The Bill Simmons Podcast - Sarah Silverman on "Funny" in 2019, Cancel Culture, 'Big Mouth,' Death Threats, the 2020 Election and 'Big Little Lies'

Episode Date: August 9, 2019

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by comedian Sarah Silverman to discuss working on 'Saturday Night Live,' internet outrage, stand-up comedy, acting, pickup basketball games, summer TV, legal weed, the Roast of Hugh Hefner, and more! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Make better choices. Choose Yahoo Fantasy Football. Pearl Jam. So I've had a podcast since 2007. Really? And I've known you since 2002. Right. And we've never done a podcast, which I saw you in Las Vegas this summer. And you mentioned that to me.

And I said, I've never asked you to come on because it seems like everyone wants you to come on a podcast. And I would imagine you know every comedian. And they're probably like, we come on a podcast. And I just didn't want to put you in the position. That's why I never asked you. That is cool. But now you're here. Because I got a feeling you were like, I'm kind of mad I haven't been on your podcast. I got a slight never asked you. That is cool. But now you're here. Cause I got feeling you were like, I'm kind of mad.

I haven't been on your podcast. I got a slight vibe from you. That was a feeling that you manifested. I made it up. No, well, you did a very clever thing and go, oh, you don't do podcasts? I go, no, I do. I'm just on a mandatory hiatus from them. Cause I keep getting in trouble.

And then, and then you go, I wasn't asking you on my podcast. They go, oh, I didn't think that you were. And then you were like, why would you do it? This isn't what happened. This is your version of this. Okay. What's your version? I felt hurt in your eyes that I'd never asked you.

That's what I saw. I saw in your pupils deep down, you were like, why hasn't he asked me? What's wrong with me? Why couldn't we have done this? It's such a great way to live life, Bill. That was what happened? That's what I told myself after. I think that's really healthy, actually.

Like, it's really, that's a good way to like see is that, oh God, everyone wants to do my podcast. And you need to have that attitude because honestly, I don't have a podcast because I would rather die than ask people to be on my podcast. Just the shame of soliciting guests. I hate putting people in that position. I hate being put in that position. I hate those emails. I, I, it's, I, I can't, you know, even I wrote a book years ago and I, they were so mad at me because I would not ask anyone for blurbs. Oh, really? So, yeah.

I get that. I made, I made up fake blurbs. You did? Yeah. That book did well. People liked that book. Yeah. Considering like Hudson News won considering like it was like nine years ago won't carry it or anything is that true i've never seen it at an airport all right so now you're here we've known each other i was debating whether it worked for for jimmy and i met you when i was here

i flew with my wife out here he did he flew me and my wife to LA to see it. To woo you. To see LA. And it worked. I was thinking about that as I was getting ready today. Yeah, it was 80 degrees both days. And I was like, wow, it'd be great to live here. And that was it.

He's like, I'm going to get the sports guy from Boston. Yeah. He picked me up in a Wagoneer. He had this Wagoneer. And that was it. So I've known you since. But then it's been a pleasure to watch your career and all the good things that have happened. Thanks.

I like it. You were doing well when I met you. I knew you had done some stuff. You were well-known. Yeah. But then after we met, things started happening and things kept happening. And now we're at the end of the second decade here. It's all because we met, things started happening and things kept happening. And now we're at the end of the second decade here. It's all because we met.

Do you think that was it? No, I'm not taking credit for that one. You think that's a coincidence that I met you and then my career skyrocketed slowly over time? I think it was a coincidence. I think it was a coincidence. I remember seeing you. I used to love SNL. I still, I don't love it as much as I did, but I used to love it.

And then you popped up one day and you were young and you were female. And it was like, who's this? How did, this isn't the normal type of person who's on SNL. You did like a weekend update. It was like a wedding or a bar mitzvah or it was some story, right? Oh yeah. It was like the news of the week, but it was like my news of the week. And then, you know, my sister got married and they're hyphenating it.

Susan Silverman Abramowitz. We're going to shorten it to just Jews. That was when they used Weekend Update to kind of sneak people in and kind of test them out. Because they didn't want to put them in sketches for some reason. But you were writing too. Yeah. I was a writing too. Yeah. I was a writer slash feature performer. And I lasted a whole season.

They must regret that though. No. I think that they did the right thing. Really? Why? I mean, I don't know. I saved the sketches that I wrote and they're terrible. Did you think they were good when you were handing them in?

Yes, of course. Or was it like a rational confidence? Well, yeah, I thought that they were good. Did you like the whole vibe? It was so earnest. Earnest? Yeah. Did you like the whole vibe of everybody crammed into all these different offices?

Yeah. I mean, it was so scary but it was um it was really cool you know i've always like in high school and this and you know like i always kind of stay at the periphery where it's like no one has a problem with me and i get along with everybody. I don't want any trouble. Right. But you get along with guys. You've been able to work your way. I get along with guys. I get along with girls. No, but you've been able to work your way into that whole, like, the guys being guys

scene. You've been able to fit in with that and bust balls in a unique way, I feel like. I've seen it. Yeah, but that's just me. That's also how a woman can be. I'm with you. I'm female. And it's just,

I wasn't doing something special to fit in with guys. I didn't say it was special. But it's, it sounds like it's some accomplishment to be able to fit in with guys. I think it was in the mid-90s for SNL. Wasn't it like a big boys culture then? Yeah, because it was, the world

is men. The world is white men. So it's like, you know, I see any woman doesn't just see the world through the lens of a woman. She sees the world through the lens of a man, because that's the

world we have to live in. Less and less so, you know, in a nice way. But the show changed the next decade. The next year it started to, you know, once they hired, you know, Tina Fey and Molly Shannon and Sherry O'Terry. I mean, remember watching that first episode and just going like, oh my God, these are stars.

I remember the Will Ferrell episode was like immediately like, who's that guy? That guy's going to be famous. He was doing Get Off the Shed, all that stuff. Yeah, it flipped. I remember, I don't remember if it was the season you were there, you were there maybe the season before, but New York Magazine had that big piece. Well, every other year it's Saturday Night Dead. Saturday Night Dead.

But it was a big part of that piece was like the boys culture and the kind of the bro stuff and the show's heading down this path where it's not a sketch comedy show anymore. It's like a lot of these, you know, monologues or like big people trying to play these recurring characters, all that stuff. And then when the Will Ferrell season happened, all of a sudden it was like, oh, it's a sketch comedy again. And real actors. Yeah, it was very personality driven for a while and everything. It was. But that's why Saturday Night Live is still so relevant. It's constantly changing with the times.

It's constantly like a reflection of where we're at, you know? Yeah. It's been interesting to see how it tries to reflect the times now in the in the late 2010s because you know they finally had to start changing the cast and making the cast way more diverse which yeah they had a lot of trouble with for a long time there but pop culture has become so much more diverse to not have a cast that reflects that i think it took them a while yeah well you have to like art has to reflect life but sometimes like art has to show life what it can be yeah you know i mean god i hate to use bill cosby as an example but like the cosby show was like um hugely that you know like just seeing this you know i love that show yeah i mean it was so huge for like us this girl in

new hampshire you know it was like how do you feel about canceled culture where we have these things from the past and then we're not allowed to kind of enjoy them anymore um you know i think it's really scary and it's it's like a it's a very odd thing that's invaded the left primarily and then the right will mimic it and in it you know kind of like oh this isn't okay then we're gonna say we're

offended by this but yeah I see it on the left like this cancel culture that I call it righteousness porn. Yeah. You know, where it's like, if you're not on board, if you say the wrong thing, if you had a tweet once, if you would ever, you know, everyone is like throwing the first stone, you know, whatever. You know, it's so odd. And it's really, it's a per. And it's, it's really,

it's a perversion. I see it as a perversion, really. You know what I mean? It's, it's really, you know, it's, um, look how righteous I am. And now I'm going to press refresh all day long to see how many likes I get in my righteousness. And the thing that breaks my heart is, ideally, and I keep myself, I try to, you know, listen, I'm not saying that I'm immune to that. Yeah. I don't like liars, but I do have compassion for, like, the lied twos. Yeah. like on my old show, I had Christian Picciolini, who's, um, was a, a Nazi and a skinhead bashed fucking people's brains in for being black or Jewish or whatever. Like he found a home, he found love in this hate group, which is why people join hate groups. And he's changed in the,

you know, the past 30 years, he's been working getting people out of hate groups. But someone had to see the possibility of change in him. You know, he said, I asked for advice. He said, find someone who does not deserve your compassion and give it to them anyway, because that's what happened to me. So all the time, I think, is this a before Christian? Oh, you know, like, is this just a Christian Picciolini in the making? You know, and not to have some, but I just feel like as I draw lines in the sand,

and I wish for other people on the left to do this too, you have to ask yourself, would I want this person to be changed? Or do I secretly want them to stay what i deem as wrong so i can point to them as fucked up in myself as right you know yeah you're talking about performance art that's what the the outrage culture where you just discussed where it's like it becomes a performance to some degree to be outraged by whatever you're being outraged by. And then the next day you move on to the next thing. There's so much to genuinely be outraged by, but you have to say like, is the action I'm taking here creating change or creating further division? I don't know.

