The Bill Simmons Podcast - The Boogie Rescue, All Hail Andy Ruiz, the Feel-Good Yankees, and Game 2 Overreactions With Joe House, Kevin Clark, and JackO | The Bill Simmons Podcast

Episode Date: June 3, 2019

HBO and The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Joe House to discuss Game 2 takeaways and Game 3 questions in the NBA Finals (3:15). Then Bill talks to Kevin Clark about Andy Ruiz, Anthony Joshua's stunning loss, and the rematch people already want (41:48). Finally Bill calls up his old friend JackO to talk Red Sox struggles, the flourishing Yankees, 2020 election speculations, and more (1:13:43). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Tonight's episode of the Bill Simmons Podcast on the Ringer Podcast Network brought to you by DAZN. What a weekend for DAZN. If there was ever a weekend to have DAZN, it was this weekend. Andy Ruiz Jr. beats Anthony Joshua 12 to 1, 11 to 1, depending on where you got it, underdog. I would say it was the greatest moment in DAZN history. And if you didn't have it, boy, do you feel dumb. Smart TVs, tablet, mobile gaming consoles. You can set it up on any device.

Go to DAZN.com or download the DAZN app in the Apple or Android store. Create an account. Start watch across any of your devices. We're going to talk about Kevin. We're going to talk to Kevin Clark about that fight a little bit later. I feel

like we're in the front row of DAZN. It's a thing now. Kyle, it's a thing. It's a thing. It's a thing. That was a real fight. Ground floor, baby. Twitter was going nuts for it. I mean, it's been a thing all over the world, but America, here we go. DAZN, D-A-Z-N.com. Check it out. We're also brought to you by TheRinger.com, the world's greatest website, where yet again in the month of May, we had our best month ever.

We keep doing it. Every month, we break whatever our record was for the website and for the podcast network. It's going great. Thank you for spreading the word. Thank you for the support. And thanks to everybody who reached out. It was our three-year anniversary for the website on June 1st. So thanks to everybody behind the scenes and all the writers and all the hosts and everybody else that we have. This is hard. It's hard to launch something. It's hard to build it. And it's gone really well so

far. So thanks to everybody out there. And thanks for spreading the word for us. Coming up, we're going to talk to Joe House about game two. We're going to talk to Kevin Clark about the Ruiz-Joshua fight. And we're going to talk to, um, Jacko, my old buddy. Cause the Yankees are kicking the Red Sox ass. He called me out on Twitter. He said, he said I was ducking him. Um,

we're going to do all that before we get to Pearl jam. Want to mention new ringer podcast feed. It's called ringer dish. You can subscribe right now on iTunes, on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's what we did. We took jam session and we took tea time, on Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's what we did. We took Jam Session and we took Tea Time, which are two delightful podcasts on Channel 33 about celebrity culture. We have moved them to Ringer Dish. They're going to be going every week. We

also are going to have a new Monday podcast on that feed as well. And it's going to be the home for realsies, Kyle. Come check it out, y'all. Yeah. Zoe Simmons. Probably like every three to four weeks. Weighing in on teen culture. This is not nepotism. She's actually just really good at doing podcasts. So we taped one of those too next week or this week starting on Tuesday. Every single day we'll have a new ring or dish podcast including for Reelsies with my daughter.

But that is launching for real. No pun intended. On Tuesday, you can subscribe right now. Please do. iTunes, Spotify, Google, wherever you get your pods. Do it. Ring or dish. All right, here we taping this part of the podcast about 8 o'clock Pacific time. The Warriors just held off the Raptors. Game two, going back to Golden State now. 1-1. House, how will you remember this game 40 years from now?

It's the boogie game! Boogie! He's back! Didn't we just say three days ago on this podcast how they made such a huge mistake playing him in game one? Wow. Of course. This is an overreaction podcast, Bill Sippins. Yeah.

It's funny. He started the game, wasn't crazy about it. He didn't look great, but I thought he really made a difference, especially when Looney went out and kind of changed a little bit of what the Raptors wanted to do, which was funny because it never seemed like he was running more than half speed, right? It was like watching us play pickup. I do think he looked a lot more comfortable with the speed, though. Yeah, sure.

I agree with you that he wasn't personally moving any faster, but he was comfortable with the speed of the guys going around him as opposed to what we observed on Thursday night. Yeah, he looked like it was almost like watching Moses when Moses was on the Wizards, when Moses just had the one speed he was going, or not the Wizards, the Bullets. When he just had that one speed, he was half speed the whole time. A lot of subplots to unpack in this game.

First of all, the Warriors basically, at halftime, you, me, and Sal, we might have a little action on the Warriors in this series. There was a lot of, what do we do? Raps have a big lead. It's not looking good. I am on the record with the text to you guys saying, I think this is done. The Raptors are up five at halftime.

They did not get a single call. The refs were really the sixth, seventh, and eighth men in that first half. And I just thought the refs were going to blow them out. Then the Warriors come out and did their classic old school 18 and nothing run, which really set the tone. And yet when Klay went down and who knows when he comes back, it really looked dark there for the Warriors. I think they were up eight to 10, but it was just Curry was the only guy who could create his own shot on the court. They weren't creating stuff really at all for Cousins other than he was the Bill Walton type

passer. What was your mindset? I sound like Doris Burke. House, what was your mindset up 10 with eight minutes left? Well, Doris, I have to tell you, it felt like Golden State, even with various guys getting hurt and being out and the boxing one that Toronto put on them, it wasn't until the three-point play that Kawhi had. With the technical. With the technical and the two free throws, yes.

But I thought for half a second, you know, the Warriors just may let this slip through their fingers because their role guys played with such confidence. Whatever Iggy took between the leg injury Thursday night and the game tonight, he made the first two baskets after halftime to get them going on that 18-0 run, and then he made the last basket of the game. So really it was the...

He made three baskets. And they were the biggest baskets, I would say. But across the board, the Quinn Cook, Sean Livingston had a much better game. And the basketball IQ of the Warriors, we are reminded of it once again. That's what distinguishes them. They took advantage of the pressure that Toronto was putting out on the perimeter and all of those alley-oops at the rim. Bogut was a beneficiary of it. Draymond had a couple alley-oops. all of those alley-oops at the rim. Bogut was the beneficiary of it.

Draymond had a couple alley-oops. He both passed alley-oops and executed them. And Boogie as well. All of that taking advantage, like basically inside the half court, breaking down that pressure and get to the basket with little two-on-ones, little three-on-ones, and, effectively alley-oop layups. That, that was the thing to me that, that made this feel like, you know, Golden State kind of had control of the game. Agree. The Raptors were a little too overzealous on D,

especially with the guys who weren't like the big time shot creator dudes. And they were getting beat on those little backdoor alley-oop. It always seemed like they were scrambling because something bad had happened. I thought that was one reason they lost. I thought the other reason was they just missed a lot of open looks over and over and over again. I felt like, I don't know what the open look number was for this game, but it felt like a lot. There was one big moment. I think it was in the late in the second quarter where Norman Powell had a three and if he made it, they would have gone up 14 and he missed it. And then the Warriors brought, came right back down and Clay made a three. And I was saying to nephew Kyle, six point swing. And there were, there were a couple of moments like that in this game where either the raps didn't have that. It was like the opposite of game one. They didn't have that shot

to push them over the hump the other way. And then when they needed a basket, even that last minute, remember before Danny green hit that three, they missed like two shots. There was that other sequence near the end where Kawhi kept getting offensive rebounds and they just kept missing. They, uh, I thought that if you just looked at who was on the court once Clay went out, they definitely had more talent on the court. You know? And they just couldn't get over the hump. We've been wondering.

So the Raptors shot 37%. And that stretch at the beginning of the third quarter is like the first quarter of basketball that Toronto has had that kind of punch in the mouth where they've missed a bunch. They miss a bunch of shots all in a row. Yeah. In like four games. Yeah, they look tight. They won five games in a row coming into tonight.

And through the first half, all those all those role guys still had that sort of swagger that home swagger that you know we belong here we think we can win this game kind of swagger and the punch in the mouth was like a few consecutive missed shots at the beginning of the third quarter and it snowballed and they did battle back i mean credit to them and it did take clay getting hurt and it did take a little I mean, credit to them. And it did take clay getting hurt. And it did take a little bit of defensive innovation with the boxing one they put on Curry. I've always liked the boxing one, as you know. Well, I want to know,

I can't tell from the stats cause we're doing this like right after the game ended, but I want to know what time in the game, Steph Curry made his last basket. Cause it feels like it was right late-minute mark in the fourth quarter. Oh, yeah. That's what it was exactly. It was 106-94 with like six minutes left. And then they didn't score again until that last diggy shot.

It was a rock fight. This was not an NBA hardwood classics type of game. It definitely was pretty ugly. It was dramatic. I thought the crowd got a little nervous. You could kind of feel the energy shift. I thought, to me, I thought the energy shifted in the first half because even though I'm looking at the stats

and the Warriors had 26 fouls and the Raptors had 22, that's the final result of the fouls. That did not reflect kind of the feel of that first half where I thought the Warriors got to lay with a lot, especially the way they were defending Kawhi. They were really, really, really physical with him. And they just established it from the get-go. And they did the thing that we thought they were going to do after game one, which was not worry as much about taking out Kawhi, worry about the other guys.

I didn't think they would be as physical as they were with Kawhi. But you and I both, we were texting during the first half, had a little bit of a late 90s, early 2000s Dick Bavetta kind of feel. Did you feel that? Just a whiff? A little Bavetta-ish whiff to the festivities? It did in a couple moments where it felt like Toronto might just bust loose. The Warriors did get a fortuitous call or two.

It felt like. What do I know? A couple of little random touch fouls out of nowhere. I was like, oh. But, you know, we had the Scott Foster, Tony Brothers, Ed Malloy crew, which is either going to mean something. You just don't know what. But I would say the Warriors got a very fair whistle tonight. which is either going to, it's going to mean something. You just don't know what,

but I would say the Warriors got a very fair whistle tonight. And, you know, the other break that they got, and the announcers kind of glossed over this, the very last play that led to the Iggy three, they trapped Curry. It seemed like they were kind of half fouling him, the refs weren't calling it. And then he threw the Gerald Henderson to the James Worthy, Gerald Henderson steal pass, that floater across the court.

And it looked like Kawhi was going to pick it off. And Livingston got it. But if you watch it, it looked like Kawhi had the lead on the ball. You know what play I'm talking about? Yeah, I know exactly what you're talking about. And I had the exact same reaction. I thought, oh, that's a turnover. Yeah, and I don't understand

that I'm watching the shown replays right now on my TV as we're talking. I don't understand how Kawhi didn't get that. In fact, I think he would have been my first draft pick to get that steal on that play because it was basically a 50-50 ball, but he had a slight

lead on it and he had the long-ass arms. And if he had gotten it, I think it would have been a layup. So it was just one of those nights for the Raps. But you noticed it too, right? It had a little worthy Henderson feel. Sure, absolutely. And speaking of going backwards, when Clay went down, it started to get a little 89 Lakers, 87 Celtics-ish

with are the Warriors going to pass the point and no return with these injuries? Because, and we saw Clay kicked his leg out. It looked like Danny Green fouled him, but they showed a different replay and it turned out he didn't. And then you could tell something was wrong because he kept like trying to shake it out.

And then like eight, nine plays later, it looked like he was really hurt. showed him after the game he had ice on his hamstring but you're talking if he's not ready for game three i from what i've heard i don't think kd's gonna be ready either game three is gonna be wednesday and then uh and then curry should be healthier than what he was but you know you know, if you remember the 89 Lakers, this is what happened. Just too many injuries. Probably would have lost anyway. Well, as I will know, because I was shocked by how much bounce Iggy had.

Maybe he was, like, preserving energy or whatever. I just thought his legs looked way better. He was a lot more bouncier active than I anticipated with the way, you know, he was down at the end of, of a game one and then Emma MRI. And it's like, Jesus.

