The Bill Simmons Podcast - The Chet Holmgren Hard-to-Evaluate Hall of Fame and Other Lottery-Related Madness Subplots With Ryen Russillo

Episode Date: March 21, 2022

The Ringer’s Bill Simmons is joined by Ryen Russillo to discuss that great feeling the NCAA tournament brings, keeping an eye on the top NBA draft prospects during the tournament, Bill’s list of all-time hardest players to evaluate for the draft, the best teams for each of the top-four prospects, the new list of NBA title contenders in the Eastern Conference, and much more! Host: Bill Simmons Guest: Ryen Russillo Producer: Kyle Crichton Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

For as long as I've known the NBA, it's been a stars league. But even among the stars, there's an exclusive club. Russell, Dr. J, Jordan, Kobe. They're all part of a select group that paved the way for the NBA superstar of today. And some even shared secrets with each other along the way. From Spotify and the Ringer Podcast Network, I'm Jackie McMullen, and this year. I love the first month of the season because you have to go into the season thinking, I think Pittsburgh's going to be good. I think the Chargers are going to be good. I think Seattle's going to be good. And then trying to back what you think in those first few weeks and then zag the other way. If you were wrong, you could bet

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per 355 mil can so why not grab some Miller Lites today your game time tastes like Miller Time must be legal drinking age we're also brought to you by the Ringer Podcast Network. Launched a couple podcasts last week,

in case you missed it. The Town, our new Hollywood industry pod, hosted by Matt Bellany. He is doing it two to three times a week. Really good week one. Talked about Amazon and MGM and the Bond franchise feature. That.

Talked about Netflix's password crackdown. Talked about the Batman ticket upcharge. This is a good pod. If you like Hollywood, you'll like this podcast and you will like the big picture as well because it's Oscar season and Sean Fantasy is diving into it over there. So we have that. We also launched Icons Club, our new narrative series by Jackie McMullen about the evolution of the NBA superstar. We put up the prologue. We put up the first episode, which was about Bill Russell and Will Chamberlain, their relationship, and how they became kind of the OGs of everything that would follow over the next 60 years. You can check that podcast out. It's on the Book of Basketball feed.

Remember the Book of Basketball 2.0? Yeah, it's on that feed. Maybe it'll inspire me to start doing more Book of Basketball podcasts. So we have that. One other feed to tell you about, the Ringer F1 show. Kevin Clark resuscitated it. He broke down Drive to Survive, the 10 episodes on Netflix.

We did that in three parts, previewed the F1 season, and then he's going to have a reaction pod to the first race, which was Sunday night, Ferrari kicking ass. No surprise to anyone who's admired Ferrari from afar all these years. Rasul and I might talk about that a little bit later. We're going to talk about college basketball and the lottery, which players would be the best fit for which teams. And then Rasul and I are going to do our NBA thing. This is another classic. I don't know what to tell you. We just keep banging that home runs. Hopefully, like Trevor Story will be doing for the Red Sox for six years,

140 million. A shortstop who are moving to second base, even though he's a better defensive shortstop than the guy we have at shortstop. And the Patriots haven't signed anybody. I am kind of a mess from all the signings and weird signings. Pats, Red Sox, Bruins made a big trade. Celtics coming on. Hopefully we'll see. Yeah. Talk about that with my dad, maybe this week. Today we're talkinging this a little bit later on Sunday night. Ryan Masillo is here. What a sports weekend. A lot of stuff going on.

Feels like an inordinate amount of stuff with the football and the baseball signings and then NBA and then NHL trades and then March Madness and F1 started. And I just, my head's spinning. My wife and daughter are away this weekend. I just watched sports for three straight days. It was great. Yeah, look, you're trying to keep it all together. Those first two days, I mean, it's 12 hour days where you go, I'm watching every one of these

games and I've got all the TVs going. I mean, I just, I wish people could understand how hilarious it used to be back in the day of us just collectively getting so mad the next day, whether you were in school or if you were at work being like, and then they cut out of the Richmond game to go to Indiana. And it's like, there would just be these stretches where the programming people couldn't get a break. And they would just be cutting out of the wrong possible game to get to the,

it would just be hilarious. And now obviously that's not an issue. So it's awesome. I was actually trying to figure out today whether it's been 40 years for me with the tournament where I actually remember watching it. I don't remember the Ainge layup. I feel like I saw that live,

but I remember somewhere between 82, 83, 84 range hustling home on that Thursday because there were games. And then I remember in the mid 80s, the late games, they would have the late, late games that were, uh, you know, the Thursday, Friday that were just, you know, they would end at like one 30 in the morning East coast time. Um, but if it's four straight decades of this, they've spread the games out. They've at least figured out how to stagger them. So we don't have the cutaway problems as much, but I was feeling it on Saturday and Sunday, just having the one game,

you know, start basically chewing up half of the afternoon. If that game sucks, then, and it didn't, the Baylor game was incredible. But if that game had sucked, it's like, all right, that's half of our Saturday with only one good game, you know, one game and it was a loser, but that one wasn't. NBA refs, stock up. I feel like this happens every year, though. People watch the college and they lose their minds how bad the college... Yeah, it's weird. They love calling, reviewing the charges.

They love penalizing people for holding onto the rim and stuff like that. It did make me feel bad about the NBA refs. The Baylor game was the game of the, uh, of the first four days though, because the kid fouls out in Carolina who looked like he was at almost famous.

It was having an awesome game. Looked like he was setting 40. Yeah. He's out. Baylor hits a couple of shots. You're like, Oh, is this going to be one of those things where we remember what happened when this kid got kicked out? And it goes through. Incredible comeback. Gets to OT and you're just like, oh, there's no way North Carolina can hold on now. That was one of the biggest collapses I've seen in a game. And then somehow they win an OT. how they went in ot so i was at the gym that morning because i was like hey i got to figure

out some window to get out of the house and when they went up i go okay i'm good and manic's out with 10 minutes i thought that the elbow was intentional because he was trying to get pissed back at sohan who pisses everybody off the whole time yeah and i know you and i both like sohan a lot from oh my god um i love that kid oh my god so I know we'll probably do a little bit more of it later. So I was kind of doing a back and forth thing, being like, I can't believe I left the house. And now this game is turning into one of the all-time collapses. I mean, it's a 25-point game with like 10 minutes left.

It was 67-42. That's right. Nailed it. So I watched it again just from that moment on. And I wanted to keep track because all Twitter was was talking about the officials. And I'm like, this is so bad on social media. Like, I wonder what it's going to be. So I want to track everything. North Carolina sucked for 10 minutes too. All right. There are some calls that didn't go their way. They couldn't get the ball in.

They didn't, it was like they'd never seen pressure before. And Baylor also plays with intensity with all these big, huge guys flying around when they're playing desperate. That's not a great time. But North Carolina did far more to themselves than the officials did. I totally agree. I thought the coaching was bad. They were calling timeouts to set up inbounds plays that then were just the guy being trapped in the corner. It was really weird.

And then, you know, they kept showing Roy Williams in the stands. I kept thinking he was going to come out of the stands like Shooter and Hoosiers. But it was the makings to figure out what was the biggest collapse I've ever seen in a basketball game. And immediately Clippers Houston is the biggest huge score collapse that I can remember. And then Spurs Miami game six, 2013, Blazers Lakers 2000. But most of them were NBA. And I couldn't really remember, what were the great college collapses where you could just see the entire team choking at the same time i felt like duke had a run there where the other team would always just you'd be like okay this team just isn't gonna hang on because that's what i look i love the tournament it's arguably my favorite sporting event and instead of being mad about the refs because it's bad and all the different stuff i'm just kind of like this is awesome like you're just

flying around the dial for 12 hours and you're learning about guys as you get ready for the draft. If you're excited about that part of it. But I always felt like one of the things that would drive me crazy about it is the team. And it doesn't feel like it happens as much now because maybe there's just an awareness of it. But I feel like when you and I were growing up, there was always a team that was up, but that wasn't supposed to be up. And they just, they stopped playing basketball. They couldn't wait for the game to be over. Right.

They had a 35-minute game. Right. Couldn't quite get there. Yeah. I didn't bet on Thursday because every Thursday I lose. And I just, I'm culling my memory of like, oh, I watched that team on mid-February on ESPN2 at midnight. So I stayed away. And then Friday, I'm like,

nah, I'm going to sprinkle some stuff around. But what I'm going to do is I'm going to tie everything to the Raptors' money line against the Lakers. Because I know the Raptors are going to beat the Lakers on Friday night. That's definitely happening. So I tied the Raptors' money line to like five games.

I'm like, I'm going to try to go four and one with these five. And then the Raptors lost to the Lakers. And they were up three with the ball, nine seconds left. They somehow can't inbound it. Russ comes out of his coma for the year,

steals the ball, and then hits a three to send it into OT. And then that was it. Or they won it. Whatever that happened. My head was spinning. But yeah, Big Steel, Westbrook 3, and that was it.

Why are you looking at me confused? No, because when you asked me about the collapses, I was trying to remember how many Memphis was up on Kansas when Kansas came back and won in overtime. Oh, that was a good one. Yeah, the 2008? Yeah, that's a good one. Yeah. the 2008. Yeah, that's a good one. Yeah, that's a nice one.

Yeah. I'm trying to look it up. You're right, by the way, because we were watching, I think we were texting during the Raptors game. So we were just sitting around and, you know,

Russ almost cracked the backboard on that one from the left side. And then he made us kind of, you know, it was a sort of scramble play i i was shocked to even get his foot behind the line and he hits the three and you're like oh all right i mean scotty barnes got in the hall of fame with that game too as well it's just it's kind of funny listening to lakers though talk about like they're trying to make it more complicated because it sounds better if they can make it complicated for why there's these struggles and

you know westbrook hit the shot and good for him he was like look my missus 20 000 points my missus they don't matter i'm like no we're aware your misses do not impact you we we're we're we have plenty of evidence this year that you do not care it's amazing how defining is when something good happens it's he has this aura about him like see told you this has been sitting here the whole time you guys just don't haven't asked for it it would be like if you had the worst person ever on first take who just over and over again had the worst takes in the world and then one time had a good take and people like oh they had good point he's like yeah told, told you. Got more. Take fountain over here. I got this in my bag.

I got this in my bag. But if they just said, hey, we don't try. We don't like the trying part. Like that would just be more, it'd be more accurate and it'd be better. No one's ever going to say it's hilarious, but they're always like, well, you know, we felt good about this and we did some things defensive.

Somebody should just be like, we don't really love trying if we haven't noticed. We just don't, we go long stretches. We're like, I don't want love trying if we haven't noticed. We go long stretches and we're like, I don't want to do this tonight. And that's who we are. It's a weird situation because them not having their pick, they can't tank. They can't shut it down

because LeBron is now thinking about all these scoring records. LeBron is getting an amazing amount of media coverage too for a team that's 10 games under 500 and is completely irrelevant and cannot do anything. But they're just in this, like I was driving, I had to drive Ben somewhere yesterday

and I was listening to Lakers Wizards. And the announcers, the Wizards came back and Porzingis was doing stuff. And the announcers, I know the local announcers have to like root for their team and do the whole thing, but they seem stunned that the Wizards were coming back. I'm like, oh my God, poor Zayn.

