The Bill Simmons Podcast - The Wemby Weekend, Scoot vs. Dame, UFC 290, and Bill’s Big Vegas Weekend With Ryen Russillo

Episode Date: July 10, 2023

The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Ryen Russillo to discuss a turbulent weekend for Victor Wembanyama in his NBA Summer League debut, why Scoot Henderson is definitely the real deal, Portland's Damian Lillard conundrum, Jabari Smith Jr.'s encouraging performances, Chet Holmgren's return, Gregg Popovich's five-year extension, in-season NBA tournament thoughts, Bill's report from UFC 290 in Las Vegas, and more! Host: Bill Simmons Guest: Ryen Russillo Producer: Kyle Crichton Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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First, our friends from Pro Gym. All right, we're taping this late. It is 10.15 Pacific time, Sunday night. I just flew back from Vegas. I was there Friday, Saturday, and Sunday for Summer League and UFC. Ryan Rosillo is here. So much to discuss. Let's start with Wemba Diama. He was written off Friday night. He was bust.

He was Greg Oden, LaRue Martin, Sean Bradley, pick a bust. It was where we were headed. Everybody was freaking out. It was dark. I can give you some of the stories of being in the building for that one. And then Sunday, I can't believe it,

48 hours later, a generational, but the possible superstar actually looked pretty good. So I'm going to give everyone some settle down juice. I have a lot of Wemby thoughts, but what did you see in the two days? Well, he was bad in the first game, but it's just tough when the audience has been hearing about this guy. And let's face it, most people have not watched him. And so their first impression of the best prospect since LeBron and the guy that's potentially going to do things on the floor that we've never seen before, that size sucks, then it's hard to tell. And was nervous. Right. And it's hard to tell the audience, no, no, you're wrong. But I mean, I was, I was watching the game with somebody and they were like, seriously, dude. And I, I like right back to them. I was like, are you serious? Like you've, you've got it. You've, you've figured it out. You already know who this guy's going to be. And then of course he was terrific today. So I'm, I'm way more interested in your perspective because you were in the building, you were around it all. So just go. Yeah, we were under the basket for the Friday game and he was definitely nervous. There was no question. And it was one of those things that the crowd was so fired up. Everybody was there five, six hours early. The crowd was so fired up to see him.

And it felt, you know, it was like the LeBron scoring record, like that kind of game. A lot of casuals, but a lot of excitement. But then all the diehard people and they were just like, let's see it. And then he comes out, he's seven foot five. He's just staggering to look at, staggering to watch, just compared to all the other people. And then he came out and he wasn't that good. And it looked like he didn't really know where he was and he was nervous and he just had no feel for anything. And this was coming off the game before Scoot Henderson played before he got hurt.

And he just looked awesome. And I can't wait to talk to you about Scoot. But so you watch Scoot and then you watch Wemby and he looks like, you know, like a baby deer for, and then it just got worse. He couldn't make a shot. It's getting banged around. There's this ridiculous foul rule in summer league where you just get to just keep fouling people and it's fine. So teams are actually incentivized to foul. And the Charlotte coaches were telling their guys, just bang them, push them. So he's just getting mauled and it just couldn't have gone worse. And people were bummed out. And it really was the equivalent of like, the only way I can compare it to is like your high school has this huge, awesome basketball game against like somebody and everybody's there early and all fired up. And from the first moment, it just goes wrong.

So then the rest of the weekend, people are like, what's the deal with this dude? Come back today, same pact, not the same kind of energy, a little more nervous. And he seemed a little nervous in the second game too, but it started to come. And I saw enough that made me think, I've

definitely never seen anything like this before. I want to get into a lot of the, like just what the right use of him is. The question I have for you, we were just sitting there for both games going, why do they think this guy's a forward? Like, why do they think he's a perimeter guy? The perimeter guy is cool, but he's seven foot five. He was six, seven, eight inches taller than anyone guarding him. You want him around the rim. I want him near the rim, around the rim. I want him getting putbacks and dunks and just using his size. And it just doesn't seem like he wants to be that yet. And the question for me over the next couple of years is they're going to gradually, he's going to start gradually moving closer to the basket while keeping the perimeter stuff.

But what is the timetable for that? How much weight does he have to gain? Things like that. But did you notice, like, it just seems like he's so intent on being like Kevin Durant, basically, and it feels like they're throwing away his best advantage, which is the size. Okay, so there's a lot there. Let's just start with the games. The games are tough to watch, they're they're a tough watch and just the way they're constructed with the rosters these

guys are fighting for their lives so whether champagny is out there who just got a nice deal because he proved himself like he wants to get going you know blake wesley is a guy that was taken in the first round wasn't in college very long i'm not a not a huge fan. He's a great athlete. And so he's trying to prove himself and then Bronham, who I like better. Wait, hold on. Blake Wesley, I don't think he went into this weekend going, I'm here to make Wemby look awesome. I don't think that was on his agenda.

I think actually in one of the sideline interviews that he did, he said that. And then Barlow gets going a bit and then there's another big center, the kid from Alabama. So all these guys are trying to figure out, like, how do I survive? So it's not set up for Wemba Nyama to be used in a way.

Like, when I'm watching him, I'm going, I can't wait when he's actually playing with the NBA guys with the Spurs because they're going to run really good stuff. And they're going to be smart. And point guards and the whole thing. And there's going to be more space. But to the power forward, small forward thing, which I think is a really good point, is Durant's the best I've ever seen for being that big and still being able to dribble in traffic. It's just the physics of it. If you're that big and you're going to try to dribble in traffic, it's usually not going to work out. And I thought in the first game, he was like,

hey, all right, let me just show you guys what I'm about here. And he would just put it on the floor, face up, and try to attack like he was a guard. And on top of the fouling thing where everybody can just foul, it just looked bad, and he looked weak, and he's falling down all the time. But I think that was part of him. I think in a cool way, especially in the the second game he was really up for the moment like he knew that he was the attraction and i i don't i didn't really look at it as nervous you were there so you know better than me but i thought it was almost a guy going i need to put on a bit

of a show here for these people which i kind of liked yeah but at 7-5 to consistently attack off the dribble again that's the attraction of him that it's something we've never seen but it doesn't really happen right well the the dribbling stuff especially in the first game like even jaylen brown was like wow man i don't know if that was a good idea. That's been moved that time into traffic for the eighth time. He, I sent you a video because this happened, I think 25 times where they're inbounding either after a timeout or loose ball or whatever. And he's down on the low block with the guy behind him. Who's thinking, I really hope they don't just lob it up to him because he's five feet away from the basket

and he can just spin and score. And then every single time, every single time, he would come back up and set a pick for the guy at the three-point line. And then they would give him the ball 25 feet from the basket. And we're watching it going, the dude's 7'5". Give him the ball six feet from the basket. And you even saw in the second game today,

he was a little more around the basket and And you even saw in the second game today, they were, he was a little more around the basket and you could see the way teams were panicking. Like if he had the ball within 10 feet, it was just complete chaos defensively. Like, holy shit. Like, Oh my God,

they're figuring out. He saw, he had a dunk Priscilla in the, uh, first half of the second game. Wait, where it looked like it was going badly again. Like my son was like, does Wemby suck?

My son doesn't know anything. He's like, does Wemby suck? I'm like, no, no, just wait, just wait. And then he had this little explosion of plays, which Windhorst was saying, because Windhorst watched him a lot. He said he'd lay low, lay low, lay low. And then all of a sudden he would have these five minutes that were just amazing. But he had this little run and he had this dunk where he was where people stand on the foul line when they're on the side, when they're watching a free throw,

like where you're the rebounder. And he was there and he just dunked over somebody from the spot. And that was the moment when everybody was like, wait, what just happened? I've never seen anybody dunk like that just easily where he reached and you could see his reach. There's some stuff he's going to figure out with his length and being able to do like the Dr. J scoop shot and shit like that. And like just being able to flip and go baseline backboard stuff. I thought that stuff was way more interesting to me than, uh, than him just trying to beat people off the dribble 25 feet away. The one thing we saw was, did you notice some of the passing? Like he definitely has vision. He's comfortable. Um, he's a good teammate. I thought he, even though he lost his confidence, I thought he was like very supportive. He was locked in even on the bench. Um, I, I didn't

see anything that made me think this guy's not going to be great. I think the mistake for Sola was some of the hype, especially coming from ESPN. Like when Woj had that thing where they were, he was like this guy, people think he could be the best player in the league in three years. And this guy could be one of the best players in the league right away. Like to me,

that's insane. That's not happening yet. This is going to take a couple of years. He's really skinny. You could see some of the bangers on Portland and on Houston the other game were just they were like, we can push this guy around. Charlotte, yeah.

Oh, Charlotte, yeah. This is going to take a couple years physically for him. Well, I think all the hype about him being a prospect is just that what it could be. The ceiling of it. Okay.

So I don't have a problem with anybody going to absurd lengths on the hype of what he could be. And there's actually, honestly, Bill, he could have sucked again today. And I wouldn't have done a pod or at least I wouldn't have been like, well, man, there's some real questions here. Okay. Yeah. Like I just, there's almost nothing that can happen in these games where I start thinking I know everything about a guy who's this young. And I watched the games in France. I saw him do shit. And those games weren't terrible games. That was a good league. It's not the best non-NBA league,

but it's still really good and it's really competitive. So what I loved was in the second game, there was a stretch. They tried to get him entry pass. It wasn't really on the block. I mean, as far as setting him up on the post, nobody really plays that way anymore. So to expect him to just be on the block and get these deep catches, even though it's an advantage, you know, good luck finding anybody can throw an entry pass in this league. Forget the summer. Look, even even the NBA. All right.

So we're talking summer league and they try to throw him an entry pass where he's like past the right or left block extended, going right to left on the TV screen. And, you know, it looks like it's a turnover, like he was too weak, but it was just a shitty pass. Like when you delay your entry pass and the defender can see it coming, it puts the recipient of the pass in a brutal spot because he's actually at the disadvantage

to the defensive player. So that happened immediately, and then it gets off to this at the disadvantage to the defensive player. So that happened immediately. And then it gets off to this other slow start in the second game. And then he went between his legs right to left and hit that pull-up jumper. And it felt like in that moment, he's like, all right, enough of this shit. And he scored like nine straight points. And he was doing all sorts of different stuff. The finishing with the left hand.