So, you know, this is the way that the warriors are going to lose. And at some point we've been saying all over all these years, they've had a pretty great run of health. Um, and, and, and,

you know, over the entirety of the five year span here. And obviously the depth of, of, you know, Katie superstar, when you have a bunch of superstars, guys can go down and you can withstand it.

But this was really a testament to the queen cooks and Andrew Bogut. And, you know, Looney had a couple good minutes while he was in there you know battling then got hurt he made a huge shot yeah i mean they they still have these guys stepping up and i just think that the collective basketball iq of that team and their ability to to adjust and respond to stuff um they They played a hand in helping Toronto miss all those buckets at the beginning

of the third quarter. It wasn't just open looks that Toronto was missing. Yeah, they still... I wasn't positive they would have this without Durant against a really,

really good team on the road, but they still have that six minutes of greatness in them. Now, if Thompson's hurt... You know what I mean? Yeah, no. It wasn't an avalanche of threes like we're used to with them. Now, if Thompson's hurt. You know what I mean? Yeah. It wasn't an avalanche of threes

like we're used to with them. And D. And guys just really, really assert themselves. You left out one person when you were complimenting all different people. Steve Kerr, really this whole playoffs has been awesome. And I thought

even that Houston series, the desperation that they just played with from that first game, like he wasn't fucking around that series. You know, I think from that Clippers series, I think was a little eye-opening for everybody. But from that game one of that Rocket series where it was clear, he was like,

I'm just not sitting back and rolling it out. Like we're trying stuff, we're doing stuff, we're trying weird lineups. We're going to try weird defensive stuff. We're just going for it. And they've had that mentality now for five, six weeks. What's cool is he's putting people in. Like Bogut was in big moments.

Who didn't even play in game one? And he sat Jordan Bell. He's really seasoned Cook to the point that, is Quinn Cook good? It kind of feels like Quinn Cook might be good. He's good on this team. Yes. With this concept, with understanding what's expected of him,

getting to the spot. Like, so many times he was the release valve as they rotated around, and he had good looks because the defense couldn't scramble around to him. And Toronto obviously made the defensive judgment that they're going to live with Quinn Cook taking those shots.

If he shoots three for five from three-pointer like he did 60% from three, then he's going to be a difference maker. 21 minutes and nine points with three threes, that makes a difference. And then I love the way they use Draymond defensively in this game. One of the things they did that I don't think basketball teams do enough is switch stuff up during the game, where sometimes they'll make the adjustments.

And then that's just here. Here's what we're doing for game two. And they use Draymond. They had him on Kawhi sometimes. Other times they would put them on a non-shooter and just have them do the free safety thing. And it really depended on the feel of what was going on, how they're using them.

Look, this was, you know, we're now in year six of the Iggy, Clay, Steph, all these dudes in the same team, year five with Kerr, and they've had a lot of big wins. This one's weirdly way up there because, you know, especially when Clay goes down with 10 minutes left, but you think you think it almost felt like Toronto was going to blow them out at a couple points in the second quarter there. Nobody really played well for them. I guess Boogie was the only one you would say would overachieve.

Curry didn't. He had no points there for a quarter or plus. Ended with 23. Didn't have a great game. Klay was good. Is he going to come out that he's sick? Is he sick? Yeah, he's sick.

But I think at this point there's something wrong with everybody. Draymond had just an awesome all-around game, but it wasn't like he made seven threes or anything.

It was just... The turnover's driving me bananas. I know, and he had a couple of dumb outlets and all that, but it's like you said.

I can't take that. The star of the game was the collective hoops IQ, and then to let that last sequence in Iggy, that's why you have dudes like that. And that leads me to the quick Iggy conversation I wanted to have. I just think he's going to end up being in the Hall of Fame.

I think he is, you know, what guys like Michael Cooper and Big Shot Rob and all these dudes over the years. I was just going to... That's right. Is Big Shot Rob in the Hall of Fame? He's not, but he should be. I tried to make the case for my book.

He's not. But I think the difference with Iggy was that he had this whole half of his career before... I talked about this last week a little on the pod about... He's a franchise guy for seven, eight years there and putting a big minutes and stuff like that he had a good year in denver he's been on the warriors now six years i think he's gonna

go down when we talk about the iconic role players in playoff history he has to be on the first wave of guys you would throw out from you out from the last 60 years of basketball. You go like Havlicek early before he became a superstar and a starter. And then you go into the 70s and you go like Paul Silas as a sixth man who finished games. Just these great, almost like overqualified role guys. He's been one of the better examples. If you look at his basketball reference page, he hasn't averaged 10 points a game in six years

since the Denver season. He has never averaged 10 points a game with the Warriors in six years, but he's fine with it. And the great thing about him is he'll guard the best guy on the other team. He knows who he is. He always makes the right play. Doesn't try to do anything he can't do.

And over and over again, he's made shots like tonight. And you know, I think everybody's going to get in the hall of fame. So the hall of fame has become stupid and it was stupid 10 years ago. And I wrote my book trying to blow it up, but I think he's, I mean, Mitch Richmond's in the hall of fame. I think Mitch Richmond can be in the hall of fame. I'm pretty sure Iggy could be in. Yeah. Well, he's... I mean, Mitch Richmond's in the Hall of Fame. I think if Mitch Richmond can be in the Hall of Fame, I'm pretty sure Iggy could be in. Yeah.

Well, if there's some sort of playoff Hall of Fame, he's definitely in that first wave. But where does he rank for you? For the all-time great role guys on a great team, who would you put him in? I'm having a hard time because he's a starter, and he's been a starter since he arrived so i don't think of starters as role guys necessarily he's a he's he's absolutely at the

like very guts of the identity of this team you know the top rung is draymond and clay and steph but iggy is such a like critical crucial component, a crucial ingredient, an ingredient without which this stew would be tasteless. It would be a bad stew. You would say, oh, this stew, it's got a lot of parts, but it needs something to really give it some oomph. Where's the umami? Iggy is the umami.

So, I mean, is Joe Dumar a role player? No, no, no. He was too good. I think it's like the Big Shot Rob, right? Where Big Shot Rob was not a role player. He was usually like the third or fourth best guy on whatever team he was on for a while there anyway. But Big Shot Rob never had a portion of his career like Iggy had, where he was the guy.

That's the thing. Like, Iggy's had two careers. Yeah, I mean, I was going to say Dennis Johnson, but he was too good. I mean, he was playing 40 minutes a game, and the league was a lot thinner back then, so you could have, you know, a starting five wasn't like what we'd have with a starting five now. then. So you could have, you know, a starting five wasn't like what we'd have with a starting five. Now, the thing with him that I don't think he gets enough credit for, remember he gets traded to Denver. He's a free agent. Everybody assumed he was going back to Denver and he signed with Golden State. And at the time it was surprising. And it was also kind of a declaration by them that they were ready to become a real team.

Remember? And then that led to the next year. It was Clay. Draymond wasn't Draymond yet. Bogut was still there. Curry was rounding into what he would eventually become. And Andre was the guy that made them seem credible. And that led to 2014.

They had the great series against the Clips and that I think seasoned them for the next year. But he's been there the whole time. Finals MVP, you know, I never feel great when the best guy, you really have to have a shit series not to win the finals MVP if you're the best guy

in my opinion but it's on his resume and it's great he's he's get say his finals mvp for the rest of his life so uh a really great great great non-superstar i think would be the legacy for him right i'll go along with that yeah that's a good description. Or super great non-superstar. A great non-superstar. And I wonder, like, you know, he's somebody that would... Hugh Mabee. And I think Bosh was a great semi-superstar. But, like, had to do a lot of the Iggy stuff when he was on those LeBron Wade teams.

He had a bigger workload. He got more shots. He was a better player than Iggy is, frankly. But same thing. Is he going to make it? Somebody sacrificed a lot to

be part of something more special. I guess the cutoff line is probably Bosh. I think he's too good. And Gasol, I think, is another one who sacrificed a lot. Is Bosh going to make the Hall of Fame? I mean, he should. Mitch Richmond's in. Once Mitch

Richmond got in, it's like, were you good? You're in. Congratulations. You're a Hall of Famer. You know that's my argument. Your dude, Anton Jameson's going to make it. He's going to make the Hall of Fame. No. He is. He's going to make it. He scored 20,000 points. I can't abide it. I mean, the baseline that he gave up to LeBron, I'll never forgive it.

He was the wizard. Go ahead. Quick break, and then we're going to continue. You know how hard it is to find a new job. Look at Boogie Cousins. He couldn't even find a team last summer. Thought he was going to the Lakers. Nope.

Couldn't go back to the Pelicans. What was he going to do? Ends up taking, I think, one year, five million to go to the Lakers. Nope. Couldn't go back to the Pelicans. What was he going to do? Ends up taking, I think, one year, $5 million to go to the Warriors. Now he might get a ring. That's a good case scenario. There's bad case scenarios too. Well, what if you had your own personal recruiter to help you find a better job? ZipRecruiter's technology can do that for you.

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better job. And speaking of downloads, don't forget, ring or dish. Subscribe right now on Apple and you can get it when we start putting a new podcast up there on tuesday it is going to be the world's premiere celebrity culture feed so it's a place to find for realsies every once in a while too yeah uh all right back to us we had to give house a minute to take a breath after finding out antoine jameson is going to make the option he has dare you i'll tell you another thing. Glenn Rice eventually might make it if this keeps going the way it goes.

He really was. The 97 stats were in parallel. There's going to be a world where Jalen makes it. I'm starting to talk myself into it. Three years in Michigan. The whole NBA career he had.

Countdown. I don't know. I don't have any problem with it. I'm being serious for 10 seconds. If you want to put the Fab Five into the NBA Hall of Fame, I mean, the Basketball Hall of Fame. I'm sorry, not the NBA. I'm for that. What they ushered in, in terms of, you know, a cultural change, a kind of player empowerment thing.

Like, it's a controversial kind of era. But I definitely credit those guys with a lot of, you know, opening up some eyes to what college basketball is all about. Like laying bare some of the underbelly of college basketball. And, you know, what they did stylistically, culturally, the impact that they had is indelible and will go on forever. If you want to put them in the Hall of Fame, I'm good with it. Well, at the very least, C-Web should be in as a representative of all of them. And nobody has a more complicated relationship with C-Web than you do. But having had to sit through many of his half-assed Wizards games for about four or five years there.

I mean, speaking of an innovator an innovator true innovator nobody played more games come on Kyle has to beat that now come on what do you want me to do stop no we're cutting that

what an innovator I will but if you want to put him in as the Fab Five guy, that's fine. It is complicated because he called a timeout he didn't have. But for what the Fab Five meant, the sort of transformative impact they had on Cox basketball, I'm fine with it. Well, and also, now that Jawan's the coach, they've kind of become America's unofficial team, I feel like.

Unless you hate Michigan for some reason, or you have your own team. But for people like me, you still have Maryland. I didn't have anybody. I had Holy Cross, who got rid of scholarships while we were there. So I'm happy to jump on that bandwagon. We got to watch that Purple Rain movie, by the way. Let's watch Purple Rain and compare notes on it. Oh, they made a documentary about Holy Cross.

That's right. Yeah, the basketball. Let's talk about that. I forgot about that. I would rather watch a documentary on Holy Cross intramurals, though. We had a good run. From our era. We had a good run. What era um what happens in this what happens in this nba finals now

i i'd feel like we are now we are now uh the tes what what is it called when you in the tesla and the tesla's driving the person's not driving what's that self-drive i mean the auto yeah the auto drive the auto drive whatever it's called. I feel like we've now hit that with this finals, where we're not driving the finals anymore. I have no idea what's going to happen. You can tell me anything. I believe it. You beat me to it.

