The Bill Simmons Podcast - Tortured Jets Fans, NFL Fixes, and Curb Your Enthusiasm’s 25-Year Run With Larry David

Episode Date: January 31, 2024

The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Larry David to discuss sports, movies, 'Seinfeld,' 25 years of 'Curb Your Enthusiasm,' and more! Host: Bill Simmons Guest: Larry David Producer: Kyle Crichton The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming, please checkout theringer.com/RG to find out more or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

coming up, an extended hang with the one, the only, Larry David, next. This episode is brought to you by Prime Video. You know me, I can't go a day without sports. I really can't. And now Monday nights are all about hockey. That's right. There's a new exclusive home for streaming Monday night NHL hockey, and it's on Prime.

All season long, watch Prime Monday Night Hockey deliver unreal plays, the biggest goals, can't miss moments. Matthews, McDavid, Crosby, the NHL's best. They're all on Prime. Prime Monday Night Hockey. It's on Monday. It's on Prime. This episode is brought to you by my old friend, Miller Lite. I've been a big fan of Miller Lite, man, since college days when I was allowed to have beer. I think nephew Kyle is a fan too. Miller Lite keeps it simple for us. Undebatable quality, great taste. Picture this, it's game day, all the gangs here, you're tailgating outside the stadium. It's a great time for beer. Or how about when you're standing at the grill and the smell of sizzling burgers is in the air? Moments like that. Or when you want a light beer that tastes like beer,

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Your game time tastes like Miller time. Must be legal drinking age. We're also brought to you by the Ringer Podcast Network. Put up a new Rewatchables last night. We grabbed one from the Rewatchables 1999 feed. It is The Insider, a classic Michael Mann movie with me and Sean Fennessey and Chris Ryan hosting this one, by the way. Just 25th anniversary of that movie this year. Super important. One of the last great Pacino movies, Russell Crowe, throwing 99 miles an hour. And a really interesting story

to go back on, especially as you think about where cigarette smoking is in the 2020s. You can check that out on the Rewatchables feed. You can also check us out if you got tickets

on the Rewatchables tour. We had an unbelievable time in Chicago last night. Washington, D.C., as you're listening to this, we're probably taping the Rewatchables. There we're doing Forrest Gump and then Philly doing Creed. And then last but not least, New York Rounders. So thanks to everybody who came out. It's great to see everybody. We're loving doing this. That is why I went last week to Larry David's office in an undisclosed location and hung out with him for

almost an hour and a half. And we just, I had my recorder and two mics and we just shot the shit about sports and Curb Your Enthusiasm, which is 25 years this year, amazingly, as the final season is coming this weekend, which you can see on HBO and on the Max app. And you can go watch every season they have on Max. But we talked about that. We talked about some Seinfeld stuff and way more sports than I think you might realize because he's a gigantic fan. So this is a thrill.

I had him in December 2014 on my old podcast, The BS Report at Grantland. So I guess every 10 years, we're gonna be doing a podcast together. But here it is, Larry David, first our friends from Pearl Jam. All right. I am here in Larry David's secret office taping this about probably six days before everybody hears it. It's the day after Doc Rivers announced he was going back to the Bucs. You're crestfallen.

You lost a golf partner. I don't know what happens to you guys. Yeah. It's very upsetting. He didn't consult you, obviously. Well, it's very upsetting because he's a big loser on the golf course consistently.

So I'm going to miss that. And so surprising. It just really came out of nowhere. I feel a little duped because we ate dinner with him like six weeks ago. And all he was doing was telling us how great not coaching was, not told us a whole story about you get a call at two in the morning. And it's like, if it's this one person on the team,

you know something bad's happened. And now he has peace at night. Yeah. And his grandkids and golf. Right, right. He's obviously taken the job just because he doesn't want to pay for the next dinner. That was the theory. That's why he's going to Milwaukee.

This man will go to any ends to not have to pay for something. Well, he fooled me. He's back. He's back in the mix. So now this is complicated for me because I really like Doc and my team has to beat that team

so I don't know I'll reconcile it we were talking before I started recording about I mean you're like a die hard sports fan I actually don't think you get enough credit for it

it's trickled in the show no but I don't think people realize what kind of credit should I get there's a level that people don't realize. You're watching League Pass on a Tuesday night. I think it speaks of an immaturity is what it does for a man my age to be into sports. But you're watching-

But you're even way more immature than I am. I mean, you're doing it for a living. Right. You're doing your childhood passion. You're rooting all that and you're doing it for a living. You're doing your childhood passion. Yeah. You're rooting all that. And you've turned it into a lucrative living. Thank God. Yeah.

Yeah, by the way. How lucky are we? By the way, yeah. It's great. But yeah, I don't think people realize how into it you are. But what's interesting is the Jets. Yeah. So when do you decide, I'm not going to let this season torture me

and maybe I'll just play golf on Sunday and tape the game? What week of the season is that? How many bad things have to happen? That's really an interesting question because I golf on Sunday. Yeah. And so I record the games. And after the first or second week,

everybody knows, don't text me. Right. I'm going to watch the game later on. So this goes on until I send out a text and go, I don't give a shit anymore. Just tell me what's happening during the game. Yeah, I don't care. You can text me during the game. It doesn't matter.

It's over. And so last year, what was that? Around season 13, I think. With the Zach Wilson season? Yeah, around 14. Yeah. Yeah. Well, it seemed there was this moment where it felt like in this last season

that the Jets were going to suck you back in, that they were lingering and there was a moment, and then all of a sudden Rodgers might be coming back. Oh, that. I never believed that for a second. I didn't either. Yeah, that was ridiculous. Rodgers, you got four plays out of and a lot of drama.

That was year one. But I'm not sure Wilson is as bad as you believe he is. I know everybody thinks that, but I just want to give you an example, okay? Flacco last year on the Jets with that offensive line was terrible. And then he gets to Cleveland. He's a year older, hasn't even had a training camp. Right. And he's playing great until the last game. He played great. So all I'm saying is Wilson was up against so much having to quarterback that team. The offensive line,

they were decimated. And even when they weren't decimated, they weren't any good. So you have not sold your Zach Wilson stock. Uh, I guess, I guess he seems like a nice, he seems like a nice kid and I'm, I'm still rooting for him to do well someplace else. I know he's done with the jets. Cause you were saying earlier this season, like in text, you were like, I'm still in. I still think he's got talent. Because I was out on Mac Jones to the point

where I was like, not only do I think he needs a change of scenery, the league might be the change of scenery. He might have to go to the UFL. That's how bad his confidence is. Boy, it's amazing how that draft worked out for those quarterbacks. I don't understand it. I don't understand why it's become even more of a crapshoot. Because the Pats have the third pick and we'll get whoever the other two teams don't take. And it just seems like there's no rhyme or reason to it anymore. I know. But if you look at that Wilson draft, okay, Lawrence, he's doing well, not great. Right.

And then Wilson, forget it, a bust. Feels. Feels. Not sure yet. Not sure. Maybe not working out. Right. And then Jones.

And wait, Trey Lance, number three. Right. Trey Lance didn't even have a moment. Yeah. Right. Trey Lance didn't even have a moment. So if the Jets didn't trap Wilson, the only other quarterback who possibly could have worked was Fields. And I can guarantee you he wouldn't have worked either with the Jets. It would have been the same thing. He would have been just running around. Same thing. Exactly. So you did that episode about the Jets fan who died and they didn't realize or they didn't know whether the Jets caused his death or not. Because it was a suicide.

No, I think the Jets caused it, yeah. Yeah, eventually. But that was the question. That was one of the things in the story. So that was a few years ago you did that. What was the reaction from the Jets based on that episode? Zero, no reaction. Really?

No, I'm here to think. It's funny because every Jets fan I in that episode. Zero. No reaction. Really? No, I'm here to thank. It's funny because every Jets fan I know is like, finally. Finally, Larry has done the Jets on curb and finally he has expressed what we all feel deep inside. I know like Fantasy, who

works for me and he's in his early 40s now. His Jets highlights are Sanchez getting in the championship game and Vinny Testaverde taking a lead in the title game. Testaverde is great. That's like it.

That was a great season. Yeah. And they lost that playoff game to Denver. They came close. That was a fantastic season. Yeah. Testaverde really was terrific that year but yeah that's that's really yeah and sanchez that's about it the two ryan years so what is it what by the way watching ryan now on on espn i'd like to i'd like to get the guy back i like him maybe is there still time? I don't think so.