It's like, you guys have to watch all these games. The Lakers can't defend anybody, anything, but it's, man, people are saying they think it's the worst Lakers season ever. Like people who watch the team, I'm like, there's no way

this is even one of the four worst Lakers seasons. Everyone forgets the two Byron Scott years when he was just like a statue on the side as they went 17 and 65. There's no way this was worse than that. Well, it's worse in the sense

that you had expectations though. You know, those Byron Scott teams, I don't know that anybody was going, hey, this team. But at least this team, you get to watch LeBron and some, you know, who have 56 points and like, what was fun about the two Byron Scott? We're saying the same thing. We're saying the same thing.

And by the way, I guess Suri sent us a note on this. So yeah, Kansas was down nine with two minutes to go in that game. By the way, pro Westbrook take, though. I don't know what's going on with you kids. You kids out there just filming Westbrook saying, I fuck with you, and you just need to do better. And then he walks away from Westbrook, and he starts calling him goofy,

and he videotapes the whole thing, and he thinks it's hilarious. I thought Coach O, when he's being filmed in a bar, some bar some bar somewhere i thought he was gonna rip limbs out of torsos with a look on his face and like you go and have your buddy stand behind coach o with a big l on his forehead to like get it in the background and then coach o busts you for it i don't know i don't know like to me coach was like the last guy you want to do that with. That was two samples this week in social media that I just want to point out. Your thumbs down on just being dicks with camera phones? Yeah.

Think about it. Westbrook. The Westbrook part, people were like, oh, Westbrook needs to chill. Fuck that. That guy, especially if somebody's standing there holding it in front of them to be like, Hey, now I'm going to talk shit to you and then show this to everybody. And I just don't understand the disconnect of the people that would watch that and go, Oh, that was cool. Westbrook was wrong because then the guy totally exposed himself later on in the same video. Whereas once he was far away from him, he started making fun of Westbrook.

So he wasn't even being sincere the first time around. He just wanted to keep the conversation going. So whatever. I don't know. Observation. Not super important. Can we go back to March Madness for a second? Please. I want to stop myself from talking. I was thinking about Coach K. There's a moment here today when it seemed like they were going to lose

before Michigan State just shit the bed. It was in the air for about two minutes. There's a commercial. It's like, oh my God, Duke might actually lose. Round two, Jesus. Then I was thinking, Cal Perry gets knocked out in round one

and it feels like that Cal Perry, Kentucky thing, the magic feels like it might be gone with that. And you have Boeheim near the tail end. But I was thinking, who's going to be the signature college basketball coach eight years from now? Once this whole generation of guys gets weeded out or retires, the whole thing. Is this it? Is this the last hurrah for the impactful, awesome, larger-than-life college basketball coach? Or is there another generation coming?

Is it like Jay Wright? Are we going to think of Jay Wright 10 years from now? Like we thought of Dean Smith in the 90s? It doesn't feel like it. I don't think so either. I also think the Big East, all of it got so screwed up over the years, too. It just doesn't feel the same. That was so great about the Big East back in its heyday,

is you had these massive personalities that were so different from each other. And, you know, back when I'm sure you and I both love college basketball as much as we did, I just don't have as much time for it now, but I loved it. I mean, I would rather watch a big Monday than an NBA game, but like probably into my twenties, I remember watching pack 12 stuff like crazy. Cause I just loved it. It was like one couple of years there where the league was totally deep, but I'm But I'm with you. You know, I mean, what are you going to have?

Guys going three decades plus? I don't know if work works that way anymore. You know what I mean? Is anybody going to have the juice to be able to have a couple bad losing seasons and stick around? I don't think the job is that anymore. Yeah, I was thinking about the 80s Big East. Thompson. Boeheim. Raleigh, Louis Carneseca.

And it just felt like the coaches were almost the stars, even though there were all these great players throughout. The coaches always kind of levitated above everybody else. And then the ACC had that a little bit with Dean Smith, then Roy Williams and Coach K. But now we're heading into this era where I'm not sure who's going to have it because I don't feel like... Even Tom Izzo, who has been around forever and done some great things, but I don't feel like

he has crossed over the way like John Thompson did. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. There's a while there where I would have put Izzo in a game up against anybody. Yeah, I'm not talking about actual skill as a coach. I'm just talking about personality, charisma. You would think Jay Wright would have it, but I don't feel like...

I do wonder with Duke and Calipari and Boeheim, obviously. But those three, will that be it? Well, Self is somebody you would bring up at Kansas. But I mean, think about- When was the last Bill Self conversation? Like, would you have a 15-minute

Bill Self conversation? Do people have takes, sides on Bill Self? Like, no. National takes? I really like Bill Self, just for the record. Yeah, I like him too.

But like, think about in the 70s, 80s, and 90s, we would have long arguments, conversations about like Tarkanian and Thompson and, you know, Duke versus Dean Smith, who was better. Then it became Duke versus Roy Williams. And I don't know, it felt like such a big part of college basketball.

Now, I don't think about the coaches as much. I think that's the sport, though. It really is not in the daily consciousness the way that it was and it felt like it happened really quick. Do you think you have to stay in the same school for decades before that? You think that's a piece of it?

Because I guess Roy jumped from Kansas to North Carolina. Yeah, but he still felt like two of the five blue bloods and he kind of went home, you know, so. Maybe it'll be Sheena Holloway. I loved it. I loved all Big East guys getting done. I can't tell you the Holy Cross threads

I was on this weekend about, you know, for 30 years, my dream was for us to have a St. Peter's run. You know, just like have the two kids that get hot and the 15 seed, whatever. And everybody go, where did this school come from? St. Peter's has like a way less of an endowment than Holy Cross does. And yet they're the ones that made the Sweet 16

and we just couldn't figure it out. But the fact that they did it tells me like, you just need to get lucky with the coach, which is what we said with Holy Cross forever. Just the up and coming coach. Holloway is definitely going to leave now, right? Like there's no way he's there three years from now, but you got to get, if you can get lightning in the bottle once with that coach, then, then that's it. You're off and Holy Cross, it can never happen. UVM, same thing you almost you were you were sitting there ready for like a little run and like what happens to uvm if you have a run this month

you'd have to understand uvm athletics that it's just never that much of a priority up there it would be cool in the town it'd be awesome on campus it'd be fun for all of us because that's the best part about being in the tournament. You start on Thursday and you're maybe going to bed or driving to work. Going to bed tonight, driving to work Monday morning and you're like, holy shit, I get another week. I get another week, especially if it's a team like St.

Peter's where you go, I can't believe this. Think of those guys. They're like rock stars. That's the thing. If you could just get out of the first weekend you have that four days or five

it could be five days potentially where it's just like the excitement is off the charts we had it holy cross with the women's team actually

the women's team made a run it was fucking exciting I was really into it we had a chance did you have a close game with was it Kansas

like 20 years ago no it wasn't Kansas we had the the Billy Walker Frank Powell teams Did you have a close game with, was it Kansas like 20 years ago? No, it wasn't Kansas. We had the Billy Walker, Frank Powell teams got a little frisky in the mid-90s one year. But we never, you know, the closest the Holy Cross game was the Dwayne Wade year. When we played Marquette and we were like toe-to-toe with Marquette. And then Marquette had this Wade kid who kind of, you know, and there was one other guy.

And then all of a sudden it was like, oh, they have better athletes than us. But we just never were able to get over that. The St. Peter's thing. I had two bandwagon jumps. I had Iowa and Caitlin Clark. I watched the entire Caitlin Clark game today. And of course, Iowa lost.

So I felt like I was responsible. And then the St. Peter's thing was the other one. My dad was- Oh, wait. It was Kentucky 2001, because I remember watching it. For Holy Cross. Yeah. Yeah. We never got over the hump. Yeah. Did you watch the Iowa game today? I did not. I was getting caught up on F1. It was tough. It was tough. It was the ABC spot for Caitlin Clark.

I was totally ready to do a whole segment today about how she's the most exciting college person, Steph Curry. And she didn't play very well. And they lost to a team that had somebody who transferred from Iowa and went to Creighton and beat their ass. And that's how that ended on ABC.

No, I actually, I did want to check her out, but I mean, I was trying to, like you said, and on top of everything else, I go, when we're doing this pod tonight, how much NBA am I going to watch while all the tournament games are on too? We're taking a break. We'll come back.

We'll wrap up March Madness. We want to dive into the NBA and the connections with the lottery picks. This episode is brought to you by Movember the mustache is back with a vengeance look at Travis Kelsey before he rocked that Super Bowl ring he rocked that super soup strainer grow a mustache for Movember you'll do great things too you won't win the Super Bowl but your fundraising will support mental health suicide prevention and prostate and testicular cancer research. And if you don't want to grow a mustache, you can still walk or run 60 kilometers,

host an event, or set your own goal and mow your own way. Do great things this November. Sign up now. Just search Movember. Okay. So it seemed before the Auburn game, it seemed like we were going to have the top four prospects in the draft,

all available heading into week two, this tournament. And then Auburn fell apart and Jabari Smith stunk. And now he's got to wear that game like a scarlet letter. We should throw it out. I'm not worried about Jabari Smith. Not a good game, but I'm not going to do the overreact. He sucked on the thing. But Chet, watching him.

Can I give my Chet Holmgren nitpick? I do like Chet. The floor is yours. For somebody who's that tall and that long and seems to have good shopwalking instincts, I've watched Gonzaga a bunch of times now. People around the basket with him kind of get to the rim. They kind of go at him and his timing on some of those shopwalking isn't awesome. If the guy's coming at him, it's fine. But around the rim, the shiftier guys or the muscle guys, I'm not totally sold on him athletically as a

shopwalker around there. And then maybe he'll get better. But so I think about that and I think of his physique and I think he's one of the hardest to peg lottery picks of my lifetime. Wow. I don't, it's a, it's,

he's an incredible ceiling basement guy. You could walk me in any scenario and I, and I don't even have an opinion yet. The one thing I like about him, I like that he moves and he's busy and he's not just a dude that's just kind of like plotting or standing there. Like he, he's in the game, he's doing stuff. Yeah. He's always like his brain's moving. I like that. I just don't know what to make of him. I've never seen a player like him before, so I don't know how to evaluate it. And I've never seen a player like him before, so I don't know how to evaluate it. And I know some of the people like Schmitz,

KOC, Kyle Mann, like they all like him. It's not like anybody's like, this guy's going to be a bust. You know, Bradley, going way back, coming out of BYU, he took two years off, entered the draft. He'd had the one year to look at,

then he was two years older, and it was like, what is this guy? Is he athletic enough? I don't think people think Chet's going to be a bust. I just don't know how to evaluate it yet. I'm excited to watch him in more games.

He's really impressive. I think you nailed it, though, on the floor ceiling thing. I think if you argued about who has the best ceiling out of this class, this is why people argue about him being number one. Because he does. He has that. Like, what if it all comes together?

What if he fills out a little bit more? I mean, yeah, he gets pushed off of his spot, you know, one year out of high school with this kid and he's really skinny. I don't love. He is athletic, but I don't. There's just something about the way he's sort of hunched and his gait. That's a little weird, but then he'll be really explosive like he'll get going with a little momentum and he'll do a pivot through the lane spin dunk on you and then run back the other way i saw him block a shot in san francisco game in the tournament in their conference tournament where the guy was going to bring it around the other side of the rim

and he was like going up to block it with one hand and then realized the kid adjusted and he adjusted to the kid and then spiked it in the backboard and you're like that's some there are really good instincts there you know like why i've been with somebody a couple years ago one of the things i worried about even though i liked him as a prospect i was like you can see him thinking every step of what he's doing you can see him thinking the game instead of playing the game chet just plays yeah so there's a lot of stuff that i really like there but the problem is you have two absolutely just physical specimens in the argument with Bancaro and Jabari where Chet, a different draft, maybe there isn't a discussion, but we're talking about really special players that have all the size you could ever want in the wing positions that are in the mix.

