The Bill Simmons Podcast - The Clippers Curse Vol. 47, Booker’s Evolution, and Round 1 Bets With Kevin Wildes and Eddie Johnson

Episode Date: April 15, 2022

The Ringer’s Bill Simmons is joined by Kevin Wildes of Fox Sports to discuss Anthony Davis's comments on the Lakers’ flukey injuries, the Clippers' repeated bad luck, Bill’s favorite Round 1 bets, Half-Baked Ideas, and more (2:10). Then Bill talks with Phoenix Suns play-by-play analyst Eddie Johnson about Devin Booker’s MVP case and why he is nowhere near his ceiling as a player, advice Eddie would give to Ben Simmons, the obstacles that today's NBA stars face, stories from Eddie's 17-year NBA career, and more (1:01:37). Host Bill Simmons Guests: Kevin Wildes and Eddie Johnson Producers: Kyle Crichton and Steve Ceruti Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hi everyone. I'm Ian Wright. Make sure you check out my podcast, Wright is Outs, every Wednesday on Ringer FC. Each week, I'm joined by a rotating panel of guests to talk about football, Lite, man, since college days when I was allowed to have beer. I think nephew Kyle is a fan too. Miller Lite keeps it simple for us. Undebatable quality, great taste. Picture this, it's game day, all the gangs here, you're tailgating outside the stadium. It's a great time for beer. Or how about when you're standing at the grill and the smell of sizzling burgers is in the air? Moments like that are when you want a light beer that tastes like beer, that's delicious. You don't want to load up on those heavier beers and then you only have two of them. Then you feel tired. Your stomach feels full. Miller Lite, it's your friend. It just accompanies whatever else you're doing. You're super happy with it. Opening an ice cold Miller Lite can signal the beginning of Miller time.

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We're starting deep dives next week. We're into Winning Time the rest of the way. We have Barry coming with a very special guest on that one. We crashed season finale. We have We Own This City coming up end of April, which is basically the spiritual successor to The Wire and then The Offer, which I'm really excited about.

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old friend Kevin Wilds, we're going to talk all kinds of NBA stuff and he's going to do some half-baked ideas. I am going to give my playoff picks. And last but not least, the great Eddie Johnson, longtime NBA player. You can hear him with Justin Termini on Sirius NBA show, a show that I really like. And he's going to tell us about the Suns, Devin Booker, talk about life in the 80s, whole bunch of stuff. I really had fun with that one. This is a good podcast. It's all next. First,

Pro Gym. bunch of stuff. I really had fun with that one. This is a good podcast. It's all next first. Pro-Jab. All right. My old friend Kevin Wilds is here. We used to work together a million years ago. He is on First Things First on FS1. He is the master of the half-baked ideas. He is somebody who was on my side as we predicted Tom Brady would not go away, that he was immortal. Do you think he could play until he's 50? What's your final age? What's the over under age for Tom Brady's actual retirement? If I gave you like 48 and a half, would you go over? Yes. I wouldn't bet. Yeah. I wouldn't bet it. If it was at 52, I wouldn't bet it. I'd be like, ah, I'm going to leave that one alone. But he said 50 or 55 before. 55 seems strange until you look up and like, oh, Brad Pitt

is 89. Wow, he looks good for 89. That's like Bart Jones on ESPN. He's like 61. Aging doesn't really matter anymore. I think Greg Gumbel is like 123. I read that. I don't know if that's true.

Looks great. Looks great. Looks great. Looks great. Does that ever look better? Yeah, the Brady thing. I wonder what's going to happen here with Brady and LeBron from an age standpoint. I think they're going to be really fascinating because of the technology and all the ways you can keep your body way fresher than any other era we've had.

Their competitiveness, their goals to break records, to set some sort of bar, and also the fact that they love the limelight. I think Brady, we'll talk about the conspiracy stuff with the Dolphins in a second, but if Brady's still good, why wouldn't he play? You and I would both keep playing until we weren't good at playing anymore. I feel like something that has been consistently just overlooked is 44 is still young to retire. Like no one in Brady's, none of Brady's peers are retiring.

I mean, his NFL peers are retiring, but none of the guys he went to high school with or college are talking about golfing eight hours a day for the next 40 years of their life. So it's not that strange. And I know the broadcast acts like he's 70 years old because he is old in comparison to every other quarterback, but in real life, he's not old. So of course he's not going to retire. You're like, oh, Bill, you should retire. You should just be done and just go. Like, no, first of all, I like what I'm doing.

I don't want to retire. Wait, talk to me more about me retiring. Because I feel like you could talk me into it in about a minute and a half. About retirement? Why? No. It sounds great.

I try to get you the other way. I try to mail you a typewriter like I'm Tom Hanks. Like, hey, why don't you bang out a column? Give it a shot. Just start fresh. Maybe someday. Yeah, I think, Brady, I think the lesson we have,

no matter what the errors are, is people usually play until it really starts to decline and they become a little bit embarrassed. Or, like in Peyton Manning's case, nobody wants to hire them anymore. They'll stick around for as long as they can. Very rarely to hire them anymore. You know, but they'll stick around for as long as they can.

Very rarely do people go, I'm good. And they do the blackjack, wiping the hands and put their hands up, they're gone. So do you think Brady would be satisfied with a nine and eight season? A nine and eight season

where he's just, would he be satisfied with a Jimmy G type season? Where like the team wins, but he doesn't, you know, it's a lot of running attack and defense. I think he set every single individual record you could probably set.

And those things are probably so far away. He doesn't have to worry about that anymore. I think he's looking at it solely with the Superbowls. LeBron has the two things concurrently, right? He wants more rings. He has four, which is a good number, but it's still one less than Kobe, two less than Jordan. He knows he has to at least keep going to try to pass Kareem.

He knows he has a chance to do 40,000 points. I don't believe this stuff about playing with the sun as a big motivator because we have no idea if his son's an NBA player or not. That still has to play out. But the 40,000 points and more rings. So we were texting about, let's say they can't figure out the Westbrook thing. I talked about that on my Tuesday podcast with KOC.

What if they can't figure it out? What if nobody wants Westbrook? What if it's just a sunk cost and you have to bring him into the season and just hope he's an expiring contract in February? You just have to look at it like, we can't get anything for this guy, so either we bury him,

we push him to the side, or we hope we can trade him. If he's looking at that, would LeBron now look at that situation and go, this is now not my best chance to win another ring. Do I shove myself somewhere else? Where would that place be, Kevin Welts?

I think that him bouncing around, going back to Cleveland doesn't make any sense. Him looking like, oh, I want to go to New York. I don't think any of that makes any sense. Because he does have an empire in LA and his family in LA

and Bronny has another year of school. So it's like, oh, he'll never leave the Lakers. And I feel like the only one in the class raising my hand, like there is another team in Los Angeles that literally plays in the same building. Like he might be able to even like just move, pick up his stuff

and move it a few yards to the other locker room. I feel like a Paul George to play with Westbrook, by the way, that's the bonus take of it. A Paul George for LeBron move that LeBron would have to initiate. It's not like Rob would do this, but LeBron said, you know what?

Maybe me and Kawhi, maybe that's the move. I think that'd be fascinating. I don't think anyone's giving it any real, I don't know, credence. But I've yet to figure out why it doesn't make sense. Yeah, because you could say, ah, the Clippers, they have that stink on them. Donald Sterling's the owner, but he's not the owner anymore. Steve Ballmer's the owner.

You could say they're the second class team in LA, but if LeBron is on the team, that shifts a little bit in a way that Kawhi and Paul George being on a team in LA that also has LeBron and Davis, it just would swing the importance of those two teams against each other. I think it's interesting. You thought it would be a Paul George trade because I think you could talk me into either guy.. Cause for Kawhi and we'll go into some of the Clipper stuff in a second. I actually think Paul George, I don't know if I'm the Clippers. I wouldn't trade Paul George for LeBron as crazy as that sounds. LeBron's going to be in his 20th year next year. He's on the last year of his deal. I have no idea if he's going to stay versus Paul George. I have under contract and he's really good.

And then you have Kawhi who has just missed a ton of games. And, you know, I, I think if you're them, maybe that's a chance to reduce the risk of the Kawhi contract and roll the dice with LeBron. Right.

But I, I, I, I mean, maybe I just like the Paul George Westbrook pairing. I'm just, I just always am trying to reunite everybody. I just like the Paul George Westbrook pairing. I'm always just trying to reunite people. I just always am trying to reunite everybody.

It's just like the Brock Brady thing. I'm just always trying to get old teammates back together. Well, like us. We're back together. Exactly. People said it could never happen. You know, no one said that, but for the right, one other thing that I wanted to run by you.

Yeah. Anthony Davis's exit interview. Oh, yeah. He blamed a lot of it on injury, and there's been a common narrative of get his body right, hang out with LeBron, sleep in a hyperbaric chamber, eat better, use the comm app the whole night. And Anthony Davis was like like my training was great. Like I stepped on Rudy Gobert's foot and someone rolled into me and I went back and watched the injuries and like, Anthony Davis is right. This was not a training, a lack of training or a lack of endurance that got him injured, just two freak accidents.

So after that exit interview that I feel like he got kind of ripped for a little bit, but he was right. And I don't, I feel like no one's taking his side on it. So basically, do you think that Anthony Davis could come back and play 82 games and the playoffs since the two injuries he had this year were freak accidents?

Well, freak accidents in one sense, but in the other sense, I thought he was carrying too much weight. And maybe if he's carrying less weight and he's a little more limber, he might avoid it. Hey, I'm taking what Anthony Davis said and I'm veering in a sideways direction with it. I wonder, like you think of all these tall guys, the six foot 11 and up guys, the rim runners, the guys who have their hands up, the guys that are always jumping up and down where there's a lot of legs and feet. I wonder if those are the most dangerous people to pay. You even saw it with the Celtics with Robert Williams. He's had a ton of injuries. Embiid, he's been out a bunch.

And I was thinking like, this is all swinging Jokic's way because he can't jump. He's never in a situation where he lands on anyone's feet. Jokic is the safest bet of any setter because he has a six inch vertical leap. Oh, goodness.

