The Bill Simmons Podcast - Rehashing the Jimmy G Trade With Mike Francesa and Bill’s Dad (Ep. 310)

Episode Date: January 5, 2018

HBO and The Ringer’s Bill Simmons is joined by New York radio legend Mike Francesa to discuss the leaked news regarding the New England Patriots trading away Jimmy Garoppolo (2:10), evaluate Jon Gruden’s imminent return to the NFL (18:45), debate the likelihood of Bill Belichick taking another job (23:30), and give their NFL picks for this weekend (36:33). Then, Bill calls his dad to get a Boston resident’s perspective on the Patriots story (48:10) and the Celtics’ dominant season thus far (61:45). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I love BMWs. Hey, ringer.com, I have a column. I did the playoff gambling manifesto 5.0. It's been 12 years since I wrote the last one. The NFL got super weird. Now it's not quite as weird. So you can read that as well as my round one picks and the explanations for them and a whole bunch of other stuff coming up. Mike Francesa. I think we're calling my dad first Pearl Jam. All right. Every Friday throughout the playoffs,

the hibernating New York City radio legend, Mike Francesa, planning his next move. We don't know what it is yet, but right now he's going to give his picks and talk about Jimmy G with me. How are you? I'm fine. Well rested from the Florida golf courses.

Now up in the brutal cold of the Northeast. Just terrible. But we'll have the playoffs to in the brutal cold of the Northeast. Just terrible. But we'll have the playoffs to warm the cockles of my heart. So I'm looking forward to that. And I'm glad we finished the season on a winning note. Plus, when Jimmy G. Locke came through, as we told you, the Rams were going to tank. And they tanked, and it didn't even work for them. It shows you it doesn't work.

The tanking Rams did not get what they wanted. They tanked, and it still didn't The tanking Rams did not get what they wanted. They tanked, and it still didn't work out because they did not get what they wanted. They did not want to go to Minnesota. They did not want to have the playoffs set up the way they're set up now, but it just shows it doesn't work out the way you design it. But more than that, the saga of Jimmy G, he did something that has never, ever been accomplished before by anybody in this league, and that is he may finally be the person who took down, by every report, took down the Patriots, because now we are into all kinds of intrigue, all kinds of skullduggery about trades and backdoor deals and whether or not we have anything left in the dynasty.

So this must be a very tough time for you. I just want to remind everyone, we won five Super Bowls. So we were in the gravy stretch of this whole run. ESPN's headline was, could this be the beginning of the end of the dynasty? And Brady's 40, Belichick's 65, and Kraft's 76. We kind of knew it was going to head this way. The part I didn't understand, and which makes no sense to anything that has happened in the last 17 years, is if Kraft told Belichick to trade Jimmy G, which is what this story basically says, that doesn't fly with anything that's happened in the entire time I've been following the Belichick Patriots. Kraft has never told Belichick what to do. Do you believe that part

of the story? I find it hard to believe. I do know that something happened here because they loved Garoppolo. Everything we heard was how much they loved Garoppolo. They had found their future and you knew that Tom thought he would play forever. Tom not only thinks he's going to live forever, Tom thinks he's going to play forever, which is something that Belichick's always thought quarterbacks don't live past 40, which is the conventional wisdom in the NFL. It's always been the conventional wisdom,

and he hasn't played great this year. You know what? It's an amazing thing. He's done enough in this very weird NFL season to be voted the MVP. But let's be honest, down the stretch, he has not been great. He's done enough to win these games, but he has not been Brady-like in a lot of these games. I agree. And he has shown his age in some of these games. He really has, especially whenever anybody has put any pressure on him.

But that's what you would expect from a quarterback his age. You would expect the things you're seeing. The thing that is so intriguing here is what you said, is that would Kraft impose his will for Tom? Would Tom go to Kraft? Yes. Would Kraft impose his will on Belichick? Or were there other things at work here, like Belichick moving on or something like that?

We'll have to wait and see, because it got very weird. I don't believe, that's hard to believe, also hard to believe if they ever offered him the amount of money that has been quoted in the story. A backup, getting that, because that would have signaled to Tom that he's the future, which would have driven Tom crazy. All the stuff about Tom and Garoppolo is predictable, just like it was with Montana and Steve Young. These guys don't want to see or help their next guy. When they saw the real guy show up, when Young showed up, Montana knew what it was. When Garoppolo showed up, Brady knew what it was.

He knew, here's the guy. Here's the guy that can replace me. And that's what caused the tensions. Forget the trainer. The trainer, to quote a Godfather scene, the trainer is small potatoes, okay? The real crux of the matter is here, is that Brady finally saw his replacement in flesh and bone. Engineer him being gone is another question. And you left out a crucial part of this. Once upon a time,

Brady was Jimmy Garoppolo. Yes, he was. In 2001. Brady was scorned. Yeah. He's never gotten over being replaced by Drew Henson

at Michigan as a senior. Right. He's never gotten over that scar his whole life. It's actually driven him. It's actually what has fueled the Brady phenomenon. It made him work him. It's actually what has fueled the Brady phenomenon. It made him work hard. It made him go from being the worst-bodied quarterback

to ever come through an NFL draft, ever. I know guys who did that. One of my best friends in the world, Dr. Steve O'Brien, who is family, said he was the worst-looking quarterback prospect I ever gave a physical to. And he became Tom Brady because he worked and he lifted and he did everything he had to do and threw a thousand passes a day. And he became Tom Brady, was driven by that failure or driven by that benching. And it made him who he was. It's what drives him today. Brady is driven, but you know what? Anyone who accomplishes anything is driven. Right.

Being driven is what makes you accomplish things. Right. And having an ego is one of the reasons that you become successful. And Norm Brimholtzberger taught me many, many years ago. When I was a young kid, he said, show me talent that doesn't have an ego

and I'll show you bad talent. Let me throw a theory that's basically a twist of what we read in that piece. Because I don't believe Kraft told Belichick to trade him. I just don't believe it. I don't believe Belichick would do it. I think he would rather quit over do something because the owner told him to do that. And by the way, this is how Kraft got into trouble 20 plus years ago with Parcells.

And he learned his lesson. And he was always, after that, I hire these people. They do what they think. Here's what I think happened. And I do think Belichick realized that he had to trade Jimmy for a variety of reasons. I think we had talked about it before that back in April when he had a chance to trade him,

he's looking at the finish line with Brady. He's looking at the next 15 years potentially with Garoppolo, who everybody thinks is going to be really good and who proved that he was really good. And he basically took the wait and see approach. I'm going to give this one more year. I expect Brady to probably have some attrition. And eventually this will move toward Jimmy G being the guy. Here's the problem with that. First of all, as you said, Brady knew from 2001, he knows what it's like to be the other guy. But then second, Brady's 40 years old. He also has nothing in common with basically anybody in that locker room anymore.

He's much older than everyone else on the team, except for maybe two or three guys. Jimmy G learned from him. He's in there every day. He's the first guy to leave, first guy to show up, last guy to leave, just like Brady was. He's hanging out with the offensive lineman, just like Brady used to in 2002. He's thrown to all the receivers all the time, just like Brady did. And Brady's a massive celebrity. Brady's doing the TB12 thing.

