The Bill Simmons Podcast - Steve Nash on Lost Titles, Modern Point Guards, and Soccer Superstars (Ep. 194)

Episode Date: March 29, 2017

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by two-time MVP Steve Nash to discuss his best chance to win a title (6:00), the specialization of basketball (13:00), the modern point guard (17:00), playing with Kidd and KJ in Phoenix (24:00), players resting in the NBA (32:00), the NBA vs. Premier League schedules (39:00), Dirk's longevity (48:00), working with the Warriors (56:00), and the greatest soccer players in the world (1:10:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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to listen to every live home call from every MLB game around the league. Catch the Ringer MLB show only on TuneIn during April. And with your premium subscription, you can listen to live MLB games on TuneIn. Just go to tunein.com slash Ringer and subscribe. Download the TuneIn app and start listening today. TuneIn in your everything audio app and one last thing the channel 33 podcast we had reese witherspoon day in the ringer yeah we did a we did a podcast on the show about her career do you like big little eyes

some good monterey footage yeah great monterey footage that's like the star of the show but if you love reese with it on your ride home you can listen to our resources all right pearl jam let's bring him in steve nash coming up right now It's like the star of the show. But if you'd love Reese with it on your ride home, you can listen to our resources. All right. Pearl jam. Let's bring them in. Steve Nash coming up right now. All right. The two-time MVP, I was texting him last week,

and every time I see the way basketball is played now and there's a point guard just doing his thing with the floor spread, I just think to myself, Steve Nash must be watching this and just getting sad and bummed out. Wait, have you come to grips with this? You were like 10 years early. You just would have just would have gone nuts i like it you know you like it yeah like i'm not no you know like i'm a guy that came to basketball 13 years old had one scholarship offer and played till i was 40 so like you just played through your 40 I you know and so I feel like I I drenched every bit of sweat I could out of it and uh enjoyed it and and I'm happy for these guys that get to play in

a game that's open and free I think it's a great game I think the game is uh at you know one of the peaks of its history yes the way it's played the amount of talent athleticism um you can make a lot of criticisms about it and i would understand that but i think it's fantastic and i love to see the guys wild and free and playing of the teams of your best teams so i would say what was the year dirt got hurt oh two mavs yeah um was that oh two yeah? Yeah. 03. That team was good. 02, 03 Mavs era. And then the 05, 06, 07 Suns. And then the 2010 Suns. I think those were your six best teams. Which of those teams were built the best for right now, 2017? Because they all had pieces of it in those teams. It's a good question. I've never really thought about that. I mean, the Dallas one seems so long ago that I

don't even think about it. And it's like and they had so much success after that team kind of changed and then we had success so i never really go that far back but i think that team might have been a little young like dirk and i both were a little maybe let's say a little early in our careers to but we would have been successful in this type of play when you say early does that mean from just like getting the crunch time reps or going through the month or just that you didn't know the work ethic yet no we always had the work ethic we always had the work ethic and i think as a matter of fact you kind of had to be smarter about your work as you get older but i think we just that that that know-how and the games know how

to win games and and we were doing it we'd gotten ourselves to the conference finals in dallas but i still think we had more improvement to make there before we really knew what we were doing and you know we both went on to do it so to speak uh in the future but uh neither of us i think were quite at our in our prime yet at that stage. The 05 Suns, that one had Joe. Quinn Richardson, a really good year from him. I don't think Raja was there yet, but he had Amari at his athletic apex. Our starting five was great.

We were a little thin on the bench. But, man, we were running people out of the building. And that team, too, was all new. You know, like, LeBron's first year in Miami, his first year back in Cleveland. Like, some of these teams, these super teams, it'll be interesting for Golden State, especially with Kevin coming back late.

That first year, because you get in the playoffs, the intensity, the adversity, the crowd, whatever it is, you have to have that knowing look amongst each other. I've been here, but we've been here before collectively, and we're good. Instead of that look like, am I? Are you? Where are we? And so I think that's what happened in LeBron against Dallas. That team, I think that's in some ways what happened.

They were injured as well against Golden State his first year back in Cleveland, but they're new teams. When you get in that deep, deep, deep in the playoffs and there's tons of adversity and you're fighting up a mountain, you need those common experiences. 2010, which wasn't the best Suns team you were on, but that team had more of the continuity, and I think that's a good example of that really helped you that year.

Nobody remembers this now, but the ridiculous Kobe airball that Artest just made one of the best plays of his career and somehow got the offensive rebound in. But I think you guys could have won that series. I do feel like that was like a coin flip. We could have won that series for sure. And that team wasn't maybe as explosive, but it was more balanced, more experienced, a little tougher maybe mentally. I think Amari also turned a corner the last three months of that season. And, of course, he goes to the Knicks. But more than that, Amari kind of turned a corner on just being aware defensively,

knowing when to come over and when not to come over, keeping his head on a swivel. Also, offensively, we could go to him in the fourth quarter more because he would make better decisions. I think he got caught up in one-on-one battles earlier in his, you know, in those days where he would charge or turn it over on the layer of defense behind him. But he started to register and kind of measure up what was happening. You know, I'm going to beat my guy, so let's not get into it with my guy. Let's figure out what's happening behind me. He was better at that. He also got better at making the extra pass

of the pick and roll. You know, Roger bell or whoever was in the corner um actually roger was the only thing yeah roger was on that team his men's always coming in to take mario mario on the roll and he learned to make that corner pass which made everything better it just made us more difficult pick your poison for the defense put a lot of pressure under them on them so he was better i also think the first two games in staples we got hosed like we lost we lost by 10 but literally we would have had to win by 25 you can't get fined anymore you can talk about this now what are they gonna say you know we were like wow we're getting you know we're not you know i thought i think we're playing well we're losing by 10 both nights we go to phoenix and kind of blow them out both games yeah come back and then that's the game where kobe shoots the air ball i believe and uh the right corner yeah i gotta say that was a

phenomenal play by our test it was it really was it was a great basketball play we missed a box out and that's it the guy in consecutive years made arguably the two biggest plays they had in both those playoffs because in 2000 oh no that was the same year 2010 because he made a three against the celtics in game seven with a minute left yeah and as he was shooting it and i was there you could hear the laker fans go no like it was like this almost like a horror movie he was good for that he was always good for that like crazy play that just changed things or like you know what know, what's the word for it? When you just, there's no good logic behind what he's doing,

but he knows he just does something. He hasn't made a three for a week, and then he makes two big ones. Irrational confidence. And it changes the game, right? Irrational confidence. So, you know, he was good at that. And also, he obviously, I think, intimidated people in a good way. You know, to have that much lumber and just be hitting people

and keeping people off balance. He definitely played his role. I think the 05 team was the one that had the best chance to win the title looking back. Just because it was kind of a weird year for the league. The Spurs, Duncan was really banged up that year. The Spurs won anyway, but it wasn't like, he wasn't lights out or anything.

And Manu and Parker was still a little early for them. They got, Horry really saved them in the finals. He wasn't lights out or anything. And Manu and Parker was still a little early for them. Horry really saved them in the finals. Detroit was a very good team. It was kind of a weaker talent pool, I think, 10 years ago than it is now. I don't know if Detroit would have been as dominant. I actually thought you guys had the most talent. But as you said, it was the new team.

And then Joe broke his face. That hurt a lot. He came back for the last game of the playoffs. He wasn't the same. And I actually think he played really well in that last game, but it was like too little too late for our team. And I think they beat us 4-1. I'm not, no.

What year was that? But they were letting you score. They were trying to Jedi mind trick you and just shoot every game, remember? Pop. Yeah, take your 40. Take your 40, Steve Nash. We don't want you setting anyone else game, remember? Pop. Yeah, take your 40. Take your 40, Steve Nash. We don't want you setting anyone else up. That was good.

Yeah, he's great. He makes players, not just me, but he makes you have your own little battle with yourself. Because I'm sitting over there wanting to pass, wanting to pass, wanting to pass, and he knows it. And he knows that I'm kind of fighting myself. And I think I still played well and had success whenever I played the Sp pass, and he knows it. And he knows that I'm kind of fighting myself. And I think I still played well and had success whenever I played the Spurs, but he's brilliant.