The ship probably sailed. I mean, he did, he came in. It was the fourth guarantee that he made. He was guaranteeing a Super Bowl every year before the season started. He did it the first year, then the second year. Okay, Rex, don't do this again. And he did it again. And then he did it, I think, no, is he fired

before the fourth year? I don't know. He did attack the Patriots the way they needed to be attacked, which is talk a lot of shit, convince your team that you can hang with these guys, be super physical, try to go bell-checking the stuff. And that was actually the right game plan. I hated

him. The Pats weren't kind of between eras when the Jets threw a couple of haymakers on them. But yeah, that was probably the highlight of this century. But you go back, I mean, were you back for the Super Bowl? Were you in on the Jets at that point?

Oh, yeah. I've been, I started following the AFL. Yeah, so explain that to me, because just about everybody in the New York area goes to the Giants for football. Yeah, well, I was a big Giants fan. I listened to the 56 championship game against the Bears on the radio, and the Giants won 47-0. Okay. I listened to what was once known as the greatest game ever played.

Oh, Alan Amici? Alan Amici. I heard that. They wouldn't televise the game. It was blacked out in New York. How crazy is that? How crazy. So I had to listen to that on the radio.

And they lost in overtime? I don't remember. I think it was overtime, yeah. So I was a huge Giant fan. And then Y.A. Tittle and beating the Bears in 63, I think. And then you jumped. Joe Namath? why I tittle and beating the bears and, um, 63, I think. Um, and then you jumped Joe name. And then,

then the AFL came along, I think it was 1960. Yeah. Right. I don't know. For some reason I became an AFL fan. I loved the, uh,

I, I loved the Los Angeles chargers. So you like the uniforms of the helmets and some of the players. I love the uniforms and the helmets. Lance Allworth and Keith Lincoln and Paul Lowe was the other running back. John Hadle was the quarterback. Before him was Tobin Root. So they had a great team. I loved watching them. The games were on at like four o'clock.

Yeah, those were great. And so I became an AFL fan. And the Titans, I went to the polo grounds and saw the Titans play. But I wasn't crazy about the Titans. So for people listening, the Titans became the Jets. Right. Titans became the Jets. And then they drafted Namath. And as soon as Namath came along, and now they were the Jets. And then they drafted Namath. And as soon as Namath came along,

and now they were the Jets, and now they're playing at Shea Stadium. Yeah. And now there's something about this Namath guy that I just loved. So this is your guy? This is my guy. And so that's how it started and then they beat baltimore in super bowl three as like 17 point underdogs yeah and i was going i went to school in maryland yeah so there's a lot of guy i knew had a lot of friends from baltimore so that was a big deal so you're jets knicks and then yankees which is is unusual. Usually it's Jets, Nets, Mets, or there's some...

Right. Jets, Knicks, Yankees. Usually it's Knicks, Yankees, Giants, but you swap the football part. Yeah. But I still root for the Giants. I still like the Giants. So you had Namath rising in the late 60s, culminating in the Super Bowl. Then you have the Knicks rising, the DeBuscher trade.

Same time, yeah. Yeah. Right. And then they have the whole Knicks run. Yeah. But the Yanke culminating in the Super Bowl. Then you have the Knicks rising, the DeBuscher trade. Same time, yeah. And then they have the whole Knicks run, but the Yankees are going the other way. So you have two of the three going. Yes, exactly. So who was your favorite then out of the three? Or it didn't matter? Yeah, I don't know. That's how I feel. It's kind of

changed. It's always been the Celtics because we got to go to the games, but then that number, like 1B spot would change depending on who was doing well. I actually missed game seven in 1970. Oh.

The Knicks, those are the Lakers, right? Yeah. The game they won for the title. Yeah. The Willis-Reed game. Here comes Willis! Yeah, I. The Willis-Reed game. Here comes Willis! Yeah, I missed the Willis-Reed game because I was in the Army.

Really? Yeah. I didn't see the game. How long were you in the Army for? Was it a stint? I was in the Reserves to avoid Vietnam. The glasses, like the eyesight wasn't a problem? No.

That's how my dad no no the eyesight thing yeah man oh so there was a chance you had to go to vietnam if i didn't if i didn't join yeah if i didn't go in the reserves i i probably would have been drafted so then where are you living in the 70s after this are you new york the whole time are you moving around no i'm i'm living in uh i you living in the 70s after this? Are you in New York the whole time or are you moving around? No, I'm living in the city. And you're doing comedy? I started doing comedy in 74.

And you're like, this is my life. But you're still caring about the sports thing too. Oh, yeah. Is that whole romanticizing the comedy scene in New York and LA in the mid-70s, late-70s, is that overrated or underrated? Sure. Because it's like a whole generation of amazing people who then went on to shape pop culture for the next 30 plus years. It was a life that you lived and breathed. Like you'd go to the clubs,

you'd go on, you'd hang out at the clubs. Then after the clubs, you'd go to somebody's house or you'd go out to eat. You'd be home at three o'clock in the morning. I'd get phone calls at four, 4.30 in the morning.

Like, what are you doing? Like, what are you doing? Yeah, what are you doing? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So, and then, you know, you're up at one. And by the time you have your coffee and everything, and all of a sudden it's time to go back to the club. So, and then, you know, there's a softball team.

It's a whole life. And that's six days a week? Is it seven days a week? Seven days a week. You just bounce around different clubs. Bounce around, yeah. And SNL is starting at the same time, so you have that whole scene's happening as well.

Right, SNL started in 75. Yeah, because I always thought the game of if you could live anywhere, any time period for a year and go backwards in time where would you pick and i would probably pick new york in like 75 to 77 range just because everything's happening all at the same time in new york right we say like there's this music renaissance there's this art renaissance disco's happening the the comedy renaissance sports There's this art renaissance. Disco's happening. The comedy renaissance. Sports is amazing. Just everything's going on you would ever want if you were like 25 years old.

Yeah, I could see that. Or it was a little overrated for you? Yeah. I'm thinking, when would I like to live? Obviously. Yeah, what's your answer? Well, obviously, you need the modern technology for dentistry and medicine. Fair. So that rolls out of anything before the 50s? Exactly. Exactly. But if we had the modern technology for dentistry and medicine, I think like the 1910s, the early 1900s, I would have liked to have gone to a baseball game, I think, in the early 1900s just to see what that was like.

I'm kind of fascinated by that. There's a fun baseball era where everybody got dressed up to go to baseball games and wore hats in the crowd. Yeah, the straw hats. I don't know how anyone saw because all the seats were like barely elevated. Right. But yeah, there's this movie, you probably saw, Eight Men Out. It don't know how anyone saw because all the seats were barely elevated. Right. But yeah, there's this movie. You probably saw it, Eight Men Out.

It's about the Black Sox. Yeah, of course I saw it. I've seen every baseball movie that's ever been made. That movie's excellent. But I like seeing how the people in the stands just have everyone's dressed. Yeah, I saw Ty Cobb. Did you see that one with Tommy Lee Jones? Of course.

I didn't really like the Ty Cobb movie. No, neither did I. I was just watching the other day. It was just on. Because I'm still in the old school. I still scroll on cable to jump into movies. And the fan was on, and I ended up watching half of it. Wait, which one's the fan? It was Wesley Snipes as this Barry Bonds type giant. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And De Niro's an obsessed fan.

Right. And it ends with De Niro replaces the umpire during a rainstorm, and they end up having like a knife fight at home plate. It's unbelievable. And it was directed by Tony Scott, who's like one of my favorite directors. But it's just like, I don't know what happened with that movie.

That was an odd movie. So what are your top three baseball movies? Oh, boy. Like what jumps to head? I know it's hard to make lists, but what... It's got to be one that jumps to your head immediately. Well, Bang the Jump Slowly. De Niro. Yeah. That was pretty good, but you could tell he's not

a really good player. That was tough. Yeah. Yeah, there was... Well, let's see. I don't know. There's been some tough baseball throwing over the years. I'm having trouble coming up with some of these. Tony Perkins was the worst one, right? Oh, that was terrible. Yeah.

I wasn't happy with Tom Cruise in War of the Worlds at all. I didn't see that. I don't know if you saw that one. I didn't like the Field of Dreams. In War of the Worlds, he plays catch with his son and it's just... Oh, I didn't see that. It's not great. Field of Dreams. The dad in Field of Dreams really bugged me. Here's what bugged me about

Field of Dreams. What Kevin Costner bugged you? Yeah. No, no. At the end, he has a catch with his dad. Oh, he has a catch with his dad. And his dad can't really throw a baseball. And it's like, this guy's the catcher who dreamed to make the majors? Here's what bugged me about Field of Dreams. At the end, there's a line of cars that's miles long

waiting to see dead people play baseball. Are you kidding? What? You were buying that for us? I wasn't quite buying that. Yeah. It's funny. I didn't mind it if it was just Kevin Costner.