I completely agree on the passing. There was also stuff where he wasn't scoring, where you're watching and guys are getting lost left and right on screens because hell, the offensive team doesn't really even know what they're supposed to be doing sometimes. So guys will get lost because they're expecting you to do something a certain way. And what I like from Wenbanyama is that he's really smart on top of everything else. All the physical gifts is that you could see that as guys were getting kind of caught in the wash and maybe somebody would run to the corner and they would get lost in this, not even a switch,

just confusion. He always kind of knew what he was supposed to be doing. So, you know, I've gone to these games. And especially defensively too. I always felt like, that's what I mean.

Yeah. Yeah. He was floating around offensively, you know, he's setting screens, but he's playing with guys that aren't going to make them better. But yeah, I think the size is crazy.

And I, we're watching him better. But yeah, I think the size is crazy. And we're watching him at like what, like a two out of 10 for what he's going to be defensively. Because there's some stuff like some help defense stuff that you see some of the best players in the league, like somebody like Jaron Jackson. If somebody's driving to the basket, even though if he's in the corner, Robert Williams is another good one at this,

where they can fly from the corner to try to challenge at the rim. And I think he's going to figure that stuff out. The size is crazy. I mean, I just can't over-exaggerate how insane it is to see him. Like there was one moment when he's, he's sitting on the scores table waiting to come in

and he was as tall as the ref, but he was sitting. And you see shit like that and you're like, what is this going to be? So I think he's going to end up being some hybrid of he'll be able to use his size, but then he could also play on the perimeter. And he's just like this toy that we've never seen before. I didn't see anything from these two games that didn't make me think he had a chance to be all-time. Now, I don't know whether that's

all time top 30 or all time top 40, but he's just, you know, he's coordinated. He knows how to play basketball. He's got this incredible size and a real feel for basketball. So I was not deterred by anything. Here's what worried me though. There was at least four times in the two games where I thought he got hurt or was going to get hurt because he's so big. You see guys going for loose balls. They're going to his legs. He's so tall. He kind of can't get out of the way of some of those.

Then there was another one when he dove to the... In the first half, he dove. He got tripped basically doing a spin move. He landed on his elbow. And it's just like, when you land at seven foot five, like you're landing, it's not like you can kind of brace for the fall. And that was my fear of leaving the weekend. Like I have no doubt in the potential, but I just really worry about him staying healthy over the course of a season.

There's so many different ways that can go wrong when you're that size. And we've seen it with other guys that size. Well, I've been on this forever. Just, I don't know that guys are supposed to move at this size. And I'd be shocked if he doesn't have a significant injury in the first couple of years, but you would still take him. It's the Durant con. You 100% would take him. The Portland guy today stepped on his foot on the three he took, right? It's just going to be moments like that the whole season. Ooh. You say, whereas Scoot, I just feel like it would be really

hard for him to get hurt. Right. And then, of course, Scoot gets hurt. And then, of course, Scoot gets hurt. Right. But, you know, the point I would make with Durant is, what are we talking, like, four major injuries? And if you knew that, you would still take him number one, based on who he is. So, I'd expect that that injury is happening, but there's nothing in the Summer League games that was knew that, you would still take him number one based on who he is.

I'd expect that that injury is happening, but there's nothing in the summer league games that was going to make me go, oh my god, this guy isn't that good. I don't blame people for really, let's face it, a lot of people, it's the first time they saw him and they see a big dude who's falling down all over the place missing every single shot, but he was so good in the second game. I think that's really what it is about him. When you watched him the last couple of years, you go, wait, he has a step back three. Wait, he goes between his legs and kind of does the hardened sidestep three. Wait, he finishes lefty on drives. Oh, wait, block crazy he blocks it keeps the ball and goes the

length of the court makes like a great pass that is why he is considered so special because it's a combination of things we've never seen in a body that's never really been like this playing this style so i just wait can i i've just been to enough summer league games where I don't, like I rarely will leave the place going. Okay. I know exactly who this guy is or is certainly with somebody who's 19 and it hasn't even started his NBA career. You listed all those things.

Like he does this, he does this, he does this. The one thing I didn't really fully realize until I was watching in person, he's playing with people that don't even know how to do this. But when he sets that pick and if both defenders, even for a split second, kind of go with the dribbler and then he gets the ball back, like foul line or top of the key, you know, normally somebody makes that like a bam out of

bio, the guys go and he gets a wide open shot and he makes it with Wemby. He doesn't even necessarily need to be wide open, right? That his guy can can go half a step too far and come back and kind of be in his zone, but he's so fucking tall, just shoot over him anyway. And it seems like he likes to pick and pop stuff the most. So if I was San Antonio, just immediately, I'd really want to figure out who is my point guard to play with this guy? Who is my guy to just work off him? And that almost like a Tony Parker or like Jamal Murray, how he plays with Jokic. I'd be spending the next three years. Like, who is this guy? Who do we target? Is this

a free agent? Is this somebody we draft? Is this somebody we trade for? Who is it? Because that play is going to be unstoppable the same way Yoko Jumori was. Maybe Dame. He has a lot of respect for organization. I'm glad that we're both pointing out that nobody is allowed to overreact with Summer League. I had Celtic fans in my life just going nuts about Jordan Walsh, who I really like.

But he had the best possible first game. And then, of course, today he wasn't as good. But Summer League, the yo-yo of it. I think the thing that I love about Summer League is especially when you see the second-year guys come in. Jabari Smith just looks fantastic. He just looks like he's better. He's worked at stuff.

He was super confident. And that was somebody who was like, oh, I see it. Whereas then you see Jaden Ivey in the Pistons and you're like, ugh. I'm not panicking, but I kind of wish he would have jumped up a notch. Then you see somebody like Cason Wallace on OKC. It's like, yeah, it's summer. Don't overreact. But this guy looks great.

He's got a spirit to him. He tries his ass off. This guy makes sense for me with OKC. So you can learn things. You try not to overreact. I know you've probably been to more Summer League games than anyone I know. You take little glimpses and pieces,

but you also just be careful. We were at the Kedrick Brown. What was Kedrick Brown? What was the year of Kedrick Brown? Was that the 01? Kedrick Brown? Ha ha ha. Was that the 01? The 01 summer league? Or 02?

One of those Kedrick Browns. He was the MVP of summer league. Oh, Kedrick Brown. It's like, all right. Pump the brakes. Look, when there's a guy who I think sucks and then sucks in summer league, I'm like, hey, he still sucks. You know, there's some third year guys that were first

rounders that haven't done anything book night also book night and book night book nights at the top of my i think i'm worried list well that we went to the we went to the game friday they're they're running offense for him trying to get him going and and he was like all the shots were there and they just weren't going in and this is year three of up still not going in right like i'd rather see pajemski not go three for 16 but okay whatever um not not a huge deal uh like there's there's been some guys in the past where i just didn't like him before the draft and then i I'd watch them in Summer League, and they weren't good. And I was like, all right, and there's plenty of guys that I did or didn't like that I'd watch in Summer League, and they'd be the opposite.

And maybe Summer League wasn't lying to you all that much. I just thought with Wimbanyama, predictably, because you didn't watch a TV broadcast. And they did nothing wrong, but they're coming back from commercial with Wimbanyama packages in the first game where it was like, look at this rebound, you know, because that's what they were selling. The audience is tuning in unless you're a complete summer league dork, which there's a few people out there. But the bigger audience is, OK, what's this guy's deal? Let me let me check it out. And I thought ESPN was was doing the right thing the entire time by coming back showing you anything they could put together.

Here's 60 seconds on the guy that you're paying attention to. It was hard to find the good stuff. They were probably stretching a bit. Then, of course, in the second game, they didn't have a lot. I'm glad you brought up Jabari because seeing him be more aggressive, having a little bit more dribbling, being the primary

guy, it was awesome, man. I was semi-devastated because I do feel like if the Celts had pushed hard for the Jalen for Jabari at number four, some version of that, that was probably the most logical Jalen trade if they don't want to pay him the money. And by the way, they still haven't paid them the money, and it's like July 10th now.

I don't know what's going on there. But I thought Jabari, man, you think about last year, can you think of a worst team he could have been on for him? Like who's looking out for him? Auburn the year before it. Good point. Wait, let's take a break. I have a lot more Wemby stuff.

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And if you don't want to grow a mustache, you can still walk or run 60 kilometers, host an event, or set your own goal and mow your own way. Do great things this November. Sign up now. Just search Movember. So one thing I was thinking when we were, especially Friday night, when there was like a buzz that was just crazy for a fucking summer league game,

how many guys have come into the league that are just an attraction like this? And I knew this was coming. I'm not breaking new ground with this comment, but this is the first... come into the league that are just an attraction like this. And I knew, I knew this was coming. I'm not breaking new ground with this comment, but this is the first, you know, it's like Otani in baseball. Otani has hit the point in baseball where it's like, Oh, Otani's in Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Are we going like, we have to see this person. That's what I did, by the way. Like I take the Wimbledon Yama game and I went to Dodger Stadium to watch a toning. How can you not? We don't know if this is happening again.

I think Rookie Zion or whenever his rookie season actually was, I think he had some of this. Wemby's, for me, this is a really short list of when he's in your town, if he's healthy, you kind of have

to go see it. You know, I remember like going way back with the, uh, with using my dad's tickets for the Celtics when I was growing up and high in college and after college and living in Boston, I'd be like, Dikembe Mutombo is coming to town. I can't wait to see him. You know, like this is how low the bar is for like, Oh my God, the Admiral is coming in. Well, the Admiral is one thing, but like,

imagine has anyone ever gone to a game just because of Mutombo? Well, he, but he was the seven foot three shop walking rookie. I was like, I want to see it. Manu Paul, the first time he came in,

there's been these guys who are like, I want to see this. But Wendy, I think this really might be since maybe Durant. And Durant, that was such a weird season for him. He was playing shooting guard. The team sucked. I don't know.

I can't remember the last time there's going to be, everyone's going to want to go see this when he's in your town. So in some ways, I don't feel like the hype is unwarranted. No, but him being international adds to it. Because Zion wants a good call. I couldn't wait to see Zion and it was like,

okay, this is going to be awesome. But we'd seen it. We'd already seen it. Those of us, it wasn't hard to find him playing in his freshman year and then, you know, all the stuff of whether he should come back

when he messed up his ankle a little bit. And, you know, I just fell in love with the guy because he was like, what do you mean? Like not play against UNC? You know, not, not want to,

like, this is why I came here. And I just loved it because it felt like so many people didn't want him to play. And the fact that that team didn't do more in the tournament's probably still crazy. But the unknown of this adds to it. He has the advantage of the attraction because it still feels so unknown in comparison to the other guys.