Do you like any of these guys more than you liked Cade and Mobley last year? I still think maybe I like Mobley more than any of them. I know you liked him because I remember texting me like, I want to put Mobley one, but I also, you know, we'll get to this maybe with the Sixers a little bit later today. I just don't think the game is played with your big guy getting you a bucket late, even though Mobley absolutely took over that Denver game the other night. Having said all of that,

I still think I like Jabari. I just love him. Look, them losing and him stinking today, I don't care. Their guards are the worst. Yeah, I don't like their guards. We talked about that on another pod. You knew the guards were going to haunt.

I just didn't think it was going to be round two. Right. When the guards sunk them. Yeah, right. So I also think it's easier for some of these better seeds to lose games too because it's almost all these groups are just put together on the fly. So I don't know if they have like the same sense of urgency like, hey, this is my last year I'm a senior like nobody's saying that right the good players aren't those guys so um i i yeah i think i still kind of like jabari you sent me an interesting

ben caro text today that i didn't know i didn't want to talk to you about until we talk on the pod you're out on him no i'm not out. I'm out on him as the number one pick. Okay, why is that? The more I watch him, I worry. Remember the play when Duke was up one and the guy hit the three

with like a minute left because Van Carrow gave the ball up? But they they iso'd him at the top and he was going to try to score and he did like this stutter step and it just,

it had no chance and he kind of didn't know what to do and he just kind of threw it to the guard. I don't know about him and I'm sure people could send me a clip of him blowing by people at the top of the key a hundred times. I just, I don't know about him when he's playing at this next level, his ability to just go by people. And I, and that worries me. And it worries me that when he shoots, sometimes it seems like it takes like

an extra split second to develop it. The shot versus like, you know, you think like Durant as like the perfect one where Durant was just like a lever. It was just like, boom, boom, boom, boom. That's what Jabari's like. I mean, I'm not saying he's Durant and he's shot. No, but it's the same kind of thing. It's just like a lever. It's a crispness to it where it looks the same every single time. So you're saying Ben Carroll's a little too loose for you?

Slow into the shot? I just wonder, what is he like seven years from now? What's different about him? Does he have like a low post game? He seems to me like and I'm excited to watch him more, but I'm just trying to think of him in these different

situations. Like let's say he's on the Celtics. Right? Let's just switch him with Jalen Brown on the Celtics for no reason at all. The Celtics, by the way, are a juggernaut. I don't want to switch anyone on the Celtics, But just like, let's make him a four with playing next to Robert Williams.

Where is he in the court? Are we running plays for him? Is it like pick and roll? Is he the initiator? That's the part I can't figure out. How are teams going to use him? Is he going to be one of the best two options on a really good team, like initiating offense versus just like people setting him up and him,

you know, the kind of the way Duke uses them, where they get them, they try to get him these little sneaky shots, um, in that 18 to 22 range. But the, the ball handling thing,

I just don't know. I need to see it more. You've watched it more than I have. Yeah. I like them. I, you know, sometimes I'll watch him and I go,

does he settle too much? And I want to look at the shot chart. with that yeah i like him you know sometimes i'll watch him i go does he settle too much and i want to look at the shot chart then he ended up at like 31 from three on the season um you know he took a decent amount of them but he still had other guys on the team i mean the other thing that's weird about this duke team depending on when you watch them there are nights i really like went on more i like their center mark williams a lot aj griffin had a completely different second half of the season we were like okay this is why this guy's a lottery pick. Keels is supposed to go in the first round.

Roach is somebody who's playing a ton of minutes. They had seriously built five guys that would be leading scorers on other major programs. If they were just, hey, we're throwing you on Minnesota's basketball team, that guy would be the leading scorer. It's been a weird group.

They also stink on defense, which, for whatever reason, I don't know. They just do. They're not as good as they should be. Maybe I should say it that way. I think Ben Carroll does mix it up well, though, with shooting and transition. I like the way he wants to get out

and push. He's a good teammate that way. He'll get out and push, but he's not getting out and push from himself like he just wants to get the ball at the court and he has right vision in transition and i do see when just when i start to think i haven't figured out or like oh is he it's a little too loose today or is he not as into it then he'll drive and he'll take he'll get you right in there you know take you right in the paint and fucking spin and dunk on you. So I like him. I think it's funny to hear you pivot, though, because, and again, this happens with more minutes and more hours watching all these guys.

You loved him that first game. I did. The more I watch him, I just like the upside of Chet and Jabari a little bit more. You know what's interesting? And it's so weird because they look that thing alike. And I realized it today, but it was the Duke thing. There's a Leitner-ish, a couple of the things he does reminds me of Leitner.

Some of the stuff at the top of the key where he can do these spin moves and barrel to the basket, stuff like that. And I was trying to think of Leitner as a pro who was not quite big enough to be a center

in the way the old game was played, but he was like ultimately a power forward, but kind of, kind of a stretch forward. He was a little ahead of his time, but couldn't bang as much as he did in college and the pros. And I wonder like, I guess my question is,

will he be able to punish people if they, if there's a smaller guy on him? Um, will he be able to exploit that? How will teams defend him? I don't know. I want to see more. I don't have a finished guy on him. Will he be able to exploit that? How will teams defend him? I don't know. I want to see more. I don't have a finished opinion on him yet,

but it worried me today that it seemed like it seemed like it was hard for him to create shots a couple times when they really needed him. And I just kind of flagged it. Yeah, like AJ, when he gets kind of his side-to- side shit going he he makes guys look bad trying to stay in front of him like he's got a little bit more of that he's also smaller but he's got some more of that to his game than paulo does but i look i still like paulo a lot and i think a guy

like kade he's he's bigger than kade and i'm not saying he's going to be kade because kade is we're learning yes kade's really special um but the great thing about Cade is that he'll understand, he just knows angles. Like, all right, you think you're even with me. I'm going to get my shoulder into you. I'm going to finish up on this side. Like you thought you were with me, but you weren't going to contest this. And that's just one of Cade's special traits. I think Ben Carroll has some of that stuff, the way he drives and shields and gets his

body right into defenders. So, and I don't, you know, like the other thing too, I would say, because I know there's other guys you want to talk about, but Sohan's a perfect example. All right, when you watch Sohan at Baylor, he's big. Right. He doesn't make a ton of shots as far as like the traditional shooting stuff, but he impacts the fucking game.

Like every minute he's out there. I don't know what, like you just have to keep watching him to go. And this guy is like, and some of the shit's in the gray area that you don't always love, but I think almost every roster needs one of those guys on their team. And then you've got Kendall Brown, who's like the 6'8 guy who's a freshman who's all everything coming out of high school

who's also supposed to be a lottery pick. And I think probably more teams have Sohan outside of the lottery because this draft is packed. I don't notice Kendall Brown on the floor for long stretches of bailing. I'll be like, oh, that's right. That's the lottery guy. You know that's my least favorite quality.

If I forgot, you're out there. Exactly. So I would say the great thing about – the only times I don't notice Jabari is when his guards are ignoring him. I don't think it's a personality thing. I don't ever have moments where I'm not noticing Chet because as you said at the very beginning, he's finding ways to be engaged the entire time. And Paolo,

for other guys that are supposed to be big time and go top five or whatever, I don't worry about him that way. I think that's what's so exciting about this class too is that you just have... Like Johnny Davis from Wisconsin, the rest of that team's not very good. We knew that we knew that all season long with Wisconsin, that guy is making like big basketball plays the biggest moments. And I know

his last game didn't shoot it well, but I'm just like watching him going, Hey, you know, that shit we always worry about, like, where's your mindset going to be at when stuff really matters. There's a bunch of guys in this class that I love because i think they check those boxes off it looks like we struck oil with two straight classes 2021 is out of control 2021 is in the running for if you're just talking like how many classes have pumped out seven to eight guys that i just absolutely love i think we're at seven with the 2021. Sorry, I'm still waiting for Panini to release their prison box.

I'm going all in on this class. Oh, really? Oh, my God. Cade, Mobley, Giddy, Barnes, Kaminga. I mean, Franz Wagner, Cerruti's guy. Davion Mitchell's played better. Yeah, but... I'm just trying to like...

And then... Singoon. And then Jalen Green, who I think has really shown a lot of stuff, but I don't even know if I would have him in my top five favorite rookies from the class. I do not like him. Bones?

You know? Yeah, Bones. Bones is doing stuff. But then you look at this class. You mentioned Sohan. God damn, I love that guy. Wow. You mentioned Sohan. God damn, I love that guy. Wow. You might like him more than I do. I fucking love that guy. He's the first guy. And I said this about Aaron Gordon. He let me down a little bit. But I've been really wanted Sean Marion 2.0. I've been waiting for that in my life for a while. And Sohan, to me, feels very Sean Marion-ish to me.

And just relentless. He's on the floor all the time. He's just completely fearless. And I was just really impressed with him. Liked him. I thought he was the reason they came back. Let's do this. So I'm going to read you.

This is my Hall of Fame of hardest players ever to evaluate for me personally. Okay. All right. I love this. I'd never cared about the draft. That's not true. I always cared about the draft,

but I never like had enough of an opinion on the draft until MJ and Bowie. Because that was ludicrous when it was happening. It really was. It was one of thoserous when it was happening. It really was. It was one of those things where it was like, wait, they're not going to take... Hakeem was one thing because, you know, you had to take... Hakeem had to go first.

And it turned out to be the right pick, as crazy as it sounds. But MJ not going second. We don't need to litigate that. But Sam Bowie was the first really hard guy to evaluate that I can remember. Because he was good, but he had the stress fractures things. And it was just lingering over the whole thing because the talent was there.

But then you would look at his stats and I just, that was the first guy I remember being confused by. So I have him. I have Walter Berry. St. John's. Wow. The truth, the original truth. It's my second favorite college basketball player of all time. 1986, 23 and 11, 56%.

And I just thought, all right. And it was like, no, he's not going to be a top 10 pick. It's like, why? It's like, because it's not big enough. It doesn't translate. It's going to be too hard. What? And he just didn't make it.

And now there might have been other stuff going on behind the scenes, but it was the first time I really did. My eyes were telling me he was going to be better, but all the Scots were like, no, not a top 10 pick. And I was just like, wait, am I, what am I, am I doing this wrong? So this guy's not going to come in and score 25 points. So I had a couple more of these. Bo Kimball in 1990,

who averaged 35 a game for Lola Maramont. Now granted they had the pace, but just like the guy fucking scored 35 a game. He's not going to do that in college. Nope. Chris Jackson, who eventually became Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf, was just out of control as a scorer in college. But he had Tourette's and he had... If the team wasn't as good as I think people... There was a question like, well, what's this going to look like in the pros? You're going to have to gear your whole offense around him. And I was like, no, he's going to be awesome.