But it's like case by case. Some people just need to be called fucking. What do you think of the culture of the people going backwards it happens with comedians it happens with writers like i don't know this person they did this bit in 2001 and then it all of a sudden becomes a story or they wrote this piece in 2004 i mean while i was like 15 years ago why are we going backwards that's's terrifying. I mean, look, I had this last show, I Love You America. I did a whole episode about it.

But like on my show, the Sarah Silverman program, which I loved, there's so much problematic from that show. I mean, it's brutal. And then there's a whole episode where I'm in blackface. We shot it in South Central.

It's an episode about race played by a character, my character, which is like an ignorant, arrogant, you know, woman trapped in a, what I wouldn't know how to call it then, but a liberal bubble, you know? Just like, I believe there's racism. I'm going to show that there's racism, you know, or like that. This episode was Alex Desair and I swap. So he's Jewish and I'm black for the day. And I'm and we're both the most racist version of that. Anyway. If that came up, say, but yeah, but that's like Tropic Thunder. Same thing where it was.

The joke was the Robert Downey Jr. Character was trying to win the Oscar. But now I'm not sure that movie comes out in 2018 yeah i think somebody jumps in front of it line or whatever a bunch of stuff a lot of those comedies that you have to it's okay to go wow look at this back then that was so fucked up looking at in the light of today of what we know but to hold that person accountable if they've changed with the times like for me i'm not saying like don't hold me accountable i hold i held myself accountable i can't make that i can't erase that i did that yeah but i can only

be changed forever and do what i can to make it right forever for the rest of my life, you know, but to be, to not acknowledge that comedy is evergreen. And I mean, I've always said that, like, if I look back on my old stuff and don't cringe, there's something wrong, you know, because if you're putting yourself out there, it's, it's not going to be timeless. It's just not, I mean, so. I always feel like it reflects whatever was going on at the time so i feel like you know obviously i've written a shitload of columns and i would take back a bunch of jokes a bunch of things i did a bunch of ideas just in general just like oh man i wish i had you know same way you would with the with with some of the comedy you've done we were like god, that joke.

Oh, my God. I couldn't have such a better joke there. That doesn't hold up. But that's the thing. That's part of what is growing as like an artist or whoever where it's like, yeah, all right, I wouldn't do that now. But back then, that joke seemed like it was super funny and it reflects more what was happening in whatever year you're in. And also there was just so much I didn't know.

Right. I knew there was racism. I knew that there was. I wanted to illuminate that in some way in comedy, but I didn't know. I didn't know that cops were killing black people, unarmed black teenagers, like on the regular. Yeah. And that changed me forever you know i mean let's just whatever it's you know i recently was gonna do a movie two days on a movie a really

sweet part in a cool little movie and then at 11 p.m. the night before, they fired me because they saw a picture of me in blackface from that episode. Really? And, you know, I was just, you know, I didn't fight it. I said, you know, hey, I actually addressed this last year in an episode of my show and um it wasn't because anyone saw it i exposed myself you know but listen i'm not that person anymore but i was doing it you know i didn't go to a a fucking halloween party in the 80s in blackface i was doing an episode about race yeah you know now i understand it's never okay and blah blah blah you know not to blah blah blah it but you know but it's just

you know so they hired someone else who's wonderful but who's never stuck her neck out you know what i mean like it's just very it it was so disheartening it was just um just made me real real real sad because sad because, you know, I've really kind of devoted my life to, to making it right. You know? Well, you also, especially the first, like, I don't know, 10, 12 years of your career, like part of your comedy was going toward the third rail. Yeah. And I was like, what, what makes people uncomfortable? That's where I want to go. Well, I, yeah, I always, you know, I, well, the first whole part of my standup through Jesus is Magic and like kind of into the Sarasota program was, I said the opposite of what I

really felt, you know, and the hope is that the absolute power transcends if you're a math nerd. But like, you know, so, so you know that was like i was in character you know i i'm i'm gonna get fucking killed like it i in in jesus's magic i say some line and the far right has made a meme of it as if i said it in a press conference which is right uh i'm glad the Jews killed Jesus. I'd do it again. You know, something like that.

And they wrote it as if I said it in a political speech. And then people really, you know, whatever. It fucking sucks, you know, but it's not like I can stop. But I think comedy is in a dangerous place right now. Yeah, it's in a real danger. There's a pastor online in Florida who said anyone who kills Sarah Silverman is doing God's work and that he hopes that someone knocks my teeth out and kills me. And if they do, it will be God's work. Jesus.

When was that? Like a year ago. Oh, my God. Yeah. Steadfast church in Florida. You know, it's just like that's telling people to fucking murder me. Right. From that meme. Like he quoted that meme that was me in character in his comedy special.

It's like this manipulation of what can be true. It's funny. So comedy as it unfolded, 70s, 80s, 90s, there's a bunch of different ways to do it. And one of the ways was something you love to do which was make people uncomfortable push the envelope do that material people like whoa i can't believe she's going there but then you pull it off and that's the stuff that i'm not sure we're gonna see as much of anymore unless it's somebody like i saw the two charpel specials where he just says give a fuck and he's like i don't care if you get mad at this here's my comedy but i do think it

will go back it will put this will create that again well think about what we always heard about the 60s with lanny bruce and all those people who then became idolized decades later it's like those guys he had the seven dirty words they were taking them in handcuffs off the stage and he was and now it's you know I just think comedy is important. And once we start litigating it and you have a jury for every joke and every routine versus like allowing people to push the line. And if they cross the line a little bit, you know, it's okay. Doesn't mean that they should be vilified. Cause how do you know where the lines are? You do comedy. I remember when you were dating Jimmy,

we would just be hanging out at his house and you'd be like, all right, I'll be back in a little bit. And I'm like, where's she going? She's going to do like 10 minutes at the comedy store. Then you would just come back and you're just like, you would have been hanging out. And then all of a sudden it's like, yeah, I'm going to go do my job for 10 minutes. And you would just come back. And you would have been hanging out. And then all of a sudden it's like, yeah, I'm going to go do my job for 10 minutes. And you would go work out whatever routine you had in your head. Then you would just be back like 45 minutes later. If people aren't allowed to work

out material and find out where those lines are, then I really wonder what's going to happen to comedy. That's why I stopped going to the Laugh Factory because every time a comic got in trouble because like they're working out material and they say something fucked up or whatever and someone records it yeah it's always there and then the owners on the news like talking about it it's like why don't you just take people's phones or make a

rule you know what i mean It's not very protective. Nobody should have a phone in a comic book. I didn't find it was protective of comedians. At the Comedy Cellar in New York, I was so impressed by this. They have a three drink maximum. Yeah.

They'd be bad for Kyle. They could make so much more money if they don't have a three drink maximum but they care about the comics well are you conscious of that now when you're working out stuff of somebody recording it um I don't like when I see it you know it's just so annoying because I just what are you gonna watch your shitty grainy yeah recording of this like it's like people who take pictures of of fireworks like you look at this later and remember this day why don't you just google images it the whole thing

is like having the experience right taking pictures of fireworks fucking Fucking idiot. Like there's nothing dumber to me. How many years have you been doing comedy now? Like talking like since you were like a teenager? I started when I was 17. So when do you get tired of that 10 minutes

of going out there with a routine that's like It's usually about 20 minutes now. Or 20 minutes, whatever. In town, yeah. 20 minutes. But when do you get tired of

that kind of pit in your stomach or whatever feeling you have when you go out there and you're like I'm gonna test stuff with these complete strangers

like how many I did it last night I'm always I was so it's just in you for the rest of your life yeah unless I don't want to

anymore is it like playing basketball where you need to do it you don't feel right unless you're doing it that's exactly right. Yeah. My two favorite things.

Yeah, you're still playing. Yeah, I play on Sundays and Thursdays when I can. Full court? Yeah, full court. Sweating around? Is your game, what have you added? I would say I'm the worst, but I definitely don't. What have you added to your game?