He's in and out. He's basically kind of ascended the team. He almost became too famous to hang out with these guys day in, day out. And I think Garoppolo is really starting to win the locker room over. And my theory is that this was really starting to bother Brady. And the reason Belichick made this trade wasn't because Kraft told him to. I think he saw that there was a real locker room problem that was brewing. And as you know from Belichick, anytime there's a problem, anytime he sees something that he thinks is going to affect the team, the season, the Superbowl chase, whatever, he cuts it, he gets rid of it. And he obviously looked at this and thought that he had to trade Jimmy when he did. What do you think of that theory?

I think there's a lot of points that are probably good. I don't know if he would, if he did try to keep him and offer him a deal that he could live with, one that Brady couldn't have lived with. And whether or not he thought, I'll take Brady short-term versus Garoppolo long-term, I don't know if Belichick's thinking long-term anymore. I don't know what he's thinking about the future, so I can't answer that part. It's fascinating what happened here. What we do know is he thought he had a guy who could become a top 10 player.

We all know that. I heard that long before he traded him. Me too. We knew that. Everyone knew it. Who knew anything about what was coming out of there, how good they thought the kid was. Then they had passed on many deals because they wanted to keep him.

Then they wound up giving him away, we thought, because the kid turned down a contract, which was far bigger than we ever thought could ever have been offered to him. Never thought it was anything like what the rumors are. I still don't know if that's accurate because it seems to be extreme. I don't know if that's accurate either. I find that to be extreme, the amount of money. But bottom line is, from there, it's fascinating, and I agree with a lot of the stuff.

He always, always had a relationship with Shanahan. He sent it to Shanahan. He sent it to Shanahan. He sent them to Shanahan. I think that's part true. He also did, uh, make up with the Colts over and Parcells had a part of that with Brissett, who is like, who's Parcells is his advisor. And Parcells has, has handled the kid's finances, which I don't know if people realize he handles the kid's money. He handles everything the kid does. So that worked with, that took care of that. And then I didn't know, which I learned in the story,

and I didn't know this, I admit it. I didn't know he had made up with the commissioner. I was not aware of that, you know? The commissioner and I don't have a relationship, so I wasn't going to hear it. And Belichick and I don't have a relationship, so I wasn't going to hear it from either of the particulars. I didn't know, I knew how bad their rift was.

I didn't know they had mended that fence. These were, Commissioner probably got desperate. He didn't have a lot of friends. We finally went out and found one who had been one of his big enemies, and I gather they made up, at least according to the story they made up, and I had never heard that before. So I didn't know that they had made up, and I know how bad their rift was. But maybe they did.

I don't know. You know, maybe I'm next in line with the Commissioner if he's going to make up with all the guys he used to hate. So I don't know. But the bottom line is, you'd be on that list too. I'd be last. You might be ahead of me on that list. No, I think I'm last. Yeah, so maybe you're going to get a call.

But I was surprised by that. There were a lot of fascinating things. Not all those things have to be true, but when I read that story, the thing I thought about more than any of the information was, who leaked this? Because that's an inside leak. The question is, there's three camps. The Belichamp camp doesn't usually leak, but there's some stuff in there that is really stuff that is inside Belichamp. The Kraft could definitely leak.

Brady could leak. Garoppolo, I don't think, has a camp yet to leak from. So I'd say Brady, probably not. I think I'm looking Belichick or Kraft. I lean towards the Kraft camp leak in that story. I'm not just leaning there. I'm all the way there because the person who is conspicuously missing from this entire story was Jonathan Kraft. He's been on this podcast. I liked the guy. He just wasn't in the story.

And anybody who's been around the Patriots knows that the moment Belichick steps down, Jonathan Kraft is going to run this team. So I always look at these things when, when stuff gets leaked like this, who has the most to gain and all right, what's the accomplishment of this story? The accomplishment- This story took down, it basically took the two of the three-headed person, leave Kraft out, and basically took shots at both of them. Well, but then it also made it seem like the Krafts were on the Brady side, and Brady's their guy.

No, no, clearly did. And that was kind of the objective. No question. Yeah, the objective of the story was our golden boy, we wanted him to be around for the next five years, and we did what we had to do to protect that, and the coach didn't like it, but we made him do it anyway, which makes me think that the Crafts were the big leaker of this story. But the golden boy doesn't have five years.

That's what people, and I know he thinks he's going to live forever. I know he and this guy, his trainer who has been banned now by Belichick, you know they have a network they're ready to put forward. We all know that, that Tom is going to have a fitness network with his wife. Everybody knows that already. Okay, everyone already knows that TB12 is going to be a program deal from networks to apps to everything else. That's part of the plan here.

And that might be even driving Tom more than football is or equally right now. We all know that TB12 thing is a big part of his life, and he's going to make it a network and an app and everything else. Tom doesn't have five years left. I've seen slippage this year from the great Brady. I've seen it. I've seen it on the field. So has Belichick.

So has McDaniel. It happens. You can't fight. I've seen it on the field. So has Belichick. So has McDaniel. It happens. You can't fight. I don't care how many vegetables you eat. You can't fight father time. I don't care. You can't do it. But what do you do if you're the Patriots in this situation? Because it never totally sat right with me how the Niners handled Montana, who I thought until the first 30 years of my life was the greatest quarterback I ever saw. Well, he's still the greatest quarterback of all time in the big game. Well, now I'm a Patriot fan, so I have to go with my guy.

But I still infuriate Patriot fans by voting Montana number one. I just think he is because he was perfect in the big games. He really was. But leave that alone for a second. We've seen slippage, and Tom doesn't have five years left. If they go try to play Tom for five more years, they're going to become a very— they'll do it without their coach, and they will not win.

It will not happen. But is it, do you feel some sort of responsibility for the fact that this guy's had the greatest career of any quarterback ever and any football player ever, and he wants to keep playing, and if you're Bob Craft and this guy is the number one reason or the 1A reason why you won all those Super Bowls, and wants to keep going and Belichick wants to be there, can you blame Bob Kraft at age 76 for saying, like, I just want to protect this? One thing you're doing right now is the thing that you have to learn in football. Football and winning separate when you bring in sentimentality. Chuck Knoll once said,

I lost for three seasons because I could not part from the guys who won four Super Bowls for me. It was the biggest mistake I ever made. If you want to do that and be sentimental, you'll pay the price. And the Pats and Belichick, Belichick, I don't think,

has many sentimental bones in his body. He's zero. He has no sentimental bones. That Tom is reaching the end of the line. Yeah. Well, you know, I don't think, has many sentimental bones in his body. He's zero. He has no sentimental bones. And I think he realizes that Tom is reaching the end of the line. Yeah. Well, you know, we lived through this as Celtic fans with Larry Bird and McKellen Parrish in the early 90s where they kind of hung on to it. The hardest thing in the world to do is say goodbye to an iconic player.