Yeah. Okay. But once you're starting to sell tickets. To the ghosts? To the ghosts. No, I don't think so. I think that movie depends on when you saw it. Because I saw it in college when you're idealistic and you'll believe anything.

And I was like, I'm all in. This is the greatest movie I've ever seen. And then as it in college when you're idealistic and you'll believe anything. And I was like, I'm all in. This is the greatest movie I've ever seen. And then as I got older, you start picking it apart. It's like, eh,

with this many people come, what about the Negro League all-stars? Why didn't any of them get to get invited? You just start, you go to all these places. But when I saw it originally,

I was like, oh my God, an amazing movie, Moonlight Graham. Now it's like, eh, Shitless Joe, Ray Liotis batting right-handed. That's ridiculous. Yeah, right. God, an amazing movie, Moonlight Graham. Now it's like, ah, shitless Joe, Ray Liotta's batting right-handed. That's ridiculous. Yeah, right. Yeah. Right. They're getting better

at how, you know what movie I really liked as a baseball movie that I thought kind of came and went was 61, the Maris Mantle movie that Billy Crystal did. Yeah, very well done. I thought that was excellent. Thomas Jane and I think Barry Pepper. Thomas, yes. It was good. And they and I think Barry Pepper. Thomas, yes. It was good. And they both look very much like the people they played. They really did. Yeah.

And Billy Crystal really cared about all the little pieces of it. Yeah, great casting in that movie. Yeah, that was good. Sandlot's a good one. Sandlot, which one was that? It's a kid's baseball movie. Probably haven't seen it. Maybe not. My son that it's a it's a kid's baseball movie probably haven't seen it maybe my son watched it 130 times i was a big bad news bears and breaking training guy the second one

the second one the second one when they have to go the first one's really good first one's great but i like when they go to the astrodome i didn't see the second one yeah they got they they steal a van and they drive to the astrodome that was a a good one. I don't feel like they're making baseball movies the same way. They had one last renaissance where it was like, Costner kind of got it going, then it died, and then it came back again

when sports movies kind of came back in the early 2000s. And then now it's like, I think they would just make a basketball movie over a baseball movie now. Because I don't know how many people under 30 watch baseball. Oh, yeah. 30 secret about baseball right now, you know? I don't know.

What was the attendance last year? Was it down? They say it's fine. It's weird, though. I don't know if you've been to a game recently, but they got the nets up. Everyone's on their phone. Yeah. It's just a weird, it doesn't feel communal the nets up. Everyone's on their phone. It's just a weird, it doesn't feel communal the same way. Here's my problem with stadiums in general now.

Like I went to a game at SoFi. Yeah. And I'll never go back there. You can't, you have to scream to just talk to the person next to you. There's so much noise coming from the loud speaker. Yeah. It's crazy.

And, and, and then the, uh, the guy on the PA, the PA guy is just, whose house is, yeah,

you are, you're assaulted. Your senses are assaulted and you can't watch the game. Have you been to a Clippers game? They're the worst offenders of this. It's like, what time is it? Yeah. Yeah. That's probably the same guy. Yeah. They just kind of moves around and yells at fans. Yeah. I think they're so afraid to have silence that they, they overcompensate. Exactly. They have it at baseball games too now. Yeah. They don't, they don't let you just sit and talk and relax. Yeah. You know what's cool is the Oregon at a baseball game.

Yeah. My dad and I were talking about when Rick Pitino was the Celtic coach and everybody hated him and the players had checked out of him and, but they didn't fire, didn't fire him in the last game. We went to his last game and they weren't playing music during the stoppages, the timeout. So the crowd was bummed out. It was just silent. So you could hear people.

And there was this guy behind us and the whole game, he was like, Petito, you suck. And it was just echoing through. And Petito, like he stepped down the next day and we were like, that you suck guy drove Patino out of Boston. But I can still hear it. Now it's like nobody could ever impact a game like that because they would just be blasting disco. I think when I was a kid, like up until like I was 14, I think I used to yell.

The heckling? I think I used to heckle when I was a kid. And now when I hear people doing that, it's like, I just can't believe it. That's like, society's definitely changed with that. Because I think back in the day, sports heckling was really fun. It was just part of going to a game. Yeah. Right?

I wrote about this story once. We were sitting in the first row at Yankee Stadium. It was probably in high school or college. Our front of us had awesome tickets and frank howard was the first base coach and he had this weird stance in first base he would like bend over with his hands on his knees and we had to look at frank howard's ass for three hours so we were drinking yeah i actually remember yeah i know what you're talking about so at one point it was super quiet we were drinking so i think it was me it was one of us but I'm pretty sure it was me. It was like, hey, because his nickname was Hondo. I was like, hey, Hondo, nice ass. And it just echoed and he turned around. But you can't do those anymore.

I'd feel bad. I mean, in comedians, that's a huge issue now in the comedy clubs is people either videotaping them or yelling at them. I'm sure you must have some heckling stories from when you're a comic oh my god people throwing shit uh i was i was verbally abused every every night it was horrible but you kind of learned how to i guess play up i don't know never i didn't learn i would lose my temper. I challenged people to fights. Would you really? I'd say, no, because I knew I had friends in the bar. I go, come on.

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Securian Canada. Insurance designed for life. Whether you're practicing your morning breath work, Securian Canada. Insurance designed extraordinary life. Live more with Liquid IV Hydration Multiplier. Available in refreshing lemon, lime, passion fruit, and strawberry flavors. Buy a stick in store at Costco, Walmart, Amazon, and other Canadian retailers. I never told you, I religiously watch Fridays. Oh, what? You know, I really did. Because i was the only child i started watching snl in the late 70s and then fridays came on on friday nights and i would i would do the combo and that was it well yeah so the when michael richards came on seinfeld i because i love michael richards on fridays right and then he was in this movie i think think it was called UHF before that.

He's kind of bounced around, but he was in UHF and I remember like, oh, that's my guy. He made a movie. And then all of a sudden he ended up in Seinfeld. I couldn't believe it. I'm not saying I invented

Michael Richards, but I was like, oh, I really liked that guy. That guy was so good on Fridays. But that's how you met him. I guess. Yeah. That's where you saw it.

But it doesn't seem like you liked the friday's experience uh no i really didn't what was your first positive professional experience was it side felt well i did have some you know anytime i did a good set, stand-up, I was always positive. So all individual stand-up stuff. Yeah, the individual stand-up stuff.

When it worked, it was fantastic. Yeah. But often it didn't. So I would say, yeah, Seinfeld. Yeah. So until you could be in charge of your own stuff. Right. So we're like, I'm always the happiest when I'm in charge of my own stuff.

Yeah. Yeah. It's tough to take orders and notes from people. I can't have a boss. When did they leave you alone in NBC? Or did they ever leave you alone? I've told this story before. Fair. We can rush through it. Okay.

So, I quit the show a couple of times. Yeah. When they tried to interfere. Oh. The first time they had hired a guy after we got picked up for the first four shows,

they hired somebody to be the executive producer, to be the boss. And he called us into his office, me and Jerry, and he gave us notes on the first couple of shows. Oh, gosh.

And when he was done, I didn't say anything. He talked. And then when he was done talking, I looked at him and I said, no. I said, no. I'm not doing one thing. And then we left the office. I said to Jerry, Hey,

good, good luck with this thing. Cause I, I, this is, I'm not going to be able to do this. Had the first four aired already or you had them in the can? Okay.

Just written. We hadn't even shot it. Yeah. They were just scripts that we wrote. Got it. And then Jerry said, no, no, don't worry about it. And then, sure enough, that was the end of that. I didn't have to do any of the notes.

Castle Rock just kind of let me be in charge. But then there were other instances. As the show got bigger, probably. As the show got bigger. Because they're starting to think of it as like a Cheers replacement when Cheers leaves. Then there was a meeting. Then we did the first four. Then we did 13 shows.

That was considered the second season. Well, that ends with Elaine and Jerry maybe ending up together. Yeah. So really, and then the next season comes and it's like, it never happened. Yeah, exactly. But anyway, after those 13 shows aired, I was in New York and they called us for a meeting in LA at NBC with me and Jerry and Jerry's managers and NBC and Castle Rock. And so before the meeting, I was told outside, hey, don't say anything. Let them talk. Oh, no. So I said, okay.