He really is. The 07 is the one everyone mentions. The suspensions? Yeah, I thought that Spurs team was really good. Even thinking about it 10 years later, the suspensions were ludicrous. I really hated that they did that. I still feel like the Spurs were really good that year.

It would have been a task to beat them. They were good. I still feel, and I don't look back like blaming. I'm like, we lost. We lost. But if you want to break it down, we went home, I think, with a chance to go up uh three two yeah and we missed amari and boris and we were thin on the front line and we were winning until the last minute

at home and lost and so i don't remember that yeah it was close we we were we i think were up three in the last minute and hadn't had they hadn't had the lead until the last minute at least and they beat us by three maybe but uh so we hung on valiantly we got beat and then go back out there and they they beat us but uh you know i like to think that that team if we had been able to get through the spurs had a pretty decent look at it you know i think that was utah and then cleveland yeah a cleveland team that had no business being in the finals. Right, and I think we'd be in Cleveland by 30 both times that year. I mean, not to say that that means everything, but it means something.

It wasn't a great—you think about the talent now versus the talent 10 years ago. I don't know what the reasons are. They don't totally make sense. But there's no doubt. There's just more great players now, more very good players. If you had to come up with some reasons, what would they be? I've thought about this.

I think part of it, I think the rookie scale has really helped. And the fact that guys have to earn their contracts now versus when you were drafted, what were you, 98? 96 uh you could get like a 60 million dollar deal right so 96 Antoine's in the league for three years he gets 80 million you know it's and they were just handing out giant contracts left and right I think it really damaged the guys from that decade and it made them you know it's also it was also different I

don't think the NBA did as good a job of kind of preparing guys when they came in the league and things like that. And now you have, it's not just this generation, it's the LeBron generation I think has been really good for the next generation because those guys, they handle their business off the court. I mean, it's not like you didn't, but a lot of people in your generation didn't

and they didn't take care of themselves off the court. And the LeBron generation, they have their business quite a way off the court. They're professionals. Yeah, they're pros. They take care of their bodies. And I think these new guys come in, and they want to catch up to those guys and see what they do. And now it's like this.

Right, it's evolution in a way, right? Like that generation took it to another level. Now the next generation is taking it. I also wonder if the specialization of sports has something to do with it. In a good way. Yeah. Well, good and bad.

I think in some ways it's bad. Oh, you're talking about like youth sports. Yeah, like I'm saying that NBA players nowadays have to choose basketball from the time they were 10, 11, 12. Yeah. Whereas maybe earlier they were playing different sports.

So maybe you get guys that are, you get more kind of talent in the NBA, but on the negative side, what I've been hearing is that when you see a 19, 20-year-old's MRI when he comes in the league, it's bad and doesn't look like it did 20 years ago because guys were playing all sorts of different sports.

Now, I know that's a bit of a generalization, but it's something to consider, I think. Well, think about it, especially if you're playing on cement. I think cement is just the death of... But I don't think kids anymore play on cement. I really don't. You think they're in the summers,

they're playing on course. Sports is totally monetized, so it's all programmed. So whether it's monetized through an AAU coach, or it's monetized through your parents buying you private lessons, at either end of the spectrum, financially, I think it's been monetized. And so it's all programmed.

Like you don't see, like the parks, there's no kids playing pickup in the parks anymore. I grew up playing pickup outside. And it was important. In the streets of Canada? In the streets, man. You're putting your mittens on? In the streets and the rinks of Canada. But we'd always meet after school.

You knew where there was parks where we'd go to the university and play with the college team or college kids. And, you know, if you lose, you have to sit for a while. And that taught something different. Like, I think there's more talent in the league today, but I think there's also more specialists. Whereas you look back, I think, like, think about the backup centers in the 80s. Like, they couldn't play in today's game, but they knew how to play.

They knew how to set picks, to pass, to roll, to read and react, to post up, you know, things like that. Our, you know, first of all, centers can't really play in our game anymore, but, but, you know, they, they don't think it's two threes. Right. Yeah. It's gotta be like Kelly. It's gotta be like the fakest center of all time. It'd be a stretch for, but so the game is just an evolution.

Part of it's an evolution. part of it's a cycle. I mean, look, even the college game's influenced. Look at Oregon. They have the kid that's not really a big in Bell. He's mobile, 6'7". I don't know what he is, but he's kind of a mobile forward that guards the pain. They lost Boucher.

But they have four playmakers around them. I mean, they're in the final four without their 6-10 shot blocking three-point shooter I mean I don't know if that ever happens in previous eras where you just get four playmakers I mean they're all very good but four playmakers around a 6-7 guy in college basketball you usually get beat up on the glass give up way too many offensive rebounds and you get beat but we have mark titus writes college hoops for the ringer for us and he was just like he always picks a team with a good point guard who could play defense yeah he's like that's college basketball and so i was kind of

watching for it this year and it did seem like for the most part those are the teams that advance i i've been really impressed by how the point guard position has evolved in all these different directions i think your era the point guard there were basically two types it was like the traditional point guard like you and then there was like the gilbert arenas type point guard the i'm gonna shoot first clear out which kind of was the the nephew of the michael jordan era and now you have all these guys like i guess kairi irving's a point guard but he's, it's more like they're creators now. I don't even, I don't even know if we should necessarily use the word point guard anymore. James Harden's not a point guard. He's just create stuff.

Playmakers. I mean, I think, yeah, I mean, in the purest sense of the word, there's not a lot of point guards because the positions change. So I don't even think it's worth arguing or saying like, you're not a point guard. Who cares? Like you're a playmaker, you make plays. It doesn't matter. You know, I mean, Kyrie may not be a point guard in the purest sense of the word, but like ever since Gilbert and then, you know, Derek Rose even and, and Russell, you know, those guys are just, they just make plays. They just attack and they put so much pressure on the defense with their overall game that, you know, they have a huge influence on the game obviously.

And why, why do you need a pure point guard? If you had a guy that's putting that much pressure on the defense. With that said, then you see somebody like Lonzo and you're like, Oh yeah, that's, that's what a point guard, like you just, anytime they get a rebound and you just see the big guys like, where's Lonzo? I got to get it. And everybody else is running cause they know they can get the ball.

I miss that. There's still room for pure point guards for sure. It's just a matter of how many are there. And if not this guy, why would you take a pure point guard just for the sake of it? I think even little examples. I mean, Lonzo's great, but the point guard in Philly. Kid from Arizona. TJ.

Yeah, TJ McConaughey. I mean, he's a pure point guard. He makes your team better. I like watching Philly a little bit. I do too. And, you know, like he just, he's kind of overmatched in a lot of ways, but he's smart, he's tough,

and he can make plays. And he's a pure point guard, and there's still tons of value for that, I think. Well, how about Jameer Nelson? I think he was in your draft. And he's still like on Denver's because he's just old school you know i don't think that was him when he came in the league no i don't know he was the opposite but now he's realized how to have longevity yeah um so you know there's still a value in in the pure point card there's just not a lot of them i think lonzo ball you know he's he's an interesting one because he he has a feel and can can read and make guys around him better and

i don't know it's an argument that's that's tough the thing i think that's cool about him is the pace that he has is just different the rhythm the rhythm of how what he's trying to do the game usually kind of ends up taking the form of what he wants, which was what made the Kentucky game so interesting because Fox is such a freak athlete. Fox was just like, I'm picking you up full court. I'm not, I'm not giving you that pace. You're going to have to, you're going to have to be compromised and it worked. Yeah. And I think he's just, he's part of his growth.

He's just got to learn to be more aggressive it worked. Yeah, I think he's just, he's part of his growth. He's just got to learn to be more aggressive. I totally agree. I was upset at Lonzo because I'm like the biggest Lonzo fan. I just think he has it. And I was just like, just attack this guy. What are you doing?

Right. Yeah, he definitely, I think he was a little, and I don't know if this is a trait of his, he was a little low energy and he wasn't aggressive enough. I think he'll learn as he's a competitor, you know, that he'll learn, like, I can't sit back.