What do you mean? As people get older, they add things to their basketball game. You added like, yeah, a corner three. I do. You know, look, when I was playing Sunday, I go, because the past couple of years, I've really been focusing on my inside game. But I think it's just because it's terrifying to me. Yeah. terrifying to me yeah you know but you've got to always be going down the you know picking the lane and like going down inside if someone has the ball outside and it's the right thing to do and be ready

to creating space yeah and um i really you know i i get scared doing it uh sometimes because sometimes the guys they throw the pass like a bullet, you know, because it's like not their problem to get it and put it in the basket. They're just like, boom. And it's scary, but, you know, I'm obviously not that scared. But listen, Bill, my face is my fortune. Yeah, protect your face. And my inside game is just like, is it worth it? I don't know.

But sometimes I think just because with all the news and everything, I need to sweat and I need like full body contact like i i think there's like something about mild injuries that just feels like just feels something i feel something you know like the move when you get older with pickup basketball is just don't get outside shot don't get elbowed don't get elbowed in your face that's like the number one goal don't get elbowed. Don't get elbowed in your face. That's like the number one goal. Don't get hit. Don't get tripped. And the worst is my eyesight deteriorated so badly. You need LASIK.

I'm not a candidate for it. You have bad eyesight? Yeah, I can't see. Oh, I can't either. I'm not a candidate either. You look so handsome right now. All I see is your silver hair and your blue eyes and some stubble. Thank you. I have the same thing.

I'm not a candidate. I have like minus 10 contacts. You know when I'll have perfect vision? When I have cataracts. Because it's like my dad had cataract surgery and now he doesn't need glasses for the first time ever. Like he just has perfect vision. Can we go back to the comedy thing for a second? All right.

So you're preparing this material how has your process changed now that we're we're so electronically trapped to our phones and our computers and all that stuff are you still like grabbing a notebook and going to no everything's in my phone most yeah every all my notes you type the stuff on the phone well no i have i'll show you i've like i got, I just keep notes of all kinds. Every, I think everybody does. Oh yeah. I do that too. But in the, in 25 years ago.

700 of these. And then. So she just showed me a note thing. Right. And then I, when I go on stage, I have like. Oh, you have a little like beautiful mind card with all these different things. Jesus. Russell Crowe. I just have like this, you know, right now beautiful mind card with all these different things. Jesus. Russell Crowe.

I just have like this, you know, right now I'm living off of these. Who, when you were like, when you wanted to do this, who were the influences? Because you're in New Hampshire, which isn't exactly like the comedy Mecca. Well, my mom had like a Woody Allen double album uh where he's just like in a it sounds like he's in a small bar you know it doesn't seem you know there's an intimacy you hear you hear the drinks clinking and you know i don't know i we listened to that a lot i was worshiped steve martin and i had all his albums i loved you know i was grew up in the 80s i loved robin williams like i had a tape of robin williams at the met you know

um so did you did you take different things from different people because that's like what i did as a writer i had like seven writers i like and you grab like one piece from each person? I don't know who I was like. I loved Joan Rivers, but I mean, I wouldn't say I was like her. And I loved Albert Brooks, like his films, his short films and stuff. Letterman? Oh, every night. I mean, I was in love with him. Yeah.

Me too. I don't want to take over Jimmy's love of him is the thing. No, Jimmy's, he I was in love with him. Yeah. Me too. I don't want to take over Jimmy's love of him is the thing. No, Jimmy's still in love. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yeah, that was our age group. I mean, he was just like everything. Yeah.

You know, the Alka-Seltzer tank, the Velcro suit. Yeah, it was a thing. It was also like there were less channels and then four yeah and then i had cable so i probably had 20 channel 38 channel 56 oh yeah yeah you had like nine local channels and uh durham channel 11 yeah so that didn't you grow up in boston i did yeah yeah we, it was 27, 37, 38, 56. Yeah. Yeah. We were probably watching the

same shows because 56 had the Brady Bunch Partridge family. Remember? Just like when you know someone's from Boston. Years ago when we're all like trying to like come out here for pilot season and you know like

and uh and you know mark maron will be the first one to tell you he was like riddled with jealousy you know he was that guy you know and uh i didn't do a lot of things just to be a dick but i remember talking to him and going like can you believe believe who Dana Hersey got a pilot for NBC? Whatever. I just knew because that name from the movie. Oh, you knew, you knew he would get that.

Yeah. And he was like, what? Let's talk about luminary. The new podcast subscription service with some of the best content around. I'm excited because you can listen to the rewatchables 1999 there. We are in a hiatus right now. We did 10, got some more coming in the fall, but right now we have our new podcast, Break Stuff, the story of Woodstock 1999. It's a podcast you will not want to miss if you like

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Luminary.link slash Simmons. Cancel anytime terms do apply. So when did you move out here? 95. After SNL? Yeah. For Sanders? For, I came out here to first to do comic strip live.

Like it was a standup show on Fox. And evening at the improv. And I ended up going to a party for John Stewart's MTV talk show. Yeah. Leather jacket, John Stewart. Yes. Yes.

And I met this fucking cool girl. It was like smoking cigarettes and had like a cool hat. And she was just like, I don't know. I immediately was like, well, who's this girl? And she was like,

Hey, my roommate's moving out. If you want her room. And immediately was like, whoa, who's this girl? And she was like, hey, my roommate's moving out if you want her room. And I was like, okay. I went back to New York, got my stuff and moved in with Tracy. Yeah, Tracy Katsky. What part of Hollywood was it? West Hollywood. Oh.

On Palm, between Palm and Larrabee. So then you started hitting the comedy clips. Well, I was living in New York City. Yeah, but I mean, in LA, you start doing the scene. Yeah. And like the alt, you know, that was when Largo, you know, started and Uncabaret, which I was like peripheral in only.

And the improv and The Laugh Factory. That was when I wrote my book. You know, I would, Dave Rath lived up the hill from the Laugh Factory. And I said, you know, come down. I'm going to be at the Laugh Factory. We're good friends. And he had a goatee and he came down

and he gave me a kiss on the lips like, hi. His goatee was, I was just like, were you just going down on somebody he goes yeah like he thought he was like i was magic that i would know i go wash your face oh my god literally his goatee put a goatee of vagina on my face and then you hired him as your manager no he never was my manager he never was no he did Oh, he never was? No. He did.

We worked together at Jimmy Show, me and Dave Rath. I never knew that story. Oh, really? I probably would have looked at him differently. It's a chapter, not that you would, I mean, but in my book, it's a chapter called Pussyface. I read that. And ever since, his nephews call him Uncle Pussyface. I read that book nine years ago, and I think I blocked that part out of my mind. Yeah, no, me too.

I didn't want to look at Dave Rath that way. Because I mean, it's a very prominent facial hair thing. I don't know if he still has it. So following from afar, because I'm living in Boston, you were on SNL and then you weren't on SNL. Right. I was like, there's no internet at that point. You might as well have been like kidnapped by aliens. I didn't know what happened.

And then you popped on Sanders, my favorite show. Yeah. And I was like, Hey, Sanders. And then you did how many, you were, you popped on like what? Five, six times? No, three episodes. One full episode that revolved around you. You were only on two other times?

One, like a story. One was like a B story. And one was like, I was just kind of in the writer's room. And then you became friends with them. No, no. I became friends with them before that. Dave Rath, the glue of all things. Pussyface.

Pussyface brought me to the basketball game in 95 at Gary's. And I played every Sunday until- Were you like the first woman ever to cross the cross the line? You were like the Jackie Robinson of that game? Yeah, maybe. But then I played every Sunday depending on various boyfriends I had

or whatever like at the time but pretty much for the next 21 years. Was he a mentor? Massively. Yeah. Oh, my God. We all miss him so much.

He was just the most generous. He'd read your script. He gave you advice. He wanted us to learn from what he had to learn the hard way. He like served to us on a silver platter. I spent, I went to a boxing match with him and I spent a whole night with him with Pete Berg and a couple other people. And I never really hung out with him.

And he, he's just like, I've never, just never met anybody like that guy. Cause he was like immediately a life talk. Yeah. You know, you met him five minutes ago and then he would just kind of fixate on you. And then just, he was just really curious. Yeah. It was like, you're doing a podcast, but nobody was taping it. And then it would just go for hours and he and then he was so

um i i don't know like his confidence level was not nearly as high as i would have thought it would have been for somebody who had created like the greatest comedy probably in cable history um but it was like do you think i should do that like you know just it was exactly kind of what i imagined in my head he would be like, but he was actually like that. Yeah. So he was good. That show, it's funny.

