well, this is why your character on your show can never be a massive success. I know.

It's over once he really starts to kill it. But we want to. Or he could be a success for a minute, and then some dick pic scandal comes out, and he just loses everything. To me, that's what it is. It's like the show runs the risk. I liked Entourage.

I think we all watched Entourage. It runs the risk i liked entourage i think we all watched entourage it runs the risk of becoming entourage if pete my character just starts buying nespresso machines you know what i'm saying like i i if pete gets a nice apartment or something it would only be to potentially lose it or almost lose you have to change the title to yeah no longer crashing flourishing if flourishing is good flourish season three is now called Flourishing. Remember when we changed it to Cougar Town? We're doing it again.

So you got January 14th crashing. January 14th. The You Make It Weird podcast. You made it weird. Past tense. I mean, you made it weird. Sorry. You're good.

I'm honored. Yep. What do I know about you? You started writing for the Phoenix, and it was almost like a joke in your Wikipedia page. I can't believe you're writing. I haven't looked at my Wikipedia page in like 10 years. I just assume like half the stuff's wrong on it. You have a very long Wikipedia page.

It's weird. I was mad at how long your Wikipedia page was. I can't imagine. It's fucking upsetting. You carried me on this podcast. My New Year's resolution was I'm getting in shape, and I'm not eating that much. So I had a split pea soup for lunch,

and I'm kind of out of it now. It's kind of like the reverse of having mushrooms. Well, your eyes are glassy. I know. I thought you were tired. No. You caught me on the wrong day. I wish I had had you like three weeks from now.

Or I should have just had like a steak sandwich. We can do it again. I don't know if that's going to... It would have made me tired. You know, you could listen. Speaking of my podcast, and I don't mean you just sent out a cry for help that you need some food and to wrap this up,

but we had a weird guy, Dr. Joel Fuhrman on my podcast, talked about nutritarianism. It's very interesting. It's where you only eat things for their nutrient content. Because he would say like- So you don't eat for joy? No, no, no. It's not, you can still eat joyfully.

Okay. But he's like, he's a very far out guy. I think just like very, almost like savant level nutrition, almost the way that people can be about sports statistics. Yeah. He knows what's in everything. And it's all about like eating whole foods and stuff and like making sure like this smoothie is a nutritarian smoothie it has like flax seeds that i ground you brought we should mention you brought a smoothie berries you gotta eat berry what does he say berries onions mushrooms seeds uh and greens all that all that sort of stuff.

Anyway, but you're in great shape. I don't understand. No, I'm getting in shape. I'm making one more basketball comeback, ironically. You're going to play a basketball game? One more time. You look like the guy that wears the goggles. No, no, no, no, no, no.

You wear the goggles and you throw bows. No goggles. No more bows either. And you call charging a lot. None of that. I'm super fun to play with and I space the floor now I'm old you space the floor

means I'm shooting like 20 to 25 footers that opens the space for the guys who are still athletic I can do stuff I'll spread the floor for Tate did Bird spread the floor well late end of the career for Tate did Bird spread the floor? well late end of the career

30 pound back brace Bird spread the floor he couldn't run when I was a kid they said he won some championship or something and they were like

what are you going to do with the money? and he goes I'm going to give it to the Larry Bird Fund and I was like that should be one of those you know thug life

vines Larry Bird Fund he's like Larry what are you going to do with the money? and he goes I'm going to give vines. Larry Bird fun. He's like, Larry, what are you going to do with the money? And he goes, I'm going to give it to the Larry Bird fun. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. A joint flies in his mouth, sunglasses.

Those were some players, man. I didn't give a shit about sports, but McHale, Parrish, and Bird. And Jordan. Jordan versus Bird on Nintendo. Oh, it was one of the first great great times yeah one of the first great video games and I wore Jordans

like I gave a shit about that stuff and slam dunk contests they mattered in the 80s used to matter that's true Dee Brown yeah

with the no look oh yeah I waited in line at Thunder Sports for two hours Thunder Sports just to get an autograph from Dee Brown

we used to draw him and shit one great poster good Reebok poster he has. That's what I had him autograph. That's what we needed. And I had like a Andre Agassi starter jacket

and like three lines in my head like vanilla ice. It's a good time. Andre Agassi starter jacket. All right. Thanks for coming on. This was fun. Thank you, Bill.

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