Okay, I won't say anything. So I got, so, oh, that's my phone. So we go to the meeting. Yeah. And they're giving me things that they want in the show for the following season. Things I don't want to do. And so I don't say anything. And then when the meeting's over,

we gather around in the parking lot. And there's, there's, I must be like 10 of us, 12 of us. I don't know. And I, we're in a circle in the parking lot.

And I said, good luck. I'm not doing it. And I said, good luck. I'm not doing it. And I said, my hand will not obey the command from my brain to write what they want me to. So I'm not going to do it. And then from that point on, I never had any other problems at all. That was the end of it. I mean, even the 13 shows, they were giving us little notes here and there, things you could do

easily. But when it came to bigger stuff, and I realized that all I got to do is say no. And I wasn't married or anything. It was easy. I didn't have kids. I only had to answer to myself. You weren't risking anything. I wasn't risking anything. And I had no problem going back to New York. So it's funny when people ask me, young writers, whatever,

any advice, and I say to them, stay single. Because that's the only way you can really do what you want. As you're ascending. Yeah, no question. Yeah. Because you got to throw everything into it to make it happen. Right. And there's just so much compromising that you can do if you're in a good, I think. When people say they were with Seinfeld from the beginning, do you secretly want to ask them, were you Seinfeld Chronicles from the beginning or just Seinfeld? Because that's kind of the litmus test. Because I was there from Chronicles because I loved Jerry from the Letterman appearances.

Wow. I was all in. I saw Jerry do stand-up twice in Connecticut in the 80s. I made my parents take me each time. But just because Letterman had such an outsized... Anybody that was good on his show, those became my favorite people right I think I already told you this but yeah so when the the Seinfeld Chronicles was like oh my god they gave that guy a show yeah but then it was only four but we watched

it in college like we were there and then it left with the cliffhanger the second season of it seemed like oh they're gonna do the thing where he dates Elaine was that the deal episode yeah but it seemed like, oh, they're going to do the thing where he dates Elaine. Was that the deal episode? Yeah, but it was like, oh,

so now they're, because we'd watched Cheers where as soon as they consummated Sam and Diane, the show really had trouble figuring out what to do after that. And then you guys just reset it and that was it. Then, then the show fell into place. Yeah. I mean,

that's it. I think season two is still really good, but I think once you realize we're not pursuing it with these two, it kind of opens the door. Yeah. It was just one episode. Only because I made a deal that was similar to that in my life. And I thought- It's one of my favorite episodes. And I thought, yeah yeah this is a funny idea I should try and do this well

the only way we could do is with Jerry and Elaine so what was crazy was watching re-watching it with my daughter but we had seen them at a sequence so she had seen other episodes from other seasons but then it was like alright we're going to watch these in order

when we get to that one and she was But then it was like, all right, we're going to watch these in order. So we're watching. When we get to that one and she was just so, she was like, wait, what? So did they, what? And I'm like,

no, no, I just watched the next one. We're going to pretend it never happened. But it was such like a fascinating sliding doors for the show because they really did have chemistry. Like they could have played off

as a real couple. You could have carried it for five seasons. It was like Bruce Willis and Sybil Shepard. Yeah. The 80s, they... Did they consummate on the show?

Yeah. Bruce Willis and Sybil Shepard? Eventually, yeah. I think that's what killed the show. Because Cheers, they never should have. But then they figured out they navigated it. But now this is the eternal dilemma with all TV shows is when do you consummate? Exactly.

How long can you keep them apart? You never had to worry about that on Curb with you and Susie. That was never getting consummated. The last time you, we did a podcast, I think it was like 11 years ago when I was at ESPN and you taught, we talked about the finale and somehow that got aggregated for like five days. Cause I, I guess you had never really talked about it before. What the Seinfeld finale?

Yeah. Yeah. And you've gotten, you've talked about a bunch of times. Well, it's interesting since we did that, which I think that was like 2014 or 15. So it was 10 years ago.

Yeah. But then Seinfeld, which you think like, all right, at some point, these will start petering off, right? Send one generation. I feel like the show is as large as it's ever been. Like, I don't know whether it was the Netflix, the streaming, my daughter's generation.

It's just still going. And I don't really understand it. Because Cheers stopped eventually. Yeah. And I don't know whether it seemed too dated or what, but it's still going and going. It doesn't seem like it's going to stop. I don't know.

You don't even have an answer for it. No, I have no answer. I don't know. All right, so Curb. Yeah. That starts 2000? Raven's Super Bowl? I think the special. Special.

And it was a special. It wasn't a pilot. It's a mockumentary, basically. Yeah, exactly. I think that's 1999. That's on their website. Or on the app. You can go watch the original. It's like basically the original movie.

Yeah. That paves the way. Right. And Jeff's in it. I haven't seen it in a while. Jeff's in it and Cheryl's in it. But nobody else is in it that eventually is in it. I don't think so.

Yeah. So now, this is the 13th season? 12th. 12th season. But over 22 years, how many times did you think that's the last season I'm not doing it?

Once, for sure. What year was that? That was season five after I died. I died specifically to end the show. I died and went to heaven. Oh, so you did that

because you thought that might be it? I thought, yeah, I'm not going to do this again. Wow. So I died and went to heaven. I met Ben Hogan. He gave me some golf tips and my mother and whatever. Yeah.

In fact, the title of the show is called The End so I don't know if people realized that you were doing it that way when you did it no I don't know nobody did because I didn't really tell anybody wow so then what made you come back I missed it I love it I I love doing it.

It's just so much, it's the most fun I've ever had. So that season five. Yeah. Are you getting divorced in real life at that time? You are, right? Or it's about to happen? I'm getting divorced in 2007. So is that during season five or like it's after it or it's right around?

No. Your character becomes single on the show. When are you single in real life as a parallel? You know what? This is a really good question. I think I wrote being single on the show before I got divorced. Oh, interesting. I think

so. It's a little hazy right now. Yeah, yeah. So it's around the same time. I really have to go back and look at the dates that the shows were written because I know when my marriage was in trouble. Yeah, yeah. So I was on an airplane, I'm going to say like five months ago,

going to visit my daughter. And everything was down except for some of the on-demand stuff. And they had curb. I was like, all right, I've seen all these. I think I'd even seen them during the pandemic. You could be a little more enthusiastic. No, but I literally just watched them like two years before. I've done the run-through.

Because I always try to run through my favorite shows every couple of years. All right, I'll, I'll do some work and I'll watch season one. So I ended up watching like nine up. It was cross country flight. I think I watched nine season one, season one,

season one, the 10 episodes. So I'm like, all right. So I'm like, all right, now I'm in. And I kept watching,

kept watching and just kind of kept watching. And, and for some reason I realized this time, Larry becoming single was the key to extending the show. It opened up all of these different paths. You were going to run your course with how you were doing it. And once he became single, now you get to bring in new characters. Now he's dating. Weird shit's happening. I get to date. Right. Which all of a sudden,

it's almost like a sports trade. It's a completely different dynamic. It's like when we drafted Gronk. It's like, oh my God, we got a tight end now. And it just opened it up. Because I think that's probably my favorite stretch of the show as you're trying to navigate that and you know at that point super dave's on you know my feelings about super dave but you you'd kind of nailed some of the supporting

characters at that point and it's just i felt like the show fully realized what it was with that said some of the early season episodes i think think are probably, you would say probably your favorite episodes. Yeah. Some of the early ones. Yeah. The doll for sure. The ski lift. Ski lift. Yeah. You said that, I asked you this when we were at dinner and you said the doll was the first one that jumped to mind for some reason. So why? I think it's because generally with these stories, I like to have a, um, I like the stories to intersect. I like there to be a couple of stories that kind of come together at the end. Right. But in this particular this particular show I there was only really one story which was and this story had legs most stories don't have legs like the doll yeah story but the doll story had legs cutting off that doll's hair had legs and it just took up the entire show.

I didn't, I didn't have to think of anything else. Right. Other than it, because all the, all the ensuing scenes just, just came out without even having to think about it. So the Seinfeld reunion season,

I think I'm just so glad it exists because you didn't do the reunion, but you kind of did. Right. But the most fun part is just watching you and Jerry, because that obviously wasn't on Seinfeld. Yeah. But, and then everything called it hits at the Super Dave joke with you and Jerry, which every once in a while just becomes a social media viral clip again.