If things aren't going my way, I'm not getting a free wheel. I got to put my head down and get to the basket and make plays, get to the line, you know, look for my shots. How old were you when you realized how to do that at the highest level? You were like 23, 24? I mean, even, you know, at the NBA level, even a couple years maybe later, like 26, 27. I mean, nowadays kids are coming to league so early, they're developing faster. You know, my day, you know, I went four years, which sounds amazing. Right. Yeah. But that's, that was, that was most half the guys went a full college term. So I was like, you know, you, you learned at different paces, you earn

things more. I mean, I still remember going in the gym, my rookie year and AC green, kicking the balls all around the gym and telling me to go pick them up. Like that's never happening today. You know, kids are not picking them up. Sorry. You know what I mean? And they're on a Twitter feud or something. And so it's just different.

Twitter feud. You know, it's like it's different and not all for bad. I'm not the guy that's like back in my day. I'm just saying like it's different and that's natural. And it's great for what it's great for. And we miss some of the things that we miss. All right, let's take a quick break to talk about baseball, Red Sox fantasy. I'm pumped. Baseball is starting. And guess what? You need T-Mobile. They're giving away a free year of MLB.TV premium. That's an almost $113 value, absolutely free, and only for T-Mobile customers.

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Unlimited data. Keep up with your favorite team from almost anywhere. Every pitch, every big moment, every walk-off homer. All without worrying about blowing up your phone bill. Stream, post, and share. All things MLB. Here's how you get it. First, get T-Mobile, obviously.

Second, download the T-Mobile Tuesdays app from the App Store. And third, this is important, on April 4th, get your free year of MLB.tv Premium through the T-Mobile Tuesdays app or go to T-Mobile.com backslash MLB. At 480p, web-enabled mobile device and qualifying service required. MOB trademarks used with permission. Blackouts, other restrictions apply. See terms of use for details. Back to Steve Nash. One thing that happened in your career that I always thought was one of the strangest things, the strangest roster things in the history of the NBA,

was for at least a year, you were on the same team with Jason Kidd and Kevin Johnson. And I think Jason Kidd, I haven't made my list of the greatest ever. I haven't done it in a while. Jason Kidd's in the top 40 ever, especially like the longevity he had. And he was the best point guard in the league for four or five years in the early 2000s. And then KJ didn't have the long career and had trouble the best point guard in the league for four or five years in the early 2000s and then kj you know didn't have the long career and had had trouble staying on the court but his his apexes

were way way up there like he was just completely undefendable yeah and then you're on that team too yeah is that was that good or bad for you both i mean i think it would have been interesting if i had got a chance to play a lot early on but it it's the cards I was dealt. So I approached it the best way I could. And I think one of the best accomplishments in my career was my second year in the league was Danny Ainge played all three of us together and I got to play like 22, 24 minutes a game. And for him to like, for me to earn those minutes and largely because I had a coach that was like, screw it, I'm going to play all three of them. That was a huge accomplishment. I put a ton of work in and thought, look, I got two maybe Hall of Fame guys ahead of me, two kind of all-star caliber guys ahead of me. If I work hard, though, I'm knocking on the door, and Danny rewarded me. Did he play you all at the same time?

The three were out there together. Yes. So what were you like in the corner? Yeah. But I mean, if you got the ball, go. Right. I mean, Danny was amazing to play for, for me. Like he, I remember I was, you know, I was a rookie and I didn't have a big like hype

machine or anything, you know. Yeah. If I dribble down in front of our bench, he'd be like, take him, take him. Like no offense. He'd just be like, take him, take him. Like no offense. He'd just be like, go, go, take him. Because he'd played one-on-one with me before practice every day and thought I was really good and believed in me. And he gave me that confidence.

He didn't like hold me back, you know, so, and I was lucky. So I could have been somewhere else where I got to play a ton or I could have been with Danny who still gave me a chance to earn minutes with those two guys. And he gave me a ton of confidence. He'd be like, go, you know, like attack, attack make plays and so that was an amazing experience was kid competitive with you because at that point he'd only been in the league a couple years like didn't he think of you as competition not really because i hadn't really i think shown the levels that i i went on to show early in dallas and but i think that i think he could see it you know i remember know, I remember that I was going to, that I was coming and I was going to get there, but he was never competitive.

You know, we went back to our college days in the Bay area. So we'd known each other and we're friends. Um, but I remember Kevin Johnson saying to me, you know, one of my, maybe my rookie year, you know, he's like, he said to me one day in the locker room, he's like, you know, you're as good as anybody as good as anyone I've played with. And it meant a lot to me because I didn't know that yet. I would try to go at those guys in practice, and I think he saw enough. He's like, you have everything. You can do everything that anyone else can do. You just got to believe in yourself.

And that was important for me to see that someone that I thought was kind of unguardable was telling me that I could do whatever. I've told you this, but I remember seeing you in Boston once, went to the Celtics Suns during Chauncey's rookie year before Patino traded him after 50 games. And you torched Chauncey. And I was just like, this guy from Santa Clara? This guy's really good.

What the hell's going on? I just didn't understand it. You knew what you were doing. You could see it. and at that point yeah i think you were either a rookie that was 97 so i guess you were a second year it would have been either yeah second half of my rookie year yeah yeah um but i was like man this guy and then you went to then you're having back issues well actually that didn't happen until dallas so i had two good two you know development years in phoenix and i think they realized we got Jason, who's our franchise point guard.

Um, we should trade Steve before he becomes a free agent and leaves. And so they traded me to Dallas. Would they get free? Do you remember? I can't, it was like, uh,

I think it was like, uh, I bet they got a pick and like maybe Tony Dumas or something. Oh, congratulations. That's a, that's a great, I can't remember. So you went Tony Dumas or something like that. Oh, congratulations. That's a great honor. Maybe more. I can't remember.

So you went to Dallas. Then you got hurt. I went to Dallas, and it was the lockout. And we were playing a pickup game in early January, and I went to the basket, got knocked out of the air, fell on my back. And my back was really bothering me. And I didn't really do much about it, but it hampered me that whole 50-game season. It really was hard on me.

And then 10 games left in the year, we were, you know, classic Nelly. We were playing dribble tag to warm up and shoot around one day. What's dribble tag? Like everyone's got a ball and you have to tag the other person. This is the NBA, folks. And I got back spasms. Never had them before in my life. I must have been, I don't know, 23, 24 maybe.

And I had to get wheeled out of the building. It was like, whoa. Oh, my God. I was like, what's going on? Like literally couldn't walk for two days. I was freaked out. They told me I had this thing, spondylolisthesis, which is pretty common. I think like 20% of the population has it.

But obviously in professional sports, it can be tricky. So, um, you know, that, that was kind of like, you know, that was when the back issue started, but it actually made me a better player because I met my physical therapist in Vancouver, you know, helped me become a better athlete, helped me be really, really focused on being in shape and preventing injury and all that stuff. So I, I think in, in some ways it demanded a lot more of me. When did you go all in on the dieting and stuff? I think that's one of your legacies is the dieting and the sleeping. You were like five, six years ahead of everybody.

I should open a restaurant chain, brand it. I'll never forget seeing Jared Dudley asking you what to order at Sundance and being like, oh my God, Nash even orders for his teammates. It's unbelievable. JD, that's great. It was kind of an evolution. I think by the time I, you know, like there was a stage where I thought, you know, when you, I mean, late 90s,

I still thought like a big heaping plate of pasta was good. At 1130 at night. You know, or yeah, or even before a game. And like, God, I was like, man, I have to eat an hour earlier because I still feel full at game time. Yeah. You know, like, so you learn and learn and learn. And then, you know, I think when I got to Phoenix,

it was when I really realized, just eat as many natural things as possible and less processed. No sugar, right? And cut out the sugars, which is a big, you know. Now everyone's doing it. You should be getting royalties from the entire league. Sure. People are in sleep chambers. You never had a sleep chamber no but i sleep was obviously i realized i was one of the huge i remember you told you might even um maybe on my podcast five

six years ago you were you had discovered napping the power of napping yeah i mean i'm not a great sleeper yeah and i think that sleep what i learned is that it's cumulative. You know, it's kind of like you're, and we're always overdrawn. And so any chance to get it back. So napping, I think is good for that day, but it's also a good cumulative over the course of a season. If you could nap every day or every game day, even, you know, by the end of the year, you've put that much sleep back in your bank account for recovery and clarity and all those things that you need to perform.