It's the hardest thing to do in any city, in any sport, is to say goodbye to your iconic figures. But they never out. No one wins against all the time. And Tom won't eat it. Despite how many vegetables or how many things this trainer whispers in his ear, it's not going to work. And you're seeing it already. Tom, listen, he still can make the big play. He still makes the great drive. He still turns it up in the fourth quarter. Look at the Steeler drive as a perfect example,

although the tight end clearly bailed him out on one throw that was in the dirt. But other than that, he made some great throws on that drive. Tom is still great when the game's on the line. But day in, day out, play in, play out, he's starting to show his age a little bit. Now, he might get through one more year, but he's not getting through five more years. Yeah, I agree with that, but I'm going to defend him for one second. I think a lot of this Patriots regular season was just about getting Brady and Grock specifically to round two. And Brady took care of his body in ways that I've never totally seen him do it in the regular season. just about getting Brady and Gronk specifically to round two. And they have. And Brady took care of his body in ways that I've never totally seen him do it in the regular season, like just getting rid of balls when he was going to get hit,

checking down as fast as he could, things like that. He just never did stuff like that as consistently as this year. And Gronk, you saw it. They never sent Gronk over the middle unless they absolutely had to. And when they had to in that Pittsburgh game, they did. Absolutely. And they protect them because they can't win without them because they can't win with their defense. We all know it. And the other thing with Brady though,

no, they can't win with the defense. But the other thing with Brady is this was the first year in like 12 years where he hasn't had his trusty slot receiver. You know, he didn't have Edelman, no Troy Brown, obviously, no Wes Walker, obviously, and he missed it. He doesn't have the underneath passing game that he had. What he has, though, is a running back who's become a star.

Yes. Who's the best running back he's had probably since Corey Dillon. Oh, he's become a star. In the last five, six games, he's become an absolute star. So this is going to be fascinating to watch. We'll do a lot of pats in the weeks to come. Two things right now. First, I'm going to give you one here.

Gruden is going to be named the head coach in a day, two days. Okay. It's coming. Okay. It's, it's, we all know it was coming. What happened was the Raiders, he was, he was talking to the Bucs and the Raiders stepped in and the Bucs said, we're not getting into a bidding war to finish second to the Raiders, uh, and jumped out and the Raiders jumped in and you knew he was going to the Raiders. Let me say this. It is very hard to come back. And the only coach currently active and only two of them in history that I would hire who have already won Super Bowls, they are the worst buy in sports.

No one who's ever won a Super Bowl has ever won another one with another team. Most of the time, their tenures are bad, and guys coming back in the league flop much more than they succeed, and I'm telling you right now, Gruden has a quarterback which is a huge plus. He's got a good quarterback, not a great quarterback. People jump the gun on him being a great quarterback, but he's got a good quarterback, but I'm telling you, Gruden's return to the league will be far more rocky than people think. I wrote a column today for The Ringer. I was saying, after he won the Super Bowl,

500 for the next five years, and then did TV for the next nine. I have no idea why people think he's going to be good coming back. He's not. He's gone too long. And if you look, the time, the second time around, does not work. Now, someone said to me, well, would you hire Belichick?

I would. Because Belichick has broken every exception and deserves the right to go to another team. And if I were the team, I would hire him because I think he's that good and he's that single-minded of purpose. So I would hire him, but I would not hire anybody else right now who is active, who has won a Super Bowl, who is young enough. This leaves Parcells out because I would hire Parcells. But anyone else I would not hire. Holmgren should have won with Seattle. He got screwed in that Super Bowl, the worst officiated game of all time. He should have won it. But he would have been the first and the only guy to ever win with two teams.

Parcells obviously had close calls. He didn't do it. No one has ever done it. And I don't think Gruden will do it either. I think Gruden's day will be very rocky. I think Vermeule is the only success story I remember from somebody disappearing and coming back and actually having real success.

Absolutely true. And look at Gibbs. Look how Gibbs came back. And Gibbs was a great coach. And he didn't connect when he came back. It didn't work. Gruden's been out a long time. I know people think he talked to the co-autobacks and he did this and he had his camp, but he has been out a long time. That will absolutely hurt. Now, before we get to pics, I got one movie I saw this week. It rained one day in Palm Beach, so we went to the movies. All the money in the world. Have you seen it?

It's like the only one I haven't seen because I didn't get a screener for it. And let me say this. First of all, went with my wife, and I even let my kids, who are not yet supposed to see all, but I looked it up,

and except I didn't let them look at the one bad scene in the movie, which I'm not going to give away, that was a little bloody. But other than that, this is a story, of course, of the Getty kidnapping, which is a real story that happened. And we all know at that time, Getty was the richest man in the world, played by Christopher Plummer, who will hands down win the Academy Award. Oh, wow.

This is the man, hands down, win the Academy Award. He's approaching 90. Everybody loves him. Remember, this is a guy who was the Von Trapp patriarch in the sound of music singing Edelweiss 50, 60 years ago and was the heartthrob of Hollywood as, you know, Colonel Von Trapp, you know, in the sound of music, which is an iconic movie that every kid grew up on.

And now here he is 60 years years later, playing this role and killing it. Absolutely killing it. He could not. This is the role that they had to replay for Spacey. He took him out of the movie. Plummer in. He will win hands down. Great, well-acted movie

on a lot of levels. Plummer stole the movie. Movie's 15 minutes too long, like most movies are. They don't know how to edit movies. Way too long. But solid movie. I'd give it a good B. Wasn't an A because it was 15 minutes too long.

Well acted. And Plummel will win the Academy Award. All right. I'm going to need you to see Lady Bird and Phantom Thread because those are going to be the two big Oscar contenders. I have not seen them.

You're going to put those on your list. I get all the movies because I'm a SAG voter because I'm a SAG after member, so I get them. So I will try to see those. I haven't looked at any of the movies yet. I also saw the coming attractions for the Tanya Harding. That's a good one. Janney is great, and I've always liked her from the West Wing. They say she's great in that movie. Wait, I have two quick questions for you before we get to the picks.

One, do you think there's any chance in hell that Belichick goes to the Giants? I would be stunned if Belichick's the next coach of the Giants. I've been asked that five times today. I would be stunned if that happened. I would really be stunned. Now, the guy who would have stood in the doorway would have been George Young. He couldn't stand Belichick, but he's long gone.

I think these guys would, would basically send their best yet to bring Belichick to, to the Meadowlands. But I just don't see it happening. I really don't. What if the Giants, Belichick would have to collect himself for a year if he left there. I don't see him jumping right into another job. What if the Giants offered him

$16 million a year and 1% of the team? First of all, the Giants aren't going to offer anybody 1% of the team. You're not even allowed to do that. You can give equivalents. You're not even allowed to give real percent to the team. Let's go $20 million a year. Right. If they offer him $20 million a year,

he would take it. I'll tell you something else. That job would be a great draw for him. I think that job would appeal to him. I'm thinking the Giants and he would have trouble connecting. And here's my biggest thought. Both Patricia and McDaniel are going to be head coaches. There's no question. They're bolting. They're leaving the nest. I don't think he would feel that he would be able that quickly to put a staff together he could live with. He can't take Skarniecki with him. Dante will not leave. Dante could have been a head coach all over this league. He's one of the great coaches in the last 30 years of football. He could have been a great head coach in his own right.