The true unknown is the health situation. Not hurt as clay. Will Steph be better from whatever it is that he suffers? The cold that he's experiencing or flu or whatever. Will he be better on Wednesday it is that he suffers the cold he's experiencing or flu or whatever, will he be better on Wednesday and you know Toronto, to their credit

they are not afraid to go on the road and beat somebody's butt that game six in Milwaukee was pretty impressive Sounds like you like Toronto I just I'm so impressed by

the quality of their depth and I thought it was the thing that was going to have them lose to Philadelphia in the second round. And they got close. I mean, it took a miracle basket by Kawhi with two seconds left.

But, you know But those guys have risen to the moment. Van Vliet, Powell, Siakam predictably regressed. How did we not pound under 19.5 points for him tonight? What's wrong with us?

For God's sake. Was he 5 for 17? 5 for 18? Well, and they were also defending those side guys a little bit better this time. It looks like Golden State is somewhere between minus 270 and minus 290 to win the series now, which seems high to me. Which is exactly where they were when the series started.

Right. We have three days rest until Wednesday, which helps them. The Friday is a murder. That's 48 hours later, they got game four. Well, is it a murder or is Kevin Durant's leg going to be better? It's a murder of Clay's hurt. The Durant thing is set up now.

I mean, think about the conversations we're having on this podcast a couple weeks ago or even last week about oh my god can you imagine what if they win the title without him can he come back if they're up to nothing it's almost embarrassing if he came back and they lost now it is like not only do they need him i don't think they can win the series unless he comes back oh that, that's interesting. That's a take. If Clay, the Clay thing did not look good. I mean, whether he can play or not, that's not one of those shake it off. I'm not a doctor.

I'm not a doctor. But I am in a whole, no, I'm not even gonna make the bad joke. It looked like a hyperextension. And as far as hamstring injuries go, I don't think a hyperextension. And as far as hamstring injuries go, I don't think a hyperextension necessarily is the word. So the thing with Clay, famous, famous, famous badass of injuries. Yeah, great point.

He's one of those quarterbacks from the 70s. It's like Ken Stabler. Ken Stabler's playing with a broken ankle. I mean, Favre. Yeah, Favre. He's like Favre-esque. It's like, oh,ler. Ken Stabler's playing with a broken ankle. I mean, Favre. Yeah, Favre. He's like Favre-esque. It's like, oh yeah, Clay has a sprained ankle. He's going to play. That's a high ankle sprain. He'll be fine. I think

he can play with just about anything. The one thing with that, though, is if it's a hamstring thing and it's his push-off leg, there's just no way that can't affect his shot. He would have to change how he shoots. Then the other thing is they still need him defensively in this series. So if he's kind of compromised,

then Draymond just has to be out of his mind. So I think the answer would be Steve Kerr. Just telling Draymond, we need you. I love you. You're my guy. I need you to go to another level. I think he told him that. Game six against Houston.

I think he must tell himself like, hey man, I just ran into Rick Welts backstage or behind the court. And he was saying he didn't think he had it in you to carry us tonight. And I was just like, I don't know, man. Don't count out Tremont. But Rick was just like, nope, that guy's not, he doesn't have it. He must pull like all that weird motivational passive aggressive shit with him, right? Just like little sprinklings. He has to. My single biggest disappointment was there was not a camera on Draymond as the game ended

and whether or not there was any exchange with Drake. Because Draymond had to have gone over there, right? Oh, no question. And I think the NBA told ABC, stop showing Drake so much. Our rights are up in two years. Don't fuck with us. We've had it with this Drake stuff.

Do not show him anywhere. Thank you. It's on somebody's cell phone. I need to see the footage. Drake had a rough weekend because Anthony Joshua was his guy too. And then he had his ass kicked. That was my favorite.

I mean, I can't begin to tell you. I wanted, I was so impressed by, by my man Ruiz. I went out for Mexican tonight. Five Pacificos. Five Pacificos for Ruiz.

We're going to talk to Kevin Clark about that in a second in an interview that we've already recorded. And let's just say we discuss his weight and his body. He's my hero. I love that guy. I want to have a meal with that guy. He really... Now that's a house of carbs.

Can we get Ruiz on House of Carbs? Nephew Carbs? Nephew Kyle. Should I inspire Nephew Kyle like Steve Kerr inspires Draymond? Give it a shot. I mean, if you can't get him, I can ask Craig or Bobby if they can pull it off. Craig will do it. Or Bobby. Craig will get right on that.

Craig or Bobby maybe could get that. One of those dudes. Send an email now. Don't worry. Let's see if Kyle can do it I don't know who knows Who knows if he can book Ruiz The best would be the photo Of you and Ruiz

About to eat 10 pounds of food On the house Where does Ruiz live We could arrange that For like a video shoot I'm going there. He lives on this hemisphere, so I can find him. Yeah, you think Ruiz wins the title and his entourage and his trainers are probably not like,

oh man, we got to watch out for Ruiz here. He can't let himself go. Which way do you think it goes? No, that's what I mean. It's not like he can let himself go. He's already gone. He's already gone. What if he gets in shape?

Is that a bad thing for him? It's great. It reminds me of, remember that year when Oliver Miller on The Sons was... I'm not laughing because he battled his way through his whole career. That was like a problem. No, but remember that one year on the Suns where he was playable, how much fun that was?

Everybody loved... Yeah. They had Oliver Miller and they had Richard Dumas who had already been suspended, I don't even remember how many times, for drugs. And they just were able to just get these one magical year out of each of them. And it was really enjoyable. It was really fun. All right, House. year out of each of them and it was really enjoyable it was really fun um all right house so you think so you both of us are just throwing our hands up in the air at this point yeah who i

think the warriors are going to win i think the warriors are going to win in six that's you know that's the expert opinion it's the same thing i thought before the series started. I'm greatly intrigued by my senses are alert. All five senses are at play with what Toronto has brought to the table. But that third quarter, the beginning of the third quarter, that stretch, I've been waiting for it for three and a half games. And, you know, this is the thing you never know until you get punched in the face. Right. But somebody's going to respond. So let's see.

Let's see what they show off with on Wednesday night. Well, most important, if the Warriors end up winning the title, Boogie actually deserves, he earned the ring now. He earned the ring? He earned the ring because he'll cry after they win. It's legitimate. He's going to play a huge part in the rest of this series.

I mean, they played him like 28 minutes tonight and it looked like he was done at about the 23-minute mark of that and just kind of gotten through it. Him catching the ball at the free throw line as a distributor for those backdoor cuts is incredible. They have Draymond and Boogie both

capable of doing that. It's a game changer. You know what's crazy? He was such a good low post player back in the day. They're not even using that at all. They didn't even use that part of him in that game.

In that entire six-minute stretch where they didn't have any baskets, I kept wondering why don't they just try and get the ball to him down low. Maybe that'll be a game-free wrinkle. That was like when one of the most frustrating things about the Milwaukee-Toronto series was Milwaukee just forgetting that Brooke Lopez was a low-post player for his entire career until this year and has a jump hook and a drop step and a bank shot.

Like he's got moves down there. I felt the same way with cousins, especially if they mix it up and try to put like a Bach out there, stuff like that. Well, really you can see him. Yeah. He thinks he has an advantage over Gasol.

He knows he does. Like you, you can see him licking his lips a couple times when he got the ball and then faced up and was like, his brain is processing. His body's not up to where his brain is. This is like you and me trying

to play basketball right now. I know what to do. I know where I want to go. I know the angle I want to take. I know I can beat this little bitch, but maybe the parts don't want to go there. All right, House, this is fun. Thanks for doing this. Always.

I hope you have one more burrito tonight in honor of Andy Ruiz. Is there leftovers for Pacifico? I'm going to go have another Pacifico. I know that much. Was the restaurant Pacifico, or you're drinking Pacifico? I'm going to go have another Pacifico. I know that much. Was the restaurant Pacifico or you're drinking Pacificos? I'm drinking Pacifico, obviously. I thought you went to a Mexican restaurant called Pacifico.

I'm an idiot. The world's famous Guapos here in Northwest DC. Guapos. You got to go to Guapos. Guapos. We got to take Andy Ruiz to Guapos. Oh my God, are you kidding me? Andy Ruiz to Guapos. All right. Oh my God.

Are you kidding me? Andy Ruiz. Come on House of Carbs. House. We'll talk to you soon. Talk to you later. All right. We're going to call Kevin Clark in one second to talk about an incredible boxing weekend.

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Roku, Chromecast, iPhone or Android or Android online no subscriptions no contracts free entertainment I just used Voodoo this week we need to get Dead Poets Society because we're doing rewatchables on it next week actually and

here's what happened. First of all, they had the best price of anyone for a rental. It was $2.99. But it was $9.99 to buy and I loved that movie. I stepped in. I really did. Go to voodoo.com slash rewatchables to sign up and

start watching today. Catch up on Dead Poets Society before next week's rewatchables episode at vudu.com slash rewatchables. $2.99 to on Dead Poets Society before next week's Rewatchables episode at vudu.com slash Rewatchables. $2.99 to rent Dead Poets Society. And don't forget while we're here, Ringer Dish, our new podcast feed, Celebrity Culture. You get tea time. You get jam session.

You get our new Monday pod that's going to be on that feed. And you can get for realsies with my daughter. There's a new one coming this week. Kyle produced it. Don't forget to subscribe the Ringer Dish pod. All right, let's call Kevin Clark. All right. On the line right now from the ringer.com Kevin Clark, it takes a lot to get him to just randomly volunteer to work on a weekend. And now we've had a piece from Kevin Clark and our podcast parents from Kevin Clark. He didn't think he was doing anything this weekend. Then a young man,

a young lovable man, a young jiggly, fantastic champion of a man. Andy Ruiz Jr. Came into our lives. I'm still reeling. Kevin Clark. I,

I, I think I'm happy. I think that's the overriding thing right now. I'm just, just still really happy. I, that was just such a fun fight. It ruins all the plans that promoters had for the next two years of boxing, which is a very good thing. And I'm just thrilled that Andy Ruiz exists. Yeah. So this fight, I was going to watch it.

I was watching the Bruins game, game three, and the Bruins had it handily decided, but it felt like there were going to be some fights because the Blues were getting a little chippy. So I had hung around and I was watching it. And then I forgot the fight was on and I go over, I flipped to the zone because there's like three minutes left in the Bruins game. And all of a sudden, all hell breaks loose. The round three, it's like, oh, there's Joshua. Oh, he's all right. He's going to knock out Ruiz now. And I'd been getting texts, seeing on Twitter, like, oh man, you should see this Andrew Ruiz. How is this guy a boxer?

Gets knocked down, gets up. Joshua's going for the finisher. Ruiz is like responding with bombs. And then all of a sudden Joshua's falling down. And this becomes one of the great rounds in recent boxing history. Nothing. And I repeat, nothing, delights me more than when both guys get knocked down in the same round. Does it have a name?

Is there a phrase for that? I don't know. I mean, we can come up with one right now. Yeah. How about double knockdown? Double knockdown? Well, I think that's when it's at the same time. But I mean, this was amazing. So Ruiz hits him with a left and Joshua never really recovers.

And that leads to those two knockdowns. He was basically saved by the bell at the end of that round. And then he was just gassed after that. I don't know what Joshua was doing the entire fight. He was very cocky, even at the end, you know, right before the last knockdowns, between knockdown three and four. There's so many of them. He kind of looked at his corner and gave like shrug like, I'm totally fine, or an eyebrow kind of

raised like, I got this. And he just clearly didn't. I don't know how he was processing what was happening. It was a very strange fight from his end. This happens every once in a while in boxing. I forget who mentioned. Did you have Corey Sanders in your piece? I can't remember. Yeah, a couple people did. I did not. Corey Sanders obviously beat Klitschko. Maybe I saw it on Twitter. Yeah, because I watched that too. That was like 03. It was Vladimir Klitschko. That was right when he was getting some momentum as like, here come the Klitschkos. And this dude, Corey Sanders just beats the living hell out of him and knocks him out in two rounds. Corey Sanders had similar interesting body type as well. Right. He had thick trunk, thick trunk on Corey. And then the brother avenged it the next

year. So that was a fun subplot too. I was like when the brother has to avenge whatever. This one, like Rockman Lewis was a big deal. I think that got swept under the rug. Everybody defaulted right to Douglas Tyson, which- Yeah. I think Rockman Lewis is more like it, especially the English champion thing. I will say I watched the Rockman fight today. Yeah, I did too. The HBO broadcast started singing America the Beautiful after the knockout. That was George Foreman. That was an interesting choice. Yeah, it was a little more xenophobic back then, I think.