Whereas all these other guys who are in the air, no matter who they are, they seem over and over again, like either their bodies break down or like Blake Griffin. How many injuries did Blake Griffin have? Eight different injuries. I don't know. He's stuck

on the bench. Whereas LeBron, I think one of the reasons he's more durable is he would get in the air, especially in the first half of his career. But he was really, he became more of like, I'm just plowing through everybody. Kind of like what Anthony Edwards does now, the young Anthony Edwards. But I wonder like,

I would just, I was thinking about Duncan. The young Anthony, the young Anthony, Kevin Garnett. Kevin Garnett's another one, 2009. High alley-oop,

lands on site, and that's it. His career has totally changed. I don't know. I was just thinking like, it is weird that there's so many of these injuries with those guys who are around the rim.

And should we be more concerned about when you give like somebody like a $220 million deal for a big guy, those guys seem to get hurt more. That's interesting. I think there was a Reddit post and I talked to somebody about this and it was on landing mechanics. And it was for all, for all of the science and analytics someone just broke down landing mechanics and i think it was a derrick it was a derrick rose post on just how when you when you're so explosive you can get up in the air you

just land incorrectly and then there should be more focus on like hey this is how you should land that no one has ever studied or explained. It's certainly interesting. Ja got hurt this year. Zion, he's been out. I wonder, like... Zion out or... I mean, the Zion stuff. Have you ever seen more... Have you ever seen better warm-up dunks for a guy who can't get on the court like what dunk are we waiting for zion to do he's doing 360 dunks yesterday he threw one off the

backboard between his legs caught it and dunk like what exactly do we need him to jump over a kia to for the pelicans be like you know what i think you're ready you pass the kia test we talked to the doctors if you can jump over k think you're ready. You pass the Kia test. We talked to the doctors. If you can jump over Kia, if you can jump up and blow a candle out from a cupcake that we have on the rim, then we'll be ready to go. You passed.

It's ridiculous. Well, why is he wearing those giant sweatshirts? It almost seems like he's trying to hide something. He's dressing like somebody who came back from spring break and put on weight and is now wearing like baggy clothes. So nobody,

I can't tell. It's very strange. You'll look at another picture and he, and he looks super ripped. So I don't know. Yeah. For some time, some reason he dresses half the time,

like, like the, the brother who failed in a sports movie, who's jealous of the hero. And he's just, he's like Rod Tidwell's brother and Jared Maguire. He kind of has that, that kind of vibe to him. Yeah. I was, cause I was trying to figure out why big guys, some guys last longer and some guys have more injuries. And admittedly, I haven't done

the mega study on it, but Tim Duncan, basically the last 10 years of his career, right. He was on one leg, but maybe that was one of the reasons he was so durable and played so long because he wasn't like constantly around. I, every time I watch basketball, I'm always amazed more guys don't get hurt. When you see these guys flying into a pile of bodies with the feet, the ankle, just everything. Like, I think it's kind of amazing. We don't have more injuries. Did you hear my no diving? Like the smart curry thing. How does that not happen more often? No diving, let's hear it. My no diving take is diving should be outlawed in the NBA.

You can't dive for the ball. Period. Ever. If you can dive for the ball, if it's going out of bounds and you want to keep it in bounds, like the old Dennis Rodman poster, but if there's someone near the ball yeah and the idea that you would dive for it like it's a fumble would be eliminated from the game it'd be a flagrant foul it's just too dangerous of a play where lebron got hurt doing um uh steph got hurt um kairi got hurt. I think that was earlier this year.

Kyrie almost got hurt. Like we're just waiting for someone to get seriously injured with something that's obvious. And there's a certain nostalgia for it. Like, Oh, get on the floor, dive.

It makes no sense. And it's a player safety issue. Like, no, you can pick up the ball, but you're not allowed to just dive at the ball head first when there's someone around. I would treat it like a quarterback roughing the quarterback. Any touch of any molecule

is a flagrant foul. Interesting. It sounds crazy, but it makes perfect sense and it will eventually happen. I'm going to be going in the ground in 50 years and be like, good news, they passed the no diving road. Like, yes, I knew it was going to happen. And then I would go,

it's going to happen eventually. It's ridiculous. Yeah, I was trying to think if you had told me, what, 15 years ago that you're not going to be able to hit receivers over the middle anymore

and you can't try to sack a quarterback unless it's at their hips. I would have said, there's no way they're going to do that. That's going to ruin football. And the game's better.

The game's better and faster and safer. Maybe we do, in the regular season, you can't dive. No, you can't ever. That's actually not bad. That's actually not bad. You know what?

If that's what it needs to get over the finish line, it's like getting a bill through the government. Like, you know what? I'll make that concession. Well, then what do we do with soccer? The slide,

the slide tackles, the most dangerous thing in soccer. There's no slide tackles in youth soccer. No slide tackles. Too dangerous. It's just called a dangerous play because it's too dangerous. Slide tackles overall should go. Let's take a break.

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This episode is brought to you by Movember. The mustache is back with a vengeance. Look at Travis Kelsey. Before he rocked that Super Bowl ring, he rocked that super soup strainer. Grow a mustache for Movember. You'll do great things too. You won't win the Super Bowl,

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Do great things this November. Sign up now. Just search Movember. All right, coming back. So we're taping this. It's Thursday morning. The Clippers playing game is on Friday night. So if Kawhi miraculously does the Willis read for this game, like we didn't know. Sorry, we didn't talk about that, but I'm going to guess that's not going to happen. This Clippers thing is pretty crazy. In 2019, they're 48-34.

Feel good team. Lost to Golden State in round one. They had SGA. They had Gallo. Zubats. Pat Beverly. Schammett. Harrell.

Lou Williams. Ton of picks. Capspace. They say, fuck it. They go all in on Kawhi and Paul George. OKC's haul from that trade. They got SGA. They got Gallinari.

They got Miami's 2021 first, which turned into Trey Mann. They have the Clippers first this year. Pick swap with the Clippers, 23. Clippers first and 24. Pick swap with the Clippers, 25. Clippers first and 26. Here's what's happened with the Clippers, 25. Clippers first and 26. Here's what's happened with the Clippers.

49 and 23 in 2020, lost round two game seven in the bubble. 2021, 47, 25, lost to Phoenix round three conference finals game six. 2022 Clippers, 42 and 40, playing for their play-in lives against the Pelicans. This could be the end of year three of Kawhi and Paul George. So I guess the question is, was it worth it?

Yeah, well, okay. I mean, you just laid out a great argument that it was not worth it. But suppose they get through the Pelicans and all of a sudden Kawhi is feeling good. Would you be shocked if they ended up in the Western Conference Finals?

Would you be just... And I believe in the Suns with an asterisk. But would you be shocked if... What asterisk? What else do they have to do? They could have gone like 67 and 15 if they wanted to. What do you mean asterisk? What else do they have to do? They could have gone like 67 and 15 if they wanted to.

What do you mean asterisks? What's missing? Tell me. I don't know. I just believe in the Suns. I said I believe in the Suns. What's the asterisk?

It's like I think it's, it might be a little bit of franchise. Oh. That they've never gotten over the hump as a franchise. Yeah. I believe, you know, I believed in

the Red Sox. But before, until we won a World Series then he started to really believe it. And I know that makes no logical sense. No, it makes sense. It's a red sign. That Tom Chambers failure has nothing to do with Devin Booker.

But I'm just, you know, I'm just going to tell you what's in my heart. I believe in them with an asterisk. Kawhi and Paul George, they've missed 208 regular season games in three seasons. Kawhi missed the last eight playoff games last year. Probably not in the playoffs this year.

They've won three playoff series total. And here's my take. I think you'd do it again. I would do it again. That's what I'm saying. You've got stars. I went into this when I was doing my research thinking the day of

the go-for- it trade is over. And then I look back at all the go for it trades, starting with the Celtics and with Kyrie that did not work. Two series wins. He played five playoff games total. The Rockets with CP3 almost worked. Had a great regular season team. Couldn't get over the hump. For what they gave up, maybe.

Brooklyn getting KD, like basically using their cap for KD and Kyrie hasn't worked over the hump. For what they gave up, maybe. Brooklyn getting KD, like basically using their cap for KD and Kyrie hasn't worked yet. Sure. But 2019 Raptors, with the go for a trade with Kawhi, one year of Kawhi, they gave up DeMar DeRozan and Purtle,

who's good. It worked. They won the title. 2020 Rockets, they go in for Russ, did not work. That's like your worst case scenario big picks down the road

trade was a disaster hard now to be traded 2020 Lakers gave up more for anybody in the history of the NBA worked they won a finals I think most Lakers fans

I guess would do that again yeah I don't know maybe yeah the Clippers we mentioned 2021 Bucks, Drew Holiday,

won the finals. And then the 2022 Sixers. So I just listed nine teams who went for it since 2018. And three of them

were three of our four finals champions during that stretch. Well, don't you prefer a team to just say, I feel like we're in the golden age of sports carpe diem.

And it's probably LeBron when he was signing all those one-year contracts of like, no planning for the future. Let's, I want to win now. And, you know, bring Kevin Love here. Like, I want to win now. And then I felt like Tom Brady followed LeBron's footsteps. want to win now and we're in you know bring kevin love here like i want to win now and then tom i felt like tom brady followed lebron's footsteps yeah belichick was like ah we kind

of put a championship on the credit card now the bill's due and tom is like well i'm out on this i'm done with you guys spending money on special teams when i want wide receiver yeah um and then the bucks went all in and then now it felt like Tom Brady had to have a sham retirement to make them go all in again. Right. If I'm a franchise, I like a team that's willing to go all in. If I'm a fan, I like a team that's willing to go all in. And yeah, I would do it again if I was a Clippers.

And if I'm Steve Ball. The Rams too. The Rams are another all-in team. I don't understand the Rams' salary cap. Explain that one to me. It's like the Bermuda Triangle. When we used to watch Bermuda Triangle shows in the 80s and 90s, we were like, why is this a bigger deal?

All these players just disappear there. What's happening? Every free agent is like, oh, you know, Gilmore is interested in the Rams. How? How? What is going on? They're good with the cap. Like, how? How? Right. What is going on? Well, they're good with the cap.

I follow sports for a living. I got a 690 in math on my SATs. And I feel like I understand everything. And then when it comes to the NFL salary cap, it might as well be in like Greek.