So it's really all the way back to LeBron. I mean, when he shoots a three, it's kind of stunning every time because he's so tall. Tall guys just don't shoot threes. Yao Ming was never like, here, do a little pick and pop. I'll shoot my 25 footer. Nobody this size just this easily gets shots off.

I liked the way he carried himself. He seemed like a great teammate. Um, I liked that he fought through that first game and he had the weird Britney Spears thing the night before. It's just chuck up Friday to like some weird shit happened. If it's in you, you got to respond.

Because Friday, I did have conversations where I was like, you know what? If you saw Kareem at this age, or you saw, I don't know, pick any great 19 year old player. You'd see the glimpses if you saw them in a situation like this.

And with Wemby on that Friday, it was just hard to see. But then I started thinking about it after. I'm like, oh, well, he did do that. Brandon Miller went to shoot that three and Wemby just jumped out and blocked it. And everybody was like, wait, what just happened? Because he was six feet away.

He still did like six things in this game that he absolutely sucked that I was kind of surprised or stunned by. I thought that was a good sign. Let me ask you this. Did you watch the first game going, why did I just get

in line with everybody else and not challenge any of this stuff? Were you starting to doubt your own... Go ahead. I think you and I both have the... If the zag is there, we're going to at least, you know, kick the tires on it. Take it out for a cup of coffee.

Because in person, he's just super skinny. Like skinny to the point... Each team they played had that typical 6'9 summer league guy who has no offensive game like the guy on the blazers today i can't remember his name he had six fouls and one rebound in the fourth quarter um bodgy something like that yeah yeah the ball all these all these teams have two guys like that and these guys are like i'm gonna fucking kill somebody to make an nba team what

do i need to do and all of them were like, oh, this Wemby guy is 210 pounds. I'm just going to shove around, throw elbows, push them, do everything I can. So you see how he was handling that. He really was just getting shoved around. So then you start thinking, all right, well, what happens when, I don't know, he's playing Jalen Williams, the forward Jalen Williams on OKC, Just guys like that. These 6'6", really strong guys. The P.J. Tuckers. When those guys are slamming into his body, what's going to happen?

But he'll be fine. He'll figure it out. He's too smart. You can see his intelligence already. Right. The guy you're describing also is Najee, the first-round pick this year, who I actually ended up really liking, who was on Charlotte,

and he didn't play a ton of minutes, but his entire thing is just, I need to come into the game and just wreck everyone. And he's built like an Adonis. Right, right. Although he did get dunked on pretty good one of the other games. But, yeah, look, I mean,

if we have to do it this way, you know, in five years, do you go, huh? Like, oh, he's pretty good. But like, he wasn't that. I guess you would start to say, like, it was all it was this potpourri of all of these things. But it was just really cool because he was so big and could do all these things. But he never really put it all together. I just I don't know how you could ever, right. I just don't know how you could ever write anybody off that is this size and has these skills. It's just like, okay, so do you just mean like everybody

that does this for a living that's been watching this guy for like three or four years that they're just all wrong? Um, you know, I think that's always kind of smart to challenge yourself every now and then to be like, wait, do I need to watch this guy as if I don't think he's always kind of smart to challenge yourself every now and then to be like wait do I need to watch this guy as if I don't think he's going to be any good if I had one sentence if this podcast were one sentence it would be I don't really care what he looked like in either of these games

I just wouldn't let's get to the league let's get to the season and see how it looks at game 40 I left it a little more frustrated with how he was used. That was my only thing. Where I just felt like he was too far away

from the basket too much. And then defensively, look, the Spurs, I don't know if they'll do this, but if Spolstra was his coach, he would just play a zone and put him in the middle. He's so fucking tall.

He's like covering forwards in the corner. It's like, just put him around. Everyone was so terrified to go at him. You know, and I think they'll get there eventually. And then he's going to pick up, he'll have like, he'll pick up his version of a jump hook.

He'll have his little drop step. He'll have his Dr. J scoop thing. And he'll get to the point when he's seven feet from the basket, he'll be able to turn and just immediately get near the rim. And then if he misses, he could just jam it back in, which he did today a couple times. So I think if you're the other team, you're excited when he's 25 feet away. It's like, great.

Knock yourself out, dude. Keep firing. When he's closer to the basket, I'm scared. And if he's protecting the basket versus on the corner, I'm super happy. Can we talk about Scoot? Yeah, because you know who went at Wimbanyama? Not this week, but when they played in that U.S.

showcase thing in Vegas, like the first game when they had the back-to-back games, because Scoot actually didn't play in the second one. Scoot, that was when I fell in love with Scoot, is that Wimbanyama was the headline for that. It wasn't the Chet matchup. It was later. And Scoot, you know, got him a couple times. Granted, Wimbanyama blocked him a couple times,

and that's when I fell in love with him, and I fell in love with him all over again in that first quarter. I fucking love him. So, yeah, you and I are probably, we're in the front row. So my plane was late and we missed the first half. Got in for the second half and he played, I don't know, 10 minutes before he got hurt. I only needed to see four.

He's going to be a fucking star. Like you could, people can cut this out. They can put it with like Titanic music five years from now. I'm going to be a fucking star. People can cut this out. They can put it with Titanic music five years from now. I'm going to be right. This guy is a star. He fucking has it. I will fight you to the death if you disagree with me. He has it.

He just has it. I've been watching basketball my whole life. I know who has it and who doesn't. He fucking has it. He can do two things that you can see right away in four minutes. He can go by anyone he wants. He's downhill all the time, all the time. The other guys, the defenders are terrified of him. He can go right by you. He can go left by you. It doesn't matter. He's going by you. He's got speed. He's got athleticism. He's strong enough to bounce against big guys. I haven't seen anybody this young

be able to do this since Rose and Westbrook. Those are the last two guys that had this kind of athleticism and ferocity that they play with. He fucking carries himself like an alpha. He can already run NBA sets and he's running pick and rolls and stuff. This guy is a star

and the Blazers have to trade Dame. Get him the fuck out of there. Start the new era. This is, this is, they hit the jackpot. Two teams passed on this guy. One couldn't pass on them because Wemby Yama was there.

But the Charlotte thing is going to live in infamy. I don't think Brandon Miller is going to be a bust. But this is going to haunt them. I'm just, I'm saying it now. I'm not even predicting it. This is going to be a disaster for Charlotte.

If you're a Charlotte fan, I was talking to Tate all weekend, he's a big Charlotte fan, he's fucking devastated. Scoot's going to be a guy. He just is. And we knew this, and they didn't take him. Well, I don't think Brandon Miller... Look, if Brandon Miller is still really good, and I don't care about his shooting numbers in these two games, he'll be fine if he ends up being really good it's not

devastating it's just that I like what you said about scoop because when I'd watch it and you try to talk about it and you'd be like okay what can you do and be like all right he does this a little bit but he also even though he's so aggressive with the ball he'll get it out like he'll be like all right no no like We have an advantage. We have a three on two. I don't need to just have the ball and cross half court with it. I'm thinking ahead. I'm one to attack all the time in transition.

It's like, okay, but he doesn't shoot it well enough. People felt like this past year wasn't as good as the year before. The team was better, by the way, the year before. But the it thing with him, you know, when I said, I was like, there's just some juice to him. When you watch it, you go, holy shit. And the last guy for me,

because I didn't really see it in college with Anthony Edwards. I knew athletically how special he was, but that team wasn't very good. He took a million bad shots. You know, later on, they kind of replay the results where it's like he knew how bad the team was,

almost like the Patrick Mahomes thing where you're like, why did you make some of those throws at Texas Tech? And it's like, well, because I knew we were going to give up 60. So I just, I had to raise my level of risk. And I was like, oh, Jesus, I wish I had known that before you came out of the draft because it shows how smart you are. And with Anthony Edwards at Georgia, I was like, okay, like I get what, but I just wish he was a little bit better at the basketball stuff.

And then once he got to the league and you saw him, grant it's not the same position you're talking about rose westbrook clearly but there was just an element to him as edwards developed where you're like now this guy kind of has all the stuff you want in a body and athleticism but also an attitude and there's an immediate impact on the game when scooters out there like his attitude plays and about this he's a fucking alpha he's an alpha he owned the court you would i i don't know what his workout regimen is but he he he's built like a 30 year old and he carries himself like a 30 year old i don't understand it like my son like, I don't understand how he's only four years older than I am. And I was like, I don't understand it either. We were just like in awe of him.

He's so comfortable and he's just, his ability to, whenever he wants, go by whoever is guarding him is the single most precious skill you could have as an offensive player. If you can go by whoever you want, everything else is going to be easy. And it's like, oh, he can't shoot well enough yet? Cool. Check with him in three years because we know what his work ethic is. He's going to put it in. And Portland's set, and this goes back to the damn thing, with Simonson, Sharp, and

Scoot, I have my guards, which is why the Miami package is so stupid. They don't need fucking Tyler Hero. That would be idiotic. What do they need him for? So if they're going to trade him, to me, I need to get Towns back. I don't even know if I necessarily want Towns, but I need to get Towns back.

I need to get Jalen Brown. I need to get Brandon Ingram. Or Paul George, if you're also throwing me picks and that's really it because I hit the, I hit the lottery with this dude. This guy fell to us at three. This is like the reverse. He's not gonna be as good as Jordan, but it's just funny. Like Jordan, not as good as Jordan. Have this Kyle, have this be the breakup video. No, it's just funny that Jordan goes to three. Portland doesn't take him. And then all these years later,

Jordan throws them back a solid. He's like, here, here's Scoot Henderson. This guy's going to be your franchise guy for 15 years. I think it's so stupid that he didn't go second. I just can't get over it. And again, I liked Miller, but it was a classic Rosillo. I forgot you were

out here a couple of times. He's good, but I didn't feel like he was special. And I don't really know what the comp is. And please, I'm not shitting on him. I'm not saying that. I'm just like, if you're going to pass on Scoot, you better feel like this guy you're taking is going to be like a multiple NBA guy. That's the only recourse. And if your other reason is we already have LaMelo Ball, then you should quit your job. Because Scoot is going to be better than LaMelo Ball. And that's it. It's a fucking fact.