I guess he was kind of semi-disappointing as a pro, right? Compared to where we thought he was going to be in college because he averaged 29 a game in college. Think about that. Do you remember your Chris Jackson takes 30 plus years ago? Yeah. I mean,

he was appointment viewing for college basketball. Yeah. He seemed like a lot for the NBA and then they're like, it's too small. He's a shoot for his point guard. It's not going to happen. I'm like, no, it'll be fine. So I got him. Sean Bradley 1993.

This was one for me. Isaiah Ryder. 1993. 1993. Kobe Stopper. At UNLV in 1993, he averaged 29 points and nine rebounds a game and was a 52, 41, 83 percentages

and was super exciting. And at that point, I was watching college hoops and I just thought like, people don't see it. This guy, he's going to destroy the league. He was just, I think, just had too many personal things going on. But that was a tough one because talent-wise, it was there.

Right? It was like, this is happening. But the other stuff kicked in. Next one is Adonald Foyle, 1997. Here are his stats at Colgate. 24 and 13 with 6.3 blocks per game. Remember, it was like, is this guy Bill Russell

or is he just in the Patriot League? What are we watching? So, next one, Marvin Williams, 2005. Now, I was out on Marvin Williams, but I also thought he was hard to evaluate because i was like if he was good he would start for unc i was in that camp but then there was the camp of like perfect 3 and d guy you guys don't see it he'll be but i think my camp his body changed he he yeah he has big ass he did the drew gooden thing where drew gooden

at kansas and was like oh well and drew Gooden still was a hell of a player there, but it was like, you turned into big-ass rebound punish-you guy instead of like, give me the ball, I'm going to slash through everybody. So Marvin went in that Drew Gooden direction. Adam Morrison, I think, is the top three hardest person

ever to evaluate because he was an awesome scorer in college. I thought he was going to be good in the pros. I kind of still feel like if he goes to a different team and doesn't blow out his knee, there's a world where he's good. But then other people were like, no,

he's going to suck. Yeah. And I, it was really hard to figure out, uh, Greg Oden, 2007. Don't need to litigate that one.

Evan Turner, 2011 was really hard. Cause this, he was like basically 2010 and seven every night. And it's like, what is this? Is this going to be something? Evan Turner was a classic. I love this guy. How come people aren't talking them up?

Yeah. I can't believe he's outside of the lottery. This is stupid. You guys are fucking stupid. And then it's like, oh, he's going to go to, I'm like, I don't like, then you were almost arguing against yourself. Cause for a year I'm watching him play at Ohio state. I'm like, I don't. Then you were almost arguing against yourself. Because for a year, I'm watching him play at Ohio State. I'm like, I love this guy's game.

He does everything. This is a joke that he's projected outside of the lottery. And then as it caught up, I was like, oh, I don't know if I like him this much. Yeah, it was kind of like what happened with Westbrook, actually. Westbrook was my favorite sleeper in that draft. And all of a sudden, he was going fourth. I was like, well, I didn't.

Fourth seems high. Two more. I had Austin Rivers, which just seemed like this guy was the best player heading into college basketball. Freshman year didn't go quite the way it went, but it still seems like he should, I don't know, have a little more cachet than being the 10th pick. Dame Lillard's going to go

back. Dame Lillard, is it Weber State? He's going to go ahead. Austin Rivers, who was the number one pick a year, number one recruit a year ago? That might be in a draft diary archive of mine. Really? Yeah. Really? We're taking Dame Lillard over Austin Rivers? What are we doing? Dame was funny because it was...

Tough. There was a team that I was talking to that they felt like they were on him earlier than other teams. It's not like there's going to be any secrets. They had a pick, I think, in the middle of the first round. We're like, we're going to get this guy. We're going to get this guy. Then they show up to Weaver State. Now, everybody was on him.

They're like, we're not going to get him. He's going to be gone. He goes sixth. Yeah. My last guy was Lamella. That's my entire list. Yeah, Lamella was Lamella. That's my entire list. Yeah, Lamella was

a tough one because it was Australia. It wasn't as bad as Giannis. We talked about it on this pod many times. We had no idea

what to make of it. The Australia stuff was terrible. And he played interviews. The interviews were tough. But we never,

when we get dragged for that, no one ever mentions it right up until the draft, though. I was like, hey, I'm hearing from teams that have interviews the interviews were were tough but i we never when we get dragged for that no one ever mentions that right up until the draft though i was like hey i'm hearing from teams that have gotten them in now and they're like now there's some there's something like smarter teams that i trusted were like we're sort of blown away like once we had them in here uh i think the yannis one is one of the all-timers because there's nothing I... Well, there's definitely things I hate more than this. But one of the things I think is entirely unfair to front office and GMs is like,

oh, look at all of these guys that went ahead of Giannis. It's like, okay, but did you... And that's why I'll always defend my position. I'll be like, did you watch him? Did you watch any of the Giannis stuff? Because the Giannis stuff was... You didn't really know what to do with it. You didn't know what to do with it. But he also, he grew three inches too.

He went from six, nine to seven feet after the draft. True. But it was the level of comp that at least I had access to. You were like, okay, like this is ridiculous. Like these guys, they looked like Ben's buddies with pennies on trying to guard Giannis in a gym where there were no seats on like one side of it. So, and I talked to John Hammond about it, you know, who, and I go, what was it? And he was, he's always been pretty forthcoming. And when he talked to him about stuff and he goes, he just fit a profile with somebody thought had a really high ceiling.

It's the middle of the first round, like, you know, kind of like whatever, you know, there's definitely safer bets here, but look at this guy maybe becomes this maybe a little this little of that and now he's you know in the conversation of the best basketball player in the world but that was that's absurd it's absurd to think that when you look back at the stuff that you had access to when he's coming out of the draft i don't even he doesn't even make my hardest to evaluate list because to me he was just a really raw great athlete athlete. Who the fuck knows? Could he be Paul George? I remember that was when, because I did that draft. I liked when they took him. I thought it was the right place to take him. I was like, oh, the guy could be

Paul George, like a 6'9", small forward who can handle the ball. Nobody, no fucking way. So that's my list. I have Sam Bowie, Walter Berry, Chris Jackson, Bo Kimball, Sean Bradley, Isaiah Ratter, Donald Foyle, Marvin Williams, Adam Morris, and Greg Oden, Evan Turner, Austin Rivers, Lomelo Ball, and then new inductee, Chet Holmgren, who I think is in the Mount Rushmore for me

of hardest fucking guy to figure out. You can tell me he's going to be on five all-NBA teams, and you can tell me he's going to be fairly five all NBA teams and you can tell me he's going to be like fairly disappointing and I would believe any version of it so anyone anyone that uh we didn't talk about that you would throw in there all time no just for you hard hard to evaluate guys well that was the Giannis thing um yeah and bead thing was I mean bead was so clearly the best player in that yeah that was that wasn't hard but But when it's a foot, it's a back. Like part of the Embiid story that I think is kind of crazy,

and granted, there was a little difference, so maybe people don't seem to, but if you play 31 games to start your career in the first three seasons, and then you become an MVP and arguably one of the best in the game, like that's normally, you don't get that start to a good story.

Right. That's usually a start to a disappointing story. And. That's usually the start to a disappointing story. And for all the bumps and bruises along, he stayed way healthier than I ever thought he would. But you also understood with somebody that big, sometimes the foreign prospects, the teams can get a little spooked

sometimes on some of the medical stuff. And Jabari Parker went ahead of Joel Embiid. And not one person thought Jabari Parker was better than Embiid. That was a tough one. I mean, he hurt his knee again after that draft too, but once he had the double ACL thing. Let's take a quick break.

I want to figure out most fun teams for these guys to go to. So, Tankapalooza, which is looking like a top four of Houston, Orlando, Detroit, and OKC. Probably in that order. There could be some jockeying. And then you got Indy and Sacramento and Portland, who is bound and determined to lose every game by 40 points the rest of the year.

I don't know if people appreciate who is playing basketball for the Portland Showblazers right now. So that's our top seven. Houston, Orlando, Detroit, OKC. Then Indy, Sacramento, Portland. Then it drops again. The New Orleans is going to give Portland their pick

if it's between five and 14. The Lakers are giving New Orleans their pick. Right now, that would be 11th. So those are the only pick swap situations. So let's go through our guys and decide most fun team for them to go to. Let's start with Jabari. I'll give you the following four choices.

Houston, Orlando, Detroit, OKC and you can even throw in Indian, Sacramento if you want where do you want Jabari to go? I wonder if Orlando trades out if they end up with a number one pick because they just don't have room because of what a juggernaut they are? because of all the talent they have now

do we want to bring in another number one like Chet, Jabari, Apollo, and mess up what we have? I'll tell you, I think I like Orlando. I like watching them. You're preaching to the choir. Right.

So yeah, we don't need, I'm actually not making fun of Orlando, even though it sounds like I'm making fun of Orlando. Listen, they're playing both Wagner's and it's working. I want, I want Cade to have somebody he can trust.

So who's that? Detroit. I would say Jabari. Interesting. Because I had... Yeah, that would be a good fit because they have some size. And it's just, you know, it's weird. There's always...

I talk about this far too much, but the balance of having a lot of scoring options and a lot of scoring options fucking fucking up your balance, you know, how do you, how do you play that note perfectly where it's like, we have a lot of guys that can create that Raptors thing from 19, you know, like, Hey, we get a lot of guys that are comfortable with the ball in our hands, but it doesn't mean that now people feel left out and aren't committed defending and all the other kinds of stuff. Although really I, I buried the headline. The best fit is Chet and OKC and Poku's like,

all right, I'll take them under my wing. I got this. We're talking about Chet in a second. On your Japar Detroit thing. Yeah. He's super competitive. And so is Cade.

And that would be one of those situations where it's like alright you have those two guys you have Sadiq Bae you have Stewart who I think really gives a shit he's a backup though

he's a backup no but I'm just like you're just adding you're putting together a roster of like guys who give a shit like you're on your way to having identity

that's a good point yeah you know what I mean how about Sadiq dropping 50? Because he hadn't been as good this year and I still like him. You know, whatever. Maybe he's having a bad year compared to his first year. Is 50 too easy now?

I feel like when the days when like Eddie House had 50, it was like the most surprising thing that happened to me in the entire year. And now it's like Sadiq is 51. Wait, so you're suggesting your entire year was just like, remember that year Eddie House had 50? Yeah, that's where it starts. I didn't have a lot going on that year. I have chat to OKC as well.

I think that's perfect for him. I don't love the thought of him in Detroit for some reason. Just Darko vibes? Yeah. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever. No, it does make sense though.

I don't I just don't it's so it's no I said it out loud being dumped like there's no way that because Darko sucked 20 years ago. I don't like that

aspect of it. It's ridiculous. I want Chet to go to a team where he has no shadow of any sort of bust hanging over him. He goes to OKC. He's fine. He's got two guards.

He's got Giddy and he's got SGA. And I think he would play really well with those guys. He's really good at the little handoff stuff. The thing when we were talking about Chet before, the thing that I really like about him is how he, because he's so fucking tall and he's hunched over a lot and then when he kind of unhunches. Unhunches, yeah. When he unhunches, all of a sudden he's like Bill Walton sometimes at the

high post. It just seems like he can throw any entry pass he wants. And I just like the thought of those three guys together. I would enjoy. I would love, I love Giddy throwing lobs at Chet. Because Giddey has that thing where he makes you think he's done with the play. You know what I mean?