It was an interesting choice. That's all. It was just an interesting call. Yeah, I hate when the Douglas Tyson's name gets taken in vain because that was the greatest sports upset of my lifetime other than maybe the Americans beating the Russians in 1980. It was just so improbable. Everybody was watching it. This fight was considered to be this pushover. It was a last minute. Ruiz is coming in. He's filling in for somebody who failed a PED test. I'm sorry, Bill, three PED tests. He failed three different ped tests give or take it was one give or take two others

and uh the last minute sub and joshua fought like a guy who had a last minute sub and saw a picture of ruiz and it's like oh i'm fighting that guy all right i just won't train anymore because he was a disaster in this fight he got knocked down times. He didn't look like he was in shape. He was incoherent after the fight. He seemed happier for Ruiz than Ruiz's family. I don't know what the fuck was going on, Kevin. So there are a couple of things. Number one is that the commonality between both the Lewis loss and then the Tyson Douglas loss is that they were all in not the country of the champion.

They were seen more as marketing tours. And that's certainly what this was. I mean, all the talk before this was just about Joshua having his footprint in the United States before the mega fight start in 2020 or 2021. And those three have that in common. And from a just a fighting perspective, I think there was a total lack of respect, like what you said, for Ruiz. Ruiz was a top prospect. He's only had one loss and it was controversial to Joseph Parker who went the distance with Joshua. So it's not like he was a total can. This wasn't a disgrace of a fight. It's just exactly what you said. You see a picture of Ruiz and you underestimate. Maybe that helped him a little bit. I think from a boxing standpoint, Joshua had huge flaws and I

just don't think that they've addressed those. I mean, he still lacks a reliable jab. The broadcast talked about last night that he still does not fight like a guy who's six foot six. He still fights like a guy who's six foot and that's just not how he should operate. So he had huge flaws. I mean, it looked like one of those football games where one of these teams just did not have a game plan. It's like they'd never watched film before. Yeah. I blame myself because this felt like one of the great gambling opportunities of all time. Anthony Joshua in general was dying to get beaten by somebody who had huge odds. And it was just a matter of time before it happened. I've never totally understood it. He looks the part on paper, much like the Klitschko brother did before he got knocked out by Corey Sanders. Just he looked the part, but the overall game wasn't there. The thing is, I don't follow boxing the

way I used to follow it. And I think the diehard boxing people actually kind of liked Ruiz. Like he just looks weird, but he's got, he's got really fast hands. He was a big prospect, as you said. He hasn't really gotten his ass kicked in a fight, even that one fight to Parker. People thought he won that fight. So this wasn't unbelievably crazy. And then the other thing is the fact that Joshua has just been ducking everybody and been very careful about who he's fighting is a bad sign. I think that says something. I think Joshua would be the first to admit he's probably not that good, right? So there's a couple of things to unpack there.

Number one is that Joshua has been on the ropes a couple of times. He was hurt against Klitschko. He was hurt against Dillian White even before that. But I think that people... I don't know if real boxing heads really liked Ruiz in any meaningful way. I think there are a couple of people who are now coming out of the woodwork and I'm sure that the people who bet, great for them. But I didn't see any real momentum for Ruiz before the fight. I saw somebody said last night there was some late money coming in on Ruiz.

Really? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, who knows how reliable that is. I saw, did you see the odds, by the way, that they put out on now Wilder versus Joshua and Fury versus Joshua? Because it's flipped. And now he's gone from a favorite in both those fights to an underdog in both those fights just overnight.

So that's a separate thing. And that's kind of incredible. But I agree. The fact that he wasn't even entertaining big fights. You know, Lennox Lewis came out and kind of ripped him, ripped Joshua about five months ago and said that they feel like he and his team are content with just keeping him in the United Kingdom, selling out big stadiums, going against inferior competition. There was a lot of money to be made in fighting at Wembley, fighting in Cardiff, whatever, selling 80,000, 70,000 seats, and having him win in a fifth round knockout or whatever. I think that his team maybe got a little too complacent in that regard, and he didn't step up in competition. And now all of a sudden, he's getting beat by Andy Ruiz. Well, let's be honest. This was the Vladimir.

I could never say Vladimir. I'm my, my lips can't do it. That Kuchko, the inferior Kuchko brother. He, that was basically his recipe. Unless there was, I mean, it was partly, there was one of the worst heavyweight droughts just for talent that ever, that we had for about 10 years. It was just two Kuchkos and they wouldn't fight each other. But if you look, so he loses to Sanders and then he lost to Lamont Brewster, TKO, three fights later. And that's in April 2004. And then goes on this epic 10-win winning streak.

Actually, it was more than that. It was like 15 wins. I defy you to name three guys that he fought. Let's do it. I challenge you right now. No, you can't it. I'm looking at it right now. No, you can't look. I'm looking at it right now. Don't look.

I'm sorry. I'm already looking at it, but I will say he went 11 years. It was not a murderer's row. Not a murderer's row. This was like when in Rocky III, when Mickey admits to Rocky that he intentionally just had him fight

a bunch of beat balls so he could keep the title. It's like Samuel Peter. He fought Rockman seven years after you would have wanted to fight Rockman. All these dudes. David Haye is in there. Oh, my God. Lamont Brewster, that loss was a venge.

Chris Bird was in there. I mean, Pulev was in there. It was an interesting crew there for that 11 years. Then he lost to Tyson Fury in 2015. Right. So the recipe was in place. And Joshua, the fact that... Well, I mean, the recipe for every boxer ever is in place,

which is just fight for your competition, make a ton of money. Unfortunately, that's the way to make money in boxing at this point, and let these super fights marinate three years after everybody wants them. Yeah. It's called the Floyd Mayweather. He fought a couple of good dudes, in boxing at this point, and let these super fights marinate three years after everybody wants them. Yeah.

It's called the Floyd Mayweather. He fought a couple of good dudes, but Floyd is able to get out of boxing basically with almost all of his brain cells, it feels like. What? Like 95%? Yeah. It's a mixture of savvy booking and great defensive fighting. Great head movement from Floyd. Yeah.

He played it perfectly. Kudos to him. So the thing with Joshua, what we've seen with this resurgence with boxing and the streaming services and ESPN Plus and DAZN and everybody's kind of lining up to try to get their guys. I don't think Joshua had a deal like the deal that Canelo had, but he definitely was under the zone.

And I think people's first reaction, this is obviously a little awkward because they're the sponsor of this podcast, so I don't have inside info on this, but I think people's first reaction was this is bad for the zone. I actually think it was like the greatest moment of the zone history. They're going to get the rematch, and odds are he's going to take this rematch a little more seriously. It's a great fight. It's now a can't miss fight. Plus we get

Andy Ruiz out of it. I'm sure they have options on that dude. And more importantly, it has people talking about heavyweight boxing again, which really started, you know, with the, with the Fury Wilder fight. And just in general, these fights have been so much more entertaining the last couple of years. Kind of feels like heavyweight boxing is a little bit back, right? Kind of. I mean, where is Andy Ruiz now

after this fight as far as famous active boxers? Oh my God. Like really high. Yeah, you would think. I mean, really, really high. So everybody is going to watch this rematch. It's going to be awesome.

Then you have... So in early 2020, Wilder and Fury are fighting. And so this is actually starting to... Okay, the Wilder-Joshua megafight is out, but who cares? I'd rather have this and a spark in the entire division than the 2021 megafight at Wembley Stadium. I don't care. I have things to do in my life.

Let's see some actual matchups here. Yeah. So you have this... And Wilder-Fury. Yeah, Wild have things to do in my life. Let's see some actual matchups here. Yeah. So you have this and Wilder Fury. Yeah. Well, if you're in early 2020, hopefully for that sake, Wilder gets past the Ortiz rematch, which is this fall. And so you've now got sort of a setup here where, I mean, if Ruiz beats Joshua, that's, that's just, again, that's just incredible. And he would, I guess, face the winner of Wilder Fury after that. And then Joshua's career is a little more blemished and maybe he fights the loser of Wilder Fury. I don't know how exactly it sets up. I just know maybe this loss from Joshua makes

everybody more comfortable fighting each other. You know, one of the things, Jim Lampley's talked about this a lot, kind of the cult of the zero in boxing, which is Floyd Mayweather was, you know, 49 and 0, then 50-0, and everybody wants to keep that zero. And losses can be a good thing. They can spark things. Think about all the middleweights in the 80s. That division was helped because guys weren't afraid to lose their zero. Now that Joshua loses his zero, he won't be protected. Maybe they get a little more aggressive with the booking stuff. It is true. Ali lost a bunch of times, even before he started really losing his brain cells and his coordination. He had some losses. Losses are fun. People have to come back from losses. They're a better storyline.

I would much rather have this. I also feel like we see this in UFC and Bellator. We're kind of conditioned to good guys losing and then coming back and winning the next time. When Conor McGregor lost against Khabib in October, he was at Cowboy Stadium like a week later and they acted like he was a king. I mean, it was like no one cared that he lost. And I think that there's in other sports, even other fight sports, there's less of a stigma around losing. And for some reason in boxing, we've just been conditioned to throw guys aside when they lose. And maybe this is going to be okay for the heavyweight division.

Well, the Wilder, two of his last three fights have been really entertaining. The Ortiz fight was good. I liked that one. I loved it. And then he had a knockdown in his last fight. That was one of the better knockdowns of the social media era. I felt like that was on everybody's feed. And then the draw against Fury was

like a really fun sporting event. And I'm excited to watch them fight again. There's a theory going around and it was suggested on the broadcast as well that Wilder's knockout at Brazil a couple of weeks ago led to some of the early mistakes

from Joshua because he was going for that highlight real knockout. When he had that third round knockdown of Ruiz, you could see him just get really, really excited about the knockout. It looked like he was trying to close, and that's when he opened up a little bit. So I wonder if there was sort of a, hey, I've got to match this, not necessarily for social media, but hey, he just went out and destroyed a guy that, that I took seven rounds. Uh, maybe I have to get that, that kind of vicious knockout too. And you could tell he was maybe going for that a little bit in the third. Yeah. And if you pause the fight right before Ruiz landed the counter that got that just completely flipped the fight, it just seemed like Joshua was two punches away from from finishing it and now you look at it and i i that was a pretty

devastating loss from just a stylistic standpoint once i always think like once a dude gets knocked down or a fight flips like that you kind of find out who they are as a boxer to some degree you know and like when this if you i watched a klitschko um cory sanders fight again this morning and he just didn't know what to do once things flipped and he wasn't the bully you know and he didn't know how to hold he didn't know how to keep him off with his jab nothing and chris mannix and his piece that he wrote did a good job of pointing out how it that was the fight when he goes and gets emmanuel sanders yep stewart yeah i'm sorry emmanuel who's emmanuel sanders the wide receiver god i'm turning to any of them the fight when he goes and gets Emmanuel Sanders. Yep. Stuart. Yeah. I'm sorry. Emmanuel. Who's

Emmanuel Sanders? The wide receiver. God, I'm turning into Eddie. Emmanuel Sanders is the wide receiver for the Broncos. Peyton Manning went out and got Emmanuel Sanders. He got Emmanuel Lewis and then, no, no. No. So he gets Emmanuel Stuart, teaches him how to throw the heavy jab. That completely changes the course of his career. And it's interesting with the size that Joshua has, it's really crazy that he doesn't have a jab like that. And he does seem like somebody that, you know, whoever 2019's version of Emmanuel Stewart is, would have some fun at least working with him.