No idea. No idea. The Rams are like, oh, the Rams signed this guy. And we're like, the Patriots, they spent four free agents

a spring ago, and now they're completely handicapped this year. They can't get anybody. They're just bargain shopping. I do understand the Patriots' salary cap. The Patriots' salary cap is very much like the cash I have in my wallet. Like, oh, I have

$20. I bought a coffee. That was $17. A bag of tuna for a sandwich. It's like, okay, now I'm down to eight. There is no good news, everybody. We got Tyron Matthew, and we're paying him $12 million a year. Like, oh, great! It just feels

very basic. It almost seems like the NFL salary cap is a credit card in college that you can either go nuts with or be responsible with. And it seems like the Patriots are just super responsible. We don't want to do this. It could hurt us down the road. The part I don't get

is they have a quarterback on a rookie contract who's picked in the middle of the first round, which is the biggest asset you have. You have everybody else's, like Derek Carr. He's, I don't know, $40 million a year extension, right? Every good team

that they're competing against is paying somewhere between like $20 and $50 million for their quarterback. And the Pats have a quarterback probably making like $3 or $4. And they're like, ah, JC Jackson, too rich for four. And they're like, ah,

JC Jackson, too rich for our blood. It's like, is it? I think we're, I follow the salary cap guy on Patriot salary cap on Twitter. I like that guy. I think we're going to have a ton of money next year. I also don't like to be in the preseason.

I don't like to be in the preseason talking about next year already. Yeah, I agree. Anyway, back to the Clippers. They didn't really, from a salary standpoint, get crushed the first two years.

But this year's team, which went 42-40, Paul George played 31 games, Kawhi played zero games. Made the playoffs. $166 million payroll, $83 million luxury tax bill. The team cost $249 million.

I guess the bigger picture thing for the Clippers, it wasn't just a gamble on winning the title. It was a gamble on trying to own basketball in LA. It was Ballmer's belief that he could build an LA basketball team that could either rival or surpass the Lakers. Right down to the fact that he's building this

multi-billion dollar basketball arena in Englewood because he doesn't want to be tied to the Lakers in any way. We're going to beat these guys. And they get Kawhi and they get Paul George. Kawhi made first team all NBA last year.

Paul George made third team. So two of the best 15 guys in the league. So I still think it's defensible. It's just kind of amazing how bad the luck was with the Kawhi injury when it happened. To have somebody hurt his ACL in round two of a playoff series that they're probably about to win,

but then it's a 12-month injury and it brings it to win, but then it's a 12 month injury and it brings it to the next. So it's almost like you somehow lose two playoffs with the same injury, which is, and Denver, I guess, has a little bit of this with Jamal Murray, but that to me, that gets into some weird Clippers curse shit, which I was writing about in 2009, about pulling the team away from Buffalo and all the weird shit that happened. This is among the weirdest thing that's happened to them. I love that you are a wonderful mix of in-depth

analysis and then just talking about curses. Crazy shit, yeah. It's this wonderful mix. Prove me wrong. What other team would that happen to? This is a 45-year run for them of just pick the worst thing

that can happen to a team. Blake Griffin. Blake Griffin had eight surgeries. This was their guy. He was out for the year as a rookie. Well, yeah, he came out of college. He got hurt in summer league, right? He got hurt in preseason.

Yeah. Okay, question for you. When you talked about Ballmer wanting to own LA basketball, do you think that is remotely on the board? Because we're going through it here with the Knicks and the Nets. The Nets are in the playoffs. They have maybe a definite top 15 player of all time.

Kyrie, one of the most dynamic players of all time. And at one point, an MVP in James Harden. And it was still like, oh, the Knicks won two in a row. Like, yeah, big celebration. And the Nets will never have it. It's just, it's like Yankees-Mets a little bit. I wonder if the players feel that. Or do they even care?

Like, I don't think Durant cares about... I just think he wants to play basketball. I don't think he cares about his situation in any way. He mentioned it the other day. When they won at the Garden, there was a little bit of cheering. He's like, oh, we're getting there. I think Kyrie cares a little bit, just because he grew up in New Jersey, and he's talked openly about like how much he loved

the Nets growing up. But I wonder if Ballmer is sort of chasing this goal that he can never catch of like the hearts and minds of the LA sports fan.

Even when he gets a championship, he's still gonna be like, eh. Turns out it's still a Lakers town. I have a good analogy for you. Okay.

It's a little like Zuckerberg with the metaverse. I'm going to start on the metaverse, dude. He's like, I see the future. And I'm going to be at the forefront of it. It's the metaverse. Ballmer's like, I see the future. It's LA basketball, only instead of the Lakers, it's the Clippers. And just goes all in.

And it's like, Steve, stop spending money. No, I can't stop. I'm going to make this happen. And that's kind of like Zuckerberg. I really like Ballmer. I think if you have Ballmer as an owner, you're in great shape. All you want from an owner is be supportive, do whatever it takes to win, spend money, be a good guy.

He seems to check all those boxes, but I think he's sorely, sorely, sorely underestimated the Laker DNA in LA. To the point where Kawhi and George go to Dodgers games and they show them on the Jumbotron and they get booed. I didn't know. Really?

Oh, yeah. It's that know. Really? Oh yeah. It's that Lakers Dodgers. Cause Lakers fans and Dodger fans. That's it. That's 97% of LA and they don't like the Clippers. So if Laker fans aren't like, well, if we don't win,

at least the Clippers are still in it. They don't think that way. It's just like the Knicks fans could care less about Brooklyn. So I don't know how you, I don't know how you defeat that. You try to get kids, you have cool, cooler uniforms,

you know, and you basically try to raise young pup nets and Clipper fans, I think is the move and grab people in their twenties who just root for players instead of teams. That's where our kids are going to root for players, not teams. That's where this is really at. Oh yeah.

My kids, my kids love the bucks and the chief, not teams. That's where this is really at. Oh, yeah. My kids love the Bucs and the Chiefs. Yeah, which makes no sense. You live in New York. I know. I like the Patriots, but they don't live in New England, so they don't have an affinity for the Patriots, although I'm trying to indoctrinate

them with Mac Jones. But Billy likes the Bucs because he dressed up as a pirate, and he saw the Bucks have a cannon. That's great. And Rusty likes Mahomes. Everybody loves Mahomes. So, yeah.

You know what? We're going back to where we were in the mid-70s where most of the kids in class would either go, the kids would either go for the local team or just who was good

the moment they started liking sports. That's right. Which is why a lot of the people in my age are like big Steeler fans, big Cowboy fans, big Yankee fans, you know? And I guess in Boston, there weren't a lot of Yankee fans,

but there were like, because the Patriots weren't very good. There were Steelers and Cowboys fans, which I always thought was weird. It's like, why don't you run for the Patriots? They're right here. It's like,

well, they went three and11 last year. But yeah, the Clippers, it's a missed opportunity, but I don't begrudge them for going for it. I will say, we could look back

at this historically with all the picks they're going to give up if Kawhi cannot stay on the court. And Paul George, who's now, he's had a whole bunch

of different physical issues too. Those guys are now in their 30irties. And, uh, and I just wonder how that works out for them. Do you want to still talk? Can I throw one more take in on the Clippers? And this was something Nick said on the show today. Nick Wright, Kevin Durant's arch rival, Nick Wright.

Okay. Good. You know, any news is good news. Um, you should have them on the pod by the way this is my public oh you would you would love it you guys would be great um he's more analytical less like curses but you guys could get into it yeah um he he said something interesting said the last person that led the lakers that the lakers drafted, was Kobe, it was a trade, and then James Worthy.

Like, every Lakers star was, you know, came to LA for the Lakers. It wasn't a build-through-the-draft scenario. So do you think that, because it's a lot of the, you know, Well, technically they drafted, Kobe they technically drafted, but they traded for the pick to get him. Got it, okay. So yeah, I'll count Kobe and James,

but then it's James Worthy. Yeah. And the idea that LA, just like the Rams, whether it's business and the weather and whatever, don't you think that the Clippers can draft off that a little bit and just sell LA as part of the benefit of playing for Steve Ballmer and Steve Ballmer's team? I mean, their best hope is that the Lakers continue to be such a dumpster fire behind

the scenes that the Clippers just look like the more competent organization. Because you think the Lakers were a complete dumpster fire for the entire 2010s. They got LeBron because he wanted to live in LA and they had cap space. They got Davis because they had been in the top seven of the lottery so many times and they had LeBron. They were able to will Davis to come over thanks to Clutch. But other than that, now they're in the same situation again with the same two guys and really no help at all. And you could argue they have one of the worst organizational situations in the entire league.

Whereas the Clippers have been pretty competent. They have a really good coach. And, you know, I think there's a professionalism to them on the court behind the scenes that I just don't know if the Lakers have. Maybe it's the new arena. Well, the new that I just don't know if the Lakers have. Maybe it's the new arena. Well, the new arena will be, you know, that could push over the top too. Who knows? All right. We're gonna take one more break. it's having the spend to powers your scale with no preset spending limit more cash on hand to

grow your business with up to 55 interest-free days and the ability to reach further with access to over 1400 airport lounges worldwide redefine possible with business platinum that's the powerful backing of american express terms and conditions. Visit amex.ca slash business platinum. All right, I did a Wild's like Instagram post. I wrote out what I thought was going to happen in the playoffs. Now, I actually didn't do this for Instagram, but then when I wrote it out,

I was like, oh, that looks cool. And I just posted it. I posted my picks, which my picks were basically Miami over Atlanta, Toronto over Philly, Phoenix over New Orleans, Dallas over Utah,

Boston over Brooklyn, Milwaukee over Chicago, Memphis over Minnesota, Golden State over Denver. Then, next round. Miami over Toronto. Boston over Milwaukee. Phoenix over Dallas.

Memphis over Golden State. I'm sorry, Golden State over Memphis. And then, last but not least, Boston over Miami. Phoenix over Golden State. and then the finals. Phoenix over Boston. The 1976 finals rematch.

Those are my picks. I nailed all four playing games so far. Out of the ones, my favorite for round one. I like Golden State the most. I picked them in the Instagram post, Golden State in seven. The more I look at it,

I think Denver, I think Denver might be the worst team in the West that made the playoffs. Even if you gave me New Orleans or the Clippers coming in there, it's Jokic who I voted for MVP. And then it's just like,

I don't trust anyone else in that team. And I guess the question is, like if you're Phoenix and you have the first pick, you could pick any other playoff team in the West to play for. And let's say we'll include New Orleans and the Clippers.

Would you take... You would rather play the... All right, let's say the Clippers beat New Orleans. Yeah, okay. We'll take New Orleans out. Would you rather play the Clippers beat the New Orleans. Yeah, okay. We'll take the New Orleans out. Would you rather play the Clippers, Minnesota, or Denver? If you're Phoenix. I think I would rather play Denver.

Yeah, I'm not playing Ty Lue. After Ty Lue... The Bill Belichick of basketball? Yeah. You know what? I like that. You did? Can he win more than one title?