People say Sopranos was the show that kind of got HBO going, but I always felt like it was Sanders. Of course. And then Sex and the City comes, then Oz, then the Sopranos is kind of the culmination. Well, the West Wing, didn't Aaron Sorkin said he got the long hallway shots for the West Wing? He stole from Larry Sanders. Didn't he says that?

Yeah. I'm not surprised. So what happened late 90s? You're just doing comedy, trying to break into movies? I don't think I know this story. I never had a plan. I never thought that way. I never go like, I'm going to try to do? I never had a plan. Never had a, I never thought that way. I never go like, I'm going to try to do this.

I know I feel weird saying that because I feel like people are so goal oriented, but I've never been goal oriented. Just kind of work on stuff or. What do you remember from the first year of Jimmy's show? It was so exciting. I don't know. Let's see. It was, well, he had the bar, you know. That didn't last long.

It's funny. Like all the things, all the ways you want to break convention, he had to learn, you know, bit by bit that there's a reason for those conventions. Yeah. You know. That was kind of the legacy of that first season. I'm not going to wear a tie, and people are going to drink, and I'm not going to do a monologue, and I'm going to be behind the desk or whatever. And all those things perfectly make total sense. But for some reason, there is a reason for those conventions, you know?

I mean, Seth Meyers, it works behind a desk because the audience already knows him but remember he being behind a desk he that was the big tweak right but it's because they already knew him from behind a desk so to see his legs like seeing kermit's legs yeah but um but and to that effect like if he's if jimmy stuck with those things they would probably become convention you know what i mean but there's like the panic of probably executives saying like it's not working the numbers and the truth is like talk shows need and you know it was so great because it was lloyd braun yeah who when he hired hired him, first of all, he had the vision of seeing this in Jimmy. And he also said, you're going to suck the first year, which he didn't. But you know what I mean? Like he said, I'm making a commitment for three years

because that's how long it takes. You need those ad bats. And there are very few executives who understand that. I feel like I can't stand the sound of my voice, right? How does a woman talk like this? Hi, this is my voice. Now you sound like Theranos lady. Hi. Hi. We have a way to make blood.

Look at the documentary. Yeah. It's such a fascinating story but i was like this documentary should be better why are they using like old timey footage what is this the fucking brian benben show it seemed pretty stiff you know you're talking about jimmy show i remember they had a focus we had a focus group really and it was it was like, here are our results. We're going to come in and explain two results. And we were all in the room. And everything they mentioned was like a thing that made the show different.

They were like, so we got to get rid of that. The focus groups, they don't like the co-host. They don't understand. Oh, God. Why there's a co-host. The weekly co-host. They don't understand why Jimmy doesn't wear a tie. And it just, they went through and it was like seven of the nine things that when he was creating the show, he was like, so this will make the show different.

It's so absurd to go like, they don't understand why he doesn't wear a tie. It's such a weird thing. Because he's not wearing a tie. But the thing with the focus group that they were pretty adamant about is like it's 11 45 12 it was 12 o'clock at night it's like 12 o'clock at night they're half asleep they just want something comfortable well that's as they're falling asleep they want to see they're not they don't want chaos every night even though i've seen it each episode 12 times it's like i don't want a surprise to fall asleep too i want the opposite yeah they don't want chaos they don't want a surprise to fall asleep to. I want the opposite of that. They don't want chaos.

They don't want Sal lighting Jeff Ross's car on fire at 1230. So it was really sobering. I almost wish there was a video of it because by the end of it, all of us were like, oh, okay. So this is why all TV kind of feels the same. But he figured out how to take the convention. Oh, my God. Yeah. Do the whole thing with it.

When did you feel like you started getting typecast as the girlfriend in the rom-com or worried about getting those kind of roles you're just getting for like two, three years? Well, you know what I realized? Or the bitch, the school life bitch. That's what Jewish women get. They're the friend or they're the cunty girlfriend. Yeah. You know, I know Jews run Hollywood, supposedly,

but they really don't like seeing their women folk. It's so funny. I mentioned that to someone once in an interview, and he goes, Woody Allen? I go, who are his leading women? Name them for me. Yeah, and they're all 17. Mia Farrow, Diane Keaton, Scarlett Johansson.

Oh yeah, not Jewish. No. I mean, I love all of those women. I worship them. But don't you think by the end of this decade now, I feel like that has really flipped. I don't think we would have had a fleabag 15 years ago. Is she Jewish?

No, but I'm just saying like different types of people. Oh, yeah, totally. But there are also five, you know, 600 channels. True. So they can take a bet on diversity. I mean, fleabag is brilliant. I love fleabag. So good.

I was actually, I was late to it and I couldn't believe how few episodes there were. I was like actually kind of outraged. Yeah, so easy to watch. It was,

the second season was six episodes, like 25 minutes a piece. It was like The Avengers was longer than season two of Fleabag. It was like, that's it?

It's over? And then she was like, yeah, I'm never doing it again too. No, it was good. It was smart. It left me wanting more, which I don't feel like shows ever happened before. Did you watch Killing Eve? Yes.

That first season was incredible. We have people here at The Ringer. They love The Killer. Of course. Jodie Comer. Jodie Comer, yeah. She's unbelievable. Yeah.

She had big Ringer points last year. Yeah. I mean, Sandro, too. But like, yeah, that yeah. She's unbelievable. Yeah. She had big ringer points last year. Yeah. I mean, Sandro too, but like, yeah, that killer. She's unbelievable. But they said Phoebe might actually be on the show this year for like one episode. Really? Yeah. I thought I read that.

So they are doing a season three? For Killing Eve. I think they are. Yeah. Wow. What else are you watching? Handmaids. Obvs. Just finished Big Little Lies.

Yeah. A lot of staring at the ocean this season. Man, that's so beautiful there. It's great. It's not even, they cheat it. They make it seem like it's Monterey and it's- Malibu. They're filming it in Malibu.

Yeah, but holy shit. I mean, and if you're Meryl Streep, it's like everyone has such high expectations. Yeah. And then they were blown out of the water. She went even beyond what you could ever imagine. You know why? Because she's Meryl Streep. Yeah, she's fucking Meryl Streep.

She's by far the greatest actor of all time. She goes, give me some teeth and a wig and I'll make you a character you've never seen before. A fucking 70-year-old woman with Asperger's who's a shit stirrer. Who's meek but aggressive. Have you ever met her? I mean, I think for two seconds once, but no. She's one of those people, like, I wonder what her normal Meryl Streep is. Because somebody who can become 30 different people. Well, right.

A lot of times, like character actors who are always, you know, I know a couple who are lost people. Yeah. They're like, who am I? They don't even have their real. But I think she has a very defined self. That seemed like she has, she's got this whole normal mom life where kids and- No, her kids are like 40.

No, but I mean, she raised a family. But while it was also like, oh, I'm going to go be Sophie in Sophie's Choice. I'll be back. Holy fucking shit. I don't know how you do that. I don't know how you switch that. Wait, did you watch Big Little Lies? Of course.

Can we talk about it or is it like a spoiler thing? No, fuck the spoiler. It already happened. Here's the thing. The one thing that drove me crazy during the court scene, like the second to last one. Yeah. When they're like getting Nicole Kidman. When Nicole Kidman all of a sudden becomes like Johnny Cochran.

I mean, what? I have to believe her backstory is that like one of her parents is Australian. Oh, she let the Australian accent slip. I don't know, but she is an incredible actor. But the character, like when they're saying like, what, oh, if he was abusive, why didn't you get your kids out of there? Did she forget that the reason

why he was beating her up when he died was because she fucking moved out and had her suitcases and bought a house to move in with the boys? Yeah. How did that not come up? Probably should have been mentioned. Yeah. What about the part? Why are they all like, let's all make a pact? Why didn't they tell the truth?

He fell down the stairs. How about like he was beating the shit out of our friend and we were trying to get him off her. Yeah. And that was it. I guess because- There's literally no crime was committed. No.

Because then you can't have a season two if they're just like, yeah, let's all just tell them what actually happened. He was committing domestic violence in front of all of us. Yeah. Yeah. But I guess their knee jerk reaction was they lied and then they had to stick to it because they lied.

My biggest issue with season two was Reese Witherspoon's character who they just kind of didn't know what to do with. Well, the dynamic with her and Meryl Streep was incredible. Right. But then it's like, and I love Adam Scott, but you go, why do they want to be together? Yeah, they hate each other. Do they love each other? No. There's like one moment when she's in the wedding dress where you're like? Yeah, they hate each other. Do they love each other? No. There's like one moment

when she's in the wedding dress where you're like, oh, they like each other. But it's like, now she just has total guilt and she has to go with what he likes. Like, oh, we'll have a big tent. No, it will just be us.