Sorry I'm swearing so much. I got off a plane. I'm a little haggard. Coming back for a 50-year-plus Simmons off a Vegas bender. Swearing up a storm. I know. I'm sorry. I apologize for my language.

I was fired up about the scoot thing. I felt so vindicated. It was like you and me and five other people, and we were just like, how are you guys missing this? I was having those moments. those moments just watching the game, and I'm just full of joy watching him do stuff where I go, do you not see that this kid already does this stuff? This is, you know, look, the Chris Paul comp,

he's more physically gifted, as good as an athlete as Chris Paul was at a young age um but there's some real like okay i'm actually going to do this to you i'm going to set you up this way and then i'm going to come around the screen and you're going to play it this way but i'm actually going to wait and then he's doing some stuff where he gets in the lane which just shows that because he's smaller and has to figure out stuff like again kairi's still the greatest i've ever seen i think the game has ever seen a small player finishing at the rim because he just changes the angle

so many times. But Scoot's been doing some stuff where he delays, like he goes into it, like, okay, so I'm timing you off for the first move into the second move.

And then the second move doesn't come. And then everybody's... Now, granted, he's making summer league guys look terrible with it. But it's just some of this little stuff that he's already figured out that I'm going, this is special. Well, and he also, he's just a badass. It was right on our basket and it was right. I don't know if this was the play where he got hurt,

but he has a breakaway on the right side and Jabari Smith's coming and he kind of sees Jabari and he's like, all right, athlete versus athlete. Let's fucking go, dude. And he goes right to the basket on him. And Jabari is like, no, I'm not letting you have this. Cause he was going to dunk on him and fouls him hard. He took the hit and went in the basket support and then kind of came back and talk some shit. But it was just, it was honestly what the Rose Westbrook were the two guys I was thinking of. And he's much more filled out than he's almost got Westbrook's body with the way Rose played in,

in oh nine. But I also think he's more sophisticated than Rose was as a basketball player. So there's a little Chris Paul in there. I, I can't throw enough great guards out to compare this guy. I'm just like, I'm telling you, I only need to see four minutes.

I'm like, I'm good. I bet i've seen everything i need to see okay would you say that no one is prime derrick rose getting past guys though because i don't know that i have well that but that's that's what it reminded me of though. Really? Wow. You saw it in person. I'm just saying like when I saw Rose in person. He's so easily, he's so easily can go either way past somebody. Yeah, you're right. And that's like, how many guys have been like that?

How many guards? That's like the, for me, that's like the number one skill I want for, I either want, you have to be a lights out shooter like Durant was, or you just have to be a lights-out shooter like Durant was or you just have to be able to go by anybody. But with him, the key thing is that he's

strong enough to bounce off these dudes and be durable. I don't know what happened with the shoulder injury if they're just being super careful. Yeah, that's probably it, especially after they had the Sharp injury last year with Labrum and everything they had to deal with. And by the way, Sharp I thought was terrific in the first game. Wasn't as good in the second game but like just the fact that that

first game kind of had that second year vibe to it that javaris you know had here where i think that's more positive than i'd be frustrated about i'm missing shots in the second game but going back to some of the g league stuff with scoot like i remember there was this one game where they kind of figured out all right well we have to figure, like we have to trap him on the first thing. You know, let's send him sideline and trap him. And he saw what was going to happen, that they were going to play it differently on this high screen and roll,

because they were kind of doing it as he was bringing the ball in transition. So it wasn't like a straight, hey, everybody stop, get to your spot, bring the screener up from the paint and then run it. It was something that was happening quicker before everybody kind of got settled. And so they thought they him like he was just he was going to be trapped because there's two guys and he could already tell what their adjustment was and he just kept going like

he didn't really use the screen and then went past two guys and now it's on because he's in the paint and the defenders are going like wait how is he already in here you guys were supposed to trap him over there and he saw and that's the kind of stuff when you watch you go, I can't, I can't believe he's already figured the game out to this kind of level. Yeah. It is one of those things where if it turns out he's 27, I'm not going to be like shocked. If, if there's a whole, like he's, it's like watching the little league kid.

It's like the Cody Webster, little league world series with these kids that just like, how, wait, how are you this age? LeBron was like this when LeBron was 18, 19. You're like, wait, what? How are you this age? I just, I left the weekend with him just thinking like there there's real urgency if I'm Portland. And by the way, this is something I heard. I don't know if people have talked about this, but this is what I heard with the Dame story. When they shut him down, and he had a chance to be like, first team on Bay, he was having a great season.

And they're like, no, no, no. We're going to obviously get a better pick, if you say it. So they talked him into that. We'll trade the pick. And they didn't know they were getting Scoot. At that time, it was Wemby and Scoot. And I think when they got Scoot, that changed the equation. That's what led to the late trade. Because the timing of the trade was always a little weird. Like why do it when, you know, first day of free agency, if you're going to push for a trade, do it before the draft

or do it, you know, when you have a little more flexibility with stuff. And I, I, I think there was from the Dame side, I'm not going to say betrayed, but I think there was an understanding that they were going to make a trade. And I think when they landed scoot and they realized what they had, it's like, dude, we're keeping scoot. We're not trading them. And the trade that makes sense is Dame. So now he's trying to force the Miami thing. And it's been funny because the Miami side is the only,

the Miami fans are the only ones that think their offer is a good offer. And then they're, now that it's the whole, well, they owe it to Dame. You know, he was there. Well, let me ask the Miami fans, did you owe it to Dwayne Wade when you lowballed him and he went to the Bulls? What about that? When he won the Miami fans did you go to Dwayne Wade when you lowballed him and he went to the Bulls

what about that when he won the three titles for you and you were haggling over five million bucks and it's like well we had to let him go we got to think about the future of the franchise Dwayne Wade gets shoved to the Bulls how is that any different well I mean I'd ask Miami fans if Jimmy Butler got a four year extension and then decided you know what

I actually want to go play in LA would you go well hey he got us to the NBA finals. Yeah, thanks, Jimmy. Yeah. Let's do the right thing. Let's do. Let's do. Let's take back Rui Hachimor and D'Lo and two firsts for Jimmy Butler. 27 and 29. Yeah, let's do that. That's fair. We owe it to Jimmy.

No, the whole thing's stupid and you know, you can get into it, but it doesn't really... It's all pointless. like you made a line about scoot henderson like you may have your guy for the next 15 years you're like well if they handle the dame trade the right way then he'll know they treat stars the right way and then scoot will stay for that long like that other dumb thing like again i'm not trying to like i like sedano i got into it with him a little it wasn't like nasty or anything on twitter where he was saying like i i

had heard the thing um that was being sold the idea that other stars would be watching how portland handles their star yeah by doing the right thing and it's like they will not ever ever not fucking once will there be an nba an all-star an all-star level guy who's like you know what i'm on the fence about this portland miami thing or portland miami la or new york but you know what? I'm on the fence about this Portland, Miami thing or Portland, Miami, LA or New York. But you know what? They did right by Dame. They sent him to Miami because that's where he wanted to go, even though he had signed the extension with four years left. So you know what? I choose Portland. Right. How about Jimmy Butler in 2019? He's like, you know, Miami wants me, but I saw what they did to Dwayne Wade three years ago, and I'm just going to have to have to pass. Well, apparently that got worked out. And to

Sedano's credit, like he pointed that out and said, hey, it happened to have to have to pass. Well, apparently that got worked out and to Sedano's credit, like he pointed that out and said, Hey, it happened here and it had to happen. I also would say, uh, he knows more about it than I do, but I do.

I've been around this long enough that sometimes guys love telling those stories after everything's already been decided to say like, you know, I had to work it out with Wade. It's like, Oh really? Cause you were going to say no to the heat prior to that. So the point, the point is, is like, it's not even specific to Miami. It's like, oh, really? Because you were going to say no to the heat prior to that? So the point is, it's not even specific

to Miami. It's not about Butler. It's not about my conversation. It's not even about Dame. It's about the idea that, and you and I argue about this sometimes, and the Kevin Loveland, bring it up again, where there's stuff that's done in this league where the team is doing the agent a favor and you hate it

because you feel like that never comes back. I would disagree. But in this case, that Portland, you know, and all this stuff is coming from Dane's team. And then the other part of it were his agents, which is fine because that's what they're there to do is fight for their client and fight to get him to Miami. But that they're telling all the other teams, don't trade for him.

Don't trade for him because he only wants to go to Miami. And then they're ruining the team's market on top of everything else. But I just do not agree that you get all these karma points that you get to cash in later on because you trade a guy who the more I think about this Lillard situation, it's bullshit. It's bullshit. It's bullshit that he gets the extra two years. And before this even kicks in, he's like, you know what? I want to go, but I'll only go to this one team. So not only am I fucking you by asking out, I'm fucking you by destroying the market.

And, you know, I don't really think this is that. I almost feel as if we've been so conditioned to everybody getting what they want. And maybe even the Lillard side of it that that he's like, yeah, just do this, because that's what everybody else does, but not really. Not with the four years left. And also, with the amount of money he makes and the fact that we could list 17 teams right now

that are just happy with their point guard and want to trade them. If you looked at it from 40,000 feet, you'd be like, of course the Knicks would trade Brunson for Dame Lillard, but course the Knicks would trade, you know, Brunson for Dame lower, but they're not going to trade Jalen Brunson. They,

you know, they've built this whole thing around this Villanova and the connection and his dad works for them like that. You just got to cross them off. There's only 13 teams that actually need a point guard and wouldn't have to spend and send an expensive guard back, which is a really important piece of this. Portland cannot take a guard back.

They're good with their backcourt. They don't want more guards. And they have to have picks. So we're talking about the Celtics, and it would have to be Jalen. And, you know, I just don't think that's going to happen. But just to jump in real quick, everybody thinks you're dumping on the Heat thing

because you want him for Boston. It's not going to happen. I don't think they have any chance to get to get dame and i i think i think you're talking simply market like what makes sense for portland side brooklyn i have them in bold chicago needs a point guard but they don't make sense. I don't think the Miami offer makes sense. Orlando, I have him bold. If they said, fuck it, let's go get Dame. But I don't know how he's in a better situation. Toronto, sure. But he's not in a better situation to get closer to a title.