He's got the perfect body. He's got power. It's unclear if he can take a punch, but there's some real tools there so I don't know we'll see how he goes I would say would you say the Wilder odds were against him? Wilder he is now plus 110

and he was minus 200 yesterday and Wilder is another one who gets clocked in these fights against Ortiz and Fury who gets clocked in these fights. Against Ortiz. Yeah, but... And Fury. Yeah, Fury is now... He's now 150 against... Plus 150 against Fury

and was minus 150 yesterday. So it completely flipped. And then we... I don't feel like we've spent enough time talking about him, but the man who won our hearts, Andy Ruiz Jr. First of all...

Oh, my God. Did you see the D-Generation X chop? I did. And just blubber going everywhere. It was just, it was transcendent. Who was Andy Ruiz Sr.? Did you find out? Did you do a deep dive on that? I have not done a deep dive. He gave a very touching tribute to his mom. He said, they're not going to struggle anymore as a family, which is very touching to see. He was a former top-ranked guy. Chris Mannix, again, talked about that in the piece about how good of a prospect he was.

Again, it was not like he was a can. Quite a personality. Tyson Fury comes out earlier this week and compares him to the child from Up. And the UK press asked him if he's offended by this. And he was like, no, I do look like that guy. Like he's just, he's a very honest, self-deprecating guy.

Loves Snickers. Said he was going to eat Snickers before the match. I don't know if he did that or if he was just saying that. I'm sorry, I didn't follow up on this actual Snickers consumption. Yeah. But he is a guy that we need in our lives. He's a guy, and listen, I was, I was walking around Los Angeles today. People were talking about this at the gym. They were talking about it at lunch. I heard it.

I haven't heard outward boxing talk in a long time. Yeah. And that was even coming off the heels of the Fury Wilder fight, which was a great fight, but I agree. This felt a little bit different. And I watched out my wife and my son were watching with me because they were waiting for the fight to end so we could watch a movie. And both of them were so transfixed by him and rooting for him. And then we were also having questions that I've never had watching a fight before. And I've been watching fights my whole life about, we got in an argument about whether all the extra fat is actually good for him. Because my wife was like, it's actually good. The punches are bouncing off him. It's more of a shield. And I was like like i'm not sure that's how it works i don't know if

there's muscle underneath there and she's like well how do you know what if what if he's just hard underneath and then the outer fat is a shell i've never had that conversation in my life i'm 49 years old this is basically this is base it's a literal Simpsons plot where Homer was such a large man he could just take punches. He had such a large head and man. And so he became a professional boxer. Very good episode

if you haven't seen it. But I do think the fact, at some point, it becomes an advantage that Ruiz had like 25 pounds on Joshua. He's 268. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, I know Joshua's, what, seven, six inches taller, five inches taller, something like that, but at some point, being compact like that matters. Well, and he had fast hands, which was clear from the first round.

Joshua looks slow. Yeah, and he wasn't, you know, we've seen fat guys before fighting, and usually they throw, their punches take a long time to develop. And he was the opposite. It was pretty clear right away like that.

He wasn't a chump. And then he got knocked down. I was like, oh, that was stupid. Why do I think this fat guy had a chance? Yeah. And then he gets up and starts throwing bombs again. There's also the sort of weird sort of psyche thing where right before the broadcast they mentioned this, where his one loss against Joseph Parker, the reason he thought he lost was he didn't let his hands fly. So he was just

going to start throwing bombs. That was what was really fun to see. It's a lot of these guys, you know, we complained a couple weeks ago, especially about the Canelo fight, where it's like, why don't these guys in the 11th round just start throwing handmakers? That's easier said than done. You're going to get knocked out if you do that. It's more of a guy from a couch yelling.

But Ruiz was really intent on just throwing bombs. He was fighting like you would imagine a heavy underdog should fight. It was awesome to see. Well, and my fear with where boxing was going with all of these streaming sites carving up the best talent with big deals was what happened with Floyd, where the fights become a business arrangement, not a fight. And it's not one of those things,

I hate to use the term life or death with boxing because people have died, but it doesn't feel like life or death out there. Guys go to the fringe, but they're not really laying it all out knowing that if I win this, I'll get a huge payday. Now they've already gotten the payday. They've locked it up. And even with somebody like Joshua, who doesn't have the $330 million contract like Canelo got,

he's still taken care of with his own deal. This fight was not life or death with him. He didn't take it seriously. And he just thought he could show up and fight a tomato can. And the guy was in a tomato can. But what was the fight? We were just talking about this. Triple G against Jacobs. Jacobs Canelo. Yeah, I'm sorry. Canelo against Jacobs. And in the 12th round, it wasn't inconceivable that if Jacobs won the last round or if it was even 10-8 that he could have gotten a draw or won. And you would have thought he would have gone out there just throwing bombs. And he was totally good with it. He was like, all right, I'm okay if I lose the 12th and I lose this fight 7-5.

I didn't get knocked out. I'm great. I'll live to fight another day. I'll get more fights. I'm good. And'll live to fight another day. I'll get more fights. I'm good. And that's been a lot of boxing fights I've watched. I don't know. Partly has to be, you know, the fact the guaranteed paychecks,

but I also wonder like, you know, the collateral damage of boxing just in general and what we've seen with some of these retired guys. It's rare that you see somebody just get off the canvas throwing haymakers like Ruiz did. It was intoxicating. It's something Max Kellerman talks about a lot and it's something that's really insightful,

which is that essentially boxing fans and boxers have the exact opposite interests in mind. Boxers want to get out with the most money and the least damage. And the fans just want a lot of damage. They want wars. Yeah. And they want super fights. And the super fights, if they occur too much,

sort of limit the amount of money you can have. Yeah. And so if you were a boxer, if I were a boxer, I would want to go the sort of Keith Thurman route, which is fight twice a year, make one five, and out. That's the smartest move. You keep your head, you keep your brain, and you get out with money. I mean, I think that in some ways, the stuff we want to see is against the interest of the boxer. And it's a very strange thing to reckon with in that sport. And with the added, I guess, benefit for the boxers of a pretty big sample size now of how you don't want to end up.

Yeah, I'd say. I don't know if MMA has that same sample size yet. Well, I think that MMA is a little too new to know that. Yeah. I mean, it's only been around for 25 years. Yeah, that's what I mean. I think that it's a bad sign that when Wilder and Fury were fighting and they fought in Los Angeles and I went to the fight this is a fan like I felt like there had been some sort of mistake that these

guys were fighting like that's a bad sign right like I was just like what's going on like is this fight actually gonna happen I was driving there and I was like is there like a clerical error or something why are two of the best heavyweights fighting each other? That's a problem. So Andy Ruiz Jr., I don't know how long he's going to be in our lives, but so damn lovable. I love... Oh, by the way, I forgot to mention, first Mexican-American heavyweight champ. Yeah. I don't know when, but I think there's going to be a spectacular scolding story from somebody about the fat shaming of andy ruse jr is going to be i'm going to guess monday but maybe tuesday but probably monday somebody just lecturing us and and getting on mount pious and being all pious about it look this is boxing and people

are usually in shape when they box and this guy was not and for us to not talk about that is insane and the other thing is he can't win the title and now get out of shape he's already out of shape it's not like it's like oh man watch out now that this guy's won the title watch out man he's gonna let himself go it's like he let himself go five years ago we're here we've arrived it reminds me a little bit of like you know those the genre of viral tweet where it's like some guy who's now a great athlete look like a dork in high school like noah syndergard right like it's like hey this guy this guy looked like this 10 years ago now he looks like this it room the ruiz photos remind me of that except that's what he still looks like like the embarrassing photos are just what he is and it's amazing it's great like i i don't see... If there is a shame cycle about Andy Ruiz, I'm opting out. I just think that

he's great. He's wonderful. We should embrace him. He's an amazing personality and I hope a super duper star. The shame cycle yeah i'm opting out please can you can you write a long think piece and make me reconsider my thoughts about watching andy ruiz and wondering why he was overweight i need i need to i need to reconsider because because that's that would that wasn't a natural reaction at all to be like oh my god that guy's like 30 pounds overweight how is he not getting knocked out incredible i i hope he never changes i would love to have him on the podcast i enjoyed his interview um i hope he stops by the ringer and we can all hang out with him he's the best and you're is boxing amazing person i can't remember

the last time i talked about boxing on a podcast and for 27 minutes we're back it's been a while we're back all right casey um are you worried about D'Angelo Russell for $180 million this summer with the Magic or no? That would be a sort of a previous sort of Rob Hennigan panic move. I believe in the front office now. I believe in the front office now. Holy shit, Kevin Clark.

I believe in the front office. We have a new front office. What's happened to you? Do you believe in the Jets front office? We're going to let... Riley McAtee came up to me in the office the other day asking me whether Vooch was a fit for the Kings. And I said, absolutely.

At some insane cost. Go ahead. You can have him, Sacramento. Knock yourself out, Sacramento. Jets? Jets front office? You have faith in them or no? If they hire Joe Douglas, that's the best thing they can do.

But I mean, wouldn't it have been better to hire the smart guy from Philadelphia before the draft and before free agency? Just a thought. I was really hoping that all the Peter Schrager stuff was true because it would be funny to have somebody who has made a concerted effort to connect with all media people over the last 12 years, including me, now have a GM job. Who would he leak to? What would he do? It would just be like a leak. You know, the leak wasn't that Peter Shaker was actually going to be the GM. It was that he was

going to pick the GM, which wasn't true. I know. But then I got excited that maybe they would just ask him to be the GM. He would pull a Dick Cheney and just name himself GM. Yeah, exactly. Media people have become GMs. They sure have. Matt Millen went from the media. Yeah, Matt Millen was like a broadcaster. Yeah, Mike Mayock.

Mike Mayock. He's a GM. Peter Schrager's not unbelievable. One of the Jets leaks was that Daniel Jeremiah was going to go, but that seems to not be the case anymore. He was going to go be Joe Douglas' number two, but the reporting now says that's not going to happen. Joe Douglas is a legitimately good hire for the Jets if they can make it. They need to give them full roster control and give them a time machine to undo the free agency.

So you have Giants minus 150 over the Jets for most incompetent New York football franchise. Well, a lot of our staffers are really excited to chart this this year. Jets versus Giants minus 150 over the Jets for most incompetent New York football franchise right now? Well, a lot of our staffers are really excited to chart this this year. Jets versus Giants. Yeah. I don't think either of them are going to be good this year. If they hire Joe Douglas, it depends if the sort of... I don't know. Darnold is a better quarterback than anything the Giants have going on. How about that? So automatically, the Jets are going to be in a better position than the Giants. agree with that somebody on my twitter the other day was talking about eli in the 2011 san francisco playoff game and i went and watched the video

because it was just this chorus of everybody just agreeing how great he was in that game and how tough he was and i was like all right like, all right, I got to see this. I don't really remember it this way. And he did make some plays, but there's a 14 minute clip of the game. And in classic Eli fashion, two different times during the game, he threw an interception and double coverage and the guys collided into each other. The first time the guy got carried off the field after like eight minutes. And then the second time was on the key play of the game where if either guy had caught it, the game's over and the Giants lose. That's how I'm going to remember Eli.

When all's said and done. I don't know if he makes the Hall of Fame or not, but I will never remember another QB throwing into double coverage and having both guys not only drop it, but potentially knock each other out like Eli Manning. What a QB. Hey, Bill, you know how I'm going to remember

Eli Manning beating the Patriots in two Super Bowls. I don't know if you were there. Hey, Bill, you know how I'm going to remember Eli Manning beating the Patriots in two Super Bowls. I don't know if you were there for that or anything like that. You don't even have a football team. Exactly. I can throw these lobs. You don't even have an NFL team. I'm like Andy Ruiz. I can just come out and just start throwing these hooks.

You caught me off guard. I just sped out my mouthpiece. I'm just looking at my corner. Well, you could always come with your Lando magic. It's fine. God, how do we lose two? Kyle, how do we lose two Super Bowls to you, Le'Veon? I'm done with it.