Okay. And that's the happy ending. She's got to like contort her joy to his because she fucked a guy. Well, also she completely betrayed who the season one. Break up. Yeah, seriously. You guys don't like each other.

But in season one, she's his troublemaker. Yeah, what does he do all day? But in season one, she's such a troublemaker. And then in season two, she's this meek, ashamed. I'm sorry I hurt our marriage. I think everyone is a team sport. And it was too abrupt. Not everyone could have any story and she's producing it.

And she probably, it was like, so the key I thought should have been, they should have had her got more involved in the school. Cause the school stuff always, I enjoyed that part. Cause you do have those psycho parents in school and you're like, oh,

fuck. I mean, the charity thing settled down. The what's her face storyline. Renata Lord Laura Dern was great. But like I wish that had something. Well, I guess it was like she just left

and smashed his shit and left him. Laura Dern gave me the feeling all season that she read all the Meryl Streep press clippings and was like she's not getting the best supporting actress Emmy yet without me saying or doing something about it.

And she just like stepped up. She ratcheted it up. But yeah, I mean. She's going to have to come through me this season. She was really good. She had that great, I will not not be rich. Yeah, that was good. But when she was like comforting the housekeeper i knew that the

housekeeper had fucked the husband by at that point yeah that was a nice little we are gonna hire you back it's not goodbye and i'm like oh she yeah why do i have this scene then i like these seven episode eight episode me too it's like it's like dating versus like having a real relationship with TV shows where you're just kind of like you're going out for drinks a couple of times with the show and then it's over. I don't like when things just go on forever because I know that there isn't like a beginning, middle and end all thought out for you. Lost.

I was just going to say that. Lost was the one that taught us that. Well, season one, great. Season two, great. Season two, great. Season three, they're playing golf and bee stories that you're just treading water. They're going backwards. What the fuck? Then they know.

Then they sign a thing, three more seasons, and they map it out. Yeah. And it's incredible. But now I think most people do that now. We've seen people who they know within the first two seasons, like, here's my exit plan. Yeah. Because they don't want to be on for 12. That was the mentality, though, like when we were growing up, is you just tried to keep your show on for as long as you could.

Yeah. Get rid of a character, bring another character in. Grey's Anatomy, I guess, is like that now. That show's been around for like 17 seasons. It's crazy. Do you watch The Bachelor? Are you into that whole scene or no for like 17 seasons. It's crazy. Do you watch The Bachelor? Are you into that whole scene or no? I love it.

But a couple of years ago, my dog developed a sound sensitivity to the, this sounds so crazy, but I'm not kidding. I'm so triggered by it now for her because when someone swears and it goes beep, it gives her like a fucking epileptic seizure. Like she goes fucking bananas. This is like Kramer and Mary Hart? And I can't, yes.

And I can't soothe her. Like it sucks. So it's like all my favorite shows I haven't been able to watch unless I'm in New York. And then I try to catch up on all of them or I like will listen to a podcast of a recap, you know? So to recap, you can't watch The Bachelor anymore because the beep gives your dog a seizure. Yeah. And now it makes me mad because I go, why do they have to have that big, loud, assaulting beep? And I know it's just because every time it happens, I get scared that my dog's

going to freak out. Right. But why do they, why don't they just drop the audio or have like a or like a, just an easier. That's what MTV does. MTV just goes silent on the switch. Yeah. That's what they do on the E channel channel in their Sex and the City reruns. They just drop the audio. Just drop the audio. My wife watches those from time to time. The heavily edited E! Sex and the City.

It's really a fascinating rewatch for a lot of reasons. It's like, yeah, because it's like the porn without the porn. Yeah, and it's Kim Cattrall just like ready to have sex with somebody. Well, those storylines don't And it's Kim Cattrall just like ready to have sex with somebody. Well, those storylines don't hold up that Kim Cattrall like just like, I'm a horny 40-year-old. It's just like, oh, God.

I actually think it's kind of bad now to rewatch those. Yeah, but some of the- It's kind of like, what were we thinking? Just the true relationship stuff is just, is good. I like it. But yeah, I mean, anything now, you just go like, wow, it's so white. Anything from 5, 10 years ago, you're just like, wow. Friends.

Wow, yeah. Friends, which had a major renaissance. And they're both New York City stories with all white people. Right. It's just bizarre. The funniest thing with the Friends rerun is clearly somebody gave the note around season three, and you would just see at the Central Park, there would be like two black characters, but not talking, just in the background.

They're like, hey, did you get those extra black extras? Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're in this episode. They got an NAACP award for that. Did they stop it? No. Now people, I feel like that's not nearly as much of an issue as it used to be

people are consciously look at that now even like Jimmy's writers from that first year was all dudes and one female writer before her it was Maureen Driscoll and then Morgan Murphy after but now I think those days that's not happening

anymore your first show but yeah but now I think those days that's not happening yeah your first show there were only five of us writing yeah or something Comedy Central was it 05, 06, 07 yeah somewhere in there maybe

till 09 I think yeah so what's your plan now going forward? What do you want to do? I know that's an open-ended question. You know, I don't know because I like, well, I'm going to do a pilot for, I don't, are we allowed to say like pilots? I don't know. Whatever.

I'm going to do a pilot. I don't know. I don't know. No one tells me the rules and then I fucking get in trouble. Just don't say who it's with. Oh, yeah. don't know i don't know no one tells me the rules and then i fucking get in trouble but just don't say who it's with oh yeah i'm gonna do a pilot that's like a another kind of like political but like also aggressively stupid you know i like that mix is important to me and uh and see because i am into that but then then i'll miss acting and it's funny funny. I like, you know, it's, I took an acting job, actually.

I'm doing a movie October, November. I'm going to New York for three months, September, October, November. September, I'm doing the, we've got our last workshop for The Bedwetter, the musical. Did I tell you about that? No. It's finally happening. It's going to... Broadway? It's at the Atlantic

Theater in New York. Nice. They started, Spring Awakening started there. Are you in it or somebody else in it? No, I don't know. So you hired somebody to be you? No, no. It's me the year I'm 10.

So it's all kids, but it's like rated R. Oh, my God. That sounds like in my degenerate son's wheelhouse. Oh, my God. I mean, I co-wrote the book and the lyrics, and Adam Schlesinger wrote all the music. We co-wrote the lyrics and this great playwright, Josh Harmon. And it's been seven years. It will have been seven years. It's such a slow, it moves so

fucking slow theater, but that's just how it is. It's so many schedules and so much to coordinate. So finally, we go into previews at the Atlantic in April. So we have our last workshop in September. We're still doing some rewrites and stuff. And then I do this movie for a couple months. This movie with Leo and Matt Damon. No, no. I'm kind of playing the friend, but it's in New York and it seems really fun.

So I just figured, fuck it. I'm making like quality of life choices where it's like, I'd love to be in New York for the autumn, you know? And then. You're like Adam Sandler when he starts like doing entire movies in Hawaii. I go, I don't know. I mean. I love that he does that. This isn't like.

I've always wanted to go to Wyoming. Let's make one there at the Yellowstone. You know, the stars, I heard the stars are both like on time and delightful. And, you know, so it seems like it'll be fun. And then I'm going back, coming back here and do that pilot, I guess. And then go back for rehearsals and for the play. Do you know what the biggest show is right now for My Son's Eleven?

You would like My Son. He's like legitimately funny, but- Eric Andre. Nope. Big Mouth. Oh, right. Wow, that's so exciting. Big Mouth is like a massive show.

Yes. And it's either you watch it or you're not allowed to watch it, but you watch it anyway. What a great show for kids to sneak and watch. He saw all of them and we didn't even know he was watching it. And he wasn't telling us. Because it's great comedy and it's kind of, there's some beauty in it.

Like it's, you know, have you seen Pen15? So they didn't like that one. I was surprised. Everyone kept telling me to watch it, which always makes me not want to watch stuff. But I kind of happened upon it. And it's so fucking good. My daughter had an interesting reaction to that. She didn't like that they were older than the age.