Washington, he's not going to win title there. Clippers, I just don't think Paul George and two picks is enough. And I don't know if that guarantees him anything. Minnesota is interesting. two picks is enough. And I don't know if that guarantees him anything. Minnesota is interesting. New Orleans is interesting. Well, he could be with the Clippers by himself quickly, too. So, you know, I don't know how that. Although you'd sell it on good front office, great ownership.

And you know what? Like, we're going to reinvent it around you with the remaining years in the contract. Like, that would be the conversation there, I guess. Phoenix, San Antonio. He's not winning anytime soon, especially after just seeing Wemba Dama in person. And then Utah would be the one that's kind of the wild card because that team actually would be pretty good, but I don't think you'd want to go there. So you got to cross off.

Like he's not going to go many all these places. And I just, I don't know what the trade is. And I think it's going to end up being Brooklyn or Miami through Brooklyn or basically what I laid out on my podcast on Thursday. But I don't think they're going to want to bring him into the season. Because before the weekend, I was like, they'll bring him back. They'll play it out. I don't think they're going to want to mess with that now

because I think they know what they have with Scoot. You just want to make the trade move on and usher in the Scoot-Henderson era as fast as you possibly can. Say it were some three-team where I like having a little freedom on this stuff and trying to figure

it out because ultimately, whenever we talk about trades and then people are like, it's not accepting the machine. You're like, okay, yeah, but that's not really how it works is they figure out if they want this deal to happen, if the two sides, they'll get a third team in there and they get a little asset out of it, a couple of hinky second round specials to make it work. But if you were Tim Conley and you were under the Timberwolves, you're like, all right, we actually can agree with Cronin here on a deal like cats out Lillard. And then there's other pieces flying around.

Okay. So they're going to say yes to this package. All right. And granted, Portland was looking at it. It's like, as soon as he's traded for Mark, like we don't trade that most,

this trade makes the most sense. I'm with you. We, we don't care if he doesn't play for you. Like he's not our problem anymore. And now we have a legitimate scoring big who, again, is not my favorite guy ever. But if you're looking at floor balance offensively, something

there. Would you then, if you were Conley, go, alright, he doesn't want to play here, but I'll make that deal and bet that we can talk him into it. Would you do that as a GM? I think I would because he asked for the trade. You know? And at some point,

like that guy, Joe Cronin, this is his one chance to be a GM. Right? We watch TV or we listen to radio and there's former GMs and former executives. They're on all the time. I don't want to be one of those guys if I have that Portland job and I have Scoot Henderson. Because I'm like, if I can fucking figure this out, I'm good.

I'm going to be here for 10, 12 years. And I would make the trade. And then if he didn't want to go to Minnesota, Minnesota could figure it out. Minnesota would probably be happy they got rid of Towns anyway, right? I'm not talking about Cronin's perspective. To me, if you get another team that says yes to it and you like the package, then that's everybody else's problem. I'm talking about

if you're Minnesota and you're picking them up at the airport, all right, and you're going, hey, welcome to Minnesota, Damien. Well, here's where to go bear. Here's Anthony Edwards in you're saying if he's like, I don't want to be here. Right. His agent, his agent's like, Hey, I heard the deal. Don't do it. He's not going to play there. Would you still do the deal? If you're Minnesota, I think

I would. I'd roll the dice with it. Cause I still feel like I could spin him. First of all, he likes basketball too much. Second of all, I feel like I could spin him in December, January, probably for more than I could have spun towns for. So I would do it. I think,

I think this will work out with the, some sort of Brooklyn, Miami thing, but I just don't think the package is that good. Like for instance, like do we think Brandon In think the package is that good. For instance, do we think Brandon Ingram for Dame is a fair trade? Yeah, I do.

I thought Ingram was so good. I always worry about his ability to stay on the floor a little bit. That's my favorite of all the trades. I don't know if Dame would be happy

in New Orleans, but just basketball, talent for talent, all the stuff that comes with both guys, what Ingram would mean to Portland. It's a great trade. I don't know if it'll happen,

but it's got to be something like that if I'm Portland. I want an awesome guy back. If you're the other team and you're not Miami and you're saying yes still yeah despite the agents telling everybody again i don't blame them for doing it they're doing their job it just sucks for portland even more you know if you're a trailblazers fan you're like oh wait you want out and you're owed all this money oh and we can only trade you to one team. Are you fucking serious? You might end up benefiting

your point that you'd mentioned of the Durant part of it. I never think Durant... Right. I never think Durant would be okay pulling a Ben Simmons, which, by the way, we got an update that he's not doing three-on-three work yet. Oh. Two-on-two?

I don't know. I guess that's the one that's one tier down. So maybe he has played twos, but not clear, not three on three stuff yet. Well, I bring up the Ingram trade because we both think that's a really fair trade Ingram for day Lord. If Miami offered new Orleans,

Tyler hero, um, Duncan Robinson and a couple of firsts and some swaps for Brandon Ingram. Guess what New Orleans would say? No. Thank you anyway, though. Thanks for the call. So you can't just,

because Dane decided he wanted to play in Miami, just feel like you'd get him at 50 cents on the dollar. That's not how the league works, unfortunately. Well, it kind of is how the league works,

so that's the problem. If you had a bet today on who's getting him, we'd still bet on miami but the reason the deal hasn't happened yet despite some people saying that it's already done i don't if i'm portland i'm already fucked getting i'm getting it from every angle so why am i in a hurry to do it now let's just wait this out oh you know what i mean like the bad miami deal's still gonna be there if i'm Portland, I'm happy.

You are? Because I have Scoot Henderson. And again, I think Brandon Miller is going to be a good player. But I didn't go to the Keontae George game, but everybody was like, holy fucking shit. Like this guy, Jesus. And we'll see if he can sustain it during the Summer League.

But I think that Brandon Miller and some of these other guys that were in the top 10, I don't know who's going to be the best out of those guys, but I promise you, Scoot will be better than all of them if he stays healthy. Let's take a break. All right, some Vegas scuttlebutt.

Chet Holmgren, who just looks like, I talked about him a little on my pod on Thursday, but just looks like he's in an awesome spot for OKC and looks really good. If you had to bet rookie of the year right now, and Wemba Nyama's the favorite, and Chet's like five to one and Scoot's like three to one and you had to bet on one of those three guys who would you bet on I don't I wouldn't bet on Chet just because I don't I think there's like enough established things around him it's going to be hard for him to get the buckets that are going to sway the voters.

Yeah, but could he be a potential almost dominant defensive player as a rim protector? Dominant in his first year? All those guys around him. Just say as a close to dominant rim protector. I don't think he'll be a dominant

rim protector in his first year. All right. He is 4-1 now in FanDuel. Scoot's plus 380 and Wemba Dama's minus 130. I think Scoot and Wemba Dama should have the same odds. Because one thing with Scoot, I think he's just going to get stats. Right? Like a good version of Tyreek Evans.

Where every game is going to be like 22, 7, and 11. 19, 8, and 8. 25, 6, and 12. I just think that's what he's going to do. He's too active. So, but I like that Chet's in this conversation. And if I had to pick

any dark horse, I mean, did you watch the Can't Do George game? I didn't see it. I did not see that one, no. I mean, I know he went for 30, but. As you know, I like to read the local news pieces because you get good quotes and anecdotes. They're all talking about him like they can't believe it.

Like they're like, he's. Like they can't believe it. Like they, they're like, he's in like the holy shit zone with like this small Utah. Like it, it's happening. So we'll see. But I think for, where did they take him?

He was like, was it like 14 or 16, 16, something like that. Yeah. Seems like that was a steal. Um, and then what other?

Oh. 16. Then we had that fun Philly, Utah thing that happened where Utah gave Paul Reed the poison pill contract. Little karma coming around for the Omer Asik and Jeremy Lin poison pills coming around. And then Danny kind of sticking it to Daryl, which I really enjoyed because I think that's like a little frenemy situation

on that one. Philly ended up matching now they're in the luxury tax. That was fun. And then our guy Grant Williams goes to Dallas. You and I haven't talked about this. Pretty fair price. Yeah, he wanted, when they wanted to do the extension before,

they had offered an extension before the season, from what I remember. And I don't know how far off it was from this number. It may have been a little bit lower, but he was hoping for like that $70 million extension. It was pretty much the same number. Yeah, whatever the Kelton Johnson number was, I think. But did you hear Grant talking about the Dallas state tax?

Why? What's the deal there? He had a quote. He was talking about him and his agent figured it out. And if it's Texas, it's actually because there's no state tax. It's whatever the number is, but it's really worth $6 million more. That was what he said. Was he presenting as if this is new? He was pointing to how shrewd they were with the Texas part of it.

It was the takeaway. I'm surprised more players, we haven't talked about that more than no state tax in Texas. Can we both agree that Boston should not have paid Grant Williams 15 million a year to play 12 minutes a game? Not with that roster, not with the depth. That's like the summer league when you're watching Celtics summer league. It's funny, different teams. When I was watching New Orleans today, I was like, there's a couple of guys here and even get EJ Liddell back.

And I'm like, you know what? Like Dyson Daniels apparently determined to show that he's a three point shooter, but the rest of his numbers were terrific today. So I'm not going to get on for two or 10, but like new Orleans, you're watching it going,

Whoa, that's like, like, look how many other guys that'll be in the rotation possibly. Yeah. And Hawkins from Yukon who, you know, the more and more I did the draft prep, it's like, look how many other guys that'll be in the rotation possibly. Yeah. And Hawkins from UConn who, you know, the more and more I did the draft prep, it's like, I feel like I didn't appreciate him enough during his college season. And then you look at the Celtics summer league deal and you go, the chances of one of these

dudes getting, like being the 10th guy getting minutes for this team is probably a stretch i think wash has a chance to be in the top eight no be in top 10 okay top 10 i think he has a chance to be a i think you know how boston works who are they going to love immediately they'll love this guy because he just plays his ass off the entire time so as i bring it back to grant like if they weren't as deep then i'd go you know you're just going to lose it for nothing because I don't think Grant Williams sucks. Yes, I think he's one of the most annoying athletes I've ever watched. But I do think in certain matchups, he's like a really nice player. And, you know, if anything comes back to the shooting, it just is going to be tough. Like if you're going up against a smaller perimeter team, I think that's where Missoula lost all confidence in him. And then, you know, when Grant kind of got just knocked out of the rotation entirely,

I wasn't like freaking out going, I can't believe you're doing to this guy. But then you could see his value in other times where he'd come back out there. So I think it's a nice number. Good for him. He'll have more opportunities there, but he's probably more beneficial in a specific matchup unless the shooting

turns back into what we've seen in the past. Like if he's, if he's still going to be really good from three, then you're always going to find minutes for him. But for Boston, it probably didn't, he was a luxury that was probably not worth what it was going to be with the amount that use them with Missoula.