Unbelievable. God, make that guy go away if he retires. Kevin Clark, we can hear you on The Ringer NFL Show. We can read you on TheRinger.com. Thank you as always. Thanks, man. All right, we're going to call my buddy Jacko to talk about baseball and a little 2020 presidential election. First, today's podcast

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SimpliSafe with two I's, simplisafe.com slash BS. And since we're here, don't forget about Ring or Dish. Subscribe now on Apple, on Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts. All right, we're here, don't forget about ring or dish subscribe now on a, on Apple, on Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts. All right. We're going to call Jacko weird Red Sox weekend. Almost got swept by the Yanks rallied to pull one off tonight, but either way, I promised to call this person no matter what happened this weekend. So now we're calling them on Sunday night. Here he is, Jacko. All right. On the line, my buddy Jacko, you know, had the finals, had all these things last week, and someone got salty that I didn't call him

before a big Yankees-Red Sox series that, I'm just going to say you came out and basically made it seem like I ducked you because the Red Sox season wasn't going that well, which that hurt my feelings that you said that. I'm sorry. I'm happy to talk to you again. I was worried I was never going to talk to you again on the phone. So I thought you would just exchange angry texts with me. So it's good to hear your voice.

I'm glad that you're still upright, still alive, and still using the phone. That's good. Look, first of all, we won the World Series last year. I don't know if you realize that. We've won the World Series twice since the last time we won the World Series. We've won the World Series four times more than this century. I don't feel like I have anything to prove right now.

That's why I didn't check in. We're just living in the past. Is that the deal? We're not living in the past, but I still have faith in this Red Sox team that has been ran around 500 for one third of the season and has a $240 million payroll or whatever it is. But I still feel like it's going to heat up, Johnny. You do, huh?

Well, I mean, you know, John Sterling, the voice of the Yankees, always has this thing where he says to his cohort, Susan Baldwin, well, that's baseball, Susan, when some guy goes four for four one night and over for the next. So really the 2019 Red Sox are the epitome of, well, that's baseball, Susan, because last year they were world beaters. They couldn't lose. They have essentially the same team this year with the exception of Kimbrell.

But none of these guys are world beaters this year. The team that couldn't lose last year can't get out of its own way this year. It's crazy. Yeah, we have essentially the same team except for nobody to close a baseball game. And we've had like nine blown saves. Yeah, you have had blown saves, although your bullpen is, you know, aside from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play? But aside from the blown saves, your bullpen actually has not been horrible.

No, it hasn't. It's just we don't have somebody who could actually close games. Now, Kimbrough was a walking heart attack last year. He was what? He was a walking heart attack last year. Yeah, I was going to say. You know, you walked the tightrope with him a lot last year, so it's not like he was, you know, prime Mariano Rivera.

But obviously all the naysayers are like, well, you should have signed him, you should have signed him and you should have given him the money, but you know, his demands were outrageous. He wants a hundred million dollars. It's just, it's just not going to happen. Yeah. Well, he, he was my other choice to call for this podcast. If you did, if you didn't answer, sorry, cause he's available. I think the biggest problem with the Red Sox is what my buddy Hanch, who's trying not to lose his mind, especially because he loves the Bruins, they're in the Stanley Cup. But he just texted me over the weekend. If all the Yankees and Red Sox relievers were just all in the same bullpen, how many Yankee relievers in a row would get picked before any Red Sox reliever? Oh, yeah, absolutely.

And I just got bummed out. It's true. I mean, the Yankees bullpen, which was predicted to be a strength of theirs, has turned out to be. And you have guys like, you know, Adovino and Conley who's back, and Britton and Eraldis who's been, you know, he makes me nervous, especially against the Red Sox, but he's been really good this year. So their bullpen has been lights out.

Adovino has been everything that was advertised. And Conley is back. And Britton, who last year was a little bit of an adventure, has righted the ship. And their bullpen has just been a locked-down bullpen because their starters, Hermann was hot. He's gotten cold lately. CeCe is CeCe. Tanaka is a tightrope every day, every outing.

But their bullpen, you know, the starters don't have to go that deep because the bullpen is so deep that you can bring guys in early. Four or five innings out of the bullpen has not been a problem so far this year. And you don't have Batances, who I made fun of you before the season about having had that type of guy on my fantasy team every year. Of course, he's on my fantasy team right now. Getting the updates of, oh, the long toss. They've increased the long toss to 60 feet.

Oh, good. He threw from 75 feet. Hey, there's been a simulated game against a bunch of Little League World Series kids. I think this week is throwing from the mound. So he's making progress. Coming back. Throwing from the mound. But as it turns out,

you didn't need him because you have 40 other guys. Exactly. When he comes back. It's been good so far, knock on wood. We're underselling this Yankee season, though.

I do feel, watching from afar, just bristling with hatred at all times, I do feel the Yankee fans really love this season. And they love all the injuries and all these fucking random dudes that have come up and had, you know, a couple of big hits here or there and a couple of spot starts. And now who's next up?

Oh, this guy's hurt. No, whatever. Some random dude. And you're just all really enjoying it. And I hate it. Well, one correction. We don't love the injuries. Nobody loves injuries.

Nobody loves injuries, but we do love the fact that it's like the gritty, gutty Yankees of old, the guys that are not highly touted, guys off the scrap heap, you know, your Gio Urshela, your Luke Voigt that would, you know, Cardinals basically gave him away, Urshela, I think the Yankees got for cash. They bring up a guy like Tyro Estrada who was is not, I mean, he's a semi-highly touted prospect, but not the top of the line. And he has filled in admirably. They've got guys like Cameron Babin off the scrap heap.

You know, the guys that you never thought would be involved in the Yankees series. And they have these guys that, you know, they're not trying to hit the ball out of the park. And the problem the Yankees have had the past couple years is they went out and the Marlins essentially gave them Stanton. They didn't really have a choice but to take him. And he's either a big swing or a big miss guy, so it's either he's all or nothing.

I know the advanced metrics people say there's no such thing as clutch, but when you look at a guy like DJ LeMay, he's hitting like 400-plus with two outs and runners in scoring position. That's what the Yankees have lacked. They have not been able to get a big hit with guys on base, especially with two outs. Certainly last season, that was the bane of their existence.

This year, guys like LeMahieu and Urshela have been coming through every time in big situations. It's just incredible. And, you know, going into the season, you're thinking, well, it's going to be Stan. It's going to be judge. It's going to be and a heart and a heart who had the highest average on the Yankees last year and was their best hitter. And the thing they haven't had is guys that can get on base in front of the guys that can hit it out of the park at this year with the Mayhew and Urshela and, and, you know, voice had some big hits, you know, voice more of a home run hitter, but or Mayieu and Urshela are guys that can cut out base in front of guys and do some damage.

It's really been awesome to watch. The last four Batances headlines were, ready for mound work, close to facing hitters, set for another bullpen, could face hitters this week. There's nothing worse. There's nothing worse than having an injured pitcher in a deep fantasy league. Who, if you had to guess, you don't, I mean, you don't have to, I'm not going to tie you to this. I won't make fun of you if you're wrong.

If you had to guess which Yankee who is doing probably well right now is most likely to fail a PD test. Would you say like a 10 way tie? Or is there like one name that really jumps out? Well, the one that I would always be worried about is Sanchez. Because he's gigantic? Well, yeah. Because, you know, he was hurt

last year. He's got a little something to prove and he has... I saw a stat today where the last guy to have 18 home runs before the All-Star break was Yogi Berra. And Sanchez has done it now with still another month and change to the All-Star break. It was Yogi Berra. And Sanchez has done it now. It's still another month and change to the All-Star break.

You should send him your pee. Send him a nice reserve of urine. I definitely will. If it comes to that, I'll send whatever's needed. They'll be like, we tested Sanchez's urine today. It says he's a 49-year-old white man

in Connecticut. It's weird. We might have to run another test. He tested positive for IPA, not PED. Do you think you'll ever see Judge again? Like, is he just, he just has too much muscle? He can't, he's just going to keep pulling muscles that you and I probably don't even have in our bodies?

Well, it is funny to think about baseball. Oh, it's not really funny but ironic that you have these guys like judge and stanton that are like you know greek gods like carved out of marble and you have a guy like john cruck you know or greg luzinski these guys were never right sure you know smoking cigarettes and drinking beer after the game never hurt but these guys that are like you know workout fiends are hurt all the time. You know, they're always injury prone. So I think you need more fat guys in baseball and less Greek guys. But that is a concern with judges that he's just, he's so big and there's

just, you know, baseball swing is so violent that there's just so much that can go wrong there for a guy his size. And, you know, that's probably going to be a lingering thing in his career. Unfortunately, you know, Carlos Beltran came out and said that the nature of judges injury, that even when he comes back this year, he's never going to feel a hundred percent. Yeah. I believe me.

I'm reading all of this. Cause he's one of the best guys on my fantasy team. That's tank. And, and there's been stories like, even if he comes back this year, he'll never be a hundred percent until next year. It's like, what, even if he comes back this year, he'll never be 100% until next year. It's like, what? Right. What, did he get, like, shot by an old rifle from the 1700s?

What happened to this guy? I know. The Yankees have these diseases, like, from the Old West, it sounds like, like a wagon train. Like, you know, he's not going to recover from that one, you know? Yeah, but I guess because his side is oblique or whatever, and he's swinging, and, you know, if you're swinging a baseball bat, it's just going to re-aggravate it,

so he's just going to have to deal with it. And the one that's more troublesome is Stanton, who, you know, originally went on the DL with a, I think it was a bicep injury. He, like, tore know, originally went on the DL with a, I think it was a bicep injury. He tore his bicep or something. And then that happened to his back and his shoulder. And, like, they can't even explain what's wrong with his shoulder.

Like, you know, we could put a man on the moon. We have MRIs. We have all kinds of medical technology. We can't figure out what the hell's wrong with Giancarlo Stanton's shoulder. It's like mystifying medical science. Jesus. And then he, like, hurt his leg. He came back for alo Stanton's shoulder. It's like mystifying medical science. Jesus. And then he like hurt his, he came back for a game and hurt his leg.

It's like, God almighty, this guy's really snake bitten. They're like WWE wrestlers. Not just, not just judging Stanton, but like, you know,

12 guys in baseball where it's like when Triple H, yeah, Triple H is going to miss WrestleMania. His tricep came off his body and rolled around the ring and they had to put it back on. Like these are injuries that you get when you're just like gigantic and really strong. Which must hurt so much. Like I can't even imagine how much it hurts to have your bicep torn. Well, what about- It's got to be so painful.

I don't, do we have an oblique muscle, Kyle? Do we have- I'm not sure. Kyle, can you research this? All human beings have an oblique muscle, right? Ours probably just aren't that. Might not be able to see us. Right.

I've never done anything that would possibly strain it in any way, I don't think. Yeah, if Kyle texts me and goes, hey, man, I'm not going to be able to produce the podcast for six weeks. I pulled my oblique muscle. I'd be like, what? How'd you do that? Outermost of three flat muscles on the

anterior abdomen. Yeah, man. I mean, you have to have just a really strong abdomen. Maybe he should just cut the weightlifting a little bit, do a little more Pilates, sounds like. Maybe a little more high yoga.

Maybe a little yoga. Maybe a little high yoga for Aaron Judge. Maybe. Maybe you don't have to be 280 pounds. There was a time about a month ago in the season where I was like, do the Yankees actually, do they stretch before games? Is it like a beer league softball game where they just show up and just start playing? Because every guy had like a strain or a tear or some kind of a pull.

And I'm like, you know, this is a billion dollar, multi-billion dollar sports franchise. Players are paid millions of dollars. There's a lot of money. Like, you know, I would have invested in some sort of stretching device before the game. Yeah, maybe some high yoga on the charter plane when they're flying to different cities, anything.

Something. And if you told me, you know, after all these injuries, that they'd be, you know, rivaling the 1998 Yankees in terms of winning series and winning streaks, I'd be like, wow, really? With all these guys, you know, Urshela and LeMahieu, it's incredible.