He does. He's awesome at this shit. And a lot of the guards, this whole high screen and that lob and trying to get the big who's in drop coverage to showing and retreating. Gobert does it perfectly. He did it the other night against Milwaukee. It was like masterclass. But Giddey will do stuff, and the best guards do that,

where they keep you baited. And having an option like Chet, who has great hands, has great feet. You know what I mean? This is somebody who's just this freak show that's running around. I don't love his gait, as I said, because the back and his shoulders and stuff. But he's not running around where you see these guys and you're just like, where's the coordination? He's super coordinated, despite it just doesn't look all that great all the time. I think your Chet to Detroit thing is hilarious and likely wrong.

But anyway, I just needed to get that off my chest. I don't like it. All right. It's fundamentally I don't like it. Noted. I tweeted yesterday that I like that Chet is a sneaky, busy guy,

which I want Jay Billis to borrow that when he does the draft telecast. Sneaky, busy is an adjective. The guys here are just kind of sneaking around. They're like burglars. They're just kind of up to stuff. I like that he doesn't stand in a spot. He's just kind of doing things.

Which for a big guy is rare. If you were still doing a draft for ESPN on the draft, it's sneaky busy or it would say the opposite of Tobias Harris. Although Harris has been playing really well lately. Just to throw it out there, I think his last week plus he's been putting up big numbers. All right, so our dream scenario is Detroit wins the lottery again and they take Jabari Smith.

OKC is second with Chet Holmgren. Where do we want Paolo to go? Don't say... Houston, him just trading possessions with Jalen Green kind of worries me. Look, I'm just going to tell you right now, I don't want anyone that I like to go to Houston. Yeah, I'm with you.

Is that a bad thing to say? No. I don't like the culture there at all. No, and it's not even on the coach. It's not Jalen. I just, the Christian Wood, Kevin Porter, Jeter, and Johnny Emmett. Yeah, those guys have to go. So if they were gone, then yeah.

Paolo, Jalen Green, Sengoon, you know, a little Usman in there. I have for Paolo, I have Indy. I have Indy moving up into the top three and striking oil with Paolo. And then he gets to play with Halliburton and Brogdon. I like that fit. Yeah, because I think people are going to think it's just me being anti-Houston again. It isn't. It's just I don't like young guys that are in situations where it's just me being anti-Houston again it isn't it's just I don't I don't like young guys that are in situations where it's just older guys that

don't want them there or don't want them to shoot well we like we like Jalen Green and we like Shangoon and we like Gordon I I'm not a Porter guy and I'm not a wood guy there you go well said uh I would like Celtics to trade up for Matherin. This kid from Arizona, he's just stones, man. Stones. I don't know how we're in overtime right now as we're taping this, but he carries himself exactly the way you want every wing scorer to carry himself. I have my Orlando selection. I think that's the right Ivy place.

I think that's actually the perfect team for him to go to. And then Cole and Suggs and one of those guys becomes the third guard, which is probably the destiny for one of them. They're going to have to just do rock, paper, scissors. But they need the two guard who can do some stuff and be athletic and create some shots and have some high upside. That would be my dream for that team. Because I wouldn't mess with the front court

because it's basically they put together the 86 Celtics. Bird, McHale, Parrish, Wagner, Bamba, Carter. It's very similar. When Isaac gets back. Isaac back from his five-year hiatus. I would have Ivy going to Orlando. That would be good. By the way,

I like R.J. Hampton. I like him. They kind of stole him, right? What trade was he in? They got him for nothing. Yeah, it was in the Denver deal. I like R.J. Hampton too. I think he's a bench guy. I think Cole is probably on a good team. Go ahead. You know what was in the Denver deal. I like RJ Hampton too. I think he's a bench guy. I think Cole is probably on a good team.

Go ahead. You know what I liked RJ Hampton? That game when Kyrie was going off, the 60-point game. And RJ Hampton was kind of like, I got this, guys. Let me have him. And he tried to guard Kyrie for multiple

possessions, but really felt like he could stop him. I enjoyed it. Yeah. And then, you know, this next group though, like there's all these G League guys that I need to do a better job of digging into. This is... Yeah, we just wanted to do the top four.

Yeah, totally. What's your dream Sohan team? I think I said I wanted everyone to go to Golden State for like 10 years, so I shouldn't say that anymore. Because remember we were doing that for the Phoenix Suns when it's seven seconds or less? We'd be like, oh, you know who you'd be great with? Phoenix. Just running up and down Phoenix.

It's like the Scotty Barnes thing. I want Sohan to be allowed to be Sohan. And that usually means away from a ball-dominant guard. KOC had him ninth on the big board, which I was fired up about, because to me, he's

a top-ten guy. Look at that. So, the trades, the Lakers have, it goes to New Orleans if it's in the top 10, but then it goes to Memphis if it's 11 to 30 and they're right on that 10, 11 French. Memphis could have the 11th pick in the draft. I mean, that would be a perfect so-hand team. Imagine that. Actually, that's a great call. I like that.

New Orleans is top four protected or it goes to Portland 5-14 or Charlotte 15-30. Houston gets Brooklyn's pick. Brooklyn gets Philly's pick. San Antonio gets Boston's pick. San Antonio gets Toronto's pick. Indy gets Cleveland's pick. And Memphis gets Utah's pick. You know who he might be great for is Atlanta.

Sohan? Yeah. Dude, somebody's going to text Sohan on Monday Going, do you know these guys? They talked about you off and on for an hour and a half You're not that good I love Sohan I'm all in

When's Atlanta going to be good? By the way, I know they beat Memphis this week They're a game under 500 We're 70 plusplus in here. Just waiting on you guys. You know what I've done with them? I'm just out. It's one of those things like I don't watch them anymore,

and I'm going to wait for somebody to tell me they've figured it out. It's okay to watch them again. I don't enjoy it. It doesn't seem like the guys really enjoy playing with each other that much as you talked about on a previous pod you can't act like you won the finals last year when you made the Eastern

finals and you probably shouldn't have it took a major Ben Simmons meltdown for it to happen I'm just annoyed by them you know who I'm not annoyed by drumroll okay the Boston Celtics who just beat the shit out of everybody for it to happen. I'm just annoyed by them. You know who I'm not annoyed by? Drumroll. Okay. The Boston Celtics who just beat the shit

out of everybody. I was trying to think of another surprising Boston team that just kind of Jekyll and Hyde-ed it like this team did. And the only one

I could think of is the Morgan Magic Red Sox. 88? Yeah. But that team wasn't, that team wasn't like annihilating teams. Like this Celtics team, how many games are they just up

by like 25 in the second quarter? It feels like, what, 60% of their games? 70% of their games? They're just, it's 62 to 30? You know, 59 to 38? This is an easy game to have it gotten lost.

I mean, they had 70 at the half. They were up 30 like that. This game was over. Everybody zinging the ball around. I know it ends up being a 20-point game. This thing was over so fast, man. It was hilarious. In the second quarter, 35-16, they outscore them.

Tatum is almost a perfect game here going. Jalen has 30 as well. Pritchard knocks down everything. Pritchard. So Pritchard's been coming. Off the ball now stuff. Go ahead. I was talking to him about my dad yesterday,

and he was like, are you going to go to the funeral? And I'm like, for who? And he's like, for Derek White's jump shot. I'm going to go to the funeral? I'm like, for who? And he's like, for Derek White's jump shot. I'm going to go. Like he was making fun of how bad Derek White's jump shot. It's like my dad's still throwing heat at age 74. Derek White can't make a shot. That's the worst thing going on with the Celtics right now

is that his shot's off. And if that's your worst problem, you're doing pretty well. They did give up a pick for him. Right. Look, this is unbelievable how dominant they've been. And, you know, when they first put the streak together,

it was like, okay, they were missing... Every one of those teams seemed to be missing their best players. And then they're starting to beat healthy teams. I mean, this is a two-month stretch where statistically

it's so off the charts what they're doing now. It's a two and a half months now. Have you allowed yourself to start thinking about a banner, though? Like, how does that change? Because to me, I was completely dismissive of it. Now I'm more open to it,

even though I still thought some of the projection stuff was absurd, how much it weighted it towards the Celtics championship in comparison to some other teams I still think are really good but where are you now like give me give me a timeline of events of of your emotional how much you allow yourself emotionally to to think that's possible great question thank you for asking i'll just tell you this I told my wife this week I'm probably going to be in Boston a lot during the spring

I'm just flagging this for you We had the talk about Can I go back? How many games can I go back for? I can work from there Looked at the calendar for things I had to be in LA for I'm taking this seriously. So that's your answer.

The team has been lights out for two and a half months and it feels real. And I think they're really hard to play. I think defensively, they've been the best in the league and I don't even know who the second place best in the league defensive team is. And they match up really well with a lot of the teams they have to play.

You know, Brooklyn has the... I just, you know, nobody wants to play Durant for a series, but I do think if there's going to be no Simmons in that series, it's a good matchup for the Celtics. Philly, they can run and move up and down and really use their athleticism.

And I think defensively, they've always had success against Harden. The team that I'm most afraid of is Milwaukee because of the Giannis piece, because I just think he's unbelievable. And he can swing a series athletically in a way that you're just like, what just happened? And they've been there before, and I think they're getting guys back and I'm

probably the most worried about them. But yeah, I think to me it's Milwaukee and Boston and Brooklyn and Miami. And those are the four. And I don't have Philly in the four. I don't feel free to stick that quote on a bulletin board. I don't think they have enough. I don't think they've been together long enough.

I think they're too slow. And I think there's ways to just beat them inin board. I don't think they have enough. I don't think they've been together long enough. I think they're too slow. And I think there's ways to just beat them in a series. I don't trust Doc. I don't think, to me, they're not in the four. Yeah, I really was unimpressed again with Philadelphia today. Yeah, you watched that one. I didn't.

So what did you see? I just don't understand how teams that have never done anything together collectively carry themselves. Like they have done something, you know, it goes back to that Celtics team with Kyrie. I couldn't stand them. Couldn't stand them constantly talking about how nobody can beat us in seven

games. You're like, or Milwaukee is going to win four in a row. It's going to be humiliating. Um, a little bit to the Atlanta piece that we talked about a little bit earlier. Like who, what right do you have to carry yourself as if you've fucking done anything? And Philadelphia doesn't have guys that have individually done anything, and they just can't be bothered. Maybe it's because it's a Sunday. I don't know. But they can't be bothered. They can't be bothered to defend, to close out, to take different stuff seriously. And then they start the fourth quarter, it's like three straight turnovers. Well, they get nothing from their bench either.