Parcells tried to bring him places a million times. He would not leave that area. He'll never leave that area. And Belichick's brought him back multiple times. The guy's a brilliant coach. They all rave about him, Dante Skarniecki as a coach. So he won't have Skarniecki. He won't have McDaniel. He won't have Patricia. I don't see him with that case jumping right into a job if he didn't have a staff he could live with. I got to say, well, first of all, this is my worst fear. And even if it would be funny to

watch the Giant fans flip on Belichick and all of a sudden love him again, it would be terrible for me as a Patriot fan. But I just think it's the big play. My thing is, if you're going to make a big play for a coach, it can't be John Gruden. You've got to go big. You've got to go get Bill Belichick. If the Giants got Belichick, it would be the biggest story of the decade in New York.

John Brown's going to make that call. He's going to make that call. There's no question. But if they would do anything in their power to get him, I just don't know if he... Now, I think he would be drawn to the Giants. And listen, I don't try to fake. Belichick and I have never spoken a word since he's been at Foxborough. We did not get along, okay?

That's not a secret. We have never gotten along. And we have never spoken a word since he's been at Foxborough. We did not get along, okay? That's not a secret. We have never gotten along. So, you know, and we've never had a relationship. So I don't want to try to tell you I know what he's going to do. I don't. So I don't know what his feelings are. I just think that he is a guy who's smart enough to know that you can't coach the coaches. It's an old adage that I know he grew up on because I grew up on it.

And it's an old adage where you have to have the right staff because you can't take time to coach the coaches and coach the players. It's an old adage. And I don't think he'd have a staff that he believed in. And I think that would throw him off. I think he'd like a year to go to Nantucket, take it easy, and then put together his perfect staff

and come back after one year out of the league. That's the way he would attack this. That would be my opinion, is that he would take a year to have the intrigue build. Could you imagine next year, every week, people talking about where Bill Belichick's going to land, what it would be like? It would be a game show that would start

the first week of the season, and would be the lead story on those shows every day, every day of the year until he finally picked the team. And I think he would go big too. If he left, which I really hope he doesn't, I hope he stays for another 12 years. But if he did leave, I think it would be for like Los Angeles or the Giants. I don't think Belichick would ever live that far from the East Coast. He loves Nantucket. I don't think he would live. I don't think he's a West Coast guy. I could see him in places in the Northeast. I could see him in New York. I could see him up at the East of the Seaboard. I couldn't see him all the way there. I don't think he's, I think he's like me. He's not a California guy, nor am I. I don't see him there. Now, let me ask you the question. Here you go. Patriots 2020. Who's the coach? Who's the quarterback? I think Tom Brady is still the quarterback.

Really? And who's the head coach? And I think Bill Belichick is still the head coach. I think this is fine. Wow, that's it. That's a great call today. I do. I really do. On this day in 2018, that is a great call today, making that call. That's a fascinating call.

So opening day 2020, they're still together. I genuinely believe, and by the way, this is going to be my second question for you. It is funny that ESPN just tries to start shit with the Patriots all the time. They do not treat the Lakers like this, for example. Only you. Listen, they got a story. They would treat any team this way. This is a huge story. You got great intrigue. You have the team, the team, and the team has now had the great infighting, the Shakespearean infighting that you love to see. the head coach, the great quarterback, the iconic coach, and now who ran to the owner, and did the owner impose his will on the great coach? Oh, it's fascinating. And now you've got

the other kid who turns out to be the foil in the story, and he's Jimmy G, who you heard in the story, people saying the Pat staff knew he was going to be a great player. Belichick knew he was going to be a great player, how thrilled he was and how proud he was that he went there and was undefeated. He sent him to a guy that he really wanted to help. I mean, it's perfect. It's,

it's, it's really, it's, it's really Shakespearean in every way. It's a classic, classic story. It really seems like Jimmy's biggest mistake was having the same agent as Brady. I think in all future scenarios.

I didn't understand that part. That was the one part that made the whole negotiation very hard to fathom. Yeah, because they couldn't do anything secret. I didn't know they had the same agent until I read that. And I'm like, wait a second. These guys have the same agent? It doesn't make any sense. It really, that whole negotiation part is very flimsy.

Wouldn't you say? I think it's very flimsy. Yeah, and there's no way they could approach Jimmy with anything. The story pointed this out without Brady finding out. So what do you do? How do you handle it? And that's why I don't think they ever made him an offer. Because the other part that I don't think could be overstated,

you can't pay Jimmy as much as you're paying Brady because it goes back to the ego thing Brady looks like he goes very I found that part very unrealistic I agree I also agree with you about Kraft coming down heavy on Belichick after all these years very very hard to do but I'm not surprised nor are you if Brady would try to wipe out the quarterback, who he felt was a huge threat. You know, and I was around this, I know how rough Montana was on Young and how bad things were with Montana and Young, and they're still not good.

And it ruined the Montana-Walsh relationship. There's no question. Yeah, I mean, you know these are very tough, and Brady has those scars that he's carried. We know that he was not the guy who was the number one pick in high school, the number one player in college, the number one pick in the draft. This is a guy who had to come up the hard way, who had to fight for everything,

was scorned in the draft, was basically treated like he was nothing coming out of Michigan. So from that standpoint, he had a lot to overcome, and he had a lot of scars, and he's carried those, and he's worn them well. They've actually turned out to be his biggest attributes. They've led him to such incredible greatness. And I told you, I can't even say who told me the story. Scott Piole told me that it was a March night,

and there was no one there. And he wanted to get home to see an NCAA tournament game. And as he's driving down the hill in Foxborough, he sees that the field house has the lights on. He's like,

son of a gun, I'm going to ring one of those kids next. And he goes in there. It's a March night on a Friday night. He's running home to see an NCAA regional game.

And he goes in to flick the lights off. And in there, by himself, with racks of balls, flick the lights off, and in there, by himself, with racks of balls, throwing the balls, is Tom Brady, at 9.30 at night on a March night. Yeah, he doesn't want to give it up. You need to be told. That tells you everything you need to be told about Tom Brady.

And I think, last thing, and then we'll get to the picks. I don't think he should be criticized for wanting to keep his job and to extend what's already been the greatest career. I think like, yeah, if he's a little threatened by this younger, handsome dude who's going to take his job someday, it's fucking human nature. You can't criticize the guy for that. You want to stick around. Wait, am I supposed to grease the skids? If I have someone, should I teach him everything I know in my job? Should I help the guy who's going to replace me?

Now, I went out on my own, but if I was not the case and there was somebody who was up and coming, do you think I would have helped that guy get my job? Not a chance in the world. I was going to ask you. I wouldn't have done that in a million years. If you had some 24-year-old 2020 Flash guy who was this rising hot talent... Yeah, I would basically, I would help one bit. I'm not going to give him everything I've learned.