Mabin and Kendris Morales, Clint Frazier. It's crazy. Did you hear the announcement earlier today that they're just building Torres' Hall of Fame plaque now? Did you stop to get it over? Torres. Oh, it's labor. Yeah. Well, they should.

Yeah. They said they were done in July. I think if he's going to get a plaque, then LeMay, he really might have to get a statue. And Urshela probably should have some sort of monument, too. It's really incredible. I mean, in Urshela, not have you know some sort of monument too well really incredible I mean in Urshela not just offensively but defensively and I don't mean to throw poor Miguel Andujar under the bus and last year I made fun of a bunch of people on Twitter when he was in the rookie of the year battle because they were saying his user UZR stats weren't that great

defensive metrics that what a difference to doubt to see a guy that actually is a competent defender. Urshela makes it look easy. It's incredible. That's been a huge part for them because last year they kicked the ball around a lot. This year they have just a lockdown infield so it helps pitching out a great deal. It's been awesome all around. Do you like Aaron Boone more these days?

Do you take back any of the mean-spirited comments you've made on Twitter and on this podcast about him? I don't. I saw a Twitter poll the other day and it said, are they winning because of Boone or in spite of Boone? And I couldn't punch in spite of Boone quickly enough on my phone. I just think, I mean, he doesn't really manage the team, so I shouldn't even really pick on him because I think he's an idiot. I mean, the team is run by the analytics department. Yeah. And his job is just to be, like, you know, the face of the team and be a media guy.

But the one thing, the one thing I will say is that I've read online that the players love him, that he's like a great clubhouse guy. Yeah. Already made everybody uncomfortable, but Boone is like their buddy and like, you know, they love him.

So I really, as much as I dislike him, I think he's over his head. I really can't argue with the results, certainly. And if the players are happy and they're playing well, then I'm happy. So.

Did you find a new job for Luis Severino or is he going to stick with baseball for a couple more years? Well, we'll see, you know, he's going to be like getting a big picture at the deadline. He's going to come back. He's been their ace and,

uh, you know, getting a big picture in the major leagues, getting a big picture at the deadline. He's going to come back. He's been their ace. And, you know... Getting a big picture in the major leagues? Getting a big picture? Yeah, absolutely. And he's well-rested. Last year, he kind of, you know, he got tired towards the end and faded, but this year, he's going to be fresh. It's a big addition for us. You're trying to harsh my mellow here. It's not going to work.

We're in cloud nine, baby. Are they going to spend money for deadline people, or is it still a strict budget from, from Hank Steinbrenner? Well, no, I think they're going to go out and win, but I mean,

I'm not sure they're going to have to spend money if they got one more, could they use one more starter? Definitely. But you know, I don't know who's going to be available. I mean, I listened to, I listened to the bad dog pretty much every day.

I'm serious on my way home. And he's a big San Francisco giants guy. So he's been trying to hype up a Bumgarner trade. But I really don't want any part of him because I think he's kind of shot and over the hill, and I think he's a free agent. So I really, you know, Mad Dog's like, well, he'll take Frazier and Andahar for Bumgarner.

I wouldn't do that. Hey, you get a guy like Bumgarner, and you get a big-game pitcher. Exactly. I mean, give me Frazier, Andahar, and we'll give you Bumgarner, you're a big game pitcher. Exactly. I mean, give me Fajan, and we'll give you Bumgarner. The guy would, I mean, if the Nationals ever fell out of it, trade at Scherzer, but I think he's still

under contract for a couple years. The Yankees have taken on a lot of money. I'd be intrigued by that because that's the guy that's pitched in the American League before. Bumgarner worries me because he's always been a National League pitcher, and I think he's over the hill. So I'm not sure.

I know he's been a big game, huge postseason pitcher, but I don't know. He doesn't really do it for me. So I don't know who the big starter is that's going to be available. Would the Yanks be in the mix for that? Yeah, because I think their farm system is still decent. They have prospects. Their infield has an embarrassment of riches now. So if somebody wanted, I mean,

I can't believe I'm saying this, but like, you know, I would part with Andahar. I know a team would have to take him off a year after surgery, but he's still a competent player who's a great hitter. Yeah, sounds like you love him. We have a couple starters for you in

Boston, if you're interested in trading for some expensive starters. We might have a neighbor, too. Yeah, right. If you're interested in trading for some expensive starters, we might have a name or two. Yeah, right. We'll go get Price or Sale. Not so much. Chris Sale doesn't intrigue you at all? No.

I'm like Duke and Rocky when we used to do in college. Rocky would apologize. A part of me died too, but now you're the one. That's basically how I gave that speech to Gio Urshela. When Andahar got hurt, a part of me died, but now you're the one. And now I don't even remember Andahar's name. I know. I've fallen out of love and in love.

You enjoy when the Yankees are surprisingly good like this, but you also love more than anything when it's a disappointing Red Sox season. What have you enjoyed? Right. So it's really been, this has been like my dream season so far. Absolutely. I couldn't be happier. What have you enjoyed from a media coverage slash fan message board perspective from the Red Sox side the most? You do know me well. So I have been on Twitter looking at various Red Sox writers and reading

the comments and the number of people who want Cora fired really, really shouldn't have surprised me, but it did surprise me. Yeah. This is the guy that won 100 games last year and won the world series. Like everything he did was right. And now they're going to run them out of town because they're 500 at the moment. So funny.

Yeah. It's been a perfect storm of predictable things. The year after you win the world series, when it's just like one of those seasons. My favorite is when people blame the White House thing. Yeah. As dividing the locker room or whatever the hell they're saying. Well, yeah, that was a good one.

Yeah. I have seen that too, that it divided the locker room because Cora wouldn't go to the White House or whatever. Yeah, the players are like, oh my God, I can't believe we wouldn that it divided the locker room because Cora would go to the white house or whatever. Like, yeah, the players are like, Oh my God, I can't believe we can go to the white house.

Like, come on. That's the most, like Cora was going to go to the white house. Who ever thought that was happening in a million years ever. That was never happening. My favorite thing is when Trump, when the Red Sox went out,

like we're hot for a minute there when they were playing some mediocre teams, they got hot. Trump tweeted out that they had gotten super hot after they went to the white house yeah coming to the white house now it was like the opposite of the si curse yeah i saw that funny i saw that he the best part when they visited him when they he he talked to he mentioned mentioned Steve Pierce. Did you see that part? No. When he said something like, and Steve Pierce, big part of last year's team, off to a little bit of a slow start this year, but I'm sure it'll come around.

He was hitting like 100. It was just like, it was just classic. Yeah, it was a little awkward that basically all the white guys went, or most of the white guys, and then nobody else. But on the other hand, hand, I don't know. Do you really think this was a turning point? This wasn't like the Celtics where they had to have 15 team meetings and Kyrie Irving just being moody

and being a different person every week. I just think they move on to the next thing. They're baseball players. They're not rocket science. No, and the notion that any player cares week. I just think they move on to the next thing. They're baseball players. They're not rocket science scientists. The notion that any player cares who went to the White House or didn't go to the White House, I mean, it's ridiculous. There's no way. That's true. I

have seen that in some of the messages and I totally forgot about that. That's been my favorite. The Cora thing is hilarious though because that was like the best managing performance I've ever seen in my life last year and everybody loved him and he was a 10 out of 10. They got rid of John Farrell because that was the best managing performance I've ever seen in my life last year. And everybody loved him, and he was a 10 out of 10. They got rid of John Farrell, because he was like a... Cora's like a boon, where all the players love him.

He was the breath of fresh air in the clubhouse. Last year, they couldn't lose, set the world on fire, 108 wins. This year, they're a little slow out of the gate, and you're going to run Cora out of town. Not to mention that your city's won 1,500 championships in the past 10 years. Yeah, high expectations. The fact that the Red Sox are 500,

we could take a breath on that one. I'm counting Liverpool as a Boston title. Well, that's right. I forgot. John Henry owns them. Yeah, that's right. We have a couple of Liverpool fans at the ringer, uh chris ryan long time grantland ringer um you know one of our main inner circle people who is a diehard liverpool people so i was i was doing some we did it stuff with him and i think he was getting mad i was like another boston title for us and he's a philadelphia guy

he doesn't want to admit that a Boston owner brought his Liverpool team title. But, I mean, what a run for John Henry. Really, like all time. You win the World Series and you win the Champions League back to back. That's pretty... And that's his wife's thing. She loves being like the queen of Liverpool, I believe, right? Right.

So they had those two. I guess the loss would be the Boston Globe. Which... They have, so they had those two. I guess the loss would be the Boston Globe, which somehow isn't even at 100,000 print subscribers anymore, but yet the digital isn't that high either. It doesn't seem like they have a great plan for that one. They put their articles behind a paywall, bum me out, because after the past couple of games, I wanted to go read some Red Sox articles and see the comments, and they wanted me to pay for it.

They should do targeted Instagram campaigns for Yankee fans. Read our sad Yankee coverage right now, 50% off. Right. I'd have paid a couple bucks to read that. If I could just read depressing Red Sox coverage, I would pay a couple bucks for that. Don't count us out, Johnny. No, I won't.

Don't count us out. We've got a lot of bats. A lot of bats on this team. Stranger things have happened. Believe me, I'm well aware. Well aware. I will say Devers, Hench and I, we love this Twitter account. It's at Red Sox Stats.

The guy knows more about the Red Sox than, he should probably just run the Red Sox. And he loves Devers more than I love both of my kids. And he's right. Devers is like an unbelievable two-way player now. He's really great. And, uh, and they have good bats.

I'm not, I'm not ready to give up on this season before, you know, you got Mookie, you got JD Martinez. I mean, you know, sale,

the Yanks beat him the other night, but he did have 10 strikeouts. He's, he's looked better. Um, you know, price can still do price things. Um,

you'll, you'll figure out a bullpen. You guys will go make a move and get a closer. There'll be some team that's out of it. They'll give you a closer, and that will turn things around. Yeah, we'll get like Shane Green from the Tigers. Just give us Shane Green. Yeah, I mean, these teams that are awful, you don't need a closer. So that's the easiest thing in the world to go get.

Shane Green, at one point this year, last week, the Tigers had 21 wins and he had 17 saves. And I was like, how is that even possible? It seems inconceivable. Before we go, I should mention well, first of all, did you see Andy Ruiz Jr. last night? That was your

kind of content. No, I did not. I saw that this morning and I couldn't believe the pictures of what the heavyweight world looked like. Speaking of beer league softball, that guy looks like a barroom brawler that he just won a street fight. It's like in real life Rocky. They get that guy out and you fight the champ just for a show.

And he won the whole thing. Crazy. Love it. And then he came out in a Knicks jersey at the press conference. I know. Big win for the Knicks jersey at the press conference. I know. Big win for the Knicks fans. Absolutely. Things are turning around for those wacky kids.

Before we go, I wanted to mention, the last time you were on, I think we were talking about if Biden ran, what Trump's nickname would be for him. And I think we settled on Gropey Joe. We did. And what did Trump settle on? Well, it's, it's funny. He's the first, the first one that he came out with, or it seems like the first iteration was sleepy, creepy Joe, which we were, we were like, wow, we should have, we could have come up with that if we had brainstormed 10 more minutes. But lately in his, lately in his tweets, it's just sleepy joe he's gotten rid of the creepy and i mean i don't i know joe biden's you know he's 76 or whatever but you know one

trump is no spring chicken and two biden never comes across particularly as like sleepy to me like or lazy you know he's if anything he's like too boisterous. So I don't quite understand the sleepy thing. I think that's a play on that he's older, but he's 76. Trump is 74. I'm not quite sure what the logic is there, but he seems to be going with sleepy Joe. Do you think his advisors told him maybe dump the creepy since you're not exactly Mother Teresa? Perhaps.