Nothing. And there was a good piece. I think it was Hoffman from The Athletic that wrote about how bad some of these minutes are with the backups. And it's not just, hey, shocker, breaking news, the backups aren't as good as the starters. But it was really good that these DeAndre Jordan minutes have been disastrous. And I also thought he made a really good point. I thought Harden looked the healthiest and the most active and engaged he's ever been, at least in a couple of years when he first got there, which is always kind of that new car smell thing that players always do. It's like when you're meeting the in-laws for the first time, like you're just on your game, you're asking questions, you're pretending you're actually

interested in follow-up answers and all this kind of stuff i'd be like oh that's really great that was you do exporting importing too so that's oh wow yeah perfect so harden played that way for like a week and then slowly i was like wait has he lost the step again like what's going on with him so i know those guys think they're just it's all going to click it's all going to be fine as much as i love and beat and i do and the Maxie element maybe calms you a little because it's this other dynamic like I don't know what ceiling I'm supposed to put on Tyrese Maxie at this point like he and Jordan Poole for me are now guys where I go

why am I supposed to have a ceiling on either one of these players the shit Maxie's doing for his size and finishing the way he's doing at the rim and then on top of the shooting and the fact that he's off the ball doesn't have the ball as much now and he's still he's better um maybe gives you some hope for philadelphia but i worry a little bit about a post offense being your central go-to thing in a playoff series well today they lose to the raptors they score 88 points

danny green three points off the bench. Niang, who I think is one of their best five players, he had 11. And then Paul Reed, DeAndre Jordan, and Shaq Milton with zeros. They don't play cork bots anymore. I think Doc has just completely given up on him. And unless I'm missing something,

I think that's everybody. Millsap's there. He's been done for a couple years. I just don't love the team. And I think, you know, like I was against Dallas on Friday night. Dallas is slow and methodical, and that's good for Philly. But against these teams that are going to run, these teams that are deep and have a bench,

I think they're going to be in a lot of trouble. Like, it's just amazing that they're playing DeAndre Jordan. You know, and it makes me wonder, I don't love Drummond either, but did they have to throw Drummond in that trade? Do you think Brooklyn was like, we're not doing this trade unless Drummond's in it? Yeah, I haven't always been the biggest Drummond guy, but I've watched him at certain nights.

I think he's even better with Brooklyn. I agree. Couldn't they have gotten Brooke Lopez? There was nobody else like DeAndre Jordan that's where they landed you mean Robin Lopez Robin Lopez I'm sorry yeah I mean

you think like Toronto they're going to try really hard they're athletic and that's an interesting test for Philly and they failed and I just don't see it with them I also think they've already kind of made it clear they don't want to be in the top two. So now Boston is now 44 and 28 Phillies, 43 and 27 Boston's going to pass them. And Philly is going to get into that four or five matchup with Chicago, which is what they want.

And if Chicago, like they got Patrick Williams, I guess he's coming back Monday. Lonzo is going to be back all of sudden, they're going to be deep with Io. And I think their bench could give Philly a lot of problems. I'm worried about Chicago, though. I mean, we're talking about a team that was 26-10, toast the town, and I love it. I love that fan base, you know. And I'm not

even talking about, like, the Jordan stuff, because I didn't really appreciate it as much back when it was happening. But watching them have this resurgence, I always want to give front office credit and say, hey, let's just be better. Do you want to just be better? Do you know how we've been fighting for the 10 or 11? Why don't we just be better? They're 26-10.

They've had their injuries. Almost every single fan base can point to missing a good chunk of the season, not having their guys. Chicago's been 15 and 19 since that point. And they... Yeah, the Celts were nine and a half behind them.

Now they are above them. Month of March, they're like the fifth worst offense, the sixth worst defense. And I know the point is, oh, we're going to get Lonzo, we're going to get Patrick Williams, all this different stuff.

I think it's been a great story. It's a nice resurgence. They've been a very good basketball team now for two months. The Celts have, for whatever reason, played way more games than anybody else. They just went 3-0 on this road trip. They got OKC on Monday night. And then they have Utah, Minnesota, Toronto, Miami,

Indiana, Washington, Chicago, Milwaukee, Memphis, but spread out. They're playing 10 games over the course of the next basically 20 plus days, which is nice. There's other teams, like Philly has a bunch of games left. So I'd be interested to see how it plays out. All right, a couple more things. We'll take one more break. Here's the topic for you. I didn't tell you this was coming.

The 2022 You're Out of Excuses All-Stars. Okay. We did this last year. I don't know if you remember. James Harden? We're tapped out The box is empty There are no excuses left You Pushed your way out of two teams

You pushed your way to Philly You're playing with one of the best Four to five guys this season Team wanted you Your guy Daryl's there You're out of excuses you're playing with one of the best four to five guys this season. Team wanted you. Your guy Daryl's there. You're out of excuses. Literally, you're out.

None left. Agree? You should have a sound effect for this. Just a little drop. You're out. You're out. You agree, though, Harden? This is it. If they suck,

let's say they lose in round one to Chicago they lose in like five games what what's the spin coming out of that you've just wasted

an MVP caliber season from a bead you went on on this trade you traded picks you traded Seth Curry and then it's like

oh these guys just need a year to gel I guess that's what they would say. Is Doc Rivers the coach next year? No, if they lose in the first round, no way. No way. They'll be coaching later.

I'm kind of already there, so this isn't new news for me. I'm sure not a shock to longtime listeners. But yeah, that would be if they were to lose early, and then, oh, by the way, now you've got to go pay him. You've got to pay this guy. Well, I'm sure that's already agreed to. I think Doc is on the you're out of excuses all-stars as well. Yeah.

It's just like you've coached more talent over the last 15 years than any coach in the league. Maybe even twice as much talent as any coach in the league. Twice seems high, but. 120% as much as any coach in the league. Maybe even twice as much talent as any coach in the league. Twice seems high, but 120% as much as any coach in the league. Rudy Gobert? Well,

it depends on what the Rudy Gobert conversation is. I appreciate him, right? And then we have what happened in the clipper series which wasn't really all his fault they were asking him to cover the rim and the corner it's fucking really hard to do but the problem is he doesn't ever scare you offensively so yeah i don't i think it's already to that point like do you think there's how many undecideds that's probably the best way i would

ask this to you of all the stuff in life that we talk about as a country how many undecideds? That's probably the best way I would ask this to you of all the stuff in life that we talk about as a country. How many undecideds do you think there actually are? Um, with Rudy Gobert or just, well, you could say it in general, but like how many people are still holding out hope being like, you know,

one more year, I'll see what happens. So you might be right, but I imagine more people aren't going to change their mind about him already. Anyway. All right. If I'm a Utah fan, I'm looking at this season.

I'm going, the Lakers went completely sideways. An incredible break for us. The Clippers, they trade seven years of picks for Kawhi and Paul George. This is year three of just having the worst luck possible with that. You have Denver, which every week that goes by where Jamal Murray doesn't come back starts to seem more unrealistic that he's going to be able to help them. And they're just not deep enough.

Then you have Dallas that seems like they're a player away. You have the Warriors who Curry gets hurt. And you know I hate foot injuries. One of my least favorites. Foot, back. Those are my two.

And Curry's just going to come back as we head into the playoffs. I of my least favorites. Foot, back. Those are my two. And Curry's just going to come back as we head into the playoffs. I'm worried about that. They don't have a big man. Wiseman there officially seems like they're punting on. It's suddenly a lot on Kavon Looney and Draymond.

Memphis hasn't been there before. Phoenix keeps having this bad luck. Like, if I'm Utah, I'm like, could this be more fucking set up for us? Let's go. But nobody has taken them seriously at all. But we knew this was going to happen. It didn't matter.

They could go 70-12. Nobody was going to care. Well, they're out of excuses. So is Quinn Snyder. I'm worried about them against Memphis. Utah. Yeah. Well, round one, I think it'll be Dallas or Denver, right?

Unless Minnesota keeps on this fucking crazy run they're on. And Minnesota has a chance now to crack at the top six. Denver's got to worry about, by the way. Minnesota in the month of March is 9-1. They're the number three offense and the number one defense. Killing teams. One more you're out of excuses. I have a couple more actually. Anthony Davis?

No. He still has plenty. You think he has some left? Most people would agree with you. I'm holding out. What's in the excuse chart for Anthony Davis? Give me some. I just don't think my career's over at 29. Can everybody fuck off? I'm not saying it's over. Yeah. Yeah. But what about

when they traded 17 first-round picks for him and it was like Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Anthony Davis? I think a couple guys being on the top 75 really hurt them. There was extra angst. Anthony Davis is one.

Westbrook's the other one. They're like, wait, we put this guy? So what are your excuses left for Anthony Davis? Because when he was 25 and they traded all that shit for him, everyone was like, that makes sense. This guy's fucking awesome. He's going to be amazing. And now he's 28.

And he gets hurt every year. Bad luck. The bad luck is a good one. Bad luck with injuries. I'm going vegan. Okay. Have you watched Bad Vegan, by the way, on Netflix?

I heard it was really good. It's really good. Not quite sure why the Russian guy seems to get away with a lot, but I don't spoiler alert. I have two more. You're out of excuses. It makes me want to tweet it famous people more. All right, back to basketball.

This is really for Cerruti. Vucevic, are you good or not? Let's see you in a playoff series. We got a long look under the hood of Evan Fournier outside of Orlandolando and i don't think anyone liked the engine and vooch has not had the most awesome offensive performance this year

compared to what we saw in orlando and it's like all right are you good or not yeah but we knew that we knew we just let's see it touches let's see got? Cerruti, you want to take this one? Cerruti? Everything that you need to know about Vooch happened in the Toronto series a couple years ago when he was a complete no-show after being their best player the entire year. I love the guy. Great years in Orlando.

He's just not that dude. Sorry. Guess he's out of excuses. I can't believe he's still taking... He's still taking 16 shots a game with this Chicago team. He had a little bit of a good run, but he's not going to be where they thought they were getting. He's not making threes this year, and he doesn't really get to the free throw line for a guy that plays that much.

That's pretty crazy. God, he can rebound, though. He used to kill the Celtics. One more year out of excuses for me. Celtics got killed by centers for like two straight years, remember? Yeah. I think the Kawhi-Paul George trade, this is the last year

where we can make excuses for it. And then, if nothing good happens next year, we officially have to start talking about how this is just an atrocity of a trade. Bad luck, but still. They gave away SGA

and a bunch of picks and went all in and they were supposed to be the Clippers taking it seriously and it's like, all we have to show for it is a couple round twos

and a lot of injuries and again, bad luck. But, I just think 20 years from now and we'll look back at that and be like,

man, remember when the Clippers traded all that shit for Kawhi and Paul George, then those guys never played together really. Cause one of them was always hurt. That's where this heads, right? Yeah.

Look, I can't, I can't disagree with any of this part of it too. And I always kind of joke whenever I look at those trades and go, my God, they threw in that pick. Like what did Presti ask for first? You know what I'm saying? saying like how did how did you get

to this point with it and in the like remember how we had talked about this and i remember you telling me that daryl had heard something i said and he was like it was almost like i don't agree with much what he says but he was right about that so that's why i remember it and that we we've overrated we've overvalued mid to late first round draft picks way too much like if you look at the hit rate on them for success they're it's way lower than you would think it sounds cool when you have like the 17th pick it sounds awesome when you trade for like oh we traded this guy for two first you end up with like the 25th and 27th and good luck good luck if you get a rotation guy one of those two but then it's it swung so hard bill to where it was

like so wow now what do you do you just give a decades of picks like you just give them all your picks just give them all and they're all unprotected and then you throw in the unprotected swaps and then you have these deferments on some of them where it's like if we just don't like this we'll just do it next year instead and you're sitting there going like if the kawaii paul george thing continues to go as bad as it's gone it's a it's a weird job or they just say screw it you know miami heat style and go doesn't matter we'll just add the next available veteran that wants to come here but i don't know if the clippers have that kind of cachet maybe they do but not the success of the miami heat i think the other players notice how the Clippers are second-class citizens here.