Tom doesn't owe that kid that. There's no way. And Tom wants to play forever. Yeah. He wants to live forever. He wants to play forever. He wants to be the eternal quarterback. That's why he eats all those vegetables. That's why he does all that work. That's why he spends all the time with those bands and all that crazy stuff. And you know what? I'm sure it all works for him. I respect that. I don't have any criticism of that. I respect that. I respect people who are single-minded of purpose. You know, when I was a kid, you might not even know this,

two years, when I went to school, I was a communications major at St. John's. They started a program called Athletic Administration. They asked me to go into the program and have a dual major. I did, and you had to pick your internship out of a hat. I picked the New York set, the World Team Tennis team. And of course, I wanted the Giants,

I wanted the Yankees, I wanted, I wanted to put the World Team Tennis. But I spent two summers with Billie Jean King, who became very close when I was a kid. My first job

I ever did for one day was pick Martina Navratilo over up at the airport when I was 18 years old, pick her up to come play in World Team Tennis. And on the way in, she made me,

she asked me if I would stop at McDonald's and get her a double cheeseburger. On the way in, that's a true story. She was like 17 at the time. True story. And I spent two years, summers with Billie Jean King. She and Larry King tried to hire me full time. I said, I don't want to be in tennis.

She was insulted, but I said, listen, I don't want to spend my life in tennis. I'm a football, baseball, basketball guy. I don't want to do tennis. But I interned there, and she told me, Billie Jean King said, listen, I don't want to spend my life in tennis. I'm a football, baseball, basketball guy. I don't want to do tennis. But I interned there, and she told me, Billie Jean King said to me, the only people who change the world are single-minded in purpose. So don't ever think that's a bad thing. And you know what? I've always remembered that.

And I believe that. And I think there's nothing wrong with people who are that way. And I think people have to sacrifice certain things if they want to be great at something. And they want to change. And I have no problem with any of that. I think he's been nothing but short of been brilliant. I think he's been great. From the first day he stepped in there, he's been single-minded.

And he has been great. You should see Battle of the Sexes. It's solid. It's not great, but it's solid. I haven't seen that yet. I haven't seen that yet. It's solid. I know some stuff from her about that.

And like I said, I spent two years with her, and I loved her. She knows so much about sports. Her brother, remember, was a baseball pitcher, Randy Moffitt. She grew up a huge, giant fan. Her father was a minor league player and was a fanatic baseball fan. She grew up a fanatic baseball fan. Her brother was a major leaguer. She knew a lot.

Her best friend was Ed Snyder from Philadelphia. She knew everybody, and everybody. You know what? I learned a lot. Her best friend was Ed Snyder from Philadelphia. She knew everybody and everybody. And you know what? I learned a lot from her in two years. I still, things I say today in sports, I learned from her, just to tell you. She was fascinating. All right, let's get to the picture. Yeah. Taking a break to talk about SimpliSafe. When you make an investment, you want to make sure it pays off. Investing in the safety of your home is no different. Researchers from leading universities like Rutgers and UNC Charlotte have proven security systems deter burglars.

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For the home security I trust, go to simplisafebs.com today. Simplisafebs.com, Simplisafe with two I's simply safe BS dot com. Round one picks. How many are you doing? Three or four? Are you doing all of them? I'm doing all four.

Okay. You got to pick all the playoff games. Yeah, I know. I know. There's one I don't like but go ahead. Regular season

you can do what you want. I had a very good regular season. You got on me for not winning in week 16. I bounced back and gave people

a lock of the year as you did you last week with the Rams and also won with the Falcons thank God although it wasn't easy. the year, as you did you last week with the Rams, and also won with the Falcons, thank God, although it wasn't easy. Would they kick a few field goals last week or what? I mean, my gosh, that game was not as easy as it should have been. All right, here we go. Tennessee and Kansas City. I'm worried about the Kansas City defense. I saw it in person. They seem to have made some adjustments. I know Bob Sutton very well. He's usually good in these games. I don't think Tennessee has any right to be in the playoffs. I think Kansas City will make a couple of big

plays offensively in the passing game. The line is eight and a half. Give me Kansas City minus eight and a half, game number one. Game number two, and I think this is the hardest game of the four to pick, is Atlanta and the Rams. I've been on Atlanta all year. I'm going to stick with them here and take the five and a half points. I think this game is going to come down to a field goal late. I'm worried about the Rams stopping the run. If they don't stop the run early and get some hats on early, they're going to be in big trouble. The Rams have to run the ball to win.

I think Atlanta can win this game if their linebackers and their safeties play a big game. I think Julio Jones can be game-breaker here. I like the Atlanta field goal kicker. He's good in these spots. I'm going to make this a three-point game either way. I'll take the five-and-a-half with Atlanta for game number two.

Buffalo and Jacksonville, everybody's all over Jacksonville. I don't trust their offense here. I'm going to take Jacksonville to win, Buffalo to cover, though. I think Buffalo's going to make this a very much defensive game. I think their coach is a good defensive coach. I think in their first playoff game, Jacksonville will be very tight offensively, and they'll let this be a very low-scoring, tight game.

Either this game will be Jacksonville obliterating the Buffalo offensive line and winning 40-0. If that doesn't happen, this game will be a very, very boring game, low-scoring, and Jacksonville will win a tight game. I think it's that game. I think Jacksonville will be worried about Bortles making mistakes and won't allow them to. I think Buffalo will gang up on the run.

I think this game, Taylor will make more plays than you think with his legs in a game, in a playoff game, to let him run wild. I think I'm going to take Buffalo plus the 8.5. And then I don't like Carolina. I don't like what I've seen from their offense. I think their defense is good. But I think Carolina, I think the Wallens has beat them twice. They've scored over 30 both times.

Make it three straight times. Saints will score over 30. Saints will come up big. Their backs will have big games. They'll make some special teams plays, and I think they'll score 30 and cover. So my four picks are Kansas City, minus 8.5. Falcons, plus 5.5, Falcons plus 5.5, Buffalo plus 8.5, which I think will surprise people,

and St. minus 6.5. You got it. What do you got? I have two of the four. So we have the same two. The first one we agree on is New Orleans. I actually don't understand the case for Carolina. They have no receivers left.

Oh, and I think they've scored 30 on them twice, which means they've figured out their insurance with these games. And they've figured out Carolina's defense twice. They'll figure it out again. I think they're out in that game. Yeah, the problem with Carolina, they don't make big plays as it is. And now Funchess has a bad shoulder. They're saying Olsen's healthy, but he hasn't looked healthy since he came back.

No, he has not. None of their receivers are left. Also, Saints have beat them twice and put up 30 both times. So to me, I'm big on Saints. And the Saints need to make five, six big plays a game. I think they had 89, 20-plus plays this year. Good coach, home, in a dome. I think it's going to be tough for Carolina to play from behind.

So I actually think New Orleans blows them out. So we agree on that. The other one we agree on is the game I hate. I didn't know what to do with the Chiefs-Titans game. I hate laying nine points for the Indy Reed, but Arrowhead. I think they'll blow them out early, and I think Tennessee can't come from behind. Well, that's the thing. Tennessee's offense is horrible.