I wonder if it's for our age. I think it's for adults. Because it's like, oh, yeah, it's so brilliant. It's pretty wild. It's funny. They were talking about the birds and the bees with my son's class near the end of fifth grade and he was like he was like they told us we could ask a question so i'm gonna ask a question and i and i was like first of all like knowing my son i'm like oh no all right can you tell me what the question is and he's like yeah i want to ask how do you clean up a wet dream

and i was like definitely don't ask that. Why not? And he's like, why not? It was on Big Mouth. And then I was like, no, can't you ask something else? He's like, I already know everything. I've seen every episode of Big Mouth. I know everything there is to know about puberty. I was like, Nick Kroll has an insane amount of power right now over kids 10 to 15. I think that's probably a much better way to learn about puberty than how other kids might. Yeah.

I guess it is better than learning about it by googling boobs. Yeah. And just seeing what comes up. I was thinking about Ace. His joke about my day I used to just have to try to see a boob in a cloud

do you see him when you're doing stand up? I see him all the time he's like really into the stand up comedy thing we're talking about Adam Carolla we see I see him and you know we're so different but I like to think we love each other you know but boy he was on stage but I like to think we love each other, you know.

But boy, he was on stage at the Improv a couple months ago. And he's so brilliant. But in many ways, he is stuck in a moment. Yeah. I'm sitting next to this young black comedian and he's just doing race stuff that is not. Whatever. But, you know, he's trying stuff just like we're saying, you know. stuff that is not whatever. He's trying stuff, just like we're saying. But I turn to the kid and I go, you know, he's from another

time. He's like, what are you making excuses for him? I go, I'm not, but it's just the truth. He's doing the best he can with what he's been given. He's got a lot of talent. He has many gifts. But there are some things I of talent. You know, he has many gifts, but there are some things I believe in.

Well, he was always a 55-year-old man. Yeah. But now he actually is a 55-year-old man. But before he was a 35-year-old man who was a 55-year-old man. I think it's really good that he's doing a lot of standup because I think when he just does his podcast,

which just is massive and he's got followers that, you know, what he says is God, and he's just doing it from this, you know, castle up on a hill, it's easy to get out of touch. With his head tilted back, with his eyes rolling back. Yeah, I know. I remember, like, Mike August would be like, come do a show. I go, why would I drive all the way to Glendale to watch Adam talk?

I can do that from my own home. He's still doing it in case you haven't seen him in a while. Yeah. I was just interested in the relationship between the two of you. I always thought it was funny because you had the common ground

of just pure love of things that are funny. But you were approaching it from completely different ways. Yeah. We don't agree on lots of things, but I love him to pieces. And I'm always amazed that he loves me. To me, that always, I find that moving. But that's the thing is when you're comics, you're kind of all together.

You might be wildly different, but we're all like an island of misfit toys. So I don't like comic on comic crime. God, I hope what I just said about Adam wasn't bad. I love him so much. I wish I articulated it and maybe in a more loving way, but I don't like comic on comic crime. I just, I don't get, I don't like that stuff. It doesn't happen that often, but when it does happen.

You know, like when you're on Twitter and you're like, ooh, I should weigh in on this. And then you go, wait a minute, I don't have to. Like, you know, like that moment where you're like, you don't have to weigh in on every fucking thing. Hey, you love to cook. You're not in the mood to do the dishes tonight. Well, watch your favorite show with your favorite people.

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can you explain what happened? You didn't like the nipple thing or it wasn't a strike. It was a protest. Well, it was nothing. I mean, what do they care? They're, they don't need me, but it was, um, no, I, no, I wouldn't have called any of that. It was like, to me, funny, but it's also just absurd. It seemed like you were mad. It seemed like I was mad? How? I don't know. It seemed like it was half funny, but you were half aggrieved. No, no.

It was such a game to me because, well, I posted a picture that was like just of my cabinet, like my bathroom cabinet. But if you look close, you can see like my boobs. They're like in the reflection of the mirror. And what do I care? You know so um i posted it and then they took it down for obscenity meanwhile if you fucking have like two big fake tan tits like greased up with like with the nipple smashed down with suspenders where you're just covering the nipple. That's fine. As long as it, you can jerk, if it's something you can jerk off to, fine.

But if it shows like the part that nourishes life. You can take two acorn shells over your nipples. Yeah. You know, like, what is it about a woman's nipple? Men have nipples too. Then I was doing like pictures of guys' boobs, but close up where you can't tell if it's a man or a woman. You know, but if it, then I widen out if it's a man or a woman you know but if it then i widen out it's a man then they keep it they go in close you can't tell you know like there was

one they took off and then i widened out i go that was a dude you fucking idiot you know whatever but it's just like men have boobs and nipples sometimes full-on breasts and nipples. It's bizarre that one is seen as obscene and one isn't. But one can be wildly sexualized as long as you don't show that one tiny part that feeds babies. I mean, you don't think that's bizarre? I think it was funny that you were challenging a company that can't do anything right anyway. This is like the least of the things that they're screwing up these days. Yeah, it's fucking absurd. Yeah, well, I mean, listen, did you, yeah.

Facebook is so complicit in what's wrong with this country and the direction it's going and the end of democracy. I can't stand Facebook, and I especially can't stand how they do the whole throw the hands up thing ah we didn't know no they they what they sorry guys what it is is they love money yeah and they're wealth addicts like everyone like the the the leaders of the world all the you know and the most influential people in the world who can buy policy because it's legal to buy policy. They're making choices on behalf of the rest of us based on complete unexamined lives.

These are people that are so damaged and have not looked at their lives at all. And it's why they're successful. They're filling this unfillable hole that's made them the Walton family or Jeff Bezos or Donald Trump or whatever. They're filling an unfillable hole that gives them an immense amount of whatever is monetary success and therefore power. And then they make decisions for the masses that are based on daddy issues. It's really, really crazy. And really, the fact that we take democracy for grant, whatever, you don't want to hear

about this on the Bill Simmons podcast, but. No, because you care about it. I want to hear about anything you care about i mean we have basically democracy's we have 15 more months we're in the denouement of democracy 15 months here to figure out something yeah i'm hopeful but i'm not wildly hopeful i'd be so happy it seemed like you were more hopeful like three years ago with some of this. Weren't we all? Yeah. But now you seem beaten down. No, I try to stay hopeful.

But what I do is I need to take breaks. Yeah. I remember when my mom was alive and I'm almost glad she didn't see this. Like she died thinking like Bernie was going to be president. But or Hillary. Yeah. And, but she would just watch MSNBC all day, all night and all day and like go fucking bananas. And I would say to her like, mom, sometimes you got to just watch like a Bones or something. And that's where I'm at. Yeah.

So I just like put on Law and Order. I watch, you know, like any kind of procedural. Just like, just forget about it, you know. Play basketball, do whatever. But I definitely need to take breaks. I look at Twitter and get the news. Because that's where I get, you get the news from every single, you can get everything. It's pretty great.

And, but it, I definitely need breaks. I mean, listen, the reality is it's not unlikely that, that was a weird way to put that. Trump could very likely be reelected. He's the heavy favorite. It's fucking bananas. It the it's the farthest read it's the it's the it's a the first cyber cult you know it because remember watching going clear i assume you watch yeah and how paul haggis goes this so embarrassing, but they told us not to look at anything, any news about Scientology.

So we didn't. Yeah. And that's what Trump is doing. He said, don't believe your eyes and ears. Don't listen to the news. Only get your news from my Twitter feed. And millions of people are doing just that. They're either, it's just Fox News or him, and they're lying to them and that's why i have compassion for them they're they're being lied to they're they're you know some of them

are just fully racist and so excited but some are just fucking people the uh when in 2016 after hillary lost people were blaming like the bubbles and the celebrities. Names like yours was getting thrown around. Like, well, Pete, the right resented the left and the celebrity culture and the bubbles. That was the first time I'd ever really thought about the concept of bubbles. Yeah. And that we're here and people think a certain way. And if you're in New York or Brooklyn or whatever, but then if you're in like freaking Alabama.

Well, they just made abortion illegal there. Right. I mean, it's like a whole other world. But it's, I don't know why I never. They're in a bubble too. Yeah, but I'd never really thought about the country has all these different bubbles. The hypocrisy is that Trump is a celebrity. Yeah.

He's a reality show host. And a snake oil salesman. I mean, he's always been like Trump steaks, Trump college, Trump, you know, water. I watched every episode of Apprentice, by the way. I loved that show. I did, too. I was really genuinely excited when Carolla was on and he was with like arsenio hall and all this so good but i remember the one first glimmer of like trump you know like of was like i remember when gilbert godfrey was on and

they had their first meeting outside of Trump Tower, and everyone was freezing. And Gilbert goes, can we do this meeting inside? And then Trump goes, it's cold, right? Oh, wow. I guess there isn't global warming. Like he said something about global warming being a hoax. That was the first hint for you? Yeah, I was like, what the fuck?