You can't pay Porzingis $30 and Rob Williams $16 and Horford $10 and then Tatum, Max, and Brown and then be like, oh, also here's Grant Williams for $15 million. I think the Celts are in a weird spot with this because I was thinking about it over the weekend. Both of the guys they traded, which I talked about this in my pod on Thursday, which was two pro-Missoula moves. The two guys he didn't vibe with are both gone. It's not a coincidence. But both of them are going to do really well next year for their new teams. And that's just a fact.

And there's a scenario about four weeks into the season when Grant's doing really well in Dallas and Marcus is completely rejuvenated in Memphis. And the Memphis fans are like, I can't believe you guys traded. We love this guy. And Dallas is like, oh my God, Grant Lamb's the perfect fit with Luca. That Boston's going to look bad, especially if Porzingis is hurt five weeks into the season. That world is kind of sitting over there. I don't want to think about it, but I do think

both of these guys are going to do really well on their teams. Dallas is the perfect team for Grant. Luke is the perfect guy for him to play with. I think the fans are really going to like him. I do feel like he's one of those guys that the more he plays, the better he is.

If he's going to play 35 minutes a game he plays, the better he is. And if he's going to play like 35 minutes a game for them, I think he'll be good. But you can always get away with one guy that doesn't shoot. And he'll be that guy for that team. The Celtics couldn't get away with that in the playoffs because we saw what happened every playoff series. So they just want more offense. I think the Celtics,

the more I talk to people in the vicinity of the team and all that stuff, like, I just think they were tired of looking like dog shit offensively in this playoff series. They, they just felt like that fundamentally was not a way you can win a title. If teams over and over again can stop you the same way. And they felt like they were,

it ran the course and they had to do something. Yeah. I think that has more to do with why Smart's not there. Yeah, both of them. Yeah. Grant doesn't have the ball enough to be the reason why that happened. No, but it's just they got rid of two guys that just didn't help them offensively.

Grant had that one game against Milwaukee, but I think they care more about offense than defense is my takeaway from the Celtics summer. I'm totally fine with a Marcus Martre. Totally fine. Me too. He'll do great in Memphis. A couple other things. Did we talk about

Pop for five years? We did not. Pop got a five-year, $80 million extension. Everyone thought he was going to retire. What did you make of this? This is what old successful people do. They talk about how they're going to retire. What did you make of this? This is what old successful people do. They talk about how they're going to retire. It's right around the bend. Everybody talks about it all the time.

And then they don't want to retire. You want to know why? People like money. And when you are a competitive person your entire life. Are you talking about me right now? Bob Iger? You could throw yourself into this. Bob Iger? I'd like to throw No. Bob Iger? You could throw yourself into this. Bob Iger?

I'd like to throw me, Bob Iger, pop. Because I think one time you even told me, like, I don't know how many years. I'm like, the idea that you're not going to be 70 going, hey, Kyle, can you tape? Okay? Like, who the fuck are you kidding? I know I'm going to be fine walking away.

You're going to freak out you're gonna need to talk to somebody about something there's there's no way i'll be fine everyone's gonna miss me in a year and a half be like dude i think sam hauser's kids better than he is i'm just gonna go right into coaching eighth grade basketball i'll be know, hey, Bob, you could do nothing or you can continue to work with an organization that you love and a game you've dedicated your life to, and we're going to pay you handsomely for it. So I think there's a lot of people, there's people listening to this right now that think they know when they're going to retire. But if you love what you do, then you get to that imaginary date. Like, look, when you're 30, you think 50 is like,

oh, I'll be dead. Yeah. I'll be in a wheelchair right when you're 50 you're like i don't want to be doing this when i'm 70 like these other guys and then you're 70 and you're like i i still like doing this so i wasn't surprised by it at all i'd tell you though and i'm thrilled that wim benyam is but, and maybe it's just running out of material, but you would have thought the Spurs, man, like at some point during the game, you know, Churchill originally wanted to land in Portugal. And then RC Buford and Popovich said, no, we've got to take it to the beach. Like what the fuck?

You're a basketball team, man. The way they get talked about, it's like, were they involved in the vaccine or did they get the 7-5 kit? What are we talking about? You'd have to have heard it. I respect and appreciate the Spurs, but they haven't been good in seven years, right?

Six years? When was the last good Kawhi season? 17? Well, he had kind of shut it down. You know what really helps is when you win the lottery and get Tim Duncan. That's good for the culture. You know what really helps the Warriors?

Yeah, I am too, but you know what really helped the Warriors? That they didn't trade Steph Curry and then he became a generational superstar. Superstars really help set the culture. The Patriots, Tom Brady. Really nice to have Tom Brady for 20 years. It helps. Um,

I, I like your point though about the action is the juice. Cause Stern was another one where it's like, yeah, though Stern's going to retire. And then remember Seelig? Seelig was supposedly a temporary hire. Oh,

he wouldn't, he wouldn't leave Lord Michaels. People found out what's he like made and they're like wait what you're like oh no wonder you know like oh the owners he's comfortable with the owners but he only has a couple more years with it lauren michaels another great one yeah because what are you supposed to do what are you like how can you replicate if you still love it and there's no indication that popovich doesn't still love it you know somebody told me this story once i think it was set i think it was set on a podcast

talking about lauren michaels rogan the seth myers and maybe it wasn't on a podcast but it applied to stern and lauren michaels about it was right around the same time people like how long are these guys gonna do this i think it was lauren mich same time. People were like, how long are these guys going to do this? I think it was Lorne Michaels. And they said, the moment you're not running that show, people aren't returning your calls in the same way. You're not getting that same dinner. It's just the juice kind of shifts in a way that you feel. But when you have that job, anyone you want on the phone,

you have the juice. And I don't know. I think your point is correct on some of this stuff. Like Pop, he probably looks around and sees the retired coaches and he's like, I'm not ready to be a retired coach yet. And Wemba Yama certainly helps. I'd rather coach the seven foot five guy

for the next five years. And think about how Popovich got involved. He took over for Bob Hill. And I remember just being a college student going like, wait, who's this Popovich guy? I think he's like, hey, we got Duncan. You're out of here. And I was uninformed.

I didn't know what Popovich's deal was i didn't realize that he was kind of running the show anyway but like from the outside completely uneducated 21 year old i'm going they get duncan and this guy just decides bob hill's out like what are you serious like that guy can do that it's a michael corleone move right then he gets wimby yama no kidding and you you probably heard the same stuff like going back maybe three years is the first time you'd heard it like okay pop isn't long for this pop isn't long for this like it was always thought maybe quinn snyder would go there and take it over right but there's always been a lot of weird ones like

doc rivers to orlando that was always one that was always they're going to bring them back they're going to do that there was always a steve nash they're going to bring them back. They're going to do that. There was always a Steve Nash and Phoenix one, which I doubt is ever going to happen now with Ishbia in place. But there are always these names that are linked with these organizations and all the years of all the gossip and all the stuff of like,

oh, this guy might end up back here and all this stuff. But to land this pick and to actually face the decision of, are you actually done? Because if you don't want to be done, we don't want you to be done. And so that's why I thought,

I'm repeating myself at this point, but we get it. Belichick. Still going. What's he going to do? What's he going to do? What are you going to do? What am I going to do?

I don't know. I'll probably call you on a Saturday night and be like, oh my God, did you see Scoot tonight? In-season tournament was another big topic this weekend. I'm going to keep an open mind, but as we've discussed in previous pods, I don't really get it.

I don't understand the stakes because the stakes are like everybody on the team wins $500,000 if you win the title and you get this cup and this is a marathon, not a sprint.

We're going to establish this cup. I get all that. I don't know why the fans are going to care. I think the media is going to care because they position this perfectly in Vegas. It's during this dead

kind of December weekend right after college football kind of dies but before pro football heats up it's like, I think it's a Wednesday and a Friday or Thursday, Saturday, something like that. So it's not conflicting with football at all. And they're going to try to turn this into

an event. I think the real reason they wanted to do this was they wanted their version of like, you know, when everybody descends on one place to actually watch basketball. All-Star Weekend used to be that, but All-Star Weekend sucks, you know? And it's like this corporate event.

It's not fun. They wanted people to descend on Vegas to watch really important basketball games. I just wonder if anyone else is going to care because the stakes aren't really stakes. Now, if you're telling me this is the gateway to eventually the winner, the two teams left in this tournament or the four teams will play international teams and we get a little champions league type thing. And that's part of

this down the road that makes a little more sense to me, But ultimately, I'll watch it. I'll be excited for it. I'll be like, oh, cool, Tuesday, Friday, these are tournament games. But ultimately, I don't really know what that means. Well, it's funny.

When I first heard about it, of course, I didn't like it. And then I read about what it was and I went, this is actually really easy and it's cool. It's so simple. Just go through how the teams are assigned to

certain pods and then there's certain games that are designated like i don't know if it's seating is the right term or whatever but like there's certain regular season game i thought like most people that didn't put any time into understanding what it was i was like wait you're just going to stop the season and all these games are going to count but they're not really going to count and then of course it's an extra television product to boost revenue even more. Once I understood what it was and that it really doesn't interfere with the regular season at all, except for the actual tournament that you're going to have. And if it ends up being a champions league thing, as much as I don't pay attention

to soccer, whenever I pay attention, I'm like, Oh wait, a champions league. Like, let me, let me check this out for a bit. I can't turn it off. I fucking love it. I'm not saying it's going to be that, but we shouldn't be judging it in its first year. Maybe it builds into something like that, but it's not as intrusive. It doesn't alter. The way you think about it, you're like, oh, that's like, again, I guess I'm only speaking for myself. When I didn't know anything about it, I didn't like it. Then when I actually took the time to figure out what it was they were doing, you're like, this is going to be really easy to execute. It's going to be simple. It's going to be a little extra thing you're paying attention to. And maybe people can make fun of it the first couple of years, but I'm all for it. I think it's great. You and I will both be in Vegas December 7th for the semifinals and finals. I'm ready. So I'm definitely not bagging on this idea. I thought there would be more stakes, but I get the sense it's like a work in progress and this is year one and they'll tinker with it,

see what works, doesn't work. Maybe this, maybe losing team, the entire roster can't ask for a trade for two years. That'd be good. I thought they would, they told me that they were very, very adamant that they didn't want anybody to gain some sort of long-term advantage

from winning the tournament. That they wanted just to be a competitive tournament that mattered. And I think the real reason, other than having basketball people to send to Vegas in this December, is I think they were really feeling that stretch, you know, basically up till Christmas when the NBA, it's like the diehards

that care. Nobody else does. Cause everybody's just football, football, football, football. So now there's this thing that's happening. That's like, oh, that's happening. And I just feel like it's a way for them to kind of knock on the door and remind people, oh, we're here. I know this season started a month ago, but we're doing this now. The semifinals are coming up. Any interest? And let's face it,

anybody who likes basketball is going to be like, I'll watch those games. It's an interesting idea. I'm not against it. I was disappointed that it wasn't like the winner gets the 10th pick in the draft or something like that. I really thought there should be some sort winner gets the 10th pick in the draft or something like that.