And like, you know, Paul George getting booed at a Dodger game, stuff like that. I will say this about Presti. You and I were talking about this recently, not on a podcast, about there's two camps of why LeBron mentioned Presti at the all-star weekend. One was that he was trying to plant the seed for, I guess like maybe, maybe Presti drafting his son down the road. Who knows?

I thought I interpreted it as he wants Presti to run the Lakers next year. And that was why I think everything LeBron does, especially in a stage like that is pretty purposeful. And that was why he floated that out. And I think if you're Preston, at some point you got to move to one of the big markets, I think. And I think he's the best guy available out there. So that was how I interpreted it.

But you didn't interpret it that way. Well, I wouldn't say that I wouldn't rule out the second part, but I do think the motivation was hoping that the Thunder have a million picks. And Leron said something nice because I think he's very calculated with everything he does. And in that setting, he had clear things that he wanted to say and get it out there. And I think he wanted to get his son drafted. So we'll see. We'll see what happens. I just don't think that Presti and I just don't know that there's going to be a lot of GMs that would go,'m on the fence about this prospect but he was LeBron was super complimentary in Cleveland all-star weekend two years ago so here so with the 17th pick we take Braddy James yeah I'll take him I'll take him uh I think the the thunder thing though big picture what what ends up happening with all these picks and everything like that's as interesting oh you know it's not the most interesting thing about the future in the nba but if we were ranking if we're doing a simmons top five storylines for the next five years

oh yeah i can't wait to see what happens with it because even if you're oklahoma city you're like okay now we're armed with so much stuff we can outbid anyone for the next mad star okay cool and then that when then what happens you give up three four firsts for a guy that doesn't want to stay in oklahoma city because most guys aren't going to want to stay in Oklahoma City. So what are you actually paying for? And then to say, well, this means you can maneuver around the draft. I don't know. History has never shown us this. Yeah, they couldn't do it last year. They were dangling six and everything to move the top three and everybody was like, cool, thanks. No. Right. So what if you were this year and you go, oh, we've landed at three, but we think Chet is a franchise changing player. So here's four extra picks. If it's that kind of special player, even though the top of this draft is deep this year and you go, oh, we've landed at three, but we think Chet is a franchise-changing player, so here's four extra picks. If it's that kind of special player, even though the top of the

strap is deep this year, I don't know that teams do those trades either. It's a really weird thing. Then there can be times when you have so many picks, because there's actually so many teams, a handful of teams that have a greater concentration of these picks, that your value of the picks can be undermined by somebody else who also doesn't want to pick fucking 10 guys over three years that are top 15 picks. So I don't know what's going to happen with it. And to say, oh, well, Presti would never leave because he wants to ride it out. I think it's more challenging and more complicated. It sounds great, but the execution of it, I'm at a loss through how it all plays out.

So I wouldn't be shocked if he wanted to go somewhere else. Yeah, if you think what's happened the last five years, I feel like I have a pretty good handle on sports. I have completely lost my ability to understand

how many draft picks is worth what in football and basketball. Like, Devonta Adams only went for a first rounder and a second rounder. Deshaun Watson, who's going to get suspended and who's going to cause like a fan base riot when he gets to Cleveland. He goes for three first round picks. Wilson goes for two. Anthony Davis goes for a hundred.

Harden goes for way more the last time. This time he goes for Ben Simmons and two firsts and Ben Simmons is a bad back and can't play. I've just given up trying to figure it out. I don't understand it. Derek White goes for a first round pick and a pick swap. It just seems like the, I don't know. It just seems like it's basically up to the beholder. It's almost like going to an auction and watching one of those school auctions and watching two drunk dads just kind of compete against each other. I don't think there's any rhyme or reason for it anymore.

The Watson thing blew my brain. I couldn't believe they gave up three first rounders for him. That was always the price. And that's like always the price. Yeah. That doesn't mean you're going to get it. Then you have to deal with all the other stuff.

I mean, Jesus Christ. And they gave him the 230 guaranteed. I don't know what to make anything anymore. The guaranteed is fucking crazy. 80 million more than Rodgers? I guess the take coming out of it is like quarterbacks, because there was always like, we're never going to guarantee money in the NFL.

But I guess what we're seeing now with the quarterbacks is that they're basically becoming NBA players where people are giving them the super max. Nobody else is going to get that on the team. But the quarterbacks, because you don't have to worry about them really getting hurt anymore because quarterbacks never get hit.

That's, I guess, where we landed. I'm just having a lot of trouble processing sports lately. Can't tell. Like what else? Just like that. I always felt like, oh, this guy's worth this. This guy will get this contract.

And then they gave Watson 230 guaranteed. I'm like, all right, so what's Pat Mahomes worth now? Like $11 billion? Like, I don't, how do we put a value on anything? Then you have the Rams who are always able to just pay guys.

It's like, yeah, we've agreed to a Stafford extension. It's like, how are you Stafford extension? How are you paying Aaron Donald and Jalen Ramsey? I don't understand the NFL salary cap anymore. The Pats, they're like, you know, counting pennies. And it was like, we've signed Ty Montgomery. And it's like, well, we went all in last year. We don't have any money left.

The Red Sox, who make more money than God, they don't get Carlos Correa, but then they give Trevor Story $140 million. It's like, I've lost my calibration, Rosillo. Did you look at the story, home road splits? I did. A lot of strikeouts for him, too. Yeah, the Correa stuff. I always love the Boris deals deals because you'll be like okay so what is this boris somehow turned baseball contracts into football contracts where

we see what it is and then we go oh that's not really what it was and boris would be like well i need correa's average to be higher than the other guys that signed but since he didn't get the contract that he wanted for the market it's really really just a one year deal. And you're like, okay. Yeah, but you know why they did it that way though. Maybe I'm too cynical because the old agent was tied to the contract. So it's like the one year deal, the agent splits the commission with Boris because he was Correa's agent. And then they blow up that contract and then Boris gets the full commission on the new contract. Right, right. No, but I'm just saying like with boris whenever it was like the bryce harper thing you would go well no this wasn't about the you needed the total number

to be over this so it was like yeah you can make it 13 years you know it's like whenever i'll look at his deals it'll be announced as something and you go okay but what was the motivation here like getting the best deal or having it be the new latest headline. I think the marketplace, though, on the trades and all that kind of stuff that you're talking about, it is weird. I think the Evan Fournier thing is a perfect example. Fournier, you couldn't get a first for him in

a trade. I'm not telling he's awesome, but he can fucking score. He's a scorer for his entire career. Guy can score. And yet you can't get a first for him in the trade market, but then he can get 70 million in guaranteed money. And you're like, so a guy that can get that kind of contract can't even get you a first because his contract's up, I guess. I mean, it would be the way, because like the Kawhi deal to Toronto, like if that deal happened a year

later, then there's probably five picks attached to it. The Kyrie deal is another example. The Boston one? Bunch of contracts and the eighth pick in the draft for Kyrie Irving, who was under contract for two more years. Now, five years later, there's four extra pick swaps in that trade. Yeah, that's what it is. The math on it has all changed. Where football, the quarterback, it always seems to be

three firsts. And then there's always the crazy ones where you're like, all right, so this is a 31-year-old linebacker that needs a contract that's restructured

and we actually love this linebacker. And you're like, all right, he'll be a third maybe. And you're like, well, awesome. That's way better.

Like, I'll take that guy. And I think Belichick even tried to do that for a little while. There was a cool on short transaction in there at one point. The Pats are a good example. 2016 to 2019, they botched the draft about as badly as you can botch it for four years. If they just traded a bunch of picks like the Rams did, probably would have been better off. And the Rams look at it and they're like,

fuck it. We don't have to worry about the top 30. Maybe they're looking at we can scout the guys ranked 55 to 150 better because we don't have to worry about the top 25 guys. I don't know. I don't understand

any of it. Everybody's thinking outside the box and doing all these weird contracts, deals, changing how we think about draft picks. And I'm just trying to keep up. Remember the old days when it was like, yeah, if you get the Devante Adams,

that costs two first round picks. He's the second best receiver of the week. Jamal Adams went for two picks. That trade looks disastrous. You just can't trade. Didn't you always think like Solak said this to me on Thursday's pod. The going rate for getting one of the best guys

at his position was always two first round picks. At least. But you couldn't just get somebody for one. I want to end on this. We did this last year too. I want to know what your list is. You didn't know I was going to ask you this. You're down one. There's 12 seconds left. Your hierarchy of guys you trust the most. You need a basket. You're down one. You're on the road.

Ooh, road. I need a basket. I think Durant has to be the clear number one. I don't even think it's a question. But do you have somebody different? No, no, it's Durant. What possible argument could be made? There's no argument to be made. Who is second? Now we're arguing.

Down, down one, 12 seconds left. argument to be made. Who is second? Now we're arguing. Down. Down one. 12 seconds left. On the road. You're adding the drama here. On the road. You know, LeBron's still a very good option.

I had him lurking the one thing with LeBron is he does settle for that 29 foot step back too much for my liking right so it happens you get tired if it's just like hey LeBron's gonna go to the basket he's my second choice

if it's LeBron's gonna he's feeling that 29 footer I don't like it as much. I actually had DeRozan second right now. Wow. Yeah. I just feel like whatever zone he's in, I just always feel like he's going to score. Where's Chris Paul on this?

Well, I had Jokic third because he can either get me a shot or he'll find an open shooter, but I'm getting a good shot with Jokic. You are. Right? I had LeBron fourth.

Gulp. I had Kyrie fifth. That's fine. It's probably too low, but that's all right. Too low or too, like he should be higher? It's probably too low,

but the difference is Durant has the superpower where it doesn't matter. Like it doesn't matter. Like he got rushed on that shot he hit against the Mavs. He admitted he got rushed. And so he adjusted for what – because Dallas has been doing a really good job now of switching up what they're doing. And Durant laid it all out.

He's like, they are switching the stuff they do. And I had to be like aware of what it was. And then you can see when you're thinking about as an offensive player, you're like, I got to get into the shot earlier before the help comes up. Or I guess wrong and go too soon. And Durant admitted that he was rushed. And here's the thing. He still looked like he made the game winning three until Dinwiddie hits

another one at the other end. Who, by the way, Dinwiddie has been terrific. You know, for a guy that wasn't a blast to play with in D.C. and didn't make a lot of shots, he's found a way to fit in here in a very short amount of time, so we'll see what happens. But I just don't even know how anybody can be over the draft. I think

the weird part, we haven't mentioned Steph, but I think people... I had CP and Booker sixth as a combo because they kind of ride with whoever's feeling. So where's Giannis? I think then we go to Giannis and Steph like in the 7-8 range.

Yeah, because for Giannis, it's weird because you feel like you can be prepared for it because you know it's going to be just this overpowered thing. Yeah, now that he does that back down kind of spin thing that he kind of figured out in the playoffs last year, now he's doing it. I think he's moved up the ladder for me. Would you rather have Booker or Mitchell? 12 seconds. Booker. Okay. Booker. You know, and what's weird is Luka's not on my list,

even though he's terrifying, because I think he settles too much for those 28 footers. I just don't like the shot. I know it looks great when it goes in and it gets cut and it goes on Twitter and it's like, Luca, step back. But it's a 30% shot. Tatum's starting to at least knock on the door of this club. When they post him up and when they do the dirt play with him at the foul line, I feel like he gets a good shot every time from that now that he could spin and go with his, with his, you know, to his right, or he can do that little fall away thing. But I think he's starting to figure out the foul line in a real way. I'm not ready to put him in that club yet, but it's stuff stuff's happening.