So sleep's huge. I know, uh, I know you love assessing the point guards as a whole. Are we in like the glory days of point guards right now? There's so many of them. Yeah. I mean, it's incredible. The only interesting thing is that there's not a ton of pure points, but there are amazing point guards.

Yeah, I guess I should. In that, just for argument's sake, there's no Jason Kidd really out there. But, I mean, man, you look around the league and think how many guys are so good. Let me flip it around. Like if you were playing now, just the night after night of, oh, man, this guy.

Yeah. Oh, and then tomorrow I got this guy. Yeah, I mean, I think that's true, but I think it was about the same. You had the same situation. Maybe it's even better now but it was so good the last kind of tense maybe six years you know yeah of my career was like you know it's the same deal maybe it's just even better now but you still was like wow this position is the strongest

position in the league all of a sudden and i remember you telling me early on with Westbrook, you were like, I don't like playing that guy. I hurt, I mean, he's, and he's gotten better. You know, he has. Like, he's smarter. He's a playmaker now. He wasn't early in his career. I think, you know, he was apt to make a lot of mistakes early in his career. Now he doesn't, you know, like the way he's played in the playoffs, you know, he's overcome a lot of things to add that to his physicality. I wrote a piece about him like four weeks ago about how i just thought he was doing too much i think you can pass a point on a basketball team where

when you're doing everything it's actually bad for the other guys because then they're not thinking on their own and they're not you know oh now i get to shoot and it's one of those things and he scaled it back the last few weeks. He's picking his spots more. And they're a really good rebounding team. They're at least a dangerous first-round opponent because they can rebound. Because in the Dallas game the other night, they're down by 10 with two and a half minutes left. And he just scored all the points. Scored 12 of the last 14 in two minutes and just wins the game. That's why I wouldn't want to play them in the playoffs.

Yeah, but I think they're better when he relies on his teammates i do too no no question you can't in this league you can't go through a season or seven game series and do everything so i think you know if he does relinquish more and more there'll be a tough out yeah but if he insists on doing it all i don't think they'll be that difficult yeah i it would seem like the't think they'll be that difficult. Yeah. It would seem like the right amount of shots, not that you'd be like, oh, I can only take 20,

but when he's in that 18 to 21 range and Oladipo has 12 shots and Adams has eight and it's all spring, Cantor comes in, that's when I think they become dangerous. Who do you think is the best team out of the ones you've watched? Period? Yeah, like who would you bet on? Canadians aren't of the ones you've watched period yeah like who like who would you bet on if you i mean i just canadians aren't allowed to bet but if you like

i still would you know think golden state's the best team um there's no if like if durant comes like the no i mean i think sure there's ifs but there's ifs with everyone because yeah you know if kevin comes back and isn't quite himself, okay, that's different, but they're still pretty good. If they come back, if Kevin comes back and they still, they're having those first-year blues, looking around, wondering what's happening, a tough game, I don't think that's going to be the case with this team, but that's a factor. You know, but there's factors with every team.

Look at every single team. Look at LeBron. Look at the minutes he's logged. Like, is there a day where it, you know, blows up in his face? I think it's blowing up. I mean that they don't play defense anymore and i can't tell if it's because they have too many below average defenders just they just pass the point of no return or whether i think it's fatigue and boredom that's probably you know they might prove to be not a great defensive team this playoffs but i think they can ramp it way back up.

You know, if he's more focused, has more rest in between games, he can demand more of his teammates. You know, he's taken on a lot this year. I mean, that's a burden, you know. You're 14. Yeah, and just the way he plays, and it's, what is, how many playoffs,

how many finals in a row, like six or something? Six finals in a row. It's crazy. His next playoff game will be 200, I which is which is awesome it's because as you know the playoff games are like they count as games and a half right it's beyond like that's that's just unfathomable i mean that and that's part of the reason why you know the whole debate not to bring up a topic but about players sitting out games and yeah you know i i just think it's uh it's happening. And it's just we're going to go through a two- or three-year transition era

where the fans are going to be mad about it, and rightfully so. And then we'll get through to the other side, and people will accept that that's just the way it is nowadays. And personally, I think that, you know, you look at soccer, and players sit all the time. You'll hear coaches in press conferences say, yeah, he's on fire, but he's in the red now as far as loads. And he's going to sit in the next two weeks, one of these games. And they play twice a week at most. So I think it's something that's evolving.

We know what we know in science now and about the body and travel and rest and recovery and injury. It's just inevitable. I hate to to say it it sucks for a fan when lebron comes to la and doesn't play but it's just the way it is and if you're lebron and you're and you're cleveland and your goal and your fan base is all built around winning a playoff you know championship not the regular season title you know that's and you're judged you know we are so i mean look at the media cycle now and how much pressure we put on people we're judged. You know, we are so, I mean, look at the media cycle now and how much pressure we put on people. We are judged on winning the NBA finals or nothing. And then there's the day-to-day cycle too, which is totally different. You know, so like, you know, and at the end you get crushed if you don't win it all.

So it's just the way it is. And especially like we can't have LeBron injured for the finals. Yeah. I think they should cut back the number of games. I said that, I wrote on Friday I thought 76 was a good number you're getting rid of one game a month I remember when you were playing when we used to text you know you'd just be like

schedule loss you just knew like the guys in the team almost know half the time like oh you can look at the schedule and go Tuesday March 13th fourth game in five nights and we're in Utah we can't win that game that would be like superhuman yeah that's not good it's true I mean and you know because I work with the Warriors still it's you know you know that they're back-to-back they they always

play the Spurs on the second night of a road back-to-back and yeah you know like there's all this you know there's so many and that next year could be the opposite but there's things that you just know that the chips aren't stacked for us and we're in trouble. So I think there's the schedule. I think 76 would be great. I think it hopefully doesn't ruin the model and maybe it makes some games more important and so you can get it back.

But I also think it's going to help that they're cutting out the preseason games by two weeks or something and stretching the season. That'll help a lot. Little bits help a lot. The All-Star break is tough because your All-Stars are getting run around town doing media and events and stuff. Yeah, they're like the president.

It's harder than the season in a way. So while the game isn't more exerting, it's still harder than the season. Does it bother you that they've just thrown away the all-star game completely did you like it'll come back it'll come back i was never the type because it was a little bit too like loosey-goosey but um it was never my thing but uh it'll come back it goes in cycles i think and you know we've pushed too far one way now and it'll come back a little bit quick break to talk about about Cabbage. If you're wondering how to get the funding needed to run a small business today, Cabbage has the answer. Cabbage helps

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$100 Visa gift card. Visit Cabot.com. That's Cabbage with a K. Cabbage.com. Back to Steve Nash. You're a big soccer fan. You're talking about the schedule. Premier League was what 36 games

35 Premier League I think it's 38 38 yeah which is how something like Leicester City happens it's the most amazing

thing ever it's like actually it's a 38 game season yeah in the NBA if like if they had to play an 82 game season

I think stuff would maybe start to even out over the course. But I do like that every game is a signature game. And I was thinking, like, there's no way it would work. I mean, this is ridiculous. They would never give up the attendance. But it would be really fun if basketball was just twice a week.

And it was a 50-game schedule. And every time it was everybody just rested at their best. It'd be interesting because the amount of hype you could put around matchups and how important games could be. I don't know that you could model it out where you'd get enough back in. You wouldn't.

It doesn't make sense. Because stadiums are only so big, and people have other lives and stuff. But it's an interesting thing. I think that's one of the reasons Leicester City could win is because they were in, basically, you know, the top teams were all playing Champions League or UEFA. That's another thing. That's crazy.

You know, and then the FA Cup and then the League Cup. So you add that up, there's, you know, for example, the top teams are playing or at least starting the season in three other competitions, whereas Leicester started in two. And for those top teams, they're putting all their eggs in the basket of the top competition. So, you know, I think that's one factor. I mean, it was a perfect storm, but it is crazy that how many games soccer players actually play and then they only get a six week break. And that doesn't include the guys who have to play for their country. See, I would change a lot. If I was the soccer czar, first of all, I'd have a World Cup every three years.