I think he'd be great. Can he win a playing game against Anthony Edwards and D'Angelo Russell before we compare it to Bill Belichick? He will. Did you compare him to him? Was that a sarcastic take or no? Or a real take? They said that on the telecast.

Kevin Harlan and the other guy. They were like, you know, some people in basketball, they feel like he's the Bill Belichick of basketball. Oh, I thought that was a Bill Simmons exclusive. Wait, what? No. Oh, I thought that was a Bill Simmons exclusive. Bill Belichick of basketball is

iconic. Yeah, but anyway, my point is, I think Denver is probably the team you'd want to play in the West because of the supporting casting, because they're not going to have Murray back, it doesn't seem like. So if they don't have Murray back, I'd rather play them and just give Jokic, give them his 32, 17, and 10 every game,

and I still think I can beat them. I agree with you. Are you worried about Luka's cast? Where's your worry meter on a scale of 1 to 10? I'm not worried, but I just feel like he's like us. Luka's our avatar for what it would like to be the NBA. He shows up overweight. He likes to play at his own pace.

No, I'm just saying, in general, he's the most identifiable player of the week. It's like, oh, Luca, why did you show up 15 pounds overweight? I love sweet tea. I'm sorry. It's my weakness. It's like, Luca went on vacation. Oh, no, he came back. He gained my weakness. It's like, look what on vacation. Oh no, it came back.

He gained seven pounds. Oh, Luca strained his calf. I am rooting for Luca to come back. Me too. Cause I, I adhere to the, um,

to the Donovan wants out of Utah conspiracy theory. I mean, that's great for your show that you get two months out of that. But if, but if, if the jazz win and then all of a sudden Donovan and Rudy start playing well, I'm like, no.

Donovan, now you're not going to ask out. But the Donovan to New York thing, I'm just obsessed with. I just love the idea of Donovan to New York. Him leaving Utah. Quinn Snyder's going to leave. Him and Rudy don't seem to be perfectly gelling, let's say.

But man, if they beat Luka, I'm like, gosh darn it. So all Knicks fans need to go. We're going to fly down to Dallas for game one. Yeah, why not? Support the franchise. Support Luka.

I have Dallas and Seven in that series. I'm tired of watching this incarnation of Utah. I think they're probably my least fun team to watch out of all the teams. I think Dallas and Utah is actually I would stay away from that from a gambling standpoint. My favorite ones

I had these on FanDuel. I like that there's a parlay you can do with the Golden State Moneyline and the Bucks to either win in four or five. They're not going to win in four. And that's plus 117.

No, it's just Bucs to win four or five. Oh, four or five. Okay. Yeah. So it's just that that series does not go to game six.

You can bet on that. It's minus like 190. I like that. I like the Toronto Moneyline. I think that Tybalt thing is a disaster for them. That's their only defender. He's not going to play in three Toronto games?

That's brutal. Well, you have to make sure you don't get to three Toronto games. Right? Yeah, I think that's a bad matchup for Philly. I also like the Raps in six. That's plus 490. I like the Celts in six, plus 550. I don't know if Brooklyn has the same kind of...

Boston was one of the best road teams in the last 20 years. And I'm not sure Brooklyn has the kind of home court advantage like if they were going to Milwaukee or a place like that. I think a Brooklyn game would have a lot of Boston fans at it.

Brooklyn has no home court advantage. Can I give you my best Celtics stat courtesy of my researcher, Dusty? Yeah. Do you know the largest point differential since the merger? 95-96 Bulls, 12.2.

Won the title, obviously. 2022 Celtics. Now, this is the caveat I made with Dusty. Not looking at the full season. I'm breaking the Celtics season into two. 2021 Celtics and the 2022 Celtics. So this is all

since New Year's Eve. Differential, 12.2. 2016-17 Warriors, 11.6, won the title. 96-97 Bulls, 10.8, won the title. So the 2022 Celtics, starting at New Year's Eve, don't talk to me about October,

have the second best point per game differential since the merger. And it's pretty good. I just love that stat. And everybody around them has won the title. So I'm surprised you don't believe in them. I'm going to the finals and losing. I don't believe in them.

I'm going to the finals. I have to beat Brooklyn and Milwaukee back to back here. I just think that's... And losing. I don't believe in them. Go to the finals. I have to beat Brooklyn and Milwaukee back to back here. I just think that's a really hard road. Phoenix since January 1st, 37 and 10. Dallas 35 and 12. Celtics 34 and 12. Memphis 33 and 12.

I'm with you. I actually think people are sleeping. This Brooklyn Boston thing I don't want to jinx it There's more rumbling Simmons is going to come back midway through the series But Robert Williams will be back middle of the series

In my opinion Can I give you a half-baked idea here? Yeah I've gone down a few YouTube Spirals I get caught and I can't pull myself out of it Greatest Entrances and a half baked idea here. Yeah. I've gone down a few YouTube spirals. I get caught and I can't pull myself out of it. Greatest entrances.

So it's a lot of like Eminem shows up at a concert. Drake shows up at his concert to do his verse. CM Punk. Yeah, yeah. A lot of real rumble stuff. Yeah.

And a countdown. So if Robert Williams or Ben decide to come back, I would just like at one point, you know, don't be on the bench. Just be like, oh, we don't know where Robert Williams or Ben Simmons. And then it's just like, boop, boop, boop. Oh, like Chris Jericho in 1999.

Robert Williams comes back. There's a famous like Luton Larry Bird. Like, here comes Larry Bird. Just take it to the next level and just give me a full-on Ben Simmons theme song. If Ben comes back out in Boston, I'd be like, Ben Simmons is back. I would love it.

I would love it. So the Celtics for game five, everyone's on the court, warm-ups, they're about to do the announce-ups, and it just goes dark. Yeah. And a spotlight on the entrance. warm-ups. They're about to do the announce-ups, and it just goes dark. And a spotlight on the entrance.

It's the rock. Oh, the rock is here! But then the rock introduces somebody. So it's Robert Lance. It'd be great. Oh, Lord. We need a good theme song. I don't know if we have enough time

to get the composers to compose something great. No, you just use the Chris Jericho where it'd be like, it's like that loud countdown and then it just, there's an explosion. They've read the explosions,

I think would help too. I think we see him, the way this, the spacing of the schedule just a total fluke really broke nicely for both teams. I personally think Simmons, who we still know has not full court scrimmaged at all. They're claiming like, well, if he comes back, they'll ramp it up.

But if he gets thrown into this, not having played basketball for a year, a guy that allegedly has battled with some of his mental makeup stuff, and he goes into this. I think the Celtics are just going to hack a Benham. Put him on the line right away. Try to mess with him. I really think that's what they're going to do. You can't just let him come out there and be like, cool, I'm just going

to guard Jason Tatum and I'll stay out of the way on offense. It's like, no, man. Motherfucker, you're in this series. You're going to the foul line right now. Let's see it. Let's see what you got. And try to get them. That's interesting. So this is, I think the Nets need to get up.

Last year, we had like a few blowout playoff games. And the Nets have, the Celtics have blown some people out. And the Nets can never hold on to a lead. When the Nets were up 20 points the other day. Because their defense sucks. They're bad on defense, like legitimately. So I wanted the Nets to have a big lead. This is what I want.

The Nets to have a big lead and then get Ben five random minutes. And the reason why I think they're going to do that is when Ben went to Philadelphia to sit on the bench, I think they're going to do that is when Ben went to Philadelphia to sit on the bench, I thought it was very smart because he didn't go on all the road trips. And I think, I think the nets were in Boston on the game before,

and he didn't go to Boston, but there was a decision made between Ben's camp or the Sixers or, or excuse me, the nets or whatever. We're like, Hey man, you're going to have to, let's just dip your toe into this.

Just sit on the bench. Just sit there. And we were about to do it eventually. And I thought it was a smart kind of ramp up. But again, you know, I don't think throwing him in the cauldron of the playoffs is their plan. You can't throw him into a road game.

It's got to be like game three or game four in Brooklyn if he comes back. I still don't think he's going to come back though. Yeah. I think it'd be good for him just to come. If they're up big, here comes Ben. He kind of looks like, you know when Tom Cruise goes, what's that wax museum?

Where like they, it's like Tom. Madame Tussauds. Yeah, and it's like Tom Cruise met his wax dummy of Tom Cruise and look exactly like, and it's got the frozen Tom Cruise smile and then Tom Cruise stands by it and takes pictures. That's kind of what Ben Simmons looked like in that green outfit two days ago.

He's just there. He's frozen with this look on his face. I don't know. I would be very cautious. The Time Lord thing is different because I think he had the best version of that surgery. I think one of the reasons they wanted to play Brooklyn, other than they just think they're better, is that they thought he might be coming back. And as you said, they have a really big sample size now. This is a

15-week sample size of the Celtics taking huge leads in the first half on teams, of being really, really elite defensively, of Tatum, who I think is going to make first-team All-NBA, it looks like. It's not like they don't have good players. Do you think that... I was going to say, I think the Minnesota-Memphis series goes 6 or 7. I like that series. I just think it's going to be a back-and-forth, just really young, athletic, fun to watch.

Six or seven on Fandles, plus 106. Boston-Brooklyn going six or seven is minus 192. You can parlay those together for plus 213. And then I like Golden State in five for plus 290 as a flyer. Those are my faves. We'll see. What was your Toronto-Philly thing? That feels like the biggest upset

that you just kind of like, oh, I got Toronto over Philly. Well, they're plus 154. Yeah, plus 154, which isn't that big of an upset. But I think like, if you go Raps in six plus 490, you'd think

if they're down three, Philly's down 3-2, no tieable for game six. You're in Toronto and you have Harden whose legacy of do or die games is probably the worst in the league.

And give Embiid 37. Give Embiid 37 a game in this series. I still think Toronto could beat them. It's going to be Harden. They need Harden in this series. I trust him the least of any good player we've had the last 10 years.

I think that is a brilliant strategy of, hey, let's give Embiid, let's pencil Embiid in for 45 and let's not let Harden get anything and watch him just self-destruct. We saw Pop did this with Nash in 2005. He was like,

Nash, knock yourself out, man. You can 35, 40 a game. Good. Go for it. Nobody else is, we're staying home on everybody else.