It just bounces around. What a joke. I had no idea he was going to tell that so you didn't know absolutely not you know what he used to do bob einstein he he would tell okay he told that joke which which got left in the show obviously because actually it moved the story along a little bit well it also had the best reactions ever from you guys the funniest yeah god damn joke but but i would do a scene with him and in the scene as we're filming he would start telling a joke in the scene and and i'm letting him go on but in my head i'm going okay okay come on come on you know right i know i'm cutting it

yeah he would do it anyway. And everybody would laugh. Right. He was amazing. I think he's the single funniest person I've ever been around. He probably is. Yeah. He called in when Sal launched his podcast with us in the mid-2010s of The Ringer. And he was like our fifth guest. And he came in and just was immediately on the attack.

What is this? Is anyone going to listen to this? We were just dying. I don't know what it was. And then it was always like another joke. And you would get serious for a second. It reminds me. And then you were just going to the next thing.

But yeah. When did you realize somebody like that should just be part of the show? Obviously, you know him. He's been around for a long time. He's somebody that can do the improv. We were missing one friend on the show. I had Lewis and I had Jeff, but Jeff is my confidant. So I can't really get into too many conflicts with Jeff. And there were some conflicts that I couldn't get into with Lewis. So we needed another character. Like a wild card.

Yeah. Somebody who's basically super offended by you, but still likes you for some reason. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, I would say he was a friend of mine.

Right. And then he just, I mean, he immediately got the shorthand of it of mine. Right. And then he just, I mean, he immediately got the shorthand of it. Yeah. And then JB was the other one who just, Oh my God. Yeah.

He's the black season. And then it's like, we just have to just keep him on the team. Yeah. It was impossible. I mean, it makes literally zero sense that he just stays at Larry's house. She's just living in the guest room.

Did he pay rent? Look, there's a lot of questions. Did he work? Did he have a job? There's a lot of questions about Leon. I think everything's better left unsaid. Because I don't really have answers for you. What did he do the last 15 years? Did he ever try to get a job? I don't answers for leon that's not to go there so all right look it back what is your single favorite i mean you got to think of it one of the first reasons we ever talked was because i did a thing in a column where i did pitching seasons for curb episodes oh my god and you were like who the hell is this guy? Yeah, right. Tell the audience what you did. I think I went, so this was the Buckner season because I was still at Grantland. And it was like, just like,

it was like one of those pitcher seasons where the guy's like 20 and three in August. You're like, oh my God, is he going to win 25 games? And so I just said, all right, I'm breaking down every curb season. Like it's a pitcher season with an ERA and strikeouts. That was really, really something to read. But did any part of that make you mad or you're just like- No, it didn't make me mad. I really enjoyed it.

Okay. So what's your favorite- I love the analogy that you compared a season and you gave it baseball statistics. So what's your favorite now? It's 2024. You don't have one? My favorite what? Favorite season. What's the one you felt like, I guess you could look at it from degree of difficulty crossed with how you executed it crossed with do the episodes still hold up? Boy.

It feels like, it sounds like bullshit, but it just feels like every season that ends is my favorite season. Because it gets harder and harder to keep doing the tightrope of it. Exactly. So I would say that this season now,

I just finished, this would be my favorite season. But I would say that for every season that I had just finished. What did you want to do with this season that you hadn't done in the other seasons? I didn't have any grand plan like that. Just get the gang back together. Yeah.

Just write the funniest shows that we can. Because those hiatuses have gotten longer and longer between seasons. Not the last four seasons. It's like a year and a half two years like we season nine started filming in 2016 season 10 2018 season 11 2020 season two years yeah every two years but before season nine you did season eight now it was like 2000 there there was a big gap between

eight and nine. Yeah. Because that was when they started wondering if you were ever doing the show. Yeah. I didn't know. But now you're claiming it's over, potentially. Yes. Yeah, I know. But nobody believes you.

No, people don't believe me. I guess because there was a five-year hiatus and I came back. But no, this is it. This is definitely it? Yeah. Yeah. But could you do another project that's maybe not necessarily a series around the same characters, or this is it? No, no, this is it.

So who's the most bummed, Jeff Garlin? I think the cast in general felt like it was also time to end it. Yeah? Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. I'm trying to think what sports team this is like.

Well, I mean, you're basically, you're going through this. You've outlasted the entire Belichick-Brady era. Right. It's unbelievable. And just if you're comparing it to other TV shows, it's like, is Grey's Anatomy still on? I have no idea.

Yeah, I don't even know. But it's shows like that, or it's like soap operas, or it's like Johnny Carson. Yeah. Or it's like Johnny Carson. Yeah. Or it's like the NFL. Right. TV shows aren't meant to last for almost a quarter century, which is this... If you count the TV movie, not the

pilot movie. 25 years. This is 25 years of the same thing. I don't know if that's been done. Especially not in a comedy. Yeah. It's hard to... I know, it's interesting.

It's hard to imagine comedies going that long. Especially with all the things that changed over, especially when taste you know, taste changed a little bit. You can feel with the movies from 2000 to 2014, and then things shifted a little in movies, the way, the way comedy changed.

Right. You know, some of the movies from 2000s, like they would never do some of the shit that they did back then now. But you would always, you always got like a little bit of a free pass with that stuff, with content.

Yeah, I'm lucky. I mean, like even the Palestinian chicken episode, that's about as far as you push the line, but it was funny. It was fine. I think everybody, you know, what was the biggest blowback you got over the 25 years?

Anything? Let's see. Peeing on the portrait of Christ. I forgot about that. Okay. That was bad. And then there was some Jewish blowback. I'm trying to remember for which one.

Jewish blowback? What's worse than Jewish blowback? It wasn't for the Holocaust shoots. It was for something else. I can't remember the show. What about the end of season one? Was it the sexual victim? Yeah, the incest survivor group?

No, I didn't hear anything about that. Different times back then. I don't know. It feels like any show that I did then, early 2000s, I would do now. I can't think of anything that I would delete now. Can I ask some weird 25 years of curb questions? Sure. Um,

how many celebrities just pitched themselves to come on a curb and what was their batting average for actually getting on? Cause I'm sure that was an issue and you must've hated it. Well, no, because I don't have to put people on just because they ask. It was just awkward though, right? It's not awkward.

No, it's not awkward at all. When are you going to put me on Curb? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, you know. No, it's not awkward. Okay.

People don't really expect that they're going to be on. They just go, hey, I'd like to be on the show. Okay. So that doesn't mean you have to put them on. But I would hear from the casting director, so-and-so really wants to do the show. Oh, so they wouldn't go to you, they would go... Yeah, unless they saw me somewhere. And they'd go, hey, I'd love to do the show.

Or they would see somebody else in the cast, and somebody in the cast would say, hey, I ran into so-and-so, and she really wants to do the show. And then you'd file that away. Yeah, you'd file it away. How do you decide, or how did you decide, whether somebody who's famous enough to be themselves on the show or play a character? Because the Vince Vaughn thing always threw me off.

I was like, in this curb world, Vince Vaughn should be Vince Vaughn, but he's a member of the Funkhouser family. Yeah, he's Freddie Funkhouser. So how is he not Vince Vaughn should be Vince Vaughn, but he's a member of the Funkhouser family. Yeah, he's Freddie Funkhouser. So how is he not Vince Vaughn? Because I needed someone, because the show about Funkhouser's daughter who transitioned to a man and he gave himself an extra large penis. Right. I needed to have that discussion with with an actor okay and i knew it was like a sensitive discussion to have and i needed it to be really funny

and so i had to think about who to cast in that part because it was supposed to be from for bob einstein right it was supposed to be for Bob Einstein. Right. It was written for Bob Einstein. Oh, because you didn't, yeah. And then he died. But that was written for Funkhauser's daughter. Yeah. So now it had to be a relative of Funkhauser,

and who's going to play the relative. And Vince, I thought, is the person who could who I could have this discussion with. And it wouldn't feel I don't know, like unacceptable. Yeah. And also, it felt

like he was in the Funkhizer kind of area. Yeah. Something about him. Yeah. After decades of shaky hands caused by debilitating tremors, Sunnybrook was the only hospital in Canada who could provide Andy with something special. Three neurosurgeons, two scientists, one movement disorders coordinator,

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The one with irresistible taste and zero sugar. Win or lose, Coke Zero Sugar is the most refreshing way to end the game. Coke Zero Sugar. best Coke ever. Learn more at coca-cola.ca. Metrolinx and Crosslinks are reminding everyone to be careful as Eglinton Crosstown LRT train testing is in progress. Please be alert as trains can pass at any time on the tracks. Remember to follow all traffic signals. Be careful along our tracks and only make left turns where it's safe to do so. Be alert, be aware, and stay safe. Any sports stuff you want to get out? Can we talk about your rule to change football?