The four-year thing drives me crazy. It's like, why? And the Women's World Cup should be every two years. They don't really have anything else. They should be running that back all the time. But I've only gotten into soccer like the last eight years it is astounding to me that they have such a short regular season but then at the same time you know barcelona it's february and they have the champion

this champions league game then they have to worry about their two division games like the nba that would never happen no be like the Warriors are playing the Spurs today. And then on Saturday, they're playing AC Milan in Italy. It's like, what? They would never do that. Right. And, you know, you can get caught in points of the season where you have that congestion.

You have so many games and so many big games. I mean, you'll see them a couple of years ago. Didn't they play like Madrid three times in like nine days for three like trophies, basically? Like the league the cup and the champions league or something you know like stuff like that can happen so i get it like these models are there and people make a ton of money but that's why the sport of soccer and basketball but soccer is getting so young like you just need guys that can run at

such speeds for so long our 18 year old on ameryear-old on America? He's amazing. Are you a Canadian citizen or an American citizen? This might be the one that pushes you to become an American citizen. This is by far the best American player we've ever had. It's one of the rare things that I feel like it's not a big enough deal yet. We've never had a guy who can go downhill at half speed and then turn it on and go nine directions

and the way he passes. Watching him play, you'd expect him to play for Argentina or Spain. Yeah. Or like he's Messi's protege or something. I mean, he's that good that he's that clever that he can play that quickly of mind and foot. And stop and slow it down.

He has patience with two defenders around him. In every sport, it's space and time and his ability to slow the game down in your mind. We've never had a guy in America who can do that. And he's, I mean, we've had some good players. Clint Dempsey is a terrific player. They're great, but not even like this. But this is, the level he's playing at is,

I don't think, for him to have the impact he's had in the Champions League at 18, I don't know that an American's ever had that impact. Maybe like John O'Brien was at Ajax and had some success years ago and was a fantastic player, but injuries and stuff cut his career short. But this kid's already having a major impact at a top 10 team in the world in the Champions League. I mean, he's 18.

And in the last two qualifiers, I think he is. He just looks like he's the best player. A goal and five assists or something. Looks like the best player on the field. And he's like, it's his first. It once again proves that the old argument about what basketball players would be great soccer players, it's really you have to look at like Isaiah Thomas

and people like that. It's the lower to the ground guys. Sure. I think Pulisic's probably what, 5' the ground guys. Sure. I think pool six, probably what? Five, five, nine,

five, 10. I think that's generous. Maybe five, eight. Yeah. And messy is like five, seven,

maybe, maybe five, six. Yeah. I, to me it's, although I still think Westbrook would be Westbrook on a soccer field. If he had been doing it from day one would have been,

he would have been like he would have been like uh Suarez multiplied by five well you've seen Pogba play yeah Pogba long he's about I don't know six three six four you know he's long physical but he's also you know a great vision and and great feet so and Ibrahimovic six huge feet. Well, what if Sean Marion had been a goalie from day one? Yeah, he would have been pretty tough to get it by. If he's from age six, he's just in a net. Yeah. Plus, he was kind of a quirky guy, and goalies are quirky.

I actually think he would have been a good goalie. He didn't love contact, though. Oh, that's bad. I don't know. Maybe he would have been fine. Goalies have to be okay with a concussion. On corners and stuff, we have to come out in a crowd and demand the box but he would have been the best goalie i mean he could have been i mean he could have jumped so high over everyone there

would have been no contact right if he had but uh i mean how about raja you know i think it was uh raja would have had no problem he would have loved the contact no problem coming out for the ball but uh he'd been kicking it out of bounds for corners. Yeah. But I think it was David James played in the Premier League and played for England goalkeeper. He wanted to do a TV show where he took, and I'm not sure if he ever did it,

he took ex-American college basketball players and tried to teach them to be goalies. And he was trying to get that kind of 6'4 to 6'6 athlete that didn't make it in basketball but was still athletic and long and could understand sports and convert them. I think that's fascinating. And you need great hands.

And you need quick, the ability to jump from side to side. My awareness. Total coordination. And you'd have to be a crazy person because I think goalies have to be a little crazy. A little bit. You need great hands and you need quick, the ability to jump from side to side, total coordination, and you'd have to be a crazy person. Cause I think goalies have to be a little crazy. Yeah, a little bit.

So anyways, I think that's a cool show concept. I mean, at least for maybe an audience of one. No, I think, cause think about it in football. They turn,

they turn college basketball players into tight ends all the time. And it's become like this talent pool for, for tight ends. For goalies it would make more sense. Who are the best tight ends of all time and it's become like this talent pool for right for tight ends well yeah i mean for goalies it would make more sense who are the best tight ends of all time i mean you could argue rob gronkowski is probably the best one but he wasn't okay but tony gonzalez yeah tony gonzalez antonio gates both two they're top five yeah and they played they both played hoops i mean who is it tate who's the other one who got converted jimmy graham j got converted Jimmy Graham who's the one there's a younger guy now too there's a bunch

at least five or six Julius Thomas was one there's one other younger one that's interesting I wonder what other converts we could make in crossing sports so we're going to do this this will be one of our first reality shows we'll go to all these

different colleges. Think of other sports where it translates or athleticism translates. I mean, football is such a specialty sport. You can find a position arguably for a soccer player. You can play kicker. Do you think it's weird that soccer players have never crossed over and just become field goal kickers on the side? It can't be that different.

What's the farthest you kick a field goal if you practice for three weeks i don't know i'm not like a huge i don't know that that would be my strength anyways but i don't know i wonder if guys just it just doesn't appeal to them to just kick field goals and they'd rather and just kick what is it what is the what is the kicker make these days probably not as much as they would make playing soccer i mean obviously not as much as they make soccer would they make as much as they'd make a couple million a year yeah yeah yeah i think ben and terry's making like four or five million a year it's like four three is the highest gots kowski what's the minimum minimum's gotta be yeah it's gonna be like oh oh, you might do it. Now you're thinking about it. You sure?

Not I. Not I, but I'm trying to think what would incentivize some of these guys to go do that. One last break to talk about SoFi. If you've worked hard to get the career you want, SoFi is here to offer easy savings on the student loans that helped you get there. If you've taken out student loans to invest in yourself and your career. SoFi wants to help out attending college and following your passions. It's an investment, as we know, but with student debt, it can be quite the burden. SoFi is in the business of helping you pay off student debt faster. It's the leader in student loan refinancing.

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Loans originated by SoFi Lending Corp. California Finance Lender Law License number 605-4612. And MLS ID number number 1121636. Back to Steve Nash. We got to talk about your old friend, Dirk. Yeah. He's still going. Yeah.

I don't understand this anymore. This should be over. He's seven feet tall and he's been playing for 20 years. He has stretches where he's pretty good, too. Yeah. They go to him at the end of games and he scores on guys who are 15 years younger than him. I know. It's amazing.

I don't understand it. Explain it to me. I don't understand it. He's, I mean, he knows what he, he knows his space. You know, he knows how to, I mean, sometimes I think his feet and, you know, his body are, have gone to the stage where like he has to kind of almost force a shot. But sometimes he's still able with his just ability to get a guy off balance or leaning or overcommit. He's so good at finding his little pocket to get his shot off.

It helps that he's seven feet tall. Of course. Of course. You couldn't do it if you're 6'4". But he has that gift and he has that know-how. And some nights it's got to be really painful him. So he probably can't move that well. And other nights he looks pretty, pretty spry for a, an aging player. And, uh, he's, I mean, it's incredible. Would you, if your body hadn't given up on you, would you have just kept going until it gave up or would you? Yeah. Yeah.

I would, I would, I mean, I would have played until I wasn't effective and that's basically you would you just kept going until it gave up or would you yeah yeah i would i would i mean i would have played until i wasn't effective and that's basically what happened because the injuries i just couldn't i'd have flashes i'd have practices that i have game where i'd be like wow i feel great i look great everything's good and then i couldn't recover and just that you know that that diminishing returns you put all that work and you're not effective that's no fun so that would have been it if i if i had kept playing at an effective rate and level i would have probably played for a few more years but defend dwight howard for me uh in what way which record uh he the last six years he's gone to teams and it just seems like they don't do as

well until he leaves i mean the two the two things i will say is that the game's changed and if you're not fleet of foot in the middle which he's not anymore i don't think he's not mobile like he was when he was younger it's easier to get him you know get him in trouble defensively and then you know i think he he's not the same physically as he was. He's not as mobile. And that affects him. And one, I think it affects his ability offensively regardless, but also in today's game where it's so,

the returns just aren't there for post-up play. It's just not. Guys can cheat in the lane, crowd it up, and make it difficult. So in essence, you've got a guy pounding on pounding on you you got other guys making it crowded and hedging their bets and and making you second guess and you're gonna get a jump hook over someone you know i mean because guys will come to you if you get too deep it's just the game there's just not a lot of returns on post-up play anymore and Greg Monroe is the test case for this because he's about as old school of a post-up guy as you get.