You get yours. And Nash talked about it. We talked about it on my podcast. It like fucked with his head. That he wanted to get people involved. Because then Embiid

would start forth like, oh, Harden, you get, you know, Embiid's a nice guy and wants, you know, everybody to eat. That'd be interesting. The other thing with Embiid, and he was in good condition this year

and I thought he finished games better than he has at any other point in his career. But these playoff games are also, they're really intense. They feel like a game and a half and the kind of burden he's going to have in a series like this. You know, they don't have, if Harden doesn't get going, they feel like a game and a half and the kind of burden he's going to have in a series like this.

You know, they don't have, if Harden doesn't get going, they don't have that kind of random heat check guy other than Maxie. So the question for me is, are they just going to, are they going to let Maxie drive the car or is it going to be like a James Harden? Did you see Jalen had one of the best bits

I've seen in a while from him? The concert thing? Yeah, Harden's box scores look like concerts. 3 for 14. 4 for 12. You just let all of them up. I thought that was great. Alright, let's do

a half-picked idea. Oh, wow. Do you have a round one pick you want to throw at us? Anything? Nothing you're fired up about? Give me one. You like Brooklyn, a round one pick you want to throw at us? No, I think yours are all. Nothing you're fired up about? Give me one. You like Brooklyn, don't you? I can see it in your eyes. I want to like the

Celtics, but if Ben comes back, I'm going to root for Ben. I'm going to root for Ben just because I feel like Ben doesn't have enough people. I feel like Ben doesn't have enough fans. I'm like, I'll be your fan, buddy. I'm rooting for you. I like the Celt fan, buddy. I'm rooting for you. I like the Celtics, but...

This is interesting. You feel like there's an inefficiency for the Ben Simmons fans. Just who's riding for Ben? Who is just like, Ben Simmons is my guy. You never made a mistake. You've never been felt pressure

and haven't been able to meet the expectations. Everybody has felt that. Like, well, he's trying to get his money back. Like, yeah, you know what? It's worth an email. Hey, can I have my $19 million? I do not hold Ben like, oh, you know, if I was in the,

I would play, if I couldn't play, I would let the Sixers keep the money. I wouldn't. I would send a few emails. Hey, here's a PDF. I will let it play out a little bit for $19 million. Oh, you know, in my day, you'd have to go to work. Yeah, I get it.

But it's, you know, it's worth a few texts. It's worth hiring a lawyer to say, yeah, I'd like to get the money. Meanwhile, he could have faked. He could have faked a back injury the entire time and got his money so there's an element of honesty to the to the to being transparent about his mental health that i think should be applauded that's wow i got fired up about ben on a sale we'll take i was excited because i felt like my son was in the driver's seat in the Ben Simmons versus Ben Simmons. A lot of stuff going for him.

Got him to the high school he wanted to get into. He's going to play football next year. And then, six are, Ned's Ben Simmons. Now he's on the comeback trail. My dumbass Ben Simmons, who keeps skateboarding, even though we tell him not to skateboard, does the hairline fracture of his ankle because he cracked it on his skateboard. He's out four weeks, misses eighth grade baseball season,

missed this whole last two rounds of a 77 football thing that he was in and now has retired from skateboarding. But it's like you have your kids and you're just like, now this turned into parent corner. Your kids are like, hey, don't do that.

You're going to get hurt. And they're like, I know better than you. I'm 14. I know i know better don't tell me and then it's like oh now you're in a cast for four weeks you dumb ass go go skate in the metaverse that's what i tell my kids i say hey right you want you you want to play uh you know skateboard get in the metaverse but that's the first that's the first good case i've heard for the metaverse the metaverse is the metaverse you can't get The metaverse. You can't get hurt. You can't get hurt.

Your kids are safe in the metaverse other than the psychological damage. God, the metaverse. All right, let's hear two great half-baked ideas and we'll wrap. Oh my gosh. My best half-baked idea. Okay.

I'll start with a sports one and I'll end with my other business. I'm going to start. This is a business though it's called you know the media is so fractured right now we've got podcasts

and TV shows it's not like the olden days where you could just rip the back page of the newspaper and stick it to a bulletin board and there you got your bulletin board material used to be easy the head coach could do that you could coach the team and provide a bulletin board. And there you got your bulletin board material. Used to be easy. The head coach could do that. You could coach the team and provide the bulletin

board material. But now that the way the media is, who's got time for it? Certainly you don't if you're trying to coach a team. That's why you call me and my new business, Bulletin Board Material Inc. You call me and say like, oh man, we need to get fired up for this game. Is there any bulletin board material out, Kevin? Good question. I will comb the sports universe and find sort of the hotter takes and I will mail you

a fully completed bulletin board that you can put up in the locker room. So we have three levels. Are these media takes? There's a player take where Bruce Brown had that thing about they don't have Rob Williams. We can go at Tyson Horford and say, put that on the bulletin board.

But I didn't know that it made it. But then Kevin Durant tried to defuse it. He pulled it off the bulletin board. But he's not a client. He's not allowed to put stuff. I keep it on the bulletin board. I got three levels. I got trash talk.

This is just in general, regular season game. If you need some bullets and more material, just trash talk from the media, from other players, you know, I got to go through Draymond's entire podcast. See if there's anything I can put on the bulletin board.

Level two, no one believes in us. Classic bulletin board material. You know, they can't play defense, this and that. And then this one, you have to sign another waiver. It's inflammatory rhetoric.

And now we cannot be held accountable if you order the inflammatory rhetoric billboard, excuse me, bulletin board, and your quarterback melts down and throws three interceptions. Or if James Harden goes one for 15 and O for 10 from three and with a bunch of turnovers

and he sets a turnover record again. That one is dangerous. It's almost like hot ones where I just a little bit of inflammatory rhetoric. Yeah. That's bulletin board material. I like that it's hot ones. It's like, hey, be careful. Just a dab.

You just need a little bit of inflammatory rhetoric. So Quinn Snyder calls you. Yeah. And it's like, hey man, I'm worried about my team. I don't,

I don't feel like we're locked in enough. I don't feel like the guys are aggro, agitated enough. So you're like, hold on Quinn, I got you.

I'm going to go through. I have a list of all the people who didn't pick Rudy for defensive player of the year, first team all defense, and some of the most inflammatory things they said about him. Well, not too much because I don't want to throw him off. I don't have that like, hey, Donovan's

only passed the ball to Rudy Gobert four times in 10 years. I don't want to do that because then Donovan will start forcing the ball on the block. So I've got to be very careful. So it's got to be like somebody on a TV show doing the, you can't win with Donovan will start forcing the ball on the block. So I've got to be very careful. So it's got to be like somebody on a TV show doing the, you can't win with Donovan Mitchell. Exactly.

Very generic, big picture. I like this. Can I tell you, that literally happened. Remember on Turner, Donovan was regular season last year? Yeah. Whether it was Shaq or Barkley, it's like, ah, you're not a superstar. I don't think it is.

And he's like, okay. And he responded and he started scoring 50 points in the bubble. Well, Embiid, ah, you're not a superstar. I don't think it is. And he's like, okay. And he responded. He started scoring 50 points in the bubble. Well, Embiid, that was a better one when they all called out Embiid. And Embiid, it was like a spiritual awakening for him for whatever reason. It works. These guys hurt my feelings. All right.

What's your next one? This is not sports related, but it's probably worth a billion dollars if anybody wants to jump on it. It's called Fitz Furniture. It's a furniture company. Now, is it the best quality furniture? It isn't. Is it the most stylish furniture in the world? It's not.

Does it fit through the doorway? You're damn right it does. This furniture fits through doorways. It fits up the stairs. You got a landing on your stairs. You can flip that couch in there. It goes right up. That's the only thing we're trying to do.

It fits and it's light. Why are you making furniture out there like an art project with no bearing, no bearing on how a standard door is. Buy a chair. I don't know if it's going to fit. Need David Blaine to come over and get it in.

Not with Fitz Furniture. It all fits. It's comfortable enough. And it's light. So when you need to move it, it's nice and easy. It saves your marriage. It totally fits.

That's it. Fitz Furniture. That's a billion dollar idea. That sounds like a New York City idea. It's an idea. Ever else in the world, we could just put stuff through doors or windows. You put in a couch.

You can get a couch into your basement. It is true. Couches should be able to fit through doors. We should work on that. All right, I'm with you. It's furniture. Give me one more before we go. Oh, I got the silver bullet beer of the month.

Want to hear that one? Yeah. My mother-in-law got me a beer of the month. Want to hear that one? Yeah. My mother-in-law got me a beer of the month club. I said, oh, thank you. So I get 12 beers from around America and it comes

with the recipes that might go well with the beer and a little profile of the brewmaster and their inspiration. It's like almost, and I get a poem. It's beautiful. So I do this exact thing. And then I get all the beers.

They buy them in bulk. I open up the beers and I dump them in the drain because they're undrinkable. Trying to drink oatmeal beer, peanut butter beer, agave beer. I don't want it. And I fill it up with Coors Light. I recap it and then I don't want it. I fill it up with Coors Light. I recap it

and then I mail it to you. You still get this whole artisanal story. You can feel like you're special and you're participating in the renaissance of American brewery and when we made things, but you get to drink

delicious Coors Light and nothing that has strawberries in it. Or even Miller Lite. I have a deal with, it's called the Silver Bullet Beer of the Month Club, but I could do Miller Lite. That's another option.

No, that's fair. Whatever. Whatever beer you like. So you basically can request the beer you like. Yeah. But the bottle's much fancier. It's so funny you mentioned this. The design is great

i bought because now you can buy beer right they just deliver it so i was like going and i bought this one i don't know it was like because i thought like oh somebody will like this like these special flavored ones oh yeah it's got a guess what wasn't touched in the fridge of course yeah even even nephew kyle Won't drink those It's terrible There's been like Six pumpkin ale Things in my fridge For like three and a half years

Even nephew Kyle Just eyes them And is like Eh I'm good I'll come over And drink the Pumpkin ale

It's gotta be under 50 degrees though Pumpkin ale Pumpkin ale On Halloween Cold pumpkin ale Okay Oof

It's great Alright you can hear Wilds on First Things First and watch him too because it's a television show. Yeah. Both. Good to see you as always.

Good to see you, buddy. All right. Eddie Johnson is here. He's going to yell at me about Devin Booker being fourth on my MVP ballot. But I love his show on Sirius NBA channel

with Justin Termini, who's also been on this podcast. I'm finally excited for you that you get to be the real host after toiling away with Justin. Like, I'm sure this is like a thrill for you just to be with me for a half hour. It totally is. My heartbeat is just normal.