Yes. So I'm going to make you sports are for the day. Okay. You were infuriated. We're taping this. Um, it's a few days after the bills lost because their kicker missed a 44 yarder and it went wide, right? So your, your change is what I really, I, I've said it before, and thank you for giving me the opportunity to say it again, but I really believe that we should get rid of goalposts in football. No bullshit. The field goals ruin the game. They don't enhance the game. They make it worse. You have a guy who's kicking a ball through parallel bars to win games. Why? There's no reason behind it. He's not a football player. Buffalo didn't lose that game. This guy, this one guy who's not even a football player loses the game for them. Why, why, why do we have to have it? What,

what, for what reason? So you would get rid of kickers entirely and you just go for it on fourth down every time and not have kickoffs. Well, if you, unless you want to punt. Right.

So you keep punters. You keep punters. Yeah. Okay. I think I'm down. Like I was thinking the UFL, this new spring league or whatever, the merger,

this is like not a bad wrinkle for them. Wouldn't it be great? More fourth downs. Even the Bills having to go for it on fourth and 13. If they make it, that's amazing. By the way, it completely changes your mindset on offense. You're no longer operating with three downs. Right.

You're operating with four downs. You're operating with four downs. So when you're on the 40-yard line, the 50-yard line, you're not thinking about, oh, well, we have three downs. You know you've got four downs. You might not punt from the 50. You're not going to punt from the 40, from the other team's 40. So I just think it changes how it's going to change how you run your offense. So if seven kids solid comes back next year and says, I've gotten rid of our field goal kicker. He no longer exists. The punter is going to do kickoffs and we're just never kicking this year. You'd be in. I think, yeah. I think it would really, really help the game. Listen, Buffalo,

they lose a Super Bowl because a kick is wide right. It's dumb. And we won multiple Super Bowls because our kicker made crazy kicks. So I'm pro kicker because kickers have been really meaningful to the

Patriot fans. It's so stupid though. In a baseball game, should they put up parallel bars in center field and have a fungo specialist try and hit the ball through the parallel bars? It has nothing to do with the game. So extra innings, these guys come in? Yeah, extra innings. Yeah, you come in, you bring in your fungo specialist, and he tries to hit the fungo through the parallel bars. That actually sounds like a good rule. Yeah. I mean, it's as dumb as that.

Here comes Bonzo, our fungo specialist. He's going to come in here. Oh, looks like the fungo specialist is warming up. Bad weather today. We'll see if the Fungo Specialist can do it. Oh my God. That's so funny. What would you do about the Baseball Hall of Fame?

Because Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens and all of these people who were among the best baseball players I've ever seen are not in the Baseball Hall of Fame. And we're getting still precious about all the steroid stuff. I'm not convinced we don't have steroids and HGH stuff now. Right. Pretty sure we do.

Yeah. I'd be interested to see if a major star failed the test, how people would react. But it just seems, what's the point of having the Hall of Fame? Todd Helton made it today. He's going to make it before Barry Bonds? You know, I go back and forth on this. I suppose if Brady Anderson didn't hit 52 home runs one year, because he'd never even hit over 20, right? Yeah. Before that?

He hit 50. Yeah, he hit 50. Okay. I suppose if he didn't hit 50, then you could say, well, they're still great players. They're just hitting more. But they still would have made the Hall of Fame anyway. So it skews the home runs in a way, and I guess it skews batting averages and everything else. It'll ruin the stats. It's hard to really figure out the stats.

Yeah. I guess if you look at their careers before steroids came in. Yeah. And they were Hall of Famers before that. Or headed that way. Or headed that way. Then I would give them the pass. I would have everybody in. I would just put it on the plaque.

Put it on the plaque. Yeah. Just put something on the bottom. But even then, it's like arrested in a Balco trial. It's a tough thing to put on the plaque. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe you have to press a button and it tells you what happened, but I don't know. I guess I just don't, I was writing about this in the mid 2000s. I guess I don't fully understand

the point of a hall of fame because I always thought it was a museum that honored the best ever. And you take your kids or your grandkids there and you teach them about the sport. And to not have people that were literally the best players of their era in the Hall of Fame and not even mention why they're not in just seems weird to me. I don't get it. Especially when you consider a lot of the people who were already in there before. Yeah, like the Thai cops. Yeah, exactly. All right, next sports question.

Could you ever see yourself on the set of First Take for two hours? In like the Mad Dog spot. Just going. It's a Tuesday. It's a Wednesday. Mad Dog can't make it. You're in town. All of a sudden, you're in with Stephen A.

I think I'll pass, yeah. You wouldn't be able to do it? No. Would you be able to just craft hard sports takes and just go and argue them and get mad at Stephen A.? Oh, my God. Could you do PTI? No, I couldn't.

No. You couldn't do any of those shows? No. What would your sports podcast sound like? Would you have guests? Would you? I couldn't do a sports podcast. But you're watching all these sports.

Yeah, I don't think I could do a podcast. First of all, can I tell you something? I don't like criticizing people. And you have to criticize people to do that. Right. I don't like calling people out and saying they're bad at this and they stink. It's just not me. I feel bad for them.

I do. I feel badly when people take them apart. And that's what they do on these shows. They take everyone apart. He sucks. He stinks. I mean, these are people. They're human beings. They have feelings. I just don't like it. So I could never do it. I don't mind criticizing. If I'm having a private discussion with you, I'll say so-and-so sucks. Yeah, that's fine. He's not hearing about it. But to publicly call someone out, it's not for me.

I could never do it. Do you feel like the sports culture, have you noticed that it's much different than it was like 40 years ago? Because you saw some good iterations. Like in the 70s, Dick Young, remember? I mean, he basically got Siever traded. He was the most powerful, what was he, New York Daily News?

Yeah. And was just taking shots at Siever left and right and crushing him. And then eventually they were trading him to the Reds. Oh, do you think they did that because of Dick Young? No, but I think he was pushing a narrative that, you know, Siever didn't want to be there and what's he doing? Uh-huh.

I don't know. Just felt like the local whoever had more power. Now it seems like the national person has more kind of sway. Yeah, I don't know. What do you watch? Do you watch those shows? Oh. Do you get sucked in What do you watch? Do you watch those shows? Oh. Do you get sucked in or do you just watch games?

Because you listen to some pods. I watch those shows. Yeah. I mean, some of them. Yeah. Not all the way through, but there are shows that I'll turn on when I'm shaving or out of the shower and I'm getting dressed.

I'll definitely put them on. What would be your fix for PGA and Liv and that whole mess? Do you have one? No. It really makes my dad upset. Really? Why? He just thinks the best guys should be in one place

trying to win tournaments against each other. And that's how it should go. He's a traditionalist. Yeah. There's something about professional golfers that I don't take to. Like I don't feel it. Yeah. So I'm not that interested in them, to tell you the truth.

Yeah. That's one of the reasons you skipped the U.S. Open when it was here. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I don't like going to golf tournaments. Yeah. But I don't know. I'll watch like the last hour or two of major,

but that's about it. I don't really watch golf on television. But you're still playing like four or five times a day. I mean, a week. No, no. Three?

Twice. Twice a week. That's it. Yeah. Just to win money off Doc Rivers. Yeah. That's it. Just the weekends.

How many people are in your, once in a while during the week. How many people to win money off Doc Rivers? Yeah, that's it. Just the weekends. How many people are in your- Once in a while during the week. How many people are in your golf group? It's about eight or nine of us. Text thread, who's playing? I can do 745. Let's go. I can do it too. No, I'm the captain. You're the captain of the- Yeah, I send out the text. Yeah. When did you retire from softball and all the recreational sports that weren't golf um soft soft by the way i mean you had softball and curb in like the late 2000s yes okay that day that we were filming and i had to hit a home run to left field or a long fly ball yeah and so i hadn't played softball since the broadway show league which was like in the late 80s. Oh my God.

Yeah. And so I think it was Rosie O'Donnell was pitching and I had to hit the ball. I couldn't hit the softball. Oh no. Oh my God. And there's like a hundred people there? Yeah. There were a lot of people watching.

I was really having trouble hitting it. I, I, cause I i i don't know why yeah that's a softball slow pitch it was embarrassing but i have to say on the golf shots on the show yeah i come through i do like this year i had to hit a drive yeah and i hit somebody on the fairway and all the cameras the cameras are behind me. The whole crew is behind me. Right down the middle. 2.30. That's hard with the sight lines behind you.