Just host this show, dummy. Was that Gilbert Gottfried, the famous roast? Yeah. Was that the single most memorable moment of comedy you've been in the room for? Or is something else the answer? Well, probably. I mean. Like where you knew something substantial had happened even in the moment?

Yeah. Oh, it was crazy. And then like, I mean, they, I really didn't want to come out for it because it was October 2001. It was right after 9-11. You didn't know how to do comedy. Not only that, I was scared to fly. Oh, I didn't even think, yeah.

I didn't want to fly. And then, so they said, we'll pay for you to bring a friend. So Liz Winstead came with me. And, oh, that's the story that I just heard about later, but where Jimmy and Adam, maybe, or whoever Jimmy flew with for the roast, he was so worried and like, let's take a look and see who we can

I could take this guy if I need to like boarding the plane and then he fell asleep before they took off and didn't wake up until they landed I think that's how that story goes but I didn't I met Jimmy that that was the first time I met Jimmy and

God I remember Rob Schneider started not doing well. And Jeff Ross ran up and goes, hasn't there been enough bombing in New York? It was just like, it was pretty epic night because it also was just this massive release. And then for Gilbert to close with that, like, you know, what did he say?

Like my flight home as a layover in Tower 2 or whatever. Like it was crazy. And nobody knew what to do. It was like, everything was too soon, like in the most glorious way. And.

What's who, who, what comedian that you've seen just do stand up as killed in like the biggest way that you can remember. Like if we're saying like, if I'm talking about basketball, like who's the best basketball player you ever saw or best game you ever saw or something like that. And I asked like Kevin Durant that. He would be like, oh, this time, blah, blah, blah. It's funny. Who's that for a comedian?

The names that come in my mind are Louis C.K. and Tig Notaro. Really? Yeah. That's all we'll say about that. Because they eventually clashed. Is that why it's on? Trying to piece it together.

I'm just saying those are the two names that come to mind of people who murder, murder, murder, murder with any crowd. Do you like the whole Netflix vacation of these comedy specials and what they've done for the market? I don't know. I can't tell you. Because it's funny how it goes in waves, right? We had like that whole era in the mid-90s where it was like you got a half hour on HBO.

The MTV half hour comedy. Yeah, whatever it was. Hosted by Mario Joyner. And then it would be like, yeah, maybe you'd get an hour HBO and then devoted resources and time to it. And you get like an HBO special. It was like the big thing. And now it seems like the Netflix special is the big thing. Yeah.

Like they've just bought that corner. They have a lot of money and they love comedy over there. They must have offered you money. Mm-hmm. When was the last special you did? Two years ago, maybe? Three years ago? What's the process?

Like nine months? Six months? No, I don't do it like that. There was 10 years between my first and second special. There were probably two or three other specials in there that just like came and went. I never think about it. I just like, you just get an hour and you're gone. I just do stand up. And then eventually someone was like, do you want to do a special? And I go, oh yeah, I guess I have a special. I don't know. I never think about it. It's really dumb. Really? It's not, you don't think about it? Yeah. I just don't.

I don't know. Yeah. I mean, right now I've got like, I was surprised. I thought I had like 20 minutes that I loved. But then I did 45 minutes the other night. I was like, that felt good, you know. But I'm not like racing to do a special. And I'm about to stop doing stand-up for three months. And then I'll just be starting over all over again so if you stop is that like stopping playing golf or something where you can't even go back out there like stopping work like if you don't work

out for three months you're like i'm a big i'm a fucking fat piece of shit it's hard to even get your sneakers on to to do it yeah because you have to start over but you just have to you have to put just put your sneakers on don't think about it have to start over, but you just have to, you have to put, just put your sneakers on. Don't think about it. I always think about, I always say what Adam, Adam Carolla said once, which is about working out. I was just like, just get your sweat on. Don't put a whole thing on it. Right. Just get your sweat on. It's so funny how much it's like writing is so much like that, where it's like, you have to keep doing it to be good at it. Yeah. I mean, once you get knocked out of it, it's so hard have to keep doing it to be good at it yeah i mean once you get knocked out of it it's so hard the great thing about just having like a million things on a million burners

and like whatever comes to fruition great you know but like is that you're writing all the time you know and that i remember the one of the when i was dating jimmy he said i couldn't believe it he goes i'll never have writer's block. And I just thought, like, how could you even say that, like, in front of the gods, you know? Right. And he goes, no, because I write every day. It's true. And it's 100% true.

He's in that mode. Yeah. When you're just like, I'm doing this, I'm doing this, I'm going to go over here. If you write every day, there's unlimited things to write about. There's not, you know. Hmm. All right. I'm going to go over here. If you write every day, there's unlimited things to write about. There's not, you know. Hmm. All right. I think we hit everything.

Anything else you want to add? Oh, my God. I feel like I was so like preachy and annoying. I don't feel like. Do you feel that way, Kyle? I had a great time. You did? I did.

Absolutely. This is what you're like. What were your favorite parts? This is what it's like to hang out with you. Do you have any questions? It is? I did. This is what you're like. What were your favorite parts? This is what it's like to hang out with you. Do you have any questions? It is? I don't know. Because I get into a mode where I feel like I know everything, but I don't.

The only thing I didn't ask you was what it's like to be a celebrity. It's amazing. I'm not finished. So you're a celebrity pre-internet, and then celebrity during the early internet, and then in the internet, but now in the social media era, and where everybody's a celebrity pre-internet and then celebrity during the early internet and then in the internet but now in the social media era and like where everybody's a celebrity and a brand to some degree and you're trying to connect with your fans and figure out a way to kind of stay in people's lives how do you like you're on instagram you're doing tweets like how do you think about

all that in the in the way you're doing your career like people like i don't think like well i should put a tweet out or i haven't instagrammed or whatever but i usually like to post something like from bass you know and instagram is more just like basketball you use instagram like i do where it's like here's a weird picture of my dog yeah i mean yeah i'm not a business person so so it's not like I never think about it in that way. And yeah, you're right. It's like everyone's a celebrity. Everybody's so – I can see how it would get very frustrated to try to be seen or feel relevant. But in a way, maybe that's good because it forces you to go.

Nothing matters. We're probably fucking brains in jars. Just have a good life. Like whatever that looks like. Like I'm so lucky I get to do it. I get to pretty much do anything I want to do at all times. Yeah. You know, like, I mean, I this is a good life.

I can't believe how long it's kept going. Like, I had a boyfriend who, when we broke up, said, oh, good luck. I'm sure America can't wait to see Sarah Silverman at 40. That's an actual quote? Yeah. And I was just like, oh, fuck. Like, and that is such a it's just so mean, you know, but shit's worked out. You know, I don't know.

I'm not really I'm not drowning. You know, I'm not like trying to stay irrelevant. I just kind of do my own thing. And there always seems to be someone into it. I don't know do my own thing. And there always seems to be someone into it. I don't know. You love dogs. It's very important for the Instagram feed because you have had two dogs now. Yeah.

That have really strange, lovable faces. Oh my God. That you have to capture in the right way. Somehow you recreated the first dog. I don't know how you did that. It was like you genetically engineered it. It's so weird because I was like, this dog is nothing like duck. And then slowly I was like, oh, I just got another small black dog.

But to me, she's so different. Why is she different? They look the same. She's skinny with long legs and she's got a weird underbite and her personality is completely different but they both were very cat-like they both licked their paws and wiped their eyes well the one thing i've ever caught neither of them ever bark i forgot to ask you the political climate changed, in not a great way. But things swung your way with the legalization of marijuana.

I mean. Unbelievable. It's all coming up Sarah Silverman at the end of the decade on that front. You can buy it anywhere. We can go buy it right now. I have so much pot. People give me so much pot. I have a pantry that's half pot. If you ever want pot, please.

Just come to your house. Yeah, I'll just give it to you. You could do it. You could take gummy bears on airplanes. It's all stuff. It's incredible. You were ahead of your time in a lot of these respects. Yeah. And I am fascinated- You were making brownies for cross-country flights in the 2000s. God, remember when we went to Italy? Yeah. I made this pot chocolate. It was like Nutella.

My wife was in a coma for like two days oh my god i made basically brownie like weed brownies but in just nutella is that how you say it nutella and then poured it back in there and we would just take just like a quarter of a spoonful of nutella and you're flying for seven hours because you were like macyver with how to get stuff across. I was not going to Europe without weed. You were doing... What else were you doing? You were doing cookies. You were doing all that stuff.