You know, seriously. Like, I have to get myself ramped up. I saw my doctor a couple weeks ago. He prescribed some stuff for me to stay calm. Because five days a week with Justin it's just starting to hurt your blood? Well, you know what? Look,

he has nothing else to do. So he plans his whole day to try to get under the skin of people. Like, you and I, we have so many other things in our lives. We're doing so many things. We don't have time to even think of... I don't have time to think about him once the show is over, even before the show.

But he's thinking about me 24-7. Right. You're in his head. Yeah. He's trying to find a way to get under my skin. That's what he does. Well, it's a great show. I've randomly been in my car and I've just called in unannounced to argue because you guys got me fired up about something. You're in Phoenix.

You do a good job on the games too. It's funny. The color guys on the different teams, sometimes they'll be a little cheerleader. You have a nice mix. Obviously, you're rooting for the Suns as your team, but you'll be critical.

You've been on this Devin Booker MVP bandwagon thing for a long time. I had him fourth. I appreciated how special that Suns team was. You were one of the first people I heard talking about it. Like, hey, it's not just that they're beating teams. They're toying with them. They are laying on these 20-5 runs and these 25 to 3 runs and stuff like that.

When do you think it shifted for Booker this season? I think it really shifted for him, to be quite honest, Bill, when Ricky Rubio came. And Ricky Rubio, I think, taught him to trust him that he didn't always have to have the ball. It's almost similar to what Phil Jackson did with Michael Jordan, with Scottie Pippen. And I think, you know, Ricky Rubio and Monty convinced him that it doesn't matter, you know, how many touches you get. The touches that you do get are going to be tremendous and your scoring average is going to be good and you're going to win games. And I think Devin bought into it because he was tired of losing.

He knew he could score on anybody. And he just said, okay, I'm going to give that a shot. Matter of fact, he told Monty, I want to be coached. That was his exact words to Monty when Monty took the job. He said, I want to be coached. And that's what he's done. And Devin has adhered to it and it's turned out to be a tremendous run for him. And I think that's when it turned around.

And then Chris Paul just took it to a new level. Well, that's the thing. You talk about young players, right? So he gets Rubio in there, who's unselfish, who's a vet. Gets Monty Williams, who easily could have gone to the Lakers and boy, would he be miserable right now. And then you get Chris Paul, who's one of the great unselfish teammates of his generation.

A little difficult to play with if you're the wrong guy. I think for Booker, he just wants to play with people who are wired like Chris Paul. Booker is. So he gets these three people. What happens if he doesn't meet any of these people? What happens if he's just on Phoenix and let's say they're the Sacramento Kings

with what's happened with them, where they're just to bring more lottery picks in. It never works. The coach keeps changing. The GM keeps changing. And Booker's just basically the deer and fox in this situation. Does he still have an ascent? What does it look like? I think he probably would have been gone. And that's with any player, right? I mean, if they find that things aren't going to work out, you know, and they don't think, you know, they're going to be able to get guys in there

to help raise them to a new level, they start thinking about leaving that particular team. And that was my fear. Yeah. Because I know how good he is. From the first moment he put his son's uniform on and Jeff Hornacek was, like, trying to delay the inevitable, him starting and him being the inevitable, him starting

and him being the guy, you can just tell in the few minutes that he got that this kid is going to be special. And so this organization needed Chris Paulville. They needed Chris Paul to just balance Devin and show him the other side of success and not chasing it just based on your numbers and just taking him to a great level. It's funny when you know early with the young guys, because Tatum was like that for the Celtics.

It would just became clear pretty quickly. Like, Oh, this one, this one's actually like, there's something special about him. What's interesting about Booker. I did a bunch of pods with Durant.

Uh, I did probably did six and two years with them. And one of them, he started raving about Booker. And Booker wasn't nobody at that point. I mean, he was a lottery pick. He was in the Suns, but the team stunk. And I think I asked him something like,

what young players on your radar do you think might have it? Who might have it under the... And he was like, Booker. And he went on this thing. You were an ex-player. You played for 19 years. You were born too soon. The three-point line would have made you probably

an extra hundred million bucks. But did you see, do you feel like the guys who played, they see something, there's some sort of DNA thing that they can spot that somebody like me couldn't spot? Yeah, you know what you see, Bill,

is you see a calm. You see like a guy that understands the science of what his craft really is in regards to dissecting this game, and that's the score. He is always on balance. That's one of the first things that I saw with him, that he's always on balance. And he rarely takes really bad shots.

Like, you know, if you're a scorer, you're going to take bad shots. But if you watch Devin, he rarely does. But what also makes him unique, and you'll agree with this, because I know you remember watching Ricky Pierce play. Oh, yeah. Is Ricky Pierce loved to have contact when he shot. It was just something about a guy very close to you when you took your shot. And that's Devin.

I mean, it's like it forces him maybe concentrate more. That's why he probably gets into it. But when I saw that and then just the way that he approached the game and how respectful he was of the game. Like a lot of guys aren't respectful of the game. They don't know the history. They don't respect the players that they watched growing up. And Devin has been all of that. He's been in my ear since he's been in Phoenix. And that's the value of where he is now. And obviously, Kobe took it to a new level when Kobe befriended him. And he is just professional, man. He is one of the most professional players I've ever seen

and that's why he's successful. I love your contact point. Vinny Johnson was like that too. He needed to have somebody basically in his jersey and that's when he would really get going. There's certain guys that just feed off that. I think it's something Tatum

is learning. That's one of the ways I think he's gotten better this year is beating guys off the dribble and kind of keeping them on his side and knowing how to use that kind of stuff against him. The Kobe thing with Booker, you know, they were, they're beating into the ground during the playoffs last year. You know, he's, he's not Kobe, but I think out of all the guys we have now, I think there's the most kind of Kobe chromosomes floating in his pool. Right.

He does stuff. First of all, the, the, as you said, like the competitiveness and the commitment to the craft and things like that. Um,

the fact that he doesn't take terrible shots, Kobe went through that stage, younger Kobe, when he did take terrible shots, right. That got better as he got older. What are the other similarities? What about from an alpha dog hanging out

in a room standpoint? What is that like? Well, yeah. I mean, he is a loner, so to speak, but this team is very close. So he's opened up now because of that. But I'll just give you something else. Well, he is relentless. Talks a lot of smack, which I love.

I was a smack talker. I love it. Yeah, that was your era. Yeah, it keeps guys off balance. Love it. But also what I love about him is, like I said, he understands now how to lead. Yeah. Like, you know, these guys are always over his house.

He's always in the middle of them, in the midst of them. And now he understands that now that he said eight positive things to them, that it's okay for him to say some negative things. He just understands and gives credit to, I think, to his upbringing,

how his dad raised him as a basketball player. And I think that plays a, how his dad raised him as a basketball player. And I think that plays a role in it as well. He's special, Bill. And I'm going to say this. And so people understand why I'm pushing him because he is special. He's going to be better. And I think people are having a hard time with it because, you know,

he's 6'4", 6'5", and that's the average height height in the league we've seen guys come in the league and they can score and all of that he has another level to get to he truly does and he showed it when Chris Paul went down yeah every seven assists like people don't think he can pass he can pass the ball he can operate in a two-man game it is a level he can get to that people have not seen. Yeah, and even beyond the assist, what impressed me about that stretch was he was kind of game-managing.

You know, it's one thing to be like, okay, I'm now going to dribble the ball up and I'll throw you the ball, but he actually and Tatum, that's something he developed too this year, this ability to kind of see what the defense doing like they're going to play probably Brooklyn

in round one and Brooklyn's just going to trap the shit out of him from 40 feet right and I think he's going to be able to solve that as the series

goes along because his hoops IQ has just gotten better and better I see the same with Booker T his handle Tatum's handle has gotten so much better

his feel for the game has gotten better. I'm so proud of him. Yeah. See, now he knows he doesn't have to take 25 shots. Right. Like, I try to tell these young guys, and this is a guy that played a role.

I started my first four years, but after that, I came off the bench, and I made a living at it. And like I tell these young guys, man, it's the science of scoring. You don't have to rush it. If you get the minutes, you'll get your numbers. I mean, that's just the beauty of it. And then all-time greats figure that out. You can go to any

all-time great that'll score. You will see. If he gets 30 minutes, he's going to get his average because he understands how to do it. Well, Ice was the best example of that ever. Ice would just... Back then when you went to see Ice in Well, Ice was the best example of that ever. Ice would just... Back then when you went to see Ice in person, they didn't have the scoreboard

with the points. Then they would say the points at the end. You'd watch the whole Spurs game. You'd be there in the building. They'd be like, blah, blah, blah. George Girvin had 43. I'd be like, George Girvin had 43? I thought he had like 24.

And it was like, no, he had like 10 points a quarter. And then the third quarter, he had 13. And that's how he got to 43. I was like, I was there. I didn't even notice it. My first encounter with him as a young player, I had him rolling in the game. And obviously, he's getting his numbers.

And obviously, my game was using screens and using my's getting his numbers. And obviously my game is using screens and using my teammates to get open. And I ran him off the screen. And Josie Merriweather, and Josie's gone now, missing barely, laid a screen on him and got him good.

And I came off hitting the jumper. And I remember going back down, looking at him, he said, I was like, yeah, Mr. Gervin. It's like doing the game, right? I mean, like, I'm so respectful of all these old-time guys that I watch. He's like, look, listen. Look, man, look, trust me. When the game is over, I'm going to probably be plus 10

on you so just let me know when I'm going to get picked man I'm good I was like what let me know I don't need to get hit that hard and it's probably like a big threat I could be plus 25 on you if I really wanted it

I was like I walked away from that and it's probably like a big threat. I could be plus 25 on you if I really wanted it. Yeah. I was like, I walked away from that game. I was cracking up, man. Every time I see him, I hug him.

I remind him of it. He's like, come on, y'all. So do you, do you take it personally? Like, cause you're around the team, obviously as a broadcaster,

when these guys, like if somebody like Booker, who sounds like he's a pretty curious kid, that they don't lean on you and get in your ear and ask you for stories and just kind of tap into you as like the Yoda of the team, basically? I tell them, I just to myself, I say, it's your loss. That's just how I view it.

Like, you know, I'm not going to be overbearing on anybody. If they knock on my door, they ring my phone, I'll talk their ear off. And I'll break things down. I've had a lot of players in the past that have done that. And there's certain players, man, that I might go by because I feel sorry for them.