Yeah. Best... Now you're not going to answer this. Let me rephrase. I have some questions for you. This is my last one. Most impressed you've been by a guest star

on Curb in the last 25 years where you didn't know what you were getting. Someone where you're like, wow, they were unbelievable. So like a Rosie O'Donnell would be an example. I'm not saying her, but I'm saying like that. Like somebody who comes in one episode

kind of knows what the show is and just crushes it. Oh man. You can't answer this one. Too hard. You offend somebody. Too hard and I'll offend. Okay. Alright. Ask your questions for me. I have some questions for you.

The rewatchables. Mm-hmm. Why don't you tell us what the movie's going to be before you do the show? So therefore, so that, that way

we can watch the movie and then enjoy the podcast a lot more. Fair question. You keep it a big secret. I like the mystery of it. Well, my thing is, once it's out, it's out.

You have plenty of time to listen to it. You don't have to listen to it the moment it comes out. And you could see the movie. No, but I know. But it's better if you say what it's going to be.

So you think I should 24 hours earlier tell people what the movie is? Tell people what the movie is. What's the downside? Yeah, probably not a downside. There's no downside. Maybe people, I don't know, they're already wondering what the categories are going to be.

I don't know. They're thinking ahead. You don't tell people what a curb episode is the day before. Here's the premise. Yeah, because this movie's already been out for 25 years yeah all right good question all right i'll work on it maybe i'll announce it on sundays it'll be the larry david rule okay i have another question yeah this is a little personal yeah you don't have to put it on if you don't want to okay your wife yeah how does

how does she do it? Because there's got to be, how many hours a day are you putting in watching? Oh, that's fair. All right. So football is 17 Sundays plus the playoffs. So Sundays are out for 22 weeks. Yes. I don't really do college football anymore unless I'm home. Basketball can pick my spots.

We got in the living room, we got this giant new TV set up in the new house with the big TV, but then the two TVs next to it. And so I can put two basketball games in the side TVs, but we can watch whatever she wants to watch. What? I wish I had thought of this 10 years ago. Are you kidding? So you're watching basketball. No wish I had thought of this 10 years ago. Are you kidding? So you're watching basketball. No, I'm watching, we're watching a TV show or movie together, but there's also basketball on the left. So I can kind of make sure I know what's going on. So like when Carl Anthony Towns has 62

points and then gets benched, I'm not catching up to that after the fact. But then a lot of it is like, sometimes I'll cheat in the mornings. I won't see the game when it happens and I'll come back the next morning. I'll watch them league pass and I'll zip through fourth quarters and things I want to see. So it's not necessarily just sitting home and watching sports every night. I feel like I pick my spots. The football like some of the Thursday night stuff could be like, you know what? I'm going to,

I'll tape the game. I can zoom through it. I can watch it in an hour if it's one game. Right. Sundays is impossible. Sundays, you have to be there.

Yeah. I always felt like for my podcast, eat the Sunday night with Sal. Like I, you really have to watch everything or else the audience can tell, you know? So it's like,

I'm just going to, this is how it's going to be on Sundays. But you, you know, so much about basketball, right? You have to watch a lot of basketball. Definitely do.

Definitely do. It's, it's on or around, but I really can pick my spots in a way. And sometimes she likes basketball. So sometimes she'll watch with me if it's a bigger around, but I really can pick my spots in a way. And sometimes she likes basketball. So sometimes she'll watch with me if it's a bigger game. But like playoffs is when I really kind of lock in. So she's always kind of like, oh, April.

Yeah, I don't really like you this month. There's like two stretches where she's like, oh, I'm not a huge fan of you. Oh, this is the time of year it is because she knows the rhythms of it now. But it's never been like an issue. Yeah, all right. But at least, I mean, that's what you're doing for a living. So you can't complain that much. You always have that card.

Yeah, see, I don't have that. What do you mean? I don't do it for a living. No, but like you did when you're doing your show, your wife wouldn't be like, oh man, you're doing that show. That's what you do. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. So I can always hide on that one. Yeah. But yeah, I try to, as you get older, you learn how to economize a lot of it, right? And use your time perfectly. I don't know if I was always good at that. It was honestly a lot harder when I was writing because I would spend a shitload of time on just writing columns or rewriting paragraphs

and that would be like an all-day thing. And then also having to watch sports, you become a little unabomber-y. When you're writing scripts for, well, I guess the curb scripts, sometimes you're just sketching out premises, but you must have to go somewhere and actually like you're

by yourself for stretches, right? Yeah. I write the shows with Jeff Shaper here. So you always have somebody else in the room with you? Yeah. But sometimes if there's a problem, I'll take the problem home and think about it. Oh, interesting. Did you have like a special place to go to or are you just, did you have like a little

office or like? Just a, just. Kitchen? Nothing? Just a chair in my bedroom. Yeah. That's it? Yeah.

When, on Seinfeld, did you write with somebody or did you write by yourself? I wrote, I wrote by myself and I wrote with Jerry. So I always thought, because I felt that a little bit with different stuff I've done, but never as intensely as that. Spending that much time with somebody and then you're not with them the same way. It's almost like when you're in college with your roommates and you just spend this crazy amount of time together. And then you just don't see each other the same way, but you still have the bond from all the time. You can just pick up. Like what,

like two of my best friends came from college a couple weeks ago. And it's just like, we just immediately go back. It's like, we've never not spent time, but you know, like one of them I hadn't seen in a couple of years. Yeah.

So there's something weird about the, it's the same way with us. Yeah. That you probably, how often do you see Jerry? Not, not that often. Um, but then when you see him? Not, not that often. Um,

but then when you see him, it's like, yeah, you just go right back. Yeah. Well, do you have other questions for me? I like,

I like how you turn the tables on me. I thought, wait, I had one, I had another one. You want to ask me what's the future of the Pats? Huh? Um,

cause you know, we have, there's this owner thing with the Pats that I think is trying to figure out how real it is why what do you mean

it's a little like the Sun was supposed to kind of take over yeah but they do the press conference for the new coach and the Sun's not at the press conference

and Bob Craft's like yeah we had a crisis with one of our other parts of the company, so he couldn't be there. And it's like, really? He couldn't be there for? Stephen Jones would have been there. That's. Right?

So the question is, one of the reasons Succession, I thought, was such a great show is that whole family dynamic of the guy who did everything possible to be in charge. Vince McMahon's like this. He's running everything. Oh, yeah. That's what I want to ask you. Good. I'm glad you brought up Vince McMahon.

Yeah. Yeah. You watch wrestling? Yeah. What is that? You're out on wrestling? Are you? What? What is this with you in wrestling this goes back to being a kid yeah i i watched it when i was a kid too

and then i realized it was fixed and i stopped watching it's performance oh so you love the performance yeah i don't think it's real it's not like i'm like oh my god i can't believe roman reigns won again no it's it's it's uh like I'm like, oh my God, I can't believe Roman Reigns won again. No, it's, it's, it's, but they're all, they're all the same, aren't they? I mean,

every match looks, looks the same. There's some art to it. There's art in the storytelling, how they build arcs. It's, it's not much different than what you're trying to do with Herb. Trying to build two,

three month arcs with two characters, have these different matches. Like there is, there's cool things to it. I can't say I'm watching raw, two, three-month arcs with two characters and have these different matches. There's cool things to it. I can't say I'm watching Raw every Monday night, but I always kind of semi-know what's going on. My son got into it, which was great, but now he's out.

Now my son's in the MMA now. But listen, you're watching this thing. Yeah, you know that it's not fixed, but the people who are there, they think it's real. No, they do. Are you kidding? They go crazy. They wouldn't go crazy

if they thought that it was real. Are you having an intervention right now? I'm trying to. They just gave, Netflix gave them $5 billion for Raw. It's like getting bigger and bigger. It's remarkable. Are you going to watch

my Vince McMahon docuseries on Netflix? I'm going to make you watch the first episode and I bet you keep watching. Because I showed my dad a cut. So wait,

is this scripted? No, it's a six-part documentary. Oh, okay. But I'm going to make... My dad, I was like, can I just show you this?

He was like, I don't like wrestling. I'm like, just watch one part. And then he watched three in a row. So that was a good sign for us. Well, I watched the first one. Yeah, Vince, pretty interesting character for one of those. Do you watch those?

Do you deep dive? Because you watch a lot of movies and stuff. Do you deep dive the docu-series on different things and like Murder Doctors and all these different weird docu-series they have? Probably, no, I don't think so. I don't watch a lot. But you watch a lot of the movies though.

I watch movies, yeah. So you had Oscar thoughts that you're not going to give us? Oh. Because you don't like being critical? Yeah. What was your favorite Oscar movie for this year? The Paul Giamatti one. Oh, The Holdovers.