Horrible. DeMarco Murray's out. I'm not a fan of Derrick Henry. I don't think they can throw the ball. Marriott had 13 TDs and 15 picks. When they get from behind that, I'm not a fan of Derek Henry. I don't think they can throw the ball. Marriott had 13 TDs and 15 picks. When they get from behind that, I'm not convinced they can do anything. He opens up early, gets up early,

and then gets a couple of picks and wins the game going away. I would not bet on this game though because you can never, ever get me to lay nine points with Andy Reid, so that's out. The two we disagree on. I love the Rams. I think that I actually really like the fact that so many people are taking the Falcons. I think the Rams have another level to go to. What they showed against Seattle a couple

weeks ago, just how fast they were, the big plays, kind of the killer instinct, went for the juggler, all that stuff. Gurley's fantastic. I think their defense is fast. And I just don't like Atlanta. I really wanted to buy into them over and over again this year. And the team I've seen against any good team cannot get to 20 points. Or if they do, it's field goals. You know, they're in the top five in yardage, and they can't score. They screw up in the red zone over and over again. They're poorly coached.

Over and over all year. All year. Look at last week. Look how many field goals they kicked. Yeah. You're absolutely right. Listen, I would have taken the Rams against any other team. I think the Falcons match up well against them.

But I can see, really, I've been on Atlanta all year. I'm staying with them, and they might make me look silly here. So I don't think your Rams is a dumb thing at all. I think Rams are going to play really well. I think Atlanta, with their A game, can beat anybody playing this weekend. I just don't know if you can get their A game. I don't know if they have an A game this year. I think we think they do, but I don't think they do.

You might be right. The front seven on the Rams. I've been on them a lot this year, so I admit I'm going down with them again. Here, getting five and a half, I'm going down with them again. And I like the front seven against Ryan. I just feel like Ryan, I wrote it today, he's looked jittery all year, and I think the Rams can really come after him

and make him make a couple mistakes. Well, I'll tell you what's going to hurt is their left guard being out, and he got that hip, that extended arm injury. He got that flexor muscle hurt, and he went out early in the game. They'll line Donald over him, and that will be a very tough matchup. And if the backup doesn't play well in that matchup, you're right.

They're going to give him a lot of trouble. I think that Atlanta, not once this year, has really shown me where they played to anywhere near what they did last year. And something's been missing all year. I admit that's a risky pick on my part. I've just been on them a lot. I'm sticking with them here. I'm sticking with them, taking the points, but I can understand your Ram pick.

And you're going with Jacksonville? Yeah, but here's the one last thing with the Rams is their kicker stinks. And that could be what covers you. Yeah, so you might get a 10-point swing with that. Yeah, I'm taking Jacksonville. I'm actually surprised anyone's taking Buffalo. If McCoy was healthy, I could maybe talk myself into it being an ugly game

that they keep close, but I don't think Buffalo's offense can do anything in this game. I think Jacksonville's defense is going to outscore their offense. I see something like 20-6, 19-6, something like that. I think this game is where they will coach around their quarterback. I think that they will be scared. Buffalo's defense, if you look on the road, has come up with some surprising performances this year on the road

and has played some really, really good games and has shut down some pretty good teams and surprisingly done a good job. And I agree with you. Everyone's awful, and that's why the line's so high, because of McCoy. I think Jacksonville will play this game ultra-conservative, worried about Bortles.

And if it'll either be, as you said, they'll obliterate him with the pass rush, which Jacksonville's got a great one. They'll obliterate him with the pass rush early, and that's why I think his mobility is enormously important in the game. They'll obliterate him with the pass rush, which Jacksonville's got a great one. They'll obliterate him with the pass rush early, and that's why I think his mobility is enormously important in the game. They'll obliterate him with the pass rush, and that's going to be 30-3.

If not, I think Jacksonville will let this be a very, very conventional, close to the vest, we just want to win this game and get to the next week kind of game. And I think they'll be a little nervous in this kind of game where I think Buffalo's playing with house money.

They didn't think they'd be here. They're here the first year, and I think they'll play fast and loose. And that's why I could see them getting maybe a big play somewhere early. And all of a sudden, now Jacksonville's playing very tight, and it turns out to be a very tight game. I can see that kind of game. Them worried about their quarterback, especially if he makes an early mistake. I think that could be the case.

They try to win it just with the running game. And that's why I'm taking the 8.5. That's for that reason. I think Fournette might have another level on him, too, is another reason I like Jacksonville. I think he can go up a notch. Jacksonville's got everything except the quarterback. The question is, is the quarterback ready to win this kind of game? I'm surprised, though, as the longtime gambler you are, that you're not afraid of the Bills the week after

they basically just won the Super Bowl by making the playoffs. You never want to take the week after the happiest week of their life. This is an anti-Ortles pick. I think sometimes teams that haven't been in the playoffs in a very long time get very tight early on. That's the Rams case. This game means, but their mentality is very different with their coach. Marrone, this game means a lot to him. He has real anger towards Buffalo.

Yeah. And, you know, he really wants to beat them badly and he'll run up the score where anyone would in the playoffs anyway. But so I understand the whole idea of that. But to me, I just thought the line was too high. I just think Jacksonville

laying eight and a half with their offense, boy, that's a lot of points. Especially in a playoff game where I could see teams, I could see that game being 0-0. See, if that game's 0-0

early in the second quarter, I'm going to feel very confident about that game. You should. Very tight to the best game. Yeah. I think once it's 6-0, the game's over for Buffalo. We'll see. I can't wait. If they get them early, if they score early

in the game, I think they're dead. I totally agree. And the Falcon game is, again, you'll know right away, if they are not, if you're not saying, oh man, they're going to have trouble with Julio Jones all day. If they're not saying that oh, man, they're going to have trouble with Julio Jones all day. If they're not saying that right from the get-go, then I'm not going to have a chance in that game.

Yeah. All right. I can't wait to find out what happens. Mike Francesco, a pleasure as always. Thank you. Good to talk to you, Bill. Thanks, Mike. Bye-bye.

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All right, before we go, wanted to call my dad, who's out of his mind with this Patriot story and the Jimmy G thing. And plus there's a blizzard going on. Are you all right? First of all, are you okay? That was my first question.

We're all right. We only had 17 inches of snow yesterday. And the winds were 50 miles an hour. Oh my God. What a terrible day for the story to drop. Terrible day because everybody was home. Nobody had work. The governor and the mayor said stay off the roads.

Everybody was home reading about Tom Brady, Bill Belichick, and Robert Kraft, and Jimmy Garoppolo. I just talked to Mike Francesa about it and we batted around some theories how much of this story did you believe on a scale of 1 to 10? 4 4? Wow that's low lower than I expected what didn't you believe?

well I read it a couple times there's no sources nobody's named you know how I feel about stories where there's no named sources. It's all innuendo, rumor, third-hand information. a little bit, but I will say that you and I talked three years ago when they had Deflategate coming down. It was just about this time of year, maybe a couple weeks later, and we both felt very strongly that Belichick threw Brady under the bus. And then nothing really came of it.