And I see them struggling. And I might say something. And if they embrace what I say, then I'll keep going. If they don don't I'll just move on I'm not going to force feed anybody you know you shouldn't be immersed in your struggles if it's something simple you can get out of and there's a lot of players that I see that's immersed in simple struggles that really with a good ear and a good voice just to go up to them that that ran that road and went that marathon and tell them that can get them on the stride,

you know, they should embrace it. But a lot of them don't. They'd rather embrace this workout guy that, you know, they met when they were in middle school. And, you know, he's hanging on and, you know, they're paying him a ton of money. And he's teaching them these weird drills. And they think that's the key. And it's really simple. What would you, so let's say,

let's say you see Ben Simmons. Let's say it's a Philly, I'm sorry, a Brooklyn Phoenix Finals and Ben Simmons has not played the whole year and you just end up sitting next to him at a restaurant and he's like, hey,

you played, you just start talking. And he's like, what do you, what do you think? How can I get better? What would you tell him? Well, first I would tell him, you're on the right team,

man, because we know you don't love to score. Like, you score because it's a necessity and you're there and you're in that situation. But really what you love to do is defend and pass the ball. We get it. Okay? But you gotta still go to your sweet spots

and just do damage. And people won't bother you. They won't. They won't. You won't stand out. Like get your foot in the paint like he did when Joel went down last year and he dropped 42 on Gobert. Right. Yeah. That's where his sweet spots are. So if you want to get to your sweet spots, then what you got to do, what? Rebound the ball yourself, push it. Two, beat Joel or beat, I mean, beat KD down the court and plant yourself in there and force him to throw it to you. But don't be selfish in doing it.

I mean, that's how you get fans off of you. Like, they'll tend to forget. And he doesn't understand that. He doesn't know that. He's locked in. Oh, I passed up the jumper. I passed up the jumper. When really, in essence, fans don't really care.

They want to see the ball go through the hoop. However you can get it done. And that's his struggle right now. It's between his ears, man. But he's on the right team, Bill, because he doesn't have to shoot. Because he's got Kyrie and KD going to do all the shooting. So he can hide in the midst of those guys. And then Patty Mills on one side,

you got Steph Curry on another side. He is in the best position he could be in as a basketball player. Fear of failure. An underrated NBA skill or detriment depending on which side of it you're on. I think once you're afraid to fail,

they're talking about, oh, he might be back for the Celtics series if they play Celtics. We're taping this before the playing game. I'm like, that would be insane to bring him back. Guess what the Celtics would do? They would foul him the moment he comes in and try to put him on the line and try to get in his head. He's not going to be ready to do that.

He hasn't even played full contact basketball yet. That AAU mentality just drives me nuts. And that's why I say the Brooklyn's not going to win. Are they talented? Of course they are. But to me, if they win, it's a hit on basketball. Because it's going to tell young kids that they can take time off. They can just play half the games like Kyrie, you know,

and they can come and win a championship. That, to me, that would be the worst thing to happen. And I haven't seen it since I've been at the game at a high level, and I don't plan on seeing it. I just cannot see them being able to do it. And adding Ben Simmons without practice time, without the knowledge of all the teammates, and to think that's going to blend in

and lead you to win 16 games in the second season? Not bad. I wonder if all the stuff that's happened the last couple years is going to make teams a little more hesitant to turn their entire franchises over to one or two guys

or an agency or both. Because you think Clippers had bad luck. Right. But at the same time, they traded away an entire decade of stuff for these two guys. And you know, if, if they're, they're healthy, maybe it's a different conversation, but we're year three. It's not the Lakers. They got the titles in the bubble, but now they're in an absolute quagmire. But then you have the Philly situation of the Brooklyn situation. Um, you have the what houston did every year where they're trying to make hard and happy and i'm starting to wonder if you know i think teams gravitate to whatever the model is

that works and they're going to look at boston and phoenix and memphis and milwaukee as these models of like we have the star we, we have stability, we have consistency. We have guys that have been together for three, four, five, six years in some cases. Like in Boston's case, the best three guys in the team have been playing together since 2016, 17. And at some point that matters, as you know, because you were on a bunch of different teams. The teams that were probably the best teams you were on were the teams that at least stayed together a little bit. So maybe that comes back. I don't know.

What do you think? No, look, I hear you. And I think what's been lost in translation over the years is communication. It's like just because you're paying a guy a lot of money, he's going to be okay. He won't leave. He won't take less.

That is not true. If you love the game of basketball, the only thing that makes you happy is playing the game of basketball. And playing it at a high level, if you have expectations on you, you want to make sure you live up to those expectations. And so it's upon the

team to communicate with these guys and make sure that you keep them right. Like, we're going to work with this man. We're going to get this right. You got to be patient with us and kind of give them some ownership. I think sometimes teams just take it for granted and they lose that player. And all of a sudden now they're trying to grab them back. I.E. Ben Simmons. They heard those fans moaning and groaning all the time. I mean, with somebody in his

ear to just really help him, forget about the fact getting on him that he's not shooting, but to say, Ben, what's going on, man? What can we do to help you? Just constantly to show him the love and then those comments from Doc and Joel Embiid, they wouldn't hurt as much as they did.

Right. But you can tell, based on his reaction to what they said, told me that his relationship was not at a high level with those two guys. Well, plus they tried to trade them, though, too. And I think that was the biggest piece of it. That it was like, oh, no, no, we actually do like you. We just like, let's forget about the part when we were 90% down the road to trading you. But no, we're really glad you're here. I wonder like, you know, and I'm sure you're around it way more than I am now, but the phones and the whole concept of a team in some cases where in your era, in the eighties,

you guys were together all the time. You're flying. You didn't even have charters back then. And you spent an incredible amount of time together. You really got a feel for each other in a lot of different ways. And that eventually shifted over the next 40 years. But it does feel like every generation in the NBA had their one thing that was the big obstacle. Yours had the cocaine era. It either like all, it either ruined or, you know, tarnished or set back a lot of guys from the 80s.

A lot of guys. And then the 90s was money and these contracts that people are getting when they're 19 and 20 that they couldn't handle it. Then we move into like this generation and it's the social media

and it's being on the phones all the time. Even the commissioners talked about it, like really being worried about, you know, the state of mind of his players and the connection that they have to each other. And, you know, that's why I watch a team like Phoenix or like what Boston has now. And you're like, man, this is it. This is what it should look like. Yeah. You know what? They do lack focus.

They truly do lack focus yeah uh they truly do lack focus uh and the reason why they lack focus is because they got so much going on yeah when i came up man i didn't have anything going on i mean yeah the mobile phone was this heavy you don't want to carry that thing around all the time i mean it's like you know we didn't have cable to a high level when we were watching all these shows. We didn't have apps. You know, we weren't able to navigate computers. Twitter. There was so much info in front of them that they don't know how to balance it all. And throw in looking good, you know, with the jewelry and decorating the body and wearing the clothes.

I mean, there's so much in place for them now that is very difficult at times. And that's why the ones that you do see navigated, you look at them and you appreciate them. But yeah, the challenge is to continually communicate with these young kids, man. Let them know that, man, your career is really short. Just because you came into the league at 18

does not mean you're going to play longer. Once you start running that marathon, you don't know when your body's going to break down. I'm looking at James Harden right now. People are like, he's not playing well. I'm telling people, no, his body is failing him. He's 32, but his body is failing him. He's 32, but his body is probably

38. Yes. Because of how he handled himself. And that's on him. That's his personal preference. He's had a tremendous career. He's an unbelievable player. But you look back in the past, I mean, you look at the Isaiah Thomas in the world, 13 years. Magic Johnson, you know,

everybody in their low teams, you know? And so these guys think they're going to play long, and it's not always the case. And people have to communicate that to them and get them on course to say, if you want a title, then, man, you got to hurry up and go get it because it's not guaranteed to you. Yeah, I was thinking about that.

I was talking to a Celtics buddy of mine the other day about the time the Celtics almost traded for Iverson. And it was, I think, a year before the KG trade. And at one point, it seemed like it was going to happen, where it was like Al Jefferson, whatever contract, two first-round picks, and the

Celtics were really pushing it. They ended up sending him to Denver. And he had probably two more years in Denver than Denver flipped him. All of a sudden, his career was over. And you think like, man, what a what if for the Celtics where the door B was Kevin Garnett

and then this great five-year run they had, they only won one title. But door A was Iverson, who at the time, I would have been super excited. Like, oh my God, we got Allen Iverson. He averages 30 points a game. But going to what you said,

like was not a guy that took care of himself. And I do, we don't, we don't know what Harden does at night, but he looks different. He looks slower. His game has changed. I mean,

we have a general idea of what he does at night. Can't get around people. Can't get around people. Can't move laterally. That happens when you get older, but you can fight it off if you do the necessary things to stay in front of.

That's what I'm seeing with him right now. Yeah, and we've seen other guys like LeBron's year 19 and has figured out how to... Now he missed... Chris Paul as well. Chris Paul. Chris Paul who stopped eating meat. What is he? Plant-based, no sugar, no meat,

and became a different guy, which I'm sure Houston wishes that he had told him that he was going to do all that. What made you play so long? I mean, you're like a complete anomaly. It was like you and Parrish and Kareem. You played what, 18 years, something? 18 or 19 years?

I played 18 years. I played 17 NBA and I played, yeah. I played 17 NBA and 18 total. Jesus. So I played one year in Europe. Yeah, but that was an era when people didn't do that, though. They didn't do that. And I will say this, one, I'm blessed.

My mom's 92 years old. She looks like she's 60. Okay? So I'm not going to own all of it. But I think for me, I paid attention bill to my life as I grew up. And I just took a point to say, I'm not going to be like him. I'm not going to be like him. And those hymns were friends of mine. They were my brothers. And, and so, and they would remind me, don't be like me. And so I took that to heart, man. And I knew I was next to the last in line to make it right for my mom, who raised seven kids by herself.

And so I knew that it was on me when it became my time. And back then, you know, I mean, my first year in NBA, I made sixty five thousand dollars. I almost made more money on my shoe contract only than I did with my salary. And I said, I got to play a long time. And I just, man, I just took care of myself. That was it. I mean, I talked to people. I learned from people. I stayed away from people that were doing the wrong things. As you mentioned, that era was kind of drug infested. I've never put a drug in my body. And so those are the things I went for. And lo and behold, I was able to play that long. So it's no surprise to me how it lasted that long, because I thought I did all the correct things to do it. A lot of teammates, a lot of friends, they'll come up to me and say, man, I should have known you more.