It needed to be done. Yeah, you did the job. But now it's like you can just get it anywhere. It's interesting because it's legal and it's like you go, oh, there's a lot of opportunity. It's like knowing about oh there's a lot of opportunity it's like knowing about apple before apple like truly but the gross thing about it is that there's still all this red tape around it yeah you know because it's not federal and and it's all because the pharma and tobacco and the alcohol companies all those big three have so much influence on

the legislators and until until they get a stronghold on that fucking weed money they're gonna make it hard for other people you know we have so many devices now, all these different types of one-hitters. Oh, it's incredible. It's really the glory age. This is it. This is the peak. Look at how happy. You don't like that. This is the happiest he's ever been during the podcast. No, I was, and then they changed it.

What do you mean? They used to be able to buy weed in jars, and it was like, not anymore. What do you mean? It used to be like, you have a bud tender, and then they'd pick the stuff out, like three and a half grams. Okay, there's five grams. Now, it's got to be like you have a bud tender and then they pick the stuff out, like three and a half grams. Okay, there's five grams. Now it's got to be pre-sealed. There was a proposition that passed a year ago.

This will be your podcast if you ever do one, Pot Corner. Probably not. Just banging out. Do you imbibe in any way? Not as much as I used to. Weed? Yeah. I don't remember you ever smoking weed. Well, when I say used to, like the nineties, I think were my heyday. Then Jimmy's show the first year,

you know, that was like Mike Tyson, the week he brought the medicinal marijuana. I didn't even know what that was. Mike Tyson's guy, Mr. Black or something. And he's like, if Mike offers you weed, smoke it or he'll be offended. And we're like, all right. He had that weed and it completely fucked up our entire show for the whole week. Because it was the weed they give to cancer patients when they're dying that he somehow got. And we'd have the writers meeting the next day and everybody was like, you know, half comatose. So yeah, now it's come all the way around. Now we have bud tenders. Oh my God, I buy it for my parents.

My stepmother loves it at night. She eats an edible, goes to bed. She doesn't take sleeping pills anymore. I actually try to get my wife to take it every day in some form. Because I like her more when she's got a little Got a little edge off You could have just like three milligrams

I mean it's just like you can microdose that Yeah I've noticed some of my kids went to the Queen concert And my son who I am a little worried about with all this stuff But he was like He somehow knows the smell of weed and can identify it and was like, yeah, these people were smoking and he's getting a

contact high. How old is he? He's 11. Yeah, he's We went to Amigo's concert. He knew all about it. Yeah, he went to Amigo's concert. That was another one. Yeah, I'm a little worried about him. This was fun. I'm glad we finally did this. Yeah. Oh, shout out to Amy Zvi, by the way.

Zvi! Because she could have blocked this single-handedly. She could have. Yeah. She's the gatekeeper. She is. She's my everything. You always have had a small team.

Yeah. You have like a small, loyal crew and nobody else. That's how you roll. Every day, I'm like, I can't even believe how lucky I am I have Amy's V. People complain about their managers all the time or this. She's fucking, I'm so lucky. Can you give me, before we go, your number one Jeff Ross story ever that you could tell on a podcast? Hmm.

She's made a face. No, I don't know. I mean, you know, I love him. Come on. That's it? He's like your brother. He is. I mean, he's literally like your brother.

I mean, we've done yoga in my apartment before. You had Jeff Ross doing yoga? Yeah, he loves literally like your brother. I mean, we've done yoga in my apartment before. You had Jeff Ross doing yoga? Yeah, he loves doing yoga. What? Frozen yoga. No, he does love yoga. You know, he does. He's very lenient with himself.

On the yoga side? Yeah. But, you know, like we went to a class once and I look over and he's just like sitting on his mat and the instructor came over and he's like, no, no, I'm resting. You know, I mean, he's just like, you know, but good for him for being there and doing some of it. You know, the roast master, the roast master general. He does have some of the best jokes. Oh, my God. I love that one about a...

I dated a porn star. I said, when do you want to go out? She goes, well, I'm working Tuesday and Wednesday. How about Thursday? I said, how about Monday? He's one of the funniest persons, people I ever met god and I still feel like roast is insane because I do feel like comedy has reached this point where some of the people that are doing stand-up it's like this intellectual stand-up but they're not actually funny people

totally well my favorite comedy is yeah I mean it's, I wouldn't, I don't know that I would be my favorite. Like, I don't know if I wasn't me if I would be a fan of me. I love, like, Jeff Ross. You're a blend of the middle, though. Huh? You're a blend of the middle. Yeah, yeah. But there's certain people like Jeff Ross, I think Carolla when he's on is like that, where they're just fucking funny.

They can, you just throw them in any situation. Todd Glass. They have to start making fun of the people around them. It's just innate. Jeff Ross is like that. Oh, yeah. He can't help himself. He's always like, yeah, if you're on a plane with him, he'll be the whole plane. He'll start talking to the flight attendant, the guy next to him.

It's so good. Yeah. Did you overlap with Chris Farley or no? Yeah. Because they always said Chris Farley was just like the naturally funniest guy. No? Yes. But also sweet and appreciative.

I remember just sitting. We were both early for rehearsal on a Thursday. And he goes, can you believe it? We're sitting on the stage, 8H, where Belushi was. I mean, he was already there for three years and a star right but uh and I remember once

there's like they used to do a retreat before the season would start in like Mohonk I think and there's like a bonfire people sitting around and I remember just overhearing Chris sat down next to Lauren and he goes, Lauren, would it help the show if I got even fatter? And Lauren goes, no, Chris,

we want you to be healthy. And I just thought, wow. It's like when you catch a sound bite like that. When you see Laurenuren what happens i love seeing lauren it's funny because i think you know it was really when i was there i was a kid i was terrified i was you know i i don't know looking back it's amazing that he saw anything in me yeah like i was 22 i know what was i i wasn't me yet you know and uh but you know years pass and it's like i get so tickled to see him he's he tells the best stories he's such a character you know i mean just like the things you hear about like one year when tracy morgan said something on stage that got him into trouble and that 30 Rock, you know, put out a statement like apologizing.

And I heard, this is hearsay, I mean, but I heard that Lorne said to them, like, why did you apologize? It's a summer problem. Meaning like, it's the summer right now. By the time the fall comes and the show's on, in a million years, no one will remember this. You know, it's just like, he's such an old pro, you know? Yeah, I wonder how long he does that.

Because now he's like officially, I think he's like 72, 73, something like that. Yeah, but I mean- But it seems like they're going to have to carry him out. The show is so vital. Yeah. But like, he does it though. The show like, it grows, it changes, it morphs. And it's just like, other show gets, does that.

It's like still relevant that many years later. It's pretty crazy. Yeah, the ratings are as good as they've been. I mean, I'm not going to get into the Trump part of this. Yeah, and this coming year, election years, it's insane. My only, my biggest criticism is like when we're having like these Democratic debates now, I feel like they need to be involved. I know it means like getting people to come back and all that,

but I do feel like- No, I know. All you do is go like, you know- You want the SNL take on the debate. I said Kate McKinnon as Marianne Williamson, but then somebody said Kristen Wiig, and it's like, oh my God, right. Right.

Kristen Wiig comes back and is Marianne Williamson. Kamala Harris will be interesting. I wonder how they'll handle that because I think she's going to be involved. Yeah, she'll go all the way. And then Biden, you can... Well, that's Jason Sudeikis, right? But he's kind of become an SNL character

because he's forgetting things and... I don't understand why this is like the guy that everyone thinks is the only one that can get elected. Like, this is his fourth time running for president. He's never been elected. I don't get, I don't mean to shit on him.

Whoever it is, I'll be thrilled to support, but it's just, I don't, I don't think he's the guy. Anyone who thinks they can predict who the person, the right person is, is out of their mind.

No one would have thought we would elect a black guy with the middle name Hussein for eight years in a row. Right. No one would have predicted that. No one would have predicted Trump in a million years. I was saying Trump the whole, no, I wasn't. Nobody was. No, at this point, he had 1%.

Trump, the weekend before the election was was like 5-1 underdog. I know. Well, that's also why I don't really even trust polls, you know? You know, Sal and I, we parlayed the Patriots to win the AFC East with Hillary Clinton to win the election. And we could have hedged with Trump, but we decided not to, to try to cover the bet. Oh, my God. People must have made so much money betting on Trump. Because everyone was lying in the polls.

Yeah. Well, that's in England they call that, or in Britain they call it shy Tories, you know, where they act like they're not, and then they vote Tory in the booth. Sarah, this was a pleasure. Yeah, come on. How many times are we going to wrap this up? This is it.

Final one. Bye. Bye. Bye.