You know, we went on, we won two Super Bowls, and it kind of got lost in the shuffle, but maybe for Brady it didn't get lost in the shuffle. So that's the only thing that kind of gives me some sense of there might be something to the story. I'm not sure I believe the whole thing, though. I will say one other thing, though. It really pisses me off. You know, you go back to the Super Bowl we went to in 08, and we get there, and all of a sudden, the whole week is ruined by Spygate. Three years ago, Super Bowl, the whole thing is overshadowed by De flake gate. And now suddenly we're in the throes of the playoff season and this shit comes to the

surface. I don't know. I feel like Bill Pullian is behind it. He's putting out all this. Bill Pullian is retired. I know. See, this is why I wanted to have you on, because the 70-year-old Boston fan is going to have the most imbalanced take

of basically anyone on this story. I will say, though, and I said this to Francesa earlier, as somebody who's watched this team for two decades pretty closely and read everything and digested everything and consumed everything, I just find it hard to believe that Kraft told Belichick to make a trade and Belichick just did

it. It doesn't jibe with anything we saw this entire century. What was your reaction to that? Well, I agree wholeheartedly. I think if Belichick didn't want to make the trade, he would have done a Parcells. He would have said, I'm not making that trade. If you want to make the trade, he would have done a Parcells. He would have said, I'm not making that trade. If you want to make that trade, then I'm gone. So it flies in the face of the long-term relationship that Kraft and Belichick have had. I find it incomprehensible that Belichick didn't sign off on the trade. That begs the issue, though, of why that trade was ever made. And, you know, it's old history. Everybody's revisiting it now, particularly after the six games that Jimmy G had, or five games, whatever it was.

But, you know, and that's the hot story up here. You turn on talk radio or watch TV, and it's all about what a terrible trade that was, how the Patriots didn't get enough, or even if they had a better offer, they never should have made the trade. We should mention that every time you and I have talked on the phone since that trade, you've brought up the trade. Oh, it's just terrible trade uh yeah you know that every year the patriots sit on this tremendous amount of money at the end of the year you know i don't

know what it is this year of course they don't put it out it's probably 15 million um they have guys that they're not going to resign next year uh they certainly could have franchised grappolo and bought another year to see what was going to happen with Brady. I mean, you and I have talked about how concerned we are with the last six weeks of the season. Ironically, since the trade was made, Brady just hasn't looked good. Maybe he's hurt.

You know, they talk that his Achilles is strained or bruised, but he just doesn't look... He's looked like a 40-year-old quarterback all of a sudden. Now we go into the playoffs, and we have no backup quarterback for the future. So I don't know whether their plan is to use suddenly that second round pick that's like the ninth or tenth pick in the second round. It isn't so valuable anymore. Yeah.

But to pick up a quarterback for the future, but, you know, look how long it took to prepare Garoppolo, and he's a special talent, and you have no guarantee you're going to get the same kind of special talent. The trade just made no sense. You have a 40-year-old quarterback. My theory that I gave to Mike, which I'll rip through because the listeners already heard it, was that it was becoming a problem for Brady that Garoppolo obviously was so good and so talented, but also is much younger and is hanging out in the locker room, is friends with all these guys,

kind of like what Brady was like 15 years ago when he was there. Now Brady's this 40-year-old guy who's much older than everybody else who has his own business. And he's such a famous person and a big celebrity. It doesn't relate to the guys on that same level. And maybe it was becoming a problem for Brady. And the one thing I will say that it jibes with everything we've seen Belichick do over the years is when he senses a problem

that he feels like could derail the season, he moves. You know, like Jamie Collins last year. He didn't like something about how Jamie Collins was going about his business. Even though the trade didn't really make sense, it made sense to him because it removed the problem. And in Belichick's case, maybe he just looked at this and said, this is just going to become a worse and worse problem, and there's no resolution, and we're probably going to have to lose Garoppolo anyway because Brady's not going anywhere, and the Crafts don't want Brady to go anywhere, so I don't have any outs.

And then he of the franchise. He wasn't worried about what would the franchise look three to seven years from now. He was looking for this year and next year. Hold on. Are you sitting down? Because I'm going to tell you something I don't want you to pass out. Okay.

What if it's a one or two year window for him to be the coach of the Patriots? That's what I'm just saying. No, you said retired. Oh, either one. I'll say either one.

Wait a second. It's much better for us if he retires than if he leaves and goes to another team, that'd be terrible. I don't want Belichick to go to another team. I love Belichick. I can't see it happening, but,

uh, you know, he, he's you know, he's had a obviously Hall of Fame career. It sets all kinds of records. I can't see him going anywhere else. I don't buy it. The parallels, Mike and I talked about this before, of what we saw with Bird and Parrish and McHale 25 years ago about feeling indebted to these guys that were legends and not wanting to move on. And then the flip side of it, what Danny Ainge did with Isaiah Thomas where he just shanked him because he had a chance to get Kyrie Irving. You and I, we've always felt like if I had to do it over again, I'm glad they handled Bird, Parrish, and McHale that way.

I would not have wanted them to do it over again, I'm glad they handled Bird Parish and McHale that way. I would not have wanted them to do the cutthroat, well now it's time for us to move on and keep the franchise going thing. Even though the next 10 years were miserable, I still feel like that was the right way to play it. And I feel like it's the right way to play with Brady. The guy won five Super Bowls and he

should be able to call his shots on winning leaves. That's what I think. Yeah, and I don't disagree with any of that. It's why I still would have franchised Jimmy G, though. But what if Jimmy G wanted to play? What if he was in that Aaron Rodgers mode that he was in?

Who cares what he wanted? You have the right to franchise the guy. Almost every player gets franchised is unhappy about it. Even if you franchise him and then move him, his trade value is different. You know, and we talk all the time about, I don't want to see Brady go anywhere, but he's 40 years old. Do we really think

he's going to play until he's 45? He does. He does. He does. But I just can't see it happening. The first telltale sign is the Achilles. He's got a bad left shoulder. The team around him. This is great. I love all of this. We have the story that distracts everybody.

Everybody's counting out the pats. This is great. This is, we have the story that distracts everybody. We have Brady. Everybody's counting out the pats. This is great. This is who we are. We're back. Well, this is, yes, this is who we are. And then Spygate, Deflategate. Yeah.

Pour it on. And the timing of it is so, again, I just think Bill Pauly implanted the story. Bill Pauly. I'm holding to that story. He's like a nursing home. He's listening to this with his roommate right now in Winding Hills. It just pisses me off. Can't we just enjoy football? I mean, do we have to have this story written

by a guy no one ever heard of? Is he an ESPN employee? No, he's a legit writer. He's good for them. Seth Wickersham. He's a good writer. Okay. Yeah.

Does he not have any sources? Well, maybe. Could he have listed one source in that story? Should we be worried that maybe his main source was one of the crafts, like the sun? Because that was my inclination after I read it three times. Jonathan Craft was not in that story. Well, Jonathan Craft is never in a story. I mean, it's always Robert. Um, all right. Again, uh, if there's a four or even a five level of truth to some discontent or discord,

I just can't see that trade being made without Belichick signing off. I agree. And if, if, if Belichick did not want that trade happening, I think he would have given an ultimatum to the crafts. Or, you know, or if he thinks he's leaving after the year and he doesn't give a shit, which is even more worrisome than the other scenarios. And we've been there. Weren't we there once before with Bill Parcells? Yeah, it sucked. It was terrible. It sucked and it probably caused us

that Super Bowl. Yeah, we would have won the next year. I still feel like that we would have won in 97. That was the best Pats team. Wow, this is really depressing. I'm going to rally back, though. It's the story up here. And of course it is. Yeah.