I should have listened to you. Because they knew. Their careers got cut short because they did not adhere to detail. Justin Termini would say your career lasted that long because you didn't guard anybody. That too. I was very selective. Like I said, I met George Gerben

very young. I'm not going in that paint unless it's an opportunity for me to score. And the great Buck Williams made that known to me. And I love Buck to death. He's a great friend. He and his wife Mimi are great. But Buck laid me out one time, man, in the lane. I was in Seattle playing against Portland.

And I thought I got hit by a truck. And he just looked at me and said, I like you, but just don't come in here, man. Yeah, this is not the place for you. Don't venture down this road here. I said, okay. Well, for the people listening, Eddie's career started so long ago that it started in Kansas City. And you played, what, four years in Kansas City? Yeah, we moved aside.

Wait, Kansas City had a team? Yeah, Kansas City had a team. They're now the Sacramento Kings. Yeah, they had some tremendous players on that team. Reggie Theus was on that team, Mike Woodson, Larry Drew, Sal Thompson, the great Sam Lacy, Phil Ford

was one of my mentors when I first got in. He was good. He just got hurt. Phil Ford, I think, would have been in that Norm Nixon, Gus Williams,

Tiny Archibald, kind of that sphere. He would have been. He just couldn't stay healthy. Let me tell you a quick story with Phil Ford. And I want to mention Ernie Grunfeld's on that team

as well, Reggie King. But quick story with Phil Ford. We're playing a preseason game. Cotton Fitzsimmons is the coach. And I'm a rookie. You know, I'm just quiet, not saying nothing. And we're playing an exhibition game, and Phil had it going.

Like, and I was, like, in shock because I was like, man, I heard NBA players didn't play hard during the exhibition, which is a huge myth, right? And so he was just going off, and so Cotton called a play to end the game for him, and he missed the shot. And so his locker was next to mine, and we're sitting there, and I'm not kidding you, he was bawling. Like, he was crying.

I was like, this is the exhibition season. Right. But it was so impactful for me. It was like, here's this grown man I watched play, North Carolina. I mean, leading that full corner offense. Yeah. And it hurt him that bad to miss a shot in a preseason game. Mm. And I was moved by that, man.

Phil's one of my heroes, man, because he balanced me, man. I was like, okay, you need to take everything serious. That's right. Well, you also, that team, I think the 84-85, I have the poster. You did an All the Kingsmen poster, which is one of the funniest. Yeah, that's one of the best posters ever. It's one of the funniest, best, coolest. You guys have this giant statue behind you.

Reggie Theus, he has his mustache. He looks like the guy from Coming to America. The other crazy thing about your 80s career is there's another Eddie Johnson who's one of the biggest F-ups in the league. And when I was researching my book, there was this whole Sports Illustrated feature about like, I mean, when you talk about wheels coming off somebody's career,

he's like a nine and a half out of 10. So you're like, you become like the good Eddie Johnson. You're like, I'm not that Eddie Johnson. I'm the other Eddie Johnson. But they, I mean,

were you aware of this whole other Eddie Johnson situation? Yeah. I mean, I played against him a few years, and I had encounters with him. And, you know, he was always nice to me. He was good. Oh, yeah. John Drew was on that team.

Who just passed away. Yeah. And so I truly loved, like, competing against him. And, yeah, I mean, here's another guy with my name. But, you know, Edward Johnson is one of the most common names on the face of the earth. So my mom threw in Arnett as a middle name,

but I'm like, I'm not using Arnett Johnson. That doesn't even sound right to me. So I kept Edward with the Eddie, and yeah, I was on vacation in Hawaii with my family. And I had known of his problems and stuff like that, but never

to this level. And when I landed back in Phoenix, my phone was blowing up. I just thought, oh, he missed me. So I'm kind of ignoring it. And then Mike Woodson, who's one of my best friends in the entire world, finally got through. And he's like, are you okay?

I was like, yeah, what's wrong? You haven't heard? I'm like, nope. He said, well, I'm going to tell you one thing. You need to get somewhere safe. I'm like, what? I'm in the car driving and I turn on the radio and

that guy that's the host of Undisputed, I'm not going to say his name, it's not Shannon Sharp. Yeah. And he was going off on me. And he was letting me have it. The worst of the worst. Can't believe the Phoenix Suns hired him.

How did they not know? Just went crazy. Oh, my God. And so I'm like, in the car, I'm like, what? And what happened, my God. And so I'm like in the car. What? And what happened? My hometown paper, Chicago Tribune, they wrote an article. Well, they saw the story of Eddie Johnson got arrested for child molestation.

And so the guy that the editor at Tribune thought it was me. Oh, my God. I didn't know this story. Oh my God. Even though he saw Albert, 6'2", he changed the story. Oh, that's,

that can't be right. Eddie's 6'8". He changed it. Eddie Johnson, University of Illinois, 6'8", was arrested. But yeah, in the Tribune,

my hometown paper, like no one recognized him. Oh my God. And so, a lot of entities nationwide ran with him they like you know and they followed it so i'm all in the paper my website probably had a million hits in less than two hours okay it was ridiculous i mean it was like so i'm like okay i don't carry a weapon but maybe I need to go get one. Right. And so, you know, finally, I get somebody at Fox.

They were getting ready to run with a big story on me. What I heard, picture, everything. And somebody at Fox said, no, that's not Eddie. That's not him. Jesus. Good for Fox that they did not. Because I don't think I'd be working right now right seriously

I never knew that story I only knew all the cocaine issues he had in the early 80s and stuff oh no man it came right back to me and so you know a lot of newspapers had to recant their stories they had to rewrite and go through

it and all of that. Wow, that's horrible. But then it was all over the world. Yeah. If I research Chinese newspapers now or something like that, they still use my picture when they talk about him. And so, yeah, they paid a price. Don't get me wrong. I have a nice lawyer. They all paid a price. Don't, don't get me wrong. I have a nice lawyer.

They paid a price, all paid a price, but it wasn't fun going through that. It, you know, it just enhanced that the, the, the difference between he and I.

Yeah. And even today people still make that mistake. Oh, that's right. Well, I'm glad you told that story though, because I didn't know it. So I think a lot of people probably found out. Yeah, I was thinking about that team when, because John Drew passed away this week. When we started Grantland, which was I think 2011, I had found out, I got this email from a reader who's back when I live in Houston. John Drew is my cab driver. You remember John? And I'm like,

and I was always fascinated by John Drew, because if you look at his basketball reference, I mean, he was even more of a heat check guy than you were. He was like 26, 27 a night, some nights playing like 25 minutes a game. And he kind of flamed out and he had a lot of the same issues from, but anyway, we tried to do a story about him and John drew wouldn't talk. He's like, I don't like, just please respect my privacy. I don't want to,

I don't want to do. And that was what came out this week as well about like the stories were 30 years. He turned down interviews about what happened to him. I didn't even know he passed away. Yeah. Uh, Wayne Cooper passed away to X NBA player,

uh, yesterday. Right. I didn't even know that John Drew was unreal, man. He was one of the coolest. Dr. J was the coolest basketball player I'd ever seen, still to this day.

But John Drew was right there, man. John Drew, I mean, his uniform was always pristine, man. He'd just talk smack. And so, yeah, man, he was a tremendous player, man. He just talks smack. And so, yeah, man,

I, he was a tremendous player, man. We had great players, as you know, back then. And, and people need to know their stories, you know,

and not when they pass away either. And that's part of what I try to do. I try to just, you know, let people know how great players were back in my era, because they don't know. Well, Larry Bird used to love playing

against you. He taught me how to trash talk, man. He loved the scoring forwards who were more offense than defense in the Western Conference swing. Had a few of those guys. He loved that trip. Purvis Short, all those guys.

Purvis, Kiki. People don't realize how good Kiki was. Oh, my God. They don't understand how good Alex English was as a scorer. It was so many scores back then. That's why people say, man, you scored 19,000 points and you can make an all-star team. That's why.

You had Kiki. You had Purvis. You had Mark Aguirre. Ivis, you had Mark Aguirre. You had Larry Nance. You had Mike Mitchell down in San Antonio. You had James Worthy. That was why. And all

guys who had different types of games and weren't really three-point shooters, even you who were like a quote-unquote three-point shooter, you probably averaged like, what, one a game at your peak? One a game. Because you didn't take them. No. No. But now you'd are like a quote unquote three point shooter, you probably average like what one a game at your peak. One a game. Cause you didn't take them. No,

no. But now you'd be like, now you would have been, I think three a game. I think you would have taken like nine days a game. Oh my God. I'd be chucking it up, making about 40 mil,

50 mil. I don't know. How much does Duncan Robinson make? I'll make double. I'm thinking Joe, Joe Harris and Duncan Robinson are like 17, 18 a year. You're easily making that.

Yeah. You're 20 million a year. You're bouncing around. Um, all right. You got to go do your show. I want to, I want you to come back on when it really gets going with the sons.

Cause I think the sons, the sons are going to be around for a while in these playoffs. I've been trying to tell people, the Suns aren't losing. Unless somebody gets hurt, they're making the finals. You can make your Golden State case, your Memphis case, whatever, but we are going to see the Suns in the finals

unless there's an injury. We're good, man. We're good, Bill. We can stay healthy. I've never been around a team that has been this connected, ever. And I'm not just saying that loosely. I've watched these guys all year.

They are the real deal in regards to being a team. And it's a beautiful thing to see. Well, you got to ask Monty, like, deep down, kind of happy he didn't take that Lakers job, right? Now, he said it was never offered

because Phoenix just jumped the gun and they just offered him and they took him, but totally macro. Yeah, and they just offered him and they, they took them, but totally macro. Yeah. Yeah. And James Jones. But yeah, Monty, Monty, he knew what he wanted. He knew, he knew he wanted to be able to control his environment. He knew he wanted to be able to do all the things that he probably didn't do when he was in New Orleans, you know,

and he wanted that second chance with a group of guys, young guys that would listen to him and that's why he's here and they're listening to him he's like their dad dad granddad

all of the above and coach well I voted for him coach of the year so I did I did have one positive at least you did that at least I did that

alright I'm popping on your show at some point but I'm glad we did this I'm bringing you back later in the playoffs good to see you, Eddie Johnson. Appreciate it.

Thank you. All right. That's it for the podcast. Thanks to Wilds. Thanks to Eddie Johnson. Don't forget to check out the Prestige TV podcast. If you like winning time, we have a really good episode that's going up.

Rewatchable is coming on Monday as well. Enjoy the weekend. I will see you on Sunday night. On the wayside On the Bruce I never was And I don't have To ever forget