And then Embiid would be the other one, but the Embiid end of the game stats are horrific. You seen those? His last two-minute stats are really bad. People will be like, where's Embiid? It's like, well, go look at the stats. Yeah, that's all I got. I'm going to give... This is my last piece of this question, though.

Most random guy who you have a seat for in this club. Cause mine is Jordan pool. I feel like Jordan pool down one. If you're just like trapping Steph, I'm totally fine with Jordan pool deciding the game for me. I don't know why I completely trusted.

That is ridiculous. I love it. Look, Jordan pool stock is rising. He was so hand. So hands family's going to buy a retirement home somewhere after this it. Look, Jordan Poole's stock is rising. Him, Sohan. Sohan's family's going to buy a retirement home somewhere after this podcast. You know what?

I'll throw one dumb one out there. Yeah. I have one dumb one, too, for you. Well, you know what? It isn't dumb. I never would have thought I would have said this, but Levine needs to be mentioned. Because Levine physically can get himself into a situation

where it's going to be hard to challenge what he's doing because he's just so gifted physically. Do you want to award an irrational confidence guy for this list who doesn't necessarily belong but is furious that we didn't include him? John Lucas? I'm going to nominate Cole Anthony. Cole Anthony's a good one.

Cole Anthony's like, finally, I'm going to nominate Cole Anthony. Cole Anthony's a good one. Cole Anthony's like, finally, I'm trading baskets with Luca. This is what America wants. Or finally, it's me versus LeBron. I knew it was going to end this way. Time for the duel. Levine's at like almost 40% on eight threes, seven, eight threes a game the last two years.

He was 42 last year. He's 40 this year. He's 51 and 48 overall on 19 and 18 shots this year. So he's like a shot and a half left. And Levine, it wasn't ever what he was capable of. It was just that his decision-making was so bad. Are we positive he's going back to Chicago next year we are right

yeah his thing is different it was a little weird right on the way that his extension worked with him but uh I don't know I just I never trust anything anymore no I look I hashtag this league what if Harden were like you know what it didn't work out

yeah didn't really out. Yeah. Didn't really like my time here. But where would he go? Oh, I don't know. Nobody has cap space. It's like Orlando and San Antonio. Oklahoma City, run it back. Never should have left.

Orlando would be the funniest for the Tex. Oh, yeah. OKC would be good. Hmm. All right. Prediction for the tournament? Ooh. Arizona pulled that one out.

That could be the kind of thing. I don't know. I don't really have much. I kind of thought Gonzaga was going to win. What team do you like the most? I really like watching the Zags play. I just do. Me too.

But this Arizona team, man, this was, you know, trying to pay attention to it. Well, I'm going to watch it now after we're done taping. They've got some stones. So I was fired to see them hold off and win that game. Any F1 lessons from the race today?

Well, yeah, a couple. You know, not a great day for Red Bull. Go from thinking you're going to maybe finish second and fourth and build towards a Constructors' Championship, and then you lose both cars in the last five laps.

Haas is a factor, which I did not expect. It's nice to see the Scudieri of Ferrari finish the way they did, and then Hamilton and Williams. And here's Williams in a Mercedes now. Excuse me, not Williams. Russell, George Russell, in the Mercedes, leaving Williams. By the way, did. And then Hamilton and Williams. And here's Williams in a Mercedes now. Excuse me, not Williams. Russell, George Russell

in the Mercedes, leaving Williams. By the way, the cars. This is my second season ever. They made bigger tires. They have different rims. There's a better camera angle. There seems to be

some sort of flange thing going on. I'm excited about all of it. I don't know what most of it means. I really enjoyed it this morning. Did you get up and have a little routine? You liked it, huh? I was up already. It was like 8 o'clock. It was great. Pop of it means. I really enjoyed it this morning. Did you get up and have a routine?

You liked it? I was up already. It was like eight o'clock. It was great. Popped it on. It's not too long. It's not too long. You can kind of do other stuff as it's on. You can do that too. You can kind of look down and when the announcer starts to get excited, then you really watch the last 10 laps. But yeah, it was fun. I really had a good time. I can't believe this. Look at who are we. Look at you. I know.

Look at us. That fucking Netflix show, man. They really knew how to do it. My thing is, like Mallory already picked, I forget who she had, but she has somebody. And I know you have people you like.

I need somebody. I need somebody to really gravitate to. That is my, is my kind of crew and I haven't really figured out who that should be. Yeah. I'm almost like, I'm just kind of, I'm watching this stuff and I'm just seeing where my heart takes me and nothing's really pulled me anywhere yet. I have always enjoyed Ferrari though, but I know that's like for the Yankees. It isn't though,

because they haven't been good the last few years. I know, but it's Ferrari though. You know, it's, I don't know. I don't know. I don't think that's, that's, I think we're looking for- So can I do Ferrari? Because I'm half Italian.

I think you can do Ferrari. Honestly, Mercedes would be the Yankees. Well, I would never do Mercedes. BMW guy. Where's BMW, by the way? How are they not an F1? The fuck are they doing? This is over my pay grade.

I have no idea. None. So you are... I don't know. I still haven't really figured it out because I kind of like McLaren. And then Ricardo went on part of my take twice and then said that they'd get them to us in six months

and we complained and then they unfollowed me. So right now my relationship with McLaren isn't that great. And then they stunk this weekend. So, um, I'm not ruling it out. You know, adults can, can work through things, but it was just seemed very weird that McLaren would then unfollow me because I was annoyed that we had put in for Ricardo and they were like, no, he's not doing anything. And I get that.

He went on PNP. You know what? I'm out. I'm out of mclaren too fuck those guys he went on a second time after they were like you know when you put in an interview request and they'll say yeah maybe in six months it's just such a fuck off and so it was a little frustrating but then mclaren did send me stuff so then i felt bad so i don't know i'm out all right so say no more williams no haas was always kind of a joke because they were so bad but basically they were gearing up their entire 21 season for 22 so they're just getting smoked they're finishing last like every single race both cars and their team

principal sort of this goofy guy but then when i didn't even realize they had like russian oligarch money and it was like one of the kids, the Khmeltsin pan was the kid, you know, so some nepotism going on there too. So once I learned about that, I was like, all right,

but now I guess Haas is free and clear, all that stuff. And Kevin knows his stuff better than I do. Kevin Clark. I kind of like Verstappen because he's such a freak. So, but then I'm like, am I just going to root for Red Bull?

So I don't know, man. I started thinking about Ferrari this weekend as well. I haven't really picked anybody yet, though. Maybe I'll just enjoy the race. Maybe I'm just there for the love of competition. I don't know, Bill. You're partly Italian, right? Yeah. Well, I feel like that's our end with Ferrari.

Right? Who does Cerruti root for? Cerruti, who do you root for he's like the most italian guy going but he's i don't think he's that into f1 he had the el classico today so he was busy a lot of soccer today but no i kicked around verstappen i was gonna root for uh what was it was it haas but then they folded right no they didn't fold they were awesome today after a terrible year what was the american team haas oh then it. I thought they folded for some reason. Oh, yeah.

Maybe I'm a Haas guy. You seem pretty locked in. I'm definitely locked in. That's my squad. Glad we asked. It seems like everybody goes on a couple dates with Verstappen and then it doesn't take. Like there's a moment.

I had it watched in the Netflix show where I was like 33. That's my number. Got to root for him. And then I was like, 33, that's my number. Got to root for them. And then I was like, I can't get there. Apparently BMW stopped because it was too expensive, by the way. See, that's why they're the best. They don't need to waste money on F1 to prove that they're the best.

Yeah. Haas is Gene Haas, who was born in Youngstown, Ohio. And if you know anything about Youngstown, you know the best people come from Youngstown, Ohio. And if you know anything about Youngstown, you know the best people come from Youngstown. So, yeah. Can we do a life advice about Kyle quickly? Yes. Yes.

Is he around? Kyle's 19-year-old brother, my nephew, was in town. And Kyle, who has this weird sense of, I don't know, like doing the right thing, didn't want to bring his brother into his bar where he could have probably gotten him drinks because he felt like a sense of duty to his favorite bar.

He didn't want to do that to the bar, have the underage guy, even though they probably would have looked the other way and done the whole thing. But Kyle has made a principle, took him to the bar. Have the underage guy, even though they probably would have looked the other way and done the whole thing. But Kyle, as a man of principle, took them to other bars. Kyle,

look at you. What was that about? You just didn't want to do that to the frolic room? The biggest problem was I had told him a couple weeks ago that he was coming and that he was 19. And then it would have just been weird coming in with a 19-year-old like, hey, remember

that guy that's totally underage that I told you about a couple weeks ago? Here he is. Didn't want to put anyone in a position. So the mistake was saying that he wasn't 21 ahead of time, basically lying to the frolic room. But again, Kyle made a principle.

Yeah, that's... Did you have a good time with your brother? What did he think of Hollywood? Was he freaking out? I think his words were shit show. It's a lot. We walked past the frolic room and he just poked his head

and he was like, that's where you fucking hang out? And I was like, yeah, it's better in the daytime. We just kept it moving. He didn't love the looks of it. It's right there, right? Isn't it like right next to Ripley's or something? Like right on Hollywood Boulevard?

Pantages. Hamilton, like five times a week there. I just started reading Hamilton. You want to talk about a tough childhood? Jesus Christ. Alright, we'll leave on that note. Russell, you're doing two podcasts on your feed this week. I'm thinking about doing a Hamilton recap

once a week. Oh, that'd be good. I'm reading Chernow's book, and I was like, maybe I could just do a chapter summary for 10 minutes once a week. Or we could do it here. I doubt you'll want to do it

because it'll be long-winded. You'll get annoyed with me. I wanted to talk to you about Deep Water, but you didn't even watch it. Next week, maybe? I think we should do a little We Crashed. I saw all three episodes.

Okay, how is it? I'm going to get one in tonight. So, Jared Leto really loves these characters where he can do an accent, but in this case, the accent's really good. I actually thought he was great. I thought it was really well done. And then I realized my guys who did Focus,

I'm the only person who likes the movie Focus. Well, there's a bunch of us out there, but the guys who did Focus do this We Crash show, and it's kind of like a nice vibe to it. It's really well done. Is that the Will Smith, Margot Robbie thing? No one likes that movie, and you love it, don't you?

Me and Wesley Morris, we did a rewatch of us. I like it. I'll defend it to the death. But these guys, it's just like really well done. You know, I can't wait. I'm going to check it out tonight.

I'm going to check it out tonight. That's good. All right, Rosillo, good to see you. Thanks, man. All right, that's it for the podcast.

Thanks to Rosillo as always. Thanks to producer Kyle Creighton. Thanks to Dylan Berkey and Steve Cerruti. And we will see you on this feed on Tuesday. New Rewatchables coming on Monday.

Night, as usual. Midnight. Shooter. 15th anniversary. Me, Shea Serrano. Chris Ryan. A ridiculous movie. A ridiculously entertaining movie.

So, we're breaking that down Monday night. See you on that feed on Monday night. See you on this feed on Tuesday. On the wayside On the first sun Never lost it I don't have To ever forget