And he kills the Celtics. The Celtics, the one weakness they have, which doesn't even matter in today's NBA, is the physical post-up play. They just can't keep them away from the rim. But for the most part, the good defensive teams can just, that's it. And he's not effective. I mean, it's just changed so much.

I mean, even just centers, how talented Boogie Cousins is and how small the market was for him. Yeah. And he still gets big numbers. But does he have the impact on the game? That's the thing. And I don't know. I don't know the answer to that.

It would seem like the 2005 Amari is the model for what you want from your center. The guy who can be 18 feet from the basket, set you a pick, and either he's rolling or they're in there. And that's basketball. I wouldn't even say that. I wouldn't say that because I'd say nowadays you'd have to be either have deeper range or be a better defender. Amari was just so brilliant. So you think Amari would have to shoot threes now? He was so brilliant at catching and finishing

that he would have played in any generation. But nowadays, what I'm saying is that you can have a guy that is not a good roller at all, but he can stretch a little bit and he can cover a little bit on pick and rolls and you make it up elsewhere rather than having a guy that can really play in that position but kind of screws your team because the way we play nowadays doesn't isn't conducive to that type of player does that

make sense yeah it's i mean basically it's somebody like nerlens which made me mad when dallas got nerlens for 50 cents in the dollar that type of center and clint capella and the guys like that like deandre shooting 71 this year from the field and it's because they don't post them up because doc's like we're not we're not ever running a play for you all you're getting are alley-oops and offensive rebounds and that's a really good use of him that was something dwight never totally figured out he just should have been the best version ever of deandre and it's a shame because he he committed to that more so in orlando they went to the finals yeah and after that he was you know at the exact time that post-up game was becoming archaic he insisted on being a post-up player yeah i think that really hurt him

as well instead of the game being easier for him and him getting easier looks or his value being bigger because he was rolling down the lane sucking the defense in and making his team better and therefore giving him opportunities later to get roles or to get offensive rebounds you know he really wanted to prove that he was a post-up player and it's like right at the the exact time it went out of fashion analytically and by the way coaches want to play as well which offense are you the most jealous of? That you wish you could come back from a time machine 15, 12 years ago and just go into it? I love the way the Warriors play.

I mean, the ball moves quickly. It's not as much pick and roll as I would have liked, but I also never played with guys that could pass like that, so it would have been nice to be the beneficiary. I took very little spot-up shots in my years in Phoenix um you never got it back like that um I also didn't get many like back cut layups or things and so that that's to me is is fascinating and uh to watch them move the ball and run it's pick and roll is the hardest thing to cover they have the you know they've arguably some of the best pick and roll players and they kind and they kind of, in a way, run less pick-and-roll

by far than what they could than other teams. It's fascinating because they move and share. Yeah, they also run those little leaks that are like, you know, Quay seems like he's going to set a pick, and then he just darts back and he's shooting all of a sudden. I've never seen that before. That's new. I think a lot of that stuff is just reading the defense

and playing cat and mouse. So, like, you know, back in the Utah days, they ran the splits, and then the triangle ran the splits. You throw it in the post, and you have two guards come together and split. But, you know, when you're coming at full speed, you have a good passer with the ball, and you have two best shooters in the world coming together, there's a lot of opportunity to make mistakes.

And so they know that, and they know that if they're switching or if they're staying at home, and then they just start adjusting and put you in difficult positions. Would you have paid attention to all this advanced metric stuff that we have now when you played? Because it really started the last four or five years ago. Yeah, it started late in my career. I thought it was interesting.

I still would have paid attention to it. I would have evolved with it. As it grew, I would have paid attention to it I would have evolved with it as it grew I would have listened to it and at the same time I still think a huge part of basketball's personalities and how they mix together I agree for me that's we haven't quantified that yet and I don't know that we ever will

guess what we're not going to we quantify it with wins and losses yeah exactly so I always hold on to the fact that it's not everything. It's a tool and it's useful. And I think it gives us a lot of good data and a lot of good ideas. It helps us understand some of what we're watching. Sure, the whole thing can't be an algorithm. It just can't.

Well, I mean, the 2010 Suns are a good example. Team probably shouldn't have been as good as it was, but the pieces, everyone played well together. The pieces fit. You had guys at the right points of their career who understood what was going on. I think we were picked out of the playoffs that year preseason.

You should have been. Yeah, I mean, I remember thinking it was, you know, what's going to happen with Nash? You weren't even a free agent yet. I think you had signed another deal. And it was like, oh, man, poor Nash. He's going to be stuck. And all of a sudden, you guys were really good.

But it was because everybody meshed. I think the Celtics are both advanced metric friendly, but also a team that doesn't make sense. Not very good rebounding. They play three, four guards at the same time sometimes. But they play well together. So that's an example of personalities, that one personality.

Two, they have some gritty guys. Yes, competitors. Without that, they're a soft jump shooting team. Right. But they have some gritty guys that get deflections and steals. Chip on the shoulder guys. Chip on the shoulder. And I think, you know, although Isaiah's small, he has a chip.

Smart has a chip. Jay Crowder does's small he has a chip smart as a chip jake crowder does crowder as a chip he does yep so you got bradley so you got a group of guys that make up for a lot of things by their personality horford didn't have a chip because we gave him 30 million dollars a year but then he had like two weeks where he wasn't putting up rebounds and everyone because boston it's 24 7 oh al horford this contract sucks now he's a maniac it was like the boston all that stuff kind of got him going now he's like flying around like a crazy person the whole it's i i think washington is the the danger to them because they're it's probably the second round opponent and it's just a bad matchup with the Wall and Beal combo. I think Washington's kind of the – for me, it's the sleeper.

I don't know what to make of Toronto because I don't know if Kyle Lowry's coming back, but Washington is the one that scares me. They just ran Cleveland off the court on Saturday night. Yeah. No, they're good. And, you know, as you know in the playoffs and in every sport, I think it's about finding your stride. And I think Washington is starting to find like some real belief that they could cause some problems.

And yeah, so I think he was really good. He's good. He's good. They're both very good. And they're gaining. They're gaining momentum and confidence. And that's dangerous. What are you doing for the Warriors?

Just consulting? Yeah, basically. So I'm just basically a resource. So, you know, I go up and try to spend three days a month with them. But other than that, I'm just here if they want me to look at something or deal with something. Just a resource for anyone that coaches or players that need me. Steph seems like he'd be in your wheelhouse as somebody to talk hoops with

and all that stuff. Yeah, I mean, he's a great guy and great to talk hoops with. At the same time, there's not a lot to coach the guy on. Yeah, sure. You know, he's got it dialed so like hey Steph ever thought about yeah shooting a 32 foot three instead of a 31 foot three yeah I mean it's you know it's it's phenomenal to be associated with a great organization I love Steve Kerr of the culture he's built uh you know so I it's one of those things where I'm happy to be involved in the game still. I love my time there and want more of it, and I don't have more time.

So it's kind of like this kind of frustrating but kind of perfect scenario for me. So would you ever want to go all in and run a team or anything or down the road maybe? We'll see. I mean, right now I really love waking up with my kids taking them just getting them fed getting them to school picking them up after school

being an Uber driver for the next four or five hours and getting them to bed we're chauffeurs yeah exactly parents are chauffeurs you know and I really value that

and that that part of their life that impressionable stage of their life is gonna go and you never get it back

and so for me like I've, I worked and worked and worked and put myself in a position where I can still work and do things, but I can do them on my terms and still have that. So right now I'm still really, really valuing that over changing my lifestyle and losing that, even though some of the opportunities that I could have are really exciting. Are you, Are any of your kids playing youth soccer? My one daughter played club this last year, last couple of years, but I think that's going to be it.