People, one of the radio stations was saying Lombardi was the leak. Lombardi was more stubborn when they traded Jimmy Garoppolo than anybody. He talked about it. He did GM Street with Tate today and they talked about it. Yeah, I've read his stuff. He's against the trade. He was flabbergasted when they did it. He thought

Jimmy was going to be, he thought Bill had this succession plan that it was basically going to be 35 years of good quarterbacks. Well, I go back to Bill has a short-term plan in terms of his future in coaching. I can't see him coaching anywhere else, which means I probably see him in one or two years, probably two years, retiring.

You guys can be in Nantucket together. The future of the Patriots is not his problem. You guys can be at the Chatham Bar and Grill, whatever that place is. You and Belichick talking about you can have a couple of apple martinis. His house is in Nantucket, not Chatham. Oh. Yeah. Listen, this is who the Patriots are.

We have distractions. We have a round one bye. And we have Brady and Belichick. We've been in this scenario every winter. And this is it. They know how to deal with it. I think it's a pretty good Pats team. The defense isn't good, but Deion Lewis has been great.

Gronk is going to be awesome. And they're going to have a really easy round two game against somebody. Well, we did get good news today. It will motivate Gronk. He was be awesome, and they're going to have a really easy round two game against somebody. Well, we did get good news today. It will motivate Gronk. He was named first team All-Pro, which means that his $2 million or $2.5 million bonus gets into effect. Oh, that's good. He'll be a happy camper. Good.

I hope he doesn't spend it. Quickly, the Celts were at the halfway mark. I think they have the most wins in the league. They got killed by the schedule in December. Yeah, Golden State won last night. Both teams have 31 wins. Yeah. Tatum's starting to blossom a little bit.

No, he's not starting to blossom. He's really blossomed. He's been terrific since day one. No, I know that, but I'm saying he's starting to... We were worried. We didn't understand why he didn't get more shots, and now it seems like they're starting to work him into it more. Yeah, well, it's kind of what happened to Jalen Brown last year as well. We were criticizing Brown last year because he seemed to be standing in the corner waiting for the ball, and very seldom

went to the hoop. And Tatum did that a little bit, just settling for the three-point shot, which fortunately he was making. Now he's going to the basket. And he's got that Euro move. Yeah. He's got a terrific move to the basket. And you and I have talked about this, and we don't want to overdo it,

but he's got Julius Irving two steps from the foul line to the basket move. The sweep move to going left, which going left with his right hand, which nobody does. Nobody does, and he actually goes either way. He's a lot of fun to watch. He seems like a great teammate. There was a little story about Jalen Brown talking about, I think it was yesterday, that he had been called before they drafted Tatum by Stevens or A AAU ball together. And he said glowing things about Tatum is because it looked like they might be vying for the same position. Right. So obviously they're not.

They're out there together in Stevens' kind of positionless kind of offense. And they're thriving. They play great together. And there's such great chemistry. You see it when you look at the bench and in the huddle. Listen, it's all been great. The Kyrie trade was awesome. The Tatum trade worked.

It's going to definitely be a contender. I don't think they can win the title. Super fun season. We need one more part. But the real story, the real story, the real thing that's going on right now is the Lakers pick. We're obsessed with this. Well, I did happen to look this morning, and the worst team in the league has 10 wins,

and the Lakers have 11 wins. Yeah. So I'd like the season to stop right now. No, not right now, but right now we would get the second pick and it's only first pick lottery protected so

I like I like where we're standing and by the way I did watch the tape of that Trey point guard that you talked about

yeah we don't really need a point guard but boy is he good he's incredible yeah the Lakers pick if the season ended today it would be an 80% chance

the Celtics would get it but that could flip overnight there's the fear with the Lakers is they have no reason to tank and they should try to keep

winning these games and try to get to like the 6 or 7 or 8 spot there's other teams that Orlando Memphis Atlanta couple others that at, at some point

their incentive is going to be to lose and try to get as low as they possibly can. I don't think the Lakers have that incentive. Well, I have a different theory. Their incentive is to create enough cap room so they can sign two max free agents over the summer. I'm hoping that in order to do that, that they have to make a trade where they have to combine Dang with Clarkson

or Randall or Paul. That's not going to be enough for Dang. To get rid of Dang, they'd have to get rid of Kuzma or Ingram. I don't know if they would do that. I don't think they would. I don't know. I think you throw in Randall and Clarkson. I think they're... I don't know. I think you throw in Randall and Clarkson.

I think they're both rotation players. The poo-poo platter. Yeah, I like it. Somebody might be interested. Throw in some spare ribs. Dag makes like $35 million the two years after this year. I just don't think teams are going to want to... What I love is that every year for the past four years,

you and I have had somebody else's draft pick to be excited about. And it's actually as much fun as having the Celtics. And the Lakers is even better because I hate the Lakers. So watching them, like when they lost that double overtime game to the Rockets, it was New Year's Eve, and I'm supposed to go out with my family for dinner and I'm holding them off for this stupid Lakers game making sure they're going to lose I was just going to say

we have a three hour time difference obviously I'm up at 1230 at night watching the Lakers hoping they're going to lose on NBA TV I mean how crazy is that it's the best we have 40 more games of it yeah too old to be doing this stuff. And it really does seem like they have some real issues

in that the LeBron shadow has kind of ruined the team and guys are playing for themselves. You have Caldwell Pope's going to be a free agent and Randall. Right. You know, Clarkson knows he's going to get traded. Everybody thinks they're off the team next year if LeBron comes. Yeah, I think there are reasons. And you had that article yesterday that all the quotes from Kuzma

about all the things you just mentioned. And, you know, he's a rookie. He's a rookie who probably shouldn't even be quoted right now. I know. He's the one out there being quoted. So I love it. It's funny. He's the one out there being quoted. So it's, I love it. It's funny. That guy turned out to be the gem of,

they had all these top five lottery picks and he turned out to be the best one. They got him 27th. He's really good. And he likes the white shadow. So I love that guy. I have just one wish. I wish Mr. Ball would be a little more vocal about,

maybe when his son comes back and the team keeps losing, he can throw kerosene on the fire and make it even worse. Yeah, I've been avoiding having him on my podcast, but I might have to do it just to see if I can stoke some volcanoes. Oh, I think you should because it could get some good quotes that irritates all the other Laker players here. All right, Dad, Please don't shovel.

Pay somebody to do the shoveling. I'll give you the money. We did pay somebody. And fortunately, the 18 inches is gone. Good. I'm glad to hear that. Try to weather the storm. I'll talk to you this weekend.

Talk to you. OK. Take care. Bye. Thanks again to ZipRecruiter. Don't forget, they are the smartest way to hire. My listeners can try ZipRecruiter for free at ZipRecruiter.com. Thanks to Gillette.

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the Playoff Gambling Manifesto 5.0. I spent a lot of time on it. Read it. Enjoy the weekend. Talk to you soon. On the wayside Never I don't have A few years With him On the wayside

On the wayside Never I don't have A few years