I really thought there should be some sort of prize. 14th pick in the draft. Or you get $5 million shaved off your luxury tax number. Some sort of benefit. Wow. You wanted to get weird with it. Yeah. A little funky.

But it didn't happen. You know what I don't want to have happen? I don't want Chris Paul to with it. Yeah, a little funky, but it didn't happen. You know what I don't want to happen to have happen is I don't want Chris Paul to win it just for the memes. It'll hurt. Let's take a break. All right, so as I mentioned earlier, I took my son to Vegas,

had a great father-son weekend. I've been kind of waiting to take him to Vegas for the weekend until he was kind of old enough to get it and understand it. It was pretty funny watching his reactions to, I'm explaining like, all the casinos have a different theme.

And he's just like, what? It's like, there's New York, New York, and that's the Luxor. It's like, what? It's an, there's New York, New York, and that's the Luxor. It's like, what? It's an Egyptian pyramid? This is his first time. First time since he's like

old enough to understand what's going on. He loved how weird it was. Like, you know, talkative cab drivers and just shit that we don't get in LA.

But the UFC was why we went. And my, my kid's one of those people who's like, I gotta get there early. I'm like, we don't want to go for the early prelims.

We want to go for the regular prelims. No, I want to actually go to, I want to see every fight. Because he really likes the UFC now. I'm like, all right. So we get there like 4.15. We get the early prelims. We had a little lounge. We're in like a little VIP part.

So we got to go to the lounge and get a Coke and come back out. And then the actual prelims start, and that was great. And it ended with Robbie Lawler, who's, for the people listening, they don't really follow MMA, a UFC legend. Not one of the all-time greats,

but great for his fights are great, which is a different... It's weird. Basketball doesn't have people like Robbie Lawler where you're like, yeah, he never won anything, but his games were great. It really has to be these... Jimmy Butler? At least he made the finals

and stuff. I guess boxing has guys like this. So anyway, Robbie Lawler knocks a guy out. Crowd goes apeshit. I mean, the crowds at the UFC, they're just awesome. But the crowd goes apeshit. They fucking love Robbie Lawler. They run this little highlight video for him. It's super emotional.

It's like, all right, now we're getting to the main event, right? And all of a sudden, Trump, out of nowhere, comes out of the runway and people lose their minds. And it's like, you could tell something was happening because there are all these security guards and policemen. Is there a bomb threat? Why are there all these extra people? And then he comes out and it's almost like professional wrestling. He had

this entrance music when he came out. A leadership bomb. And comes in and there's cameras, photos, people are cheering and he comes in and he's with Dana. And then just people went up to him for the next four or five hours and took photos with them. And they showed him the jumbotron, everyone went crazy. And I was talking, cause I know David's been a little bit cause he was on the podcast and we were talking at one point

and he was like, what about Trump? The guy's like fucking Santa Claus over here. Like people go up. Uh, so as soon as he came in, the energy went up a level and the electricity in the building for whatever reason. And, and the card was great. Now you're a way bigger UFC person than I am, but every fight was good. And my son's like, are the cards like, we should go to every one of these i'm like i don't think the cards are always like this but the card was elite and then it led to volkanovski at the end just beating the shit out of uh rodriguez but um but i thought that was like a pretty exceptionally entertaining card right i didn't i have family in town so oh you missed it

okay no they were like you're gonna watch summer league and we're gonna get the fight so i was like all right we're you No, they were like, you're going to watch Summer League and we're going to get the fight. So I was like, all right. Because they were like, are you seriously going to watch Summer League the whole time? So I didn't watch all Summer League as I'm on week two of hosting. But you know what's great about the UFC? There's a bunch of reasons. It's great. But I'll tell people all the time, of all the great sporting events that i've gotten to go to um which you know i'm really lucky we're both lucky having these careers and

getting to go to all this stuff like for me the college football stuff nothing's ever going to top that yeah um my favorite to this day still tech in texas no wait lubbock and just the fact it was halloween weekend it's the upset it's the storming of the field three times and then hanging out in lubbock after and then having to drive through Odessa and everything to get back to an airport. It was just so different. And I've had all these college football moments that I put up there with pretty much anything.

But being in Vegas for McGregor and the crowd, and you used to fight an American guy at the time, and you would have thought you were in Dublin and for Ben, for your son to see that, like there's an energy at a fight and it doesn't just have to be UFC, but if it's like top level boxing, the energy, the anticipation

that so many people have money on it too on top of everything else, the energy inside the fight casino. Yeah. It actually is very hard to explain until you go to it. And then you're kind of like, all right, now I get it. So I'm sure he was fired up because the card was good, but it's unlike any other sporting event because there's this sustained anxiety that lingers in the air. And then depending on who you're rooting for,

whatever, it's a bit like hockey where all of a sudden it can just be over and you didn't even see it happening. And then everybody freaks out and takes it to this whole next level. McGregor was its own lane because it was so many kids from Ireland that came over for it.

And about 20 of them were arrested before they even made it in. Like they got arrested as they were going through to check their tickets in so i'm sure look if i were a high school kid and i'd never been anything like that before i go wait this exists because that's what it felt like for me the first time i went i wasn't even in high school yeah and i mean the best ufc fights are always when the the round flips where it's like hooker Turner was great. Turner just seemed like he was in complete control and he was going to knock out Hooker. And then Hooker landed one. And then these rounds are so long. That's the other thing. Because the boxing, it's like three minutes. They're kind of circling each other. And very rarely do you have this awesome start to finish round. You see like five minutes is a long time, you know, and somebody can have not only the round, but it feels like they have the fight and this is basically going to be a wrap. And then all of a sudden it flips and the crowd can feel it right when it's happening. Right. And there's like just supercharges. So the second round of Hooker Turner, where it's like both guys seem like they're going to knock the other guy out. It was just awesome.

We were like, whoa, we're not getting a better fight with that. And then we had Pantasia against Moreno. And this is like the third time they fought. And that one, the first three rounds of that one, I was texting Aria. I was like, is this like the fight of the year? But like, put this in context for me.

Everyone's going nuts. Everyone's rooting for Moreno. And so that was great. And then the main event with Volkanovski was just like, I don't even know what basketball player would you compare him to? Where he's just... Matt Geiger? Face-wise.

He can fight any style he's just in your shit it doesn't seem like there's any real way to there's what's the strategy against him well that's what was so great about Jones is that when you watch prime John Jones you go like oh he's

going to do this tonight and then there's another fight with Jones years ago where he was winning he was up he was up every round and the other guy was still hanging around i don't know i forget who it was and he decided like all right you want to you want to throw punches at each other like it was so dangerous it didn't make any sense he was winning the fight and jones just loves fighting so much he's like all right i'll just start throwing punches with you then too and exchanging i was gustafson maybe i don't know anyway uh max kellerman once said this i always loved the line because it was good

and i you know it was just perfect it was perfectly delivered by kellerman too he goes fighting's everyone's favorite sport and you know he waited for the desk to be like what are you talking about i love football. He goes, when you see a fight, you stop and watch it. You can't say that about any other sport. That's a great point. We even had it yesterday. There were all of a sudden the obligatory fight in the stands.

Which Ben must love. It was between, oh, Ben was like, what's going on? People are getting separated, and everybody, even Trump, is turning around like, what's going on? Like people are getting separated and, and everybody, even Trump is turning around like what's going on up there? But it's like, you're right. You can't look away when,

when there's something. The Volkanovsky, I don't know, he's basically conquered the featherweight division. There's nobody left for him to fight. It's a, which is always funny

when that happens at boxing or UFC where it's like, I'm out, I'm out. I'm out of opponents, guys. What do I do now? So now he's going to have to move up to lightweight to fight Islam again.

But he was just awesome. He was surgical. He could go, oh, we want to go to the ground? Let me take you to the ground this round. And then the guy he's fighting is like, I don't want to go to the ground anymore. It's like, cool, I'll just beat the shit out of you and then I'll take you out the ground this round. And then the guy he's fighting is like, I don't want to go to the ground anymore. It's like, cool, I'll just beat the shit out of you and then I'll take you out.

I was impressed. Was Trump cool? What did you guys talk about? Stayed away. You know, Mel Gibson was there too. They're about 15 feet apart. And Guy Fieri was there. It was quite a scene.'m not gonna comment i just

want to talk about the sports angle out of it but there was definitely an energy your guy miles teller was there looking jacked i think you would have been really proud of him yeah he kept his maverick muscle yeah once he went top gun and then the aaron rogers stuff i don't i i get to i don't he's in another tier. He ascended, yeah. I don't think I can reach out to him anymore and expect any reciprocation

at this point, but that's just the game. So I respect it. I'm not worried about it. I just, I'm trying to think of like Trump and Mel Gibson talking and I'm just going like.

I think it happened. I loved you in White House down. That's good. Greenland, didn't get it. You know what else I like? David Spade and, David Spade and Dennis Miller sat together

they're still like buddies thought it was so heartwarming they've known each other like 30 plus years did you hear Spade and Dana Carvey do the Chevy Chase interview

last year on their podcast oh yeah yeah that was every Chevy Chase interview is elite can't miss appointment viewing but the thing is is like you realize why spade everybody loves spade yeah it's in the business because like it's not about being in a movie it's not being in skits spade is actually

able to hang with chevy and his zingers in there while while Chevy's not paying attention or is paying. It was, I left that like taking spade in my head. Like I, I changed my pyramid because of how goddamn funny spade was with Chevy chase the whole time. He's great. Um, my, my big takeaway from UFC is like, they've just, yeah, I remember I went, I wrote about it for page two in like 2001. I went to the one of Mohegan sun, like early, early USA,

early. Let's just say different experience state. Now it's, it's just, it's this absolute spectacle. Like they just, every single piece of it is, it feels Vegas-y.