It was just crazy. So she's in club volleyball now, both of them. I mean, the clubs that gets the monetization of sports, you have to choose at 12 or younger. That's what I was going to ask you. It's frustrating. How would you fix the youth sports scene? I hate it. My daughter is basically all soccer now and she's not even 12 yet and it bothers me it just sucks

it does and i think it's you know you can't i don't know that you can change it's like and basically what it looks like to me is like it's monetization the club says if i can have this kid for 11 months i can charge them 200 you know 2500 or 4500 or whatever it is for the year instead of sharing it with volleyball, soccer, baseball, whatever it is. And so it's someone saying, look, this is the way our business model works. But I think that's why some of the MRIs are tough when you look at our young guys coming to the league, because they've been on the same rollercoaster tracks for 15 years already. Whereas, you know, other eras, guys were cross-training playing different sports which I also think gave you a lot I think the parents that you know try to specialize early and try to you know buy the 10,000 hours it's a mistake you know I think some kids obviously are going to get

through but it's for me it's about a kid's love for the sport and one way to keep them loving it is to have them play other sports so here's the frustrating part to this because i 100 agree with you but these kids now and i even include my daughter in this where they're good at one sport and they don't want they mess around with the second sport and they're not the best at it and there's kids that are better and they lose confidence and it's almost like everybody's so afraid to fail now. That's been frustrating for me as a parent. I don't know.

My daughter played basketball on her school team and she was the second best player on the team. They lost in the finals. She felt like it was her fault and she didn't ever practice. It's like, it's fine. You're 11. You made the finals. This is great.

Tell her to come talk to me. Lost a few games in my day. Yeah, but it seems like people either want to be they're all in they can't just casually do anything right and you you know you it gets frustrating you can't you have to commit to a sport and if you miss a sport or you don't play well you feel like you're not going to make it the next year and everything's about results results results instead instead of development and enjoyment. These academy teams now, when you hit 12, 13 in LA, in Southern California, and they're playing four three-hour practices a week,

and then they have tournaments in the weekends. They're playing three, four games a weekend. What is this? I don't remember having the amount of homework my kids have in the sixth grade. Their time, they're not just out on the street playing like we grew up. And they're slime. That's another thing. Everyone's got slime.

I had to ban that. I banned that. I told them there's a lot of carcinogens, so it's not allowed in my house, which is unfounded. Well, do you see what happened? So, for people who don't know, I don't know if it's Southern California or everywhere, but all these kids ages third to, like, seventh grade are making slime out of like borax yeah that's what it was so i was like no no so here's what happened and it's terrible but somebody got third degree burns from making it the wrong way and all the parents now are forwarding around

like this is what happens if so hopefully slime is gonna die it seems like it was one of the worst ideas ever i was in my daughter's bedroom two weeks ago, and there's this big Borax bottle, and I'm like, you have Borax in your room? What is this? Oh, slime. Slime's the worst. I don't get it.

We got in a fight the other day about something, and she's like, well, you took away my slime. It was some therapeutic measure. I was like, just please relax. What's happened to society? I've been in Canada. They don't have slime. Uh, I hope not. It's two, two quick questions. Uh, um, 2020 Olympic, the Canadian team, are we in good shape?

Could be. I mean, for sure. I mean, I think we have the second most NBA players now to the U S Wiggins Tibbs put a lot of minutes on Wiggins. You have to talk to Tibbs. He did. Wiggins is headed for 3,000 minutes. Say, Tibbs, slow down. You're not making the playoffs. He should be okay for 2020, but his career could be over by 2024.

Slow down, Tibbs. But, you know, I think those guys, if they take, this is again, this is a generation, so I don't know if the Olympics means as much anymore it should for the Canadians they've never even like made the

I know but like medal but it's again it's your peer groups and your you're like you know your your circle on

Instagram and Snapchat do they care about the Olympics or do they just it's like what we just talked about youth sports

I don't want to go we're gonna lose it'll be embarrassing sure yeah so I so you got Wiggins, Tristan Thompson. Yep. Corey Joseph, Stauskas, Olenek.

Olenek, nice stretch five for the Olympics. Anthony Bennett didn't work out. Anthony Bennett, can we save him? We'll see. We'll see. He could come back in the fold. Tyler Ennis, we'll see what happens with him. I'm not giving up on Tyler Ennis yet.

No. And, you know, I don't know where these guys will stack up, but Andrew Nicholson and some of these guys that are still in the league and, you know, in the international game, they can stretch and shoot. So Wiggins, Olenek, high screens. A lot of that. You know, the other one we have, the best, is he a freshman or 10th grader in the country right now? R.J. Barrett.

Oh, that's good. Why don't you make a deal with LeVar Ball to get them dual Canadian-U.S. citizenship? I don't even think they're American. They're just Los Angeles citizens. He doesn't want them playing anywhere else. They're the country of Los Angeles. Last question, soccer. Give me your top three right now.

Players. Players? Yeah. I mean, I think you kind of have to put Ronaldo in there. See, everybody says it that way. We don't say that with basketball where we're disappointed. It's like, I guess we have to put LeBron one. And with Ronaldo, it's always, I guess Ronaldo.

I don't think he's, I don't know. I feel like maybe I've swung the other way. It's like the MVP race. I think it says more about you and our personalities collectively than it does about the actual players. So part of me is like, maybe Ronaldo's not necessarily my favorite guy, and so I don't rate him as highly as he should. But I think he, in some ways, if I were to knock him,

I'd say he's at times benefits from playing on such a great team where Messi's team would struggle without him. Having said that, Ronaldo's been unbelievable for a long, long time. He's basically LeBron, right? Everybody's just picking him apart every year. What he's been able to accomplish and the things he's done. But he's just he's not the type of guy who's going to pick the ball up dribble through the team anymore and score like messy can or like he could have done 10 years ago um but he still has changed his game and adapted and gets in the right spots to finish

and his numbers are strong hair strong hair game yeah physically physically he's you know he's he's gonna do i'll do all right, you know. Friday night, he'll be fine. But Messi to me, though, is number one. He's the best player to ever play the game. Okay. For me. Best player to ever play the game.

You know, like I know in Argentina they love Maradona, but, you know, Maradona played in an era where guys smoked cigarettes at halftime and half the guys were stayed in South America. Right. You know, whereas nowadays there's like over 200 Brazilians in the Champions League and you could probably say the same for Argentina almost.

And, you know, you're playing against track stars every day in a congested fixture schedule. And every game is worth so much and seen so far around the world. And what he's able to do under those parameters is is off the charts and Thierry Henry tells a story about one day in practice I've been to Barcelona practice before and they'll play like 11 a side like a full game but on half a field full goal and everything and even in that half a field the 20 players excluding the goalies will be within 15 yards like the lines of the two defense they're're all bunched up, right? And it's like just this unbelievable speed of thought and ability and the way they tic-tac and play in those tight spaces. But apparently one day, and we're talking about when this happened,

they're the best team in the world and arguably one of the best teams ever. Messi looked to the coach for a foul, didn't get it, it was pissed ran back to his goalie when his goalie got the ball and said basically like tin cup like ball gets the ball dribbles through basically 20 players scores and stares at the coach i mean it's so unheard of like that's not even like i don't jordan can you like you can't you know what i mean there's not even an equivalence in in um in basketball so he for me he's the best player to ever play the game. The two things he does better than anyone I've ever seen are when he's in front of somebody and they're trying to catch him from behind

and you could just get tripped at any time. He has a way of dancing over the trips. Yeah, he does. And they never actually trip him. Yeah. And then his ability when he's going by somebody to hop over their feet and keep and like nothing ever happened i've just never seen anybody do stuff like that it's like a ballerina yep and that's why guys are so i mean one way to kind

of explain it is too is when he's a he's running at you he's putting his he's so low to the ground and he's small and he uses it to his advantage and quick he puts his feet down more than you do so like as you're picking yours up he's and he's gone the other way it to his advantage and quick, he puts his feet down more than you do. So as you're picking yours up, he's... And he's gone the other way, you know, or fakes the other way. You're trying to recover and you recover again. And he's just... What basketball player is like that?