Yeah. You like that one? Yeah. You're an Alexander Payne guy? Yeah. Yeah, I like him. It was. You're an Alexander Payne guy? Yeah. Yeah, I like him. It was good. It was good to have him back.

He didn't make a movie in a while. Yeah. Yeah, he's really good. What else did I like? I'm big on boarding school movies in general. I feel like that could be a cable channel. Just like boarding school movies and TV shows. I love boarding school movies.

It's the best. Boarding school movies. My favorite was the Brendan Fraser one. What was it? School Ties. School Ties. That's my favorite movie. Try to solve anti-Semitism.

They didn't get there. Boarding school, anti-Semitism. You cannot. You cannot. Football. Football. Are you kidding? It had it all.

You can't do better than that some great young actors yeah fantastic cheating come on so you're in for a for school ties as a limited series school ties is it for me that that's it i could i could watch movies like that all day yeah well i asked you to come on the rewatchables because you actually listened to it and you only wanted to do movies from like the 40s and 50s. I don't know why we couldn't do something from like a school ties type of movie. All right, well, pick one. Maybe I'll do it. I'm going to just send you a list.

I think we should do a baseball movie though. Well, you really like Date Man Out, right? I mean, we could do a movie like that. I like Date Man Out out I'm forever blowing bubbles we could talk black socks pretty fascinating yeah

um whether shoeless Joe got a raw deal we could go in all that stuff boy this Comiskey fellow he must have been

something Charlie well I do think like with the legal oh wait a second you know what movie we left out for great baseball movies Bull Durham Charlie well I do think like with the League of oh wait a second you know what movie

we left out for great baseball movies Bull Durham Bull Durham and The Natural oh The Natural yeah

still classic fantastic yeah I really like For Love of the Game too which one was that that's the one with Kevin Costner

when it's like he's gonna retire from the Tigers but it kind of turns into a rom-com halfway through but the baseball with Kevin Costner when it's like he's going to retire from the Tigers. But it kind of turns into a rom-com halfway through, but the baseball stuff's really good. Yeah, it was all right. The rom-com part probably could have cut out.

Yeah, it was good. I liked it. Yeah. Yeah, Costner's probably the... He's made three, I think. Oh, baseball movies? Yeah, just three baseball movies. I forgot the other one, but his best sports movie was the golf. The Tin Cup.

Tin Cup. Yeah, that was really good. So maybe we do Tin Cup. Roy McAvoy, that would be good rewatchables for you. Would you just want the two of us or would you want a third? Would you want a third co-host? How would you want it to play out? I really don't know.

I'm feeling a lot of pressure. Before we go, you didn't explain to us why the Yankees aren't good anymore. Why they're not good anymore? Yeah, what happened? It seems this team they put together, like every player, like remember when they had Luke Voigt? Remember that lineup?

Yeah. Judge, Voigt, and Stanton, and they have all big lumbering guys who can't move and are powerful, but they strike out a lot. And there's a lack of athleticism on the team. They don't seem to be able to move quickly. Hard for them to steal runs.

Yes. Yeah. I don't know. They just strike out too much. They don't hit with men on base. Seems like you're down on it. And analytics. I hear a lot about analytics that they depend too much on analytics.

Oh, wait, there's another great baseball movie. We forgot money ball. Money ball is the best one of the last 15 years. Yeah. I love money ball. I actually jump it in that one all the time. Yeah. So the team you're happiest with is the Knicks.

The Knicks? Yeah, you genuinely like watching the Knicks. I heard you say on one of your shows last year that you don't know anybody who watches hockey during the season. Except my dad. And me. You watch hockey during the season? So Rangers are number one for you?

Yep. You're in on the quick comeback, the Jonathan Quick resurgence? I'm a huge Ranger fan. Still? Even regular season? Regular season. I see entire games. I'll tape them.

And then I watch them. And I can get through it in an hour. Oh, that's smart. Yeah, that's 60 minutes and you're done. And if it's too late, then I'll just go through the tape for the goals. So when you're taping a game, is it people know not to text you about the game? Yes. Yes, range of fans know not to text me.

Yeah, so you're surprised that wasn't a curve plot. You know what? That would mean giving away a game. Somebody ruining the game for you. Yeah, so you're surprised that wasn't a curve plot. You know what? You mean giving away a game? Somebody ruining the game for you. That was on the Seinfeld pilot. Was it really? Yes.

I don't remember that. Kramer gave away, I think, a Mets score on the Seinfeld pilot. Oh, he could have dipped back. It was 30, 40 years ago. Jesus. That could have been a whole curve plot. Somebody ruining game five of the Knicks. It's an easy, it's too easy of a premise anyway.

It's too easy. You like to think of things that you think other people might not think of. Yeah, but this is such a huge part of your life. Yeah, I know. But so what? Anytime I ever text you during a jet ski,

I'm like, I'm golfing. Don't tell me what's happening. Oh, God. Well, you have the Jets. You have, I think, a top 10 pick. You don't have a second round pick. They'll draft a tackle, I hope.

And I guess Aaron Rodgers comes back. I won't force you to give us your Aaron Rodgers feelings, but people could probably read between the lines. Was it a great year one? You have them below Namath on your rankings. It started

out so hopeful. It really did. They were going to Broadway shows. Did you watch the- Oh, yeah. He went to the Tonys? No, it wasn't the Tonys. They went to a Broadway show.

I thought he also went to the Tonys. Oh, maybe he went to the Tonys. And it was just- What's that show? HBO? What is it? What's the show they do? On the football team.

Oh, Hard Knocks. Yeah. He had a great Hard Knock football team? Oh, Hard Knocks. Yeah, he had a great Hard Knocks. Yeah. Great Hard Knocks. He met Liev Schreiber. Yeah. Yeah. Right.

HBO Hall of Famer, Liev Schreiber. Yeah. Do you think they should have an HBO Hall of Fame? I feel like they could do that at this point. People seem to be very concerned about what's going to happen after they're dead. Hall of Fame and things like this. Yeah.

I'm the opposite. I'm just trying to get to next year. Yeah, right. Thanks for having us. Curb, you can't tell us anything about this season, right? No. The potential last season. No. Okay.

That's not really the greatest way to promote the season. Is this airing before the first show comes out? When is this airing? No, this airs Tuesday before the first episode. Oh, before the first episode. The first episode's February 4th? Yeah, February 4th. Yeah. And this is when? This is going to be the Tuesday before that. Oh, right before. The first episode. Oh, before the first episode. Yeah. The first episode's February 4th? Yeah, February 4th. Yeah.

And this is when? This is going to be the Tuesday before that. Oh, okay. All right. Yeah, so I saw the first episode and I told you I saw it. Yeah. And then I didn't realize you needed feedback. Well, I mean-

Because people go either way. The guy says, hey, I got the first episode. I'm watching. Can't wait to see it. And then I never hear from you. You don't do that. You're so stupid. I didn't. Can't wait to see it. And then I never hear from you. You don't do that. You're so stupid. I didn't know if you were a feedback guy. A feedback guy?

There's only one conclusion I could reach. Oh, so you think if I don't give feedback, that means I didn't like it. Absolutely. Here's why you don't call somebody after you see the show. I like every Curb episode. I'm a bad critic.'s why you don't sell somebody. Here's why you don't call somebody after you see the show. But I like every Curb episode. I'm a bad critic.

The reason you don't call somebody is that I don't know how to tell them that I didn't like it, so I just won't call. Yeah, that makes sense. So that's my bad. Yeah. It's a rookie mistake. All right. All right, Larry David, good luck with the last season.

Congrats on a quarter century of Curb. Unbelievable. Insane. Good to see quarter century of Curb. Unbelievable. Insane. Good to see you. All right. Thank you. All right. That's it for the podcast.

Thanks so much to Larry David. Thanks to Kyle Creighton and Steve Cerruti for producing as always. Don't forget to check out youtube.com slash Bill Simmons. If you want clips from this podcast or the shorts that I do as I walk around and turn my camera on like an idiot, apparently people like these. I actually have fun doing them. I'm glad you like them. And we're going to run some stuff from the rewatchables as well as we tour the East Coast

and the weather hopefully continues to cooperate. I'm not sure if you're going to see me on Thursday. It's up in the air. So if I don't see you Thursday, I will see you on Sunday. Enjoy the rest of the week. On the wayside, I'm a Bruce O'Leary. I don't have to be. Must be 21 plus in President's like states. Fando is offering online sports wagering in Kansas under an agreement with Kansas Star Casino LLC.

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