And every entrance, the lights, the packages, the announcing. I think Rogan does a really good job with the interviews. I think we're used to having so many bad sideline interviewers in our lives. You really notice the ones that actually know what the fuck they're talking about

and ask the right questions and can kind of capture the moment. It's a really fun night i have to throw my guy anik in there just because oh he was he's there's he came over there's just very few guys there's very few guys that finally get to that level that everybody's really happy for them that they got to that level yeah like normally you just get to that level then it just turns into everybody piles on be like you know, actually this guy isn't that good and all that shit. You may be aware of this

phenomenon. But Anik is so well liked. It's like Mike Breen. Mike Breen's the exact same way. It's a great call. Just like unanimous approval rating. Nobody's like, I fucking hate Mike Breen. He's a fucking dick. That'd be an awesome list. I mean,

it'd have to be a real summer pod. Like, try to come up with the top 10 list of the highest approval rating people in our business. Ian Eagle's in there, right? Who doesn't like Ian Eagle? At any big time in a Celtics game, I'd say, can we get you on the pod? He goes, oh, not during the tournament.

I'm like, I don't want you on after the tournament. He was like, oh, there you go. Wow, okay. He dropped to the second round i love that guy but i just loved it because he was like nah so i don't know i just have to add it to the scouting report if we're actually going to do the definitive list of the highest q ratings i i would bring that up in the war room we still may take them ninth but i'd bring it up there There's an ESPN talent who wants shush Juliette Lippman. And it's been a running joke for 10 years.

It's funny. Those little moments, they just stick with you. Hey, she, Juliette did it to me. She's like, Oh,

he forgot my name again. And I was like, sorry. Yeah, it was early. I didn't even work here. She remembers every insult that has ever happened. Um,

my son now wants to go to the UFC cardc card in utah in salt lake city and uh on the 29th i'm surprised he didn't come back with some training equipment or something like how does he want to no you know what he did was he he beat the shit out of me the whole weekend he kept like trying to john fake john jones elbow me and all this stuff and then o'malley's fighting in Boston for 292. And he's like, well, we're going to go to that. It's a football game the night before. We can't. So now we can take the red eye after the game.

I'm like, so you're now, he's now gone. He's crossed some sort of line with UFC now. I've seen him do this. Right. I got to ask, though, a Ben Simmons Vegas question. Because he's 15 now right he's he's gonna be 16 in November so separate hotel

rooms we did we did we did separate hotel rooms separate hotel rooms did you refuse to stay in a room I didn't you know I I'm at a real crossroads with with gambling in Vegas these days I haven't announced my retirement yet no but the last time we gambled together we had a terrible time it wasn't our fault we just were like we

looked at each other and just said why don't we just go i was like yeah actually i don't think i'm gonna stay out um all right okay i'm rapid firing you here is ben do you have to talk to about not sneaking out or is he allowed to wander the floor no here's the thing with vegas you can't because i thought i was excited on friday night i thought i could play blackjack and he could stand behind me because he's almost six feet tall he's 180 pounds like i even though he's 15 he looks like he's older. And the casinos are like, they're on it. Like, everywhere we went, they were like, he's got to get out of here, like immediately. So then he was like, Vegas sucks. I thought we'd be able to gamble.

I'm like, I told you we weren't going to be able to gamble, but I thought you were going to be able to gamble. Yeah. He was all excited to stand behind me for blackjack and like kind of like or ladder craps or anything and they're just really villaging about that a lot of these girls are mid af he didn't use the word mid a couple times um so he he was just you know well again i guess he could have snuck out and walked the street and called people nerds or something you know what i mean like i'm just wondering where he would be at with a fear level because I know he's not afraid of you at all. The fear level is zero.

On Saturday, I was like, I might go see... If I go see Tate and Kyle, are you going to be good for a couple hours? No, no. Yeah, leave me alone. He was a little too excited about it. I'm like, you know what? I'm going to actually stay with you. I don't trust you. That's what I wanted to get to.

Yeah, perfect. He was all excited to get dressed. Yeah, perfect. Yeah. He was all excited to get dressed up for UFC and wear his medium chrome shirt and just look like he was ripped. And I don't know. You would have been really proud of him. It was an elite performance all weekend.

But now I don't know. We might be like UFC family, Matt. I might have to travel for cards now. I didn't have this on my bingo card. And then I was thinking, maybe UFC just replaces baseball for me because I went to the Dodgers game on Thursday and Mookie played short and went two for four. JD was bad in cleanup for them. And then the eighth inning, they had some guy come in and he was throwing 101. And it was that guy Gratterall who was in the Mookie deal. And then the Red Sox rejected him so they could

get Jeter down. So it was no longer even with the organization. And I was just like, I, I, I got all, I lost my mind about the Mookie trade all over again. Then you went the next night, same thing where it's just like, what is the point of having a professional team? If you're not going to keep this guy who's so good now, he can just play the infield. Yeah. So my dad is in town with my youngest brother and they'd both never been to Dodger stadium. Well, it makes sense because my youngest brother's young, but you know, my dad is not young. So your dad never been interesting. He had never been to Dodger stadium. So, you know, it's hard because you grow up going to Fenway and we went all the time.

You're kind of comparing everything to it. And I said, look, it's a very laid back thing, but it's gorgeous. It's awesome. And he kind of sits down and he's looking around and I was like, no, no, no, this is, this is incredible, but it's just, it's, it's the epitome of California. Like this is Los Angeles. It's baseball. Everybody's late. The mountains in the back behind the stadium, the sunset. It's fantastic. You kind of walk up to go into it. And then once he got settled and we had good seats where I just went out and I didn't get him from anybody or anything. I just went ahead and said, all right, we're going to do this right and buy the seats.

And then Mookie hits two home runs, turns an insane double play while he's playing second base. Yeah, he played short the night before. Right. And it's the same damn thing that you said. two home runs, turns an insane double play while he's playing second base. Oh, my God. Yeah, he played short the night before. Right, and it's the same damn thing that you said where my dad and I look at each other. We're just looking like, how did the Red Sox lose that guy? And by the way, look at the Soto package compared to the Mookie Betts package.

It's a disgrace. It's so bad. It is like if you knew, it was the package back even though i do always i'll always like verdugo but me too i i there's there's certain teams that should never lose a guy like that in his prime and people can say he was always going to leave he was always going to leave well he's always going to leave because they didn't want to pay him ahead of time they didn't want to pay him ahead of time and They didn't want to pay them ahead of time. And it's just embarrassing that the Red Sox of all organizations

wouldn't be in front of something like that to make sure it doesn't happen. The indefensible piece to me is if you're going to pay somebody in their 30s, which is a no-no most of the time in baseball, where you get these power hitters or these bigger guys.

The history of the positional guy getting that long, long deal. It's overwhelmingly terrible history, but that's what makes it so crazy that they didn't see with him. Like if there was ever a fantastic bet to age, well, it's this guy who can basically play any position on the field, who is an absolute elite outfielder and had speed and power and, you know, and, and honestly wasn't that big, you know, he's, he's the type of guy who's, you just feel like he's going to keep going and going and going. Uh, the fact that the Dodgers are just like, oh, we need a shortstop tonight. And he is, he's like John Havlicek. He could just move into any position you need for your lineup. You know your lineup. I got all mad all over again. I thought

I had done. I might just be done with the Red Sox until Marcelo Mera comes up. It's just really... I just don't understand it. The Dodger fans, the people were walking around like, hey, thanks for Mookie. I made the trade.

No one's listening to this anymore because I did the exact same thing you did where i'm like how did they like how do you let this happen and i don't want to hear about like oh he's always going to leave he's always going to leave well he's always going to leave once he realized they didn't want to pay him that's when he was okay with moving taking the money if they offered it to him it's ridiculous right and even if the history is bad not only does he physically maybe get put in a different category,

pay the seven years of it when it's worth it and worry about the back end of the back end. It's not like the TV money's going anywhere. So your dad, it sounds like he was like a B- for Dodger Stadium. No, in the beginning he was and then he warmed

up to it and he really liked it. Did you get a Dodger dog? He did. He loved it. Over Fenway Frank or below? I think he said it was better than a Fenway Frank. He doesn't eat hot dogs very often. He knew not to get me one.

I had a hot dog streak of like seven years. Didn't eat one. One of the things I like about the Dodgers games is... Just in case you were wondering. I like their... I think their fans are like legit. There's just like a lot of like old timers. It reminds me of the Red Sox.

Just people, the kind of the pre-2004 Red Sox fans where the people in the stands are just people that go. They're not like, oh my God, I'll try this Dodgers game. They're like people who go and they're like keeping score and they're super nerdy about it or they're all wearing the colors

and I respect that franchise. There's a lot of those old school guys that are there that probably at some point lived on the East Coast anyway. So I know we've talked about it with the Lakers and whatever but the intensity for the fans and you want to tell me they're not into the chargers no shit you know you want to tell me the rams thing still feels a little new okay no problem um but when it comes

to the dodgers and lakers it there's not in the u.s ucla thing's good too right there's a stigma that you live with or that you think of unless you move here. And we've already covered this. So go Dodgers. All right. Go Dodgers. We'll wrap it up because it's almost midnight. So we're going to do, are we doing a pod next week or are we done?

I can't remember. I don't know. I think we were done by this time last year after summer league, but I'm actually still going to summer league. I'm still planning on going this week. Well, we had one gimmick we wanted to do. Maybe we'd do it from your pod if I'm gone.

Yeah, because somebody was like, well, you're coming later when no one cares. When it cools off. Yeah, that's when I really lock in the two-way contract, guys. Alright, Russo, thanks for staying up. Good to see you.

Yeah, of course. Kyle Creighton, thanks for staying up and producing the pod. Good to see you. Is Cerruti on this or no? Too late for Cerruti. I don't blame him. All right, I will see you on this podcast on Tuesday. Thanks for listening.