Man, he's... I mean, it's a little bit of... I mean, they're totally different, but a little bit of what it seems like it would be to guard James Harden when... Yeah, a little bit. You're going backwards and you don't know how to... Yeah, a little bit. But going backwards and you don't know how to yeah a little

bit but i think the the the in overall ability but i think that it's that's true in transition but i think it's more like the water bug like the quick feet thing isaiah like if isaiah thomas got the boys coming at you full head of steam at the top of the key you know from his own foul line true not a lot gonna happen you know you have no idea which way he's going. Or pull up, and you're kind of like, oh, wow, there he goes again. So I think that's kind of the same analogy, but obviously he's able to— They don't call Isaiah anymore for the push-off, which has helped his 30 points a game. When did they stop calling you for the push-offs?

Like 2006? Great guys. Did you have to win the MVP first? Probably. I think it was after my second. When did you realize you could push off on the drives um you know what i i did i learned from kevin johnson was when a guy went to hand check you like grab his arm oh so it was like whenever you'd reach to get a little hand check in he would grab like a martial arts almost grab your your hand and pull you the way you're going that sounds like donald trump's handshakes when he goes to handshake somebody pulls them in

let's not even go there but uh you do the so you would pull so if a guy reached and you either swiped his hand like he's reaching towards you keep his hand going behind you yeah i mean so he's coming even farther towards you as you're going by him. That was kind of... Did you feel like you got superstar calls at the end? Not really. Once you became a superstar? You never felt it?

Not really. Because Westbrook now is the all-time, just gets everything. It's like he goes into traffic, he's getting a call. I never really felt that at all, actually. But... But you went the other way.

You felt like you weren't getting enough calls. I never really wanted... Don't give me calls but like sometimes i felt like i could have gotten a call and i didn't get it but there were times when you would drive into the basket of a big guy and you're just bouncing off them trying to get the layup up and trying to get the three-point play yeah there's a lot of times though that they didn't care i think maybe i wasn't that explosive and they would just be like, no. Keep begging. So you have Messi 1, Ronaldo 2, and Pulisic 3. I would love to see a B3.

I would love to see a B. Ronaldo 2A, Pulisic 2B. I think Neymar's. So Neymar to me is, he's like the Marc Messier slash. Come again? I don't even know. Well, in hockey, like Marc Messier. As a sidekick. He's a the Marc Messier slash... Come again? I don't even know. Well, in hockey, like Marc Messier. As a sidekick.

Was the big gamer. He was the quote-unquote sidekick, but he wasn't. And in the big games, would rise to the occasion, and you could really rely on him. I don't even know if there's an NBA equivalent on that, because in the NBA, everyone's a superstar. But Neymar, like in the French game, Neymar played the best seven minutes of soccer

I've ever seen in my life. He was actually great the whole game his and I think that's sometimes what people I think his detractors sometimes don't realize like how hard it is to play against top teams and to want the ball and to constantly try to go by someone yeah like he even the pressure playing great teams he's still just continually trying to take someone on. Which, you know, if he gets tackled 50 times and the one time he gets by someone and gets it across the face of goal and hits someone and goes in, you win. So like, his ability

to continually never lose his confidence, never lose that will to beat someone off the dribble. I mean, he's in that PSG game when they had basically 10 guys in front of their 18 yard box, he still tried to go every time. And I just, I respect him as a winner and a battler and a fighter like to say like, I'm going, cause if we can't just keep lofting the ball, then we

got to try to beat somebody before we make a pass into that area. And so he did have that seven minutes, but I actually left. Cause when PSG, we were on vacation when psg got the psg got the away goal i was like forget it my wife was like how long is this game i was like all right we can go now and so i missed the seven minutes and i already left thinking man neymar was unbelievable today like attacked every time was so much he got fouled a hundred times yeah you know which so he's he's up there he's closing the gap on on on messi in a way but messi's just out of this world neymar is my favorite my favorite he's one of my favorite ever um athletes in like the way he moves his ability to like move is so graceful fast

his balance his coordination his creativity i mean he's just one of the most beautiful athletes i've ever seen you know what else i like is he's got he's got a little fu in him for sure which he wouldn't he wouldn't be where he is yeah you know he wouldn't be in the top three if he didn't he'll take he'll take someone down once in a while just because he's mad at something and it's like i don't take this guy out of me being a tottenham fan i think the same of deli alley i don't know if you've watched him unbelievable young player and he just on the edge of being sometimes you know too much he's got so much confidence but he's also got like that you know like i don't care who you are i we can just start fighting right now and i'll beat you up. That kind of thing for a skinny 20-year-old.

Can you imagine if Draymond was a soccer player? There would be some red cards. There would be some reds, yeah. Draymond's team's down 2-0. Oh, God, somebody's rolling around on the ground. What happened? The ball's over there. Draymond on a corner kick, just take it out, dudes.

He'd have been an old-school center back for sure. He did yesterday to Beverly. Did you see that? No, I missed it. Beverly was getting a little frisky, so Draymond Beverly. Did you see that? No, I missed it. Beverly was getting a little frisky, so Draymond just laid him out on a pick. And Beverly loved it.

He got up. I mean, Draymond and Beverly are going to be in the third world war if it ever happens. They're soulmates. Yeah, when it happens, that's it. Everyone's going to have to run out of the arena as they fight to the death. I love it. You want to plug your charity soccer thing?

Yeah, this is our 10th year. Steve Nash Foundation Showdown, charity soccer game in New York City, June 21st. It's usually the week before the draft. It's the night before the draft every year. Oh, great. Yeah, the night before the draft.

It's a seven-a-side soccer game on the Lower East Side. NBA players and international soccer stars. We've had unbelievable crew of guys over the years. Thierry Henry, Robbie Fowler, Steve McManaman, Zanetti, Cordoba, Giuseppe Rossi comes every year. Go down the line, we've had

some unbelievable players. Can you get Pulisic? I think that would be huge. I would take him under your wing right now. Has he ever seen a basketball game? You just got to reach out there. What I'll say to him is, this can be your game if you come this year for the 10th anniversary i'll put your name in the title yeah it'll be yours forever yes let's get him get in on him early that'll be huge if we can get who is the best

nba player has ever been in that game uh i mean in terms of how good they were at soccer yeah i think like luau dang leandro barbosa i would i would have guessed barbosa yeah those two are um is barbosa just to play until he's 50 because he's such a good guy people want him on the team? Yeah, I think so. Is he like the ultimate example of that? How old is Albino?

I think he's my age. He's like 47. He could play a while. And he loves it. He loves it. Dudley's another one. Dudley will play as long as he wants. And then he'll move into that

Juwan Howard assistant coach, good guy role. He'd be great at that. If he doesn't get a media gig, he loves his media too. I know. I got to have him on soon. I get jealous when he's on other things. He must be great. I've had him on. He's good. He's getting better too. Steve Nash, it was a pleasure.

It's fun. Thanks for having me. Thanks again to T-Mobile. Don't forget, baseball season's coming up. They're giving a free year of MLB.TV premium. That's an almost $113 It's fun. Thanks for having me. On April 4th, you get your free year of MLB.TV Premium in that T-Mobile Tuesdays app or go to T-Mobile.com backslash MLB. Blackouts and other restrictions apply. See terms of use for details. And thanks so much to Cabbage. They help small business owners access simple, flexible funding right away without the headaches that come with applying for a traditional loan. It's a simple way for businesses to get flexible access to up to $100,000.

Visit cabbage.com slash BS and you'll get a $100 visa gift card when you qualify. That is K-A-B-B-A-G-E dot com slash BS. Don't forget I'm on channel 33 with the Reese Witherspoon podcast. If you love Reese Witherspoon, I If you love Reese Witherspoon, I'll listen to that one. Me, Amanda, and Juliet. And also the Masked Man show is doing WrestleMania all week. I think I'm going on that one on Friday too.

And we have another BS podcast coming up on Friday with a famous person. Steve Nash is a famous person. Another famous person. And a good conversation coming on Friday. I would mark this one on your calendar. Until then, the BS Podcast.

I don't want to see them on the way so I never want to say I don't have feelings with them On the wayside. I'm a person never on. I don't have to ever.