Yeah, perhaps. I don't know. They must have focus group that and maybe the people didn't mother Teresa, but perhaps, yeah, perhaps, I don't know. They must've focused group that. And maybe the people didn't like creepy, but they liked, they would like sleepy. I really don't know. I think they need to go back to the drawing board on that one.

Cause I think what you really want to hammer home is the creepy thing, like sleepy, creepy, you know? I mean, I think you're grasping it. They're grasping at straws, but the sleepy alone,

I don't think is doing it. Sleepy Joe. I really thought we struck oil with Gropey Joe. I thought for sure he was going to do that one. It almost rhymes. It just works somehow. Gropey Joe. I know.

It sounds like a car wash or like a bar that you would go to in North Hollywood. We're going to Gropey Joe's tonight. I don't know how he didn't go for that one. I don't know. It's back to the drawing board for us, I guess. It's a long time until November 2020. So there's time to rework that for his team, I guess. So what, uh, what have you most enjoyed about the 20 democratic nominees we have? It's hard to pick just one, one thing. Um, it's crazy how many people are running and some of

these people that get into it. And I mean, I guess you sort of run for president at this, in the same age because it raises your profile and you can get it, you know, after you bow out, you get increased speaking fees, your names out there or whatever. But I mean, some of these people, I mean, I've literally seen like Facebook or Twitter quizzes where it's like, who, which of these people are real presidential candidates. And I'm pretty attuned to politics. I read some of these names. I'm like, really? That person's running for politics. I read some of these names, and I'm like, really? That person's running for president?

I couldn't pick that guy or that woman out of a lineup. Yeah. You think that's a problem? It's crazy. And, you know, Beto O'Rourke from Texas, who lost to Ted Cruz, and he was, you know, anointed the next Bobby Kennedy by an adoring media. And, boy, he fell off the earth quicker than uh anybody in history of mankind i mean he he was at these lofty heights and everybody loved him and he had like the your former colleagues the

pod bros in his back pocket and you know hollywood and everything else and they just fallen apart this guy who's the mayor of south bend indiana put pete buddhich i guess it's like that he's stolen all of his thunder and really come out of nowhere. You know, he's taken the Beto lane. I would never know if it's Beto or Beto. It's Beto. It's Beto. He was a little like Anthony Joshua.

He looked good on paper, but when he took a couple hits, he just went down. And his problem is he doesn't really have any rationale for running. No. He's our age, and he's just sort of, like, trying to find himself. Like, he's had, like, 15 different careers. Right. And, you know, he comes from some money. His father was in politics,

and that's kind of the family business, but he has no real, like, you know, people ask him questions, and he's like, well, that's a good question, and we're going to think about that. I'm going to listen to you about that. Like, well, no, no, I'm not running for president. You are.

I'm asking you the question, you know? So I think people saw through that and were like, um, yeah, there's no, they're there. So I have kind of fallen off. I have a couple of people that I work with who I won't name, but we, we had been talking about him during the brief apex. And it was a lot of like, what's going on here. He's not saying anything. Right. It's a lot of like, what's going on here. He's not saying anything. Right.

It's a lot of, I was born for this. It's like, okay, what do you stand for? Uh, what's your plan? Are you going to,

what's your experience? Do you have any experience? Some experience would be good. I lost to Ted Cruz. I was born for this. Exactly. Yeah. And it's like, you know, the media and everybody loved them because you're running against Ted Cruz. I was born for this. Exactly, yeah. And it's like,

you know, the media and everybody loved him because you're running against Ted Cruz because even like Republicans don't like Ted Cruz. So, you know,

you're running against Ted Cruz, you're bound to look good, especially to the liberal media who's going to love you. But now when you're running against, you know, 19 or 20 or whatever other liberals

are running, the media is not going to be as in love with you. The one I like and he just got in is the mayor of New York city, Bill de Blasio, who literally has like a 10% approval rating. And he's like, ah, I'm going to run for president. And people said like,

literally his advisors said off the record or not off the record, but anonymously rather, or like, uh, he's basically doing it because he's bored as the mayor of New York. Oh, that's fantastic. That's good's good yeah i was thinking it's like president it's like if there was a higher job than owner of a special a professional sports team where you owned all the teams and james dolan's like good news i've thrown my hat in the ring people people would be like what you're gonna be the chief owner You can't even own your own team. Like if Jim Dolan was like,

I'm throwing my hat in for commissioner of the NBA or something. No, no, that was an elected position. Yeah. I love Mayor Pete just for like how he, how he basically orchestrated that five week run there where he just did all the perfect media hits. He sounded confident, did his thing. Nobody else really was able to gain any momentum.

I saw the AOC documentary on Netflix. Yeah. Oh, no. Well, that was a derisive yeah. Yeah. Yes, it was. Jesus. She's interesting.

I mean, she's 10 years away from whatever, but her passion and her story and all that was really compelling. And I do think there is a spot for some young person who's eight, 10 years older than her to make an impact like that. Cause I think people are ready for it, but unfortunately that person does not exist. And no, I mean, she, she's, she's very good. She's very good politician. She's a really good politician. That's a perfect way to put it.

She's a very good politician. Her story is pretty good that she was basically a, not basically, she was a bartender. The guy who had that seat in Congress was entrenched and had been there for a long time and nobody ever figured he was going to lose. Certainly not to this woman that really nobody had heard of. So for her to do it the old fashioned way with shoe leather and, you know, knocking on doors and saying like, what's this guy done for you lately and everything else. That, that part is impressive. I mean, you know, that's a district where you could run my dog as a democrat and he's going to win if he gets the if he wins the primary because you know you could run jesus christ himself as the republican and he's going

to get like five percent of the vote so it's a good district but the hard part for her was winning a primary and i guess the guy you know the guy she beat not only had been there for like 100 years or whatever but he i think he was like up in the leadership ranks of the democrats and could have been like the number two or three not the number two but three or number three or four guy in the house so he had a lot of juice a lot of seniority so to beat him out coming out of nowhere is impressive you know, her ideas and such are maybe less so, but, uh, yeah,

she certainly seems to be the, uh, you know, people seem to like her, put it that way. I like her. I just wish we had a presidential candidate that I was that excited about. I'll tell you what,

I'll save, I'll save you a lot of time. You can pretend she's president and you can just send me 90% of your paycheck. You have my address. Just send it in the mail or direct deposit. Either way, save time. That's good.

You don't like her 1090 plan? I'll send you my kid's college bills. You can just pick that up. This is on Uncle Bill, kid. He wants to pretend AOC is president. We're going to help him. President AOC is president. We're going to help him. President AOC. I enjoyed the documentary, and I think she has good ideas.

So I shouldn't be waiting by the mailbox? Is that what you're telling me? No. We're going to get sleepy Joe. I'm going to get so many angry tweets about this from angry socialists. It's going to be fantastic. Yeah. Bird might be here with pitchforks and torches.

Great. Yeah, we're having fun. We're having a good time here. That's good. Absolutely. It's a fun day. It's a fun podcast. Yanks are good. The Red Sox are mediocre. Everything's right with the world. Yeah.

Do you think there's any chance anything happens with Trump? Did you follow all this impeachment stuff and all the, all the, uh, I think they'd be, I think the Democrats would be crazy to impeach him. I mean, you know, I understand for two years, you know, I, I remember, you know, hoping that Bill, you know, Monica Lewinsky thing was going to bring Bill Clinton down and, you know, waiting with bated breath for that to happen or for him to resign. And he didn't.

So I understand the disappointment and waiting for, you know, the Mueller report to, say, list all these crimes and everything else. But when he essentially came out, I know it's open to interpretation and everything else, but when he found no influence, essentially, with the Trump campaign and Russia. Now, I'm not to say that they didn't try, but I think they were too inept to really do anything illegal. You can get into the obstruction and everything else.

But in terms of the collusion, it was pretty clear that there's nothing where they were directly tied to any Russian involvement in anything. So I understand Democrats' disappointment in thinking, well, they were going to have the smoking gun and this was going to be all she wrote for the Trump presidency. But I think they would be crazy to impeach him. Me too. As happened with Clinton, it made him more popular because impeachment really should be only for like really serious crimes where it's obvious that everybody is on board with this guy or this woman has to go because they're a criminal. To do it because it looks like you're overturning an election. And I think it just people that are sort of in the middle, maybe don't love Trump, but are happy with the economy or something. I think that gins them up.

And it's like, why are the Democrats trying to overturn an election when there's going to be one in, you know, 15 months? I have a friend. I think it'd be crazy to do it. But I think Nancy Pelosi is under a lot of pressure because her, certainly their constituency wants to, is gung-ho for impeachment, and they're trying to gin everybody up to do that. And I think a lot of the members want to do that,

but I think that would backfire on them. Well, Trump is plus 120 to win the presidency. Joe Biden is 3-1. Bernie Sanders is 12-1. Elizabeth Warren is 15-1. Mayor Pete's 20-1. Kamala Harris is 30 to 1 Andrew Yang is 50 to 1

and Beto's born to do this at 55 to 1 you know if you wanted to put some money down on somebody that I would not count out I'd go for Kamala Harris at 30 to 1 really? what's your case?

well I think the vanguard of the Democratic Party does not want to nominate a white male if they could help it. I think she's from California, which is always huge in terms of Hollywood money. And, you know, California is a humongous constituency for the Democratic Party. So I think that helps her. I think being a female helps her. So I think that helps her. I think being a female helps her. A female of color helps her. I think in their heart of hearts, that's who most Democrats would like to vote for. Now, I don't know. The problem for her is I don't know how well she's going to do in Iowa and New Hampshire is probably Bernie Sanders territory because he's from Vermont.

So but she could do well in a place like South Carolina where there's a large African-American vote. If she wins South Carolina and she becomes a top-tier candidate, I think she's got a good shot, outside shot. I think the smart money would be on Biden, but if you wanted to make a, you know, kind of a crazy bet, but like an outside shot bet, I'd go for her.

We know, we'll know when to start taking her seriously when Trump starts doing drive-bys on her, taking like those little nicknames. And he's got to be careful with that because, you know, she's an African-American woman. And, you know, I mean, I don't know, maybe he doesn't because God knows what he does already and he's gotten by with it somehow. The thought of Trump going, yeah, maybe I should hold back this time around. Right, let me hold my fire. Yeah, that's true.

What am I talking about? Common sense and logic. Have I learned nothing in the past four years? Common sense and logic says maybe I should tone it down a little here. Yeah, I don't think he's going to do that. It's a farce to even try to predict this because I went around for two years

saying there's no way Trump's going to get the nomination. I'm like, there's no way he's going to win. And here we are. What does anybody know, really? I'm trying to think what his name is. It would be something playing off the word Camilla. Yeah. I don't have to think about this.

He seems to go with crazy a lot. Crazy Camilla? Crazy Camilla or whatever. He likes to be crazy. Everybody's always crazy. Everybody's always dumb, lazy, or crazy. That's been his vernacular. I wonder if he would, what about can't do it Camela?

There you go. Because he likes to have like the kind of awkward force of a nickname as it seems to be in his wheelhouse too. If you're going to vote for can't do it Camela. Well, let's see. I'm on the edge of my seat. Johnny. You know what's going to vote for can't do it, Kamala. Well, let's see. I'm on the edge of my seat. Johnny. You know, it's going to be fun.

The debates are going to start soon and that will be fun because, you know, he's going to be watching it and like live tweeting it essentially. So he'll have like a running diary on Twitter as he watches the debates and just the dynamics of the debate will be interesting. So that might be one of those where like a half hour before the debates, the wifi goes down in the white house. Yeah. Like,

sorry, Mr. President, the wifi is down. No signals can come out of the way we're trying to figure it out. The 5g has gone down. If they have the Saturday night live goat boy, like electric prod,

that's when they're going to have to break it out. That's going to be the time. All right, Johnny. Thanks as always. This is a pleasure. And we'll talk to you over the summer. Good to hear from you again. All right.

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Until then. I don't want to see them on the way so I never say I don't have feelings with them. On the wayside, on the way so I never say I don't have feelings with them.